►
From YouTube: Kingston, Ontario - City Council - July 13
Description
City Council meeting from July 13, 2021. For full meeting agenda visit https://bit.ly/36zTkkV
A
As
the
mayor
of
the
city
of
kingston,
I
offer
these
words
in
the
spirit
of
this
gathering.
Let
us
bring
our
good
minds
and
hearts
together
as
one
to
honor
and
celebrate
these
traditional
lands
is
the
gathering
place
of
the
original
peoples
and
their
ancestors
who
are
entrusted
to
care
for
mother
earth
since
time
immemorial,
it
is
with
deep
humility
that
we
offer
our
gratitude
for
their
contributions
to
this
community,
having
respect
for
all,
as
we
share
the
space
now
and
walk
side
by
side
into
the
future.
B
Yes,
mayor
patterson,
we
have
quorum
at
this
time.
I
can
confirm
that
all
members
of
council
are
here,
with
the
exception
of
councillor
shroud
joining
us
from
staff.
We
have
cio
lanny,
hertl
paige
agnew,
commissioner
of
community
services,
peter
hughenbaugh,
commissioner
of
business
environment
projects,
brad
joyce,
commissioner
of
corporate
services,
sheila
kidd,
commissioner
of
transportation,
and
public
works,
desiree
kennedy,
cfo
and
city
treasurer
john
bolanone
city
clerk,
jennifer,
campbell
director
of
heritage
services,.
B
B
B
Matter
we
also
have
delegations
from
leslie,
dalson
and
and
matthew
holmes
from
queens
from
pamela
cornell.
Regarding
the
small
pot.
Excuse
me,
tiny
homes,
micro
living
spaces,
pilot
project
with
habitat
for
humanity,
and
I
would
note
that
our
last
delegation,
we
have
received
an
email
from
mason
roseberry
that
he
wishes
to
withdraw
his
delegation.
So,
although
he's
listed
on
the
addendum,
he
won't
be
present
tonight
and
we
also
have
a
briefing
from
dr
ken
reimer
and
dr
tasman
liang
regarding
the
kingston
inner
harbor.
A
Thank
you
great.
Thank
you
very
much,
so
we
were
just
meeting
in
committee
of
the
whole
closed
meeting.
We
did
discuss
one
item
with
respect
to
proposed
or
pending
acquisition
or
disposition
of
land
by
the
municipality
or
local
board
and
king
street
property.
So
I
will
ask
for
a
motion
to
rise
without
reporting.
Please.
A
Favor
opposed
and
that's
clear:
next
we
have
the
approval
of
the
adds.
There
are
two
sets
of
addeds
that
have
several
delegations.
We
have
a
report
from
planning
committee.
We
have
a
motion
of
congratulations
and
then
some
other
communications
can.
I
have
a
mover
in
a
second
for
the
addeds.
Please
move
by
deputy
mayor
neil
seconded
by
councillor
kylie,
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that's
carried.
C
A
Okay,
thank
you
very
much.
Seeing
no
other
disclosures.
We
will
continue
on.
We
have
no
presentations
this
evening,
but
we
do
have
several
so.
Our
first
delegation
is
kathy.
Borowick
chief,
executive
officer
of
habitat
for
humanity
and
jacqueline
collier,
head
chair
of
the
board
of
directors
for
habitat
for
humanity
will
be
present
and
speak
to
clause.
A
2
report
number
65
received
from
the
cao
with
respect
to
tiny
homes,
micro
living
spaces
pilot
project,
habitat
for
humanity,
just
a
reminder
to
all
of
our
delegations
that
you
have
five
minutes
to
speak
and
then
at
that
point
we
will
open
it
up
for
questions
from
council.
So
ms
sporwick
miss
collier.
If
you
are
there.
E
As
some
of
you
may
know,
habitat
partners
with
families
and
individuals
in
need
of
a
hand
up
to
build
a
place
they
can
call
home
stable
housing,
has
a
tremendous
impact
on
family
and
community
health,
improved
education
outcomes
for
children
and
increased
financial
stability
and
opportunity.
The
cascading
effects
are
far-reaching
and
they
are
transformational.
E
Housing
is
simply
foundational
to
building
strong
communities
and
the
work
habitat
does
helps
to
drive
critical
social
and
economic
outcomes.
I'm
going
to
turn
it
over
to
kathy
borowak
our
ceo
to
carry
on
and
explain
a
little
more
about
habitat
and
what
this
partnership
means
to
habitat
and
our
community.
F
F
We
don't
give
away
free
homes,
people
pay
for
their
shelter
with
home
ownership,
habitat
holds
a
mortgage
made
affordable
through
payments
geared
to
the
household's
income
and
the
future
owners
volunteer
500
hours
with
us.
We
remove
barriers
that
can
make
owning
a
home
impossible
for
many
low-income
families
and
individuals.
F
F
Presently
we
receive
benefit
through
the
home
ownership
down
payment
assistance
program.
We
very
recently
broke
ground
on
land
given
to
habitat
for
the
construction
of
four
town
homes,
adding
much
needed,
affordable
housing
stock
to
the
area,
and
we
appreciate
that
planning
and
engineering
fees
for
affordable
housing
providers
have
been
waived.
F
All
of
this
helps
us
do
what
we
do
in
the
fall
of
2019.
At
a
meeting
to
discuss
a
pilot
project
of
tiny
homes,
habitat
expressed
interest
in
being
involved.
We
see
a
way
to
adapt
our
program
to
respond
to
a
growing
need
for
more
and
different
forms
of
housing
to
review
local
statistics.
Briefly
of
the
seventy
thousand
households
in
kingston,
fourteen
14
or
approximately
10
000
live
in
core
housing
need
that
is,
housing
that
is
unaffordable
and
or
unsuitable
and
or
inadequate.
F
F
There
is
good
reason
for
us
to
undertake
this
exciting
and
innovative
project.
Habitat
strategic
goals
include
forging
strong
community
partnerships
and
to
identify
and
help
meet
the
housing
needs
in
our
community,
and
we
see
an
opportunity
to
lend
our
experience
in
home
building
an
affordable
housing
project
to
this
project
at
habitat.
We
believe
everyone
has
a
right
to
the
safe
and
decent
place
to
live
and
that
it
benefits
all
of
society
when
they
do.
We
thank
you
for
your
time
and
consideration
of
this
new
venture
together.
G
F
F
G
C
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson,
so
the
first
question
is:
do
you
have
other
similar
projects
that
resemble
the
model?
That's
proposed
of
that's
not
exactly
home
ownership.
It's
a
rental
situation,
and
one
thing
in
particular
that
I'm
interested
in
knowing
is
whether
or
not
that
the
volunteer
component
of
the
relationship
that
you
described
with
habitat,
whether
that
would
how
that
would
work
in
the
model
that's
been
proposed
this
evening.
F
C
H
Information,
your
worship
and
thank
you
very
much
for
the
presentation
very
excited
to
see
tiny
homes
being
built
in
kingston.
I
just
have
a
question.
We
know
that
there's
gonna
be
six
homes
and
when
you
were
talking
about
applicants,
do
you
already
have
a
list
of
applicants
or
how
are
you
going
to
get
the
applicants?
How
does
somebody
know
to
apply
to
be
an
applicant
if
you
don't
already
have
a
list
going?
How
does
that
work.
F
H
F
I
Thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
mayor,
thank
you
for
your
efforts,
especially
in
the
insufficient
government
funding
for
the
for
housing
in
these
days.
This
is
a
question
from
a
constituent,
and
I
said
I
would
is
it
and
don't
take
it
from
me?
Okay,
it's
not
for
me.
Is
it
possible
to
propose
more
attractive
than
more
personalized
structures
than
habitat
is
proposing?
F
A
A
J
Our
objective
is
to
proceed
with
the
garage
using
high
quality,
architectural
vertical
board
and
baton,
vinyl
siding
the
material
issue
here
is
not
the
about
the
expense,
although,
as
I'm
certain
counselors
are
aware,
the
price
of
wood
projects
has
increased
this
last
year
due
to
supply
and
demand
for
us.
The
issue
is
time
spent
in
maintenance.
J
J
So
we
don't
believe
that
it
should
be
treated
as
a
heritage
building
in
the
same
way
as
the
main
building.
That
said,
we
know
and
understand
that
the
garage
should
not
detract
from
the
heritage
building.
We
want
to
use
high
quality,
architectural
vertical
board
and
batten
vinyl
siding.
There
is
a
lot
of
it
around
and
it
looks
very
good.
Vinyl
is
not
the
same
as
it
used
to
be,
so
all
vinyl
should
not
be
labeled
with
the
same
stamp
using
high
quality,
architectural,
vertical
board
and
batten.
J
J
J
J
K
J
J
Which
the
present
day
costs
range
between
four
dollars
and
450
a
square
foot,
so
a
total
of
5600
to
6300
direct
comparison
plus
an
inherent
20
waste
factor
when
when
those
boards
are
cut,
increasing
the
potential
cost
to
to
about
67
to
7
7
500.,
and
there
are
additional
costs
for
original,
caulking
and
possible
annual
re-caulking.
So
it's
it's
a
labor
intensive
as
well.
L
A
Don't
see
any
other
questions
from
council,
mr
imran,
thank
you
very
much.
Thank
you.
Okay.
With
that
we'll
move
to
our
third
delegation,
we
will
invite
leslie,
delsin
executive
director,
athletics
and
recreation
from
queens
university
and
matthew
holmes,
director
of
government
and
institutional
relations
for
queen's
university,
who
will
appear
before
council
to
speak
to
clause.
4
report
number
65
received
from
the
cio
with
respect
to
a
request
for
extension
of
noise
exemption
queens
university
richardson
stadium.
M
Sorry
about
that,
it's
only
the
third
time
today.
So
my
apologies
good
evening
and
thank
you,
your
worship,
mayor
patterson
members
of
council.
My
name
is
leslie
dalsin,
the
executive
director
of
athletics
and
recreation
at
queen's
university,
and
I
am
joined
tonight
by
matthew
holmes.
The
director
of
government
and
institutional
relations
council
has
raised
our
received
our
detailed
application
for
a
noise
bylaw
exemption
request
for
richardson
stadium
that
covers
the
remainder
of
2021
and
the
year
of
2022..
M
M
This
also
saves
our
local
community
group
partners,
the
majority
of
whom
are
you
sports,
the
expense
of
having
to
apply
for
multiple
individual
requests
throughout
the
year.
I'm
pleased
to
say
that
we've
had
no
formal
complaints
through
the
2019
year
or
in
response
to
this
year's
request.
Queens
did
deliver
advance
notice
to
our
west
campus
neighbors
near
the
stadium
in
june,
advising
them
of
our
our
noise
bylaw
exemption,
request
and
seeking
comment.
M
The
application
that
queens
has
put
forward
to
the
city
is
for
the
same
terms
and
conditions
as
the
noise
bylaw
exemption.
That
was
approved
last
last
approved
by
the
city
council
in
in
2019,
but
with
two
changes.
A
decreased
number
of
occurrences
in
2121
due
to
the
pandemic
and
the
2022
year
is
identical
to
the
requests
made
for
2019.
M
M
All
activities
at
richardson
stadium
will
be
done
in
consultation
with
public
health
and
in
a
manner
that
is
safe
and
in
alignment
with
all
kovid
19
protocols.
We
hope
that
city
council
sees
will
continue
to
see
the
benefit
of
the
one
full
application
for
community
sponsored
and
queen's
events.
At
richardson
stadiums
provided
in
this
way,
my
thanks
to
all
of
you
for
your
consideration
of
our
request,
and
I
would
be
pleased
to
answer
any
questions
that
you
might
have.
D
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mr
mayor,
thank
you
for
your
presentation,
and
I
just
want
to
mention
that
I
have
also
not
heard
from
any
residents
any
concerns,
but
it
is
great
to
hear
that
you
reach
out
to
the
neighborhood
before
submitting
the
exemptions
tonight,
just
wonder
when
you
reached
out
with
people.
If
you
also
gave
a
phone
number
or
contact
information,
if
anybody
does
have
concerns
how
they
could
reach
queens
to
discuss
any
concerns.
M
N
Thank
you,
mayor,
patterson
and
through
you
thank
you,
miss
delson,
for
your
presentation
and
also
I
want
to
recognize
what
you
said
in
your
presentation
that
you've
changed
the
format
of
request
to
include
community
groups
and
your
events,
and
I
think,
that's
helpful.
I
know
that
is
what
we'd
asked
for
last
time,
so
I
I
personally
appreciate
that
that
is
the
route
you
took.
My
only
concern
with
it,
though,
now
seeing
it
in
action
is
that
we
don't
know
the
actual
dates
that
are
being
requested.
N
M
All
all
of
our
all
of
our
scheduled
events
do
appear
on
our
website,
so
our
so
our
our
our
west
campus
neighbors
know
what's
coming
up
and
and
and
are
aware
of
the
activities
that
are
going
on.
I
I
would
say
this
year
has
been
more
difficult
than
than
in
previous
years,
because
of
the
nature
of
the
pandemic,
we
haven't
been
able
to.
A
With
that,
we
will
move
to
sort
of
fourth
delegation,
so
just
noting
that
I'll
first
need
a
motion
to
add
or
for
delegation,
so
moved
by
council
mclaren
seconded
by
councillor
hutchison
that
clauses
12.9
and
12.11
of
our
procedural
biology
wage
in
order
to
allow
pamela
cornell
to
speak
to
clause.
2
report
number
65
from
the
cio.
This
is
the
living
spaces
by
the
project
for
habitat
for
humanity.
O
Thank
you.
Can
you
hear
me?
Yes,
if
we
can?
Okay,
I'm
really
excited
about
the
tiny
homes
project.
That's
in
the
works.
Now
we've
been
waiting
for
it
to
come
to
council,
but
I
think
the
key
to
success
in
a
venture
like
this
is
community
involvement,
and
that
hasn't
happened.
Yet
with
dramatic
emphasis
evidence
of
the
climate
crisis
all
around
us.
We
need
to
ensure
that
these
little
houses
reflect
the
best
expertise
that
can
be
brought
to
bear
on
their
design.
O
Provision
should
be
made
for
groups
like
350.org
to
contribute
their
knowledge
of
materials
and
infrastructure,
along
with
perhaps
their
volunteer
building
efforts
in
detroit's
cast
tiny
homes.
Community
each
house
has
its
own
solar
panel
to
supplement
the
electricity
supply
contrast
to
houses
with
indoor
acreage.
O
A
goal
of
tiny
homes
is
to
decrease
the
builders
carbon
footprint,
while
also
helping
occupants
reduce
their
own
energy
demands
and
cost
of
living
by
2030.
The
government
of
canada
is
aiming
to
require
in
its
building
code
net
zero
buildings
that
will
use
only
as
much
energy
as
they
can
produce
from
renewable
sources.
