Token Engineering Commons Parameters Working Group, 27 Jan 2021

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From YouTube: W6 Parameters WG: Models, Tokenlog and explaining the process

Description

Timecodes:
00:00 - What Parameter in the Hatch is going to be most influential for your vote?
10:57 - Ygg explain the models and go through the parameters
35:29 - Tokenlog
40:55 - Jake/Griff explain the process
43:55 - Closing round.

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A

And I'm gonna share my screen right now. Let me know uh everybody got it good, got it good all right, tec, params vote, call welcome to it all right, but before we get into this, I'm just going to read you a real great outcome of all of this is that we are potentially helping community members who may have never used github or dao's or cad cad take part in token engineering. They will get to have a choice in their economy. The opening questioning to all of you is when voting. Everyone has their top issues.

A

There is no difference here. What parameter in the hatch is going to be the most influential for your vote. I'll start with myself.

A

um Just because simply I just want to make sure there's always enough people taking place so support required minimum core. I want to make sure we actually do it and I'll pass it to ygg.

B

uh Thanks jake, uh can you so is it a question? Can you repeat the question?

B

uh Is it selecting.

C

B

Is the most influential to my vote.

C

Yeah, I I so I I wrote the question and thinking of like politics in general. You know like when you vote. You know everyone has their core issue like oh.

D

I'm okay, life.

C

Or pro-choice or I'm.

B

C

Economic decisions that the government makes are the most important and I only support people that think this way so could.

B

Likely be like a support required or minimum quorum, those are so pivotal in the decision making process.

B

So so someone would have the the whole template of parameters in front of them at this point and have gone through them and and uh played with them and seen the visualizations and.

B

Sweet, we should put some images. We should put some screenshots in here jake.

A

You're, muted jake all of your models, that's we're talking about.

B

I think so for context unless I've um sorry, I didn't read the agenda notes for this I'll. Let you keep going jake, okay,.

A

We're gonna, I'm gonna pass off to griff griff. You pick your favorite one. That would influence your vote.

C

Yeah, so uh just so, you guys know, there's there's a a list of all the different parameters that are in the hatch. uh It's the implementation, spec and there's short explanations of what they are. So I'm sure a lot of you guys, don't don't know this, but uh um the key parameter.

C

For me, I I mean ygg mentioned it: the minimum, the minimum goal, which is pretty huge, but the one that I think wouldn't be mentioned uh that I want to put in uh are basically the impact hour math, uh especially the uh there's, like one variable, that's poorly named called expected uh impact hour rate, or something like that.

C

um I actually think it's really really important the shape of the impact hour curve and that because I want to make sure that the people who are putting in the elbow grease here get rewarded fairly and that the cultural tribute uh percent is also like not so high for the people. I I feel like that's like the complicated space here, and I really uh that's the thing I'm going to be. Judging everybody's uh parameters on yeah cultural, build tribute and impact hours uh reward so I'll pass it to.

C

Let's go with uh olivia.

D

I actually, um I would actually pick impact hours too, because I think it validates the cultural build and it's the the most like community ownership type of parameter that it should be very valued since we are having all of this work previously.

D

Like all this work, to build the dao before the hatch um and I'll pass to huanka.

E

Thanks libby, can you hear me, can you hear me? Yes, yes,.

B

Loud and clear.

E

Okay, thank you. Well, I would say uh impact hours as well, um because um I think it's like a a very good application of distribution of wealth that um we are doing and that um it should be um continued and improved and I'll pass. Two.

E

F

Thank you everyone for me. One important hatch parameter is the funding pool because- and we are going to maintain, that funding pool, because I mean the whole thing is working on that. So if we don't have phones in there, yeah, that's not good. So I think we have really to think carefully on how we fund it and how we and keep it going.

A

Who do you want to pass it to zeb.

F

Oh yeah, sorry I'll pass it to ytg.

B

Thanks zep, um I'm back in the game. Now I got the resource open in front of me. I'm also sharing my screen so I'll try to follow along that the ones that people are going over. So I found a really interesting one when I was uh putting together the the parameter dashboard and playing with these something that I didn't think about too much before.

B

In fact, I had written the the blog, uh the the forum post on it, and I thought it was quite simple, but as I got to move it around, it got me thinking more and it was the tollgate fee. uh It's a pretty interesting dynamic.

