►
From YouTube: Social Cybersecurity WG Meeting: October 4th, 2021
Description
Date: 06/04/21
Moderator: Florence Hudson
Institution: NSF Big Data Hubs
A
I'm
I'm
interested
in
what
this
looks
like
not
only
for
for
what
it
is
that
we're
talking
about
here.
But
then
how
can
specific
domains?
And
in
my
case,
I'm
thinking
about
food,
either
replicate
the
same
kind
of
model
within
their
domain
or
or
else
find
a
way
to
to
latch
on
to
what
what
you're
talking
about?
And
maybe
you
know
and
imagining
things
like
code
sprints
around
this
one.
I
think
one
of
the
one
of
the
things
that
we
talked
about
in
the
last
meeting
that
I
thought
was
interesting.
A
It
kind
of
surfaced.
I
don't
remember
exactly
how
it
surfaced,
but
when
we
think
about
using
big
data
and
ai
and
security,
one
of
the
things
that
I
think
is
worth
thinking
about
is
that
we
don't.
We
only
know
some
components
of
specific
domains
that
might
want
to
be
sort
of
private
or
obscured
in
order
to
prevent
exploitation.
A
What
are
the
exploitable
sort
of
data
components
that
that
you,
that
would
potentially
be
important
and
and
one
of
the
examples
that
we
talked
about
was
on
facebook,
for
instance,
and
thinking
about
social
media?
No
one
had
really
sort
of
predicted.
This
idea
that
you
could
scrape
people's
public
information
about
their
music
tastes
and
a
variety
of
other
things,
and
you
know
and
then
turn
it
into
a
disinformation
campaign
and
and
sway
political
beliefs
and
things
like
that.
So
what
it?
What
does
it
look
like?
B
C
Yeah
very
quickly,
thank
you
for
the
summary
florence
and
caroline.
I
really
appreciate
that
you're
wanting
to
work
with
a
team.
I
think
that's
that's
a
very
good
endeavor.
Thank
you
for
that.
So
my
that
I
just
want
to
add
one
quick
comment
here
is
that
for
data
management
or
ai
email
for
substrate.
Indeed,
there
has
been
a
lot
of
work
out
there
absolutely,
and
I
agree
with
caroline
that
there
are
a
lot
of
black
boxes.
This
is
a
lot
of
the
nigerian
not
only
that
they're
black
blocks.
C
Definition
of
let's
say
a
research
project,
usually
take
half
of
time
to
finalize
what
a
problem
is.
So
so.
I
think
that
the
iteration
between
practitioners
and
researchers
is
very
important
and
in
this
case
practitioners
it
could
be
industry
could
be,
government
could
be
higher,
air
could
be
high
performance,
computing
and
so
on
so
forth.
So
I
think
that
one.
C
I
would
suggest
that
the
working
group
consider
one
of
the
topics
in
upcoming
year
is
to
think
about
how
to
further
facilitate
the
practitioners,
real
world
problems
and
real
world
concerns
as
well
as
that
they
might
have
a
question.
I
know
that
those
tools
but
which
one
can
I
use
kind
of
thing
that
and
create
a
venue
for
them
to
interact
with
researchers
in
a
meaningful
way.
I
think
that
would
be
good
for
this
working
group
to
foster
that
dialogue
more.
B
D
Yeah
thanks
florence,
and
thanks
to
the
other
participants
today,
I
just
wanted
to
mention
that
you
know
the
hubs
are
really
convening
entities
and
you
can
see
the
convening
power
given
the
breadth
of
interest
that
folks
have,
whether
it's
you
know,
corporate
data
management
or
food
or
whatever
the
the
domain
area
is
there's
a
there's,
a
broad
interest
in
this
topic
across
the
the
regions.
Here
we
were
talking
the
other
day
on
the
the
planning
call
about.
D
D
E
E
In
this
instance,
it
feels
like
there's
a
pretty
good
opportunity
where
the
the
practitioners
have
data
which
the
academic
community
lacks
meaningful
data,
and
the
academic
community
has
new
ideas.
As
john
said,
I
think
the
last
couple
of
weeks
just
made
it
clear
that
the
security
community
is
is
in
dire
need
of
new
ideas.
However,
far
out,
so
it
does
feel
like
there's
a
basis
for
an
interest.