O
A
front
porch
or
a
back
deck
can
serve
to
expand
the
limited
indoor
space
and
the
surrounding
lot
can
provide
the
comforting
activity
of
growing
flowers
and
vegetables.
Ideally,
no
two
of
these
houses
should
look
the
same.
They
should
reflect
the
fact
that
each
is
occupied
by
a
unique
individual
if
there
are
to
be
eight
houses
and
that's
what
I
up
to
eight
houses.
I
guess
there
should
be
more
than
two
or
three
designs
and
none
should
be
attached
to
the
others.
O
Of
course,
this
will
cost
money,
most
of
which
will
have
to
be
raised
in
the
community,
though,
a
series
of
trillium
grants
might
also
be
a
possibility,
dawn
house
qualified
for
all
three
of
the
trillium
grants,
seed
capital
and
grow,
and,
let's
hope
this
project
does
too
a
successful
fundraising
campaign
will
depend
on
a
visually
appealing
plan,
combined
with
compelling
stories
of
the
transformative
effect.
These
tiny
homes
could
have
not
just
on
the
lives
of
their
occupants,
but
also
on
the
supportive
community
that
has
been
built
around
them.
O
A
condition
of
occupancy
might
be
committing
to
attend
monthly
classes
at
the
north
kingston
community
center,
where
volunteers
could
offer
guidance
on
cleaning
products
and
processes,
preventive
maintenance,
seasonal
upkeep
requirements
and
handy
person.
Skills
during
those
classes
which
could
be
open
to
any
interested
members
of
the
public
instructors
could
offer
suggestions
about
organizing
books,
dishes,
kitchen
utensils
and
clothing
class
discussions
could
focus
on
how
to
streamline
a
closet
and
craft
storage
cubbies
under
beds
on
top
of
walls
inside
footstools
and
on
shelves.
A
tiny
plate,
tiny
home,
is
no
place
for
a
hoarder.
O
G
G
Our
comprehensive
zoning
bylaw
is
going
through
the
process
right
now,
and
it's
already
had
a
draft
presentation
looking
at
tiny
homes
being
made
available
by
wright
and
some
of
the
discussion
of
how
how
to
build
or
what
qualifies
as
a
tiny
home
is
also
part
of
that.
If
you
haven't
yet
seen
the
draft,
that
would
be
great
if
you
have
an
opportunity
to.
G
O
P
A
R
Sure
thank
you
maren
and
councillors
for
the
opportunity
to
give
a
brief
briefing
today.
The
presentation
summarizes
results
from
a
decade
of
study
that
we
undertook
on
the
kingston
inner
harbor,
which
culminated
in
a
large
report
produced
in
2014
and
which
is
now
publicly
available
and
we'd
like
to
clarify
that
we
are
not
speaking
on
behalf
of
the
federal
property
owners
for
the
kingston
inner
harbor
and
that
the
proposed
sediment
management
plan
that
came
to
council
in
the
april.
Six
briefing
is
based
on
recent
studies
and
not
our
2014
report.
R
However,
it
does
appear
that
the
federal
property
owners
and
their
consultants
have
come
to
similar
conclusions
that
we
did
about
the
kingston
inner
harbor
and
we're
here
today
to
provide
some
context
on
the
studies
carried
out
in
the
kingston
inner
harbor
prior
to
2014
and
to
respond
to
questions
based
on
our
professional
expertise
and
our
knowledge
of
the
kingston
inner
harbor.
Sediment
contamination
next
slide,
please
so
just
a
little
bit
about
our
credentials.
Expertise
is
in
sediment
management.
I've
been
working
on
sediments
now
for
30
years.
Q
And
I'm
ken
reimer
I'm
the
professor
emeritus
and
founding
director
of
the
environmental
sciences
group
at
rmc
and
in
that
capacity
I
led
well
several
hundred
projects,
environmental
projects
across
canada,
and
I
coordinated
that
10-year
project
that
tam
just
spoke
about
the
projects
esga
undertook
were
large
and
small.
The
largest
was
the
site
as
a
scientific
authority
for
do
line
cleanup
the
cleanup
of
cold
war
radar
sites
in
the
arctic,
and
that
was
the
first
major
arctic
cleanup
and
esg
developed
the
standards
for
that
project.
Q
R
So
this
is
an
overview
of
the
kingston
inner
harbor,
which
you
know
many
people
are
familiar
with
just
to
orient
orient
people.
There's
a
salt
causeway
down
at
the
bottom
and
a
bell
park
landfill
in
the
center
with
bell
island
and,
as
most
residents
are
familiar,
there
are
a
number
of
historical
industries
that
operated
down
the
western
side
of
the
the
harbor
from
the
bell
park,
landfill
to
the
davis
tannery
to
the
coal
gasification
plant
next
slide.
Please,
and
these
have
led
to
a
legacy
of
contamination
within
the
sediments.
R
What
I'm
going
to
show
over
the
next
few
slides
is
a
few
maps
showing
the
contaminant
concentrations
in
the
sediments.
Again
we
have
the
lasalle
causeway
down
at
the
bottom
and
bell
island
in
the
center
of
this
map,
and
the
color
coding
shows
the
concentrations
with
the
yellow,
orange
and
red
being
progressively
the
higher
concentrations
of
these
contaminants
as
they
get
into
the
yellow
color.
R
It
exceeds
a
environmental
quality
guideline
known
as
the
probable
effects
level,
which
is
indicative
of
potential
effects
to
the
aquatic
ecosystem,
and
so
here's
an
example
of
one
of
the
contaminants
inc,
which
I
can
see,
has
elevated
concentrations
close
to
bell
park
and
douglas
fleur
park
next
slide.
Please.
R
This
is
arsenic
which
is
elevated
in
the
sediments
very
close
to
the
rowing
club
and
the
woolen
mill
next
slide.
Please
mercury,
which
is
more
widespread
in
a
similar
area
down
around
douglas
florida
park
as
well.
Next
slide,
please
lead
which,
not
surprisingly,
given
that
there
is
a
lead
smelter
here,
there's
quite
a
bit
of
lead
through
in
the
sediments
with
high
concentrations
around
douglas
flair
park
and
the
corner
south
of
bell
park
landfill
next
to
the
davis
tannery
next
slide.
R
Please
pcbs,
which
are
a
contaminant
which
may
biomagnified
to
high
concentrations
in
the
upper
levels
of
the
aquatic
food
web,
and
these
are
are
found.
The
highest
contrast.
Concentrations
are
found
south
of
bell
park
next
slide.
Please
polycyclic
aromatic
hydrocarbons,
which
associated
with
contaminants
such
as
coal,
tar,
which
are
found
at
high
concentrations
in
england,
bay
and
along
the
belt
park.
Landfill
next
slide,
please
and
chromium,
which
is
present
in
in
very
high
abundances
and
widespread,
which
would
have
come
from
the
former
state
davis
tannery.
R
Please
one
perception
is
that
these
contaminants
are
safely
tied
up
in
a
paste,
and
our
studies
show
that
that's
not
generally
the
case.
There
are
processes
that
can
mobilize
these
sediments
kingston.
Inner
harbor
is
very
shallow.
It's
about
a
meter
depth,
deep
throughout
and
because
of
those
shallow
water,
depths
boat,
propellers,
ice,
wave
action
and
fish
such
as
carp,
which
you
can
see
a
picture
down
at
the
bottom,
when
they
feed,
can
stir
up
the
sediments
and
re-suspend
them.
R
We
also
looked
at
burial
rates
with
clean
sediments
through
sediment
coring
studies,
and
there
is
very
slow
burial
with
clean
sediments
in
some
areas
of
the
harbor
as
well,
and
the
contaminants
in
the
sediments
are
taken
up
into
the
aquatic
food
web.
So
there's
30
years
of
studies
showing
that
in
animals
and
plants,
organisms
in
the
more
heavily
contaminated
areas
of
the
harbor
take
up
contaminants
at
a
higher
level
than
fish
and
animals
living
in
less
contaminated
areas.
R
Next
slide,
please
and
those
contaminants
can
cause
effects.
So
these
are
pictures
of
brown
bullhead,
which
are
a
type
of
fish
that
lives
closely
associated
with
the
sediment.
They
actually
bury
themselves
in
the
sediment
for
part
of
the
year.
These
are
fish
that
we
caught
in
the
area
south
of
bell
park
and
they
had
a
higher
frequency
of
external
lesions
and
tumors
than
fish
that
we
caught
up
near
the
401
in
the
the
more
the
cleaner
area
of
the
harbor.
So,
for
example,
the
upper
right
is
an
example
of
an
epidermal
lesion
next
slide.
R
R
R
R
Next
slide,
please.
So
these
risks
are
not
generally
not
spread
across
the
harbor.
Many
of
these
would
be
associated
with
the
contaminated
sediments
along
the
western
shoreline
and
the
area
south
of
bell
park.
That's
the
area
that
poses
greatest
risk
next
slide.
Please
one
question
that
might
be
asked
is:
can
we
let
these
sediments
recover
on
their
own?
It's
called
monitored
natural
recovery
and
it
can
be
a
strategy.
That's
used
at
a
lot
of
aquatic
contaminated
sites
and
from
the
april
6
city,
council
backgrounder.
R
This
has
been
proposed
for
most
of
the
harbor
area
area
from
the
the
federal
property
owners.
We
also
looked
at
this
as
part
of
our
study.
We
have
recommended
this
on
other
aquatic
contaminants
sites
we've
worked
on,
but
what
we
found
in
the
kingston
inner
harbor
is
it
wouldn't
be
effective
in
areas
along
the
western
shoreline
where
the
contaminants
concentrations
are
high
and
burial
with
the
clean
sediments
occurs
very
slowly.
R
So
people
should
be
aware
that
if
a
cleanup
does
not
take
place,
then
the
high
concentrations
and
contaminants
in
the
sediments
near
the
western
shoreline
and
area
south
belt
park
will
remain
and
they
are
a
main
source
of
human
health
and
ecological
risk.
With
that
I'll
turn
over
to
ken
to
talk
about
the
next
slide.
Q
Yes,
thank
you.
Certainly
on
our
report.
We
recommended
that
drudgie
being
one
not
the
only
one
but
one
of
the
principal
means
of
remediating,
these
contaminated
sediments,
and
we
made
that
recommendation
because
it
is
a
standard
remediation
technique.
That's
used
at
many
aquatic
contaminated
sites,
both
in
north
america
and
around
the
world,
including
in
river
environments.
Q
Now
you
might
think
that
disturbing
the
sediments
by
removing
the
material
you
might
cause
more
harm,
but
there
are
controls
that
are
put
in
place
to
take
care
of
that.
For
one
thing,
suction
drugs
are
used
or,
like
a
vacuum
cleaner
to
suck
up
these
contaminated
sediments
and
transport
them
to
a
safer
location
away
from
the
harbor.
You
can
see
here
in
the
middle
picture
an
example
of
an
engineering
control
where
the
work
area
is
on
the
right.
Q
We
do
know
that
the
contaminants,
although
they're
available
to
organisms,
are
mainly
attached
to
the
sediment
particles.
So
if
you
look
at
the
bottom
screen,
you
can
see
these
little
brown
particles
made
to
represent
the
sediment
particles
with
contaminants
attached
and
the
contaminants
are
not
dissolved
into
the
pore
water.
Little
bits
of
water
that
are
amounts
of
mud
in
the
sediment,
so
capturing
the
suspended,
sediments
and
then
sucking
them
away
or
taking
away
using
a
dredge
is
a
way
to
remove
the
contaminants
from
the
work
area.
Next
slide,
please.
Q
So
this
tells
us
that
sediment
radiation
can
be
done
in
the
kih
safely
without
catastrophic
impacts.
Next
slide,
please
we
know
this
because
there
are
many
examples
of
successful
projects.
Perhaps
one
of
the
largest
in
north
america
is
the
hudson
river
project,
historically
general
electrics
casually
dumped
transformed
fluids
containing
pcbs
into
the
river
and
when
the
impact
of
these
contaminants
were
discovered
in
the
1980s,
it
was
also
recognized
that
there
was
no
technology
that
could
safely
deal
with
the
contaminated
sediments,
even
though
they
were
having
a
significant
effect
in
about
20
years.
Q
Advances
in
technology
caused
the
us
environmental
protection
agency
to
move
forward
with
a
remediation
plan
and
that
remediation
was
mainly
dredging
supported
by
capping.
That's
to
cover
the
sediments
with
material
to
prevent
the
contaminants
being
taken
up
into
the
ecosystem
and
also
burial
with
clean
sediments
and
they're,
very
careful.
They
did
the
project
in
two
phases,
because
this
was
a
learning
experience.
This
is
one
of
the
first
really
large
projects.
It
was
conducted
and
phase.
One
results
were
applied
to
phase
two
and
phase
two
was
extremely
successful.
Q
Over
a
six
period,
an
enormous
amount
of
contaminated
sediment
was
successfully
removed
from
a
40-mile
section
of
the
river
next
slide.
Please
now
I'm
very
familiar
with
this
project,
because
I
was
involved
very
early
on
with
it,
and
I
chaired
two
independent
peer
review
committees
for
the
hudson
river
project.
Q
Q
The
first
panel
I
shared
was
to
look
at
whether
remediation
was
necessary.
Ge
proposed
that
burial
would
take
care
of
everything
and
epa
thought.
Not
our
committee
found
for
epa.
We
determined
that
the
impact
was
significant
and
that
in
many
sections
of
the
river
burial
would
not
be
possible
and
remediation
was
essential.
Q
A
second
committee
that
I
chaired
was
to
develop
the
performance
standards
to
ensure
the
success
of
the
project,
and
these
are
the
standards
that
look
into
how
what
are
the
monitoring
data
have
to
show
outside
those
barriers?
How
do
we
make
sure
that
the
project
is
doing
its
job
and
not
having
leaks
if
you
like,
of
the
contaminated
material
outside
of
the
immediate
work
area?
Q
I
didn't
share
it,
but
there
was
another
quality
life
standards
committee
and
that
was
to
ensure
that
impacts
due
to
noise
lights,
economic
issues
etc
were
dealt
with.
So
in
other
words,
there
can
be
standards
developed
and
should
be
developed
for
any
project
for
this
type
to
ensure
its
success
and
minimize
any
kind
of
negative
effect
of
the
actual
work
itself,
and
there
are
many
many
other
examples
of
successful
projects
here
in
canada,
rock
bay
in
victoria
bc.
Q
Q
So
it
is
important
to
address
community
concerns,
and
we
welcome
the
fact
that
the
public
has
become
concerned
about
this
issue.
