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A
C
A
A
At
this
time,
we're
going
to
dispense
with
doing
the
approval
of
the
minutes
until
we
get
a
quorum,
but
we
can
go
ahead
and
start
in
with
the
discussion.
So
at
this
time,
I'd
like
to
ask
the
looks
like
we've
got:
Deputy
Commissioner
to
come,
Charles
Bush,
I
think
you're
up
first
and
bring
whoever
you
want
with
you.
Once
you
sit
down
at
the
table,
please
identify
yourself
for
our
records.
C
Mr
chairman
can
I
mention
some
visitors,
possibly
or.
C
C
And
I
have
some
young,
ladies
from
Louisville
Mercy
Academy
that
are
here
advocating
for
Senate
bill
nine,
which
is
lofton's
law.
Ladies
y'all
want
to
stand
up,
stand
up
Welcome
to
our
committee.
D
Do
I
have
any
other
yeah
Mr
chairman
I
have
one
of
my
magistrates
from
The
Martin
County
Fiscal
Court
here
today.
If
you
please
stand
Cody.
A
A
F
E
Jim
well,
we'll
turn
it
over
to
you
all
right,
I
think
we're
here
to
talk
about
Senate,
Bill,
17
and
I.
Think
the
last
provision
of
Senate
Bill's
217,
and
it
was
put
into
the
law
last
April.
The
emergency
cause.
It's
for
54,
000,
acre
conservation,
easement
for
Access
for
fish
and
wildlife,
and
it's
to
be
delivered
by
the
finance
cabinet
in
18
months
is
what
the
legislation
is
said.
E
So,
let's
see,
we've
got
a
few
slides
I
want
to
go
over
our
process
and
as
I
touch
on
our
process,
I'll
tell
you
where
we
are
in
that
process.
If
that's
okay,
initially
we
do
appraisals
on
acquisitions.
E
The
appraisals
were
acquired
back
in
last
summer,
so
fish
and
wildlife
could
apply
for
their
federal
grants,
so
TNC
paid
for
one
appraisal
for
the
legislation
we
paid
for
another
appraisal
in
the
review.
That
was
all
accomplished
back
in
all
before
August
for
the
for
fish
and
wildlife.
Next,
we
have
to
do
a
title.
Examination
on
the
properties
54
000
acres
is,
is
going
to
be
a
big
lift
for
the
title
attorneys.
We
have
an
art.
E
We
have
a
request
for
a
proposal
out
for
this
service
and
we
are
hoping
to
get
three
different
firms,
maybe
to
come
together
on
this,
because
we're
going
to
be
in
three
different
courthouses
doing
research
on
the
titles
we
expect
severed
mineral
on
this
project,
which
can
be
a
a
problem,
TNC
is,
is
helping
us
out
there
doing
a
title
report
and
they
will
supply
that
report
to
our
title
attorneys.
So
that
would
give
our
title
attorneys
a
leg
up.
E
They're
also
have
a
mineral
consent
that
they
are
going
to
try
to
put
before
the
severed
mineral
or
the
mineral
owners,
so
we're
in
the
process
of
that
the
next
two,
the
environment,
the
environmental
review
and
the
Baseline
management
report.
We're
looking
for
ways
to
expedite
that.
We
have
tnc's
work
in
Tennessee
as
a
guide,
so
we're
hoping
that
will
simplify
the
environmental
and
the
Baseline,
but
again
we're
talking
about
54
000
Acres.
E
E
They
are
preparing
their
proposed
fees
for
negotiation
on
the
survey
after
that
the
Deed,
Preparation
and
closing
and
filing
on
the
property
part
of
the
deed
will
be
a
conservation
will
be
the
conservation
easement
that
that'll
be
the
body
of
the
deed
and
I
know
that
fish
and
wildlife
and
The
Nature
Conservancy
are
kind
of
polishing
that
draft
up.
So
our
general
counsel
can
review
that.
E
Okay,
I've
I've.
These
these
maps
are
the
courtesy
of
The
Nature
Conservancy.
The
map
in
front
of
you
shows
their
entire
project.
There
was
42
250
acres
in
Tennessee,
and
the
54
000
acres
in
Kentucky
in
Three
Counties
are
shown
in
green
there
and
that's
Bell
Knox
in
Leslie
County.
E
Let
me
catch
up
with
my
notes:
the
Bell
County
property
is
31,
000
acres
and
it
has
an
estimated
perimeter
of
110
acres
and
Senator
Turner.
That's
a
rough
country
down
there.
So
that's
going
to
be
a
challenging
survey.
E
E
So
it's
a
it's
going
to
be
a
very
complicated
title,
search
and
survey
and,
let's
see
I've
got
another
slide
for
you.
E
Again,
54
000
acres
in
Knox,
Leslie
and
Bell
County's.
The
tracks
combined
have
a
318
mile
perimeter
that
will
have
to
be
surveyed.
His
attract
was
a
perfect
square.
It
would
only
be
37
miles,
but
it's
it's
satellite
tracks
in
Holdings
each
one
of
those
boundaries
will
have
to
be
surveyed.
Obviously
so,
and
every
time
we
hit
a
contested
line,
we'll
have
to
drop
back
and
and
figure
out
with
the
other
property
owner
and
agreed
upon
line.
So
that's
that
in
in
318
miles
there
there's
going
to
be
some
of
that.
