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From YouTube: Kingston, Ontario-Environment, Infrastructure & Transportation Policies Committee - January 11, 2021
Description
Environment, Infrastructure & Transportation Policies Committee meeting from January 11, 2021. For the full meeting agenda visit https://bit.ly/3oF5Uqj
A
All
right,
I
think,
it's
time
so
I
will
call
the
meeting
to
order
at
601.
This
is
the
special
meeting
of
the
environment
infrastructure,
transportation
policies
committee,
which
reports
directly
to
council
mark,
like
I
was
just
saying.
Our
regular
meeting
is
usually
on
a
on
a
tuesday
and,
I
believe,
the
second
tuesday
of
each
month
of
every
other
month.
So
maybe
you
could
tell
us
why
we're
meeting
monday
january
11th.
B
B
A
Counselor,
holland,
okay,
everybody's
here
amazing,
well
done
casserole
and
I've
just
called
the
meeting
to
order
and
the
clerk
has
verified
the
reason
for
the
special
meeting.
It's
so
that
we
can
deal
with
two
time
sensitive
matters
that
have
budgetary
considerations
prior
to
the
budget
deliberations
at
the
end
of
the
month.
A
B
Mr
chair,
it's
up
to
the
committee
how
they
wish
to
receive
the
items
this
evening
if
it
is
better
for
the
committee
that
they
listen
to
a
briefing
and
then
deal
with
the
business
item
and
then
return
to
the
second
briefing
and
then
the
following
business
item.
That
is
permissible.
If
the
committee
wishes
to
do
so.
A
A
C
A
A
B
B
Yes,
mr
chair,
if
we
have
members
of
public
they
would
be
under
the
attendees
section
under
the
participants
panel.
So
we
have
panelists
are
typically
staff
for
those
who
have
organized
to
make
a
presentation
to
the
committee
and
the
attendees
are
typically
the
members
of
the
public
who
have
registered
to
be
a
part
of
this
evening's
meeting.
At
this
time
there
doesn't
appear
to
be
a
name
with
the
members
public
here
with
us
this
evening.
B
D
A
D
Thank
you
councillor
stroud,
so
I
would
like
to
introduce
dave
roway
this
evening.
He
is
with
the
climate
leadership
division.
He
works
with
me,
he's
a
project
manager
and
we
have
been
working
on
the
development
of
both
of
these
programs
that
you'll
be
presented
to
tonight,
and
with
that
I
will
pass
it
over
to
dave.
E
C
E
E
There
we
go
okay,
so
there
are
five
major
influences
on
this
program.
One
of
them,
of
course,
is
the
corporate
strategic
plan,
which,
under
the
climate
leadership
theme,
has
an
action
that
directs
staff
to
develop
an
energy
retro
program
that
targets
high
capital,
cost
items
that
also
have
high
carbon
reduction
impact
potential
for
property
owners.
One
of
the
next
next
major
influences
is
the
fcm's
community
energy
fire
efficiency
financing
program,
which
is
a
critical
resource
for
canadian
municipalities
to
develop
and
launch
and
operate
home
retrofit
programs
for
up
to
four
years.
E
So
what
we
have
before
you
are
the
goals
and
objectives
of
the
program.
I'm
going
to
assume
you
can
read
them
clearly
and
not
repeat
them,
but
what
I
will
do
is
say
that
this
goal
is
a
smart
goal,
specific
measurable,
attainable,
relevant
and
time
based
in
no
way
is
it,
including
any
numbers
that
are
required
by
the
fsm
fcm.
These
are
self-imposed
ambitious
aspirational,
outlines
or
parameters
of
the
project.
E
E
E
However,
it
is
making
reference
to
the
ontario
building
code
standards
at
that
time
and
before
1991
that
affected
energy
efficiency
within
a
home,
so
they
were
much
lower
back
then,
and
they
will
have
the
best
opportunities
for
a
big
impact
from
this
program.
I'm
happy
to
address
any
other
questions
pertaining
to
these
other
markets
in
the
question
and
answer
period
next
slide,
please.
E
So,
let's
move
to
the
summary
of
the
program
design
so
moving
through
these
pieces
of
the
pyramid.
The
program
offers
flexible
sources
of
financing
at
favorable
rates
and
financial
incentives
for
energy
efficiency
approvals
at
home
that
achieved
ghd
reductions.
This
addresses
the
noted
barriers
we
found
in
the
research
on
upfront
cost
and
project
payback.
E
E
Technical
services
also
includes
training
for
direct
service
contractors
to
ensure
they
are
equipped
with
the
most
current
facts
on
opportunities
and
then
finally,
the
top
piece
program,
promotion
and
customer
engagement
through
the
utilities
and
channel
partners
includes
contractors
and
auditors
for
implementation
for
a
multi-layered
marketing
strategy
to
optimize
success.
This
will
also
improve
homeowner
participation
levels
next
slide,
please
so,
looking
at
the
short-term
and
long-term
expected
impacts
and
outcomes,
we've
separated
them
out
to
the
period
that
could
potentially
be
funded
by
the
fcm
program,
which
is
a
four-year
program.
E
So
we've
made
some
estimates
on
how
many
number
of
homes
could
be
really
realistically
retrofitted.
The
number
of
jobs
created
is
based
on
the
estimated
amount
of
loans
during
that
period,
using
a
multiplier
of
one
million
dollars
for
every
sorry,
16
to
30
jobs
for
every
million
dollars
invested
and
then
the
estimate
on
cost
savings
each
year
per
household.
E
The
long
term
focuses
on
the
greenhouse
gas
reduction
impact
over
over
a
period
where
it's,
the
program's
been
allowed
to
be
scaled
up,
and
the
last
point
is
important,
because
what
we're
really
doing
is
helping
develop
a
sustained
local
retrofit
market,
that's
led
by
third-party
financing
and
program
delivery.
So
we're
momentum
builders
in
the
short
term
next
slide.
Please.
E
So,
there's
three
financing
mechanisms
that
we're
proposing
to
be
included
in
this
program.
However,
for
for
this
briefing
I
will
focus
on
the
first,
as
it
relates
to
the
recommendation
before
you.
The
lic
financing
is
a
primary
focus
of
the
initial
years
of
the
program
implementation
and
is
a
big
part
of
the
funding
fcm
funding
model.
The
long-term
goal
of
curb
will
be
to
transition
to
third-party
financing
through
utility
providers
and
financial
institutions,
because
involving
private
capital.
E
Investment
has
been
shown,
particularly
in
communities
where
these
programs
have
been
around
quite
some
time
that
it's
critical
for
mass
scale
up.
So
this
is
why
we're
working
with
community
partners,
such
as
credit
unions
and
the
local
utilities,
to
offer
all
three
options
for
maximum
flexibility
early
on,
depending
on
the
homeowner
situation,
scale
of
project
to
get
their
feet
wet
and
get
them
involved
with
the
eventual
desire
to
have
them
continue
on
past
the
fcm
funding
a
bit
on
the
lic
loans.
These
are
attached
to
the
property
and
not
the
owner.
E
This
is
twofold:
it
can
assist
homeowners
with
ass
accessing
capital
for
high
upfront
costs
of
retrofits
and
two.
It
enables
the
transfer
of
the
lien
to
a
new
owner
in
cases
where
the
loan
applicant
wants
to
sell
their
house
before
the
lic
is
repaid
in
full.
The
loan
is
particularly
useful
where
the
retrofits
have
a
long-term
payback
period.
E
E
E
This
is
something
we
want
to
look
at
later
on
beyond
this
funding,
but
for
the
purposes
of
this
program,
the
loan
and
grants
money
are
to
be
used
for
one
family
dwellings.
The
rest
are
really
associated
with
the
ilic
legislation
and
the
best
practices
by
other
communities
again
happy
to
dive
into
this
more
as
needed
by
members
of
the
committee
next
slide.
Please.
E
So
this
is
a
high
level
estimate,
aggregated
estimate
of
the
program
cost
over
five
years.
