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From YouTube: Budget Committee - October 2, 2015
Description
Budget Committee meeting 11, October 2, 2015
Agenda and background material: http://app.toronto.ca/tmmis/decisionBodyProfile.do?function=doPrepare&meetingId=9948
B
B
You
want
to
hold
that,
be
you
11.2
facilities,
management
in
real
estate
and
sustainable
energy
plan,
2015
capital
budget,
2016,
224
capital
budget
adjustments.
You
want
to
hold
that
council
burden
if
you
want
to
move
that.
Ok,
all
in
favor
pose
that's
carried
11.3
Toronto,
Police,
Services,
2015,
operating
budget
adjustments
and
operating
budget
variance
report,
ending
May,
31st,
2015
I
councillor
Pasternak
will
move
the
staff
recommendations.
Alan
favor
hose
that's
carried
11.4.
The
update
on
the
budget
process.
I'll
just
hold
that
I
just
want
to
comment
on
what
that
is
with
everybody.
C
You
mr.
chair
and
questions
to
staff,
so
this
this
involves
a
lot
of
money
and
it's
spread
over
three
programs.
Someone
in
social
housing
is
is
technically
eligible
or
a
rent
supplement
agreement
as
I
understand.
That
is
that
it's
a
layering
on
top
of
the
already
reduced
rent
is
that
is
that
correct
from
what
I'm
seeing
here
so.
D
I
would
say
it's
a
bit
more
complicated
than
that
three.
Mr.
chair,
the
the
social
housing
program
includes
a
NOC,
basically
an
operating
subsidy
to
keep
the
lights
on,
but
it
also
includes,
within
at
a
rent
subsidy,
to
bring
the
rents
down
to
thirty
percent
of
a
tenant's
income.
There's
a
subset
there's
another
program
called
rent
supplement
on
top
of
that
it
gets
a
little
complicated
because
most
of
the
rent
supplements
are
agreements
with
private
sector
landlord.
So
it's
just
the
rent
subsidy
for
tenants
through
agreements
with
landlords
and
the
pro
in
the
private
sector.
D
Some
of
those
rent
supplements
have
also,
over
the
years,
been
put
into
nonprofit
buildings
in
units
that
would
otherwise
be
at
full
market
rent.
So
there's
a
bit
of
a
mix,
but
the
core
of
the
social
housing
program
does
include
a
rent
subsidy.
That's
not
called
around
supplement
is
just
called
an
RG
I
subsidy.
So.
C
C
D
Counselor
you
either
get
one
or
the
other,
so
you'll
either
get
a
rent
subsidy
through
TCHC.
It's
not
a
reduced
rent,
it's
actually
a
rent
subsidy
or
you
get
a
rent
supplement.
The
unit
would
otherwise
be
at
market
rent
because
with
TCC
has
buildings
that
have
mixed
mixed
income
and
in
some
cases,
they've
added
rent
supplements
four
tenets.
That
would
otherwise
be
at
Marcus,
with
their
mutually
exclusive.
All.
C
D
What
we
tell
them,
if
they're
living
in
a
market
unit
in
TCHC
they
they
would
have
to
put
their
name
on
the
waitlist
for
an
RG
I
subsidy,
just
like
just
like
anybody
from
the
community.
They
don't
get
special
treatment
because
they
happen
to
be
living
in
a
market
unit
into
the
reason.
That's
there
so
that
people
can't
jump
sort
of
jumped
the
waitlist
by
moving
into
a
TCH
SI
unit,
paying
market
rent
and
then
very
soon,
after
applying
for
an
RG
I
subsidy.
C
So
I
one
thing
about
rent
supplement
agreement
in
in
other
jurisdictions
is,
is
portability
and
to
what
to
what
degree
can
someone
move
with
I
know
there's
housing
allowance,
but
what
to
what
degree
can
someone
take
their
their
their
housing
allowance
or
the
rent
supplement
agreement?
The
rest
supplement
agreement,
I
understand,
is
anchored.
The
housing
allowance
can
move.
Is
that
that's
correct,
so
the
housing
allowance
follows
the
family
or
follows
the
person's
yes,
yeah,
okay.
C
C
D
The
other
program,
which
is
the
strong
communities
read
supplement
program,
is
strictly
a
dollar
amount
that
the
province
gives
us
every
year
here
and
we
have
to
reduce
the
number
of
units
because
the
it's
not
increased
by
inflation,
so,
but,
but
generally
speaking,
yes,
the
the
number
of
units
is
fixed
and
the
the
dollar
amount
is
fixed
and
it
varies
simply
by
income
levels
and
just
trying
to
manage
the
budget.
