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From YouTube: COVID-19 Committee - 12 May 2020
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A
A
The
same
are
joined
this
morning
by
in
Michael
Clancy,
who
is
the
director
and
Julianne
Moore's
late
policy
executive
from
the
Law
Society
Scotland,
and
at
this
point
I
should
probably
remind
members
of
the
committee
that
my
register
of
interest
is
8th,
but
I
am
a
member
of
the
Law
Society
of
Scotland
and
I.
Welcome
both
Michael
and
Gillian
to
meeting
Michael
members
from
direct.
A
B
Good
morning,
committee
members,
it's
a
delight
to
be
here
or
in
this
historic
event,
the
first
time
that
evidence
has
been
given
from
bass,
parlor
that
here
at
home
and
I'm
delighted
that
the
committee
saw
fit
to
invite
in
the
law
society
that
to
give
evidence
on
this
important
bill,
the
coronavirus
Scotland
number
two
bill:
Jillian
new
Jillian
Maudsley.
My
colleague
is
the
policy
officer
in
the
law,
society
and
I
am
the
director
of
law
reform
there
and
consequently
a
lot
of
the
coronavirus
legislation.
B
We've
also
been
looking
at
maintaining
the
rule
of
law
and
the
interest
of
justice
there
in
that
system
and
the
upholding
of
human
rights
to,
and
particularly
when,
we're
dealing
with
emergency
legislation
there
or
even
expedited
legislation
such
as
this
bill.
There
is
the
objective
to
keep
proper
scrutiny
of
that
measure
and
make
sure
that
government
is
held
to
account.
B
So
those
are
the
sort
of
introductory
parameters
convenor
which
we've
been
working
to,
and
we
can
look
at
those
in
further
detail
as
we
go
through
questions
on
the
bill.
I
think
it's
worthwhile
recalling
and
that
the
what
would
Health
Organization
is
director-general
and
Chandra
is
Adnan.
Ibrahim
said
we're
in
this
together
to
do
the
right
things
with
calm
and
protect
citizens
of
the
world.
That's
a
quotation
which
we
picked
up
early
on
in
our
scrutiny
of
the
first
coronavirus
act
in
the
United
Kingdom,
Parliament
and
I.
B
Think
that
message
still
resonates
today
there,
when
we
have
seen
much
more
of
the
the
significant
impact
which
this
disease
has
had
with
its
tragedies,
mnDOT's
a
devastating
economic
impact
as
well.
So
that's
I,
think
probably
enough
for
me
at
the
moment
and
we'll
be
delighted
to
receive
the
committee's
questions.
Thanks.
A
Thank
you
Michael,
thank
you
for
that
introduction,
but
you
mentioned
there.
The
first
coronavirus
Scotland
middle
of
the
well
society
and
team
evidence
on,
but
at
that
point
you
highlighted
a
number
of
concerns,
but
whether
the
right
balance
have
been
struck
between
measures
to
tackle
coronavirus
and
restrictions
which
might
impinge
on
human
rights,
so
I
wonder
in
the
context
of
this
bill
before
us,
whether
you
think
this
bill
has
struck
the
right
balance
or
whether
there
are
areas
and
third,
we
think
changes
are
needed.
B
Thank
you,
Karina
and
I.
Think
a
this
bill
is
a
much
more
technical
and
last
wide
wide-ranging
bill
than
the
first
coronavirus
Scotland
bill,
and
so
therefore
the
impact
on
Human
Rights
is
not
out.
There
I
see
it
off
the
same
order
as
some
of
the
proposed
restrictions
which
were
contained
in
the
original
bill.
B
Nevertheless,
and
clearly
ECHR
the
European
condition
and
Human
Rights
is
engaged
in
many
areas
in
the
bill
and
I.
Think
it's
important
for
us
to
remember
that
human
rights
is
a
not
a
just
a
discrete
area
of
the
law,
but
affects
all
aspects
of
the
law
in
Scotland
and,
of
course,
that
the
competence
of
the
Parliament
legislate
and
ministers
to
meet
executive
orders.
B
I
just
held
up
the
bill
just
to
show
that
I'd
actually
got
a
copy
and
because
a
the
the
compliance
with
ECHR
and
conventional
rights
flow
is
right.
The
way
through
the
bill,
if
I,
were
to
take
aspects
relating
to
the
the
first
schedule
where
issues
relating
to
student
residential
tenancy
are
discussed.
Then
those
engage
article
14
of
the
convention
and
article
1
of
protocol,
one
of
the
Convention
which
deals
with
property
rights
and
in
bankruptcy
matters.
B
And
then
we
see
that
in
a
part
three
of
schedule,
2
and
where
there
is
discussion
about
the
use
of
paper
notices
on
court
there,
walls,
then
article
eat
the
right
to
a
private
life,
is
engaged
as
there
are
some
aspects
of
the
bill
which
the
policy
memorandum
correctly
points
on,
have
no
significant
ECHR
implication.
For
example,
article
or
Alma
Schedule,
three
paragraph
one
which
deals
with
reports
under
the
climate
change,
Scotland,
Act,
2009
and
other
elements
of
that
provision.
In
in
the
change
of
schedule.
B
Three
and
four,
its
I
think
it's
fair
to
say
that
there
is
an
impact
on
human
rights
in
the
in
the
bill,
but
in
many
respects,
because
the
nature
of
the
rapes
impacted
are
not
absolute
rights,
the
their
their
conditional
rights
in
some
respects,
subject
to
em,
lawful
interference
in
instances
where
there
is
a
public
health
threat
or
a
danger
to
health
and
I.
Think
that
that's
probably
where
we
would
comment
on
the
Human,
Rights
interaction.
A
Okay,
thank
you.
Thank
you
very
much.
Michael
I'm
gonna,
move
on
to
questions
from
members
and
I.
Think
sugar
Robson
has
just
joined
us.
So
I
think
you
should
a
lecture
and
I
just
capture
bread
and
I'll
put
it
Beatrice
wisher
first
of
all,
and
they
don't
come
back
to
Jonah.
Just
after
that,
no
Beatrice.
If
you're
there
I
think
you've
got
questions
around
property
transactions.
I.
C
Think
you
can
be
in
a
good
morning.
Mr.
Clancy.
Yes,
my
questions
are
around
the
land
and
buildings
transaction
tax
I
mean
we
know
that
the
property
market
in
Scotland's,
frozen
up
and
transactions
have
stalled,
and
homeowners
are
unable
to
move,
and
the
Scottish
Government's
issued
guidance
to
see
that
no
one
should
be
contemplating
of
all
move,
and
even
though
some
applications
for
registration
are
being
processed,
capacity
is
very
much
reduced.
C
B
We
are
conducting
or
haven't
just
finished,
conducting
research
mission
on
the
on
the
impact
of
coronavirus
on
the
profession
and
their
business,
and
what
you
said
about
the
conveyancing
market
being
flat
is
is
certainly
something
which
we
have
picked
and
in
that
research,
although
the
researchers
not
yet
been
published,
but
we're
still
working
on
analyzing
the
results,
but
that
is
clearly
something
which
reflects
everyone's
experience
in
the
current
market
and
I.
Think
in
terms
of
the
impact,
particularly
on
land
and
building
transactions
tax.
B
It's
a
it's
difficult
to
see
where
the
correct
point
for
any
de
ferrol
deed
is
his
pictures
right
or
not,
that
we
are
all
in
uncharted
waters
here
that
we
do
not
know
what
the
effect
of
the
disease
is
going
to
be,
and
we
are
aware
that
that
scientific
evidence
suggests
that
any
loosening
of
restrictions
that
may
create
a
second
spike
which
may
then,
in
its
turn,
require
further
restrictions.
So
I
think
we've
got
to
be
very
cautious
about
in
picking
a
date
in
the
future
and
saying
that
is
it.
B
That
is
when
all
these
restrictions
will
be
released,
and
so
therefore,
that's
one
of
the
reasons
why
some
aspects
of
the
bill
which
allow
ministers
to
meet
orders,
which
they
can
then
good
sleep
and
revive
again,
are
important
there.
There
needs
to
be
that
flexibility
in
lawmaking
which
applies
here.
We
welcome.
B
We
welcome
the
provisions
of
schedule
for
their
paragraph
5
of
the
bill,
which
it
concerns.
Those
amendments
to
you
know
the
ABS
and
the
additional
drilling
supplement
and
to
allow
people
to
have
that
provision
where,
if
they
bought
a
new
house
between
September
24th,
2018
and
March
2020
and
paid
eds
on
that
pushes
to
reclaim
the
if
they
sell
their
autos
within
twenty
seven
months.
It
might
be
the
case
that
ministers
will
have
to
look
at
that
again
and
that's
why.
B
C
That's
very
helpful.
I
also
think
it'd
be
interesting
to
see
the
research
when
you
had
when
you
when
it
comes
to
conclusions
I'm
conscious
that,
at
the
best
of
times
the
market
in
rural,
remote
and
indeed
island
areas
can
operate
a
very
different
piece
from
the
highly
populated
parts
of
Scotland.
Are
there
any
areas
where
you
might
expect
property
markets
to
be
slow?
B
The
restrictions
on
movement
clearly
have
a
significant
impact
on
buying
and
selling
property,
no
matter
where
that
property
is
located
and
I
I'm,
not
sure
that
we've
got
to
a
point
where
the
Scottish
government
is
in
a
position
to
refine
the
application
of
those
guidelines
there
too,
and
rural
areas,
small
town
areas
and
suburban
areas
or
urban
areas,
then
I
think
we've
got
to
be
aware
that
those
restrictions
are
in
place
and
adhere
to
them,
and
so
therefore
I
wish
I
could
offer
you
some
fantastic
solution
to
this.
But
I
cannot.
C
A
D
Good
morning,
I
wanted
to
first
of
all
ask
you
about
share
one
part
for
on
mental
health
and
in
particular
the
nomination
of
named
persons,
and
so
as
you'll
be
aware
that
M
temper
there's
a
temporary
removal
of
the
necessity
to
have
nominees
and
signatures
witnessed
by
a
prescribed
pair.
It
removes
one
of
the
safety
checks
against
someone
potentially
being
quest
in
to
nominate
now,
particularly
in
person
and
I
guess.
D
It
was
really
to
ask
whether
you
have
any
concerns,
and
you
know
what
assurances
are
there,
that
the
the
Norman
eater
has
not
been
queston
to
nominate
in
a
particular
individual
to
be
there
named
person,
perhaps
someone
who
has
not
the
best
intentions
and
without
the
presence
of
a
person,
a
person
who
would
explain
the
rule
and
implications
of
nominating
a
named
person
to
the
normani.
So
really
just
get
your
views
on
on
that.
Please.
D
Okay,
that's
that's
helpful.
Thank
you
and
I.
Don't
know
if
you
have
any
comments
on
the
Kira's
alone
supplement
and
if
so
that
that
would
be
helpful.
