►
Description
City Council meeting from December 15, 2020, Part 2 of 2, recorded on December 16, 2020. For full meeting agenda, visit https://bit.ly/3nujVGJ
A
Hey
folks,
good
evening,
it's
602,
so
we
will
reconvene
deputy
mayor,
ostroff
should
be
joining
us
momentarily
and
councilor
holland
has
a
another
meeting,
will
but
will
join
us
later
on
as
as
needed
as
well.
So
just
before
we
continue
on
with
the
agenda,
there's
a
couple
of
housekeeping
items
that
we
need
to
deal
with.
First
up,
there's
there
is
a
petition
that
councillor
boehm
would
like
to
present
so
with
the
consent
of
council,
we'll
let
councillor
boehm
go
ahead
and
present
that
petition.
B
Thank
your
worship
for
this
opportunity
for
you.
I
have
a
petition
here
to
present
with
192
names
of
residents
of
kingston
it's
from
an
online
petition
and
they
are
opposed
to
the
bylaw
amendment
for
the
above
subject:
file
d35-006-2020
for
1274
highway
15,
and
they
are
opposed
to
it
going
from
low
density
to
high
density
residential.
A
A
A
D
Yes,
thank
you,
and
this
is
I'm
not
speaking
to
the
to
the
emotion
that
I
know
that
you
circulate
I'm
speaking
just
to
this
this
exact
procedure,
so
we're
inserting
a
motion
in
the
middle
of
a
council
meeting,
and
this
would
set
a
precedent
if
passed
that
any
counselor
could
then,
if
they
wish
add
a
motion
to
the
council
agenda
if
they
got
two-thirds
of
council
to
agree
I'll,
see
how
you
can
explain
it
any
other
way.
I
I
just
think
my
colleagues
need
to
know
that
we're
stepping
precedent.
D
D
I'm
just
saying
that
that
is
the
problem
with
inserting
emotion
in
the
middle
of
the
meeting
and-
and
I
the
only
reason
I'm
having
second
thoughts-
is
the
anti-democratic
nature
of
the
of
the
of
the
of
the
way
the
motion
is
presented,
and
I
would
just
ask
the
rhetorical
question:
what
is
it
that
made
it
time?
Sensitive,
there's
the
old
saying,
lack
of
preparedness
on
your
part
doesn't
constitute
an
emergency
in
my
part,
so
this
we
always
knew
the
pandemic
was
on.
E
A
A
A
So
it's
only
in
the
the
last
I'd
say
the
last
24
hours
that
I
know
that
a
couple
of
different
businesses
have
approached
the
city
asking
for
a
potential
consideration
on
either
a
property
tax,
deferral
or
a
business
license
fee
waiver.
Now
a
business
license
has
to
be
applied
for
and
purchased
by
the
end
of
2020
in
order
for
that
license
to
be
in
effect
for
2021..
A
This
is
our
last
scheduled
council
meeting,
so
I
could
have
instead
not
done
this,
and
I
could
have
called
a
special
counsel
meeting
for
later
this
week
or
sometime
next
week.
I
didn't
think
that
that
would
be
the
preferred
option
for
for
people.
Alternatively,
we
could
just
simply
choose
not
to
do
anything
and
that's
a
fair,
fair
point
as
well,
but
I
think,
given
the
given
the
how
well
received,
I
think
our
efforts
were
as
a
city
to
try
to
to
help
and
assist
businesses
that
needed
that
extra
help
over
this
year.
A
I
thought
that
that
would
be
a
good
gesture
that
we
could
continue
for
2021
understanding
that
as
when
we
talked
about
the
motion
that
it's
something
where
a
business
would
need
to
demonstrate
why
they
would
need
an
assistant.
So
I
don't
want
to.
I
don't
want
to
get
into
the
debate
about
the
motion,
but
that
just
gives
you
context
for
for
why
this
this
has
come
forward,
as
is,
and
certainly
we'll
defer
to
to
council's
collective
wisdom
on
whether
or
not
we
should
deal
with
it
tonight.
G
G
A
So
if
it's
a
notice
of
motion,
then
it
would
come
to
me,
and
so
there
would
be
certain
businesses
that
would
have
to
choose
either
to
pay
for
their
business
license
fee
or
to
forego
and
operate
without
a
business
license
for
the
beginning
of
january,
and
I
don't
think
that
that's
something
we
would
want
to
encourage
either.
So
a
notice
of
motion
wouldn't
solve
that
problem.
A
A
So
I
I
appreciate
that
cancer
spell
again
reluctant
to
to
get
into
the
debate
on
the
motion
itself.
I
did
try
to
circulate
that
motion,
so
people
could
see
what
the
criteria
would
be.
I
think
for
this
procedural
motion.
I
think
what
I
would
offer
is
that
there
is
a
time
sensitivity
connected
to
it
and
then
council
can
judge
whether
that
they
they
would
judge
that
time
sensitivity
to
be
sufficient
to
vote
in
favor
of
adding
distinction.
A
So
our
procedural
bylaw
gives
a
couple
of
different
options.
One
is
that
we
can
waive
our
procedural
bylaw
and
add
the
motion
to
tonight's
agenda.
The
other
option
is
that
I
could
call
a
special
counsel
meeting,
so
I
have
the
the
power
as
head
of
counsel.
To
do
that.
I
am
sensitive
to
the
holiday
time.
That's
approaching,
and
so
that's
why
that
was
not
my
preferred
option,
but
that
that
is.
That
is
something
else.
We
could
do
any
other
questions
discussion
on
the
we're
off
to
quite
a
start.
Yes,
counselor
carly.
I
A
C
Mr
mayor
just
want
to
remind
everybody
that
in
audience
land
we
do
have
quorum
for
this
evening's
meeting.
The
first
item
of
business
is
the
report
from
the
administrative
policies
committee.
It's
moved
by
councillor
straud
seconded
by
councillor
usterhoff.
The
report
number
12
from
the
administrative
policies
committee
be
received
and
adopted.
A
Okay,
so
there
is
two
items:
first,
we
have
a
a
briefing
from
staff
and
then
we
will
move
to
item
1b
discussion.
So
at
this
point,
paige
agnew.
Commissioner.
Community
services
will
brief
council
on
clause,
1b
report
number
12
from
the
administrative
policies
committee
with
respect
to
the
short-term
rental
licensing
program.
Commissioner,
agnew,
you
have
the
floor.
J
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mayor,
patterson,
happy
to
be
here
today.
I'm
also
joined
by
my
colleague,
kyle
campo,
who's,
the
manager
of
enforcement
services,
so
kyle-
and
I
are
both
on
the
council
meeting
this
after
this
evening
and
happy
to
take
any
questions
that
come
up
following
the
presentation.
Next
slide.
Please,
the
the
purpose
of
the
briefing
tonight
is
to
really
try
to
to
bring
together,
what's
been
about
three
years
of
work
so
far
related
to
the
issue
of
rental
licensing
in
the
city
of
kingston.
J
So
as
part
of
that
work,
we
presented
a
report
to
council
in
2018
and
at
that
time,
council
decided
that
for
the
present
time,
they
wouldn't
proceed
with
the
rental
licensing
program
for
all
rentals
across
the
city,
but
they
did
give
us
direction
to
develop
a
short-term
rental
licensing
program
to
amend
the
bylaw
to
start
to
regulate
strs
through
the
mat
tax,
because
the
mat
tax
that
was
originally
implemented
through
the
bylaw
exempted
strs
at
that
time.
Next
slide,
please!
J
So
the
information
I'm
bringing
to
you
tonight
is
basically
the
culmination
of
multiple
years
of
work,
but
also
about
four
separate
reports,
so
we're
trying
to
bring
a
high
level
summary
for
for
council
to
give
you
the
most
amount
of
information,
given
that
this
is
an
important
decision.
That's
before
you
this
evening.
J
J
The
second
was
to
allow
residents
to
use
their
properties
to
earn
additional
income
to
offset
housing
costs
and
that
being
a
consideration
that
came
forward
through
consultation
with
the
with
the
community,
specifically
the
need
to
protect
the
community's
long-term
rental
housing
stock,
and
we
have
seen
as
a
city
a
low
vacancy
rate
for
a
number
of
years
and
with
the
removal
of
a
number
of
units
from
the
long-term
housing
market
that
have
gone
to
short-term
rentals.
It
certainly
hasn't
helped
our
vacancy
rate.
J
J
This
just
gives
you
an
overview
of
what,
where
we're
pictured
right
now
in
terms
of
short-term
rentals.
At
the
present
time,
we
have
approximately
488
str
listings.
This
shows
you
how
they
populate
from
a
geographic
perspective
across
the
city,
east,
west
and
central
about
52
percent
of
of
the
str
listings.
Right
now
are
single
detached
dwellings,
and
that
really
speaks
to
what
I
was
just
talking
about
with
respect
to
impact
on
the
long-term
housing
market
and
about
80
percent
of
those
listings
currently
are
on
airbnb,
and
there
has
been
some
discussion
about
that.
J
J
Throughout
the
last
couple
of
years,
we've
had
various
opportunities
to
engage
with
the
public
and
stakeholders
related
to
this
topic.
We
did
some
work
originally
through
the
rental
licensing
program
that
also
dealt
with
short-term
rentals,
and
that
was
through
2018
in
2019
through
july
to
november.
J
J
We've
we've
met
with
them
about
seven
times
through
zoom
meetings
and
conversations
mostly
mr
compo
has
been
leading
that
work
on
behalf
of
our
group
between
march
and
october,
and
we've
also
been
looking
at
best
practice
and
the
work
of
rental
licensing,
that's
happening
and
and
various
other
municipalities
throughout
the
process,
including
vancouver
victoria
toronto
prince
howard,
county
montreal
and
ottawa
next
slide,
please
so
in
terms
of
municipal
comparators.
Again,
I
just
wanted
to
pull
this
forward
and
what
this
does
is.
J
J
What
the
rental
periods
that
have
been
considered,
vancouver,
victoria
and
toronto,
being
some
of
the
more
restrictive
programs
that
are
currently
in
the
market,
whether
they're
collecting
mad
as
part
of
their
process
and
giving
you
a
status
update
the
city
of
toronto,
had
their
process
actually
appealed
to
the
lpat,
and
that
was
upheld
this
year
through
an
lpat
decision.
So
that's
that's
new
information
that
we
didn't
have
about
a
year
ago.
Next
slide.
Please.
J
What
I
wanted
to
demonstrate
with
this
slide
is
just
to
give
council
an
idea,
because
there
have
been
multiple
reports
on
this.
What's
happened
in
the
evolution
of
the
development
of
our
thinking
and
recommendations
that
every
floor
council
tonight
across
the
top,
you
can
see
three
different
key
reports
that
are
identified
december,
2019
february
february,
2020
and
november
2020.
J
What
changes
we
made
in
february
2020
and
where
we
are
right
now,
so
the
key
things
that
change
with
respect
to
the
regulations
we
were
proposing
in
2020
were
two
pieces,
one
that
we
removed
the
regulation
that
the
str
operation
was
limited
to
a
principal
residence.
So
that's
truly
limiting
it
only
to
a
home
sharing
opportunity,
so
that
was
removed
in
february
2020
and
remains
out
of
the
proposed
bylaw
as
it
is
now,
and
also
we
removed
the
limitation
for
180
days
per
year.
Again,
that
still
remains
in
the
bylaw.
J
Now,
since
the
february,
2020
and
and
going
back
through
admin
policy,
further
changes
that
have
happened
is
that
there
were
some
significant
concerns
with
respect
to
working
with
an
american
company
and
staff
were
given
direction
to
go
and
look
for
a
canadian
platform
that
would
help
with
compliance
monitoring.
So
that's
reflected
in
the
change
from
host
compliance
to
hamari,
which
is
part
of
the
staff
recommendation
tonight,
and
the
other
significant
change
that
we've
made
since
that
time
is
that
originally
the
mat
tax
was
proposed
to
be
collected
by
cap
cap.
J
Currently,
does
that
process
for
the
city
of
kingston?
Now
with
respect
to
larger
operators
and
by
way
of
of
work
and
looking
at
the
business
decision
again,
staff
have
made
a
further
recommendation
that
the
matt
tax
associated
with
short-term
rentals
be
collected
and
administered
by
the
city
of
kingston
and
not
through
a
third
party.
So
that's
part
of
the
staff
recommendation
tonight
and
the
last
piece
that
we've
added
in
is
the
addition
of
an
administrative
monetary
penalty
for
offenses
related
to
this
bylaw
you're.
J
Going
to
see
a
number
of
these
recommendations
coming
forward
and
various
bylaws
we've
been
doing
that
with
respect
to
covet
enforcement
and
have
found
that
it
is
a
first
line
of
enforcement
tactic
that
can
keep
matters
more
regulatory
in
nature
at
a
lower
level
of
enforcement,
rather
than
everything
having
to
go
through
the
court
system.
So
we're
recommending
that
as
well
tonight,
next
slide,
please.
J
J
That's
a
self-remittance
module
that
hamari
was
going
to
develop
for
the
city
specifically
to
assist
with
mac
collection,
so
that
str
operators
would
be
in
control
of
that
process
and
it
was
a
self-remittance
process
which
was
something
that
we
heard
from
operators
through
the
stakeholder
conversations
over
the
last
six
months.
Next
slide.
Please.
J
A
couple
of
things
that
I
wanted
to
make
sure
that
council
has
all
of
the
information
before
you
make
a
decision
tonight.
I
wanted
to
provide
you
with
some
some
thoughts
from
a
staff
perspective,
of
what
the
potential
impacts
would
be
in
our
ability
to
effectively
enforce
the
bylaw
and
the
mat
tech
collection,
with
the
amendments
that
are
before
council
tonight
with
respect
to
the
staff
recommendations.
J
So
the
number
one
thing
I
just
want
to
identify
is
that
the
internet-based
advertising
and
booking
services
they're
the
key
to
the
str
business
model
and
therefore
from
from
staff's
perspective
as
an
enforcement
ex
and
with
our
enforcement
expertise.
We
feel
that
enforcement
must
in
part
take
place
in
the
digital
realm,
and
in
order
to
do
that,
we
need
assistance
to
be
able
to
do
that,
because
we
don't
have
the
technology
in-house
to
be
able
to
facilitate
that
process
without
the
enforcement
techniques
we're
talking
about.
