►
Description
July 14, 2014 - St. Charles County, Missouri Council Work Session
A
B
B
C
C
So
what
is
our
mission
at
the
university
of
missouri
extension?
Our
mission
is
to
improve
the
lives,
the
communities,
the
economies
by
producing
relevant,
reliable
and
responsive
educational
strategies
that
enhance
access
to
the
resources
and
research
by
the
university
of
missouri.
So,
basically,
what
that
means
is.
We
are
an
avenue
to
the
non-traditional
set
of
resources
for
our
community.
We
we
provide
programming
that
is
beneficial
to
our
community
by
way
of
classes,
forums
and
all
aspects
of
community
involvement.
C
C
How
do
we
do
it?
Our
approach?
We
empower
the
community
in
a
variety
of
ways
we
coordinate
and
we
support
several
volunteer
programs
that
you'll
hear
about
a
little
bit
later.
We
extend
information
to
a
diverse
client
base
via
telephone
calls
and
walk-in
visits.
I'm
not
sure
if
any
of
you
have
ever
visited
the
saint
peter's
location.
C
C
C
Our
platform,
these
are
the
services
that
are
offered
out
of
our
office
and
we
have
specialists
that
represent
each
one
of
these
areas.
We
have
health
and
nutrition,
we
have
home
lawns
and
gardens
farming,
natural
resources,
personal
finance,
small
business,
4-h,
youth
development
and
family
relationships.
C
So,
let's
talk
a
little
bit
about
our
programming
areas
and
I
won't
read
the
information
that's
up
there
for
you.
However,
I
do
want
to
highlight
some
of
the
programs
that
we
do
have
in
each
specialty,
so
our
health
and
nutrition
portion
is
handled
by
linda
rilliger
and
she
is
very
sweet.
Lady
if
you've
never
met
her,
but
some
three
of
her
top
programs
are
the
family
nutrition
program.
The
quality
for
keeps
and
the
taking
care
of
you
body,
mind
and
spirit.
She
also
does
another
program
where
she
does
food
preservation.
C
Our
next
one-
and
you
guys
are
probably
familiar
with
mr
scott
kilpak.
He
is
our
home
lawns
and
gardens
farming
and
resource
agriculture,
specialists
and
a
lot
of
his
programming
is
what
we
handle
on
our
day-to-day.
We
have
a
lot
of
walk-in
clients
that
you
know
ask
questions
about
grass
about
bugs
the
master
gardeners
program
is
really
phenomenal.
We
actually
have
a
master
gardener
that
sits
on
site
and
they
are
a
volunteer
program
and
that
master
gardener
answers
all
types
of
questions
I
mean
you'd
be
surprised
what
type
of
questions
you'd
get.
C
I
was
intrigued
one
time
by
one
of
the
visitors
that
came
in
and
they
had
a
fungus
growing
on
their
grass
and
the
master
gardener
looked
the
information
up
and
she
was
able
to
tell
that
individual
what
that
fungus
was
and
how
to
treat
their
lawn
and
how
to
get
the
fungus
cured
from
their
grass.
So
it's
a
very
valuable
program,
so
we
also
have
master
naturalists
field
crops
and
forges
and
consumer
horticulture.
C
C
Women's
financial
education
series
is
something
that
kind
of
helps
women
that
are
accustomed
to
one
way
of
living
with
finances,
and
then
they
may
suffer
a
loss
through
divorce
or
you
know,
spousal,
and
that
teaches
the
women
how
to
act
financially
within
the
economy
without
that
significant
other
or
how
to
bounce
back
from
it.
It's
a
really
viable
class.
C
You
have
the
small
business
development
sector,
which
is
my
area,
and
I
am
new
to
the
area.
I
started
in
this
role
march
of
this
year,
so
we
are
in
the
process
of
rebuilding
this
program.
In
the
saint
charles
county
area,
we've
done
some
partnering
with
the
saint
charles
city,
county
library,
we're
going
to
be
offering
some
classes
through
that
resource
to
how
to
start
a
business
in
saint
charles
county
and
how
to
write
your
business
planning.
C
We
have
our
4-h
youth
development,
which
I'm
sure
all
of
you
all
are
familiar
with
that
as
well,
and
that
is
represented
by
mr
john
nickler,
and
he
does
a
lot.
He
just
recently
finished
with
the
4-h
youth
camp.
That
was
done
throughout
the
summer
and
it
keeps
him
so
busy.
John
is
a
wonderful
guy,
so
they
do
the
4-h
camp.
C
Then
we
have
mrs
teresa
marshall,
who
does
programming
centered
on
focused
on
kids,
building,
strong
families
for
adults
and
youth,
health
insurance,
education
initiative
and
the
emergency
preparedness
program,
and
the
programs
that
I
named
here
are
only
a
few.
I
asked
the
specialists
to
give
me
their
top
three
programs
that
they
do,
because
I
don't
want
to
hold
your
time
too
long,
but
just
to
give
you
a
highlight
of
some
of
the
programs
that
we
do
out
of
our
office.
C
So
then
I
wanted
to
tell
you
about
our
support
staff.
Our
support
staff
serve
as
the
backbone
of
our
extension
office.
Their
support
encompasses
a
wide
variety
of
services.
Now
again,
this
is
only
a
tip
of
the
iceberg
of
what
our
support
staff
does,
but
some
of
that
is
the
soil
test,
processing
the
program,
registration
and
evaluation.
So
any
time
we
hold
classes
or
seminars,
our
support,
staffs
handle
all
of
the
registration
and
the
evaluation
process,
the
maintenance
of
the
programming
database.
So
they
create
all
types
of
spreadsheets.
They
do
the
contacts
for
us.
C
They
send
out
the
information
they
send
out
the
flyers.
They
do
the
marketing
piece
for
us-
and
you
know
it's
how
many
there
is
one
two
three
four
five:
six
specialists,
seven
specialists
in
our
office
and
our
support
staff
is
there
to
help
all
of
us,
so
they
are
really
phenomenal
and
they
also
do
the
in
individual
programming
support
for
the
specialists
and
the
specialty
groups.
