Koha-US SIG - Cataloging Special Interest Group, 3 Sep 2020

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From YouTube: Cataloging Special Interest Group - 9/3/2020

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Chat logs:

00:19:20 Heather Hernandez: https://keys.bywatersolutions.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-search.pl?q=fanning+voyages+discoveries
00:19:28 Heather Hernandez: https://keys.bywatersolutions.com/cgi-bin/koha/opac-detail.pl?biblionumber=16157
00:19:34 Heather Hernandez: https://bugs.koha-community.org/bugzilla3/show_bug.cgi?id=17867
00:27:18 Heather Hernandez: MARC21 linking entry fields info here: https://www.loc.gov/marc/bibliographic/bd76x78x.html
00:45:37 Bruce Metcalf: +1
00:50:34 Bruce Metcalf: Can someone post a link to the location of those XSLT files?
00:50:46 Tomas Cohen Arazi: I will
00:51:38 Tomas Cohen Arazi: https://gitlab.com/koha-community/Koha/-/blob/master/koha-tmpl/intranet-tmpl/prog/en/xslt/Del952.xsl
00:51:43 Bruce Metcalf: Thanks!
00:54:00 Stephanie: All. The. Time.
01:05:17 Stephanie: I overlay in the basic editor, and it happens to me as well.
01:06:59 Barbara Johnson: • We get brief bib records when we order from our vendor. When the item is received we overlay the brief bib with a full MARC record via Z39.50. Sometimes the incoming record has tags that we never want in our bibs (local 9XX tags, 852, local 59x notes, etc. We'd like a way to prevent those tags from being imported instead of having to delete them from every incoming record.
01:07:09 Barbara Johnson: • We include some local ordering info in the bib records when we order from our vendor. It is set up to come over in tags that we never use (025, 026). When we overly the brief bib record with the full record via Z39.50 we lose info in those tags. We would like a way to define specific tags that we do not want to be overlayed by the incoming bib.
01:07:19 Barbara Johnson: • Because we include some local ordering info in the 025 and 026 tags it would be helpful to us to be able to highlight (a different font color, a background color, etc.) that info so it is easily seen during cataloging.
01:07:45 Barbara Johnson: • Batch record modification - we would like for any new MARC tags to be included in the modified bib record in tag number order.
01:08:04 Barbara Johnson: • When using Z39.50 to overlay a bib record diacritics are often wonky. Sometimes changing the Z39.50 server from utf8 to MARC-8 or vice versa will fix it. But often neither encoding will fix the diacritics from some servers.
01:08:30 Bruce Metcalf: Question about diacriticals....
01:08:31 Barbara Johnson: • When using Z39.50 to overlay a bib record the list of servers does not sort by the rank included in the server setup. They display in the order in which the server was created. It would be helpful to fix the ranking issue. It would also be great to have a sort feature on the modal display itself for the servers such as alphabetically or by newest/oldest.
01:08:45 Barbara Johnson: • When using Z39.50 to overlay a bib record it always uses the default template. So if there are really important changes I need I have to edit the default template (which I know I'm not supposed to do) There needs to be a specific template associated with importing and overlaying bibs from Z39.50.
01:08:58 Barbara Johnson: • There is a 'Clear search form' button on the screen when you use Z39.50 to create a new record. It would be nice to have the same functionality on the Advanced Editor screen.
01:15:47 Jason Robb: Conference info http://koha-us.org/learn/conferences/onlinetogether2020/

A

Okay, we are recording good morning. Everyone hey bruce.

A

So this morning we're gonna look at some related formats. I'm gonna put some links to some records in our catalog in the chat and then I'll share my screen just to show off a few.

A

Things put this putting the links in the chat so that they'll make it into the comments on the youtube.

A

A

Okay, we've got some more people.

A

A

Okay, let me share my screen.

A

A

And I'll go over to our catalog. I hope everyone can see that great, so uh bywater's been doing some work in our catalog to get the linking between related records. Working and oh I'll put another chat, another link in the chat to the mark formats for these fields, because a lot of people don't work quite often with related records.

A

Many places do them in different ways.

