Jenkins June 2021 Contributor Summit, 25 Jun 2021

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From YouTube: Terminology Update

Description

Jenkins Contributor Summit June 25, 2021 - Terminology Update Track

slides https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Ax9MTbAuhmk26ceiczN3vWBAojDEBE3pByuvLTu_fUU/edit?usp=sharing

A

Yeah thanks again for doing this session angelic and everyone, because it's so much.

B

Appreciated, okay, straight to the point. So what are we talking about the terminology? It's about changing uh how we name the things in the jenkins ecosystem overall, so um the first one is yes, we called uh the jenkins instance master. Now it's a controller and that's easy right, uh just change it everywhere, but no, no, um not that easy. There is in some cases it's the built-in node when we are talking about the node jenkins as this node itself, and there is a see so the the git in the git world, the master branch.

B

So in the community, there is an agreement about calling it the default branch when it's about git. There is also the word that we tried to remove that. The community tried to change since many years. That is still there in here and there it's agent slavin.

B

That goes to agent, and there is also the white list and black list that now um the default name is a low list and deny list, but as we have saw them in the code most of time, you can adapt to the context, for example, once it was about filtering something, so I think we called it.

B

Filter, filter, filter list or something like that, so whitelist or back blacklist usually can be changed to something very contextual and that's all, and now that's not all because terminology, it's also on the ui. So it sounds also about uh what are the word in the other language for everything uh all of this word, and it's mainly also for plugin maintainer. I have a pull request with someone changing words in chinese in russian in french. What do I accept or not is it's the? Is it the right term or the bad term?

B

So it's it's something that uh that touch a lot of a lot of words overall in in jenkins. At the end, any remark question so far. Suggestion.

A

Yes, so one comment that uh sometimes it's not enough to say master to controller, because there are also sub-terms, I'm not sure whether you will be talking about that, but yeah the increased complexity, especially for user documentation, which have so many underlining terms and another issue. We discovered when we were working on the terminology that some languages like, for example, french or russian. They also have genders- and sometimes, if you want to build the inclusive language, a english doesn't have genders in general. So it's easier.

A

But when you start switching to languages you discover that particular terms may be actually non-inclusive in target languages and you have to come up with an approach so yeah. We found an approach for french for russian based on practice of use, because it's not the only use case like that. But yeah. There are a lot of hidden stones. When you start talking about languages.

B

Yes, and also for some languages, I I if I want to remove, for example, slave on all languages. I don't know what is the word in the other language, so I cannot do a github search right now because I don't know all the possibility in our.

C

B

So we had several discussion in the. I have put some link at the end, so we will go to uh with all the documents and links and places and discussion and ho.

B

B

B

B

This is murphy in the five minutes. You are talking all the all the homies it's coming in the room. So, okay, sorry.

D

B

Back to the scope, so yes, but what do we change? The first idea is about the user interface because it's highly visible, it's the first thing, the end user so and there is very few backward compatibility issues, mainly it's about changing some, the same word in some tests that were using the word to verify something.

B

So it's a very good starting point and there is a lot of contributors that have started doing these changes on the ui.

B

There is also the the the console.log so both the job build, console and and the log it's quite visible, still for end user um and it's it's often some strings. So it's quite the same. It's only uh the backward com compatibility, it's only about changing updating some text on tests, but there is also some trouble shooting tools that may grab some log or something like that to detect some behavior. So this is also where the backward compatibility can be a bit adapted.

B

Then there is the documentation part. So I didn't look much at the jenkins I o documentation. I I think it's quite up to date, but there is also plug-in documentation like markdown file. The readme it's it depends on what you consider the user is, but if you consider that a developer that is using the plugin is the user, then it's fairly visible for this kind of user, too.

B

um There is also the code command so when we did.

B

We tried to to update. We began to just do the ui text, but by doing also the change in the cut command you lower the the you make it easy to search if there is still some uh term that you want to change that remain in the code. So uh we I saw- and I saw that a lot of contributors are changing uh comments, also because it's more handy for um the following.

B

Then there is some.

B

Nearly code, but it's something that is generated from codes like the configuration has code, so you can have some term that ends up on the yaml, because it's a viable name on the code or the pack or the the class name.

B

So it's quite visible and the good. The good news is that by using um the annotation symbol it should be easy to keep both the old term and the new term for a while before changing in completely yes. So you can have the background.

B

Compatibility for the jenkins cli.

