►
From YouTube: Open Source Creative Podcast
Description
(raw video, official version forthcoming)
By (and with) Jason Van Gumster - maker of the Open Source Creative Podcast.
Jason wrote Blender for Dummies.
Jason van Gumster does a lot of things. Mostly he makes stuff up. He writes, animates, and occasionally teaches. He has heavy entrepreneurial tendencies that run nearly as deep as his creative ones... so he has a constant fascination with producing creative content with as much control and independence as possible. Naturally, he's a big proponent of open source software; very nearly everything that he produces is made using Free and open source tools.
Using those open source tools, Jason ran his own small, independent animation studio for 8 years. And in the course of that, he had the privilege of managing mid-sized international production teams on ridiculously tight deadlines (4-7 minutes of CG animation in 2 days)... for fun. He's transferred some of that experience in writing to two separate books, Blender For Dummies and GIMP Bible. The rest of that experience he continues blurt out a bit at a time during his weekly[-ish] podcast, the Open Source Creative Podcast.
Currently based just outside of Atlanta, Georgia, Jason spends the majority of his time drinking coffee and trying to be awesome. The former he's pretty much gotten down to a science. The latter... well, every now and again he succeeds at that one and makes it look like it wasn't an accident.
-----------------
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A
My
focus
primarily
is
gonna
be
on
on
actually
using
it
to
make
things,
but
obviously
the
people
who
make
the
tools
just
like
with
what
you're
doing
with
the
universal
stuff
making
the
tools
is
just
as
important
as
actually
using
them,
and
so
that
there's
a
lot
of
tie-in
for
that.
As
far
as
I'm
concerned,
yeah.
A
Right
right,
yeah,
I
tend
to
tend
to
play
a
lot
on
the
software
side
of
things
like
my.
My
hardware
either
is
gonna
is
either
very
much
on
the
analog
I'm
making
stuff
with
like
wooden
knives
and
I'm
not
even
touching
anything
that
involves
software
or
on
3d
printing
and
that's
pretty
much
where
it
ends.
For
me,.
B
A
A
A
I
have
a
like
there's
a
couple
boiler
questions
I'll,
probably
ask
if
I
can
remember
to
ask
them,
because
I
often
forget
but
yeah
I
really
just
having
an
organic
conversation
about
it
and
and
probably
at
some
point,
if
you,
if
you
mention
anything
in
the
show,
I
might
make
a
note
of
it
if
there's
a
link
to
it
or
whatever.
I
might
bother
you
to
send
me
a
link
to
whatever
that
is.
A
A
B
A
A
A
A
A
B
I
wanted
to
do
something
concrete
for
making
a
better
world
and
started
the
open
source
ecology
project,
essentially
about
what
it
means
to
apply
open,
open,
collaborative
principles
to
developing
basically
an
operating
system
for
society.
How
do
we
create
a
society
that
collaborates
as
opposed
to
competes
or
just
goes
through
tremendous
amounts
of
competitive
waste?
Because
one
thing
I
noticed
that
actually
made
me
start
the
project
during
the
university
time
was.
I
couldn't
talk
openly
to
others
about
my
work.
B
We
had
some
hot
work,
I
mean
it
was
fusion
energy
stuff
turbulence
crazy
stuff,
but
when
I
noticed
that
I
thought
wow,
this
is
that's
interesting
and
I
was
thinking
about.
Well,
that's
definitely
preventing
me
from
going
where
I
need
to
in
terms
of
educating
myself
and
working
openly
with
others
communicating
learning,
and
I
thought,
if
that,
if
that
happens,
even
at
the
public
institution
at
our
universities,
I
thought
this
must
be
a
pervasive
problem.
So
so
I
I
was
looking
into
that.
B
A
Right
on
well,
so
I'm
gonna
back
up
just
a
second
there,
so
you're
you,
you
stepped
away
from
from
fusion
which,
like
granted,
I'm
I
don't
have.
My
studies
are
nowhere
near
that.
But
you
know
when
someone
talks
about
studying
that
that
that
is
the
mindset.
That
is
the
sort
of
help
the
world
with
with
this,
this
with
fusion
power
sort
of
thing
and
like
to
to.
I
guess
that
is
that
so
the
the
sort
of
locked
down
nature
is
that
kind
of
what
pushed
in
that
direction.
B
So,
okay,
so
there's
a
big
point
about
during
the
fusion
program.
I
learned
about
what
appropriate
technology
really
means.
I
was
initially
interested
in
renewable
energy
and
I
thought
oh
yeah
now
a
few,
so
I
was
interested
in
solar.
I
studied
that
a
little
bit
undergrad
and
I
did
a
thesis
actually
on
increasing
efficiency
of
solar
cells,
and
then
I
thought
oh
yeah
next
thing
fusion.
Well
what
if
we
could
make
our
own
suns
on
a
planet?
Wouldn't
that
be
awesome
great.
B
So
as
soon
as
I
got
into
the
program,
I
got
decked
with
a
bunch
of
theoretical
studies
and
and
found
pretty
quickly
that
the
stuff
that
we're
studying
is
very
far
from
reality.
Yet,
and
in
fact
I
mean
it's,
the
running
joke
is
it's
going
to
be
10
years
in
the
future.
It
always
was,
and
it
always
will
be,
but
that's
the
idea
there
is.
I
mean
there's
some
fundamental
physics
issues.
It's
a
really
hard
problem,
but
it
made
me
think
it
made
me
think.
B
Well
what
about
stuff
that
already
exists
like
the
solar
power
that
throws
at
us
10
000
times
more
power
than
we
already
use?
Why
not
go
back
to
that,
so
what
happened
was
I
actually
was
started
doing
outreach
about
fusion
energy?
I
got
questions
like
yours,
okay,
so
how
good
is
this?
Is
you
know?
What's
the
benefit
to
humanity?
B
And
of
course
one
one
answer
was
that:
well,
it's
not
here
yet,
but
the
second
question
that
people
asked
was
well
what
about
the
radioactivity,
because,
actually
that
that
issue
you
still
have
to
resolve
this
is
like
this
is
nuclear.
It's
not
like
nuclear
fission,
which
is
much
more
polluting,
but
fusion
does
still
have
the
untractable
issue
of
high-energy
neutrons,
making
radioactive
anything
they
come
in
contact
with.
There
is
no
physical
law
that
allows
you
to
negotiate
that
that
we
know
of
there
will
be
neutrons
and
there
will
be
radioactivity.
B
A
B
B
A
B
Started
basically
take
50
of
the
most
important
machines
that
we
think
it
takes
for
modern
life
to
exist.