A

We do different formats on different records, for example print on one record online on another record, a title change one title and one record another title on another record, and this is mostly because we participate in oclc, so we're following the oclc in the library of congress standards, rda and doing them on separate records.

A

A lot of places, though, find that for their users, it works better for them to keep formats on one record and if that works best, that's great do that that way. But what I'm going to show off today are the separate records and what I've got here on the screen are two records, one for the print and one for the online version, and so, if we go into one record.

A

We'll see that this is the online version, we've got the links to the online versions of it here and those will link out and then our catalog is saying available in another form, print version and the record number is hyperlinked to the other version, and so here's the book in our catalog.

A

And if I've done all my mark records correctly it'll link back yes,.

A

And the way the mark record looks.

A

Is that it's the records are linking in this field in the 01 field, with our oclc numbers.

A

And the way the linking field looks is right here: this is the 776 for available in another physical form, print version, and we are linking on the oclc number because we're in oclc library, you can have a local catalog number in that sephieldw.

A

Whatever works.

A

Best another related format that we've got working- and I have them up here- are title changes and again: bywater is still working on this, so you're gonna see it looks a little weird. We've got other relationship duplicated here. That is, that is not intended. That's a byproduct of the work being done right now, so they are working on having that not only not duplicated but having those other relationships down the record where they're supposed to be with this continues and continued by.

A

So this is a record that had a title change. It was the register of shipping four, it continued the new register book of shipping for the year and if you wanted to go to that previous title, hopefully this works. Yes, it does the new registered book of shipping for the year and it changed its title to register shipping, for we can go back to that record through that link.

A

And then it was continued by lloyd's register of british and foreign shipping.

A

And hopefully it works, it does yay.

A

And again, one reason why we have it on that. Oclc number is that identifier then works over in worldcat.org as well.

A

And there are bugs related to this to the getting the linking fields. Working. One of them is bug 17867, improved display of the source mark 21 773. In the result list there may be other bugs that people know about.

A

So I'm going to go ahead and stop my share.

A

And so uh let's open it up but feel free to unmute turn on your video. um How are these related records print online? Other formats title changes? How are they working or not working for other people? Do people have questions tips I see. Tomas has joined us he's our actual developer. Who is interested today and hearing?

A

What do we want to see in coho? What is working? Well, what could work better.

A

Good morning, thomas.

B

I'm really excited to be here. um I've been interested on the this evolution of the mark format and, and I don't have access to ea specifications, uh so I wanted to hear from real librarians using it.

B

I live in latin america, and here people are starting to manually craft, my records, adding the new fields etc and as a developer, it always felt like they. They are missing. Some point like the tool should be doing most most of the heavy lifting they are doing.

B

uh So I wanted to see how this should work uh with rda, um especially in the linking between the work and the manifestation uh and hearing people real people using this. uh So so we can have some clues on how to evolve, how to make the ui useful.

B

uh So so you don't need to do uh repetitive tasks that are that aren't really needed. Besides the the fact that our display of that information is is not perfect or far from perfect. Thank you for letting me.

A

Well, it's delightful to have you here and have you interested uh one thing that you had mentioned in an email to me was how about something like if you're generating a new record say I have the print record and I want to generate the online record. If I could have certain fields come over automatically created. That would be fantastic.

B

uh When I talk to my to the librarians, I work with uh one thing that arised immediately was the fact that linking should happen the same way we have. We do with analytics uh so doing. That should be pretty trivial, uh but we still need to to clarify the way we need to model the work and the manifestations in the database structure in koha.

B

uh But that's that's the thing we do very easily once we have the ideas, uh so I want to hear what what do you think uh you would benefit from uh and how can us developers access the specification of rda?

B

um I assume by the tiny beats I saw from the person who was presenting that uh rda basically uses the 700 700 fields for linking, so it will be a matter of adding more information on the database about those relationships, uh whether if they are vertical or horizontal, etc, but I'm sure you will need to start from one record and consider it the the work and then link the other ones as manifestations.

B

That's that's where I'm lost at the moment.

A

Okay, well, um you know oclc and connection client that I use has a macro that you can run on a record to generate an online record, which is very typical.