But
I
also
wanted
to
ask
you
about
the
issues
relating
to
the
extension
of
time
limits
and
criminal
proceedings,
obviously
covering
things
like
a
penis
in
court
from
police
custody
and
Undertaker's
to
appear
in
court
and
whether
there
are
any
human
rights
issues
or
any
difficulties
that
you
have
identified
with
any
of
those
and
whether
you
have
any
comments
on
computers
allowance
supplement
as
well.
E
B
F
G
Thank
you
Michael.
Yes,
sir,
a
number
of
changes
being
made
to
time
limits
in
this
bill,
largely
they
follow
the
changes
to
time
limits
are
for
court.
Business
were
contained
in
the
first
covert
bill,
but
you
are
specifically
if
we
had
any
any
concerns.
Fundamentally,
they
are
there
to
make
it
easier
to
reduce
the
number
of
court
hearings
or
to
reduce
the
people
that
have
to
come
to
court
and
they
are
to
large
extent,
pragmatic
and
non
objectionable.
G
However,
I
well
aware,
the
whole
purpose
of
time
limits
in
criminal
proceedings
is
to
ensure
that
the
human
rights
aspects
the
right
to
a
fair
trial,
the
article
six
that
Michael
mentioned
is
respected
and
the
rights
of
the
accused
in
not
having
lon
John
out
uncertain
future,
though
there
are
different
time
limits
that
are
being
extended,
the
ones
to
do
with
what
I
call
a
procedural
matter
continued
without
plea,
the
section
one,
four
five
and
one
four,
five,
a
are
fine.
These
are
kind
of
administrative
procedural
hearings
until
cause
a
concern.
G
G
Discretion
Percy
not
objectionable,
but
we
would
have
concerns
about
the
open-ended
nature
for
people
who
are
remanded
in
custody,
though
we
would
suggest
that,
though
it
is
perfectly
reasonable
provision
to
look
at
the
time
periods
that
there
for
a
purpose
and
perhaps
when
considering
the
bill,
there
might
be
a
finite
period
pute
or
some
respect
on
the
courts.
Discretion
just
to
add
to
that
I
think
we're
perhaps
one
stage
slightly
further
two
stages.
Finally,
slightly
further
forward,
we've
all
talked
about
uncharted
territory.
G
We've
talked
about
flexibility
and
totally
respect
that
on
the
one
side,
but
I
think
refracts
looking
at
something,
that's
not
going
to
be
done
and
dusted
in
a
short
period
of
time,
perhaps
I'm,
considering
whether
in
fact,
if
finite
period
should
be
put
on
remand,
to
provide
certainty
and
clarity
is
something
that
perhaps
I
would
encourage
her
to
be
considered,
but
not
but
again
respecting
the
need
not
to
repeated
court.
Appearances.
Perhaps
difficulty
from
doctors
or
psychiatrist
giving
necessary
reports,
pressure
and
social
workers
etc.
Distance,
like
this,
you
know,
social
distancing
with
respect
to
work.
A
B
H
Okay,
I've
several
questions
that
I
will
on
prime
I'm.
I
was
going
to
just
make
the
important
point
before
I
forget
that
I
too,
should
refer
to
my
range
of
interests,
we're
and
I'm.
A
member
of
the
lost
sight
of
Scotland
and
whole
different
practices
were
typically
but
I'm
not
currently
practicing.
So
I
just
wanted
to
sure
I'd
remember
to
get
that
in
when
we
started
with
the
proceeds
of
crime.
H
So
basically
the
approaches
to
allow
the
Verona
virus
to
be
beated,
as
an
exception
of
circumstance
which
pleasantly
is,
but
for
the
purposes
of
the
legislation
such
that
at
confiscation,
hearings
can
be
postponed
and
indeed
the
time
to
P.
If
you
like,
on
the
part
of
the
the
individual,
can
be
extended
and
I'm
not
saying
that.
H
That's
not
reasonable,
because
I
understand
moment
that
it's
actually
there
in
matters
such
that
you
could
arrive
at
a
confiscation
hearing
is
rather
complicated
by
the
fact
that
court
hearings
are,
you
know,
not
taking
place
in
the
way
that
they
would
normally
do
so.
You
would
require
to
have
crown
and
defense
agents
and
so
forth.
So
I
understand
the
reasoning.
I
just
wondered
if
you
had
any
thoughts
about
to
one
extent,
any
possible
evasion
is
facilitated
by
further
extensions
Thank.
G
You,
mrs.
Ewing
I,
we
looked
at
these
provisions
and
we
thought
they
were
substantially
sensible
in
all
the
circumstances.
You
yourself
have
touched
upon
the
aspect
of
perhaps
clarity
of
the
law
by
stating
that
you
know
covet
19
circumstances
would
be
exceptional
that
at
least
takes
away
from
what
would
appear
to
be
a
technical.
You
know
it
would
be
a
record
to
be
looked
at
on
a
case-to-case
basis.
I
think
that
clarity
is
clear.
G
I'm,
not
certainly
understandable,
I
think
it's
important
to
stress
that
the
proceeds
of
crime
mechanism,
as
we
call
it
that
will
still
be
in
place.
All
that
is
being
attributed
is
that
there
will
be
afforded
delays
where
those
people
subject,
food
proceeds
of
crime
may
suffer
the
adverse
effects
of
covet
in
trying
to
either
pay
or
extended
periods
for
payment.
G
I
think
it
must
be
stressed
that
these
proceeds
of
crime,
which
are
terribly
important
and
very
important
within
the
criminal
justice
context,
because
a
lot
of
people's
a
lot
of
the
penalty
comes
in
proceeds
of
crime
rather
than
necessarily
the
actual
conviction,
and
it
is
important
that
they
pay
their
due.
It
won't
go
away.
G
All
that's
happened
is
that
they're
being
afforded,
if
you
like
a
degree
of
leniency
where
they
too
are
inhibited,
perhaps
from
the
points
that
you
discussed
earlier
about
selling
property
about
realizing
assets
to
pay
this,
and
it
would
seem
somewhat
unfair
if
they
were
suffering
the
consequences
when
we
are
ready
fully
aware
of
the
full
impact
of
covered
on
all
economic
matters,
financial
matters
etc.
But
I
stress
the
whole
point
is
that
they
don't
go
away.
The
confiscation
order
will
still
apply.
It
will
still
required
to
be
paid
I'm,
not
sure.
H
Well,
thank
you.
I
do
see
them,
as
the
professions
is
reasonable
and
I
suppose
is
fair
to
say
that
twice
for
as
long
as
there
are
difficulties
in
the
conveyancing
market,
then
it
would
apply
to
busy
by
and
large
but
I
think
it's
something
that
should
be
looked
at.
You
know
going
forward
very
carefully
because
I
think
in
Scotland
there
has
been
a
great
success
with
proceeds
of
crime
and
confiscations,
and
it
would
be
a
pity
if
we,
after
we
get
to
the
new
normal.
Whenever
that
may
be
see
any
backtracking
in
that
I.
G
I,
don't
really
see
any
other
than
totally
support.
What
you
said,
mrs.
Ewing
I
think
it
has
been
a
major
success.
Proceeds
of
crime
I
have
myself
been
involved
in
these
aspects
years
ago,
and
it
is
viewed
by
I
think
some
of
those
convicted
as
much
more
onerous
than
perhaps
a
conviction
in
prison.
So
I
would
not
like
to
see
any
take
away,
but
I
understand
that
Crown
Office,
we're
totally
in
support
and,
in
fact
had
been
part
of
I
think
identifying
the
need
for
these
changes.
G
B
Thank
you
very
much
for
that
interesting
question
and
the
I
think
I
think
you.
It
is
right
that
we
know
move
to
a
position
where
these
documents,
which
are
placed
on
the
walls
of
court,
are
placed
on
the
virtual
walls
of
court
as
it
where
the
Scottish
courts
and
tribunals
service
website
and
and
of
course
there
is
an
issue
around
in
preservation
of
right
to
private
life
and
protection
of
data
and,
of
course,
the
the
courts
and
the
Scottish
courts
and
tribunal
service.
B
Those
are
not,
then
beautiful.
In
the
walls.
Of
course,
they're
retained
as
private
documents
just
know
and
I
would
expect
the
same
kind
of
approach
to
be
taken
that
by
the
by
the
courts
just
now
and
provisions
of
a
new
section,
1
e
2
there,
which
are
those
that
this
publication
and
the
website
does
not
apply
to
a
document
if
it
is
of
the
type
that
the
Lord
President
of
the
Court
of
Session
or
the
Lord,
just
as
general
same
person,
different
offices
and
it
has
directed
that
it
should
not
apply.
B
And
and
of
course
that
would
mean
perhaps
either
the
document
does
not
go
on
to
the
website
or
that
it.
Some
of
the
information
on
it
is
redacted.
So
I
think
there
are
sufficient
safeguards
there
for
individual
privacy
embedded
in
a
section
9
of
the
bill,
and
these
the
I
think
we
can
rely
on
Lord
Callaway
to
exercise
this
direction
power
and
with
those
thoughts
in
mind,.
H
Thank
you.
We
have
a
supplementary
to
that
question
and
I'm,
taking
it
very
much
common
sense
of
the
right
to
privacy
issues
which
are
engaged
but
living
to
the
new
normal
of
our
lives.
Whenever
that
happens,
and
it
may
well
be
that
some
of
these
things,
including
electronic
registration,
that
the
register
of
inhibitions
and
vegetables,
for
example,
some
of
these
things,
building
things
on
those
SCT
s
website
may
be,
you
know
a
better.
We
do
some
of
this
in
the
21st
century.
A
lot
of
that
is
prospective.
B
Well,
I'm
not
sure
that
people
would
describe
me
as
a
moderniser
button.
I
recognize
the
important
role
which
the
internet
and
and
and
all
the
other
forms
of
media
play
today
in
people's
lives,
and
it's
important
that
the
courts
and
other
public
administration
offices
move
along
with
that
flaw.
So
this
change
may
become
a
permanent
change
for
the
future.
It's
bound
by
the
same
limitations
which
the
rest
of
the
provisions
of
the
bill
have
found.
B
B
Looking
on
this
period
as
a
kind
of
trial
period
for
how
this
kind
of
thing
works,
but
it's
in
entirely
in
key
being
with
the
modernization
of
procedure
and
truces,
which
then
started
with
the
guild
reviews
a
few
years
ago
and
which
lured
Connelly
that
has
pushed
forward
with
them,
as
the
legislation
has
paid
it
down
and
changes
have
been
taking
place.
So
I
can
can
I
predict
that
that
will
be
the
way
in
the
future.
Probably.
A
E
A
F
Given
C's
introductory
remarks,
I
have
a
faint
feeling
he
may
direct
this
towards
Gillian.
Here
goes,
and
let
me
start
with
the
electronic
signature
of
forms
in
the
bankruptcy
part
of
this
legislation,
and
oh,
oh
well
and
group,
but
in
particular
what
it
does
tend
to
be
by
an
insert
into
previous
legislation.