Everything
like
a
tractor,
a
circuit
maker
production
equipment,
renewable
energy
equipment,
car.
Even
a
house
I
mean
that's-
that
is
a
technology
we
live
with.
So
looked
at
selecting
some
of
the
most
critical
technologies
that
will
allow
anybody
to
prosper
and
the
idea
there
is.
Let's
talk
about
appropriate
technology,
how
technology
truly
serves
human
needs
so
that
we're
not
spending
most
of
our
time
just
trying
to
make
a
living
but
prospering.
B
So
that's
one
of
the
myths.
The
myth
of
technology
is
still
here.
It's
like
it
says
that
oh
yeah,
our
life
is
absolutely
easier
and
we
can
all
relax
at
the
beach.
But
no
I
mean
the
with
the
more
advanced
technology.
It
seems
like
we're,
working
harder
and
harder,
and
part
of
that
is
the
how
things
break
down
like
just
planned
obsolescence
and
other
issues.
A
Well
and
there's
there's
also
the
the
the
the
efficiency
barrier
right.
So
the
the
the
myth
is
that
when
you
have
a
technology
that
gives
you
more
time
to
do
stuff,
you're
magically
going
to
have
more
time
to
do
stuff
which
what
what
that
basically
means
is
no
you're
going
to
use
the
same
amount
of
time
just
doing
different
stuff.
And-
and
so
you,
you
end
up
doing
just
as
much
if
not
more
work
based
on
the
technology
making
you
more
efficient.
B
Yeah
and
and
the
idea
there
is,
we
kind
of
have
to
stop
and
think
about
that
a
little
bit
and
think
about
what
our
true
needs
are
and
first
of
all,
but
at
the
same
time
I
mean
most
of
the
world
right
now
is
still
deprived
of
that
very
basic
productive
technology.
So
that's
the
other
area
to
address
allowing
access
to
a
modern
standard
of
living
anywhere
in
the
world.
A
B
Product
there's
a
you,
can
look
at
sonar.
We
we
have
a
wiki
open
source,
ecology.org
wiki.
You
can
look
at
a
state
of
completion,
there's
an
infographic,
so
we
prototyped
about
25
or
so
of
the
machines
already
we're
busy
getting
products
out
into
the
marketplace.
It's
actually
a
lot
of
the
work
to
date
has
been
around
prototyping
and
right
now
we're
at
the
stage
where
we're
shifting
to
okay.
B
Let's
do
some
business
developments
so
that
we
can
bootstrap
fund
the
project
because
once
again
in
open
source,
you
have
to
start
talking
well
who's
going
to
pay
your
bills
at
some
point,
you're
going
to
have
to
create
meaningful
revenue
models,
so
we're
really
shifting
to
the
enterprise
development
aspects.
These
days.
A
Well
then,
you
also
talk
about.
I
guess
you
would
need
to
talk
about
the
the
tools
to
make
these
tools
right.
I
mean
you
guys
have
a
a
3d
printer
that
you've
you
have
designed
actually
you're
selling
it
now
right,
yeah
yep,
but
so
there's
also
the
the
raw
materials.
It's
not
just
could
be
made
out
of
abs
or
pla.
There's
also
metal.
B
Yeah,
yes,
so
the
global
village
construction
sets
set
operates
on
different
levels,
so
one
is
you've,
got
production
tools
that
can
make
machines,
but
also
you
have
to
talk
about
materials,
as
you
said,
so,
for
example,
the
capacity
to
melt
down
steel
in
an
induction,
furnace
and
roll
it
into
virgin
metal.
That's
part
of
the
set,
and
then
you
can
take
your
precision,
machining
equipment
and
then
make
finished
parts
like
engines
and
hydraulics.
B
B
A
creative
product
by
share
alike,
so
viral
clause
on
those
software's,
typically
gpl,
but
yeah
just
make
access
available
to
anybody.
We're
very
particular
about
the
nonsense
with
the
non-commercial
clauses
like
a
lot
of
people.
These
days
call
their
open,
source-ish
projects
open
source,
even
though
they're
under
the
non-commercial
licenses,
which
is
a
lot
there's
just
a
lot
of
illiteracy
in
terms
of
what
open
source
really
means,
but
yeah
we're
absolutely
committed
to
that.
We
go
a
step
further.
We
also
talk
about
the
the
step
beyond
the
blueprints,
and
that
is
enterprise.
B
So
what
we
design
is
not
only
that
you
can.
You
can
have
the
open
source
blueprints
for
the
printer,
but
how
do
you
run
an
enterprise
for
producing
these
printers?
So
that
is
the
production
engineering.
The
facility
layout
tooling,
builds
the
materials
supply
chain
and
all
that
we
document
all
of
that
too,
because
we're
interested
in
a
world
where
there's
more
entrepreneurs
more
capacity
everywhere,
and
we
actively
train
people
to
be
our
competition.
We
think
that
is
good.
The
more
people
you
have,
the
more
collaborators
you
have.
B
We
look
at
people
as
collaborators
not
not
to
the
enemy,
so
that
concept
is
called
distributive
enterprise
and
we've
published
that
since
about
2013,
and
we
really
stick
to
that,
but
we
really
don't
know
of
anybody
else
who
does
this
kind
of
work,
where
they're
actually
actively
promoting
others
and
training
others
to
get
into
the
open
source
enterprise?
That's
that's
a
big
deal.
I
think
that's
extremely
important.
I
think
that's
the
next
evolution
of
the
human
economy
towards
distribution.
B
A
Know
these
things
we've
got
to
distribute
yeah,
and
I
mean
you'll
see
this
in
in
the
the
on
the
creative
side
of
things,
especially
if
you
look
at
like
like
audio
and
and
some
like
photo
and
images
as
well.
You'll
see
yeah,
it's
released
under
a
creative
common
license,
but
it's
it's
non-commercial
and
no
derivatives.
Well,
what's
the
what's
the
point.
B
And
it's
just
blows
my
mind
because
I
mean,
if
you
think
about
it,
you
know
just
stop
and
think
about
it's
like
wow,
just
think
about
how
many
people
are
reinventing
the
wheel
over
and
over
again-
and
that's
you
know,
that's
how
I
felt
so
going
back
to
my
phd.
I
thought.
Okay,
I
can't
really
talk
to
other
people.
I
got
to
go
in
and
maybe
research
it
myself
and
just
repeat
something
that
people
have
already
done.
B
Why
and
then
apply
that
to
okay,
for
example,
the
tractor
that
that
I
I
bought
that
kind
of
started
the
whole
notion
of
lifetime
design.