E
E
They
anticipated
50
to
60
miles
of
surveying
now
they're
looking
at
120
miles
and
they're
about
halfway
through
or
halfway
complete
with
that
survey.
D
You
all
procured
an
attorney
yet
as
an
added
by
SB
217
to
to
complete
the
title,
work
and-
and
this
work,
as
you
described,.
F
So
Senator
we
have
an
RFP
that's
out
on
the
street.
Currently
it
will
close
in
mid-February
to
acquire
that
Council
and.
D
You
know
back
in
April
of
well
yeah
towards
April
of
last
year.
F
Well,
Senator
we
issued
that
in
January
1,
because
that's
that's,
ultimately
when
we
were
prepared
to
to
issue
it,
but
you
know
in
working
with
the
nature
conservancy.
At
one
point
we
were
under
the
impression
that
they
were
going
to
undertake
more
title
work
than
we
thought
they
were
going
to
do.
Some
of
this
work
and
I
think
there
was
just
some
confusion
there,
and
so
that
was
that
was
part
of
the
delay.
Thank.
A
Well,
we
actually
have
the
Conservancy
here,
and
so
we
can
have
them
if
they'd
like
to
go
ahead.
Unless
you
have
anyone
else,
you'd
like
to
table
I'd
like
to
to
bring
the
Conservancy
up
and
anyone
they'd
like
to
have
speak
with
them.
It
depends
on
how
many
people
they've
got
you
all,
welcome
to
stay
or
see.
Do
you
have
two
okay,
you
guys
come
on
up
then
and
then
we'll
ask
you
to
sit
down,
but
if
you
have
further
comments,
we'll
certainly
yield
back
to
you.
A
G
A
Think
they
agreed
to
stay
back
there.
They
may
have
additional
comments
as
well.
So
you
are
welcome
to
pull
a
chair
up
there
to
the
table
altogether.
If
you'd
like
yeah,
just
go
ahead
and
enjoy
it,
make
it
a
lot
easier
all
right.
Obviously
this
is
a.
This
is
our
first
meeting,
because
this
is
a
very
important
issue.
H
A
Thank
you,
David
I'm,
going
to
ask
you
quickly
to
just
just
briefly
outline
what
we're
meeting
about
today
and
the
project
that
you
all
made
us
aware
of
and
and
this
unique
opportunity
for
Kentucky
for
anybody.
That's
either
watching
right
now.
That
may
not
be
familiar.
Why
we're
having
this
hearing
and
what
brought
us
up
to
this
date?
I'll
turn
it
over
to
you.
H
Sure
and
I'm
Mr
chair,
thank
you,
I'm,
going
to
actually
defer
to
my
colleague.
She
has
some
prepared
remarks
and
then
we're
glad
to
answer
any
any
questions.
Thank
you.
I
It's
currently
owned
by
Cumberland
Forest,
LP
and
managed
by
The
Nature
Conservancy,
The
Nature
Conservancy
is
the
largest
conservation
organization
in
the
world.
We
work
in
all
50
states
and
more
than
70
countries.
Our
mission
is
to
conserve
the
lands
and
Waters
on
which
all
life
depends
and
we
strive
to
do
this
in
a
way
that
is
Solutions,
oriented,
science-based,
non-partisan,
pragmatic
and
non-confrontational.
Our
approach
is
to
work
with
partners
and
stakeholders
to
find
Common
Ground
solutions
to
benefit
people
in
nature,
so
the
Cumberland
Forest
project
spans
253,
000
Acres
across
Kentucky,
Tennessee
and
Virginia.
I
Early
on,
we
began
discussions
with
kdfwr
about
public
access
and
Wildlife
Management
opportunities
on
this
property.
It's
located
in
the
heart
of
Kentucky's
elk
Zone,
which
is
home
to
the
largest
U.S
elk
herd
east
of
the
Rocky
Mountains,
and
it's
an
area
where
Kentucky,
fish
and
wildlife
has
long
prioritized
access.
I
The
assembly's
support
for
this
project
and
its
direction
to
move
forward.
Since
this
generous
State
appropriation
and
SB
217
were
passed,
the
nature
conservancy
has
been
working
in
strong
partnership
with
Kentucky
fish
and
wildlife,
as
well
as
the
Rocky
Mountain
Elk
Foundation.
To
move
forward
with
the
easement.
We
have
regular
working
group
calls
and
we
invited
staff
from
the
finance
and
administration
cabinet
beginning
in
May.
So
the
legislation
was
passed
in
April
and
in
may
we
did
that
so
positive
action
was
taken
by
the
Kentucky
Fish
and
Wildlife
Commission
in
June
of
2022.
I
Various
items
of
due
diligence
are
underway
and,
as
was
already
stated,
two
appraisals
and
an
appraisal
review
have
already
been
completed.
The
U.S
fish
and
wildlife
service
has
approved
Kentucky
fish
and
wildlife's
proposal
to
use
federal,
Pittman
Robertson
funding
for
the
rest
of
the
acquisition
and
a
working
draft
of
the
easement
is
nearly
complete
in
December
of
2022
Rocky
Mountain
Elk
Foundation
was
awarded
650
thousand
dollars
from
nif
whiff
through
the
Walmart
acres
for
America's
program,
and
this
marks
the
first
ever
acres
for
America
investment
in
the
Commonwealth
of
Kentucky.