B

I mean what, if we made it because it's it's I'd, say it's: it plays with the uh support required and minimum quorum because remember, minimum quorum is the percentage of all that have to say yes and support required is a percentage of the voting tokens that have to say yes, not all the tokens, um but the tolgie tool gate fee is how expensive it is to um actually put a vote forward to put a proposal forward, and so we could turn this right up to 100 wx die, and that would be an really interesting case.

B

Maybe even hatchers would have to like pull money to make it to like contribute like we might have to pool uh resources to get to a very sophisticated um proposal that the whole community wants to move forward with, and then it's interesting to think. uh Where does this tollgate fee go right? I think it goes into the reserve, um but that's something we always have to go back and check the specification.

C

B

So it's really interesting.

C

It goes, it goes to the non-redeemable pool so uh yeah. It's like effectively a donation to the te commons.

B

Yeah right right, so I think it would be cool. So this one in the models that I put together is just a simple widget. It doesn't really change anything, but it would be interesting. uh The cad, cad modeling could come next and model, some interactions between, say, toll gate fee and support required minimum quorum and, like sentiment, member hatcher sentiment.

B

So I I picked this one okay, so I'm gonna pass it over to um let's see, uh I forget your name, kinshasa did you go yet.

G

uh I did not yet yeah, I'm garrett, I go by gary.

B

G

Whatever reason.

B

Yeah I go by ygg for whatever reason.

G

Great, uh you know what would impact my.

G

What do, I think, is the most important.

G

I guess the period I I'm not sure I guess I'm not more, of a fly on the wall today. I have no idea what uh I would do a weight more than another. um I guess I like this toll gate idea and that you've got a threshold to get serious proposals out. um So it's not just anything but.

G

Yeah- so I guess put me down for that sorry, I don't have as much intelligent commentary to add, but this is really. This is cool.

B

Well, the hatch period is a really interesting one. That's how long the hatch is open to collect funds super easy.

G

A

All right, thank you. Okay and again, yeah that uh test hatch implementation specification is up and it's right there in the forum. uh It's really a great piece, and it's all right there for you to understand as we move on uh to our agenda as we go over each thing, uh when we're done we'll give everybody two to five minutes and around robin. If you have questions or comments, so, let's get to it how to propose for hatch parameters.

A

Well, first of all, everyone needs to understand your impact, our tokens and where you can find them uh your impact hour, tokens or iht uh are on the x die chain, of course. So when you open up your uh wallet, you're going to want to make sure you're on the exit chain- and you should already have them because I've been distributing them- they have to do exactly with your impact hours. So, whatever you have for impact hours, you will have in direct correlation impact our tokens.

A

They are also when we get to toy log. They are match 50 50 with quadratic body. Now, with that, I'm gonna pass it to griff, and he can explain you a little bit more about what we're doing there.

A

Or not so I can keep going.

C

I was just doing my hair, so you know uh but uh yeah.

A

I noticed that that's just.

C

Lovely thanks for joining the party bud come on you, gotta, look good uh anyway, uh so token, log, um I'm very excited about token log, and the idea here is that we will be able to create an issue that represents your own proposal for parameters. This is a lot of. It is based off of ygg's work. In fact, maybe before I go in the token log, it might make more sense to let ygg talk about uh how to use the cad cad models, and then then, I think token log might make more sense.

B

Okay, okay, okay, so like this can be simplified, but you can find how to do it here. So we go to uh github, slash te commons right now we look at the lab, um so I'm just going to go t e comments.

C

Igg all right, yeah you're, sharing like both screens, is it possible to really share. It's part.

B

It's hard to do that on discord, but the easiest way is I'm just going to unplug. My other monitor.

C

Sorry, oh yeah, that works.

B

C

B

Oh yeah, I know all the tricks I had so many technical issues. This morning it was crazy. My computer went boop, my keyboard wasn't working, uh my phone went log into gmail. It was a weird morning just one of those days. You know okay, so um here we have the tech, the tech labs, the tec labs. um So you can find this pinned.

B

It should be pinned in the tec labs channel also available from the notion workspace for the labs, that's uh pinned in the channel there, and um so these are the instructions to run so this works on a linux terminal or on a mac or in sort of a linux environment, or you can use the windows, github, client um and there's a demo of how to do this. A recorded session from the very first lab, that's posted in the lab youtube playlist, uh so you can find that if it everything I'll mention is connected.