Where
the
tractor
broke
I
paid
to
get
it
repaired,
then
it
broke
again
and
pretty
soon
I
was
broke
too.
Like
I
talk
about
in
my
ted
talk
right,
I
mean
to
make
a
design
closed
source
that
everybody,
so
many
different
companies
have
to
compete
to
reinvent.
They
will,
instead
of
collaborating
to
make
something
bigger,
better
solve
a
bigger
problem.
B
B
A
B
A
B
B
So
freecad
now
is
at
a
state
where
it's
it
allows
us
to
do
all
that
we
do.
What
we
actually
are
doing
with
freecad
is
because
it's
open
source
we're
creating
new
design
workbenches.
So
right
now
you
can
download
the
the
3d
printer
design
workbench
in
freecad,
and
you
can
start
designing
different
iterations
of
our
3d
printer
and
that's
the
beauty,
that's
something
we
could
never
do
with
proprietary
software
for.
A
Sure
for
sure,
what
and
that's
actually
kind
of
free
cat
is
one
of
those
things
I'm
a
blender
guys,
so
so
so
free
cat
is
this.
This
feels
weird
saying
this,
because
blender
has
a
history
of
being
this,
this
painful
interface
to
get
around,
but
now
that
I
have
my
my
whole
head
wrapped
around
it
trying
to
like
shift
gears
back
to
more
of
a
cad
mentality
and
and
working
with
freecad
there's,
there's
there's
there's
some
weird
stepping
off
points
for
for
me
because
it's
you
know
you
you
before
you.
B
Accurate,
well
I
mean
so
the
freakout
work
workflow
for
me
is
the
sketcher,
where
you
really
get
to
doodle
in
that
and
then
extrude
that
so
now,
I'm
also
not
a
not
a
blender
guy,
but
I
am
trying
to
learn
blender.
Basically,
where
you
take
yeah,
you
start
with
your
blocks
and
just
start
manipulating.
I
guess
sculpting
them,
but
I
do
find
like
with
the
freecad
sketcher.
B
You
can
design
any
kind
of
complex
geometry
in
2d
and
then
make
it
into
3d,
and
then
you
can
take
any
of
the
sides
and
make
features
upon
features
until
you
get
any
kind
of
geometry
that
you
like.
So
conceptually.
That's
that's
a
very
simple
concept.
I
can
wrap
my
head
around
and
it's
it
can
design
anything
yeah.
A
B
A
B
Well,
actually,
you
know
people
that
is
a
barrier,
especially
with
people
who
have
experience
with
cad,
because
they're
saying
no,
I'm
not
going
to
learn
free
cat,
because
it's
it's
different
and
weird.
But
the
thing
is
we
have
more
success
with
novices
learning
free
cad
like
I
can
teach
somebody
to
do
the
basic
workflow
to
design
any
geometry
in
about
an
hour
and
they
can
actually
start
producing
things
for
3d
printing.
Whatever
we've
done
that.
A
Yeah,
you
actually
see
that
with
a
lot
of
open
source
packages
that,
if
you
anybody
who
already
has
a
workflow
in
mind,
you
know
you
see
you
see
this
with
like
photoshop
and
someone
trying
to
pick
up
or
somebody
who
knows
illustrator,
trying
to
pick
up
the
inkscape
and
like
they're,
trying
to
yeah
like
ham-fistedly
work,
their
their
old
workflow
into
this
other
tool.
And
it's
not.
It
does
the
same
thing,
but
it
works
and
thinks
differently.
B
B
No,
I
think,
that's
interesting
because
like
so,
we
have
osc
linux,
which
is
basically
the
distribution
with
all
the
software
that
we
use,
but
I
find
that
it's
useful
to
just
like
any
any
piece
of
software
will
have
okay.
This
is
you
have
to
conceptualize
it
in
your
mind
and
get
your
mind
around
okay.
What
is
the
basic
principle
of
how
that
works?
The
workflow
works,
and
once
you
get
that
then
learning
the
mechanics
of
that
is
okay.
B
B
We
built
it
on
top
of
ubuntu
for
the
first
one
and
we're
going
off
linux
mint
for
the
second
one,
but
it's
basically
a
distribution.
That's
got
all
the
software,
including,
for
example,
like
the
freecad
workbenches
that
we
created
it's
already
pre-loaded.
So
you
have
to
spend
all
this
time,
configuring
downloading,
like
10
or
20
programs.
When
you
work
with
us.
Basically
we
want
it
to
be
like
if
we
do
so,
we
do
large-scale
collaborative
design.
B
A
A
B
A
dev
team
we
have
our
osc,
maybe
like.
If
you
talk
about
con
ongoing
communication,
ob,
open
source,
ecology,
workshops,
facebook
page,
that's,
probably
the
best
place
and
we're
just
actually
setting
up
discourse
forums.
We
had
other
forms
that
we
kind
of
trashed
a
couple
of
years
ago
because
they
got
out
of
control,
but
yeah
we're
getting
back
on
discourse
to
get
that
community
going
back
again.
B
B
B
Yeah,
I
mean
see
we
we
don't
have
like
a
really
established
organization
as
it's
a
bunch
of
people
that
come
and
go
it's
a
volunteer
run
organization.
So
there's
like
we
have
like
three
or
four
full-time
equivalent
in
terms
of
volunteer
effort.
I'm
absolutely
full
time
on
this.
My
partner
is
doing
open,
building
institute
work
which
we're
collaborating
on,
but
that's
the
thing
we're
aiming
to
crack
right
now
and
we
just
started
our
program
to
train
people
to
run
osce
chapters
in
different
locations.
B
We
actually
have
one
person
from
south
africa
applying
right
now,
but
the
perennial
thing
has
been:
you've
got
volunteers
that
come
and
go.
You
know:
you're
gonna
who's,
paying
your
bills
is
the
idea,
so
right
now
we're
actually
for
the
osc
chapters,
we're
training,
people.
Okay,
how
do
you
run
and
build
the
3d
printers
that
you
can
produce
that
you
can
run
workshops
around
that
you
can
run
the
steam
camps
with
so
we're
really
getting
serious
at
the
the
livelihood
part,
because
after
all,
it's
got
to
be
the
mass
creation
of
right
livelihood.
B
A
B
Start
with
a
full
tool
chain
like
we're,
starting
with
a
3d
printer,
that's
a
established
technology,
but
the
good
thing
is
we're
going
to
be
producing
parts,
for
example,
for
the
cnc
torch
table
for
cutting
metal
or
the
filament
maker,
shredders,
shredder
parts
or
rubber
tracks
for
the
tractors.