It
assumes
500
homes
averaging
25,
000
dollar
loan
per
home,
which
is
what
toronto
experienced
over
a
five-year
period.
And
again
this
is
a
loan
on
the
cost
of
the
retrofit,
and
this
would
be
having
this
program.
Budget
approved
is
a
prerequisite
to
applying
to
the
fcmc
eef
program,
so
we're
recommending
approval
of
the
full
18.5
million
dollar
capital
plan
in
the
2021
budget
to
be
managed
over
the
four
years
of
curb
implementation.
E
E
So
I'm
going
to
summarize
this
slide
by
saying
that
city
of
kingston
is
playing
the
role
of
program
from
behind
and
ensuring
the
lic
loans.
Repayment
are
processed
accordingly,
and
we
obviously
have
some
monitoring
and
reporting
responsibilities
both
to
council
and
to
fcm
as
the
funder.
The
utilities
are
recognized
as
key
program,
delivery
and
promotional
partners
in
conjunction
with
the
energy
coach,
to
reach
the
homeowners
and
help
them
make
informed
decisions.
E
The
trade
channel
partners
are
the
contractors,
energy
auditors,
training
institutions
and
home
improvement.
Retailers
that
help
us
promote
the
pro
program,
as
well
as
provide
direct
retrofit
services
and
products
to
the
homeowners
and
for
my
last
slide,
the
next
one
I'll
touch
on
next
steps,
as
it
relates
to
the
recommendations
before
you.
E
E
E
F
Okay
and
my
preparations
this
afternoon,
I
I
didn't
see
anything
with
electrical
on
there.
I
read
electrical,
I
don't
know
if
anyone
thinks
I
should
declare
a
pecuniary
interest.
I
don't
think
I
should.
If
we're
fixing
roads,
we
all
drive
cars,
but
I
I
don't.
I
don't
see
it,
but
I
just
noticed
it
so
I
wanted
to
ask,
but
I'm
if
someone
feels
it
as
a
contractor,
I
shouldn't
be
part
of
the
conversation.
A
C
A
E
Riverweight,
thank
you
through
you,
mr
chair
councillor,
neal,
that
that
is
a
would
be
a
fully
funded
position
with
the
fcm
monies.
It
would
be
it's
yet
to
be
determined
where
the
ideal
place
where
they
would
reside
as
an
employee.
It
could
be
with
the
city,
it
could
be
with
one
of
the
utilities
it
could
be
with
a
non-profit.
All
three
of
those
have
been
practiced
in
canada,
and
we
expect
that
to
be
a
part
of
conversations
and
negotiations
over
the
following
months.
So
sorry,
I
don't
have
a
more
conclusion.
C
A
E
Ruid
through
you,
mr
chair,
that's
a
good
question.
Counselor
neil,
the
guidance
we
got
from
fcm
is
that
it's
not
so
much
the
ownership
because
to
clarify
somebody
renting
a
house
could
be
eligible,
but
the
owner
of
the
house
has
to
consent
to
the
the
improvement
and
taking
on
the
lien.
So
it's
more
a
question
of.
Is
it
a
three
stories
or
less
so?
E
What's
called
a
one
family
or
used
to
be
called
a
single
family
home
multi-residential
aren't
eligible
largely
to
do
with
something
to
do
with
the
building
code
and
the
use
of
the
federal
enter
guide
audit.
The
enter
guide
audit
is
only
suitable
for
single-family
homes,
multi-residential
much
more
complex
systems.
You
don't
have
a
furnace
in
each
unit.
You
have
a
giant
boiler
in
the
basement.
You
also
would
need
much
more
resources
to
do
multi-residential
buildings.
It
is
definitely
something
we
want
to
explore
in
the
future
is
just
not
eligible
for
this
funding.
E
G
Yeah,
sorry,
thank
you,
council
shower
and
just
to
add
to
that
and
thanks
dave,
those
are
great
responses
for
counselor
neil.
I
think
we
can
definitely
take
that
away.
I
I
am
maybe
perhaps
more
familiar
with
the
co-op
that
you
might
be
speaking
of
or
the
co-op
model
here,
counselor
neil
and
there
are
a
lot
of
single
family
or
one
family
residences
in
that
model.
So
that's
something
we
can
definitely
take
away,
and
I
think
you've
heard
that
loud
and
clear
here
from
from
mr
elwade.
F
F
I
mean
you
know,
I'm
not
that
old,
but
I
remember
the
you
know,
get
off
oil
program,
believe
it
or
not
from
1980
1980.
There
you
go
when
I
first
got
involved
in
the
trades.
You
know
so,
but
this
is
but
a
couple
of
things.
I'm
just
you
said
it
and
maybe
not
so
it
doesn't
hurt
to
review
it.
Fcm
is
the
federation
of
canadian
municipalities.
F
E
Are
you,
mr
chair,
so
it
is
a
national
program.
It
was
in
the
federal
budget.
I
believe,
two
years
ago
the
monies
were
passed
on
to
the
federation
of
canadian
municipalities.
I
believe
300
million
dollars
was
the
total
amount
nationally.
It
will
be
dispersed
over
a
period
of
about
five
or
six
years,
and
so
they,
I
don't
know
what
their
formula
is
by
province,
but
individual
municipalities
can
apply
to
up
to
10
million
dollars
in
loans
and
5
million
dollars
in
grants.
So
we're
just
about
maxing
out
that,
with
our
expected
budget.
F
Okay,
sorry,
I
think
I
don't
know
it's
obviously
administration
of
this.
I
I
kind
of
see
what
you're
doing
I
think
it
works
good
for
I
like
it,
I
just
don't.
I
hope
that
we
can
keep
it
as
simple
as
possible,
so
administratively
it
doesn't
become
a
burden,
and
I'm
sure
you
is
that
something
we
kingston's
gonna
look
after
is
that
we
we
have
the
capability
of
doing
that.
Of
course,
I
guess.
D
Yes
through
mr
chair,
so
the
way
the
program
we
are
looking
at
and
we've
been
reaching
out
and
working
quite
thoroughly
with
utilities,
kingston
and
hyderabad
and
bridge
all
our
utility
providers
in
in
the
city
and
we'll
be
working
with
them
with
the
securing
of
the
funding
from
scm.
We
would
then
work
and
provide
agreements
that
would
be
brought
back
again
to
this
committee,
looking
at
which
utility
providers
would
be
providing
that
service.
D
With
respect
to
the
energy
coach
again,
we
would
look
at
how
best
to
implement
that,
and
the
city
would
then
would
maintain
the
administrative
component.
The
marketing
component,
certainly
with
the
lic,
would
have
to
maintain
that
administrative
detail,
but
certainly
the
full
details
of
how
the
administration
of
the
program
and
the
implementation
of
the
program
would
then
be
brought
back
to
the
committee.
With
this
hearing
of
funds.
F
Yeah,
thank
you
thank
you
for
that.
I
have
a
couple
comments
on
that,
but
maybe
maybe
later
as
a
rural
counselor
representing
the
rural
district,
of
course,
there's
there's
a
bit
of
a
disconnect
there
between,
uk
and
and
and
countryside,
there
is
some
some
areas
that
they
are
familiar
with.
So
I
guess
I'm
just
asking
for
reassurance
that
there
will
be
efforts
made
to
make
sure
there's
not
excluding
the
actual
area.
That
uk
is
not
not
necessarily
has
not
ventured
in.
D
F
Of
those
service
providers
yeah,
I
might
have
missed
that
part
so
just
and
getting
to
the
meat
and
potatoes
of
it
like.
Maybe
I
missed
that
too,
and
I
apologize
but
we're
talking
the
basics
of
every
home's
envelope,
the
envelope
the
windows,
the
doors
installation
is,
will
there
be
a
checklist?
I
mean.
F
E
Wig
for
you,
mr
cheer,
so
fortunately
there's
a
well-established
process
and
it's
natural
resources.
