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A
A
A
A
Hence
starting
an
open
discussion
about
what
and
how
values
such
as
equity,
justice
and
diversity
influence.
Our
science
is
important.
More
specifically,
our
community,
the
csm
community
needs
to
begin
having
conversations
about
how
the
scientific
community
can
work
in
effective
ways
with
the
diversity
of
stakeholder
communities
to
produce
information.
That's
reflective
of
complicated
ethical
issues
we
encounter
at
the
intersections
of
climate
change
and
justice
so
quickly.
A
Information
about
the
layout
of
the
session
we're
first
going
to
have
three
speakers
a
keynote
talk
that
will
be
around
30
minutes
by
dr
joella
ajibade,
who
will
speak
with
us
about
what
justice
means
in
the
climate
context
and
how
we
should
understand
the
multiple
dimensions
of
justice
in
terms
of
the
ways
in
which
they
can
intersect
and
conflict.
When
we're
thinking
about
climate,
we're
then
going
to
hear
from
two
members
of
the
csm
community
who've
been
thinking
about,
and
working
on,
issues
of
justice
within
their
own
research.
A
First
speaker,
there
will
be
laura
laundrum
and
then
the
second
one
will
be
yifon
chang
and
those
talks
will
be
around
30
minutes,
while
joel's
stock
will
be
a
little
bit
longer
about
25
or
30..
Our
session
will
then
conclude
with
around
an
hour
for
questions
and
discussion
between
the
audience
and
our
speakers.
A
So
three
possible
questions
to
take
into
consideration
are
how
we
can
do
science.
That
is
aware
of
and
consistent
with,
environmental
and
social
justice
concerns
in
the
context
of
climate
change,
how
we
can
incorporate
social
values
in
a
legitimate
way
into
our
climate,
science,
research
and,
lastly,
how
we
can
produce
information
for
adaptation,
resilience,
innovation,
intervention
and
mitigation,
that's
responsive
to
diversity
of
values,
beliefs
and
perspectives
that
exists
across
the
communities
and
cultures
that
are
impacted
by
climate
change.
A
B
B
B
B
But
I've
also
read
in
other
people's
research
to
understand
all
the
different,
multi-layered
issues
that
we
need
to
think
about
as
we
work
on
climate
justice
or
as
we
work
on
climate
change
and
justice
as
two
separate
issues,
but
also
at
issues
that
intersect
in
multiple
ways
and
on
multiple
levels.
When
we're
thinking
about
impact
when
we're
thinking
about
the
causation
first
and
then
the
impact
on
different
communities
and
then
the
action
and
inaction,
how
sometimes
some
actions
can
actually
assassinate
injustices
and
how
some
actions
can
actually
allow
us
to
address
existing
problems.
B
So
thank
you
again,
everyone
and
I'm
just
gonna
move
on
many
of
you
will
be
familiar
with
this
donut
economics,
visual
framework,
which
I
I
also
really
like.
It's
a
framework
for
sustainable
development,
and
in
this
framework
you
can
see
the
first
part
here
somewhere
here
you
can
see
which
talks
about
the
ecological
ceiling.
The
idea
of
you
know
as
humanity.
B
But
there's
a
lot
of
we've
fallen
short
in
many
ways
when
you
look
at
it
on
global
level
and
the
number
of
people
in
poverty,
you
look
at
the
number
of
people
without
access
to
energy,
without
access
to
clean
water
or
even
housing,
and
then,
when
you
intersect,
that
with
challenges
that
we're
seeing
with
that
impact
of
climate
change,
that
is
exacerbating
those
problems.
But
we
also
know
that
climate
change
is
one
of
many
issues
that
we're
dealing
with.
It's
not
the
only
issue.
B
There
is
air
pollution,
there
is
loss
of
biodiversity,
some
of
which
is
caused
by
humans
as
well.
The
land
transformation
we're
seeing
chemical
pollutions
as
well,
so
those
are
key
issues
that
are
important
and
if
you
look
at
the
second
diagram
here,
you
also
see
this
other
one
about
people
thinking
here
same
robots
and
others,
and
some
of
the
other
people
have
even
improved
of
this
diagram.
B
A
few
of
you
or
many
people
here
might
be
from
the
u.s.
We
know
that
in
the
us
as
well,
there
is
a
historical
blaze
place
based
in
justices
right.
That
is
also
intersecting
in
many
ways
with
contemporary
injustices,
such
as
you
know,
the
sighting
of
industrial
waste,
the
oil
refineries
who
is
living
near
those
places
and
who
is
exposed
to
air
pollution.
B
There
are
a
lot
of
research
that
has
shown
that
it's
mostly
people
of
color,
it's
low-income
people
that
are
exposed
to
these
problems
that
are
also
exposed
to
cancer
and
and
and
asthma.
Because
of
this,
existing
industrial
sighting
of
industrial
is
near
people
of
color.
So
those
are
another
justice
issue
that
we
need
to
think
about,
and
that's
environmental
justice
issue
which
also
intersect
with
climate
justice
issue.
So,
and
there
are
other
ways
in
which
we
know
sometimes
efforts
to
address
climate
change,
or
sometimes
efforts
to
mitigate
climate
change.
It
may
involve
greening.
B
It
may
involve
relocation
of
people.
Again,
we
see
that
in
some
cases
it's
the
display.
It
leads
to
the
displacement
of
black,
in
some
cases,
indigenous
communities
as
well.
So
there
is
this
legacy
of
multi-layered
environmental
injustices.
That
is
also
layered
on
the
extraction
of
people's
labor.
That
is
also
layered
on
the
transformation
of
land
that
is,
makes
our
current
existence
a
very
difficult,
particularly
low
income
and
people
of
color.
So
when
thinking
about
the
justice
dimension,
what
does
it
mean?
B
B
So
black
brown
people,
indigenous
communities,
they
consider
issues
around
labor
rights,
land
rights,
housing,
health
and
other
social,
social
justice
concerns
as
part
of
the
larger
picture
of
the
environment,
but
also
a
part
of
a
larger
picture
of
addressing
climate
change
issue,
which
I
think
is
important.
But
we
must
be
careful
not
to
conflict
this
with
the
existing
cultural
words,
and
I
will
talk
about
that
in
key
more
in
a
moment.
B
Another
thing
I
want
to
emphasize
here
when
we're
thinking
about
climate
justice
is
also
the
building
of
coalitions
at
the
global
level
to
address
this
issue
and
really
bringing
together
a
variety
of
progressive
allies,
people
of
different
races,
religion
to
really
push
forward
for
efforts.
Although
the
kinds
of
efforts
we
want
to
see
are
not
really
where
it
needs
to
be.
B
At
the
moment,
as
this
is
going
on,
we're
also
seeing
a
lot
of
climate
disinformation
happening
right,
we're
seeing
people
coming
up
with
stories
some
this
information,
which
is
really
just
sometimes
deliberately
mixing
up
information
to
to
really
delay
action,
and
sometimes
it's
just
misinformation
where
people
spread
inaccurate
information
about
what's
going
on
climate
change,
and
when
you
see
the
confliction
of
misinformation
and
disinformation
about
climate
change
come
together
with
this
culture,
what
is
particularly
happening
in
the
us,
but
by
culture?
What
is
this
war
around?
B
You
know
people
don't
want
crt,
that's
the
what
you
call
the
race
theory,
critical
race
theory
in
classrooms
or
the
abortion
rights
or
or
things
around
lgbt
rights,
and
they
are
conflicting.
Those
issues
with
issues
around
climate
information
and
sort
of
using
those
things
to
delay
action.
Those
are
problems,
but
for
me
the
problem
is
really
what,
when
you
interpret
those
issues,
what
it
means
it's
delivering.
You
delay
action
on
climate
change.
B
It
means
that
people
that
have
been
historically
marginalized
people
who
are
really
experiencing
the
impact
of
climate
change,
particularly
frontline
communities,
are
likely
to
continue
to
see
those
impact.
If
we
don't
move
very
fast,
so
climate
disinformation,
as
far
as
I'm
concerned,
is
also
a
form
of
injustice
because
it
prevents
action.
It
prevents
the
kinds
of
climate
actions
that
we
really
need
to
move
the
needle
forward.
So
that's
one
thing
I
want
to
put
out
there.
B
The
other
issue
I
want
to
put
out
is
also
the
the
narrative
we
talk
about
when
we're
thinking
and
scientists
are
also
involved
in
this.
Where
we
talk
about
climate
change
as
though
it's
a
futuristic
issue
like
you
know,
we
just
need
to
stabilize
the
climate
at
plus
one
1.5
degrees
celsius,
the
global
average
temperature
of
that
and
we'll
kind
of
define
right
now.
B
Obviously
we
know
there
are
all
these
transitions
that
are
scary
for
everyone,
but
I
would
say
for
many
communities,
especially
places
that
I
work
on,
I
will
talk
about
them
soon.
Those
impacts
are
today,
the
people
are
experiencing
them
and-
and
we
need
to
begin
to
really
push
for
real
action
so
that
we
people
we
can
see
the
kinds
of
changes
that
people
really
need,
so
people
can
have
access
to
water,
they
need
for
their
survival
access
to
agriculture,
food.
B
All
of
those
things
have
been
impacted
by
climate
change,
so
we
need
to
change
our
discuss
about
this
future
impact
because
the
impacts
are
here
today,
but
they
will
be
exacerbated
as
we
know
in
the
future
and
last
and
many
of
us
will
look
through
the
pandemic
gladwell
we're
here
today,
but
in
2020
secretary
general,
antonio
guterres,
from
united
nations
called
for
something,
I
think
is
important.
I
want
to
reinfor
emphasize,
but
in
a
slightly
different
way
he
talks
about.
He
said
you
know
across
the
world.
B
B
We
know
how
that
has
played
out
and
how
you
know
the
impact
on
variety
of
people.