I
As
such,
The
Nature
Conservancy
has
a
few
recommendations
that
you
all
consider
making.
That
would
help
us
Advance
this
easement
first
to
clarify
that
Kentucky,
fish
and
wildlife,
rather
than
the
finance
cabinet,
should
acquire
the
easement
while
The
Nature
Conservancy
did
not
take
a
position
on
SB
217
outside
of
supporting
section
11.
This
bill
did
shift
many
responsibilities
from
Finance
to
Kentucky
fish
and
wildlife,
making
the
easement
process
inconsistent
with
new
Kentucky
fish
and
wildlife
authorities.
I
Next,
it
should
clarify
that,
when
transferring
the
conservation,
easement
Cumberland
Forest
LP
shall
not
be
subject
to
the
provisions
of
krs-382
850,
which
provides
that
for
any
outstanding
mineral
rights,
the
subsurface
interest
owner
must
consent
to
the
conservation
easement.
The
proposed
conservation
easement
already
recognizes
that
the
easement
shall
not
operate
to
limit,
preclude
delete
or
require
waivers
for
the
conduct
of
coal
mining
operations,
including
the
transportation
of
coal,
a
pond
or
across
the
subject
property.
I
Extending
the
state
appropriation
through
the
end
of
the
biennium
budget
would
provide
additional
flexibility
for
certain
expenses,
such
as
the
survey
which
take
longer
to
complete
again
on
behalf
of
the
nature.
Conservancy
I
cannot
overstate
how
appreciative
we
are
of
the
general
assembly's
support
to
date
for
the
Cumberland
Forest
easement.
We
recognize
the
difficult
decisions
you
always
face
in
wisely
investing
our
state
revenues.
In
order
to
fully
realize
this
critical
investment.
We
respectfully
request
that
the
committee
consider
making
these
adjustments
and
ensure
that
we
can
get
this
important
project
across
the
finish
line.
I
A
Both
David
and
Heather,
you
know
I
really
appreciate
you
as
when
this
thing
began
to
take
shape
working
with
us
at
a
fish
and
wildlife
to
give
us
this
opportunity,
because
just
be
clear,
you
did
not
have
to
do
this.
You
have
a
board
of
investors
and
other
people
that
you'll
have
to
report
to,
and
you
could
have
gone
many
different
ways
with
this
project,
but
you
brought
something
that
is
a
legacy
project.
A
Last
year
was
for
delays
that
had
already
occurred
when
you
showed
up
to
us,
you
were
already
struggling
having
problems
with
delays
coming
from
the
revenue
cabinet
and
it
was
brought
to
our
attention
and
so
to
have
give
it
a
nudge,
because
we
understood
things
do
happen
and
there
are
delays.
We
gave
it
a
push,
a
significant
push
with
the
members
of
the
the
Senate
and
the
house
last
year
to
help
get
this
along
and
now
we're
back.
A
I
will
tell
you,
as
chairman,
I'm,
not
pleased
because
to
risk
a
project
like
this
because
of
delays
that
are
not
really
making
a
lot
of
sense
to
me,
but
I
hope
there's
going
to
be
enough
further
added
documentation
to
show
me
why
we
waited
to
issue
this
or
why
there
are
meetings
that
occur,
that
nobody
from
the
cabinet
even
attended
workshops.
They
could
have
helped
sped
this
along,
but
I
will
I
will
hold
my
comments
until
later.
I
do
have
a
representative
or
sorry
Senator
Turner.
It
does
have
a
question.
G
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman,
as
I
got
those
timelines.
H
Mr
chair
and
to
address
the
Senator's
comments.
That's
right
when
we,
when
The
Nature
Conservancy
through
Cumberland
Forest
LP,
acquired
the
property.
We
did
a
full
title
search,
but
we
did
not
complete
a
survey
prior
to
that
acquisition.
H
H
Yeah
title
search
was
completed
back
a
hundred
years
on
the
entire
253
000
Acres.
That
was
a
part
of
the
overall
acquisition,
including
the
full
acreage
in
Kentucky
and
and
I
I.
Do
want
to
point
out
just
maybe
a
little
bit
of
correction
to
prior
testimony
or
clarification,
at
least
from
the
nature
conservancy's
perspective.
H
We
have
offered
our
title
all
our
title
work
that
was
done
and
completed
back
in
2019
to
the
finance
cabinet
again
to
give
them
a
running
start
and
we've
gotten
very
mixed
messages
from
them.
Whether
that
is
something
they
could
use
or
would
be
willing
to
use.
We
feel,
like
obviously
title
on
this
size
of
a
property
is,
is
a
really
significant
undertaking.
We've
done
a
lot
of
that
work
and
it's
really
a
matter
of
updating
that
title
from
2019
to
the
present
and,
of
course,
it's
only
been
in
our
ownership.
A
E
I
I
believe
I've
spoken
in
my
comments
that
we
we
do
welcome
their
title.
I
think
your
title
may
have
gone
back
60
70
years,
we're
going
to
be
required
to
go
back
100
years
at
100.,
so
that
that
is
is
going
to
give
us
a
leg
up
with
our
titles,
and
we
welcome
that.
Let
me
let
me
ask
you
another
question.
G
As
a
lawyer,
who's
done
plenty
of
title
work
understands
Knox
County
used
to
be
part
of
Harlan
County.
