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From YouTube: Investing in IPFS Startups & Web3 Business Models - Lacey Wisdom, Gabriel Anderson, Carlos Silva
Description
Panel discussion with Protocol Labs, Tachyon and Faber on investing in IPFS Startups & web3 business models.
B
My
personal
background,
I
I
started
working
in
cyber
security
for
a
few
years,
so
my
background's
in
computer
science
I
then
went
off
to
to
Oxford
to
do
my
MBA
and
I
started
my
own
company
there.
So
I'm
co-founder
of
Cedars,
which
is
today
one
of
the
leading
Equity
crowdfunding
Platforms
in
Europe.
We
were
recently
acquired
by
by
us
company
at
the
same
time,
back
in
2017
I
joined
Farber
as
a
partner.
So
Farber
is
a
an
early
stage.
Vc
based
out
of
Portugal.
B
We
invest
typically
from
pre-seed
up
to
series
a
with
three
main
investment
themes,
so
one
around
Ai
and
datas,
and
machine
learning,
computer
vision,
natural
language
processing,
the
Big
Data
cyber
security
and
so
on.
The
other
one
around
ocean,
Tech
and
climate
Tech,
so
more
focus
on
sustainability
and
kind
of
carbon
emissions
and
so
on,
and
the
third
one
is
around
web3,
on
which
we've
worked
with
protocol
Labs,
as
Reuben
was
saying
on
on
the
accelerated
program,
and
we're
super
excited
about
that.
B
We
tend
to
be
kind
of
very
active
investors,
so
we're
all
ex-entrepreneurs
operators
and
so
on.
So
we
always
like
to
kind
of
be
close
to
the
teams
and
work
with
the
teams
and
get
involved
solved
tickets,
ranging
from
around
100K
about
to
1.5
million
euros
and
investing
globally
in
companies
that
have
some
sort
of
connections
with
Europe.
So
that's
that's
me
and
Power.
In
a
nutshell,.
C
C
Our
companies
have
collectively
raised
about
150
million
at
close
to
a
billion
dollars
in
valuations
over
60
percent.
Give
or
take
of
our
Founders
end
up
raising
a
round
from
amazing
investors
like
Faber
and
others
coming
out
of
our
demo
day,
but
myself
previous
three-time
founder,
two-time,
ear,
I've
built
Venture
back
companies,
I've
built
in
of
one
companies,
I've
built.
If
you
name
it
at
this
stage,
I've
probably
built
it,
but
having
been
a
founder
and
a
builder
myself,
I
really
love
that
zero
to
one
phase.
C
It's
probably
my
favorite
tell
Founders
all
the
time.
Your
business,
your
startup,
will
never
be
better
than
the
early
days.
I
promise
you
so
I,
really
love
working
with
Founders
at
the
earliest
stages
been
in
crypto,
since
2018
mean
I
came
in
at
the
height
of
the
bear
market.
So
this
is
probably
the
second
and
third
bear
Market
I've
seen,
and
these
are
my
favorite
markets.
Builders
build
and
bear
markets
and
I'm
very
excited,
so
yeah
happy
to
meet
all
of
you
and
thank
you
for
inviting
us
on
this
panel.
B
Yeah
I
mean
from
from
our
perspective,
I
mean
when,
when
the
market
started
to
tank,
there
was
definitely
kind
of
a
a
bit
of
a
freeze
for
for
a
bit
trying
to
understand
where
the
market
was
going
or
not.
I
mean
we.
What
we've
seen
in
other
investors
is
that
people
are
a
little
bit
more
conscious
in
terms
of
looking
at
the
underlying
value
of
the
companies
and
the
underlying
value
potentially
being
created.
B
I
wouldn't
say
that
the
good
companies
are
not
getting
funded,
I
think
the
good
companies,
regardless
of
the
market
they
get
funded
and
the
investors
want
to
invest.
I
would
say
that
companies
that
are
kind
of
purely
created
on
hype
and
where
investors
kind
of
sometimes
struggle
to
see
the
value,
but
they
have
a
kind
of
a
bit
of
a
guesswork
that
eventually
it
will
come.