A

um It also has a very handy macro where, when you want to generate the linking entry field, you can put in the record number of the related record and it generates all of that uh set field. A subfield t, subfield d, pulling from the record, and that is really handy.

B

I see so uh this is. This might be a silly question, but.

A

There are no silly questions.

B

If you have a, if you have a mark record for a printed book, and you want to add manifestation, would it work to uh to generate a new mark record that it's a replica but in which you fill some.

B

Some of the 300 fields that are required uh then have the 700 field automatically, considering the original one. The work is that how it should work.

A

Yeah, that would work really really well. um I can I can go ahead and share my screen and we can look at a record and I could highlight those fields that are typically different between the print and the online. Let's take a look.

C

A

A

Here we go get my browser up, so let us look is this the yeah. This is the print record. Let's go ahead and look at the online record.

A

And let's open this up in the.

A

A

In the 008.

A

This character is added zero for online.

A

I mean letter o letter o for online.

B

A

The call number in the library of congress call number system will be identical to the print version, except for a little work letter added this little typically a or a aaab ac.

A

The 300 field will usually be one online resource with the information from the print version record subfield a now, in parentheses, with the pagination and then the subfield b pulled. This is not correct. Punctuation here for rda, I can go ahead and fix.

A

That and then the subfield c information is dropped because we no longer have fixed measurements of height of an item. Since it's online, then the three these three three x fields are added for usually text computer and online resource.

B

Those should be filed, but have field by choosing options right. You create a a manifestation. You might just choose this computer rda media media and representing the text.

A

B

uh This is the kind of thing that looks like it should be filled automatically.

A

It would be wonderful to have it filled automatically, based on the source record.

B

Right and some options, yeah.

A

Yeah uh one thing that this record lacks that it could have it's not mandatory as a 583 for system information not necessary. One thing that they typically get is this 588, which is the source of the description that just says, print version record.

A

Then 776 linking entry fields since the source was the print version record. It gets a subfield I to link to the source, saying print version, and then this information is all pulled from the source record. Subfield I or the subfield a is from the 100 subfield. A the subfield t is from the 245 subfield. A the subfield d is from the source, records, 260 or 264 field all put in the subfield d. This is from the 260 or 264 subfield a this is from the subfield b, and this is from the subfield z.

A

Then the record numbers are pulled from a dlc number is pulled from a source records, 0, 1 0 and an oclc number in our case is pulled from the source records, zero, zero. One.

A

And then, since this is an online record, it would be mandatory that it'd have at least one 856 fields linked to the online resource.

B

Yes, of course, yeah do you do you think uh we could have a list of uh fields that should come from the host record yeah the originating one? If we had such a list yeah we we could do some mock-up or or even um uh yeah. We could try something.

A

I should be able to pull that from the oclc macro very pretty easily run it in my oclc connection, client and then do some sort of copy and paste so yeah I'll I'll see. If I can generate that.

B

Excellent cool and then yeah the next step would be to group things on search results, but that's more.

D

B

But that's something we can one once people can catalog with ease. We can start thinking about about that. That's my that's. My reasoning.

A

Yes, that would be fantastic.

B

The main problem is uh the hybrid catalogs we will have for people starting to to use rda more often and how to how to to make records. Go exist.

B

A

Yeah yeah, because I our records, are a hybrid between I, the very very old isbd aacr1 aa002 rda, but uh adding the the chief difference between the non-rda and the rda records are those three three x fields and they're pretty easy. They would be pretty easy to add. I mean easy being a relative term.

B

Yeah, no, they look like very easy. I can't imagine if you, if you have a way to add a new analytic, analytical record, we could have something similar saying, add a new manifestation that will pop up uh some form in which you choose uh the physical form or if it's online etc, and once you choose all those options, you have a clean record with those things set.

B

ah You're happy.

A

B

Okay: okay, okay, give me the information and I will try to do something, but uh I'm excited as well.

A

Oh wonderful, so am I.

B

B

So uh one one thing I like to mention, and it's a bit of criticism about rda uh as a developer- I guessed uh it relied on the already existing 700 fields for linking, but I found no information about that it. It is not that easy to to understand how things should work, because uh most uh systems implementing this uh are proprietary.