B

It's quite similar. There is maybe some jenkins li with the term that we want to change. I also have in mind that maybe tomorrow there will be some other term that we wanted to change. I don't have any in mind right now, but it's it's about the overall process.

B

It's mainly, I think, visible to people that administrate the controller so and the backward compatibility can be keep by deprecating, the old cli name and having both the new and the whole name in the same time, and then after a while removing the deprecated one.

B

And change log there have been a discussion in google uh in the google group. um I'm not sure that there is an agreement. uh Maybe I missed the right meeting on that, um so it's mostly the release. No, not not the git change log, because some people asked it's about the release, not that of the plugin, for example. If there is a reason that is five years old with old terminology, do we change them or not? Do we change the past or not it's something that is not decide yet. I.

B

Think- and there is also more and more system property- usually some system property I use worker run, so it should be less used, but uh often the package name is used and if the package name, you have some term that we want to change. Then the term appears on the system, property.

B

I don't have a methodology yet in mind. Maybe you will come with description and for http endpoints, like request to update to to ask some data from jenkins and the url in the browser.

B

It seems to be something that we need to look at one by one. I'm not sure um there is a generic way for.

B

That and the last one is the code itself and the last part.

B

The package name the java apki. There is a lot of background compatibility issue, so I think it's the the part that most people keep for later for now,.

B

And this is the link, so I think that now the main entry point is the the post that oleg did on this course.

B

um Most of link are inside and most information. There is a lot information here.

A

And I will be happy to see these slides also embedded on this page because they are awesome. So thanks a lot angelic for preparing.

B

This update, I will show them uh there- is this uh github project page that I really liked. Netflix did also, and um you can see if there is some uh open pull request or um I think it must put requests and the work that has been done so far you see on the down column, there is a lot of contribution and that's really great to see so many considerations.

E

Great question angelique uh has any thought being given to the extreme names in extreme because you touched on the classes, but extreme is distinct from the classes.

E

I don't know if people uh read the xml and would get offended by seeing a class name something slave in there or not, but we can alias so we can alias um a fubar slave to fubar agent, even though the class name is still fubar slave using xstream.

B

Okay, you mean for configuration file, for example,.

E

Yeah, the actual the actual things that are on disk, the raw xml that if you went to, if you weren't using config code, you were just using the jenkins ui and you hit save.

D

I suppose it would anyway be at least related to the class names james. You know, and their persistence.

E

No, no, you you can you can change what something is serialized as without changing the class itself by adding an alias and say.

C

E

Want I want to save the I want to save bob as fred and fred d marshalls to bob so in the xml fred is always bob, but in code it's always fred it. It kind of helps, move things forward in the fact that people won't complain about the xml contains offensive language, but it removes the mapping that this maps to this class. So it's easy to find out what something is doing.

D

I would imagine that in ideally the things would be kind of migrated. You know.

C

E

Are like a slave.

C

D

The disk you rename the class you put the alias it's understanding that you know it was previously named blaspheme. It's loading and saving at blah blah.

E

You can't change the class name in the actual java code without fixing all the usages of that class. Sure you can change the alias what it's persisted at without changing the class name.

D

Yeah sure, but we know that it's already a big problem and big difficulty. That's the last box in the in the slide right now, right.

E

No, I I'm trying to say, there's a there's, an intimate potential there's a an intermediary part that could be done um that you, you can change the persistence format without changing any of the java code. Oh.

D

Yeah, I thought you were okay, yeah, I get it. I get it here. So you're saying you know if we think that you know changing class names is a is a mess and very, very tricky, which I can't agree with uh just at least changing for now, immediately more immediately more soon, the serialization format is a potential intermediate to say that makes sense.

C

Yeah- and there is another point that is not in the slides- that is the repository names and some at least one repository contains uh one of the the words that we want to remove a last one. I don't know if there are no.

E

Oh there's also plug-in names as well.

B

C

Yeah, it's the same.

B

It's related often yeah.

A

Plugin names uh the most complicated part, because.

F

It requires very serious to work. I have some way many designed for that. uh I'm not sure there is shaded in public or only within hobbies, but yeah remaining plugin artifact id is so complex that I.

E

F

E

It is very simple if you create a new plugin move, all the code from the old plugin to the new plugin and just depend on the new plugin from the old.

D

Plugin, this is just a bit tricky to manage, but it's.

E

It's a pain, but it's relatively trivial and then all you have to do. Is anyone that's dependent on old plug-in? They need to start depending on new plug-in. Instead and jobs are good yeah and it's.