So
if
you
all
I
did
hear
your
statement
in
response
to
me
that
you
went
back
a
hundred
years.
H
I,
excuse
me
Mr,
chair,
yes,
I
I
think
we
did
go
back
100,
but
actually
we
may
have
only
gone
back
70.
so
I
that
that
may
have
been
a
misstatement
on
my
part.
I'll
get
that
clarified
for
you.
After
the
hearing.
G
Well,
I
would
I
would
appreciate
that
from
you
too,
because
if
you
went
back
a
hundred
years,
then
there's
no
reason
to
do
any
title,
search
and
and
because
title
searches,
title
search,
lawyers
have
to
certify
it.
G
E
G
G
G
G
And
it
got
done
back,
it
was
done
and
I
got
this
timeline
that
I'm
kind
of,
like
the
chairman
I'm
a
little
bit
bothered
because
you
said
that
the
you
contact
the
administration
in
May
fish
and
wildlife
in
June,
and
if
the
title
work
was
done
years
ago,
we
should
have
been
up
and
running
starting
in
June,
not
wait
until
January
of
this
year
to
come
back
and
say:
where
is
the
cabinet
in
this
process
shouldn't
we?
If
the
title
Works
done,
then
you
got
the
survey.
G
G
A
G
Reason
the
reason
we're
concerned
is
we're
trying
to
get
the
biggest
elk
population
there
in
Bell
County.
This
is
connected
to
Bell
County.
It
runs
on
down
to
the
Daniel
Moon
Forest.
It
comes
into
McCray
counting
around
there
and
you
got
the
coming
Falls
right
up
there.
So
it's
going
to
be
a
historical
thing
for
the
benefit
of
the
that
part
of
the
state,
which
is
my
district
and
it's
all
of
our
citizens
District
in
a
sense,
so
I'm
just
really
concerned,
like
chairman
and
I
guess.
G
G
G
We
owned
property
down
in
McCreery,
County,
right
border
I'm,
surrounded
by
the
Daniel,
Boone,
Forest
and
so
I'm
very
concerned
about
the
slowness
of
this
act
of
of
the
government
agency
that
slowed
the
process
down
when
The
Nature
Conservancy
is
done
done
so
much
of
the
work.
Thank
you.
Mr
chairman.
A
Very
good,
thank
you,
Senator
Turner,
Senator
Webb.
Thank.
J
You
thank
you
all
for
being
here:
I'm
sorry,
I'm
late,
I've
been
a
little
under
the
weather
and
about
lost
my
voice,
and
some
of
y'all
might
like
that.
But
as
the
bill
sponsor
I'm
not
happy
with
the
way.
This
has
been
carried
out
on
many
levels.
J
I've
set
the
last
year
and
watched
the
inaction
and
the
lack
of
communication
between
not
only
the
agencies
and
implementation
of
this
bill
that
we
passed
with
directives
and
some
of
the
things
that
have
almost
happened
with
our
Conservation
Camp
contracts,
not
being
almost
kids
not
being
fed
at
Conservation,
Camp
on
and
I.
Think
Charles,
especially
knows
that
my
dad,
you
know,
was
Camp
Webb's
named
after
my
dad,
so
that
I
would
have
probably
been
leading
a
protest
down.
J
Capitol
Avenue
if
that
happened,
but
so
as
a
bill
sponsor
and
somebody
works
in
a
fairly
nonpartisan
Manner
and
has
always
worked
and
grown
up
with
the
fish
and
wildlife
agency.
And
it's
truly
part
of
my
being
I'm,
not
happy.
I
I,
as
the
real
sponsor
have
written
letters
made.
J
Personal
visits
sent
emails
gone
through
all
the
proper
protocols
to
interact
with
the
executive
branch
on
this
matter,
to
no
avail
and
not
even
as
much
gotten
a
response
back
and
I
hate
to
be
sitting
here
saying
this,
but
I'm
just
going
to
call
a
spade
a
spade.
Mr
chairman,
because
I've
been
waiting
for
this
day
and
hope
that
it
never
would
come
have
to
come
to
this.
J
J
I
have
been
known
to
go
down
and
speak
to
the
Tennessee
legislature,
Sportsman's
caucus
and
have
very
good
relationship
with
their
agency
and
Senator
Bell
and
others
there,
former
Senator,
Bell
and
others,
and
on
a
national
level.
Certainly,
you
know
we
can
be
the
envy
of
the
United
States.
With
this
project,
we've
already
exported
milk
and
doing
all
those
things
and
after
the
pandemic
I
think
we
realized
that
the
state
bottom
line
for
that
area
can
be
driven
with
tourism
dollars
and
Sportsmen
and
women
dollars.
J
So
this
is
a
bigger
issue
than
just
securing
that
property.
This
is
a
multi-state
model.
It
is
we're
being
watched
on
the
national
level.
J
We
appreciate
this
partnership
because
you
know
historically
it's
it's
it's
just
coming
together
and
and
and
showing
that
barriers
can
and
differences
can
be
met
and
there
can
be
compromise
in
conservation
initiatives
and
that's
what
it's
going
to
take
to
maintain
the
ecosystem
and
the
opportunity
for
to
maintain
our
culture
of
sport.
