Kubernetes SIG Cluster Lifecycle, 9 Jan 2020

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From YouTube: Cluster API Azure 2020-01-09

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A

Hello, hello: everyone today is a Thursday January, 9th 2020. It is the this. Is the cluster API user office hours kneading? This is our first meeting for 2020 so happy new year. Everyone who's watching it's a meeting that will be recorded and available on the Internet. So please be mindful of what you say and do please be sure to adhere to the kubernetes code of conduct and in general, just be awesome, awesome folks.

A

So for the people who are on the call, if you have any agenda items that you want to drop on, feel free to the agenda is in the zoom chat right now. I think there are some immediate things that we want to talk about. The first one on my end is also if anyone is available and wants to take notes, please feel free to jump on. The first thing on my end is I'm.

A

Gonna have some meeting conflicts and I think that overall, we were talking about you're, talking about changing the meeting time to be more convenient for some of the people who might want to contribute across maybe in different time zones. So right now this is kind of convenient for us us, Eastern and Pacific, but not necessarily so for amia, and we have some contributors that are interested in joining more frequently there.

A

So I'm going to put together a doodle I didn't want to do it before the before the break, to make sure that everyone actually sees it so I'm going to put together a doodle for next week and send that out and then what we can do is start the start, a new meeting series for the for two weeks from now I'm with a new time. So that should be enough soak time for people to get.

A

Involve in waiting for right, we need to release its release. Caps, ev2 rv1, alpha 2, so I think that week make that happen for next week. Does that sound gets? Everyone is excited about that.

A

So yeah, looking over looking over the docks, I I, have been super busy. Gonna be honest. Rhea has graciously offered to work on the docks and she has already opened a PR to check that out so I'll be doing a review of that and speak of the Rhea Rhea is here so of Rhea.

A

Thank you for for jumping on the docks it looks like it looks like it should be fairly straightforward, I think so I'd mentioned before, but my my primary concern around the docks is that I had I had like a few people internally, tryout cap see or try to tryout cap, see with the current docks in place, and it has been a pain for for them.

A

So I worry that in the flurry of us getting excited and and and tweeting and blogging, or whatever we're going to do about releasing few and alpha-2 people are going to get to the repo and have a bad time and I. Don't want that. So yeah so I think that once we land the development docks which it looks like they're mostly done to be honest already we can.

A

We can get that merged in the cecile has done some awesome work in landing the b-y-o-see net work and opened some some additional PRS and issues around support for for a Vina that differs from v-net subnet group Avena resource group that differs from the primary resource group of the cluster, so that stuff is moving forward nicely.

A

We've got a we've, got a PR, open, I believe for the v1 alpha 3 types. So again the plan is as soon as we release V 1. Alpha 2 will be speeding forward into v1 alpha 3 I. Don't think that we need to have a secondary release for alpha-2.

A

Unless something is wildly wrong and, to be frank, the we are, we were a little behind now so jumping into v1, alpha 3 as soon as as as we land that does that sound good everyone, cool cool, Cecille regard with regards to the blockers outside of the docs I. We've we've buttoned up everything around around image images: image, building all that good stuff right.

B

Yeah I think we're good on images. For now, as long as there's versions are releasing okay.

A

Okay, so we have I know we have a 116. We have 117 as well.

A

All right so outside of that I I would want our there easy, like short links for images available, because I want to also publish that in the repo.

B

Yeah sorry I'm cutting out so I can send you there's a link where you can use to address a light to see all the images available and it will list them in a table. Okay,.

A

B

Oh commence sorry yeah.

A

Cool alright. So since we have no 117 image, I think that we should get that out the door before we release. That sounds good.

B

Yeah I can take care of that cool.

A

If you want we can we can wait a little bit, so our tentatively plans are I, say tentatively just for the recording, but the patch release team is planning to release patch releases for 117 one one. Sixteen five I think and one fifteen eight On January 14th. So that's next week, Tuesday, hopefully want to wait until one seventeen one comes out to build images. That would probably be a good so.

B

The thing is, the images don't require any code changes in cabs II. We can just publish them independently, so I think we should still move forward with the release and we won't have to make any amends. We can publish the images whenever those versions are available. Okay,.

