Internet Society Virtual Peering Series - Central Asia, 14 Sep 2021

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From YouTube: Virtual Peering Series – Central Asia 3

Description

The Internet Society, RIPE NCC, and Euro-IX organized the third event of the Virtual Peering Series – Central Asia on 14 September 2021.

This event focused on what is required to implement a successful IXP, such as equipment, services, and convenient access to fiber routes. It discussed the importance of setting up and running IXPManager, a management platform for IXPs as well as route server and looking glass services, how to apply for Autonomous System Number (ASNs) and IP addresses from the RIPE NCC, and how to register with PeeringDB, a web-based database of networks that are interested in peering to showcase the IXP and its participants. It also discussed value added services that can be located at an IXP such as a Root Domain Name System (DNS) server, the AS112, a service that secures the DNS system and Authoritative DNS (AuthDNS) services, a Network Time Protocol (NTP) server, and how to implement the Mutually Agreed Norms for Routing Security (MANRS) actions.

KNOWLEDGE CAFE 2
Massimiliano Stucchi, Regional Technical Advisor - Europe, Internet society

PANEL
Ucha Seturi, Project Coordinator, Georgian IG forum
Flavio Luciani, Chief Technology Officer, NaMex Roma IXP
Albert Toneyan, Owner, WEB LLC

MODERATOR Vahan Hovsepyan, External Relations Officer, RIPE NCC

DISCUSSANTS
Arnold Nipper, Chief Technology Evangelist, DE-CIX
Michalis Oikonomakos, Head, GR-IX
Luca Cicchelli, Interconnection Manager, TOP-IX Consortium
Angela Stanescu, Executive Director, Interlan Internet Exchange
Maurizio Garretti, General Manager (CEO), NaMex Roma IXP

https://www.internetsociety.org/events/virtual-peering-series-central-asia/vpsca-3/

#IXPs #Peering #GrowInternet

A

Hello, dear participants, this is the third episode in our virtual peering series for central asia. The series is supported by facebook, flex, optics team, kimroo and techix. I am the moderator of the series and most of you and know me already. My name is: I am external relations officer with ripe and central asian. What is the objective of this meeting?

A

During our earlier events? We were discussing experience in general. We were talking about what is an ixp. Why does it exist today? We will focus on the factors and numbers of a successful ixp, such as equipment, services and access to a fiber of routes which is relevant to many of the ixps in the region. On our agenda today we have the ixp knowledge, cafe, 2.

A

This presentation will be delivered by max stucci, a regional technical advisor for europe, the internet society, and we assembled a panel to hold the discussion the panelists are, which is from georgia, florida, china from namex and albert tonyana from rmx. Of course, you can ask your questions and we will have some kind of closing.

A

I have already mentioned that we have several sponsors of this event: flex optics. There is also facebook and our other event sponsors.

A

The first two sponsors were the sponsors of the series, but the event sponsor is team, summary and techics, and let me introduce this very modest guy. Who is his cast his glance downwards? Max stucci worked with us for a long time at the viper ncc. Now he is the original technical advisor for europe of the internet society and the incident society is the initiates of this event and our panelists. Our speakers are, let me introduce how do you describe butcher?

A

He is such a character and such an expert. At the same time, and uh when I say internet governance in georgia, we mean ucha, which I believe is an active engine of community networks and georgia he's the co-founder and founder and everything else of georgian igf and georgia xp so, which is the georgian internet flavio luciani represents nameks flavia will introduce himself and his.

B

A

Albert is the pioneer of the internet in armenia.

A

He is the founder of one of the very first companies that introduced the internet in armenia and he is the president of the armenian isaac and he is the founder and the ceo of armenian drug exchange. That's been in operation since 2010..

A

I have already mentioned that we have several responses. Let us once again say thank you to all of them for supporting this event for supporting the whole series.

A

Our main goal is to assist central asia in becoming one of the most successful regions in terms of efficient, peering and advanced nxps, and now I am very happy to give the flow to your max study.

A

He will run through his presentation now. Let me add just one more thing since in the list of participants, we have a lot of people who have long inductive experience with peering and axes. I would like this session to be more interactive than our previous meetings. Can we please try to have a discussion around the topic of what can be done to make even more progress with isps and appearing, not just in central asia and the caucuses, but also everywhere in the world?.

C

Thank you, verhan. Thank you very much good morning. Everyone, the intent of the virtual peering series, has been to meet people who are interested in enhancing peering in the region in central asia, so that as organizations, the internet society, the ripened cc and also uh euroax, who is also participating in in organizing these events, can have a better understanding of the environment and as internet society, especially we have a.

C

We would love to see peering increase in the region and we would love to see internet exchange points start or in the region. The goal of this session is to show that setting up an internet exchange point is relatively simple, but there are a series of services, a series of additions that people sometimes overlook, but which can make a big difference in having an ixp being successful or not.

C

But before we start, I would like to take one minute to remember susan forney, who was also a presenter in the virtual, getting series on the first event, and I would like to just express how thankful we are for for what she did. She recently lost her, but she will always be remembered for how kind and how witty and how intelligent she was and how always she wanted to help everyone in the world to understand more about interconnection hearing and everything, that's related to networking.

C

So thank you, susan and then, let's get into the presentation, I wanted to start with this with you have a switch you have bought the best switch you could find, but you want to call it an isp and there's still a lot of work to do in the virtual repeating series number two: we covered part of this, the basics.