J
We
really
feel
that
our
ability
to
implement
the
bylaw
is
going
to
be
limited,
but
the
one
thing
I
want
to
identify
specifically
as
well
too
is
that
the
enforcement
techniques
that
we've
spoken
to
with
respect
to
the
hamari
platform
and
then
the
additional
in-person
techniques
that
staff
would
have
to
do
to
follow
up
on
cases.
Those
are
only
proposed
to
be
utilized
to
seek
out
non-compliant
operators,
so
operators
that
are
licensing
their
their
str
and
are
paying
their
mat.
Those
enforcement
techniques
will
not
be
part
of
of
those
operations.
J
The
the
self
identification
module
that
hamari
provides
is
really
key
to
us
being
able
to
enforce
the
licensing
requirement
without
that
we're
not
able
to
determine
the
actual
location
of
short-term
rental
operators
and
what
we
would
be
reduced
to
doing
is
trying
to
identify
them
on
a
on
a
case-by-case
basis
in
a
very
manual
format.
So
what
the
technology
does
that
hamari
has
developed.
It
uses
their
own
proprietary
algorithms
to
be
able
to
search
all
of
the
information.
J
That
would
be
a
process
that
we
need
to
try
to
determine
how
to
do
internally.
And
we
haven't
yet
done
that
work.
So
that's
a
consideration
and
then
again
just
identifying
for
for
counsel
that,
without
these
platforms
or
similar
platform,
our
enforcement
capabilities
will
be
really
limited
and
complaint.
Driven
only
so.
J
Our
map
bylaws
speaks
very
specifically
because
these
are
public
funds
to
being
able
to
audit
any
third-party
collection
of
that
money,
so
that
we
have
the
confidence
that
it's
being
collected
properly
and
efficiently,
and
that
we're
able
to
provide
that
to
our
auditors
as
well
in
terms
of
the
collection
of
public
dollars.
So
the
the
privacy
limitations
that
airbnb
puts
in
the
privacy.
J
As
a
household,
however,
like
I
said,
we
we've
removed
the
the
provisions
right
now
that
are
really
directly
linked
to
being
able
to
protect
the
community's
long-term
rental
housing
stock
and
also
with
respect
to
our
ability
to
be
proactive,
responding
to
concerns
with
respect
to
noise,
garbage
parking
and
safety
that
proactivity
as
I've
spoken
to
is
not
something
that
we're
going
to
be
able
to
get
to,
because
we'll
have
a
very
manual
complaint
driven
process.
If,
if
council
moves
forward
with
the
recommendations
that
are
before
them
tonight,
next
slide.
J
So,
as
I
indicated
mr
kampo
and
I
are
happy
to
take
questions,
we're
happy
to
discuss
any
matters
like
I
said,
there's
been
a
number
of
reports
and
it's
a
lot
of
information
for
council
to
digest,
and
we
just
want
to
make
sure
that
you
have
the
maximum
amount
of
information
to
assist
you
with
your
decisions
this
evening.
Thank
you.
A
A
So
questions
to
staff
can
happen
in
both
points,
so
maybe
I'll
say,
if
maybe
right
we
could
do
right
now
is
any
questions
directly
related
to
the
briefing
from
stuff.
We
could
do
right
now
and
then
we
can
reserve
other
questions
as
things
come
up
once
we
get
into
the
discussion.
If
that's
that's
reasonable,
so
questions
yes,
councilor
bolton.
B
Thank
you,
your
worship
and
through
miss
agnew,
I'm
just
wondering,
commissioner.
I
knew
if
I
you
could
answer
why
the
comparator
cities
all
seem
to
be
major
cities
like
toronto,
montreal
vancouver
ottawa,
I
believe,
and
not
our
normal
comparator
cities-
that
we
would
see
that
are
a
similar
size
to
us.
The
guelph,
waterloo,
berry
and
london
may
take
a
different
approach
than
a
third
party.
J
Yes,
thank
you
and
through
you,
so
the
comparator
cities
that
we've
looked
at.
I
mean
different
municipalities,
and
I
mean
this
is
more
of
a
it's,
not
just
a
canadian.
It's
a
north
american
or
it's
a
it's
a
global
issue,
because
str's
are
operating
in
in
pretty
much
every
market
across
the
globe.
I
think,
with
respect
to
the
comparators
we
selected
the
comparators
that
actually
have
programs.
Some
of
the
cities
that
you
mentioned
counselor
bone
have
not
yet
developed
or
implemented
licensing
programs
for
the
str.
J
B
So,
for
instance,
thank
you
for
that.
For
instance,
waterloo
we
heard
from
a
delegation
last
night
has
a
very
non-controversial
program
and
that
seems
to
be
working
wonders
and
none
of
the
cities
phrases
and
it
doesn't
include
something
like
hamare.
So
I'm
just
curious
was
waterloo,
considered
as
a
comparator
city,
and
if
not,
why
not?.
J
J
What
they
have
started
doing
over
the
past
year
is
collecting
that
with
respect
to
all
of
their
accommodation
providers
across
the
city,
so
that
would
include
large
hotels
as
well
and
short-term
rentals,
and
I
believe
that
they
are
working
most
closely
with
airbnb
in
terms
of
a
voluntary
service
agreement
and
in
collecting
the
mat
again
in
our
communications
with
waterloo
they've
identified
that
it's
going,
it's
going
well
in
terms
of
the
collection
they
receive
a
check
from
airbnb.
It
is
a
lump
sum
payment.
J
There
isn't
much
documentation
that
that
you
know
corresponds
with
the
payments
that
they're
receiving,
but
I
also
can't
speak
to
whether
their
mat
bot
their
matt
bylaw
specifically
has
auditing
requirements
as
ours
does
so
that
part
I
can't
speak
to,
but
can
verify
that.
Certainly
waterloo
has
spoken
positively
about
their
experience
with
a
airbnb
in
the
collection
of
matt
through
that
mechanism.
B
B
I
mean
that's,
that's
in
a
way
kind
of
speaks
to
how
well
they
run
their
system,
but
in
a
sense
it
limits
us
now
with
that,
if
they
protect
that
privacy
so
much,
you
had
a
slide
where
I
believe
there
was
already
488,
strs
id'd
and
somehow
we
already
know
that
80
of
them
are
with
airbnb
in
the
other
20
or
with
other
platforms.
How
do
if,
if
we
can
already
gather
that
information
right
now,
how
did
we
get
that
information?
J
B
J
J
B
J
It
would
be,
we
would
be
able
to
look
at
the
number
of
postings
that
are
through
the
platforms,
but
we
wouldn't
be
able
to
identify
their
actual
location
specifically
because
the
information's
at
such
a
high
level.
It
shows
it
more
at
like
a
aggregate,
neighborhood
level,
and
until
you
enter
into
an
agreement
to
rent
a
location,
you
can't
find
out
where
it's
actually
located.
So
it's
just
showing
you
that
high
level
map,
but
not
specific
locations
as
to
where
the
sdrs
are
operating.
J
B
B
Hearing,
sorry,
I
I
was
just
gonna
say:
would
it
would
it
be
fair
if
it's
complaint
driven?
Would
it
be
fair
to
consider
that
str
host
that
our
licensing
would
also
make
money
against
those
that
are
not
licensed,
simply
because
they
want
as
fair
playing
field
as
everybody
else
for
following
the
rules.
J
J
J
It
also
does
cross-platform
matching
of
calendar
block
dates
and
then
they're
overlapped
with
eliminated
dates,
so
that
and
it's
something
that
uses
like
an
or
operation
so
that
it's
able
to
look
at
average
block
length
and
it's
able
to
cross
reference
between
platforms
to
determine
that
if
something
is
blocked
off,
then
likely
it's
it's
not
being
it's
not
being
operated
consistent
with.
What's
what
the
str
calendar
is
showing?
That's
how
I
understand
it:
okay,.
B
So,
basically,
just
using
it
and
or
methodology
and
an
algorithm,
basically
an
attempt
to
predict
but
short
of
actually
having
enforcement
there
looking
at
it,
there
will
still
be
limitations,
one
it
wouldn't
actually
know
for
sure
short
of
having
somebody
actually
better
do
the
movies
and
goings.
That's
that
fair.
E
So
you
are
correct
and
I
think
that's
sort
of
the
short
answer
is
that
unless
we
are
sent
by
complaint
and
we're
able
to
follow
up
with
concerns
about
that,
we
would
not
be
able
to
identify
how
many
are
actually
physically
in
the
in
the
dwelling.
Unless
we
were
to
receive
a
complaint
and
act
towards
it,.
D
Trout
all
right,
thank
you,
worship.
Thank
you,
councillor,
excellent
questions.
Thank
you
staff.
So
far,
could
we
is
there
any
way
we
could
get
up
on
the
screen
that
one
slide?
I
found
very
useful
in
both
the
timeline
of
the
changes
through
the
committee
and
then
the
columns.
You
know
the
the
various
aspects
because
it
has
all
the
pieces,
the
main
high-level
pieces
that
are
in
the
policy.
D
D
D
D
Thank
you
okay,
so
my
questions
have
to
do
with
what's
on
here,
because
no
matter
what
we
decide
tonight,
we
need
to
make
sure
we
have
all
the
pieces
that
would
make
this
useful
program
and
you
know
not
something
that
would
sort
of
be
dysfunctional
right
from
there.
So
here
we
see,
the
licensing
remains
all
along
the
language
about
the
capacities
is
there
along
and
then
you
see,
things
have
been
removed
and
this
is
and
I'll
get
the
staff
to
confirm.
D
D
Right
so
you
see
here
the
things
that
were
removed.
You've
got
the
principal
residence
language
in
the
bylaw,
the
180
day
limit
language
in
the
bylaw
I'll
get
back
to
those
in
a
minute.
I
have
questions
about
that
that
might
require
going
to
a
different
slide,
but
the
compliance
monitoring
is
by
far
the
most
controversial
aspect.
D
So,
let's
just
I
have
a
couple
questions
about
this
so
concert
home
has
already
touched
on
some
of
this,
but
see
it
was
switched
on
that
table
from
the
compliance
american
company
to
the
canadian
version,
which
is
hamari,
but
the
controversy
remains
because
people
consider
the
surveillance
or
spying
other
extreme
words
have
been
used
to
describe.
This
staff
told
us
at
committee
that
a
lot
of
this,
that
all
of
this
is
public
information
and
that
these
are
people
that
are
publicly
advertising
their
property
for
rent
on
the
airbnb
or
other
websites.
D
D
A
D
J
Yes,
thank
you
and
to
you,
your
worship,
so,
at
the
staff
level,
the
things
that
we're
missing
are
the
address.
Identification
module
is
something
that
is
specific
to
the
unique
algorithms
that
have
been
developed
as
part
of
the
hamari
software.
That
is,
is
able
to
cross-reference
with
our
own
internal
data,
to
drill
down
to
determine
the
location
of
str's
and
the
actual
registered
owner
of
the
property,
which
is
really
important
when
we're
doing
enforcement,
so
even
in
our
our
current
circumstance.
J
Now,
if
we
are
attending
a
property,
as
you
can
imagine,
there's
a
party
going
on
or
something's
happening
and
we
get
a
noise
complaint.
It's
often
a
night
noise
complaint
we
may
have
property,
we
may
have
officers
that
attend
a
property
and
they're
knocking
on
the
door
to
say
you
know,
a
noise
complaint
has
happened,
oftentimes
we're
dealing
with
the
person,
who's,
who's,
rented,
the
str,
not
the
actual
operator
themselves,
and
sometimes
the
person
who
rents
doesn't
actually
know
a
lot
about
who
they're
renting
from
so.
J
In
those
cases
it
enables
us,
like
we
do
with
all
of
our
enforcement
work,
to
to
drill
down
into
to
know
the
actual
property
and
to
be
able
to
cross-reference
that,
with
with
our
internal
information,
to
verify
the
actual
name
and
identity
of
the
registered
property
owner,
so
that
we
can
go
through
that
process
and
it's
doing
it
in
a
much
more
instantaneous
fashion.
What
we
have
to
do
now
from
a
staff
perspective
would
be
a
lot
more
detailed
involved.
J
Investigative
work,
that's
quite
a
bit
more
onerous
on
a
on
a
case-by-case
basis,
so
the
address
identification
module
is,
is
one
of
the
most
important
things
that
were
that
we're
missing
now
to
to
help
us
to
effectively
administer
in
a
proactive
way,
a
to
make
sure
that
operations
are
running
with
licenses
and
and
then
again,
specifically
with
respect
to
the
map.
That's
the
second
component
of
it.
D
D
J
Yeah,
thank
you
and
through
you,
so
yes,
the
hamari
software.
You
know
it
does
similar
things
to
host
compliance
and
that
they're
they're,
both
companies
that
assist
with
compliance-based
technology.
For
the
you
know
the
virtual
environment.
They
I'm
I'm
quite
certain.
They
have
their
own
algorithms
that
are
different
from
one
another
and
they're
proprietary,
so
they
they
have
similar
results.
How
they
get.
J
There
may
be
a
little
bit
different,
specifically
with
respect
to
the
administrative
policies
committee
meeting
from
february
of
2020,
we
were
asked
specifically
to
go
out
and
find
a
canadian
company
that
would
provide
a
comparable
service
to
host
compliance
and
hamari
was
the
only
company
in
the
market.
We
were
able
to
find.
I
we're
not
aware
of
any
other
canadian-based
companies
that
are
providing
that
service
unless
they're,
very
fledgling
in
nature
and
and
not
yet
something
that
that
we
become
aware
of.
D
Okay,
but
so
from
what
you
just
said,
the
the
most
important
thing
that
related
to
my
question
was
the
proprietary
nature
of
that
software.
So
most
compliance
has
proprietary.
Software
primaries,
obviously,
would
be
different,
otherwise,
they'd
be
infringing
on
the
proprietary
rights
of
those
compliance.
D
Harmari
has
proprietary
software.
There
may
be
another
newer
company,
that's
competing
with
murray
for
the
canadian
market,
but
that's
kind
of
not
useful
to
us.
We
well,
we
need
one.
We
need
some
kind
of
address
identification
software,
it's
an
advanced
software
program
that
we
can
only
get
through
hamari.
So
the
the
obvious
follow-up
question
would
be
so
with
the
current
recommendation,
with
no
third-party
software
company
involved
at
all.
D
J
J
We
have
run
reports
that
show
us
a
detailed
breakdown
of
the
str's
operating
in
our
market,
which
we're
able
to
determine
if
they
have
licenses
or
if
they
don't
and
then
also
cross-reference,
that
to
determine
if
they've
paid
their
mat
or
they
haven't.