A

Perfect perfect, that is even better all right. Okay, so we won't block on that yeah and so I'll go over what they're our release Docs our I know we have some semblance and Philly stocks and some manual stuff I just want to make sure that nothing has changed on the upstream capi side before doing that, but I I doubt I doubt it it's really just going to be pushing the button too. You know cutting a tag and then pushing the tag up and yeah yeah. That should be it. He says, hopefully, cool all right.

A

So next up nothing, no topics.

A

We should probably plan to do a. We should plan to plan right. I should do a planning meeting, maybe I don't want. Maybe we can plan to do that for one of the next two meetings to give people an opportunity to kind of settle back into the work thing that we do apparently.

A

So if that sounds good, we can put something on the schedule for planning, especially since we're there probably a few things that we want to look at for b1, alpha 3.

A

All right, hmm easy, breezy meeting.

C

So wait for the next release. Is the dock set I put the PR for, like that's the holdup right now right? Yes, okay, cool.

C

Yeah I mean they should work, there's details that I need to fix yeah.

D

C

Work the thing is, it won't work anyway until there's a release, because you have to vote for master.

A

Right, so these are so that we want to make sure that we're differentiating between I actually think that maybe we should move the docks to a different location or make it clear within the title that yeah.

C

Right now like getting started, it's a little bit yeah.

A

So that should probably be something like development guide, right and and land in like slash docks development guide or guides. Oh.

C

Really I don't see it's from a development perspective. I was writing this from like I, want to use CAD Z and like create a cluster and then create multiple clusters.

A

Right so right now, right now, they're, essentially written in the context of someone pulling from master right, but there there's a different set of Doc's too, that are like the production grade, Doc's that are in the cluster API book.

A

C

So I was trying to make it from that perspective of, like I, am new to Azure, but I want to be able to create this cluster on okay. So if this is a development guide, then I gotta change it a little bit. Okay,.

A

C

A

C

We have Docs that are specifically for developers already yeah.

B

So we had development and getting started and development was for developers getting started was for users and we didn't have any thing about Asscher in the cluster api book, I went and added an azure section in the cluster API books now it's there. But that means now there's dedicated info between the book and what's in getting started and getting started, it's kind of outdated because it's from a while ago, No so I think we should remove maybe getting started and merged whatever it was in there.

B

That's kind of different from what's in development to development, exactly.

A

B

A

So it would so if getting started remains I. Don't think we need to keep the link around that we can tombstone the link and then say that's like hey if you're building, if you're, if you're, not building cluster API, if you're consuming cluster API, then here is the quick start and point them to the cluster API book right. Okay,.

C

A

And then the development Oxford should be for people who plan on working on the repo with us, I.

B

Think the prerequisites or the thing that, because that's nowhere else, sorry.

A

You broke up did.

B

I okay, I said.

A

B

Prerequisites are the only thing, I think or the main thing that are gonna, that we're gonna have to keep because they're, not in the book. Okay,.

A

B

The book says the.

A

The book says: keep CTO and installing or configuring a managed cluster, which is there's a little more like.

D

Yeah I'm a hundred percent sure I've missed all this because I'm not super familiar with. What's there and what's not so somebody might need to tweak the notes to capture this okay.

C

Okay, so I can go in and update the developing AMD, with some more as your specific info for people that are like new to Azure, but they want to start developing with CAD, see yeah.

A

C

A

And I think that the development one has some of the stuff that you're writing up right now, like things about the service principle and I, don't.

C

Know if it's as detailed but but yeah, mostly.

A

C

There you go cuz yeah. If all you need to do, if all you really need it was a developing guide. I mean that one's there.

C

A

Yeah I'm I'm feeling weird about this, because I feel like having our instructions in the in in the cluster. A guidebook is going to lead to mismatches and information. It would be great if we had a if it could be a site right or this could be a subdirectory of a site right. That was, if it lived.

E

A

It lived in our repo and then was aggregated with the cluster API info and yeah.

C

Like, ideally, every single repo would have their own user Docs and then that like, if you want to aggregate it in one place like, hopefully, you could pull the information but like maybe this could be the source of truth. Would that be easier? It's.

