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Description
Continuous Improvement for Senior Leadership
Kevin Behr (Red Hat)
OpenShift Commons Briefing
6/19/2020
Executives have introduced continuous improvement in many different organizations. One common anti-pattern is that the execs do not use these techniques and certainly do not model them in front of their teams. In this session Kevin will introduce systematic continuous improvement for senior technology executives, directors and engineers. This approach can link the strategic with actionable steps that will reveal powerful new solutions, all while growing common skills, language and community.
Guest Speaker: Kevin Behr, Global Transformation Office, Red Hat
A
Welcome
everybody
to
yet
another
OpenShift
Commons
briefing
this
time
as
we
do
every
Friday
we
have
one
of
the
many
members
of
the
global
transformation
office.
This
time,
Kevin
Baer
is
going
to
talk
about
continuous
improvement
for
senior
leadership,
so
I'm
gonna,
let
Kevin
introduce
himself
talk,
has
talked
his
good
talk
here
and
then
at
the
end,
we'll
have
cute
live
Q&A,
so
if
you're
watching
on
Twitch
or
Facebook
or
live-streaming
on
YouTube
will
aggregate
the
questions
from
there
and
bring
them
into
this
conversation.
So
with
that
Kevin
take
it
away.
Hi.
B
I'm
Kevin,
Baer
and
I
am
with
the
global
transformation
office
and
basically
I
have
written
some
books
that
you
might
have
heard
of
the
Phoenix
project
and
I've
also
written
visible
logs
and
I'm
here
today
to
talk
to
you
about
continuous
improvement
for
senior
leadership.
This
is
a
topic
that
I
am
very,
very
passionate
about
and
I
want
to
get
going
right
away.
B
So
first
we're
gonna
talk
a
little
bit
about
what
doesn't
work.
Look
at
some
of
the
proof
that
it
doesn't
work
and
then
I
want
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
how
scaling
these
efforts
happens
and
doesn't
happen,
and
also
just
some
kind
of
understanding
about
the
kind
of
economies
and
costs
and
capacities
that
organizations
have
in
terms
of
constraints
and
then
I
want
to
talk
to
you
about
what
Akata
is
and
then
I
want
to
talk
to
you
about
the
Toyota
Improvement
kado.
B
But
really
this
talk
is
really
to
talk
to
you
about
focusing
on
the
kind
of
adoption
of
these
techniques
at
the
senior
management
layer.
They
have
not
been
really
adopted
in
mass,
their
outside
of
manufacturing
organizations
and
some
some
kind
of
knowledge
work
organizations
that
are
really
ahead
of
a
lot
of
folks.
So
what
doesn't
work
around
improvement?
I
think
all
of
us
know
is
that
meetings
don't
work.
B
So
meetings
are
one
of
the
worst
places
to
you,
know
kind
of
create
this
notion
of
lists
of
things
or
telling
people
to
use
a
suggestion
box
for
their
improvements,
and
I
can
talk
to
you
a
little
bit
about
why
that
is.
It
literally
has
to
do
with
the
notion
of
multivariable
experiments
when
a
lot
of
people
make
lists
and
a
lot
of
people
then
actually
start
working
on
those
lists.
B
What
we
find
is
is
that
people
tend
to
engage
in
work
that,
while
they're
working
on
their
own
doesn't
seem
like
it
affects
others
as
a
manager.
You
start
to
see
that
it
does,
because
you
hear
from
multiple
people,
so
sometimes
things
that
we
intend
to
go.
The
right
direction
can
actually
go
the
wrong
direction
when
we're
doing
them
too
many
at
a
time
and
also
in
a
very
unfocused
or
unsystematic
way
or
non
systematic
way.
B
So
I
think
these
kind
of
notions
of
Lists
and
and
by
the
way,
if
you
ever
take
an
hour
with
a
team
and
say,
let's
list
all
of
the
things
that
we
can
improve,
you're
gonna
quickly
run
into
the
problems.
Just
we
don't
have
enough
time,
money,
staff
or
budget
to
do
all
of
those
things.
You're
also
going
to
find
that
the
lists
of
things
to
improve
are
often
the
outcomes
or
the
things
that
people
want,
but
really
not
the
underlying
systems
or
steps
or
people
or
processes
that
deliver
those
results.
B
So
many
times
we're
addressing
symptoms
rather
than
causes,
one
of
the
things
I
think
organizations
have
done.
You
know
really
to
try
and
get
people
to
improve,
because
people
don't
like
to
systemically
improve.
What
we
found
is
is
that
they
bring
these
awards
into
this
conversation
like
you're
gonna,
get
some
sort
of
honorable
mention
I've
even
seen.
Plaques
I've
seen
team
awards
and
those
can
be
effective
tools
for
recognition,
but
not
as
a
sole
strategy
for
getting
people
to
improve
matter.
B
Of
fact,
what
that
leads
to
is
often
vanity
improvements
where
you'll
get
the
mission
accomplished
style
meetings
where
people
will
declare
a
victory
but
before
anything,
has
actually
been
delivered.
So
the
other
thing
that
we
think
of
when
we
look
through
these
lists
is
how
many
of
these
changes
are
things
that
we
could
do
without
additional
budget
staff
or
even
clearing
or
kind
of
traffic
control,
from
from
our
leadership
to
buy
a
space.
B
And
when
we
look
at
the
list
of
improvements,
they
wind
up
becoming
incredibly
large,
like
project
oriented
improvements
and
when
we
think
about
improving
an
org
a
lot
of
times
we're
talking
about
improving
around
things
that
are
in
limited
supply,
constrained
things,
either
items
time,
resources
and
so
we're
looking
to
get
those
things
many
times.
The
improvements
themselves
because
of
their
scope,
actually
require
use
of
those
same
constrained
items,
people,
resources
and
things.
So
sometimes
our
improvements
can
cause
things
to
go
the
wrong
direction.
B
If
we're
not
careful,
the
worst
thing
ever
I
think
is
creating
lists,
big
suggestion
boxes
and
the
notion
that
we
want
to
improve
without
actually
having
any
way
to
do
it,
and
so
the
big
thing
that
people
always
want
to
do
and
when
I
even
talked
last
week
about
ITIL
and
DevOps
the
last
time
I
talked
a
lot
of
people
said
hey.
When
we're
doing
our
DevOps
work,
we
have
a
better
way
to
test
changes.
We
have
a
better
way
to
do
things
we
just
want
to.
B
We
want
to
you,
know,
completely,
replace
this
process,
and
that
is
a
big
bang
improvement
that
somebody
wants
to
make
and
when
that
happens,
that
actually
cost
us
a
lot
of
problems.
First
of
all,
it
actually
can
cause
an
immune
reaction
for
the
people
that
you
know
is
to
run
said
process
and
then.