Otherwise,
it
would
be
a
very
manual
based
process
in
our
level
of
efficiency.
In
the
time
it
would
take
us
to
get
compliance
or
a
high
level.
Compliance
with
the
bylaw,
I
think,
would
be
tremendously
longer.
D
Right
so
so
you've
said:
there's
two
aspects:
one
is
the
the
pure
access
to
the
information
that
the
address
identification
software
gives
and
then,
but
the
second
one,
perhaps
just
as
important,
is
the
level
of
efficiency.
It
allows
staff
to
monitor
all
the
the
smart
hosts
that
there
are,
it
would
be
painstaking
if
done
manually
is
what
you're
saying
and,
and
so
it's
not
just
access
to
information.
It's
also
the
ease
and
the
speed
of
the
processing
information.
J
We're
able
to
extract
that
you
know
through
the
hamari
software
that
is
very
helpful
to
the
collection
of
our
evidence
with
respect
to
you
know
being
able
to
enforce
against
those
individuals
that
are
non-compliant
with
with
the
bylaw
kyle.
I
don't
know
if
you
want
to
speak
to
that
anymore
from
from
an
enforcement
perspective,.
E
Thank
you,
and
through
your
chair,
I
think
it's
pretty
simple-
is
that
it's
if
we
did
not
have
this
platform,
is
that
you
would
only
be
really
looking
at
85
percent
of
this
market,
where
not
only
that,
just
like
you,
said
counselor
stroud,
it
would
be
a
painstaking
process
to
do
this
manually.
We
rely
on
the
analytics
and
information
that
comes
from
this
platform
if
we
were
to
go
with
working
directly
with
airbnb,
there's
nothing
to
stop
hosts
from
jumping
platforms
and
then
for
everything.
D
D
Is
there
any
way
that
I
know
this
was
kind
of
implied
with
the
language
around
what
would
happen
if
we
entered
into
a
surface
level
agreement
with
mari?
But
how
can
is
there
a
way
that
we
can
get
very
strong
legal
assurances
data
that
they
have
access
to
is
a
not
confidential
and
b,
not
shared,
so
any
way
we
could
write
that
into
the
service
level
agreement.
J
J
So
that's
number
one
number
two
through
our
is
nt
group
before
we
enter
into
any
types
of
these
agreements,
there's
a
due
diligence
process
that
happens,
that
that
looks
at
all
of
those
privacy
components
and
the
agreements
in
the
the
third
party
agreement
that
would
have
to
be
established.
So
that's
something
that
would
happen.
Should
council
want
to
proceed
with
that,
and
that
is
how
our
is
t
group
corporately.
We
vet
any
of
these
types
of
third-party
agreements.
J
D
Thank
you
and,
on
the
other
hand,
if
we
entered
into
an
agreement
with
airbnb,
it's
a
much
much
much
bigger
company.
What?
What
are
the
kind
of
challenges
that
that
poses
that?
We
haven't
already
mentioned
that
we
might
have
mentioned
that
committee.
That
council
may
not
have
heard
the
challenges
with
with
an
agreement
and
negotiating
with
a
company
as
large
and
as
global
as
airbnb.
J
Thank
you,
and
through
you,
so
from
from
a
staff
perspective
and
again
looking
at
the
direction
that
we
were
provided
at
committee.
Just
the
the
first
thing
that
I
would
identify,
because
the
committee
specifically
gave
us
direction
to
look
for
a
canadian-based
company
is
that
airbnb
is
an
american
company
and
their
data
is
stored
on
on
american
based
servers.
J
So
if
that
is
a
primary
concern
and
anything
related
to
privacy,
protections
and
and
the
patriot
act,
which
is
something
that
was
brought
up
earlier
in
in
the
process
of
developing
this
program,
is
something
that
certain
counselors
felt
quite
strongly.
That
was
a
concern,
certainly
that
would
still
be
present
with
respect
to
the
city
entering
into
an
agreement
with
airbnb.
J
The
second
thing
that
I
would
say
is
that,
as
part
of
our
discussions
with
airbnb,
they
aren't
able
to
guarantee
that
they
will
work
with
the
city.
So
this
is
something
where
I
think
the
the
amendment
or
the
recommendation
is,
is
talking
about
us
as
working
towards
a
voluntary
service
agreement
with
airbnb.
J
They
won't
give
you
any
assurances
of
a
commitment
to
work
with
the
city
until
after
they
review
your
bylaw
as
its
past
and
kyle
had
another
meeting
with
airbnb
this
week
to
specifically
try
to
understand
a
little
bit
more
about
what
that
process
would
entail.
So
we
could
plan
for
it
from
the
staff
perspective.
Should
council
want
to
go
that
direction
and
the
the
feedback
that
we
received
from
airbnb
is
that
they
do
that.
J
For
a
few
reasons
again,
they
want
to
make
sure
that
they're
working
with
someone
that
already
has
a
bylaw
that
that
requires
it.
But
secondly,
they
look
very
carefully
at
the
nature
of
the
bylaw
and
typically
decide
not
to
enter
into
agreements
with
municipalities
that
have
more
stricter
provisions
in
their
bylaw
and
for
us.
J
You
know
with
the
way
the
staff
recommendation
is
and
what
we've
put
in
the
staff
reports
about
continuing
to
monitor
and
potentially
needing
to
come
back
to
share
information
with
council
to
look
at
adding
provisions
like
the
180
days
or
the
owner
occupied
provisions
that
we
took
out
that
were
there
earlier
in
the
process
that
are
really
meant
to
help
protect.
The
long-term
housing
supply
that
should
council
want
to
do
that
is
that
going
to
compromise
our
ability
to
work
with
airbnb,
because
our
bylaw
would
be
more
restrictive
than
it
is
now.
J
So
from
an
auditing
and
reconciliation
perspective,
there
could
be
some
challenges
with
respect
to
that
process.
Based
on
how
our
bylaw
is
written
now
and
some
of
the
financial
practices
that
that
we
administer
as
the
city.
I
don't
know
if
ms
kennedy
would
like
to
add
anything
further
on
that,
because
I
believe
she's
also
had
some
discussions
with
our
auditors
with
respect
to
to
looking
at
the
process.
K
Thanks
for
you,
mr
mayor,
so
thanks,
commissioner
agnew.
So,
yes,
we
do
have
currently
in
the
bylaws
some
requirements
around
auditing,
and
that
is
speaking
specifically
to
ensuring
that
we
have
completeness
of
revenue,
which
is
one
of
the
elements
that
our
auditors
also
look
at.
When
they're
doing
the
the
annual
audit.
We
have
to
be
comfortable
that
the
revenues
are
complete
and
that
we've
received
everything
that
is
due
to
the
city.
K
If
we
do
not
have
specific
information
as
to
what's
making
up
those
funds
that
are
coming
to
the
city,
it's
very
difficult
to
be
able
to
get
an
assurance
that
we
are
collecting
everything
on
one
hand.
My
understanding
with
airbnb
there's,
probably
minimal
risk
in
terms
of
if
we
have
an
operator
using
airbnb,
those
monies
are
going
directly
to
them,
so
very
little
risk
from
the
operator
side,
but
we
would
have
no
way
of
being
able
to
validate
that
those
monies
are
flowing
through
a
proper
process,
with
proper
controls
and
coming
to
the
city.
K
So,
for
example,
could
quite
easily
be
a
mix-up
in
processes
at
airbnb
and
one
of
the
operators
monies
didn't
come
to
us.
It
went
to
another
municipality,
we
would
never
have
any
way
of
knowing
that,
and
it's
also
very
difficult
to
perform
any
kind
of
substantive
procedures
over
those
amounts
as
well
to
ensure
that
they
at
least
are
reasonable
or
that
we
can
connect
them
back
to
where
we
some
of
the
data
that
we
have
in
terms
of
of
the
operations
within
the
city.
A
D
Yeah,
so
your
worship-
I'm
almost
done
here
so
that
sounds
on
the
airbnb
agreement.
That
sounds
like
a
huge
question
mark.
Basically,
we
don't
actually
know
what
it's
going
to
look
like,
which
is
actually
in
the
amended
recommendation,
because
it
asks
it.
It
acknowledges
that
it
asks
for
a
report
in
four
months
time
in
may
we're
just
doing
questions
now,
but
I
will.
I
will
need
to
speak
at
some
point
when
we
get
to
debate
about
what
happened
at
committee.
L
A
G
A
J
J
If
we
were
doing
this
more
on
a
manual
basis
would
be
for
us
to
be,
you
know
basically
clicking
through
and
looking
at
postings
and
seeing
if
there
is
a
corresponding
license
associated
with
those
specific
postings
or
operators.
However,
again
without
an
address
identification
module
would
be
difficult
for
us
to
actually
know
where
that
str
is
operating
and
who
owns
it.
G
J
Thank
you
and
through
you-
and
I
may
ask
mr
akonfo
for
some
assistance
on
this,
I'm
just
going
by
by
memory
with
our
licensing
bylaw
the
way
that
it
is
right
now
there
are
a
number
of
of
types
of
businesses
that
are
required
to
get
business
licenses.
It's
not
all
businesses,
specifically
there
there's
an
exemption
in
there
with
respect
to
the
large
hotel
operators.
J
I
think
what
we
have
in
their
under
lodging
houses
is
for
a
small
inns
that
are
four
or
more
units
are
required
to
get
a
business
license
specifically
the
way
that
bylaw
our
business
bylaw
is
written
right
now,
but
our
business
bylaw
doesn't
contemplate
necessarily
like
this
full
arrangement,
so
whether
it
would
be
subject
to
a
license
or
not,
I
would
have
to
look
into
that
further
kyle.
I
don't
know
if
you
have
some
additional
information
on
that.
E
G
J
Thank
you,
and
through
you,
certainly,
if
the
if
the
city
entered
into
the
voluntary
service
collection
agreement,
we
would
definitely
be
relying
upon
airbnb
to
be
able
to
provide
us
with
information
about
the
the
financial
pieces
that
they're
collecting
on
behalf
of
the
city.
But
certainly
there
would
be
you
know
we
would
have
an
agreement
with
them,
but
without
being
able
to
validate
it.
I
think
that's
the
concern
and
that's
what
miss
kennedy
spoke
to
with
respect
to
or
matt
collection
bylaw.
C
J
E
Thank
you,
your
chair,
just
echo.
Yes,
I
think
the
two,
the
two
major
flaws
would
be
the
reconciliation
process,
but
not
only
that
that
we're
sort
of
subject
to
what
airbnb
dictates.
That
means,
like
commissioner
agnew
spoke
previously
with
the
voluntary
collection
agreement,
the
stiffer
our
regulations
are
or
if
we
decided
that
we
wanted
to
put
further
restrictions
on.
They
then
review
our
bylaw
to
decide
whether
or
not
they
want
to
continue
with
the
vca.
E
I
believe
a
delegation
spoke
to
that
even
last
night
that
agreements
with
the
vca
are
subject
to
that
municipality's
bylaw
and
their
restrictions.
So
if
we
wanted
to
decide
later
down
the
road
that
we
wanted
to
implement
further
restrictions,
well
we're
going
to
have
to
go
through
airbnb
to
discuss
that
through
our
agreement.
Further.
L
Thank
you,
your
worship,
but
through
you
just
one
question
to
staff,
and
it
has
to
do
with
what
we
saw
at
the
very
beginning
slide
about
the
number
of
short-term
rentals
that
we
have
in
kingston,
and
I
know
that
the
administrative
policies
committee
had
already
eliminated
the
requirement
that
any
short-term
rentals
would
have
to
be
in
the
principal
residence.
But
do
we
know
in
kingston
how
many
short-term
rentals
are
in
a
principal
residence
versus
how
many
are
the
entire
house?
Do
we
know
that.
J
Thank
you
and
through
you,
so
the
the
last
data
that
we
looked
at
as
part
of
the
hamare
presentation
was
showing
that
of
the
number
of
units
that
we've
spoken
to.
I
think
there
were
approximately
104
that
were
cross-referenced
as
home
sharing,
so
that
would
be
more
of
the
owner-occupied
situation,
where
they're
offering
at
a
part
of
their
home,
as
part
of
as
part
of
the
str
platform
that
they're
offering.
With
respect
to
the
total
number.
L
J
Sorry
so
52
of
488,
so
257
that
are
single,
detached
dwellings,
104,
showing
as
a
home
share
option
so
so
488
is,
is
what
we're
showing
in
our
market.
Now
that
is,
you
know
it.
It
slides
back
and
forth
a
year
ago,
we're
about
600
in
the
in
the
summer
time
we're
over
500.
I
don't
know
if
it's
if
it's
seasonal,
if
it's
part
of
the
housing
market,
but
right
now
we're
showing
488..
M
J
M
J
J
Yes,
thank
you
and
through
you,
your
worship,
that's
an
important
point
so
that
the
staff
recommendation
about
the
hamari
platform
with
respect
to
matt
and
again
we
we
spoke
with
hamari
about
this
through
the
process.
It
wasn't
part
of
our
original
recommendation
of
looking
at
having
them,
develop
a
self-remittance
portal
for
matt
and
that's
important,
because
that's
what
our
communication
with
the
hosts
had
said
that
that
was
their
preference.
J
F
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson
and
yeah.
I'm
wow
there's
a
lot
of
stuff
here,
so
I
guess
the
first
question
I
have
is
related
to
the
audit
issue
that
there
seems
to
be
concerned
about
that.
Where
is
that
based
within
our
our
finance
department,
and
is
that
something
that
can
be
reconfigured
to
to
not
be
a
stumbling.
J
Block
thinking
through
you,
I
can
speak
to
part
of
it
and
then
some
of
it,
ms
kennedy,
may
want
to
be
able
to
contribute
directly
as
our
city
treasurer
the
the
provisions
that
I
spoke
about
that
speak
to
the
requirement
for
auditing
associated
with
matt
collection
that
comes
directly
from
the
map.
Bylaw,
that's
in
effect
that
council
passed
so
there's,
there's
several
clauses
associated
with
that.
K
K
Looking
at
our
controls
to
see
what
the
oversight
is
over
those
funds,
but
in
terms
of
where
you've
got
an
entity
like
airbnb,
that's
collecting
them,
we
don't
have
any
control
over
their
processes,
so
the
auditors
can't
confirm-
or
we
can't
confirm
that
they've
got
appropriate
processes
to
know
that
the
monies
that
came
in
from
a
specific
operator
in
kingston
are
actually
getting
flowed
back
out
to
the
city
of
kingston.
