Jenkins Governance Meetings, 16 Dec 2020

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From YouTube: Jenkins Governance Meeting, Dec 16, 2020

Description

Recording of the regular Governance meeting. We discussed the new year blogpost, trademark usage requests, and reviewed the Jenkins roadmap. Full agenda and meeting notes: https://docs.google.com/document/d/11Nr8QpqYgBiZjORplL_3Zkwys2qK1vEvK-NYyYa4rzg/edit#heading=h.v4sls9rnbtoa

A

Hi all welcome to the jenkins governance board. Meeting today is december 16th uh we have uh several contributors on the call um and the today's agenda is to go through the recent news uh process. The trademark usage request from wish to schlub discuss new year blog post, take a look at the roadmap and at least the topic for jenkins electronic book, which we need to publish.

A

Are there any other topics? We would like to discuss.

B

Is is the new year blog post, also covering the concept of the cdf newsletter? Is that the same the same topic oleg or? Is that what does that need to be not exactly? Okay, yeah.

A

So uh you know we can discuss it separately, but your cdf new letter is basically a summary of key events in the project we need to send to them and the new year blog post is what we use to publish every year and we believe that we should publish it this year as well.

A

Okay, so let's talk.

C

Just a quick question, so that block is that the same thing as the um kind of like a a year recap gotcha.

A

uh Yeah so mark he is not able to join uh today, so yeah I'll, just discuss it on the high level, then okay, recent news so yeah last week, was relatively silent. Two weeks ago we had a major discussion about the outages about new releases jenkins, three proposal and other things.

A

So if you're interested to see news, please refer to the previous meeting.

A

um New events you would like to share today.

B

I guess not yeah.

A

None for me yeah, so maybe uh yeah. On a small note, uh we have started to call for uh google summer of code, project ideas and mentors. So it's in the developer mailing list. There will be also a blog post from uh published today.

A

So if you are interested uh to participate in google summer, of course to have a student working on a project of interest this summer, it's a good time to think about project ideas and maybe submit one so that we can start accumulating the project list for the application we will submit in mid february.

A

There is still plenty of time, but there are students exploring the project and if we have ideas early, it also means that we have better chances of attracting students who rediscover it. During the christmas break.

A

A

Okay and yeah, I don't think that you have anything new to share.

A

So, let's go forward with the agenda, so trademark usage request um yeah. There was a long discussion in the mailing list, uh so the context is that, uh on october 14th we adopted a new policy which is saying that we want to follow linux foundation trademark usage guidelines as they default, though.

A

At that point we made a additional disclaimer that if in exceptional cases, mostly in the case where there is a precedent of similar name being approved, we may accept alternate data, but we set a clear expectation that the trademarks would be that our recommendation is uh to follow our linux foundation trademark guidelines.

A

So here we have got a request from virtuslab, they are launching new product and they would like to use a virtual schwab agency separator service. So the problem with that uh trademark that yeah it's compliant with our previous policy.

A

uh Well, we should be using a couple of years ago and before we actually started adopting the linux foundation one, and if you take the decision we had in october photons, then no it's not compliant, because there are another other patterns uh recommended by the linux foundation, treatment, islands and there was a proposal for vista lab operator service for jenkins.

A

We discussed that, but yet the requester decided to proceed with the original name, this one. So we started uh facilitating feedback in the mailing list. I hear what the words we have. I personally cast it through zero because yeah, although I do not feel strongly, I do not see particular reason why it would be an exception.

A

In this case we adopted the policy and we should rather start following that same feedback from given and we have plus one from mark and we have minus one from daniel based on the process discussion.

A

So right now we have net zero in the mailing list and we didn't get feedback from all board members. Yet so.

A

From those who on the caller alice and we haven't voted yet and yeah would be nice to get your feedback.

C

I think uh for me, if we are, if we want to adhere to the linux foundation guidelines and let's, we need to start somewhere. So um so, let's start with this one um yeah.