Secondly,
it
can
really
really
really
cause
friction,
because
maybe
the
people
that
are
proposing
that
improvement
don't
have
the
whole
frame
when
our
improvements
that
we
propose
involve
others
or
affect
others
in
a
dramatic
way.
B
B
So
look
this
up
and
research
this
on
your
own,
but
in
the
late
eighties
a
book
was
called
published,
called
the
machine
that
changed
the
world
and
it
was
basically
about
the
automobile,
and
it
was
about
the
fact
that
we
had
discovered
this
came
out
of
MIT
that
there
were
a
certain
group
of
manufacturers
in
the
world
that
were
actually
making
a
very,
very
radically
different
economy
out
of
auto
manufacturing
and
they're
other
manufacturers.
Subsequently,
they
were
making
more
cars
than
we
were
in
less
space
like
half
the
space,
not
its
own.
B
That
doesn't
seem
like
a
big
deal.
They
were
making
cars
than
us
more
cars
than
us
with
half
the
inventory,
which
kind
of
actually
but
follows
the
mind
a
little
bit.
How
can
you
make
more
when
you're
constantly
running
out
of
things
there?
They
were
able
to
make
more
cars
than
the
US
auto
manufacturers,
in
all
cases
and
in
half
the
time.
B
So
that's
the
cycle
time
they
were
delivering
cars
faster
and
then
the
scarier
part
about
all
this
is
they
were
delivering
all
of
the
cars
with
less
inventory,
less
space
less
cycle
time,
but
they
were
doing
it
with
half
the
defects
and
so
I
think
you
start
to
say
wow.
That
is
a
very,
very
big
difference
and
then
the
first
question
is
we
ought
to
ask
is:
are
they
doing
that?
What
are
they
doing?
And
matter
of
fact,
that's
what
this
book
was
about.
B
The
book
was
about
hate,
there's
Japanese,
auto
manufacturers,
in
this
case
Toyota
and
Toyota,
and
some
of
these
other
manufacturers
are
doing
things
completely
different
to
where,
when
American
auto
manufacturers
toured
some
of
these
early
rebuilded,
you
know
rebuilt
factories
in
Japan
after
the
war,
they
didn't
actually
believe
they
were
real
because
they
didn't
think
there
was
enough
inventory
on
the
floor.
They
didn't
think
that
there
was
enough
of
the
kinds
of
activities
that
you
would
see
in
a
large-scale
manufacturing
operation,
so
they
thought
they
were
being
hoodwinked,
but
they
weren't
and
I.
B
What
happened?
Nothing
Toyota
very
very
sure
in
steady
1950
was
bankrupt
and
Ono
focused
on
basically
putting
an
organization
together.
That
was
not
allowed
to
have
more
inventory
than
it
had
orders,
which
was
one
at
a
time.
The
kind
of
genesis
of
one
by
one
flow,
which
is
actually
a
new
goal
for
many
organizations
right
and
they
weren't,
allowed
to
have
much
space
and
the
reason
they
were
bankrupt
is
they
had
built
a
bunch
of
inventory
that
nobody
had
wanted,
so
they
weren't
going
to
get
much
inventory.
B
So
the
problem
that
we
started
to
see
is
is
that
this
was
a
limitation
to
their
ability
to
scale
so
from
1950
to
1960,
60kg
Ohno
and
several
of
the
other
principals
at
Toyota.
Mr.
Toyota
and
shigeo
shingo
worked
on
building
a
new
approach
to
using
what
little
resources
they
had
to
scale
and
make
a
lot
of
cars
by
generating
a
lot
of
orders.
One
problem
was,
they
didn't,
have
a
lot
of
order
capability,
because
the
marketing
organization
had
been
split
off
from
them,
so
what
they
had
to
focus
on
was
the
system
itself.
B
How
do
we
make
and
deliver
cars
so
they
won
by
doing
these
continuous
small
improvements
and
the
Toyota
kata
was
something
that
we
missed
initially
in
the
first
lean
efforts,
many
of
the
folks
that,
were
you
know
doing
the
research
on.
Why
there's
such
a
difference
between
the
manufacturing
capabilities
of
Japanese,
audio
manufacturers
and
ours
we're
looking
at
what
was
being
done
with
the
hands,
because
we
wanted
to
understand
what
they
were
doing
and
for
many
many
years
after
1988
until
I
believe
actually
mike
Rother
wrote
the
toilet
I
caught
a
book.
B
Many
folks
did
not
understand
that
the
word
Kaizen
was
referring
to
the
continuous
small
improvements
embedded
in
the
kata
and
mike
Rother
goes
that
length
to
tell
you
why
this
is
it's,
because
we
couldn't
see
what
they
were
thinking.
We
could
see
what
they
were
doing
with
their
hands,
but
what
they
were
thinking
was
a
simple
method
or
kata
that
was
allowing
them
to
all
work
in
kind
of
a
synchronized
harmony
towards
a
goal.
B
B
B
Though,
then,
when
Ford
bought
the
robots
later
on,
they
bought
him
at
less
money
as
they
were
not
buying
as
an
early
mover,
and
they
knew
exactly
what
they
were
buying
them
to
do,
and
they
understood
where
they
would
put
them
and
I.
Think
that
is
a
very,
very
important
lesson
for
all
of
us
is
bigbang.
B
Improvements
in
the
sight
of
a
big
opportunity
can
often
fail
to
deliver
and
also
distract
us
from
the
real
improvements
we
need
to
be
making
in
the
long
term,
so
again,
kind
of
coming
back
to
the
systemic
nature
of
how
we
improved.
How
will
it
be
taught
if
it's
not
something
we
can
repeat
now
we
can
do
artisanal
guilds
and
we
can
actually
have
people
work
together
and
the
mentor
and
mentee
relationships
which
actually
is
really
really
important.
But
still
there
needs
to
be
a
body
of
knowledge
that
we
can
all
pass
to.
B
Each
other
makes
it
much
easier
to
point
people
to
other
resources
and
also,
if
you're
not
available
for
somebody
else
to
step
in
and
then
the
big
thing
is
is
how
will
we
measure
our
improvements
and,
and
the
most
important
thing
I
think,
is
without
some
sort
of
former
system?
How
are
we
going
to
make
consistent
progress
and
advance
that
progress
with
a
common
language?
One
of
the
largest
problems
I
have
seen
in
corporate
America
is
a
very
simple
problem
called
learned
helplessness.
B
The
enterprise
at
large
is
designed,
regardless
of
what
we
say
to
actually
mitigate
the
effects
of
change
at
the
personnel
level.
It
goes
along
with
the
basic
notion
of
the
corporation,
providing
enterprise
goodwill
being
greater
than
any
one
person.
It
also
has
the
intonation
that
any
one
person
cannot
mess
this
up.
In
other
words,
it
also
means
it's
really
hard
for
any
one
person
or
group
of
people
to
change
the
system
in
an
enterprise.