A

It's easier, if it's easier, if our repo is the source of truth, so we can manage everything in one place and we also don't have to seek approvals for the cluster API book for the cluster API Azure stuff. But for right now, right now, I just want to I just want to ensure that people who are coming into the repo and have ideas and want to contribute can do that effective. Yeah.

C

Because, like for me just going through the docs, it was it, it was harder, like are people gonna, land in cluster API or they're gonna land in a specific provider? First I.

A

It depends I, guess a you know. So, if you're a consumer, if you're, if you're like, if you've heard of cluster API and you're like wow I, want to start getting started there and you know, then you might think about your favorite cloud provider and yeah.

C

A

C

I would like I would think that we would have links to all the cloud provider repos in like cluster API, but then like for the specific source of truth for like what the provider is doing, it would live in like our repo, so we wouldn't go and update the instructions in cluster API. We would update it like directly here, at least that's the way that I've thought about it. That's.

A

C

A

That would be my preference, okay.

C

A

C

Cuz then I we could keep the getting sorry, god I can name it something else. That makes a little bit more sense for like in a user like like, ideally that would even be in our and our like. First initial read me: yeah I, don't know yeah, so someone could just like they wouldn't have to actually know the directory structure to get started with Bajor exactly.

A

Yeah yeah, so maybe this is a cluster API question, because the because right now, if someone's ingress point, is the cluster API book, then they're going to assume that the instructions there are correct right. So we hang.

E

A

That those are correct for consumers and then yeah.

E

A

If someone knows that they want to develop on cluster API Azure, then their ingress point is going to be different right. So we also have to make sure that I read me has all the bits that it needs. It feels circular, though yeah.

C

A

In the read me to point someone back to you, the cluster API buggin yeah.

C

Maybe we can talk about this in that cluster API meeting I, don't mind, bringing it up, yeah sure, that's a concern.

C

Yeah I'm like just getting started with all this stuff, so, okay.

E

Cool yeah, so what should I do.

E

D

My notes failed.

A

So I would say: go into go into the development guide right and and and see if you end-to-end can like spin up a cluster as a developer. Great okay,.

C

So, what's it so that what you care about is a developer guide for the next release. Yeah, so I can get the developer it make like double-check. His developer Docs add detail if I need to from the getting started. Can we ignore the getting started for the next release.

A

Yes, so the next thing I would care about so like the development Doc's are important, so we can on board more people, but the second thing I care about is like. What's the experience gonna be for someone like after we say, we've released cluster API zero, three zero right like what's their experience, going to be yeah.

E

A

So like when we write the release, notes, it's gonna be hey. Here is the doc that you look at to do the stuff for here's, the command that you run? Do we point them to the cluster API book? If that's the case, do we clean that? Do we clean our instructions up? Can we run what's in the book today and get a working cluster.

C

Okay, so we can talk about that like in our cluster API meeting too, and but that doesn't like the getting started stuff and like the weather, we put the those instructions in cluster API versus here is that's not a blocker for the next release, all right.

A

Yeah no I think like like moving stuff around if we need to change directory structures or the way that we do, the docs, like that's totally fine, okay,.

E

A

That's like that's, not necessarily a user concern as long as we're making sure that we tombstone files properly and point them in the right direction to a set amount, success rate but yeah every every dock that we have right now should make them be successful right, whether it's the book, whether it's getting started if getting started, needs to go away. That's totally fine and and the development guide. Okay,.

C

Okay, I'll double-check the development guide, PRA fixes, if need be, and then hopefully we can that'll be good for getting us unblocked for the release, and then we can move forward with, like the actual user, Docs and I.

B

Was just gonna say, I think for the release. The user Doc's are more important than the development of guides, because.

E

Development is.

B

Not tied to the release, but the release, people see the release want to try it out and they're, not gonna go build from source they're gonna want to use the artifacts and the only dog. We have right now on how to do that.

B

Makes sense with how things work no.

A

So so it's not so I mean that's that's one of the problems like that is not the only dock. We have right, it's also the cloister. If.

E

A

Started if getting started is actually going to the quick start, then we can delete everything and getting started and just point yeah.

B

A

Right yeah, we.

B

Should at least yeah either removed getting started completely or fix it, so it doesn't say things that are going, but we should have yeah they're. My.