B

So usually, if you follow the link at the top it'll, take you to like a forum post or take you to a notion workspace, and you can always find your way to the youtube uh playlist to see all the labs. um So these are the instructions. Now what I'm just gonna run this locally. I'm not gonna expect everyone to do it right now. What needs to be done is the this readme needs to be moved over to the dedicated repository that we've made, which is called token log hatch params.

B

So I'm just going to make a new issue now uh that says um migrate.

B

A good readme file from the tec, labs repository for instructions to run.

C

um And there will- and there will be a good way to do this through the ui as well right like without well.

B

We can terminal.

C

B

Yeah well, what we want to do is we want to. We want to launch this as a web. App is the best way to do it. I'll show you, how I'll show you how we can do that in a moment, um good, so I'll make that issue now when I go in here, so I'm doing the handoff on friday in the labs. So I you know I wasn't. This is I'm a little on the spot here, but that's fine, so I just activate my virtual environment to get all my python things.

B

This might seem intimidating, but it ends up being pretty simple um and then I open up uh jupiter lab.

B

So all you got to do is get to this place, so it's just get cloning and then lab to run it as a lab, but we can skip all of this if it's deployed as a web app.

C

That's amazing oig. I forgot you said that we're just going to make a website where people can do this. That's that's genius.

B

Yeah I'll need a little bit of help deploying that, but it's ah it's not so hard. I can actually use this program called ngrok where like, if I, if we just needed it up even for like an hour, I can just run it on my computer here and use a program called ngrok to make it a public domain.

C

We'll get help for you we'll get help to do that. No problem.

B

Okay, so I run this, so you know I've. All you have to do in python is install I've actually taken all the code and put it in this tech dot pi. So this is pretty cool. This is all modularized. These are classes, so we've got dandelion voting uh at the hatch uh impact hours formula and uh the impact hour uh hours data, and so these have functions for loading data and visualizing it and processing it and uh shout out to sam and griff for the beautiful formula for the impact hours.

B

But um this this is a this is still a prototype. This will probably evolve a lot over time, but we just simply import it here. So in python you just have your dependencies installed, which you'll see in the readme is like the pip install step or on windows. You use conda, but I'm in a my virtual environment. So I have everything installed.

B

This can even be put on a google colab too. We can just run this on a google collab.

B

So there's uh these the visualizations I'll just give you show you them all at first and when you go through them slowly it makes sense. So this is actually our accumulated impact hour, so you can play with these widgets. So you say um this: this is the historical data up to january 15th, and the blue line is the projected future of impact hours based on our past trajectory, and this is based on the modeling that griff did in excel is quite nice, and then this is like an optimistic uh pace of impact hours.

B

If it grows linearly, we'd rather have them grow linearly than take off exponentially, um but you can kind of anticipate how many empowered hours you think will end up or or the general project will end up having in the end.

B

This is the impact hours reward formula. It needs to be refactored a bit, but there's a few key concepts here that actually go into the protocol, and it's it's these two it it's this one that we're playing around with. It was called expected impact hour, raise rate, something like that. um I just put for now raise horizon because it's you know griff said just call it shape of the curve it's the shape of the curve parameter and that that makes sense because it really is the shape of the curve.

B

But um I thought like raise it's: how much we raise how much we anticipate raising and the more we it's like. How strict are we on ourselves? It's how slow the impact hour rate grows. It's the slowness.

C

Beautiful moon.

B

Yeah, so it's like how much we, how much we're shooting for with our rays um and then the maximum impact hour rate. This is uh a max threshold, so it's like say we raised tens of millions of die. um Then we don't really need to be paid like a thousand die per hour for our impact hours. We say like no matter how much we raise we'd have hard cap on our impact hours. So this is the test hatch. So these numbers are all for matching the test hatch.

B

So our maximum impact, our rate goes from like 0.01 to 10., and uh then you know these target rays maximum rays. These can even be refactored out, there's a little bit of complexities here that don't necessarily need to be here this. We could probably slim down a couple of these widgets, which would be nice in the end, but we get some modeling of the funding pool and cultural tribute. We get the target impact hour rate and expected empire rate, but we're simplifying this down. It's just going to be target.

B

All this expected stuff is going to be out the window. It's just going to be the actual model itself plus a target, and then we get based on the parameters the expected payout given impact hours. So this is like the super juicy part. Everyone can scroll down here and see your name and based on the parameters and projected.

B

Raise how much everyone's going to get paid and I'm going through this quite fast now I go if you want to really get caught up and see it in slow detail, there's a lot more detail in the lab session that was recorded this past friday.

