Open Source Ecology 3D Printer, 3 Jul 2018

Previous Meeting Next Meeting

⏯

youtube image

►

From YouTube: Development Team Meeting - June 3, 2018

Description

Notes:

1. LibreSolar battery charger collaboration with OSE Germany
2. Spencer: Introducing OSE to Chi Hacknight - https://chihacknight.org/
3. Eric - CNC circuit mill - FreeCAD and KiCad import
4. Ruslan - 2020 frame 3D printer
5. Marcin - CNC Circuit Mill workshop coming up - https://www.opensourceecology.org/cnc-circuit-mill-workshop/ - and 1 month left for application deadline to Immersion Training - https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/OSE_Immersion_Program

A

That's good, okay,.

B

All right, everybody so welcome to our July third.

C

Meeting for open source ecology, we do have a couple.

B

Of guests today, we've got Spencer and Michelle from Spencer's from actually from Chicago. He right you're from Chicago and he's looking at doing some collaborative wor PR on some.

C

Electronics, power, electronics, so we'll let him talk about that then Michele also collaboration from OSC Germany, the German side on an open opus or charge controller and other electronics work. So.

D

I'd like to.

C

Bring everybody's attention to the meeting agenda there so pretty much type in her notes and follow the general order. They're posting that into the chance for everyone to to get in there to take notes. We.

E

Do need a note-taker.

F

C

Don't believe Jen is here so who can take? Let's see, can somebody take notes? Let's see.

B

Ruslan, would you mind taking notes today.

A

C

Yeah, if you can just capture the main points on a notes page and also for anyone who has questions, please do write them on on a questions page. So.

B

Okay, so main main events happening at open source, ecology, so.

C

The continuing preparation for the Arjun training program- that's the big thing for this year in terms of getting getting more people involved in the project full-time, so basically training people to to do what we do, which is running workshops and that's that's we're doing as our current.

D

C

Model, you don't have funding from foundations. We are largely bootstrap there's a little bit of funding stew coming in from I do have bottle hunger, so true fans they're still still contributing to the product than which is something I started in the back, almost probably in like 2010 or so also a good number of years on the trans. But the.

G

C

We can make this goes by workshops and that's what we're we're in for training people for the immersion program, signup deadline for the actual full immersion applications for that are due on August 1st. So anyone who wants to watching this and wants to participate in that ideas there's at whatever we do here. You're open teaching, everybody exactly. How do that to generate revenue is one of the main things in doing any any project is considering that that difference between a project and actually a product.

C

So so, if you have some kind of a product you can, you can generate revenue for it from it. An.

B

Idea is that basically.

C

At this point, we're getting we're getting to the point of being in a position to train others and have people run workshops in different locations. So this weekend, actually we're running the.

B

Cnc circuit millwork shop actually.

C

Put in a slide under that, let me go back.

C

Cnc circuit no workshop OSC just want to paste that into the chatbox.

C

Everson, if you can take that into the notes there, but that's something up this this weekend, actually a three-day workshop building the open source, ecology, cnc circuit, mouches, basically identical to the printer, except with a router head and we've proven it well enough, actually Shane who's, whose boat hosting that workshop with me. He actually included that in his master's thesis, so he's gonna be publishing more info on that as a viewable product that we think we have right now or making circuits very high resolutions. Like point one millimeter resolution, which is very.

B

C

We can print pretty decent, mil pretty decent circuits with it. So that's that's pretty good. Coming up this weekend, we're gonna build probably two of them and learn a lot about electronics, the middle, a couple sample devices and basically prove out further develop the CNC mill towards a complete complete product package. So that's that's a big one back at home here, I'm continuing work on I'm, just building more printers kind of shaking down.

C

You think so you can see on slide six, that's what it it looks like right now, I built another one here, so basically proving out more details on it: improving the the printhead mounting the new electronics assembly. On that just making slight improvements towards really high product high quality product. You can see the universal axis, as you see it in a picture, all the axes are identical, so really focusing on the absolute minimum parts count and simplicity of build I timed the build time for each axis, so now then quite experienced with it.

C

It takes me 15 minutes to build when access completely from scratch from the raw parts from the 3d prints from the Bolton and individual components assembling that completely from scrap parts. When I say scratch, parts and things you can get readily off-the-shelf. So 15 minutes there's five axes, two four: five moving axes.

C

That means about an hour under an hour and a half more like an hour fifteen minutes for a skilled person to build the complete access assembly, including mounting that, if you have the frame, so the frame has got the bolt together. Construction and yeah.

B

That's that's quite I must.

C

Say it's quite pleasing to see how it's it's relatively simple and still like in the build process, refining some of the details like what is the correct procedure? How do we make it easier for for it to be totally foolproof, and one thing that I'm doing right now before there was something that nobody could get right, which is like? How do you orient the axis because it matters whether the like, if you see zoom in here but yeah? Actually let me let me share my screen for everybody, so you can see what I'm looking at.

C

You know zoom in here, so that's on one of the axes. You see the belt holding peg. It can be on the right hand or left hand side during former builds. What we learned is that if people didn't, we wanted to have it such that you get it right so that the motion is correct and right now, just one simple medication is not ringing about that being correct in the mechanical, but that we plug in the stepper motor to the controller that controls the proper direction.

C

So that's much easier to modify than having to if you get it wrong to remove the axis from machine, so it.

E

F

Little details a simplification.

C

That it all worked well, so that's that's happening. 60 Circuit mill, workshop last thing I will just bring about, is uh on the tractor, the micro tracker. No there's gonna be some forward motion on that, in a sense that the German guys, where I went at the University of Helmut Schmidt University in Hamburg, so they actually inviting me to the detsen funding or like a Tunisia project where they're inviting me to build the actual tractor. So what proposed to them as we build the tractor without loader, but with remote control.

C

So that's coming up for Tunisia sometime early 20 Nats great, because that will allow us to replicate the tractor mean we prototype again and actually make some business. What remote control, which we have already done, but we haven't tested that with the tractor yet so there's be gonna, be a little bit of improvement there in terms of forward motion. But that's that's a pretty exciting project that will be done for for basically up to 20 students, probably at a university at somewhere in Tunis I.

C

Don't know much detail more than that, but said the initial conversation on I, which is quite exciting because we probably will end up if we don't know if they have access to CNC cutting of metal. But if they do, that would be a great replication of a tractor it and it's it's kind of cool that you can build that all in a period the workshop will. All together will be five days.

C

So it's cool to see that you can get a bunch of newbies or experienced people and have that and build guide them in building that in under a week. So I mean probably more like two days for mechanical, probably two days for the electrical parts and there we go.

F

So that is pretty good.

C

Pace of build because of the way we build it involved, so that's.

E

C

My side I think so I like to hear then from now Michel him.

C

So can you China to us on so what we'd like to find out is what exactly is the status of the the truck controller and electronics work, that's being done and and the German side so yeah.