C

How do you get people connected? What are the effects of connecting to an internet exchange? What does it mean in terms of latency? What do you get in terms of return, but now what else do you need once you have a switch? You have the optics. You have connected the first two or three participants, let's say even five or ten, but how do you bring your internet exchange to the next level? What are the tiebreakers in this case? First of all, you need resources.

C

What are these resources? We're? Talking about ip addresses we're talking about autonomous systems, because you need to have specific ip addresses for specific uh reasons. You have to become an liar to do this. It's a very simple process with ripencc. You can contact vahan, you can contact elena as well. You can ask me, teach how to do all these.

C

The costs are a thousand euros for the setup and 1 400 euros per year, although I put a star there, because while the price is set for every year, ripen cc so far has had additional funds available. So every year, for the last four or four five years, the the maintenance fee, the membership fee has always been in reality, lower than that, so around 1, 000 euros and the process requires about two weeks to complete. You become a member, you become a local internet registry and you can ask your addresses.

C

So there are two parts that you need to consider and let's start looking at the infrastructure as divided into two parts. There is one that is the public services, the management interfaces and the rest, and it's the parts that people will see when they try to access your website when they try to look to go into the management interfaces, and for that you need what's called the pa provider. Aggregatible addresses.

C

I don't think there is a good translation in russian for that there isn't even a good translation in italian for that definition, and then you need specific ips for the internet exchange part for what is called the peering line, and those addresses have to be somehow, let me say, special because they need to be reserved specifically for that reason, but they're not supposed to be announced on the internet. This is why you need two separate parts.

C

You need one, that's the pa, it's a network that you announce on the internet and then there are the peering glan addresses that are supposed to just stay on the peering land. No one is supposed to be seeing them on the internet and they're just used for the interconnection of the users.

C

The same goes for the autonomous system. Members. You need two in this case as well, one for the public services management and other, and an autonomous system number for the route servers so for the peering line and again this is also an autonomous system that should not be seen on the internet, and it's just reserved for this specific use.

C

You could do with just one, but it's better. If you have to, I see arnold has a hand up I'll get to you in a moment. Arnold give me one. Second, one additional thing you need is transit people sometimes overlook this. An ixp still needs transit for your website again for management, and don't forget that some members might need that, but not really as a paid service, but they might need it to fill up their caches.

C

Cdns might need to ask you for this service to be able to replenish their caches or to get data to some of their servers there. So arnold.

D

Yeah, thank you very much max sofa, so I would even recommend to to go for three as then, you definitely need one for the services now you need definitely one for your peering line, and sometimes it's even recommended to have a third one. If you have a root collector, because if you look into the definition, what an asn is, it has to have a an own policy.

D

C

uh Yeah I said that you could make it work with just one but two and then, as you said three, I didn't consider the case of the route collector, but that's a good point and thank you, arnold. So the way we have built this presentation is that now we are going into a little bit of a discussion with our panelists, but again as you've seen with arnold, we, everyone is welcome to to join the the discussion.

C

So let me ask a quick question to say, for example, flavio how many asms does namex have it's now I'll ask the same question to our mix and then ask you how you divide that and how do you use them?.

E

Imax and hello, everyone and, first of all, thanks. Thank you very much for inviting me today. Just a brief introduction about myself, because the I don't know if before someone did it, but mainly my name is- and I am mainly the chief technology officer of namix namex- is one of the italians internet exchange. Point and namex is the room internet exchange point so we are involved.

E

Yes, I can answer your question economics today. We count about 200 autonomous system interconnected to our interconnection facility. I would like to say if I can maxim, I would like to add some comment about what you said before. First of all, I usually start from the definition of internet exchange point.

E

It looks like something academic, but I think it is really important to understand what an internet exchange point is and does- and this is my humble point of view- an exchange point is something really useful in the internet ecosystem and I think that we are not only peering interconnection systems, but in general we are physical infrastructure. Where interconnections happen, the world interconnections happen and not only the peering interconnection. So peering is the main service that usually we provide to our customers and it there is also an historical.

E

We say reason because today we always say: okay exchange points are hearing ecosystems, but this is the main scope to facilitate the exchange of reachability information among members, but we are going through uh something new and many exchange points around the world are showing that we are more debt than a single point where building interconnections happen.

E

This definition from my site is very important because, by thinking of what you are, you can easily understand what you want to go through.

E

I would like to comment what you said and what you say it is in in reference on the peering service, so you need an autonomous system to provide services to your members. You have to have another autonomous system for the road server infrastructure, because road servers are another key element of an internet exchange point. You can provide a service to facilitate the establishment of the hearing. Interconnection among your membership and everything is right, but it is a reference for the peering service and not for hard access. This is that an exchange provide to the members.

E

So this is my comment. I don't know if someone else has some comments on that.

C

Maybe albert, would you like to.

F

We are using two as numbers, as you say, max one for announcing our network to internet from transit, internet and one for road collectors, but we will discuss the recommendation and maybe we will use another as number we'll see. Thank you. Thank you.

C

All just to add something here together with ucha at isoc, we are working on we're helping actually, which has set up an internet exchange point in georgia. So I'm not asking the same question to tucha, because the ixp is still getting to start so we're designing it together with them to have two ascends, maybe we'll think about the third one but yeah. So I I didn't ask that question because it's still yet to come in his case, which you'll have your chance. Maybe the next questions to chip in and expart.