B

Should I keep going.

C

Yes, please yeah.

A

C

Just gonna say: does anybody.

A

Have any quick questions or comments? Otherwise, just go.

B

Does everyone see your name.

B

Okay, so that's a fun one. This can be deployed as.

D

A website pretty.

B

Simple okay, so this is the actual hatch. This is kind of cool. We have the total c stack tokens, and this is based on data. This is a real number, but this data was sampled. You know maybe a month ago or so um the hatch oracle ratio. This is for every c stack token that you hold. This is how much x die you're allowed to invest into the hatch.

B

So if you have one x die you set it at one. Then you can. uh Oh sorry, you have one c stack token you set this to one, then you can invest. One wrapped x die now. If you set this to one, it says: okay, here's the top hundred c stack token holders. It's. Basically, the distribution of c stack token holders um this, and this is like a ranking so index zero. Is the person with the most c stack tokens, so I use the example. I'm pretty sure it's griff green.

B

I haven't double checked this in the data, but griff is either one or two but he's up there, and this is actually capped. So there's a nice I implemented here. What is uh to be happening in the protocol, which is c stack?

B

Token distribution gets capped at 10 per individual, so there's two people um that have more than ten percent of all the c stack tokens, so uh they get capped at 10 and the whole distribution just gets like kind of renormalized, so everyone gets a slightly larger um amount, which is pretty cool, so this is given that 10 cap, this is the distribution, so you can see there's like uh 20, you know very active c stack token holders. 40 active. You know, you know this is the top hundred. So it's pretty interesting um now.

B

What are these different colors on the graph? So first of all, blue is our target rays, so this is this is, um and this is the amount that each c-stack token holder would have to invest out of their max capacity. If every c-stack token holder invested as much as possible, then that would be a target raise of of one, and that means that in this case there would be a total of seven hundred and eleven thousand x distinct.

B

um The average c stack holder would have invested two thousand seven hundred and eighty x die.

B

um There would be 35 000 x. Die in the hatch tribute is that the non-redeemable, that's the non-redeemable reserve, I believe, and then we have the redeemable reserve, which is.

C

uh I think it's the other way around.

B

C

35 000 is the redeemable reserve and the non-redeemable is the 600.

B

Yeah, so this I'll make another github issue to match. I want to match all these to the specification so that it's so clear or see how to implement this other thing that comes with this panel library, which is doc strings.

B

That could be so useful, but I haven't been able to get them to render yet there's got to be some way.

B

And so we have the cap raise the target, raise the max goal, uh the min goal. So this is how much will be raised. The threshold raised to allow the protocol to go forward with the hatch and if the min goal is not met, uh everything is, is the hatch tribute non-redeemable in the case that we don't meet the min goal.

C

If we no, no, if we meet the main goal, then it's all redeemable then well it then it's all sent back well, it's all all the money is claimed back. There is no hatch tribute until we hit the mingle.

B

Oh here's. The hatch tribute.

C

So if we hit the main goal, then the hatch tribute applies, but if we are less than the main goal, then everyone who puts money into the hatch gets their money back and the project doesn't start.

B

Yeah: okay, yeah! That's what I thought that makes a lot of sense.

C

So graph is still correct because the main goal, um if it hits it, then the hedge tribute applies the main thing, and this is really also first optimus. The main thing to think about here is that the funding pool is not necessarily the hatch tribute here, so the funding pool amount will be decided on the commons upgrade and the hatch tribute kind of just guaran. It's more like a forced donation.

C

By to everyone who uh contributes to the hatch to the commons upgrade and.

D

C

Thing here with the hatch tribute is that whatever goes to the hatch tribute is not redeemable by people with tc tokens uh if they don't like.

B

Oh yeah, that's right.

C

If people don't like the economy, that's chosen in the commons upgrade for the bonding curve and conviction voting. Then they can actually turn in their tec tokens their tc hatch tokens and get back the money that's in the redeemable pool. But there will be this other pool where the toll gate fee goes and where the hatch tribute goes, that they cannot redeem from.

B

It's like your auntie when you're playing poker, you know the non. Even if you fold you gotta pick up the ante.

F

That's awesome. Thank you for clarifying grief. That's awesome.

C

Yeah and and auntie is a great name for it. Maybe we should change it from hatch tribute to auntie. That's a really good name.

B

Something to think about, I would.

C

Really definitely.

