►
Description
Join @Akiva, who posted the initial proposal, to learn more about Pairwyse and how it compares and contrasts with the other two proposals for fixed-rate vaults.
Pairwyse:
Proposal - https://forum.makerdao.com/t/discussion-pairwyse-as-a-solution-for-fixed-rates-on-makerdao/10145
Akiva:
akiva@akiva.capital
MakerDAO:
Forum - https://forum.makerdao.com/
Chat - chat.makerdao.com
A
All
right,
hello,
everyone,
I'm
seth,
goldfarb
the
facilitator
of
the
content
production
core
unit
here
today
for
the
ninth
edition
of
ask
maker
dao
today
we're
going
to
be
discussing
a
proposal
to
implement
fixed
a
fixed
rate
dialogues
from
pairwise
maker.
Dow
currently
has
three
proposals
to
implement
fixed-rate
loans.
B
A
B
Awesome,
so
let
me
introduce
myself
real,
quick
and
my
team
a
little
bit
about
myself.
I've
been
really
fascinated
by
maker
dao
for
a
very
long
time,
probably
all
the
way
back
to
2015
when
I
first
found
out
about
it
and
I've
been
very
committed
to
doing
what
I
can
to
help
it
succeed,
and
that's
that's
why
I've
done
things
like
joining
the
open
market
committee
and
some
other
committees
that
involved
in
maker
that
are
part
of
maker
dow
to
to
to
you
to
really
put
us
on
the
right
track
to
success.
B
B
So
just
to
sum
up,
I
mean
what
what
that
theory
states
is
that
if
you
it's
very
difficult
to
control,
if,
if
you
have
no
monetary,
no,
if
you
try
to
get
a
fixed
peg
of
currency,
exchange
rate,
sovereign
interest
rate
policy
and
lack
of
capital
controls-
and
this
is
something
we've
tried
to
bring
up
on
the
forums
and
we've
got
some
very
interesting
responses
out
of
people
like,
like
makerman,
for
example,
has
been
very
active.
Talking
about
how
talking
about
how
you
know
impossible.
B
B
So
right
now
make
or
not
everything
is
overnight.
You
you,
you,
you
do
your
ether,
vaults
and
everything
pretty
much
per
the
second,
the
interest
rates
being
calculated
as
the
seconds
go
by
and
what
we
do
we.
What
we
envision
is
that
what
can?
What
can
happen?
Is
that
make
your
cadav
just
like
a
bank?
B
Would
have
a
bunch
of
maturities
and
tenors
for
its
kind
and
manage
assets
and
liabilities
that
way,
so
that's
why
we
propose
a
solution
for
providing
fixed
rates
and
not
only
fixed
rates,
fixed
terms,
and
that's
really
those
two
really
go
together
and
by
providing
fixed
rate
and
fixed
terms,
we
can
do
a
lot
of
great
things.
One
we
can
maintain
the
stability
of
die
over
a
longer
term.
We
can
maintain
die
as
a
decentralized
product.
B
We
can
provide
better
guarantees
to
the
clients
of
maker
dow
because
they
don't
have
to
worry
about
changing
interest
rates,
and
we
can
also
do
all
that
and
have
some
really
good,
sound
policy
which
which
can
really
build
a
great
defile
around
us.
I'll.
Tell
you
a
little
bit
about
my
own
background.
I
got
started
actually
in
crypto,
when
I
helped
the
ethereum
foundation,
with
their
post,
ico,
financing
and
just
a
very
small
deal
between
them
and
a
toronto
venture.
Capitalist
called
xdl
capital.
B
I
worked
for
that
venture
capital
group
and
grew
my
investor
network.
That
way
and
later
I
worked
with
astronaut
at
kpmg,
also
my
business
partner
who's
on
the
line.
Right
now
and
we
work
together
at
kpmg
on
a
variety
of
audit
and
blockchain
projects,
I'm
going
to
tell
you
a
bit
about
ashwin,
because
she's,
pretty
a
modest
astronaut
is
the
founding
member
of
the
of
the
bit
of
the
r
d
team
at
what
became
india's
largest
startup
called
paytm.
B
B
B
B
B
B
Just
so,
I
could
get
a
sense
for
where,
where,
where
the
dye,
where
the
dye
market
was-
and
I
actually
went
from
new
york
to
argentina,
to
get
a
sense
of
to
get
a
sense
of
what,
where
maker,
that
I
was
heading
in
the
business
development
front
and
we
and
we're
committed
to
working
with
with
maker,
does
core
units
to
really
promote
the
use
of
fixed-rate
products
and
to
help
grow.
