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From YouTube: Joint Revenue Meeting, April 27, 2022-AM
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A
She's
on
her
way,
I'm
sure
excuse.
B
Representative
baker,
here
representative
gray,
here
representative
hallinan,
here,
representative
henderson,
representative
jennings
representative
roscoe
representative
sweeney
representative
yen,
here
co-chairman
harshman,
excused
he'll,
be
here
shortly
and
co-chairman
case
president.
We
have
a
quorum.
Mr.
A
Thank
you
very
much
josh,
so
we
have
everybody
present
in
person
or
we
have
two
people
online.
Senator
schuler
and
representative
harshman
will
be
joining
us
shortly.
So
with
that,
oh
that's.
A
big
ugly
picture,
welcome
to
everybody
to
lander
wyoming
thanks
for
coming
and
we'll
kick
off
our
interim
work
and
we
have
a
big
big
agenda
ahead
of
us
a
big
two
days
before
we
even
start
just
a
couple
of
earlier
remarks.
A
We
are
hearing
from
the
state
board
of
equalization,
but
they're
just
going
to
give
us
a
little
bit
of
an
update.
It's
not
meant
to
be
a
big
dig
into
the
property
tax
world
out
there,
but
we
will
be
continuing
that
topic
over
to
future
meetings.
So
we
will,
we
will
be
working
on
that.
They
have
developed
three
concept
papers,
they
want
to
share
with
us
and
then
the
real
truth
of
the
matter
is
don't
tell
anybody
but
jane
mockler's
brother
now
lives
in
fremont
county
and
she
wanted
a
trip
up
to
fremont
county.
A
The
other
thing
is
tomorrow
this
issue
about
limited
liability
companies
and
private
trusts.
It
continues
to
grow.
I'd
expect
we're
going
to
spend
quite
a
bit
of
time
on
that
tomorrow.
It's
not
necessary.
I
think
that
we
understand
the
complexity
of
it,
we're
going
to
we're
beginning
our
education
and
it's
a
long
education.
A
So
if
there
are
any
questions
we'll
just
dive
in,
I
know
that
obviously
k-12
revenue
is
very
important
to
our
co-chairman
harshman,
but
he
is
at
a
charity
event
in
riverton
he's
on
his
way
over
now,
but
he's
definitely
close
by
so
mr
wilmoth,
would
you
like
to
start
us
out
k-12.
C
Revenue,
you
bet
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
members
of
the
committee
matt
wilmart
lso
senior
school
finance
analyst.
C
This
topic
comes
to
you
as
your
number
two
priority
for
the
interim
as
related
to
revenues
for
k-12
education,
and
I
prepared
a
presentation
this
morning
that
will
set
the
stage
for
the
discussion
for
the
interim,
focusing
on
state
revenues
as
well
as
local
school
district
revenues
and
how
how
the
state
and
other
states
in
the
united
states
resource
their
schools
feel
free
to
pause
and
ask
questions
throughout
the
presentation
more
than
happy
to
answer
them.
C
So
with
that,
mr
chairman
I'll
go
to
slide
two
of
this
presentation.
This
sets
an
outline
of
where
today's
presentation
will
go
and
first
I'll
discuss
kind
of
the
historical
concept
of
the
federal
land
land
grant
program
and
in
school
trust
lands
and
how
that
was
established
to
provide
a
revenue
source
for
states
to
fund
public
schools.
C
I'll
discuss
the
constitutional
implications
here
in
wyoming
and
court
decisions
across
the
united
states
and
specifically
in
wyoming,
and
how
that
kind
of
sets
the
the
stage
for
how
schools
are
financed
and
also
how
each
state's
funding
formula
also
impacts
the
revenues
to
school
districts,
I'll
also
focus
on
k-12
revenue
sources
and
where
those
come
from
specifically
for
for
school
districts
and
then
also
where
state
revenue,
tax
sources
come
from
and
then
I'll
finish
up
this
morning
with
this
state
state,
wyoming
school
foundation,
program
account
and
the
school
capital
construction
account
and
on
those
revenue
sources
and
how
they
have
evolved
over
the
past
nine
biennia.
C
Mr
chairman,
just
to
kind
of
set
the
stage
of
why
this
discussion
occurs.
Is
there
is
a
structural
revenue
shortfall
for
both
the
school
foundation
program
account
and
the
school
capital
construction
account
for
the
current
biennium,
the
lsra
will
transfer
approximately
237
million
to
the
school
foundation
program
account
to
ensure
it
has
at
least
100
million
dollars
at
the
end
of
the
fiscal
year
that
this
is
a
school
capital.
Construction
account
was
supplemented
for
this
current
biennium
by
approximately
73.2
million
dollars.
C
From
other
accounts
to
pay
its
bills,
the
2324
binium
estimates
are
about
128
million
structural
shortfall
in
the
school
foundation,
program
account
and
then
a
65
million
shortfall
in
the
school
capital.
Construction
account
again.
School
capital
construction
has
been
supplemented
by
other
accounts
to
take
care
of
that
shortfall
and
the
school
foundation
program
account
will
be
supplemented
from
the
lsra,
and
you
did,
you
did
say,
that's
a
biennial
amount,
mr
chairman,
that
is
a
biennial
and
obviously
we
know
that
the
23
24
bionium
is
based
upon
january
crate
estimates.
C
C
Mr
chairman
I'll
go
to
slide
three
and
discuss
the
federal
land
grant
program,
and
this
comes
from
the
1785
land
ordinance
act
and
the
1787
northwestern
ordinance
and
federal
federal
support
for
public
schools
goes
back
more
than
two
centuries
and
federal
lands
were
granted
to
states
to
set
aside
a
portion
of
the
lands
that
were
granted
to
each
state.
C
As
part
of
their
active
admission
to
support
and
fund
public
schools-
and
this
was
a
way
to
encourage
public
education
throughout
the
west-
carry
that
as
states
were
brought
into
the
union
and
originally
section
16
of
each
town.
Step
township
were
set
aside
to
support
public
schools
in
wyoming.
As
part
of
our
active
admission,
section,
16
and
36
were
set
aside
in
utah
and
new
mexico.
Additional
sections
were
set
aside,
so
they
had
about
four
sections
of
land
that
were
set
aside
to
support
public
schools.
C
C
Leasing
and
kind
of
renewable
activities
are
used
for
the
support
of
public
schools
on
a
annual
basis,
so
that
that
the
the
federal
land
grant
program
really
does
provide
kind
of
a
basis
for
the
initial
support
of
public
schools.
Going
on
to
slide
four.
This.
D
Representative
gray,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
mr
wilmarth.
Were
there
any
uses
of
those
lands
at
the
active
admission
that
were
prohibited,
I
mean.
Was
it
basically
just
do
what
you
want
whatever
is
going
to
yield
the
in
your
opinion,
the
highest
amount,
or
was
there
any
restrictions
on
that
when
the
federal
government
granted
that?
Thank
you,
mr
walmart,.
C
Mr
chairman
and
representative
gray,
the
states
were
given
those
in
trust,
and
so
the
states
had
to
use
those
the
maximum
benefit
to
benefit
public
schools.
So
specifically,
the
section
16
and
36
were
used
for
the
benefit
of
public
schools.
Other
sections
were
set
aside
for
other
institutions
such
as
the
university
of
wyoming,
the
prisons,
so
but
the
state
is
obligated
to
use
those
to
support
to
the
best
benefit.
D
Of
public
schools,
follow-up
yeah,
mr
chairman,
where
has
obviously
that's
sort
of
an
opinion
have?
Has
anyone
ever
challenged
whether
a
sale
is
is
the
highest
benefit,
and-
and
I
I
was
more
thinking
about
uses
of
the
land-
is-
is
there
any
restrictions
of
uses
itself
or
is
it
just
the
highest
highest?
Revenue
amounts,
mr
wilmar
yeah.
C
A
On
that
yeah-
and
I
think
it's
kind
of
a
complicated
question
in
a
lot
of
ways
and
we
will
be
hearing
from
the
office
of
state
lands
and
agricultural
leasing
is
a
big
component
of
what
they
do
and
how
those
leases
are
and
where
their
market
value
and
how
they
come
about.
There's
been
lots
and
lots
written
about
that.
There's
been
some
litigation,
I
know,
but
we
we
just
have
the
office
of
state
land
walking
the
door
actually
so
anyway,
we
will
get
to
that.
So
mr
wilmart
keep
going.
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
on
slide,
four
I've
illustrated
the
initial
common
school
acres
that
were
awarded
to
each
state
and,
as
you
can
see,
wyoming
had
approximately
initially
3.47
million
acres
awarded
to
it.
C
You'll
note
that
new
mexico
and
arizona
have
significant
and
even
utah
has
significant
higher
acres
awarded
to
them
again.
This
was
part
of
their
additional
sections
that
they
set
aside
for
schools.
Well,
I
mean
only
set
aside
section,
16
and
36.
ohio
said
only
16.,
so
one
state
that
you'll
know
that
isn't
colored
is
texas.
C
C
The
federal
government
never
held
their
lands,
and
so
that's
why
they
aren't
shown
as
a
state
with
school
lands
awarded
to
them
by
the
federal
government
same
thing
with
hawaii
there.
They
were
in
a
similar
situation
and
then
alaska.
They
had
an
agreement
where
only
a
small
portion
of
their
lands
were
considered
school
lands.
C
So
what
what
revenues
on
these
lands
are
are
used
to
generate
revenues
for
for
schools?
As
I
indicated,
any
sales
of
these
lands
will
be
deposited
in
the
into
the
common
school
permanent
land
fund.
Two-Thirds
by
the
constitution,
two-thirds
of
the
mineral
royalties
are
deposited
into
the
common
school
reserve
account
any
easements
or
damage
payments
are,
are
deposited
in
the
in
the
common
school
account.
C
C
The
common
school
reserve
account
any
any
excess
over
150
percent
of
that
spending
policy
is
deposited
and
transferred
to
that
comma
school
account.
C
Going
on
to
the
next
slide
on
on
slide
five,
I
put
together
the
historical
revenues
back
to
2007
of
the
revenues
generated
from
the
common
school
lands.
On
the
left
hand,
side
are
the
land
activity
revenues,
so
these
would
be
the
leases
and
bonuses
any
royalties
or
any
other
activities,
such
as
a
sale,
and
so
over
the
past
15
years,
2.9
billion
dollars
has
been
generated
from
land
activities.
C
466
million
has
been
generated
by
renewable
activities
such
as
the
leases
and
bonuses.
That's
about
16
of
the
total.
C
Over
that
15-year
period,
approximately
2.3
billion
has
been
generated
from
non-renewable
mineral
royalties,
that's
about
78
of
the
total,
and
then
the
remaining
164
million
is
generated
from
other
activities
such
as
land
sales,
right-of-way
easements
and
service
damage
payments.