Now.
C
Is
there
is
there
a
a
problem
with
recruiting
private
landlords
to
to
the
program
when
I
bump
into
a
landlord
I
start
telling
them
about
this?
Then
they
don't
really
know
about
the
program.
They
so
send
me
some
information.
We
might
be
able
to
do
a
few
units.
Do
you
have
a
robust
program
through
with
you,
mr.
chair,
to
to
to
make
sure
that
we
bring
in
new
landlords
and
get
them
to
buy
in
on
the
program
through.
D
You,
mr.
chair,
we've
got
a
fixed
number
of
landlords
that
I'm
in
now
and
because
be
it's
not
an
expanding
program.
The
money
doesn't
increase.
We
only
bring
a
new
landlords
when
others
drop
out,
and
it
doesn't
happen
very
often,
and
many
of
the
landlords
only
have
they
might
have
five
or
six
units
in
the
building.
It
won't
be
the
whole
building
speak.
You
really
don't
want
an
entire
building
to
be
full
of
rat
supplements.
Housing
connections
manages
this
on
our
behalf.
We're
actually
bringing
housing
connections
into
the
city
so
will
be.
B
E
You
mr.
chair,
in
regard
to
the
the
map
in
the
appendices,
Penix
be
its
map
that
somewhat
mirrors
what
you
might
find
in
terms
of
income
distribution
throughout
the
city,
but
not
necessarily
so
and
I'm
wondering
if
you
could
comment
on
that,
because
I
know
that
there
are,
there
are
significant
pockets
of
poverty
in
Scarborough
and
yet
there's
not
that
many
supplements
there
and
I
look
at
the
two
downtown
wards
and
I'm
thinking.
E
The
downtown
area
is
receiving
a
lot
of
supplements,
and
maybe
it's
my
lack
of
understanding
of
downtown
housing,
but
it
seems
disproportionate,
for
some
reason
is
this:
is
this
map
over?
Is
this
map
been
overlaid
with
one
that
shows
income,
distribution
and
and
what
would
it?
What
would
it
tell
us?
You.
D
E
D
Chair,
I
think
I
think
the
the
total
number
of
households
in
core
housing
need
in
the
city
just
based
on
income
is
about
is
over
two
hundred
thousand
households,
and
I
assume
their
distribution
is
somewhat
different
from
from
this.
If
we
had
more
funding
for
rent
supplements
like
when
they
weren't
attached
to
social
housing,
you'd
likely
see
them
in
in
other
parts
of
the
city.
What's.
D
E
D
E
F
Thank
you,
yes
am
I.
I
I'm
wondering
if
I
understood
the
the
map
differently
than
councillor
Campbell.
Perhaps
this
is
a
map
of
rent
supplements,
three
types
of
rent
supplements,
but
it
doesn't
necessarily
it
doesn't
give
us
the
indication
of
where
subsidized
different
types
of
subsidies
of
housing
all
exists.
So
if
we
were
to
add
to
this
actual
rgi
units
that
are
Justin
as
part
of
the
TCHC
regular
rgi
program,
the
dark
purple
would
then
more
closely
resemble
the
poverty
horseshoe.
Would
it
not.
F
D
F
F
D
Know
they
they
do
not
be
the
one
program
of
the
three
does
strong
communities
around
stuff
that
the
other
two
do
not
have
expiration
dates.
You
just
have
to
happen
to
be.
It
happens,
to
be
a
fuller,
GI
subsidy
and
up
usually
in
a
private
building
right
rather
than
in
TCH,
see
what
we're
short
on
our
housing
allowances.
We've
had
great
six
good
success
than
last
year
with
housing,
allowances
that
are
portable
and
they
do
not
take
people
off
the
waitlist,
but
they
help
with
people's
affordability
issues
and
there
they
cost
less.
D
Was
chaired
no
not
really
they're.
Basically,
we've
been
using
short-term
funding,
that's
been
giving
us
to
the
province
under
the
affordable
housing
program
and
now
the
investment
in
affordable
housing
program,
and
we
do
the
best
we
can.
The
city's
been
putting
what
half
of
its
funding
under
those
the
general
runs
for
three
to
four
three
two
three
years
or
five
years,
but
what
we
do
is
we
create
us
we're
allowed
to
create
a
stream,
a
housing
allowance
for
a
family
or
a
household
for
five
years
or
up
to
ten
years.