The
ecosystem,
we're
also
developing
some
newer
products
which
will
be
announced
later
year
later
next
year.
B
We
like
we,
like
the
model
code,
is
a
law
and
we
like
to
develop
products
around
the
idea
that
code
is
law
and
we
we
that's
not
only
in
the
financial
sense
and
we're
gonna.
We
want.
We
want
to
develop
more
more
derivative
products,
derivative
products
which
can
be
used
all
across
d5,
where
the
derivative
contract
being
settled
is
that
on
chain,
and
that's
what
we
mean
by
code
as
well.
B
I'm
gonna
in
a
couple
minutes,
I'm
gonna
hand
it
off
to
ashwin
real
quick
to
show
you
our
main
demo.
We
have
deployed
contracts
on
mainnet
with
our
front
end.
We're
gonna
show
you
what
it
all
looks
like
last
piece
I'll
say
is
that
we
we
do
own
some
intellectual
property
around
using
smart
contracts
to
facilitate
floating
to
fix
on
maker
vaults,
and
it
was
already
granted
in
japan
and
we're
and
we're
pursuing
it
in
other
countries
as
well,
so
also
I'll
hand
it
over
to
you
to
show
a
quick
demo
of
the
platform.
C
C
C
C
C
So
it's
a
full
web
3
app
and
you
can
log
in
with
your
wallet
of
choice
and
I'm
gonna.
You
know
in
the
within
the
maker
dial
protocol
or
somewhere
within
the
pairwise
protocol.
There's
essentially,
you
know
three
participants,
it's
the
borrower,
the
lender
and
the
administrator,
which
is
the
dow
that
we're
seeding
around
the
protocol,
and
so
I'm
going
to
log
in
as
the
borrower
just
to
give
a
quick
tour
of
our.
C
So
we
already
have
some
capital
deployed.
These
are
just
like
test
deals
to
kind
of
stress
test.
The
protocol
we
in
addition
to
a
front
end
and
a
smart
contract
system.
We
also
have
a
back
end
that
not
only
does
you
know
triggers
the
cache
mediation.
We
also
have
an
oracle
system
that
is
listening
to
collateral
valuations,
based
on
maker,
dao's,
oracle
feeds
and
and
and
and
with
that
complimentary
risk
engine
that
will
notify
users
if
their
vaults
or
their
deals.
D
C
We
also,
you
know,
provide
information
on
the
vault
state
and
we're
constantly
monitoring,
bald
states.
You
know,
on
behalf
of
participants,
to
you,
know,
ensure
that
you
know
the
vaults
are
at
adequate
collateralization
ratio
and
and
as
well
as
we
track
internal
balances
in
terms
of
the
cash
flows
that
we
manage
between
borrower
and
escrow
accounts
that
manage
the
fixed
rates.
On
top
of
you
know
the
agreement
details,
we
also
are
keeping
track
of
the
update
history.
C
This
includes
all
key
transactions
from
the
onboarding
of
the
borrower
and
the
onboarding
of
a
lender
to
the
agreement,
as
well
as
the
cash
flows
that
happen
in
response
to
interest
rate
changes.
If
you
click
on
any
of
these
transactions,
it'll
just
take
you
to
ether
scan
where
you
can
inspect
the
more
granular
details
of
the
transaction
involved
and
as
well
as
you
can.
You
know,
see
exactly
what
the
smart
contracts
are
doing
with
within
the
transaction.
C
C
Maybe
if
we
have
time
I'll
take
you,
you
know
into
a
demo
on
our
covant
test
app,
because
then
I
can
show
you
the
full
life
cycle
that
happens,
and
maybe
what
I'll
show
you
is
just
a
quick
visual
of
what
that
life
cycle
looks
like
throughout
a
term
loan.
You
can
read
this
in
our
white
paper,
but
essentially
so
what
happens?
Is
you
know
a
borrower?
C
You
know
the
fra
begins
with
a
borrower
creating
and
posting
a
pending
deal
to
the
platform,
so
the
borrower
will
create
an
fra.
They
will
onboard
their
collateral
assets
to
that
fixed
rate
agreement
and
once
they've
signed
off
on
that
transaction,
it
will
be
posted
in
the
protocol
and
the
protocol
has
an
automated
management
system
to
automatically
either
approve
or
reject
the
proposed
loan.
C
Based
on
you
know
your
basic,
you
know,
you
know,
principles
of
you
know,
making
sure
there's
the
right,
collaterization
ratio
and
we're
above
dust
limits
and
things
like
that
and
then
upon
approval
of
the
fra.