That's
about
six
percent
of
the
total
over
the
past
15
years,
then,
on
the
right-hand
side,
I've
illustrated
what
has
been
distributed
to
the
school
capital.
C
So
over
the
past
15
years,
2.7
billion
dollars
has
been
distributed
to
the
school
foundation,
program
account
and
the
school
capital
construction
account
of
this
amount,
24
or
about
670
million,
has
been
generated
by
land
activities.
Again,
this
is
the
leases
and
bonuses
and
mineral
royalties
that
aren't
deposited
in
the
into
the
end
of
the
corpus,
and
then
2.1
billion
or
76
percent
has
been
generated
by
investment
earnings.
E
Sorry,
mr
chairman,
so
matt
on
the
left-hand
left-hand
section.
Obviously
there's
a
major
drop
in
revenues
between
2017
and
2021.
So
was
that
because
of
one
particular
coal
mine
or.
C
C
And
represents
sweden,
so
these
land
activities
are
are
subject
to
the
the
fluctuations
of
the
commodity
market,
and
so
this
would
be
both
the
production
and
the
pricing
of
those
minerals.
It's
not
not
just
driven
by
a
particular
coal
mine,
it's
the
entire
market
of
oil,
natural
gas
and
coal
and
the
production
of
those
minerals
as
well.
But
we
do
know
that
in
the
past.
C
We
had
a
significant
year
in
bonus
sales
in
2011
over
100
million
dollars,
and
then,
if
you
look
at
2017
the
far
right
blew
from
other,
we
had
a
significant
sale
of
a
parcel
in
teton
county
that
was
deposited
into
the
common
school
permaland
fund.
So
those
are
a
couple
outlier
years
and
there's
different
reasons:
one's
a
land
sale,
one
is
bonuses
on
on
sale
of
school
lands.
A
Mr
wilmoth
walmart
back
to
these
the
chart
on
the
I
guess
the
right
hand
side
of
the
screen
that
talks
about
the
income
from
the
land
activities
versus
income
and
investment
activities.
That's
a
substantial,
substantial
difference,
and
that
would
beg
the
question
that,
should
we
just
sell
all
the
land
and
put
the
money
in
and
because
we
seem
to
be
doing
better
with
our
investments
and
it
would
carbon
proof
potentially
our
returns.
And
it's
a
real
question.
I
don't
know.
C
Mr
chairman,
I
don't
know
that
I
have
the
best
answer
that
again
I
I
would
defer
to
the
office
of
state
lands
on.
You
know
I
I
do
think
they
evaluate
those
those
activities
and
whether
or
not
renewable
versus
re
non-renewable
versus
renewable
activities
on
those
lands.
I
think
there
are
very
valuable
parcels
in
certain
parts
of
the
state
that
potentially
could
be
sold,
and
I
know
from
reading
some
of
the
documents
preparing
this
presentation.
C
Arizona
sold
a
a
lot
of
their
land
to
deposit
in
their
common
school
permanent
land
fund,
but
the
result
was
the
land
they
sold,
resulted
in
a
lot
of
development
and
urbanized
that
which
increased
their
costs
for
students
now.
So
I
think
those
have
to
be
part
of
the
discussions.
If,
if
you
are
going
to
sell
parcel
land,
will
that
increase
the
the
number
of
customers
in
your
education.
A
System,
that's
a
great
answer,
mr
walmart.
I
think
it's
just
talking
horse
question
you
guys,
because
we
all
know
the
lands
have
other
uses
and
it's
just
good
to
have
the
land
and
the
open
space
and
the
public
aspects,
but
they're
not
totally
public
land.
These
are
the
trust
lands
and
we
have
to
kind
of
remember
that,
and
so
they
we
do
have
an
opportunity
cost
when
we
don't
manage
them
correctly,
but
it
really
wasn't
a
serious
suggestion.
I
promise.
C
Mr
wilmar,
back
to
you,
thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Turning
into
slide
six,
this
might
be
one
of
the
most
interesting
slides
that
I
want
to
draw
your
attention
to
as
part
of
this
research.
We
we
selected
for
their
states
or
around
the
region
to
that
are
similar
to
wyoming,
but
we
wanted
to
evaluate
you
know
on
a
per-pupil
basis.
C
C
So
this
is
their
land
activities
and
their
investment
earnings
and
what
they
distributed
to
their
schools
for
support
their
budgets,
so
in
in
2018,
colorado
generated
approximately
197
dollars
per
student
on
their
school
lands,
idaho
generated
approximately
164
dollars
per
student,
new
mexico
and
I'll
get
to
them
in
a
little
bit
generated
three
thousand
eighty
three
dollars
per
student
on
their
trust,
lanes
and
investments.
C
North
dakota,
distributed
about
thirteen
hundred
dollars
per
student
on
their
school
lands
and
wyoming's,
almost
three
thousand
dollars
per
student
on
their
school
on
our
school
lands.
C
And
then
you
know
what
does
this
represent
in
terms
of
their
total
revenue
per
pupil?
Colorado
is
about
1.4
percent
idaho's
1.7
new
mexico
is
about
25
of
their
total
revenue
per
pupil
comes
from
their
common
school
lands.
North
dakota
is
about
8.1
and
they're
growing
and
wyoming's
about
15,
so
wyman's
pretty
competitive.
C
When
you
look
at
how
much
generation
how
much
revenue
we
generate
on
a
per
pupil
basis
for
total
revenues
and
then,
interestingly,
looking
at
the
their
approximate
values
of
their
permanent
land
funds
colorado,
their
permanent
landfill
is
only
about
1.3
billion
dollars.
Idaho
is
only
about
1.9
billion.
This
is
as
of
end
of
fiscal
year.
21.
C
new
mexico
is
26.7
billion
for
public
schools
is
their
permanent
land
fund
and
their
sovereign
wealth
fund.
Just
to
give
you
kind
of
in
terms
of
where
does
new
mexico
sit
in
the
world,
they
have
a
a
total
value
of
their
permanent
land,
from
about
31
billion,
which
is
the
31st
largest
sovereign
wealth
fund
in
the
world,
and
then
north
dakota
is
about
5.7
billion
and
that's
grown
exponentially
since
about
2007.
C
One
state
I
didn't
list
on
here,
but
I'll
give
you
some
information
on
is
texas,
texas,
as
I
indicated
they
weren't
granted
any
federal
lands,
but
they
they
do
have
a
substantial
common
school
permit
land
fund
and
that
sits
about
55.6
billion
dollars
and
it's
the
23rd
largest
sovereign
wealth
fund
in
the
world,
and
so
one
other
interesting
piece
is
new.
Mexico.
100
of
their
royalties
goes
into
their
into
their
permaland
fund.
C
They
don't
set
aside
a
third
to
to
fund
their
schools
like
we
have
they
they
deposit,
100
of
and
have
substantially
more
acres
available
to
do
that
on
as
well.
C
D
Representative
gray,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
mr
willmoth
one
one
of
the
ways
to
interpret
this
slide
and
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong
here,
but
this
is
in
a
way
a
little
bit
concerning
if
our
permanent
land
fund
is
much
smaller,
but
we're
contributing
such
a
high
amount
from
the
permanent
land
fund.
Does
that
mean
we're
tipping
more
than
other
states
and
being
more
aggressive
in
our
tips
to
which
could
potentially
hurt
the
corpus
down?
The
line
is:
is
that
one
way
to
interpret
this
slide.
C
Yeah,
mr
chairman,
and
represent
great,
I
think
it's
a
combination
of
things.
First,
I
think
it's
wyoming's
school
lands
have
significant
mineral
wealth
compared
to
other
states,
montana,
idaho.
C
We
have,
as
a
state,
set
a
policy
to
put
at
least
two-thirds
and
prior
to
2019.
It
was
all,
but
eight
million
dollars
of
the
mineral
royalties
were
deposited
into
the
common
school
land
income
account.
Second,
your
investment
earnings,
as
I
indicated,
was
about
two
point
or
three
quarters
of
the
total
amount.
You're
distributing
to
the
school
foundation
program
account
over
the
past
15
years
has
come
from
investment
earnings.
C
C
C
So,
as
you
can
see,
new
mexico
25
of
their
total
k-12
revenue
comes
from
their
common
school
account
from
investment
earnings
and
also
the
land
activities,
and
so
with
a
26
billion
dollar
corpus
in
new
mexico,
they've
been
able
to
leverage
their
corpus
and
investment
earnings
to
distribute
the
majority
of
their
or
25
of
their
funding
through
through
the
investment
earnings.
So
I
think
different
policies-
and
I
think,
location
and
geology
matters
as
well.
Arizona
doesn't
have
a
lot
of
mineral
wealth
that
they
have
utilized
to
fund
their
schools.
F
Mr
co-chairman,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
mr
wilmar
too.
I
think
just
kind
of
refresh
that
committee's
memory
here
I
mean
talking
about
that
eight
million
dollar
cap
that
was
lifted
in
such
crisis
here
really
beginning
with
the
1617
downturn
and
coal,
so
durantic
and
bankruptcies,
and
all
that.
F
But
that
added
I
mean
just
off
my
memories,
about
44
plus
may
in
a
year
to
where
we
had
the
eight
the
constitution
says:
one
third
will
go,
and
but
somebody
in
the
1990s
put
a
cap
on
that
not
to
exceed
8
million
when
it
was
about
8
million
back
in
the
90s.
C
Mr
chairman
and
chairman
harshman
you're,
all
right
so,
prior
to
the
2019
and
or
2018
session
fiscal
year,
2018
really
wyoming's
policy.
The
legislature's
policy
was
to
only
distribute
eight
million
of
the
mineral
royalties
on
school
lands
to
the
school
capital,
construction
account
and,
as
part
of
the,
I
think,
ways
to
help
close
the
gap
in
the
structural
deficit
in
the
school
capital.
Construction
count
was
to
expand
that
to
utilize
the
constitutional
allowable
one-third
of
mineral
royalties,
the
full
one-third
to
to
be
deposited
in
the
school
capital
church
account.
C
This,
I
think
this
year
is
about
35
million
is
the
full
one-third.
So
if
you
subtract,
eight
million
from
that
you're
sitting
about
27
million
was
the
benefit
of
expanding
to
the
full,
one-third,
okay,
perfect
and
then.
F
I
think
it
was
was
a
cinephile
like
I
don't
know,
29
or
a
year
or
two
ago,
two
years
ago,
already
the
the
the
statutory
one
percent
that
we
started.
Saving
you
know
during
the
jonah
gas
boom
and
and
really
did
the
four
by
ten,
the
eight
by
eighteen
and
really
doubled
and
doubled
again.
The
per
mill
trust
fund
we've
seen
that
same
thing
in
the
common
school
too.
I
just
remind
the
committee-
I
mean
one
that
long
ago
the
com
school
fund
was
a
billion.
F
You
know,
and
the
market
value
now
is
four
and
a
half
billion
plus.
So
it's
we've
done
incredible.