Canada
enter
guide
auditing
framework,
so
a
registered
energy
advisor
goes
in
before
the
retrofit
and
does
a
lot
what's
called
a
blow
or
door
test,
and
they
look
at
the
current
energy
use
of
the
home.
They
take
note
of
some
of
the
major
equipment
such
as
space
and
water
heating,
and
then
you
get
this
energy
rating
as
well
as
a
ghg
number,
within
that
the
building
envelope
is
included.
E
E
It's
so
it's
at
the
way
at
the
back
of
the
activity,
so
you
can
see
on
the
right.
This
is
the
type
of
thing
that
will
be
identified.
You
know
the
the
floor
area
and
the
year
built,
but,
moreover,
the
type
of
heating.
What's
its
efficiency
level,
does
it
have
a
heat
pump?
How
is
the
hot
water
heated
up?
What's
that
efficiency
that
you
can
see
those
insulation
levels,
those
are
really
low?
You
want
higher
rsi
values
and
then
right
at
the
bottom.
E
You
have
an
air
tightness
value
that
one
you
want
really
low.
That's
how
many
air
exchanges
within
an
hour,
so
it
is
looking
at
the
whole
home
as
a
system
and
that's
how
you're
going
to
optimize
the
retrofits,
the
benefit
to
the
homeowner
and
our
use
of
resources.
So
sorry
for
the
long,
protracted
answer.
F
No
thank
you
that
resonates
until
very
familiar
that
that
has
been
happening
too.
I
mean
over
the
years
there's
been
that
same
same
inner
guide.
Retrofit
has
has
been
going
on
in
other
programs.
So
that's
very,
I
have
heard
of
this
and
I'm
familiar
somewhat
with
that,
so
that's
great
and
they
okay,
that's
good.
Thank
you
very
much,
no
more
questions
at
this
time.
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
A
H
A
E
E
Mr
ruiz,
through
you,
mr
chair,
thank
you
that
that's
a
very
good
question
and
we
we
have
already
started
talking
to
some
of
the
trade
channels,
the
utilities,
all
of
them
utilities,
kingston
and
ambridge
gas
and
hydro.
One
have
been
very
cooperative
with
connecting
us
with
their
contractor
networks
that
operate
in
this
area.
We
started
to
speak
to
some.
We
will
be
actually
holding
another
consultation
after
council
later
in
the
month
to
dive
a
little
deeper.
E
This
has
come
up
in
many
communities.
Unfortunately,
with
this
national
funding
that
actually
started
over
a
year
ago,
many
municipalities
are
developing
this
program
and
many
are
talking
to
industry
and
trade
associations.
So
a
lot
of
us
are
already
telling
them
we're
going
to
have
a
lot
of
work
for
you.
So
the
short
answer
is
there
are
already
some
positions,
but
we
will
need
more,
which
encourages
the
trade
associations
which
encourages
the
existing
businesses
because
they
see
more
work
to
come.
But
that's
also,
why
we're
talking
with
st
lawrence
college.
E
They
have
an
energy,
sorry
in
engineering
systems
and
environmental
design
program
that
trains
people
to
do
trades
and
energy
audits,
and
we
have
let
them
know
we're
going
to
need
more
people
trained.
So
that's
why,
in
the
early
years,
it'll
be
a
slow
ramp
up.
Some
communities
are
really
proposing
something
like
2
000
audits
a
year
and
from
what
I
understand
from
the
trades
community.
That
capacity
isn't
there
yet
it'll
take
us
a
few
years
to
get
up
to
that.
So
the
short
answer
is:
there's
jobs
there.
A
H
Thank
you
and
through
you
thanks
for
the
presentation
and
they
really
well
written
and
in-depth
report.
It
was
really
interesting
reading
and-
and
I
really
appreciated
the
examples
of
the
the
type
of
homeowner
and
and
the
the
type
of
homes
was
really
well
done.
Just
a
few
questions
and
I
might
as
well
ask
the
one
that
kind
of
related
to
the
job
creation.
I
just
wonder
how
did
you
come
up
with
the
calculation
like
the
formula
to
calculate
that
we
would
have
that
many
jobs
per
whatever
million.
E
So
they
use
a
multiplier
of
16
to
30
jobs,
forever
a
million
dollars
spent
on
retrofitting,
and
that
includes
both
direct
labor
and
trades
for
the
the
the
hvac
personnel,
as
well
as
some
of
the
indirect
jobs
it
creates
by
increased
demand
for
products,
materials.
Insulation
sales
are
going
to
go
up
over
over
the
years
with
these
programs
being
proliferated.
So
it
was
a
formula
established
within
that
national
research
report.
H
E
Right
three,
mr
chair,
so
there's
there's
four
major
types
of
heating
systems
within
kingston,
predominantly
it's
natural
gas,
but
there's
surprisingly,
quite
a
number
of
oil
and
propane
heated
homes
and
we'll
be
definitely
looking
at
them.
They
actually
represent
the
best
opportunity
from
both
a
greenhouse
gas
reduction
perspective
and
a
cost-saving
perspective
of
the
homeowner.
Sorry
was
that
your
question:
are
we
looking
at
oil.
H
I
know
I
was
just
because
you
didn't
specifically
mention
oil.
I
was
a
bit
worried
about
that
because
it
is
I
because
I
recognize
that
it's
one
of
the
best
ones
to
kind
of
get,
and
there
probably
aren't
that
many
homes
anymore
with
oil,
but
still
so.
The
other
question
I
had
is
regarding
the
this
death
staying
with
the
home,
and
I
wonder
if
that
I
wonder
if
you
spoke
with
real
estate
agents
about
that,
because
I
don't
want.
E
Through
you,
mr
chair,
so
that
no
we
haven't
spoken
to
any
any
real
realtors,
I
mean
the
homeowner
can
put
this
as
a
condition
on
sale
of
their
home,
where
they
had
the
option
where
they
could
pay
off
the
lien
before
the
homeowner,
the
new
homeowner,
the
buyer
takes
it
over.
So
I
mean
it's
really
largely
up
to
the
homeowner.
E
I
maybe
it
is
worthwhile
to
speak
to
some
of
the
realtors,
so
they
understand
it
closely
related.
Is
we
also
need
to
speak
to
financial
institutions
because
in
toronto,
during
their
programs,
some
of
the
mortgage
lenders
expressed
concerns,
because
ours
is
a
priority
lien,
so
we
will
be
providing
documentation
with
participating
financial
institutions
ahead
of
time.
So
we
can
address
any
potential
problems,
proactive.
H
I
really
really
recommend
you
do
that,
because
that
was
one
of
the
problems
at
the
beginning
with
the
microfit
program
when
they
were
developing
the
micro
fed
program
for
solar
state
agencies,
as
well
as
financial
institutions,
concerns
regarding
that
and
there
was
a
major
confusion,
so
we
don't.
So
I
think
that
if
we
get
ahead
of
that,
then
we
won't
find
that
we'll
have
problems
later
on.
D
For
you
yeah
through
you,
mr
chair,
just
to
add
to
what
dave
said
and
thank
you
that's
a
really
good
question.
We
did
recognize
when
we
spoke
with
toronto,
that
the
lic
on
the
property,
the
institution
financial
institutions,
did
have
an
issue,
but
since
that
time,
fcm
as
well
as
cmhc,
has
worked
with
the
major
corporations
to
alleviate
their
concerns
and
they
seem
to
have
been
resolved.
A
A
Okay,
before
we
go
to
a
second
round
of
questions,
I
have
a
question
do
with
the
usage
in
the
report
of
the
word
efficiency.
It
wasn't
clear
to
me
at
all
times
that
we're
talking
about
energy
efficiency,
because
there's
also
especially
when
you're
doing
it
home
by
home
and
the
analysis
by
you
know
when
the
energy
audit
is
done
because
there's
the
variable.
A
E
Go
ahead
so
within
the
enter
guide
audit.
No,
it
is
not
that
what
you
see
is
energy
efficiency
and
ghd,
but
not
cost.
The
cost
effectiveness
would
be
in
part
of
discussion
with
the
energy
coach
and
with
the
contractors
providing
quotes.