The
agreement
will
then
be
added
to
changing
status
from
pending
agreement
to
an
open
agreement,
and
what
that
does
is
makes
that
agreement
available.
C
Now
to
a
marketplace
of
die
investors,
so
these
are
investors
from
corporate
treasuries
to
folks
who
are
looking
for
fixed
income
products
with
very
low
risk,
low
risk,
meaning
you
know,
while
they
would
like
to
get.
You
know
some
kind
of
yield
in
return,
they're
willing
to
sacrifice
a
lower
interest
rate
in
return
for
principal
protection
and
because
we've
set
up
the
fras
to
manage
both
the
borrower
and
lender
escrows
were
able
to
because
we
locked
the
lender
die
in
in
a
dsr
within
the
fra.
C
We're
able
to
guarantee
that
the
principal
will
remain
intact
in
the
event
of
a
credit
default
from
the
borrower,
and
so
once
that
deal
is
posted
to
the
marketplace,
a
lender
can
scan
over
various
various
deals
and
then
accept
it
and
match
the
principle
once
it's
matched,
then
it's
the
die
loan
is
unlocked.
The
vault
is,
then
the
escrows
are
then
locked
within
the
contract
and
then
what
we
produce.
C
A
B
Yeah,
so
I
can
answer
that
we
do
require
a
camera
party
for
the
deal
because
we
think
we
think
it's
necessary
for
there
to
be
a
matched
book
where,
for
every
liability,
there's
an
asset
for
every
asset.
There's
the
liability
there.
So
that's
how
we
see
it
at
the
same
time.
You
know
we
do
think
that
a
lot
of
dye
users
are
interested
in
this
product.
A
B
I
mean
a
lot
of
it.
A
lot
of
it
is
just
you
know
like
some
some
principles
of
just
capital
markets
where,
where
like
floating
rates
and
fixed
rates
like
there's,
no
free
lunches,
so
there's
no
free
lunch,
and
when,
when
you
have
floating
liabilities
and
floating
assets,
you
need
to
match
them
and
we
think
that's.
We
think.
That's
the
correct
way
to
do
it.
E
Oh,
I
think
the
main
the
main
question
was
you
know
like:
why
is
it
a
peer
that
needs
to
match
the
liability
instead
of
the
maker
protocol
itself?
And
I
guess
like
in
thinking
through
that
question
myself.
I
understand
like
if
maker
does
like
a
direct
deposit
module
and
and
just
acts
as
the
unlimited
counterparty
for
for
this
sort
of
fixed-rate
product,
then
that
die
that
it's
providing
technically
is
unbacked.
E
Unless
the
protocol
uses
the
surplus
buffer
die,
at
which
point
it
would
be
pretty
much
the
same
as
any
other
peer
that
could
that
can
interact
with
the
system
is
my
understanding.
So
that's
like
that's
kind
of
my,
my
reasoning
for
why
I
think
like
it,
has
to
be
the
borrower
and
not
maker
to
do
it.
But
if
maker
were
to
do
it
they
could
you
know
we
could
do
it
with
dye.
That's
in
the
surplus,
basically,
but
anyway,
just
thinking
out
loud.
B
B
C
Okay,
if
there's
any
other
questions,
I
you
know
put
this
visual
up
to
kind
of
show.
You
know
why
a
matchbook
is
important
and
to
kind
of
speak
to
akiva's
point.
You
know
really.
What
you
want
with
a
fixed-rate
solution
is
a
solution
that
can
a
scale
with
you
know,
with
the
existing
die
supply,
rather
than
have
inflation
pressures
kind
of
build
up,
because
there
was
an
unmatched
book
or
liabilities
and
assets
were
not
matched
or
investments
versus
lending.
C
You
know
who
were
mismatched,
and
so
you
know
we
we
touched
on
a
a
lot
of
that
in
a
white
paper,
so
happy
to
answer
for
the
questions
on
that.
You
know,
I
think
what
really
you
know
it
comes
down
to.
Is
you
know
maker?
Really,
you
know
it
has
solved
the
issue
of
a
of
a
reliable
decentralized,
stable
coin,
and
but
in
order
to
provide
fixed
rates,
it
could
basically,
you
know,
if
maker
dollar,
to
do
this.
C
C
So
it's
really
complementary
to
what
maker
dial
solves
and
it
really
solves
what
you
know.
Markets
really
want,
which
is
you
know,
a
stable
coin?
That's
decentralized
that
you
know
has
a
fixed
income
as
well.
As
you
know,
fixed
rates
for
financing
and
yeah.
I
can
do
a
little
bit
more
in
the
demo,
just
to
show
you
actual
transaction
and
how
an
agreement
is
created.
