►
From YouTube: OPS Live w/Benjamin Ball
Description
Austin Parker and Liz Fong-Jones interview Benjamin Ball of The New Stack at OPS Live.
B
B
A
B
A
C
A
C
I'm
kind
of
multifaceted,
because
we
are
we're
a
small
company,
so
wearing
a
lot
of
hats
as
I
think
all
of
you
will
be
very
familiar
with,
but
really
intensely
trying
to
cover
this
space
that
we
have
been
in
for
a
long
time.
This
is
actually
my
first
cube
con.
The
last
one
I
would
have
been
to
was
Lenox
con
Toronto
on
a
series
of
sort
of
unfortunate
events
has
always
kept
me
from
coming
back,
but
you
know
we're
very
into
like
everything
that
we
cover
everything
everything.
C
A
A
C
C
To
be
honest,
what
the
vendors
are
telling
me
what
other
analysts
and
media
are
covering
and
then
sort
of
what
are
using
actual
yes
and
I'll,
give
a
really
good
example
of
that.
Probably
Emily.
Do
you
think
docker
was
docker,
yeah
I
think
still
dot
cloud
at
the
time,
but
there
was
a
thought
that
there
was
continuous
delivery,
as
people
described
what
they
did
and
then
there
was
continuous
delivery.
That
was
the
ideal
version
of
what
they
say.
They
want.
A
Right
exactly
how
many
people
are
actually
pushing
12
times
a
day
versus
how
many
people
you
know
we're
pushing
once
a
day
or
once
a
week
or
you
know,
anything's
an
incremental
improvement
right
like
this
is
not
a
you
do
or
you
don't
have
it
right,
I
think
that
we're
seeing
this
names
are
really
cute
right.
Like
it's
a
you
know,
you
don't.
C
And
that's
that's
something
that
I
always
want
to
try
and
gauge
talk
a
little
bit,
but
not
always
as
deeply
as
an
actual
engineer
or
software
developer.
You
know
I'm
looking
to
other
people
to
say
you
know
this
is
what
we've
experienced.
This
is
what
you're
actually
capable
of
doing,
and
so
observability
has
been
something
that
we
followed
and
seen.
This
absolutely
has
legs.
People
are
absolutely
doing
the
things
they
claim
to
do
and
I
imagine
that
you
can
probably
weigh
in
as
much
that's
not
always
been
the
case.
B
Really
the
thing
that
I
keep
coming
back
to
is
that
there's,
a
lot
of
and
I
get
why
people
would
be
confused
right,
because
there
are
a
lot
of
different
options
and
it's
been,
and
you
know
if
you
had
time
traveled
forward.
You
know
three
years
right
from
2016
to
now
and
though
everything
looks
different,
you
know.
There's
these
new
technologies
we've
had
some
really
amazing
advances
in
the
accessibility
like
how
easy
it
is
to
get
started
with.
You
know:
observability,
tooling
and
telemetry
tooling,
right.
B
B
B
C
That
makes
sense
to
me,
and
actually
you
mentioned
in
production,
one
of
these
sort
of
life
cycles
that
I
look
for
is
once
a
a
trendy,
new
term
or
technology
gets
to
the
point
where
people
are
shifting
towards
how
can
I
actually
use
this
in
production
and
there
are
mature
answers
and
patterns
for
that.
It's
when
I
really
start
perking
up
and
saying.
Oh,
this
is
not
something
that's
gonna
blow
away
and
right.
C
I
wonder
too
I
mean
I
actually
got
asked
just
the
other
day
about
observability,
because
I
was
telling
someone
what
we
cover
and
I
included
that
as
part
of
sort
of
the
cloud
native
scope
of
things,
I
talked
to
someone
who
is
I
think
everyone
will
be
familiar
with
someone
who
has
a
job
they're,
not
necessarily
connected
into
the
meta
of
a
technology
conversation
they're,
not
on
Twitter,
engaging
of
the
hashtags.
You
know
they
use
what
works
for
them
and
he
had
a
good
question
for
me.