C

So I'm for sticking with the linux foundation, guidelines.

A

So basically, it's minus one.

A

And yeah I've taken the conversation, I'm also leaning, towards uh reducing my vote because yeah daniel is absolutely right. If you adopted the policy, you should rather go for that yeah.

D

So I'm not saying there shouldn't be any exceptions, but um I think exceptions make sense when the result would be weirdly inconsistent. So, for example, a sibling product to a previously approved trademark usage.

D

Has a reasonable case for an exception. This one is just something completely new, which is why I don't really think it's a good idea to just go ahead with allowing it.

E

Okay: okay: this is not the same discussion as in the beginning of the meeting or I'm because I came a little bit too late. So yeah same discussion uh same discussion: okay, sorry, yeah! Okay! So I think if we now have adopted the new naming convention, we should stick to it. That makes sense so minus one from me as.

A

Well: okay, oh sorry,.

A

A

Sorry, if I confused you yeah so um yeah, I still feel that we don't have a quorum. I suggest that we wait for feedback from marquee and then close it in the mailing list, but yeah. I think that we either bite the bullet with the policy and it feels like.

D

It's time to do that, a quick question like did you mean to put a zero for gavin, or is he on the wrong one.

A

D

E

A

So, are you finding this this fault or does anyone want to consider adjust.

C

Looks good to me.

A

Okay, so um I think uh yeah we can a bit in the mind at least and then just following the discussion. We definitely don't have strong consensus to approve.

A

A

A

A

A

Should we move on, I think that I'll take action item to communicate it back because yeah.

A

It was rather me who probably overemphasized possibility for exceptions, so I will take action item here to communicate.

A

Okay, so for the new year, blog post, so.

A

We need to post one last year, we posted it after the new year. It was something like january, 7th.

A

This one yeah january 7th- and this blog was basically summarized key- highlights it included project updates. Basically, once we had from the lisbon contributor summit and after that, there will some starts, we collected from different sources.

A

So this is what we've got and maybe it's a format we should follow this year when we had a discussion two weeks ago, marquis wanted to take a delete on this effort and calculate the blog post. um We wanted to have a sync up this week so that we would start drafting that, but yeah marquis might not be available for a while. So um I think we need to regroup and if yeah so next week, latest summary of us will submit a draft so that we can create a new blog post together.

A

Does it make sense to everyone or should we speed up.

C

That it makes sense to me.

B

And to me, I think, that's reasonable, like.

B

A

A

Yeah and on separate notes, we have.

D

Yes, just to confirm: what's the intended publication date, uh we don't have.

A

A strict date for publishing, obviously it's better to do it around the christmas new year period, but if it arrives slightly late, it's also fine.

A

So historically, it was rather beginning of january.

D

Right, okay um seems like I was just wondering whether we're targeting january 1st or what the intended date.

D

Is but uh to clarify late next week or mid next week, is the intended publication date that we're aiming for? Is that correct.

A

Optimistic one, yes, but.

A

So it really depends uh on contributions, and maybe it's a signal that we actually should start it even earlier.

A

Yeah same for the cdf newsletter, so deadline for projects is january 12, but it's again a summary of key events and we have some. So I think that it should be just another document we create and collaboratively update.

A

A

I yeah, I will also create one and again, uh I will coordinate with marquis what is his availability, but both documents, I think, should just go to the developer mailing, please so that everybody can contribute push and we just review them and send off an advocacy and outreach seek or somewhere before posting.

A

A

So do we want to do roadmap preview?

A

I believe so. Last time we did it. It was in november since that I'm not sure we had any major changes. um So there were some items uh here and there which we need to draw.

A

So uh you know we have confirmation that ching's templating engine is now on the development.

A

um We have uh pretty big up in tools and service integrations, because even if there are plugins uh happening here and there uh contributors do not put them on the roadmap and yeah. This is something you probably need to figure out how we do because there are services appearing, um but we need to improve contributor outreach, because otherwise we will always have a kind of gap there. This g-shock project ids on the right.