So
this
is
our
van
test
net
and
our
development
team
has
been.
You
know,
really
stress
testing.
C
The
protocol,
like
I
mentioned
before
you
can
you'll,
have
on
the
platform
deals
that
are
in
various
states
of
of
of
onboarding,
and
the
active
deals
are
the
ones
where
the
terms
are
active
and
we
we
made
it
pretty
easy
right
now
to
create
an
fra,
so
the
borrower
would
would
log
in
hit
the
create
button.
They
would
choose
a
collateral
type.
We
can
for
the
time
being
in
test
mode.
C
We
have
you
know
just
a
few
collateral
types
like
ether
and
and
the
unilp
types,
but
it's
very
easy
to
activate
all
collateral
types
on
on
our
platform,
any
collateral
type
that
that
maker
dow
accepts
within
their
cdp
evolves.
You
know
we
will
have
active
in
our
system,
and
that
includes
rwa
as
well
as
well
as
all
the
digital
assets.
That
maker
supports
its
collateral.
C
So
when
a
borrower
is
creating
a
deal
they
would
you
know,
essentially
they
would
specify
how
much
cloud
will
they
want
to
deposit.
So
I'm
just
going
to
put
three
here
and
I'm
just
going
to
take
out
a
die
data
2000
of
as
a
demo
they'll
specify
what
fixed
rate
they
want
to
offer.
The
lender
so
I'll
say
four
percent
and
for
the
purpose
of
this
demo,
I'll
just
set
the
expiration
date
to
one
day,
but
the
tenors
can
be
infinite
and
the
idea
is
that
the
borrower
will.
C
It's
the
pro
the
borrower
has
given
the
protocol
authority
to
transfer
the
collateral
to
the
agreement
contract
and
once
that
transaction
goes
through,
we
can
see
that
now
a
new
pending
deal
has
been
posted
and
we
can
see
the
details
of
that
pending
deal.
The
reason
we
put
an
approval
step
in
the
protocol.
It's
automated
on.
You
know
on
our
mainnet
system
and
manual
here.
C
You
know
above
the
dust
limit,
so
we
don't
run
into
technical
issues
in
in
managing
the
loan,
and
so
you
know
that's
what
a
borrower
does
and
a
borrower
has
the
ability
to
add
more
collateral
and
then
once
the
loan
has
been
matched
by
lender,
the
borrower
can
withdraw.
You
know
their
the
loan
principal
or
the
loan
proceeds
and
and
the
loan
becomes
active
so
and
if
anyone
has
any
questions,
feel
free
to
ask,
and
otherwise
what
I'll
do
is
I'll?
A
E
Yeah,
I
think
I
can
jump
on
now.
The
neighbor
is
a
little
quieter
now.
So
I
had.
I
had
two
questions,
so
the
first
one
I'll
ask
and
then
paper
had
one
and
then
we
can
answer
my
other
one
after
papers.
So
has
your
team
looked
at
the
deco
protocol
solution
or
the
term
lending
module
solutions,
and
I'm
curious
if
you
have
any
views
on
those
approaches
and
maybe
insights
into
how
pairwise
is
different
fundamentally
from
those.
B
There's
not
so
much
we
can
say
about
other
protocols.
Really.
Let
me
tell
what
we
could
say
we.
I
think
it's
good,
I
think
in
general
you
know
it's
good
to
have
a
vibrant
ecosystem
around
maker,
like
it's
good
to
it's
good
for
maker
to
to
have
to
have
a
lot
of
different
proposals.
I
think
that's
great,
but
we
can't
say
much
else.
I
think
I
think
I
think
we
should
go
to
your
other
question
that
one
thing
I
can
answer
better.
B
Those
are
the
same
touch
points
that
any
other
client
of
maker
would
use,
so
the
the
the
regulation
of
maker
from
as
far
as
I
could,
I'm
not
a
lawyer
but
for
from
my
research
talking
to
lawyers
is
that
is
that
that
you're
going
to
be
any
different
from
maker
in
general
for
maker's
perspective,
how
much
is
maker
actually
learning
versus
the
peer
providing
yeah?
I
mean
yeah,
just
just
to
give
you
a
clear
view
of
our
regulatory
situation.
B
We're
we
have
partnerships
with
regulated
investment
banks
and
what
we
plan
on
doing
is
is
is
using
our
network
of
investment
banks
to
to
to
use
this
and
to
and
to
and
to
sort
of
you
know,
do
it
in
a
compliant
way.
So
we're
not
we're
not
obviously
we're
not
gonna
we're
not
gonna
go
against
securities
law.