Those
are
the
ones
that
are
suffering
the
most
in
a
bear.
B
C
Yeah
I
mean
I,
don't
know
that
I'm
going
to
add
a
whole
lot,
but
markets
like
this
one
and
the
founders
that
I
like
to
back
love
markets
like
this.
This
is
where
all
the
noise
gets
turned
way
down.
All
the
weekends
get
flushed
out
of
the
market
and
and
all
the
The
Mercenaries
are
completely
gone.
This
is
where
the
the
true
missionaries,
the
True
Builders,
the
ones
who
really
believe
in
the
future
of
web3.
These
are
the
ones
that
roll
up
their
sleeves
and
get
to
work.
C
These
are
the
moments
that
I
like
these
are
the
moments
that
the
founders
that
I
back
like
these
are
the
ones
where
we,
where
we
get
our
hands
dirty
and
start
building
the
next
leg
of
what
the
the
next
Bull
cycle
is
going
to
look
like
so
like.
If
you
look
at
the
last
bear
Market
amazing
companies
came
out
of
that,
bear
Market,
that's
where
we
got
companies
like
Ave
protocol
Labs.
C
You
know,
we've
got
companies
like
uni,
swap
you
know,
and
so,
like
the
things
that
I'm
starting
to
see
right
now,
what
what
many
of
you?
Probably
in
this
room
are
building
I
think
are
going
to
be
like
the
next
really
big
leg
of
what
we
see
in
web3.
So
no,
we
don't
see
any
slowing
down.
In
fact,
you
know
tachyon
we're
doubling
down
right
now.
C
We're
scaling
up
our
business,
we're
trying
to
figure
out
how
we
back
even
more
Founders,
because
we
know
that
this
is
the
time
where
true
Founders
get
to
work.
All
the
noise
is
getting
dialed
down
and
going
away
so
now,
I'm
I'm
not
seeing
any
slowdown
in
the
investment
activity
at
all.
In
fact,
really
smart
investors
know
that
this
is
the
time
that
you
back
really
ambitious,
Founders
and
let
them
go
execute.
A
And
just
to
add
to
that
I'm
on
the
point
about
dry
powder
like
just
factually
there's
so
much
Capital.
That's
still
on
the
market,
I
mean
we
all
saw
those
like
eye-popping,
like
fundraising
rounds
from
like
Andreessen
with
the
4.5
billion
dollar
fund
and
electric
with
their
billion
dollar
fund,
and
there
are
so
many
other
announcements
just
like
that,
and
that's
just
dedicated
capital
for
web3
and
those
funds
have
to
deploy
it
in
kind
of
a
two-year
cycle.
A
C
I
think
that
the
Reuben
was
talking
about
this
earlier,
the
days
of,
like
a
token,
go
up,
win
Moon
those
are
gone,
and
so
now
it
really
comes
down
to
the
difference
between
a
project
and
a
startup
is
a
customer.
What
are
you
building
for
your
customers
and
users?
What
do
they
need?
What
problems
are
you
solving
for
them
and
are
they
willing
to
part
with
their
valuable
time
and
or
Capital,
Fiat,
crypto
or
otherwise,
in
exchange
for
the
problem
that
you're
solving?
C
So
you
know,
I
I
think
the
things
that
we're
starting
to
see
like,
for
example,
I'm,
seeing
a
lot
of
nfts
now
with
real
utility,
real
use
cases,
I
mean
even
attacking
we
launched,
we
launched
an
nft
tar,
Community
called
Sigma
pass
and,
if
you're
a
sigma,
Pass
Holder,
whether
you're
a
Founder
investor
or
Mentor,
or
what
have
you
you
can
get
access
to
something
called
Sigma
house.
So
think
of
this
as
like
a
distributed,
Soho
house
that's
available
at
large
events,
even
even
here
in
Lisbon.
C
Actually,
we
launched
Sigma
house
Lisbon.
So,
as
an
nft
holder
of
our
Sigma
pass,
you
can
unlock
this
exclusive
benefit
and
get
access
to
Sigma
house
and
meet
up
with
other
Founders
other
mentors
and
other
investors
in
the
tachyon
ecosystem.