B
It
is
designed
to
sustain
value
in
a
footprint
and
I
think
this
is
one
of
the
things
that
is
most
kind
of
troublesome
about
enterprise
transformation
as
a
notion,
it
often
fails
to
take
in
the
account
the
fact
that
there's
a
system
designed
to
prevent
things
from
changing
and
also
that
the
the
entire
organization
has
a
disposition
of
doing
things
the
same
way.
So
if
we
can't
develop
a
common
language,
if
we
can't
develop
some
sort
of
regular
systemic
process,
that's
built
into
the
daily
understanding
of
what
important
is.
B
Whatever
the
new
feature
is
whatever
the
new
platform
is,
or
whatever
the
new
capability
is,
there's
an
assumption
that
the
hard
part
is
the
rollout.
The
easy
part
is
just
using
it
or
uptake
well.
I
could
tell
you
that
we
don't
know
that
this
is
not
true.
There's
been
a
lot
of
platforms
bought
and
many
companies
that
nobody
adopts
there's
been
a
lot
of
tools
that
nobody
uses
delft.
B
Where
is
common,
and
so
one
of
the
things
that
we
need
to
understand
is
the
reasons
those
things
happen
are
also
those
reasons
that
it
makes
things
hard
to
improve.
That
makes
things
were
to
improve.
So
we
don't
have
a
lot
of
time.
We
certainly
don't
have
a
lot
of
mental
bandwidth
and
we're
being
distracted
at
kind
of
an
unprecedented
pace.
Years
ago
there
was
research
done
at
University
of
California
back
when
blackberries
were
a
thing.
The
tech
workers
were
getting
interrupted
by
their
devices
about
once
every
15
minutes.
B
I
think
we
all
know
that
that's
a
luxury
that
we
would
all
love
to
have
today
15
minutes
of
solid
thinking
without
a
device
going
off
all
of
these
fragmented
attention,
fragmented
time
over
driven
with
meetings
getting
more
deliverables
in
many
case
than
we
can
deliver.
All
of
these
things
are
the
things
that
make
it
hard
to
improve,
but
they're
also
the
things
that
make
it
hard
to
assimilate
all
of
the
improvements
that
are
available
for
us
to
use.
B
The
other
thing
is:
is
that
as
you
change
in
a
smaller
amount,
those
changes
can
scale
out
to
a
larger
group
of
people
because
they're
easy
to
assimilate.
It's
kind
of
like
the
metaphor
of
chelation
Galatian
allows
you
to
embed
things
like
vitamins
or
minerals
inside
of
things
like
sugars,
so
that
your
cells
will
take
them
in
sugars,
have
a
certain
size,
they're
very
small
and
they're,
very
easy
to
fit
into
cells.
So
it's
nice
to
take
those
big
rocks
that
you
want
to
get
in.
B
You
like
magnesium
and
calcium,
and
reduce
them
to
the
size
that
they
can
actually
fit
inside
sugar
and
when
they
do,
your
cells
will
take
them
in
both
at
the
same
time.
So
this
is
the
kind
of
thing
that
we
need
to
think
about
with
improvements,
which
is
how
do
we
make
these
improvements
small
enough
attractive
enough
and
absorbable
enough
to
become
adopted,
and
so
this
is
a
big
reason.
Why
I
like
a
systemic
approach
to
do
improvement?
It's
less
herky-jerky,
it's
less
about
funding
and
the
other
thing
is.
B
Is
it
includes
morale,
one
of
the
things
that
I
think
really
decreases
morale
in
an
organization?
Is
that
huge
list
of
things
we
need
to
fix
on
the
wall
and
nothing
gets
crossed
off?
In
other
words,
things
don't
change
for
the
better.
The
other
piece
is
mastery
of
changes
that
are
smaller,
obviously
are
more
manageable.
B
So
I
want
to
talk
to
you
a
little
bit
about
kata
I
did
let
the
word
slip
out
in
the
conversation
a
little
bit
earlier
and
I
want
to
talk
about
what
just
a
kata
is
in
a
generic
sense.
A
kata
is
like
a
move
or
a
dance
move.
If
you
think
about
martial
arts
such
as
gongfu
or
Taekwondo,
there
are
a
series
of
motions
that
are
learned
and
these
motions,
when
put
together,
can
become
Coty's.
So
just
like
certain
dances
like
the
merengue
or
salsa
all
have
styles
of
movement
and
steps.
B
Even
my
dancing
does
right.
So
these
things
are
actually
small
Coty's.
One
of
the
most
important
things
to
understand
is:
is
they
coordinate,
motion,
thinking
and
experience,
and
that
is
a
really
really
important
thing
to
think
about.
It's,
not
just
rote
doing,
there's
an
awareness
to
the
kata.
So
when
Mike
Rother
found
that
what
they
were
doing
at
Toyota
wasn't
just
lean
that
there
was
something
behind
their
eyes.
There
was
something
in
their
heads,
the
folks
that
they
were
watching.
B
What
were
they
thinking,
though,
through
observing
Coty's,
he
was
able
to
start
to
understand
the
thinking
and
talking
to
people
and
that
led
him
to
write
the
Toyota,
kata
I.
Think
one
of
the
things
I
thought
has
been
really
interesting
is:
is
that
lean
has
literally
missed
this
part
for
decades
and
which
was
the
thinking
part
of
this?
We
have
all
of
the
techniques
you
know
how
to
shine
and
make
everything
pretty
and
how
to
do
value
stream,
mapping
and
all
those
things,
but
we
missed
the
most
basic
motion
or
execution
of
improvement.
B
That
was
happening
that
literally
had
the
largest
impact
and
I
think
some
of
us
wondered
why
70
to
80
percent
of
lean
adoptions
were
failing
other
than
the
fact
that
70
to
80
percent
of
adoption
of
most
things
seems
to
fail.
It
seems
to
be
a
Pareto
shape
in
the
nature
somehow,
but
one
of
the
reasons
had
to
do
with
the
fact
that
we
were
really
adopting
what
they
were
doing.
B
We
adopted
what
we
thought,
the
folks
that
we
were
learning
from
we're
doing
and
I
think
that
that
was
an
important
discovery
that
Mike
made
Mike
was
at
the
University
of
Michigan
and
matter
of
fact.
To
this
day
he
still
offers
the
Toyota
kata
training.
I
can't
tell
you
enough
about
the
resources
that
he's
put
up
for
free
on
his
website,
including
videos,
the
templates,
the
questions
and
everything
you
need
to
do
to
get
started
with
this
and
I
think
the
most
powerful
thing
about
this.
B
B
But
when
the
Toyota
kata
got
revealed
to
me,
I
understood
that
it
was
the
basis
or
kind
of
the
entry
point
for
making
an
improvement.
The
other
thing
is,
as
I
mentioned
before,
learned
helplessness.