It's
important
that
their
concerns
be
brought
forward
to
the
federal
owners
before
detailed
design
takes
place
and
all
segment
magic
pros
of
this
type
must
undergo
a
detailed
impact
assessment
to
look
at
those
concerns
and
implement
measures
to
address
them.
They
need
to
minimize
any
negative
social
and
economic
impacts.
Q
The
activities
need
to
be
planned
to
avoid
impacts
to
wildlife,
and
it
has
to
be
assured
that
the
remediation
work
does
not
cost
environmental
harm.
So
this
impact
assessment
has
to
be
conducted
and
address
these
concerns
in
order
to
make
sure
that
it's
going
to
be
successful
and
we
believe
it
can
be
next
slide,
please
so
sudden
recreation,
in
our
view
in
the
kingston
united
harbor,
can
be
owned
safely.
Q
S
Thank
you.
So
we
heard
from
a
presenter
last
time
that
there
could
be
a
catastrophic
event
and
it
sounds
like
you're
confident
that
we
can
avoid
this
with
remediation
things,
with
using
a
vacuum
sucker
or
some
sort
of
cordon
off
of
the
water
thing.
So
you're
basically
telling
us
that,
based
on
your
knowledge
of
this,
we
can
do
this
safely
without,
like
we
can
raise
all
this
stuff
from
150
years
of
of
heavy
waste.
Q
Q
They
must
have
come
to
similar
conclusions.
That's
a
very
comforting
thing
for
people
in
science
area
to
see
that
two
groups
independently
arrive
at
the
same
conclusion
and
it.
Furthermore,
they
would
not
get
funding
through
the
federal
contaminated
state's
action
plan
unless
this
work
was
peer-reviewed
successfully
to
say
that
it
is
necessary
and
our
work
is
also
peer
reviewed.
So
that's
two
separate
lines
of
thought,
plus
a
third
line,
which
is
the
examples
of
many
successful
projects.
We
can
only
let
that
evidence
speak
for
itself.
S
Thank
you
and
the
second
follow-up
question
we
were,
or
at
least
I
was
shown
this
report
by
a
member
of
the
public
and
on
as
a
preface
to
that
report.
There
is
a
letter
that
was
signed
by
three
people,
dr
lang,
dr
kosh
and
dr
weber,
and
there
is
a
paragraph
there
that
is
concerning,
and
it
claims
that,
as
of
april
2021,
a
proposed
approach
for
sediment
management
has
been
developed
to
address
risk
posed
by
contaminated
sediment
in
the
kingston
inner
harbor.
S
The
proposed
sediment
management
approach
is
based
on
the
studies
undertaken
since
19
or
since
2014,
and
therefore
is
not
and
not,
as
underlined
here
contained
in
this
2014
report.
This
2014
report
does
present
some
preliminary
analysis
of
management
options,
but
the
discussion
is
now
outdated
and
should
be
considered
to
be
superseded
by
the
follow-up
work
done
in
other
areas.
Since
do
we
is
it
possible
for
us
to
get
copies
of
these
follow-up
reports
and
based
on
that
letter
is?
Is
there
a
recommendation
still
to
dredge.
R
I
can
speak
to
that
one
because
I
wrote
that
letter
and
really
what
I
wanted
to
make
clear.
There
was
that
the
the
federal
property
owners
have
undertaken
more
study
and
they
have
based
their
plan
on
the
recent
studies,
but
they
also
appear
to
have
come
as,
as
ken
just
spoke
to
to
very
similar
conclusions
as
we
came
to
including
the
the
areas
that
need
to
be
addressed,
and
the
fact
that
more
active
intervention
methods
are
needed
here
than
monitored
natural
recovery.
R
R
Q
Q
Of
course,
on
behalf
of
the
federal
property
owners,
we're
speaking
behalf
of
our
knowledge
of
both
our
our
knowledge
of
10
years
of
experience
on
the
river
plus
knowledge
of
other
projects
of
this
type,
this
can
be
done
successfully.
That's
the
message,
I
guess
we're
suggesting
there
are
questions
that
need
to
be
answered
by
the
project
proponents
to
ensure
that
the
right
performance
measures
are
put
in
place
to
ensure
that
success.
S
D
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mr
mayor,
thank
you
for
the
presentation
and
we
found
it
very
interesting.
You
mentioned
that
standards
developed
and
that
we
need
to
ensure
that
their
proper
standards
are
developed
to
ensure
successful
project,
and
you
also
mentioned
third-party
reviews.
I
wonder
if
you
could
speak
to
the
important
of
process
to
ensure
that
this
will
be
a
successful
project
if
it
does
go
ahead
and
how
and
if
it
wouldn't
include
a
third-party
review
and
what
about
public
engagement.
Q
D
R
Okay
sounds
good,
so
we
did
look
at
some
of
the
sources
along
the
the
harbor
and
some
of
those
sources
have
been
addressed
quite
successfully
in
in
that
there
have
been
remedial
measures
put
in
and
then
there's
been
follow-up,
sampling
and
confirmation,
on
behalf
of
the
regulators,
to
be
sure
that
those
properties
are
not
still
a
significant
source
to
the
harbor.
There
are
other
lands
around
the
the
harbor
that
are
still
a
potential
ongoing
source
and
one
that
comes
to
mind
is
the
the
orchard
marsh
north
of
the
davis
tannery.
R
Q
And
in
our
report
we
identified
the
orchard
marsh
and
certainly
had
discussions
with
the
city
of
kingston
about
what
kind
of
activities
could
take
place
to
try
to
limit
any.
You
know
further
impacts
from
that
particular
area,
so
it's
identified
in
our
report,
I'm
sure
I'm
sure
I
haven't
seen
that
I've
read
the
reports,
but
I
would
definitely
believe
that
it
will
be
in
the
transport
canada
documents
as
well.
So
there
has
to
be
a
plan
to
deal
with
those
ongoing
sources.
Q
I
Q
It
could,
if
it
was
not
dealt
with,
but
I
know
we
had
many
discussions
is
when
we
developed
our
own
report
into
various
ways
that
could
be
used
to
deal
with
those
both
the
storm
sewer
and
the
orchard
marsh.
There
are
quite
a
what
number
of
ways
that
could
be.
This
could
be
dealt
with,
so
the
simple
answer
is:
yes,
it
needs
to
be
done
and,
and
there
are
ways
that
it
can
be
done
and
cam
down.
If
you
want
to
elaborate.
R
I
think
I
think
that's
and
I
I
know
it's
been
brought
to
the
attention
of,
as
ken
said
during
our
our
talk
about
addressing
that.
It
is
typical
that
other
sediment
management
projects
have
looked
at
recontamination
from
sources.
I'm
sure
that
it
would
be
looked
at
it's
a
question
to
bring
forward
to
public
consultation
when
we
hear
more
information
from
the
property
owners.
I
Q
I
think
those
are
the
major
ones.
Aren't
they
tam?
I
mean
there's
a
lot
of
work.
The
city
has
done
successfully
with
the
bell
island
landfill
to
maintain
leachate.
That
was
probably
an
original
source.
Davis
january,
of
course,
was
a
huge
source.
During
its
day
I
mean
when
you
look
at
satellite
or
aerophotos
of
its
actual
operation.
The
amount
of
effluent
was
tremendous,
so
they
have
diminished
because
of
either
controls
have
been
put
in
place
by
in
the
city
in
many
cases
quite
successfully
or
just
by
nature.
Q
Q
I
don't
think
of
any
surprises.
I
guess
would
be
my
my
my
feeling
we.
I
should
add
that
when
we
did
our
10-year
study,
we
had
formed
the
cataract
or
stakeholder
group
which
include
the
current
property
owners,
transport,
canada
parks,
canada,
the
city
of
kingston,
the
regulators,
ministering
environment,
environment,
canada,
issues
and
oceans,
a
number
of
different
stakeholders.
So
we
had
input
for
a
lot
of
the
players
who
have
current
and
previous
knowledge
of
the
inner
harbor.
I
Q
I
know
that
it
looks
very
overgrown,
but
I
can't
add
that
a
part
of
our
study
that
we
did,
we
did
commission
a
a
private
group
with
a
lot
of
experience
more
than
30
years
experience
in
looking
at
the
biodiversity
of
similar
wetlands,
and
I
believe
the
conclusion
tam
was
that
it
was
the
the
worst
wetland
they'd
ever
seen
in
30
years
of
their
history,
so
capping
it
would
not
be
a
disaster
to
the
ecosystem.
It
is
not
a
successful
habitat
at
this
moment.
Q
I
I
R
Yeah
this
the
contaminated
sediments,
particularly
along
the
western
shoreline
and
south
of
bell
park,
have
unacceptable
associated
with
unacceptable
human
health
and
ecological
risks,
and
if
we
address
them
by
taking
by
removing
them,
then
we
allow
for
those
risks
to
be
addressed,
and
so
that's
really.
The
main
driver
for
these
projects
is
that
in
general,
sediment
management
remediation
projects
are
not
undertaken
unless
the
sediments
can
pose
these
type
of
risks
and
that
it.
That
is
the
case
here.
Q
And
it's
the
nature
of
the
river
in
those
shallow
areas
in
the
western
area
where
the
contamination
is
highest
that
presents
that
problem,
because
it's
in
shallow
water
that
sediment
is
constantly
being
redisturbed.
It's
not
going
to
be
buried
for
decades
and
decades
if
at
all,
by
and
and
be
covered
by.
You
know
natural
healing,
it's
going
to
always
be
a
source
and
a
potential
risk.
So
if
we
don't
remediate
it
we'll
be
stuck
with
more
of
the
same.
If
we
do,
we
can
look
forward
to
a
enriched
inner
harbor
environment.
Q
Well
there
there
are
many
different
techniques
to
clean
up
contaminated
sites.
We
have
a
lot
of
experience
dealing
with
land-based
contaminated
sites
as
well
I
mean
you
could
remove
the
material
you
could
cap
the
material.
You
can
create
barriers
between
the
contamination
and
the
river
itself.
There
are
juice
membranes,
engineered
membranes
that
do
that.
R
Sure
so
that's
definitely
a
question
for
the
for
the
federal
property
owners
to
ask.
Looking
at
managing
projects
like
this
to
minimize
impacts
to
turtles
or
other
species
at
risk.
Is
it's
important
and
it's
required,
and
so
there
will
be
mitigation
measures
put
into
place
that
are
protected
of
the
turtles,
and
there
should
be
more
information
forthcoming
on
that
in
terms
of
shoreline
habitat
there.
R
I
Q
That
takes
place,
so
it
depends
how
they
design
the
sections
that
they
work
on,
how
large
those
sections
are,
how
quickly
they
move
along.
So
these
are
all
the
right
questions
to
be
asking
the
federal
government
opponents,
but
I
can
say
that
this
has
been
effective
elsewhere.
So
it's
not
that
it
can't
be
done.
It
can
be
done,
but
it
has
to
be
done
with
these
precautions
and
concerns
in
mind.
I
Q
No,
I
can
answer
that
question
I
I
retired
from
rmc
in
2014,
and
the
10-year
report
that
we
produced
was
that
I
handed
that
over
to
all
the
members
of
the
category
of
stakeholder
groups
with
great
exhaustion,
because
I
didn't
think
that
anybody
was
going
to
do
anything
about
this
project,
even
though
we
felt
it
needed
to
be
done.
So
I
was
greatly
surprised
this
spring
to
learn
that
a
project
had
actually
come
about.
Q
G
Q
In
2014
I
mentioned
there
was
a
fairly
large,
I
probably
haven't
included
everyone
stakeholder
group
that
have
been
formed
and
they
they
actually
were
involved
on
a
regular
basis
with
the
studies
that
were
being
done,
the
results
were
being
found
before
the
report
was
even
written.
The
report
was
also
peer-reviewed
by
three
government
departments:
environment,
canada,
health,
canada
and
fisheries
and
oceans.
Q
So
when
we
finally
completed
that
report-
and
I
have
to
admit-
I
was
retiring
at
the
time-
and
I
didn't
think
I
was
getting
traction
in
this
project-
so
I
gave
the
report
out
and
I
said,
hostile
visa,
so
I'm
thrilled
to
be
back
involved
in
this
in
this.
Seeing
this
any
way
we
can
help
to
make
sure
these
questions
are
answered
correctly.
G
G
Q
Q
Q
G
Q
How
do
I
handle
swimming
in
tam
hell's
aquatic
life?
She's
a
biologist?
After
all,
I'm
a
chemist
because
the
the
contaminants
are
attached
to
the
sediment
particles
and
the
important
thing
to
note
is
that
doesn't
mean
they
can't
be
extracted
from
the
sediment
particles
by
wildlife
and
plants
and
such
so.
That's
why
they're
bioavailable
that's
where
they
get
moved
up
into
the
food
chain,
but
they
don't
readily
dissolve
in
the
water.
Q
So
when
the
sediment
particles
with
contaminants
attached
are
removed
and
then
the
you
know,
there's
restoration
of
the
of
the
bottom,
the
water
quality
should
be
very
good.
The
water
quality
is
already
okay,
it's
just
subject
to,
in
fact,
in
fact,
there's
a
lot
of
organic
matter
that
comes
into
the
river
and
it's
a
there's
other
issues,
there's
not
chemical
contaminant
issues
of
that
type,
so
I
think
that
would
be
swimming
would
be
more
readily
available,
soonest
and
aquatic
life.
Probably
a
little
later.
Damn.
R
Yeah,
so
it
depends
on
what
type
of
aquatic
life
we're
talking
about
so
organisms
with
shorter
life,
lifespans,
like
the
the
small
aquatic
larvae
that
live
in
the
sediments
when
they're
provided
with
clean
sediments,
will
rebound
fairly
quickly
in
general,
as
long
as
the
the
other
conditions
for
life
are
suitable
organisms
that
are
liver
longer
lived
like
fish
there.
There
is
a
lag
time
and
it
you
know,
depended
in
that.
The
older
fish
will
will
have
a
large.
R
G
Thank
you
and
lastly,
I
know
I
had
two
questions,
but
the
third
one
just
popped
in
mine
I
over
the
years,
I'm
a
retired,
high
school
teacher
and
I
taught
in
both
gannon
aqua
and
in
rockville
after
the
dredging
and
the
cleaning
is
done.
Is
there
a
concern
that
some
of
our
downstream
neighbors
will
be
affected
at
all.
Q
There
should
be
no
downstream
effects
on
neighbors,
because,
again
those
containment
measures
to
obtain
those
sediment
particles
will
be
monitored.
They
need
to
be
effective,
otherwise
work
there
should
be.
There
should
be
a
protocol
in
place
that
if,
for
some
reason,
there's
an
exceedance,
work
would
stop
and
then
appropriate
action
would
be
taken.
Q
The
key
thing
is
remember
that
the
the
contaminants
are
are
attached
to
those
sediment
particles
they're
not
dissolving
into
the
water
column.