So
that's
one
of
the
main
value
added
that
we
hope
to
have
that
coach
provide.
So
the
homeowner
can
make
that
most
cost
effective
decision.
What
we're
doing
with
this
program,
design
and
within
the
115
or
so
pages,
is
that
we
already
know
on
principle
based
on
their
heating
and
building
envelope.
A
A
E
E
I
think
toronto
has
included
seventy
five
thousand
dollars,
but
that's
because
ten
percent
of
the
home
value
in
toronto
is
way
above
forty
thousand
dollars.
So
those
are
the
maximums
we're
suggesting.
We
recognize
that
this
is
an
additional
debt
burden,
so
we
feel
those
caps
still
make
it
we'll
keep
it
within
reasonable
parameters.
E
Three:
three
mistakes.
Yes,
that's
correct,
so
the
15
million
would
be
it's
actually
12
and
a
half
million
dollars
in
loans
and
that's
assuming
25
000
loan
per
home
for
500
homes.
The
average
could
be
much
lower,
particularly
with
the
incentives
we're
offering
and
now
the
announcement
of
the
federal
incentives
coming.
You
know,
the
payback
and
interest
rates
will
be
better
if
the
loan
is
lower,
but
if
somebody's
doing
some
major
retrofits
to
their
building
envelope
their
heating
system,
their
hot
water
system,
it
could
get
high.
F
E
E
E
C
C
C
D
After
you,
mr
chair
and
I'll,
try
to
answer
your
your
question,
I
think
I
understand
what
you
mean,
so
we
have
we.
We
would
be
applying
to
fcm
for
grants,
as
well
as
the
loans,
so
the
loans
would
be
where
it's
going
to
be
used
for
the
lic
and
we've
looked
at
10
to
20
years
and
they
would
be
repaid
back
to
the
city.
C
A
micro
fit
if,
if
it
works
and
the
reason
I'm
asking
is
several
years
ago,
I
went
to
portland
oregon
and
they
had
a
brilliant
program
where
this
city
put
out
a
call
for
tenders
and
got
very
low
prices
on
both
the
installation
and
the
purchase
of
solar
panels.
And
is
this
is
any
of
this?
Or
is
there
potential
for
this
to
be
an
approach
that
the
city
could
do?
E
For
you,
mr
chair,
so
renewable
energy
technologies
are
eligible
and
ultimately,
while
the
inner
guide
auto
set
getting
that
gig
of
dual
use
down
to
low
as
possible,
it's
really
up
to
the
homeowner
what
their
budget
is
and
they
may
put
solar
on
if
it
fits
their
budget
and
that
would
reduce
their
purchase
electricity,
the
the
thing
with
solar,
it
won't
reduce
greenhouse
gases
as
much
if
it's
used
for
electricity.
Our
grid
is
fairly
green.
E
However,
having
said
that,
if
somebody
was
getting
off
natural
gas
to
an
electric
furnace,
so
then
their
cheap
natural
gas
use
goes
down,
but
they're
like
more
expensive
electricity
goes
up.
Solar
makes
a
lot
of
sense
there,
because
that
can
lower
their
electricity
costs
back
down
again
and
you're
right,
I
mean
there's
a
very
good
payback
on
solar.
Now
the
the
cost
per
kilowatt
hour
hours
come
way
down,
so
it
will
really
be
on
a
house
by
house
basis
and
up
to
the
homeowner's
budget,
but
renewable
technologies
are
eligible.
E
Three,
mr
chair,
so
yes
there's
a
way
to
bring
down
the
per
unit
cost.
It
is
not
our
recommendation
that
the
city
consider
playing
that
role
so
the
first
part
there
are
a
number
of
municipalities
that
are
looking
at
working
with
industry
associations
to
get
group
rates,
because
there's
so
many
of
us
proposing
these
programs.
E
G
Yeah,
thank
you
chair
and
the
follow-up,
and
thanks
dave
and
counselor
neil
so
yeah.
I
appreciate
the
what
the
counselor
is
asking
and
it
doing.
This
doesn't
stop
the
city
from
pursuing
that
opportunity,
but
the
program
right
now
is
set
up
is
looking
at.
What
can
we
do
right
now
in
response
to
council's
goals?
G
This
meeting
would
say
that
for
the
next
four
years
this
will
go
exactly
how
it's
planned
and
there'll
be
no
new
technology,
and
nothing
like
that.
I
don't
think
anybody
would
be
saying
that
tonight,
but
I
appreciate
what
dave's
saying
I
think
we
have
to
focus
on
how
the
program
can
be
set
up
right
now
and
then
remain
flexible
to
to
implement
other
things,
whether
it's
through
this
or
through
something
else.
G
Absolutely-
and
I
would
hope
also
that
through
the
work
that
we're
doing
with
the
leadership
plan
and
with
the
community
that
whether
it
needs
to
be
a
motion
of
counsel
or
not,
it
can
be
driven
by
the
staff
and
the
community
to
find
new
ways
to
deal
with
things
as
as
these
opportunities
come
about,
and
but,
as
you
can
see,
this
team
is
ready
to
do
that,
because
the
work
that
you're
seeing
tonight
has
been
well
thought
out.
Well-Based-
and
I
I
think,
is
something
that
that
can
be
really
great.
A
C
A
A
A
A
I
I'm
not
sure
it's
really
a
question
and
we've
touched
on
it
a
little
bit
already
counselor
neil
mentioned
the
king's
court
area
and,
of
course,
the
area
I
represent.
So
I'm
quite
interested
because
I
know,
speaking
with
sustainable
king
sorry
utilities,
kingston
staff
who
work
in
the
area
of
sustainability
a
while
back.
I
I
was
told
that
we've
done
some
sort
of
heat
mapping
of
the
city
for
high
high
energy
costs,
and
so
I
was
just
wondering
how
how
that
might
be
incorporated
in
the
future
and
as
far
as
sort
of
incense
incentives
or
promotion,
are
we
going
to
really
mr
rowan
mentioned
the
that,
with
certainly
with
like
with
propane
and
get
and
oil.
That
would
be
something
that
makes
a
lot
of
sense,
but
just
wondering
if
certain
neighborhoods
would
be
targeted.
D
Well
through
you,
mr
chair
I'll
start,
but
I'll
certainly
have
dave,
and
I
think
there's
a
slide
that
we
could
call
up
with
the
hot
market.
And
I
don't
know
if
you,
when
you
look
at
the
chart,
there's
that
hot
market
and
the
warm
market
and
the
market
segments
and
how
we
would
target,
probably
as
we
launch
so
dave.
If
you
have
that
slide,
and
you
want
to
go
over
that.
That
would
be
a
really
good
opportunity
to
highlight
how
we
would
target
as
we
launch
this.
A
E
E
The
short
answer
is
yes:
we
are
targeting
households
with
a
higher
energy
cost
burden,
so
that
is
households
that
are
sorry.
The
very
last
slide
of
the
whole
deck
slide.
37.,
that
is,
those
are
households
that
are
paying
double
the
national
median
on
their
utility
bills
in
relation
to
their
household
income,
and
we
have
mapped
that
out.
E
So
this
map
shows
the
percentage
of
the
census
tract
with
that
high
energy
cost
burden,
so
double
the
national
average-
and
I
believe
king's
court
is
that
blue
segment
in
the
middle,
that's
at
42.8,
so
that's
roughly
43
of
that
census
tract
has
a
high
energy
cost
burden,
they're
paying
twice
as
much
of
their
income
on
energy
energy
costs.
Now
that's
a
relation
of
both
their
household
income
being
low
and
their
energy
consumption.
E
The
hot
market
is
all
the
oil
users
they're
spending
up
to
four
thousand
dollars
a
winter
season.
On
heating
alone,
the
warm
market
includes
the
oldest
natural
gas
and
electric
homes.
The
electric
homes
are
also
spending
three
to
four
thousand
dollars
a
year
on
utility
costs,
when
the
average
is
only
around
two
thousand
two
thousand
one
hundred.