F
It
says
it
includes
a
version
of
an
electronic
signature
which
is
representing
a
poor
documentation,
sees
backwards
to,
for
example,
the
2007
to
2010
occations
Act,
section
7,
which
makes
no
reference
to
ever
take
an
electronic
signature
and
putting
it
onto
paper
and
also
to
the
bankruptcies
cotton
regulations,
2016,
which
at
section
2
2
again
talks
about
you
being
able
to
use
electronic
in
substitution
for
paper.
This
appears
to
be
the
first
legislative
attempt
to
substitute
electronic
with
paper
and
I.
Just
wonder
if
the
Law
Society
has
any
concerns
about
that.
F
No,
let
me
explain
my
concern,
which
might
of
context
that
what
it
specifically
says
in
the
2000
act
is
an
electronic
signature
incorporating
a
logical
answer
to
a
particular
electronic
communication,
or
particular
electronic
data
and
the
certification
by
any
person
with
such
a
signature.
But
the
certification
is
an
electronic
signature
which
involves
looking
at
every
single
dot,
comma
number
and
letter
in
the
electronic
document,
thus
being
signed
together
with
an
electronic
piece
of
information,
uniquely
known
by
the
signer
and
a
computation
which
is
in
the
propagator.
F
In
other
words,
when
you
put
it
on
paper,
you'll
lose
the
electronic
connection
between
a
big
number,
which
is
the
electronic
signature,
and
what
might
be
on
that
bit
of
paper?
You
could
change
a
number
and
not
know
that
that
has
happened.
That's
the
law
society
thought
about
this.
What
seems
to
be
novel
and
I
use
the
world
in
the
non
endorsing
way
and
move
to
allow
electronic
documents
to
be
put
on
paper
and
have
the
same
validity
as
the
previous
electronic
one
I.
B
Am
they
did
have
an
agreement
with
Jillian
that
matters
which
related
to
bankruptcy
would
be
passed
to
her,
but
this
is
much
more
particular
than
the
generality
of
the
bankruptcy
provisions.
So
if
you,
if
you
don't
mind,
being
disappointed,
mr.
Stevenson
now
questions
by
by
saying
that
they
say
in
this
particular
provision
does
not
appear
to
have
been
considered
by
electronic
or
IG
committee,
but
I
will
ask
them
to
look
at
it.
B
So
that
then
meets
the
question.
What
the
drafter
thought
when
the
freeze
electronic
signature
was
used,
and
I'm
sure
that
you
and
other
members
of
the
committee
will
be
aware
that
some
people
advance
the
idea
that
an
electronic
signature,
which
I
believe
is
an
erroneous
idea,
is
my
signature
scanned
into
scanned
into
later
of
which
then
goes
into
the
internet.
That
may
be
the
version
of
an
electronic
signature
which
was
referred
to
here,
and
perhaps
we
need
to
ask
the
minister
of
what
he
thinks.
F
F
It
is:
is
it
proper
and
reasonable
using
this
way,
but
but
the
difficulty
is
that
the
actual
referring
back
to
the
Communications
Act,
where
our
section
7
makes
it
very
clear
by
the
requirement
of
certification
by
any
person
such
a
signature,
that
such
certification
is
by
context
an
electronic
certification
and
that
the
image
of
the
signature
on
its
own
is
not
sufficient
in
the
context
of
home.
Alright.
But
but
that's
observation
and
I
will
not.
I
will
not
ask
you
to
comment
because
I
suspected
I
was
going
to
have
to
ask
the
minister
on
this.
F
F
And
then
it
says
in
the
next
section
references
in
this
part
of
the
tenner
after
all
of
these
persons,
I
read
that
as
meaning
that
all
the
persons
who
are
party
to
the
tenancy
have
to
provide
notice,
but
any
single
person
who
may
be
part
of
the
landlord
state
that
may
be
receiving
this.
It
may
be
sufficient
to
give
effect
to
it.
Is
that
the
meaning
of
what
the
drafting
said.
B
B
And
so
therefore,
one
would
think
that
if
flatmates
decided,
one
flatmate
would
give
up
the
Chanin
C,
but
the
other
would
not.
Then
it
would
cause
difficulties
with
the
continuity
of
what
agreement
there
was
and
the
responsibilities
then
which
adhere
to
that
agreement
and
to
the
individuals
who
are
parties
to
it
so
yeah,
it's
it's
a
good
question
and
I
think
you're
you're
right
to
highlight
this
as
being
something
which
there
is
is
not
an
error.
It's
not
a
mistake.
A
I
Thank
You
convener
and
my
David
I'm
interested
in
around
the
criminal
justice
aspects
of
the
bail
and
they've
been
largely
covered
in
answer
to
issue
and
Robson's
questions.
I
would
be
interested
in
your
specific
thoughts
around
the
arrangements
for
the
custody
of
the
ten
persons
at
police
stations
and,
if
you're
content
that
there's
enough
clarity
around
the
transition
and
the
role
of
custodian
between
prison
officers
and
police
officers
that,
for
the
purposes
of
having
those
detained
at
police
stations,
for
example,
a
to
appear
four
core
appearances.
B
G
You,
yes,
mr.
Greer
you've
highlighted
a
very
important
aspect
to
the
criminal
justice
system
and,
as
many
of
you
will
be
familiar,
the
trial
starts
in
the
police
station.
So
it's
absolutely
essential
before
even
considering
all
the
provisions
that
the
committee
and
the
Parliament
have
been
considering
that
the
process
is
that
the
police
station
are
safe
from
everybody
concerned,
and
you
have
picked
out
one
aspect,
which
is
the
use
of
prisoner
custody
officers.
G
We
understand
that
is
entirely
to
facilitate
the
remote
access
of
people
who
will
no
longer
be
required
to
be
taken
to
court
to
appear,
and
that's
obviously,
very
important
and
the
largely
technical
revises.
The
1994
Act
are
to
take
account
of
the
prisoner
of
custody
officers,
undertaking
these
duties
quite
correctly
to
free
up
the
police
officers
to
do
other
things,
so
that
aspect
to
the
bill
is
fine.
G
I
would
just
highlight
that
there
are
ongoing
discussions
with
regard
to
facilitating
the
interviews
of
suspects
and
the
safety
for
all
persons
there,
and
that
is
an
ongoing
matter
that
is
receiving
the
attention
of
the
Scottish
government.
Indeed,
only
today
my
president
was
asked
to
join
a
working
group.
Looking
at
this
and
I
would
stress
that
this
is
very
important
in
an
aspect.
G
That's
not
clearly
covered
by
the
bill,
because
it's
not
necessarily
required
at
this
stage,
but
the
intention
we
understand
is
to
facilitate
remote
access
in
due
course
when
that
can
be
arranged
and
that's
absolutely
essential
to
avoid
obviously
contact
and
also
it
is
absolutely
essential.
But
that
perhaps
looks
at
the
role
of
the
appropriate
adult.
I
Yes,
certainly
it's
a
very
useful
thing
on
those
ongoing
discussions
as
well.
Do
you
envisage
that,
when
they're
concluded,
when
agreements
reached
on
on
how
to
have
those
facilities
in
place,
that
that
would
require
any
further
change
to
primary
legislation
or
could
conduct
achieved
through
second
registration?
Another
practical.
G
Policy
yeah
I
think
again.
That
would
be
something
perhaps
to
direct
your
question
to
the
minister
and
the
appropriate
persons.
There
are
obviously
provisions
in
the
2016
out
the
criminal
justice
Gotland
out
with
which
you'd
have
been
concerned
a
couple
of
years
ago
that
refer
to
a
sort
of
being
present.
G
That's
a
matter
that
perhaps
could
seek
clarification,
but
I
would
suggest
that
that
questions
best
directed
to
the
minister
to
clarify
whether
any
legislative
fix
would
be
required
to
facility
which
clearly
would
be
the
recommended
route,
which
is
from
what
access
being
afforded
by
solicitors
and
safety
of
everybody.
That's
required
in
connection
with
police
interviews
to
be
respected.
J
Thank
You
Kim,
you
know
a
good
morning
to
earn
what
this
seized.
Computers
asked
a
very
helpful
question
at
the
beginning
of
Michael
Clancy
about
the
violence
in
terms
of
human
rights
into
the
nation's
and
and
makeup
helpfully-
and
you
say:
oh
there's
fellas,
it's
largely
quite
technical
and
the
impact
on
human
race
is
not
in
the
same
order
as
as
P.
These
fellows
do.
J
Dental
business
already
asked
about
the
the
mental
health
treatment
aspect
or
nomination
of
needs
patients
and
a
margin
satisfied
with
your
answer
to
that
Michael,
but
can
just
ask
to
to
what
extent
and
your
team
looked
at-
that
the
cumulative
impact
of
the
other
types
of
legislation
that
and
forced
because
the
the
names
Pearson
and
as
practical
as
we
know,
has
considerable
and
power
over
an
individual,
and
we
know
that
people
in
cause
and
situations
I'd
completely
rely
on
other
people
for
their
care
and
treatment.
I
am
concerned
that
and
Englund
the
Care
Quality
Commission.
J
The
regulator
has
an
are.
We
intervened
because
deaths
and
mental
health
hospitals
have
doubled
since
last
year
and
so
that
data
is
available,
but
we
don't
get
how
about
detect
and
in
Scotland
door.
Her
questions
for
the
cabinet
secretary.
But
how
satisfied
are
you
that
we
have
enough
data
and
that
would
able
to
properly
monitored
the
impacts
of
the
legislation
and
look
at
it
in
a
election,
mulleted
fashion?.
B
Well,
I
think
it's
probably
LEDs
or
enough
data
to
be
gathered
and
and
I
be
surprised.
If
our
committee
had
data
which
the
hadn't
passed
on-
and
there
are
notes
to
me
for
the
purposes
of
this
discussion
and
unless
they
thought
that
this
question
wasn't
going
to
come
up
and
I,
it's
it's
obviously
a
difficult
situation.
B
Just
now
where
we
are
still
getting
to
grips
with
this
legislation.
The
coronavirus
Scotland
act-
2020
is
just
over
a
month
old,
it's
five
weeks
old
and
since
it's
the
Royal
Assent
on
the
6th
of
April,
and
so
therefore
I
think
one
needs
to
have
a
critical
mass
of
operation
of
an
act
of
Parliament
that
before
one
can
then
begin
to
tease
out
there.
B
The
research
points
and
and
the
information
that's
needed,
and
it
may
be
the
case
that
ministers
have
access
to
information
which
they,
the
legs
of
Mead,
do
not
and
I
think
it's
probably
more
likely
than
not
because,
as
you
will
know
from
your
interest
in
these
matters,
there's
learning
that
a
health
questions
are
are
constantly
being
looked
at
and
and
data
is
being
generated
all
the
time
so
that
there
can
be
clear
policy
directions
and
clinical
decisions
and
but
I'm
awfully
sorry.
But
I
do
not
have
that
information
to
hand.