B

Yeah anti that's interesting, definitely can be used as a metaphor like in a paper or something it would be a perfect analogy, um and the funding pool certainly needs to be renamed this. This is kind of what griff was saying. This isn't the funding pool. This is a this is a redeemable reserve that is moving towards the phase two of the hatch.

B

um Yeah, so these numbers here are actually this is the scale that each c-stack token holder would invest. So the max capacity with these parameters that griff green could invest into this hatch would be just over. Eighty thousand uh wrapped x die and a lot of people could invest up to twenty thousand uh wrapped x die, so we're using. I use this geometric mean here, because this is what's called. It's actually called the power distribution because it grows by powers uh like exponentially and so to find sort of the middle point we take.

B

The geometric mean it works out nicely, and so what this says is your your average covester c stack holder for for these results to raise this much um seven hundred thousand x di staked.

B

You know um thirty five thousand non-redeemable moving forward to phase two of the hatch your average co-investor would put in 2783 wrapped x die, but this is a geometric distribution. So we would expect some people to put put in around 10 times this amount, so 27 000 and some people to quite a few people to put in one tenth of this amount. So about twenty seven hundred two hundred and seventy.

B

To get to get these results and make around 22 billion tech tokens, but you can play with that parameter. That's the exchange rate.

B

This is the fun one because it actually doesn't change the math at all everything it's all normalized away. Always it only changes. What the number on the screen will be when people are buying and selling these and evaluating the the tokens.

B

So it'll be interesting to see what the what community members would hatch members pick for this parameter.

B

And finally, this is my favorite one. This is the dandelion voting.

B

um So, given what you select here for your parameters, it'll determine the total number of tokens.

H

B

B

Okay, so support required sixty percent yeah. Definitely these widgets need matching documentation so either we should expect people to sort of have the tech spec open side by side or we gotta embed. If we turn this into a web app, we can make a lot of beautiful documentation actually so so.

C

Yeah those little tool tips or like the little eye.

B

Oh yeah, oh yeah, look into that.

C

I I think it's fine for the web app and you can keep the cad cad model simple.

B

Nice, so this is, uh I kind of want to bring this up. This is a conversation griffin I had he said: is this cad cad modeling and at first my thought was well no we're not using cad cad lib, and then I thought well yeah.

B

It is because zarghum talks about cad cad as as a lot more than just the python library, it's more of a a process, a methodology and a language, and I think the the fundamentals of cad cat is the process of token engineering or modeling dynamic systems in general, which is well in the context of token engineering, it's requirements, gathering and then mathematical specifications and then systems, modeling and analysis, and I think that's the process that the tec followed with this um all of the forum posts that were so fleshed out uh and uh yeah.

B

I think that's that's sort of a requirements gathering and then there was a lot of math done actually in those forum posts, of course, like all the and all the math. That's been done on dandelion voting in the past and this novel uh formula here for calculating impact hours really elegant, based on the maximum that we think we need. We should pay and um this sort of race horizon.

B

So to finish this off support required. This is the percentage of so let's say, total tokens are like 100 million vote. Then this would say at the threshold of this line.

B

Oh see, we could make this a bit nicer, interactively, there's lots of issues that could be posted on on the github repo, but this line will give us the number of those token holders that need to vote yes for it to pass. So this boundary is the the boundary between votes, passing and votes, or proposals passing and proposals, not passing, and it you could actually play this through time, which is something would be. It would an awesome spin-off of this project.

B

You could have a sorted data stream or you could click through a date yeah you could just have a sequential stream, so it's like every 10 milliseconds. Another data point comes in, but you could simulate of simulate a vote process uh where we'd be moving to the right as more people use their tokens to vote and we'd be using moving up as more people vote.

B

Yes, instead of no, so you could watch the progression of this vote play out over time and the vote could actually pass between passing and not passing and passing and not passing and how the amount of time that it could do that for is dependent on these other parameters. Here. Vote duration: this is the key. Oh no uh vote buffer hours uh ragequit hours, so um let me ask griff: would a vote pass as soon as it passes into a passing threshold? Oh I haven't explained this minimum quorum.

B

This is the minimum number of people that need to show up to vote uh that need to vote. Yes, actually uh out of all tokens for a a token to for a proposal to be passable. So if we put this at 10 percent, then uh at least 10 percent of all token tokens must vote yes, and so it's the combined blue and red space are blockers and anything in green is a past proposal.