So
that
is
very
much
centered
in
this,
even
though
we
know
this
is
a
ghg
driven
program.
We
know
from
years
of
public
dialogue,
political
political
discourse
and
debate
on
energy
people
need
energy
relief.
E
That's
correct:
there's
some
homes
that
will
have
opportunities
to
cut
their
utility
bills
in
half
oil
is
higher
carbon
content.
You
can
reduce
90
of
the
emissions
from
those
homes.
Propane
would
be
more
like
30
to
40
percent
natural
gas
is
challenging
because
it
is
a
cheaper
fuel.
If
the
homeowner
is
inclined,
there
are
other
opportunities,
but
the
the
improvements
are
more
in
the
15
to
25
percent
range.
So
we're
not
we're.
A
Okay!
So
then
I'm
looking
for
a
mover
in
a
second
before
the
recommendation
move
like
accounts
for
neil.
It's,
like
my
counselor,
just
give
me
a
second
to
get
it
up
on
the
screen
here.
Going
back
and
forth
between
there
we
go
so
the
recommendation
and
I
will
read
it
quickly.
I
apologize
if
I
slur
any
words.
A
The
curious
canadian
has
found
his
community
energy
financing
program
and
that
staff
report
back
to
the
itp
in
q3
2021.
That's
this
year
following
notification
from
fcm
on
the
city's
funding
application
with
the
final
program
details,
including
the
results
of
additional
stakeholder
consultation
and
a
recommendation
regarding
the
implementation
of
the
kingston
home
energy
retrofit
program.
A
A
A
A
This
is
an
opportunity
in
front
of
us
from
fcm,
with
a
grant
and
loan
program,
with
specific
specifics
and
literature
and
everything
already
up
and
running
with
with
federal
money.
That's
just
basically
for
us
to
participate
and-
and
it
does
require
some
work
on
this-
that's
part
of
the
stuff
it's
willing
to
do.
It.
Does
require
the
various
moving
parts
all
fit
together
and
it
requires
like
they
said.
The
energy
coach
and
the
utilities
involvement-
and
I
require
requires
votes
of
counsel,
for
budget
considerations
and
so
on.
A
G
A
A
They
definitely
need
energy
relief
and
they
definitely
need
cost
effectiveness.
It's
going
to
be
the
only
thing
driving
their
decision
making
most
of
the
time,
so
that
piece
that
cost
effectiveness
piece
is
key
to
the
success
of
this
program.
In
my
mind,
in
really
any
retrofit
program,
I
believe,
because
not
everybody's
made
of
money
and
we've.
A
A
A
So
I
believe
this
program
has
all
those
elements,
I'm
a
very
practical
person,
and
so
as
it
as
the
reports
come
back,
that's
the
way
I'm
going
to
be
evaluating
it
is,
it
will
have
the
best.
Whatever
has
the
best
bang
for
its
buck
is
going
to
be
what
sells
and
what
works
and
what
it
gets
us
to
sell
out
of
our
own
money.
So
I'm
hoping
that
it
is
very
successful
and
that
is
council
trump
hinted
that
we
might
actually
run
out
of
12.
A
A
Okay,
well,
I
guess
we
we
did
a
lot
of
our
talking
in
our
questions
and
we've
covered
all
the
bases.
So
I
guess
I'll
call
the
question
all
those
in
favor
of
the
recommendation,
all
those
opposed
and
that
passes
unanimously
well
done,
move
on
to
the
next
item.
There
is
the
briefing
as
well,
so
that's
the
green
standard
community
improvement
plan
update
and
I
guess
we've
got
same
staff.
Ms
salty
keen
do
you
want
to
introduce
the.
D
D
So
thank
you
tonight
we're
going
to
present
now
on
the
proposed
green
standard
community
improvement
plan.
What
we're
going
to
do
is
provide
you
an
update
of
the
progress
we've
made
to
date
in
the
development
of
the
green
standard,
cip,
and
there
is
a
request
before
the
committee
tonight-
a
recommendation
with
respect
to
the
official
plan.
So
the
presentation
will
speak
to
the
strategic
directions
and
the
guidance
on
the
process.
D
Why
we're
here
before
you
tonight
the
green
standard,
cip
overview
and
the
need
for
an
official
plan
amendment
any
of
the
stakeholder
consultation
that
we
have
been
doing
over
the
last
year,
considering
options
for
the
incentives
why
we
need
better
buildings
and
then
we
will
lay
out
our
next
steps
as
we
go
forward
next
slide.
Please.
D
So
we
have
the
strategic
direction
on
the
cip
development
from
council
through
the
strategic
plan
and
through
that
we
have
there's
direction
through
the
provincial
policy
statement
and
the
planning
act
and
then
the
evolving
changes
to
the
ontario
building
code
as
they
certainly
through
the
ontario
building
code
and
the
canadian
building
code.
The
the
extent
to
building
to
green
has
been
changing
over
the
years
as
we
anticipate
as
we
go
forward
to
2030
as
well.
Next
slide.
D
So
we've
just
highlighted
here
the
climate
leadership
that
we
were
directed
to
develop
and
promote
the
incentives
for
residents
to
reduce
their
energy
use
and
what
we
just
heard
before
you
was
the
kingston
home
energy
retrofit
program,
and
now
we
are
as
well
developing
a
new
new
build
net
zero
policy
in
the
incentive
program
through
the
cip
model
that
was
directed
by
council
and
certainly
over
the
last
year.
We've
done
a
lot
of
work
on
the
development
of
the
the
program
itself
and
which
we
will
be
laying
out
tonight
next
slide.
D
So,
as
as
indicated,
we
there
is
direction
and
policy
direction
through
the
provincial
planning
act
and
the
building
code.
The
planning
act
does
allow
for
a
cip
to
address
public
interest
need
which
includes
net
zero
development.
The
national
building
code
of
canada
addresses
this
and
the
continuous
improvement,
as
I
spoke
to
earlier
on
the
ontario
building
code
regarding
energy
efficiency
requirements.
So
the
the
policy
structure
is
there.
We
have
the
requirement.
We
have
the
cip
structure
through
the
planning
act,
as
well
as
through
the
official
plan.
D
So
so,
looking
at
to
the
building
our
climate
leadership
and
the
green
standard
cip,
we
wanted
to
ensure
that
we
are
enabling
a
standard
that
will
aim
at
stimulate
construction
of
new
residential
commercial
buildings
to
a
high
efficiency
use.
It
will
include
financial
incentives
and
that's
where
we
will
be
over
the
next
number
of
months
as
we
continue
to
develop
this
program.
D
Look
at
the
financial
incentives
to
help
cover
the
increased
cost
of
building
to
a
higher
performance
level
and
you'll
hear
from
us
as
well
that
there
is
a
fine
line
as
to
what
that
incentive
will
look
like
and
we've
done
a
lot
of
research
on
that
to
date
and
which
we'll
be
bringing
forth
when
we
bring
the
final
green
standard
before
the
committee
later
this
year.
And
finally,
the
program
would
be
voluntary
when
we
proceed
with
the
cip
and
it
would
be
similar
to
how
the
the
brownfield
cip
works.
D
The
ask
that
we
are
requesting
of
the
committee
tonight
is
recommending
that
they
direct
staff
to
amend
the
official
plan,
the
current
policies
within
the
official
plan
and
schedule,
10
limit
community
improvement
areas
within
the
urban
boundary,
and
certainly
with
this
green
standard
cip.
We
want
to
ensure
that
it's
applicable
throughout
the
entire
municipality,
so
we
are
requesting
that
we
amend
the
op
to
permit
this
green
standard
project
area
through
so
through
the
development
of
the
opa.
D
E
Thank
you
julie,
so,
regarding
stakeholder
input
to
date
earlier
in
2020,
we
held
a
in-person
net,
zero
form
for
developers,
home
builders,
real
estate,
financers
and
contractors
is
very
well
attended.