C

I don't see any other any other comments, so maybe we can move on to the next part and it's a fundamental services. So I divided the presentation into what can be considered a fundamental service and what could be considered then a value-added service where we added on top of what we already have. There is a series of services that are considered fundamental, that are the basics of an ixp. You could run without these, but the chances of becoming successful are much much less and they're not hard to implement.

C

So, first of all, you want to have an interface that where your members can go and and check who is also connecting at the ixp who what is the? Where is my port? How are my traffic drafts and then have a customer portal for that, but also in this case I highlighted ixp manager, which is one of the choices you can make for such a software.

C

But then ixp manager also helps your participants in, for example, being able to send peering requests to other participants in an automated fashion, and then the important part of ixp manager for a new established ixp nowadays would be switchboard configuration and then, at the same time providing the source of truth for other parts of the ixp configuration. So you do everything in ixp manager and then with ixp manager as the center, you can add other components that catch all the configuration data, all the important information from isp manager.

C

From there we'll see in a moment there are route servers, you can generate the route server configuration starting from what ixp manager says. Is there you could do the same with your website to show the list of participants at the ixp?

C

You could do plenty of other automation based on the information you find in ixp manager, and then it's a nice interface to give to your customers to your members so that they can do a lot of self-service actions and make it easier for them to be on the hearing land get all the information they need directly from one source.

C

Then we have route servers. That servers is a service for members to peer easily. Why easily? Because, basically, it's a way to reduce the amount of configuration needed from different members to be able to make the most out of internet exchange point. If I appear with the route servers, then I get immediately all the routes. I learn all the routes from all the other members who, at the same time peer with the route servers.

C

So in one go, I configure one normally two hearing sessions and I get the routes for all the other members who do the same without having to establish a single direct bgp session with all the other participants.

C

So I get a lot out of just one bgp session, for example at links you get by default, just with one session with route servers you get about 170 000 routes, and that already collects a lot of traffic that you just put into the internet exchange and then route servers are a point where the ixp could also do filtering. It's a filtering point. It could be based on the routing registering it could be based on rpki and for an ixp starting right.

C

Now I would base everything off of rpki, mostly with a fallback to routing registry, but also they represent an opportunity to look into how routing is in a country or an area, because you normally collect all the local exchange, local networks, all the routes. You have a way to look into how they're routing and it gives you a way to provide more data, understand more about how the network environment is in the area.

C

But the two important parts of the cloud servers are basically setting up just a couple of bgp sessions and receiving all the routes for all the other participants who also appear with the route servers and then have them as the first line of defense filtering based on strict rules that the ixps can enforce.

C

Then, on top of this, this is not a service that is offered by the ixps, but peering db is also another central point of information where the single ixp should start publishing all of the information about their participants and the peering lands.

C

Because then, all the large networks, all the cdns, but also medium and small networks, can use peering db as a way to understand. Okay.

C

Where should I appear and in which facilities can I do that when I want to join a certain number of internet exchange points and what value is that going to add to my routine, because I want to check which other networks are also appearing at that internet exchange, so peering db is a window into who your members are and which facilities they are, so that prospective new members can start checking and can make provisions on.

C

Okay, if I join a certain internet exchange, who am I going to find and in some cases also how much traffic am I going to exchange there based on what I already have in my network right now, so peering db is really an important part, an important set of information to fill in and to keep updated continuously, and then you should be pushing your members to also keep being db updated as much as possible.

C

So any comments on on this section I see, maybe flavio, would you like to add something about all this.

E

Yeah, you have mentioned three important tools. I can share with you my experience, for instance, by starting from the first one isp manager.

E

I think that you say everything and I can say it is a good tool and also provide info useful information to your membership, but also it is a good tool for your internal troubleshooting, because you can have our view on what is happening in terms of traffic sport errors, and it is a really good tool to make troubleshooting internally and also, I probably you say that if you think that an exchange point can have a huge number of network operators interconnected, it is a really good way to how to make the demons configuration, because you have to take care on not only the basic configuration of our bird or open bgpd.

E

But you are also to generate filters. You have to put and mix all together and the route servers are a key element in robin security, because you can implement on that. The check as a validation chain in terms of our pki internet rooting, registry, filtering and xp manages is very useful to mix everything together to have a a core reconfiguration.

E

Let me say also sometimes it is a good tool to to provide, for instance, peer-to-peer traffic statistics to your members, because if you think about the really small medium-sized internet service providers, network operators, they don't have many tools to to check, for instance, where they are doing uh huge traffic, for instance, if you think about it, some events can occur and you can provide them. Okay.

E

This is your aggregate in terms of traffic that you are generate on the internet exchange point and then you can see also the p2p statistics, so you can find where your traffic is flowing in a sort of a way. What about servers? Also, here you say everything, and also here I say something if I think about the the bearing service route service represent a great commodity for your membership.

E

Of course, the main goal is to facilitate the establishment of the peering sessions, because, with one pillion session, you can get any rules for all the participants on the road server, but also in terms of broad insecurity, and I think this is another main scope of an internet exchange point to provide a service and to try to mitigate as best as we can.

E

Rooting threats and the routes are very, very useful tools to do that, and then what about the ndp is really famous and it is really used in the interconnection industry, and I really recommend to exchange points to try to maintain up-to-date information on that, especially when you are onboarding a new network operators. In your exchange point you have to try to sensitize them to maintain uh pdb up to date. This is what we usually do. We usually say: okay, you have to use it, but you have to not only use it.