J
But
you
know
I'm
I'm
not
finished
here,
I've
asked
cabinet
and
Beyond
if
there's
anything
that
we
need
to
work
on,
because
when
I
brought
this
bill
forward
last
year
after
much
deliberation
work
with
stakeholders
and
others
as
in
total
I'm
talking
about
the
whole
bill-
and
it
wasn't
an
easy
process
and
a
lot
of
people
weren't
happy
with
it
and
that's
just
the
way
things
are
sometimes
here,
but
I'm.
J
Protecting
this
agency
and
I'll
continue
to
protect
this
agency
and
its
Mission,
and
this
is
part
of
its
mission
and
I-
have
asked
for
to
no
avail.
Once
again,
as
217
was
brought,
I
sent
right
there
and
told
everybody
it's
work
in
progress.
This
isn't
the
Panacea
to
everything,
but
it's
a
work
in
progress.
We're
going
to
be
back
and
I've
not
received
any
input,
any
input
from
the
executive
branch
on
how
to
make
it
better.
The
pro
I've
asked
about
problems
of
implementation.
I've
asked
to
mediate.
I've
asked
to
do
anything.
J
So
as
a
Bill's
sponsor
and
a
member
of
this
body
who
was
directed
in
217
many
things,
you
know
I
and-
and
we're
not
done
we're
not
done.
If
you
all
want
to
have
input
in
the
process.
Please
get
with
me
because
it
I
haven't
had
any
input
in
the
process.
So
I
got
that
off
my
chest.
Mr
chairman
I,
appreciate
the
form
and
the
opportunity,
but
we're
going
to
fix
the
problem.
J
We're
gonna
fix
the
problem
and
I
do
appreciate
the
work
you
all
done
on
on
enhancing
conservation
in
the
Commonwealth
in
the
United
States.
A
Senator
Webb,
with
her
her
father,
obviously
has
a
very,
very
rich
Heritage
in
this,
and
the
the
gentleman
like
Dr
Webb,
who
would
have
dreamed
of
something
like
this
I
mean
truly
spent
their
lives,
fostering
an
opportunity
that
sets
in
front
of
us
right
now
to
for
us
to
have
any
delay,
and
it
would
be
just
boggles
them
to
their
mind.
To
think
that
we
would
be
putting
this
off
David
just
quickly.
We
have
the
Rocky
Mountain
Elk
Foundation
is
going
to
come
speak,
but
how
much
time
do
you
all
have
I
know?
A
We've
we've
wasted
a
few
years
here
trying
to
get
this
thing
where
it
should
be,
and
there's
a
lot
of
steps
we
can
take
before
this
session's
over
with
to
make
this
go
much
quicker
for
you,
and
hopefully
we
will,
but
but
how
much
time
before
you
all
have
to
start
looking
at
maybe
a
different
person
or
group
to
purchase
this.
This
opportunity.
H
Thank
you,
Mr
chair
and
can
I
just
say
thanks
to
Senator
Webb,
for
your
comments
and
appreciation
for
our
work.
I
really
appreciate
that
I
think
our
primary
concerns.
Mr
chair
are
timing.
Deadlines
Associated,
both
with
the
general
assemblies
appropriation
and
the
federal
funding
there
are
timelines
on
that
that
are
are,
will
come
due
before
our
investors
lose
patience,
but
they
are
certainly
watching
this
very
closely.
This
is
a
this
is
a
unique
set
up
for
The
Nature
Conservancy.
H
Normally
it's
it's
us
and
we
are
the
sole
decision
makers
and
we
are
the
managing
partner
in
the
LLC.
So
decisions
on
how
Wildlife
is
managed
how
Timber
is
managed
that
rests
with
the
nature
conservancy,
but
we
have
a
fiduciary
responsibility
to
our
investors
and
the
whole
model
for
us
in
this
project
is
to
prove
that
private
investors
can
do
well
by
doing
good
on
the
ground
and
doing
good
for
local
communities.
H
So
we
got
to
have
both
halves
of
it
work
we
have
to
have
the
conservation,
be
a
shining
example,
and
we
also
have
to
deliver
these
returns
to
our
investors,
and
so
that
timeline
is,
is
not
as
steep
as
the
federal
funding,
but
folks
are
are
watching,
and
they
certainly
want
to
see
progress
and
and
being
able
to
complete
this
deal.
This
calendar
year
would
be
a
big
big
step
forward
for
the
project.
So
that's
what
we're
really
focused
on
timeline,
wise,
very
good.
A
A
F
May
I
address
Senator
Turner
and
Senator
Webb's
comments.
F
May,
in
terms
of
the
survey
you
had
asked,
questions
about
you
know,
did
the
Commonwealth
need
complete
a
both
a
survey
and
title
work
for
the
for
the
property
and
yes
under
state
law.
We
are
required
to
both
do
a
survey
and
and
title
work
for
the
property,
and
so,
as
we've
testified
previously,
we
are
have
issued
an
RFP
for
the
title
work
and
we
have
a.
We
have
are
talking
to
a
survey
a
vendor
to
complete
that
work
on
our
behalf
and
Senator
Webb,
you
know.
F
Certainly
we
are,
you
know,
would
be
happy
to
speak
with
you
if
you
have
any
questions
or
concerns
about
the
about
the
project,
to
try
to
try
to
allay
those.
Those
particular.
A
We're
good
at
this
time,
Senator
Turner,
please.
F
G
F
I'd
have
to
disagree.