The
proceedings
were
posted
on
the
get
involved.
Kingston
page.
We
also
conducted
a
virtual
public
meeting
more
recently
in
november,
as
well
as
research
on
other
green
development
incentive
programs,
particularly
in
ontario.
The
the
provincial
codes
varied,
are
very
different,
say
in
bc
or
nova
scotia.
So
we
did
try
to
look
at
best
practices
within
ontario.
E
However,
we
do
recognize.
Additional
consultation
is
necessary
with
developers
and
home
builders
regarding
effective
incentivization.
As
you
see
in
the
report,
hamilton's
numbers
have
been
underwhelming
by
their
own
conclusion
for
a
variety
of
reasons.
If
we
go
to
the
next
slide,
we'll
look
at
some
of
the
ways
to
build
effective
incentivization.
E
So,
fortunately
there's
a
number
of
existing
building
performance
rating
programs
that
are
suitable
for
new
construction.
Some
of
them
are
quite
well
known,
such
as
the
inner
guide
rating
system
and
the
lead
canada
rating
system.
Others
are
more
popular
in
europe
and
are
only
recently
coming
to
canada,
such
as
passivhaus
and
bill
green.
The
important
thing
here
is
that,
as
you
can
see
by
the
middle
diagram,
they
can
be
related
back
to
energy
use.
In
some
cases,
emissions.
E
E
E
So
staff
are
in
the
midst
of
a
process
where
we're
trying
to
determine
the
appropriate
balance
between
resourcing
the
incentive,
with
public
monies
and
adequately
incentivizing
the
development
community
to
voluntarily
build
to
these
higher
standards.
This
process
includes
several
variables
as
listed
on
on
this
slide,
because
they
affect
the
type
of
incentive,
the
timing
of
incentive
and
the
quantum
of
the
incentives.
E
So
while
there
are
a
number
of
incentives
that
are
being
explored
by
staff
and
we're
assessing
the
different
and
innovate
approaches,
we
need
to
look
at
their
level
of
influence
in
encouraging
the
developers
and
builders
to
participate
in
the
program,
as
well
as
the
different
levels
of
cost
of
the
municipality
to
implement
them.
This
is
what
will
we
be
reporting
back
later
in
the
year.
It's
also
to
consider
the
appropriate
mix
of
incentives
for
the
different
types
of
buildings
and
the
owners.
E
E
This
line
graph
is
a
conceptual
graph,
so
the
numbers
aren't
specific
to
evidence.
It's
more.
The
conceptual
approach
that's
outlined
in
the
report
before
you,
and
it's
really
speaking
to
that
the
incremental
capital
cost.
That
is
the
cost
to
go
above.
What
is
required
by
law
in
the
building
code
is
going
to
come
down
as
the
building
code
becomes
more
strict
on
energy
performance,
and
so,
as
the
energy.
Sorry,
the
building
code
moves
towards
getting
to
net
zero
energy
thought
to
be
in
between
2030
and
2035.
E
This
incentive
program
should
be
phased
out.
Of
that
main
focus.
The
the
see
the
incremental
capital
cost
will
be
zero
when
it's
required
by
law.
So
this
is
really
just
a
concept
of
why
the
incentive
should
be
the
greatest
over
the
next
five
or
six
or
seven
years,
when
the
incremental
costs
are
still
somewhat
high,
with
the
lower
obc
levels.
Next
slide,
please.
E
E
If
I
can
have
the
next
slide,
please,
the
greenhouse
gas
emissions
from
buildings
were
before
you
last
year
when
we
brought
the
community
emissions
inventory,
and
in
that
report
we
showed
you
that
43
nearly
half
of
emissions
in
this
community
come
from
buildings,
so
that's
separated
into
the
industrial,
commercial
institutional
sector
at
29
and
low-rise
residential
buildings
at
14
and
in
terms
of
the
amount
of
money
spent
on
energy.
In
these
two
sectors,
it
was
over
300
million
dollars,
so
the
new
buildings
that
are
being
constructed
in
the
future.
E
E
The
energy
bundle
does
also
include
gasoline
and
diesel,
but
electricity
has
increased
greatly
in
in
the
price
per
kilowatt
hour
over
this
period
of
time,
so
that,
recognizing
that
this
trend
will
likely
continue
again,
we
can
influence
the
type
of
building
and
the
building
costs
that
those
owners
and
users
will
be
burned
with
next
slide.
Please.
E
Another
compelling
reason
that
buildings
will
need
to
perform
differently
in
the
future
is
based
on
a
trend.
That's
been
happening
over
the
last
50
years
and
is
expected
to
continue
over
the
next
50
years.
That
is
a
decrease
in
the
heating
days,
which
you
see
on
your
heating
bills.
The
number
of
days
you're
likely
going
to
need
to
turn
on
your
furnace
and
an
increase
in
the
cooling
days
for
those
of
us
who
have
air
conditioning,
it's
going,
it's
those
extreme
hot
days
where
we're
likely
going
to
need
to
turn
on
our
air
conditioning.
E
Interestingly,
a
building
built
to
code
has
excess
heating
capacity
today
and
insufficient
cooling
capacity.
This
is
something
really
important
to
address.
With
the
green
standard.
We
have
the
ability
to
address
that
to
accommodate
those
those
changing
things
over
time
and
increase.
The
increase
in
cooling
days
has
an
impact
on
health,
as
we
saw
in
quebec
and
montreal
with
a
heat
wave
a
couple
years
ago,
so
enabling
that
capacity
for
cooling
to
increase
is
an
important
factor
we
can
achieve
with
the
cip.
E
I'm
not
going
to
speak
to
each
one
of
these.
Some
I've
already
touched
upon,
but
it's
not
just
about
money.
It's
not
just
about
energy
and
emissions.
There
are
health
and
comfort
levels.
The
important
implicit
point
here
is
that
we
know
how
to
build
to
achieve
these
benefits
and
advantages
over
the
20th
century.
Development
approach
and
municipalities
are
in
a
great
position
to
incur.
G
D
D
A
F
Thank
you,
mr
chair,
and,
again,
an
excellent,
excellent
submission
and
presentation
very,
very
interesting.
I
would
obviously
support
what's
that.
What's
the
feedback-
and
I
missed
that-
maybe
the
engagement
that
what
did
you
gain
much
from
that
also
with
with
building
inspection
departments
and
all
that?
Obviously,
this
was
something
that
was
well
received
or
is
there
a
concern
about
price
increases.
D
I
was,
I
was
gonna
start
off
and
let
dave
continue,
mr
chair,
so
we
have
the
we
had
the
forum
in.
I
believe
it
was
last
march
just
before
the
pandemic,
and
then
we
had
our
get
involved
page
we
launched
that
in
november
and
we
had
a
virtual
public
meeting
at
that
time.
We
did
have
a
number
of
home
builders
and
developers
attend
the
online
forum,
and
a
lot
of
the
questions
are
around
the.
D
How
were
we
going
to
incentivize
speaking
to
what
dave
was
talking
about
that
fine
line
of
how
do
we
get
them
to
build
to
the
net
zero
and
what
is
the
the
incentivize
that
would
get
them
to
do
it.
So
they
had
a
lot
of
questions
around
that.
So
that's
what
we
will
be
working
on
over
the
next
number
of
months
is
to
to
look
at
that
programming
and
that
and
how
do
we
incentivize
and
what
are
those
some
commitments
that
we
could
look
at.
F
And
from
a
building
inspection,
I
guess
that's
our
own,
our
own
authorities
and
professional
input.
I
guess
was
this
something
that
was
complicated,
you
know.
Is
it
difficult
to
change
building
code
is
that
is
that
a
local
thing
or
is
it
a
provincial
building
code?
I
know
electrical
code,
but
not
a
building
code?
How
does
that?
How
do
you
address
that.
D
D
They
look
at
you,
know,
accessibility,
so
they
do
bring
forth
new
changes
in
every
every
few
years,
certainly
with
the
the
building
department,
we've
been
working
with
them
and
consulting
with
them
the
to
to
set
the
program
or
to
set
what
net
zero
is
and
the
different
builds
as
to
you
know,
net
zero
or
lead,
etc.
