►
Description
Gregory Landua of Regen Network does the opening keynote at the ReFi Summit in Seattle, WA, May 2022.
A
A
There's
a
couple
things
I'm
going
to
try
not
to
talk
a
lot
about
that
are
the
things
that
we
probably
talk
about
all
the
time
or
share
in
common.
So
I'm
going
to
just
to
sort
of
frame
that
out
a
little
bit.
I
am
not
going
to
talk
about
the
problems
of
climate
change
and
biodiversity
collapse,
and
all
of
the
rest
of
that,
I'm
going
to
assume
that
that
we
have
common
ground
there,
that
we
all
understand
and
are
similarly
motivated
by
both
the
urgency
and
the
beauty
of
a
different
way.
A
So
I'm
just
going
to
like
set
that
aside
and
we're
all
there.
We
don't
need
to
dive
deeply
into
that.
I'm
also
going
to
assume
that
we
all
understand
the
opportunity
that
presents
itself
that
this
is
sort
of
a
civilization,
transforming
opportunity
which
also
potentially
is
an
opportunity
for
making
a
lot
of
money
and
that
that
connection
between
money
and
speculation
is
something
also
that's
a
ground
that
we
share.
Although
I
do
want
to.
A
How
are
we
incorporating
an
understanding
of
what
a
solid
foundation
to
regenerate
finance?
What
does
that
need
to
look
like,
so
I
am
going
to
spend
a
little
bit
of
time
there
I'm
going
to
do
my
best
to
propose
a
few.
I
guess:
directions
or
definitions
for
all
of
us
to
be
thinking
about
over
the
course
of
time,
and
I'm
also,
with
everybody's
permission,
going
to
talk
just
a
little
bit
about
some
of
the
ways
that
we're
trying
to
approach
some
of
the
complex
problems
at
regen
network.
A
What
does
it
look
like
to
sort
of
be
thinking
about
things
from
the
deep
d5
perspective,
from
the
suspended
perspective
and
from
the
refi
perspective,
and
how
do
we
sort
of
link
those
together?
So
I'm
going
to
do
my
best
to
kind
of
weave
that
all
into
one,
I
think
everybody
heard
me
just
say,
I'd
I'd
like
to
propose
that
the
definition
of
regenerative
finance
is
increasing
the
evolution,
a
system
of
finance
that
increases
the
evolutionary
capability
of
living
systems.
A
So
this
isn't
just
sort
of,
I
think,
there's
some
hazards
on
the
way
carbon
tunnel
vision
is
a
hazard,
but
at
the
same
time
we
have
to
have
functional,
transparent,
efficient
carbon
markets.
Right
like
we
have
there's
a
minimum,
sufficient
foundation
for
all
of
this
to
work,
and
I
would
propose
that
that
is
functional
carbon
markets
like
we
have
to
solve
that,
but
we
can't
get
stuck
in
it.
We
have
to
keep
going
so
what
else
do
I
mean
by
evolutionary
capability?
A
A
A
So
how
many
people
here
would
identify
as
coming
from
the
sort
of
defy
crypto
space,
how
many
people
would
identify
as
crypto
native
okay,
how
many
people
would
identify
as
coming
from
the
sustainability
regeneration
space
sort
of
like
hey,
you
know
awesome
how
many
people
would
identify
as
coming
from
this
sort
of
traditional
finance,
whether
that's
natural
capital,
finance
or
okay,
great
awesome,
all
right.
How
many
people
here.
A
How
many
people
here
have
a
firm
idea
of
what
regeneration
means
like
if
you
have
a
you,
have
a
definition
you're
like
I.
I
understand
what
that
means
a
couple:
few:
okay,
a
fair
amount.
Okay,
great!
Thank
you
that
just
helps
me
think
about
you
know
how
how
to
sort
of
land
all
of
this,
so
I
I
want
to
so.
Let's
talk
a
little
bit
about
minimum
like
what
does
it
mean
to
have
a
minimum
viable
carbon
market?
That
actually
is
pricing?
That's
incorporating
the
price
of
carbon
into
the
economy.
A
What
does
that
look
like
what
needs
to
be
true?
There's
a
bunch
of
people
in
this
room
who
are
way
better
at
this
part
of
the
conversation
than
I
am
right.
Paul
from
nori
is
much
better
at
this
part
of
the
conversation
than
I
am
renan
from
moss
is
much
better
at
this
part
of
the
conversation
than
I
am
so
I
just
sort
of
want
to
point
out,
like
I'm
just
going
to
do
my
best.