B

This is problematic and the access to the rda toolkit is paywall as well.

B

A

B

If it is as easy, as you say, we we can certainly try something in the short term.

A

One thing that is free uh is the mark 21 standard and that's where the 77x linking entry fields are defined and described as well as the 33x fields, and even though I do have access to rda. I have to say it's not that easy to read and understand what it's trying to do right.

B

B

B

I will try to provide some prototype, so so we can start talking about something concrete and something you can try. Okay, just give me the list of fields that need to be mapped.

A

I definitely will, and what I might do is also share that with the cohort list to get the eyes of other catalogers onto it to see what I've forgotten or misdescribed or yeah, because you know I I'm sharing mostly what I think is useful for my setting and my library is a specialized maritime history library.

A

So it's very difficult for me to have an eye for how things work best in other settings like public libraries, or you know, libraries that are specialized in other areas like, for example, fred's, medical library, using a lot of records for articles a whole different setting and uh the relationships between uh analytic and host are probably much more important. I would think for fred in in other settings. I see some people nodding.

B

E

Hey actually, my author's catalog uh is cobbled together with mostly with uh it seemed like a good idea at the time um six years ago. So I really it would probably make you um turn green and pale and then pass out under the floor under your desk. So in fact I was just showing it to the new chair of the department of medicine and I was updating it and I thought yeah. This needs a lot of updating and standards and.

A

A

Quality, control and and record enhancement is something that we always do all the time.

E

And when you're sort of making it up as you go along, it gets worse.

A

Well, I think we're all kind of making it up as we go along.

E

But as far as the actual medical library um yeah, we do have online and print books, usually on the same record. It's easier that way for me.

A

Yeah and if that works best, that's great.

E

Well, we're such a small library that I'm the cataloging department.

B

A

Well, does anybody else have anything they'd like to chime in about on uh related records, record relationships.

E

E

F

We don't have anything in regards to the related records because we're a public library- and we generally are not doing that, but we've got some other um things that we think would be helpful um and the first one is that, um of course, I know we, we probably catalog different from other libraries, but we get brief bib records from our vendor and then, when the item is received in the advanced editor, we overlay the bib, with using a record from z, 39.50 and the incoming record sometimes has tags in it that we really don't want, like other libraries, local 9xx tags or a 59x or or whatever, and so we delete those out of the record, but if there were a way to prevent those from, you know be able to set it up that I never want these tags coming in.

F

That would just be a time. Saver to you know not have to have deal with that on each record, so we'd be interested. You know if there were some way to set up. I don't know if it's a template or or you know I don't know what it would be, but that's one idea.

B

That sounds familiar. uh I think I wrote a plugin, but that works for staged files. You can choose uh over live overlay options, but it's only for that.

E

In the meantime, you could use mark edit to take out all the nine xx, files or fields that you want or don't want.

F

B

Well, give me a minute: I I think we have that we have a feature in cohab for tweaking incoming records using xlts uh when they come from sru. Is that correct? Don't we.

E

Can I share the screen, I think I remember seeing something like that.

A

Yes, please go, I think you should be able to yeah there. We go thomas.

B

So this is uh a developer. Gohan start. You servers, say you you pick here this library of congress yeah. You can specify xlts for transforming the results.

F

um I had talked to bywater about that and I think what they told me was that that was really more for authority records and I do have a ticket open and they're they're looking at something, um but that was the first thing I looked at and then they said that um or at least there's there's some things already defined for authority records. I guess that's what it was.

B

Yeah, uh I provided some examples for for deleting uh 952 fields when importing. uh So this is something you can actually have your own files and it should work you should. We should be able to to give you uh a way to to eliminate information uh from the incoming records.

B

That's what is what is designed for so.

F

C

Yes, is there a place where we can see those, like example, xslt.

B

Yeah, it's it's in the code base. uh Let me show you again uh here uh in the xlt. ah This is too small right. uh These files.

C

B

This these files are sample files and they basically delete information. This is for deleting the nine subfield.