So
so,
but
just
just
to
give
you
a
clear
picture,
I
mean,
I
think
I
think
it
could
be
perceived
in
different
ways
from
a
regulation.
C
Yeah,
if
I
can
say
you
know
something
on
the
first
question,
you
know
we
did
address.
You
know
different
approaches
to
fixed-rate
provision
in
our
white
paper,
and
you
know
you
can
kind
of
read
just
the
introduction
of
our
white
paper
and
and
we
go
through.
You
know
where
you
know
we
see
pairwise
in
terms
of
not
just
fitting
fixed
rate
provision,
but
the
way
we
approach
fixed
rate
provision
through
a
composable
design
really
allows
us
to
go.
C
You
know
into
kind
of
like
a
broader
realm
of
you
know,
derivative
contracts
that
you
know
that
would
essentially
help
bridge
the
existing
d5
space
with
legacy
capital
markets.
So
the
composable
design
is
is
one
innovation.
You
know
that
we
brought
the
market-
and
we
kind
of
described
here
in
this
section-
the
different
approaches
to
fix
rate
provisions
and
so
invite
you
to
read
this
section
and
happy
to
also
hear
your
feedback
on
on
this
as
well
as
counterpoints.
C
You
to
specific
sections,
but
as
akiva
mentioned,
it's
really
providing
the
you
know
the
the
right
kinds
of
white-listed,
on-ramps
and
off-ramps
from
dai
and
from
ethereum
in
general,
so
that
corporate
treasuries
who
are
kind
of
in
the
legacy
world
as
well
as
you
know,
real
world
financiers
who
are
you
know,
building
assets
in
the
real
world.
They
can
do
so
safely.
You
know
from
the
jurisdictions
that
they
reside
in
and
so
there's
more
than
just
a
smart
contract
system.
E
Oh
yes,
so
so,
actually,
so
before,
so
I'm
just
listing
questions
as
they
come
to
me,
but
I'm
curious
to
get
one
of
my
questions
answered
that
wasn't,
which
was
the
one
here.
So
it's
kind
of
like
a
user
experience
question,
because
I
realized
that
when
somebody
creates
an
fra,
they
have
to
kind
of
wait
for
the
system
to
either
match
them
or
for
another
peer
to
be
like
okay.
This
is
acceptable.
So
I'm
curious.
E
Is
there
a
range
of
parameters
at
a
given
time
in
which
the
fra
is
created,
where
it
instantly
gets
fulfilled,
where
there
isn't
that,
like
waiting
period
for
for
it
to
get
picked
up,
maybe
based
on
like
yeah?
I
don't
know,
basically
I'm
just
seeing
if
there's
ever
a
case
where
it's
instant
and
there's
no
waiting
time.
B
B
There
would
already
be
a
sort
of
sort
of
sales
process
where,
where
the
borrower
would
already
be
going
around,
almost
like
a
road
show
presenting
to
different
investors
around
the
fixed
income
side,
and
that
way
they
can
already
come
to
agreement
before
they
start
posting
on
the
platform
just
like
just
like
any
other
capital
markets,
transaction
and
that
way
by
the
time
they're
posted
on
the
platform
it's
already
agreed,
and
they
can
just
go
in
one.
Second,
like
that.
B
We
rely
a
lot
on
on
off-chain
discussions
where
you
know
we're
not
even
talking
we're
not
even
talking
in
the
blockchain,
we're
doing
we're
doing
a
whole,
we're
doing
a
whole
presentation
for
for
the
client
and
just
like
on
a
regular
caller
in
person,
and
that
way
you
can
come
to
agreement
and
then,
by
the
time,
everyone's
ready,
you
don't
have
to
wait
between
the
pending
period.
You
know
very
quickly.
E
Right
right,
yeah
that
makes
sense,
and
then
my
second
question
was
about
how
much
is
maker
actually
lending
versus
the
peer
providing
the
die
for
the
fra.
So
so
yeah
like
I
was
curious
more
about
like
a
ratio
or
a
figure.
So
if
somebody
borrows
100k
through
maker
through
a
pairwise
fra,
how
much
of
it
is
freshly
generated,
die
versus
pure
die.
B
We
just
we
want
to
see
at
the
beginning,
there's
more
risk
when
you
reduce
it,
because
then,
if
let's
say
the
dsr
goes
to
like
500,
which
probably
won't
happen,
but
if
it
does,
we
need
to
be
resilient
and
robust
and
anti-fragile
to
that.
But
but
but
if
we
can
be
sure
that
the
dso
won't
go
above
like
20
or
something,
then
we
could
and
we
could
change
that
and
potentially
require
a
lower
amount.