That's
the
kind
of
stuff
we
talk
about,
so
we
start
with
the
printer
and
that
that
we're
getting
to
a
fully
developed
product.
B
So
if
you
understand
the
pattern
for
the
small
printer
use,
bigger
parts
and
similar
design
pattern
to
make
a
much
bigger
one,
so,
for
example,
we've
made
like
a
4x8
torch
table
already
with
the
printed
parts
that
were
scaled
up
and
the
whole
motion
system
was
scaled
up
and
things
like
that.
So
that's
there's
a
whole
product
ecology
of
how
you
go
from.
So
you
start
with
a
3d
printing.
You
then
go
to
the
metalwork
precision,
machining
and
bootstrapping.
Your
whole
technology
set
yeah.
A
So
so
I
guess
that
would
that
would
that
leads
me
in
sort
of
the
next
thing.
Is
that
so
of
of
of
these
designs
that
you,
that
you
have
these
machines,
that
you
have
there's
50
of
them
there
they're
in
various
states?
How
soon
do
you
think
you'll
have
all
of
them
either
in
prototype
or
like
as
viable
things.
B
B
But
that
means
a
lot
of
work
left.
2028
is
essentially
the
cutoff
we're
setting
to
okay
we're
going
to
be
done
with
whatever
we
have
right
now.
We're
spawning
the
larger
collaborative
development
processes
like
actually
right
now
we're
we're
working
on
a
major
major
effort
and
that
so
let
me
talk
about
that
for
a
second,
because
we're
seeing
that
okay,
you
can
only
do
so
much.
We've
been
at
it
for
a
decade,
we're
like
one-third
done
initially.
B
B
So
so,
having
upped
my
skill
set
on
the
enterprise
side,
we're
really
going
at
that.
So
the
next
step
in
our
work
is
to
address
when
you
think
about
it.
What
is
happening
with
open
hardware?
There's
not
a
lot
of
good
example
of
effective,
open
hardware,
product
releases
and
that's
that's
the
perennial
issue.
It's
hard
to
get
people
to
show
up.
So
how
do
you
motivate
people
to
do
that
and
we're
saying?
Okay,
let's
create
an
event,
and
so
this
is
what
we're
planning
for
about
next
summer,
not
not
this
summer
but
next
summer.
B
So
an
event
we're
going
to
handpick
2
000
people
with
a
collaboration
architecture
of
people
for
the
right
right,
skill
set
roles
to
deploy
the
open
source
micro
house.
So
it's
the
seed
home
like
I
actually
live
in
a
seed
home.
This
is
the
seed
eco
home.
I
can
send
you
a
link
on
that.
It's
a
nice,
pretty
house,
but
we
started
the
open
building
institute
and
we
learned
about
modular
building
construction.
B
B
Gonna
be
a
three-day
weekend
event
we
get.
We
gather
all
the
people
and
develop
it's
largely
documentation,
but
everything
around
the
business
side.
So
how
do
you
develop
the
website,
marketing
copy
distribution
and
all
all
the
assets
for
starting
a
business
and
we're
going
to
publish
that
so
imagine,
2
000
people
24
hours,
so
it's
24,
000
hours,
12
man
years
compressed
into
a
weekend?
B
Can
we
do
it?
So
that
is
a
huge
experiment,
but
the
goal
is
to
address
the
thing
that
we're
saying
at
the
end
of
this
we're
going
to
release
this
product.
So
this
is
a
crazy
experiment,
but
this
is
literally
what
needs
to
happen,
because
none
of
the
it's
so
rare
that
a
hardware
project
gets
to
the
finish
line.
Yeah.
A
There
is
a
giant
sort
of
logistical
thing
with
with
managing
that
large
of
a
team
yeah,
but
one
of
the
things
that
I
found
from
from
stuff
that
crazy
stuff
that
I've
done
in
the
past
that
got
knocked
out
in
the
weekend
was
yeah
people,
especially
when
you're
dealing
with
people
who
are
volunteers.
You
really
need
to
you
do
things
that
that
value
their
time
right,
and
so,
if
you
can
do
things
that
are
well,
if
you,
if
you
can
say
all
right,
your
commitment
is
limited
to
this
weekend.
A
People
are
way
more
interested
way,
more
willing
to
say
all
right.
I've
got
48
hours.
I
can
throw
at
that
and
throw
as
much
as
I
can
into
it.
It's
the
same
thing
you
see
with
like
the
the
sort
of
high
intensity
interval,
training
workouts,
where
it's
like.
Oh
you
could
do
anything
for
20
seconds
right,
oh
well,
then
they're,
huffing
and
puffing
at
the
end
of
it.
A
But
but
that's
that's
the
sort
of
thing
where
you
get
this
this
that
sort
of
sprint
mentality
everybody
gets
on
board
as
long
as
you
have
sort
of
all
of
the
infrastructure
and
logistics
in
place,
so
that
when
you
inevitably
run
into
like
a
hiccup
or
a
trip
or
or
or
because
it's
gonna
happen,
but
if
you
have
the
the
systems
in
place
to
handle
that,
especially
with
that
number
of
people,
then
you
just
sort
of
keep
striding
on
and
everybody's
got
a
lot
of
energy
to
make.
These
things
happen.
A
A
Don't
even
know
if
they're
still
doing
it,
I'm
pretty
sure
they
are,
but
this
was
well
over
a
decade
ago
that
I
was
doing
it
the
48
hour.
Film
project
is
what
it
sounds
like
you
have
two
days
a
weekend,
basically
to
produce
a
film
okay,
I
had
the
I
had
the
crazy
and
the
film
well,
I
had
the
crazy
idea
of
okay.
A
I
did
it
four
separate
years
in
a
row
and
we
we
finished
it
twice
out
of
those
four,
but
we
end
up
with
a
team
of
like
30.
Some
people
spread
out
internationally
and
we
were
broadcasting
what
we
were
doing
live.
We
had
all
sorts
of
cool
things
working
wow
yeah,
I
mean
the
only
downside,
I'm
going
to
tell
you
this
right
now.
A
B
B
A
B
Well,
maybe
we
can
help
us
collaborate
because
actually
video
production
is
gonna,
be
part
of
that.
So
in
that
24
hours,
there's
gonna
be
a
big
effort
of
animation
and
video
to
get
the
the
prototype
builds.
We're
gonna
build
the
thing
all
the
prototype
modules
in
that
time,
so
we're
gonna
need
video
and
animation
for
explainers
and
all
of
that,
so
maybe
you
can
help
us.
A
Yeah
I
mean
that
let's
look
me
up
if,
what's
that
next
year,
we'll
we
could
talk
about
that
that'd
be
fun,
yeah,
yeah,
yeah,
yeah!