So
we're
seeing
like
really
cool
and
creative
actual
use,
cases
that
are
coming
to
bear
because
things
like
the
nft
marketplace
are
are
massively
depressed
because
token
prices
are
massively
depressed.
People
are
thinking
about
what
is
my
actual
business
model
you
know
and
how
do
I
actually
make
money?
How
do
I?
C
B
No
I
mean
I
mean
I'm
just
going
to
reinforce
what
Gabriel
just
said:
I
mean
at
the
end
of
the
day.
I
think
the
main
difference
between
kind
of
a
year
ago
and
right
now
in
terms
of
the
business
model
within
the
web
3
world,
is
that
people
actually
think
about
business
models,
which
is
a
nice
for
a
change,
so
I
think
now
it's
all
about
like
building
just
for
the
sake
of
building
and
just
for
the
sake
of
Technology.
B
This
is
not
a
great
time,
but
building
to
try
to
solve
people's
problems,
to
make
processes
more
efficient
change,
more
efficient
to
help
them
scale
to
increase
speed
to
increase
value
created.
Now
is
the
perfect
time
to
to
build
like,
as
Gabriel
was
saying,
like
I
started,
sitters
back
in
2008
that
was
kind
of
right
after
the
lemon
Brothers
collapsed.
B
A
B
B
I
I
tend
to
draw
parallel
with
what
we're
going
through
with
web3
to
what
I
saw
back
in
the
90s
with
the
boom
of
the
internet.
At
that
time,
I
was
kind
of
like
super
into
it
very,
very
early
days
like
9600
broad
modems.
Probably
you
don't
have
any
idea
what
a
modem
is,
but
that's
how
I
access
the
internet
and
it
was
a
purely
kind
of
Anarchist
chaotic
kind
of
place
where
information
flowed
freely
and
you
could
do
and
be
whoever
you
wanted,
and
there
were
no
rules.
B
I'm
sure
you
can
kind
of
see
the
parallel
with
today's
web3
things
evolved,
but
back
then,
like
most
people
that
I
talked
to
they
were
saying
like
well
the
internet
that
has
no
use
like
this
is
kind
of
super
Niche
thing.
A
bunch
of
kids
playing
around
this
is
not
going
anywhere.
There's
no
business
use
for
this
and,
in
reality,
like
the
internet,
is
more
like,
like
the
the
the
the
the
the
the
blood
of
today's
world,
I
look
at
the
web
3
and
more
or
less
the
same
way.
B
So
right
now
lots
of
people
talking
like
it's
a
bunch
of
kids
kind
of
playing
around
I
think
we're
a
little
bit
more
mature
in
that
right
now,
but
it's
still
very
early
days,
we're
still
kind
of
in
the
very
beginning.
So
the
way
I
look
at
it
is
I.
I
draw
on
my
experience
from
the
boom
of
the
internet
and
I
look
at
businesses
that
can
build
the
new
internet
of
tomorrow
that
address
kind
of
infrastructural
problems.
The
problems
that
we're
still
dealing
with
in
the
the
web
3
world
kind
of.
B
Can
they
build
better
infrastructure
and
improve
the
infrastructure
that
they
have
right
now.
Can
they
build
and
start
building
kind
of
use
cases
that
address
what
the
Enterprise
is
looking
for?
Can
they
provide
better
services
to
the
Enterprise,
because
if
they
can
do
that,
if
they,
if
they,
if
the
Enterprise
players
are
not
ready
to
buy
today,
they
will
be
ready
to
buy
tomorrow
and
they're
going
to
need
it
tomorrow
and
they
will
have
to
start
building
today.
B
B
These
are
the
kinds
of
stuff
that
I
I'm
looking
at
mostly
and
if
they're
targeting
these
things,
then
we're
definitely
interested,
but
more
than
anything,
it's
a
lot
like
investing
in
a
web
too.
It's
do
you
have
the
right
team.
Are
you
guys?