E

You have to maintain the information up to date and yeah.

C

Thank you. Arnold has a hand up again just.

D

Three sentences to add or to return it is first of all, I also can only highly recommend to use ixp manager. This is really an excellent software.

D

It's up to date and it's developed a lot of features and especially for small to middle-sized ixps. It's definitely the software to use for route servers. I would say, route server is a must. An internet exchange without and route server is like a party without drinks, so it's useless so route server really helps new members to get up to speed within seconds. So I've seen in my career members connecting to the internet joining the route service and their port was almost full within a couple of minutes.

D

Last but not least, to peering db also is a must. So you would like to be seen. You would like to make your known two potential networks. So therefore, if you have an ixp, also register at peering db and also keep your entry up to date, that's what I wanted to add.

C

Thank you, arnold and let me add a bit to what's what he has said this. I I run a small asm. That's under my name. You can look it up, but the moment I joined an ixp and I updated peering db. I think it took 10 minutes after that. To get the first emails, would you like to peer with us from other participants who are there so there's a lot of automation going on peering db, and this will help you as an ixp in providing a good service also to your members.

C

If you keep it all updated, I see albert has a hand up so albert.

F

Yes, um thank you. I would like to say that our exchange point is a very small one. There are only 11 members connected to our network, but from other side from the other side, they all internet providers in armenia are connected directly or via other already connected providers. We are also using bird as a road collector.

F

We have two collectors, two road servers and we are doing four bgb sessions for ipv4 and ipv6 and as for ixp manager, you know our community is very small and everybody know knows each other uh very well. We have no any more requests for peering, so everything is stable and this is the situation. Romania. In our mix.

F

We have several statistics sites, for we are collecting, as flows and users can do some filters to see their traffic and if there is a need for acting on traffic, we are providing communities and some of our participants are using communities to manage the traffic coming from either from other participants or from cache servers that we have in our mix. Thank you.

C

Thank you albert. I see ucha had a hand up, but now it's down, you still want to say something.

G

Thanks for inviting me an opportunity to share more information because we are just beginners and we are just trying to start work, but I would say that these all sources you when they're current to use, are very useful and very important for us and about additional services.

G

Maybe local, cbs and also ip transit services will be very interesting because for georgia iex and for our members, we have right now. 17 founder members of ix connect to the local cbn international cbs and connect also to the iep transit, is very important and very crucial for our boss. That's it six months.

C

Thank you. Let me ask briefly albert: do you use ixp manager or do you use a different system or is it something you have built yourself at army.

F

We are not using ixp manager, but we are going to to use for configuration of road servers and switches.

F

We have nominated in isp manager because everything is already configured and there are need of only small changes and we are doing everything in manual way, but we are going to implement isp manager and it's in our plans in the near future. Thank you.

C

Sounds good otherwise, please.

H

Yeah hello, this is thank you for organizing this fora. I just wanted to point out max that we should mention ixpdb as well as a source of truth. It contains a lot of authoritative data regarding axps and it's a pity that it hasn't been mentioned before. Thank you.

C

Okay, yes, sorry about that, is that I didn't want to add too much at this stage, but that's also a good point that is pdb should have been mentioned. Arnold.

D

And just one note: um there was the word truth mentioned several times. I would really recommend to change the word truth to information. Thank you.

C

I mean when I once mentioned the source of truth to source of information. Okay, I took a note of that, but let me ask flavio: do you use ixp manager or do you have a different tool, something you no no.

E

Will you no? No, we use xp manager yeah, and we are also moving to the last release in this period, because there are many improvements on that and I think yeah.

C

Let me, let me ask michalis, you just just spoke, but do you use xp manager, yeah michalis michalis is from is from from.

H

Grx, the greek internet exchange sorry for not disclosing earlier hi, again yeah. We are using ike's manager for many years now. We are sponsoring it as well and we are very happy. Basically, we are using x manager as a source of truth for everything related to the exchange and we build all or automation.

H

Based on that the source of truth, we automate everything in the exchange that includes both the route server configuration and the switch's configuration.

C

Thank you. I see there is luca there's a fellow italian on the call from topics. Maybe luca can tell us what they use at topics, which is the internet exchange of uh torino in northern italy.

I

Hello, everyone thanks max for involving me and you already introduced, who I am and where I'm from so I don't spend any more work on that. So going to your question what we are using. We are implementing uh route service and we are using bird, for example, so with two different instances in two different virtual machines also located in our own cloud for the management, I would say. Unfortunately, we are not using isp manager because it was a choice of the past, and so we are using a tool that we have developed internally.

I

But now, for example, as already mentioned by the other speakers, there are new features related to the automation that it would be very useful for the implementing the automation with our new coming platform. So it's a choice. We will put up the discussion again and last but not least, you mentioned the fact that you can provide transit to other players.

I

We are doing that as we are a regional, so local isp. We are not providing our own transit, but we make it possible with marketplaces.

I

Some members can sell services, including happy transits to others, so that is basically implementing private villas to the seller member and to the buyer member, and we do not go into the contract of the the ip transit. So we are only the interconnection platform. So it's also a way to have a larger use of the interconnection and the switching fabric.

C

Thank you luca. Now I I've done the a tour of the is present on the call and I think I've missed uh angel until now from interland. Would you like to to tell us if you use ixp manager or if you have something else, angela.