G

D

C

You can take us do that. The idea for OSC is. We have an offer ed seen, eco-home that you might have seen and in it we have three kilowatts of photovoltaics. We use off-the-shelf chargers right now with lead-acid batteries, but we'd look to, of course, as time goes on to get all the opens power. Electronics is there and that's part of the global village Construction Set we have the universal power. Supply is with the relevant project within the global village.

C

Construction Set is and that power supply actually applies to other things, like your induction, furnace welders, inverters charge, charge systems for like windmills on a larger scale and the way we think about it is modularity, as always scalable in units of 1 or 10 kilowatts. So so then, you know if it's scalable at 10 kilowatts, we can be talking about. Ok, we can do a system, that's a hundred kilowatts and when we say the global village, we typically think about a 200 watt scale or around. Let's say: 200 horsepower 200 watt scale.

C

That's the current claim of trying to prove as sufficiency for a modern economy. It gets up to all industrial features of modern civilization, so the.

G

Scalability gets.

C

Us there, because if we can do a smaller system with one or one units, one kilowatt or units of 10 kilowatts, then can scale that we design everything for out the Germany.

C

H

But it's like 1 Jaeger, the main developer, he's doing it and he's not explicitly part of the open source Jeremy right just for ya bucks.

B

And you're you're located in Hamburg I'm.

D

Located in Hamburg, yes and.

C

D

Hope you can yeah.

C

A little bit more are at the University earth. Tell me a little more about yourself, yeah.

H

From my side, I'm in verse, achieving my master now in automation, systems yeah and for this, your organization, that's called the hammock open or a university, and they are doing like an projects and open educational resources so yeah. So this was the initial for me to found group called collective of Costa. Mesa and I want to do some open source hardware project in the field of University. So this was engineer. I found, Martin Yeager turn in develop or delete close up to check.

H

This is the solar charger charger in together and the open source, ecology Germany. We put it up a soul ox, so the ecozone are box. So it's just larger electrical component of the open source, although charger.

H

So this is main project behind it and we also want to try it or you're, providing like an open educational resources so for assembly objects, so how to reproduce them also our products just to do it for for newbies, for people who don't have this knowledge and therefore we are providing this open educational resource and the first step is now the PCB production so how to produce the PCB. So, as I said, you are doing a workshop with a PCB mill.

H

This would be also I think a great possibility to cooperate and to do some collaboration in this field. Yes, oh and for your questions now for the Solar, Charger I, don't know if you see my screen, you see yes,.

E

H

E

H

This is the the project of it and it's an select two main parts. One is it's attached controller, so it's in charge controller. So it's not just a MOSFET, the H rich mosfet inside of it. So you can use it from the hardware side as a boost and l-pod quarter. So you can step down. You can step up to whatever so easy peasy comfortable, and it's just like the software. You have changed to another function, so this is also good. I. Think the modularity behind it.

H

You just have to change the software and then you can use it. The other way, uh-huh.

E

C

E

C

Ask you about that so then, between a boost and Buck converter function here so you're saying that is the circuit identical, so it's made it. What may such that, if you did an individual set down versus step up with the components, be different works.

H

Like on components like you have for MOSFET for it, so it's a calling H rich and that well you can use it. It's like.

H

C

Good because then so you can use modify the software to give the different functionality. That's that's great.

H

Yeah, yes, and for an hour for the for the power, it's like this charge controller. Now it's up to 300, Watts people. You can connect here uh-huh on this, on this one charge controller and on the output, and you can have a 12 volt battery level or a 24 volt battery level. So it's up to 24 volt and the input voltage level is 44.

H

Sorry 55 for ya, but.

C

Can you do, for example like if you have.

D

C

Battery system, can you actually use that to charge 24 volt batteries.

C

D

You have 12 volt.

C

Battery 12 for PV panels can you charge 20.

H

What hold matters? Yes, yes,.

H

G

H

Don't think it in me, you don't have a 12-volt PV panel, but maybe a 12-volt DC generator, so yeah both little windmills and then with this you can you can charge up to 24 20.

C

Just typically the things you get off the shelf look at the standard, commercial and PP teach controller. Does.

B

C

Allow you to step up or only sub down Tippett little.

D

Step down right.

D

C

Least the one I have I believe it's. It can only go down again if it's not because.

H

It's so much harder and.

H

C

H

Voltage level higher than right.

C

No, it's great that's great.

H

Mm-Hmm so system layer, maybe I, can also and explain a little bit from here. So this is the solar box system layer, but this is also just Caleb. Oh and yeah. The system is the same, just the frame behind it, so we we call it not a solar box to compare, because we want to check for portable box, but the system layer. You can scale it up and yeah.

H

So here's the beauty and now this is the solar charger which you can under ectly connect to acid acid lat batteries right and now it's also the second component of the leafless. A large project is the battery management system, and this is for, if you're using line, and so now we got lion Iran.

H

C

Or lithium batteries, lithium, various.

H

C

Then so them any BT part. That's you to, let us add batteries, and then BMS gets you to with the embarrassed.

D

H

Maxilla for now, for now in the test, if you can have yeah, need a third and buy anything as employees, because the penis just switch DC DC converter unit VMs, so that you can I say to any couple so that children have the swatch level here at here for knobs directly. So the better really voltage level as.

H

D

H

So now the battery voltage level always the great voltage level. So if you want to connect- and here are the loads- it's depending on voltage level.

H

F

E

From the power.

H

Like I said, 300 watt busting up now, I'm doing also my master thesis behind it that room to interconnect more of these components so that we can scale it up and limit that we have little energy management behind it, so that each component most what the other ones needs, because we got here. Communication interface, Basin canvas so lock where it's it's a campus and we got also a gateway behind it, so that we can transfer depend data into y by together the rest person you row for now.

H

You can also use a USP anything just to get on the data, your Wi-Fi and then just open Harper project, I'm, looking nother, open energy, monitor and you're using this for visualization.

H

C

G monitor who's who's.

H

C

H

Also doing great job also providing some.

H

So they're providing like measuring.

F

D

C

Is that fully open source there.

H

They've got the hoppers.

H

D

You guys we replicated it. You.

H

Bought it the ha not know we will use the software so we've got. We got Mad Men sister on the harder year so for measuring the wallet in the car up there, a little measurement components in the hopper so don't need the hardware from the energy monitor, but we use the software for the visualization okay yeah.

H

H

Yeah, yes, so this is roughly I think we are done. As I said, we are doing it you're right. We for open educational resources. I think this is the the main possibility to get into design check code to get into the university field, because then also the professors and the students get maybe more attracted to this project, and yes, also the regenerated systems.

H

For now. It's really on the focus so yeah.

G

H

To provide here, the workshop, slides, yeah, Esther, sealed also I, think CDMA.

D

H

I, don't know how am I how much time if you want to see you know you can just see it on the. If you, if I share the link, you can watch over yeah.

B

C

And go ahead, tell us a little more okay.

H

Okay yeah so first is open. Educational access in.

H

This topic, then input so large and run here is the surprise so for building up PC space and.

C

You type the pocket. Can you just type that into the chat box cuz? My screen is not updating.