So
that's
one
thing
he
was
talking
about,
but
for
me
I'm
also
talking
about
those
issues
in
the
context
of
climate
change
that,
as
long
as
we
continue
to
defer
action
or
delay
action
on
climate
change,
the
impact
on
communities
that
are
already
suffering
the
frontline
communities
are
already
suffering.
B
So
that's
one
key
thing:
we
definitely
need
to
do
if
we're
really
going
to
move
the
needle
on
addressing
climate
change
through
multiple
actions
and
through
the
use
of
science,
and
the
second
thing
is
also:
there
are
traders
for
different
groups
and
our
different
skills.
Whatever
action
we
take
in
terms
of
mitigating
or
addressing
climate
change,
there
are
a
lot
of
trade-offs
which
I'll
talk
about
soon,
but
how
we
operationalize
those
trade-offs.
How
do
we
balance
them
in
my
way?
B
B
I
frame
solidarity
science
as
a
sign
that
works
with
community
to
build
a
case
for
climate
actions
on
multiple
skill
in
terms
of
adaptation
in
terms
of
resilience
in
terms
of
mitigation,
and
it's
also
a
science
that
actually
embraces
and
work
with
multiple
or
multiplicity
and
diverse
perspective
and
knowledge
system
to
reinforce
or
to
center
racial
justice,
environmental
justice,
economic
justice-
and
we
know
these
three
key
issues
also
underpin
climate
change.
So
how
do
we
bring
the
science
and
how
we
bring
these
dimensions
of
justice
together
to
really
push
for
action,
but
also
justice?
B
So
this
is
really
what
I
define
as
solidarity
science.
How
do
we
do
that
kind
of
work?
And
I
think
that
kind
of
work
is
what
we
need
going
forward
for
the
rest
of
my
talk.
I'll
talk
about
some
of
the
impact
that
we're
seeing
across
the
world
on
climate
change,
but
also
try
to
think
and
really
bring
this
old
conversation
and
story
together
on.
B
How
do
we
think
about
different
justices
as
we
address
climate
issues
with
multiple
actions
and
which
multiple
policies
and
programs,
a
lot
of
people
are
familiar
with
this
issue
around
vulnerabilities
that
climate
change
yes
is
happening,
but
also
there
are
existing
vulnerabilities
in
terms
of
our
aging
infrastructure
and
housing
in
public
services,
poverty
that
makes
particular
communities
experience.
This
impact
a
little
bit
more,
and
we
also
note
on
the
other
side.
B
So
how
do
we
begin
to
think
in
ways
where
we
center
really
the
solidarity
science
to
address?
Not
the
impact
of
climate
change,
but
also
simultaneously
addressing
existing
vulnerabilities
that
marginalized
communities
or
historically
marginalized
communities
have
faced?
That's
those
are
key
issues,
we're
thinking
about
definitely
we're
thinking
about
climate
justice.
B
When
you
look
at
it
from
a
global
perspective,
we
zoom
out
again.
We
know
for
sure
that
disaster
impacts
have
increased
and
when
you
look
at
it
on
a
decatur
level,
however,
some
people
may
argue
well
not
all
of
these
disasters
are
caused
by
climate
change.
I
think
that
may
be
true,
but
the
fact
that
disasters
are
increasing,
that's
that's
a
given,
and
then
we
also
see
that
you
know
number
of
decks
have
increased
the
number
of
amount
money.
We're
also
spending
to
deal
with.
Some
of
this.
This
crisis
has
also
increased.
B
We
also
know
things
like
flawed.
Storms
have
also
increased
across
the
world.
So
the
question.
Of
course
people
are,
you
know
there
are
a
lot
of
skeptics
out
there
what's
causing
this,
and
I
think
the
science
is
continuing
to
show,
especially
the
new
science
we're
seeing
in
terms
of
attribution
science.
B
I
would
definitely
I'm
supportive
of
that
kind
of
science
to
also
help
reinforce
the
knowledge
we're
building
in
understanding
what
is
really
causing
some
of
these
disasters
and
why
it's
that
we're
seeing
them
increase
so
certainly
kudos
to
all
of
the
scientists
working
on
contribution
science.
I
think
we
numer
of
that
sorry.
The
other
thing
I
also
want
to
talk
about
is
in
terms
of
not
just
the
impact
we're
seeing
in
built
environment
and
elsewhere
and
which
obviously
is
causing
different
impacts
physically
on
people's
debts,
but
also
pushing
people
to
migrate.
B
There
is
the
other
side
of
the
issue
that
we
need
to
think
about,
which
is
the
issue
of
the
migration
of
animals
as
well
as
animals
migrate
because
of
climate
change.
We're
also
seeing
viruses
happen.
As
you
know,
we
talked
about
kobe
just
now,
and
for
me
it's
not
just
the
connection
between
migration
and
climate
change
and
the
virus.
It's
really
what
gets
affected
when
those
virus
you
know
jump
into
humans.
B
Wu
does
not
have
those
health
insurance
access
to
good
hospital.
We
know
most
of
the
time
these
are
people
of
color.
We
know
most
of
the
time.
These
are
low-income
groups,
and
we
know
during
covet,
for
instance,
that
a
lot
of
you
know
our
teachers,
our
our
farmers,
our
especially
also
immigrant
workers.
We
know
many
of
this
group
were
exposed
and
many
of
them
also
died
our
bus
drivers,
and
so
we
need
to
definitely
put
in
a
lot
of
efforts
to
begin
to
address
these
types
of
issues.
B
B
These
are
cities
that
are
exposed
to
flooding
and
cities
that
are
also
exposed
to
well
manila
and
tokyo
is
close
to
typhoon
and
in
these
cities,
especially
in
the
girls
and
manila.
The
struggles
that
I've
seen
is
that
the
impact
of
flooding
and
the
impact
of
sea
level
rise
the
homes
that
get
repeatedly
flooded,
the
basements
that
get
brought
for
them
even
here
in
the
us,
the
blazing
don't
get
further.
Those
are
places
where
low-income
groups
leave,
and
so
those
issues
for
me
are
issues
of
climate
justice.
B
You
know
how
we
adapt
and
who
are
the
groups
of
people
that
have
been
relocated
from
areas
that
are
exposed
to
repetitive
flooding
or
areas
that
are
around
the
sea.
Many
of
those
relocations
are
low-income
groups,
but
they
have
been
moved
to
homes
that
are
not
necessarily
have
the
kinds
of
structures
that
people
want,
or
the
kinds
of
livelihood
opportunities
that
people
want.
B
So
there
is
this
injustice
also
built
into
sort
of
adaptation
and
resilience
planning
as
well,
but
as
we
look
into
the
future,
we
also
know
that
we're
likely
to
see
a
lot
more
people
be
exposed
beyond
just
those
three
places.
I've
shown
we're
likely
to
see
according
to
co-op
and
sprouts.
They
did
this
work
trying
to
look
at
with
new
estimation
of
where
are
the
places
you
may
see
a
lot
of
coastal
flooding
and
sea
level
rise
and
they
came
up
with
different
parts
of
the
world,
and
these
areas
are
also
included.
B
Alexandria,
egypt,
shanghai.
This
is
where
the
old
projection
based
on
other
people's
work,
and
these
were
their
own
new
projections
in
ho
chi
minh
entire
in
thailand
in
shanghai.
So
we're
likely
to
see
a
lot
more
people
be
exposed
to
sea
level
rise
and
flooding,
which
means
that
a
lot
of
people
will
have
to
migrate.
A
lot
of
people
will
have
to
relocate
and
according
to
corp
and
strauss,
they
said
by
200
with
me,
630
million
people
being
forced
to
relocate
or
migrate.
B
If
you
want
to
use
that
word,
and
they
said
by
2030,
we
may
see
about
350
million
people,
and
these
were
just
in
the
cities
that
they
looked
at.
It
doesn't
necessarily
include
other
rural
areas
or
areas
that
are,
you
know
small
island
states
that
are
already
experiencing
the
impacts
of
climate
change.
B
We
know
many
of
these
places
are
places
that
are
also
occupied
by
indigenous
groups.
Addition
charge,
for
example,
and
also
communities
in
alaska
as
well.
So
all
of
these
different
issues
connects
back.
For
me,
a
real
global,
but
also
local
climate
justice
concerns
that
we
as
researchers
need
to
continue
to
work
on
and
think
about.
B
It
was
yeah
and
quite
a
number
of
people
died,
but
when
you
look
at
the
ways
in
which
potline
itself
had
evolved,
particularly
I'll
talk
about
redlining
soon,
but
when
today,
some
of
the
work
that
have
been
done
by
my
colleague
vivek
sanders
actually
shows
that
there
are
parts
of
the
city
that
are
certainly
harder
than
others.
And
obviously,
you
begin
to
ask
the
question:
why
is
it
that
is
it
just
about
the
climate?
B
Or
is
it
also
that
there
are
existing
urban
and
land
use
and
housing
policies
that
are
also
engendered
these
types
of
problems?
That
makes
it
to
be
trapped
in
a
particular
location
and
for
particular
groups
of
people
to
die
more
and
in
the
last
year's
events
in
2021
we
had
about
96,
confirmed
debts,
and
some
of
these
there's
62
of
them
were
actually
in
multnomah
county
in
the
portland
area,
and
they
were
also
in
areas
that
were
historically
redlined
and
areas
that
are
fewer
trees.
B
So
those
are
key
issues,
the
access
to
trees
from
different
communities,
but
also
the
red
lining,
which
is
an
issue.
So
when
you
look
at
the
distribution
of
trees,
you
would
see
many
of
this
I'll
go
back
here.
Many
of
these
areas
are
also
areas
where
you
have
fewer
trees,
and
so
this
brings
me
to
existing
or
historical
issues
that
are
still
being
experienced
today
and
for
those
who
are
not
familiar
with
redline
I'll,
just
quickly
explain
what
it
means.