C

And uh on your previous question, first off, I think this is one of the coolest things that the token engineering commons has come up with. So far is this visual representation of what it takes for a vote to pass and it would be super cool to see a line where people are voting and you can see if it's in the green area or in the blue area and where it where the vote is in that moment, I I think this this graph will be used by a lot of dows in the future.

C

In my opinion- uh and it's amazing that they're not already using it anyway uh in dandelion voting. Every vote goes until the very end of the.

B

C

B

This is a parameter.

C

Yeah, so no matter what the vote will go all the way to the end in disputable, voting and other voting like when we do the commons upgrade. We may not use dandelion voting for the commons upgrade. We might use disputable voting, and in that case the vote will pass once uh support required cannot be violated and the quorum has been represented so so like if 80, let's say required, is 88 and 88 of all token holders. Vote. Yes.

C

Well, then, no matter what the support required will be met, so the vote would pass in that moment, uh but that's not the case for danny line voting.

B

Nice and then it's important to to point out so keep that in mind. Votes will last for the full duration and multiple votes can be ran simultaneously, but there's a buffer. You can't just make two different proposals at one time and if you make a proposal, someone can't make one an hour later and that's what this vote buffer hours is. So it's the time between launching proposals, so it defaults to eight hours between between proposal uh launches.

B

So it creates a maximum number of proposals that could actually go through.

A

B

No one's going to ask about rage quit hours. I guess it speaks for itself, but it's this idea that um if, if the vote's passing- because this is a big deal, this is the tec moving from phase one phase, two deciding on parameters of launching the the bonding curve and conviction voting and if a hatcher sees that the proposed proposal has gone through it's moving forward. It's been voted yes and it's passed.

B

Then they have this many of ours to redeem their initial redeemable, um hatch, investment, uh co-vestment or whatever we're calling it tribute um yeah. I forget what the legal term is, but this is the rage quit hours to get the redeemable amount of that back. If someone's not happy with a proposal, that's going forward.

A

Okay cool: uh can we get into token log? Yes, all right, all I'm actually having some bandwidth problems, so I can't share my screen. So it's when you trip or watch if you take over and hurry up and show them what token log and the repo we're gonna have the issues go to and how they're gonna do this and what then one now. This is where you can vote with your impact hour. Tokens.

C

Okay, cool yeah, I'll I'll just uh run run, so we can get through this. uh Basically we'll have this.

C

The way that we're going to choose the hatch parameters is that people will use the website that ygg is going to create to choose their parameters, then we'll find a way so that they can say these are my parameters, maybe it'll be a link that sets the defaults to that website, or something like that and they'll make an issue in this repo that ygt is showing and when they make that issue in that issue, they'll need to describe what they were thinking you know like. Did they fork from someone else?

C

Did they take someone else's idea and change one little thing, because they like it this way or did they? You know there? They should give an explanation in the github issue and then in this github issue, uh once they create the github issue, uh token log will actually allow people who have impact hour tokens and people who have c stack tokens to vote on um quadratically on which per set of parameters they like the most.

C

So we will set a day. We will set a a date where something happened where uh the top voting. This is the proposal.

C

uh We set a date where the top voted proposal uh for a set of parameters according to impact hours and csec token holders uh will be the chosen parameters on uh when we deploy so uh token log. I don't know ygg if you're able to uh go to tokenlog.xyz, sure and just show so the.

C

So there is a there is a te version.

B

Should I connect exactly.

C

B

Connect, I'm not sure which network I'm on.

C

I don't think it matters, that's a nice thing. Okay, oh actually it does matter. If you're on x die, then you get a prettier. No, you get a prettier set of numbers, but it doesn't matter for voting all right and, as you can see on this, there's lots of people who are using token log. It's super cool, you can scroll down and you can vote you use token log to vote on eips, but the one that we care most about is the te commons.

C

Although common stack is great too uh yeah click that one and uh here you can, you actually have a yeah so because he's not on xdi, you get these nan vp like under the c-stack token in the right corner, but you don't even need that because we're not using we're not sending any transactions when you vote, uh but you could imagine like right now we're testing token log with uh prioritizing issues that are in the coordination repo, so the tec, community stewards are actually you know deciding which issues to prioritize each sprint.

C

And now you can actually vote with your iht and your c stack, which issues are the most important, but when we're choosing the hash parameters, each one of these issues will represent somebody's choice of parameters. They went to the website they this they like tweaked the graphs and saw what they could do and now, oh, so uh you must not have any. This must not be your c stack address. Yeah.