D

F

Done noted as one of the easiest way in my dog, there are still concerns, for example, for configuration as cohort etc, because it will likely become.

A

A source of mess, unless you use full wheel of materials but.

F

Sorry, but still it's, it seems to be the easiest way. No.

A

And maybe so for ssh reputations. It would be an excuse, for example, to redesign the plugin a bit.

F

For windows agents, I will be happy to re.

A

List to do zero and probably fork the code or maybe just duplicate the plugin. To be honest, uh unless there is a maintainer.

F

So yeah this approach is easy, but it also it's also quite complicated.

A

In terms of user impact, uh we shouldn't be thinking about classic, excuse cases. We should be thinking about configurations code. These.

B

B

In time I have five minutes.

B

Maybe what I want to discuss is this. I I was trying to have uh a table with all uh sorry, the zoom widget, on top of my.

B

Yeah so I I was working a way to have all all the world at one table to be able to uh to look at them easily find them easily, and so I started a chap thinking. It was a specification but- and I have no strong opinion, but baby could be also on the documentation on jenkins io.

B

I don't know what do you think about this part.

A

I think that since you have started a jab, you should rather finish it.

B

A

Because uh yeah moving from one form to another is overhead, and while this story doesn't necessarily require jab, uh it raises the profile of this story a bit, and in this case I don't see a problem.

B

What I wanted is to have git history, because I think it's interesting to see when a new term has been added or if there is some discussion on one translation. Maybe.

G

You know it might make sense to for the here. This is a reasonable start, but for the jet to be a point to another repository that actually tracks the the uh like a jenkins, ci uh terminology, approved terminology repository that actually does this separately. So that way it can be maintained uh separately from the jep process.

G

It's like look that we have this process and it's and and that could also be where we would maintain a some automated tool that does uh that does scanning over over jenkins and jenkins repository or or other things like that right, um because I think in the long run, we would want this to be something we where we do automate it to a significant degree right at.

B

Which point yeah we could automatically detect this word in pr. For example, I don't know, I don't have a tool in mind, but I'm sure that it's possible and.

G

Npr's implements.

A

Yes, well, we can uh process dock as well as a source of information, so it wouldn't be a blocker, even if we wanted to put it as this, so.

G

It might be interesting.

A

G

You use the ascii dock as the source of truth.

A

Well, ascii dock is machine readable, so.

G

A

uh Yeah, it might be not the easiest, so in my case I would just advise to not over design because yeah, it's awesome to think about all these tools, but at the same time I would rather let people focus on actually cleaning up terminology and investing too much time in the process at the moment.

A

uh So yeah, that's why I am basically happy with whatever approach just to enable others to proceed with the changes and uh just interface that this changes in any feasible way.

G

Yeah- and I can actually see that, like you said putting in the jet- means that it is like a first first class citizen of of the the project as a whole that that the terminology that we use is this is this: is our terminology? It's managed the same way that all the other sort of jep level things are: it's a design level choice, that's project wide and that we can reason over in the same way.

B

I was thinking also about maintenance. You know if there's some pr about french language and you're, not speaking french, do I accept or not this pr having this table, make it easy. I think.

A

D

A

Yeah what we could do, maybe you could just put a recommended three viewers just to this table as one of the options uh I thought. Maybe we could standardize it a bit because we had a discussion about official localization partners.

A

A while ago, for example, there was a company in russia which translated the entire ocean to russia, and we were thinking about more making this translation of maintainers more or less official, but it was always somewhere in not on the top of our priority list, but for this particular job, for example, for german translate of a french translation, it's easy because you you can just take this call and how many french speakers do. You have well exclude me please, but still you have enough right.

B

A

D

Don't know what you're talking about.

E

Oh, we we have google, perfect, french speaker, isn't it.

A

Well, not exactly google has difficulties with spreadsheet agendas. I can assure you about that. Yes,.

B

Google see me as a male developer, so I have tried on twitter anyway,.

A

So yeah anyway, I think that just putting suggested reviewers here would be the best approach, uh because it's again it's easier, you just put them and then you can figure out a more complicated process. If we ever decide to do so, and I commit to be a review for russian language if needed, and for french.

B

And I am stop sharing because it's time for guava.

A

Yeah one topic I would like to discuss lately is the journey inconclusive, naming initiative as official member uh but yeah. I will rather stuff than in the developer mailing list, because it's quite important topic- and I think that the participants on this call- we already discussed it briefly, and there was no opposition, at least so. Maybe I will start in the developer list right away to save everyone's.

A