G

B

Okay got the link.

C

G

C

A prerequisite question here so you're actually amending that people replicate this module fully.

E

C

What part of it had been? What hazard versus in you know, involvement and.

H

So we're provided now here we production of the PCP, but we know that do this because PCP products pasties, really yeah, but we wanna show because it's open source, so it's possible. If you want to do it and we also showed the addict open the same like the flaps and the open workshops you can. You can use for this so that you can you do it by yourself and yeah.

H

We got a disclaimer here because we are not providing any any a currency or something like this, so the PCBs are tested, so the PCBs are also in use so Martin Yeager, who developed it, not sold it but gave it to some people who wanted to because choosing also on a boat and carob, and things like this so and he knows what he's doing, because I was working in the battery development for vehicles or electrical vehicles. You're testing viewers, yeah peace out testify. So we got.

G

H

Got a problem so we tested in University for electric magnetic yes t so the CEO certification that you provide PCBs the lecture part spin around and for this decimal. So the values a little bit too high, but not it's too high for for getting the certification or the not to violate its are.

B

You actually pursuing the C certification.

H

Yeah I've wanted to see your test. Okay,.

C

Clemmy more about the product ization of it. So are you looking to actually sell kiss and make business.

H

C

H

Know so far huh sex Oh Watson, yes, the main developer I think he wants to live from it because a lot of development, but it's I, don't know distance more behind it, but I think it just like.

H

So maybe in this direction, but like I said, that's, that's Martin Yeager for me! Now not it's just like to get the open hardware into universities and to get also students with it. So that student sees what is possible because if I am studying electrical system, I've never built up PCBs. So this was the first time just because I I solve it as possible. Mm-Hmm.

G

B

So tell me just a little bit more about which role you have versus versus Martin Yeager, your so you're working.

H

In this process, so the Lipa solo project is fully from Martin.

H

I was doing this cozy Masada the collective open doors hardware, so the community group- you know Baden Humber. It's also like the open source ecology. So we wanted to be a region little bit, but like independent, so I, just distributed community for building up just in general community with open source is fairly open source Harvard. So this wasn't named and reason for myself so I'm the founder of this comfortable hardware and.

H

G

H

So for your question, sir, so like so just gave it up, okay I would suggest. Maybe because I said you got a busy bee circuit mill. Maybe if you are interested to rebuild the CCB, because we show how to how to put together a part where ready, I'm a PC so already printed PC, so we bought the red even to easy de, but we put it together with the electrical components like verses on capacitor, so your project would be the first step.

H

Power would be the second step, and then we are doing now the third project for building it up to a system so like connecting batteries with it connecting solar panels with it, so that you have really really ready to use to centralize energy system. Okay,.

B

And here's that here's a question for you then so we like to approach the.

C

Philosophy of saying, okay, whatever components whatever, however, you can simplify.

B

Things by putting it as much on the.

C

Software and microcontroller side so that the electrical components are minimum, for example, instead of designing circuit with opponents, put it into code and use the maximum functionality of the microcontroller, and one looked at the design, it seems like seem like you're, not really doing that and I wanted to ask you what is or was the rationale? How are you thinking behind your thinking behind it so that you, in a beloved, a DIY manufacturability like with CNC circuit notes?

C

First, so if somebody doesn't have access to the stands, souls the more advanced way of doing it, can we simplify the structure, so it's easily printable the CNC circuit mill or mobile, with a CNC sermo and then as much of it going on the micro site, so you you're, using the basically from each information age, components which are microcontrollers to displace as many of the discrete components as possible. Does that does.

B

C

H

You'd like to get more on a software to be like more flexible, just changing my friend to get his little quieter hardware.

H

C

Use more functionality of the microcontroller, because.

E

It's easier to another I software, then to make.

C

Things with hardware yeah.

H

So by now this design yoga right. Oh so it's completely full of huge features, so this was also the main reason behind it as far as I understand Martin Yeager, because he wanted just to show how much you can get by yourself but right, it's it's really complex for now he's also developing I, don't know when we will get out a simplified charge controller, especially for a developing country, so to get just like in UCB output to have a little less power.

H

So I don't know if if we get the right requirements of put of the production of TCP so how to develop, it I think we can get it.

H

Right now it's just for us. We can get it in any way. You want it. Yeah.

C

Yeah, that's right! So what are the like? The discussion like do you have a you know? What's your method of communication and form or something like you guys, communicate both totally breasts a lot and yeah.

H

And our cause in this is on the table. We are now opening it, though, and so psychology dominant they're, providing a giftie so also get a stir and yep and with the with hoses are we want to change to the kicks G and literally people are seen.

H

The development is the base in the communications, because now your lips, like maybe.

H

C

You say telegram.

H

B

Telegram, as in show me Linda, can you send the links, tell it and use a telegram, that's telegram. I.

H

B

No I haven't used. It is that popular in Germany.

H

C

I use a US team reuse. Our game I never used it. I.

H

Think it's not the best security in everything.

H

H

C

Can you send type in the link via telegram the group find out? We find your group on there yeah.

D

Thank you, yeah.

H

Kentucky left for the code for closing stock room, so the kunais age, sort of collective sauce.

H

C

Yeah I'm, just thinking about how we can into the communication links yeah right: okay, lbs.

F

C

It from if we can collaborate, maybe on a CC milled version, you'd like for a developing world or our goal is try to simplify the tools at so you can still obtain same functionality, but without the more enhanced tool.

H

To get the loop into it for building, we got the nano grit, so this would be good that the main idea behind it so open in a grid system and yeah. Also, although all the power supply modules you are developing, to try to get in one great time, just go yeah.

B

Yeah definitely, and when you say the micro grid, is that your focus or is that Martin no.

H

It's like yeah, also my focus like nano micro grid so because of my master, thesis and I think this is also the only way to get the scalable the scalable of functionality behind it, because yeah.

H

Power limit and also the communications you hundred together stand the communication. Hang it so. Our teens.

H

On open energy protocols, so we like.

H

Systems, you know some was doing I.

C

Don't ask you who are there any other groups working on open source hardware, micro grids.

C

Do you know any other groups.

C

Are you guys, like the only ice.

H

Yeah, so that you would also be used.

H

C

Now all we should talk about that. Let's no! Let's start this around that see what a brain would look like. I'll be good, okay,.

B

Yeah, as is, do you rep recommend, though, if.

C

We want to replicate this with the CNC circuit mill. How would you suggest we do it? Do we want to build one of yours just as it is right now and maybe tested or just.

H

Just would be so if yeah, you can see with holidays right now, you can see if you could print it.

G

C

H

C

You guys be able to make one for us.

H

C

I mean it would be great to just start replacing I. Don't you see our off grid our system for the seeker home? It can start snagging out those proprietary components and putting in the open source ones. That would be a very attractive, very proposition for the world yeah, but.

H

You just sort it's everything, awesome.

H

C

G

C

um Yeah and what about the populating? The board is that all doable by hand or you have to have I mean you have to have the stencil and all that right. You know, there's.