J
J
If
you
think
that
that
that
theorem
is
and
a
specific
enough
definitions
that
need
to
find
out
for
the
clarity
I'm,
just
thinking
that
owns
dedications
we
are,
and
someone
could
see
they
have
corner
by
it
is,
but
they
haven't
been
tasted
or
they
wouldn't
be
tasted.
So
I
just
wondered
what
could
the
practical
implications
be?
I,
don't
that.
G
Thank
you.
Yes,
the
corona,
corona
virus
related
reason.
It's
very
broad,
and
we
took
from
the
criminal
justice
perspective
that
it
was
genuinely
broad
in
the
interest,
if
you
like,
of
the
accused
that
there
are
all
sorts
as
Michael's
outlined
reasons
why
you
might
not
appear
court,
because,
fundamentally,
this
comes
in
under
undertakings
that
requirement
that
you
get
out
the
police
station
to
appear
in
court
in
a
specific
date.
But
for
that
date
you
would
be
suffering
from
a
covered
related
reason,
so
it
could
be
carrying
responsibilities.
G
It
could
be
thank
you've
covered
and
the
fact
that
it's
not
to
find
if
you
like,
with
greater
clarity
I,
think,
affords
a
discretion
that
allows
things
that
we
might
not
think
about,
not
to
define
it
to
prescriptively.
There
was
a
point
raised
about
whether
a
mental
health
condition
would
be
in
because
I'm
suffering
from
a
mental
health
condition
as
a
result
of
people
are
only
of
corvid
or
natural
anxiety,
whether
that
was
covered.
G
But
I
thought
it
was
broad
enough
that
the
court,
certainly
from
criminal
justice
Whedon,
would
be
seeking
not
to
have
warrants
granted
where
there
was
some
reason
being
put
forward
that
the
court
could
accept.
That
was
as
a
result
of
covered
now.
It
might
argue
that
that
means
that
latitude
would
be
sure
in
favor
of
the
accused,
which
wouldn't
otherwise
be
the
case.
G
I
think
that's
a
slim
possibility
because,
ultimately,
the
day
of
reckoning
will
come
and
they
would
be
required
to
appear
before
the
court
and
effectively
the
provisions
that
are
the
bill
on
that
area
really
till
I.
The
court
that
flexibility
and
that
fairness
to
avoid
people
possibly
traveling
at
times
when
they
should
not
be
doing
so
in
respecting
the
government's
health
advice.
J
A
E
Very
much
convenient
Michael
you
mentioned
at
the
outset,
some
of
the
busy
and
supposed
to
defend
any
legislation.
You
said
with
law
should
be
coherent,
comprehensible,
it
should
work
in
practice.
Then,
can
you
see
those
elements
unless
legislation
governor
s,
emergency
legislation-
and
it's
had
to
have
been
derived
really
in
a
bit
of
a
hurry
to
deal
with
this
emergency
declaration
and
clear
the
is
he
a
will
the
safeguards
and
the
public
and
the
application
of
this
kind
of
legislation,
particularly
thinking
about
any
unintended
consequences
that
might
arise
from
some
of
it?.
B
Thank
you
very
much,
it's
a
very
interesting
question
because
it
goes
to
the
heart
of
the
job
that
you
and
your
colleagues
as
a
maze.
Peas,
are
doing
in
terms
of
the
scrutiny
of
the
legislation,
and
this
bill
contains
many
order
making
powers
and
some
of
those
are
in
the
body
of
the
bill
and
some
are
in
the
schedule.
Schedule
but
and
I
think
it's
quite
important
for
us
to
remember
that
scrutiny
taken
at
speed
me
result
in
unintended
or
unforeseen
consequences
and,
of
course,
the
whole
point
of
unforeseen
consequences.
B
Is
that
no.14
seizes
them
and
that's
a
difficult
thing,
and
but
in
a
complaint
I'm
table
like
the
one
which
this
bill
is
under
being
subject
to
with
this
evidence.
Ation
today
stage
one
debate
tomorrow
stage
two
on
the
19th
Stage
3
on
the
20th
and
is
is
better
for
scrutiny
than
an
emergency
legislation
they're
under
the
Parliament
Standing
Order
9,
therefore,
which
will
take
place
with
the
entire
stages
of
the
bill
in
1d,
as
we
had
with
the
coronavirus
Scotland
bill
1.
B
B
Currently,
the
delegated
person
Law
Reform
Committee,
has
each
orders
which
it's
considering,
which
are
labeled
as
coronavirus,
Scotland
portals,
or
at
least
those,
but
they
eat
that
I
could
find
in
the
website.
Last
night,
the
UK
Parliament
is
dealing
with
70
orders
mm,
which
are
coronavirus.
Their
orders
and
the
Hansard
society
has
recently
done
a
survey
of
the
UK
Parliament's
approach
to
this,
which
is
quite
instructive
and
I'll
I'll,
pass
that
on
to
mr.
Johnson,
the
clot,
and
so
that
he
might
circulate
it.
B
It's
an
instructive
piece
of
work
and
that
one,
which
I
find
quite
interesting
one
of
the
things
which
the
minister
said
in
terms
of
legislation
subordinate
legislation
which
it
was
being
true
to
the
DPL,
our
he
wrote
to
the
convener
of
that
committee
a
few
weeks
ago,
and
it
was
that
the
Meade
affirmative
procedure
was
being
used
and
made.
Affirmative
procedure
is
a
kind
of
fast-track
procedure
for
subordinate
legislation,
and
it
needs
to
be
watched
very
carefully.
The
House
of
Lords
Constitution
Committee
in
its
report
on
legislation.
B
That
said,
the
the
Meade
affirmative
procedure
is
often
used
in
acts
where
the
intention
is
to
allowe
significant
powers
to
be
exercised
quickly.
In
most
cases,
the
parent
Act.
This
says
it
specifies
which
form
of
procedures
should
be
applied
to
instruments
made
under
it.
In
some
cases,
however,
the
Act
may
meet
floor
either
draft
affirmative
or
meet
affirmative
procedure
to
be
used.
The
me
definitive
procedure
is
effective
immediately
and
the
house
went
on
to
say
the
instruments
bleed
as
made
instruments
almost
inevitably
p-please
a
serious
time
pressure
on
those
dropping
them.
B
A
recent
joint
committee
on
statutory
instruments
record
drew
the
special
attention
both
houses
to
three
statutory
instruments
which
have
been
laid
as
made.
Affirmatives
provisions
had
been
made
to
these
instruments
down
to
the
moment
that
they
were
being
made,
and
there
had
been
a
serious
time
pressure
in
the
making
of
those
instruments.
So,
and
does
that
mean
that
all
legislation
which
was
made
in
haste
and
has
to
be
reflected
on
in
leisure
and
the
mistakes
found
clearly
not
it's?
It's
the
Scottish
parliamentary,
their
councils
office
and
the
solicitors
in
the
Scottish
Government
legal
department.
B
They
are
clearly
expert
drawing
up
these
instruments,
but
this
speed
of
which
they
are
produced
and
the
speed
of
scrutiny
is
something
which
we've
got
to
be
careful
about
and
I'm
sure
the
DPL
R
will
have
that
on
its
radar.
Now
what
is
done
about
it?
That
is
the
two-month
review
which
is
in
in
the
bill.
They
say
there
you
can
see
that
that's
a
sanction,
15
and
this
bill
is
replicated
in
section
12
in
the
coronavirus,
Scotland
Act
and
in
Section
95
in
the
coronavirus,
Act
2020.
B
E
A
Okay,
thank
you.
Thank
you.
Willie
this,
you
know
nod
from
Tompkins
that
Michael
Clancy
is
so
comprehensively
answered
that
last
question.
Nothing
to
add
so
I'm,
not
seeing
any
other
members
desperately
committed
with
any
follow-ups.
So
in
that
case
can
I
just
thank
you
Michael
and
Jillian
very
much
for
your
time
this
morning,
I
appreciate
it
was
a
significant.
Oh!
No,
how
about
you
you
just
caught
my
eye,
so
you
can
follow
up
a
development
yeah.
H
Yeah,
it's
just
me
sorry,
I
had
to
put
it
in
a
file
part
that
I
hadn't
raced
a
lot
of
buttons,
so
I
realized
you
hadn't
received
my
are
a
request,
and
it's
just
to
go
back
to
the
issue
of
the
mental
health
and
the
witness
thing
of
the
name
person's
signature,
a
very
important
issue,
and
it
was
just
to
double-check.
My
understanding
is
correct.
B
A
Thank
you
a
moment
right,
I'm,
not
seeing
anybody
else,
so
I
think
that
I
think
that
is
also
you
know.
I
just
thank
you
might
call
a
kazillion
both
for
your
time
this
morning,
I
appreciate
it.
It's
a
significant
challenge
when
the
bill
was
on
the
publish
and
yesterday
morning
to
be
able
to
give
it
a
digital
and
consideration,
but
you've
done
a
very
good
job
for
us
this
morning
that
helped
us
on
a
range
of
subjects.
We
do
appreciate
your
time.
A
B
A
Right
welcome
back
we're,
never
terms
you
are
saying
in
which
reducing
here
from
Michael
Russell
is
the
cabinet
secretary
for
Constitution.
You
know
and
external
affairs
and
look
me
Bradley,
who
is
the
billable
team
leader
only
Scottish
government
and
I
can't
offer
you
both
to
the
meeting
in
terms
of
the
technology
cabinet
secretary
cut
as
a
chest.
A
If
you
wish
to
invite
Luka
to
speak,
you
just
confirm
that
and
the
appropriate
time
and
bring
him
in
and
just
mind
you
that
because
of
the
technology
delays,
if
you're
asked
the
question,
you
just
stop
and
take
a
breath
before
your
answer.
It
I
would
be
helpful
before
we
move
to
questions.
Can
the
secretary
joy
to
make
a
short
opening
statement
to
the
committee.
K
Thank
you
convener,
and
thank
you
for
the
invitation
to
give
evidence
this
morning
and
to
answer
your
questions.
The
bill
time
table
that
we
are
entering
into
for
this
second
coronavirus
bill
is,
is
a
little
more
relaxed
than
that
of
the
first
bill,
but
it
is
still
pretty
hectic
and
can
I
just
remind
perhaps
the
committee
where
we
are
in
the
in
the
flurry
of
legislation
and
regulation
of
we've
had
since
the
start
of
this
process
and
I
want
to
thank
the
bill
team
and
Luke
and
his
colleagues.
K
First
of
all,
the
bill
team
has
been
responsible
for
to
very
complex
bills
in
a
process
of
six
weeks,
so
that
is
utterly
remarkable.
But
of
course
there
these
bills
involve
a
range
of
individuals
and
they
also
involve
a
range
of
Ministers.
So
from
time
to
time
as
this
bill
progresses,
my
colleagues
will
be
coming
to
the
chamber
or
to
the
committee,
certainly
to
the
chamber
tomorrow,
where
I
expect
to
be
joined
by
a
Kevin
Stewart
virtually
on
Somerville
and
then
in
terms
of
amendments
to
this
bill.