B
Redline
refers
to
the
federal
government's
practice
in
the
1930s
operating
neighborhoods
to
help
mortgage
lenders
determine
which
areas
of
the
city
are
considered
risky
or
hazardous.
So
the
federal
loan
home
owners
corporation
made
maps
and
shaded
these
maps
in
different
colors,
the
red
bean
areas
that
are
considered
the
most
riskiest
or
the
most
dangerous,
and
these
were
areas
that
you
had
african
americans
leave.
B
You
had
immigrants
living
there,
you
had
other
people
of
color
as
well,
and
this
practice
of
redlining,
along
with
other
segregationist
policy
in
the
housing
sector,
obviously
has
had
lasting
effects
and
which
is
even,
in
some
cases
some
of
those
areas.
You
still
have
concentration
of
poverty
in
some
of
those
areas
and
also
reduced
the
access
of
people
to
own
ownership
in
those
places.
B
But
that's
one
issue.
The
other
issue
is
that,
because
of
this
redlining
and
its
enduring
effect,
we're
also
seeing
that
impact
I'm
going
to
go
back
there.
The
impact
of
climate
change
is
very
severe
in
those
places
and
it's
particularly
severe
on
people
of
color
as
well.
That
lives
in
those
places
and
this
example
is
not
peculiar
to
the
portland
area.
Ulfmen
and
others
did
some
work
and
they
showed
that
across
the
us,
the
midwest,
not
east,
west
and
south.
B
They
also
noticed
that
areas
that
were
redlined
were
areas
that
you
also
had
this
correlation
with
it,
and
there
were
also
some
of
them
were
areas
where
you
had
fewer
trees
as
well,
and
you
had
also
increased
impervious
surfaces.
You
have
ash
fates,
which
obviously
wasn't
eat
island
effect.
So
when
we're
thinking
about
impact
of
climate,
we
also
have
to
think
about
the
historical
injustices
that
make
some
of
this
infect
much
more
prominent
in
communities,
and
so
it
brings
me
to
the
question
that
monica
was
saying.
B
Like
you
know,
jolla
is
going
to
help
us
think
about
some
of
the
justice
issue,
and
so
when
I
look
at
this
broad
overview
of
a
variety
of
things,
you
know
the
misinformation,
the
redlining,
the
exposure
to
flooding
the
exposure
to
sea
level
rise.
Who
is
affected
all
of
those
issues
and
I'm
thinking.
How
do
we
really
center
justice
there's
so
many
issues
you
can
think
about
the
impact
still
and
and
also
some
actions
that
also
exacerbate
problems.
B
For
instance,
in
some
cases
where
you
have
trees
being
planted
to
mitigate
the
effect
of
heat,
especially
in
low
income
communities,
we
also
realize
housing,
quality
or
housing
value
in
those
spaces
increases
and
therefore,
in
some
cases
leads
to
displacement
of
people
and
also
gentrification.
So
how
do
you
ensure
tree
planting,
for
instance,
without
genification?
B
Abolition
is
really
about
figuring
out
how
to
work
with
people
to
make
something,
rather
than
to
erase
something.
It's
really
about
a
theory
of
change.
It's
a
theory
of
you
know
a
new
form
of
social
life
and
vision
and
change
in
different
ways,
and
for
me
to
do
that,
we
need
to
think
about
a
variety
of
justice
that
comes
together
to
help
us
recenter
this
issue.
B
One
is
the
recognition
justice
you
know
recognizing
some
of
those
historical
problems
for
a
redlining
that
has
really
exposed,
and
not
just
redlining
environmental
injustice,
exposure
of
people
to
substance
materials
that
really
expose
people
because
of
where
they
who
they
are
and
where
they
live
so
really
centering.
Recognition.
Justice
is
very
important
when
we're
thinking
about
how
do
we
bring
together
this
abolition,
climate
change
approach
or
climate
justice
approach?
B
There
is
social
justice
right
which
is
giving
people
access
to
housing,
to
food,
to
resources
that
they
need
for
survival,
even
in
the
context
of
climate
change.
How
do
people
continue
to
thrive
in
spite
of
climate
change,
so
those
are
key
things
when
you
think
about
how
do
we
bring
together
social
justice
in
this
framing
as
well
in
this
work
that
we
all
need
to
do
together?
B
And
then
there
is
a
environmental
justice
issue,
which
is
a
question
of
distributive
justice
and
procedural
justice.
Right
wu
is
involved
in
decision-making
when
it
comes
to
the
sighting
of
amenities
and
of
disamenities.
We
know
that
this
amenities
is
really
by
the
same
enemies.
I
mean
air
pollution
and
toxic
waste
things
like
that,
and
even
heatwave.
Things
like
that
right.
B
The
people
who
have
been
historically
exposed
are
essentially
people
of
color
and
also
low-income
people,
but
how
do
we
center
their
voice
in
decision-making
to
really
bring
about
change
when
it
comes
to
environmental
justice,
then
how
do
we
ensure
in
bringing
about
change?
There
is
an
equitable
distribution
of
the
kinds
of
amenities
that
matters
to
people,
even
as
we
think
about
impacts
of
climate
change.
So
that's
key.
Then
there
is
the
ecological
justice
which
is
really
thinking
about
more
than
human
relationship
and
more
than
human
focus
and
justice.
B
As
I
mentioned
earlier
that
climate
change
is
also
pushing
animals
out
and
these
animals,
obviously
some
of
them
may
carry
virus
that
may
also
affect
us.
So
there
is
the
issue
of
maintaining
ecological
spaces
for
the
sake
of
the
ecosystem
itself,
but
it's
also
the
issue
of
thinking
about
it
from
a
human
perspective,
but
outside
of
does
the
human
password.
How
do
we
ensure
ecological
justice,
this
relationship
between
human
and
non-human,
in
a
way
that
is
really
just
as
well?
B
B
How
do
we
begin
to
restore
particular
communities
that
have
suffered
body
historically
and
contemporary
and
really
be
thinking
about
reparation
right
many
times
when
people
go
and
give
talks,
we
hear
people
give
the
you
know
the
land
acknowledgement
and
nobody
talks
about
giving
the
land
back.
But
really
we
should
be
thinking
about
that
as
well.
You
know
giving
people
the
lands,
the
suffering
to
about
their
land,
lantern
or
systems
right
that
works
for
people,
particularly
communities
that
have
been
marginalized,
whose
land
whose
homes
have
been
stolen,
whose
culture
have
been
you
know
been
degraded.
B
So
how
do
we
restore
those
types
of
justice
matters?
Even
when
we're
thinking
about
climate,
climate
justice,
because
this
is
what's
going
to
be
pull
people
together
as
well?
And
the
last
issue
is
also
intergenerational
justice.
Every
action
we
take
every
step,
we
take
matters
for
the
next
generation
as
well.
We
know
that
redlining
because
of
the,
I
would
say,
very
racist,
prosper
versus
action
by
groups
in
the
back
different
groups
of
people
who
instituted
redlining.
B
We
know
that
the
impact
of
those
types
of
policies
are
being
spelled
by
me
and
you
today
for
those
people
who
live
in
different
areas
and
particularly
for
those
who
live
in
red
light
areas.
We
could
see
that
impact
today
and
it's
90
years
ago
that
that
kind
of
policy
was
implemented,
and
so
whatever
policy
will
implement
today
to
address
climate
change
is
definitely
going
to
affect
the
future
generation
positively
or
negatively.
B
So
we
need
to
be
thinking
about
that
as
a
form
of
justice
as
well,
making
sure
all
of
the
policies
and
plans
we're
implementing
today
does
matter
and
will
help
really
make
the
lives
of
the
next
generation
or
multiple
generations
better.
So
this
is
the
way
I've
been
thinking
about
these
justice
issues
and
a
really
welcome
conversation
on
how
we
can
sort
of
operationalize
this
intersectional
perspective
in
addressing,
but
also
pushing
climate
actions
forward,
while
also
addressing
different
impacts
of
climate
change,
on
different
at
different
scales
and
in
different
landscapes.
B
As
I
would
wrap
up
by
just
also
saying
this
that
you
know
people
there
are
effects
that
is
going
on.
So
what
I'm
saying
is
not
like
you
know:
people
are
not
doing
things.
There
are
some
effort
that
I
think
are
worth
mentioning
to
integrate
justice
issues
and
climate
adaptation
and
mitigation
and
hazard
plans.
There
is
the
justice
force
c
program
by
dividing
and
iris
plan.
B
There
is
that,
and
here
in
portland
we
have
the
clean
energy
funds,
which
is
really
a
sort
of
funding
that
is
being
directed
to
support,
particularly
people
of
color
and
also
low-income
groups,
giving
them
access
to
job,
but
also
access
to
participating
in
this
clean
energy
transition
that
we're
all
heading
to,
especially
here
in
portland
and
so
those
types
of
effort.
I
think
we
need
more
of
them
both
at
the
national
level
and
also
in
different
cities
and
at
different
states.
You
know
really
recently
an
effort
to
support
justice.
B
So
that's
something
we
have
to
figure
out
where
we
increase
ourselves
for
low
income
groups
while
simultaneously
ensuring
that
they
have
the
green
spaces
that
they
need
and
that
those
types
of
housing
do
not
lead
to
problems
so
really
finding
the
intersection
between
the
abolition,
climate,
justice
and
intersectional
justice
approach
in
adaptation
mitigation
and
other
plans
will
be
important.
And,
lastly,
just
reminding
us
using
solidarity.
Science
to
really
advance
climate
justice
will
be
key
as
we
move
forward.
So
thank
you.
B
A
A
To
ask
like
how
we're
going
to
work
with
different
groups
to
increase
the
multiplicity
of
values
and
perspectives
that
are
represented
in
our
science
and
make
sure
that
we're
developing
information
that
can
be
used
by
plurality
of
different
communities
and
then
also
how
we
go
about
integrating
knowledge
systems
or
even
shifting
our
knowledge
generation
systems
within
climate
modeling,
so
that
we
can
be
consistent
with
principles
of
of
things
like
solidarity.