B

So oleg, can you share some examples of tool and service integrations that are in progress, but aren't on the on.

A

The roadmap currently so we can just take a look at hosting requests, so there are new, plugins being hosted and yeah. Half of these plugins integrations with different tools, got it okay. So thanks. It's a question which of these plugin integrations, are important enough and address a significant uh subset of users to be posted on the roadmap but yeah. I think that we need to highlight some of these.

B

Activities now would we had discussed in google summer of code office hours this morning, a git, plugin or a credentials. Binding topic is that under tool and service integrations as a gsoc project, would that be somewhere else? It would be a tool and.

A

Services- uh okay, section, that's for sure, so regarding uh so roadmap, still highlights a key initiatives with a major impact. So what we will need to do is once uh there is a clear scope for this project. We decide whether it should be highlighted because yeah this year, g-shock projects will be smaller. Last year we added many of them on the roadmap, I'm not sure about this here.

A

So I think we just need to discuss it on a case-by-case basis, but the git plugin is definitely important for pretty much every jenkins user. So it's a rather a question of what we put there great. Thank you. Thanks for the clarity, yeah, so user experience, plugin management, ui ux, revamp it's in preview. There are still changes flowing in, but I would say that plugin management completely changed thanks to daniel thanks to team and to many other contributors.

A

So I'm not sure whether we plan any more major changes. There.

D

I don't, I think, the it's only really major, because it's a collection of many individual minor changes so.

B

Yeah and yet, and yet for me, the delight of dramatically faster, more attractive user interface, more intuitive search, yeah. I agree with daniel that they may have been individual contributions, but I think it's much much better than it was before. That's been a significant improvement over the last year in the plug-in management yeah.

A

I totally support that and I think that we should keep it in preview and maybe move it to complete it with the next lcs cycle, but yeah. It's the subject for your ux6 discussion.

A

Next item. We have configuration ui table studios, so this one is definitely in preview. This one definitely needs more contributors and if you are looking for where you contribute to jenkins, this is something to consider and yeah. You can see that we invented this change more than one month ago. There is still many compatible plugins which we need to address and the clock is ticking because the next lcs cutoff is in a bit more than one month.

A

So by this time we will definitely need to take a look at this dashboard and decide what we do either try to deliver all these fixes um or find alternate solution for me. It's rather push forward and try to get it done, but yeah still, it requires significant time because yeah most likely, this list is not even a final list. Most likely there are other plugins. We still don't know about.

A

So definitely something to consider, and maybe you will still need to come up with whatever compatibility there in javascript, though I'm not exactly sure whether we can implement that back. In previous discussions.

A

Okay, so modernize mirror infrastructure. I believe it's done or not.

B

I I think it is done daniel any any insight you have on things. Oh, like I bet, if you click that you'll see. If you click the link there you'll see it will open for us and I think most of the tasks yeah. I I think it and we're now working again on azure file storage. So so we're back running the way we were before the outage. So I I think that one is justifiably done.

A

Okay, then yeah, probably we should uh close it yeah.

B

And is it okay? If I submit that pull request, you don't.

A

B

Find great okay.

A

Let me make myself a note: okay, then items in progress, um your ux look and feel updates. We still have some stories flowing in definitely the scope you find by uxc hasn't been fully delivered yet so we should keep it as is plugin documentation, migration. We still have a lot of plugins to migrate. um Well, last time I checked we had around 600 plugins.

A

So it's it's a big number, but we still have a lot which haven't been submitted or which haven't been released.

B

Yes, and we did actually on that topic, we did have a conversation raised in the jenkins infra meeting from olivier bernin asking what our plan is for jenkins, wiki and so we've started a plan there in first draft talking about where we go with the jenkins wiki. It's going to stay read only and eventually we need to probably decommission it.

A

Eventually, we definitely need to do that.