We've
had
incredible
blessings
and
with
these
minerals
on
school
lands,
but
just
to
remind
the
committee
now
and
folks
who
are
here
that
it's
really
important
we've
gone
back
to
saving
that
statutory
one
percent.
We
pulled
it
off
a
couple
years
where
we
were
really
in
deficit,
but
half
of
that
now
severance
tax
is
going
to
go
to
the
permanent,
the
common
school
permanent
landfill,
it's
about
45
million
a
year
or
so.
C
F
Kind
of
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
we're
back
to
really
kind
of
where
we
were
maybe
a
little
more
on
kind
of
deposits
and
that
permanent
piece
on
that.
But
the
other
piece
of
this,
I
think,
is
important
for
people
for
us
to
know
is
a
lot
of
you
know:
there's
a
certain
amount
of
severance
taxes
derived
off
school,
minerals,
school
trust,
minerals
and
for
all
of
our
history.
F
The
severance
tax
there's
not
been
a
penny
of
it
go
to
the
school
children,
and
I
think
this
was
a
an
important
change
where
we've
taken
half
of
the
statutory
one
percent,
45
million
or
so-
and
I
do
you-
have
that
number.
What
is
the
severance
tax?
That's
derived
off
school
minerals.
F
F
G
Mr
chairman,
chairman
harshman,
we've
looked
at
those
numbers
before
as
far
as
the
severance
taxes
derived
from
state
lands.
If
you
will-
and
I
don't
know
if
it's
quite
that
high-
it
has
been
about
a
year
or
two
since
we've
looked
at
that,
but
your
50
million
dollar
estimate
might
be
a
little
bit
high
on
that.
That.
F
F
C
Great,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
going
to
slide
seven
this.
This
kind
of
gets
into
the
next
section
of
the
presentation.
C
C
They
have
categorized
wyoming
or
state
constitution,
education
clauses
into
four
categories,
and
so
category
one
is
a
mere
mandate
of
a
system
of
free
public
education.
Category
two
mandates
that
the
system
of
public
schools
meets
a
certain
minimum
standard
of
quality
such
as
thorough
and
efficient.
Then
category
three
is
a
combination
of
categories,
one
and
two:
that's
where
wyoming
is
at
and
then
category
four
is
the
most
greatest
obligation
on
states.
C
So
I
just
want
to
kind
of
you
know
illustrate.
You
know
that
that
is
one
one
aspect
of
the
state's
requirement
of
funding
education.
If
you
look
on
slide
eight,
there
are
three
clauses
in
wyoming's
constitution
that
really
outlined
the
state's
obligation
in
article
seven
sections,
one
eight
and
nine
really
established
the
the
legislature's
responsibility
and
and
funding
education
under
article
seven
section.
One
legislature
shall
provide
for
the
establishment
and
maintenance
of
a
complete
and
uniform
system
of
public
education.
C
C
Those
are
the
the
three
sections
of
article
seven
that
really
kind
of
set
the
stage
and
then
go
into
a
slide.
Nine.
The
us
supreme
court
in
1973
really
shifted
the
burden
on
on
public
education
to
states.
C
There
was
a
case
san
antonio
versus
rodriguez,
that
indicated
education
is,
is
not
one
of
the
rights
afforded
explicitly
under
the
under
the
federal
constitution
so
that,
as
you'll
see
in
these
later,
slides
is
kind
of
an
indication
of
when
really
state
support,
kind
of
increased
and
and
the
burden
of
that
revenue
started.
Shifting
from
more
local
revenue
to
state
revenue
going
to
slide
10.
Another
aspect
of
financing
education
is
court
challenges.
C
There's
been
only
four
states
in
the
nation
that
have
not
had
an
adequacy
or
equity
challenge
and
those
are
hawaii,
iowa,
nevada
and
utah.
Every
other
state
has
had
some
challenge
on
the
basis
of
whether
or
not
their
school
finance
system
is
providing
an
adequate
or
an
equitable
education,
and
so
that
really
does
play
a
role
in
whether
or
not
your
your
own
state
supreme
court
tells
you
you
need
to
either
provide
additional
funding
or
modify
your
formula.
C
C
Also
in
campbell
one
in
1995,
the
the
court
declared
unconstitutional
school
finance
scheme
under
which
school
districts
could
levy
optional
mill
levies,
and
these
were
for
maintenance
as
well
as
operations,
and
they
were
outside
of
the
school
foundation,
program
account
and
provided
the
ability
for
for
districts
to
have
wealth-based
disparities,
and
so
those
were
ruled
unconstitutional
and
the
court
ruled
in
in
entirety
the
the
school
finance
system
unconstitutional
as
well.
What
plays
an
important
role
in
wyoming
is:
is
the
campbell
2
decision
in
2001?
C
Not
only
were
the
the
operation
side
of
the
school
finance
system
unconstitutional,
but
the
capital
construction
side,
then
it
was
real
unconstitutional.
So
the
whole
burden
of
capital
construction
was
placed
on
the
state,
and
so
that
plays
an
important
role
in
wyoming's
obligation
in
funding
k-12
education
in
campbell
2.
C
As
I
indicated,
the
the
court
indicated,
literature
literature
may
raise
revenue
through
an
unlimited
number
of
mill
levees
as
long
as
they
are
uniform
and
just,
and
so
this
was
one
way
that
the
the
court
indicated
hey
if
you
want
to
pay
for
capital
construction
just
raise
the
number
of
middle.
Ladies,
that
wasn't
their
requirement
but
an
option.
C
They
just
ensured
that
if
you're
going
to
raise
middle
levees
to
be
uniform
and
just
as
the
constitution
requires
so
just
those
these,
why
we
supreme
court
cases
really
do
dictate
the
legislature's
role
in
in
funding
education
and
guiding
what
is
available
options
on
slide
12.
Another
important
role
is
what
type
of
funding
formula
does
the
state
choose
to
adopt?
Mr.
C
I
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
I
had
a
quick
question
for
I
was
wondering
how
espinoza
versus
montana
department
of
department
of
revenue
would
play
into
this,
because
that
has
to
do
with
using
grants
for
private
schools,
and
so
I
was
curious
on
how
that
would
play
into
this,
because
montana
has
kind
of
the
same
structure
with
their
constitution
and
not
using
government
funds
for
private
education,
but
the
supreme
court
ruled
against
that,
and
so
I
was
wondering
how
that
would
play
into
this.
C
Mr
walmart,
if
you
can
mr
remember
that
deferred
mr
anderson,
okay.
B
Mr
anderson,
thank
you,
mr
chairman.
You
know
we
we
haven't
had,
or
we've
looked
in
that
case
somewhat.
You
know
from
my
understanding
my
reading
of
the
case.
B
It's
a
little
different
from
the
situation
in
wyoming
in
that
at
that
time
of
that
case,
montana
was
providing
some
public
funds
to
some
private
schools,
but
had
excluded
religious
schools
due
to
their
constitutional
limitation,
and
this
the
court
case
said
that
if
you
were
giving
money
to
private
schools,
you
had
to
give
it
to
to
all
private
schools.
So
a
little
different
situation
than
what's
currently
in
wyoming,
where
we're
not
providing
any
money
to
any
type
of
of
private
schools.
A
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
on
on,
as
indicated
on
slide
12,
the
the
type
of
funding
formula
that
a
state
chooses
to
implement
influences
also
the
the
level
of
education
support
going
to
the
education
commission
states
website.
They
have
categorized
state
funding
formulas
in
into
four
categories:
wyoming
sits
in
a
what
they
consider
a
resource-based
allocation.
The
most
common
is
a
student-based
foundation
which
is
kind
of
a
base
per
pupil
amount
adjusted
by
certain
weights.
C
But
this
just
illustrates
again
one
aspect
of
the
total
picture
of
the
the
type
of
funding
formula
that
you
do
choose
to
adopt
does
influence
the
state's
obligation
in
in
funding
k-12
education.
Mr
wilmar,
just.
A
I
don't
know
if
this
is
quite
the
appropriate
time
or
not,
but
wyoming's
journey
to
fund
education
and
getting
us
to
the
you
know
the
model
and
the
student-based
funding
sources
and
the
accounting
for
different
factors
and
local
resources
and
what
we
used
to
call
power
equalization
from
cheyenne.
But
you
know
kind
of
it
does
get
high
marks
for
equity.
Doesn't
it
I
mean
we
can
argue
about
whether
it's
too
much
allocation
or
not
or
not
enough
resources,
but
it
gets
high
marks
on
the
equity
side.
C
Mr
chairman
you're
accurate.
Yes
in
equity,
it
does
and
as
well
as
adequacy,
but
both
of
those
two
pieces
receive
high
marks
for
wyoming.
A
And
there
were
brutal
brutal
years
and
I
came
through
some
of
this
lawsuit
stuff
where
we
we
were
not
on
the
equity
side
and
some
which
the
adequacy
side
was
in
doubt
as
well,
especially
depending
on
where
you
were
so.
It's
been
a
very
brutal
journey
to
get
to
where
we
are,
and
I
always
think
it's
a
it's
a
good
idea
to
remember
how
far
we've
come
and
really
there's
a
lot
to
be
proud
of
here.
So,
mr
walmart,
back
to
you.
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
That's
kind
of
the
end
of
the
second
piece
if
there's
no
further
questions
I'll
go
into
the
to
the
next
piece,
really
just
which
focuses
on
the
revenues
at
kind
of
a
u.s
and
wyoming
level,
of
where
those
revenues
come
from.
So
if
there's
not
any
questions
I'll
I'll
head
to
slide,
13.
J
A
I
I
A
So
before
mr
wilmar
answers,
I
think
we
we
all
need
to
think
about
the
thing
that
we
have
a
funding
model
that
provides
funding
based
on
a
kind
of
a
theoretical,
idealized
school,
and
then
local
school
districts
implement
that
model,
the
senator
james,
they
don't
exactly
follow
the
model,
they
don't
say
well,
the
state
says
we
should
have
this,
and
so
we're
going
to
have
the
exact
same
thing.
They
tend
to
do
it
quite
differently.
Actually,
so
that's
where
we
get
the
exact
questions
about
what
people
make
what
goes
to
salaries?
A
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
and
senator
james.
Why
I
mean
is
a
little
bit
unique
and
we
are
very
detailed
in
how
we
allocate
our
resources
to
our
our
funding
model.
As
you
can
see,
from
the
map
on
on
page
12,
most
states
have
a
formula
that
uses
a
kind
of
a
per
pupil
allocation
and
then
adjusts
those
per
pupil
amounts
by
certain
weights
for
whether
the
students
free
and
reduced
lunch
or
special
education.
C
But
all
states
do
generate
a
certain
amount
of
resources
for
teachers
or
administrators
or
central
office
or
maintenance.
They
just
do
it
in
a
different
manner.
Wyoming
is
very
prescriptive.