Well,
that's
because
that
was
that
was
actually
in
in
realm
of
my
next
question
because,
like
how
are
you
going
to
get
these
things
be
made
because,
obviously,
if
you've
been
doing
it
for
10
years
and
you're
30
the
way
there
you
know
you're,
either
going
to
be
keep
you're
either
going
to
keep
waiting
or
you're
going
to
have
to
do
something
like
sprints
or
something
along
those
lines?
B
Well,
that
that
is
exactly
that
so
now
think
about
how
do
you
coordinate
much
larger
events
that
yield
a
product,
so
the
experiment
for
next
year?
That's
going
to
be
a
big
big
experiment.
It's
it's
all
about
enterprise,
development
and
compressed
time.
So
right
now
we're
getting
the
3d
printer
enterprises
up
and
going
so
that's
bootstrap
funding
and
we
simply,
as
you
said,
we
have
to
accelerate
so
we're
looking
for
ways
of
how
exactly
do
you
do
that?
It's
it's
not
an
easy
thing
like
when
you're
dealing
with
hardware,
it's
much
more.
B
It's
I'd
say
it's
like
a
thousand
or
a
hundred
thousand
times
more
complex
than
software,
but
yeah
we're
working
on
it
and
and
we're
giving
ourselves
still
20
28.
So
we've
got
about
eight
years
left,
but
to
finish
meaning
to
the
level
of
a
distributed
distributive
enterprise
for
each
of
the
projects,
you
can
make
a
living,
I'm
building
a
car
building
houses,
building,
tractors,
building
3d
printers
or
whatever.
So
all
those
have
to
be
turned
into
enterprises.
A
So
I
guess
the
related
to
to
that
effort
and
related
to
getting
that
to
happen.
Yeah
a
lot
of
people
who
listen
to
this
show
we
have
people
who
are.
I
have
a
pretty
interesting
sort
of
spectrum
of
people
listening.
We
have
everything
from
people
who
are
really
or
just
they're,
just
interested
in
open
source
and
and
everything
dealing
with
with
open
culture
and
those.
A
We
have
people
who
are
who
are
very
interested
in
just
technology
and
and
those
things.
Of
course,
you
know
it's
the
open
source
creative.
So
we
have
a
lot
of
people
who
do
creative
work,
who
you
know,
write
video
animation,
music,
these
sorts
of
things
so
yeah,
the
other
two
sort
of
because
it's
open,
because
it's
almost
ecology
because
they
have
the
technology,
because
I
have
the
the
the
open
source
angle
on
that
that
where
they
fit
those
those
those
sorts
of
people
where
they
fit
is
great,
but
on
the
creative
side.
A
If
so,
if
somebody
listening
to
the
show,
for
instance,
was
interested
in
helping
you
out,
what
do
you
need
the
most?
What's
what's
aside
from
making
like
just
making
it
happen?
What
sort
of
what
sort
of
skills
you
do
you
think
if
I
wanted
to
contribute
to
to
this
project,
where,
where
would
I
slot
in.
B
What
can
I
do,
unfortunately,
it's
business
development
or
fortunately,
business
development
and
marketing,
because
we've
got
so
many
different
prototypes
and
things
that
we
have
done.
For
example,
the
house,
that's
ready
to
be
a
product
and
that's
why
we're
doing
that
productizing
that
next
summer,
in
our
extreme
first
extreme
enterprise
event,
the
extreme
enterprise
concept
by
the
way
is
like
that's
only
like
a
month
old
here,
but
we're
really
focusing
on
okay
studying
what
we
have
done.
B
What
is
missing
and
it's
clearly
the
the
finished
product,
the
enterprise,
the
people
showing
up
but
showing
up
to
get
to
that
final
product.
So
we've
got
the
houses,
I
can
send
you
links,
people
can
look
at
we've
got
the
micro
tractor.
We've
got
the
tractors
that
we
have
built.
We've
got
the
3d
printers
the
houses,
cnc
circuit
mill,
all
these
things
that
are
ready
to
be
turned
into
good
businesses,
and
that's
the
level
we're
working
at
right
now.
So
there's
copywriting,
there's
marketing,
there's
product
product
development.
B
At
this
point
I
mean
we've
got
an
amazing
amount
of
substance,
for
I
mean
the
technology
works
and
the
modular
kind
of
lego
set
like
design
where
we
make.
We
focus
on
modules
instead
of
finished
machines.
That
gives
us
extreme
flexibility
like,
for
example,
with
a
tractor,
the
same
principles
we
use
to
build
a
tractor.
We
build
a
backhoe
or
a
bulldozer
or
a
bobcat
or
whatever.
So
so
it's
a
very
generative
set
it's
it's
about.
A
So
I
one
of
the
things
that
that
strikes
me
is
what
about
making
the
making
things
with
these
things
right
and
so
yeah
from
the
art
side
of
things.
You
talk
about
a
brick
press,
I'm
like
okay.
What
if
I?
What?
If
I
put
a
mold
in
that-
and
I
do
a
brick-
that's
you
know,
making
a
mold
of
whatever
maybe
make
a
3d
sculpture
print
out
a
mold
for
that
and
then
do
the
brick
press
with
that.
You
have
a
cnc
on
here.
A
You
know
it's
cnc,
you
can
do
cool
manufacturing
stuff,
but
maybe
you
can
make
just
cool
sort
of
a
wall
relief,
sort
of
thing.
Those
sort
of
things
are,
I
mean
I
don't
know
it
sort
of
strikes
me
a
little
bit
as
as
granted.
There's
the
there's
the
the
blueprint
for
society
where,
where
you're
you
have
the
functional
side
of
it,
but
I
mean
there's
art,
there's,
there's
there's
doing
things
that
it's
not
necessarily
intended
for
so
like.
A
B
Well,
what
you're
saying
is
that
there's
the
opportunities
are
endless
right
in
terms
of
more
artistic
products
as
well
once
again
like
in
the
world
of
business.
Everything
is
nothing
right.
You
have
to
focus
on
okay,
let's
develop
one
thing
after
another.
An
idea
is
what
we're
really
working
on
is
creating
that
collaborative
literacy,
where
we
found
that
one
of
the
biggest
blocks
is
for
collaborative
development.
Is
that
it's
hard
for
some
person
to
imagine
that
together,
there's
enough
for
everybody,
the
abundance
mindset
that
oh
yeah,
we
can
all
do
better
doing
that.
B
So
that's
one
of
the
things
we're
really
struggling
with
like.