E
I
will
comment
that,
as
maybe
four
or
five
years
ago,
worked
on
a
consortium
that
had
86
or
seven
financial
institutions
sharing
this
kind
of
data
it
made
sharing
a
pii
for,
for
you
know,
clinical
use
look
easy.
So
so
it's
not
a
not
an
easy
lift
and
it
requires
a
bunch
of
trust,
but
it
feels
like
especially
now
there
might
be
motivation
to
make
it
happen.
B
B
He
might
be
immutable
right
now,
but
you
can
always
join
in
so
that
that's
what
we're
thinking
for
cyber
security.
So,
as
you
could
hear,
we'd
like
to
keep
going
on
this
and
we'd
like
to
figure
out
the
best
way
to
do
that,
it
could
be
a
workshop,
would
be
part
of
it.
It
could
be,
something
else
would
be
part
of
it,
and
so
I
think
those
are
the
things
we
can
bring
into
the
discussion
with
nyle
when
we
meet
later
this
month.
B
Thumbs
up
thumbs
down
no
thumbs,
okay,
thumbs
up,
okay,
great
yeah!
You
can
use
your
thumbs.
Jim
you're
not
allowed
to
use
your
voice,
but
you
can
use
your
thumbs.
I'm
kidding,
okay,
very
good,
excellent.
Okay!
Now
why
don't
we
get
into
our
lightning
talk
discussion,
which
is
further
ideas
for
future
topics
in
the
fall
in
2021?
And
it
could
be.
Ideas
like
this
are
totally
different,
especially
where
we
can
leverage
our
convening
capability,
as
as
john
mcmullen
was
saying,
you
know
we're
good
at
bringing
people
together
listening
and
then
helping
them
work
together.
D
Yeah
I
mean,
I
think,
that
that's
a
good
example
of
what
I
was
talking
about,
where
you
know
we
did
a
readiness
assessment
of
the
community
and
and
some
surveys
and
you
know,
produced
some
some
guidance
documents
and
so
those
kinds
of
activities
I
think,
are
appropriate
here.
But
you
know
going
beyond
that
and
maybe
having
a
workshop
or
doing
some
some
proposal
development,
you
know
and
really
trying
to
move
things
forward.
F
Taken
myself
off
mute,
so
you
get
to
hear
my
raspy
voice
again,
but
you
know
something
that
john.
I
think
this
would
resonate
with
john
as
well,
because
we
were
on
a
call
earlier
this
morning
that
talked
about
sort
of
middle
layers
for
making
access
to
data
more
seamless
in
in
sort
of
recognizing,
specifically
that
we're
it's.
It's
not
going
to
happen
for
us
to
be
able
to
create
a
gigantic
repository
of
all
the
data
that
we
would
like
to
see
to
do
our
research.
F
You
know
some
of
the
use
cases
I
think,
would
be
interesting
to
talk
about
some
of
the
successes
and
where
they've
had
difficulties
would
would
be
interesting,
and
I
know
matthew-
and
I
have
spoken
about
this-
with
respect
to
ontologies
and
food
and
there's
some.
I
think
some
really
exciting
examples
in
in
that
space
and
then
john
and
I
were
talking
about
it
in
the
context
of
of
water
resources.
F
Sure
you
know,
I
think,
I
think,
in
agriculture
this
has
been
a
strong
focus
of
ours
in
terms
of
developing
the
gems
platform
which
I've
talked
about
to
this
with
this
group
earlier
a
couple
of
years
ago,
I
think
hydrashare
is
doing
some
fantastic
things
in
that
area
as
well.
In
fact,
gems
is
collaborating
with
hydroshare
to
sort
of
more
seamlessly
be
able
to
share
data
that
are
of
interest
to
both
the
ag
community
and
the
water
resources
community.
It's
a
really
good
example
actually,
but
yeah.
F
B
E
I
think
more
broadly
we've
over
the
past.
Over
many
years,
the
working
group
has
been
going
on
we've
seen
and
then
and
hydroshare
was
a
really
good
example
of
that,
as
well
as
gems
platforms
that
are
doing
a
a
really
nice
job
of
kind
of
creating
portals
into
masses
of
information
specific
to
a
domain
sdsc,
I
think,
talked
about
wildfires.
E
We
had
a
couple
of
good
presentations
about
transportation,
related
related
data-
I
don't
know
if
you
want
there's
one
possible
theme
is:
is
either
recapping
or
trying
to
mash
those
those
ideas
up
a
little
bit
to
get
more
products
fertilization,
the
way
you've
done
gym
with
with
with
food.