That
was
the
easy
component
of
of
looking
at
and
establishing
what
the
program
may
look
like
and
the
certifications
that
would
be
required.
F
Yeah,
I
would
look
forward
to
seeing
that
I
mean,
like
a
good
builder.
I
mean,
is
also
going
to
recognize,
there's
incredible
incentives
just
on
there's
a
return
on
your
investment
as
well.
So,
but
you
know,
I
think
I
think
the
time
is
now
to
to
make
that
headway
and
that
people
can
receive
a
better
product
and
good.
I
think
it's
fantastic.
Thank
you.
J
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
Through
you
a
question
to
staff
thanks
so
much
for
your
presentation
on
page
162,
it
talks
about
the
other
cities
in
ontario
that
have
a
program
like
this,
so
vaughn
brampton,
richmond,
hill
and
halton
hills,
and
then
I
know
that
you
also
mentioned
toronto
and
hamilton
are
those
basically
the
only
cities
in
ontario
that
do
have
a
program,
and
I
think
you
mentioned
that
hamilton
you
know
hasn't
had
very
much
uptake.
Is
that
the
same
thing
then
for
vaughn,
brampton,
richmond,
hill
and
halton?
D
For
you,
mr
chair
and
I'll
I'll,
leave
it
to
dave
to
add
as
well.
So
certainly
the
green
standard,
cip
that
we
are
developing
would
be
the
first
ontario
there
isn't
a
cip
for
green
standard
at
this
time.
The
toronto
incentive
is
through
their
development
charges
and
the
the
one
in
hamilton
they
have
the
incentives
of
for
development,
but
they
haven't
been.
There
wasn't
hasn't
been
that
much
uptake
the
other
municipalities
that
we
spoke
to.
E
I
I-
and
I
would
add
that
while
toronto
is
probably
the
more
successful
program,
I
think
many
people
would
agree.
That's
somewhat
of
a
unique
market,
or
only
one
of
two
or
three
of
that
size
and
of
that
magnitude,
where
you
can
attract
investors
and
developers
for
a
program.
Hamilton
has
struggled
much
more
toronto.
Hamilton
are
actually
the
only
ones
in
ontario
currently
with
financial
incentives,
as
julie
was
alluding
to
the
other
ones,
really
only
have
performance
metrics
and
they
encourage
them.
E
They
provide
education
and
guidance,
but
no
incentives
and
the
canadian
green
building
council
came
out
with
a
report
that
showed
currently
the
return
on
investment.
It's
okay
for
public
sector.
That's
why
you
have
universities,
social
housing
and
municipalities,
building
these
buildings,
not
a
lot
of
private
sector
buildings.
The
return
isn't
that
great.
Now
is
the
time
for
incentivization.
J
Right,
thank
you
when
I
was
on
the
planning
committee
back
in
2006
to
2010.
That's
when
I
think
it
went
well.
That's
when
woodhaven
right
was
coming
online
and
I
remember
at
planning
committee.
We
were
always
like
every
new
subdivision
that
came
up.
We
were
always
asking
the
developers
if
they
could
make
the
roof
solar
ready.
J
You
know
one
level
of
government
actually
provided
incentives.
Do
you
remember
any
of
that
or
maybe
it
was
just?
We
were
always
asking
but
never
making
headway
and
then
we
kind
of
gave
up
asking
for
that
at
every
single
meeting.
Do
you
remember,
do
you
recall
anything
especially
julie
or
miss
salter
keane?
You
were
in
the
department
back
then
a
do.
You
remember.
D
For
you,
mr
chair,
I
don't
remember
that,
but
certainly
we've
been
working
with
planning
department
on
our
climate
leadership
plan,
because
that's
one
of
the
action
items
that
we
can
look
at
policies
for
the
community
to
be
able
to
implement
in
use
so
dave,
and
I
actually
have
a
couple
meetings
coming
up
with
the
planning
department
to
look
at
what
we
can
do
moving
forward.
The
zoning
bylaw,
nothing
to
do
with
the
cip,
green
standard
or
with
you
know
the
retrofit.
A
G
G
G
What
we're
looking
at
right
now
and
it's
not
for
another
recommendation
tonight
to
approve
the
the
cip,
the
green
standard,
cip,
but
what
it
does
is
it
it
puts
that
framework
in
place
after
we
get
the
official
plan
of
change
to
include
all
of
the
city,
including
the
rule,
so
that
different
programs
could
happen.
So
if
it's
the
will
of
council
staff
the
community
to
say,
can
we
do
this
for
development
land
development?
Or
can
we
do
this
for
these
types
of
buildings,
this
type
of
incentive
program
those
programs
can
be
put
in?
G
They
can
be
correct
me
for
wrong
dave
and
julie,
but
they
can
be
altered
or
changed
or
amended
under
that
cip
umbrella
framework,
so
those
those
types
of
things
and
and
whatever
else
like
we
were
talking
about
earlier
things
that
we
can't
think
of
right
now
that
could
be
coming
up.
Then
we
have
the
framework
in
place
to
be
able
to
put
those
programs
in.
So
it
is
relative
to
the
program
tonight,
but
more
something
more
specific
down
the
line.
C
Thank
you
and
I'll
try
not
to
wander
into
that
space
that
we
were
just
recommended
not
to,
but
I
know
that
official
plan
has
a
lot
of
recommendations
and,
in
my
mind,
not
enough
shells
that
are
more
binding
for
development.
I'm
thinking
of
affordable
housing,
for
instance,
for
decades
we've
had
a
target.
I
think
it's
15.
It
may
be
higher
we've
yet
to
have
a
developer.
That's
actually
met
that
target.
C
So
I
guess
my
only
concern
with
the
recommended
cip
before
us
tonight
is
that
if
all
we
have
is
targets-
and
I
appreciate
that-
there's
we're
trying
to
incentivize
it,
but
are
there
any
things
that
are
more
low-hanging
fruit
that
we
could
make
a
shell
within
the
within
the
the
official
plan?
I
know
it
planning
and
we
always
bring
up,
for
instance,
making
sure
that
new
builds
have
the
ability
to
install
electric
chargers
for
evs,
and
usually
we
get
compliance,
but
is
there?
D
After
you,
mr
chair,
certainly
as
mr
hoogenbaugh
said,
what
we'll
be
putting
together
is
the
framework.
The
policy
of
the
official
plan
is
there
to
ensure
that
we
can
bring
forth
the
cip,
so
what's
in
that,
cip
would
be
important,
but
the
requirement
for
the
amendment
to
the
official
plan
is
really
to
ensure
the
entire
municipality
so
the
framework,
the
policy
to
develop
the
cip.
Is
there
it's.
When
we
come
back
with
the
cip,
we
can
look
at
what
you
said.
D
A
Just
this
is
a
theoretical
though,
but
but
using
a
specific
spot
so
that
you
can
frame
it
in
your
minds
where
I'm
going
with
this
question
so
contaminated
waterfront
land,
where
there
is
a
development
proposal,
and
now
we
perhaps
might
have
a
wording
in
the
op
with
the
green
standard,
cip.
This
is
in
the
future
of
this
passage
would
those?
How
would
those
two
things
interact:
the
brownfields
incentives
and
these
and
any
potential
cip
incentives?
Would
they
be
completely
separate?
G
So
I'll
start
I'm
just
waiting
for
my
video,
but
I'll
start
there.
We
go
counselor
shroud,
so
yeah.
That's
also
something
that
we
have
talked
about,
and
it
is
something
that
we
are
working
to
generate
some
ideas.
But,
as
you
know,
with
the
you
know,
significant
files
in
brownfields
there
has
been
a
need
to
to
amend
and
revise
on
those
unique
cases.
So
it
is.
There
is
a
potential
that
if
we
are
having
a
significant
development
on
a
brownfield
site
that
we'd
also
want
it
to
be
net
zero.