So
the
master
gardeners,
the
master
naturalists.
They
are
also
the
support
staff
for
those
groups
as
well.
C
We
have
our
council,
our
extension
council
and
it
is
made
up
of
10
elected
and
three
appointed
members
and
their
goal
is
to
plan
and
oversee
all
local
activities
prepared
by
the
extension
faculty
and
staff.
Their
goal
is
to
ensure
proper
programming
classes
and
service
offerings
that
are
designed
with
the
community
in
mind,
and
they
stated
it
is
their
privilege
to
meet
that
individual
need.
So
why
am
I
here
today?
How
can
you
help
us?
C
We
are
looking
for
ways
to
better
engage
the
community,
better
increase
the
participation
and
the
support
we
are
looking
for
recommendations.
We
are
looking
for
active
participation
in
october
of
this
year.
We
are
going
to
be
hosting
a
community
forum
to
help
us
better
put
in
place
some
programs
that
will
be
offered
for
our
2015..
C
We
are
working
on
putting
together
our
strategic
plan
for
2015
as
well
and
in
this
community
forum.
We
would
like
some
key
stakeholders
to
be
there
so
that
we
can
hear-
and
we
can
understand
what
it
is
our
community
is
looking
for
with
regard
to
family
regard
to
nutrition
regard
to
business
development.
So
that
is
the
reason
why
we
are
here
today
in
your
presence,
to
offer
and
to
ask
for
that
community
support
and
that
engagement
when
we
go
before
and
we
have
our
stakeholder
meeting,
which
is
in
october
october,
9th
to
be
exact.
D
C
We
do
coordinate
with
those
individuals
myself
ron,
miller,
mueller
miller.
Mueller
is
the
edc,
so
he
is
the
exact
same
as
I
am
he's
from
the
sbdc
side,
so
how
we
coordinate
that
there's
a
huge
pie
and
if
it
was
left
to
one
office
to
try
to
handle
that
it
probably
wouldn't
get
done.
So
in
those
instances
we
have
established
relationship.
We
also
work
to
do
those
programming
classes
together
as
partners,
because
in
the
end
the
goal
is
to
impact
the
whole
saint
charles
county.
E
C
C
So
my
background
is:
I
worked
for
ssm
healthcare
for
10
years.
It
was
10
years
this
month.
If
I
had
stayed
it
would
have
been
10
years.
I
was
a
data
integrity
specialist
there
in
2011
I
started
my
own
business,
which
was
working
with
small
business
owners
to
help
them
with
their
business
planning
and
understanding
their
strategic
side
of
their
business,
and
I
still
have
that
business.
It's
you
know,
transition
to
something
different,
but
so
I
went
to
school.
I
received
my
bachelor's
in
marketing
management.
I
have
an
mba.
C
B
B
Whatever
we
can
do
to
help,
thank
you
very
much.
Your
presentation
was
was
fantastic.
I
like
how
I
was
so
well
organized
and-
and
you
really
covered
a
lot
of
information
for
us
quickly,
so
thank
you
very
much
for
that.
Give
us
a
real
good
overview
about
what
you
all
are
doing
over
there
now
so
well.
C
B
B
Okay,
I
appreciate
we've
got
a
quite
a
few
people
in
the
audience
today.
So
as
we
go
along,
we
we
we
this
one.
This
part
of
the
meeting
is,
is
much
more
formal
when
we're
when
we're
setting
up
on
the
diets,
we
have
to
to
have
a
little
bit
more
more
of
a
structured
meeting,
so
we
will
be
able
to
talk
to
members
of
the
audience
as
well
as
we're
as
we're
going
along.
B
I'm
gonna.
Let
joe
kind
of
this
has
been
something
that
joe
brazel
has
been
working
on
for
for
quite
a
long
time.
I
know
it's
there's
been
several
different,
varied
changes
that
that
have
evolved
through
time.
I
know
he's
worked
with
with
a
lot
of
different
people,
so
we're
gonna
kind
of
let
joe
lead
this
part
of
the
discussion
with
that
I'll
I'll
turn
it
over
to
you,
joe
all,.
I
I
The
community
development
department
was
running
a
lot
of
problems
with
the
wineries
on
the
way
the
old
old
ordinance
was.
Is
it
was
growing
grapes
making
wine
pretty
much
period,
then
the
wineries
evolved
into
weddings
and
different
events
and
selling
beers
and
having
restaurants
and
all
this
other
stuff,
and
so
the
community
development
was
having
issues
with
the
way
some
of
the
winery
ordinances
were
written
because
they
weren't
compliant
to
our
ordinances.
I
So
what
we're
trying
to
do
is
not
be
anti-business
but
be
more
compliant
with
the
business
of
the
winery,
so
we
rewrote
the
ordinances
making
it
more
business
friendly,
and
then
we
came
up
with
the
at
district.
The
a.t
district
was
in
place
has
been
in
place
for
over
three
years.
Now
we
wrote
it
in
a
fashion
to
be
more
business
friendly
towards
the
wineries.
I
But
three
years
ago,
when
we
came
up
with
the
at
district,
it
was
we
were
at
the
75
rule
on
the
grapes
and
we
were
we
allowed
lodging
and
some
other
things
like
if
you
that
we
changed
it
to
actually
where
you
could
have
a
brewery,
you
could
have
a
theater,
you
didn't
have
to
have
a
winery.
If
you
had
40
acres,
you
could
do
these
other
things.
It
was
if
it
was
tourist
related
and
the
the
it
was
the
the
way
we
wrote.
I
I
Maybe
we
could
do
this,
but
then
this
is
creating
problems,
because
if
you
have
a
special
event
and
your
parking
lot
is
three
acres:
well,
that's
going
to
take
up
like
seven
percent
and
then
you
have
no
room
for
buildings,
so
we
thought
well.