K
There
will
be
other
ministers
who
wish
to
take
part
at
stage
two
and
stage
three,
so
this
is
unusual,
but
I
hope
it
will
be
helpful
to
the
Parliament
and
to
the
committee.
We
passed
the
LCM
for
the
UK
bill
on
the
24th
of
March
and
the
coronavirus
number
one
bill
was
passed
on
the
1st
of
April
and
we
are
now
considering
the
coronavirus,
number
2
bill
and
inevitably,
we've
learned
from
those
experiences.
K
We've
also
had
a
detailed
series
of
regulations
that
we
start
with
those
regulate
on
the
25th
of
March
publishing
the
business
and
social
distancing
guidelines,
26th
of
March
we
made
and
brought
into
forest
health
protection
regulations
they
took
on
lockdown
regulations.
Physical
distancing
guideline
was
published
on
the
27th
of
March.
The
small
amendments
were
made
on
the
1st
of
April.
The
regulations
were
reviewed
on
the
16th
of
April
on
the
21st
of
April.
K
We
made
more
substantive
changes,
which
I
discussed
with
the
committee
before
we
reviewed
the
regulations
on
the
7th
May
and
in
the
11th
of
May.
We
updated
those
with
one
change
which
you
are
familiar
with.
That
is
all
a
flurry
of
activity.
I
I
anticipate
that,
of
course,
we
will
have
more
regulations
to
consider
as
we
go
forward.
K
We
also
have
the
reporting
process
to
put
into
place,
and
that
will
start
at
the
end
of
this
month
when
we
bring
start
to
bring
forward
the
first
set
of
reporting
on
not
just
the
number
one
bill,
but
also
on
the
number
two
bill
and
on
the
LCM.
This
bill
is
a
simpler
bill
in
the
first
bill,
and
it
has
a
number
of
items
which
you
regard
as
urgent
and
I
just
heard.
Michael
the
tail
end
of
Michael
Clancy's
evidence
and
I
entirely
agree
with
them.
K
The
issue
of
urgency
and
legislation
is
a
difficult
and
both
in
primary
and
secondary
legislation.
We
must
be
sparing.
We
must
apply
a
judgment
that
the
pieces
of
legislation
are
urgently
required
and
are
needed
and
can
only
be
used
when
they
are
needed.
I
will
pass
out
of
views
as
soon
as
possible,
but
this
bill
covers
those
things
in
four
broad
topics:
individual
protections,
the
operation
of
the
justice
system,
adjustments
to
deadlines
for
reports
and
accounts
and
some
miscellaneous
measures.
Now
the
reporting
on
this
bill
is
exactly
the
same
as
the
previous
bill.
K
During
the
first
bill,
we
have
enabled
find
a
what
we
think
is
a
solution
to
that,
and
that
is
in
the
bill.
Jelly
out
of
Somerville
tomorrow
we'll
be
able
to
talk
about
the
Social
Security
of
particularly
the
coronavirus
carers
allowance,
which
we
hope
to
be
able
to
pay
in
gym.
There
are
key
issues
on
bankruptcy,
because
debt
will
be
regrettably,
an
issue
that,
during
this
crisis
period,
I
heard
Annabel
Ewing's
leave
a
question
about
mental
health
and
the
requirement
to
relax
the
need
to
witness
a
name,
personal
nomination.
K
That
is
a
very
sensitive
issue,
happy
to
discuss
that
there
are
some
criminal
justice
issues,
proceeds
of
crime
issues,
intimation
of
documents,
issues
and
then
a
range
of
other
issues.
Matters,
including
the
matter
of
the
UEFA
European
Championships
of
the
fact
that
they
will
be
postponed
for
a
year,
and
we
need
to
alter
the
legislation
that
we've
only
just
recently
passed
on
that
matter.
K
As
we
go
forward,
I'm
grateful
to
the
opposition
parties
for
making
suggestions
both
about
what
is
in
this
bill
and
for
a
notification
from
some
of
the
opposition
parties
about
issues
that
aren't
in
this
bill,
but
they
would
like
to
see
it
good
in
this
bill
in
that
you
know,
I've
consistently
said
in
every
bill
that
I've
been
involved
with
bills,
improve
as
they
as
they
age,
and
we
have
a
period
of
time
in
which
we
can
improve
this
bill.
It
will
not
be
impossible.
K
It
will
not
be
possible
to
take
on
every
issue,
but
certainly
we
were
giving
to
issues
serious
consideration
and
serious
discussion.
Finally
convene
at
a
timetable
for
this
bill.
I
think
is
clear.
After
today's
session
there
will
be
a
parliamentary
stage,
money
debate
tomorrow
afternoon,
the
committee
stage
to
debate
next
Tuesday
morning,
which
could
take
us
some
time.
If
members
choose
that,
that's
what
they
wish
to
do,
because
the
standing
order
preventing
committees
to
meet
well
Apolo
meeting
has
been
suspended.
K
K
To
the
Advocate
General
to
the
Attorney
General
and
the
secretary
for
Scotland
questing
and
expedited
rather
sent
if
the
bill
is
passed
on
Wednesday
the
20th
of
May,
so
that
we
would
have
the
matters
in
this
bill
that
finally
make
it
through
available
by
Thursday
the
28th
of
May,
and
with
that
I'm
happy
to
answer,
questions
and
I'm
sure.
The
Luke
will
also
be
happy
to
do
so.
A
Okay,
thank
you.
Thank
You,
Calvin
segment,
very
helpful
summary
where
we
are
and
then
the
members
have
some
questions
on
and
what
is
in
the
bill,
and
those
are
some
questions
about
issues
that
are
not
currently
covered
by
the
no
but
I
know
where
it
is
in
pursuing
as
amendments
and
later
stages,
I
wonder
if
I
could
just
start
off
with
a
very
general
point
which
I
suspect
might
be
in
the
minds
of
some
people
who
might
be
watching
this
and
they'll
have
seen
the
announcement
from
the
the
first
minister.
A
We
came
to
some
relaxation
of
the
restrictions
that
there
are
and
kind
of
locked
out
it.
You
know
very
much
I
think
a
direction
of
travel.
We
all
hope
where
we're
seeing
a
loosening
of
restrictions
might
be
wondering.
Well,
if
that
is
the
Kings,
and
we
are
attentionally
through
the
worst
of
this
or
presently
do
the
worst
of
the
first
phase
of
it.
Why
do
we
know
needed
a
new
bill
with
more
restrictions
and
more
measures
being
positive
at
this
particular
point?
A
K
I
think
we
have
to
apply
proportionality.
Clearly,
it
would
be
in
our
minds
that
the
regulations
may
change
over
the
coming
weeks
and
months.
I,
don't
I
think
the
phrase
that
the
first
minister
uses
baby
steps
and
that
is
going
to
be
a
lengthy
process.
I
think
that
has
been
made
clear
by
everybody
and
we
are
only.
We
have
only
made
a
very,
very
small
change
in
the
regulations
this
weekend.
The
power
is
in
here
will
be
required
for
some
time,
and
we
said
this:
for
the
bill
to
Worcester
is
still
major
disruption.
K
That
is
not
great
that
it
is
going
to
take
us
considerable
time
and
in
those
circumstances,
what's
in
this
bill
is
what
we
believe
is
required.
I
hope
this
will
be
the
last
film
though
there
is.
You
know
that
small
glimmer
of
legislative
light
at
the
end
of
the
parliamentary
tunnel
I
think
that
we
will
have
dealt
with
the
vast
majority
of
items
we
feel
we
need
to
deal
with.
K
There
are
still
issues,
for
example,
such
as
a
jury,
trial,
issue,
I,
understand,
there's
an
announcement
today
that
lady
Dorian
will
be
taking
forward
a
judicially
layered
group
to
look
at
how
that
should
be
dealt
with,
and
that
has
been
a
difficulty
which
is
not
yet
resolved.
There
may
be
other
issues,
as
Michael
Clancy
rightly
pointed
out
to
think
about
unforeseen
issues.
Is
you
can't
foresee
them?
There
may
be
issues
coming
forward,
but
to
the
best
of
our
ability
we're
trying
to
deal
with
what
we
need
now
what
we
will
need
in
the
next
period?
K
The
judgment
about
the
next
period
can
be
made
in
terms
of
the
legislation
either
when
we
switch
cars
on
and
then
off
or
on
at
the
end
of
September
and
of
course,
the
staging
post
at
the
end
of
September
are
the
end
of
May
and
then
the
end
of
July.
When
we
can
also
stay
and
the
whole,
parliament
can
say
whether
these
measures
are
still
required,
whether
they
should
be
phased
out
and
then,
of
course,
a
decision
about
the
whole
bill.
A
K
Would
not
be
our
intention
to
do
that
as
a
matter
of
course,
and
indeed
with
anything
major
I
think
the
one
you're
referring
to
is
a
small
change
in
the
UEFA
championship,
a
bill
which
I
think
on
reflection.
That
was
decided,
as
this
would
require
an
additional
piece
of
seconded
legislation.
In
any
case,
it
might
be
best
to
save
everybody's
time
and
roll
it
up
with
him.
What
was
required
the
the
bulk
of
the
cars
in
this,
in
all
the
legislation,
the
overwhelming
majority
of
the
parts
are
to
do
with
the
coronavirus.
K
The
UEFA
championship
bill
is
to
do
with
coronavirus,
because
the
championship
had
been
postponed
for
a
year
as
a
result
of
which
the
legislation
we
have
there
cannot
be
in
act.
It
cannot
be
imposed.
Do
we
have
to
move
it
on
again?
The
small
change
that
is
in
there
is
designed
I
think
to
save
people
time.
If
there
was
a
rooted
objection
to
that,
then
we
would
have
to
use
that
time
with
this.
This
bill
I
think
that
wouldn't
be
to
edit
in
anybody's
interest,
but
the
judgment
we
apply.
K
A
E
Very
much
convener
and
cabinet
secretary
you've
introduced
some
new
provisions
for
students
in
relation
to
terminating
their
10:00
tendencies
that
you
mentioned
you'd
said
there
and
also
I
think
protecting
them
from
being
forced
to
pay
for
accommodations,
shoot
these
restrictions
and
continue
into
the
new
term.
Could
you
just
turn
broadly
outline
for
us
what
the
provisions
are
that
you're
introducing
and
what
issues
that
they'll
resolve
are
Scotland
students.
K
Yes,
I
think
there
were
the
greatest
sympathy
when
this
was
raised
under
the
first
bill,
I
think
by
the
Green,
Party
and
and
I
think
they
would
have
liked
that
stage.
They've
taken
it
forward.
There
were
very
considerable
concerns
as
to
how
that
should
be
done,
and
it's
one
of
those
areas
where
it
did
require
a
lot
of
consideration
as
to
whether
it
was
possible
to
do
this
now
it
has
been
decided,
it
is
possible
and
we've
brought
in
essentially
something
pretty
simple.