E
Does
that
give
us
like?
I
don't
know,
maybe
I
don't
know
what's
like
what's
wrong
in
my
thinking,
but
I'm
imagining
that
a
fixed
rate
vault
through
pairwise
might
actually
offer
a
cheaper
rate
than
the
floating
rate,
in
contrast
to
something
like
obvi's
fixed
rates,
which
are
typically
at
a
premium.
Yeah.
D
E
B
I
mean
generally
the
way
we
see
it
is
that
there
there
is
a
research
like
which,
which
suggests
that,
when,
when
you
have,
when
you
have
a
party
which
is
guaranteeing
a
fixed
income
deal
that
actually
reduces
the
cost
of
capital.
So
when
maker
has
a
tremendous
55
million
dollar
system
surplus
buffer
and
that
that's
backing
all
the
die
so
by
by
going
through
this
by
go
by
doing
a
deal
which
is
involved
with
that
surplus
buffer,
we
actually,
we
actually
reduce
the
cost
of
capital
in
in
a
general
in
a
general
sense.
B
In
the
general
sense,
the
idea
is
to
reduce
cost
of
capital.
That's
part
of
why
we're
pursuing
this,
because
if
we
want
to
make
an
acre
really
scale
and
want
to
make
make
it
really
huge,
we
need
to
offer
competitive
terms
to
companies
out
there
in
the
world.
So
the
idea
is
to
reduce
the
cost
of
capital.
But
that
being
said,
there
could
be.
It
is
dependent
on
the
expectation
of
the
dsr,
so
it
could
be
higher
or
lower
than
the
floating
radon
maker,
but
it
should
be.
It
should
be
lower.
That's
the
target.
B
Well,
from
their
perspective,
from
from
the
from
the
cash
rich
investors
and
perspective,
which
is
the
lender's
perspective,
they
they
have,
they
have
on
one
hand
they
hold
diet,
so
they
have.
The
risk
of
radius
are
going
down
on
the
other
side.
They
have
this
fra,
which
the
risk
is
the
opposite.
So
the
idea
is
to
neutralize
everything
so
pretty
much.
Nobody
has
any
more
risk
and
everyone.
Everyone
just
has
a
nice
safe
exposure.
F
For
having
a
question
hey,
I
joined
a
little
late,
but
got
a
question
with
regards
to
your
product
here.
Is
it
fair
to
say
that
pairwise
touches
bolts
and
liquidations,
in
other
words
maker
here,
is
going
to
be
two
or
three?
You
know
it's
taking
on
two
or
three
counterparty
risk,
meaning
that
makers
taking
on
fixed
rate,
lender
and
treasury
risk
and
also
is
the
credit
support
provider.
B
Well,
it's
it's
fair
to
say
that
maker
is
the
credit
support
provider,
but
that
general,
as
far
as
I
can
see,
that
generally
is
the
business
that
maker
is
in
maker
maker.
Makes
money
by
by
by
by
guarantee
by
you
know,
mkr
holder
is
guaranteeing
the
die
supply.
So
I
think
in
that
sense
it's
right.
Yeah.
F
B
No,
we
don't
we
don't
we
don't
deal
with
liquidations
right.
The
idea
is
that
maker
maker
is
a
very
advanced
system
for
dealing
with
liquidations,
so
we,
in
terms
of
the
code,
the
smart
contract
that
we've
released
this
afternoon,
you
won't
find
anything
in
there
about
liquidations.
All
of
that
is
is
dealt
with
by
maker
and
that's,
and
just
just
to
clarify
in
terms
of
our
proposal,
we're
not
proposing
any
code
changes
to
maker
whatsoever.
F
Yeah,
I
think
that
was
one
of
the
questions.
Well,
jerry
has
a
different
question
with
regards
to
auditing
the
code,
but
I
guess
the
code
was
released
a
little
bit
later.
You
said
like
today
right
and
is
that
because
it
wasn't
ready
yet
I
mean
what
was
the
reason
behind
releasing
both
the
white
paper
and
the
the
code
a
little
bit.
You
know
way
after
you,
you
submitted
the
the
mips
six
application.
B
F
D
B
Yeah
and
yeah
and
we
were
audited
by
iosiro,
so
ios
hyrule
is
a
somewhat
well
known,
pretty
well
known
a
d5
audit
firm
and
with
the
outdoor
smart
contracts.
We're
we're
going
through
another
audit
in
the
next
few
weeks,
so
we're
looking
at
engaging
some
of
the
alternators
which
actually
audited
mcd,
so
so
so
yeah.