In
the
way
we
set
up
our
prototypical
models
in
ensuring
there's
minimum
resources.
We
reimburse
special
education,
which
is
very
unique
across
the
states.
We've
looked
at
that
through
our
recalibration
efforts,
transportation.
C
We
reimburse
at
100
percent
based
upon
the
allowable
expenditures
set
by
the
department
of
education,
but,
as
I
indicated,
most
states
have
a
kind
of
a
per
pupil
amount,
but
they
do
have
a
rationale
as
how
they
fund
those,
and
they
do
include
resources
for
teachers
and
administrators
and
support
services
for
tutors
or
counselors
and
so
forth.
A
I
To
interrupt
mr
chairman,
I
was
just
trying
to
look
for
what
more
like
an
roi.
You
know.
Are
we
getting
a
bang
for
our
buck?
Are
we
spending
more
on
the
non-productive
end
than
we
are
in
our
production
and
production
and
being
the
teachers,
because
they're
handling
the
product
being
the
students-
and
you
know,
they're
the
ones
with
the
hands-on
working
with
the
students
and
so
and
I'm
just
wondering
if
we're
spending
more
money
and
on
the
admin
end
of
things?
I
C
Mr
walmart
yeah,
mr
chairman,
and
senator
james,
certainly
I
can
grab
that
information
from
the
national
center
for
education
statistics,
each
state
reports,
expenditures
to
the
national
center
for
education
statistics
and
they
break
it
down
on
certain
categories,
and
so,
when
I
get
back
to
the
office,
I
will
gather
that
data
by
category
and
I
will
certainly
identify
where
wyoming
looks
on
terms
of
classroom
expenditures
compared
to
supplies
materials
administration.
G
A
Senator
james,
I
think
it's
a
really
good
line
of
questioning.
I
I
think
we
all
saw
that
there
was
an
article.
It's
been
a
week
or
so
ago,
in
the
cowboy
state
daily
that
looked
at
superintendent's
salaries
and
it's
pretty
universal,
that
our
superintendents
are
paid
higher
than
the
model
says
they
should
be,
but
that's
a
local
school
district
decision
based
on
what
they
have
to
pay
to
attract
people,
and
so
it's
probably
you
know,
there's
there's
probably
lots
of
categories
like
that.
When
you
look
at,
we
do
not
restrict
what
school
districts
spend
on.
A
We
just
give
them
an
amount
of
money
that
is
based
on
what
our
experts
tell
us.
We
should
be
giving
up,
but
there
is
a
disconnect,
I
suppose,
certainly
in
school
superintendent.
That's
the
hot
button.
So
is
that
the
kind
of
thing
you
were
talking
about
senator
james.
A
It's
a
hard
place.
You
know
where
you
want
to
start
micromanaging
local
school
boards.
We
trust
them
so
much
or
but
yet
on
paper,
at
least
our
consultants
tell
us
it
should
cost
this,
but
you
know
it
we're
we're
moving
forward.
We
try
to
get
there
anybody
else.
Mr
wilmar,
do
you
have
anything
to
conclude.
C
Mr
chairman,
with
that
section,
if
that's
concluded
I'll
go
to
the
next
section,
as
I
indicate
this,
this
data
explores
the
national
center
for
education
statistics
in
the
first
part,
on
per
pupil
revenues
and
and
total
revenues
and
kind
of
the
distribution
of
those
revenues.
Whether
they
come
from
state,
local
or
federal
sources.
C
On
the
left-hand
side
is
a
illustration
of
per
pupil
revenues
dating
back
to
fiscal
year,
19
1920
up
through
2018-19
and
there's
some
years,
obviously
skipping
in
there,
but
on
u.s
average
in
in
the
most
recent
years
available
2018-19
the
u.s
average
per
pupil
revenue
was
twenty
two
dollars
and
you
can
see
early
on
that.
There
was
not
much
federal
support.
C
It
wasn't
until
the
really
the
elementary
and
secondary
education
act
of
1965
when
the
u.s
department
of
education
started
providing
a
little
bit
substantial
amount
of
money
early
on.
As
you
can
see,
on
the
on
the
right-hand
side,
the
proportion
of
funding
and
kind
of
the
from
the
great
depression
all
the
way
up
through
you
know,
1960
came
from
local
property
tax.
Well,
the
local
share
was
83
in
1920
and
it's
moved
about
45.
C
You
know
part
of
the
responsibility
also,
as
I
indicated
court
decisions
in
1980,
there
was
a
wave
of
adequacy
and
equity
challenges
that
moved
the
state's
obligations
at
a
higher
level
than
than
it
used
to
be,
and
so
up
until
recently,
state
proportional
funding
was
higher
than
local
funding
the
recession
in
2008
kind
of
dipped
down
and
and
took
some
of
that
funding
away.
But
the
local
wealth
has
kind
of
maintained
about
fifty
percent
of
funding
since
1980
forward.
C
As
I
indicated,
the
great
recession
2008
also
saw,
I
think,
we'll
see
similar
trends
to
the
cove
18
pipe
pandemic.
There
was
a
little
bit
of
a
bump.
If
you
see
on
on
the
bottom
line
of
that
graph
on
the
right,
there
was
a
bump
of
federal
revenue
in
about
2010
2011..
C
C
Going
on
to
slide
14,
I
wanted
to
illustrate
in
terms
of
2019,
where
does
wyoming
sit
compared
to
all
other
states
and
washington
dc?
We
said
about
ninth
in
in
2018
in
terms
of
per
pupil
revenue,
that's
a
little
bit
lower
than
historically
in
the
past
10
years
or
so
and
we're
you
know
I've
kind
of
categorized
where
our
local
state
and
federal
money
comes
from
in
the
in
the
bottom
graph.
C
A
couple
states
I'll
point
out
is
new
mexico,
as
indicated
earlier,
they
have
a
little
bit
of
money
from
their
local
wealth
and
that
local
wealth
is
actually
partly
from
their
property
taxes
for
capital
construction.
They
only
assess
a
half
mill
for
k-12
operations
on
their
property
owners.
C
Well
I
mean
we
says
43
mills
on
our
local
property
owners,
again
they're
in
a
different
position,
with
their
sovereign
wealth
fund
than
what
I
mean
is,
but
that's
just
different
policies
in
the
in
the
states
and
different
trends.
Hawaii.
They
have
very
little
local
support.
Why
they
have
one
school
district.
Hawaii
is
the
school
district,
just
unique
circumstances,
policies
and
states
impact
also
state
aid
versus
local
aid.
C
If
we
look
at
slide
15,
this
illustrates
wyoming's
per-pupil
revenue
from
fiscal
year,
1989
up
through
2018-19.
Again,
when
I
talk
about
all
revenue,
this
is
all
revenue,
including
capital,
construction
and
operations,
so
wyoming
looks
kind
of
wavy
in
the
past
15
years
or
so
there
are
substantial
capital
construction
investments
from
about
2003
to
2018.
C
We
we
saw
substantial
hundreds
and
hundreds
of
millions
of
dollars
invested
in
capital
construction.
That's
why
you
see
some
of
these
peaks
and
valleys
over
the
past
couple
years
in
wyoming.
Another
interesting
aspect
of
wyoming
is
you'll
notice.
This
almost
looks
like
a
mirror
image
on
the
right
hand,
side-
and
this
is
the
function
of
wyoming's
funding
formula
where,
when
the
minerals
are
good,
the
state's
obligation
goes
down
when
you
kind
of
have
those
those
busts.
The
state's
obligation
goes
up
so
you'll
kind
of
see.
C
F
Have
a
question
for
the
chairman
just
comment
on
that
mirror
image
there
on
on
15,
on
the
right
hand,
column
and,
and
really
just
maybe
explain
to
the
committee,
the
double
whammy
which
is
kind
of
the
triple
whammy.
Really
when
you
count
recapture,
whereas
we
know
you
know
you're
going
to
show
in
your
presentation
the
amount
of
property
taxes
paid
by
minerals.
C
C
C
In
some
cases,
there's
two
examples:
one
is
teton
county,
they
have
zero
mineral
low,
but
they
have
substantial
property
wealth
from
non-minerals.
They
are
what
we
call
a
recapture
district,
where
their
local
revenue
exceeds
that
guarantee
amount.
So
we
recapture
that
and
we
send
it
back
out
and
we
deposit
in
the
school
foundation
program
account.
We
send
that
back
out
to
school
districts
support
the
state's
obligation.
C
The
other
example
would
be
close
by
in
sublet
county,
where
their
natural
gas
wealth
has
allowed
them
to
have
excess
revenue,
and
so
they
could
be
an
example
where
they're
they're
a
recapture
district.
They
send
the
state
excess
revenue.
So
this
mirror
image
really
represents
the
fluctuation
of
commodity
prices,
but
also
in
teton
county
property
wealth
from
non-minerals,
where
the
state
balances
each
district's
property
taxes
to
ensure
that
no
district
has
a
wealth-based
disparity
that
that
excess
revenue
is
collected.
F
Okay,
just
a
follow-up:
oh
we're
gonna!
Do
a
follow-up,
then
we'll
go
to
you.
So
mr
will
martha
members
when
you
look
at
that
graph,
like
2008
and
nine
as
a
as
a
dip
in
the
blue
in
the
local.
That's
a
classic
property
tax
dip
because
of
mineral
price
and
production
dropped
dramatically
and
0
809,
and
so
then
the
local
portion
of
the
guarantee
drops
in
the
state.
F
Then
you
can
see
the
state
go
up
at
that
same
time,
not
that
the
state
has
more
money,
the
state's
broke
too,
and
that's
why
it's
called
the
double
whammy.
At
a
time
when,
when
there
is,
has
to
be
more
state
support
because
local
property
taxes
are
lagging
because
of
mineral
production,
the
state
then
is
required
to
spend
more
and-
and
that
phrase
was
coined-
I
don't
know
in
the
late
80s
90s
the
double
whammy.
C
Chairman
harsha,
thanks
for
catching
that
additional
double
emmy
concept-
and
this
really,
I
think,
illustrates
that
the
strain
that
we're
seeing
on
the
school
foundation
program
account
granted.
This
is
a
couple
years
old,
but
chairman
harshman's
right,
the
state's
obligation
doesn't
go
down,
but
you
can
see
in
2005.
C
You
know
it
was
about
a
50
50
split
between
the
state
and
local
school
districts.
Well,
the
state's
obligation
has
increased
to
pay
more
dollars
and
that's
a
couple
combinations.
We
had
a
substantial
increase
in
funding
to
school
districts
in
fiscal
year
2006
and
beyond,
but
the
the
state's
obligation
is
now
53
of
total
revenues
to
school
districts
as
compared
to
39
percent
of
total
revenues
and
in
in
local
local
revenues.
C
K
C
Mr
chairman
representative,
it
fluctuates
year
to
year
depending
on
assessed
valuations,
but
I
think
this
year,
there's
four,
I
believe:
that's
converse
county
and
douglas
conners
county
school
district
number,
one
sublet
county
school
district
number,
one
and
nine
in
teton
county.