Does
this
frame
out
that
this
is
important.
A
I
also
want
to
own
that
we
at
regen
are
almost
always
trying
to
like
work
on
the
next
thing,
and
not
this
thing.
So
it's
sort
of
like
you
know,
there's
a
little
bit
of
a
mismatch
there.
So
we
need
to
be
able
to
have
liquidity
and
market
efficiency
for
good
price
discovery
right.
So
that
means
we
need
to
be
able
to
connect
different
markets
together.
So
we
need
bridges.
We
need
bridges
from
the
old
system
to
tokenize
old
carbon
credits
so
that
there
can
be
active
price
discovery
right,
like
moss.
A
Does
that
and
toucan
does
that
we
need
the
ability
to
natively
tokenize
new
credit
types
right
nori
does
that
and
regen
network
does
that
and
open
forest
protocol
is
working
on
that,
so
there's
sort
of
a
suite
of
people
who
are
working
on
both
of
those
we
need
to
be
able
to
have
sort
of
auditing
standards
right.
We
need
to
be
able
to,
as
a
community
determine
what
is
fungible
right
is
a
unit
of
carbon.
A
I
just
recently
saw
that
the
marine
permaculture
folks
won
part
of
I
think
it
was
the
xprize
which
is
amazing,
they've,
been
working
on
this
for
years
that
as
a
unit
of
carbon,
is
that
the
same
as
soil
carbon,
that's
coming
from
the
new
south
wales
pilot
that
region
network
did
with
impact
ag
and
sold
to
microsoft
a
couple
years
ago.
Are
those
two
the
same
is
that
the
same
as
a
nori
carbon
ton?
A
A
You
know,
what's
the
level
of
certainty
related
to
the
claim
and
I'm
going
to
circle
back
to
certainty,
but
I
think
that
if
there's
one
thing
that
we
all
need
to
work
on
as
a
community,
it's
having
standards
around
the
quantification
of
uncertainty
right
because
all
of
this
is
probabilistic
science.
There
is
no
determinism
in
ecological
state
monitoring;
it
doesn't
exist
right,
there's
always
going
to
be
a
model
and
a
set
of
data
and
an
estimation
about
what
that
means
related
to
carbon,
that's
being
sequestered
into
soils
or
being
sequestered
into
forests
or
being
stored.
A
There'll
always
be
uncertainty,
but
what
doesn't
exist
right
now
in
the
sort
of
incumbent
carbon
markets
is
actually
the
the
rigor
and
the
commitment
to
quantify
the
uncertainty.
Instead,
we
have
an
institutional
trust
model
where
it's
sort
of
we
have
a
bureaucracy
right,
a
carbon
registry
that
says
you
know
we're
standing
behind
the
claim.
So
you
can
trust
us
right
instead
of
here's,
the
claim.
Here's
the
data,
the
support
that
here's
the
model
that
supports
it.
A
Here's
the
people
who
looked
at
it
and
you
can
go
and
double
check
any
of
that
yourself,
which
right
this
is
the
promise
of
what
I
would
call
refi
right
and,
and
so
again,
I'm
sort
of
like
setting
out
this
framework
defy
suspey
and
refi.
So
in
the
sustainable
finance
approach,
we're
simply
tokenizing
existing
assets.
What
does
that
mean?
What
are
the?
What
are
the
drawbacks
of
that?
The
drawbacks
of
that
is
that
we're
not
actually
increasing
auditability.
A
We
don't
actually
know
really
anything
about
the
the
credit
in
natively.
We
don't
know
anything
about
the
credit,
that's
being
traded
right.
We
know
that
it
was.
We
know
that
it
comes
from
a
trust
model
in
which
vera
or
gold
standard,
or
somebody
else
said.
This
is
good
right.
That's
what
we
know
about
it.
A
In
order
to
achieve
regenerative
finance,
I'm
proposing
to
everyone,
we
actually
need
to
have
a
situation
in
which
any
actor
in
the
ecosystem
has
equal
access
to
all
of
the
information
at
as
close
to
zero
marginal
cost
as
possible
right,
every
single
asset
needs
to
be
auditable.
You
need
to
be
able
to
know
who
is
saying
what
about
where
using
what
data,
what
methodologies
and
you
need
to
be
able
to
basically
like
rerun
the
compute
and
get
the
same
outcome
right?
