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A
C
Mr
chairman
and
members
of
this
committee
house,
bill
144
is
a
familiar
piece
of
legislation
to
this
committee
and
to
the
general
assembly.
We
passed
this
in
the
form
of
house
bill
413
in
the
last
legislative
session.
C
When
we
passed
this
in
2021,
it
was
the
idea
that
this
would
give
local
our
small
businesses
in
our
districts
and
our
communities
a
reprieve
from
the
the
taxes
that
were
expected
to
go
up
at
about
a
hundred
dollars
per
employee
because
of
the
depletion
of
the
unemployment
trust
fund.
Due
to
the
large
number
of
of
claims
filed
against
that
fund,
that
bill
did
pass
both
chambers
and
went
to
the
governor
and
the
governor
vetoed
the
second
year,
which
is
the
year
we're
in
right
now
2022.
C
That
veto
was
not
overridden
and
we
ca.
We
are
back
today
with
this
bill
that
would
freeze
these
rates.
Just
for
the
year.
2022
employers
will
see
a
jump
to
schedule
c
if
we
don't
freeze
these
rates,
and
that
is
averaging
about
a
70
tax
increase
for
them
per
employee
in
their
business.
C
I
think
this
is
an
important
bill
because
it
does
help
folks
who
are
still
struggling
right
now,
as
we've
all
heard
from
our
constituents
and
those
in
our
districts,
the
shutdowns
had
a
negative
effect
on
them,
we're
seeing
a
labor
shortage
right
now,
you
know.
Just
last
night
I
passed
a
busy
restaurant
in
my
hometown
that
normally
on
a
weeknight,
you
would
see
a
long
line
through
the
drive-through
up
until
10,
30
or
11
o'clock.
C
D
Chairman
members
of
the
committee,
we
are
happy
to
be
back
again
this
year
in
support
of
this
legislation.
We
do
believe
it
is
still
warranted
and
necessary,
as
we
continue
to
recover
from
the
pandemic.
It's
been
quite
some
time
from
those
early
days
of
the
pandemic,
when
businesses
were
forced
to
close
or
greatly
curtail
their
operations
to
stop
the
spread
of
the
virus,
and
so
we
do
think
it's
important
to
do
a
second
year
of
the
tax
freeze,
70
per
employee
savings
on
average.
D
Even
if
you
were
to
provide
the
appropriation
which
is
in
house
bill,
1
of
the
trust
to
the
trust
fund,
the
tax
would
still
remain
at
that
higher
tax
at
schedule
c
without
this
bill.
So
we
do
think
that
this
is
important.
It
is
certainly
necessary
to
help
businesses
continue
to
recover.
We
are
struggling
with
a
labor
shortage
in
kentucky.
E
C
D
E
Second
question,
mr
chairman:
so
necessarily
when
we
freeze
the
rates
and
the
wage
base,
it
necessarily
creates
for
lack
of
a
better
term,
an
unfunded
liability
in
the
ui
system,
and
something
has
to
fill
that.
There's
no
appropriation
contained
in
this
bill
to
do
so,
but
necessarily
unless
we
want
to
create
unfunded
liability,
we
will
have
to
have
a
funding
mechanism
down
the
road
that
is
correct,
gotcha
all
right.
Thanks,
guys,
senator.
F
What
I'm
trying
to
find
out
is
this
year
are
we
are
we
really
in
the
same
place,
because
obviously
we
need
our
businesses
up
and
going,
and
I
I'll
get
to
why?
I
think
we
also
have
issues
there,
but
right
now,
if
moving
forward,
if
businesses
are
not
paying
their
full
amount
in
as
senator
mcdaniel
just
mentioned,
then
we're
having
an
unfunded
liability.
F
Is
this
not
specifically
to
that
business?
If
somebody
now
becomes
unemployed
like
starting
from
now
or
I'm
having
a
hard
time
figuring
out,
if
you
have
just
hired
somebody,
you
know
a
month
or
two
ago
whatever,
then
they
get
let
go.