We
got
to
make
this
work.
If
we're
gonna
do
this,
so
then
we
started
looking
at
rewriting
it.
So
we
took
out
if
you,
if
you
read
through
it,
we
we
changed
some
things.
I
We
changed
with
a
parking
lot
issue
where
okay,
it
can
be
a
gravel
lot
for
for
temporary
parking
for
big
events
and
some
other
things
to
make
it.
So
it's
not
so
difficult.
So
it
is
somewhat
business
friendly
and
while
we're
reviewing
it,
community
development
came
up.
They
they
were
talking
about
the
whole
grape
issue
and
the
grape
issue
seems
to
be
the
the
vortex
of
the
issues
here.
I
They
they
felt
that
the
county
has
not
have
the
wherewithal
to
monitor
grapes,
okay
and
we
that,
when
they
rewrote
it
wayne
anthony
the
community
development
took
the
whole
grape
thing
out
said
that
okay,
we're
gonna
we're
gonna,
just
make
it
zero,
because
to
be
quite
honest
about
it,
it's
hard
to
write
ordinances
and
if
you
can't
enforce
them,
how
can
you
ride
them?
Because
we
don't
have
someone
that
goes
out
there
and
count
grapes?
We
don't
have
people
going
into
your
businesses
and
reviewing
your
books.
I
We
don't
do
that.
I
mean
we
don't
have
the
resources
for
one,
but
we
just
don't
do
that
so
we're
trying
to
make
it
just
an
honor
system
which
was
or
was
not
working.
You
know
we
don't
know
for
certain,
so
we
took
the
whole
grape
thing
out
and
that's
why
so
at
the
last
meeting
we
had
several
months
ago,
there
was
that
issue
was
somewhat
again
the
bone
of
contention,
and
so
the
grape
growers
group,
the
people
who,
I
I
would
say
the
older
wine,
is
in
some
of
the
newer
wineries.
I
I
Tony
and
I
have
had
some
conversations.
He
was
concerned
that
we
were
discounting
the
wine
district
on
not
having
wineries
but
having
wine
bars
and
having
breweries
and
things
like
that.
So
I
don't
know
if
you
noticed,
but
in
a
new
ordinance
we
you
have
to
have
a
winery
first,
okay,
we
we
came
to
that
conclusion
that
that
was
probably
a
good
idea
that
you
cannot
have
a
theater.
You
can't
have
a
brewery,
you
cannot
just
have
a
restaurant,
you
have
to
have
a
winery
first
and
then,
with
that
winery.
I
Everything
from
that
point
on
is
a
conditional
use.
So
if
you
want
to
have
a
theater,
then
you
have
to
have
a
conditional
use
to
the
wine.
Permit
or
you
have
to
have
a
conditional
use
for
the
brewery,
but
you
have
to
have
a
winery
first
and
we
also
agreed
that
you
have
to
have
five
acres
of
grapes
on
premise
and
you
also
have
to
buy
fifty
percent
of
your
grapes
from
saint
charles
county.
I
I
I
think
those
are
some
pretty
strong
things
that
we
added
now.
The
other
thing
is
is
there
was
some
language
sent
over
that
was
much
more
restrictive
on
the
80
rule
and
we're
going
to
allow
everybody
to
talk
and
explain
their
positions,
but
from
the
perspective
of
our
county
counselor,
I
was
sending
that
information
forwarding
that
from
all
sides
saying
take
a
look
at
this,
see
what
you
think
and
give
us
your
opinion.
Tell
me
what
you
think
and
see
what
you
we
should
do
with
this.
I
If
possible
and
our
feedback
was,
is
you
have
to
be
very
careful
on
restricting
competition
through
planning
and
zoning
in
some
retrospects?
It
could
be
considered
unconstitutional,
and
so
that
was
the
line
we
had
that
we
had
to
be
very
careful
with
how
we
wrote
this
ordinance
on
how
restrictive
we
were,
because
you
cannot
be.
I
You
cannot
restrict
competition
through
zoning,
and
that
was
the
legal
feedback
I
was
getting
so
that's
kind
of
where
we're
at
so.
We
tried,
and
I
feel,
that
we
did
a
fairly
good
job
of
trying
to
meet
all
conditions
of
everybody,
to
try
everybody
to
work
together
and
give
the
50
leave
the
50
rule
in
there
and
do
some
work
with
and
and
also
it.
What
we're
doing
is
when
this
ordinances
has
passed
all
conditions.
If
you
were
doing
it
a
certain
way,
then
you're
you're
allowed
to
do
it.
I
D
Yeah
I
got
several,
I
mean
there's
a
lot
of
conditions
in
this
thing
like
the
pitch
of
the
roofs
and
the
seven
percent
footprint.
Still
in
there
and
cellular
type
of
paving
the
type
of
landscaping
I
mean
as
a
as
a
businessman
myself.
I
look
at
this.
I
think
boy,
I'm
glad
I'm
not
in
the
winery
in
business,
because
there's
a
lot
of
hoops,
you
got
to
jump
through
here.
Well,.
I
I
No,
let
me
let
me
do
restrictions
here.
This
is,
there
are
new
restrictions,
but
here's
how
we
looked
at
this
is:
if
we
have
a
vision
and-
and
I'm
not,
you
know,
I'm
not
the
end
all
say
all,
but
I
was
talking
to
other
people
and
I'm
thinking
that
all
the
whiners
now
that
they're
there
are
established
right
if
more
wineries
want
to
come
out
there
and
they
want
to
do
they
don't
have
to
they're
still
the
winery
ordinance
is
still
in
place.
I
You
could
have
16
acres
and
have
a
winery
or
10
acres
or
whatever.
If
you
follow
the
winery
conditions
strictly
only
a
winery.