Science,
so
yeah.
Thank
you
so
much
for
giving
us
a
lot
of
amazing
information
and
a
lot
of
things
to
think
about.
E
B
Yeah,
I
I
like
that
question.
It's
a
great
question.
Thank
you
murphy.
So
if
we
look
at
the
history
of
abolition
in
general,
I
will
just
speak
to
that
very
quickly.
It
really
evolves
from
black
geography
work
and
it's
really
was
about
the
abolition
of
slavery,
which
today
has
benefited
many
of
us
that
we
have
more
or
less
equal
rights,
at
least
in
law,
not
always
in
practice.
B
But
yes,
so
that's
really
the
root
of
abolition
idea,
really
just
abolishing
systems
of
injustices
that
deprived
black
people
of
equality
and
access
to
just
livable
context
in
here
in
america,
and
so
when
we
think
about
abolition,
just
a
climate
justice.
So
we
have
the
abolition,
climate
justice
to
me,
at
least.
For
me,
it
really
means
not
just
bringing
people
together
but
really
working
with
people
to
create
new
forms
of
justice
system
that
hasn't
really
existed.
B
The
way
in
which
we
want
to
see
it,
and
so
that's
why
I
brought
together
those
multiple
perspectives
of
justice.
So
there
is
the
dimension
of
climate
justice
where
we're
saying:
okay,
we're
going
to
the
un,
we're
going
to
the
corp
meetings,
to
challenge
the
system
and
to
say:
oh,
we
want
action,
but
there's
also
the
other
dimension.
We
could
also
be
demanding
for
those
actually
here
to
erase
existing
systems
of
injustice,
but
to
create
new
ones
that
can
actually
push
for
a
different
kind
of
future
that
we
need
to
see.
B
So
I
think
the
challenge
before
us,
particularly
people
of
color,
that
continue
and
other
historically
marginalized
group
that
keep
experiencing
the
impact
of
climate
change
very
visually.
We
need
to
be
pushing
for
what
kinds
of
systems
and
what
kinds
of
future
we
want
to
see.
Apart
from
saying,
okay,
we
need
to
destroy,
you
know,
disrupt
and
destabilize,
like
capitalism,
whatever
kind
of
system
that
hasn't
worked
for
us.
What
else
can
we
also
do
and
push
for
that?
B
Allows
us
to
address
climate
change
through
key
actions
that
matter,
because
addressing
climate
change
actually
benefits
us
more
because
the
system,
the
status
quo,
actually
works
for
the
dominant
group
and
works
for
the
wealthiest.
You
know
in
different
countries,
and
certainly
here
as
well,
but
what
we
have
right
now
is
not
working
for
many
of
us.
You
know
how
do
we
change
that
system
to
create
a
way
that
addresses
climate
change,
because
it's
in
our
interest,
but
also
make
sure
that
justice
and
equity
around
existing
issues
are
also
addressed.
A
F
A
F
Take
it
away
all
right
so,
first
off,
I
wanted
to
start
by
thanking
monica
and
jf
for
having
this
working
group
in
this
outbreak
session.
The
fact
that
we're
just
having
it
and
that
we
have
an
attendance
of
nearly
100
people
at
this
shows
the
level
of
interest,
in
my
opinion,
that
we
have
in
our
climate,
modeling
and
scientific
community
in
justice
and
climate
change,
and
thank
you
for
having
this
providing
us
this
opportunity
to
share
and
discuss
things.
F
I
also
want
to
thank
the
previous
speaker,
dr
ajibadi.
You've
set
this
up
quite
nicely
for
my
talk,
thank
you
for
the
big
global
perspective.
I
am
here
today
to
tell
you
about
a
project
that
I'm
involved
with
called
search.
Search
stands
for
the
study
of
environmental
arctic
change.
It
is
working
on
co-producing
knowledge
and
ways
of
of
advising
science
and
policy
makers
and
local
communities
in
the
arctic.
So
it's
not
as
as
big
a
picture
as
that
was
pretty
then
before,
but
it's
a
smaller
one.
F
I
am
I'm
going
to
start
off
by
saying
the
group
itself
is
is
dedicated
to
informing
arctic
decisions
with
indigenous
and
scientific
knowledge.
I
am
not
an
expert
on
climate
justice
I'll
just
I'll
just
put
that
out
there.
I
got
kind
of
nervous
for
this
talk,
but
monica
was
very
insistent,
but
I
I
am
a
western
trained
scientist.
I
am
laura
landrum
and
I
come
from.
I
live
in
fort
collins,
colorado.
F
F
My
mother
and
father
suzanne
walters
and
robert
landrum
and
my
paternal
grandparents
came
from
wichita
kansas
in
the
land
of
the
osage
kiowa
wichita
dakota
and
the
koda
peoples.
My
maternal
grandfather
came
from
rochester
new
york
in
the
land
of
the
seneca
and
hadanasanae
peoples.
My
maternal
grandmother
came
from
a
large
farming
family
near
jackson,
ohio
on
the
lands
of
the
cascasia,
osage,
shani
and
maya
mia
peoples.
F
I
have
a
background
in
western
science.
I
am
trained
in
science
from
academia
and
I
gave
that
introduction.
That's
not
an
introduction.
You
will
normally
hear
at
a
scientific
venue.
I
encourage
all
of
you
to
do
a
little
background.
Work
into
your
own
background
and
where
people
came
from
search
is
the
study
of
environmental
arctic
change.
We
are
a
complex
collaboration
of
scientists,
indigenous
people
and
decision
makers.
We
are
synthesizing
across
disciplines
and
knowledge
systems
and
sharing
holistic
understandings
of
the
drivers
and
consequences
of
environmental
change.
F
We
assume,
as
a
group
search
by
the
way,
is
an
nsf
sponsored
program.
It's
a
five-year
nsf
grant,
it's
a
very
large
grant
and
our
assumptions
are
that
robust
knowledge
systems,
including
social
science,
natural
sciences,
indigenous
knowledge
and
indigenous
sciences
must
be
respected
and
supported
in
order
for
society
to
adapt
most
efficiently
to
environmental
changes
in
the
arctic
and
elsewhere.
F
I'm
going
to
focus
just
a
little
bit
on
that
last
statement.
We
just
had
as
search.
We
had
our
first
executive
meeting
last
september
and
we
had
our
first
all
teams
meeting
in
person
in
anchorage
last
week.
It
took
nine
months
to
put
these
teams
together.
There's
a
lot
of
time.
One
of
the
members,
jackie
schaefer,
was
quoted
as
saying
you
have
to
acknowledge
the
past
in
order
to
change
the
future.
F
I
would
change
that
a
little
bit
and
add
you
have
to
acknowledge
the
sources
of
injustice
in
order
to
address
justice
colonizing
and
extractive
behavior
is
not
limited
to
the
past
and
as
an
example,
I'm
going
to
show
you
a
clip.
This
is
a
video
clip
from
the
arctic
futures
conference.
In
2050
I
mean
arctic
futures
2050
conference
in
2019
in
washington
dc.
F
The
person
speaking
is
mera
tiretsky
she's
on
a
panel
with
brendan
kelly
matt,
melanie
bonte
and
gifford
wong,
on
the
urgency
of
collaborating
to
inform
arctic
policy,
and
I
am
not,
I
was
not
able
to
figure
out
how
to
get
just
the
video
in
only
the
segment
I
want
to
play,
but
don't
panic,
I'm
not
playing
45
minutes
of
this.
I'm
just
gonna
play
a
couple
clips.
F
You,
okay,
all
right,
I
will
just
paraphrase
it
then
so.
Merit
here
is
speaking
about
the
word
colonial
in
terms
and
scientists
are
often
uncomfortable
with
it.
We
often
and
and
part
of
this
talk
is
my
experience
as
a
scientist
doing
work,
that
is
co-producing
and
environmental
justice
and
some
of
the
things
that
I've
gone
through
personally.
In
order
to
do
this
work
merit
is
talking
about
how
scientist
she
heard
an
analogy
that
really
stuck
with
her
and
how
northern
scientists
are
sometimes
viewed
as
snow
geese.
F
They
come
every
year
at
the
same
time
like
clockwork,
they
come,
they
gather,
they
ravage
the
light.
They
sometimes
leave
the
land,
not
very
well,
they
take
what
they
need
and
they
leave
and
then
there's
another
comment
by
melanie.
After
that
she
says,
you'd
like
to
comment
on
it,
and
at
least
the
snow
geese
provides
some
form
of
sustenance
for
the
communities.
F
F
F
So
once
again,
the
goal
of
search
is
to
produce
and
share
actionable
knowledge
to
inform
decisions
about
the
socio-ecological
systems
in
the
arctic
and
beyond,
we're
doing
this
through
what
we
call
co-production
reiteratively,
going
through
different
knowledge
systems
to
come
up
with
a
different
ways
of
knowing
and
different
knowledge
that
can
be
given
to
policymakers
and
local
communities,
and
it
represents
a
circle.
It's
a
very
circular.
We,
we
iteratively
change
things
as
we
go
along.
F
This
is
the
team,
the
executive
committee
and
the
co-leads
on
our
co-production
teams.
We
have
three
co-production
teams:
arctic,
environmental
change,
co-led
by
marika,
holland
and
vera,
metcalf,
human
health
and
well-being
co-led
by
jackie,
catalina,
schaefer
and
jamie
donato,
and
then
geopolitics
and
social
economics
led
by
co-led
by
francis
fizzy
and
evan
balon,
and
so
those
are.
Those
are
the
three
teams.
What
I
want
to
point
out,
you
can
read
this.
While
I
talk
about
this
is
one
of
the
things
as
a
scientist
that
has
been
different
from
me
in
this
project.