So
hopefully
we
can
release
some
more
audit
results
soon.
A
Yeah,
certainly
I
I
have
another
question
about
liquidations.
If
I'm
curious
since
frank
brought
it
up
like
do,
do
liquidations
essentially
work
the
same
in
this
context.
So
if
someone
creates
a
a
fixed
rate
loan
and
then
their
collateral,
the
value
of
the
collateral
drops,
does
it
get
liquidated
as
usual?
Or
do
you
have
something
in
place
similar
to
device
saver
to
help
mitigate
that
or
how's
that
yeah
it
gets?
It's.
C
Liquidated
as
usual,
and
what
that
does
in
the
pairwise
protocol
it
it
basically
triggers
the
term
to
end
prematurely,
so
it's
basically
a
call
risk
and
upon
a
liquidation
event,
the
fra
is
is
ended
and
the
escrows
are
returned
to
their
respective
owners.
In
that
scenario,
yeah
you
know
the
principal
is
protected
for
the
the
lender.
C
Of
course
they
lose
on
the
interest
income
and,
of
course,
the
borrower
will
have
to
deal
with
the
fact
that
they,
their
the
vault,
was
liquidated,
and
but
you
know
that
happens
seamlessly
in
our
protocol.
What
I'll
say
about
you
know
in
terms
of
the
lender
risk,
because
it
came
up
in
another
question-
is
essentially
what
you're
looking
here
in
the
fra
is,
you
know
the
ability
you
know
the
way
we
kind
of
composed.
You
can
take
a
look
at
our
code.
C
The
reason
why
possible
design
is
is
attractive.
Here
is
because
it's
really
a
way
of
managing
multiple
competing
interests
within
a
capital
stack
in
this
case.
It's
a
it's
a
three-party
deal
between
the
borrower,
the
lender
and
maker
dao,
and
the
order
of
priority
in
in
terms
of
who
gets
what
money.
When
what
cash
flow,
what
happens
during
liquidation?
C
That's
all
handled
you
know
within
within
the
smart
contract,
in
a
very
composable
way,
and
what
that
allows
us
to
do
over
time
is
now
create
next
generations
of
fra
contracts,
where
we
can
start
to
address
things
such
as
insurance
or
hedging
on
on
the
lender's.
You
know
interest
income
as
an
example.
So
this
is
why
we're
super
excited,
because
one
is
the
solution
can
provide
an
immediate.
C
This
is
an
immediate
solution
for
fixed
rate
provisions
on
maker
dow
we're
already
on
mainnet
we're
going
through
audits,
and
so
this
is
very
much
gtm
ready,
but
you
know
there's
a
whole
wider
future
of
all
kinds
of
extensible
derivatives
we
can
create
even
just
on
top
of
maker
dao.
So
that's.
What
really
has
us
excited.
F
Yeah
I
was
wondering
if
and
this
this
probably
hasn't
been
done
yet,
but
have
you
guys
run
any
kind
of
numbers
as
far
as
like
a
forecaster
of
what
you
know,
what
kind
of
cash
flow
forecast
so
to
speak,
this
product
can
bring
and
if
you
haven't,
then
maybe
you
have
some
thoughts
it.
So
I'm
saying
the
simulation
right
like
if
you
get
a
tvl
of
100
million,
500
million,
et
cetera.
C
Actually,
yeah
yeah,
that's
our
investment
banking
team,
saxon
advisors
in
the
uk
have
actually
you
know
done
that
research,
so
what
they
did
was
they
looked
at
the
entire
securitization
market
around
the
world
and
actually
broke
it
down
country
by
country?
It
was
actually
impressive
what
they
did
and
we
can
make.
You
know
some
of
that
research
available
as
well.
We
just
have
to
kind
of
you
know
make
it.
You
know
consumable
for
you
guys,
but
what
they
did
was
they
looked
at.
C
C
That
maker
dao
is
in
a
position
to
capture
and
maker
dao
is
in
a
position
to
capture
the
majority
of
it,
because
I
think,
in
terms
of
real
world
assets,
you
know,
I
think
speaker
has
the
first
advantage
over
some
of
the
pure
other
peer
protocols
and
from
maker
dao,
who
you
know
our
investment
bankers,
you
know.
Did
you
know
a
kind
of
analysis?
Okay,
what
kind
of
market
could
a
product
like
pairwise
capture
and
how
would
that
grow
over
time?
C
And
certainly
you
know
in
the
early
stages
it's
going
to
be.
You
know,
starting
at
you
know,
seven
eight
figure.
You
know
test
deals
really.