K
The
bill
will
introduce
a
seven
day
notice
period
for
those
currently
tied
into
student
accommodation
and
a
28
day
notice
period
prevalence
entered
into
well.
The
Act
is
in
force
now
those
are
simple
to
understand,
but
they
do
deal
with
something
that
has
been
a
problem.
Most
students,
you
know,
are
not
at
university.
K
Functioning
in
their
normal
way,
in
these
circumstances,
tying
students
in
to
this
to
these
arrangements
is
is
basically
unfair
and
very
detrimental,
and
we
feel
it
is
right
to
take
this
step.
There
will
be
a
combination
providers
who
are
concerned
about
it,
but
we
do
think
that
this
is
natural
justice,
essentially
to
be
able
to
do
so.
E
Thank
you
for
that.
We
know
that
some
students
have
been
elected
in
their
contracts,
particularly
witness
offer
to
build
accommodation
providers
and
so
and
we'll
well.
This
provision
that
we're
introducing
allow
any
claims
of
a
DB
validity
for
some
of
the
students
to
seeker
a
rebate
on
some
of
that
payment
that
they
need
the.
K
Regulations
do
not
permit
that
in
this
present
stage
and
I
think
that
would
be
difficult
to
do
legally
as
well.
Of
course,
it
is
an
issue
worth
discussing
I
know.
Mr.
Greer
was
very
concerned
with
this
at
the
the
first
bill,
and
he
may
well
wish
to
pursue
that
issue,
but
it
is
hard
enough
to
legislate.
You
know
promptly
and
effectively
in
this
area.
I
think
if
you
add
to
that
most
desirable
outcome,
but
if
you
were
to
add
to
that
burden,
think
you'd
find
it
even
harder
to
do
so.
K
E
My
only
other
question
cabinets
safety
was
in
the
UEFA
championship
that
was
mentioned
deal
by
the
it
can
be
known,
I
think,
as
a
two-year
extension
to
the
sunset
clause
that
we've
introduced,
that
we
know
the
championships
been
delayed
like
years.
Why
have
we
introduced
a
three-year
extension
to
the
sunset
quality.
K
A
L
But
there
is
the
world
of
difference
between
that
and
and
making
it
really
very
difficult
for
people
to
get
married
at
all
because
I
understand
it.
Although
you
know
please
correct
me,
if
I'm
wrong
in
the
Scots
law,
only
five
people
are
required
to
be
present
for
a
lawful
wedding,
the
Registrar,
the
two
parties
and
two
witnesses,
and
there
are
many
rooms
available
where
we
can
have
social
distancing
with
only
five
people
at
present.
K
Yes,
I
can
let
me
just
get
the
exact
detail
here,
but
it
is.
It
is
possible
for
those
who,
because
of
the
circumstances
in
which
you
have
mentioned,
let
me
take
two
in
particular.
One
is
end-of-life
issues
where
people
wish
to
get
married
and
also
somebody
who
requires
to
leave
the
country
to
work
or
whatever,
and
we
wish
to
get
mine.
It
is
still
possible
for
that
happen.
That
is
the
the
technical
situation.
K
Is
that
there's
presently
you
know
the
licenses
are
not
being
issued,
but
that
could
happen
in
those
circumstances
and
the
Registrar
General
has
the
right
to
do
that
most,
not
only
to
approve
that,
but
to
waive
the
notice
period.
So
it
is
possible
to
do
it
and
I'm
happy
to
provide
the
committee
with
a
written
account
of
how
that
can
be
done.
K
Forced
marriage,
for
example,
would
be
easier
to
bring
forward
if
there
was
no
physical
presence
there
and
no
possibility
of
a
setting
as
a
register
will
often
do
what
the
circumstances
are.
No
I
think
the
video
length
thing
was
written
off.
I
think
there
was
a
view
that,
as
we
are,
maintaining
the
the
lockdown
as.
I
K
M
K
Not
moving
it
with
one
small
exception
this
week.
It
would
be
the
wrong
time
then,
to
bring
forward
arrangements
that
would
loosen
it
in
one
place.
I
think
you'd
have
to
loosen
it
in
a
number
of
other
places.
The
very
very
difficult
and
you
and
I
will
both
have
had
representations
about
this
to
funerals
issue
would
require
to
be
dealt
with
there
and
I.
K
Think
that
is
difficult
unless
you
deal
with
all
of
those
things
and
if
you
deal
with
all
of
those
things
that
becomes
almost
impossible
to
contain
and
I
think
there's
an
issue
of
capacity.
I
mean
the
registrar's
are
dealing
with
issues
of
capacity.
They
are
finding
themselves
and
the
gradient
of
pressure,
particularly
with
the
registration
of
deaths.
There
have
been
big
changes
to
that.
So
I
think
what
we're
seeing
here
without
any
pleasure
in
saying
it
is
that
it
will
be
difficult
to
do
for
weddings.
K
We
understand
the
problem,
it
is
an
area
which
will
have
to
be
fact
into
the
the
lockdown
and
the
loosening
of
regulation
when
that
happens,
and
we
are
not
at
that
stage,
I,
stress
and
and
in
terms
of
the
emergency
circumstances
which
have
been
raised.
It
is
possible
to
deal
with
those
and
they
have
been
dealt
with.
L
Well,
I'm
grateful
for
that
and
I'm
sure
the
committee
would
welcome,
as
indeed
probably
the
broader
Parliament
cabinets
actually
would
welcome
clarity
around
what
exactly
the
legal
rules
are.
With
regard
to
the
issues,
you
talked
about
the
Registrar
General,
being
able
to
waive
ordinary
notice
periods
and
registrar's.
Contrary
to
what
don't
my
constituents
they're
writing
to
me
about.
It
seem
to
believe
that
being
able,
within
the
current
rules,
to
license
marriages
as
I
understand
it.
K
And
very
happy
to
provide
to
the
committee
the
information
I
have
and
indeed
to
seek
it
to
be
expanded
about
how
application
could
be
made
in
a
very
limited
set
of
circumstances.
The
circumstance
as
I
understand
them
I
if
one
of
the
partners
with
people
involved
is
dying
or
whether
somebody
is
to
be
about
to
leave
or
to
be
posted
overseas,
particularly
the
Armed
Forces.
But
I
am
happy
to
get
that
information
to
provide
the
committee
more
widely
to
to
the
Parliament.
And
if
that
is
not
happening,
and
my
sense
is
it
is
happening.
K
K
J
A
J
K
Yeah,
of
course,
I
think
you
know
you're
putting
your
finger
absolutely
on
the
key
issue
within
this
proposal,
though,
which
is
not
that
the
proposal
should
be
made,
but
how
far
the
proposal
should
go
and
I
know.
Jackie
has
has
some
views
on
this
and
I
welcome
those
views,
and
we
can
have
a
debate
and
the
conversation
about
it.
I
think
there's
a
number
of
issues
in
here
one.
What
is
the
issue
fees
for
background
video,
which
is
a
bit
difficult
to
meet
for
some
people
and
we're
trying
to
address
that
within
here?
K
Jackie
is
aware
of
that
too,
because
the
number
of
MSP
is
the
number
of
bodies
have
been
thinking
about
this
and
there
will
be
different
views
about
what
level
of
fees
and
and
and
and
what
the
littler
limit
should
be
in
both
parts
of
this,
because
there
are
two
parts
to
this
proposal.
I
I
think
that
there's
always
a
compromise,
and
we
think
this
is
a
right
compromise.
We
think
it
broadly
gets
support
from
money,
advisors
and
others.
K
Creditors
are
weary
of
these
proposals,
because
they're
wary
of
people
who
are
running
up
debt
and
then
cannot
pay
it,
and
you
know
there
are,
regrettably,
some
people
very
responsible
in
that
regard,
and
there
are
some
people
who
will
do
it
deliberately,
and
some
creditors
are
wary.
The
debt
advice
bodies
would
also
want
to
go
further,
so
you
have
those
two
things
sort
of
you're
pulling
in
opposite
direction
and
we
think
what
we've
ended
up
here
is
probably
the
right
compromise.
But
of
course
there
should
be
a
conversation
about
that.
K
But
if
there
is,
you
know
to
be
a
change
here,
it
can
either
you
can
only
move
against
the
creditors
and
in
favor
of
the
debtors
or
the
other
way,
though
you
know,
we
would
be
moving
further
in
favor
either
of
those
who
are
owed
money
or
those
who
owe
money,
and
perhaps
we
should
try
and
strike
a
balance.
But
this
isn't
on
tablets
of
stone.
There
can
be
a
debate
and
discussion
about
that.
Of
course,
there
should
be.
J
Thank
you.
That's
a
helpful,
helpful
starting
point.
I'm.
Sure
members,
though,
engage
and
weighted
discussion
on
that
and
I.
Don't
know
if
you
heard
my
earlier
equation
to
the
law
society,
it
was
releasing
to
the
the
mental
health
kid
in
treatment,
Scotland,
act
2003
and
that
the
part
of
this
bill
that
and
effects
the
nomination
of
of
means
patients
with
it.
J
The
issue
that
ends
the
second
tier
and
so
on
and
I
just
wondered
millon
all
on
it's
all,
and
this
is
a
a
relatively
modest
change,
but
I
just
wondered
because
you
mentioned
that
the
bail
is
cost
cutting
another
medicine
involved.
What's
been
this
a
the
cumulative
sends
to
all
that
of
the
other
and
acts
and
and
regulations
that
that
have
been
passed
in
terms
of
impact
on
on
human
race
and
has
there
been
consultation
with
their
quality
and
human
rights
commission
and
the
Scottish
human
race?
J
The
particular
part
of
the
bow
and
kabat
second
duty
may
be
aware:
there's
been
some
concern
expressed
in
England
about
deaths
or
people
who
have
been
detained
under
the
legislation
and
has
doubled
since
last
year
and
I
haven't
seen
the
detail
of
Scotland.
So
is
there
anything
you
can
add
to
provide
some
assurance
around
that
there.
K
Has
been
consultation
with
a
range
of
bodies
about
this
and
and
all
of
us
would
be
very
cautious
here.
The
continued
provision
I
heard
Annabelle
viewings
last
question.
I've
cited
here,
your
full
question,
I
came
in
from
cabinet,
just
as
Michael
was
just
a
questions
being
answered,
and
there
has
been
I
think
an
agreement
that
this
is
needed,
but
it
it
cannot
be.
It
cannot
be
a
power
that
does
not
have
checks
well
as
balances.
The
checks
are,
the
continuation
is
Anabelle
indicated
of
the
witnessing
that's
to
take
place.
K
K
It
may
be
one
of
these
things
that
might
never
be
used
only
on
a
very
very
few
occasion,
because
it
is
possible
to
do
to
use
a
default
position,
but
if
it
is
not
possible
to
use
a
default
position,
then
there
is
a
problem
and
it
becomes
a
complication
in
to
be
blunt,
the
lives
of
people
who
don't
need
complications.