G
I
will
go
back
to
one
of
things
I
think
dave
said
before
he
got
cut
off
by
his
internet
problems.
There
in
his
presentation
was
that
over
time
the
building
codes
are
are
looking
like
they'll
be
changing,
so
there
there
may
only
be
a
small
period
of
time
where
we're
overlapping.
We're
also
done
very
well
with
our
brownfields
program
and
redevelop.
Many
pro
many
sites,
so
I
I
wouldn't
say
that
it's
necessarily
something
that
this
whole
program
has
to
be
geared
to
address,
that
one
that
one
particular
issue.
G
A
Relevant,
so
getting
it
from
your
answer,
then
that
it
is,
it
would
be
possible
to
have
multiple
types
of
incentives
on
one
site,
but
but
if
that
were
the
case,
that
would
be
a
complex
site
to
begin
with,
that
would
need
multiple
incentives
to
even
be
possible.
I
guess
that's
sort
of
what
I'm
hearing
and,
if
there's
been
also
possibly
this.
This
might
add
a
layer
of
complexity
to
a
project
applying
for
this
kind
of
cip
might
make
a
project
more
complex.
I
guess
is
the
other
aspect
of
your
answer.
G
Well,
no
doubt
net
zero
development
does
make
things
more
complex.
I
I
don't
mean
it's
not
possible,
I
just
it's
a
higher
level
of
building
code,
it
exceeds
building
code
and
it
uses
different
technology
that
dave
and
julie,
but
especially
dave
can
speak
better
than
I
can,
but
but
yes,
net
zero
development
is
is
more
complex
than
than
the
current
building.
E
If
I
could
add
mr
chair
to
add
to
peter's
point,
there
are
some
innovative
ways
that
we
can
achieve
say,
for
example,
making
a
brownfield
site
into
a
net
zero
building
a
very
quickly
outlined
too
one
of
them.
Fcm
is
a
separate
funding
that,
for
some
reason,
is
only
available
to
brownfield
sites
and
that's
for
it
to
have
renewable
energy
generation
on
site.
So
right
now,
municipalities
can
apply
just
for
a
renewable
energy
project
unless
it's
on
a
brownfield
site,
so
we
could
potentially
be
a
funding
partner.
E
We
could
apply
on
behalf
of
the
project
and
then
have
the
flow
through
money
making
sure
it
uses
the
cip.
So
it's
not
bonusing.
Another
really
creative
way
is
coming
up
from
the
private
sector.
There's
four
different
geotechnical
companies
and
enbridge
gas,
who
are
now
offering
a
geothermal
where
they
will
cover
all
the
capital
costs
for
the
underground
piping,
which
is
60
80
percent
of
the
cost.
The
developer
only
needs
to
put
in
the
heat
pump
make
sure
the
building
envelope
is
tight.
A
Your
your
last
intriguing
thing
that
you
brought
up
there
generate
another
question,
so
so
you're
saying
that
that
enbridge
and
others
are
as
an
incentive
of
their
own
in
the
private
sector,
presumably
for
the
purpose
of
market
development.
Of
these
alternative
energies
are
offering
heavy
incentives
to
to
insult
geothermal.
A
For
some
of
these
large,
multiple
tubes
and-
and
we
also
have
what
the
first
part
of
the
question
is,
this
fcm
grant,
similar
to
what
we
just
talked
about
specifically
for
brownfield
sites,
yeah
for
a
net
zero
development
and
would
that
fit.
So
the
question
is:
would
that
fit
into
this
green
center?
Cip?
Or
would
this
be
yet
another
machine.
E
A
E
A
A
There's
always
a
digital
delay
because
of
having
everything
on
the
computer
right.
So
7b
is
a
report
which,
which
was
included
in
the
package
and
a
recommendation
with
two
clauses
in
an
introductory
clause.
So
before
we
move
in
seconded
it,
we
would
normally
go
to
members
of
the
committee
questions
on
the
recommendation
and
then
to
members
of
the
public.
Who
again
I
see
there
aren't
any
in
attendance.
A
We
need
to
move
her
in
a
second
number:
four:
the
recommendation
of
a
counselor
dougherty
samurai
council,
holland,
the
ditp
recommend
council,
the
following
council
direct
staff
to
amend
the
eop
to
permit
a
green
standard,
community
improvement
plan
and
project
area
within
the
entire
municipality
and
that
staff
report
back
to
itp,
with
the
proposed
green
center
community
in
improvement
plan
and
cip
bylaw
upon
the
approval
of
the
official
plan.
Amendment
so
first
the
official
plan
amendment
and
then
the
report
back
with
a
proposed
plan
for
the
green
standard
cip.
A
A
A
With
this
new
kind
of
thinking
to
me,
my
interpretation
of
this
and
what's
in
front
of
us
tonight,
is
using,
for
the
first
time
the
cip
language
in
the
op
for
this
purpose,
tied
to
actual
incentives.
The
same
way
that
brown
fields
works
in
the
in
the
sense
that
you
you
put,
the
the
you
defer
the
spending
for
the
developer,
allowing
them
to
put
the
money
in
to
to
this
to
the
extra
cost
of
implementing
what
it
is
that
you
want,
and
I
think
it's
worth
a
shot.
A
But
again,
as
california
was
saying,
this
may
things
of
this
nature
have
been
tried
before
and
failed
at
the
uptick
in
other
misfouties,
as
mr
rohit
was
saying,
has
not
been
great
with
the
ways
that
they
approached
it
in
in
the
in
the
report.
It
speaks
to
the
way
trump
following
hamilton
and
some
limited
success,
but
not
really
nobody's
tried.
This
particular
angle
to
this
point
so
requires
an
amendment
to
the
official
plan
and
and
again
official
plan
itself.
A
The
language
in
it
is
kind
of
like
a
framework
by
nature
and
not
not
like
something
compelling
like
that,
not
a
something
that
you
force
a
developer,
to
do
something
necessarily
depending
on
how
it's
worded,
which
is
why
counselor
neil
was
asking
for
the
word
shall
be
put
in,
so
that
it
wouldn't
be
something
that
you
choose
to
do
it
wouldn't
be
an
option.
It
would
be.
A
You
know
mandatory
in
my
understanding
of
official
events,
that's
difficult
to
do
effectively
in
the
official
plan
language
because
it
needs
to
be
flexible
enough
to
allow
the
secondary
plans
to
feed
into
it.
So
I'm
not
sure
I'm
not
a
planner,
but
I
I,
I
suspect
that
part
of
the
reason
that
that's
not
easily
done
is
is
that
is
that
it
may
be
a
lot
more
difficult
than
it
sounds
that
all
being
said,
we
got
to
start
somewhere.
A
A
Hopefully
it's
that
it
can
be
done
in
a
way
that
doesn't
break
the
bank,
because
otherwise
it's
not
gonna
go
anywhere
either
we'll
see
what
comes
of
it.
You
know
it's
a
new
year
hope
springs
eternal,
but
we
are
all
obligated
to
take
a
good
look
at
it
when
it
does
come
back
and
to
try
to
make
it
as
effective
as
possible.
A
A
Yes,
everybody
just
wants
to
vote.
So
let's
do
that.
I
call
the
question
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that
seems
to
also
have
passed
unanimously.
Thank
you
very
much
staff.
We're
almost
on
the
agenda.
We'll
go
back
to
the
last
few
pieces
of
the
agenda.
So
madame
clerk
do
we
have
any
motions
or
notices
of
motion.
A
Just
just
a
side
note
on
the
correspondence
and
on
the
lack
of
attendance
tonight
from
members
of
the
public.
I
I
have
noticed
this
trend
with
special
meetings
and
therefore
I
don't
like
holding
special
meetings
when
they
can
be
avoided.
I
understand
the
reason
for
this
one,
perhaps
the
next
time
we
see
these
items,
though
it
could
be
at
a
regular
meeting,
would
publish
the
agenda
that
schedule
people
know
in
advance
if
we
want
to
get
public
input.