B

You can grab one of those and adopt it.

C

Okay to your own needs, I will definitely play with that. We have the same problem: barbara. We have our our catalogers spend an inordinate amount of time going through imported records and just getting rid of things. They don't want in the record. So if we can wipe those out at the point of import, that would save a lot of time.

B

Yeah, if, if it doesn't work, you should tell us absolutely.

F

And the the other side of that is in our brief records. um Sometimes we do things that are just that work for us locally, so we're using two fields that we never use and we're putting some local acquisitions information in them.

F

And so then, when the catalog goes in they're seeing this information and it means something to them, but because we're overlaying the record, then we end up losing the data in those fields. So if there were some way that when you overlay, you could also say, don't overlay specific tags.

F

That would also be helpful.

B

That's that's interesting.

B

I'm looking for a.

A

Link yeah: this would be helpful for us because we have for our special collections and rare books. A lot of particular information in 590 notes that we would always want preserved, and before I overlay a record, I spend a lot of time looking to be sure copy paste copy paste if this could just be preserved. That would be really helpful. ah Thank you for the link in the chat.

F

I'm kind of going along with that. You know looking through the record and trying to make sure everything's, either there or correct or whatever.

F

Sometimes I wish that there was a way that certain specific fields that you know maybe mean something to us that I could um have those display in a different color or have a background color in the advanced editor, so that it would draw my eye to a specific place and help me.

F

You know delineate different parts of the record quicker.

B

Yeah, it looks like you know what you, what you need.

B

It's a very good idea: I've got more.

E

F

E

Gets one thumb up from me because I probably wouldn't use it, but I think it's a marvelous idea.

A

I would use it if I could do user-defined colors of particular mark fields in the advanced editor that would rock my world. I I adore the red little spacers.

C

A

Up that is so super helpful and that just made me want more user-defined color options but barbara. What are your other ideas? It's wonderful hearing, these.

F

Okay, so I've got um so when we overlay, when we use z39 to overlay a record, not when I don't think this is a problem when you create a new record from z39, but when we overlay a record um a lot of times, the diacritics are just wonky and we'll try it with the utf-8 uh we'll try it with the mark eight, sometimes using one over the other, we'll fix it, but sometimes neither setting will correct the diacritics, and so then we have to go and fix the diacritics.

F

You know and look for them to make sure we get them all.

F

So if there were a way to you, know kind of look at the how that's working or why it's not working when you overlay a record that would be really helpful.

D

I've I've found that I have to set up the interface for each z3950 and once I've done that diacritical has come through correctly. Have you have you had a pro problems with things that don't.

F

So how do you mean for like we have a lot of different z39 servers and we have the encoding set, but sometimes it just no matter what you do it. It doesn't fix the diacritic problem.

D

Sounds like it may be, a problem in their catalog.

F

It could be, although I think the issue is, we tried importing them um as if I were creating a new record, and that worked just fine.

F

So we didn't feel like it was a problem with the incoming that there's there's something going on compared from if you create it new to. If you were overlaying- and this is a ticket I had from a long long time ago, but um that critics sometimes.

D

Yeah that critics are one of the curses of my life.

E

Rubric can you say which tell me which z3950 libraries you get the majority of your records from.

F

uh We have luck with seattle and that's pretty good. um We have used, uh I think it's milwaukee and the diacritics on that one don't come in correctly.

F

Those are the two I can think of.

D

Be glad you don't have an international collection, I've got about half my z3950 sources are overseas and some of those get really screwy and that that's even before I get to cyrillic titles.

F

Another thing that I think is true is when you are using z39 to overlay a bib record, it's using the default template and correct me if I'm wrong, so I've had to make a few slight changes to the default template, which I know I'm not supposed to do, but they were important enough to me to go and do it for time, saving or whatever.

F

um So if there were a way to have the z39 have its own template, I guess and not have to be the default so that you didn't have to pull with perhaps messing up the default template.

F

That would be good.

A

Oh we're not hearing you tommaso, you might be muted.

B

Can you hear me.

A

Now we can hear you.

B

Okay, uh when you say templates, are you talking about mark frameworks.