If
you
want
to
do
the
at
district,
where
you
want
to
do
other
things,
if
you
want
to
have
a
winery
and
then
have
a
theater
and
then
have
a
brewery,
then
you
have
to
you're
going
to
kind
of
concede
to
say
I
will
agree
to
the
a.t
district,
but
I
do
have
to
do
these
special
english
additions.
We
don't
want
to
have
metal
pole
barns
out
there.
We
don't
want
to
have.
I
We
wanted
to
look,
have
some
value
and
that
was
kind
of
what
we
thought
we
wanted
to
do
that.
What
that,
I
think,
was
the
vision
to
make
it
look.
You
know
you
don't
just
someone
to
put
up
a
hundred
by
thirty
pole,
barn
and
call
it
a
winery,
because
all
the
other
wineries
put
a
lot
of
energy
into
what
they
have
and
you
don't
want
to
undermine
it,
and
that
was
the
train
of
thought.
I
I
J
There
are
some
architectural
design
guidelines
that
go
with
with
the
district
which
we
can
review
in
order
to
understand
what
the
overall
intent
of
the
ordinance
is.
The
overall
concept
is
the
zoning
is
agricultural,
and
so
the
attempt
is
to
ensure
that
the
uses
that
are
in
the
area
are
primarily
agricultural
or
agricultural
production,
but
we'll
realize
that
in
certain
circumstances
it
may
be
acceptable
to
allow
certain
non-agricultural
uses
but
kind
of
isolated
on
a
tract
so
that
they're
not
bothering
their
neighbors
in
the
area.
J
The
seven
percent
rule
is
intended
to
ensure
that
that
the
land
is
still
predominantly
agricultural,
because
the
overall
concept
is
agricultural
zoning
and
also,
frankly,
the
75
rule
50
rule.
Whatever
number
you
want
to
use.
That's
was
never
intended
from
zoning
perspective
to
be
used
to
try
to
limit
competition
or
decide
where
grapes
are
going
to
come
from
other
than
to
help
preserve
the
agricultural
character
of
the
of
the
area
that
was
intended
to
ensure
that
again,
the
area
remains
predominantly
agricultural
and
I'll.
J
You
there's
it's
perfectly
acceptable
to
say
that
you
can
only
sell
things
in
the
farm,
stand,
for
instance,
that
you've
grown
on
the
property
or
some
minor
amount
of
other
things,
as
opposed
to
someone
opening
a
farm
stand,
selling
selling,
grapefruit
lemons
and
basically
it
becomes
a
grocery
store
at
an
agriculture
area.
Grocery
store
is
perfectly
fine
in
a
commercial
area,
but
an
agricultural
area.
It's
a
finite.
The
land
is
a
finite
resource
and
also
the
rural
character
is
a
finite
resource.
J
D
And
one
other
question:
I
had
too
what
I
heard
you
say
joe
and
what's
in
the
bills
a
little
different
you
said,
50
of
the
grapes
have
to
be
grown
in
the
county,
but
here
it
says
50
have
to
be
grown
on
the
site
if
you've
got
a
guy,
that's
got
a
nice
pretty
facility
in
94,
but
maybe
he's
got
40
acres
down
the
gravel
road
where
he
grows
most
of
his
grapes.
Is
this
ordinance
flex
open
enough
where
he
can
use
those
grapes
to
counter
towards
his
94.
B
B
I
B
I
I
K
G
I
I
B
I
G
G
K
G
K
B
G
D
I
understand
it's
a
real
fine
line
between
protecting
all
those
people
that
have
put
their
time,
talent
and
treasure
into
these
wineries
from
the
guys
they're
going
to
open
up
a
pool,
barn
and
sell
mogan
david
in
a
styrofoam
cup.
Okay,
but
my
question
to
you
is:
do
you
think
this
is
going
to
help
both
preserve
the
atmosphere
that
helps
these
folks
be
successful
and
still
keep
the
door
open
for
the
new
guy
that
comes
in?
It
wants
to
start
a
new
winery
dinner.
I
We're
trying
to
yeah,
I
mean
this,
this
ordinance,
a
t
ordinance
has
been
in
place
for
three
years,
but
then
we
just
tweaked
it
to
make
it
more
compatible,
make
it
more
friendly.
Okay,
I
mean
that's
what
we're
trying
to
do.
You
know
I
mean
that's
why
we
had
so
many
public
hearings
and
so
forth
for
everybody's
input.
We
took
everybody's
input,
it's
not
like.
We
did
it
and
tony
by
the
way
I
didn't
mention
on
page
one
of
these
pages.
I
We
do
have
the
ability
now
on
page
fifth,
what
page
is
it
now
we
didn't?
We
never
had
it
in
the
in
the
ordinances
before,
but
now
we
can.
You
have
the
right,
the
community,
with
page
13
when
you're
concerned
about
the
records
we
do,
have
the
ability
now,
because
it's
in
the
ordinance
to
if
someone
is
not
in
compliant.
I
N
N
N
B
B
All
that
on
small
tracks
of
ground
and
the
way
I
understand
it
and
somebody's
telling
me
if
I
got
it
wrong,
you'd
still
have
to
have
40
acres,
not
not
five
acres
to
get
started.
You'd
still
have
to
have.
If
you
want
to
go
and
do
these
other
things,
you'd
have
to
have
the
40
acres.
You'd
have
to
grow
at
least
five
acres
of
grapes
there
before
you
could
start
and
have
a
a
restaurant
or
any
of
these
ancillary
businesses
associated
with
the
wineries.
N
N
No,
that's
that's
the
at
district,
so
there's
two
things
that
are
happening
here.
Number
one
is
the
agricultural
district
which
allows
wineries
on
five
acres.
Presumably,
then
you
have
something
new.
This
is
a
three-year-old
ordinance,
which
is
the
a.t
district.
The
the
winery
ordinance
goes
back
30
years,
we're.
G
B
N
N
K
N
K
Well,
if
you
are
in
the
a
district,
then
it
is
robert
may
be
able
to
speak
better
to
this.