D
F
D
Would
I
would
say,
we've
had
this
discussion
internally,
we
need
a
balance
between
stock
and
a
flexible
housing
allowance
program.
Some
people,
their
their
affordability
needs,
are
better
met
with
a
somewhat
shallow
housing
allowance.
They
may
be
working
poor.
Others
really
need
long-term
they're
better
off
in
a
non-profit
building
where
there's
other
supports
that
could
be
could
be
frenetic.
F
D
C
B
G
Noticed
one
of
the
comments
in
here
is
about
dealing
with
increased
rent
in
private
market
buildings,
and
there
are
lots
of
aggies
above
guideline
increases
all
over
the
place.
So
I'm
wondering
if
there's
anything
we're
doing
about
that
in
in
terms
of
monitoring
it
and
providing
support
to
people
who
are
fighting
above
guideline
range
increases.
I,
don't
know
who
does
that
I
don't
know
if
Phillip?
That's
your
only
wig
that.
H
G
Understand
that,
but
this
says
it
requires
close
monitoring
to
manage
associated
costs
and
costs
escalate
and
that
we
are
obligated
to
pay
the
rent
increases.
So
are
we
at
all,
maybe
even
just
monitoring?
How
are
you
monitoring
above
guideline
increases
in
buildings
where
we
have
rent
supplements?
Do
we
have
any
information
on
that?
D
D
Each
of
these
resultant
agreements
is
part
of
an
agreement
with
the
landlord.
What
doing
it?
The
agreement
is
to
cover
the
difference
for
a
tenant
that
we
select
from
our
waitlist
to
cover
the
difference
between
the
market,
rent
and
the
ramp
that
the
tenant
is
paying
based
on
thirty
percent
of
their
income,
and
you.
G
G
D
G
G
There
was
a
motion
to
look
at
property
standards
and
the
outstanding
condition
of
private
sector
buildings
and
to
look
at
this
issue
where
we're
spending
a
lot
of
money,
investing
a
lot
in
rent
supplements
and
other
investments
in
private
buildings
that
are,
in
many
cases
in
very
poor
condition
and
have
many
outstanding
violations
for
property
standards,
and
we
were
going
to
look
at
this
to
see
whether
that
we
could
address
this
using
our
leverage
of
funds
to
ensure
that
they
bring
their
buildings
into
property
standards.
Compliance
so.
H
B
C
C
I
realize
it's
only
antidotal,
but
the
people
who
come
to
my
office,
who
are
in
real
need
are
about
three
three
or
four
hundred
dollars
a
month
away
from
eviction.
Now
without
knowing
the
circumstance
of
the
ten
thousand
people
on
this
is
there?
Is
there
a
way
to
share
this
a
little
better
22?
Are
we
giving
too
much
money
to
some
and
we
can?
We
can
share
it
so
that
others
who
are
at
risk
of
eviction
or
unable
to
to
stay
in
an
apartment?
Can
it
can
in
fact
tap
tap
into
this?
So.
D
As
I
said,
these
programs
are
under
what's
called
a
service
level
standard,
so
we
have
to
provide
them
as
our
GI
rank
your
dinkum
housing,
we're
asking
for
the
flexibility,
for
example,
to
provide
housing
allowances
instead
and
maybe
target
them
to
houses
that
may
be
facing
the
eviction,
for
example,
but
I
think
the
bottom
line
is
you
need
a
lot
more
funding
than
this
to
address
the
broader
need,
and
you
know,
there's
an
analysis
that
could
be
done
to
show
what
that
would
look
like.
But
this
is
a
very
limited
program.
D
C
D
Formula
is
based
on
the
cmhc
standard
of
what
core
housing
need
is,
which
is
that
a
household
should
be
able
to
afford
housing
in
the
community
within
thirty
percent
of
their
gross
income.
So
this
is
essentially
so,
if
alice
there
in
that
income
band,
they
won't
get
this
assistance.
There
are
many
others
that
aren't
precarious
circumstances
that
could
certainly
use
a
form
of
housing
allowance.
C
What
helped
you
need
from
us
at
the
political
level
to
convert
some
of
these
funds
into
housing
allowances
which,
which
would
which
would
give
us
more
Portability
and
and
potentially
spread,
spread
this?
Maybe
maybe
we
instead
of
ten
thousand
nine
hundred
sixty-one
units,
you
know
we
could
get
up
to
you,
know
13,000
by
sharing
our
existing
envelope
and
maybe
topping
it
up
so.