I
think
we
are
compelled
by
state
law
to
to
do
title
work.
G
So
if
a
done
law
firms,
it's
probably
done
work
for
you,
I
was
done
certified
and
done
for
the
Nature
Preserve
done
certified
a
title.
100
Year
title
of
that
you're
telling
this
body
that
the
state
agency
that
you
working
under
the
Governor
from
the
one
of
those
ages
are
going
to
redo.
That
again,
is
that
what
you're
selling
me
so.
F
We
will
we
will
bid
that
project
out.
The
the
attorney
that
is
chosen
or
attorneys
that
are
chosen
may
look
at
the
title
work
that
was
previously
done
and
if
they
can
utilize
that
title
work,
we
would
certainly
encourage
that.
G
Well,
I
would
request
that
we
be
made
aware
of
that
and
before
that's
done,
I
hope
we'll
drag
somebody
back
over
from
your
agency,
whoever
you're
directly
doing
that
from
to
get
that
cleared
up,
because
that's
going
to
be
a
waste
of
time
and
you've
heard
the
urgency
of
the
federal
money
taxpayer
dollars,
because
a
title
search
is
a
title
search
is
a
title
search
under
Kentucky
law.
It's
got
to
be
certified
on
the
Supreme
Court
rules
that
lawyers
that
do
it
and
for
the
state
to
duplicate
that
would
be
pure
waste.
G
G
I
want
somebody
to
certify
to
us
this
body
that
we're
this
group
that
they're
under
the
law
of
Kentucky
that
they
have
to
do
another
title
search,
because
we
as
legislators
can
shortchange
that
you
know
not
real
quick
time.
We
can
do
a
bill
in
one
day
to
change
that
rule.
To
get
this
thing
moving.
Would
you
please
keep
us
advised
with
that,
go
back
and
talk
to
whoever
your
superiors
are
and
report
to
us,
whether
you're
going
to
have
to
do
another
title
search?
Can
you
do
that.
G
A
K
Thank
you.
There
we
go
that's
better,
so
the
Rocky
Mountain
Elk
Foundation
I,
am
our
senior
conservation
program
manager
covering
all
the
Eastern
United
States.
K
First,
obviously,
thank
you,
chairman
Smith
and
committee
members
for
the
opportunity
to
speak
today
and
offer
some
insight
on
this
entire
project
a
little
bit
first
about
remef,
since
1995
rmef
and
our
partners
have
completed
194
projects
in
Kentucky's
elk
Zone,
and
these
have
a
combined
value
of
currently
we're
sitting
at
over
9.9
million
dollars.
We've
invested
in
this
area
and
conserving
or
enhancing
over
6
400
Acres
of
habitat
in
this
elk
zone.
K
So
rmef
absolutely
has
a
vested
interest
in
Kentucky's
Elkhart
and,
despite
all
of
our
financial
commitments
to
date,
all
of
our
successes
and
accomplishments.
To
date,
this
CFA
Tire
project
is
is
the
most
impactful
eastern
project
that
we've
been
involved
with.
Since
our
organization
was
founded
in
1984..
K
You
know
thinking
about
a
public
land
in
Kentucky.
You
know
it's
important
to
when
you
look
at
these
Parcels
across
the
state.
The
the
three
largest
public
land
units
are
all
federally
owned
and
that
accounts
for
roughly
854
000
Acres,
this
CFA
Thai
property.
At
54,
000
acres
is
the
fourth
largest
public
land
unit
in
this
state
and
it's
the
largest
privately
owned
tract-
that's
enrolled
in
a
public
access
program.
K
So
it's
critical
for
sportsmen
and
women
to
have
access
to
this
and
that
access
currently
is
granted
via
a
Wildlife
Management
Area
agreement
between
TNC
and
Department
of
Fish
and
Wildlife,
and,
what's
so
important
critical
to
remember
here,
is
the
the
financial
plan
for
this
project
with
TNC.
This
property
will
be
sold
in
the
coming
years
and
without
this
easement
Ernie's
may
like
it
in
place.
You
know
a
future
landowner
with
no
public
interest
and
with
no
interest
in
public
access.
K
This
could
be
lost
absolutely
and
currently
it
accounts
for
nine
percent
of
the
public
land
entirely
within
the
Eastern
elk
Zone.
So
the
easement
itself,
you
know
most
folks,
don't
realize
RMF
has
a
land
protection
division,
so
this
is
right
up
our
alley.
Tnc
was
a
natural
fit
partnering
with
this,
so
looking
at
the
structure
of
an
easement,
what
it
does.
Yes,
it
does
protect
the
the
conservation
values
of
the
property
limits.
K
In
addition
to
those
conservation
values
me
personally,
I'm
biased
the
one
of
the
most
critical
components
here
is
has
been
discussed
prior
is
the
permanent
Public
Access
that
would
be
granted
that
managing
authority
to
Fish
and
Wildlife
so
collectively.
This
project
is
going
to
conserve
and
protect
54
000
Acres
of
public
access
in
perpetuity
in
the
kickers.
That's
regardless
of
the
future
landowner
status.
So
this
is
forever,
and
this
is
for
all
Sportsmen
and
women
of
Kentucky.
K
You
know
within
the
boundary
the
elk
Zone
itself,
there's
about
six
hundred
thousand
acres
of
public
land
I
believe
almost
all
those
lands
they're
not
owned
in
fee
title
they're
public,
because
they're
enrolled
in
some
form
of
often
voluntary
Public
Access
agreement.