A
That's
that's
just
a
building
block,
because
if
we
don't
have
that,
then
I
fear
we're
basically
going
to
have
hyper
efficient
markets
and
price
discovery
and
we're
going
to
have
this
weird
thing,
and
it
happened
in
2008
right.
The
sub
subprime
mortgage
crisis
we're
going
to
have
this
thing
where
the
institutional
incentives
are
to
like
pretend
that
nothing's
wrong
with
any
of
any
of
the
assets,
and
you
know
you
sort
of
build
this
big
financial
system
and
it
has
to
collapse.
A
A
A
A
I
think
we
have
an
opportunity
in
this
community
in
the
emergence
of
refi,
to
be
pretty
radical
about
that
I
mean
that's
why
it
is
so
exciting
to
use
decentral
like
a
decentralized
tech
stack
is
that
we
can
actually
invite
stakeholders
into
owning
the
the
public
infrastructure
that
we're
building
on
right.
That's
what's
so
compelling,
but
how
do
we
do
that
right
and
why
is
it
important
it's
so
easy
to
sort
of
get
on
the
runaway
train
and
just
have
a
system
in
which
the
the
sort
of
the
wealthy
get
more
wealthy?
A
The
same
is
true
with
scientists,
because
otherwise
you're
not
going
to
get
the
information
and
the
feedback
and
the
system
is
going
to
be
dumb
essentially,
and
it's
eventually
it's
going
to
get
misaligned
and
it's
going
to
kind
of
go
over
the
edge.
So
one
of
the
the
things
that
I'm
constantly
finding
myself
saying,
I
think
that
there's
a
there's
an
urgency
in
this
movement
and
people
feel
like
we
have
to
make
this
happen,
and
then
we
start
to
focus
on
how
do
we
financialize
it?
A
A
The
sec
is
making
public
companies
do
carbon
accounting
moving
forward
already
the
bank
of
england
and
swiss
re
are
not
lending
or
insuring
companies
that
don't
have
a
net
zero
plan
by
2050..
This
has
already
happened.
This
change,
the
sea
change
already
happened
so
actually,
what's
important
is
not
that
we're
super
urgent
about
that
change
because
it
took
30
years
or
more
to
happen,
and
it
already
happened,
we're
living
in
the
world
in
which
that
already
happened.
A
What
we
have
to
do
is
make
sure
now
that
it
happens
in
a
good
way
and
that
it
doesn't
create
a
subprime
carbon
collapse
and
that
because,
if,
if
that
happens,
if
in
10
years
we've
we've
poured
billions
and
trillions
of
dollars
into
the
refi
economy
and
it's
based
on
crappy
credits
right
and
the
system
collapses,
we
will
we'll
never
get
another
chance,
the
the
shaking
of
confidence,
societal
confidence
in
a
market
mechanism
to
coordinate
and
drive
our
response
to
climate
change.
I
do
believe
we
pretty
much
get
one
crack
at
this,
so
we're
already.
A
You
know
if
this
to
use
a
metaphor,
we're
already
on
the
river
we're
in
the
rapids.
We
don't
need
to
talk
about
how
to
get
the
boat
in.
We
just
need
to
talk
about
how
to
steer
it
at
this
stage.
So
all
of
the
fundamental
questions
about
stakeholder
inclusion,
verifiability
of
claims,
governance
of
standards,
making
sure
that
these
are
happening
in
a
dynamic
web
3
native
way.
These
are
the
conversations.
These
are
the
conversations
I
believe
we're
all
we're
here
to
have
right,
because
those
are
the
building
blocks
for
for
healthy
liquidity.
A
A
Is
there
anybody
here
that
disagrees
with
that
statement
or
doesn't
know
what
I'm
saying
just
to
make
sure
that
I'm
not
okay?
So
all
monetary
value
is
socially
constructed.
We,
as
a
society,
are
choosing
what's
valuable
right.
Dogecoin
has
a
particular
social
construction
of
value
backing
it.
It's
like
memes
bitcoin
has
a
particular
social
construction
of
value
backing
it.
The
u.s
dollar
has
a
particular
social
construction
of
value.
A
What
we're
doing
here
is
trying
to
reconnect
the
social
construction
of
value
with
ecological
health,
with
regeneration
with
a
healthy
carbon
cycle,
with
the
reduction
of
energy
use
and
the
increase
of
quality
life.
That's
what
we're
trying
to
anchor
it
at
we're
trying
to
say
this
is
how
money
comes
into
being.