The
right
kind
of
people
are
because,
even
if
you're
wrong
about
the
products,
if
you,
if
you're
wrong
about
your
basic
assumptions
like
the
best
teams,
will
will
kind
of
be
able
to
build
amazing
products.
B
C
Yeah,
maybe
the
only
thing
that
I'll
add
there,
because
I
think
Carlos
said
it
very
well,
is
great
Founders
create
their
markets
right
so
like
if
you
look
at
like
if
we
took
an
analogy
from
web
2,
for
example,
nobody
thought
a
business
model
like
Airbnb
could
possibly
exist.
Staying
in
a
stranger's
bedroom.
Are
you
kidding
me
like?
C
That's,
not
gonna
happen,
yet
those
Founders
to
your
point
about
great
great
teams,
cockroaches
they
pushed
through
and
created
that
market
and
I
think
we're
going
to
see
a
lot
of
that
happen
in
web3
when
I
first
came
into
crypto
back
in
2018.
If
you
looked
at
the
the
dau's
on
like
dap
radar,
for
example,
it
was
maybe
like
a
thousand
or
1500
I
mean
there
was
nothing
happening.
C
There
wasn't
a
lot
of
activity,
but
there
was
a
lot
of
of
Builders
kind
of
building,
mostly
off
of
instincts,
but
then
listening
to
market
demand
and
making
really
fast,
fast
iterations
and
going
through
that
that
iteration
cycle
really
quickly
so
I
think
really
good
Founders
end
up
creating
their
Market.
They
end
up
creating
you
know,
there's
a
little
bit
of
of
instinct.
There,
but
they
can
sense
the
customer
demand
and
they
push
through
and
try
to
figure
it
out
until
they
create
something
that
that
customers
and
users
actually
want
I.
C
A
That's
great
I
feel
like
we're
already
talking
about
it.
So
would
love
to
like?
Have
you
guys
elucidate
a
little
bit
more
like
what
you're
really
looking
for
in,
like
a
good
team
like
I,
think
a
lot
of
companies
will
come
to
me
and
like
ask
what
do
investors
want
to
hear
in
that
pitch
like
what
do?
What
do
they
want
to
see
from,
like
the
founding
team
and
I
think
we're
kind
of
hearing
that
already
like
you
want
them
to
be
cockroaches?
C
For
us,
we
are
only
making
a
Founder
bet.
I,
like
the
the
companies
that
come
through
tachyon
I,
would
say,
50
to
60
of
them
make
some
kind
of
a
pivot
over
that
12
weeks.
So,
whatever
idea
you
have
whatever
you
know
what
your
early
product
looks
like,
it's
probably
going
to
look
very
different
before
you
start
talking
to
VCS
institutional
investors
Etc,
but
yeah
for
us
we're
we're
making
an
early
bet
in
Founders
right.
So
I
look
for
I,
look
for
the
qualitative
things
right!
I!
C
C
You
know-
and
you
can
sense,
that
when
you
talk
to
a
Founder
who's,
really
Mission
oriented
like
they
see
a
vision
of
the
world,
the
way
the
world
needs
to
look
and
they
are
going
to
push
through
to
make
it
happen.
Now
that
doesn't
mean
that
they
romanticize
about
their
technology.
They
don't
romanticize
about.
C
You
know
maybe
that
early
version
of
the
product
that
they
built
in
hackathon
they're
loose
in
how
they're
going
to
get
there,
but
there's
a
there's,
a
a
Persistence
of
grit
right,
so
a
lot
of
investors
will
call
it
founder
market
fit
right.
All
that
means
is
that
this
founder
has
that
they
know
something
about
the
space
of
the
industry
that
they're
operating
in
they
have
an
an
instinct.
B
So
I
I
think
you
hit
the
nail
and
head
like
it's.
It's
a
lot
about
great
it's
a
lot
about
kind
of
Drive.
Is
it's
a
lot
about
passion
as
well,
for
what
you're
doing
and
that
meaning
something
to
you
I
sometimes
play
around,
although
I'm
mostly
serious
about
it,
sometimes
play
around
that
if
a
Founder
is
starting
a
business
purely
for
the
money
and
purely
to
get
rich,
he
is
an
idiot
because
yeah,
our
odds
are
odds,
are
like
that's
a
really
bad
economic
bet
like.