H
You've
you
have
given
us
support
already
in
endorsing
our
submissions
to
the
long-term,
affordable
housing
strategy
review
and
yesterday
to
the
coda
review
through
which
we
are
asking
the
province
to
amend
the
legislation
on
service
level
standards
to
provide
us
with
flexibility
to
use
the
subsidies,
use
the
stock
in
the
way
that
makes
most
sense
and
goes
furthest
in
our
community.
So
the
political
support
council
has
provided
that
and
the
rest
it's
up
to
the
province
now
to
make
those
legislative
changes
or
regulatory
changes.
B
F
F
I'm
just
wondering
on
a
point
of
order:
it
is
the
chair
of
CDRs
having
a
lot
of
interesting
questions
here
and
also.
This
is
one
of
the
most
simply
put
and
clear
reports
on
this
particular
set
of
programs.
I've
seen
in
a
long
time,
perhaps
so
that
we
can
speed
through
the
rest
of
the
budget.
We
only
have
25
more
minutes.
F
C
B
B
Let
let
them
let's
just
hold
that
item
any
other.
Any
other
questions
on
this
item.
Any
speakers
to
the
item.
Okay,
why
don't
we
just
hold
it
down
just
for
a
sec
while
they
confirm
and
then
we'll
figure
out
how
to
how
to
manager?
Okay,
let's
go
to
the
last
item,
which
is
a
bu
11.4,
an
update
on
the
2016
budget
process,
I'll
just
sort
of
give
the
update
quickly.
If
there
any
questions
on
that,
we
can
take
them
afterwards.
B
So
I
think
all
the
counselors
are
well
aware
on
the
Budget
Committee
that
we
have
begun
an
informal
process
that
is
customary
on
the
Budget
Committee
to
to
meet
with
all
the
divisions
and
agencies
to
gather
information
in
the
form
of
questions
through
all
the
divisions
and
agencies.
It's
a
customary
thing,
we've
been
doing
over
the
last
I.
Don't
know
how
long
counselor
Carol,
if
you
could
sort
of
indicate,
but
it's
been
it's
been
a
while
we've
been
going
through.
B
That
process
will
be
going
through
that
process,
probably
for
the
next
month
before
the
public
session.
As
part
of
that
process,
and
as
part
of
the
work
plan
that
the
budget
committee
members
have
been
doing,
I
put
together
a
I
guess
a
set
of
questions
that
have
come
back
to
us
as
in
the
form
of
a
briefing
note,
though,
these
questions
are
questions
that
have
come
up
to
discussions
or
dialogues.
With
a
lot
of
that.
The
members
on
the
concerns
are
interested.
They
may
have
as
part
of
the
budget
work
plan.
B
B
The
briefing
process
that
we're
doing
right
now,
I
do
want
to
clarify,
with
with
the
budget
members
and
and
and
anybody
else
or
the
public
I
guess,
is
that
these
briefing
notes
will
be
made
public
and
will
be
part
of
the
public
process
when
we
launch
I,
don't
even
know
the
date
of
when
we
launched,
but
whenever
we
launched
so
I
just
want
to
be
clear
that
the
work
that
is
doing
in
the
work
that
is
happening
right
now
are
all
in
the
form
of
questions
that
inform
the
budget
committee.
Members
on
on.
B
You
know
what
we're
doing
and
trying
to
gather
the
information.
All
of
this
in
the
form
of
a
briefing
note
will
be,
of
course,
public
and
will
be
available
public
as
as
soon
as
as
the
budget
opens.
So
I
just
wanted
again
that
this
is
just
an
information
item
to
all
of
the
the
budget,
members
and
staff
on
process
of
what
were
half
and
or
what
we're
doing.
In
this
present
time,
questions
on
counselor,
Davis
questions.
G
B
Well,
listen
I
think
they
can
be
part
of
standing
committees,
but
they
all
impact
financially
in
some
respects.
When
you
look
at
all
the
questions,
there
is
an
impact
financially
at
some
point,
so
I
think
that's
as
part
of
the
purview
of
the
Budget
Committee.
These
questions
are
being
asked.
They
could
easily
be
asked
at
individual
standing
committees
by
all
means,
but
as
part
of
the
budget
process
and
the
I
guess,
the
financial
impact
or
implications
as
we
go
through
the
process.
These
are
all
pertinent
questions
so.
G
B
Again,
counselor
that,
maybe
you
know
less
financial,
but
from
the
perspective
of
the
budget
committee
members
that
was,
you
know,
questions
they
they
felt
wanted
to
be
asked
in.
You
know
with
regards
to
the
financial
nature's
of
what
we're
doing
those
items
this.