This
notion-
and
you
know,
there's
a
lot
of
psychological
experiments-
have
been
done
around
learned
helplessness
over
the
years,
but
the
notion
that
you
can
take
somebody
that
knows
how
to
find
the
cheese.
Literally,
the
experiments
were
done
with
rats
and
they
allowed
the
rats
to
find
cheese
to
learn
how
to
find
the
cheese.
B
Instead,
the
cheese
would
just
randomly
come
into
the
cage
at
a
place
where
the
rat
didn't
expect
it,
but
could
never
figure
out
how
to
activate
so
then
the
result
was
the
rat
just
sat
still,
because
it
basically
knew
that
it
didn't
know
what
to
do
and
that
cheese
was
just
gonna
show
up
and
I.
Think
that
this
is
a
patent
that
many
of
us
have
learned
in
the
enterprise
we
try
to
make
improvements.
We
have
a
great
idea.
We
want
to
do
a
thing.
B
We
want
to
make
something
better,
we're
tired
of
banging
our
head
against
the
wall
whatever
it
is,
it
could
be
a
group
of
us
and
we
try
and
make
a
difference.
We
go
get
approvals.
We
do
the
things
that
you
would
do
in
a
normal
situation
to
make
improvement
happen
logically,
but
then
what
I
call
the
Enterprise
effect
happens.
There's
all
of
this
resistance.
Nobody
wants
to
help,
people
don't
see
it
management
doesn't
find
the
value
in
it.
B
There
are
just
more
reasons
that
something
will
not
happen
than
you
could
ever
imagine
and
after
a
while,
a
lot
of
us
give
up
trying
to
improve
out
sort
of
us
outside
of
a
certain
circle
that
we've
determined
that
we
have
control
and
influence
in
and
in
an
enterprise.
That's
pretty
small.
So
again
that
also
leads
to
morale
issues
over
time
kind
of
like
a
hopelessness
that
can
develop.
If
we
can't
even
address
the
most
basic
things
in
our
daily
work
life,
then
what
is
it
that
we're
doing
that's
supposed
to
be
bigger
than
that?
B
Don't
the
other
big
thing
about
Toyota
kata,
that
I
thought
was
really
brilliant
and
I.
Think
a
lot
of
people
have
talked
about
this
over
time.
Is
it
allows
folks,
since
the
kata
is
practiced
and
I'll
get
into
the
details
in
a
minute
of
what
the
kata
actually
entails?
But
since
the
kata
is
a
practitioners
tool,
in
other
words
the
people
that
do
it,
our
folks
at
the
edge,
largely
I'm
talking
to
about
you
to
actually
bringing
this
into
management
as
a
discipline
before
you
bring
it
out
to
the
edge?
B
Because
if
you
can
model
this
internally
and
I'll
talk
about
that
in
a
little
bit,
you
have
a
lot
higher
chance
of
getting
folks
to
actually
execute
this
where
they
work.
But
again,
this
method
and
the
series
of
steps
really
focuses
that
on
moving
decision-making
to
the
edge
around
improvements,
it
provides
a
very
light
work
framework,
a
lightweight
framework
for
making
the
improvements,
by
the
way,
its
scientific
thinking
and
a
adaptation
of
the
scientific
method.
B
The
Toyota
kata
is
surprisingly
stealthy.
This
way,
it
will
actually,
as
it's
practiced
among
your
management
and
your
folks
on
the
line,
will
actually
increase
your
scientific
thinking,
capabilities
dramatically
to
the
point
where
you'll
actually
develop
a
language
among
your
team
about
talking
about
problems,
opportunities
and
improvements.
That
sounds
like
science,
in
a
very,
very
good
and
crisp
way.
B
Well,
you
would
be
focusing
on,
as
managers
would
be
focusing
on
the
coaching
of
these
things.
So
the
thinking
behind
the
work
that
they
are
doing
is
what
your
coaching,
your,
not
telling
them,
what
to
do
or
how
to
solve
the
problem,
and
this
is
very
powerful,
because
what
you're
building
is
people
that
are
capable
of
teaching
other
people
and
mentoring
other
people
through
this
process,
if
you
guys
don't
as
managers
and
leaders,
especially
senior
leaders
model
this
effectively
before
you
ask
people
to
do
this.
B
In
other
words,
if
you
kind
of
do
the
babysitter
routine,
where
you
say
hey,
we're
going
out
and
somebody's
gonna
come
over
and
teach
you
some
stuff
while
we're
out
and
they're
gonna
buy
you
a
pizza,
we
want
you
to
do
everything
they
tell
you
to.
That's
less
influential
than
actually
something
that
your
team
sees
you
model
and
actually
use
yourself
and
I.
Think
that
that's
obvious,
but
I
have
to
say
it
because
apparently
it's
not
I've
had
so
many
folks
that
have
told
me,
hey
great
we're
gonna
learn
how
to
do
Toyota.
B
B
Then
we're
having
trouble,
and
so
we
have
that
credibility
gap,
and
so
one
of
the
best
things
I
think
that
you
can
do
with
your
team
and
for
your
organization
is
to
actually
figure
out
how
to
do
this
kata
at
home.
So
when
I
tell
you,
the
steps
and
I
give
you
some
resources
as
to
where
to
look
specifically
go
to
Google
right
now
and
type
in
Mike
Rother.
B
So
I
would
definitely
give
that
a
check
out
real
quick
before
you
start
talking
to
your
team
about
it
consume
all
the
free
resources
there
are,
but
all
you
need
to
get
this
going
in
management
is
a
small
nucleus
and
I
mean
by
nucleus
two
of
you.
The
reason
why
the
kata
it
can
be
run
personally
and
I
think
it
is
oftentimes
best
run
personally,
but
I
do
believe
that
it
is
best
learned
in
a
group.
B
That's
how
I
learned
actually
was
with
Mike
and
with
Bill
and
I
learned
it
from
them,
and
it
was
one
of
the
best
experiences
I've
had
I've
taken
several
people
up
to
their
training
in
Michigan
and
and
had
a
blast.
It's
it's
a
really
really
good
time
and
and
I
think
it's
a
really
really
great
chance
for
you
to
show
the
rest
of
your
team.
How
how
excited
you
are
about
improving
things?
It's
a
really
worthwhile
during
I,
highly
recommend
it.
B
But
again,
if
you
can't
find
another
person
to
learn
this
with
and
model
it
with
and
find
something
simple,
the
two
of
you
can
focus
on
to
improve-
or
even
you
know,
as
another
step
even
earlier
as
agenesis
for
yourself
take
these
materials
off
the
web
and
find
something
in
your
life
that
you
want
to
like
improve.
That's
been
kind
of
nagging
you
that
has
some
obstacles
and
I
think
what
you'll
notice
is
is,
as
you
begin
to
apply
the
base
steps
of
cada
you're
gonna,
find
one
thing
really
quick.