If
they
dissolved
in
water.
It's
a
different
story,
although
they
would
then
become
diluted
and
washed
away,
so
that
would
the
downstream
neighbors
would
be
receiving
a
much
lesser
impact
if
you
like,
but
that
is
not
the
case.
Q
It's
it's
a
retention
of
those
sediment
particles
and
you
can
well
imagine
that
even
if
and
I
really
hate
to
use
the
word
failure,
if
something
failed
for
a
moment,
sediment
particles
aren't
going
to
go
all
the
way
downstream,
they're
going
to
fall
out
into
the
bottom
again
somewhere
away
from
the
work
area.
But
I
have
every
confidence
that
the
monitoring
program
should
exclude
those
possibilities
and
the
containment
measures
should
be
effective.
R
P
Thank
you,
worship.
I
appreciate
the
presentation.
I
actually
have
an
undergrad
in
biology
myself
and
studied
the
comparative
analysis
of
of
camberis
robustus
and
and
the
bronchi
bedelidae
as
a
commensal
living
on
the
exoskeleton
on
a
circumnuetral
stream
and
an
acidified
lake
up
in
sudbury.
So
I
have
some
appreciation
for
the
the
issues
that
you
were
addressing
and
you
mentioned
that
the
report
was
from
2014
and
certainly
one
of
the
great
topics
that
we
have
around
the
council
table.
Thanks
to
many.
R
I
think
we
do
see
some
of
that
and
we've
also
seen
higher
water
levels
and
flooding,
and
so
when
we
think
about
leaving
contaminated
sediments
in
place
in
some
of
the
higher
concentrated
areas,
we
also
need
to
think
in
the
future.
Are
we
going
to
have
higher
water
levels
here
that
might
mobilize
these
sediments?
P
Yet
if
I
was
to
purchase
a
waterfront
property
and
build
on
it,
I
would
have
to
be
at
least
100
meters
back
or
120
meters
back
depending
on
the
the
the
conservation
authority.
Would
it
be
prudent,
then,
that
any
development
we
have
along
this
waterway
should
be
at
least
120
meters
away
from
the
shoreline
as
it
exists
today,.
R
Q
P
R
Q
No,
they
weren't
at
the
time,
but
because
we
were
focused
mainly
on
the
regulators
and
the
owners,
so
we
were
trying
to
get
the
science
of
the
project
done,
and
so
are
we.
We
did
not
develop
our
report
beyond
the
idea
of
there
was
a
problem
it
needed
to
be
dealt
with.
Here's
some
of
the
ways
it
could
be
dealt
with,
but
it
didn't
move
beyond
that,
which
is
what
would
be
if
you
know
how
best
to
do
that,
how
to
implement
that,
and
that
would
of
course,
definitely
engage
the
other
stakeholders
as
well.
Q
So
we
were
at
the
early
stages.
I
mean
it
was
a
10-year
project,
but
we
funded
it
out
of
funds
that
we
had
within
the
environmental
sciences
group,
so
it
took
a
while
to
to
get
it
done,
and
so
that
is
a
necessary
next
step
and
that's
where
that's
well,
where
we
are
now.
I
guess,
because
you
need
to
see
what
transport
canada
has
done
subsequent
to
our
work.
You
need
to
hear
their
answers
to
the
types
of
questions
that
we're
posing
here
and
you
need
to
have
that
engagement.
Q
Q
We
had
we
did
a
lot
of
basic
and
applied
work
with
the
the
environmental
sciences
group.
I
mentioned
the
do
line.
That
was
a
huge
project
because
we
were
the
people
who
designed
the
help,
design
the
cleanup
and,
most
importantly,
we
were
chosen
by
federal
government
inuit
because
we
were
an
independent
university
body
as
a
university
professor,
even
at
a
federal
university
like
rmc,
I
had
an
in
you
know
an
academic
freedom
clause
to
do
my
own
work
and
not
report.
You
know
not
be
subject
to
the
just.
Q
You
know
the
direction
of
my
employer,
so
inuit
saw
that
as
a
very
profitable
thing.
So
we
were
so.
We
applied
in
many
cases
a
research
overhead
charge
on
many
of
that
contract
work.
We
did
and
we
invested
that
work
back
into
studies.
We
did
including
the
kingston
inner
harbor,
and
so
that's
how
we
did
it
with
a
little
bit
at
a
time
of
spare
funds
that
we
had
to
invest
in
basic
research
and
of
the
type
that
we
just
described.
A
number
of
students
benefited
as
well.
Q
We
so
labor
was
less
expensive
graduate
students
and
undergraduate
students
contribute
to
the
project
but
overseen
by
a
highly
professional
group
of
full-time
professionals
with
master's
and
phd
degrees,
so
we're
very
confident
the
quality
work
and
it
was
stood
peer
review.
So
we're
pretty
happy
about
it.
That's
good.
P
Q
Well
again,
this
is
something
the
proponent
will
have
to
speak
to
you,
but
I
can
tell
you
that
I've
I've
been
on
dredging
barges
and
they
are
quite
remarkable,
and
this
was
some
years
ago,
I'm
sure
they're
even
more
remarkable,
but
I
remember
sitting
in
one
of
the
fox
river
in
wisconsin
and
the
guy
had
a
beautiful
computer
screen.
They
had
detailed
mapping
of
the
of
the
of
the
river
bottom.
Q
They
knew
where
boat
racks
were
where
obstacles
were
et
cetera,
and
so
he
could
direct
the
dredge
with
great
precision
in
and
around
things
you
know
in
some
areas
I
presume
they
stayed
away
from
with
some
sort
of
buffer
zone,
so
the
technology
is
quite
valid,
it's
quite
sophisticated,
so
it's
it!
You
know,
I
can't
see
them
cutting
sewer
lines,
leaving
down
to
the
the
sewage
treatment
plant.
They
would
be
pretty
poor
operators
if
they
did
that.
P
P
My
final
question
really
deals
with
turtles
and
you
know
I've
been
heavily
involved
with
trying
to
preserve
turtles
because
they're
such
an
incredible,
the
janitors
of
the
of
the
waterway,
and
I
just
love
them
because
they're,
it's
such
an
important
creature
in
our
communities
and
when
you
talked
about
removing
species
such
as
fish
and
whatnot,
I'm
not
sure
turtles
with
a
in
innate
geolocation
are
easily
transferred
or
moved.
And
so
I'm
wondering
understanding
that
aspect.
R
P
Yeah,
well,
we
haven't
seen
any
of
the
research
from
the
proponents,
so
I
I
can't
comment
and
obviously
you've
indicated
you
haven't
been
able
to
see
it
either.
So
I'm
hoping
they're
as
diligent
as
you
are
after
these
10
years
that
you
put
in
because
it's
a
phenomenal
report.
It's
it's
it's
definitely
light
reading.
H
Thank
you,
your
worship
and
thank
you
very
much
for
your
presentation
and
giving
us
these
very
detailed
answers.
It's
helping
us
a
lot
learn
about
this
process.
I
have
a
question
for
dr
reimer
and
dr
reimer.
You
used
the
examples
about
the
pcbs
being
removed
in
the
hudson
river
or
rocky
bay
in
victoria
bc.
I'm
in
our
situation
we're
dealing
more
with
heavy
metals
correct
and
so
are
the
characteristics
of
bcbs
or
what's
being
removed
in
rocky
bay.
Are
they
similar
to
the
heavy
metals
that
we're
seeing
here.
Q
There's
quite
a
mixture
of
contaminants
in
the
inner
harbor
and
you're
right
some
deal
with
things
like
chromium
and
lead.
There
are
some
pcbs,
but
certainly
not
they're,
not
the
major
contaminant
as
they
were
in
hudson
river,
but
in
terms
of
their
fact
that
they
are
adhering
to
sediment
particles
that
that
fact
they're
less
water
soluble.
This
is
the
the
type
of
and
form
of
chromium.
That's
in
the
sediments
is
not
as
not
water
soluble,
so
it's
attached
to
the
sediments.
Q
They
are
behaving
in
similar
ways
in
terms
of
the
the
the
that
you
that
would
they
could
they
could
be
dredged
or
remediated
in
the
same
approach.
I
guess
that's
what
I'm
trying
to
get
at?
Yes,
they're
different
chemicals,
but
they
have
that
characteristic
in
common
and
that
will
in
fact
facilitate
the
the
remediation
process.
H
Q
Sure
I
mean
when
you
think
about
how
sediments
at
the
bottom
of
a
river
or
lake
are
formed,
it's
from
material
that
runs
off
from
the
land,
so
soil
particles,
you
know,
leaves
and
stuff
all
kinds
of
things
that
run
into
the
body
of
water
and
they
begin
to
accumulate
and
decay
on
the
bottom
of
the
the
water
body.
Of
course,
when
they
do
so,
they
they
trap
water
as
well.
Q
So
as
you
go,
if
you
were
to
take
a
tube
and
push
it
vertically
into
those
sediments,
you
would
collect
mud
that
you
know
goes
at
the
top
goes
to
the
bottom
and,
depending
how
far
you
push
you'd
find
that
there
would
be
water
still
in
between
those
sediment
particles
less
at
depth
than
at
the
surface,
because
it
gets
pressure,
would
push
it
upwards,
and
so
you
would
have
still
bits
of
water
particles.
So
that's
called
pore
water,
the
pores
between
the
actual
sediment
particles
themselves.
Q
So
one
of
the
things
we
looked
at
was:
are
there
chemicals
in
the
sediments
that
are
dissolving
into
that
pore
water,
because
that
would
be
quite
difficult
to
remediate,
because
when
you
were
to
restart
to
remove
the
particles,
the
pore
water
escapes
and
if
the
chemicals
were
dissolved
in
that
poor
water?
That
is
very
difficult
to
capture
and
could
cause
problems.
But
that's
not
the
issue.
The
the
chemicals
are
largely
attached
almost
entirely
attached
to
the
sediment
particles
themselves.
Q
So
that
means
that
the
the
mass
amount
of
contaminant
is
attached
to
a
solid
object
not
into
dissolved
into
the
water,
the
the
so-called
pore
water.
So
it's
a
it's
a
mass
balance
issue,
there's
far
more
massive
contaminant
attached
to
the
particles
than
dissolved
in
those
little
tiny,
pores
of
water.
That's
trapped
within
the
sediments
themselves,.
Q
I'd
be
looking
for
turbidity.
Are
you
looking
for
sediment
particles
suspended
in
the
water
for
one
thing,
because
because
we
also
note
that
they,
they
don't
dissolve
very
easily
in
water,
but
I
suspect
they
would
also-
and
this
is
the
case
even
though
pcbs
are
very
water-
insoluble-
they
don't
dissolve
very
much
in
water
in
hudson
river
project.
H
H
Okay,
I
think
I
had
another
question
related
to
the
monitoring
oh,
and
to
what
standard
like?
Would
it
be
we'd
be
looking
at
to?
If
you
were
the
lead
project
person
right?
Would
it
be
to
a
drinking
water
standard
or
would
it
be
to
the
standard
for
aquatic
life
are
we
are
we
worried,
like?
I
think
I
heard
you
answer
in
from
previous
and
dr
ling
as
well
saying
that
I
I
don't
have
concerns
with
the
contamination
in
the
river
to
downstream
drinking
water,
so.
Q
Yeah
I
mean
they'd
be
looking
at
standards.
I
can
only
speak
to
the
project
that
I
was
involved
in
where
I
know
that
we
are
looking
at
particulate
matter
with
pcbs,
I'm
talking
about
the
hudson
river,
now
the
amount
of
that
that
would
be
moving
outside
of
any
containment
area
and
also
any
dissolve,
even
though
it's
very
tiny,
tiny
amounts
of
dissolved
stuff.
They
were
concerned
about
drinking
water
that
might
be
taken
from
the
river
downstream,
and
so
they
were
calculating.
Q
If
you
have
a
certain
amount
released
from
a
work
area
of
a
certain
size,
there
is
dilution,
of
course,
because
there's
clean
water.
That's
now
dissolving
further
that
material.
What
would
be
that
number?
That
would
be
pro
not
acceptable
to
a
downstream
location
and
they
had
you
know
various
design
decisions
about
how
far
away,
but
because
here
we
are
looking
at
things
that
are
quite
water
insoluble.
I
think
that
you're
looking
to
make
sure
those
sediment
particles
don't
escape
would
be
one
of
the
principal
things
they
would
be
monitoring
for
tammy.
R
Those
kind
of
standards,
I
think,
I
believe,
are
standard
on
dredging
projects
to
have
performance
standards
that
you
look
at
like
that,
and
I
think,
with
most
with
the
new
dredging
techniques,
they're
pretty
effective,
that
often
dredging
projects,
usually
they
can
maintain
those
standards
if
they
don't
cause
releases.
Thank.
H
You
and
my
final
question
is,
since
we
did
start
to
talk
about
dilution
effects
since
we're
in
a
low
water
response
right
now,
if
that
was
just
issued
by
the
conservation
area
I,
and
with
climate
change
and
our
hotter
summers,
and
right
now,
even
like
the
shipping
on
the
river
for
shipping
is
really
low.
Is
it
true,
then,
that
the
dilution
effect
for
dredging
should
should
like?
We
should
make
sure
for
this
eis?
H
Q
They'll
have
to
have
to
speak
to
all
of
those
issues
when
they're
developing
those
standards,
those
engineering
performance
standards,
are
critical.
They
need
to
look
at
all
facets
of
what
might
be
what
could
it?
What
could
impact
on
them?
I
guess
is
the
the
short
answer.
I
know
they
were
exceptionally
involved.
We
had,
I
chaired
a
12-person
panel
to
develop
those
performance
standards
for
the
hudson
river,
and
so
it
was
a
lot
of
different
expertise
to
come
to
the
table
to
examine
that
question
from
many
different
angles.
H
N
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson
through
you,
thank
you
for
the
excellent
presentation
and
what
perhaps
might
be
a
record
for
a
non-staff
briefing
to
counsel.
So
this
is
great.
I
only
have
one
question
and
it's
actually
about
performance
standards,
so
it
comes
at
a
good
time.
Perhaps
dr
reimer,
when
we
talk
about
performance
standards,
are
we
limited
to
ecological
considerations
like
we've
spent
the
last
two
hours
talking
about,
or
are
there
other
things
that
a
project
like
this
should
take
into
account
from
your
from
your
experience
at
the
hudson
river
or
elsewhere?.
Q
I
I
think
I
mentioned
the
quality
of
life
standards.
I
think
those
are
important
too.
I
mean
the
hudson
river.
Is
you
know
narrower
most
in
most
sections
of
the
river
than
the
inner
harbor?
Well,
probably
in
all
sections,
but
it
is
wider
and
narrow,
but
it
was
heavily
populated.