So
what
we
would
do
instead
is,
we
would
look
at
substantive
type
procedures
to
ensure
things
like
reasonableness
size
of
the
operator.
K
That
type
of
thing
comparing
last
year
to
this
year,
different
types
of
substantive
procedures
that
we
would
do
or
that
the
auditors
would
do
at
year
end.
The
challenge
with
that
is.
You
need
to
have
the
detail
to
know
that.
So,
if
all
I
have
is
an
amount,
that's
come
in
this
month
and
I
have
no
idea
which
operators
it
relates
to.
F
K
Yeah
for
you,
mr
mayor,
absolutely
that's
a
discussion
that
we
could
have
with
waterloo.
I
would
I
would
hazard
a
guess,
probably
a
couple
of
things.
One
waterloo
may
have
just
decided
that,
based
on
the
values,
it
was
not
worth
the
risk
and
they
were
happy
to
take
that
risk
on
and
address
it.
That
way,
if
there
was
other
things
that
they
felt
were
more
important
in
terms
of
going
that
route.
K
The
other
thing,
I
would
say,
is
certainly
from
a
level
of
materiality,
and
I
can
say
you
know,
there's
minimal
risk
for
us
in
terms
of
our
external
audit,
for
those
that
are
on
the
administrative
policies
know
our
materiality
with
kpmg
is
10
million
dollars,
so
this
would
fall
below
that.
So
there's
not
a
risk
in
terms
of
putting
our
external
audit
opinion
at
risk
at
all,
and
certainly
waterloo
would
have
a
much
higher
amount
in
terms
of
their
materiality,
so
yeah.
F
Right
my
next
question,
mayor
patterson,
is
related
to
the
cost
benefit
analysis
report
that
we
received
last
night
and
I'm
wondering
why
what
your
feedback
would
be
that,
from
a
treasurer
point
of
view,
because
the
if,
if
somehow
we
go
with
the
hamari
route,
we
we
realize
our
costs
are
going
to
be
very
high
and
it's
going
to
absorb
any
any
monies
we
might
bring
in
through
a
mat
tax.
And
what
would
you
say
to
the
cost
benefit
analysis
that
looks
pretty
grim
here.
K
So,
thank
you
counselor
for
you,
mr
mayor.
Unfortunately
counselor.
I
can't
comment
on
that.
That
was
the
first
I
saw
that
last
night
and
I
was
trying
to
get
it
blown
up
on
the
screen
to
to
take
a
look
at
some
of
the
numbers.
So
I
can't
comment
on
that.
I
think
the
only
thing
I
would
say
is
it.
It
certainly
was
a
a
financial
analysis
and
I
would
suggest
you
know
looking
at
it
from
a
business
case
perspective,
there's
a
lot
of
other
elements
as
well.
K
F
Okay,
I
appreciate
that
the
other
matthew
mayor
patterson,
the
other
thing
that
I
wanted
to
ask.
I
I'm
struggling
with,
because
there's
two
components
here
we
will,
we
will
be
pursuing
a
license
as
well
for
the
str's
and
and
I'm
wondering
why
we
wouldn't
have
that
license-
have
enough
components
that
would
help
us
in
some
of
the
ability
to
exert
enforcement,
because
no
officers-
and
maybe
this
is
for
someone
else-
no
officers
would
have
a
problem.
They
would
know
if
there
was
a
complaint
if
this
was
a
fully
licensed
home.
J
Yeah,
thank
you
and
for
your
worship.
So
certainly
there
are
clauses
in
the
licensing
bylaw
for
str's,
as
as
we
have
recommended
that
speak
to
enforcement.
Specifically,
I
think
that
the
issue
is
the
speed
and
the
efficiency
at
which
we
can
do
the
enforcement
without
the
technology
that
helps
us
to
proactively
identify
where
we
have
issues
as
opposed
to
responding
on
things
on
a
case-by-case
basis.
J
F
The
but
we
from
an
enforcement
point
of
view,
then
I
want
to
ask
already:
there
are
already
bylaws
in
place
that
that
that
have
that
deal
with
noise
and
garbage
and
parking
and
safety
in
in
residential
areas
is
that
right.
There
are
already
bylaws
in
place
that
give
our
bylaw
officers
something
to
work
with.
F
J
H
Thank
you,
your
worship,
I'm
very
pleased
to
hear
miss
kennedy.
Talk
about
the
actual
materiality,
the
level
of
materiality
so
insignificant,
for
the
saw
that
red
herring
of
the
auditing
component,
I
think,
is
a
bit
of
a
misnomer
I'd
like
to
know
if
staff
has
seen
any
reporting
or
any
samples
of
reporting
from
from
airbnb,
because
the
reason
I
ask
this
question
is
because
when
this
was
first
brought
forward
in
february,
there
had
been
no
conversations
with
just.
H
So
my
question
is,
you
know
we
hear
this.
The
this
discussion
about
the
documentation
coming
from
airbnb
may
not
be
sufficient
and
it's
a
lot
of
subjective,
but
we
have
not
heard
from
airbnb.
We
don't
have
any
presentation
of
what
they're
able
to
provide
it's
just
all
speculation.
So
I'd
like
to
know
if
there's
been
any
sample
documentation
of
what
a
report
would
look
like
that
is
presented
perhaps
to
waterloo
or
another
similar
size,
municipality.
J
Thank
you
and
through
you
so
appreciate
the
question.
I
wouldn't
characterize
staff's
conversations
with
airbnb
as
speculative
those
conversations
have
taken
place.
Most
of
them
have
been
facilitated
by
mr
compo
directly.
We
do
have
some
email
documentation
from
airbnb,
although
they've
been
hesitant
and
difficult
to
have
things
put
in,
writing,
they're,
more
open
to
phone
conversations,
but
until
we
have
a
bylaw,
they
haven't
been
willing
to
more
formally
engage
with
us
in
providing
us
with
samples
of
agreements
or
any
of
those
types
of
of
pieces.
Until
we
move
to
the
next
level.
H
So
moving
to
the
next
level
is
essentially
what
this
bylaw
amendment
does.
Is
it
encourages
a
formal
bylaw
to
be
passed
and
encourages
that
negotiation?
The
conversation
take
place.
It
gives
us
a
window
to
see
if
it
works.
It
gives
you
an
out
that
hasn't
worked.
We
can
go
back
to
original
plan.
If
it
does
work,
we
got
a
one
year
renewal
to
look
at.
How
is
that
not
a
reasonable
approach,
rather
than
a
big
stick?
So
if
you
have
a
hammer,
everything
looks
like
a
name
sponsor
chappelle.
This.
A
H
Sure
I've
got
so
many
with
respect
to
the
process.
That's
lied
out
aside,
take
care,
mario,
it
doesn't
not
seem
like
a
reasonable
compromise
to
do.
Self-Enforcement
self-registration,
when
you
have
so
many
of
over
a
hundred
plus
coming
forward,
say
they
want
to
pay
the
mat
tax.
No
one's,
not
no!
This
is
not.
This
is
a
reasonable
approach,
so
the
question
is:
is:
is.
J
Thank
you.
I
don't
think
it's
it's
my
position
to
comment
on
whether
something's,
reasonable
or
not.
I
think
what
we've
tried
to
do
at
the
staff
level
is
provide
counsel
with
as
much
information
and
all
of
these
facets
as
possible.
It's
it's
up
to
you
to
determine
what
you
think
is
reasonable.
I
think
what
we've
provided
is
our
our
expert
expertise
with
respect
to
enforcement.
What
we've
seen
is
working
and
not
working.
H
J
H
J
Thank
you
counselor
for
the
question,
so
I'm
happy
to
speak
to
that.
Mr
campo
may
want
to
provide
some
comments
as
well.
So
definitely
we
do
have.
We
have
a
system
where
people
are
able
to
call
in
and
register
complaints,
but
where
we
have
moved
to
more
of
a
proactive
format
is
more
in
the
the
education
approach,
our
our
approach
to
working
with
property
owners,
giving
them
opportunities
to
come
into
compliance
in
more
of
a
friendly
format.
J
Before
we
move
on
with
you
know,
more
additional
forms
of
enforcement
having
more
more
staff
that
are
out
on
the
streets
engaging
with
with
stakeholder
and
community
based
organizations
as
well
in
those
collaborative
conversations
and
identifying
where
we're
seeing
issues.
So
that
is
more
of
the
proactive
approach
that
I've
been
speaking
to.
Mr
conto,
I
don't
know
if
you
have
additional
comments
to
provide
on
that.
E
Thank
you
and
through
your
chair,
I
completely
agree
with
commissioner
agnew.
We
do
solid
waste,
proactive
enforcement
throughout
the
year
with
our
solid
waste
colleagues.
We
also
do
it
for
property
standards
and
our
animal
control
bylaws
our
primary
bylaws
that
we
enforce
with
this
city.
We
do
it
on
an
education
basis
as
well.
E
Thank
you
and
through,
I
think,
one
of
the
biggest
things
that
I've
looked
at
is
that
we're
only
capturing
a
certain
percentage
of
strs
through
any
of
our
enforcement
in
any
of
our
bylaws.
We
do
not
just
discriminate
against
one
group
and
one
percentage
of
a
group.
We
incorporate
the
whole
community,
so
that's
a
that's
a
standstill
that
we
do
for
any
bylaw.
That
is
a
philosophy
that
I
went
into
this
project
with.
H
One
of
the
biggest
concerns
that
many
of
these
small,
like
I
think
it's
too
different
items-
we've
got
the
the
individuals
that
have
the
the
in
in-home
dwellings
of
like
104
of
them
and
257
family
homes.
These
are
typically
people
who
are
trying
to
pay
their
taxes,
because
the
taxes
are
significantly
high
in
kingston,
so
there
are
small
business
owners.
E
I
think
that,
through
this
consultation
period
again,
we've
we've
tried
to
focus
on
the
full
market
and
not
just
a
certain
percentage
of
this
market
when
we
go
to
look
into
a
proper
consultation-
and
I
know
counselor
chapelle,
you've
spoken
to
that
many
times
about
what
proper
consultation
looks
like.
I
think,
through
the
course
of
our
engagement,
especially
with
kingston
homeshare
association,
is
that
we
tried
to
look
at
concerns
number
one,
removing
the
the
principal
residence
which
was
a
huge
concern
and
the
second
one
was
removing
the
180
days,
accumulative
restriction.
E
So
right,
then,
and
there
you're,
taking
the
majority
of
the
bylaw
away
we've
already
watered
down
this
bylaw.
So
when
we're
looking
at
just
dealing
specifically
with
airbnb
again
now,
this
is
something
that
is
not
an
oral
practice.
We're
completely
just
viewing
one
platform:
we're
not
incorporating
any
other
platforms
in
an
enforcement
side.
We're
also
looking
at
what,
if
you
jump
platform
to
platform.
So
when
we're
talking
about
meaningful
engagement
with
our
stakeholders,
I
think
we've
gone
through
that
this
year
and
when
we're
talking
about
we,
we
are
on
two
different
ends.
H
A
A
O
J
J
I
thank
you
and
through
you
so
again
I
don't
have
formalized
data
from
them.
I
I
a
number
of
the
individuals
that
we've
met
with
through
that
organization
definitely
identified
that
they
are
offering
accommodations
out
of
their
home
as
as
part
of
their
their
their
strategy,
their
financial
strategy
associated
with
their
property,
but
certainly
there
are
some
that
have
additional
properties
to
their
primary
residence
that
they
are
renting
out
as
well.
J
O
I'm
just
saying
that,
because,
in
the
meetings
that
I
attended,
I
thought
there's
a
difference
of
there's
a
difference
of
interest
here.
They
may
identify
certain
common
interests,
but
there
are
also
differences
of
interest.
So
I
think
when
we're
talking
about
drafting
a
bylaw,
we
need
to
keep
that
in
mind.
You
said
earlier
and
answered
to
a
question
by
counselor
sanik
that
at
the
moment
we
have-
and
I'm
just
confirming
this-
this
is
actually
a
question
we
have
about
488
available
short-term
rentals
in
kingston.
O
Now
in
2020
we
had
500,
I
think
this
summer
you
identified
and
in
2019
we
had
600
seasonally
affected
to
be
sure
to
some
extent.
So
I
guess
my
question:
is:
we've
been
discussing
a
lot
of
things
with
the
home
share
host
association,
but
are
they
representative
of
the
of
the
short-term
rental
market.
O
J
O
O
J
I
would
say
that
that
the
the
home
share
host
group
that
we
have
been
engaging
with
would
probably
be
represented
if
we
look
at
the
overall
sample
and
the
number
of
individuals
that
have
indicated
they're
part
of
of
that
stakeholder
group,
that
would
be
probably
an
accurate
overall
percentage
again
in
the
formulation
of
looking
at
the
recommendations
that
staff
have
provided.
We
tried
to
look
at
this
from
a
whole
market
perspective.
J
Certainly,
there
are
conversations
at
points
in
time
where
we
were
we're
asked.
Can
we
have
different
regulations
for
people
that
own
properties
in
the
city,
but
don't
live
here?
Those
types
of
things
where
again
from
you
know
a
fairness
and
consistency
perspective.
We
have
to
treat
all
property
owners
regardless
of
whether
they
live
in
the
city
or
they
don't.
J
Similarly,
in
terms
of
of
putting
together
a
program-
and
I
think
that's
what
mr
campo
was
speaking
to-
is
that
certainly
you
know
there
have
been
some
stronger
voices
at
the
table
with
respect
to
their
particular
interests
on
this
matter.
But
staff
tried
to
take
all
of
that
into
consideration,
as
well
as
looking
at
best
practice
comparators
and
our
knowledge
of
of
what
we've
seen
working
in
kingston
with
respect
to
enforcement
and
where
we
have
gaps
and
to
put
the
recommendations
that
are
before
you
tonight,
which
I
think
are
quite
balanced
and
fair.
A
Okay,
thank
you.
Are
there
any
other,
any
other
questions
for
our
staff,
so
you've
already
asked
questions
for
the
briefing,
but
you'll
have
a
chance
to
ask
questions
once
we
get
to
anybody
else
in
the
briefing
okay.
So
with
that,
then
we'll
move
to
1b
supplemental
report,
short-term
rental
licensing
program.
So
at
this
point
we
will
put
the
the
recommendation
from
the
administrative
policies
committee
is
now
on
the
floor
and
open
for
debate.
Discussion
first
on
my
list
is
council
shrub.