B
Some
videos
and,
like
I
said
mike,
has
a
ton,
a
plethora
of
videos
up
there
for
you
to
watch
and
I
think
you
can
get
a
lot
of
great
insight
and
if
you
still
have
questions
go
to
a
class,
but
do
it
on
your
own
at
first
or
take
a
buddy
that
work,
but
don't
don't
throw
an
organization
into
doing
kata
without
you
having
some
idea
and
being
able
to
model
how
it
works.
Otherwise,
it'll
just
be
another
thing
that
you
try
to
get
people
to
do
that
they'll
pretend.
B
Want
to
do,
and
that
will
fade
away
over
time,
so
I
think
it's
pretty
clear
that
your
team
knows
what
you
understand
and
that
the
modeling
this
is
important.
So
let
me
get
into
what
the
kata
is.
I
flashed
a
screen
here.
That's
got
three
books
on
it,
both
the
original
book
to
the
left,
which
is
the
Toyota
kata,
and
then
the
Toyota
practice
guide
to
try
to
cut
a
practice
guide
which
is
in
the
middle,
and
this
is
actually
really
affect.
B
Although
some
of
these
resources,
again,
like
I,
said,
are
available
on
the
web
and
then
learning
to
see
is
a
really
great
book
that
is
not
listed
on
here.
That
Mike
also
wrote,
which
is
about
value
stream
mapping,
but
I,
really
like
this
book.
The
Toyota,
kata
culture
and
I
think
that
one
of
the
most
important
things
that
we
can
understand
about
the
kata
is
is
that
culture
is
changed
by
doing
something
different
a
lot
of
times.
B
We
think
that
culture
is
changed
by
embracing
a
new
mindset
or
having
learning
a
new
way
of
doing
things
or
all
getting
on
the
same
page.
These
are
kind
of
Western
ideas
that
we
have
heard
all
through
the
years
and
and
stay
without
even
thinking
sometimes
but
I
really
believe
and
I
think
that
a
lot
of
people
believe
that
the
way
you
change
something
is
by
doing
something
different.
B
So
the
way
we
change
culture,
if
we
think
about
culture
like
a
rearview
mirror,
or
maybe
even
the
disposition
that
our
organization
has
two
things,
it's
basically
things
that
we
have
done
that.
Maybe
we
are
more
likely
to
do
so.
The
way
to
change
that
culture
is
not
to
steer
and
drive
in
the
rearview
mirror.
It
is
simply
to
intend
to
do
a
new
thing
and
to
do
it
and
those
the
doing
changes,
culture.
The
doing
also
changes
our
minds.
B
B
B
So,
basically,
this
is
a
little
bit
about
of
lists,
but
basically,
if
there's
four
steps
of
the
kata
that
we
use,
we
actually
want
to
understand
the
direction
of
the
challenge
and
one
of
the
things
that
I'm
not
gonna,
spend
a
lot
of
time
on.
With
you
today,
because
at
the
beginning
of
this,
where
we're
really
trying
to
understand
how
to
apply
this
in
a
small
scale
in
ours,
in
our
own
life
or
in
leadership
again,
I
really
encourage
you
to
get
the
details
from
the
materials.
B
But
when
we
understand
a
challenge
and
I'll
briefly
cover
what
a
challenge
looks
like
and
how
that
works.
But
basically
one
of
the
problems
we
have
when
improving
things
at
our
particular
they've
were
in
you
know
in
a
plant
and
we're
going
to
improve
something
at
our
workstation
in
the
plant.
It
really
comes
from
understanding.
How
do
we
get
you
know?
B
What
must
I
do
today
to
actually
get
the
goal
or
the
challenge
accomplished
that
we
wanted.
So
we
think
of
strategies
as
like
far
off
cities,
and
if
we
think
about
a
challenge
in
in
the
kind
of
kata
mindset,
a
challenge
is
going
to
be
somewhere
in
between
or
somewhere
on,
the
way
to
the
larger
strategy
or
goal.
And
so
what
we
actually
want
to
do
is
develop
a
series
of
challenges.
Breaking
that
larger
goal
down
into
smaller
pieces.
We're
gonna
break
those
down
into
challenges.
B
So
if
we
achieve
enough
challenges
as
a
team,
we're
gonna
achieve
the
goal.
But
challenges
are
still.
Let's
say
the
goal
is
a
year
long,
a
challenge
could
be
four
months
long.
That
could
be
a
lot
to
achieve,
so
I
still
may
not
know,
and
we
still,
maybe,
as
a
group
will
not
be
able
to
break
down
the
things
that
we
need
to
do
on
a
daily
basis
to
meet
that
challenge.
So
I
think
this
is
why
Chaya
of
the
the
COD
approach
here
is
so
brilliant.
B
We
not
only
have
challenges
to
break
down
the
larger
goals,
but
we
actually
have
a
really
really
nice
crisp
unit,
that's
at
the
daily
level
or
at
the
experience
level
of
your
work
every
day
called
the
target
condition.
A
lot
of
people
will
mistake,
the
target
condition
or
the
challenge
or
for
the
goal.
Some
people
will
use
the
word
goal
instead
of
target
condition.
B
I
suggest
that
you
actually
stick
with
the
term
target
condition,
because
this
reflects
the
changing
nature
of
the
fact
that
you
are
always
shooting
for
something
that
you
do
not
have,
and
that
is
important.
The
target
condition
allows
us
to
focus
on
what's
next,
what
what
needs
to
be
next?
What
is
success
for
this
next
day
or
for
these
series
of
experiments
that
I'm
doing
so
again?
We
have
kind
of
a
continuum
of
goal
at
the
end
target
conditions
in
between.
B
B
So,
if
I
fulfill
enough
target
conditions,
I'll
fulfill
a
challenge,
I
fulfill
in
challenges,
I
will
fulfill
the
goal.
It
allows
us
to
orient
and
focus
on
the
step
by
step
things
that
matter.
So
this
is
why
we
want
to
focus
our
improvement
to
be
in
the
size
of
those
target
conditions
or
happening
daily.
B
Small
improvements
allow
for
easy
to
assimilate
change,
and
that
means
broader
adoption
of
the
improvements
that
we
make
so
we're
gonna
get
the
direction
or
challenge
we're.
Gonna,
say:
okay,
I'm
gonna,
understand
that
in
this
case,
let's
say
the
challenge
is
going
to
be
that
I
need
to
be
able
to
complete
all
of
the
work.
That's
put
in
front
of
me
every
day:
that's
a
pretty
good
challenge.
B
B
That
will
allow
me
if
I
succeed
and
lock
enough
target
conditions,
I
will
achieve
a
challenge
and
when
I
knock
enough
challenges,
I
will
achieve
or
help
to
achieve
a
larger
goal
for
the
team.