But
if
you're
in
the
a
district,
then
you
may
not
have
a
micro
brewery
or
some
of
those
other
conditional
uses.
If
you're
in
the
at
district,
then
you
have
to
have
the
40
acres
and
your
winery,
where
you're
producing
wine
first
before
you
can
have
the
microbrewery
or
the
restaurant.
H
Correct
me,
if
I'm
wrong,
but
it
sounds
like
there's
current
regulations
that
include
that
definition,
everything
and
and
we're
not
changing
that
we're
just
changing
these
sections
of
the
current
codes
of
saint
charles
county,
being
the
405
at
405.08
and
085.
Is
that
what
we're
doing
or
are
we
just?
Are
we
rewriting
the
whole
section.
J
Well,
what
do
you
have
before?
You
includes
a
an
amendment
to
the
definition
of
winery
and
honestly
for
as
a
planning
and
zoning
professional.
I
think
the
wording
now
is
more
clear
to
me
in
terms
of
enforcement.
The
wording
right
now
for
the
definition
doesn't
even
technically
the
way.
I
read
it
until
you
get
the
very
last
sentence.
It
doesn't
even
obligate
you
to
produce
wine
on
the
property.
You
know
it
gets
close
to
requiring
you
to,
but
it's
not
until
the
very
last
sentence
and
there's
some
ambiguous
terms.
J
So
I
think
in
in
that
respect,
the
proposed
definition
is
is
a
lot
better
now,
in
addition
to
those
changes
for
the
ease
of
administration,
there
is
a
substantive
change
and
that
would
be
the
the
percentage
the
percentage
requirement.
So
that
would
be
a
substitute
change
and
I
think
part
of
that
is
a
reflect
reflection
of
what
we
heard
through
all
throughout
all
this
discussion
about.
J
B
K
I
The
a
district
though
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong,
but
the
winery
definite.
If
somebody
wants
to
come
in
and
do
a
winery,
what
we're
doing
has
nothing
to
do.
What
we've
done
has
nothing
to
do
with
the
past
winery
ordinances.
What
we're
doing
is
dealing
with
if
you
want
to
do
an
at
district.
If
you
want
to
do
some
extra
things,
you
have
to
have
a
winery.
First,
you
have
to
have
40
acres,
you
have
to
have
a
winery
first
and
then
you
can
get
everything
secondary
from
that
with
a
conditional
use.
Permit.
K
K
I
I
What
you're
saying
holly
is
the
winery
definition
has
always
been.
This
way
is
what
you're
saying
this
portion
of
it,
because
the
at
district?
What
we're
dealing
with
now
from
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong
we're
dealing
with
the
18
district,
if
you
want
to
do
an
a.t
district,
if
these
guys
all
got
wineries,
they're,
just
gonna
they're
doing
business
as
usual.
If
they
want
to
do
other
things,
if
you
have
a
conditional
use
permit,
then
your
grandfathered
in
and
all
those
other
things
yeah.
I
K
I
A
I
N
O
N
N
The
whole
ordinance
has
been
changed.
This
is
the
this.
Is
the
original
ordinance
and
there's
not
one
sentence
contained
in
the
revised
ordinance
that
was
in
the
original
ordinance.
So
the
entire
thing
has
been
changed
and
we
can
go
through
it
step
by
step
and
I'll.
Tell
you
what
has
been
changed
and
why
it's
bad
for
this
county.
I
live
in
the
agricultural
district.
You
know,
I
don't
necessarily
want
a
bunch
of
little
honky
tonks,
opening
up
or
liquor
stores
that
are
open
all
night,
long
and
stuff
like
that.
I
think
it's
inappropriate.
N
I
N
N
405.060
is
the
winery
definition.
It
applies
to
the
wineries
in
the
agricultural
district
and
it
applies
to
wineries
in
the
a.t
district.
All
that
would
be
required
is
five
acres.
There
is
no
requirement
for
a
winery
license.
You've
removed
the
requirement
for
operating
under
a
domestic
winery
license
hold.
B
B
C
N
The
the
thing
is,
it
says
here:
all
wines
produced
at
the
winery
produced
under
a
licensed
duly
issued
by
the
state
of
missouri
that
could
be
a
liquor,
buy
the
drink,
and
that
is
unfortunately,
at
the
state
level
there
there
was.
There
was
a
problem
that
problem
is
trying
to
be
remedied,
but
what
happened
is
is
that
the
state
tried
to
help
out
wineries
because
they
said
hey
look
it.
You
know
we
can
only
sell
wine.
There's
a
lot
of
people
that
come
to
the
wineries
want
to
have
a
beer.
N
You
know,
could
you
allow
us
to
sell
beers
and
they
said?
Okay,
here's
what
you
do!
You
buy
a
liquor,
buy
the
drink
license!
Okay!
Now
you
can
act
like
a
a
a
liquor
store.
You
can
act
like
a
bart.
You
can
do
any
of
these
things.
There's
no
restrictions
on
what
you
can
do
and
without
the
county
defining
exactly
what
a
winery
is
and
how
a
winery
can
operate
by
saying
you
can
operate
under
any
license.
D
You
probably
know
the
area
as
well
as
anybody
you've
been
down
there
forever.
There's
a
lot
of
really
nice
places
down
there,
a
lot
of
nice
wineries,
so
obviously
the
original
ordinances
that
we
have
we're
flexible
enough,
that
it
enabled
folks,
like
you
and
others,
to
to
build
wineries
down
there.
Is
that
a
fair
statement?
Yes,
okay.
Secondly,
is
the
what
commonly
what
I
called
mogan
david
in
a
styrofoam
cup,
but
other
people
are
calling
honky
tonks.
N
N
N
D
N
N
If
I
could
just
finish
the
one
comment
and
then
I'll
get
get
out
of
here:
okay,
one
minute.
So
what
I
was
saying
is
that
our
group
is
not
trying
to
limit
comment
competition.