Why
isn't
the
obvious
happening,
like
just
amazing
enterprise
development,
just
take
take
within
our
project,
the
stuff
we
already
have
like,
say
the
3d
printer?
To
give
you
an
example
2008,
when
we
first
did
the
brick
press,
I
thought.
Okay,
once
we
publish
this,
this
is
going
to
go.
Wow
people
are
going
to
start
massive
enterprise
everywhere
and
no,
it
doesn't
work
like
that.
B
A
Illustration
for
for
magazines
or
a
website,
you
know
the
the
the
the
argument
always
of
why
to
use
open
source
tools
can
never
just
be
the
accessibility
conversation
which
is
unfortunate
because
that's
a
big
component
of
it
right.
That's
that's!
That's
like
one
of
the
big
things:
accessibility,
avoiding
vendor
lock-in.
Being
able
to
have
this
decentralized
thing
where
you
always
have
one
you're
guaranteed
ownership
of
what
you
do.
B
A
B
To
no,
no
that's
not
that's
not
it!
That's
we're
competing
with
industry
standards.
That
means
we're
going
to
build
things
that
are
cheaper,
better
faster
than
the
normal
product,
so
our
brick
press
has
to
produce
as
many
bricks
as
the
commercial
brick
press,
but
we
do
it
at
one
fifth,
the
cost
our
tractor
has
to
have
the
same
horsepower
and
capacity.
Our
printer
has
to
be
be
as
good
or
better.
So
we're
not
talking
about
like
the
diy
case
is
one
application.
B
You
can
take
our
blueprints
and
make
this
stuff,
but
the
other
thing
is
starting
enterprises,
where
you're
producing
things
on
an
open
market
like
a
lulzbot
or
prusa
3d
printer.
Those
are
open
source,
commercial
products.
So
we're
talking
about
that
that
stuff,
that's
good
enough
to
start
an
enterprise
with.
Does
that
answer.
A
B
A
B
B
The
thing
to
figure
out
here
is
like
that
that
we're
struggling
with
is
like
what
are
the
incentives,
because
clearly
you
can
get
better,
faster,
cheaper,
stronger
kind
of
deal,
but
it's
hard
to
convince
people
that
that's
the
real
case,
well
we're
struggling
with
200
years
of
industrial
history,
where
everything
has
been
proprietary
for
one
and
people
think
that
competition
or
just
like
patents
or
whatever,
is
the
law
of
nature.
No,
it's
not!
B
So
let
me
go
back
to
the
to
the
ultimate
incentive.
What,
if
you
can
collaborate
on
a
development
process
where
you're
guaranteed
that
you're
going
to
have
that
product
at
the
end
of
the
day?
So
it's
like
basically
like
pre-funding,
a
kickstarter
or
whatever,
but
that's
exactly
what
we're
trying
to
tap
with
the
extreme
enterprise
model.
So
the
2000
people
that
are
gonna
participate
in
that
guess
what
each
one
of
them
like?
What
is
the
strongest
motivation?
The
most
true
stakeholder
in
that
process
is
the
person.
B
That's
gonna
get
that
house,
so
those
two
thousand
people
are
gonna
get
their
house
for
fifty
thousand
dollars.
That
is
the
ultimate
catch.
Do
you
think
we
can
attract
2
000
people?
To
do
that?
I
think
so.
It's
going
to
be
a
big
organizational
process,
a
lot
of
scrum,
agile
theory
and
extreme
manufacturing
theory
put
into
practice.
B
B
Is
going
to
fit
with
us
right,
so
the
requirement
for
those
2
000
people
are
not
an
entrepreneurial
mindset.
It's
a
subject
matter,
expertise,
we're
going
to
say:
hey
you're,
the
guy
that
does
technical
documentation
or
the
blender
guy.
That's
going
to
do
the
exploded,
part
animations
for
this
house.
B
We
need
you,
you
get
this
house
at
the
end
of
the
day
that
you
can
buy,
that
we
will
do.
There
is
an
element
of
enterprise
and
right
now
we're
currently
thinking
that
out
of
those
2000,
there's
going
to
be
a
crew
of
about
a
hundred
that
are
pursuing
the
enterprise
track,
meaning
that
they're
going
to
learn
more
enough
so
that
they
can
actually
take
this
on
as
a
business
producing
these
houses
for
others
right
now.
All
I
know
is
that
I
will
be
with
open
source
ecology,
you'll,
be
learning
that
skill
set.
B
So
we
can
train
more
people
to
do
that,
but
the
2000
people-
you're,
not
you
know-
to
make
to
get
an
entrepreneur
subject
matter
expert
super
co-operator
in
all
those
areas,
it's
harder
if
you
had
the
enterprise
requirements.
So
here
it's
mostly
like
subject
matter
experts
in
all
the
different,
the
radical
modular
breakdown
of
the
house
into
modules
and
then
into
the
enterprise
development
modules.
B
That's
subject
matter
expertise,
but
yes,
that's
a
good
question
because,
what's
struggling
with
it,
how
do
you
this
does
sound
like
an
enterprise
layer
event,
but
it's
not
really
the
people
were
were
attracting
to.
It
is
mostly
stripped
of
that
requirement
because
there's
just
not
so
many
entrepreneurs
out
there.
I
I'd
say
yeah.
A
It's
it's
definitely
more
of
a
they're.
The
entrepreneurial
mindset
population
is
overall,
a
smaller
subset
of
general
human
population,
so
yeah
trying
to
trying
to
try
and
well
here's
the
other,
tough
part.
I
guess
is
you
said:
you're
gonna
do
this
next
summer.
Yep
so
have
you
so
so?
Have
you
like
officially
announced
that
are
you
like
where
in
the
house,
because
that's
a
lot
of
people
to
gather
in
in
less
than
a
year.
B
B
There's
a
bit
of
work
work
ahead,
so
a
budget
of
hiring
a
few
people
full
time
for
like
six
months
in
order
to
do
that
and
getting
the
funding
to
that.
So
those
are
the
challenges
in
front
of
us.
I
think
we'll
be
able
to
get
the
funding
for
that
easily,
but
if
this
is
an
impossible,
organizational
challenge
that
nobody
has
done
yet
love
it,
oh
cool.
A
A
B
No,
I
think
we
covered
a
pretty
good
deal.
I
think
we
I
I
want
to
definitely
point
people
whoever's
watching
this.
Take
a
look
at
my
four-minute
ted
talk.
That
summarizes
the
whole
scope
of
what
we're
doing
here,
because
we
only
touched
on
a
few
other
sub
subjects
that
we
can't
talk
about,
but
it's
a
big
ambitious
project
to
create
a
different
operating
paradigm
for
how
society
works.