H

Also, production who got a pick-and-place machine, so you need someone who got a.

G

H

Machine will give you the fully to fully or.

B

We can take a look at.

H

What it would look like, oh we can thank with one or we can send you one. It was yeah.

B

Yeah, let's see what's possible, but definitely we'd want to go into the route of saying.

C

Okay, let's, let's redesign this for circuit malleability and possibly the spliff ocation by logic, of removing the physical components and thing is not of the functionality onto the motor processor, microcontroller.

D

As possible, because the circuit.

E

C

It's a big base. If you got you got.

E

C

Assets and some eight drivers and you got the fast signals from them from a motor controller.

H

You have to reduce it. Look like the communication.

H

So you can do consent. The requirements like yeah, okay,.

C

Well, that's great yeah! That's the.

D

C

Something I mean you: can we can at least start using this right now and seeing seeing what what improvements or what? What modifications it to be made for the scalability and and ease of manufacture, yeah, okay, excellent.

B

Well, I think that that that does that anything.

F

B

Anything else you'd like to wrap up with, or did you communicate all that you wanted to say or.

H

Yeah I think at this time. Yes, okay,.

G

H

I really like to have to be the collaboration for you. I can say some general thing, but you know everyone gets the limited time you can yeah.

D

Yeah I mean we want.

H

H

C

That's why we're you know or try to go the route of okay, so anything that we do that's ready to be productized an opportunity, so I can actually take that and prize and run with it. So there's good energy behind it in its self funding and the idea behind that is we also the business side completely open source. So it's a distributive enterprise, but there's definitely different people around the world that make money from it or a run and prizes. So Ashley continues development, that's fully open source and so forth. So I don't think.

C

There's any good example of such an enterprise. Right now, like the 3d printer, perhaps is the closest, but none of the companies are actually trying to promote the replication of their business by others like physical proof, so doesn't try to start up another who's, something else where we're trying. We are trying to do that. Well, saying: okay, let's: let's develop the full business model, Enterprise case and then teach people how to do that, so that there is an active development effort, that's up on through the products.

C

So that's the general idea there's a lot of work to do on that.

G

C

Okay, well Michelle. So thank you. Thank you for your feedback here and then, let's continue, the meeting I will continue on communications on the Internet, we'll follow up. So let's maybe hear from Spencer. So Spencer is also a guest online today with us. So Spencer, would you mind filling us in more what so in Chicago? What's what are you interested in doing there tell us more.

C

Yet Meza pencil you gotta onion to yourself, you muted. Now, if you're trying to speak.

C

Oh Spence, yes,.

D

Spencer no and he.

C

For some reason, knob and you try.

G

Something else like oh.

C

So again here yet.

C

Anyone else here, Spencer, no, we can't hear you can.

F

You just like a bee to refresh.

C

The browser no.

F

I'll just rush the browsers.

C

If you, if the voice comes in.

E

C

You now we can't yeah, okay, okay,.

I

So, what's the per second yeah.

D

I

Every started going to think I'll shine, haptic. First of all, clone. My name is Spencer mainland.

I

Electricals near and do you bedded systems, company call shop track and I've been interested in open some constant for a long time and I want to see if I can help by getting a group together here in Chicago, so ash I act like it's just kind of a they they meet every week on Tuesdays anybody can come, join they'll have a presentation at the beginning over a ran the topic, that's all about like social, good and civic technology, to help cities and communities, but anybody can start a group mm-hm.

I

So mmm after where'd soldiers have work groups for the rest of the night, so I thought it was a good opportunity to see it become like an open source culture and depending on what people like and what talent I can gather into it. What projects I can work on.

I

As far as myself, I image cynic on electronics. I one point designed a Tesla coil project.

I

Adduction furnaces, similar circuitry, just a big power burger.

I

So but anyway help so it is I'm gonna be starting in August since I'm going to Europe for weeks and then I'll see where it took me from there. Yeah.

C

Play people show up to the show.

C

I

40 50 people ah and that will be a presentation the beginning and it will break up into groups except it's down to town there. It's a place called on the Merchandise Mart.

I

So it's this big open space, I, think they're using headquarters of a company called Braintree, and so.

D

I

Do you have any questions about it.

C

I

Or if you're interested in like getting involved while I started this group going to go, mentum yeah I was thinking potentially what I could do if we need a workspace we vehicle to a makerspace or some place. If we work someplace where there's actual equipment I know a few places gonna city I have to potentially go to so.

H

C

Seen that Jude, you would have this group, it shouldn't meet. Add me: do like the design word that.

C

Spaces well do an actual prototyping yeah yeah. So so can you cut to the I mean? Does the duction first project Macon's to your? Would that be fun for you, yeah.

I

It makes sense, I'm familiar some familiar, I, think the requirements, but I have a bachelor's degree, level, education and our electron so I'm, a metabolic which is to design it sorry, but so it really timed on which people we can get tell us. You know sources.

I

C

H

What was a simple.

C

Zero voltage crossing power supplies that you can get on Amazon, but let me see: I've been delaying $40 yeah.

G

B

Do you think of that I mean? Is that.

C

Scalable to much higher power.

B

By by enlarging components or.

G

B

Maybe like say to a couple.

C

Of kilowatts or 10 kilowatts can.

B

C

To 10 10 kilowatts so.

I

What I know about um induction furnaces is that they usually have these big capacitor banks in them. Mm-Hm I, don't know if those like they're like the size of a cabinet right because you're, it's it's the opposite end of a resonant tank circuit, I, don't know exactly how those scale with larger power.

I

So we saying we're finding out yeah.

C

Do you have any familiarity with how you actually track the cuz.

B

C

Doesn't work like it should turn on the appropriate capacitance of depending a load like like it actually follows the lobe that yeah yeah it does and.

I

As all as the load changes as a heats up, so metal in the middle is functioning as a cordis doctors, the inductance and resistance change with temperature Kirk right. You.

C

Know how they actually track that like they, how they all it actually end up. Turning on bank of the capacitors, you know, I'm not sure yeah, no.

G

I mean it's, it's something I.

C

Can do well, we know what we can do is do a dump like a really dumb sub I, that you can say it's like 2 kilo watts, but it would not follow the load and it would be very inefficient. But maybe that's.

E

C

Maid, like a nun in the prototyping plan, that could be the way to go. First, we say: okay, we can make this scale this to any power. Now it won't be really efficient, but would it work and then we go on to the okay? Add the load following feature such that we can actually make it highly functional. That could be one way to go, but we.

B

D

C

Maybe where we can have you do? Can you maybe like start looking into this and come up with kind of a prototyping plan as far as what you would see would make make sense, and we could say I would say the like. If we go all out to this project, I mean we can say.

C

Ok, the first phase is do a very small circuit like like then it goes up to kilowatt, and then we can say: ok now we're getting some serious power modules of 10 kilowatts and can we scale, and so many come with a protein plan, how you would go about that and how we can go from one of the NASA. We max sizing, like the common use of components, basically do modular design on this, so in skelet, modular, scalable design as much as possible and, of course, hopefully with something that can Arden.