It
is
a
heavily
populated
river,
with
businesses
and
homes
and
and
such
along
the
shoreline.
So
they
really
looked
at
how
long
a
day
should
a
dredging
day
be,
would
the
lights
and
the
noise
from
the
dredging
facilities
impact
on
the
local
community?
Q
How
would
the
dredging
activities
impact
on
local
businesses?
So
those
are
all
considerations.
I
think
that
that
go
into
the
the
development
of
a
successful
project
so
that
you
get
the
community
buy-in.
I
mean
community
members
need
to
express
their
concerns
and
they
need
to
be
addressed,
and
I
think
I
think
that's
the
most
important
message
I
hope
we're
giving
today
is
that
this
can
be
done
without
being
there
being
a
catastrophe,
it
can
be
done
to
make
people
comfortable
it
can
be
done
to
in
with
a
minimum
of
disruption.
A
T
L
A
A
So
first
moved
by
mayor,
patterson
seconded
by
deputy
mayor
neal,
the
sincere
condolences
of
kingston
city
council
will
be
extended
to
kelly
horbay
executive
assistant,
the
commissioner
of
transportation
and
public
works.
The
passing
of
her
father,
frank,
carnegie.
On
june
23
2021
frank
joined
the
canadian
armed
forces
at
age
17
and
served
for
35
years
a
dedicated
community
servant.
He
thrived
on
mission
for
others.
Our
thoughts
are
with
kelly,
her
family
and
friends.
A
You
know
survived
by
his
wife
and
their
sons,
and
our
thoughts
are
with
them
during
this
difficult
time
and
then
finally,
moved
by
mayor
patterson
second
by
council,
kylie,
that
the
sincere
congratulations
of
kingston
city
council
be
extended
to
councillor
mary,
rita
holland,
the
completion
of
her
phd
in
kinesiology
and
health
studies.
At
queen's
university
last
month,
cancer
holland
successfully
defended
her
doctoral
thesis
examining
the
role
of
family
caregivers
in
world
new
brunswick.
Congratulations,
dr
hollow!
A
L
A
Please,
okay,
seeing
no
other
separations
we'll
deal
with
the
balance
of
the
clauses.
So
first
clause,
1,
2021
city
of
kingston
arts
fund,
grant
recommendations
cause
number
two
word
of
contract
city
hall,
stairwell
equipment,
relocation
plus
number
four
special
occasion:
permit
love
kingston
marketplace
sundays
in
court
plus
number
six
community
investment
fund,
2021
funding
recommendations,
road
safety
enhancements
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that's
care;
okay,
flipping
back
then,
to
clause
3,
review
of
council
remuneration
for
the
2022
2022-2026
term
creation
of
a
citizen
committee
to
review
council
remuneration,
pastor,
chappelle.
P
Thank
you,
your
worship.
I
found
this
an
interesting
approach.
Having
a
citizens
committee,
I
was
hoping
that
the
the
clerk
might
be
able
to
walk
me
through
this
as
it
addresses
you
know,
I
guess
the
the
remuneration
for
all
potential
counselors
in
the
future,
and
I
I
think
a
little
more
discussion
needs
to
happen
than
simply
this.
This
brief
report,
I
I
don't
necessarily
understand
why
this
can't
be
like
I
like
to
understand
the
structure
and
maybe
I'll
have
some
additional
questions.
T
T
It's
really
an
independent
process
whereby
it's
really
community
driven
and
it
allows
the
community
to
maintain
autonomy
as
they
review
the
remuneration
provided
to
members
of
council.
It's
been
a
successful
process
over
the
last
number
of
years,
it's
supported
by
both
the
clerk's
department
and
the
human
resources
and
organization
department.
T
What
we
found
in
the
past
is
that
this
diverse
group
is
able
to
work
with
us
to
take
a
look
at
our
competitors
and
to
take
a
look
at
other
things
that
we
think
are
important
for
this
exercise.
We're
also
going
to
take
a
look
at
the
possible
support
that
can
be
provided
to
members
of
council
to
assist
them
to
do
their
work.
T
So
our
goal
is
to
have
the
recommendation
approved
this
evening,
start
with
the
targeted,
diverse
recruitment,
make
the
appointments,
which
will
be
pointed
out
solely
for
ratification
and
start
the
process
to
get
the
work
undertaken
prior
to
the
next
election.
With
our
goal
being
of
having
a
report
to
council
a
final
report
in
like
2
4,
20
21.,.
P
Thank
you.
Thank
you
for
the
clarity.
I
do
have
one
question
and
you
you
referenced
it
and
it's
something
that
I
know
has
has
been
an
issue
for
this
council
and
it's
been
more
complex
with
with
covid
and
other
pressures
we're
facing,
and
that
is
the
idea
of
assistance.
Will
you
be
having
consultations
with
current
council
members
as
to
look
at
what
means
might
be
more
of
an
assistance
to
council
to
be
better
prepared
for
some
of
these
long
agenda
nights?
P
T
A
U
U
T
If
you
worship
that
is
correct
just
for
production
purposes,
there
are
five
sectors
that
staff
will
be
engaged
with
in
terms
of
determining
who
their
representative
and
alternatives
would
be.
And
then
this
group,
then,
would
take
a
look
at
the
applications
from
former
members
of
councils
identified
in
the
report,
as
well
as
undertake
a
review
of
applications
that
will
come
in
from
the
two
public
members
who
will
also
form
a
part
of
this
group.
U
T
To
your
worship,
as
indicated
before
the
process
we've
followed,
is
to
identify
five
specific
sectors
within
the
community,
that
being
the
business
community,
the
health
care
community,
the
non-profit
sector,
the
educational
community,
as
well
as
the
organized
labor
community
and
with
the
representatives
that
they
provide
to
us.
When
I
see
us
I'm
talking
about
the
corporation,
they
then
undertake
the
next
step,
which
is
to
populate
the
committee
with
a
former
member
of
council
as
well
as
two
public
representatives
as
indicated
previously.
This
is
one
of
those
committees
that
really
works
independently
of
council.
T
T
There
could
be
survey,
work,
there's
a
number
of
things
that
will
go
into
a
work
plan
for
this
group
to
execute.
As
I
said
before,
one
of
the
issues-
and
I
believe
you
brought
this
issue
of
counselors
with
respect
to
council
support,
and
we
have
heard
you
and
that
will
be
part
of
this
review
as
well.
U
U
So,
for
example,
it
says
the
healthcare
community.
Well,
the
healthcare
community
is
is
rather
vague
and
it
says
university
hospitals
kingston
is
the
is
the
group
that
is
approached
how
many
times
since
2008
has
this
sector
volunteered
a
union
member
as
a
representative
from
the
healthcare
community
which,
as
we
all
know
all
nurses,
are
union
members.
So
what
I'm
really
asking
is
how
many
times
has
a
nurse
been
part
of
this
process
as
volunteered
by
university
hospital's
case.
T
U
T
I
don't
know
if
I
would
agree
with
that
statement.
As
I
said
before,
the
representative
from
the
healthcare
community
from
the
university
hospitals
kingston,
I'm
unable
to
advise
you
whether
or
not
that's
a
union
or
non-union
position,
as
you
question
me
on
so
taking
a
look
at
just
what
you
said
there
with
respect
to
the
80
20
split,
I'm
saying
that
that
could
be
possible,
but
I
wouldn't
stand
behind
that
at
this
point.
A
U
A
U
T
To
your
worship,
this
is
a
process
which
we
have
utilized
throughout
my
tenure
since
2008,
which
I
believe
has
been
successful
with
respect
to
ensuring
that
the
council
remuneration
is
at
the
level
which
is
competitive
with
our
competitors
or
our
comparators.
I
should
say
at
the
same
time
we've
taken
a
look
at
other
opportunities
for
engagement,
reach
with
respect
to
trying
to
determine
the
workload
members
of
cancer,
whether
it's
truly
reflective
and
remuneration
that
is
attached.
So
we
feel
that
this
process
works.
T
It's
processed
that
other
municipalities
have
started
to
follow
and
it's
the
council
could
decide
whether
or
not
they
want
this
process
to
continue
we're
as
staff
bringing
the
recommendation
forward.
The
council
is
an
opinion
that
they
don't
want
to
follow.
The
staff
recommendation
council
is
free
to
do
as
they
choose.
U
Thank
you.
I
have
one
final
question
and
I
I
mean
no
disrespect,
mr
clerk.
My
questions
regarding
union
representation
are
legitimate
and
are
simply
to
highlight
the
fact
that
those
making
this
recommendation
are
not
union
members
now.
My
final
question
has
nothing
to
do
with
that.
My
final
question.
U
T
G
I
have
to
say
it
was
always
left
up
to
council
and,
quite
frankly,
I
don't
think
that
that's
the
right
way
to
go
about
it.
What
happened
then,
was
some
people
were
concerned
about
upcoming
election
or
their
electability,
and
they
ended
up
voting
no
to
the
recommendation,
even
though
they
they
would
count
the
vote
and
then
vote
no
to
please
some
of
their
constituents,
but
afterwards
would
say
boy,
I'm
glad
that
passed
and-
and
that
I
think,
is
what
we
want
to
avoid.
G
G
I
would
love
to
see
more
labor
representatives
on
there
as
well
or
people
with
lived
experience
on
there
as
well,
and
that's
something
I
mean
councillor
stroud
was
perfectly
within
his
rights
to
bring
that
question
those
questions
forward.
So,
but
I
think
the
system
itself
is
a
good
system
and
we
shouldn't
abandon
it.
Thank
you.
K
You're
worshiping
through
you,
I
know
that
the
previous
speaker
mentioned,
like
a
wonderful
system
and,
ultimately,
I
believe
question
is
that
we
ultimately
approve
whatever
comes
out
of
the
recommendation
from
this
working
group
or
whatever
you
want
to
call
it
so
really.
At
the
end
of
the
day,
I've
already
had
feedback
from
multiple
constituents
that,
although
it's
not
us
that
actually
decided.
K
I
do
agree
with
it
maintaining
this
sort
of
third-party
distance
separation
from
us.
However,
I
do
have
a
question
to
staff
is
right
now
we're
just
simply
talking
about
rememberation
and
I've.
Looked
at
multiple
other
municipalities,
the
whole
population
greater
than
ours
that
actually
have
fewer
councillors
representing
the
population.
T
So
it's
through
your
worship,
that's
a
great
question
counselor.
That
would
be
a
slightly
different
process
with
respect
to
this
talking
at
reducing
the
number
of
counselors
changing
the
world
boundaries,
there's
a
specific
process
under
the
legislation
that
goes
about
a
little
late
in
the
game
to
be
talking
about
the
elections
at
large,
as
well
as
the
reduction
of
counselors.
So,
as
I
said
before,
that
is
something
that
is
independent
of
this.
It's
not
something
that.
K
K
K
Is
there
a
possibility
to,
I
guess,
seek
a
greater
balance,
and
this
is
in
reference
to
counselor
strength.
Concern
is
to
seek
a
greater
balance
amongst
kind
of
working
class
versus
managerial
class,
to
sort
of
understand
the
struggles
that
counselors
face
that
have,
I
guess,
multiple
jobs
or
maybe
from
union
versus
managerial
positions.
Just
to
accret
achieve,
I
guess,
a
a
greater
sort
of
representation
of
you
know
the
age
full
role
that
we
play
within
the
community
is
that
something
we
can
strive
towards
with
the
composition
in
the
future.
T
For
you,
mr
mitt,
that
is
what's
been
a
great
question.
That
is
something
we
could
strive
for
in
the
future.
I
know
that,
through
our
recruitment,
we're
taking
a
look
at
this
with
an
edi
lens
to
ensure
that
we've
got
our
people
in
place
with
the
right
skills
to
be
able
to
undertake
reviews.
So
we'll
take
all
those
comments
into
advancement,
and
we
hope
that
we
will
get
a
good
community
that
will
be
able
to
provide
some
strong
recommendations
for
announcements.
Consideration
in
2,
4,
2021.
A
N
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson
through
you
quickly,
similar
to
counselor
bowman's
questions.
Actually,
mr
clark,
could
we
just
have
a
footnote
in
the
report
or
some
clear
indication
of
what
comparative
comparator
municipalities
have
full-time
counselors
know
what
we're
talking
about,
compare
apples
to
apples
when
we,
when
we
look
at
those
numbers.
A
V
Thank
you
through
you,
mr
mayor.
So
yes,
so
this
this
report
is
before
council
really
just
as
a
housekeeping
item
the
bylaw.
The
original
bylaw
that
we're
asking
to
be
repealed
was
done
back
in
2000
before
some
major
changes
to
the
municipal
act
and
at
that
time
it
did
require
a
by-law
listing
reserve
funds
that
had
previously
been
approved
by
council,
and
we
also
had
to
have
council
approval
in
order
to
consolidate
our
funds
for
investment
purposes.
V
However,
what
did
remain
is
that
council
still
has
to
approve
whenever
we
are
putting
funds
into
a
reserve
fund
or
when
we're
taking
funds
out,
and
so
we
don't
have
to
have
this
separate
bylaw
anymore,
and
the
municipal
act
does
allow
for
us
now
to
be
able
to
consolidate
our
funds
for
investment
purposes,
but
counselor
doherty.
Just
to
assure
you,
the
reporting
will
still
stay
the
same.
V
This
consolidation
is
really
just
for
investment
purposes
and
it
allows
us
to
be
able
to
have
a
bigger
pool
of
monies,
particularly
for
our
longer
term
investments,
and
that
opens
up
some
of
our
better
investment
opportunities.
We'll
still
provide
detail
at
budget
time
and
as
part
of
the
audited
financial
statements.
You'll
still
see
all
the
detailed
reserve
funds
and
the
balances
that
are
in
them
and
and
going
forward.
V
You'll
also
still
have
the
opportunity
to
approve
when
monies
are
going
in,
particularly
at
budget
time,
we
would,
we
would
have
those
as
part
of
budget
or
as
separate
council
reports
or
as
part
of
the
fourth
quarter
report.
We
often
are
asking
council
to
approve
monies
to
go
into
reserve
funds
and
also
monies
coming
out.
You'll
also
see
that
as
part
of
our
capital
reports,
we
have
one
on
there
tonight
and
that's
one
of
the
reasons
we
have.
V
D
A
A
A
A
So,
just
before
we
proceed
any
further,
it
is,
it
is
9
28..
We
still
do
have
a
fair
bit
of
work
ahead
of
us
in
the
agenda.
So
if,
if
we
looks
like
we
are
not
going
to
be
able
to
get
through
the
majority
of
this
gender
by
11,
30
or
so
then
my
intention
is
to
to
recess
and
to
reconvene
tomorrow
at
seven,
so
we'll
see
how
things
go,
but
I
just
believe
that
there's
only
only
so
long
any
council
meeting
should
should
go.