I
don't
know
if
that
takes
us
anywhere,
but
I'll
just
make
that
that
observation.
B
That's
not
going
to
work
anymore
or
the
same
thing
with
other
flooding
and
fires
turn
into
floods
because
of
the
scarring
on
the
earth
and
all
this
stuff.
And
then
what
do
you
do?
How
do
you
learn
from
the
past
and
how
do
you
predict
what
would
be
better
for
the
future?
So
this
natural
hazard
and
cascading
disasters,
which
is
how
they
talk
about
it,
which
sounds
so
sad?
That's
how
they
say
it
so
in
the
world
of
pandemics
and
natural
hazards
and
cascading
disasters.
B
B
It's
almost
as
bad
in
new
york,
again
so
yeah.
Interestingly,
the
hazard
people
say
there
are
no
such
things
as
natural
disasters.
There
are
natural
hazards
and
when
humans
do
something
to
mess
it
up,
it
becomes
a
disaster.
So
that's
how
they
talk
about
it
and
apparently
the
u.n
talks
about
it
that
way
too.
So
I
can't
use
the
words
natural
in
disaster
together
anymore,
since
I've
been
schooled
on
that,
but
that
might
be
a
very
interesting
topic.
You
know
for
the
future
and
I
think
niall
had
brought
that
up
chris
right.
E
B
E
One
of
the
things
that's
been
kind
of
pleasing
about
the
the
security
conversations
is
they've
aimed
in
the
general
direction
of
something
actionable,
and
this
feels
like
it
might
be
a
nexus
that
we
could
also
steer
in
the
direction
of
something
both
actionable
and
new.
This
idea
of
kind
of
the
cross
products
of
of
hazards
feels
like
a
a
new
ish
idea
that
might
bear
some
fruit.
B
A
One
of
the
areas
that
we're
thinking
a
lot
about
is
supply
chain
reconfigurability
in
response
to
disruptions
in
supply
chains
which,
which
you
know
I
mean
clearly
we're
not
the
only
ones
thinking
about
it,
I
mean
president
biden
has
put
out
an
executive
order.
You
know
asking
his
cabinet
members
to
to
do
things,
and,
and
the
secretary
of
agriculture
has
similarly
put
out
a
request
for
comment
on
how
we
can
do
things
like
this.
So
it's
it's,
it's
not
just
about
those
disasters,
but
how
do
we?
A
E
A
A
B
B
H
E
You
know
I
I
have
the
advantage
of
not
having
thought
about
it
carefully,
but
there's
there's
kind
of
an
interesting
matrix
of
you
know
bad
things
that
can
happen
and
then
there's
kind
of
social
structures.
If
you
will
that
that
either
respond
well
or
poorly
supply
chains,
one
physical
infrastructure
is
another
public
health
is
clearly
another.
E
A
For
us,
one
of
the
you
know
just
as
a
another
quick,
for
example,
you
know
the
real
sort
of
rude
awakening
around
the
pandemic
was
when
we
were
watching
essentially
a
couple.
A
couple
I'll
give
you
two
examples:
one
is
watching
farmers
who
normally
served
restaurants
having
to
plow
their
crops
under
because
they
couldn't
access
grocery
store
supply
chains
and,
at
the
same
time,
the
lines
at
the
food
bank
are
getting
longer
like
that.
Just
doesn't
make
any
freaking
sense
to
anybody
right.
A
B
No,
it's
a
good
point
for
a
little
while
I
was
able
to
get
those
really
big
strawberries,
but
they
only
used.
They
only
usually
have
inexpensive
restaurants,
and
I
was
like
why
can't
I
get
those
anymore
they
decided.
You
know
they
made
more
money
before
I'm
like,
but
please
we
love
them.
You
know
I'll
pay
a
little
more.
A
H
A
So
as
we've
centralized
our
food
process,
production
and
processing,
we've
created
these
enormous
single
points
of
failure,
and
so
we
are
not
as
resilient
as
we
could
be
in
terms
of
our
food
supply
chains.
So
just
thinking
in
terms
of
even
the
numbers
of
points-
or
you
know
the
nodes
in
the
network
and
and
where
those
vulnerabilities
lie.