In
fact,
we
embrace
competition
if
somebody
wants
to
come
and
grow
grapes
and
and
have
a
winery
in
and
enhance
our
district
make
us
more
like
napa
valley
or
or
the
finger
lakes
in
new
york,
where
they've
got
three
million
visitors
a
year.
N
I
say:
let's
have
it,
you
know
what
we
don't
want
to
do
is
have
a
situation
where
people
can
open
up
under
the
auspices
of
a
winery
and
act
like
a
bar
or
a
phony
winery,
or
something
like
that.
I'm
not
saying
that
they're
in
the
place.
This
is
exactly
what
console
said.
I'm
not
saying
that
they're
in
the
place
for
this
kind
of
business
there
is,
but
it's
probably
in
more
of
an
urban
setting.
You
know
it's
it's
it's
it's
not
in
the
ag.
F
F
My
my
property
is
zone
commercial
and
I'm
across
the
street
from
the
from
the
biker
bars,
and
so
I
all
the
at
stuff
doesn't
really
apply
to
me
and
unless
you're
going
to
make
it
apply
to
commercial
districts,
it
doesn't
really
apply
to
me.
What
I
really
want
to
talk
to
you
about,
though,
is
the
the
75
percent
rule.
F
F
F
F
F
The
truth
of
the
matter
is
that
the
majority
of
wineries
in
this
country
and
in
missouri
procure
grapes
from
other
places
and
those
other
places
can
be
anywhere
from
right
down.
The
road
to
a
long
way
away,
but
grapes
are
a
are
a
raw
material
in
the
same
way
that
corn,
wheat
and
soybeans
are
they're
a
commodity.
In
fact,
grapes
are
a
commodity.
F
Here's
one
that
I
think
nobody's
talked
about
very
much.
I
heard
it
mentioned
for
the
first
time
tonight,
though,
and
that
is
a
75
requirement-
is
really
anti-competitive
in
that
it
protects
saint
charles
county
growers
from
competition
from
other
missouri
vineyards,
and
it
constitutes
a
form
of
monopoly.
Now,
I'm
not
talking
against
growers,
I'm
a
grower.
I
grow
grapes
too.
So
I'm
not
it's
not
us
versus
them,
but
you
can't
protect
one
segment
of
the
grape
growing
population
and
hold
the
other
segment
off
by
saying
you
can't
buy
those
people's
grapes.
F
No
other
county
in
this
state
has
a
requirement
like
this.
That
ought
to
tell
you
something.
Missouri
is
a
pretty
good
sized
grape
growing
state.
Now
we
have
over
125
wineries
in
the
state,
they're
scattered
all
over
the
place.
We
have
a
missouri
wine
and
grape
board
that
does
an
excellent
job
of
marketing,
missouri
grapes
and
we're
producing
a
lot
of
grapes
and
a
lot
of
wine
in
this
country
in
this
state
and
yet
nobody,
nobody,
no
other
county,
has
looked
at
restricting
the
purchase
of
grapes
to
that
county.
In
any
percentage.
F
F
F
It's
just
a
compounding
of
of
legal
requirements
and,
in
my
opinion,
it's
overreaching.
And
finally,
I'm
very
sympathetic
of
something
here.
The
area
down
in
augusta
and
that's
obviously
in
our
county-
has
passed
and
gotten
through
a
historic
ava
district,
and
there
are
several
wineries
of
which
I
think
tony
is
is
one
of
the
people
in
that
district
and
if
they
want
to
have
a
percentage
requirement,
that's
okay
with
me.
If
they
want
to
say
grapes
made
and
grown
in
ava
district
number,
one.
F
The
first
district
of
its
kind
in
the
united
states
have
to
come
from
that
district
have
to
be
grown
in
that
district.
I
don't
have
any
problem
with
that,
but
don't
put
the
burden
of
the
ava
requirement
on
those
of
us
who
are
not
in
that
district.
That's
the
other
wineries
in
saint
charles
county.
It's
actually
loading
of
these
requirements
on
to
the
the
the
all
of
the
wineries,
which
really,
I
think,
are
intended
to
benefit
the
wineries
within
the
ava.
So
we're
burdened
with
the
requirement
with
none
of
the
benefits.
F
My
point
is
this:
you
can
talk
all
you
want
to
about
reducing
it
from
75
to
50
percent
and,
frankly,
it's
not
being
enforced.
It's
not
enforceable.
You
don't
have
the
mechanism
to
enforce
it.
We
pretty
much
volunteer.
We
may
have
gone
over
it
a
time
or
two,
but
most
of
the
time
we're
within
the
75
pretty
easily
we
grow
virtually
all
of
our
grapes
are
we
buy
all
of
our
grapes
from
missouri
and
we
make
all
of
our
wine
on
our
premises.
F
F
F
It'll,
remove
the
inhibition
to
purchase
other
and
more
experimental
and
different
wines
to
sell
in
saint
charles
county
I'll.
Give
you
a
classic
example.
We
sell
a
wine
that
was
just
approved
last
year
called
aramella
arrow
mellow,
you
never
heard
of
it,
but
we
offer
it.
We've
offered
it
for
quite
a
while,
while
it
was
in
its
experimental
state,
but
nobody
in
st
charles
county
is
growing
caramel,
it's
pretty
darn
good
little
wine.
We
have
a
grower
up
in
central
missouri
at
ellsbury
that
grows
aramella.
F
The
truth
is
there
probably
won't
be
any
because
nobody
pays
a
lot
of
attention
to
the
75
rule
anyway,
I'm
not
being
smart
with
that.
I'm
just
trying
to
tell
you
that,
in
fact,
until
this
issue
came
up
in
the
in
this
thing
here,
I
think
there
are
a
couple
of
wineries
out
here
that
never
even
heard
of
the
75
rule
right
other
questions.
D
Those
grapes
up
there
because
it
says
85-
has
to
be
missouri
grown
right.
Are
you
good
with?
I
mean?