A

Let's see what would be the implementation, but now yeah there is still a huge gap to. I feel right yeah. Maybe we could just archive these pages so be it. We don't really need a confluence to display.

A

Them so, let's see.

A

Okay, then, the communication immigration to junkies. I was still in progress. A lot of things happened, but yeah. There is a lot of documentation same for terminology and pull requests get emerged, but everything is in progress, so these columns remains the same.

A

Management administration: do we want to go through the entire list today, or do we want to stop at particular areas so that we cover other topics.

B

Packaging packaging and platform support is one that I would like to be sure we touch on uh other areas are less of less of concern for me and jenkins on cloud. Maybe is one that you want to touch on.

A

um Okay, so I think that uh they are always in the right state. There are many permissions preview, remote and preview of plugin compatibility is still a work in progress, although I would say that the vast majority of plugins are compatible. So probably we could close it as an initiative.

A

There will be long tail, but whatever.

A

The window services and script security, basically they're in the same state. There are pull requests suggested, but they haven't been fully integrated. um All cloud platforms, jinx's, father runner and development that are changes they're, not ready for 1.0. I don't expect it to be ready for 1.0 anytime soon.

A

So just there is still things in there to be completed: external fingerprint storage. It's in preview. It works. There are adopters, so we rather need to move it completed. But, firstly we need to move apis for ge, but I think that this story is solid enough to call it closed.

A

uh Ticked, on pipelines, build step under development. uh There are some changes uh going there. There is a new road map, but it's in alpha, so the state is correct. uh Plug will build clock storage for jenkins pipeline, basically the same so it's uh in preview. Everyone can evaluate that at the same time, it's fully operational. So if you want to you can uh use it, uh there is 3d plugin and a few other implementation attempts pluggable unit test result. Storage uh again it was shipped in the juniors plugin, with positive sql implementation by team.

A

So we need team to comment whether it's ready for ge or not, but yeah. The implementation is definitely ready for preview.

A

The command junk is on kubernetes. I think we should move it to done once the last pull request is implemented. There is still a lot to do, but.

B

But that project that project as a project has concluded zenob is actually continuing to write and we have office hours tomorrow with her okay, that's.

A

Good and yeah, basically, no other changes on this list, so packaging and platform. I suggest that we close here and finish other topics after that so um uh mark. Would you like to summarize.

B

Yeah, so for me there. The summary is that I need to be sure that I get updates made there and we've got significant work going on in the docker image generation.

B

Trying to get towards these multi-plat multi-arch images like s390x, powerpc, arm64 and and the pull requests are in progress will continue making progress on them. I also owe the organization a proposing a doctor image, deprecation policy or a docker image maintenance policy and that I hope within the next well before the start of the new year.

A

uh There is consensus so job, please well, it would be nice to have one.

B

Yeah the the platform sig wants the jet very much because we're we're behaving oddly right now and that's that's. The benefit of a jet is it'll, get us more consistent document to refer to for our behavior. What do we do? How do we choose things.

A

Okay, so any other updates on platforms.

B

A

So yeah, um I think this is a good summary. For now we can discuss governance, uh but for governance topics. It's definitely. It definitely makes sense to have more governance. uh uh Members.

E

A

We need to plan our activity for the next year, so my I think that in january, when all the holidays are over, we will give discussion with willie markey and gavin and kiki tyler and all other contributors who are willing to split in the governance area so that we could.

A

Prepare the roadmap for the next year because currently we completed all major items to be planned for the year. um There are some items like funding which still needs to be addressed, but ultimately you need more content there and it's a good time to think about that.

C

Well, can I also add um so when we uh were in past in person um jenkins user conferences in our devops world, we had a lot of people who come to the booth and say you know, wants to know what's the latest and greatest in jenkins and then um for this year, devops world, the virtual event we also had well one of the top um presentation or session was about people wanting to know what is the latest and greatest in jenkins, and I think that was your session and um and um um oh my gosh, partly oh, I'm.