J

Yes, I'm right here, hello, everybody, yes, we are using ixp manager as well, and we consider is very useful. What I would like to ask everybody: how do you promote your network operators to register in peering db.

C

That's a very good question. I think oh flavio yeah.

E

I have my personal answer. It is not absolute, but it is my personal point of view during the onboarding, as I said before, I try to check different kind of things such as.

E

If the network operator is on boarding, they have rpk iras if they have all the router 6 objects and a set inside the internet, routine registry, and also we check if they have an entry inside here in db, and if so, we only ask to reference numx as the appearing point that they are joining and if not, we usually support them to add a new profile on pdb and yeah and setting everything correctly.

E

This is what we do usually sometimes one time per year. We usually do a whole check on everything in terms of alphabetical order. We check all the autonomous systems interconnected if they have everything will update on pdb not only b but also.

C

Thank you flavio, angela, any other questions. Maybe you want to no.

J

That's fine, okay, good! Thank you! So much.

C

Thank you. Thank you for the contribution. I cannot stress this enough as to keep keep all the information updated. My name was still put as appearing the appearing coordinator for a network even 10 years after I left it. So I had to send numerous emails to that network to say: can you correct that so that I don't get any more calls to to ask me about peering with you?

C

Maybe one last quick question is because we have an example of a very large experience. Arnold, what do you use ixp manager at 3, gigs.

D

So, thank you for the question max. So actually, when we started the kick, the isp manager was not around and we actually, I guess we reroute the complete provisioning software also a couple of years ago when ixp manager was not around, so we are not using ixp manager, but what we do is where we help new ixps coming up like, for example, angola, ixp.

D

We also use ixp manager there, and also, I guess, the bigger ixps links, m6 net naught and so on. They have an internal, separate, internal and technically set up with evpn and so on, which ixp manager currently is not able to support. That's a reason for them not to use it. I guess.

C

Thanks arnold, that's exactly why I asked you this specific question, because there are, there are historical reasons: ixp manager is relatively new compared to ixps, so if there is an isp that started before the manager was around, they had no other choice other than going for something either built by themselves or something different, just something pulled together with some automation built in or they are in the process now of moving to to ixp manager.

C

Although I don't know of any doing this, for the reasons that you uh just mentioned, some features are not yet supported by expert manager.

D

And just to add most of the large ixps, they also offer additional services, and you do not want to have two pieces of software to manage your provisioning system and ixp manager probably also is not able uh to provision these services. So that's. The other reason would make it hard, even for mid-size, to to launch isps to move to itp manager.

C

Yeah and I understand, but to make it clear for a new ixp nowadays, I personally would recommend- and I guess arnold you two- I would recommend ipg manager. Definitely yes, because that really helps in setting that up. Then, if you want to grow and you have additional parts, you can still figure it out later, but at least at the beginning, ixp manager would be the way to go.

C

Okay, I think we can move on to the next part of the presentation and then which is about fostering the community, because you have built it, and I don't know if that there's a movie associated to a book, kevin costner hears a voice and says: if you build it, they will come it's not entirely true for ixps. You can build it, but then there might be some challenges for operators to join.

C

There might be challenges for cdns to join, so you have to create a community around the the switches and the peering platform and as an ixp operator. That's your role. That's the important part you have here. It is important to understand how you can position yourself there. You can be a creator of community.

C

The first part is convincing the cdns to join. There is a long list of challenges here. There is no one rule fits all.

C

I was having a discussion with flavio a couple of weeks ago, and he came up with also all these concepts like you have to understand, which cdns are the most important for your country or region, because in central asia, probably users are more interested in accessing mail.ru or are more interested in accessing yandex.

C

Then users in western europe are so in western europe. You would have more google, you would have probably more interest on in facebook in central asia. You have different content that people would like to access. So, first of all, you have to figure out what are the cdns. I want to talk the most with there's an example that maybe flavio or luca can explain in a moment in in more depth in italy. Nowadays, most of the football matches are broadcast over the internet exclusively.

C

So, as a network operator, you want to figure out which cdns are distributing this content to be able to provide the best service to your users by connecting to these cdns as much as possible, and then the question is once you figure out who these content networks are? How could they reach the ixp? Where are all the fibers? Do you have diversity or what are the carriers or operators? They can leverage to join, to reach the ixp? And what is the capacity that's available?

C

Then cdns might decide to put a cache at the ixps and use your transit to fill it with content. There are cases- and maybe, in a moment, flavio can mention that. But there are all these parts you have to take into consideration, because it's not just enough to set up the ixp and the cdns will come. You have to convince them.

C

You have to show them there's value, and you have to show them that there's a way to do it, that there is the infrastructure to join the the exchange change and then, on top of this regular meetings meeting with the members with the participants, they are going to help improve the peering landscape, because when you have people who create a community there's more cohesion, there are more contributions that that happen in the peering landscape, which means also very simple things.

C

If the members have real ways of communicating I've seen it in, for example, in the zanuk, the south african network operators group people are so close to each other. They know each other that sometimes they just send a call out. Okay, I need this I'm in this data center and I need an optics, that's slightly different from what we normally use.

C

Does anyone have any optics of this type lying around and then everyone jumps to help many people jump over to help figure out where what can be done, and this can really help a community can really help the whole peering landscape.

C

I've jumped from just a regular meeting to a full community thing, but by giving a chance to people to meet, then that's what you get long term.