B

I uh I got it it's on my laptop, I bricked my laptop because I was recording obs and it filled my hard drive and I can't boot into my laptop when the hard drive is full. I've got a boot into the bootloader and uh mounted.

C

B

Unload some of that disk and then it should be fine. This is happening.

C

That's okay, so yeah, but it's really cool. The ux will be simple. You'll just see the github issues which will represent people's parameters and then you'll click and, uh depending on how much tokens you have you'll, have more voting power to use and um and then you'll choose your parameters, the the ones that you vote for. You can vote for. Multiple sets uh and the voting happens quadratically. So each voting power point that you have uh you if you want to give one point one issue: oh yeah, yeah!

C

uh If you want to give one point to one issue: that's fine! If you want to give 2.2 voting power points to an issue, it's going to cost four voting power for you to do that, and if you want to give five of your, if you want to give five voting power points, then it'll take 25 and uh the quadratic thing applies. So so yeah any questions about token log. I didn't do the best at explaining it, but.

A

We're going to have another call next week at this time, just about token line two. So don't don't worry too much if you know we're gonna come back to it. uh The other thing to remember here is after you've done this you've seen the models. You've come to token log. You have proposed your you've proposed your uh uh your proposed your parameters, you're gonna, vote on them. Then we want you.

A

We have a set thread at the forum that you're gonna go post on about why you chose your parameters and- and you know what you chosen- why you chose them. So we have a consistent line of transparency and then we have a you know a full thread on why people are doing what they.

A

C

Yeah so it'll be super cool and, and the real goal is to make it so that everyone, whether you're, a dev or not, can actually propose and improve on the other proposed parameters for the for the hatch and- and I I believe this will be the most community driven technical deployment uh that has ever existed in the dell space. We're we're hoping to use this strategy to fight the technocratic, leaning that we end up with uh when building uh blockchain-based economies, because the devs are the ones that understand everything.

C

So there's a lot of effort here to make sure that the community can understand what these parameters mean and how they'll have an impact when they're chosen and and to really engage non-developers and empower them to have a say in in the economies that are deployed so jake. Do you want to? Oh sorry, go ahead.

A

No yeah, that's it um sundays.

A

We have work sessions uh and, like I said next wednesday, we're gonna do this all again and it'll be just about token long um and uh feel free to always reach out to me whether discord or telegram, if you have any questions or want further information, uh otherwise we're gonna keep at it uh and please come to ygg's tech labs on friday, where he goes over all of this way, far more in depth and then actually has full-on lessons on how to do this and what it does um this is.

A

This is huge for token engineering in general. This is what exactly what the commons is trying to do so we're advancing the field with both of these oh and also to advise this token. Log and tech labs are both proposals within the tec.

A

So this we're we're not only you know we're creating this as we go and we're looking to support this in the process. This. This is truly the tec right here in work, and you get to be a part of it and we're going to make it as easy as we can. So everybody can understand it. That's the biggest point, too, all right. Thank you for our ted talk. We have 10 minutes.

A

If you have any more questions or just want to go, just want to talk, go ahead.

C

Let's, let's do a quick round we'll give everyone put everyone on the spot and and make them say it I'll just say. Thank you. I got to talk a lot so and I'll pass it to kinshasa.

G

Yeah, so just being super new to this, um the fact that you guys are creating a mechanism for non-technical people to to get involved and have a voice is just sick, so um trying to keep up, but I'm very inspired by this. So thank you for um all. You guys are doing for the space.

A

What do you want.

G

uh Yeah there you go sorry one thanks.

E

um I think that this is amazing, and that is this modeling is so important for for providing information to all the community and uh that information can make us take uh better decisions as a whole. So I think that this is amazing to manage the expected benefits and the expected costs of of our decisions. So I think it's.

E

A

Thanks all right: hey olivia! What do you think? Oh she's gone, um hey craig.

I

Hey, um I think it looks horrible and it sucks.

I

No, I'm only kidding um somebody needed a kick in the gut instead of a pat on the back, but um I think uh yeah, I'm I'm thrilled with this. uh I mentioned to sean before this is kind of my background in regular work, and I'm uh not so happy that I can't actually dig in more, but it's brilliant. I love it. Keep it going and I'm going to tune in as much as I can.

I

um Who zeptimus have you gone.

F

No thank you craig. I think that the job here is amazing.

I

D

I want to thank ygg for all.