A
B
Facebook
page,
but
if
you
want
to
get
involved,
there's
a
page
on
the
wiki,
that's
just
getting
involved.
If
you
get
an
account
on
the
wiki
for
editing,
you'll
get
a
follow-up
with
here's
all
the
ways
to
get
involved,
but
yeah
I
mean
the
thing
we're
trying
to
push
forward
right
now
in
a
big
way,
I
said,
is
the
entrepreneurial
aspect.
B
So
here's
the
deal
if
you
want
to
learn
how
to
build
a
3d
printer,
for
example,
as
an
enterprise,
we're
the
only
guys
in
the
world
that
are
going
to
teach
you
that
none
of
the
other
companies
do
that
they
don't
teach
their
own
competition.
But
we
do
that.
So
that's
a
pretty
unique
opportunity
and
then
there's
the
immersion
training
to
actually
start
osc
chapters,
building
the
3d
printers
running
workshops.
That's
a
business
model
that
we've
been
doing
for
a
decade
so
basically
combining
education
and
production
and
information
in
one
kind
of
an
enterprise
package.
B
B
B
You've
done
some
of
these
collaborative
events
yeah.
I
will
tell
you
more
about
that,
like
once
we're
actually
getting
the
all
the
people,
we're
basically
saying
here's
2
000
rolls
like
it's
a
it's
an
agile
waterfall
process,
meaning
that
we're
going
to
script
out
the
architecture
of
what
all
needs
to
be
done
and
essentially
lay
out
the
table
of
contents
for
a
big
bible
book
that
walks
you
through
every
single
step
of
building
this
house.
B
But
then
we
put
put
roles
to
it,
but
then
again
so
I'll
talk
to
you
about
that
and
say:
hey!
Do
you
want
to
do
this,
and
do
you
want
a
house
that
you
can
build
with
a
friend
in
one
week
for
fifty
thousand
dollars?
So
if
you're
in
that
pool
we're
going
to
be
inviting
people
with
the
skill
set
for
that
kind
of
an
offer,
yeah.
B
A
Yeah
yeah
so
yeah
my
before
before,
when
I
before
my
current
employment,
I
was
running
a
small
animation
studio
in
richmond,
virginia
doing
television,
production
and
short
films
and
those
kinds
of
things
and
having
fun
doing
that,
and
then
I
got
offered
a
the
weirdest
application
of
animation.
I've
ever
been
involved
with
I'm.
I
design
anti-counterfeit
security
features
for
currency.
A
A
A
That's
that's
sort
of
that's
kind
of
some
of
the
stuff
that
that
was
done
before
I
got
hired,
but
that's
the
technology
that
I
get
to
play
with,
and
so
you
see
micro
optics
now
was
just
released
in
the
in
aruba
for
their
their
whole
series.
Actually
has
it
we're
in,
like,
I
think,
over
100
different
denominations
at
this
point
around
the
world
and
yeah,
it's
it's!
It's
the
weirdest
application
of
animation.
I
have
ever
been
involved
with.
B
A
Well,
because
it
it's
it's,
you're
you're,
working
with
depth,
you're
working
with
very
small,
very
fine
geometry,
and
you
have
to
manage
the
timing,
and
so
it's
between
building
up
assets,
doing
the
actual
animation
part
of
it,
which
blender
is
great
for
winter's
node
system,
which
is
python
based,
allows
you
to
build
out
a
you
know.
We
have
our
own
tool
set
that
we
actually
built
as
a
blender
add-on
to
allow
us
to
do
our
own
designs.
B
A
A
B
A
A
I
spent
years
trying
to
get
rid
of
those
patterns
in
television
when
I
was
doing
stuff
now,
with
what
I'm
doing
now,
I'm
controlling
how
that
more
interference
pattern
produces
synthetic
images
and
those
synthetic
images
are
the
animations
that
show
up
in
the
micro
optics,
and
so
I
do
animations
in
blender
that
we
route
through
our
through
software
that
we
wrote
in-house
that
generates
the
data
that
runs
through
the
micro
optics,
that
our
giant
presses
produce.
That
gets
pressed
on
paper.
A
It's
it's
most
a
lot
of
it's
just
trade,
secret
and
patented,
because
you're
dealing
with
trying
to
stop
counterfeiters.
So
that's
the
only
sort
of
weird
part
of
that
is
my
tool
set
is
predominantly
open
source,
but
I'm
doing
something
that
for
very
good
reasons,
if
it's,
if
it,
if
that
entire
tool
chain
were
fully
announced,
it'd
still
be
very
hard
for
our
counterfeiter.
A
So,
but
because
of
that,
that's
where
a
lot
of
that
stuff
is
is
in
housing
and
in
cape
town,
which
also
is
difficult
for
the
portfolio
by
the
way,
because
I
can't
necessarily
tell
anybody
any
particular
thing
I've
worked
on,
but
because
because
the
technology
is
so
interesting,
I
haven't
gotten
bored
with
it.
Yet
so
I've
been
doing
it.
B
A
Yeah,
because
they're,
because
because
there
are
limitations
and
and
and
you
know,
if
you're
talking
about
animation,
how
many
frames
of
animation-
or
you
know
you
have
to
have
things
replaced
and
and
loop
cleanly
or
so
you
have
to
have
an
understanding,
it's
just
like
working
with
with
any
media.
Actually,
if
you're
talking
about
television,
there's
some
things,
you
can
do
in
television
that
you
can't
really
do
in
film
very
well
that
that
gap
has
shrinked
substantially.
But
there's
there's.
A
A
More
frequently,
and
so
my
commute
sort
of
disappeared,
but
also
that
means
that
when
you
don't
have
to
commute
an
hour
each
way,
I
also
end
up
with
more
time
at
home,
and
I
can
do
things
like
relaunch
my
podcast
and
then
covet
hit.
So
that
was
the
additional
thing
on
top
of
all
of
that,
so
I'm
definitely
working
from
home.
Most
of
the
time.
B
B
A
A
I
have
written
really
horrible
patches
that
they're,
but
I
I've
termed
them
as
feature
requests
that
are
that
are
masked
as
packaged
as
patches.
So
I
need
blender
to
do
something.
I
write
a
really
crappy
patch
that
gets
it
as
far
as
I
can
get
it
to
go
to
do
it.
I
submit
it
as
a
patch
and
then,
like
I
understand,
where
you're
going.
This
is
the
wrong
way
to
do
it,
toss
it
out.
Here's
good
code
that
actually
does
it.
B
A
A
B
A
B
A
B
A
Bit
yeah,
I
I
found
that
I
enjoyed
it.