C

You get a more connected community and one thing to keep in mind is cater to both the technical side of the operation, so people who configure the routers and the organizational side, so the marketing departments or the ceos counter for both of them in your meetings, make sure everyone feels welcome or maybe create separate meetings that are to do this and then to increase the ability for networks to appear.

C

But some isps have technical meetings every six months, a big meeting with peering one-on-ones once a year, which means that you have a room now with all the restrictions we have. That's. This might be challenging, but imagine a big room with tables where networks who would like to peer with each other can sit and talk and shake their hands on getting a new interconnection or set up just a bgp session. New agreements, port upgrades think about all of this. In one go. There are platforms where you can help your participants set this up.

C

So this is an important aspect of creating an internet exchange and everything that comes around it and then mailing lists are smaller in importance in a certain way, but still important get to know. Who is the new member on the block? The new member on the peering line get to know about port upgrades, get to know about the maintenances, but also have a discussion list where you can help where people can talk to each other, to discuss troubleshooting to discuss what's happening with to their neighbors and so on.

C

So this also helps strengthen the community and its relationships, and then we have people on the call we have rebecca from euroax and we have bijal I'll give them maybe a chance to add to what I'm saying now not only look at community of your internet exchange, but look also at the community of internet exchanges, and in this case there is euro x having a membership where it is not mandatory, will help you in getting to talk to other xp operators getting to meet with them.

C

Getting to have access to resources that these speeds have euro x, gathers 70, ixps and runs mailing lists meetings, both virtual and physical, and it's a platform to meet other isp operators, learn and discuss about all the issues we all see.

C

I pointed to a few things: flavio I mentioned a discussion. We've had I'll ask you first, if there's anything you would like to add here and then we'll also talk to ucha, who is facing similar issues, and then I have a special question for albert after that.

E

Yes, it is a really big topic, the growing of an internet exchange point. I think the first question you have to answer. If you want to build an internet exchange, point in area is which is the real value that you are bringing on the region, and I think that usually the answer could be.

E

Yes, there is a value, because an exchange point is always more or less a value for a region, a country, and so next questions may be something like which is the real value that you are bringing to the local network operators and which is the real value that you are trying to bring to content, delivery networks, content providers or other kind of actors that operate in the internet.

E

And you have to work side by side by thinking that you have to put an eye the local community- and you have to put an eye to the content that you want to bring to your exchange point and then, first of all, as you say max, you have to know as best as you can. The ecosystem in your country you had to you, have to really understand the fiber spot, for instance that enter and leaving your country.

E

You have to know which operators have connectivity in your country and also you have to especially you have to understand, which are the needs of your local community, because you have to put your effort at the beginning by trying to involve content, delivery networks or contents in general that they are a very benefit for the local community, because at the beginning you don't have you have many things to do. Also, you have to understand how to build your technical infrastructure as well and local network operators.

E

I can share with you just briefly our experience that we have in albania. We are building the first neutral internet exchange point. There is called arnics. In this moment we are trying to convince content providers to come. We are trying to create a huge density of network operators, because it is important if you want to involve the content delivery network. So it is not easy to understand how you have to do first, but probably, in my opinion, if I can suggest something.

E

The first step is to create a critical mass of local network operators by sensitizing them about which is the real benefit to be everyone at the same point- and this is very powerful because you are, I don't know, 20 network operators in albania at in in the same data center, and it is easier, not easy in general, but easier to try to involve the cd hands to come and yeah it is powerful.

E

So I think this is the first step create a local community to have more power, to establish, of course, uh discussion with content delivery networks. Then you have to work on the ecosystem. You have to also give back to content delivery network, something which is the benefit for a cdn to come in your exchange point, so you have to to bring them also the value that you are bringing and sometimes the value, is and always a critical mass of local internet service providers.

E

This is one of the first goal and also the first value that you can bring on the table when you are discussing with a cdn to come or not.

C

Yeah I see bahania is a hand up I'll go to vahan first and then we go back to china and albert so yeah.

B

Thank you. Thank you. That's true that you should create a critical amount, but it's something like uh cdn provider says well how many participants do you have and participant says if you don't have a cdny, should I get connected, so in that case the solution might be just to provide the commitment, letters to the cdn provider that these are the participants that are committed to connect to me. If I have a cdn here that might work in some cases.

E

Yeah, that's because yeah, that's because I said before you have to try to, let me say sensitize them just to say: if we are all together, we can do the different. If we want to involve content delivery networks, sometimes you can reach the goal. uh Sometimes it's not easy to share this knowledge, especially for the smaller one.

E

This is my personal experience that, because in albania in annex now, we have facebook, but we work on that for three years uh before having facebook in our facility and the first step was involving the local network operators and the first staff we had is to organize meetings. There uh yeah try to share our knowledge in terms of okay. We can do the difference if we are all together at the beginning. It's not easy, but you can do that if you want.

B

But the last, let's say developments leading to that that even small providers have enough traffic to put the cdn at their premises, and in that case it's quite important to understand why they should come to the ixp if they can also put the cdn in their premises so also for content delivery networks. It is important to show that in any case it will be, it will be a benefit for them to come to ixp if they, for example, fuel the caches from xp cache or if they can position that cdn as original hub etc.

B

I don't have the answer to that. Yet because cdn providers don't make it yet, but but the equation is open yet yeah.

C

Thank you. Thank you, flavio you're starting, but we've had a lot of conversations about how to maybe, in the long term how to attract these cdn. So what's your experience thanks.