So
what
happens
is?
Is
we
we've
get
this?
We
define
this
target
condition
after
we've
understood
what
we
can't
do.
We
say
that
we
need
to
be
able
to
do
it.
B
So
my
target
condition
at
a
high
level
could
be
here:
hey
I
need
to
be
able
to
get
all
this
work
done
every
day,
so
zero
in
box
would
be
my
target
condition.
Then
I
would
say
all
right.
I
need
to
get
some
experiments,
because,
right
now
my
current
condition
is
not
zero
in
box.
Its
thousand
messages
over
every
day.
B
So
the
first
thing
we
have
to
think
about
is
the
obstacles
that
stand
in
our
way
between
us
and,
in
this
case,
a
zero
in
box,
and
once
we
define
those
lists,
we
don't
need
to
remember
how
I
talked
about
lists.
Let's
not
come
up
with
more
than
two
or
three
obstacles
here,
and
what
you're
gonna
want
to
do
is
pick
one
of
those
obstacles
and
you're
gonna
design,
an
experiment
for
that
day
to
run
against
it.
Now
these
experiments
need
to
be
small,
like
very
small.
B
If
you
need
to
get
other
people
involved,
I,
don't
know
that
it's
going
to
be
done
in
time
for
the
day
and
you're
gonna
kind
of
violate
the
role
of
having
the
experiments.
So
the
the
biggest
thing
to
focus
on
with
the
experiments
is
small
within
a
day
and
not
involving
other
people.
That
is
very
critical.
So
the
next
thing
that
we
want
to
focus
on
is
is
that
when
we
do
these
experiments,
we're
only
doing
one
at
a
time,
so
we're
gonna
do
an
experiment
and
we're
going
to
come
back
and
talk
about
it.
B
So
here's
what
it
looks
like
from
a
coaching
cycle
where
there
are
kind
of
like
five
questions,
that
you
would
ask
as
a
coach
to
step
up
to
somebody,
who's,
doing
improvement
and
you
would
up
come
up
to
them
and
you'd
say
as
a
coach,
hey.
What's
today's
target
condition:
okay!
Well,
I
want
zero
in
box,
okay.
So
what
we're
at
right
now
well
I'm
at
a
thousand
messages
interesting.
B
So
what
obstacle
you
think
you
know
are
in
the
way
kind
of
getting
to
that
zero
inbox
that
you
talked
about
and
which
one
you're
working
on.
So
you
know
you'll
list
off
your
shortlist
and
you'll
say
well
right
now:
I'm
working
on
the
fact
that
I'm
getting
a
lot
of
spam.
Oh
okay,
that's
interesting!
So
what
your
experiment
well
I'm,
going
to
install
a
spam
filter
and
see
how
many
messages
go
away.
Great
I'm
gonna
come
back
tomorrow
and
I'm
gonna
see.
Well
you
learned
from
that.
B
So
then,
tomorrow,
when
you
come
back,
it's
just
like
you
know
we
can
reflect
on
what
you
learned.
What
you
plan
on.
Did
you
know
what
you
learned
kind
of
like
basically,
a
synopsis
of
the
scientific
method?
Right
we
make
a
hypothesis,
we
test
the
hypothesis
right
and
then
we
record
our
observations
and
then
we
can
decide
whether
that
hypothesis
was
true
or
not,
or
maybe
like
most
science
will
need
to
actually
take
another
step
and
develop
another
hypothesis
or
do
another
experiment.
B
In
other
words,
it's
a
process,
but
the
great
thing
about
this
process
is
is
that
there
are
two
people
involved
in
it.
There
is
the
person
doing
the
improvements,
the
improver,
and
you
are
also
in
this
case
now
talking
about
a
coach
or
a
mentor
that
comes
in,
and
this
is
what
I
propose
that
we
do
with
middle
management
in
many
cases
right
now,
which
is
move
to
a
style
that
is
more
about
thinking
about
the
way
our
folks
are
thinking
how
they
solve
problems
rather
than
the
specific
problems
themselves.
B
B
This
literally
undoes
learned
helplessness
over
time
in
people
and
I
think
that
what
we
find
in
the
work
environment
is
is
it
creates
a
morale
situation
where
people
are
like
I
have
the
ability
to
affect
my
environment
in
a
positive
way,
and
it's
encouraged
by
my
management
and
every
day
somebody
shows
up
to
see
how
I'm
doing
doing
that
and
one
of
the
Lord's
things
I
think
at
Toyota
that
maybe
people
missed
at
that
time
was
their
slogans
were
different.
There
was
a
big
emphasis
on
putting
improvement
before
the
work.
B
One
of
my
favorite
examples
of
that
was
a
slogan
Toyota
had
for
a
while,
which
was
better
cars
or
more
people.
You
can
see
where
they
put
the
improvement.
It's
at
the
beginning
right
and
it's
an
important
thing
to
understand,
and
it's
very
counter
intuitive
to
us,
but
actually
allowing
your
team
to
make
time
to
do
these
experiments
every
day
and
then
taking
time
to
come
review
these
experiments
with
them
every
day
in
a
short
period
of
time,
we're
talking
about
15,
20
minute
pop
seer.
B
This
is
really
powerful
and
it
also
brings
a
level
of
engagement
and
understanding
of
where
your
people
are
at
that
I've
not
seen
other
things
do
so
very,
very
important
again,
link
on
the
bottom
of
the
resources.
I'd
really
suggest
that
you
go
out
and
get
these
and
I
will
do
some
more
in-depth
kata
training
for
managers
as
we
move
along
so
again,
I
want
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
the
way
to
roll
with
this.
You've
got
to
do
this
with
your
peers.
B
First
management
do
not
try
and
do
experiments
on
your
teams
without
understanding
the
moral
hazards
and
and
understanding
the
basic
you
know
boundaries
of
what
you
want
to
teach
them
and
how
it
feels
to
do
it.
It's
really
important
to
say
things
like
when
I
do
this.
This
is
what
I
struggle
with.
It
really
helps
people
to
see
that
you're,
a
real
human
being,
and
then
the
other
big
thing
I
want
to
talk
about
is
try
this
at
home.
B
B
We've
got
to
apply
these
techniques,
we
have
to
hit
these
target
conditions
and
then
one
person
raises
their
hand
and
asks
the
most
feeble
neat
question
that
betrays
the
fact
that
this
guy
no
idea
what
he's
doing,
though,
all
of
those
words
about
importance,
urgency
and
all
of
that
stuff
does
mean
nothing
to
people.
So,
what's
important-
and
all
of
this
is
that
you
internalize
this-
not
that
you
externalize
it
so
not
enough
to
direct
a
team
to
do
it.
It's
basically
your
leaders
watch
you
and
they
know
what
you
know.
That's
the
thing.
B
Maybe
a
lot
of
people
don't
understand,
and
they
know
it's
important
to
you.