I
think
we're
at
the
early
adopter
stage
where
different
securitizers
are
seeing
the
potential
and
and
they're
working
with
the
maker
in
different
capacities
to
bring
their
you
know
to
securitize
and
tokenize
and
bring
their
collateral
into
maker
dow
for
fix
for
fun.
C
You
know
towards
the
end
of
this
year
and
in
the
beginning
of
next
to
in
one
year
you
know
one
billion
to
two
billion
being
actively.
You
know
brought
in
as
pbl
on
the
platform
through
pairwise,
and
you
know
the
way
pairwise
is
set
up.
Any
deals
that
are
being
on
pairwise
are
concurrently
made
on
maker
dow,
so
we
kind
of
both
get
to
enjoy
the
pbl's.
C
Yeah-
and
I
think
you
know
there
really
is
a
lot
of
unknowns
in
terms
of
you-
know,
understanding
the
markets
right.
So
I
think
you
know
we've
done
really
well
in
understanding,
securitizers
and
originators,
and
what
we
are
really
lacking
is
understanding
of
who
would
be
the
potential
die
investors,
so
one
is
what
are
existing
die
holders
actually
doing
with
the
dive
that
they're,
you
know
purchasing
you
know
on
the
open
market,
for
investment
purposes
or
or
what
have
you?
C
You
know,
that's
one
unknown
and
of
course
you
know
we're
busy
talking
with
corporate
treasuries
and
folks
kind
of
on
the
institutional
side
to
really
understand
what
makes
them
comfortable,
even
just
investing
in
a
stable
coin.
Forget
that
it's
even
decentralized.
What
would
even
you
know
what
would
remove
the
inhibition
of
even
say
using?
You
know
any
of
the
centralized
stable
coins
as
your
kind
of
gateway
to
you
know
the
the
d5
world,
and
that's
what
you
know.
C
You
know
as
much
as
we're
working
on
the
technical
side,
we're
really
working
on
the
problems
on
the
business
development
side
and
would
love
to
engage
the
the
community
at
large
on.
You
know
how
we
can
understand
the
market
better
and
how
we
can
you
know,
create
products
that
will
that
will
serve
their
needs.
A
E
Yeah
I
was
like
thinking
through
the
whole
design
and
and
I'm
curious
like
for
some
reason.
My
brain
is
pointing
me
towards
the
conclusion
that
a
dye
depositor
in
dsr
would
get
a
better
yield
than
the
pairwise
fra
die,
pier
and
like
my
reasoning
for
thinking
that
is
that
all
right
like,
if
I'm
putting
up
let's
say
100k,
it
gets
matched
on
an
fra,
all
right,
so
the
protocol.
Let's
say
this
is
all
east
right.
E
E
C
These
are
extremely
sensitive
to
interest
rate
changes.
So
it's
not
just
you're
getting
the
best
rates
or
getting
in
when
rates
are
low
and
locking
it
in
it's
really
about
just
having
a
predictable
cost
of
capital,
because
once
you
know,
there's
a
predictable
cost
of
capital
for
financing.
That
organization
cannot
have
any
deviation
in
terms
of
managing
those
costs
from
any
uncertainties
that
you
know
that
they're
facing
especially
from
from
potential
credit
risk.
C
So
you
know
that's
something,
we're
very
cognizant
of
and
and
that's
why
we
kind
of
designed
the
solution
and
we
envisioned
the
marketplace
and
it
will
be
a
you
know,
a
marketplace
that
will
adjust
its
expectations
of
you
know
what
would
be
the
rate
fluctuation
over
a
period
of
time
and
then
borrowers
and
lenders
will
essentially
negotiate.
You
know
what
that
fixed
rate
should
be,
for
you
know
the
loans
that
they
enter
into.
A
B
If
there's,
if
there's
one
message
to
take
away
from
this,
is
that
ashwin
and
I
are
very
actively
working
on
growing
the
dye
user
base,
we're
actively
using
investor
networks
to
increase
the
amount
of
people
holding
dye
and
at
volume
and
at
and
at
corporations
as
well
and
and
all
that
stuff.
So
that's
what
we're
doing
and
that's
what
we
want.
You
guys
to
know.
E
E
No
final,
I
mean
I
can't
speak
for
everybody
else,
but
actually
a
final
comment
from
me.
So
next
week
on
the
12th,
I
know
akiva
and
ashford
might
already
know
this,
but
they
are
invited
to
an
issue.
Discussion
call
that
we
are
hosting
in
partnership
with
constant
production,
but
we're
gonna
go
through
the
different
fixed-rate
solutions
that
exist.