G

Max good question, because we have to sleep for georgia, because we have strange situation here yet because actually local smps or big providers, few of them are using international cbs as a tool as a as a power to make money for transit to access to them. But we have also local content, which is also very important part, and I mean the georgian content and the content collocated in here in policy.

G

So what can I say, as you know, and we'll be scaring and with other guys step by step. We are moving forward and our goal is to increase at least start increase. The traffic amount exchanged in the 2000 ix, and after that we will kindly ask facebook and other big cdns to help us, because, right now they are using this information.

G

As a, I would say, a tool against a competition. Honestly, that's the case for georgia, but we have right now uh biggest vocal, cdn cloud. Nine as it starts to create temptation for micro and the small operators to connect and to be with us, and we are hopefully to have like. I said big cds, like on my facebook, because johan also mentioned about the using the facebook, for example, georgia population is 3.7 million, but we have more than 4 million facebook users.

G

So it's very popular here in georgia yeah it's strange because small businesses are also using facebook for e-commerce regions. That's a point for georgia and about the igf nok, I'm uh chair of the small and medium telcos telecom operators and intersex providers. That's that's our network and we are using this opportunity to go forward to unite and to move forward because about 75, maybe a little bit more percent of households are under the two mine providers, and uh 150 providers are keeping the last 22 or 26 percent of households.

G

So that's also case for us, but as we are moving forward, they are understanding important as numbers ip addresses, bgp connection. We have right now sent five uh requests on aes numbers and the right membership and therefore also for establish, therefore before addresses. So we are moving forward and hopefully we have to have a different situation in few months. Thanks max.

C

Thank you now, I I have a question for albert, and you mentioned in your previous intervention that you only have 11 members and then the question is what is preventing you from growing or what do you think is the issue there about growth.

F

Internet providers are connected already, they have a problem for connecting providers from regions because they have to pay already for transit, but they are connected through other big providers and they are using exchange of not only even not only um local also is cdn traffic. For example, in gumry we have a provider who is using a separate line to connect, but not every small provider is able to connect because it makes an additional expenses there, but they are connected ip numbers and is numbers running in armenia are connected.

F

We have in our exchange, so it's no big difference. Are they connected directly or through the other providers? This is the answer.

C

Okay, thank you albert did, you want to add something else.

F

Yes, I would like to talk about about the cdns. I want to say that, as one said, even small providers are able to set up some kind of cdns like facebook, google, but we have only two running in in our and most of our traffic is generated from this akamai cluster, and so I want to say about the pch cluster. We have hosted in our akamai.

F

This age is very important: it's not generating a big huge traffic, but it's very important and very not visible, but we're doing a very good job in our isp vch is providing a huge number of unicast dns top-level dns servers resources, several number of root servers.

F

Our customers are using quad 9 public dns servers so located in pch cluster, and it's very important and- and I will recommend if thank.

C

You actually albert you anticipated the discussion of the next. It's good, it's good! You gave me a way to transition to that part. So let me share my screen and okay. Thank you. Let's get back to that and there are additional services to create additional value. This is the last part of the presentation.

C

Some operators offer these services that are creating additional value and, as albert mentioned, they add a lot of value in a silent way. There is k root from ripen c. You can talk to vahan. If you're interested there is fruit from isc. There is pch offering a large number of authoritative dnss, but there's actually a lot more. You could provide ntp, and here maybe we can ask luca about mtp at the topics I mentioned root. Dns there is an additional service you could set up yourself, that's called as112.

C

This is an autonomous system. Number that's reserved for providing a specific service. Reverse dns queries for private ip addresses, not a lot of traffic over this, but if you set it up, you'll help all the users of these isps to have lower latencies in inside their network, because a lookup for a reverse dns for a private ip address will just hit the local internet exchange and then the answer will come faster and then authoritative. Dns is for top level domains.

C

There is more. Actually there is a lot more and here I plugged in service db, which is similar to what luca already mentioned a platform for ixp members to find and offer services based on the pops or isps where they appear at it's free for the members of federated xps. It was created by namics, but other exchange points can join for free, and this also helps creating more business and more community around the peering platform.

C

If you give members a way to find or provide additional services and they can generate more revenue, then they're more interested in joining.

C

You can find more at servicedb.net, but then we'll ask maybe not flavio, but then maybe we can ask maurizio or luca if they want to also say a couple of things about service db and then last but not least, manners it's. A specific manners program for ixps manners is an initiative from the internet society and there are specific actions in there about promoting manners to the members and helping them in implementing manners as an ixp.

C

When you implement manners and when you become a member, you add value to your exp and you should also help your members in joining manners, and this is a collaborative effort to bring more rooting security to the whole country, because you can be a catalyzer for the full, the whole routing security in the area in the based on your presence, based on how you do filtering, based on how you teach your members on how to filter at the ixp. So this is another, a good selling point for manners for ixps.

C

This was the last slide and then maybe we can ask maurizio to maybe say something about service db. Mauritsu is the ceo right for namex.

K

Thank you very much max. You already have said everything or unless our first goal is to be useful for our members.

K

This is one of the goal that we try to reach also to populate the exchange point even in albania is already flabby state now trying to be useful means have the opportunity to the providers to reach a place where they can have a transit services that is cheaper than their data center, because there are many that offer it or that can have, for example, this content providers available. But, as you say, the exchange point is a natural market square marketplace.