F
Is
I
I'm
a
western
trained
scientist,
I'm
very
used
to
doing
things
like
what
is
my
hypothesis?
How
am
I
going
to
get
there
and
writing
proposals
for
that,
and
and
very
clearly
stating
from
the
very
beginning
where
I
want
to
go
a
different
thing
about
co-production?
Is
you
can't
do
that
from
the
beginning?
That's
not
co-produced!
That's
you
coming
in
and
saying
this
is
my
idea,
and
this
is
where
I'm
going
to
go,
so
you
have
to
iteratively
work
with
people
to
come
up
with
ideas.
F
Likewise,
the
building
of
a
team
to
do
this
has
taken
tremendous
effort,
and
some
of
us
in
search
have
called
it
rather
torturous.
We
met
nine
months
ago,
and
it's
taken
us
nine
months
to
build
these
teams
and
then
to
come
together
in
person
to
get
to
know
each
other.
A
lot
of
the
work
that
we
need
to
do
is
qualitative
rather
than
quantitative.
We
need
to
build
relationships.
F
G
F
F
The
introduction
I
give
to
you
at
the
beginning
of
this
talk
is
an
example
of
the
introduction
that
I
give
when
I
am
working
in
an
arctic
community
that
I
gave
at
search
last
week,
it's
different
than
what
you
would
do
in
a
scientific
framework,
but
it's
it.
It
starts
establishing
ground
as
recognizing,
where
I
come
from
and
working
with
people,
and
I
want
to
put
out
there
that
when
I
talk
about
my
background,
I
really
don't
know
my
ancestors
past
about
five
or
six
generations.
F
F
600
generations,
they've
lived
there
for
thousands
of
years
thriving
in
a
climate,
that's
challenging,
and
when
we
introduced
ourselves
at
search
last
week,
the
primary
goal
of
last
week's
team
meetings
was
for
bonding
and
getting
to
know
one
another
so
that
we
can
better
do
the
work
that
we
are
hoping
to
do
and
when
we
were
told
that
we
had
two
minutes
to
introduce
ourselves
most
of
the
scientists
that
I
know
like
myself.
Well,
two
minutes.
F
Oh
my
gosh,
that's
a
lot
of
talking
about
myself
and
many
of
the
indigenous
people
were
like
two
minutes
uh-oh.
I
can't
talk
about
all
my
ancestors.
I
have
to
cut
it
a
little
short.
It's
just
one
of
my
experiences.
I
think
one
of
the
things
I
want
to
throw
out
there
is,
if
you
choose
to
do
work,
and
I
hope
you
do.
I
hope
that
the
number
of
people
in
this
workshop
itself
is
indicative
of
people
who
want
to
be
involved
with
this.
There
are
some
things
I
would.
F
F
However,
a
lot
of
this
working
together
in
search
is
new
to
me,
and
I
found
that
everybody
at
this
meeting
last
week
felt
similarly
like
I'm
not
quite
sure
what
I'm
doing
here
and
yet,
if
I
were
to
go
on
to
our
search,
share,
drive
and
look
at
the
resumes
and
the
backgrounds
for
the
people
involved.
It's
an
astonishing
amount
of
really
highly
recognized
experts
and
each
and
every
one
of
them
is
all
like.
F
I'm
gonna,
I'm
gonna
wrap
this
up
with
one
really
quick,
like
one
of
the
things
that
we
did
to
facilitate
bonding
and
getting
to
know.
Each
other
was
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
our
dreams
and
aspirations
and
search.
I
am
a
western
trained
scientist
when
I
went
to
graduate
school
in
the
80s.
I
studied
carbon
dioxide,
air
sea
exchange
and
many
of
my
colleagues
looking
at
carbon
dioxide
and
climate
change.
F
F
I
want
a
different
result.
I
want
my
kids
to
inherit
a
planet
that
is
on
a
different
path
and
it's
a
big
ship
and
it's
going
to
take
a
lot
to
turn
it,
but
I
want
to
see
if
my
background
and
expertise
is
science.
My
understanding
of
polar
climate
and
polar
science
can
be
of
service
to
communities
that
are
facing
climate
change
now,
and
I
would
encourage
all
of
you
to
do
so
as
well.
It's
very
gratifying
work
anyways.
On
that
note,
I
will
oh
and
one
one
positive
thing
really
quickly
search.
F
There
are
people
at
nsf
that
support
work
like
this
there's
a
growing
community
and
the
nsf
was
willing
to
take
the
risk
to
support
this
sort
of
work
indicates
that
there
are
those
that
want
to
do
it.
It's
a
very
big
grant
and
it's
such
a
risk
and
such
a
large
grant
that
search
nsf
also
has
hired
external
evaluators
to
evaluate
it.
So
you're
not
alone.
If
you
want
to
do
this
work,
anyways
I'll
end,
there.
A
Great,
thank
you
very
much
and
I
just
want
to
reiterate
one
of
the
things
you
you
brought
up
in
your
talk.
That's
really
important!
That
co-production
isn't
something
that
just
happens
when
you're
engaging
in
the
research
process.
That
co-production
needs
to
happen
with
the
development
of
the
conceptual
framework,
so
that
the
way
in
which
you're
looking
at
the
problem
space
is
representative
of
all
the
different
perspectives,
and
you
have
that
integration,
starting
at
the
onset
of
thinking
about
your
research
questions
and
how
you're
going
to
approach
answering
those
questions.
A
H
H
Okay,
great
hello,
everyone.
I
would
like
to
first
thank
john
and
monica
for
the
invitation.
It's
my
great
pleasure
to
share
this
work
with
you
and
I'm
gonna
talk
about
actionable
earth,
climate
science,
a
high
resolution
couple
and
atmosphere
modeling
for
alaska,
informed
by
knowledge
co-production.
H
So
this
is
part
of
an
nsf
navigating
the
new
architect
project,
where
we
collaborated
with
indigenous
alaskan
people
to
estimate
the
climate
impacts
on
alaska
and
yukon
rivers,
fish
and
communities
in
general.
The
climate
change
the
arctic
is
rapidly
changing,
including
increasing
air
temperatures
and
precipitation
decreases
in
sea
ice
and
changes
in
seasonal
snowpack.
H
So,
starting
from
the
proposal
drafting,
we
have
involved
indigenous
participation.
Consensus
has
has
been
rich
that
the
most
useful
information
for
the
indigenous
decision
maker
will
be
set
water
basin
scale
or
high
resolution
stream
flow
and
other
land
surface
or
sensible
weather
variables,
such
as
2
meter,
air
temperature
and
precipitation.
H
So
we
can
see
that
the
from
the
size
perspective.
We
can
also
see
that
the
coarser
model
mountain
ranges
are
more
blocky,
as
you
can
see
from
the
left
plots
with
little
realistic
details.
There
are
simply
areas
with
broadly
high
terrain
here
in
the
southern
region,
while
the
high
resolution
models
can
be
used
in
this
project.
More
faithfully
represent
the
complex
rich
valley
patterns,
as
well
as
the
high
peaks
across
alaska,
like
the
southern
mountain
ranges
and
the
mountain
ranges
in
northern
slopes.
H
H
So
rapidly
changing
arctic
hydrology
is
influenced
by
complicated
land,
surface
processes
and
we
synthesized
the
community
effort
in
earth
system
modeling
and
developed.
An
optimization
workflow
for
ctsm,
as
you
can
see
from
the
left
box,
shows
how
we
configure
a
high
resolution.
Ctsm
application,
we
downscale
the
era,
5
meteorological,
forcing
data
and
use
the
high
resolution,
soil
texture
data
from
sword
grade
addition.
We
also
took
advantage
of
the
hill
slope
hydrology
implemented
in
ctsm
to
account
for
this
upgrade
variability.
H
H
H
Just
for
different
purposes
of
examination,
and
in
this
study
the
novelty
mainly
lies
in
examining
the
hydrometeorology
and
terrestrial
hydrology.
At
the
same
time,
we
evaluated
the
following
variables,
including
vertical
velocity,
total
precipitation,
slope
deprecipation
fraction
to
meter
air
temperature,
evaporation,
precipitation
ratio
terrestrial
snow
as
well
as
stream
flow.
H
H
The
distribution
of
the
difference
across
all
gray
cells
are
shown
in
the
left,
plots
with
its
mean
value
range
from
that
90
50,
up
negative
50
to
50
millimeter
per
season
and
for
the
air
temperature.
We
compared
with
over
500
on-site
air
temperature
observations
and
the
mean
seasonal
difference
across
all
sides
are
always
in
two
degrees
celsius
and
the
rosin
simulations
show
some
slight
warm
bias
during
the
winter
period
here
and
show
some
slight
bias
during
the
summer.
H
For
the
future
climate
change
studies,
which
is
also
another
big
component
in
this
project,
our
collaborator,
nicole
from
usgs
and
our
indigenous
collaborators
co-designed,
a
climate
information
survey
to
help
guide
our
model
stations
in
general.
The
decision-making
bodies
in
alaska
and
yukon
river
basin
include
the
tribal
and
traditional
councils
city
councils,
first
nation
government,
regional
indigenous
organizations
and
due
to
the
covet
restrictions,
we
send
out
226
surveys
by
emails
and
if
you
guys,
are
interested
in
looking
at
the
results
of
the
survey,
I
also
put
the
link
down
there.
H
I'm
happy
to
share
the
slides
later
so
in
general,
unless
we
receive
23
responses
from
representatives
from
a
tribal
and
traditional
council,
five
first
nation
government,
four
regional
indigenous
organizations
and
six
city
councils
across
our
study
domain,
and
we
do
acknowledge
that
this
is
not
a
representative
sample
based
on
10
response
rate.
But
we
can
still
get
important
guidance
from
the
survey
together
with
our
advisory
council.