A

There was a presentation by mark about documentation and there was a top level overview by me. Yeah.

C

I think it was yours that was at a very um that was very uh that had a lot of views on it.

C

So I'm wondering would it be worthwhile for uh for the project to maybe do a monthly, bi-monthly or quarterly update of you know the stuff that's going on off the road map and so that people can see what's the latest and greatest or what's going on with the project? And maybe you know that's an opportunity for us to um ask for contributors as well. I know we're always asking for contributors, but but that's just a suggestion.

A

Yeah by daniel and yeah, I think it would be nice, so it basically boils down to the bandwidth to prepare that um yeah. If we cannot do that, let's do that, because all these materials help we submit a monthly update to continuous delivery foundation.

A

So maybe we could uh have collaborative version um every few months on the jnksio website.

C

Yeah, yeah and um cdf can also help us with you know the um the webinar podcast, what whatever we want to do.

A

Yeah right so, let's keep talking about it and yeah. Let's try to find some time.

C

Okay, I can help drive that.

A

Cool okay, so the last topic in the agenda is for jenkins: ebook approval for depreciation governance board members, assigners of the ebook later right,.

C

Yeah, so a little bit of the background is we took about. Six um jenkins is the way case studies um where we do have uh approval to use their logo.

C

uh So we we, we shortened it very short and sweet into six. Very brief stories with you know solutions challenges, and um you know what was the outcome. um So my ask so at the beginning of this document, uh can you click on the attachment uh yeah?

C

So at the beginning of the document, um there's a letter that it's like a welcome letter and um I was asking whether we could use the governance um members as the signer of this letter underneath where it says the jenkins project right, um but oleg. I think your suggestion is great as well. I'm totally. Okay with I. I actually um think I'm okay with putting my name on it as event officer for 2020 and the um and the outreach sig so um yeah.

A

C

Sorry yeah, whatever this team uh approved for me to do, I'm okay with it.

A

Personally, I would uh prefer to give credit to you, because it's all thanks to you and to sponsors that we've got jenkins, is the way program that we have got so much content and that we've got so much user feedback uh yeah. I would be happy to sign uh that, but uh yeah my contributions, they're pretty much zero.

A

C

Well, for me, it's I'm happy doing it. I I I don't need the credit, to be honest, just just glad to be able to help out, and you know, contribute.

A

You totally deserve this credit. I think that it would be the best outcome.

C

I, for for me, I think it it has heavier weight. It has more weight if it's it's by the governance board, but I'm totally fine what we decide.

E

E

So other opinions, I like the idea to have alyssa's name there.

E

I think it's really a good idea, because you made the work and now you're the responsible person who is you're not responsible, but everybody sees that you've done a lot of things and it's really good to see you here there. I think.

C

A

C

A

B

Plus one to alyssa's name, I hadn't hadn't considered that I think that's great. I all in favor of that and for all the reasons you mentioned all like very good.

A

So my suggestion is to just press it with that. Then.

C

E

C

Right I'll proceed with that. Thank you.

A

Thanks to you,.

A

Do we have any other topics.

A

uh If not, let's stay for a second after the recording and yeah thanks to everyone uh who is watching and uh yeah, see you in the new year. Speaking of that, do we do meetings on 30s.

B

I'd prefer not personally, I would like to be out out on the 30th.

C

E

A

Well, it's easy to find consensus on this topic right.

B

And I think that's a topic where you don't. We have quorum by definition at those present in the meeting.

A

B

A

So it might make sense uh to have uh maybe out for the meeting one week later uh but yeah, let's uh discuss it when we get there.

B

I, I think, that's that's not an unreasonable idea. We did something like that with a doc sig, where we we skipped, one meeting shifted the next a little later so, instead of doing december 30th, do it exactly one week later and then be back on track the following week right that sounds fine to me.

A

Okay, so thanks everyone, I mean I'll, stop the recording and yeah, let's debut quickly, bye.