K

That is useful both for the local providers that look for services and they have a sort of directory that gives you the useful information who provided services. Who is the right guys because sometimes, even especially, if you have to ask to a a big company, you have to understand the right guy to ask, but is also useful for the big international player.

K

We think because they are present in hundreds of exchange points and hundreds of countries and to have services like this, that allow them to understand who is in this exchange point that can provide them the local services, because they look for local services, or this, I think, is something useful. That's why we create uh service db.

C

So now very quick question: we've already put you in contact with whichever, but, for example, if albert would like tarmix to join that, is it possible.

K

Absolutely yes, it's freely available and each and we create a function that allow every internet exchanger point to build their own space, and so they can manage their own internet service providers. This is also uh a way to give another rule to the exchange points so to try to organize this sort of market.

K

So the answer is yes absolutely and it's free to contact me. I can keep in my contact. I think I am absolutely available.

F

Oh, thank you. We will discuss a possibility. Of course. Thank you. Welcome.

C

Thank you going back to the services. Thank you, maurizio, by the way, luca. What about ntp is that a service that you see is being requested by your members, or did you see because I know it's a service being offered by topics.

I

Yes, it is, it will be launched in july. Your italian, you know that in august uh almost nothing is happening in italy, but now we are refreshing, uh the membership, our members, so basically ntp. I think most of the audience knows what it is. It's normally accessible on the public internet, but it's also it's often a part of ddos attacks.

I

So what we are providing to the membership is an ntp services, because we have the master clocks directly connected to topics to the membership on a private vlan. So it's almost secure because 100 of security is not possible but more secure than the ntp that you can normally get on the internet. It's provided for free, of course, because it's an additional services for service for the membership, and I think I will be able to get you and the audience an update about the overall catch-up in the next month.

C

Okay, thank you luca. Thank you. Let me ask quickly: alberto is armix part of the manners. Membership.

F

Not yet, but we are going, we are planning our colleagues from isoc armenia to start implementation of mandating. I mean yes.

C

That's good, that's good, because you have a very good iso chapter in yeah.

F

Sorry, I want to say that we have in our mix ntp server, but ntp server is run it by isoc chapter, not by our mix and of course, we have anika am domain located in our mix. In addition, I would say that it's very helpful to host ripe anchor in our mix and we are collecting some measurements. uh Some data analysis we are doing using these credits we have having from hosting anchor in our isp.

F

C

Yeah, actually, I I realize now when you said that I forgot to put the anchor as an additional service you can have at the tix. If you want to know more about that, vahana is your friend yeah. He also carries them in he's in his luggage when he travels this.

F

One he can bring.

C

You one yes, maybe if michalis or angela, you have an idea of additional services, we haven't talked about yet or maybe also flavio. Is there anything you would add to the conversation here.

J

We just want to bring values to our customers and we implemented two years ago, the device platform. This is for streaming for channels to to be easier for the operators to have access to the tv streams. This is an additional services. It's nothing! Commercial is for free, it's for everybody, and it's for free.

C

Yeah, I remember seeing a presentation, so you can check the there's a present five. I think yes about it. So if you want to learn more, you can find it there. It's a nice platform, they've built associated to the internet exchange. Yes, michalis do you have anything to add.

H

Nope, basically, I think that you pretty much covered everything max. I just wanted to point out one more thing that has been mentioned earlier uh by many of you guys and especially from flavio, that, in order to attract new members join the exchange, you have to create some value on the exchange and what biggest value of besides providing a strong ecosystem, a strong community in order to have new networks joining in.

H

I am 100 sure that especially the big cities, the big networks that are willing to join in a national exchange, let's say from abroad, are very interested in finding a healthy environment in terms of cooperation in terms of local networks that are on the exchange that are, let's say, munch, compliant that they have the raw are signed, that they have reachable knock teams and stuff. Like that, I mean that's the most critical part in my opinion, and definitely the ixp operator, the organization that runs the exchange sudden for for that direction. My opinion, thank you.

H

C

Well, thank you michalis. Maybe flavio. You want to add something to what mikhailis has said.

E

Nothing too hard, but I think there are also yes, some small tools that you can provide to. Let me say to enlarge the the number of services you are providing to your community, such as, for instance, you can host some right atlas anchor probes. You can also host the gp holiday.

E

It is up to very useful for your community if you want to give them a service for understanding if they are doing or they are receiving and hijacking or if they are doing everything correctly in terms of our pki objects and this kind of stuff here. But I think I agree with nicalis and uh yeah.

C

Okay, thank you flavio. Thank you fabio. Thank you, michalis. I think we've reached the end of the session, so I want to thank albert. I want to thank flavia. I want to thank ucha, but also luca maurizio michalis, angela, everyone who participated well, arnold, who left earlier.

C

Thank you very much and I hope this was an interesting session. It was for me indeed, and then we see you in november, where we have the fourth meeting here in bahama.

B

Yes, thank you. Thank you max and we'll see you in november. I hope this next one will be dedicated to the regulation that is very important for central asia and caucasus. In fact, for all these newly independent states, it's already for some 30 years already, but the regulation is still very important to have the xps, especially for georgia, kazakhstan and other countries as well.

B

Thanks all thanks much thanks to our sponsors, thanks to our organizers, to iso george thanks to our team of organizers, mainly from isoc, and thanks to our interpretation, I hope everybody that was on the channel have enjoyed it and thanks bucha and albert and fabia. Thank you all. Thank you and see you next time see you bye, bye,.

E