So
coaching
is
leading
in
this
scenario
not
telling
people
what
to
do,
but
working
with
them
on
their
thinking
and
I.
Think
you
really
really
have
to
evaluate
how
much
focus
is
there
really
on
improvement
in
your
organization?
It
is
largely
free.
The
book
is
true.
Quality
is
free
and
it
is
a
thing
that
we
can
actually
embrace.
But
I
can
tell
you
this
enterprise,
not
free
Diane,.
A
And
and
I
loved
I
loved
it
and
it's
wonderful
I'm
gonna.
We
had
a
couple
of
questions
so
I'm
gonna,
unmute,
Carl
here
and
I'm.
Just
gonna
say
it's
wonderful,
because
we
are
going
back
and
forth
a
little
bit
in
the
chat
about
Eric
Ruiz
and
the
Lean
Startup
and
it
may
be
yes,
we
should
try
and
ask
Eric
to
come
and
and
talk.
A
I
went
to
a
couple
of
workshops
of
his
and
read
the
book
a
while
ago,
so
that
was
really
good
and
I
and
I
love
the
when
you
were
on
the
capacity
to
absorb
the
idea
that
you
know
with
a
BlackBerry
I
think
it
was.
You
had
15
solid
minutes
without
that
and
I
always
pick
clicked
in
my
head
of
going
that
I
don't
want
Andy,
Warhol's,
15
minutes
of
fame,
15
minutes,
undistracted
time
I.
B
C
A
C
I
I
get
I
work
in
an
enterprise
environment.
That's
my
background.
I,
do
software
development
we
use
open
shift
and,
as
I
was
selling
Diane
a
lot
of
the
work
of
the
enterprise
is
especially
these
days
moving
old
systems
to
how
do
you
know?
That's
that's
what
management
wants,
but
always
there's
that
discussion.
We
want
to
embrace
lead,
embraced,
agile,
you
know,
and-
and
we
want
we
want-
why
do
they
want
that
because
they
want
to
take
advantage
of
the
lean
and
the
agile
and
fast?
C
You
know
startup
kind
of
mentality
some
day
in
the
future
when
it
becomes
important,
they
don't
know.
The
problem
is,
of
course,
you're
moving
a
very
well-defined
system,
these
verses,
that's
written
in
COBOL.
So
that
tells
you
how
old
it
is.
You
know
how
entrenched
the
business
process
is
that
ice
and
it's
kind
of
a
contradiction.
How
do
we
apply
these
kind
of
lean
things
in
in
that
situation?
Right.
B
So,
what's
interesting
to
me
about
that
is
is
I.
It's
often
that
you
know.
Quite
frankly,
it's
often
that
I
hear
people
say
that
they
want
to
apply
lean
and
that
they
want
to.
You
know
they
essentially
want
to
get
the
value
of
lean,
which,
in
a
lot
of
it,
should
be
frank,
a
lot
of
Management
here's
lean
and
they
think
costs
they
think
the
opposite
of
fat
and
they,
when
they're
saying
agile,
they
don't
actually
mean
what
we
think
they
do
many
times
they
mean
they
just
want
it
faster,
and
so
what
has
happened?
B
That
would
be
really
surprised
to
find
how
much
people
actually
understand
about
your
your
understanding
of
these
things
themselves,
right
and
so
I
think
it's
pretty
potent
that
folks
that
that
really
really
think
about
how
do
I
do
this
when,
when
people
are
to
you,
know
kind
of
overloading
my
time
they're
saying
these
words,
they
don't
know
what
they
mean.
That's,
why
I
really
like
an
atom
like
an
atomized
process
like
the
kata,
because
I
only
actually
need
permission
from
my
manager
to
do
this.
B
I
don't
actually
need
to
create
a
bunch
of
time
like
one
of
the
things
I
showed
a
network
team
a
long
time
ago
was
hey,
listen,
how
about
we,
we
make
some
improvements
and
we
don't
get
any
permission
from
anybody
and
they
thought.
Oh,
my
gosh,
we're
rogue.
You
know
we're
crazy.
This
is
gonna,
be
terrible.
We're
gonna
get
in
trouble
and
I
said
no,
actually,
you're,
probably
gonna
get
recognized
and
what
they
did
was
in
about
a
half-hour
day.
B
Fifteen
minutes
at
the
morning,
in
15
minutes
at
night,
this
network
team
started
to
figure
out
hey.
First
of
all,
we
have
a
problem.
We
can't
think
straight,
you
know,
like
Diane,
was
saying
the
15-minute
interruption
problem
right,
Network
people,
it's
it's!
You
know
that
stuff
takes
runways
of
concentration
right,
just
like
developing
and
a
lot
of
other
things
we
do
so
one
of
things
they
found
was
a
real
problem
for
them,
because
they
didn't
have
any
guidance
from
management.
Was
we're
interrupted
too
much?
B
This
team
got
a
effective
goalie
system
put
in
place
to
where
team
members
could
disappear
for
days
and
effectively.
Work
on
things
and
management
didn't
even
understand
that
it
was
happening
until
people
tried
to
hyper
escalate
around
policy
and
go
directly
to
people
and
they
weren't
there,
which
was
an
awesome
burn
right.
B
Not
only
did
they
break
process
didn't
go
direct
to
a
person
that
person
was
busy
and
everybody
else
knew
it
doing
an
improvement,
and
it
was
like
that
was
crucial,
and
so
again
they
can
grow
organically,
but
the
problem
is
this:
management
can
stomp
it
out
by
not
giving
it
time
right.
So
I
think
one
of
the
most
important
things
is
is
if
we
can
get
management
to
understand
it's
not
time
wasted.
This
is
not
extra.
If
people
feel
like
they're
doing
extra
work
to
do
improvement,
it
will
never
happen
and
the
benefits
are
small.
B
They're
not
gonna,
be
like
we're.
Not
gonna
have
a
big,
huge
mission
accomplished
ceremony.
The
next
day.
It
literally
could
be
I
figured
out
how
to
get
300
messages
out
of
my
inbox
every
week
without
having
to
do
something
right,
but
on
a
line
and
here's
where
it
gets
really
powerful
in
and
I'm
gonna
actually
do.
Another
presentation
at
some
point
and
I'll
have
an
interview
about
this
with
Mike
I'm
hoping
I'm
talking
to
him.
B
Imagine
you
had
a
strategic
capability
that
you
could
point
at
a
freaking
wall
and
it
would
eat
that
wall
down
into
sand
over
time
and
by
the
way
they
do
all
the
other
work
that
they're
already
doing.
Would
you
use
that
and
they
would
be
like?
Oh,
my
gosh,
you
could
do
that
so
if
people
start
to
see
this
kind
of
to
your
point
as
a
way
that
strategy
can
be
achieved
more
likely
and
also
that
it
grease
is
kind
of
the
rails
of
things
to
being
done.