So
that's
right
there.
A
N
Thank
you,
mayor,
patterson
and
through
you
and
apologies
to
counselor
neil
councillor
neil.
I
think
you
asked
this
at
the
beginning
of
the
meeting,
but
I'm
wondering
how
the
new
zoning
bylaw
would
apply
to
this
project,
because
tiny
homes
are
something
that
will
be
explicitly
complicated
as
we've
seen
that
planning
committee
in
the
last
few
meetings
that
we've.
A
B
A
W
Thank
you
answer
you,
I'm
not
sure.
If
that's
a
good
thing
or
a
bad
thing
that
I'm
not
frozen
so,
and
I
I
I
do
apologize
because
I
am
not
the
expert
on
on
planning,
I
I
do
know
that
there
are
enough
to
put
some
other
planning
staff
on
the
spot.
Just
improvising
here
I
know
director
park
is
on
the
call
that,
hopefully,
is
not
frozen
at
the
time
she
can
chime
in.
A
N
A
C
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson,
so
the
first
question
I
I
did
hear
from
the
delegation
from
the
perspective
of
habitat
for
humanity,
on
what
the
potential
might
be
for
the
the
arrangement
for
maintenance
on
the
site
or
any
any
kind
of
relationship
with
the
city.
I
guess
related
to
you
know
just
how
this
is
all
going
to
work
out
as
far
as
having
the
city
and
then
the
partner
and
the
rental
and
the
the
issue
of
potential
overall
maintenance.
C
So
I
would
like
to
hear
from
city
staff
as
well,
because
I
know
we
do.
We
have
similar
situations,
for
example
kingston
frontenac
housing
corporation,
where
we
are,
we
are
in
a
situation
working
in
partnership
with
a
non-profit
to
provide
housing
and
then
that
property
is
owned
by
an
organization,
a
non-profit
that
is
that,
then,
is
sort
of
working.
I
guess
working
with
the
city
on
those
property
standards
issues,
so
this
is
to
address
some
concerns
from
residents
about
potential
property
standards,
issues
on
the
site,
so
any
information
that
would
be
great.
W
Thank
you,
and
through
you
thanks
for
that
question,
so
so
yes,
the
delegation
did
address
this
briefly
and
also
alluded
to
the
fact
that,
obviously,
this
is
a
first
step.
There's
still
a
lot
of
engagement
and
and
work
that
needs
to
be
done
to
you
know
finalize
some
of
those
additional
partnerships,
and
the
one
thing
that
I
will
say
is:
this
is
not
a
an
rgi
project.
This
is
a
new
pilot
and
and
really
that
relationship
between
the
tenants
and
the
support
services
will
be
crucial.
W
So
we
will
be
very
closely
connected,
as
as
the
corporation
housing
and
social
services
department
to
create
those
relationships
and
to
really
make
sure
that
tenants
are
are
part
of
potential.
You
know
maintenance
and
property.
You
know
kind
of
hands-on
kind
of
participation
which
which
would
potentially
reduce
some
of
those
concerns.
But
again
I
think
we
are
at
a
stage
that
there's
still
a
lot
of
engagement
and
planning.
W
You
know
that
we
that
we
have
to
initiate
or
further
kind
of
communicate
and
discuss
with
habitats
and
other
partners,
so
we
obviously
again
have
opportunities
to
bring
in
partners
that
also
provide
services
at
the
veto
heights
community
center.
So
we're
very
aware
of
those
concerns
and
they
certainly
will
be
part
of
coming
up
with
a
I
guess,
programming
that
would
prevent
that
from
happening.
And
again
we
do
have
as
a
city
that
ability
as
well
to
work
with
habitat
through
our
agreements
as
well.
C
Okay
thanks
very
much
and
three
mayor
patterson.
The
next
question
is
regarding
the
timeline,
and
I
know
that
when
in
initial
conversations
with
staff
on
this
project,
it
sounds
like
it
could
move
quite
quickly
and,
of
course,
there's
the
planning
process,
but
the
to
date
I
haven't
heard
from
residents.
C
When
we
had
the
consultations
with
community
at
that
time,
people
were
quite
concerned
about
potential
for
density
in
the
area,
and
this
is
obviously
not
not
bad.
It's
not
it
and
it's
a
different
p.
It's
one
section
of
the
property,
but
just
sort
of
I'm
just
going
on
those
conversations
for
my
feedback
tonight
because,
as
I
said,
I
haven't
heard
a
lot.
C
But
I'm
concerned
that
I
haven't
heard
a
lot
because
when
we
had
those
engagement
exercises
before
there
was,
there
were
quite
a
number
of
community
members
who
want
who
had
input
on
the
potential
development
of
that
site.
So,
given
the
type,
the
potential
for
a
tight
sort
of
turnaround
and
the
fact
that
we've
been
in
summer
and
people
are
not
as
focused
on
these
kinds
of
issues
as
they
might
be
another
time
of
the
year.
A
W
I'm
happy
for
you
to
kick
it
off
on
the
non-planning
specific
engagements.
There
certainly
is
also
the
as
a
next
step,
because
we
first
obviously
wanted
to
go
to
council
to
to
present
this
pilot
to
youtube
before
we
would
move
forward
and
and
council.
Sorry
director
park
can
speak
to
the
planning
specific
next
steps,
because
there
will
be
further
planning
approvals
as,
as
you
mentioned,
consider
holland,
but
there
also
will
be
kind
of
in
line
with
the
beetle
heights
regeneration
consultation.
W
So
that's
a
very
long,
I
guess
introduction
to
say:
yes,
we
we
will,
as
part
of
the
next
step,
also
create
a
community
engagement
process
and
really
want
to
work
with
the
neighbors
beyond
the
planning.
You
know
kind
of
the
regulatory
planning
pieces
to
make
sure
that
this
is.
You
know
a
community
that
within
a
community
and
is
supported
and
fits
within
the
community.
A
C
I
think
that
all
of
that
really
demonstrates
that
there's
certainly
a
desire
and
and
a
need
for
the
kind
of
housing
that's
being
proposed,
one
other
one.
You
know
upon
upon
first
reading
this,
of
course
it's
the
fact
that
this
model
is
tied
to
our
housing.
Wait
list
is
really
what
what
jumps
out
as
the
most
the
most
beneficial
part
of
this
potential
project,
because
we
are
constantly
looking
for
ways
to
move
those
people
from
the
list
into
quality,
affordable
housing.
This
provides
a
way
to
do
that.
C
I
mean
it's
a
small,
a
small
ish
number,
but
it's,
I
think
it
does
the
the
fact
that
it
provides
a
new
housing
model
for
people
on
that
wait
list
is
really
important,
because
many
of
them
perhaps
have
different
needs
and
might
not
be
able
to.
Even
when
housing
is
offered,
it
might
not
be
the
most
appropriate
kind.
It
might
not
be
the
kind
of
housing
they
want.
C
So,
rather
than
rather
than
have
the
units
be
designated
for,
you
know
a
long
period
of
time
to
an
individual
this.
This
does
seem
to
serve
the
needs
of
people
who,
who
may
may
go
and
may
stay
there
for
long
periods
of
time,
and
that
would
be
wonderful,
but
some
may
not
so
yeah.
Overall,
I
think
the
the
style
of
this
project
is.
It
looks
really
promising
and,
of
course,
I'll
be
following
all
the
engagement
stuff
really
closely
and
and
bringing
forward
any
concerns.
I
hear
from
the
residents
thanks
very
much.
X
Thank
you
and
through
your
worship,
I
I'm
I'm
gonna
support
this
project.
I
think
it's
a
great
an
important
initiative,
but
I
I
am
a
little
surprised
at
the
cost,
so
I'm
looking
at
basically
around
nine
hundred
thousand
dollars
the
city
is
putting
into
the
project
material
cost
would
be.
On
top
of
that,
can
you
give
me
an,
or
can
someone
give
us
an
estimate
on
on
what
the
individual
costs
of
these
tiny
houses
will
be?
X
A
Y
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mr
mayor,
I
apologize.
I
had
to
log
in
from
my
phone.
The
power
went
out,
so
thank
you
for
the
question
counter
hill.
So
the
the
cost
of
construction
itself
is
about
80,
000
per
tiny
home.
The
additional
costs
are
identified
in
the
staff
report
are
actually
costs
that
are
related
to
to
fees
that
are
applicable
to
all
construction.
So
that
would
be
that
would
include
you
know,
development
charges
which
I
think
are
outlined
in
there,
the
consultant
fees
etc.
Y
So
those
tend
to
actually,
you
know,
be
quite
expensive
for
any
any
development,
so
that
those
are,
in
addition,
obviously
to
the
eighty
thousand
dollars
per
unit,
which
is,
is
actually
quite
reasonable.
At
eighty
thousand,
most
units
that
we've
been
working
with
in
the
last
I'm
gonna
say
a
couple
of
years,
at
least
for
affordable
housing
have
been
in
the
range
of
150
000
per
unit
for
a
one-bedroom
apartment.
X
P
So
I
was
just
a
little
concerned
when
I
heard
about
the
idea
of
this
being
rental
units,
and
so
please
provide
me
the
clarity
that
these
would
be
ideally
for
a
person
to
have
a
long-term
commitment
out
of
a
tiny
home.
Or
is
this
looking
to
be
a
rotational
rental
unit
that
I
really
can
engage
that
this
sort
of
clarity
would
be
great.
A
W
Sorry,
of
course,
that
happens
through
you,
I'm
happy
to
start
answering
that
question.
So,
first
of
all,
counselor
chapelle,
the
initial
as
a
dedication
mentioned.
The
initial
intent
is
this
to
be
the
first
state
units
to
be
rentals,
but
there
is
the
potential
to
also
move
them
into
home
ownership
along
the
along
the
line.
So
there's
definitely
that
opportunity
and
yes,
the
clients
that
would
come
that
would
move
into
this.
W
This
project,
they're
their
kind
of
rent,
is
based
on
25
of
their
income
and
the
intent
is
also
to
to
move
them
ideally
up
into
income,
so
they
would
move
along
in
the
housing
continuum
and
and
have
some
rotation
in
this
project.
So,
of
course
again
we
would
have
to.
We
are
working
with
partners
around.
You
know:
skills
developments,
foods.
W
You
know,
services,
there's
a
lot
of
different
kind
of
potential,
social
and
community
partnerships
that
we
that
we
have
some
had
some
preliminary
conversations
with
that
we
want
to
further
establish
to
really
support
people
in
that
journey.
But,
as
the
delegation
mentioned,
habitat
is
very
familiar
with
that
process
and
moving
people.
You
know
along
that
housing
continuum.
W
W
A
N
Thank
you,
mayor
patterson.
Perhaps
staff
could
ask,
or
I
could
ask
staff
a
question
about
the
days
when
I
asked
ms
delsin
the
question
about
when
the
noise
exemption
would
be
warranted.
She
said
that
would
be
posted
on
their
website.
Is
there
any
way
that
we
can
amplify
that?
Just
so,
residents
are
aware-
and
I
know
that
I've
heard
from
some
folks
who
are
wondering
about
this.
Z
Sorry,
I
guess
crazy
weather
right
there
thank
you
and,
as
for
you,
mayor,
patterson
yeah,
we
can
definitely
queens
is
committed
to
put
it
on
their
website
and
they've
also
committed
to
providing
licensing
and
enforcement
the
tournament
schedule
once
they
have
it.
So
once
we
have
that
we
can
post
that
on
our
website
as
well,
so
that
there's
more
visibility.
N
A
P
Z
P
A
A
A
A
S
AA
Yeah
sorry,
thank
you,
mr
mayor,
and
thank
you
council
mclaren.
So,
as
per
the
history
of
the
brownfields
program,
the
community
improvement
plan
there's
no
direct
payment
of
public
funds
to
support
this
development.
The
should
all
should
this
pass
tonight
and
should
the
planning
approvals
approve
the
the
the
tannery
development,
any
money
that
is
paid
to
the
developer,
to
recover
the
cost
of
the
remedy.
A
AA
Yeah,
thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
mayor.
So
the
the
cost
of
the
remediation
would
be
rebated
to
the
developer
through
the
new
incremental
taxes
that
are
fully
paid
on
the
site
once
the
site
is
fully
developed.
So
there's
no
payment
of
public
funds
at
this
time
and
there
is
no
rebating
of
any
of
the
taxes
that
are
paid
on
the
future
development
until
that
development
occurs
and
all
the
taxes
are
paid
on
an
annual
basis.
S
AA
AA
So
the
short
answer.
Yes,
over
the
entire
lifespan
of
the
project.
It
is
a
net
benefit.
It
is
intensification
in
our
downtown
with
condo
and
multi-residential
development,
and
it
is
yes,
the
most
most
expensive
cleanup
we've
had
in
the
brownfields
program
and
we've
had
many
many
projects
and
expensive
cleanups,
but
this
is
a
significant
amount
of
units
and
densification
in
in
the
downtown
and
including
condo
units
and
as
per
the
life
cycle,
study
of
costs
and
infrastructure.
That
council
received
last
meeting,
I
believe,
or
the
meeting
before.
AA
A
So
I'm
just
going
to
to
pause
for
a
moment,
so
I
noticed
that
I
think,
because
of
some
power
outages,
that
there
are
a
couple
of
counselors
that
have
lost
connection
so
right
now
we
do,
we
do
have
quorum,
but
only
just
so.
I
just
wanted
to
note
that
if,
if
we
lose
quorum
or
if
we
lose
power
at
city
hall,
which
is
obviously
where
we're
hosting
this
meeting,
then
we
will
at
that
point
reconvene
at
seven
o'clock
tomorrow.
A
G
Two
very
quick
questions
for
mr
hughes
that
I
should
know
the
answer
to,
but
my
memory
isn't
serving
me
well.
This
was
a
project
that
was
that
was
supposed
to
be
in
four
components
for
divided
into
four
and
in
the
funding
will
be
based
on
each
of
those
four,
the
brownfield
funding
and
what
would
happen
if
the
funding
flows
to
the
developer
and
for
some
reason
he
goes
bankrupt.
AA
I
thank
you
councillor,
neil
and
through
mayor
patterson,
so
the
the
the
funding
is
through
rebates
paid
to
the
owner
of
the
property
based
on
taxes
that
are
paid
so
the
in
the
buildings
don't
get
built.
Each
phase
doesn't
get
built
without
a
record
of
site
condition,
building
permits,
planning
approvals,
all
that
sort
of
thing,
and
you
can't
get
a
record
of
slight
condition
without
the
full
remediation
being
done.
AA
AA
A
E
I
I
I
A
A
I
AA
I
I
I
I've
got
something
okay,
so
I
don't
accept
the
answer
you
gave.