Obviously
we
can't
do
anything
about
that
anyway,
but
it
seems
to
me
like
that,
would
give
you
the
flexibility
if
we
had
the
same
thing
as
state
law.
You'd
have
the
same
you'd
have
instead
of
making
saint
charles
county
or
on
site,
if
it
was
state
law,
wouldn't
that
would
that
satisfy.
F
That
let
me
be
sure,
john,
that
I
understand
your
your
comment,
but
the
85
percent
rule
that
it's
the
state
rule
says
you
can
buy
from
this
pool.
Okay
and
that
pool
is
statewide.
Now
st
charles
comes
in
and
says
no,
you
can't
buy
from
that
pool
up
to
85
you
you,
we
shrink
the
pool
down
to
75
percent,
so
we've
got
one
layer,
two
layers
that
we've
got
to
comply
with.
It's
it's
a
little
confusing
when
you.
O
F
F
And
and
here's
where
I
misunderstood,
I
think
your
question
was:
if
ours
said
you
could
buy
85
percent,
you
had
to
buy
85
throughout
the
state
of
missouri,
yes,
yeah
sure
you're,
not
you're,
it'd
be
a
mirror
image
of
the
state
rule
but
but
yeah
I
wouldn't
have
any
problems
with
that.
I
mean
it
doesn't
add
any
burden
on
anybody.
Tony.
N
A
B
M
M
This
is
a
little
bit
about
brand
building?
Okay
and
relaxing
standards
is
easy,
and
the
challenge,
I
think
we're
all
trying
to
face
is
the
direction
that
saint
charles
county
wants
to
eventually
go
to,
and
do
we
want
to
reach
joe
a
napa
valley,
or
do
we
have
the
ability
to
do
that?
I
don't
have
the
answer
to
that,
but
what
I
do
know
is
the
areas
that
have
succeeded
in
doing
that
have
had
these
types
of
restrictions.
M
50
75,
I
don't
know
the
right
number,
but
what
I
do
know
is
for
40
years
of
business
fairly
successfully.
You've
got
to
build
brands
and
whether
it's
saint
charles
or
it's
augusta
or
defiance
or
whatever
I
would
encourage
the
board
not
to
dilute.
If
I
say
snickers,
you
all
have
an
image.
What
a
brand
is
is
a
shortcut
for
you
to
bring
value
to
what
that
is
any
brand
name.
M
You
know
lets
you
do
that,
because
saint
charles
county
does
not
nothing
against
what
the
gentleman
said
has
not
had
yet
a
definition
of
that
or
does
not
market
it.
That
way,
that's
that's
maybe
for
the
future,
but
I
think
a
brand
and
what
we're
trying
to
build
in
st
charles
county
is
extremely
valuable
and
if
we
continue
to
dilute
it,
I
think
we
continue
to
hurt
what
our
brand
is
going
to
be
for
the
future,
and
it's
in
it's
easy
to
dilute
it.
M
It's
easy
to
say
today
make
it
shorter,
take
less
peanuts
out
of
the
snickers,
do
all
those
things,
but
it
isn't
the
same
product,
and
I
encourage
the
group
to
really
keep
that
in
mind
as
you
go
forward
again,
I'm
a
grape
grower.
My
comment
would
be:
is
there's
lots
of
land
in
saint
charles
county
and
if
you
can't
find
the
grapes
you
want
my
answer:
is
you
haven't
sourced
them
or
asked
somebody
to
grow
them?
That's
what
you
want
to
have
happen.
We
want
to
build
the
value
of
the
property.
M
M
M
M
I
don't
think
I
know
enough
to
say,
but
what
I
do
know
is
this
is
what
it's
going
to
take
if
we
want
to
build
a
brand
and
live
with
the
people
in
the
world,
and
we
got
the
number
one
ava
there's
nothing
to
say,
the
fiance
can't
get
the
next
one.
So
please
keep
that
in
mind
as
you
make
your
decision.
Thank.
A
O
A
O
I'm
not
disputing
you
on
that
and-
and
I
agree
quality
is
the
number
one
standard
there
and
it's
something
that
we
can't
hang
our
hat
on.
I
will
disagree
with
you
on
whether
or
not
this
has
been
branded
well
over
the
years.
I
think
it's
been
branded
poorly
at
home.
I
don't
think
people
in
st
louis
area
understand
what
the
aba
is
know.
I
I
And
then
the
other
group
was
was
75
and
so
meeting
in
the
middle
with
one
size
I
I
came
up
with
50
now
there's
going
to
be
some
council
members
who
don't
agree,
make
it
zero,
but
I
thought,
since
this
group
thought
that
was
a
fair
number
and
this
group
thought
it
was
a
fair
number.
You
kind
of
meet
in
the
middle,
and
that's
that's
where
that's
where
I
got
there
now.
Is
it
right
or
wrong?
I
don't
know
I'm
just
trying
to
make
it
work.
I
M
Because
you
understand,
I'm
not
disagreeing
with
the
50,
I'm
just
saying
is,
as
you
build
the
ordinances,
please
keep
in
mind
that
we're
building
a
brand
of
value
marketed
well
or
not.
I'm
not
going
to
disagree
with
that,
but
I
will
guarantee
you
that
the
reason
sonoma
gets
the
piggy
back
is
because
of
napa
okay
and
if
we
don't
protect,
I
think
the
district
and
the
county.
We
have
a-
and
I
will
disagree
you
mentioned
about
who
knows
or
who
doesn't
know.
That's
the
brand
building.
We've
had
wine
dinners.
M
I've
had
people
walk
into
our
into
our
vineyard
on
a
very
special
dinner.
That
said,
I
drink
nothing
but
california
cabernets
and
I
will
not
touch
another
wine.
Two
hours
later
after
dinner,
I
was
asked:
where
do
I
buy
these
wines?
Why
can't
I
find
these
because
they
didn't
know
so
that's
the
tough
part
of
marketing-
and
all
I
want
to
say
to
the
council-
is
please,
when
you're
voting
tonight,
keep
in
mind
we're
building
a
brand,
it's
hard
work.