I
think,
is
a
huge
thing
in
something
that
I
think
a
group
like
this
thinking
about
ai
and
security
together
could
could
really
sort
of
think
about
those
things
in
an
abstract
context
and
what?
G
E
E
G
G
G
So
I
work
in
an
optimization
industry
and
our
software
helps
people
optimize
their
inventory
and
it's
great
until
something
like
covid
happens
and
completely
upsets
the
apple
cart.
You
know
completely
reconfigures
all
the
models
and
all
of
the
supply
and
demand
relationships,
and
then
and
then,
at
that
case,
optimization
doesn't
really
doesn't
really
help.
A
A
E
G
Yeah,
we
forgot
really
good,
especially
in
manufacturing
of
optimizing.
You
know
how
many
parts
do
I
have
for
this.
You
know
how
many
views
am
I
going
to
build
today
and
how
many
parts
do
I
need,
and
I
only
have
the
number
of
parts
that
I
absolutely
need
in
order
to
build
one
of
those
things
and
then,
as
soon
as
you
can't,
you
know
that
kind
of
depends
on
the
fact
that
you
can
get
those
parts
really
easily
and
when
you
can
it
just
messes
everything
up.
C
What
kind
of
data
that
general
people
like
me
right
can
access
to
understand
the
supply
chain
issue,
and
that
may
also
relate
to
public
policy
during
the
pandemic,
whether
there's
any
policy
that
changed
because
of
covet
and
therefore
affect
the
supply
chain.
You're
understand
just
food
medical
supplies
right
recent
vaccine.
C
There
might
be
economic
issues
behind
it.
There
might
be
the
minimum
supply
issue
behind
it.
I
don't
know
I'm
throwing
things
out
politics
behind
it,
so
I'm
curious
of
whether
there's
any
lighting
talk
or
the
right
people-
that's
not
necessarily
in
the
big
data
group,
but
could
have
good
insights
that
we
can
learn
from
and
understand
more
particularly
in
the
sense
of
whether
they
are
what
how
do?
C
C
What
kind
of
things
can
be
done?
One
of
the
things
that
was
very
surprising
to
all
of
us
is
that
the
kovi
data
all
over
the
world
was
shared
so
easily,
among
us,
of
course,
there's
a
lot
of
money
pumped
behind
it,
but
how
about
mid
mid-supply
mathematician
how
about
vaccines
applied
today,
I
don't
know
I'm
just
asking
from
the
data
science
big
data
perspective
that
what
kind
of
data
accessible
not
accessible
and
for
this
kind
of
problems.
G
A
E
G
A
But
on
another
level,
it's
it's
not
just
about
whether
the
data
is
proprietary,
but
it's
about
how
has
it
been
essentially
encoded,
and
I
think
this
is
a
real
role
for
for
data
science
to
come
in.
We
could
talk
about
ontologies
and
we
can
talk
about.
You
know
how
are
we
actually
structuring
this
data
so
that
we're
all
sort
of
speaking,
the
lingua
franca
so
to
speak
and
able
to
exchange
data
and,
and
so
that
friction
essentially
disappears.
B
E
H
B
Yeah,
so
I
think
you
know
the
trusted.
Ci
collaboration
has
grown
over
the
past
couple
years.
I
think
it
started
with
the
trustworthy
data
working
group
and
the
meeting
we
had
at
the
bar
outside
at
perk.
I
think
it
was.
We
all
agreed
to
work
together,
very
productive
meeting,
and
then
we
started
working
together.
B
The
collaboration
that
we
have
going
on
with
ieee
on
connected
healthcare
cybersecurity,
I
think,
is
very
interesting
for
a
number
of
people
who
are
involved
from
ieee
from
the
hubs
you
know
from
anywhere.
Really
it's
ieee,
so
you
know
it's
an
international
organization
with
over
400
000
people
in
it,
and
you
know
what
I
what
I
was
just
thinking
is:
is
there
something
else
we
could
be
doing
with
somebody
like
an
ieee
or
with
a
nist?
You
know,
nist
has
a
lot
of
things
coming
out
about.
B
You
know
they
always
want
to
put
on
things
now
they're
into
like
the
post.
Quantum
thing
right
and
that's
what
I
just
got
another
one
from
them
today.
You
guys
are
probably
on
that
list
too.