I
know
why
you
gave
it
and
in
the
study
it
indicates
that
for
every
million
dollars
in
tax
revenues,
the
city
rebates
tax
rebate,
nine
hundred
thousand
dollars
back
to
the
developer,
to
pay
for
the
remediation
costs.
That
would
be
correct,
too
right.
L
I
Steven
even
mentioned
on
page
182
of
the
382
pages
we
received
tonight,
it
says
899
000,
but
let's
not
quit.
900
000
out
of
the
million
is
rebated
to
the
developer,
and
then
it
indicates
that
0.35
shortfall
on
annual
gross
taxation
revenues
is
what
is,
is
the
argument
given
there's
not
really
an
argument
there?
The
point
is
this:
nine
hundred
thousand
dollars
per
phase
per
year
for
ten
years
is
nine
million
dollars.
I
I
So
this
is
a
big
deal
so
and
I
I
hope,
council
appreciates
that
it's
a
big
big
deal
and
it's
by
far
as
mr
huckabus
allowed
the
biggest
brownfields
we've
had.
My
argument
was
that
the
last
meeting
in
this
meeting
is
it's
a
bridge
too
far
and
like
I
would
like
in
many
ways
see
developed
and
there's
lots
of
people
might
just
feel
differently.
I
Some
do
some
don't
the,
but
what
I
want
to
do
is
if
we're
going
to
vote
on
this,
we
better
be
very
clear
about
what
we're
doing
45
million
dollars
being
rebated
to
pay
the
developer
back
to
bring
property
up
to
a
greenfield
standard.
That's
what's
going
on,
so
I
don't
know
if
the
clerk
got.
My
previous
email.
I
I
K
Thank
you,
your
questions
for
you
just
to
follow
up
on
this,
and
I
understand
counselor
hutcherson's
concerns
and
speaking
with
so
many
members
of
the
community
on
this
it's
it's
also.
I
mean
we're.
Gonna
have
concerns
regardless
there's
an
opportunity
here,
and
I
don't
think
we
can
just
quickly
push
this.
I
mean
there's
a
reason.
We
created
a
brownfield
program
and
there's
a
reason
why
this
is
such
a
complicated
project.
This
is
something
that
I
can't
remember.
K
If
it
I
remember
the
number
exactly
from
the
like
thirty
eight
hundred
dollars
in
tax
dollars,
that
we
got
from
this
property
currently,
and
I
mean
if
we
had
to
give
that
back
over
10
years
or
even
20
years
to
make
this
work,
I
mean
it's
a
net
gain
in
the
end.
This
will
be
developable
properly
for
the
future.
After
this,
that
will
not
have
contamination
that
really
sits
on
it.
K
So
it's
it's
basically
something
the
city
needs
to
partner
with
a
private
developer,
to
actually
bring
remediation
to
the
site
to
allow
us
to
actually
have
it
as
a
functional
space
within
the
city.
There's
so
much
opportunity
here,
but
there's
such
a
cost
to
basically
you
know
gaining
that
opportunity.
So
I
think
this
is
something
that
staff
is
likely
working
very
hard
on,
as
well
as
any
developer.
K
That
would
take
this
on
is
something
that
needs
to
be
considered
the
realization
that
we
may
not
have
an
opportunity
like
this
before
us
within
this
term
of
council,
and
certainly
maybe
not
even
within
the
next
two
terms
of
council.
So
this
is
a
challenging
development.
It's
always
going
to
be
a
challenging
development
if
we
have
to
spend
money
or
for
go
money
on
this
to
turn
this
into
functional
and
for
the
benefit
of
the
city.
I
think
it's
it's
it's
contingent
on
us
to
actually
really
think
about
what
that
actually
means
going
forward.
K
So,
yes,
will
it
cost
money?
Definitely,
is
there
going
to
be
money
that
we're
going
to
have
to
forgo
100?
That's
never
going
to
change,
and
you
know
what,
if
I
learned
anything
in
my
seven
years
on
council,
it's
that
things
never
get
cheaper
as
we
go
on.
They
never
do
environmental
remediation
environmental
standards,
all
those
things
construction,
they
all
get
more
expensive.
K
What
would
we
have
now,
and
so
I
look
at
this
as
an
opportunity.
Are
there
challenges
100?
Are
we
at
the
stepping
stone
of
this
100
percent,
we're
just
laying
the
foundation
for
what
can
possibly
occur
there?
But
if
we
don't
take
this
necessary
step
years
from
now,
people
will
look
back
on
a
vacant
land
full
of
contamination
and
go.
Why
didn't
that
council?
K
It
won't
likely
be
most
of
us
dealing
with
it.
So
I'm
gonna
support
this.
With
the
caveat
that
I
recognize
there
are
numerous
challenges
and
we're
forgoing
a
lot
of
tax
dollars
to
do
this,
but
with
the
understanding
that
we
are
doing
that
with
a
purpose
of
getting
a
better
product
in
the
end
and
a
functional
space
that
is
currently
not
usable.
K
X
Thank
you,
and
I
agree
with
almost
everything
that
councillor
bowman
said,
except
for
the
one
comment
there
that
we
were
foregoing
a
lot
of
tax
money.
You
know
because-
and
I
I
I
know
his
point-
was-
that
we're
not
foregoing
any
tax
money
because
there's
nothing
on
this
property.
You
know
the
the
to
counselor
hutcheson's
point.
You
know
there
was
one
big
number
that
he
wasn't,
including
in
his
calculation.
That's
the
65
million
dollars
to
remediate
this
property.
X
X
This
is
something
that
has
to
be
addressed
and
we
heard
already
about
the
potential
for
it
to
damage
the
inner
harbor
so
or
continue
to
damage
the
inner
harbor.
So
this
is
an
absolute.
In
my
mind,
this
is
a
no-brainer.
This
is
something
that
really
addresses
a
whole
bunch
of
our
of
our
target
goals
for
the
community:
increased
housing,
hopefully
more,
affordable
housing.
X
You
know
addressing
the
brownfield
issues
and
at
no
cost
at
the
end
of
the
day,
really
to
the
taxpayer,
because
if
we
don't
build
this,
if
we
don't
approve
this
nothing's
going
in
on
that
property
and
we
will
never
realize
any
tax
revenue
from
that
from
that
property,
so
I
wholeheartedly
support
this.
I
think
this
is
the
way
to
go.
I
think
this
is
going
to
be
a
good
example
for
how
we
can
address
some
of
the
other
areas
that
are
needed
remediation.
So
it's
a
big
project.
AA
N
Excellent
okay,
so,
as
I
said,
councilor
hill
has
made
my
points.
One
more
question,
though,
just
to
be
sure,
because
this
is
proposed
to
be
a
four-phase
project,
what
happens
in
terms
of
the
the
tax
revenue
and
in
terms
of
the
environmental
remediation?
If
we
get
to
phase
three,
maybe
I
shouldn't
say
we
here:
if
the
developer
the
proponent
gets
to
phase
three,
should
this
be
passed
and
then
the
project
stalls?
AA
Yes,
I
can
thank
you
counselor
kylie
and
through
you,
mr
mayor
and
I
do
have
other
staff
on
the
call
I
just
I
wanted
to
try
to
get
the
answers
in
because
it's
so
uncertain
with
this
with
this
weather,
but
paul
mcclatchy
has
joined
us.
So
he
might
I
it's
my
answer,
but
counselor
kylie,
the
the
thing
about
the
the
brownfields
program
with
the
city
of
kingston's
community
improvement
plan
is
the
risk
is
all
on
the
developer.
AA
All
the
costs
are
front-ended
and
all
the
risk
to
clean
up
and
to
achieve
all
the
approvals,
all
the
approvals
through
the
province
and
through
the
record
site,
condition
and
then
building
permits
all
the
construction
and
then
paying
taxes,
and
only
after
all,
that
is
done.
Do
the
rebates
start
to
go
back
to
the
developer
and
if
more
work
is
done,
then
the
maximum
allowable?
Then
that's
that's
the
risk
on
the
developer.
The
maximum
allowable
is
this.
AA
Is
this
amount,
and
also
if
the
full
development
doesn't
get
done,
only
the
developments
that
do
get
done
and
the
taxes
get
paid
on?
Those
are
the
ones
that
would
be
rebated.
So
I
don't
know
if
paul
wants
to
add
any
more,
but
I
think
that
addresses
your
account.
Your
your
question,
counselor
kylie,.
A
AB
Yeah,
thank
you
thank
you,
mr
mayor,
and
through
you,
it
does
have.
It
does
have
an
impact
to
the
entire
ecosystem
of
the
inner
harbor.
I
suppose,
but
the
way
land
is
remediated
in
ontario.
Is
it's
done
parcel
by
parcel,
so
a
successful
cleanup
on
phase
one
results
in
a
record
site
condition
for
phase
one
and
so
on
for
phase
two
and
phase
three
and
phase
four.
If
the
developer
gets
successfully
through
phase
one
two
and
three
but
then
let's
say
phase
four
is
unsuccessful.
N
Thank
you,
and
that
anticipates
my
next
and
final
question,
which
is
at
that
point.
If
that
were
to
happen,
it
is
reasonable
to
suggest
that
it
would
be
a
much
lesser
cost
for
the
city
to
remediate
that
portion
of
the
property
than
saying
we're
going
to
do
nothing.
I
guess
this
is
what
council
bone
was
saying,
we're
going
to
do
nothing
now
and
just
let
it
sit.
So,
even
if
that
eventuality
happens,
which
hopefully
it
will
not,
it
means
a
much
less
price
tag
for
us
down.
The
road
is
that
correct.
AB
D
Thank
you
and
through
you,
mr
mayor,
I'm
just
wondering
well.
First
of
all,
I
agree
with
councillor
hill
and
and
counselor
kylie
and
recognize
the
benefit
for
our
community
with
this
project.
But
I
wonder
now,
in
light
of
the
inner
harbor
remediation
project,
perhaps
moving
forward
and
certainly
something
that
we're
looking
at
has
the
does
staff
know
if
the
developer
connected
with
transportation,
canada
at
all,
have
there
been
any
conversations.
AB
Through
you,
mr
mayor,
the
tannery
property
is
adjacent
to
the
proposed
inner
harbor
remediation
area,
so
therefore
they
become
a
stakeholder.
I
I
do
understand
through
conversation
with
transport,
canada
and
with
the
the
tannery
owner
that
they
have
discussed
the
connection
between
the
two
projects.
I
haven't
been
privy
to
that
discussion,
but
I
do
know
discussions
have.
D
D
AB
So
any
time
you
do
that
what
they
call
a
tier,
3
risk
assessment
process
automatically
triggers
a
full
review
by
the
standards
and
development
branch
of
the
ministry
of
environment
and
conservation
and
parks,
so
that'll
be
reviewed
through
them,
and
a
record
site
condition
does
not
get
issued
until
they're
satisfied
with
the
review
and
their
review.
I
can
tell
you
from
personal
experience
is
not
trivial.
A
A
AC
A
K
A
Okay.
So
now
on
clause,
1
subsection,
1,
counselor
boehm
has
asked
for
a
separation
of
so
number
paragraph.
Eight
under
the
clause,
so
paragraph
eight
is
the
applicant
shall
substitute
a
heritage
appropriate
cladding
for
the
proposed
final
claim.
So
first
we'll
do
a
vote
on
everything,
except
for
paragraph
eight.
So
that's
paragraphs
one
through
seven,
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that's
carried.
A
N
AA
A
D
D
Thank
you,
mr
mayor.
I
just
well
the
context
around
this
is
first
of
all,
the
heritage
committee
has
never
approved
final
sighting
before
we
had
major
discussion
around
this
topic,
including
that
all
citing
there
have
been
improvements
in
all
types
of
siding,
including
vinyl,
siding.
However,
heritage
has
never
approved
final
sighting
before,
which
is
why
it's
important
that
in
clause
8,
it
actually
states
that
it
it
would
be
substituted
with
a
heritage
appropriate
cladding.
D
So
it
didn't
say
it
doesn't
specify
wood
or
any
particulars,
cladding
or
siding,
but
that
it
asks
for
the
siding
still
to
be
heritage
appropriate
because
it
is
next
to
a
heritage
property,
and
this
is
why
it
went
through
heritage
committee.
In
the
first
place
yeah.
There
was
a
lot
of
discussion
around
that.
N
Yeah,
thank
you
as
a
follow-up.
That's
what
I
was
also
trying
to
get
my
head
around.
This
is
not
a
heritage
building,
it's
just
because
it's
in
proximity
and
if
that's
the
case,
is
that
normal,
like
I've,
never
been
on
heritage
committee,
so
excuse
my
ignorance,
but
is
that
something
that
committee
even
has
purview
over.
A
A
AA
Sorry,
mr
mayor,
if
I
just
step
in
I
I
did
was
able
to
reach
commissioner
agnew
on
the
phone,
so
I
think
I
can
just
give
a
little
background
again.
I
did
not
attend
the
meeting.
I
just
want
to
give
a
little
background
on
why
I
think,
in
answer
to
the
question
as
to
why
staff
didn't
add
eight
as
their
own,
I
think
eight
was
added
by
the
committee
that
it
is
a
it's
an
out
building
that
is
not
attached
to
the
heritage
building.
AA
It
is
in
a
rural
area
of
new
construction.
This
is
a
new
construction.
A
heritage,
appropriate
cladding,
would
be
a
nice
to
have,
but
it
is
not
essential.
It
is
not
required
in
in
any
policy
is
what
I
understood
from
a
quick
discussion
I
have
with
ms
agnew.
While
I
was
trying
to
listen
to
counselor,
doherty
and
the
other
here,
but
I
believe
those
just
to
answer
that
question.
I
believe
those
are
true
statements
of
why
staff
had
made
the
recommendation.
They
did.
K
Year,
we're
shipping
three
yeah.
I
just
wanted
to
provide
a
little
bit
more
comment
based
on
what
I
heard
from
the
residents,
and
essentially
it
was
that,
ultimately,
they
want
to
do
what's
right
here
to
maintain
the
heritage
aspect
of
the
property.
However,
the
the
the
ambiguity
that
exists
within
the
heritage
recommendation
of
number
eight
was
they.
They
sought
clarification
and
nobody
was
really
able
to
give
it.
K
There
seemed
to
be
this
large
debate
on
you
know
what
was
allowed,
what
wasn't
allowed-
and
it
just
seemed
to
put
them
in
an
untenable
situation
of
not
really
knowing
what
they
could
actually
do
and
after
seeking
further
clarification,
they
were
unable
to
actually
understand
what
they
were
actually
allowed
to
use
on
an
out
building.
So
they
obviously
I
mean
you
saw
the
delegation
this
evening.
They
obviously
want
to
do
what's
right
for
that
heritage
property,
but
at
the
same
time,
from
up
to
20
meters
away.