F

This modeling and it's very easy to see the graphics and how they interact. That's very awesome and yeah. I think this is lovely like we are building it as a community and and what grief was saying like it's the first project doing that and I think that's so cool, that's awesome uh and I'll pass it to who hasn't gone yet, maybe billy uh yeah.

A

C

A

Nope I we can't really hear you, man like it's like barely audible.

C

I don't hear anything at.

A

All I thought I heard something.

C

Sorry, sp, maybe ygg can go and you can see if you can fix your mic and uh and uh say what you have to say: ygg.

B

Yeah, I just want to say that sometimes this stuff can be kind of overwhelming, like it's too much too many things happening at once, but I think the key is always to have fun with it and treat it like a game like ethereum really is the greatest mmorpg ever made. So you know uh it's. It's awesome kudos to the uh the whole team for coming out and doing this crazy cool stuff like like.

B

Look at this domain name token, log dot, x, y z, t e comment, slash tech lab this is the coolest thing ever so I just want to thank everyone, the community, for keep for putting out this good stuff, and ever you know we all. We all have different strengths and weaknesses like I'm always losing my my crypto keys, that's my weakness, so we all help each other out so much so I just want to say thanks to everyone.

A

Hey olivia jumped in she tried to sneak out, and she came back in. She didn't think we'd see her leave, but now she's back olivia, though the last question was to uh what do you think of all this.

D

I think the panda behind. Why did you it's amazing, watching us here.

B

He's the data scientist.

D

Thanks guys, all what I've heard was amazing.

G

Pretty rad: what is this so this is not cad cat.

B

um This is using the cad cad methodology, but not the cad cad library. This is just uh modeling equations, essentially the fizzle. This is like static, not static modeling, because we have like dynamic equations here, but um yeah cad cad cad essentially plays out scenarios over time. It's a simulator, and so it's really good for like injecting randomness and probability distributions or like policies of agents. So there's no there's no agent policies here, so you you would get that from the cad cad library, okay,.

A

Hey speedly, can you try again.

H

Hey: hey testing testing, that's better working! No.

B

Oh yeah sounds good.

H

Okay, so yeah, I basically dropped in probably somewhere in the middle mid of whatever was going on and I've been following, and I think I saw the hatching model before and the molok tao types of before. So that's interesting. But what I um usually lack in these things is because I'm doing the centralized finance stuff myself is uh between the actual, like funding part and the actual execution of uh proposals uh and stuff hatching and everything.

H

Why isn't the funds being allocated within a yield aggregation system, so it actually generates more income while stuff is being hatched is basically my question.

A

Well, this is the first part of what we're doing and we will be implementing a bonding curve in the second part. um So in the in the initial part of what we call the hatch, we don't technically need to then send away to yield on top, because farming isn't exactly what we're trying to do here. Our bonding curve will allow us to implement a compounded yield on top of that and we'll be able to generate more with what we're doing in that initial. Second part of the commons.

B

Okay, I think it's interesting to think about, though it could be like a lego block that gets stacked on top of this. This model, this hatch model, because you might be able to pinpoint and say, oh yeah, this uh hatch tribute sitting there for for 30 days or 90 days.

D

B

What if we apply a yield, but um that's yeah, it's interesting to work on.

A

A proposal, but we would have to then also like, are we what liquidity pools? Would we actually utilize because we're not going to create that ourselves with t? No, no.

H

It's tc tokens, there's simple stuff like if you're uh just asking for eve as uh getting funds. There's this thing called alpha hamura, which just you can just singles single-sidedly, uh have interesting bearing each or just an rv. You can just deposit eve and you're getting impressed on if you're stable coins. Obviously, if you're, not finance, there's there's a bunch of decentralized finance uh possibilities. These days, which which are pretty much well certainly.

A

It's a very interesting idea.

B

We should contact ave.

H

10 10 yields yearly. That's almost 10.

A

H

And on a 30-day hatch, you're you're missing out on that's that's one percent. You can donate or put to the project or whatever's going on it's. It's yeah like like you're, missing out on gains in my.

A

Opinion all right well, thank you.

A

I'll try to.

H

Hey guys, we only.

A

Got two minutes left: okay,.

B

A

Anything anybody else wants to say before I just cut this short because we're you know.

B

Thank you all right. Thank you. I'm excited for this piece. This is coming next yeah. Thank you. You're welcome thanks, guys, yeah, absolutely.

A