So
I
was
thinking
about
as
we
look
at
practical
answers
like
you
were
saying,
john,
you
know
practical
applications
of
something
that
that
we
can
do
together
as
well
as
the
collaborations
that
get
people
working
together
to
create
those.
Those
are
the
things
that
went
through
my
mind,
but
I
didn't
land
on
something
new.
Yet.
F
Yeah,
I'm
I
I
think
it's
a
very
good
question
and-
and
I
don't
know
that
I
have
an
answer,
but
I
I
think
john's
point
of
kind
of
networks
of
networks
for
collaborators
collaboration
of
collaborators.
I
mean
there.
We
did
a
little
of
that
in
terms
of
cross
advertising.
Obviously
with
cask,
you
know,
there's
there's
clark
as
well
and-
and
so
you
know,
I
think
I
think
those
are
you
know
you
could
look
at
this
as
sort
of
tiered.
F
Maybe
in
terms
of
how
do
we
inform
those
organizations
of
what
we're
doing
or
or
maybe
how
do
we
engage
with
them?
I
mean
those
are
two
very
different
modes
of
operation,
but
you
know
we
could
maybe
maybe
would
help
to
think
about
it.
You
know,
there's
there's
lighter
touches
that
we
can
provide
in
terms
of
how
we
might
engage
with
those
individuals.
H
So
I
I
I'd
like
to
add
just
a
thought
in
in
sort
of
practical
things.
I
you
know
the
cyber
security
requirement
or
the
security
requirements
are
going
to
shift
with
the
legislation
and
then
follow
on
policy
that
will
come
out
in
the
next
year
to
year
and
a
half
in
terms
of
federally
funded
research.
H
You
know
that
services
and
infrastructure
are
aligned.
So
I
guess
I'm
just
thinking
that
it
would
be
nice
at
some
point
to
have
a
one
of
those
sort
of
extended.
Maybe
panels
of
people
from
the
federal
agencies
and
even
aaas,
and
obviously
I'm
including
nist,
but
triple
a
s.
Maybe
and
and
certainly
maybe
the
ccc
to
to
sort
of
have
a
round
table
kind
of
discussion
that
would
be
fruitful
for
the
hub
constituencies.
G
E
We
touched
on
two
kind
of
general
areas,
both
of
which
feel
fruitful,
there's
even
forgotten
what
you
called
it,
but
incidence
and
response
and
resilience
and
so
forth
as
kind
of
a
general
area.
That's
pretty
broad
but
but
more
focused
than
the
entire
world,
and
then
also
the
the
security
and
and
data
science
nexus.
B
B
B
I
know
kind
of
like
twitching
anyway,
on
both
of
them
yeah
on
the
cyber
security
side,
with
this
great
core
team,
and
we
can
always
engage
the
rest
of
the
folks
that
got
involved
in
april
once
we
know
where
we
want
to
go
and
see
if
they
want
to
jump
in
and
on
the
pandemics
natural
hazards.
That's
something
I
have
to
get
working
more
on
anyway,
and
so
we
should
all
do
it
together
and
our
organizations
are
are
actually
working
in
it.
We
might
not
currently
work
with
those
people.
B
B
C
A
Rephrase
what
some
of
what
you
were
saying
there
john
about
sort
of
an
approach?
Would
it
be
fair
to
say
that
what
you're
talking
about
would
be
sort
of
one
way
of
examining
the
interplay
between
cyber
security,
cyber
infrastructure
and
physical
infrastructure
or
physical?
Maybe
not
infrastructure
is
the
wrong
word,
but
but.
E
F
G
B
B
B
D
G
D
Of
communities
would
like
to
leverage,
and
so
how
do
you
bring
those
together
in
a
virtual
way
that
doesn't
involve
creating?
You
know,
one
giant
system
which
is
not
going
to
work
so
what's
what's
the
infrastructure
that
gets
you
to
a
functional
system
without
having
to
integrate
the
actual
data
resources.
B
Okay,
good
and
we
didn't
make
jim
talk,
that's
good!
Okay!
So
that's
you
know
another
one.
So
I
I
colored
in
blue
the
two
that
you
mentioned
john
since
you're
on
the
steering
committee,
but
all
of
these
are
on
here
and
I
know
we
only
have
a
few
minutes.
So
I
think
this
was
a
great
collaborative
discussion
to
get
some
ideas
on
the
table
that
I
think,
will
be
good
input
to
the
steering
committee.