Are
they
getting?
Let
go
because
of
a
government
cause?
Are
they
getting
let
go
because
of
something
else
and
to
where
this
needs
to
be
in
the
private
market?.
C
I
guess
I'll
I'll
answer
your
question
to
say,
as
I've
told
folks,
if,
if
we
don't
help
these
businesses
get
over
this
hump
that
they're
recovering
from
we're
going
to
have
folks
going
out
of
business,
not
to
count
the
ones
that
have
already
gone
out
of
business
and
they're
struggling
right
now,
and
so
this
gives
them
a
reprieve
on
their
on
their
tax
bill.
C
F
Mr
chairman,
can
I
follow
up
so,
and
I
appreciate
that
because,
obviously
this
is
a
big
issue,
but
I
want
to
at
least
stick
this
on
our
radar
because,
as
we're
talking
about
businesses
trying
to
get
out
the
gate,
you
know
the
same
problem.
You
know
with
across
our
entire
society
everyone's
trying
to
get
back
going
and
the
thing
that
I'm
looking
at
right
now
that
everything
keeps
coming
back
down
to.
Is
these
mandatory
quarantines?
F
Now
it's
not
state
action
that
I'm
aware
of
that's
caused
that
problem,
but
it
may
be
inter-related,
and
maybe
we
can
do
something
about
that,
so
that
we
can
get
back
to
what
we
really
call
normal
and
that
is
if
you're
sick,
you
don't
need
to
come
to
work
if
you're,
not
sick,
please
show
up
instead
of
having
government
mandatory
guidelines
or
quarantines.
What
we're
doing
to
say,
thou
shalt
not
come
to
work
today
and
we're
causing
these
problems
in
the
private
market.
Thank
you.
A
A
D
A
Okay,
senator
mcdaniel
another
question:
yeah.
E
E
E
C
A
G
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
I
guess
mine's
related
to
the
worker
shortage,
and
I
thank
you
for
the
chamber
that
does
a
great
job
on
these
issues
for
our
employers.
D
Several
programs
and
our
foundation
on
the
foundation
side
of
the
chamber
are
focusing
on
that
particular
issue.
We
have
the
talent
pipeline
management
program
that
we
run,
which
is
specific
about
building
out
the
pipeline
of
workers
for
specific
sectors
of
the
economy.
We
have
talent
hub
that
we
are
operating,
which
is
connecting
employers
with
employees
or
with
people
who
are
eligible
for
employment.
D
We
also
have
the
transformational
employment
program,
kentucky
kentucky
transformational
employment
program
where
we're
helping
employers
connect
with
individuals
that
may
have
maybe
in
recovery
from
substance
use
disorders
in
developing
that
particular
pipeline
of
workers.
So
we
have
several
things
on
the
programmatic
side
that
we're
doing
at
the
chamber
on
that
also
in
working
with
our
partners
at
kctcs
and
in
the
universities
on
building
up
the
skill
levels
of
workers,
we
published
a
workforce
report
this
summer.
D
I
know
you've
seen
it
where
we
look
at
the
causes
of
our
workforce
shortages,
and
we
know
that
that
skills
mitch
math
mismatch
is
one
of
the
reasons
for
that,
and
so
I
think
emphasis
on
education,
training,
programs,
some
of
the
education
bills
that
we
are
supporting
in
the
legislature
right
now
are
going
to
be
so
important
for
that
and
we're
going
to
be
working
on
other
legislation
during
this
session.
I
know
chairman
weber
has
a
bill
that
he's
recently
filed
to
deal
with
some
of
these
workforce
shortages
as
well.
G
Well,
let
me
just
say
there
are
people
leaving
certain
states,
a
lot
of
people
leaving
those
states
and
moving
other
places
like
texas,
arizona,
and
we
have
such
a
need
here.
Is
there
anything
that
the
chamber
is
doing
to
reach
out
to
those
areas
and
those
folks
to
try
and
recruit
them
to
come
to
our
state
that
may
have
the
skills
we're
looking
for.