C
B
A
A
C
A
B
And
you
care
a
lot
about.
You
know.
Consistency
right,
like
I,
think
that
one
reason
I'm
such
a
huge
fan
of
you
know
open
stand
or
open
source
frameworks
for
this
sort
of
telemetry
data.
Is
you
need
something
you
know
in
a
big
enough
company
right?
There's
gonna
be
teams
that
are
using
all
sorts
of
different
languages,
all
sorts
of
different
tools.
You
need
a
single,
you
know
way
for
them
all
to
talk
to
each
other
and.
A
You
were
at
Facebook
or
Google,
you
know
the
people
are
told,
you
know
you
are
going
to
use
stubby
you're
going
to
use
GRDC
area,
but
now
you
know
we
have
to
think
about.
How
do
we
standardize
these
things?
And
the
answer
is
G.
Our
PC
is
becoming
standard
across
the
industry,
more
or
less
so
it's
kind
of
things
are
converging
and
we.
B
B
B
B
B
Know
it's
all
differently
constantly,
there's
always
gonna
be
something
and
there's
no
like
there's
real
and
honestly
there's
really
no
hue.
Like
beta
versions,
DHS
I
mean
that
you
know
there
was
like
a
market
force
there
that
eventually
like
oh,
this
one
wins,
and
this
one
loses
in
in
tech.
You
don't
really
have
that
so
much
because
of
I
think
that's
an
interesting
on.
C
C
I
could
say
to
a
lot
of
things
but
I
suppose
that's
really
our
nature
to
serve
a
list
and
even
beyond
that
service
mesh
trying
to
understand
again,
you
know
how
much
are
these
conversations
gonna
be
a
year
from
now
two
years
from
now,
I'll
give
a
very
good
example.
Our
time
was
dominated
last
year
at
this
very
conference
by
service
mesh.
I,
still
think
those
conversations
are
happening
now.
I,
don't
know
that
it's
always
the
case.
A
C
C
Think
that's
something
you'll
hear
from
us
is,
you
know
we'll
talk
about
the
abstract,
the
the
mid-level
strategy,
the
the
what
people
are
saying
the
aspirational
and
then
we
always
want
to
try
and
follow
it
up
with
concrete
use
cases,
because
I
think
that
aspirational
doesn't
weigh
very
heavily
with
especially
deaf
audiences,
unless
you
can
back
it
up
and
it's
not
always
backed
up
right
and
I.
Think
we
are
trying
to
sift
out
the
the
concepts
that
have
legs
and
I
know.
I.
C
Keep
saying
that
this
conference
is
especially
a
valuable
place
to
do
that,
because
I
think,
as
you
were
talking
about,
there
are
competing
standards.
There
are
emerging
discussions
that
only
happen
here
between
people
who
are
kind
of
deciding
the
fate
of
those
things,
so
it
becomes
especially
valuable
to
say
you
know
what
are
people
talking
about
here
and.
A
B
Right,
like
it
feels
like
a
bunch
of
components
that
ought
to
maybe
be
there
just
as
a
first-class
thing
and
so
over
time,
I
think
you'll
sort
of
see
this
convergence,
where
there's
like
really
good
ideas
that
happen
sort
of
a
periphery
and
then
as
they
move
in
and
become
more
like
a
core
part
of
all
these
systems
they
take.
You
know
telemetry
frameworks
right.
The
eventual
goal
is
I
mean
in
a
perfect
world
right.
No
one
is
actually
having
to
right.
B
A
C
I
always
start
off.
I
I
always
ask
people.
What
are
your
challenges
in
our
our
co-founder
and
energy
of
Alex
Williams,
who
hopefully
you'll
see
maybe
on
this
very
stream?
If
I
can
drive
him
this
way
he's
over
podcasting
some
routes
is
what
are
your
challenges?
What's,
what's
giving
you
a
problem
right
now
and
were
you
able
to
solve
it,
you
know:
do
you
know
what
the
road
is
to
solve
that
so.