B
If
you
look
at
the
the
odds
of
you
succeeding
like
that's
silly,
you
should
be
doing
something
else,
there's
a
lot
better
ways
to
get
rich.
But
if
that's
a
problem
that
you
you
that
you
it's
not
that
you
want
to
solve
it's
a
problem
that
you
need
to
solve,
because
you
can't
stop
thinking
about
it,
like
that's
the
kind
of
Founders
that
you're
looking
for
and
then
there's
a
lot
of
other
characteristics
like
we.
B
We
want
people,
it's
it's
difficult,
sometimes
to
understand,
but
once
you
kind
of
start
talking
to
people
and
seeing
lots
of
Founders,
you
can
kind
of
start
to
identify
it
like
you
want
people
that
are
like
convinced
enough
that
they're
right
to
keep
pushing
forward
but
at
the
same
time,
are
thirsty
for
more
information
and
are
thirsty
to
be
challenged
like
you
should
be
confident,
it
should
be
a
bit
cocky,
but
at
the
same
time
you
shouldn't
be
so
cocky
that
you're
not
willing
to
listen
to
anyone
else.
Okay,
it's
a
fine
balance.
B
Sometimes
you
want
someone
that
is,
that
is
going
to
kind
of
keep
pushing
through
and
will
never
change
their
mission,
but
is
willing
to
change
everything
else.
Business
model,
the
market,
the
way
they're
solving
the
problem,
because
everything
else
can
be
changed
and
sometimes
should
be
changed.
But
your
missions
should
be
your
mission.
That's
the
thing
that
they
fall
in
love
with.
You
don't
fall
in
love
with
it
technology
and
I'm
a
technologist
like
I
love
technology,
but
that's
not
the
reason
we
are
addressing
the
problem.
B
You
should
be
focusing
on
a
mission
if
you're
passionate
about
the
mission.
Everything
else
can
change,
because
you're
kind
of
optimizing
for
the
mission,
so
there's
a
number
of
characteristics
that
are
really
important
for
us.
When
we
look
at
a
Founder,
we
also
look
at
the
team
and
whether
they
have
complementary
skills.
They
don't
have
to
have
all
the
skills,
but
they
should
have
kind
of
at
least
an
understanding
of
what
skills
they
still
need,
so
that
we
can
help
them
kind
of
build.
A
strong
team.
B
There's
there's
a
bunch
of
stuff
but
I
think
these
are
kind
of
the
most
important
for
me
like
that.
That
drive
that
great,
that
kind
of
need
to
win
and
to
survive
that
passion
for
the
mission
and
a
self-understanding
of
their
abilities
and
the
team's
abilities
and
what
they
need
to
kind
of
make.
The
team
work
as
a
whole.
A
Totally
agree,
I
feel
like
a
lot
of
times.
Founders
think
that,
like
pedigree,
is
the
most
important
thing
or
the
technology,
but
at
the
end
of
the
day,
we're
just
looking
for
passion
and
like
dedication
and
someone
who's
coachable,
so
just
Switching
gears
a
little
bit.
Web3
has
been
around
for
some
time
now.
You
know,
Bitcoin
was
launched
in
2009,
ipfs
and
ethereum
came
out
in
the
2010s,
and
so
we've
been
through
a
couple.
Bear
markets
like
this
is
protocol
Labs,
it's
third
bear
Market.
B
B
If
we
see
that
there's
a
path
to
get
to
that
yeah,
we
still
want
to
back
you
because
you're
still
going
in
in
that
direction,
and
there
are
a
number
of
use
cases
where
we
see
that
like
protocol
Labs,
is
actually
kind
of
a
great
example
of
that.
Like
file,
storage
and
data
storage
like
the
mainstream,
is
still
using
Amazon
Cloud
and
it's
still
using
kind
of
solutions
from
Microsoft
and
from
Google.