C

That I would just go for Arduino if possible, or a very public Arduino to be able to do it. As far as I know this option, I don't know yeah.

I

I am pretty sure that surgery could happen. So it's a flight I've tried over and I found I'm having situation that there's a sign online for it's all, using passive components.

I

There's no electronics involved right, there's, no certain. Just not my brother, I trust walked so in a large or dot she's. French I'm, going to tell you how bad that you wouldn't be driving oil directly movie put it in doctors to separate it. I'm sorry, you've been putting a little transformer around the piece on the current of that, whatever that's called the coil I guess the heating element yep.

I

G

C

B

So can you maybe, like think about a you- know, a prototyping plan for how to go from the small scale to the larger scale? Can you maybe work on that? A little bit yeah.

I

I can do that yeah.

B

C

I mean a group of people working on it. Then we can contribute the knowledge that we have Shana's doing this circuit mill. He knows some decent power promise yeah.

G

C

We can continue on that, but.

G

Yeah yeah: we can hire their nature to work. No.

D

I mean that that.

C

They know right now, there's nobody that I'm aware of that sort of doing you work on this, but it'll be good to you know start with the basics: okay, there's some resources on design of, because there what's the best look out there on induction furnace or supplies, you know started with that and read up some of that document best learnings. Ideally you want fine. It would just get to one of the companies that do this or a whole other subject matter. I could just look at quite.

E

A fight somebody hitting or see it does work.

C

On on induction furnaces and see if they willing to be advisor, no good proper thing to do what to get proper guidance as well yeah.

C

But if I can give me searchable, groups are working on this like say in the States or the universities. They can just reach up to them and say.

G

C

Guys we're starting this project. Can you advise this site? You know give us like an hour of your time every month or something we can go forward on that yep.

C

Let's get some decent guidance, yeah.

I

C

I reinventing the wheel, that's a general idea. Yeah.

B

Okay, well, that sounds good, so yeah! Well, let's we'll continue discussing.

C

On that- and you know see what you can do in wrangling together, the Chicago group and it also looks like in October I'll, be going to Chicago, we'll run a 3d printer workshop in Chicago tentatively scheduled for October, so we can also meet there. Maybe we can do something together when, when we're doing this, build but okay a chance to meet yeah, definitely.

D

I

I'm sure people.

C

Are instead yeah yeah yeah that.

G

Sounds good sounds good, do you have enough Liberty.

F

C

Your your current work that you can contribute something to this or you're pretty busy at work.

C

I

I mean it's something where in fact can make the right ranges for myself that I can do it. No it's right downtown right to work things like that, so yeah.

G

C

I could do it we'll wait to build something around on the project. Okay, yeah.

I

There's not much of a hacker community Chicago them really passionate about creating that as well. Yeah.

C

Okay, that sounds that sounds good all Spencer thanks a lot move on keep moving here. So welcome to you know to what else.

D

C

Does hopefully, we can collaborate more on this? Okay, so let go on to so. We have Bruce long and Rick still. Do you guys 78.

E

C

And she'd like to share.

D

It's are you here, yeah.

F

So I've been working on the key cab to free cap toolchain yeah, so it looks like there is a work bench that has decent reviews and I started running at oh I, see Linux, so my opens up. Just fine seems to integrate. I am trying to get some familiarity, but the next step is to be able to bring in one else of the individual parts that you have to put on the board.

F

So I haven't heard that out. That's gonna stop and then.

C

I had a question for you said: Oh SELinux are doing live version. Did you install SELinux.

F

Installer: okay, okay,.

F

Justin will open up PCE files from kicad and they look very nice, but I haven't made my mom come in the precast yeah.

G

The project I was going to.

F

Kind of use the song one to build up the 3d model, the cat assembly of CMC, sir, go yeah.

G

Yeah, so I guess would mean.

F

To have the know with the wraps or it's Sergey killed, so I'm playing around I've, trying to click together those models yeah and how that assemble, and then just uh that kind of led me to the well. How do we mount this d3d Frank yeah nice suit in the documentation? There's those metal cases they were using versus Shane's field seems like it's not really mounted right on. So that's something we can discuss. Yeah.

B

And as you see, um let's see, let me.

C

Paste in a picture here, the basic Plexiglas mounting panel were solidly well. Let me show a picture of that.

C

You guys see my screen.

F

Not yeah I hear that okay.

C

If you have dad this is my personal Facebook, that's how the control panel looks like on the frame. It's pretty neat looks nice and clean, probably tight everything.

G

Is just little through.

C

Holes that are drilled with the drill and using cable ties. Four inch. Cable ties, work really well, it looks bringing so right now. That's mount, including the Plexiglas being cable tied to frame itself through 10 holes, drilled in the metal thing and that's quite workable and relatively easy to drill with a hand drill through the frame that's wash and it's not covered, but the ideas like for.

E

Example, I had to replace.

F

C

The RAM sword: well, the cool thing about this is I, takes like one myth to do that you don't have to take apart any anything so something that like, for example, if you have a well actually in the lulzbot mini that I have here, I think the board went bad and but to to extract it as a lot of effort. It probably takes about. Oh no, like half an hour, perhaps- and you gotta- have a bunch of tools here. I do like the idea of the transparent, naked design.

C

It is a good I, think good for serviceability and maybe for other versions. We might want to make it more enclosed, but for serviceability this definitely is good, and then we can clearly put a cover on this as well, perhaps even just another plexiglass cover that could be cut with a cincy cirque since the small laser cutter that he can also make on a DVD frame.

C

So if you use this tenth inch I'm using there 10 10 inch Plexiglas, imagine that being cut by d3d little laser cutter and that being a ready mounting box for all electronics. So you could even make that a transparent clover that just comes right on and off. That's when we go, we can talk about different, more dedicated ways to do the enclosures yeah.

F

That's helpful, interesting yeah, so the other bosses, the power supply, yeah.

G

F

E

Then the adrenals.

F

Is their issue of them running hot? No, at.

C

This, no not not as it is it's just small, just small, separate motor that we're driving. So that's not an issue. No fan heating is required at this stage, yet we goggle our machines, probably, but not at this point.

C

G

E

That's this is wanted.

C

Go I mean it could be a good quick prototype how to do at least on the currents treadmill that we're building. That's the current plan. It's a way to organize everything neatly without the LCD. We don't don't use the LCD on a circuit mill, yet so basically power supply and then the drivers and little relay that's needed. Yeah.

F

Yeah, thank you, um so I'll start a page and we can try out a document how deep what the options are for mounting the are the notes and the other components. Yep.

C

Excellent and about starting new projects upon Ruslan's request, there's a video put up a little video. How do you start new products? That's explaining a development template, no specific instructions for inviting that in a wiki, so we can take a look at some page six of working back here. Alright.

E

So I do have anything.

C

To add to this fine Monday, yes, okay and just to wrap up Erik, is that everything on your site or anything else, to wrap up an.