I
think
those
are
the
four
this
year
and
campbell
county
is
not
one
of
them.
Mr
chairman,
campbell
county
has
moved
off
of
a
recapture
district.
They
used
to
be
it
used
to
be
a
substantial
one.
K
K
C
A
I
think
that's
that
yeah
exactly
it's
kind
of
an
identity
that
it's
a
mathematical
formula.
You've
got
six
school
districts
out
of
everybody,
maybe
four
that
are
given
a
little
extra
money.
There
might
be
a
couple.
Districts
are
dead,
even
you
know,
but
rest
of
them
are
getting
subsidized
for
the
state.
So
that's
that's
why
this
is
a
good,
equitable
system.
That's
where
it
comes
from.
Let's
go
to
representative.
H
C
Mr
chairman
represented
baker,
I
don't
know
I
I
I
don't
know,
I
don't
have
an
answer.
A
C
Yeah
sorry,
mr
chairman
baker,
I
I
don't
have
an
answer
to
that.
I
I'm
I
was
shocked
that
there
was
only
four
I
thought
have
been
higher,
but
it
only
takes
one
one
student,
one
parent,
perhaps
to
challenge
and,
as
you
can
see
from
the
u.s
supreme
court,
the
rodriguez
in
san
antonio.
E
E
If
you
look
at
montana's,
federal
portion
and
say
south
dakota
in
relationship
to
wyoming
is,
is
there
a
reason
that
we
can't
get
a
little
more
federal
funding.
C
Mr
chairman
and
representative
sweeney
to
your
first
part.
Yes,
this
is
all
federal
revenue,
so
whether
it
comes
directly
from
us
or
that
or
the
federal
government,
such
as
impact
aid
funding.
This
this
county
here
receives
substantial
amount
of
federal
impact
aid.
Funding
for
school
districts
that
doesn't
come
through
the
wyoming
department
of
education
comes
directly
from
the
federal
government
to
these
school
districts
that
that's
part
of
the
revenue
for
federal
revenues,
as
well
as
the
free
reduced
lunch
or
the
u.s
national
school
lunch
program.
C
Yes,
all
federal
revenues
are
accounted
for
in
this.
In
terms
of
you
know,
why
does
montana
and
south
dakota
receive
a
little
bit
more
again?
These
are
kind
of
a
percent
of
the
total
revenues,
and
so
this
has
an
impact
on
their
total
funding.
So
wyoming
has
a
little
bit
more
richer
per
pupil
funding
than
those
states
and
so
more
substantially
funding
than
in
south
dakota.
C
So
that
plays
a
significant
role
in
how
these
proportional
proportion
amounts
are
are
driven.
So
I
don't
know
if
I
have
a
clear
answer
on
that
part
of
it
is
the
number
of
students.
The
majority
of
the
the
funding
for
for
schools
is
driven
by
title,
one
funding,
which
is
a
formula
based
on
number
of
students
that
are
considered
at
risk,
so
that
that
could
be
a
a
role
there
as
well.
E
Follow
up,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
I
hadn't
considered
quite
honestly,
bureau
of
indian
affairs
and
what
relationship
so
that
all
of
that
revenue
is
counted
in
those
totals
which
would
lead
back
to
your
your
comment
about
the
substantial
amount
the
fremont
county
receives,
which
I
hadn't
hadn't
contemplated.
E
C
Mr
chairman
and
representative
sweeney,
I
don't
believe
any
assessments
that
students
take
are
dependent
upon
their
funding
levels.
Certainly,
the
education
committee
reviews
all
sorts
of
assessments,
including
the
the
nape,
which
is
the
kind
of
nation's
report
card,
but
those
scores
and
students
results
even
at
the
state
level.
Is
they
not
dependent
upon
on
any
funding.
A
C
Go
ahead:
yeah.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
since
I
brought
it
up,
federal
impact
aid
is
additional
revenue
that
school
districts
receive
in
lieu
of
local
property
wealth,
so
federal
lands
in
school
districts
that
cannot
be
used
to
generate
local
property
taxes,
receive
federal
assistance
or
federal
impact
aid
funding.
C
As
a
result
of
that,
and
it's
a
complicated
formula.
Three
school
districts
wanting
to
receive
substantial
funding,
fremont
schools,
number
14,
21
and
38
here
in
fremont
county
there's
other
school
districts
such
as
laramie
county
school
district
number,
one
has
the
the
base
in
china.
They
receive
a
small
portion
of
funding
a
couple
hundred
thousand
dollars
a
year
here
in
fremont
county.
It's
substantial.
I
think
it's
like
25
to
40
million
dollars
depending
on
the
year
of
a
federal
impact
aid.
C
The
state
is
currently
prohibited
from
counting
that
impact
aid
funding
as
a
local
revenue.
C
There
is
a
formula
that
we
can
use
to
kind
of
test
to
see
if
we
can
count
it
as
local
revenue,
but
it's
based
upon
the
average
per
people
funding
across
the
state
and
why
means
per
people?
Funding
across
school
districts
varies
vastly
from
where,
from
around
38
000
to
15
000
per
student.
We
we
just
don't
fit
the
formula
to
be
able
to
count
local
impact
day
or
the
federal
impact
aid
funding
as
a
local
revenue.
C
New
mexico
has
worked
out
a
system
where
they
are
able
to
count
a
portion
of
the
impact
aid
funding
as
a
local
revenue,
but
it's
not
all
of
it,
but
it's
because
their
per
pupil
revenue
across
your
school
districts
are
very
close
as
compared
to
wyoming's,
and
so
I
hope
that
helps
kind
of
set
the
stage
for
why
fremont
county
receives
a
substantial
amount
of
money.
A
A
But
you
must
maintain
those
separate
districts
to
maximize
the
impact
they
flow
to
those
districts.
They're
reservation
districts
and
they
have
significant
needs
any
other
way
of
organizing
our
that
we
so
far
discovered
reduces
the
total
amount
of
resources,
especially
to
those
pupils
through
the
impact
aid.
A
We've
and
I'd,
explain
it
if
I've
messed
it
up
at
all,
mr
willmoth,
but
it's
it
is
a
it's
a
driver
in
this
situation
that
we
can't
quite
get
our
arms
around.
There
might
be
a
way
to
have
just
a
reservation
district
maximizing
impact
aid
and
then
everybody
else
in
another
district,
but
so
far
that
hasn't
panned
out
either
and
mr
wilmar,
please
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong
and
I've
got
another
legislative
local
representative
larson's
here
he's
helped
me
think
through
this
and
just
go
ahead.
C
C
So
but
the
state
is
prohibited
from
directing
how
those
funds
are
spent
and
we
can't
count
it
as
local
revenue
against
our
our
funding
formula
and
the
different.
A
C
You're
right,
the
the
organization
and
the
number
of
students
in
those
districts
plays
a
role
in
how
the
calculation
works
and
it's
a
complex
formula
and
you're
right.
Combining
fremont
county
into
a
single
school
district
does
diminish
the
total
revenue
that
would
be
available
under
that
impact
impact
aid
formula
and
so
to
maximize,
as
you
put
it
to
maximize
the
impact
of
revenue
to
those
school
districts
has
shown.
Keeping
them
separate
is
is
the
most
benefit
to
them.
A
E
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
really
appreciate
that
because
it
never
really
made
sense
to
me
in
in
the
funding
of
all
of
that
and
that
really
helped
clarify.
E
So
could
you
have
force
four
school
districts?
Let's
say
in
fremont
county
where
you'd
have
to
have.
I
believe,
if
I'm
hearing
correctly
and
other
conversations,
I've
had
where
you
could
have
you've
got
to
have
two
school
districts,
plus
the
federal
school
district
which
we
currently
have
for
the
reservation.
And
then
could
you
have
a
fourth
district
school
district
which
encompasses
the
other
other
school
districts
consolidated.
A
So,
mr
walmart,
you
jump
in
and
correct
me,
but
yes,
we
could.
We
could
definitely
do
that
exercise.
It's
a
little.
It's
one
bit
more
complicated,
because
if
you
make
the
assumption
that
that
only
native
kids
go
to
reservation,
schools,
you've
you've
blown
it
because
there
are
more
native
students
that
go
to
riverton
than
other
schools,
and
lander
has
a
substantial
native
population
too.
So
it's
it
gets
even
more
complicated
how
you
have
to
do
it.
A
Mr
wilma,
you
anything
to
add
to
that.
Mr
chairman,
I
know
yeah
and
we
got
a
business
manager
here
too,
and
mr
sweeney
we're
glad
you're
here
we've
been.
This
is
a
tough
one,
any
other
thing,
and
we
could
give
some
direction
to
look
into
this.
If
you
want
we're
not
exactly
the
education
committee,
but
we
certainly
could
look
into
it
more
and
I'd
welcome
the
committee
doing
so.
A
Anybody
else
representative
greg,
mr.
D
Chairman,
I'm
just
trying
to
understand:
are
you
saying
that,
because
I'm
trying
to
understand
the
tracks
we're
going
down,
it's
always
good
to
have
education
broadly,
but
are
you
interested
in
pursuing
consolidation
outside
of
fremont,
county
or
or
or
just
in
general?
I'm
just
trying
to
understand
some
of
the
thrusts
that
we're
going
after
here.
A
Here's
my
basic
point,
representative,
is
that
obviously
fremont
county
is
an
outlier
in
the
way
wyoming
funds
schools.
There
are
plenty
of
districts
with
more
kids
and
and
smaller.
A
So
it's
definitely
a
right
topic,
always
for
analysis
every
time
I've
dug
into
it
is
I
hit
this
impact
aid
wall
for
fremont
county
and
that's
where
I
end
up
kind
of
running
out
of
steam.
Could
we
have
more
broad-based
districts
across
the
state
boy?
That's
a
hot
button,
question
multi-county
districts
and
things
like
that.
I
suppose
hawaii
obviously
proved
that
they
could
do
it.
E
I
think
if
the
individuals,
my
my
perspective,
if
individuals
want
to
weigh
in
I,
I
agree-
it's
not
in
our
wheelhouse,
probably
educations,
but
I
definitely
as
an
individual
legislator
and
I'm
interested,
but
this
was
a
very
useful
discussion.
So.
A
I
think
there's
there's
benefit
to
that,
and
anybody
like
to
help
me
move
that
forward
in
thinking
I
could
use
some
help
and-
and
I
just
think
I
I
tried
it
a
couple
years
ago-
ran
into
kind
of
some
brick
walls,
but
it
has
to
be
there
and
we
do
have
you
will
drive
in
in
fremont
county
and
you
will
see
a
school
district,
24
bus
going
one
way
and
a
school
district
one
bus
going
the
other
way
and
they
will
pass
each
other
and
it
happens.
A
lot
go
ahead.