H
Thank
you,
mr
chair,
thank
you
for
being
here
the.
If
we
continue
this
on
another
year,
it
gets
approximately
100
million
dollar
shortfall
in
what
would
be
estimated
on
the
trust
fund.
Is
that
correct?
H
And
so
I
just
we
want
to
make
sure
that
we're
clear
on
that,
because
I
think
when
I
first
ran
for
office,
one
thing
that
people
talked
about
is
the
issues
in
frankfurt.
For
you
know
the
past
30
years
is
that
we
always
look
here
and
now
we
don't
think
about
the
generation
coming
after
us
and
how
we're
going
to
fund
that
we
kick
the
can.
I
don't
want
to
see
us
doing
that
so
in
the
house
appropriation
you
you've
covered
that
in
the
budget.
H
H
I've
lowered
subscriptions
to
certain
things
and
looked
at
it,
and
I
I
get
that,
but
I
also
want
to
be
fiscally
responsible
and
that
we
know-
and
let
our
all
of
our
constituents
know
that
right
now,
if
we
pass
this
again,
that's
a
hundred
million
dollars
that
we
otherwise
won't
have
in
something
else.
I
mean
it's
that
balancing
of
what
our
greater
concerns
are
and
so
well,
I
probably
have
to
vote
for
this
again
for
another
extension
of
it.
H
I
do
hope
that
we're
looking
to
because
we're
not
actually
going
to
get
back
to
pre
pandemic.
We
know
with
employers.
Things
are
different.
Now
the
same
amount
of
people
won't
be
hired.
It's
a
different
type
of
employment.
There's
different,
there's
different
technology
put
in
place.
We
have
to
look
at
a
different
way.
To
do
that.
I
mean
our,
so
our
tax
base
may
be
very
different
in
the
future
as
well-
and
I
know
the
chamber's
well
aware
of
these
things.
I
just
want
to
make
sure
my
colleagues
are
as
well.
I
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
I
I
guess
I
would
concur
with
my
colleague
senator
yates's
comments.
I
mean
I'm
inclined
to
vote
for
this
because
I
do
think
we
are
still
suffering
from
some
of
the
the
problems
brought
about
by
the
pandemic
and
and
honestly,
some
of
the
decisions
that,
in
retrospect,
you
know,
maybe
maybe
weren't
as
as
good
as
what
they
should
have
been
as
far
as
how
to
handle
this
pandemic
as
what
we've
seen
based
on
things
done
in
other
states,
but
you
know,
I
guess
what
I
don't
want
to
see.
I
Is
this
become
a
recurrent
request
on
an
annual
basis?
I
think
you
know
a
couple
years
removed
from
the
pandemic.
I
can
see
the
utility
and
and
jump
starting
our
businesses
and
getting
them
back
to
work,
but
you
know
I.
I
don't
know
that
I
would
be
as
inclined
to
vote
for
this
again
next
year.
If
I,
if
I
see
it,
come
back
again
so.
A
A
F
Supplement
vote.
Mr
chairman,
I'm
going
to
vote
yes
right
now,
and
the
reason
is
only
because,
even
if
state
government
directly
has
not
caused
this
problem,
government
generally
has,
but
when
we
get
to
a
situation
where
the
private
market
needs
to
get
its
feet
on
the
ground,
I
am
absolutely
not
going
to
support
subsidizing
the
free
market,
because
that
is
not
a
free
market.
Thank
you.
B
A
J
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I'm
robbie
mills.
I
represent
the
4th
senate
district
in
northwest
kentucky
and
I'm
pleased
to
have
to
my
left
here,
good
friend
of
mine,
sam
bach.
Sam
is,
we
are
talking
about
confirming
mr
buck
as
an
administrative
law
judge
in
the
department
of
workers
comp.
J
Mr
bach
has
been
a
personal
friend
of
mine
for
the
last
25
or
30
years,
like
it's
hard
to
say
30
years,
I'm
getting
old,
but
he's
been
a
good
personal
friend
of
mine
and
know
him
as
a
pillar
in
our
community
and
a
very
good
lawyer
and
I'll.