Is
that
there's
proof
of
regeneration
taking
place,
so
this
is
sort
of
circling
back
to
what
are
the
building
blocks
here?
A
The
observation
capability,
the
monitoring,
the
reporting,
the
verification
and
the
science
behind
us
as
a
community
deciding
that
this
value
has
been
instantiated
and
that
we're
going
to
value
it
into
the
economy
that
has
to
in
some
way
be
sort
of
place
and
culture
based
right,
and
so,
therefore,
the
communities
that
are
participating
participating
in
that
need
for
this
to
be
legitimate
need
to
be
included
right.
The
assumptions
and
the
data
that's
backing
that
need
to
be
included,
and
then
we
need
to
deal
later
on
with
how
you
fungify.
A
A
I
don't
know
if
folks
tuned
into
that
it
was
probably
a
year
ago
now
he
talked
about
legit
legitimacy
as
a
sort
of
like
core
foundation
of
everything.
That's
happening
legitimacy
when
it
comes
to
ecological
claims,
and
then
ecological
assets
is
just
it's
everything
right,
and
so
that
means
in
our
culture,
in
our
cultural
context
and
again,
I'm
speaking
to
like
I'm
speaking
to
all
of
you,
but
for
us
to
have
legitimacy,
backing
the
refi
economy.
A
A
I
think,
of
course,
the
third
that
maybe
the
third
pillar,
which
maybe
need
not
be
made
explicit,
but
I'll
make
explicit
anyway,
is
enabling
those
two
things
via
technology,
enabling
those
two
things
via
web
3
technology
specifically
and
all
of
the
other
converging
monster
waves
of
earth
observation
science,
drone
technology,
machine
learning,
artificial
intelligence.
These
are
all
things
that
are
sort
of
the
empowering
elements
active
inferencing.
A
So
it's
about
half,
so
a
keystone
species
in
an
ecological
lens
is
a
species
whose
existence
in
an
ecosystem
increases
the
resilience
and
biodiversity
of
that
system.
Like
wolves
beavers,
when
you
take
when
you
extirpate
wolves
out
of
an
ecosystem,
the
land
starts
to
degrade
the
herds
actually
get
less
healthy.
The
forests
get
less
healthy.
Okay,
I
would
propose
that
we
are
working
to
reclaim
our
role
on
the
planet
as
a
keystone
species
right
and
regenerative
finance
is
the
primary
tool
to
reconnect
the
social
construction
of
value
to
ecological
health.
A
This
is
how
we
align
our
culture
with
the
biosphere
with
planetary
health.
That's
the
that's
the
mission
we're
all
on
right
and
you
know
in
this
bigger
picture.
Honestly,
this
is
a
multi-generational
process,
so
we
both
have
the
urgency
that
we're
I'm
proposing.
We
get
one
crack
at
leveraging
market
mechanisms
in
this
rapidly
accelerating
turbulent
crazy
world
that
we're
in
right
now,
building
that
and
sort
of
like
pointing
our
global
economy
at
regeneration.
Right.
A
We
get
one
crack
at
that,
but
at
the
same
time,
that
that
being
true,
we
also
are
in
a
400
year
plus
long
project,
and
this
is
going
to
take.
This
is
a
culture
change
project.
This
is
this
is
going
to
transform
what
money
is,
what
it
means,
what
what's
valuable
about
it,
and
I'm
just
going
to
end
by
reminding
us
all
that
money,
the
social
construction
of
value.
A
In
many
eras
and
epochs
and
cultures
was
multivalent
right.
What
do
I
mean
by
that?
I
mean
think
about
wampum
or
cacao.
Both
of
these
are
old
forms
of
money
that
both
were
used
to
express
and
assemble
an
agreement
or
a
contract
between
humans
and
each
other.
They
were
also
used
in
sacred
ceremony.
They
were
also
used
as
a
unit
of
account
and
so
the
the
ability
to
fluctuate
between
a
non-fungible
agreement
between
people
about
something
super
specific
and
a
fungible
unit
of
account.
A
That
represents
proof
of
regeneration,
proof
of
adherence
to
a
social
contract
that
says
that
value
comes
from
ecological
health
and
regeneration.
That's
what
we're
working
on
that's
the
project,
and
I'm
super
grateful
to
be
here
working
with
all
of
you
on
that
project.
It's
my
greatest
passion
and
desire
to
spend
my
life
working
with
all
of
you
on
that
amazing
project.
So,
thanks
for
being
here-
and
you
know,
let's
go.