D
Thanks
your
worship,
I
think,
as
chair
of
the
committee,
it
makes
sense.
I
should
at
least
introduce
the
item
if
anyone
hasn't
been
paying
attention
over
the
last
two
years.
This
this
was
at
committee
for
since
the
very
beginning,
because
it
came
at
the
beginning
of
this
term-
and
I've
been
the
chair
for
the
entire
time.
There
has
been
a
lot
of
engagement
from
specifically
from
the
home
share
group
and,
as
staff
has
already
indicated,
with
the
help
of
that
table,
but
also
through
answers
leaving
questions.
D
If
you
take
too
much
out
of
it,
it
becomes
too
easy
to
get
around
it.
To
many
many
problems
that
that
being
said,
though,
it's
clear
that
there
was
a
this
idea
was
inserted
at
some
point
at
committee
by
those
that
will
have
to
live
with
the
regulations,
whatever
form
they
take,
that
the
that
the
scrutiny
that
is
provided
by
a
company
like
kumari
is
is
very
unwelcome.
D
That
is,
that
is
very
clear
and
it
can
be
said
in
different
ways
in
the
correspondence
I've
received
from
hosts,
some
of
whom
I
know
personally,
or
at
least
yeah
as
acquaintances.
The
whole
spectrum
is
there
from
from
conspiracy
theory
to
to
reasonable
intellectual
commentary.
It's
all
there
from
these
various
hosts,
and
I
think
that
there
is
a
there.
D
D
The
regulation
would
come
the
early
days
of
being
a
home
share
host
would
have
been
because
they
were
unregulated,
possibly
quite
lucrative,
of
course,
that
that
fact
you
know
always
brings
out
the
engagement.
If
you
know,
people's
bottom
line
is
that
at
at
stake,
I
would
submit
that
the
numbers
we're
talking
about
here.
D
The
mat
is
say
it's
a
four
percent
sir
charge
to
the
customer,
so
the
city
of
kingston
has
to
have
that
four
percent
value
added
as
a
destination
to
justify
that
kind
of
expense
and
and
it's
a
circle
right,
so
the
marketing
that
we
do.
I
mean
we
market.
What
kingston
is
the
authenticity
of
kingston
right
made
daily
right
that
all
that
stuff
comes
out
of
that
pool
and
that
that
marketing
you
do
benefit
from
if
you're
an
individual
host,
regardless
of
whether
you've
been
paying
interview
so
that
those
two
things
are
are
done.
D
D
There's
no
way
we
can
achieve
that.
If
we
are
playing
second
fiddle
to
airbnb,
okay,
airbnb
airbnb
is
bigger
than
the
city
of
kingston.
I
know
we're
the
council
city
kings
and
we're
all
very
important
people,
but
airbnb
is
bigger
than
all
of
us.
Okay
and
and
that's
the
problem
with
the
suggestion
that
we
let
them
call
the
shots
at
some
point.
It
comes
down
to
control.
D
The
amendment
takes
away
control
from
council
and
it
gives
it
to
airbnb.
I
did
have
an
amendment.
I
thought
that
was
a
compromise
I
was
going
to
propose,
but
it's
not
compatible
with
the
amended
recommendation
and
it's
also
not
compatible
with
the
original
recommendation.
So
so
that
is,
will
forever
live
in
in
my
computer.
D
B
A
B
Thank
you
worshiping
through
you,
so
I'm
going
to
read
something:
that's
right
from
hamari.com
right
now.
It's
the
fifth
bullet
point
on
their
page
for
short-term
vacation
rental
compliance,
the
fifth
bullet
states
receive
and
compile
video
and
audio
documentation
of
str
violations.
So
that's
the
first
point:
I'm
not
sure
how
they're
doing
that
without
having
somebody
on
site.
B
Knobs,
taking
pictures
of
cars
and
running
license
plates
interviewing
guests
residents
of
the
unit
in
person
which
I'm
not
sure
how
they
do
that
in
person,
without
actually
being
there
inquiring,
whether
they
live
there
or
are
renting
providing
the
lease
agreement.
If
there
is
one
they
leave
flyers
under
the
door
to
get
guests
to
check
if
their
room
is
str
compliant
and
they
follow
up
on
non-registered
str
hotline
tips
and
news
and
complaints
to
see
if
the
subjects
are
indeed
non-compliant
and
I'm
reading
this
directly
from
hamari's
documentation.
B
So
if
that
doesn't
give
you
pause
here
that
maybe
we're
not
aware
of
who
we're
about
to
go
into
business
with.
My
next
point
would
be
the
fact
that
hamari
again,
I'm
going
to
reiterate
can
only
see
what
time
is
blocked
off.
They
can't
tell
what
that
time
was
used
for
could
have
been
blocked
off,
because
the
host
was
on
vacation.
It
could
have
been
blocked
off
because
the
host
had
family
staying
with
them.
B
Nonetheless,
it's
likely
they're
going
to
get
assessments
wrong,
so
that
puts
the
burden
of
appealing
that
assessment
on
the
str's
now
and-
and
I
mean
we
all
know
how
that
goes.
Imagine
you
got
your
tax
bill
wrong
and
you
had
to
appeal
it.
That's
a
long
drawn
out
fight
and
even
if
you're
right
in
the
end,
you're
still
going
to
spend
your
time
and
effort
to
win
that.
B
J
B
Thank
you
so
again,
that's
eighteen
thousand
dollars
we're
gonna
send
outside
of
kingston
to
basically
have
another
company
come
in
and
investigate
and
I've
also
read
more
of
their
literature.
I
would
actually
ask
council
to
not
approve
this
recommendation
if
you
have
not
been
to
the
mre
website
and
actually
read
their
own
documentation,
because
it
is
very
eye-opening,
they
that
I'm
sure
they're
a
company
that
does
exactly
what
they're
supposed
to
do.
We
just
need
to
decide
whether
that's
the
kingston
approach
to
things
they
actually
do
a
lot
of
work.
B
It's
surprising
for
a
lot
of
american
states,
so
that
was
a
little
bit
eye-opening
as
well.
To
follow
up
and
finish
with.
This
is
basically
with
our
cost
of
them
being
around
18
000
yearly.
Do
we
think
we're
actually
going
to
find
more
hosts
than
we're
going
to
spend
that
are
not
compliant?
I
mean
like.
I
can't
have
more
faith
in
our
residents
that
they're
gonna
voluntarily
comply
and
and
through
airbnb,
which
is
already
80
of
the
hosts
we've
heard.
So
is
it
possible
that
we're
basically
going
into
business
with
hamari?
B
Who
will
do
the
things
I
read
earlier?
Based
on
their
own
documentation
to
solve
a
problem,
we
may
not
even
have
yet,
because
we
don't
even
know
if
we're
going
to
have
a
lack
of
compliance
from
hosts,
maybe
maybe
it's
less
than
half
a
percent
and
maybe
from
that
half
a
percent.
It's
just
simply
an
error,
or
they
didn't
know
and
as
soon
as
they
find
out
they'll
comply.
So
we
could
potentially
be
solving
a
problem.
B
Thank
you
before
you
vote
on.
This,
have
a
quick
perusal
of
the
hamari
website
and
look
at
some
of
their
points,
because
I'm
not
sure
how
you
get
audio
and
video
evidence
and
put
brochures
under
people's
doors
without
actually
being
at
the
host
property.
So
that's
very.
Concerning
to
me
and
that's
from
their
own
literature,
I
couldn't
make
this
stuff.
Thank
you
very
much.
G
G
One
of
them
was
the
fact
that
we
were
suggesting
that
we
would
be
using
both
airbnb,
which
is
a
an
independent
american
company
and
entrusting
information
from
kingstonians
canadian
citizens
with
them,
but
we
were
also
suggesting
that
we
would
be
using
an
american
platform
to
review
all
of
this.
So
I'm
greatly
relieved
that
we
now
have
a
canadian
company
that
we
can
and
I'll
ask
paige.
I'm
sorry,
commissioner,
I
knew
this
question.
G
J
I
will
acknowledge
that
similar
to
what
counselor
bulma
is
saying,
I
think
hamari
is
working
with
a
number
of
american
cities
and
in
some
cases
I
think
they're
providing
almost
a
full
suite
of
enforcement
services
to
those
municipalities
that
maybe
don't
have
the
staff
to
administer
their
program,
so
they're
sort
of
providing
the
full
suite
of
services.
But
that
is
not
what
we
are,
what
we
are
contemplating
with
respect
to
hamari
or
what
staff
is
recommended
in
terms
of
the
services
that
we
would
procure
through
the
contract.
G
G
You
have
to
have
a
lot
more
faith
than
I
do
in
the
idea
that
totally
an
un
unchecked
company
is
going
to
honestly
give
us
the
funds
that
are
we're
responsible
for
the
other
thing
is
airbnb
like
uber,
has
kind
of
grown
massively,
but
but
they're
very,
very
independent-minded
and
don't
always
comply
with
laws
and
regulations.
There's
a
history
there,
and
so
so.
G
Our
expectation
that
they
are
honestly
going
to
broker
are
are
those
payments,
I
think,
is
a
difficult
leap
of
faith
for
me
to
take
already
we're
being
told
by
our
staff
that
they
want
to
reserve
the
right
and
everybody
pause
and
think
about
this.
They
want
to
reserve
the
right
as
an
american
company
to
be
able
to
dictate
to
kingston
what
they
find
allowable
as
far
as
as
our
bylaws
go.
G
G
C
G
M
Well,
thank
you,
your
worship.
I
am
going
to
bring
a
motion
forward
here
in
in
a
couple
of
minutes.
I
just
wanted
to
begin
by
saying,
though,
that
this
has
got
really
nothing
to
do
at
all
with
the
folks
that
want
to
be
hosts
in
this
community
they're
great
folks,
they've
got
a
good
little
business
going.
I
I
commend
them
100
for
being
willing
to
pay
them
that
tax
and
and
for
for
you
know,
willing
to
be
regulated
in
the
fashion
that
they
are.
It's
got
nothing
to
do
with
that.
It's
just
it's!
M
What
it
has
to
do
with
is
the
issue
of
of
how
we
monitor
this
as
as
a
city,
it's
not.
It's
not
has
nothing
to
do
with
our
concerns
about
the
folks
at
our
hosts
I
mean
I
I've
always
used
this,
this
kind
of
a
platform.
I
think
it's
a
very
you
know
very
successful
platform
around
the
world.
It's
it's
very
user
friendly.
M
You
know
we
spend
a
lot
of
time
working
with
our
accommodation
providers.
So,
for
example,
we
we've
been
doing
a
lot
of
training
with
motel
and
hotel
owners
around
sex
trafficking
issues,
how
to
recognize
it,
how
to
how
to
alert
authorities
all
that
sort
of
thing.
But
we
can't
do
that
training
with
our
str
folks,
if
we
don't
even
know
who
they
are
and
that
this
we
need
a
a
a
format
to
monitor.
That's
gonna
allow
us
to
to
do
that.
M
That
small
percentage
of
folks
in
the
in
the
community,
very
small
percentage
of
folks
that
would
use
the
this
as
a
platform
to
conduct
some
kind
of
nefarious
activity.
You
know
we
just
have
to
be
really
really
careful
that
we
we
recognize
that
there
are
other
voters
in
the
community
that
are
going
to
be
concerned
about
how
we
address
this
sdr
issue.
M
So
you
know
we
have
certainly
heard
a
lot
from
from
the
hosts,
but
there's
great
potential
that
you
know
we're
going
to
hear
from
a
lot
of
neighbors
and
a
lot
of
concerned
residents
around
rogue
strs
that
we
really
aren't
able
to
manage,
because
we
aren't
aware
that
they
even
exist
in
the
community.
So
I
think
that's
another
big
issue
that
we
need
to
consider,
but
this
is
not
spyware
and
I
really
want
to
sort
of
acknowledge
what
commissioner
agnes
said.
M
M
This
is
really
about
looking
at
calendars,
comparing
calendars
that
exist
on
different
platforms,
seeing
which
units
in
the
dwellings
in
the
city
are
being
rented
out
as
str's,
ensuring
that
they're
paying
their
back
and
that
they're
licensed
and
they're
doing
all
the
things
that
they're
supposed
to
do
and
it
ends
there.
Any
kind
of
enforcement
is
going
to
be
is
going
to
reside
with
the
city
and
and
and
our
staff.
It's
not
going
to
we're,
not
relying
on
on
this
company
to
to
perform
that.
M
We
make
them
for
the
one
percent
of
people
who
put
their
own
interests
ahead
of
the
interests
of
our
community
and
usually
those
are
financial
and
that's
as
true
as
of
str
hosts
as
it
is
of
any
other
segment
of
society.
The
vast
majority
of
folks
are
responsible
and
there
are
a
few
that
are
not,
and
that
few
can
cause
irreparable
harm
and
we
need
to
be
able
to
identify
that.
We
need
to
be
able
to
use
that
as
a
as
this
monitoring
service
really
as
a
tool.
A
A
So
so
so
that's
just
to
be
clear.
That
is
basically
what
this
recommendation
is.
So
what
that
means
is
that
if
this
motion
to
amend
is
on
the
floor
then
effectively
it's
basically
the
same.
It's
basically
the
same
debate
as
with
the
recommendation
of
administrative
policies,
so
I
always
say
to
focus
on
the
motion
to
amend
speak
to
the
amendment
effectively.
Speaking
to
the
amendment
is
speaking
to
the
the
contrast
between
the
staff
recommendation
and
the
recommendation
for
administrative
policies.
D
Question
to
staff,
because
I'm
a
little
confused
by
where
we
are
in
the
process.
So
do
we
have
a
an
amend
of
what
the
recommendation
would
look
like
if
amended
with
this
amendment,
and
can
we
compare
it
to
the
original
amendment?
I
it's
not
clear
despite
assurances
that
this
is
actually
reverting
to
the
unamended
recommendation.
That
was
before
the
committee,
because,
procedurally,
that.
A
C
A
D
Okay,
so
to
the
to
the
amendment
and
to
as
your
worship
stated
to
the
entire
thing,
because
eventually
we
have
to
pass
a
bylaw
first
of
all,
no
matter
what
we
do
about
this
amendment.
The
most
important
aspect
of
this
recommendation
is
that
we
license
short-term
rentals,
which
is
unaffected
by
the
amendment
this
amendment
or
the
previous
amendment,
so
that
remains
either
way.
It's
not
altered
either
way,
and
the
second
thing
is
that
we
collect
the
math
tax.