F

Awesome: okay,.

C

Sounds good Eric Bruce Lee go ahead then.

A

C

A

Big event, Dolph.

A

When I went there, I think it files for for frame and add that box for boxes and I was able to do access.

A

To that file that can open up doors.

A

C

Can you upload it to your your diat instance.

A

Now, I I will try to find out what what kind of repository I will use for it, because I think about alternative to.

G

A

I already have a good life account and big packet, but I want also to check if I will use the repository provided by open source, ecology, Germany, okay.

A

Well, this thinks it's fixed and I would.

E

A

E

And I will follow your suggestion.

A

And after go together, yeah.

C

A

It wasn't shorter and you could see my products. I had some drugs to move things around whenever a lot.

D

A

Things in freakin, but also because I have much experience in Fiat yeah.

C

A

Where file simplification.

C

You need that there's a page called file, simplification on the wedding, and it tells you about how to how to simply.

C

How to convert file size, reduce file, size, mustn't, buying the files?

C

Let's see there.

G

E

C

If you'll take a look at head on we'll just paste that into the chat box, er take a look at that. If you do want to work quickly with large files, have all the details, it'll free that will get slow just like any salt or get so after some time to get friends. So do the file simplification question on.

B

The 2020 profile is that the link in the RB om is that what you're getting or have you gotten that already.

A

G

B

I'm looking at that, is that what you're actually getting.

A

B

So it looks pretty.

E

B

E

B

Three point: six euros per meter: that's pretty cheap yeah! That's good! Hey!.

A

As far as I understand that a will cut them in pieces, yeah.

D

C

E

You're making important that's.

C

For an engine I.

A

Don't need a man just for monitors, you say: sit a bit, this guy'll frame, I and laughter the frame.

A

Which is so nice.

A

Is such a cube.

A

A

This is fresh leads right.

C

And it's more than hose.

A

C

Think you're ready that's pretty.

A

A

My experience here will give you the frame as far as I know. Yes,.

A

Sire, so one something or to Europe.

A

This is three dogs and, of course, all the other parts maybe also to be stretched, but I think it is. It is not a big deal. Yeah.

B

Now does he have one of these actually running as a 3d printer.

A

I'm not sure, but he has a frame. Okay,.

G

A

C

A

Happy, but to find out the way I can buy some waters. Yeah.

A

C

Yeah, that's good, that's good! Now, I would suggest if you can to make things easier for code and changeability follow the geometry. That's on a current bill as an picture that I put in. If you look at I, put a lot of very detailed pictures of the build on Facebook.

C

It's actually a convenient way to document, because you can just upload straight away from the cellphone, but note the geometry of where x, axis y axis and z axes are, and essentially, if you're, looking from the front of the machine, the Y motors are towards the rear and the exporter is on the Left facing the year.

A

And plays the same way.

C

Yes, let's see howdy 3d Ohio's like that should be, should be the correct orientation. It's just so that everyone had a uniform orientation which makes it easier. Yes,.

A

It's not too much about it. That's right, I, just.

C

Yeah yeah that's right, right, I'm, looking at yeah! Well, not exactly okay,.

F

C

Actually I'm looking at specifically now it's not what I have, in other words it beeped you'd, have to mess around all the yeah. Actually.

G

I'll get triggered.

C

You have to end up going in tomorrow to make little Corrections, but um d, 3d, controller, okay, H, believe any controller and on.

A

C

E

I can see yeah, it's.

A

An exercise okay, well.

C

I mean flipping an ACCI shouldn't, be.

C

A

C

C

A

C

B

G

B

If you look at d3d controller, so there.

C

Is that's documented.

B

There so I just typed in do so. Okay,.

A

B

What what it says there and that's what we try to make it uniform, so there's left right.

C

Back in front okay, oh man and that's and that's not really right there either for the Z, but for the x and y that is correct. So x motor is on the left side facing the y1 motor, okay and y1 motors at the left back side. Wat motor right.

A

Jennifer I cannot process position information before a blemish in this.

C

B

C

Reading the words on there, it's the arrows are pointing to the y-axis and to the and the x axis is in between y axis, but this fall.

B

A

C

Is the operator what you're looking at and that pointing 10k looking at it? This.

A

Would be x axis you get the.

C

G

C

G

E

C

Directional for the back is why it's like a cohesion system. So if you looking at a Cartesian system, the X goes left to right right, yeah.

C

So following the invention of Activa Justin when you're looking at from the front. So that's idea but actually you're, not thinking about that I. Don't.

A

Know tomato sure, I can imagine very crazy cafes and systems Wow.

C

Understood that right away.

B

Now, the in a document itself the only changes the Z Motors have you.

C

Want them facing up like in Jonathan's, so I'm gonna change that like right now here, so we confuse less people, so you know you know see you see how that's.

A

The only example which is completely correct, this would be good. It.

C

Would be really great and I think the first person that's gonna, do just it's gonna be warded okay,.

C

Boys we still have not updated, there's like but idea is the Z motor, the Z motors, actually at a top, because.

F

It allows you to get more space more.

C

Space out of the pickle axis, that's what we learned looking motors at the top.

C

Right now, it's wrong.

E

C

Pictures I add me too, if you take a look at the pictures from the current bill, which is old, black hole or if you spoke in this document that is correct. There.

A

When I am officials.

C

A

C

All the code we've written in terms of Marlon said nobody has to mess with the axis orientation. That's already corrected all the co. So that's one less than we're worried about.

A

Your Facebook, which is hot, desperate, yes, okay, Michael about how did I, why I didn't reject drawing public wiki's.

B

C

Right click on the object, you'll make transparent, hey.

I

Guys I hit the head out before this is really informative side. No.

B

Issue this first eating yeah. No, that's that's cool you're good to go so we didn't just continue finish up the meeting so Spencer thanks. Okay,.

I

Thanks have a great rest of your happy 4th of July. Okay, you.

C

Know that yeah thank you. It was a date. Okay, alright.

C

So the link in current working document is that's the bill that you can trace every single stat and if you.

E

Phrase, the milk.

G

C

It's it can be quite helpful because that's the actual, most effective way build building one SS at a time, I think because whatever happening is one to start hitting anything to the frame, you're gonna see all you're gonna have to make all these little adjustments. So it's easy I found it to be actually easier to make adjustments on the fly.

C

There's you have to have there the day.

F

C

Final, don't bless and an artist line by sliding the rocks in and out very slightly, so it's just when you're pulling that do follow or at least take a look at what I had on Facebook. There are bunch posts about that. Okay,.

A

Yeah and then share at the.

C

D

In slide, seven.

A

You just saw just scream.

C

Know this one I know.

A

Better why this.

C

One here the this.

B

Yes, this one, this.

C

A

B

On X&Y and as Motors are at the top okay.

A

G

A

C

B

That allows them to go.

C

Further down allowing more print space, it'll work with the motors down and it won't. You won't have to change anything in the code either, but.

A

It's not very efficient there.