E
E
I
think
there
are
much
better
minds
than
this
committee
in
joint
tribal,
which
you
also
serve
on
with
representative
larson.
I
I
think
that
that's
probably
a
good
place,
which
I
know
you
you've
taken
several
times,
so
I
admire
the
work,
but
this
has
been
really
useful
and
appreciate.
Mats.
Thank.
L
C
C
If
you
go
to
slide
18
80.36
percent
of
fiscal
year,
19
revenues
from
local
school
districts
were
derived
by
property
taxes
in
total
94.25
were
derived
from
non-property
taxes
and
other
revenues
so
or
property
tax,
non-property
tax
and
and
other
revenues.
The
remaining
of
these
revenues
earning
non-interest
food
service
student
activities,
they're
just
pennies.
In
when
you
compare
total
revenues.
C
in
wyoming
you'll,
you'll
notice,
the
intermediate
revenues
appear
to
be
a
more
substantial
portion
than
the
u.s
average,
and
the
reason
for
that
is
when
we
look
when,
when
the
national
center
for
education
statistics
collects
property,
tax
revenue
and
local
property
tax
revenue.
For
why
I
mean
that's
only
the
25
mil
in
the
dark
grade.
The
top
bar
of
this
graphic
intermediate
revenues
are
the
county
level
revenue.
C
So
this
is
not
only
the
six
mill
revenue,
but
this
is
the
more
motor
vehicle
tax
revenue,
fines
and
forfeitures
that
are
required
to
be
deposited
in
the
county
school
fund.
That's
that
top
grade
level.
So
when
we
really
look
at
wyoming's
revenues,
the
top
and
the
in
the
bottom
are
the
same:
really
property
tax
revenues
with
motor
vehicle
tax
revenues
combined.
So
looking
on
slide
18.
This
shows
the
proportion
over
this
over
the
same
year
and
then
on
on
slide
21..
F
C
Yeah,
mr
chairman,
correct
and
just
one
aspect
on
the:
if
you
go
to
slide
21
emily,
their
intermediate
revenues
make
up
19.2
but
of
that
intermediate
revenue
that
includes
six
mil,
but
also
includes
the
motor
vehicle
taxes
and
fines
and
forfeiture
so
anything
collected
by
the
county,
treasurer
deposit
in
the
county
school
fund
that
that
is
included
in
the
intermediate
revenues.
Just
the
way
the
data
is
reported
is
just
a
little
nuanced
in
in
this
respect
for
wyoming
and
the
county
revenues,
the
that's
mostly
property
tax.
C
And
then
the
motor
vehicle.
A
A
C
So,
mr
chairman,
on
slide
21,
I
kind
of
did
the
same
graphic
just
showing
the
showing
the
total
revenues
to
wyoming
local
school
districts,
the
other
revenues.
I
I
don't
have
really
a
lot
of
detail
on
what
ncs
reports
as
other
revenues.
But
again
the
the
other
categories
are
small
in
comparison
of
the
total
revenues
represent
grit
yeah.
Thank.
D
D
C
Represent
great,
my
understanding
is
the
motor
vehicle
revenue
is
distributed
as
any
other
property
tax
and
the
same
proportion
I
could
be.
I
could
be
wrong,
but
that's
my
understanding,
mr
tempty
is
shaking
his
head
correct.
So.
A
Yeah
so
there
I
don't
have
remember,
I
haven't
paid
this
recently,
I'm
probably
out
of
date
on
my
tags
now
that
I
think
about
it,
but
the
higher
fee
typically
is
the
property
tax
portion
of
that.
But
there
are
two
pieces
on
that
motor
vehicle.
I
can't
remember
exactly
what
it
says,
but
the
property
tax
piece
is
the
sliding
scale
and
miss
arnold
is
here.
She
knows
miss
po
man
there
miss
henson
is
here,
and
so
that's
the
one
that
says
like.
A
If
you
have
a
really
old
car,
you
kind
of
pay
a
minimum
amount.
But
if
you
have
a
new
car,
you
pay
a
lot.
In
addition,
there's
the
sales
tax
on
top
of
a
new
purchase
and
there's
another
fee
in
that
registration
that
doesn't
have
anything
to
do
with
the
schools
trying
to
help
with
that.
But
I'm
not
doing
a
very
good
job.
Mr
wilmoreth
I'll.
C
E
E
C
Mr
chairman,
the
next
slide
22.
I
won't
spend
a
lot
of
time
on
this,
but
in
terms
of
the
state
school
foundation
program
formula,
when
we,
when
we
distribute
or
determine
the
state's
responsibility
or
obligations,
we
call
the
entitlement
portion
or
the
recapture
portion.
We
use
these
local
revenues
as
the
the
total
local
revenue.
So
obviously
the
school
district
mill
levy
the
county-wide
mill
levy.
Those
are
the
31
local
mill
levees
that
are
assessed
and,
as
I
indicated,
the
county
motor
motor
vehicle
fund,
fines
and
forfeitures.
C
This
just
again
just
illustrates
the
the
revenues
that
we
as
a
state
and
our
formula
consider
as
local
revenues
on
the
next
slide
slide.
23..
C
This
is
a
graphic
illustrating
the
school
school
district
mill
levies,
the
ones
on
the
left-hand
side
in
the
red
are
the
mandatory
operational
mills.
No
districts
can
go
above
or
below.
These
are
the
43
mills.
There's
the
12
statewide
mill
levy
the
six
county,
wide
mill
levy
in
the
25
school
district,
the
others
school
districts
can
levy
additional
mill
levies
for
a
variety
of
reasons,
whether
they
want
to
enhance
their
facility
for
capital
construction
purposes
that
would
be
part
of
their
building
fund
or
death
service.
C
They
can,
with
voter
approval
levy,
additional
mills,
there's
a
recreation
mill
levy
that
can
be
applied
by
the
school
board
or
the
recreation
board,
boces
board
of
crop
cooperative
educational
facilities
or
in
a
adult
educational
levy.
A
D
C
Yeah,
mr
chairman
and
representative
gray,
so
on
the
building
funds,
as
I
indicated,
these
are
for
above
and
beyond
what
the
state
builds.
So
if
an
example
is
in
in
albany
county,
their
voters
approved
a
additional
mill
levies
for
what
we
call
enhancements
above
the
adequacy
standards
that
the
state
construction
department
or
the
school
facilities
commission
sets.
They
added
additional
square
footage
and
additional
a
pool
for
an
example
on
their
facility,
so
their
voters,
with
voter
approval,
chose
to
do
that.
The
court
has
not
ruled
that
unconstitutional.
C
The
recreation
mill
levy
is
a
little
bit
unique
in
that.
While
it's
assessed
on
the
school
district
assessed
valuation,
there's
a
separate
board,
there's
a
recreation
board
which
sometimes
is
the
school
board,
but
sometimes
it's
a
combination
of
county
and
city
and
school
district
officials.
So
it's
not
necessarily
the
school
board
themselves.
It's
on
the
school
assessed
valuation
boces,
are
combination
of
school
districts
or
higher
education
facilities
to
or
higher
education
institutions
to
provide
services.
So
it's
again
just
not
directly
the
school
board.
C
A
But,
mr
wilmar,
isn't
it
fair
to
say
that
these
most
of
these
sort
of
came
some
of
them
were
in
existence
before
campbell
and
then
some
sort
of
have
creeped
in
as
enhancements
and
basically
they're,
not
bad
enough,
apparently
to
put
us
back
into
wealth-based
disparities,
but
it's
funny
they're
kind
of
poking
the
bear
a
little
bit.
If
you
want
my
opinion,
mr
wilmar.
C
F
Mr
coach
and
then
we'll
go
represent
again
mr
wilmarth
on
slide
23
there
on
the
right
hand,
side
then
you've
got
the
graph
of
kind
of
history
of
number
of
mills
that
are
assessed
in
the
state
and
we're
kind
of
an
all-time
low,
at
least
in
modern
history,
last
40
years
or
so,
and
so
then
under
that
was
school
reform.
97
98
was
that
that
one
mill
levy
board
approved
under
operations
and
then
under
maintenance.
The
same
thing,
one
mill
levy
board
approved
so
so
we
used
to.
F
I
mean
it's
my
understanding
that
basically
every
school
district
assessed
those
bills
in
the
state
prior
to
camel
2,
and
so
when
those
because
I
remember
you
know
mr
two
mills
and
all
those.
G
F
Former
senators
and
representatives,
some
of
our
colleagues
back
in
the
day,
tried
to
keep
those
two
mills
because
we
were
already
paying
them,
and
so
there
was
really
a
tax
reduction
with
school
reform.
Those
two
mills,
as
I
recall
it,
seemed
like
it
was
a
hundred
percent
of
districts.
C
Mr
wilmore
yeah,
mr
chairman
and
chairman
harshman,
I
do
believe
almost
all
school
districts
did
assess
those.
I
think
there
may
have
been
one
or
two
outlier,
that
they
didn't
assess
the
full
one.
It
could
have
been
a
fractional,
but
a
majority
of
the
school
district
did
assess
the
non-voter
approved
or
the
board
approved
mills
very
few
voter
approved
additional
melodies
were
enacted.
C
The
other
thing
that
on
the
top
and
that's
on
the
kind
of
the
red
on
the
top,
the
blue,
you'll
notice,
the
blue
has
gone
down
as
well,
but
that
is
kind
of
the
relic
of
capital,
construction
obligations
on
the
local
on
the
local
population
or
the
local
school
districts
that
was
again
ruled
now
a
state
obligation
after
campbell
ii,
so
you'll
notice
that
the
total
mills
in
that
dark,
blue.
The
solid
line
on
top
has
gone
down
as
well
as
a
relic
of
the
state
is
now
responsible
for
capital
construction.
C
So
that
dashed
line
is
what
we
consider
the
operational
mills,
which
included
those
operations
and
maintenance
mill
levees,
but
yeah
since,
since
really
1999
and
you'll
notice
kind
of
that
one-year
spike.
The
legislature
chose
to
give
districts
the
ability,
school
districts,
not
voters,
school
districts,
to
levy
all
six
mill
levies
for
one
year
and
they
all
did
almost
all
of
them
did,
and
so
that's
why
you
see
that
one
year
spike
and
then
it
goes
down
to
43
mils
from
here
on
out.
So
I
mean
just
so.
Mr
chairman.
F
I
think
it's
important,
though,
that
part
of
that
I
think
people
have
forgotten,
as
as
the
process
has
gone
and
40
years
ago,
we
were
paying
more
mills
in
this
state
for
education,
and
we
just
were,
and
so
part
of
school
reform
has
been
a
cut
in
the
number
of
mills
assessed
and
property
taxes.
There's
no
doubt
and
it's
shifted
more
into
minerals
and
other
areas,
and
so
I
think
that's
an
interesting
grab
that
goes
back
to
my
senior
year.
Midwest
high
school
right.
There.