H
H
However,
I
do
want
to
highlight
that
the
service
not
only
important
for
climate
modeling,
but
also
important
to
guide
other
model
efforts
in
this
project,
like
stream
flow
river
ice
river
temperature,
as
well
as
fish,
bioenergetic
modeling,
so
to
move
forward
the
first
question:
what
future
time
horizon
to
model
over
half
of
the
correspondence
agreed
that
the
near-term
scenarios
might
be
the
most
useful
to
them.
So
we
decided
that
we
will
simulate
a
30-year
time
period
from
2035
to
2065..
H
So
finally,
I
want
to
close
my
talk
with
that.
I'm
an
early
career
scientist
and
my
background.
I'm
a
trend
hydrologist,
so
I
actually
do
not
have
much
experience
with
climate
justice,
but
I'm
really
excited
about
this
area
and
the
project,
because
we
can
actually
get
the
chance
to
work
closely
with
indigenous
people
and
get
to
use
the
modeling
out
of
the
modeling,
the
modeling
that
we're
trying
to
do
to
better
inform
and
help
them
mitigate
or
adapt
to
the
climate
change.
Thank
you.
E
E
E
H
H
E
G
G
For
you
know
we
had
worked
together
in
the
past.
He
was
already,
I
think,
building
out
the
team,
that's
keith
musselman,
but
we
had
built
out
connections
with
nicole
with
itep
with
the
yukon
river
inter
tribal
watershed
council,
and
we
we
tried
as
best
we
could
to
work
collaboratively
on
the
proposal
we
didn't.
You
know
we
didn't,
have
the
advisory
council
put
together
at
that
point,
so
it
was
somewhat
of
a
hybrid
of
co-production
of
proposal
ideas.
G
You
know
so
not
maybe
fully
what
what
was
you
and
angela
talked
about
earlier,
but
we
we
did
try
to
do
a
little
bit
more
effort
than
maybe
the
standard
proposal
where
you
tack
on
those
considerations
at
the
end
and
then
the
project's
been
very
integrated.
I
think
at
least
anything
better
than
I've
ever
experienced
as
a
you
know.
G
As
a
western
scientist-
and
so
I
I
think,
we're
trying
to
you
know
meet
the
spirit
of
a
lot
of
this
but,
like
you
said,
like
it's
been
said,
it's
a
lot
of
extra
work
and
I
don't
think
we
even
appreciated
how
much
extra
work
all
of
this
takes
to
build
out
the
team,
even
folks
who
we
relatively
knew
each
other
at
some
level
going
into
this.
It's
still,
you
know
it's
a
lot
of
extra
effort
and
you
really
need
to
be
passionate
about
it
to
make
it
work
going
forward.
A
Okay,
great
thanks
andy
for
your
response.
So
are
there
any
more
clarificatory
questions
that
we
might
have,
because
if
not,
I
will
open
the
floor
to
questions
that
are
more
discussion
oriented
and
if,
specifically,
if
you
have
questions
that
you
would
like
joella
to
answer,
she
has
to
leave
us
a
little
bit
early
today.
A
F
We
can
okay,
okay,
I'm
wondering
how
you
you
go
between.
You
gave
a
very
nice
overview
kind
of
big
picture,
talk
and
talked
about
a
lot
of
big
ideas,
and
how
do
you
bridge
that
gap
between
what
I
call
a
more
academic
approach
to
this
and
working
actually
with
a
community?
It's
like?
Can
you
change
that
lane
rapidly,
because
you
did
such
a
wonderful
job
today
presenting
the
global
picture?
Are
you
also
able
to
get
in
and
work
with
the
communities
and
if
you
could
speak
to
that,
a
little
bit.
B
Yeah
great
question:
yeah:
that's
why
I
don't
get
enough
sleep,
so
I
do
all
of
those.
So
I
do
work
in
manila
in
lagos,
with
communities
and
in
tokyo.
I
did
some
work
with
experts
as
well,
so
I
go
and
I
physically
in
maninah
lagos.
I
work
in
slum
communities
so
sitting
with
people
doing
focus
group
asking
them
questions.
What's
going
on
and
also
trying
to
bridge
the
stories
they
tell
me
with
what
the
experts
are
doing
so
also
trying
to
connect
back
to
policy
makers
and
experts.
B
So
I
do
all
of
those
multi-level
work
and
I
think
it's
the
reason
why
my
work,
at
least
that
I'm
excited
about,
is
because
I
work
on
cities
and
you
can
work
with
it
without
also
talking
about
communities
that
live
in
those
cities,
so
I
breached,
which
is
why
you
know
the
mid-range
people,
that's
the
expats
and
the
policy
makers
they're
important,
because
you
know
they
determine
what
happens
in
the
city
and
then
the
communities
are
the
ones
that
feel
the
impact
of
actions
and
policy.
So
I
do
talk
to
communities.
B
I
talk
to
people
in
the
city
and
then
I
also
work
with
people
that
do
like
you
know
this
global
assessments
on
that
adaptation,
like
what's
going
on
different
parts
of
the
world.
What
are
was
seeing
in
terms
of
adaptation
practices
where
I
was
seeing
regulations
not
working
and
not
working.
So
yes,
that's
a
great
question.
I
do
all
those
things.
F
C
Yeah,
I
do
so
joel.
I
you
sort
of
answered
this,
but
I
mean
here:
we've
got
two
examples
of
arctic
research
and
working
with
indigenous
peoples
in
the
arctic
and
so
forth,
and
these
are
both
nsf
funded
efforts.
I
mean
what
are
you
seeing
in
terms
of
extra
polar
you
know,
working
with
other
indigenous
peoples
around
the
world
and
what
funding
agencies
are
actually
interested
in
this.
So.
B
I
suspect
this
question
may
be
for
laura,
so
yeah,
but
it's
a
great
question
and
one
of
the
things
I
tell
people
is,
you
know
for
those
of
us
who
are
people
of
color.
We
I
mean
the
adaptation
burden
or
the
adaptation
label
is
also
on
us
and
it's
just
really
hard
to
navigate
all
of
the
different
communities
and
the
different
impacts
that
you
hear
that
communities
are
going
going
through
right
now,
not
just
in
the
future,
and
there
I
have
students
that
work
with
indigenous
communities.
B
I
don't
necessarily
work
with
indigenous
communities
per
se,
but
where
there
are,
if
they're,
because
I
work
in
the
cities
right.
So
if
there
are
instances
where
we
go
to
places
where
we
do
our
interviews,
this,
for
instance,
here
in
portland-
and
you
know
we
have
to
talk
to
indigenous
communities,
we
talk
to
them
in
this
bracket
of
populations
or
as
opposed
to
the
kinds
of
research
I
think
in
fayette
and
laura
described,
which
is
really
a
group
of
indigenous
communities
with
very
strong
ties
together
and
living
in
a
particular
location.
B
J
Hi
yeah,
so
I
think
this
idea
of
looking
for
the
intersections
between
community
vulnerabilities
and
climate
risk
is
a
really
powerful
way
to
frame
this,
at
least
for
me,
because
I
can
kind
of
get
my
head
around
that.
But
you
know,
as
someone
involved
in
the
search
program
that
laura
discussed,
I
think
one
of
the
things
we're
sort
of
struggling
with
is
how
do
we
actually
understand
what
those
community
vulnerabilities
are?
B
I
will
understand-
and
I
guess
you
and
and
then
suddenly,
laura
recognized
as
well.
So
what
you've
asked
is
actually
what
my
inca
project
is
about.
So
it's
a
great
question.
So
what
we're
trying
to
do
is
to
you
know
there
are
people
who
have
worked
on
different
sort
of
indicators
to
understand
social
vulnerabilities.
B
So
there
is
a
work
by
quota
and
others.
There
is
this
social
vulnerability
index
and
there
is
also
the
bric
framework,
which
is
also
understanding
resilience.
So
what
I'm
trying
to
do
in
my
work
is
to
use
those
two
frameworks
set
up
together
to
see
where
you
have
pockets
of
vulnerabilities
to
decide
where
you
actually
go
to
speak
to
communities
and
when
you
speak
to
communities
and
then
helping
you
know,
engage
in
my
understanding.
So
what
are
your
concerns
about
this
particular
issue,
whether
it's
flawed?
B
It's
droughts,
it's
whatever
it
is
so
using
the
science
to
make
an
informed
decision
about
where
the
spatial
vulnerabilities
are.
You
know,
there's
lots
are
out
there
about
gis
and
how
you
bring
that,
together
with
statistics,
to
really
get
a
sense
of
what's
going
on
in
the
city,
because
I'm
working
at
the
city
level,
so
we've
been
doing
a
variety
of
variables.
B
Looking
at
where
populations
of
homelessness
is
concentrated
in
portland,
where
low-income
groups,
where
you
have
law
people
with
just
high
school
education,
where
you
also
have
people
of
color
concentrated
so
we're
looking
at
all
of
those
things
in
an
index
form
to
help
inform
where
we
go.
And
then
when
we
get
there,
then
interviewing
a
couple
of
people
in
those
places
to
really
get
a
sense
of
what
it
really
you
know
means
what
their
life
is
in
those
locations.
A
C
This
is
actually
not
necessarily
a
question,
it's
a
comment
or
maybe
a
question
for
everybody.
You
know
dave
bailey
kind
of
I
was
already
thinking
along
the
same
lines
like
we've
heard
about
two
arctic
projects,
and
I
feel
like
the
arctic
problem,
is
a
little
bit
easier
to
define,
sometimes
because
the
indigenous
population
is
so
clearly.
C
You
know
under
threat
due
to
the
rapid
climate
change
there,
but
really
there's
so
many
people
around
the
world
that
are
affected
by
climate
change
and
that's
actually
a
very
small
population
in
the
arctic
that
they're
affected
by
climate
change,
and
so
you
think
about
the
global
south
or
or
across
the
u.s.
All
the
you
know.