C

Were ways of space space.

A

C

C

G

D

C

You on your way, if you yeah, as you go along, keep doing the CAD and.

C

G

E

Is I would recommend is have.

C

You thought about which extruder you would use.

A

C

Now, if you slip pictures and Facebook we're working with Bruce, i3 and k2 modified version for our fart, with uh with a pneumatic mount, that seems to be the best option right now, given that the tenant arrow extruder is still not designed with a fan, so it doesn't have fan on it. We can mount it as is, but we need a cooling fan so and one that does everything has everything in a complete is the provide three okay and I've made of 3d printed parts.

C

That you'd need to get your hands on and if you're doing that, if you get that's, that's that's gonna block there, but do.

B

You have access to 3d printing, hopefully with the.

C

Printer, you got right now.

A

E

A

Other developer for more say, Germany, we're happy for sure excellent.

C

Excellent, so you can print yourself the.

B

Modified Prusa i3 mk2, which has got the big 8 millimeter distance sensing.

C

Sensor and that's documented on the under d3d extruder, so that there shouldn't be any controversy there.

E

A

A

B

C

The longevity of the project you want to go with same names that are found on the GVCS page, which lists of 50 different machines. That way, someone new to this without knowing that we're calling the 3d printer d 3d can actually find it I, don't.

A

C

The deal is, if you call it D, 3d printer, we.

B

Can simply put a link to the of.

C

A so-called official page, which would be 3d printer, so you want this. The answer is, you want 3d printer and if we do write d, 3d, V so and so forth, we would want to redirect so number sign. We direct that page so that, whichever you doing is looking fine. That.

A

Yes, yeah, yes,.

B

That doesn't hurt.

C

B

C

Do that I would just do that since that's how we even do it so far?

C

Does that hurt any it does help sprayed the looks? Orphans earned longer number.

E

C

Yeah, so it's fantastic.

A

Because sometimes the name in programming is pretty state exact this. Why I wanted yeah.

C

A

C

Know do the dots is more human, readable. The.

A

Business and then I was known to some government. Some documents are not just the vehicle at a large flat file, which I find also has advantages.

A

A

A

Let me see other ocean, they have a little bit information to each chap to each section.

A

But in the video which you published on YouTube, you use a separate files.

C

B

A

Separate pages.

B

Display right, the idea.

C

Is that if you have full documentation of the twenty items, it might get very long on a civil page? That's why once you have enough content, it's easy! It's useful to break into sub pages.

A

C

A

This parish is, you know: I should fall just to collect everything illness in the one, the other one against exercise. It will do a different. Do a separate and document. Okay right.

C

You can reflect the length to be correct accordingly, in your development template.

A

Like say smoke through just all.

A

C

That sounds good, let's see and I think that's that's it.

E

C

See questions there's.

A

C

August, the murder accent.

B

Let's see so for questions who asked about August immersion, what's the question I.

A

C

A

Mentioned something the bible--and first I was tempted to.

A

Turn the Sentra yes,.

B

Yeah, so the immersion program starts on on August 25th, an application deadline for anyone who.

C

Wants to sign up for the mirjana's is August 1st. That's.

C

Do some due diligence, let's see on the solar box,.

A

A

And unique assets are even better an induction purpose. I could use a pen for later, but just right there, that's nice teachers. There artist reckons.

C

I was referring to more is, for example, you can have a good example where the the software makes sense to replace a large number of components is, for example, a control panel. You have a control panel with some kind of a screen, a bunch of buttons like 10, 20 buttons or.

E

C

Can do an Arduino with a touch touch touch interface, whereby.

B

You've replaced perhaps ten to a hundred parts with this enter with this touch. Stone touched touch screen, so that's examples what I mean and of course you can't do that for other components. Like the power elements, you can't simulate them in code.

C

But other things that you can do readily with the microcontroller we should does that make sense.

A

Now, yes, I just didn't talk about any bit about it. Thank you for verification, yeah,.

C

And that's requires some strategic thinking, but the first thing I saw about Libre stole our leave. Solaar was that.

G

C

Got all these things there, then we should probably make them yeah, probably pack more, that into the software. Is that I think I saw something. I forget exactly what it was by so things that and stuff for people making a circuit for like I I, don't know like a timers. That's something eally implementable within software.

A

Salvations this is my circulation and we'll have to move a little.

A

Conversation there.

A

To form a separate, Lhasa, Apso, very fast changes.

D

B

Can you speak up, you can hardly hear you.

D

C

H

C

C

G

C

It's something if to analyze in detail, but the idea is that I think I actually run up a basic comment on that. Let me pull this up from the log and maybe you guys can continue editing that electron ice yeah. It's.

E

C

Architecture, what's.

E

What kind of architecture so.

C

Yeah, if you look at this wiki page coal, power, electronics, architecture, I just put a couple of points on that. So you want to take a look at see that link I just.

B

C

Just comment on that: that's how, if you want to create a whole product, ecology based on the global village, Construction Set, is that.

D

C

There is we're creating you know the world's first self-contained entire civilization in a box kind of deal where think about, like a shipping container so can can embody the entire civilizations techno sphere. So for for doing that, you have to get a very radical on how you simplify things, to use to do more things with less and those four points. I put for the power of trunks architecture reflect some of that thinking, so yeah.

C

Yeah yeah yeah.

G

C

I think we're on the slow page on that and we'd have to look at the details: how to make as module as possible.

H

B

Have good connections with Michigan Tech University? That's.

C

Where Shane is, for example, and that's where dr. Joshua Pierce who's a leader in the open-source hardware movement he's there? It really takes that somebody's really, a strong stakeholder on on open source hardware, which is somewhat rare.

C

But the thing we can do is maybe maybe we can collaborate on just just an architecture document or just I'm, saying, try to put together a common common document and what what we're all trying to accomplish and yeah with.

C

Which is basically which form basically a project specification like a so you can they'll, be a proposal for working on that for various masters, theses or other school projects.

C

So that's doable. It would take some energy organize that. But the thing that.

C

E

There's not, we understand a bus for that right now,.

C

It's you have that kind of infrastructure right now.

H

B

Yeah, it's worthwhile to create a process like that I think we can start that by.

C

Describing what we have and its status and.

B

Just a simple document that, if if anyone does ask us about it, then we can say: hey: we've got these opportunities. This is what we're working on I, think just showing the transparency of what what we're working on.

C

And what the next problem statements are like like roadmaps, just simple documents like that would help a lot but other than that, it's like you know, they'll get a whole. You know all other full-time position or organization that could do that and I.

G

C

It's not that transparent or easy to do that I mean we've, had contact with many many different professors, but I think it's really about you know constraints of what a specific project you know what specific University does or how it works, how the classes work.

C

Right right, so some kind of a disruption like basically a project pitch, that's something we could. We could put together and say.

E

Hey I mounting.

C

School projects we need sudden such to be done and maybe like show, show specific action that we're working on, but it does require a bit of management to do that.

C

So, let's yeah.