C
Yeah
yeah
and
mr
chairman,
it's
it's.
It's
cut
in
two
ways
cut
on
the
operational
mills
for
sure,
so
you
can
average
about
two
mills
just
say
two
meals
were
cut,
but
also
your
local
property
taxes
were
cut
because
they
were
no
longer
responsible
for
capital
construction
right.
The
blue
line
above
the
blue
line
above
as
well,
so
they
were
cut
in
two
ways
as
part
of
the
court's
decisions
related
to
school
finance.
Right.
K
Mr
chairman,
mr
wilmore,
what
is
the
reason
that
they're,
the
mandatory
operational
mills
are
split
out
like
this?
Instead
of
just
one
set
of
mills.
C
Mr
chairman
representative,
it
it
goes
back
really
to
the
the
constitution,
so
the
constitution
sets
a
statewide
12
mill,
the
constitution,
it
actually
used
to
be
the
the
the
12
mil
was
actually
the
county
and
then
the
statewide
was
at
six,
but
I
think
that
was
changed
in
about
1985.
C
C
The
the
25
mill
has
been
in
place
for
a
while,
but
that's
just
there's
no
constitutional
25
mil
it's
just.
The
legislature
has
the
ability
to
assess
whatever
mills
it
it
wants
to
to
assess
for
school
operations.
So
I
don't
know
why
they're
all
three
sub
separate,
I
I
think
the
the
state
could
modify
that,
but
you
have
to
modify
the
constitution
as
well.
C
Anybody
else
back
to
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
on
slide
24
I
broke
out,
so
this
is
a
little
bit
different
data
set.
This
is
the
wyoming
department
of
education.
This
is
a
little
bit
more
frequent
or
recent
than
the
national
center
for
education
statistics
so
ncs
their
most
recent
year
was
fiscal
year
19.
This
represents
the
most
recent
year
of
fiscal
year.
21
and
I
broke
out
wyoming
school
district
revenues
in
a
little
bit
more
detail-
and
I
averaged
this
over
from
2005
to
2021.
C
Motor
vehicle
taxes
was
about
9.1
percent
fines
and
forfeitures
about
2.1
percent
and
then
other
revenues
about
10.8
percent.
And
if
you
want
the
most
recent
fiscal
year,
so
fiscal
year,
21
property
taxes
made
up
about
80.4,
it's
a
little
bit
more
above
the
historical
average
motor
vehicle
taxes
was
about
10.8
percent
fines
and
forfeitures.
It
was
1.6
which
is
a
little
bit
lower
than
historical,
and
then
other
revenue
was
about
7.2
percent.
C
So
this
just
gives
you
a
little
bit
more
recent
data
than
what
the
ncs
data
provided.
C
Keep
going
great,
mr
chairman,
on
slide25.
This
really,
I
think,
is
again
another
important
slide,
and
this
really
gets
into
you
know
options
that
the
committee
may
want
to
consider
going
forward.
Unfortunately,
we
weren't
able
to
find
a
more
recent
report
that
looked
at
state
earmarked
tax
collections
for
education,
but
a
2008
ncsl
report
looked
at
fiscal
year,
2005
data
that
really
focused
on
specifically
earmarked
revenues
for
education.
C
I
will
indicate
in
the
report.
I
don't
know
how.
C
C
I
just
want
to
kind
of
preface
that,
in
my
opinion,
I
do
think
the
state
has
a
earmarked
state
tax
collection,
but
in
in
the
analysis
that
if
it
was
done
in
well,
I
mean
just
didn't
show
up
in
here,
but
the
most
frequent
earmarked
tax
for
states
for
k-12
or
higher
education
was
general
sales
and
use
tax
example.
Nevada
has
a
local
school
support
property
tax
specifically
for
education
in
2005
that
provided
almost
one
billion
dollars
for
did.
C
Said
sales
and
use,
and
then
you
talked
about
a
property
tax.
My
apologies
nevada
has
a
local
sales
tax,
specifically
for
k-12
education.
There
you
go
and
so
that
in
2005
generated
approximately
a
billion
dollars,
980
some
odd
million
dollars
for
education,
so
there
are
states
that
do
have
specific
sales
tax
for
education
or
they
carve
off
a
certain
percentage
of
their
sales.
Tax
collections
for
education.
C
Michigan
is
another
example,
but
in
total
11
states
were
identified
in
this
report
that
set
aside
specific
general
sales
tax
for
education.
The
the
next
most
popular
was
tobacco.
Taxes
were
set
aside
specifically
for
education
and
then
the
next
most
popular
is
personal
income
tax
utah.
C
As
an
example
in
colorado's
example,
there,
where
they
set
aside
specific
amounts
of
their
income
taxes
for
education,
one
that
really
didn't
show
up
on
here,
but
I
did
additional
research-
is
lotteries
as
of
2008,
which
was
again
kind
of
an
outdated
report,
but
as
of
2008,
23
states
had
set
aside
specific
revenues
or
proceeds
from
their
lotteries
for
k-12
education,
and
it
ranged
from
about
35
percent
was
the
highest
of
those
proceeds
down
to
less
than
a
percent
of
revenues
for
k-12
education.
C
F
So
all
right,
mr
coach,
mr
chairman,
just
before
you
flip
that
page
back
to
24..
Just
so
I'm
clear
on
this,
where
you
have
the
the
pie
chart
and
where
you
have
other
revenues,
10.8
percent,
the
majority
that
I'm
guessing
is
the
12-mil
state
property
tax.
F
C
That
that
includes
so
this
example
would
be
bond
and
interest
for
albany
counties
mill
levy
for
their
construction
project,
so
these
are
another
example-
would
be
their
investment
earnings
or
taylor
grazing
net
fees
stuff
like
that
and.
C
Kate
you're
doing
good
keep
going.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
on
slide
26
we're
almost
there
we're
about
15
slides
left.
I
wanted
to
again
look
at
specific
states
the
same
states
we
looked
at
on
the
common
school
state
lands.
C
I
think
wyoming
is
a
little
bit
unique
in
in
reviewing
data
across
states
where
the
general
fund
really
does
not
support
k-12
education
on
their
state
aid
portion.
Well,
I'm
going
to
set
up
a
system
where
we
have
a
specific
two
accounts
that
that
fund
education,
the
school
capital,
construction
account
and
the
school
foundation
program
account
up
until
I
think
this
this
fiscal
year,
the
lcra
will
support
in
buttress
the
school
foundation
program
account
which
is
kind
of
an
extension
of
our
general
fund.
C
C
C
Support
from
the
common
school
lands
comes
from
from
those
revenues.
North
dakota
77.5
of
their
revenue,
comes
from
their
general
fund.
The
remaining
comes
from
their
other
funds,
primarily
the
their
common
school
fund.
So
again,
I
think
wyoming's
a
little
bit
unique
and
where
we
have
all
these
accounts
that
fund
certain
certain
programs
for
for
education.
C
So
you
know
that
leads
us
to
believable.
How
do
states
really
pay
for
their
their
state
aid
and
so
on?
On
slide
27,
we
looked
at
state
government
tax
collections.
C
Importantly,
this
does
not
include
investment
earnings,
so
you
know
states
do
receive
substantial
amount
of
money
from
their
investments.
This
does
not
look
at
investment
earnings,
so
we
looked
at
the
census
data
on
on
tax
collections.
We
were
all
able
to
go
back
to
1950
from
this
data
source
up
to
and
through
fiscal
year
2020.
C
It
found
that
public
schools
are
funded
through
state
revenues
for
public
and
elementary
secondary
education,
arrays
from
a
variety
of
sources,
but
primarily
from
personal
and
corporate
income
tax
and
sales
taxes,
excise
taxes
such
as
ozone,
tobacco
and
alcoholic
beverages
plus
lotteries,
as
I
previously
discussed.
So
as
you
can
see,
the
two,
the
gray
and
the
dark
blue,
the
gray
is
sales
and
gross
receipt
taxes
and
that
dark
blue,
the
largest
p
piece
is
income
taxes,
both
personal
and
corporate.
C
That's
where
a
majority
of
states
revenues
come
to
pay
their
bills,
so
looking
on
on
slide
28
that
just
depicts
that
on
a
proportional
basis
from
1950
to
2020,
and
if
we
slide
over
to
slide
29.
C
This
just
breaks
down
fiscal
year,
20
into
more
some
more
specific
categories:
the
highest
percentage
in
fiscal
year,
20
came
from
of
the
u.s
on
a
us
total
u.s
state
government
tax
collections
came
from
individual
income
tax
at
36.39
percent.
The
next
highest
was
general
sales
and
use
general
sales
tax.
C
The
next
was
sales
select,
sales
tax,
and
so
in
total,
just
looking
at
income,
both
corporate
and
individual
and
sales
taxes,
they
accounted
for
89.5
percent
of
total
u.s
state
tax
collections,
and
this
does
not
include
the
schools
or
it
does
include
the
schools
does
not,
mr
chairman,
it
does
not.
These
are.
A
C
C
C
A
On
slide
30-
and
this
just
I
can't
resist
so
I
should
stop
myself,
but
in
wyoming,
people
are
very
upset
about
what's
happening
with
their
property
taxes
right
now,
and
they
think
that
state
governments,
where
that
that
money
goes
and
it's
not
property
taxes,
support
local
governments,
especially
the
schools,
and
so
it's
just
something.
To
keep
in
mind.
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
on
on
slide
30
this
for
fiscal
year
20.
I
just
wanted
to
illustrate.
Where
did
each
of
these
states
revenues
come
from
wyman's
on
the
far
right?
There's
no
income
taxes
there,
we
don't
have
income
tax
in
wyoming,
you'll
notice,
on
the
top
that
that
other
taxes,
other
taxes,
include
severance
taxes.
C
We
have
a
substantial
amount
of
money
from
several
taxes.
Similarly,
so
does
north
dakota,
north
dakota
have
substantial
amount
of
their
revenue
comes
from
severs
taxes,
almost
half
of
their
revenue
comes
from
severance
taxes.
C
So
what
does
wyoming
look
like
if
we
go
to
slide?
31
again,
I
looked
at
from
1950
to
2020
the
majority
of
our
revenue,
and
this
does
pick
up
our
statewide
12
mill
levy,
so
different
sources
picked
up
our
our
12
mil
levy.
The
top
is
our
other
taxes,
but
that
again,
I
said
is
severance
tax.
The
majority
of
that
is
severance
taxes
and
then
in
the
middle
is
our
sales
that
that
gray
area
is
sales
taxes
and
then
slight
on
the
bottom.
Is
that
12
mil
tax
levy?
C
C
Until
severance
taxes
showed
up
sales
and
use
tax
and
property
taxes
were
really
the
the
prime
contributors
to
to
wyoming's
revenue.
Since
then,
it's
kind
of
balanced
out
with
severance
taxes,
but
again
those
fluctuate
from
year
to
year.