B
But
it's
very
clear
to
me
that
there's
huge
product
Market
fit
and
that's
going
to
explode
same
thing
with
distributed
computation
same
thing
with
anything
that
we
already
have.
That
is
already
distributed
and
it's
being
provided
by
the
traditional
players
and
the
web.
3
players
are
kind
of
tackling
that
market,
and
sometimes
the
Enterprise
is
just
not
adopting
that
because
they
don't
see
the
brand
behind
it
like
we.
B
We
always
get
about
the
fact
that
nobody
gets
fired
by
buying
IBM,
it's
a
little
bit
of
that
as
well,
like
people
are
still
buying
worse
Solutions,
just
because
they
are
not
going
to
get
fired
by
buying
the
big
Brands
but
file
storage
data
storage
distributed
Communications.
It
should
be
Computing,
those
are
use
cases
that
are
the
bread
and
butter
of
distributed
models
and
of
web
3,
but
they
don't
have
the
mainstream
market
adoption
that
doesn't
mean
that
they
don't
have
product
Market
fit.
So
that's
that's
kind
of
my
view.
C
Yeah
I
think
you
said
it
great
I,
don't
think
I'm
going
to
add
a
whole
lot
other
than
like.
You
know
you
just
look
at
where
we
are
in
terms
of
like
the
stack
right
so
like
that.
Maybe
the
the
crypto
native
unicorns
would
be
like
a
coinbase
or
an
open
c
right.
Developer
tooling,
like
those
kind
of
things
I
think
are,
are
have
kind
of
hit.
I
wouldn't
call
it
mainstream
adoption.
C
But
certainly,
if
you
look
at
you
know
what
they're
assessing
their
Tam
market
value,
what
have
you
you
know
you're?
Definitely
starting
to
see
you
know
significant
traction.
You
know
lower
down
on
the
stack
I
look
at
companies
at
the
pre-seed
seed
stage,
I,
look
at
like
early
prototype
versions,
so
I
I
tell
my
friends
all
the
time
like
the
cool
thing
about
my
job
is
I
get
to
live
in
the
future,
because
I
see
the
the
bleeding
absolute
bleeding
edge
of
Krypton
web3.
C
You
know
that
that's
typically
where
we're
backing
Founders.
So
there
is
not
a
lot
of
product
where
I
can
fit
at
that
early
early
stage.
You
know
there's
a
lot
of
of
building.
You
know
within
a
circular
economy
but
I
think
if
you
look
just
for
Market
signals
you'll,
you
know
again:
coinbase
openc,
you
know
I
think
those
are
the
the
kind
of
the
the
mainstream
adoption
type
of
place.
A
C
Yeah
I'll,
just
I'll,
show
my
book.
I
was
actually
catching
up
with
one
of
our
Founders
last
night
at
Sigma
house,
a
company
that
I'm
very
excited
about
is
called
weather,
XM,
so
I
don't
know
if
any
of
you
know
them
whether
XM
the
way
that
I
explain
them
is
think
of
helium
but
for
weather
data.
So
they
are
now
the
largest
decentralized
Weather
Network
and
I
love
crypto.
C
You
I
love
crypto,
that
touches
the
real
world
like
physical
things,
infrastructure,
because
you
can
use
things
like
tokenomics
incentive
design
to
create
a
better
mousetrap
and
I.
Think
that's
how
we
end
up
engulfing
a
lot
of
web
2
business
models,
so
weather
XM
is
a
very
exciting
company.
These
guys
rolled
up
their
sleeves
built
hardware
for
seven
years
and
then
layered
on
a
token
design,
an
incentive,
token
design.
So
if
you
have
one
of
their
weather
stations,
you
can
start.
C
You
know
capturing
your
local
weather
data
and
then
put
that
that
weather
data
on
their
Network
and
then
large
insurance
companies.
Large
energy
companies
can
use
that
hyper
local
data.
You
know
for
their
for
their
business
models
and
and
you
as
a
provider
of
that
data
get
to
participate
in
in
the
upside.
Alongside
of
the
weather,
XM
community,
so
I'm
very
excited
about
those
type
of
things.