G

H

C

B

C

That document that any were like.

G

B

Yep well, at least with us, were we're starting some collaboration and we're continuously connected to Michigan Tech University.

C

So we can at least start with us.

B

Sorry date again.

C

They've got everything there.

C

The birdie has.

C

They do get pretty much everything software focusing on Hummer, but they do some software.

C

Yeah I mean I would suggest, like first thing is to document that summer like so, it's not you know like set up Sylvania or you know, you know start.

B

A wiki page start something where we actually start throwing down ideas that everyone can contribute to. So what would be that I mean that would.

C

Be a start, I mean: can you guys use our wiki on that or some some wiki or some public forum to that's openly accessible? In other words, where do we want to do this start writing down the notes on this and how to go forward.

D

B

I can start a page on this on a wiki and and pass this on to you guys, but.

C

Like basically, you know, there's we.

G

Have a lot of different pages, or we like active.

C

Projects or quickl patents in that, but we can start something: that's specific for okay universe projects, student projects or whatever. We should do that. So, let's start that I'll start add, and we can start from down ideas and specific ages to start lashing out different things that we can work on or or that are projects for specific students.

C

Right right and then using of course, part libraries and comm tools that critical, so ecad freaking.

G

E

C

Sounds good so yeah we'll start. We can start that on the wiki and see what it goes. Of course it would unreal to so to emphasize that some of these products.

E

C

We can make them grow quite a bit is when, when they're productized, there's.

B

A product behind something like like, for example, for brick, press or houses, I mean at some point. There's gonna have to be an enterprise that runs that, like with.

C

It what we're trying to do with a 3d printer that now we have energy, we have money coming in there's revenue and then there's energy to start other collaborations getting students involved like at elementary schools and high schools, colleges and so forth. You know I think it's a it's a big organizational question, but we can start with documenting some of that.

C

On the key all sir and I see you got the collaborations.

C

C

What is that? What does that plug them? There? That's.

B

Is that openly editable or do I need to be part of to euhh.

B

And just apply for an account see if it takes me there, but.

B

So that's gitlab.

E

C

It you know what like that, sir.

B

What I say that question is I.

C

Don't think so wicked pee has already done it and that called awaking and even met angling I know so I would say: look let's not fight about wiki's I think that's most powerful tool in a world right now for collaboration. That's why it! You know just start start somewhere on it. I think a lot of work can happen when people start programming or the wiki in terms of getting custom and by code and satellites and all kinds of crazy content, especially with like semantic medio.

C

Key extensions I mean wiki is extremely powerful, but you have to make it do what you want and I think that's a universal tool, that's very, very scale. So then land I I'm a great fan of lucky. As you, you see us doing, and media where he is or Wikipedia is one of the top sites in world. So it that's proven technology, but.

G

It's missing the.

C

Collaborative Lucy, though, it's like its have to understand that that's a public tool, how to use it and so forth. So that's I think a lot of the barriers are cultural. You know yeah.

B

Like, for example,.

D

C

Sorry about being a cultural understanding with getting some protocols and and some things ordered.

B

C

That's that's a big task, because it's really about re culturing whole bunch of people about how collaborate like, for example, one of the challenges with with the universities.

H

G

H

Like you know, Sammy said.

C

See here, okay, you guys get lab I've always got like a different tool that they use. You know and that's an issue. That's why just degenerate to one tool like a wiki like it's so I select one thing just go and that that would have happened for yeah. This.

A

Is nice to keyboard said why he can adjust system? You.

C

Like that, that's good.

C

A

Do we use it for for solar box.

D

A

As far as I know, maybe I'm wrong that connections between layers, they're, fearful of air holes with.

A

But we need to pass from from copper horse yeah.

G

A

I think you cannot do it with a circuit, Neal yeah.

B

A

You have them in us.

A

We cannot enjoy yourself, you know.

E

I mean: has it as.

B

Well now we can't.

C

Use the circuit mill to do what they do there to some other features. I think are too small, but we can modify the board and then we can do through holes in our in our system. So that wouldn't be a problem, but as.

E

Long as you have it in kicad, you know maybe maybe we'll do that this weekend.

C

Maybe yeah we have the circuit metal workshop, we'll take that board any sudden rearranging it in kicad, so you can make it make it available with our second, no and then good thing is we already had ki KI, all right, so gonna start buying. It.

A

A

There is a solution there.

C

A

How to do while you can forget, as.

A

Mike was before leaving is.

B

That guy open-source and.

A

Unfortunately, no but.

G

A

He shares his experience with me and with us, and the solution is not to do cable walk in Phuket. No, don't do it where.

B

A

A

It's not just sleep approaches and I think they have yes.

A

E

A

How hard to connect couple pipes in fake it and put step out on the right place and.

A

Consume a lot of resources right.

B

The useful thing about wiring- that's spelled out for people is that then a novice can can take.

C

A look at that and parse it more easily that.

E

Sense, it would be useful.

C

F

Far as the practicality that this.

C

That's another question: that's I was able to be put in general if it could be possible at some point and right now it's really it's not easy.

A

They don't do it and they have welcome okay,.

C

Okay but I, stop you right there and and expose an assumption that you have the professional environment there's not a place where they focus on on documentation or teaching people do things stance, parity, they focus on providing information to other specialists. Who then understand? But that's not we do here here. We're try, study, yeah I'm trying to do is send okay, I'm gonna make the transparent, but everybody. So we have to go an extra land to do it, so we may not be able to do it right now.

C

It doesn't that we shouldn't strive to be able to, but because clearly it would make it easier for novice to be able to understand the whole picture. Like you don't want to go to. You know you have a one picture and then you need to like hundred other documents to provide all the information. You know there's a lot of information, that's required for anything. It can communicate it with more. With pictures, I mean there's deaf people that look they're, very pictorial, well, visually.

B

If you can add that into your CAD, that would definitely help those people and.

C

That's certainly not what the the current professionals want to do. They in fact want to hide that information, so nobody can replicate it.

B

So that's part of the reason why they're very much not it may not be.

C

Interested in as much as we are.

A

They don't have to hide because they need to understand each other within a company, but.

F

A

They are professionals.

A

C

That's what we have Kirlian in the development and plate, there's wiring diagrams there's cut lists, for example, in a cut list you can put the length of cable like super, bring all the tables. Okay, you can do that yeah.

A

B

Okay, so I think I think that's about it. So let's wrap up here so I'm glad about the current little developments on some further collaboration.

C

With OSI Germany I think that's, that's really good. It's definitely a big challenge to get a lot of people coordinated around a big development project. So you know this is not not easy. We can certainly take ways you know start trying to coordinate in a better way.

C

B

So well I think we can quit here then, and thanks everybody next meeting, then next Tuesday and as I.

C

Mentioned before, if to invite other people who can make valid contributions to the team like people from other projects, other open sub projects that we can have chime in and collaborate with us more just like we had today with Bristol or Michelle and then Spencer from Chicago yeah, we'll.

I

Take everybody and.

C

We'll talk to you next week.