M
D
D
G
B
P
I'm
rick
balducci
from
belguchi
vineyards,
I
think
going
forward
for
any
new
wineries.
I
think
it's
extremely
important
that
the
definition
of
a
winery
includes
a
domestic
winery
license.
It's
required
by
the
state
of
missouri
there's
reasons
for
it.
The
85
percent
rule
is
one
reason,
but
opening
this
up
to
a
retail
by
the
drink
or
five
percent
beer
or
whatever
it's
it's
opening
up
to
a
lot
of
problems.
P
A
K
P
K
I
think
the
reason
not
to
specify
would
be
that
if
the
state
of
missouri
were
to
add
a
new
type
of
license,
then
it
would
be
covered.
If
they
were
to.
You
know,
change
this
to
a
different
name.
Then
it
would
be
covered
and
it
really
makes
that
a
question
for
each
winery
to
address
with
the
state
of
missouri
rather
than
us
saying
you
have
to
have
one
particular
license,
and
you
may
not
have
this
other
license
that
you
otherwise
would
be
able
to.
K
The
only
other
thing
I
would
say
is
that
the
definition
that
relates
to
the
license
from
the
state
of
missouri
only
regulates
the
license
under
which
you
produce
your
wine,
and
it
does
not
affect
a
license
under
which
you
are
selling
wine,
for
instance,
for
a
restaurant.
So
you
would
still
need
your
separate
license
for
that.
That's
not
going
to
that's
not
addressed
in
the
old
ordinance
and
isn't
changed
in
the
new
ordinance.
D
H
D
K
H
N
K
Right,
the
other
issue
is
that
the
current
ordinance
says
all
wine
offered
for
sale.
So
under
the
current
definition,
a
winery,
you
could
not
sell
a
bottle
of
wine
that
was
not
made
in
missouri,
and
so
the
new
proposed
definition
is
making
two
changes.
First,
it's
regulating
wine
production
and
second,
it's
saying
you
have
to
have
a
license
from
the
state
of
missouri
that
allows
you
to
do
this.
L
B
A
Q
Q
This
is
confusing
to
me
and
the
quantity
of
wine
sold
to
customers
at
the
winery
shall
not
exceed
the
greater
of
two
times
the
quantity
of
wine
produced
either
in
the
preceding
calendar
year
or
on
average
over
the
three
preceding
calendar
years.
Is
that
a
restriction
on
how
much
we
can
sell?
I,
I
don't
understand
that.
I
N
O
B
G
H
J
The
wording
here
really
has
to
do
with
the
fact
that,
if
you're
a
winery
in
an
agricultural
area,
the
property
should
be
used
primarily
for
agricultural
production
and
processing
of
wine
grapes
and
making
into
wine
rather
than
a
bar.
But
it
does
allow
some
flexibility,
so
you
could
offer
a
variety
of
wines
for
sale.
So
if
someone
came
to
your
winery
and
they
they
said
I'd
like
to
try
something
a
little
bit
different
that
wouldn't
that
would
allow
you
some
allowances
for
that.
What.
J
Q
J
Q
L
L
We
kept
a
certain
amount
of
agricultural
activity
focused
in
saint
charles
county
and
I'm
not
quarreling
with
anyone
and
I'm
not
trying
to
demean
or
diminish
anybody.
The
quality
or
merit
of
what
was
said
about
the
branding
by
by
any
means,
but
now
the
argument
over
the
75
percent
50
percent
has
somehow
segued
into
being
a
discussion
of
branding,
not
the
preservation
of
agricultural
activity
within
the
county.
L
I
rather
agree
with
the
doctor.
It
seems
to
me
that
dealing
with
branding
does
not
belong
in
a
land
use,
control
context.
It
really
needs
to
get
itself
into
a
different
place.
Maybe
it's
the
licensing
or
some
other
specialized
winery
yeah,
but
it
really
isn't
a
zoning
issue.
Now,
if
we're
going
to
have
one
50
is
better
than
75.
G
A
C
L
L
It
is
not
a
part
of
bill
4087,
it
is
the
current
law
that
exists
right
now
before
the
council
does
anything
with
bill.
4087
and
holly
was
trying
to
make
this
point.
As
you
look
at
section
405.080,
there
are
21
permitted
uses.
You
have
that
agricultural
zoning.
You
can
do
those
21
things
now
when
you
want
to
do
a
winery
in
the
agricultural
district
and
tony
was
trying
to
make
this
point.
You've
got
to
get
a
conditional
use
permit,
of
which
there
are
32
conditional
use
permits
in.
A
L
L
Now
you
then
the
18
back
to
just
the
three
years
that
the
council
member
brazil
was
talking
about.
The
at
agricultural
tourism
is
trying
to
recognize
the
winery
business
so
successfully
established
by
the
by
the
early
pioneers
has
really
expanded
itself
into
being
somewhat
of
a
hospitality
business,
and
that's
why
you
have
created
this
agricultural
tourism.
L
Now,
when
you
get
into
that
once
again,
you've
got
these
permitted
uses,
they're
spelled
out
in
section
405.085,
and
there
are
there
are
10
of
those
winery
is
not
one
of
them.
You
still
have
to
get
a
conditional
use.
Permit
for
a
winery
in
an
ap
district,
the
same
as
you
have
to
get
a
conditional
use.
A
L
I
On
that
point,
on
the
anchor
on
the
on
the
architectural
values
from
what
I
understand
is
they
had
they
had
to
go
through
a
variance
committee,
but
I
think
that
they,
it
goes
to
the
council
for
the
ultimate
decision.
So
to
answer
your
question
and
tell
me
if
I'm
wrong
holly,
but
if
a
if
a
business
owner
is
unsatisfied
with
the
proposal
conditional
use
they're
trying
to
get,
they
can
come
to
the
council
and
say
I
don't
agree
with
this.