You
know
poor
people
disadvantaged
people,
so
I
what's
not
clear
to
me
is
what
programs-
and
this
is
where
you
may
not
be
able
to
help
us
to
a
little
bit
broadly
thinking.
C
B
To
me,
at
least
so
in
terms
of
the
funding,
I
very
appreciative
to
anka
for
running
my
work.
So
I
know
there
is
the
innovators
program.
They
do
fund
these
types
of
work.
I
am
not
the
only
one
doing
equity
work.
I
think
there
are
eight
of
us
that
were
funded
this
year,
maybe
more,
but
a
lot
of
us
do
center
equity
in
our
work
and
justice.
So
and
very,
I
think
they
just
put
out
a
call
for
the
next
set
of
innovators.
B
So
you
can
look
into
that
if
it's
still
ongoing
and
sort
of
encourage
people
to
apply.
So
that's
one
area
and
the
funding
is
pretty
decent
to
do
this
kind
of
work,
it's
actually
more
than
any
social
scientifically
get.
So
I'm
very
appreciative
of
that,
and
I
encourage
people
to
to
look
to
anchor
for
funding,
but
also
I
know
noah
now
is
also
funding
projects
around
water,
justice
and
one
of
my
colleagues
got
of
some
funny
from
noah
so
and
then
nsf
as
well.
B
So
if
you're
working
with
different
faculty
in
different
institutions
and
you
pull
together,
a
team,
ns
approach
and
different
nsf
agencies
also
are
now
interested
in
justice
issues
beyond
just
the
climate
science
really
bringing
together
this
co-production
of
natural
scientists
and
social
sciences
and
how
we
can
work
together.
So
there
is
a
move
from
the
traditional
responding
science
to
really
thinking
more
broadly
about.
You
know,
society
and
bringing
different
expertise
together.
So
those
three
there
are
imagine
there
might
be
others
that
are
also
regionally
based.
B
But
those
are
the
three
that
I'm
aware
of
that.
You
know
anyone
from
anywhere,
particularly
in
the
u.s,
could
apply
to
and
then
to
your
second
question
about
you
know:
how
do
you
work
with
city
planners
and
experts
and
and
community?
I
guess
it
depends
on
the
questions
that
you're
trying
to
answer.
I'm
looking
at
issues
around
equitable
resilience,
and
I
cannot
just
look
to
community
to
answer
that
question
where
there
are
a
lot
of
policy
and
plans
and
projects
and
infrastructure
that
has
been
built.
B
Nobody
communicates
themselves
but
by
the
city
and
so
in
bringing
the
city
into
conversations
with
the
community
and
the
community
with
conversation.
The
city
is
very
key
to
building
resilience
or
being
a
resilient
community.
So
the
type
of
research
that
I
do
and
the
questions
I'm
asking
requires
that
I
talk
with
multiple
actors
and
stakeholders,
which
is
why
my
research
is
at
all
these
multiple
skills,
but
I
think
for
different
groups
of
people,
different
actors
might
matter
and
different
skills
might
matter
as
well.
A
A
I
I
can
unmute,
since
I
put
one
of
those
comments
in
there:
okay,
so
one
of
the
things
that
we've
kind
of
I
would
say
that
we've
learned,
though
I
don't
know
that
we
know
the
answer
of
with
some
of
these
arctic
focused
things.
Is
that
one
the
people
who
were
who
were,
I
think,
it's
a
little
colonialist
to
go
in
and
say
like
we
are
helping
you,
because
we
don't
even
necessarily
know
what
they
want
help
with.
So
it's
really
more
of
a
conversation.
I
There's
been
a
lot
of
somewhat
criticism
from
people
who
live
in
the
arctic
about
this
program
and
that
it's
not
necessarily
addressing
what
they
want
it
to
address.
So
I
think
it's
actually
a
really
hard
question:
how
to
do
these
projects
and
really
conceive
them
from
the
beginning
with
these
people
and
it's
hard
to
make
those
connections
with
these
people.
And
so
how
do
you
build
a
network?
So
I
think
that's
one
of
the
things,
but
that
in
that
process
I
think
there's
boundary
organizations
that
are
really
essential
for
making
that
happen.
I
And
again,
how
do
we
meet
those
people
in
the
arctic?
The
people
who
live
there
and
some
of
the
criticism
has
been
that
people
just
come
in
and
start
like
talking
to
people
or
they
approach
people
without
any
context,
or
anything
like
that,
and
without
a
boundary
organization
that
might
help
direct
you
to
the
right
resources
or
help
you
build
that
relationship.
It
can
be
kind
of
off-putting
and
somewhat,
I
would
say,
do
damage
to
that
relationship
rather
than
not.
I
So
I
think
maybe
laura
or
marika,
who
are
more
involved
with
search,
might
be
able
to
talk
about
how
search
is
trying
to
avoid
that.
But
I
just
want
to
point
out:
it's
not
it's.
It's
not.
I
don't
think
it's
quite
as
easy
as
like.
Let's
find
a
funding
opportunity
that
can
support
this,
there's
a
lot
more
network
and
relationship
building
that
has
to
go
in
and
and
honestly,
probably
some
different
values
and
how
you
work
through
those
values
and
what
that
means
to
all
the
parties
involved.
A
Yeah
this
is,
I
mean
this
is
a
really
good
point
alice.
Thank
you
for
your
comment,
but
I
mean
a
lot
of
the
literature
does
demonstrate
that
kind
of
engagement
with
stakeholders
can't
just
be
an
afterthought
after
you've
already
decided
what
the
research
questions
are.
How
you're
going
to
approach
answering
the
research
questions
that
things
really
need
to
start
in
the
way
that
kind
of
laura
pointed
out
and
her
talk
about
search
and
that
you
actually
need
to
begin
conversations
with
stakeholders
really
early.
A
So
you
can
map
out
the
conceptual
space
together
and
develop
a
conceptual
framework
that
will
then
determine
kind
of
what
problems
you
address,
how
you
address
them?
How
you
make
sure
that
the
approaches
and
the
questions
are
responsive
to
the
values
of
the
communities
that
you're
working
with
so
yeah?
I
don't
know
if
marika
and
laura
want
to
comment
on
that,
but
it
is
an
incredibly
difficult
thing
to
do,
but
it's
also
a
necessary
component
of
like
co-production
and
developing
information.
That's
usable
with
communities,
so
yeah
marika.
J
Well,
first
I'll
say:
I
think
the
navigating
the
new
art
of
program,
which
is
an
nsf-funded
program,
is
a
little
bit
of
a
cautionary
tale
in
this
area.
As
alice
kind
of
alluded
to
that,
you
know
they
they
put
out
this
call
for
proposals.
The
communities
were
inundated
by
people
like
us
going
in
and
saying
you
know,
we
want
to
partner
with
you
and
it
really
didn't
work
well,
and
you
know
kuerk
who's.
An
indigenous
organization
has
put
out
several
letters
now
basically
saying
this
did
not
work.
J
Well,
you
guys
can't
just
assume
that
we're
going
to
drop
things
at
you
know,
moments
notice
and
respond
to
your
request
for
help
in
putting
a
proposal
together,
I'd
say
under
the
search
project,
we've
tried
to
do
something
a
little
bit
different
and
that
we
we
have
indigenous
people
as
pis
on
our
project.
I
mean
they're,
not
they
helped
us
put
the
proposal
together.
J
We
don't
think
of
them
as
stakeholders.
They
are
partners,
it's
a
very
it's
a
you
know.
They
are
participants
in
the
project,
not
something
that
we
are
providing
them
information
after
the
fact,
and
we've
had
to
be
really
careful
and
they
have
to
be
careful
as
well
with
our
language,
I
mean
this
meeting
laura
talked
about.
We
had
a
lot
of
conversation
just
about
the
words
that
we
use
with
each
other
and
how
to
make
sure
that
we
have
a
shared
understanding
of
what
those
words
mean.
A
Yeah
will
and
then
dave
thank
you
marika
and
I'm
just
gonna
put
in
the
chat.
I
think
that
there's
an
important
distinction
that
you
just
brought
up
that
our
scientific
practice.
We
often
think
of
people
that
we're
engaging
with
as
stakeholders,
but
really
we
need
to
shift
the
way
that
we're
thinking
about
individuals,
we're
co-producing
information
with
and
consider
them
partners
as
opposed
to
stakeholders.
A
C
Yeah,
I
guess
you
I
want
to
reiterate
something
you
said
monica,
but
also
to
laura's.
Point
of
you
know.
Kind
of
the
challenge
of
co-producing
knowledge
makes
it
hard
to
write
a
proposal.
You
think
you
know
what
you
want
to
do.
You
have
to
know
what
you
want
to
do
ahead
of
time
and
I
guess
to
that
end
it
seems
like
the
innovators
program
is
a
way
to
start
generating
those
connections
and
that
those
relationships
with
people
in
a
way
that
you
don't
have
to
have
the
answers
ahead
of
time.
C
J
C
The
university
connections
through
innovators
is
that
we
don't
have
to
go,
find
people
like
we
that
end
car
scientists
don't
have
to
go,
find
people
to
interact
with
it's
they're,
you
know
kind
of
self-identifying
and
then
hopefully
we
can
build
teams
and
connections
with
with
people
that
do
that
are
interested
in
doing
this
work
with
us.
That's
all
I
wanted
to
say.
A
C
Sure
I
just
I
just
wanted
to
add
on
to
this,
especially
in
terms
of
the
vulnerability
and
not
understanding
the
vulnerabilities
in
different
communities
that
you
know
our
nna
project
that
I'm
involved
in
deals
with
a
different
indigenous
community.
It's
the
sami
community
in
northern
norway,
and
they
have
a
very
different
perspective
say
than
the
alaskan
indigenous
peoples
and,
and
so
one
has
to
be
a
little
careful
about
the
way
they
approach
this.