Allow,
mr
bach,
to
kind
of
give
you
some
background
on
his
legal
expertise.
K
Thank
you.
Thank
you,
appreciate
you
all
taking
the
opportunity
or
the
time
to
to
listen
to
to
us
today
I
am
sam.
I
I
grew
up
and
I
don't
thank
you
senator
for
the.
K
And
this
is
my
first
opportunity
to
address
a
panel
such
as
this
I'll
I'll
go
with
my
background,
which
is,
I
grew
up
in
the
south
side
of
louisville,
was
educated,
high
school
louisville,
bellarmine
college
university
of
louisville,
so
we'll
see
how
that
goes
moved
to
the
western
part
of
the
state
for
love.
K
We
settled
in
owensboro
subsequently
in
henderson
for
30
years,
and
it
has
been
30
years
senator
I
have
practiced
in
private
practice,
primarily
engaged
in
the
practice
of
workers
comp
through
that
time,
I
have
represented
workers,
compensation
carriers,
where
I've
represented
individuals,
injured
workers
in
all
aspects
of
workers.
Compensation
claims
in
front
of
aljs,
both
in
individual
claims
in
front
of
enforcement
actions.
K
Multiple
insured
carriers
in
front
of
administrative
law,
judges
in
front
of
the
workers
compensation
boards,
I've
represented
them
in
appeals
to
the
court
of
appeals
to
the
supreme
court
of
kentucky
and
to
the
sixth
circuit
court
of
appeals,
and
have
done
that
throughout
my
course
of
work.
For
for
30
years,
I've
maintained
a
private
practice
engaged
in
other
areas
of
practice
as
well.
A
Well,
thank
you
judge
and
thank
you
for
I
know
you
had
to
rearrange
your
schedule
to
be
here
with
us
today,
but
I
appreciate
you
doing
that
and
thank
you
for
being
here
in
person.
Members
do
we
have
any
questions,
senator
southworth.
F
Thank
you
so
yeah
you
mentioned
having,
you
know,
represented
parties
and
with
workers
compensation
for
years,
and
I
want
to
just
ask
you
like
what
was
the
hardest
situation
that
you've
ever
had
trying
to
balance
both
of
the
party's
interests.
If
you
could
share
a
story.
K
It
and
it
I'll
say
this
as
as
as
a
person
who
did
primarily
defense
work
over
the
years.
You
a
person,
needs
to
learn
and
understand
that
the
system
is
in
place
for
the
injured
worker
and
that
we
have
real
people
on
the
other
side
of
claims,
and
I
think
sometimes
we
tend
to
forget
about
that.
K
H
K
H
Good
to
have
you
just
a
couple,
a
couple
softballs
but
questions
your
your
practice
right
now.
Are
you
a
solo
practitioner?
Do
you
belong
to
a
firm.
H
And
then
the
percentage
of
your
practice
as
of
now
is
it
about
50
50
or
is
it
primarily
plaintiff's
work
or
what
is
your
practice
now.
K
I
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
mr
bach.
I
don't
believe
I've
had
the
pleasure
of
having
a
case
with
you
during
my
17
years
of
practice.
However,
many
of
my
colleagues
from
the
western
end
of
the
state
speak
to
your
integrity
and
your
knowledge
of
the
law
and
have
told
me
that
you
will
make
an
excellent
administrative
law
judge.
So
I'm
I'm
very
proud
and
happy
to
support
my
friend
senator
mills's
resolution.
If
you've
got
a
friend
like
him,
I'm
sure
that
you're
you're
you're
of
good
stock.
I
So
thank
you
for
coming
here
today
and
I
really
appreciated
your
answer
to
senator
southworth's
question.
I
think
that's
exactly
the
appropriate
mindset
to
have
when
you're
coming
into
the
job
that
you're
you're
starting
and
thank
you
for
coming
here
today.
Thank
you,
sir
appreciate.