B
I
think
it
becomes
a
much
more
innate
capability,
but
it
has
to
be
seen
the
strategic
eye
and
I
think
that
that's
the
problem
is:
is
that
in
a
lot
of
works,
it's
just
seen
as
a
tactical.
Why
don't
you
lean
that
out
when
you
get
faster?
Why
don't
you
improve
something,
and
it's
a
lot
more
than
just
a?
Why
not
you
know
I.
A
Think
it's
I'm
really
glad
that
we
stepped
through
the
Toyota
kata
to
stuff
today,
because,
like
I
had
done,
I've
done
some
of
the
lean
stuff.
I
heard
something
I've
never
actually
seen
it
all
broken
down
and
I
really
liked
the
emphasis
on
small,
discrete
things
like
and
tasks
there
because
I
went.
This
is
a
red
hat
thing,
but
like
our
okay
ours
this
year
and
our
big
things
like
last
year,
they
were
little
things
and
they
were
there
were
too
many
of
them
or
that's
how
we
fell.
A
And
now
this
year
we
went
big
and
grand
and
and
it's
it's
kind
of
like
we
always
I,
always
think
of
in
the
especially
in
the
automotive
industry
and
the
Cata
coming
out
of
that
and
it
being
a
manufacturing
process,
manufacturing
or
automotive
manufacturing
or
something
but
really
applying
it
to
business
practices
and
our
okrs.
For
those
people
don't
know
those
are
like
our
our
yearly
goals
and
thing
metrics
things
that
were
method
instance
that
when
they're
really
really
broad
it's
it's
it's
really
difficult
to
it,
not
just
to
achieve
them
and
stand
on.
A
You
know
the
deck
of
a
ship
saying
ship,
saying
mission
accomplished:
it's
also
hard
to
see
those
even
little
improvements
over
the
long,
the
length
of
the
time
that
you're
doing
the
work
and
that's
that's
kind
of
that's
hard,
and
then
you
don't
so
you
don't
you
see
yourself
arriving
at
the
big
goal?
Yes,
yes,
along
the
way,
so
there's
some
really
interesting
concepts
of
the
katha
stuff,
I
love.
B
C
B
I
think
your
point
about
the
large
goals
you
know
the
achieving
them
can
be
subjective.
There's
a
lot
of
room
inside
those
goals.
Right
you
can
say
well,
I
did
all
these
things,
yeah
I
couldn't
do
those
other
things,
but
it's
because
this
was
so
big
right
and
I.
Think
I
think
that
that
it
really
is
hard.
B
I
I
understand
what
you're
saying
and
how
do
you
know
you're,
making
the
right
efforts
and
the
right
doing
the
right
things,
and-
and
so
something
simple
is
great
and
I-
do
think
that
your
point
about
recognizing
all
of
the
achievements
that
you've
made
over
the
year
are
really
important.
I,
have
you
know
I've
told
teams
in
this
case
I,
you
know
the
network
team
that
I
talked
to
you
about.
You
know
they
actually
started
to
schedule
just
like
a
monthly
drive-by
for
their
executive
to
go.
B
Hey
we're
just
partying,
because
we
got
these
things
done
that
you
didn't
know
about
and
here's
how
it
helps
you
and
you
know.
Sometimes
the
things
are
more
exciting
to
the
executive
than
others,
but
he
knows
that
they're
gonna
come
by
about
every
30
minutes,
because
they're
gonna
have
a
party
because
they
are
gonna
go
this
do
this
right,
because
they
have
proof
that
they
made
things
better
for
themselves
and
for
other
people.
The.
B
That's
actually
really
cool
is
I,
often
tell
people
to
start
focusing
on
their
work
environments,
because
that's
where
all
the
work
happens
and
a
lot
of
times,
there's
crap
there
that
keeps
us
from
getting
work
done
so
I
think
one
of
the
things
that's
fun
is:
when
you
throw
some
of
those
projects
in
you
can
actually
feel
them.
You
feel
the
stress
go
away,
and
so,
but
even
then
you
need
to
remember
because
it
just
gets
replaced
with
something.
A
It's
interesting,
I
mean
I've
also
been.
We
have
a
lot
of
automotive
end
users
who
are
using
OpenShift.
So
there's
a
lot
of
that.
Toyota
Honda,
Porsche
informatica
down
we're
getting
a
few
because
I
don't
know
a
lot
about
cars,
but
we
have
a
lot
of
those
folks
that
are
in
the
openshift
Commons
already
so
I'd
love
to
get
some
of
them
because
a
lot,
because
this
is
a
very
automotive
and
GM
and
all
that
was
part
of
that
and
gather
them
together,
maybe
and
have
an
automotive
day
bond.
A
That
that
would
be
a
great
outcome.
I
think,
because
you
know-
and
you
know
like
Eric
Ries
I
had
never
even
thought
about
asking
him.
He
would
be
a
be
great
on
this
and
this
whole
transformation
stuff,
so
I'm
I
think
there's
a
lot
more
there
and
we
could
probably
talk
all
day.
We
could
we've
hit
our
allotted
stream
time
here.
A
A
B
C
B
B
Series
of
experiments
to
figure
out
what
works
right.
So
you
can
you
see
the
this
is
Mike's
actual
personal
page
at
University
of
Michigan.
You
could
see
his
books
here,
but
look
at
this
at
the
bottom.
It's
great
he's
got
all
these
cata
videos
on
YouTube,
he's,
got
slide,
shares
and
all
kinds
of
people
that
have
you
know
he's
done
this.
If
you
go
up
on
look
on
SlideShare
and
other
places,
you'll
see
other
people's
internal
presentations,
which
could
be
awesome.
There's
an
online
course.
B
B
You
know
the
practitioner
days
are
real
things,
so
yeah
I
just
think
it's
a
wonderful
community
and
I
love
the
fact
that
it's
fans
application
across
the
industry,
it's
just
fun
and
and
I've
used
this
quite
a
bit
of
my
life
for
my
own
health
and
it's
kind
of
hell,
I
found
some
of
the
power
of
it
myself.
Personally,
so
it's
it's
a
very,
very,
very
powerful
set
of
thoughts
so.
A
We'll
encourage
everybody
to
binge
watch
no
Takata
videos
over
the
weekend
and
come
back
and
tell
us
what
they
think
so
again
Kevin
as
always.
Thank
you
very
much
for
your
time
and
we're
really
thrilled
that
you
know
you
guys
from
the
GTO
are
part
of
the
Red
Hat
team
and
sharing
the
wealth
of
knowledge
that
you
bring
to
the
to
the
table
here
so
with
everybody
in
the
community.
So
thank
you
very
much
and
with
that
we're
gonna
sign
off
I
believe
if
I
tell
Chris
go
number
it
and
that
should
be
it.