However,
about
39
of
those
access
agreements
contain
a
30-day
out
clause
so
that
loaner
can
opt
out
30
calendar
days.
You
can
imagine
the
frustration
of
Sportsmen
and
women
not
to
mention
the
Department
of
Fish
and
Wildlife.
K
If
one
of
these
landowners
has
opt
out
a
month,
two
months
before
the
onset
of
an
elk
season,
that'd
be
devastating
with
regards
to
Public
Access
under
the
current
strategy
with
this
easement
that
that
scenario
would
not
come
to
fruition
with
kdfwr
having
permanent
Management
Authority
that
solves
that
problem.
It's
done.
A
Stephen
can
I
ask
you
a
question.
Absolutely
the
survey
was
just
awarded
you
all
I
understand
a
greater
offer
to
pay
for
the
survey.
Is
that
correct?
We.
A
K
Denied
we
were,
we
have
volunteered
to
to
participate
in
any
way
and
to
participate,
means
pay
the
bill.
We
can
do
that.
We
can
work
towards
that,
but
it's
my
understanding
that
that
Finance
is
now
moving
towards
the
the
two
components
that
we
looked
at
were
the
environmental
assessment
and
the
Baseline
report,
which
is
required
for
the
conservation
easement.
So
it's
minus
I've
been
informed
that
that
process
is
moving
forward
within
Finance.
K
A
Well
and
that's
what
I?
That's
what
just
floored
me
I'm,
sorry
to
dump
me
to
cut
you
off,
but
I've
just
been
I've,
been
notified
that
you
all
had
had
secured
the
funds
and
had
agreed
to
pay
for
it
and
and
that
finances
decided,
they're
they're
going
to
go
on
their
own
without
without
your
money
to
do
it.
A
I
just
I,
just
godsmacked,
by
how
this
thing
keeps
taking
twists
and
turns
that
seem
to
make
no
sense
to
me
other
than
that
the
delays,
the
project
in
this
case
we're
here,
just
pay
waste
good
tax
dollars
that
could
be
spent
for
something
else
and
in
doing
so
further
delays
the
project
in
there
I
mean
I
I,
don't
know
I
mean
maybe
I
can't
only
the
Deputy
Commissioner
could
answer
this.
A
Maybe
you
all
don't
want
this
project
or
something
I'm
missing
it,
but
it
seems
to
me
that
that's
a
hard
one
to
swallow
that
this
this
young
gentleman
here
is
organizations
offered
to
pay
for
it,
and
then
I'm
told
right
here
that
finances
said
no.
Thank
you
we're
going
to
go
a
different
route.
E
A
A
Well,
good,
listen!
We
will
make
that
duly
noted
here
publicly
that
you
all
have
agreed
for
the
revenue
to
accept
the
funding
from
the
Rocky
Mountain
Elk
Foundation,
and
you
all
agreed
to
raise
it
and
that'll
help
us
get
over
that
hurdle,
and
that's
good
news
I'll
make
sure
that
that's
a
duly
noted
here
but
I
have
represented
sorry.
Senator
Webb
has
a.
K
Sure
you
know
last
thing
I
want
to
touch
on
was,
and
it's
something
it's
the
financial
impacts
of
this
and
it's
with
respect
to
hunting,
and
this
is
often
overlooked
in
the
sense
that
2020,
the
Sportsman's
Alliance,
indicate
or
published
a
national
economic
impact
study.
Looking
at
by
state
even
legislative
districts,
it
was
pretty
phenomenal,
actually
collectively
what
they
pulled
from
the
Kentucky
data
Illustrated
that
Sportsmen
and
women
in
Kentucky.
K
It
had
spent
between
1.2
to
1.6
billion
dollars
in
hunting
related
purchases.
I
mean
it's
a
significant
Revenue
stream
that
most
people
outside
of
the
sporting
World
Overlook
closer
to
home,
the
Department
of
Fish
and
Wildlife
implements
a
post
elk
Hunter
survey
annually
to
gauge
Hunter
satisfaction,
but
as
well
as
some
of
the
financials,
the
most
recent
report.
These
are
all
available
online
for
which
data
is
is
available.
2021
revealed
that
Hunters
pursuing
Elkin
Kentucky
that
responded
to
the
survey
spent
1.4
million
dollars
in
those
local
communities
and
there's
two
important
things
there
that
money.
K
This
is
not
dollars
going
toward
hunting
licenses
or
apartment
application
process.
This
is
economy.
That's
pumped
right
back
into
the
ground
on
the
ground.
In
these
communities
for
fuel
gas
lodging
guides
equipment,
so
it's
a
critical
Revenue
source,
that's
an
understatement
or
underestimate,
because
you
know
we
only
have
data
from
those
that
return.
The
survey
so
there's
a
extrapolation
factor
that,
when
it's
applied
to
broaden
this
across
all
Sportsmen
and
women,
because
we
know
how
many
people
are
hunting
alcohol
permits
required.
That
number
is
actually
about
3.62
million
dollars.
K
K
So
the
significance
of
those
revenue
streams
are
critical,
especially
to
those
areas
that
depend
on
it
as
an
additional
income
source
and,
as
most
of
us
know
here,
that's
especially
true
in
Eastern
Kentucky
and
many
of
those
counties
so
in.