Otherwise
I
guess
I
wouldn't
have
done
it
four
times
in
a
row,
but
the
the
I
learn
a
lot
by
especially
from
from
a
workflow
standpoint
and
my
my
primary
interest,
especially
at
that
time
was
animation
and
still
is.
But
animation
is
an
inherently
collaborative
art
form.
You
really
can't.
I
mean
some
people
do,
but
you
can't
produce
large-scale
work
and
animation
without
having
a
team
or
like
a
million
years
to
produce
it.
A
But
it's
one
of
those
things
that
I
have
a
from
from
an
animation
standpoint.
That's
where
I
was
going
from
an
animation
and
workflow
standpoint
in
order
to
do
anything
that
I
was
doing
commercially,
putting
it
through
a
test
of
fire
by
compressing
everything
that
needed
to
get
done
within
the
course
of
two
days
really
really
lets.
You
know
where
your
bottlenecks
are.
A
Even
if
I
didn't
succeed
like
of
the
four
times
we
did
it,
we
only
finished
the
film
that
we
wanted
to
two
of
those
four
times
so
50
completion
rate,
but
every
time
I
did
it
when
I
went
back
to
starting
doing
my
freelance
work,
the
next.
You
know
for
probably
about
a
day
of
sleep
when
I
started
addressing
my
commercial
customers
and
clients.
After
that,
I
already
had
ideas
on
how
to
make
my
workflow
faster.
I
already
had
ideas
on
how
to
optimize.
A
If
I
needed
to
send
a
job
out
to
somebody
else
to
sort
of
sublet
the
job
out,
I
already
knew
how
to
organize
my
files
a
little
bit
better.
I
had
a
lot
of
things
that
that
really
improved
my
process.
With
that,
I
wouldn't
have
otherwise
done
by
if
I
hadn't
put
it
sort
of
in
that
crucible
to
to
development.
B
And
that's
that's
awesome,
I
mean
so
as
far
as
the
thing
that's
going
to
happen
next
year
with
respect
to
the
because
we're
going
to
need
documentation
and
all
kinds,
I
mean
basically
think
about
all
the
assets
to
sell
this
house
right.
That's
that's
going
to
be
a
lot
of
artwork
in
there
too.
Media
I
mean.
Is
that
kind
of
a
proposition
appealing
to
you
like
to
actually.
A
Yeah
yeah,
I
mean
it'd,
be
certainly
fun
to
play
on.
I
have
to
make
sure
my
wife
says:
okay,
but
but
you
know
I
mean
I
think
I
think
those
are
the
sort
of
things
I
think
would
be
really,
especially
if
you're,
if
you're
looking
at
trying
to
do
this,
like
this
time
next
year,
you're
you're
already
under
the
gun
in
terms
of
like
trying
to
organize
space,
organize
people
organize
time
and
get
everybody
recruited
enough
to
date,
you're
going
to
have
to
actually,
I
think,
you're,
probably
going
to
need
some.
A
B
A
B
A
Very
vibrant
and
they're
already
sort
of
same
thing
as
with
the
48
hour,
film
project
thing
they're
already
in
that
kind
of
mindset,
but
you're
also
dealing
with
people
who
are
technically
minded
already
or
understand
the
concept
of
open
source
and
and
those
sort
of
things.
So
that
might
be
an
avenue
worth
looking
into
those
like
sort
of
tapping
into
those
communities.
B
A
B
A
Right,
yeah,
it's
it's
it's
a
learning
opportunity
and,
and
when
I
was
doing
it,
it
was
specifically
around
workflow
process
and
efficiency
right.
I
wanted
to
be
able
to
do
what
I
do
normally
more
effectively
yeah,
and
that
was
a
really
big
part
of
that.
The
other
thing
is
that
I'd
already
sort
of
gained
a
reputation
for
doing
crazy
stuff
like
this
and
crazy
stunts,
and
so
that's
part
of,
I
think
what
got
people
on
board,
because,
oh
you
did
you
finished
that
thing?
Okay.
A
Well,
I
want
to
be
part
of
finishing
that
thing
and
the
fact
that
we
were
you
know
broadcasting
it.
This
was
again
12
years
ago,
so
we
were
doing
live
streaming
of
it
before
live.
Streaming
was
really
a
thing
we
were
doing.
You
know
showing
the
project
progress
as
we
were
working
on
it
watching
us
pass
out
doing
the
work,
not
sleeping
for
the
entire
time.
Those
those
those
components
are
that
the
the
stunt
aspect
of
it,
I
think
spectacle.
I
guess
aspect
of
it-
can't
be
undersold.
B
A
Yeah
well,
this
has
been
great
thanks.
Thank
you
so
much.
I
am
going
to
send
you
an
email
by
the
way
and
I'll
be
asking
for
your
address,
because
I
want
to
send
you
something
that
started
doing
this
for,
for
all
guests
is
sending
them
a
little.
Thank
you.
So
if
you
could
I'll
send
you
an
email
asking
for
that
as
well,
thank
you
and
you're
gonna
be
the
next
episode,
which
I
think
will
be
this
coming
week.
So
I
think
that'll
work
out
fairly.
B
B
B
A
B
A
A
They
put
out
a
show
every
single
weekday,
oh
wow,
oh
that's
and
so
yeah
it
is,
it
is
super
cool.
The
community
is,
is
very
cool
and
then
the
the
content
is
anything
that
is
of
interest
to
hackers
and
hacker
in
the
traditional
sense
of
people
who
like
to
make
stuff
and
tinker
around.
So
it's
right
up
your
alley.
Definitely
I
would.
I
would
certainly
tell
you
to
get
involved
with
that,
not
just
that
pod
that
podcast,
but
that
community
is
a
really
good
one
to
get
involved
with.
A
Yeah
yeah.
That
would
be
one
way
to
do
it
so
there's
and
some
of
them
are,
are
like
just
like
one's
called
you
random,
which
is
literally
just
randomness
and
more
more
sort
of
off
the
cuff
fun
stuff.
But
then
other
ones
can
be,
can
be
more
interview,
type
shows
or
or
there's
one
that's
the
they
they
circle
around
the
same
community.
It's
the
the
linux
link
tech
show,
which
is
a.
A
Yeah
this,
I
think
it's
the
longest
running
linux
podcast
ever
and
it's
just
they
have
fairly
long
shows.
There
are
a
lot
of
people
talking
about
what
they're
doing
with
with
linux
and
open
source,
but
that
one
would
be
an
interesting
one
to
go.
Buy
and
a
lot
of
those
are
are
fairly
easy
to
talk
to.
Okay,.