You
know
we
need
to
try
and
keep
this
as
as
seamless
as
smooth
as
as
untroubled
as
we
can
so
I
think
it's
a
it's
a
proportionate
power.
K
K
About
rushing
to
legislation,
the
difficulties
of
these
circumstances,
mr.
idak
key
element
and
the
key
element
is
reporting.
Here.
We've
made
a
very
strong
commitment
to
reporting
on
all
the
aspects
of
the
first
and
second
bill
and
on
the
aspects
of
the
powers
we
were
granted
under
the
LCM,
and
that
is
an
additional
check
and
reporting
every
two
months.
So
if
there
was
any
any
tendency
for
this
to
get
out
of
control,
there's
an
opportunity
to
look
at
it.
K
Every
two
months
now,
I've
been
working
on
the
issues
of
reporting
out
I
hope
to
bring
forward
some
suggestions
shortly,
which
will
which
will
give
the
committee,
as
well
as
the
chamber,
a
role
in
that
reporting.
So
there
is
an
additional
check
upon
what
is
happening,
we're
right
to
look
at.
They
were
right
to
look
at
it
very
carefully.
I
will
write
it.
J
Thank
you
just
briefly.
One
more
question
can
be
known.
The
the
part
one
kid
it
alone
supplement
and
the
Bellas
is
welcome
again
as
a
starting
point
and
the
conversation
about
we
is
that
young
kiddos
are
not
entitled
to
kill
each
other's
effort.
They
were
entitled
to
the
Cadell
in
supplement
and
like
Adams
Hall
chances.
Heights
he's
working,
Kaizen
and
managed
I've
had
inquiries
about
the
younger
students.
K
Course
I
mean
surely
hope
we'll
be
proposing.
This
will
be
talking
about
tomorrow
and
close
your
points
can
be
made
to
her.
You
know
it
would
it
would
be
nice
to
do
everything
that
we
want
to
do.
It
is
very
tough
to
do
you'll
be
in
the
circumstances
where
resources
are
very
tight
with
the
Scottish
Parliament
does
not
have
the
boiling
powers,
we
need
them
some
of
the
tools.
We
need
to
do
these
things,
so
there
are
always
compromises
to
be
made,
but
I
think
the
care
is
coronavirus.
Proud
is
a
big
step
forward.
K
What
else
can
be
done?
I
think
is
up
to
Shirley
and
to
have
conversation
about
that.
We're
absolutely
aware
of
the
enormous
least
strong
role
of
young
carers.
I
think
there
are
other
ways
in
which
we
can
need
to
recognize
that
and
build
on
it,
but
there
are
areas
which
I
think
it's
always
best
to
D
and
to
leave
to
somebody
else's
portfolio
and
I'm
sure
she
will
want
to
discuss.
That's
one.
A
I
Yes,
thank
you
convenor,
good
morning,
counter
secretary
interested
in
the
issue
of
time
scale
for
the
exploration
of
provisions
in
the
Bell
you
mentioned
at
the
start
and
then
an
answer
to
a
couple.
The
questions
I,
don't
know
if
you
call
in
our
previous
session
and
Annabel
Ewing
had
highlighted
that
some
of
the
practical
changes
that
are
being
made
here,
for
example,
about
production
of
court
documents
on
websites
rather
than
physical
on
the
walls
and
the
courts,
might
be
the
kind
of
things
that
we
want
to
keep.
K
K
Get
to
this
position
and
we
put
in
place
things
which
have
not
been
able
to
have
the
the
detailed
level
of
scrutiny
that
you
and
I
and
the
committee
and
others
would
like
to
see.
If
we
are
then
to
make
some
of
these
things
longer-lasting,
then
we
need
to
consider
two
things.
What
further
scrutiny
should
we
give
to
them
because
they
may
be
able
to
be
improved
and
are
they
working
as
we
intended
them
to
work,
in
which
case
they
may
also
need
to
be
improved,
so
the
short
and
clear
answer
would
be.
K
The
bill
expires.
The
powers
expire
in
all
this
legislation
on
the
30th
of
September.
That's
it
all
the
powers
expire.
If
they
can
be
the
new
twice,
it
may
well
be
during
the
reporting
process
that
you,
you
know
me
and
others
say
gosh,
that's
where
rather
well.
You
know
to
take
an
example.
You
know
to
display
of
documents
on
the
walls
of
the
court.
You
know
I'm
not
respecting
it,
but
it
does
seem
not
quite
as
relevant.
You
know
as
having
them
on
the
website.
K
K
And
the
Parliament
says
we
want
to
do
that,
and
we
need
to
find
a
way
to
do
so,
but
I
don't
want
to
say
that
anything
that
we're
doing
now
lasts
beyond
the
cutoff
date,
because
that
would
be
to
do
something
greater
than
we
have
said.
But
you
know
bankruptcy
is
an
example.
I
mean
we
are
going
to
have
the
legacy
of
this
for
a
long
time.
So
it
may
well
be
that
we
would
want
to
look
at
what
we
could
do
to
help
that
process
beyond
the
ultimate
cutoff
date.
I
A
I
Thank
you
and
just
one
more
question,
and
again
it
goes
back
to
something
that
you
marked
on
earlier
and
your
message,
hoping
that
this
would
be
the
last
of
the
emergency
bells
and
there
is
further
work
to
be
done
around
the
issue
of
storm
trials
and
the
rule
of
juries
and
in
discussion
with
law
society.
This
morning,
we've
picked
up
that
you're.
There
presidents
now
be
nice
to
be
involved
in
a
working
group
on
and
the
facilitation
of
court
appearances
SEO,
for
example,
from
from
police
stations.
I
It's
a
facility
of
virtual
appearances
and
the
issues
around
that,
and
so
what
I'm
interested
in
is
what
will
require
further
change
their
primary
legislation
and,
if
you're
not
in
visiting
further
emergency
bills,
but
we're
expecting
one
particular
further
feller
injustice.
Do
you
have
an
idea
yet
of
M
what
will
be
included
and
in
that
justice
about
the
be
brought
forward,
and
should
we
be
expecting
a
number
of
individuals,
smaller
pieces
of
primary
legislation
to
be
brought
forward.
K
Make
the
unforeseen
means
unforeseen
I
mean
it
may
well
be
that
something
come
forward.
As
I
said
earlier,
I
understand,
there's
a
judicially,
led
group
set
up
under
lady
Thorian
today
to
look
at
some
of
the
issues
of
doing
issues.
It
may
well
be
that
they
would
recommend
primary
legislation
I
don't,
but
if
they
did,
that
would
have
to
be
expedited
at
least
and
possibly
emergency
legislation.
There
may
be
other
things
coming
along
which
we
will
have
to
react
to
it.
K
I
am
saying
that
the
the
sort
of
portfolio
bills
that
I've,
which
is
a
specter
that
I've
been
coordinating
I,
am
not
immediately
going
to
say
to
the
bill
team.
Here's
the
third
one
coming
along
I
think
we've
done
the
trolls
that
we
needed
to
do.
We've
told
the
opposition
parties
about
what
they
want,
but,
of
course,
if
we
find
ourselves
a
situation
that
we
needed
to
do
something
urgently,
we
do
it.
A
D
Thank
you
and
I
think
the
the
mental
welfare
issues
probably
being
covered
so
I'll
just
ask
a
couple
of
questions
that
own
Decatur's
alone
supplement.
First
of
all
of
the
welcoming
the
nineteen
point,
two
million
and
the
the
recognition
I
think
magic
Fisher's
at
this
time.
I
want
to
know
that
you
said
surely
on
Somerville
Bessette
note
about
more
detail
but
I'm
assuming
given
the
cutoff
for
the
the
bill
and
the
legislation
is
the
end
of
September
that
this
is
a
one-off
payment.
D
However,
is
it
would
it
be
the
government's
intention
to
keep
this
under
review?
Should
we
end
up
in
a
very
prolonged
period
of
dealing
with
Corvette
and
limpid
carers,
essentially
dealing
with
covert
and
those
additional
pressures
and
killing
responsibilities
that
they
may
have?
Is
that
something
the
government
would
keep
under
review
and
around
potentially
a
further
payment
at
a
later
date?
D
K
Iii
can't
commit
my
colleague
or
the
government
to
you
additional
expenditure.
All
I
can
say
is
that
the
intention
is
to
have
the
the
one-off
payment
in
June.
This
was
in
in
addition
to
the
carers
allowance.
This
is
here
to
learn,
supplement
for
the
Karoo
back
the
virus
and
the
timescale.
We're
working
to,
of
course,
will
be
extended,
and
it
may
well
be
that
your
whole
range
of
thing
with
financial
help
will
have
to
return
to
that
will
be
dictated.
K
Available
to
us
I
think
you
have
to
treat
there
says
as
a
one-off
I
think
it'd
be
unfair
to
people
to
say
everything
else,
but
of
course,
you're
entitled
to
raise
the
point
and
I'm
sure
you
know
the
cabinet
secretary
will
want
to
think
about
that.
To
respond
to
that
point
within
the
limit
of
her
abilities
financially,
you
yourself
have
been
in
those
circumstances
financially,
and
you
know
it's
always
tough.
D
No
I
think
that's
that's
helpful.
I
think
it's
absolutely
right
to
be
to
be
clear
with
people
who
are
around
are
like
that.
That's
only
fair.
Is
it
also
fair
to
say
that
in
relation
to
caterers
who
are
not
in
receipt
of
caterers,
illumines
that
some
of
the
other
supports
that
have
been
made
available,
such
as
the
additional
funding
for
the
this
for
the
Welfare
Fund,
could,
if
authorities
to
which
he
used
to
support
those
cater,
don't
know,
there's
been
a
an
additional
level
of
discretion
given
to
local
authorities,
I,
don't
that
it
just.
K
Absolutely
you
but
unpaid
carers
who
wanted
to
see
you
cancel
as
there
are
a
number
of
other
routes.
You
write
to
say
the
Scottish
welfare
one
fund
is
one
of
those
routes.
The
crisis,
grants
and
Community
Care
Grants
and
indicated
that
people
have
been
doing
that.
We
would
urge
people
to
apply
for
what
they're
entitled
and
we
would
want
them
to
have
that.
K
It
is
really
essential
that
we
help
people
as
much
as
possible,
but
there
will
be
people
as
there
is
in
every
scheme
that
we're
operating
presently
there
will
be
people
who
fall
outside
it
who
do
not
qualify
for
it.
I'm
quite
sure
you
in
the
work
you're
doing
in
your
constituency,
as
I
am
doing
here
in
my
constituency,
are
trying
to
find
ways
in
which
individuals
can
qualify
even
if
they
failed
to
get.
You
know
the
ground
that
they
first
gone
forth.
I
would
say
that
you
know
EE
selector
cares.
K
D
That
that's
very
helpful
would
certainly
be
beside
just
finally
and
you'll
be
aware
that
the
cabinet
sector
for
health
has
written
to
mette
about
a
stage
2
amendment
pitting
beyond
doubt
that
health
boards
and
other
bodies
have
the
powers
to
purchase
a
care
home
or
care
in
home
service.