F

Yes, yes, okay,.

A

I've actually changed our default framework. A lot oh good, yeah.

F

I don't feel so bad.

A

Yeah, I I just am always very very careful yeah.

E

Yeah mike my experience is one little character out of place, can break the entire thing so always keep it back up, but if modifying it, something makes it easier for you go ahead. Just remember it's probably going to get wiped out in the next update, which is why the author's catalog with all the special fields is still on 17.5.

E

And actually I have no intention of changing it until I.

C

E

Positively, have to.

A

I also don't see why you couldn't have a special framework for your z3950 versus your default.

F

I know I created one originally when we first came up and and thought that I'd be, you know using that, but apparently it my understanding was that it it went out and used the default anyway or something like that and so and that may not. I may be incorrect about that, but I'm I'm uh glad to hear that someone else actually goes in and modifies their defaults, and now I don't feel so so.

F

F

And when you're, um when you're in the advanced, editor um on a record, you're, not creating a new record um and you've got the z39 form over to the left hand, side.

F

It'd be nice to have a clear search form button on it. If you're creating a new record from z39, there is a a button or link to clear out the form, um but there isn't one if you're doing it, where you're searching and then gonna overlay the record.

A

Would would you like to share your screen, so we take a look or would you like me to open ours and.

G

Take a look at that um you can go ahead. I've never shared a screen before so it might.

F

Take me a minute to okay, I'm happy too.

A

Yeah, let me share with my I'll share my screen and let's take a look at what okay, let me open a record here.

A

And go into the advanced.

F

F

So they're on the left in the blue box and you've got your different fields and you're advanced. um If there were a clear- and this is not a big deal, but I just did notice it um and.

F

I noticed it somewhere.

F

Is that that's the advanced search from that go to um if you create a z39 um from a new if you're, creating a new record from z39.

A

Okay: let's go to cataloging.

A

And new from z39.

G

So there at the bottom there's.

F

A clear search form, it just seems like it would be nice to have the same thing on the other way, if you're creating it. When you're in the record and you're going to to overlay.

A

A

Match right, there's no clear search right. There, yeah yeah.

F

I guess there there is and we're usually using it from just the box on the screen. um So if there were one there uh that would be nice.

A

Yeah yeah, when displays are consistent, it does speed up the work yeah yeah and in taking a look at creating new from z39. I'm now wondering.

A

Yeah it it would be really nice if there were a way to select the framework. I'm wondering if that comes up. Let's take a look.

D

Actually, you can select the framework in a pre. The previous screen.

A

Oh you can, I must have just missed it. Let's take a look.

D

A

D

No, you just you click the main search. If, instead, you pull down on that.

G

B

Yeah I was about to ask because I've always been proud of that drop down. Yeah.

D

It also works on the new record field, yeah.

A

Nice, so I could just do that d with that work from okay.

E

A

When I bring in something let's just.

A

Say I imported it, it would be in that framework.

A

Very nice, so yeah barbara um go ahead. Stop you could set up a a special z-3950 framework.

C

And I was, I have milwaukee set up in my uh servers as a target too, and I was playing with that. It looks like the the diacritics only get messed up if you overlay in the advanced editor. If I overlay in the basic editor, it keeps the diacritics the right way. So it seems to be like an actual bug with the advanced editors c39, import.

F

That's what I recalled that there was an issue between the two.

F

Another difference between z39 when you're, creating a new record compared to overlaying a record is when you're setting up your z39 servers, there's a place in there, where you can put in a rank to put them in order, but when you're overlaying, if you're doing it that way it doesn't it ignores that order, and you see your list of z39 servers just in the order that you created them in.

F

So sometimes you can be looking around and you know it's it's not in an order you wanted and it's not in alphabetical order, it's in an order from how they were added to the system, and so it'd be nice to be able to have that.

F

Sort order actually work when you're overlaying, but it would also be nice if you had your list of z39 servers and you had a sort button like. I want to sort my servers alphabetically or I want to sort them by the date in which they were added, or something like that.

B

It makes perfect sense.

E

Or just sort, according to your preference.

E

I would find that useful.