Second,
most
important
thing
that
also
is
not
affected
by
either
amendment.
D
D
D
Or
with
their
current
amendment,
you
you're
to
get
a
an
accounting
in
a
year,
hopefully
every
year,
for
how
the
program
is
going.
So
I
would
say
that
the
the
decision
is
somewhat
philosophical
between
whether
we
enter
in
to
agreement
with
a
canadian
company
that
gives
us
a
software
analytical
ability
that
we
sorely
need
or
an
american
company
that
basically
gives
us
what
they
want
to
give
us.
That's
that's
the
way
I
would
put
it.
D
Q
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mr
mayor,
very
rich
discussions
tonight
I
would
say
that
we
also
have
another
choice,
not
another
choice,
but
the
choice
in
front
of
us
also
includes
whether
we
choose
a
complaint
driven
system
or
a
more
proactive
system,
and
the
complaint
driven
system
means
that
we
have
to
actually
wait
for
residents
in
our
neighborhood
to
get
upset
about
parties
and
garbage
and
then
react
and
I'm
not
sure.
If
that's
the
right
thing
for
residents
in
our
neighborhood
either.
Q
We
know
complaint
driven
systems
are
very
frustrating
for
us,
as
well
as
members
in
our
community,
the
harmony
system,
with
the
information
that
it
collects,
which
we've
already
addressed
the
fact
that
people
accused
it
of
being
spyware
when,
in
fact,
all
of
the
information
is
available
in
the
it's
all
open
information.
So
it's
not
surprising
and
staff
also
confirmed
that
they
are
not
collecting
any
private
information.
Q
So
harmony
is
giving
us
an
opportunity
to
be
proactive
and
make
sure
our
neighborhoods
are
also
looked
after.
So
not
just
the
concerns
for
the
host
and
the
hosts
have
really
leaned
heavily
on
us,
and
we
heard
presentations
yesterday
and
I
found
it
actually
quite
upsetting
for
staff
that
they
were
accused
of
not
consulting
with
stakeholders.
Q
I
didn't
realize
that
you
had
met
seven
times
with
the
stakeholders,
but
I
did
realize
that
not
only
have
staff
met
with
stakeholders,
but
you
also
listen
to
them,
because
you
redo
you,
you
know
you
have
taken
away
the
restriction
of
the
principal
resident.
You
deleted
the
180
days
restrictions
you
you've
even
discussed
with
harmony
that
they
can
design,
perhaps
a
self-remittance
process.
Q
You
can
tell
by
the
conversation
today
nobody
here
is
taking
this
lightly,
but
I'd
like
to
remind
everybody
of
our
neighborhoods
and
that
a
complaint
driven
system
is
not
the
best
system,
and
I
am
confident
with
staff
involved,
that
this
is
not
going
to
be
too
heavy-handed
in
all
of
the
kind
of
accusations
that
we've
heard,
but
that
hosts
privacy
will
be
printed
so
I'll
definitely
be
supporting
amendment
in
front
of
us.
Thanks.
B
B
It
kind
of
feels
like
we're
having
a
conversation
with
half
the
party
missing,
because
it
would
be
really
neat
to
have
a
representative
from
airbnb
actually
here
or
involved
in
this
process,
to
tell
us
what
they
actually
could
and
couldn't
do
before
we
go
down
this
road.
Unfortunately,
that
doesn't
seem
to
be
possible
at
this
point,
which
is
more
to
the
shame
of
the
entire
process.
I
guess
something
that
needs
to
be
considered.
B
I
want
to
read
a
quick
excerpt
from
a
administrative
policies
report
that
actually
well
it's
report,
number
ap-20-011
and
it
says
city
kingston
was
able
to
contact
a
toronto-based
company
named
hamari
that
performs
the
same
technology-based
strategies
to
discover
strs
as
host
compliance,
staff
have
been
in
discussion
with
cap
who
will
be
paying
for
their
own
portion.
The
technology
platform
to
collect
the
mat
cap
has
concluded
that
hamari
does
not
provide
the
required
information
to
effectively
collect
the
mat,
so
that
was
the
february
of
this
year.
B
So
just
kind
of
an
interesting
tidbit
that
our
own
staff
actually
concluded
that
they
did
not
provide
the
required
information
within
a
report
that
was
received
at
the
administrative
policies
committee.
So
I
want
people
to
consider
something
and
ask
yourself
this
before
you
vote
on
this
is
have
have
you
actually
even
been
to
the
hamari
website
and
if
you
haven't,
are
you
voting
based
on
your
own
research
or
just
what's
been
presented?
B
So
with
that
in
mind,
I
visited
the
hamari
website
multiple
times,
and
there
were
some
very
concerning
things,
so
we
do
have
to
do
our
own
research.
It
goes
with
this
job.
We
do
have
to
take
that
into
consideration
before
we
make
these
decisions
that
affect
a
lot
of
kingstonians
and
our
residents,
and
also
people
who
are
just
trying
to
eke
out
a
living
with
covet
right
now,
and
some
of
them
are
just
barely
getting
by
a
little
bit.
B
More
of
that
is
remember
the
fact
that,
when
they
sign
up
with
airbnb,
they
actually
do
agree
to
their
terms
and
conditions.
So
the
fact
that
it's
an
american
company
is
kind
of
negated
at
that
point,
because
those
sdr
hosts
in
kingston
that
voluntarily
sign
up
and
use
airbnb
have
accepted
the
fact
that
that
is
an
american
company.
So
so
that's
that
they
have
not
accepted
the
fact
that
mario
will
be
basically
scrubbing
them
and
going
online,
whether
it's
a
mario
horse
compliance.
B
Now,
maybe
we
don't
start
with
hamari,
taking
pics
or
visiting
people's
driveways
or
slipping
things
under
the
door
or
talking
to
their
guests,
but
there's
nothing
saying
we
couldn't
end
up
in
that
place
in
a
year
when
this
comes
back
under
review,
because
once
we
start
down
this
path,
we
are
down
this
path.
You
we've
taken
that
first
step
down
this
path
of
using
that
company
to
basically
verify
compliance
and
as
much
as
it
sounds
good
to
say.
Well,
it'll
only
be
the
ones
that
you
know
aren't
complying
well
to
find
out
who's,
not
complying.
B
B
B
So
remember
this
day,
if
you
vote
in
favor
for
this
amendment
that
you're
choosing
to
treat
those
str
hosts
as
dishonest
and
untrustworthy,
and
the
fact
that
you
didn't
even
give
them
a
chance,
a
small
chance
with
the
previous
amendment
to
prove
that
they
were
trustworthy
and
that
they
could
30
seconds.
Thank
you
and
to
prove
that
they
could
follow
the
voluntary
compliance
and
we're
possibly
solving
a
problem.
We
don't
even
have
before.
B
We
even
know
if
we
have
it
so
usually,
I'm
very
proud
to
say
I'm
a
kingstonian
and
usually
I'm
very
proud
of
my
city.
But
today,
if
this
amendment
passes-
and
we
start
down
this
road,
it's
just
opening
a
pandora's
box
to
what
we're
gonna
do
with
all
the
other
people
who
are
not
complying,
and
I
would
actually
be
ashamed
and
embarrassed
that
this
day
this
happened
and
all
pointed
out
in
the
future
that
this
started
opening
that
door
to
spy
on
our
own
citizens.
F
F
I'm
embarrassed
that
we're
here
when
I
thought
my
first
day
at
apc
last
week
or
the
week
before
that
wow
something
good
was
going
to
happen.
We
were
going
to
breathe
life
into
our
community
again
and
no
looks
like
it
looks
like
we
might
not,
and
I'm
very
very
disheartened
I
mean
hamari
is
nothing
more
than
a
big
hammer
used
to
kill
a
mosquito.
I
mean
when
we
go
back
to
really
seeing
why
council
wanted
this
four
years
ago,
even
before
my
first,
I
think
it
was
the
substance.
F
Isn't
there
for
us
to
go
this
far,
and
it's
like
it's
like
asking
a
guard
dog
to
behave
itself
by
bringing
in
you
know,
hamari,
and
we
really
don't
know
that
ryan
said
it's
so
well.
Counselor
bones
does
so
well.
We
would.
What
we
really
want
is
a
made
in
kingston
solution,
and
this
is
not
it
okay.
This
is
no.
This
isn't
our
identity.
F
F
F
I
believe
that
the
original,
the
the
amended
bylaw
that
we're
suggesting
for
the
apc
is
the
way
to
go,
and
I'm
just
asking
us
to
reconsider
that
and
not
go
down
a
difficult
road,
but
go
down
a
road
of
compromise
and
understanding
and
working
together,
and
we
have
heard
it
all.
We
have
heard
from
the
kind
and
caring
community
and-
and
the
other
thing
is
we're
not
treating
our
hotels
that
way
either
we're
not
treating
our
hotel
because
they
would.
They
would
just
tell
us
where
to
go.
F
So
you
know
it's
really
really
shameful
that
we
would
bring
up
issues
and
like
human
trafficking
and
all
that
into
this
world,
when
there
is
no
data
at
all.
That
says
that
any
human
trafficking
occurs
in
in
short-term
rentals.
So
you
know
I'm
I'm
really
really
disappointed
and
so
I'll,
let
it
go
from
there,
but
sure
I
sure
hope
that
we
can
say
no
to
this
and
breathe
life
into
what
should
we
breathe
life
into?
Thank
you.
R
R
We
should
perhaps
look
at
that
before
we
have
local
information.
Maybe
the
statistics
aren't
as
bad
as
as
what
they
are
in
other
jurisdictions,
but
there
is
some
data.
There
is
some
risk.
It's
not
that's
not
made
up
the
I
don't,
I'm
not
I'm
going
to
take
this
away
from
the
hotel
versus
airbnb
conversation
regulation
regarding
taxation,
etc,
and
even
removing
it
from
concerns
over
privacy.
There
are
a
lot
of
red
herrings
in
this
conversation
this
occurred.
R
I
recall
we
are
all
hearkening
back
to
how
long
it's
taken
to
get
us
here.
I
do
remember
the
meeting
I
chaired
the
meeting
at
administrative
policy
committee
when
we
had
recommendations
from
council
about
regulating
and
licensing
our
rental
housing
in
kingston,
so
that
referred
to
short-term
housing,
short-term
rentals,
such
as
airbnb,
and
also
providing
some
way
to
to
license
and
regulate
the
quality
of
the
housing
stock
that
we
make
available
to
people
who
come
and
live
here
year
round.
R
The
other
is
before
us
tonight
and
the
conversation
that
I
think
we
need
to
have
to
hearken
back
to
is
what
we've
been
talking
about
all
along
through
our
strategic
priority
about
affordable
housing,
the
lack
of
affordable
housing,
the
lack
of
supply
we've
heard
about
the
reduction
in
housing
stock.
That
information
is
before
us.
It's
it's
in
the
report.
R
It
is
in
the
mayor's
task
force
on
housing
and
if
we
want
to
ensure
that
we
have
the
kind
of
regulations
in
place
to
protect
our
housing
stock,
for
people
who
are
living
here
year
round
and
to
ensure
that
people
can
make
a
living
providing
a
service
in
the
community
and
that
they're
regulated
like
any
other
business.
That's
what
this
is
about.
It's
not
about
penalizing
anyone,
it's
not
about
casting
aspersions
on
any
operation
or
any
company,
international
or
local.
R
It
is
really
about
doing
our
work
as
elected
representatives
of
this
city,
protecting
the
housing
supply,
ensuring
that
the
people
in
the
city
are
protected
and
ensuring
that
visitors
to
the
city
are
protected
and
that
all
of
their
information
and
all
the
information
exchange
along
the
way
is
held
to
the
highest
standards
that
are
regulated
by
other
levels
of
government.
So
I
think
we're
in
pretty
good
shape
if
we
proceed
along
the
same
lines
as
every
other
organization
that
has
to
look
at
these
issues.
R
F
H
I
was
hoping
that
counselor
hutchinson
would
speak
first,
but
he
always
waits
for
me.
It's
a
big
fight
to
get
to
speak
last,
so
merry
christmas
anyways.
You
know,
I
argue
that
policy.
The
the
policy
committee
should
really
do
a
lot
of
things
and
I
really
thought
that
we
had
achieved
the
greatness
of
good
in
what
we
had
done.
We
argued
that
there
wasn't
really
sufficient
consultation
and,
yes,
they
showed
a
slide
that
they
saw
10
times,
but
I'm
sorry
I
it
amounts
to
less
than
10
hours
of
consultation.
H
The
the
aspect
of
human
trafficking
yeah,
the
str
hosts
taking
their
own
courses
on
that
they
volunteer
they.
They
basically
have
are
very
active
in
the
community.
Doing
that
they're
small
business
owners,
they're
people
who
are
really
demonstrating
nobody's
gonna,
be
happy
with
the
proposal
that
we
came
out
of
apc
with
because
they're
still
you
know,
the
whole
process
is
one
year
limitation.
H
They
have
not
spoken
with
other
hosts
like
brockville
down
the
road
deals
with
with
with
airbnb
who
even
find
out
if
it's
working
for
them
or
not.
So
it's
like
we're
standing
on
the
grand
canyon.
We
are
counselors
on
one
side
of
grand
canyon
and
staff
are
on
the
other
side.
We
get
together
once
in
a
while,
but
there's
a
huge
information
gap
that
we
don't
get
to
see.
H
So
I'd
like
the
clerk
to
put
up
a
website
that
I
asked
him
to
search,
because
it
seems
that
no
one
wants
to
be
ready
to
to
read
what
it
is
on
the
hamari
website.
I
think,
quite
frankly,
that
what
we
should
be
doing
is
this
gradual
approach.
I
think
that
we
are
doing
a
real
disservice
to
the
residents
of
kingston
by
demanding.
So
here
it
is
on
hamare's
own
website.
If
you
scroll
down
to
point
number
five,
they
will
review
and
compile
video
and
audio
documentation
of
str
violations.
H
What
we're
doing
is
throwing
out
aspersions
that
we
can't
verify
can't
just
debate,
because
the
parties
being
slandered
are
not
in
at
the
table,
and
I
find
that
is
not
becoming
of
a
like.
We
can
banter
back
and
forth
between
fellow
counselors
on
our
own
items,
but
to
attack
a
multinational
company
or
any
company
or
any
party.