K
I
I
would
tell
anyone
to
decide
for
the
difference
between
wood
batten
and
it's
kind
of
it's
almost
essentially
like
we're
asking
him
to
spend
three
times
the
amount
of
money
and
short
of
somebody.
Trespassing
on
the
property
they're
not
really
going
to
be
able
to
actually
understand
the
difference
between
it
and
vinyl.
K
The
heritage
committee
may
come
back
and
say:
oh
yeah,
we've
explored
it
and
we'll
totally
allow
that.
But
that
would
leave
the
residents
that
I
represent
sort
of
already
out
to
launch.
So
in
that
instance,
I
would
ask
council
in
this
instance,
it
seems.
Staff
also
were
sort
of
not
really
sure
on
this.
K
It's
it's
not
this
outfit
to
make
sure,
and
one
of
the
main
facets
that
I've
always
held
here
in
my
heart
is
that
non-heritage
buildings
should
not
attempt
to
replicate
heritage
buildings,
so
I
I
think
that
they
need
to
be
there
to
reflect
them
and,
to
you
know,
basically
elevate
them,
but
not
try
to
be
them.
So
I
mean
keep
that
in
mind
when
you
vote
tonight.
K
I
would
ask
people
to
to
recognize
the
fact
that
from
the
road
nobody's
gonna
know
any
difference,
but
if
it's
three
times
to
four
times
the
cost
and
more
you
know,
I
guess
more
susceptible
to
to
raw
and
insect
infestation
than
what
are
we
really
asking
of
the
residents
in
this.
So
that's
all
I
have
to
say
on
that,
and
I
hope
council
will
support
my
residents
and
myself
and
importing
economic
system
recognizing
that
you
want
to
do
the
right
thing
here.
A
A
A
So
so
the
answer
sorry,
can
we
do
the
vote
one
more
time
because
I'm
used
to
announcing
who's
in
the
minority,
so
we
just
did
that
one
more
time,
all
those
in
favor,
okay,
so
councillor,
doherty,
david
o'neill,
council,
mclaren
and
councillor
holland
in
the
minority
on
that?
Okay,
very
good.
So
that's
everything
with
report
number
66
report
number
67
from
the
arts,
recreation,
community
policies.
B
A
Okay,
so
there
are
two
clauses.
The
first
is
the
report
received
from
the
arts
advisory
committee
with
appointments
to
the
art
places
working
group
and
the
appointments
to
the
mayor's
arts
awards
working
group.
The
senate
is
report
received
from
the
housing
and
homelessness
advisory
committee
with
the
housing
and
homelessness
advisory
committee,
2020
report
card
and
appointments
to
the
housing
and
homelessness
review
working
group.
A
D
I
want
to
just
make
a
comment
and
then
ask
a
question.
The
first
comment
is
I
want
to
thank
staff
for
all
the
hard
work.
That's
gone
into
this
study
and
and
the
report
in
front
of
us
it's
very
detailed.
It
really
gives
council
a
clear
understanding
of
all
the
all
the
options
in
front
of
us.
The
question,
though,
is
that
in
our
ertp
meeting
we
did
discuss
the
need
for
consultation
with
the
community,
including
schools,
before
the
introduction
of
any
bollards
and
any
traffic
calming
measures.
A
AD
Thank
you,
mr
mayor,
and
through
you,
I'm
joined
also
tonight
by
matt
hassan,
the
manager
of
transportation
policy
and
programs
who
who
worked
extensively
on
this.
So
to
answer
your
question,
councillor
doherty,
I
think
the
the
consultation
aspects
of
of
of
any
work
that
we
do
in
transportation.
We
want
to
make
sure
that
residents
stakeholders
any
anyone
who
has
an
interest
in
the
work.
AD
That's
being
done,
you
know,
has
that
information
access
to
the
information
and
the
ability
to
answer
questions
so
certainly
the
way
sharing
information
about
what
is
planned
as
part
of
any
traffic
content
traffic
calming
implementation
would
would
be
part
of
what
is
done
under
this
program,
so
that
would
include
sharing
information
with
residents
in
the
areas
but
also
reaching
out
to
stakeholders,
school
groups,
schools
and
others.
That
may
be
interested.
AD
Through
you,
mr
yes,
so
the
intent
is
that
that
information
would
all
be
shared
ahead
of
time
and
and
then
certainly
once
the
implementation
is
also
completed.
That
you
know,
staff
are
are
available
to
answer
questions
and
address
any
concerns
that
arise.
You
know
from
from
anyone
who
who
has
anything
that
they
would
like
to
speak
on
great
thanks.
K
K
K
So
with
that
being
said,
I'm
not
as
concerned
about
that
one
sort
of
road
being
picked.
I
guess
in
this
case
it's
kind
of
the
you
don't
want
to
over
promise
and
under
deliver.
So
in
this
case,
what
it
is
is
counselors
will
get
their
sort
of
one
street
to
recommend
based
on
community
feedback,
but
there's
also
many
other
mechanisms
for
the
community
to
play
into
this,
and
I
think
that's
the
most
important
takeaway
from
this
is
that
with
this
policy
it's
really
community
driven
and
as
counselors.
K
We
know
that
you
know
we
get
so
many
complaints
and
really
it
needs
to
be
driven
from
the
community,
because,
if
we're
going
to
take
anecdotal
reports,
it
needs
to
be
based
on
numbers.
It
needs
to
be
based
on
feedback,
it
needs
to
be
based
on
experience
and
we
are
only
just
one
counselor,
for
you
know
each
district,
of
course,
the
mayor
at
the
end
of
the
day.
So
it's
not
really
up
to
us
to
pick
winners
and
losers
at
the
end
of
the
day.
K
K
So
if
this
is
something
that
passes,
then
I
will
move
this
motion
with
the
the
mayor
as
a
second
next
council
meeting
in
august
and
whereas,
if
council
approved
the
traffic
common
policy
and
guidelines
that
it's
meeting
held
on
july,
30
2021
and
whereas
further
support
to
further
support
the
proposed
traffic
common
policy
would
be
beneficial
to
the
entire
community.
Therefore,
be
it
result
that
staff
be
directed
to
incorporate
funds
into
the
2022
budget,
submission
to
purchase
five
additional
driver
feedback
science
to
respond
to
speeding
concerns
in
school
zones
and
neighborhoods.
K
So
this
is
feedback.
I've
heard
directly
from
constituents
and
it's
a
request
directly
from
residents,
and
they
do
feel
those
science
make
a
difference,
and
what
this
does
is
just
as
a
little
bit
more
money
to
actually
allow
additional
signs
to
be
put
in
place
to
allow
the
community
to
actually
see
that
their
complaints
and
their
recommendations
do
actually
result
in
real
world
change.
At
the
end
of
the
day.
K
Now,
of
course,
obviously,
once
those
signs
have
been
there
for
two
years,
they
do
need
to
be
moved
as
people
to
become
kind
of
number
one,
but
this
would
give
us
more
science
to
place
around
the
city
to
actually
make
people
more
cognizant
and
aware
of
the
speed
that
they're
going
in
certain
areas
and
allow
us
to
buy
time
to
actually
adapt
true
holistic
traffic
common
policies
which
are
not
just
an
ad
hoc
approach.
They
are
a
true
sort
of
strategic
approach
to
traffic
and
better
road
designs
going
forward.
A
Thank
you.
I
have
a
couple
of
other
speakers
on
my
list.
It
is
1041.
that
looks
as
though
this
is
the
last
substantive
piece
on
her
agenda.
So,
given
that
I
will
ask
for
a
motion
to
extend
the
meeting
to
finish
the
agenda
moved
by
concert
already,
second,
and
by
counselor
hill,
all
those
in
favor
opposed
and
that's
carried
okay.
So
next
on,
my
list
is
counselor
hunch.
I
I
The
safety
measures
using
bowlers
at
the
corner
of
barry
and
johnson,
which
is
right
on
the
edge
of
my
district,
and
I
think
people
didn't
know
who
to
complain
to
so
I'm
just
wondering
that
was
done,
apparently
without
consultation.
So
my
first
question
is
under
the
policy.
Would
because-
and
I'm
following
up
on
councillor
doherty
here
under
the
policy-
would
normally
that
be
such
a
move
be
done
after
consultation
with
the
of
the
school
immediate
public.
A
AD
Through
you,
mr
mayor,
thank
you
for
your
question,
counselor
hutchinson.
So
I
think,
if
you're,
if
there
are
a
variety
of
different
aspects
of
the
traffic
calling
program,
but
if
this,
if
it
was
one
of
the
district
councillor
selected
interventions
for
traffic
common,
the
intent
would
be
that
that
street
is
selected
and
we
would
share
information
about
the
implementation
that
was
forthcoming.
AD
So
we
would
share
it
with
residents
and
stakeholders
in
schools,
as
as
I
outlined
in
in
councillor,
doherty's
question
share
that
information
share
what
was
coming
forward
and
then,
once
that
implementation
was
complete,
also
be
available
to
answer
any
concerns
or
questions
that
come
up.
The
types
of
measures
that
are
implemented,
particularly
the
type
1
measures
that
are
spoken
about
in
the
report,
are,
are
measures
that
are
easily
implemented,
they're,
also
easily
adjusted
and
allow
for
adjustments
to
be
made.
AD
The
other
piece
that
I
would
say,
though,
is
we
see
these
installations
and
the
installation
that
occurs
not
as
the
finality
or
the
end
of
the
conversation.
This
is
part
of
the
initial
way
in
which
we
can
address.
You
know
some
of
the
systemic
issues
that
may
be
in
place
on
that
roadway
or
in
that
neighborhood.
So
the
intent
is
to
is
to
install
measures
in
and
install
measures
and
impact,
motorist,
behavior
and
slow
motorists
down
and
then
continue
that
conversation
with
the
community
about
about
how
that's
working.
AD
Through
your
worship,
so
I
think
specific
to
the
installation
that
happened
on
on
johnson
street
and
and
barry
so
that
that
installation
that
was
completed
is
not
an
example
of
of
of
what
would
be
a
traffic
calming
measure
that
would
that
would
be
selected
by
a
counselor
to
be
put
in
place.
So
for
a
variety
of
reasons,
but
it
it.
AD
It
is,
that's
an
arterial
roadway
there
and
there
were
safety
issues
that
were
present
at
that
location,
that
these
types
of
tools
that
are
that
now
that
are
outlined
in
the
guidelines
are
useful
in
helping
to
address.
So
the
specific
issue
at
berry
and
johnson
street
is
is
an
issue
that
was
related
to
the
school,
the
way
in
which
pickup,
drop-off
and
other
vehicles
were
moving
in
and
around
the
school
and
the
way
in
which
that
was
impacting
crossings
at
that
location.
AD
So
these
types
of
tools
are
that
were
put
in
place
at
barry
and
johnson
are
examples
of
the
way
that
we
can
use
some
of
what
was
some
of
the
tools
that
are
outlined
in
the
traffic
common
guidelines
to
address
safety
concerns
that
come
up.
It's
not
a
it's,
not
an
example
of
the
district
counselor
selected
process,
but
it
it
speaks
to
those
ways
in
which
we
would
address
transportation
issues
overall,.
I
I
AD
Through
your
worship
so
in
in
this
particular
instance
at
barian
johnson,
so
information
was
shared
to
residents
in
the
area.
There
were
leaflets
and
other
information
provided
both
in
hard
copy
and
online.
The
information
was
shared
with
the
school
board
and
information
as
part
of
the
installation
was
shared
with
the
school
directly.
I
AD
For
sure,
so
the
intent
is
that,
as
as
any
individual
concern
comes
up
with
any
type
of
traffic,
calming
installation
or
any
aspect
of
you
know,
I
think
in
the
transportation
network
staff
follow
up
on
that
to
ensure
that
they're,
you
know
there
isn't
a
safety
concern,
that's
been
created
or
exacerbated,
and
then
we
work
with
the
residents
or
the
stakeholder
to
provide.
You
know
information,
hear
their
concerns
and
make
adjustments
as
necessary.
AD
X
Thank
you
through
your
worship.
I'm
I'm
really
really
pleased
by
this.
I
think
this
is
a
great
tool
for
for
us.
I
mean
I've
always
been
opposed
to
the
notion
of
kind
of
management
by
motion
and
that
we
would
be
kind
of
debating.
You
know
which
district
is
going
to
get
a
four-way
stop
and
which
one
isn't.
I
I
think
this
gives
us
some
tools
as
counselors,
obviously
we'd
like
more
tools,
but
you
know
at
the
same
time
what
it
also
does
is.
X
So
I
think
it's
it's
a
really
timely
document
and
I
think
it's
going
to
be
a
great
tool
for
for
us
as
counselors,
both
in
terms
of
of
exercising
some
some
tools
that
we
might
have
at
our
disposal,
but
even
more
importantly,
having
a
document
that
will
really
help
us
to
explain
the
process
to
residents.
So
I
really
want
to
congratulate
staff
on
their
good
work
on
this.
Thank
you.
N
Spring
mayor
patterson,
I
forgot
to
put
on
my
hand,
I
was
just
wondering
if
staff
could
comment
on
how
this
policy,
which,
as
councilor
hill
says,
is
very
helpful
in
articulating
and
communicating
with
residents.
But
how
does
it
fit
with
larger
issues
like
red
light
cameras
or
automated
speed
enforcement?
AD
One
of
the
themes
that
kept
coming
up
was
that
the
traffic
calming
program
had
become
where
many
many
issues,
some
of
which
would
are
not
best
addressed
by
traffic
calming,
were
ending
up.
So
it's
really
about
framing
the
and
setting
the
right
expectations
about
what
traffic
calming
can
do
and
and
also
about
what
it
can't
do,
and
there
are
many
other
things
that
need
to
that
play
into
the
city's
transportation
network
that
build
off
of
what
traffic
calming
can
help
with
at
the
neighborhood
level
and
on
our
local
roadways.
AD
So
traffic
calming
is
intended
to
to
address
an
issue
that
exists
in
a
neighborhood.
It's
intended
to
slow
vehicles
down
to
slow
motorists
down
and
and
those
that
aspect
of
it
and
the
guidelines
outline.
You
know
27
or
more
tools
that
would
be
available
to
to
try
and
address
that
behavior,
but
other
transportation
issues.
Other
transportation
safety
concerns
that
arise
aren't
necessarily
covered
by
traffic
coming.
B
A
A
You
see
no
questions
there.
We
have
no
information
reports
from
members
of
council
miscellaneous
business.
We
do
have
one
motion
that
moved
by
councillor
neal
seconded
by
councillor,
holland,
that
the
resignation
of
matthew,
porter
from
the
municipal
accessibility
advisory
committee
be
received
with
regret,
all
those
in
favor
posed
and
that's
carried.