This
briefing
note,
these
briefing
notes,
you
know,
will
be
part
of
the
the
public
process
as
we
move
forward,
but
again
these
were
counselor,
so
these
were
these
were
questions
that
were
brought
forward
by
individual
committee
members.
Okay,.
G
B
Were
questions
as
we
as
I'm
sure
you're
aware
we
go
through
a
guest,
an
informal
budgetary
meeting
process
that
has
been
customary
over
the
last
number
of
years.
So
do
we
have?
We
are
having
informal
meetings
with
all
the
divisions
and
agencies
they
do
come,
have
a
discussion
with
with
individual
counselors
there's
one
or
two
counselors
who
will
be
part
of
these
meetings?
They've
all
been
scheduled
and
they
will.
You
know,
have
a
discussion.
G
B
B
B
F
I
do
have
a
concern
and
if
I
could
just
preface
my
question
with
the
concern
when
we
were
asked,
do
you
have
some
questions
that
you'd
like
to
ask
and
have
asked
in
the
review?
I
guess
I
wasn't
paying
attention,
because
I
I
did
not
understand
that
these
were
actually
going
to
turn
into
written
documents
that
all
happened
before
the
informal
review.
I
thought
what
we
were
doing
is
preparing
a
list
of
questions
to
share
amongst
budget
committee
members
so
that
we
could
look
at.
F
You
know
what
people
wanted
to
know
and-
and
we
would
on
behalf
of
one
another
in
the
informal,
detailed
reviews
and
teams
of
two,
we
would
make
sure
that
we
were
asking
questions
along
those
line.
Now
that
they're
being
turned
into
documents,
I
have
two
concerns
that
I'm
wondering
if
I
can
ask
about
I
heard
you
say
mr.
chair
as
we
move
forward.
These
will
be
part
of
the
process.
The
the
process
was
adopted
by
council.
F
A
F
A
A
That's
that's
my
concern,
so
a
lot
of
the
information
is
being
provided
will
be
documented
and
is
part
of
the
budget.
Analyst
notes
in
that
respect.
So
that's
what
my
understanding
is
that
what
we
were
doing
so
because
there's
information
on
you
know,
costs
and
whatever
and
those
are
formed,
part
of
yeah,
listen,
okay
and
and
and
in
the
analyst
notes
they
also
highlight
and
update
particular
issues
and
those
sometimes,
if
those
questions
have
a
particular
issue
to
them,
they'll
be
highlighted
in
there.
That's
what
what
we
were.
Okay,
how
it
gets
document
and.
F
To
my
last
question,
then,
so
my
question
is:
is
it
being
made
clear
to
sep
just
just
as
it
was
the
first
year
we
ever
did
service
level
reviews,
which
was
the
last
year
of
the
term
prior
to
councillor
Crawford,
be
prior
to
councillor
Crawford
here
and
I.
Think
that
was
the
year
that
you
arrived
halfway
through
the
budget
process
working
with
the
same
Toronto,
it
was
a
dry
run.
F
It
was
clear
to
staff
we're
struggling
with
this
new
model
that
we
may
proceed
to
use
called
core
service
level
reviews,
and
it
was
clear
to
them.
We
want
you
to
try
it.
It's
not
going
to.
This
is
not
the
year
in
which
how
you
work
with
this
new
process
becomes
a
part
of
your
own
performance
evaluation.
We'd
like
to
try
this
is
that
being
made
clear
to
people
is.
This
is
an
experimental
piece
of
paper
through.
A
F
A
staff
to
staff
exercise
and
and
only
informal
review,
detailed
teams
of
two
actually
ever
even
saw
the
thing,
but
it
was
clear
to
staff.
We
just
want
to
try
it.
There's
no
reflection
on
you,
just
let's
all
be
comfortable
and
try.
This
model
is
that
is
that
the
basis
on
which
people
are
submitting
the
answers
to
these
questions,
I.
A
Would
say
that
is
the
general
understanding.
We
have
a
very
committed
and
hardworking
staff.
We
always
try
to
say
yes
to
help
to
provide
information
and
respond
as
best
we
can
to
counsel
and
I.
Think
people
are
taking
this
in
that
vein
and
being
as
as
hardworking
and
as
sincere
about
this
process
have
we
said
to
somebody:
if
you
don't
respond
to
this
report,
you're
gonna,
you
know
remnants
gets
affected.
No,
absolutely
your
performance
appraisal
gets
affected.
Absolutely
not.
I
think
we
are
all
professional
and
we
all
want
to
help
excellent.