H
O
Would
ms
agnew
to
tell
us
what
we
are
asking
hamari
to
do,
and
I
asked
that
in
the
context
that
I
did
go
on
the
mary's
site
and
it's
all
you
either
buy
in
or
you
don't
buy
in
and
you
pay
them
for
what
you
for
the
relative
amount
of
things
that
you
want
them
to
do
seems
to
me.
So
I'm
just
asking
ms
agnew.
If
she
would
the
commissioner
if
she
would
tell
us
what
we
are
expecting
hamari
to
do.
J
Yes,
thank
you
and
through
you
so
just
to
to
verify
and
to
reiterate
what
I
said
before
the
staff
recommendation
with
respect
to
hamari
is
two
parts.
One
is
related
to
the
address,
identification
module
and
all
the
purposes
that
we've
discussed
tonight
with
respect
to
that
part
of
the
software.
The
second
part
was
that
hamari
was
prepared
to
create
a
customized
self-remittance
portal
for
mat
collection
and
also
just
to
go
back
and
provide
a
bit
of
additional
information.
J
Counselor
baum
is
correct
that,
back
in
february,
we
were
of
the
opinion
that
hamari
wasn't
able
to
provide
our
needs
with
respect
to
mac
collection,
but
that
is
something
that
we
worked
on
with
them
over
the
six
months
since
six
months.
Subsequent
to
that
meeting
to
arrive
at
the
recommendation.
That's
here
tonight,
so
those
are
the
pieces,
the
mat
remittance
module
that
operators
would
provide
their
information
into
to
pay
their
mat
and
the
address
identification
module
only
there
are
other
suites
of
services
that
hamari
does
offer
as
part
of
their
website.
J
Thank
you,
and,
through
you
again,
they're
they're
part
of
the
enforcement
is
really
related
to
the
utilization
of
the
algorithms
that
create
the
address
identification
module
in
providing
us
with
that
information
and
then
also
providing
us
with
data
related
to
projections
associated
with
mac
collection,
so
that
we
can
reference
that
against
what
we're
actually
collecting
through
the
portal.
Specifically,
the
remainder
of
the
enforcement
work
associated
with
with
any
type
of
follow-up,
would
be
done
by
city
of
kingston
staff.
O
Thank
you.
I
would
like
to
go
back
in
in
part
following
council
home
that
take
you
back
to
the
2018
election
when
housing
was
something
everybody
heard
about
it,
didn't
matter
what
part
of
the
city
you
were
in
and
we
are
still
in
a
housing
crisis
and
42
of
households
in
this.
This
city
are
tenant
households,
so
this
is,
there
is
no
silver
bullet
to
solving
that
crisis,
but
so
this
is
part
of
that.
O
So
I
think
that
we
have
to
remember
what
we're
doing
here
is
important
for
those
reasons
now
I
asked
the
questions
before
what
is
the
extent
of
the
city's
knowledge
of
the
str
market?
I
did
that.
I
did
that
by
bringing
up
certain
statistics
regarding
on
the
host
association
relative
to
the
number
of
available
sdrs
that
we
have
and,
and
so
the
fallout
question
of
that
I
thought
it
was
probably
implied,
but
maybe
perhaps
not
is.
O
In
my
opinion,
they've
been
uncooperative
and
invasive,
and
that's
not
new
lyft
and
uber
use
the
same
tactics
in
other
municipalities,
much
bigger
municipalities
than
us
and
they'll
go
on
making
their
money
the
way
they
want
to
do
it
for
as
long
as
they
can
get
away
with
it.
That's
my
observation
by
reading
about
it,
so
it
seems
to
me
that
ltas
technologies
is
the
way
we
get
that
information
and
we
get
information
we
can
rely
on.
O
Is
it
not?
Does
it
not
have
some
problems?
It's
clearly
does
have
some
problems,
there's
no
again,
no
silver
bullet,
there's
no
perfect
solution,
and-
and
I
don't
we're
going
to
get
it.
I
thought
there
were
some
really
good
remarks
by
the
chair
of
the
committee
council
straub
pointing
out
that
if
this
amendment
does
not
affect
licensing
or
the
gathering
of
the
map
and
it's
going
to
be
reassessed
in
four
to
12
months.
S
O
O
So
and
I'm
also
concerned,
like
I
think
for
most
of
us,
the
str's
that
are
owner
occupied
are
one
category.
The
others
are
another
now
I
know
that
some
have
one
in
their
home
and
one
more.
I
talked
to
a
council
member
about
that.
I
don't
know
how
to
solve
that
problem
or
where
the
limit
would
be,
but
we
could
look
at
that
eventually,
and
so,
but
my
concern
is
also
that
it
refree
riders
people
that
won't
report
that.
O
Okay,
and
so
I
think,
that's
important
and
I
think
it's
important
to
realize
that
tax
compliance
is
normal,
don't
pay
your
income
tax,
they
come
looking
for
you,
okay,
they
don't
stand
around
thinking
gee.
I
wonder
if
rob's
gonna
report,
no,
no,
they
come
looking
for
you,
and
that
is
normal.
True
for
city
bylaws
as
well.
O
A
A
A
Maybe
I'll
make
a
couple
of
a
couple
of
general
comments
if
I
can
first
of
all
related
to
the
process
about
why
we
are
having
this
discussion
tonight
and
not
last
night,
if
we
had
had
this
discussion
last
night,
it
would
now
be
about
2
30
in
the
morning,
which
I
don't
think
would
have
been
perhaps
the
best
time
for
people
wanting
to
follow.
Along
with
the
debate
in
the
discussion,
I
think
it's
possible
to
have
this
debate
without
disparaging
either
side.
A
I
know
that
there's
a
lot
of
emotion
in
this
debate
and
discussion,
but
I
think
it's
perfectly
valid
to
say
that
airbnb
can
be
a
good
company
to
work
with.
We
heard
that
waterloo
seems
to
be
very
happy
with
them.
One
works
well
with
them.
I
mean
there
might
be
some
discussion
and
details
about
exactly
what
that
relationship
looked
like,
but
obviously
they
had
good
things
to
say.
A
I
also
think
it's
possible
not
to
disparage
harmari.
Obviously,
we've
now
heard
that
they
offer
a
variety
of
different
services
and
staff
have
been
clear
that
there
are
certain
things
that
are
just
not
on
the
table.
Maybe
other
communities
are
interested
in
that
stuff,
but
we're
clearly
not
and
so
they're,
so
I
think
a
made
in
kingston
solution.
Certainly,
in
my
view,
that's
what
I'm
hearing
is
that
we
are
very
selective
and
very
careful
about
exactly
what
we
what
we
would
offer.
A
I
honestly
think
that
we
can
talk
about
issues
like
the
housing
supply
and
we
can
talk
about
critical
issues
for
a
community
like
human
trafficking
without
pointing
fingers
or
suggesting
that
one
one
method
will
be
a
disaster
and
the
other
will
be
will
be
a
silver
bullet.
I
don't
think
it's
that
simple.
I
think
that
there's
honestly
both
and
there's
good
arguments
to
be
made
on
both
sides.
A
If
they're,
if
there
is
one
and
I'll
be
honest
with
you,
since
counselor
kylie
has
declared
a
conflict
of
interest,
one
of
the
concerns
I
had
is
that
we
would
end
up
as
a
six
sixth
high
and
not
be
able
to
make
any
decision,
and
I
agree
with
what
counselor
strat
has
said.
It's
important
that
we
have
a
framework
one
way
or
the
other,
given
that
six
counselors
have
already
expressed
support
for
the
amendment.
A
I
honestly
believe
that
when
you
take
a
proactive
approach
to
enforcement-
which
I
think
is
something
that's
going
on
here
and
part
of
that-
is
that
you
know
you
need
to
make
sure
that
you're
keeping
tabs
on
things
we're
taking
a
proactive
approach
on
property
standards.
That
means
somebody
has
to
walk
by
and
check
and
make
sure
that
things
look.
A
Okay,
okay,
so
that,
basically,
is
what
we're
proposing
here
for
short-term
rentals
again
doesn't
mean
that
the
property
standards
officer-
that's
walking
by
someone's
property,
is
somehow
thinking
that
you
know
anybody's
doing
anything
wrong,
they're,
just
checking
it
out
and
again.
I
think
counselor
hill
said
this-
that
again
for
99
of
people.
This
wouldn't
even
be
an
issue,
but
sometimes
for
the
one
percent
that
aren't.
We
do
need
that
sort
of
system
in
place.
So
I
think,
for
all
those
reasons,
I've
heard
the
arguments.
I
appreciate
what
I've
heard.
M
Well,
just
I
I
just,
I
think,
want
to
be
kind
of
echo
a
little
bit
about
what
you
said.
There
was
no
intent,
I
think,
on
the
part
of
anybody
to
disparage
anyone,
not
the
hosts,
who
are
wonderful
citizens,
not
the
companies
involved.
It
really
comes
down
to
a
mechanism
that
we
can
utilize
to
provide
us
with
a
lot
of
information,
a
lot
more
information
than
one
company
serving
one
platform,
and
one
group
can
do
that's
the
only
point
in
this.
I
I
can
tell
you
for
eighteen
thousand
dollars.
M
M
We're
just
about
leveling
the
playing
field,
making
sure
that
we're
doing
our
our
due
diligence
and
making
sure
that
all
of
our
citizens
in
the
in
the
community
are
able
to
enjoy
ensure
you
know,
enjoy
their
own
property
and
feel
safe
on
it,
and
I
I
for
those
reasons
and
and
for
the
you
know,
I
I
really
hope
that
no
one
has
taken
anything.
That's
been
proposed
here
as
an
insult
to
them
or
to
their
integrity,
because
that
isn't
couldn't
be
farther
from
the
from
the
jews.
I
really
do
hope.
A
F
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson.
I
just
have
a
concern
about
the
how
it
was
drafted.
I
mean
someone
wrote
to
me
the
other
day
I
mean
the
opp
or
the
kingston
police.
Don't
write
the
laws,
they
don't
write
them,
then
they
enforce
them
and
I'm
I
am
concerned
about
that
protocol
and
and
when
and
how
we,
how
we've
structured
it
and
I'm
wondering
where
what
point
will
does
our
will?
F
Will
our
legal
because
it
always
says
in
the
write-up
it
has
to
be
satisfactory
to
to
our
legal
services
and
our
expertise
there
will
we
be
told,
will
we
be
informed
of
of
of
if
they're
feeling
that
their,
what
we're
doing
the
bylaws
being
created
are,
you
know
not
not
allowed
like
you
know
where?
Where
we
will,
we
hear
that
as
council,
because
I
would
really
like
to
be
able
to
see
that
because
I
like
to
know
the
expertise.
F
S
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mr
mayor,
so
thank
you
councillor
all
for
your
your
question.
I
can
assure
you
that
not
just
this
particular
bylaw,
but
any
bylaw
that
we
bring
forward
to
committee
and
council
is
reviewed
by
legal.
We
wouldn't
bring
bylaws
forward
without
the
involvement
and
review
from
the
legal
department.
A
A
A
A
A
I
Thank
you,
mayor,
patterson
and
through
you,
I'm
hoping
that
staff
could
give
a
bit
more
context
than
the
report
does
on
the
building
automation
systems.
I
think
it
mentioned
that
there
are
28
currently
in
effect
for
buildings
across
the
city.
I
didn't
know
28
of
how
many
buildings
do
we
have
so
what
percentage
of
our
facilities
are
on
a
bas.
P
Thank
you,
and
through
your
worship,
so
there's
there
are
20
building
automation
systems
on
our
facilities
and
by
the
end
of
2021.
We
expect
that
to
rise
up
to
28
and
that's
essentially
half
of
the
of
the
buildings
that
are
heated
or
cooled
mechanically,
so
there's
56
buildings
that
have
heating
and
cooling
mechanical
systems.
I
Excellent,
I'm
glad
to
hear
it.
I
think
that's
a
a
good
starting
point
and
looking
forward
to
when
we
can
get
to
100
so
follow
up
to
that
is.
Is
there
any
sense
of
how
many
emissions
this
has
reduced?
Having
that
many
on
a
bas
or
how
many,
maybe
you
could
phrase
it
another
way,
which
is
how
many
emissions
do
we
stand
to
cut
by
adding
more
and
more
facilities
onto
a
bas.
P
So
it's
it's
a
little
difficult
to
come
up
with
a
hard
number
on
there.
What
we've
seen
since
2011,
since
we
started
with
these
the
energy
consumption
measures
and
which
which
to
a
large
degree,
is
the
bas
systems.
We've
seen
a
34
reduction
in
the
ghg
emissions,
and
I
can
see
if
we
can
get
some
information
to
council
about
what
we
expect
as
we
bring
on
the
remaining
systems
over
the
next
few
years.
That's
the
that's.
An
interest
you'd
like
to
see
more
than
happy
to
provide
that.
I
Thank
you.
I
personally
would
like
to
see
that,
and
I
think
that
a
34
reduction
from
only
half
of
our
buildings
is
tremendous.
So
if
we're
doing
that
and
then
also
committed
to
some
of
the
things
that
this
working
group
has
put
into
play
already,
I
think
we're
headed
in
the
right
direction.
So
please
do
provide
those
numbers.
A
A
H
Chappelle,
I
I'd
like
to
say
that
I'm
very
impressed
with
the
progress
of
third
crossing
counselor
userhoff
and
I
had
the
pleasure
of
walking
across
the
causeway,
seeing
the
program
and
I've
been
informed.
It's
on
budget
and
certainly
on
time,
and
I
like
to
give
accolades
to
the
engineering
team
and
as
well
as
the
construction
crew
that
are
working
on
it.
Thank
you.
A
A
A
So
the
motion
will
read
that
counselor
kneel
be
appointed
to
the
community
safety
and
well-being
committee
for
a
term
ending
december
31st
2021
and
I
have
a
mover
and
a
second
or
please
move
by
council
holland
seconded
by
councillor
kylie,
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that's
carried
number
two-
that
the
resignation
of
councillor
doherty
from
the
arts
advisory
committee
and
the
arts,
recreation
community
policies
committee
be
received
with
regret,
and
so
we
need
a
counselor
to
volunteer
for
the
arts
advisory
committee.
Do
I
have
a
volunteer
answer?
Austerhoff!
A
R
A
So
one
of
the
things
that
I
I
had
suggested
is
that
if,
if
a
sixth
member
was
needed,
that
that
I
would
I
would
step
in
so
we
can,
we
can
just
leave
out
that
last
paragraph,
so
it
will
just
read
that
counselor
dougherty
will
resign
from
the
arts
advisory
committee
and
arts,
recreation,
community
policies
and
counselor
osterhoff
will
be
appointed
to
the
arts.