A
K
A
K
I
completely
agree,
I
mean,
as
we
learned
from
our
fish
project
too,
we
could
assume
something
and
then,
when
we
go
and
talk
to
the
folks,
the
the
answers
change
so,
but
that's
it.
I
should
have
put
it
in
that
context
essentially
is.
Is
there
anything
emerging
from
these
interviews
or
interactions
that
point
to
improving
or
adding
more
capabilities
to
the
model?
So
I
should
rephrase
it
that
way.
I
think.
G
G
The
issues
always
seem
to
be
that
none
of
none
of
the
none
of
the
proper
folks
are
included
in
the
development
cycle
to
begin
with,
and
so
if
we
can
shift
that
paradigm,
then
we
can.
You
know
we
as
well.
As
you
know,
I
can
try
to
make
those
generalizations,
but
I
think
if
we
just
include
other
folks
through
the
full
development
cycle,
we
make
it
more
two-way,
interactive,
we'll
just
be
better
off
and
we
won't
be
chasing
as
much.
A
D
A
I
Sorry,
I
think
no,
I
I
think
that
one
thing
that
I've
learned
both
through
antarctic
work,
which
is
less
about
working
with
local
peoples,
because
the
local
peoples
in
antarctica
are
penguins
and
they
have
no
opinion
on
models.
But
you
know
it's
like
they're
you're,
never
going
to
be
able
to
go
high
enough
resolution
to
help
some
of
these
people
like
yeah.
They
want
higher
resolution,
but
they
want
it.
Even
in
our
high
resolution
configuration.
I
I
don't
know
that
that's
always
high
enough-
and
I
think
that's
where
boundary
organizations
or
working
with
the
people
up
front
could
maybe
help
with
figuring
out.
What's
the
right
tool
like
cesm
doesn't
necessarily
have
to
be
the
right
tool
for
everything,
but
maybe
we
could
make
sure
that
we
have
good
experiments
that
can
be
used
used
to
force
downscaling,
because
you
know
we're
never
going
to
be
able
to
capture
every
little
inlet,
which
is
what
coastal
communities
in
alaska
maybe
care
about.
I
They
care
about
their
particular
inlet,
and-
and
you
know,
I
don't
know
that
we're
ever
going
to
be
able
to
have
a
coupled
model
that
can
capture
that.
The
other
thing
that
I
think
is
not
new
to
anyone
is
you
know
how
how
how
might
we
want
to
decide
which
simulations
we
run
most
the
people
who
I've
talked
to
about
antarctic
work.
They
don't
care
about.
What's
going
to
happen
in
2100,
they
care
like
the
longest
out.
I
That
might
be
more
useful.
I
think
that
could
be
more
helpful.
I
would
I
would
also
say
that
talking
to
people
who
aren't
specifically
in
this
community,
if
you
were
like
what
do
you
think
about
adding
new
microphysics
that'll
change,
clouds
they'd
probably
be
like
what
like
what
does
that
even
mean.
A
Yeah,
I
think
I
mean
these
are
questions
that
are
important.
Sorry,
my
dog's
freaking
out
these
are
questions
that
are
important
for
us
to
be
asking,
and
I
mean
to
some
extent
we
do
need
to
know
what
the
representational
values
of
these
communities
are
like.
What
type
of
processes
are
most
significant
for
them
to
have
understandings
of
and
like
what
the
conditions
of
adequacy
need
to
be
for
inclusion
in
the
models,
but
these
are
difficult
conversations
to
have
with
people
that
aren't
climate
modelers.
A
D
You
know
what
from
the
model
does
the
community
can
can
be
adapted
to
be
like
provide
information
that
that
community
can
use,
and
then
how
can
you
communicate
that?
Because
you
know
saying,
like
we've
got
snow
on
ice
simulations,
that's
sort
of
like
well,
okay.
So
what?
But,
if
you
start
talking
about
loose
predation,
then
people
will
say
okay.
D
I
understand
why
this
model
can
give
me
important
information,
but
sort
of
offering
support
to
provide
that
connection
is
something
that
funding
agencies
can
help
with,
and
so
the
work
that
we're
doing
would
still
be
the
same.
But
then
we'd
have
an
additional
like
communications,
specialist
or
someone
to
generate
these
kinds
of
conceptual
figures
or
translating
that
for
communication.
A
A
And
I
mean
that
requires
like,
as
you
guys
are
all
as
everybody
is
pointing
out
like
boundary
spanners
like
boundary
organizations,
there
have
to
be
people
that
are
actively
playing
those
roles
and
yeah
I
mean
the
csm
community.
Hopefully
we
can
think
about
how
do
we
develop
connections
with
those
organizations
or
those
types
of
people,
so
that
that
we
can
kind
of
begin
making?
Some
of
our
modeling
products
and
our
models
better
suited
for
maybe
answering
some
of
these
adaptations,
questions,
resilience
questions
for
vulnerable
communities.
C
You
know
this
is
a
question
I
guess
to
everyone,
but
you
know
how
do
we
we
might
wind
up
in
a
situation
where
there's
two
vulnerable
groups
who
have
needs
and
we
only
have
the
finite
resources
to
help
one
of
them?
So
how
do
we
make?
How
do
we
make
that
decision
and
adjust
is
in
this
equitable
way
as
we
can?
A
Just
having
done
environmental
ethics
a
little
bit,
you
consult
ethicists
to
kind
of
navigate
the
difficult
like
conflict
of
values,
territory,
but
I
mean
this.
This
is
a
question
that
I
think
you
know
jola
brought
up
in
her
talk
that
there's
there's
a
lot
of
kind
of
intersecting
values
and
dimensions
of
justice
and
there's
gonna
be
winners
and
there's
gonna
be
losers,
and
so
how
do
we
make
decisions
in
an
equitable
manner
and
navigate
those
trade-offs
in
the
best
possible
way
to
kind
of?
A
J
Oh
jesse,
I
think
that
was
a
great
question.
I'll
just
say,
I
think
what
we
do
now
is
we
we
basically
do
what
external
funding
gives
us
the
ability
to
do,
and
I
don't
think
that's
necessarily
the
right
way
to
do
it.
But
that's
just
to
me
my
impression
is
that's
how
we're
doing
it.
You
know
we've
heard
about
a
couple
projects
today:
they're
funded
under
nsf,
navigating
the
new
arctic
or
office
of
polar
programs,
coastlines
and
people
project
is
another
one.
That's
kind
of
funding
work
in
this
space.
J
You
know,
and
but
I
mean
I-
I
don't
know
how
the
decisions
at
nsf
are
made,
that
that's
where
their
resources
should
be
focused
right.
So
I
don't
know.
I
think
this
is
part
of
a
really
long
conversation
that
we
need
to
have
and
we
need
to
include-
and
you
know
the
funding
agencies
in
this
conversation
and
all
of
that,
because
it's
it
seems
like
just
kind
of
a
hodgepodge-
and
you
know
just
yeah-
not
not
terribly
well
thought
out
necessarily
so.
K
Yeah
I
was
going
to
make
two
points.
The
first
one
is
essentially
related
to
funding,
and
I
mean
fortunately
or
unfortunately,
whatever
it
gets,
funded
gets
done
right
and
you
see
you
saw
examples
of
that
thing
with
m2
lines
and,
for
example,
leap
projects
for
machine
learning
purposes,
and
in
this
case
I
agree
with
what
marika
said.
The
funded
projects
tend
to
sort
of
get
done
and
then,
but
there
might
be
some
related
activities
related
projects
that
benefit
from
that
funding
as
well.
A
Yeah
gokan,
I
think
you're
right
and
I
think
that
there
are
those
opportunities
that
exist.
That
kind
of
do
maybe
allow
us
to
make
a
movement
towards
having
greater
representation
of
values
and
greater
like
plurality
of
perspectives
represented
because
there
may
be
aren't
such
explicit
kind
of
I
guess
norms
about
like
what
communities
you
need
to
be
working
with,
or
things
like
that
or
what
region
of
the
world
it
needs
to
be.
Representative
of
the.
A
D
But
as
a
group
you
know
there,
we
have
the
opportunity
to
talk
directly
to
the
funding
agencies
and
say
you
know,
we
need
you,
as
a
funding
agency,
to
prioritize
this
type
of
funding
and
take
risks
and
say
that
this
is
an
essential
part
of
that
funding.
Navigating
the
new
arctic
provides
a
direction
and
there
are
challenges,
but
we
can
learn
from
that
and
then
us
as
scientists
have
to
recognize
that
it's
not
just
one
person
who's
going
to
have
the
answer.
D
You
know
you're
missing
references
from
these
other
regions
and
even
though
we
had
87
other
authors,
you
know
we're
still
not
capturing
a
picture
of
what
we
need,
and
so
it's,
but
you
continue
to
move
forward,
and
so
it's
just
it's,
but
we
all
need
to
keep
trying
so
and
stuff
like
the
session.
Today
is
a
really
good
example
of
us
moving
forward.
A
Thank
you
jackie.
I
like
that.
Also,
as
our
last
comment,
I
just
want
to
gauge
and
also
see
their
thoughts
about
having
this
as
a
sustained
working
group,
so
that
we
can
continue
these
conversations,
share,
experiences
and
information,
and
so
we
we
just
want
to
kind
of
gauge
what
the
interest
might
be
and
having
a
a
working
group
come
out
of
this
session
and
possibly
on
an
actionable
science
session.
A
Maybe
there
be
a
merger
between
the
two,
because
I
think,
with
the
conversations
that
we're
having
there's
a
decent
amount
of
overlap
between
the
two
themes,
and
so
I'm
not
going
to
ask
you
to
like
raise
your
hand
or
anything
right
now,
but
if
you
wouldn't
mind,
if
you
are
interested,
I'm
just
sending
me
a
quick
email
so
that
we
can
have
an
account
of
people's
interest
and
if
you're
also
willing
to
possibly
volunteer
to
co-lead
or
to
help
with
organization
or
anything.
Please.