In
closing,
it's
my
hope
that
we've
Illustrated
the
significance
and
the
importance
of
this
project,
but
also
the
the
public
access
component
that
can't
be
under
understated,
Army,
F
and
TNC.
K
We
are
extremely
grateful
for
the
legislative
appropriation
that
was
received
last
year
towards
this
project,
that
field
of
very
important
funding
Gap,
and
it's
going
to
help
bring
this
to
fruition.
We
just
want
to
resolve
or
solve
some
of
these
issues,
creating
delays
and
ensure
that
we
can
get
the
due
diligence
done
collectively
and
meet
these
timelines
to
do
it
in
a
fashion,
because
TNC
has
you
know,
their
investors
have
have
an
interest
and
and
seeing
this
come
to
fruition.
So
you
know
with
regards
to
Senate
Bill,
217
and
section
11..
K
My
request
is
similar
to
that
at
TNC.
We
would
simply
ask
you,
please
consider
clarification
of
who,
whether
kdfwr
Finance
as
final
signing
Authority
with
regards
to
procurement
of
the
property
itself
and
or
the
due
diligence
associated
with
it,
also
we'd
like
to
evaluate
whether
the
CFA
Thai
easement
could
be
precluded
from
KRS
382
850..
That
requires
written
landowner.
Consent
for
the
easement
can
be
transferred
because
we
thought
in
this
case
it
doesn't
really
apply
the
the
minimum
right
owners.
Those
rights
are
not
impeded
if
this
easement
is
established
and.
B
K
Again,
as
Heather
mentioned,
considering
amending
timelines
associated
with
when
we
can
spend
this
legislative
money,
because
we
have
due
diligence
to
get
done
and
we,
those
funds
are
going
to
be
critical
for
that
and
then
the
ultimate
closing
timeline
as
well
to
ensure
that
we
get
it
all
done
when
we
need
to
get
it
done,
it's
you
know,
I'm,
obviously
biased.
It's
a
wonderful
project,
I
appreciate
the
opportunity
to
speak
on
this
behalf
and
if
no
one
else
remembers
anything
else.
K
I
said
today
know
this:
the
CF
attire
easement
project
at
54,
000
Acres
in
the
heart
of
the
Southern
Appalachians.
This
is
truly
a
historic
opportunity
for
for
Kentucky
and
I
can
assure
you
it's
one
that
will
be
recognized
nationally.
It's
already
getting
that
much
attention.
So
thank
you.
A
J
Appreciate
you
and
all
the
work
that
you
all
do
and
I
I'm
pretty
sure
we're
going
to
alleviate
clarifying
alleviate
your
concerns
regarding
the
project
and
it
will
get
going,
but
I
I
just
want
to
take
the
time
you
know.
I
I
was
lucky
enough
to
get
a
cow
tag
in
Montana
didn't
get
an
elk
because
it's
too
cold.
They
were
a
lot
smarter
than
us.
They
weren't
moving.
J
You
know,
but
I
dropped,
several
thousand
dollars
in
Montana
economy
and
so
I
can
attest
to
the
fact
that
you
know
it's
a
money
maker
for
this,
but
Public
Access
is
crucial
and
we
have
an
agency,
that's
funded
by
the
sales
of
licenses
and
we're
you
know
if
we
run
out
of
public
access.
J
This
is
a
problem
throughout
the
nation,
we're
killing
our
own
fish
and
wildlife
agencies
and
they
are
in
the
Forefront
of
conservation,
but
I
also
wanted,
as
as
president
of
the
national
Sportsman's
caucus
legislative
caucus
and
then
we're
now
in
50
states
and
I
just
want
to
thank
the
Rocky
Mountain
Elk
Foundation
for
always
being
there
for
us
in
the
20
years
that
we've
been
in
existence
and
looking
out
for
the
sports,
men
and
women
of
the
country
and
the
habitat
of
these
animals
that
bring
other
animals
I
mean
it
restores
his
historic
Echo
cycle
ecosystems
to
to
the
Appalachians
and
and
Beyond
so
I
appreciate
you
and
I
would
just
urge
Sportsmen
and
women
to
support
the
Rocky,
Mountain,
Elk,
Foundation
and
and
what
they
do,
because
we're
getting
return
on
that
investment.
J
A
You
folks
we're
going
to
wrap
up
here.
I
want
to
thank
everyone
that
testified
for
us
today.
David,
you
and
Heather
have
done
an
amazing
job
and
sort
of
been
the
Catalyst
of
bringing
this
to
us.
But
I
can
assure
everyone
here
and
I
will
not
let
this
project
go.
It
is
too
big.
It
is
beyond
us
up
here
and
and
people
like
Doug,
Hensley
and
Dr
Webb,
and
so
many
others
that
went
ahead
of
us
to
give
us
this
opportunity
for
you
to
even
select
us
so
one
thing's
for
sure.
A
If
we
don't
spend
this
Federal
money,
some
other
state,
will
the
state
of
Kentucky
has
our
work
cut
out
for
us.
We
don't
need
to
leave
this
on
the
table.
We
talk
about
a
legacy,
the
Legacy
that
would
be
left.
If
we
don't
do
this
and
somebody
else
take
it
so
be
one
that
I'll
be
no
part
of.
So
with
that
said,
we
stand
adjourned.