If
the
service
is
unable
to
continue,
and
is
that
something
the
government
and
is
bringing
forward
and
in
the
light
of
some
of
the
challenges
and
the
pandemic,
and
or
is
it
something
just
for
Belton
Bernice's?
K
I'm
still
in
process
a
discussion
with
Jim
Freeman
about
the
detail
of
that,
but
I'm
glad
that
the
committee
has
been
as
it
should
be,
notified
of
the
thinking.
That's
going
on.
I
think
it
is
both
the
things
you
suggest.
It
is
up
to
make
absolutely
certain
that
the
existing
powers
can
be
used
when
they
are
required.
K
It
is
sort
of
polishing
them
down
and
making
sure
they're
there,
but
it
is
also
sharpening
them
so
that
they
can
come
into
use
quickly
if
they
are
required
and
I
think
there
is
a
feeling
that
there
are
circumstances
that
may
arise
in
which
they
could
be
required.
There
should
be
no
question,
then,
of
delay.
We
should
be
able
to
move
as
quickly
as
possible.
C
Thank
you
convene
a
good
morning,
cabinet
secretary
I'm
interested
in
the
thinking
behind
a
section
of
the
bill
to
do
with
land
and
buildings
transaction
tax,
and
that
extends
the
time
that
people
would
have
to
sell
those
old
homes
without
attracting
the
second
home
tax
and
in
England.
I'm,
led
to
believe
that
that
was
the
case.
That
people
had
three
years
to
sell
up
even
before
coronavirus
and
bill
proposes
an
extension
which
obviously
will
be
welcome
news
to
many.
C
But
it
still
doesn't
allow
quite
enough
tie
or
quite
as
much
breathing
space
as
it
allowed
in
England
and
there'll
be
many
people
who,
through
no
fault
of
their
own,
are
unable
to
sell
their
old
homes,
especially
in
areas
where
property
markets
are
slower,
like
the
islands
and
that
can
cause
real
anxiety.
So,
and
the
cabinet
secretary
explained
what
the
thinking
is
in
choosing
these
small
of
these
specific
time
frames
and
did
the
government
consider
taking
it
to
the
same
level
as
England
I.
K
Think
the
the
decision
was
made
on
the
basis
of
what
appeared
to
be
in
discussion
with
with
stakeholders
was
a
reasonable
period
of
extension.
You
can't
extend
perpetually.
There
is
an
issue
here
about.
You
know
the
a
tax
that
is
due
to
be
paid,
and
you
can't
avoid
that
forever,
but
it
is.
It
is
another
of
those
issues,
you
know
a
bankruptcy
and
that
issue
it's
an
issue
where
you
make
a
judgement.
You
know
whether
you
should
this
should
be
a
whether
you
should
expand
it.
They
call
it.
K
Property
market
is
different
from
the
property
markets
at
the
pointer.
The
sums
involved
are
actually
smaller.
If
you
buy
and
large,
then
there
would
be
as
the
border.
So
you
know
we
make
our
own
decisions
about
those
matters.
If
members
wish
to
bring
suggestions
for
different
figures,
then
clearly
that
would
be
part
of
the
debate,
but
it
is
a
compromise.
It
is
a
compromise
between
you
know
not
having
income
that
is
required,
and
the
rights
and
difficulty
is
that
those
selling
properties
would
have
don't
move.
K
F
Thank
You,
convener
and
Gavin.
It's
actually
I've
just
got
one
single
issue
in
today's
and
it's
essentially
a
drafting,
but
it
touches
a
bit
on
policy
as
well.
It's
quite
cold,
so
do
forgive
me
I'm
looking
at
the
electronic
signature
of
forms
in
relation
to
the
bank
and
in
particular
at
Section
10b,
where
he
we
amend
the
the
Electronic
Communications
Act
2000
electronic
signatures
and
related
certificates
by
including
a
version
of
an
electronic
signature
which
is
repre
document
as
far
as
I
can
determine
and,
of
course,
I'm
a
layperson,
but
the
law
society
didn't
suggest.
F
I
was
wrong
and
I
put
this
to
them.
This
is
a
novel
provision.
There
are
provisions,
for
example,
in
the
bankruptcy
Scotland
regulations,
2016
2
2,
which
says
that
anything
that
can
be
done
on
paper
can
be
done
electronically,
but
the
primary
reference
that
this
bit
of
the
bill
makes
is
to
the
electronic
communications
at
each
section,
certainly
and
sections
that
makes
no
reference
of
any
kind
to
paper
and
in
particular
it
requires
that
the
be
certification
of
any
such
a
Letran
signature,
no
I'm
just
going
to
get
techie
for
a
brief.
F
You
lose
that
link
between
the
representation
of
the
document
and
the
signature
it's
associated
in
so
far
they're
verifying
whether
change
in
the
body
of
the
document
has
not
taken
place.
Awareness
the
whole
electronic
signatures
to
prevent
that
happening
and
I.
Just
wonder
if
what
the
drafter
has
actually
been
intending
to
cover
is
a
pictorial
representation
of
what
the
law
societies
described
as
a
wet
signature,
which
is
in
an
electronic
system
and
then
removed
and
put
on
paper
or
was
it
meant
to
be
that
way?
F
A
Thank
You
mr.
Stevenson
Thank
You
mr.
Rosen.
For
that
refreshingly,
honest
answer
to
that
last
question:
can
I
I
think
I
think
we
seem
to
have
lost
a
little
Ewing
for
the
time
being,
I'm
hoping
we
can
maybe
get
our
back
in
the
meantime
right,
maybe
he's
asked
another
question
about
an
issue
has
not
been
raised
so
far
in
this
station
was
not
covered
in
the
bill,
but
an
issue
I've
raised
previously
in
debate
with
you
in
correspondence
and
as
the
issue
around
and
relaxing
and
the
licensing
laws.
A
At
the
moment
it
is
not
possible
to
purchase
of
sales
alcohol
in
supermarkets
before
10
o'clock
in
the
morning.
There
is
very
good
reason
why
we
have
these
licensing
laws
in
place,
but,
of
course
that
does
put
an
unreasonable
restriction
on
those
individuals
who
can
only
carry
out
their
shopping
in
the
early
hours
of
day
and
I'm
talking
about
people
who
might
be
involved
in
groups
or
indeed
NHS
workers,
many
of
whom
find
themselves
in
the
situation
work
the
large
supermarket
chains.
A
Indeed,
some
of
the
smaller
comedian
stores
have
set
aside
difficult
times
for
them
before
9
o'clock
in
the
morning.
So
they're
not
coming
into
contact
with
others,
which
is
a
bit
very
reasonable
and
responsible
thing
to
do,
but
it
does
become
a
disadvantage
because
it
means
they
cannot
purchase
alcohol
with
their
weekly
shop
and
if
they
want
to
purchase
alcohol,
they
have
to
come
back
into
the
show.
Another
time
when
is
busier,
and
it
does
seem
rather
unfair
to
those
individuals
but
they're
left
at
that
disadvantage.
K
Thank
you,
yes,
that
you
have
them.
You
have
referred
to
this
in
the
chamber
and
I
know
you
have
spoken
to
me
about
it
mean
I
have
asked
for
advice
on
this
and
I
have
considered
it,
and
I
know
that
the
relevant
health
ministers
have
considered
it
and
I
think
the
balance
of
opinion
has
been
that
whilst
there
was
a
concern
about
the
start
of
the
dedicated.
K
Is
I
think
what
you're
referring
to
where
people
were
able
to
do
so
that
seems
to
have
fallen
away
quite
substantially
and
certainly
I
haven't
received
anything
on
it
for
some
weeks.
There
was
also
the
view
that
given
Scot
his
relationship
with
alcohol,
extending
licensing
hours
wasn't
something
we
would
want
to
do.
I
think
some
of
the
stakeholder
groups
made
that
pretty
clear,
I
think
the
last
time
you
races
in
the
chamber
and
I
I
indicated
that
it
was,
of
course
something
that
should
be
discussed.
They
were,
they
were
quite
clear
about
it.
K
F
F
Advocated
by
BT
and
I
believe
the
arguments
he
deployed
a
time
are
ones
which
I
would
wish
to
know
you.
Having
seen
how
it's
all
happened,
continue
to
adhere
to
the
fact
that
we're
in
a
lot
then
really
doesn't
change.
The
argument
in
relation
to
the
support
I
know
that
we
are
an
important
manufacturer
as
a
nation
alcohol,
but
our
consumption
continues
to
be
a
matter
of
some
concern
and
I
would
be
very
reluctant
to
see
this
brought
back
at
this
stage,
especially
as
it
would
create
that
longer-term.
F
A
A
H
H
So
if
I'm
sticking
to
repeat
or
grind,
please
know
my
first
issue
concerned
the
issue
of
the
local
connection
in
terms
of
referrals
between
local
authorities,
regardless
applications
and
the
there's
a
provision
in
the
bill
back
the
ministerial
statement
that
was
to
have
been
produced
for
November
2020,
which
in
turn
was
to
be
preceded
by
a
statutory
consultation,
and
this
has
been
put
back
to
me
2021
and
it's
just
really
two
linear
equations
on
that.
Is
it
the
case?
Well,
first
of
all,
what
are
the
reasons
for
that?
H
A
A
K
A
H
Who
explained,
therefore,
what
will
be
the
situation
on
the
ground
in
the
interim
I
think
that
would
be
where
people
might
have
the
concern?
What
will
happen
between
now
and
then
and
what
is
happening
and
my
other
issue,
if
I
may
then
for
the
cabinet
secretary
and
again,
I'm
not
entirely
sure
if
this
has
been
raised
as
the
provision
on
non-domestic
rates
and
there's
the
possibility
of
introducing
a
retrospective
that
rate
relief
during
the
course
of
this
financial
year
and
I.
H
K
Have
to
say
that
not
even
for
Annabelle
Ewing
am
I
prepared
to
go
to
the
length
of
seeing
what
the
government's
intentions
were.
Not
that
I
know
it
is
a
power
I
think
which
we
have
all
thought
requires
to
be
there,
because
it
must
be
in
the
armoury
of
PARs
that
we
need
to
have
do
to
support
businesses,
but
I
have
no.
H
A
Thank
you.
Oh
I'm.
Sorry
we
missed
you
earlier.
You
felt
out
of
it.
I
do
the
conversation
I,
don't
see
any
other
members
wishing
to
come
back
in
with
any
further
points
at
this
stage,
in
which
case
I
think
I
can
just.
Finally,
the
cabinet
secretary
have
lutely
brightly
for
their
evidence
today
has
been
very
helpful
session.
Thank
you
for
that.
We
will
now
move
into
private
session.
Consider
the
evidence
heard
on
the
terms
of
our
response
to
the
wider
Parliament
and
all
that
by
suspending
et.
Thank
you.