Ambassador
committee
hold
on
one.
A
F
A
A
Sold
okay,
so
we
now
have
a
motion
that
we'll
see
council
osterhoff
appointed
to
both
those
committees.
If
there's
nobody
else
that
wishes
to
to
challenge
him
on
other
of
those,
can
I
have
a
mover
in
a
second
or
then
for
that
motion
moved
by
a
council
hall
and
seconded
by
councillor
chappelle,
all
those
in
favor
proposed
and
that's
carried
okay
number.
Three:
the
resignation
of
councillor
stroud
from
the
nominations
advisory
committee
received
a
regret
and
the
counselor
associated
counselor
to
be
appointed
to
the
nominations:
advisory
committee
sponsors,
you're
volunteering.
A
A
Development
is
key
to
ensuring
higher
quality
of
life
for
all
residents
in
the
city
of
kingston,
where
societal
and
systemic
barriers
exist
for
underrepresented
groups
such
as
women,
persons
with
disabilities
and
racialized
peoples
prevent
full
participation
in
leadership
roles
across
society,
including
committees,
boards
and
elected
office
in
the
city
of
kingston,
whereas
the
federation
of
canadian
municipalities
produced
a
framework
to
guide
municipalities,
improving
diversity
and
gender
equity,
entitled
run,
win
and
lead
toward
parity
and
municipal
politics.
Municipal
sector
framework
for
achieving
gender
parity
in
local
government
therefore
be
resolved.
R
Thank
you,
mr
mayor,
the
okay,
so
the
the
motion
is,
is
so
there's
I'll
give
a
bit
of
background,
so
this
is
something
I've
been
thinking
about
for
a
while.
It's
an
area
that
I'm
quite
interested
in
actually
particularly
women.
Women's
involvement
in
politics,
the,
and
so
there
are
organizations
like
equal
voice,
which
is
a
national
organization
that
measures
participation
of
women
in
politics.
I'm
sure,
probably
some
of
you
received
surveys
from
a
number
of
different
academic
institutions
as
well.
R
So
this
is
something
that
is
a
priority.
It's
been
a
strategic
priority
here
in
the
city
for
a
while,
often
in
combination
with
economic
development
through
our
immigrant
immigration
strategy.
So
we've
looked,
we've
often
looked
at
trying
to
to
grow
the
city
and
encourage
people
to
come
here
from
all
over
the
world,
and,
if
that's
and
if
that's
an
objective,
we
need
to
make
a
real,
genuine
effort
to
create
opportunities
to
make
people
feel
like
they
belong
and
that
they
can
contribute.
R
So
the
this
motion
is
about
equity.
We
all
know
that
it's
challenging
to
be
here,
it's
it's,
it
was.
It
took
a
lot
of
work
to
get
to
this
place
and
it
is
a
privilege
that
we
recognize
that
when
we
are
here
when
we
do
have
the
faith
and
constituents
to
come
and
represent
them,
I've
always
been
interested
in
the
fact
that.
R
A
lot
of
women
and
people
who
are
entering
politics
for
the
first
time,
someone
who
maybe
for
them
that
was
never
something
they
considered.
Often
they
will
get
involved
at
the
municipal
or
local
level,
because
it
is
seen
to
be
an
entry
point.
It's
a
local
kind
of
more
community-based
model
of
governing.
R
At
that
level,
however,
we
don't
have
institutions
in
place
that
can
seek
candidates
that
can
vet
candidates,
look
for
different
backgrounds
and
candidates,
and
we
see
that,
with
at
the
provincial
and
federal
level.
That's
one
of
the
things
that
the
party
system
does.
It
allows
outside
organizations
to
do
that
work,
and
we
don't
have
that.
We
have
the
clerk's
office
and
they
operate
elections
as
a
democratic
process
very
similar
to
elections,
ontario
or
elections.
R
Canada
does
so
there's
a
bit
of
a
challenge
in
trying
to
figure
out
how
to
create
how
to
address
equity,
which
means
really
eliminating
some
of
the
barriers
that
exist
for
people
from
more
marginalized
groups
to
take
that
step
forward
into
representing
constituents
either
on
a
board
or
or
at
city
hall.
So
what
this
motion
is
asking
for
is
to
get
some
more
information
on
best
practices
to
look
at.
R
Eight
had
no
female
candidates
running,
so
the
real
challenge
is
to
make
sure
that
women,
for
example,
using
that
one
group
that
that
they
that
they
are
that
there
are
no
barriers
to
entering
the
process,
and
that
is
something
that
I
think
that
we
can
do
in
a
very
non-partisan
way
in
a
way
that
encourages
our
citizens
to
get
involved,
and
there
are
lots
of
things
that
we
can
look
at
to
make
to
reduce
those
barriers
and
information
provision.
All
those
things
there's
lots
of
really
simple
things,
actually,
communications
wise.
I
Kylie
thanks
mary
patterson
through
you,
I'm
not
familiar
with
the
framework
truth
be
told.
I
didn't
have
a
chance
to
read
it.
So
I
hope
counselor
hall
and
you
don't
mind
me
asking
a
question
because
a
resident
of
mine
reached
out
to
me
about
this
and
she
was
interested
in.
I
guess
minority
statuses,
so
things
that
we
might
not
be
able
to
see
at
first
glance
and
people
being
essentially
forced
to
self-disclose.
I
I
R
Yeah,
no,
that's
that's
a
good
question.
The
we
thinking
about
declaring
oneself
as
an
equity-seeking
candidate,
for
I
guess,
they're,
two
different
processes.
If
you
think
about
the
nominations,
committee
or
nominations,
advisory
committee,
for
example.
Yes,
for
sure
there,
if,
if
we
have
a
policy
which
we
don't
at
the
moment,
but
if
there
was
a
policy
that
said
that
priority
would
be
given
to
equity
seeking
candidates,
just
like
many
hr
policies
have.
R
If
we
had
that
nominations
advisory,
then
I
think
something
like
that
a
disclosure
would
be
required
for
that
consideration
for
candidates
for,
for
a
run
for,
let's,
whatever
you
know,
municipal
political
position,
the
the
idea
is
not
so
much
more
to
to
identify
oneself
to
the
public
as
it
is
to
have
a
whole
bunch
of
resources
available
to
to
communicate.
First
of
all,
so
that
people
are
aware
that
what
that
role
entails
and
how
they
might
put
themselves
forward
or
start
the
process
or
whatever.
A
R
Yes,
thank
you
and
I
I
believe
I
sent
it
to
the
second
or
so.
I
hope
that
this
is
okay
clause,
3,
the
terminology
that
that
we
put
in,
I
definitely
have
to
say
I
gave
it
due
consideration
because
using
using
certain
terms
means
it
means
ensuring
that
you
get
the
most
representation
of
the
most
sort
of
like
that.
R
So
I
wasn't
exactly
sure
if
bipoc
was
the
right
phrase,
if
that
was
something
that
was
sort
of
commonly
used-
and
I
didn't
put
it
in
originally,
but
then
noted
that
the
new
motion
2
uses
that
terminology.
So
I
thought
that
for
clause
3,
if
we
could
please
amend
to
remove
racialized
peoples
and
insert
by
poc.
A
Is
everyone
clear
on
that
amendment?
Okay,
anybody
that
needs
clarification
there?
Okay,
I
think
that's
all!
I'm
given
given
your
explanation
of
it.
It's
a
simple
amendment.
I
think
we
can
just
take
it
as
as
friendly
and
as
given.
So
if
there's
no
further
questions
or
comments,
then
we
will
call
the
vote.
Answer.
Counselor,
neil.
G
G
A
R
Yeah,
that's
great
sorry.
I
just
I
wanted
to
say
two
quick
things
just
because
counselor
neil
mentioned
that
yeah,
the
the
the
so
my
my
interest,
my
own
personal
interest,
is
in
women
in
politics.
So
that's
part
of
why
this
is
has
what
the
examples
that
I
have
are
more
related
to
women's
participation
and
obviously
I'm
a
woman,
and
so
I
and
have
had
my
own
experience
being
involved
in
politics.
R
The
I
think
I
thought
when
in
the
last
campaign,
when
we
went
from
four
women
of
13
members
of
council
down
to
three
that
was,
it
was
just
a
really
discouraging
sign,
and
I
and
it's
not
to
say
you
know
it's
any
one,
individual
person
or
policy
or
anything
like
that.
There
are
lots
of
variables,
but
it
certainly
made
me
realize
that
that
it's
not
something
that
we
can
take
for
granted
that
we
we've
had
really
excellent
representation
at
the
municipal
level
from
female
counselors
and
mayors.
R
And
so
that's
it's
more
a
matter
of
encouraging
finding
out.
What's
going
on.
There
are
potentially
lots
of
structural
things
like
time
of
day
meetings,
etc.
Again,
information
sharing
about
what
it
means
to
to
run
an
election
campaign,
things
like
that
that
would
really
help,
and
I
think
it
would
be
a
huge
benefit
to
to
do
that
work
for
ourselves,
but
I
think
it'll
also
be
something
that
other
municipalities
will
will
draw
on.
Eventually,
I've
done
some
research
and
there
there
are
not
a
lot
there.
A
lot
of
work.
R
A
lot
of
municipalities
have
different
gender
and
diversity
type
initiatives,
but
I
think
showing
leadership
at
the
council
level
and
saying
yeah.
It's
not
it's
not
that
straightforward
for
for
us
to
come
up
with
something,
but
I,
but
it's
really
important.
I
just
want
to
encourage
everyone
to
to
think
a
little
bit
more
broadly
about
it
too.
Thank
you.
A
A
Therefore,
we
resolve
the
kingston
city
council,
invite
the
kingston
chief
of
police
to
provide
a
briefing
january
19th
2021,
before
city
budget
talks,
to
indicate
how
the
police
budget
is
constructed
to
deal
with
the
concerns
raised
by
bypoc
and
black
lives
matter
and
how
those
elements
are
related
to
other
priorities
in
the
police
budget:
okay,
cancer.
Hutcheson:
you
have
the
support.
O
Thank
you,
so
I
think
this
segues
from
the
last
motion
fairly
seamlessly
the
the
so
the
purpose
of
this
we
all
have
received
the
emails
and
regarding
glyphoc
and
black
lives
matter
concerns
and
they
have
been
difficult
to
respond
to,
because
there
are
many
issues
involved
and
I
just
felt
as
a
counsel,
because
I
can
speak
for
myself.
I
have
certainly
heard
from
individuals
in
kingston
about
this
and
talked
to
them
about
it.
O
I
think
she's
willing
to
do
this,
and
and
basically
it
if
you
notice
in
the
resolve
clause,
it
asks
that
we
look
at
that.
She
speak
to
the
resources
that
are
being
directed
towards
initiatives
that
that
she
is
spoken
in
the
media
that
she's
undertaking
and
that
the
police
services
is
undertaking
and
also
I
want
it
related
to
other
aspects
of
the
budget
as
well,
because
perhaps
it
seems
to
me
what
gets
lost
is
that
the
police
serve
many
different
aspects.
O
There
are
many
services
in
police
services
and
we
need
to
recognize
that
and
and
then
we
can
think
afresh
about
it.
It's
going
to
come
to
budget
and
I
think
the
time
to
have
this,
as
indicated,
is
the
january
19th
meeting
of
council
so
that
it's
fresh
in
everybody's
mind
and
that
we
hear
the
proposal
for
the
police
budget
in
that
context.
O
So
it's
really
about
informing
ourselves
and-
and
I'm
not
asking
anyone
to
draw
any
conclusions
I
mean
I
have
my
thoughts.
I'm
sure
each
of
you
have
yours,
but
this
is
to
have
the
police
chief
speak
to
us
about
the
nature
of
the
problem
as
they
see
it
and
how
it
relates
to
program
and
services
at
the
police.
A
Okay,
we
will
call
the
vote
on
new
motion
number
two,
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that's
carried
okay
for
new
motion
number
three,
I'm
going
to
turn
it
over
to
deputy
mayor
osterhoff
and
perhaps
if
the
clerks
can
put
the
motion
up
so
that
he
can
really
take
the
chair.
That
would
be.
That
would
be.
F
A
F
S
Thank
you
and
through
you
deputy
mayor,
so
we
we
have
heard
from
some
of
our
local
businesses,
and
I
I
do
want
to
indicate
to
council
that
the
businesses
we're
hearing
from
are
are
small,
primarily
our
small
businesses
and
they're
the
ones
that
two
things
one
is.
They
have
either
a
reduced
occupancy
because
of
cobit.
S
S
So
those
are
are
not
that
are
approaching
us
they're,
not
necessarily
looking
to
to
not
pay
anything
they're
they're
looking
for
a
bit
more
time
from
the
city
and
I've
had
a
chance
to
connect
with
our
chief
financial
officer,
ms
kennedy,
who's,
also
on
the
call
tonight
to
make
sure
that
there
wouldn't
be
necessarily
any
any
cash
flow
concerns.
Should
we
look
at
a
deferral
of
of
business
licenses.
A
Thank
you
thank
you
for
that,
so
so
I
think
again
just
to
state
that
I
think
this
is
the
sort
of
support
that
we
can
offer
in
a
targeted
way
and
to
give
those
businesses
that
just
aren't
bringing
in
the
revenue
for
for
no
fault
of
their
own
until
they
are
able
to
to
get
revenue
back
to
to
then
be
able
to
have
that
extra
time
to
be
able
to
pay
some
of
those
fees.
I
think
it's.
A
I
think,
if
it's
a
step
that
the
city
can
afford
to
do,
then
I
think
that's
the
right
gesture
to
make
just
knowing
that
the
stress
that
a
number
of
small
businesses
in
our
community
are
under
right
now,
so
I
certainly
hope
that
council
will
consider
supporting
this
and
happy
to
to
take
any
other
questions.
Let
me
come.
G
G
G
F
Okay,
thank
you
for
that.
Anyone
anyone
else
they
have
to
wave
I
or
use
the
use
the
flag.
Am
I
missing
anybody
speak
up.
Otherwise
I
see.
No
one
else
wishes
to
speak.
Come
here
patterson.
Would
you
like
the
final
word?
Okay,
you
have
you're
done.
So,
let's
take
a
vote
on
this
all
in
favor
of
the
motion
and
someone
gonna
count
for
me.
I'm
can't
see
it
all.
Mr
clerk,
okay,
yes
and
I
passed
the
chair
back
to
you,
mayor
dennis.