B

So I rank me: do these meetings end up with the bugs being filed for community, because I see very interesting interactions and ideas, but do you have plans for filing bags in the community battery?

B

So maybe there is some traction on one of those ideas.

F

I know I've had a couple of tickets on some of them and I think of fewer bugs and I'd have to go back and see which ones but um the ones that aren't. I can enter excellent and I'm putting. In my questions.

F

So that it's in the.

F

A

Yeah, if these could turn into bugs in bugzilla, that would be great. I was looking to see if there was an existing bug for diacritics being handled differently. Whether record was imported through the basic editor through z3950 or the advanced editor to z3950, and I saw a couple of bugs for unimark, but not for you s mark. I might have missed them.

C

And stephanie did mention she sees the problem in the basic editor when overlaying as well. So that might not be the exact issue, but it was a builder replicate to the problem in the advanced editor.

B

B

They all sound like easy fixes. That's why I asked that's the kind of thing uh us developers. Don't notice right, we don't use it. We don't, but sometimes minor changes make your life easier. That's why I wanted to be here.

A

That's terrific yeah, it's wonderful having you here and it's so encouraging to hear that they're relatively easy fixes. Absolutely.

A

I'd also like to encourage everybody who hasn't entered a bug into bugzilla, to do it to try it because the bugzilla community is very, very friendly and helpful, and there's kind of really no wrong way to do it. If you put in as much information as you can describe it as much as you can maybe even put links into your opac, so people can see it, then uh the people who know more in bugzilla and are more experienced with it and the developers they will handle all the fields at the top.

A

For that you're, not sure about, and and that's one way to get the information in there for.

A

A

So does anybody else have anything they'd like to bring up and talk about.

D

Yes, um I'm having a big problem, uh getting diacriticals to sort properly I've seen somewhere in the back of my head. I remember a place where you can define the alphabet and you know so an uh e and e accent and e all sort equivalently.

D

But I've got a lot of weird characters and they're sorting at either the top or the bottom of the alphabet, which is less than constructive.

A

Are you using zebra or elasticsearch.

D

A

A

I haven't noticed that, but I'm going over to the manual to see if I can discover.

D

Something I I've been through all that and found nothing, and I got no response to a query on the in on the list. So I figured yeah, let's see if this group's got a sudden.

D

A

I'm not quite finding anything I'm going to keep looking. One thing I have noticed with sorting we're on 1911 with elasticsearch is that it's now sorting our library of congress call number cutters as if they were whole numbers so and the cutters are supposed to be decimal numbers. So that's a little wonky, but that's a known, that's a known issue, or as far as I can tell, our diacritics are sorting correctly, but I have to admit I haven't looked that way.

D

I've got a lot of really strange ones. uh We got some icelandic literature.

A

ah Would you would you like to share your screen and show us.

D

Oh, let me see if I can hang.

D

A

It may not be completely self-evident.

D

It will be if I can find it.

A

Well, you know uh one thing that we have on our list of things to talk about in an upcoming meeting are non-english languages and diacritics, and that sort of thing. So, since we're approaching the top of the hour, we could go ahead and make this the topic for our next meeting and take a look more at diacritics.

D

Okay, I've got a few here. Let me see: okay,.

A

Great I'm happy to stick.

D

A

Yeah we're seeing your screen.

D

This is the authority records um and the first five there uh just aren't worth anywhere near where they belong.

F

D

And, as you can see, I've got some some non-standard, even even among these few, but if uh this is something to put off for next month, I can live that long.

A

Well, it's definitely worth looking at so yeah, I'm really glad you! You brought this up because yeah that should not be sorting that way at all.

A

D

All right we'll put that on our list.

A

A

And I'm making a note diacritics for october.

A

Well before we go, I want to mention that the coho us conference is coming up online. I hope everybody joins in and we're going to have a half hour where I'm going to try my best to look at some cataloging bugs. I know some very basic skills, voting, commenting and very, very, very simple testing, but please join in and look for bugs. We can look at at that time with that. Oh great, thank you. Jason link to the conference infos in the chat.

A

So I think right now I'll go ahead, we're at the top of the hour and stop the recording.