C

Peer attempts to fix those inconsistencies, there's still some that, like I, still they're still like cluster cuddle in some of the instructions in mine which I want to delete, it's there's no reference to it, but otherwise it should be usable. It's just like. If the release was out, it would be usable. Okay,.

A

So tell you what why don't we defer everything Docs related ish right so run through the development guide and see if that works, for you right if the development guide is fine, like that's a good step in the right direction, on the getting started side, delete getting started, add up, add a link in the readme that says getting started and point them to the cluster API book.

C

A

We'll and then we'll call it done for.

C

A

To four, if you.

B

Laugh. Okay! Sorry, sorry.

A

Wait: no no keep going.

B

Sorry, it's just stuff. The cluster API book has a reference to getting started, though for prerequisites. So we can't sorry, oh boy, alright, so we can. We just keep getting started, rename it to prerequisites, remove everything, that's not prerequisites and then just do what you said: link in reaming, yeah.

A

That sounds good. It.

B

A

Like that is B yeah, okay yeah it is, it is the getting started, link okay, yeah and most.

C

This, if I add it was pre req related, so I can just like. Basically it's everything stuff for like make cluster right. Yeah.

A

C

Like keep everything else so for, like the make cluster part yeah.

A

I mean like in my head: it's it's like. Do. I have the tools that I know I'm going to use so I may be like you know, it's not a hard requirement, but the suggestion of like hey. Maybe you should get cubes ETL right, but do you have an azure account? Do you have a service tangible that you can use against this OneNote for the for the doc? Don't necessarily suggest that they have to create the service principle right, make sure they.

C

Write it without that may.

A

Well, make sure that the language is you either need a service principle or something around like you can use an existing service principle that does the stuff that you needed to do. I.

C

A

Create one right: okay,.

C

Sure yeah yeah.

A

So yeah, we just don't want people creating a bunch of service principles. Every run and that's I mean that's the the thing that popped out to me immediately. The second piece would be we're going to have Linux users, Mac users, Windows users, eventually right, so the instructions should not be there. Yeah.

C

Seeing this I put those in for myself, because it's really hard to find some of those dependencies, but I didn't know if we should. If there is another section of like references or something so.

A

Point I I would sue for like the the Getty XT or something I.

E

Would point people.

A

Out to the installation, instructions for Getty, HD, yeah.

E

A

On their platform, you know like we should we should try not to write platform documentation for some other piece of software yeah.

C

Okay, no problem yeah I'll delete those I wanted to make sure like I still had them. So that's why it's like I do.

A

The same idea, the same but like now that I.

C

A

Since I switched to Linux I'm like oh, that's, that's not a command. I can run and be successful. Right. Yeah.

A

Okay, yeah, okay, so that that sounds good and I will as soon as you've got something as soon as you've got something I've. Just ping me, you know, I'll, take a look I'm already.

C

A

On the PR cool.

C

Yeah, let me I've stayed a couple of those things that are tiny and then delete some things and should be good cool.

A

A

What there's a thing in my head and it's gone now at some point: we need to do a calico upgrade I'm thinking and a container d1.

A

We can put those up as good first issues, maybe or one of us can take care of it, but that's also it's not a rush. I think you know our first. Our first step is just getting zero: three zero, that's the door and then moving on.

A

Ace from a consumer ish standpoint, this all of that sound good to you.

F

F

Actually, I think I need to do something like we was saying: I need to spend some time and go through like end current talks in the process. I, don't know, I, don't know anything because I'm sure there will be stuff. I haven't gone all the way through you like from the beginning to end in a while, so yeah.

A

And and it's kind of the same for me, I haven't like now: we have the tilt instructions and I haven't gone through any of that stuff and.

F

A

It's been in a while since I've developed on cap C actually and then and then we had the holiday so.

A

Yeah, the seal has been holding us up.

A

Alrighty um I think that I think outside of that we're probably set unless people have more things, they want to chat about.

C

Nope good sweet.

A

All right, easy, breezy, all right, everyone I will send out doodles, so we can get a new meeting in the calendar and get that scheduled stay tuned for that should be, if not tomorrow, then early next week, I'm. Basically so one one notice that I'm rescheduling like five or six meetings, all at the same time and they're all dependent on the results of each other. So just bear with me. Well I figure out what people are doing for the new year.

C

A

Right, take it easy everyone good to see you.