So
on
slide
33.
Where
does
wyoming
look?
Look
at
in
fiscal
year,
20.
C
about
39
percent
of
wyoming's
tax
collections
came
from
general
sales
tax,
severance
tax
accounted
for
about
26
property
tax
accounted
for
15,
total
licenses,
tax
10.43
and
then
the
select
sales
taxes
accounted
for
9.52
percent.
A
C
A
C
C
This
is
finally
the
last
last
section
of
you
know
how
to
how
did
the
school
foundation
program
account
and
the
school
capital
construction
account,
make
up
its
revenues
so,
on
this
I've
listed
all
the
revenue
sources
that
are
deposited
into
the
school
foundation
program
account
that
12
mil
levy,
as
we
just
discussed,
is
deposited
in
that
recapture
revenue,
as
we've
discussed
previously,
has
deposited
the
income,
investment
earnings
and
the
land
activities
on
the
on
school
lands
from
the
common
school
lane
income
account.
C
So
if
we
look
at
slide
35,
this
slide
depicts
from
the
2005-6
biennium
to
the
estimated
2324
binium.
What
does
the
revenue
mixture
look
like,
and
it's
changed
over
the
course
of
years.
You
can
see
we
had
substantial
revenue
years
from
2007
8
2007
to
2008
binium
to
2013-14
binium
from
both
the
12-mil
levy,
which
had
high
mineral
revenues
that
year
as
well,
but
also
leases
and
bonuses
on
the
common
school
state
lands
and
then
recapture
and
fmrs.
Those
are
really
the
the
the
largest
contributor
in
revenue.
C
C
The
percent
of
the
total
revenue
in
the
school
foundation
program
account
in
2006
fmr's
made
up
41
percent
common
school
investment
earnings
only
made
up
eight
percent.
When
we
look
on
the
right
hand,
side
fmrs
now
only
makes
up
a
quarter
of
the
total
revenue
to
the
school
foundation
program,
account
property
taxes
close
in
both
both
snapshots,
but
investment
earnings
jumps
twenty
percent
from
eight
percent
to
twenty
percent
over
the
course
of
that
time,
period.
A
A
So
just
you
have
to
think
about
how
this
plays
out
over
time
as
we're
living
in
a
more
carbon
conscious
world
and
the
implications
for
that
not
saying
I
agree
with
it
or
whatever,
I'm
not
making
that
point,
I'm
just
saying
how
will
these
revenue
streams
change
both
the
property
tax
amount
and
the
fmrs
in
the
next
10
years?
It's
a
question
to
ask
who's
got
the.
F
Mr
coach,
mr
chairman,
I
mean
that's,
that's
the
trend
and
you're
going
to
see
this
when
future
legislators
are
looking
at
these
charts,
matt
will
be
getting
into
these
waning
years,
be
delivering
this
with
an
updated
third
pie
chart.
None
of
us
will
probably
be
here,
but
I
think
when
you
look
at
that,
I
just
circled
up
those
common
school
investment
numbers,
109
million
eight
percent
back
in
old
506.
That
was
when
it
was
billion.
It
was
starting
to
grow
now
we're
starting
to
save
more
money
in
it.
F
Part
of
that,
though,
was
I
think
it
was
2.2
percent,
right
dividends
and
interest,
and
now
we're
at
this
point
where
we
guarantee
5,
we've
got
a
bigger
reserve
account
and
it's
market
value
four
and
a
half
billion
dollars,
but
it's
really
incredible.
It's
really
saved
us
and
then
there's
more
to
this
investment
piece.
F
Is
you
know
it's
about
a
half
a
little
over
half
percent
of
the
permanent
trust
fund
now
point
four:
five
percent
of
the
sipa:
it's
about
a
little
over
a
half
percent
of
the
earnings
off
the
terminal.
Trust
fund
now
they're
really
important.
So
this
this
investment
earnings
are
huge.
It's
been
huge
replacement.
Thank
you.
A
Well
and
just
gotta
pile
on
because
the
investment
earnings,
if
we
want
them
to
be
more
important
in
the
future,
they're
kind
of
going
to
have
to
be
because
you
know,
if,
if
you
believe
that
we're
not
going
to
have
the
carbon
based
revenues,
then
we
have
to
make
the
investment
earnings
more
powerful,
but
we
have
to
find
other
sources
of
revenue,
but
the
the
racehorse
that's
been
working
for
us
is
the
investment
earnings.
It's
been
the
sleeper.
We
haven't
paid
attention,
but
it's
really
there.
A
N
F
The
value
of
our
state
lands
is
incredible
and
I
think
you
know
there's
six
sections
in
teton
county
of
school
lands
that
are
priceless,
they're,
not
40
million
dollar
parcels,
I
mean,
add,
add
more
zeros,
I
mean
they
are
incredibly
the
most
valuable
real
estate
in
the
world
and
I
just
think,
as
we
move
forward
and
think
about,
you
know
we're
not
going
to
give
them
away
for
5
million
for
a
whole
whole
section
like
we
did,
and
so
I
think
just
have
everybody.
That's
an
incredible
resource.
That's
only
going
to
get
more
valuable.
C
We
beat
it
to
death.
Mr
wilmar,
back
to
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Almost
there.
Lastly,
on
on
slide,
37
for
the
school
foundation
program
account
I
tried
to
illustrate
what
I
believe
are
the
revenues
that
are
attributable
to
minerals
and
non-minerals,
and
we
can
see
a
significant
shift
between
2005
6
binium
to
the
estimated
2122
binium,
where
in
this
current
biennium,
the
first
binium
in
this
time,
series
where
non-mineral
revenues
generates
a
greater
proportion
than
mineral
revenues.
One
can
argue,
I
included
investment
earnings
in
the
non-minerals.
C
One
could
argue
a
portion
of
those
are
legacy,
minerals
that
generate
investment
earnings,
so
one
could
argue
that
investment
earnings
could
be
considered
mineral
revenue.
But
for
my
methodology
I
just
use
investment
earnings
as
non-minerals,
so
I
just
wanted
to
clarify
if
there
was
any
questions.
I
put
that
in
my
source
note.
But
those
are
the
the
minerals
that
I
I
chose
to
to
utilize.
As
as
mineral
revenues
can
you.
A
F
C
So,
mr
chairman,
if
we
looked
at
slide
38,
these
are
the
revenue
sources
for
the
school
capital.
Construction
count
a
lot
lot
fewer
than
the
school
foundation
program
account.
C
But
if
you
look
at
the
last
bullet,
that's
the
big
elephant
in
the
room,
federal
police,
bonus
revenue
and
on
the
next
slide,
you'll
see
on
slide.
39
that
this
this
revenue
source
could
bonus
revenue
used
to
be
a
significant
emily.
Can
we
have
that
next
slide.
C
To
2017-18
17-18
biennium
coi's
bonus
revenue,
substantial
amount
of
revenue
to
the
school
capital
construction
account,
that's
how
the
state
was
able
to
finance
and
respond
to
the
court
decisions
to
build
schools.
C
Since
that
time,
you
don't
see
it
on
there.
Coley's
bonus
revenue
is
gone,
and
so
what
is
the
legislature
done?
There's
been
two
responses,
and
this
gets
into
chairman
harshman's
two
points.
The
first
is
the
mineral
royalties
on
school
lanes.
The
cap
was
increased
from
eight
million
to
the
full
one-third
which,
for
this
current
fiscal
year,
is
about
28
million
dollar
premium
on
top
of
8
million.
C
So
if
you
look
at
estimated
binium,
2122
and
2324,
we
have
a
new
dark,
gray
bar
and
that's
that
sipa
major
maintenance
account,
but
it
does
not
make
up
for
the
loss
of
coley's
bonus
money
and
neither
does
the
full
one-third
of
state
royalties.
You
can
see
the
small
bar
of
that
blue.
C
A
On
that,
for
a
second,
we
we
replaced
almost
all
the
school
buildings
in
the
state.
You
know,
and
so
most
the
school
buildings
over
the
past
decade
or
it's
actually
more
two
decades
really
aren't
newer
buildings,
but
part
of
the
school
capital.
Construction
is
for
major
maintenance
too,
and
I
don't
know
the
exactos
of
it,
but
we
sort
of
got
a
bonus
because
we
had
all
brand
new
school
buildings.
A
Well,
now
they're
they're
getting
a
little
bit
older.
Then
they
they
they'll
start
having
issues
and
we
won't
have
the
the
coaly's
bonus
money
to
do
the
major
maintenance.
So
we
kind
of
got
lucky.
We
used
it
at
the
right
time.
We
used
it
smartly
good
for
us,
but
now
we're
going
to
see
those
buildings
needing
more
maintenance-
and
you
know
that's
kind
of
where
we're
at
so.
C
Yeah,
mr
chairman,
and
just
to
give
you
know
perspective
on
how
much
does
that
major
maintenance
cost
a
biennium,
it's
about
160
million
dollars
per
biennium
and
it
escalates
about
three
to
four
percent
per
biennium,
but
160
million,
which
is
about
what
your
revenue
is.
But
that's
no
new
construction
exactly
or
what
we
consider
component
project
funding
minor
minor
cap
projects.
C
A
D
D
C
That's
that
under
the
cap,
under
the
200
million
dollar
cap,
the
school
capital,
construction
account
gets
10.7
million
dollars
school
and
mineral
royalties
account,
which
is
this
mineral,
that
the
full
one-third
is
about
64
million,
and
then
we
have
the
sipa
investment
earnings,
which
is
about
98
million
for
next
biennium
90
million.
For
for
this
bindium,
the
remaining
comes
from
other
transfers.
So
this
came
from
additional
transfers
from
the
cipa
and
additional
transfers
from
the
pmtf
reserve
account
and
additional
transfers
from
the
school
foundation
program
reserve
account.
C
D
Representative
greg,
thank
you,
mr
chairman.
There
were,
though,
and-
and
I
guess
my
question
really
is-
there
were
a
couple
schools
that
were
appropriated
for
a
while
within
the
budget,
and
I
think
it
was
in
the
section
300s,
and
so
what
were
the
sources
because
it
it
wasn't,
it
wasn't
just
the
school
capital
construction
account.
I
think
that
there
was
a
transfer
to
that
account.
That
specifically
was
earmarked
for
those
schools.
So
did
we
get
out
of
that
practice
recently
because
of
of
the
recent
influx?
D
C
Yeah,
mr
chairman,
and
represent
gray
there's
two
two
sections
in
the
budget
bill
that
kind
of
deal
with
this.
This
section
313
past
couple
years,
is
where
school
capital
construction
has
been
funded
and
the
project
specific
projects
have
been
identified.
All
those
appropriations
come
out
of
the
school
capital.
C
Construction
account,
we
don't
specify
x,
amount
from
cipa
is
paying
for
the
new
tinsley
construction
project
up
in
in
wausau
county
school
district
number,
two,
what
we
do
in
our
section
300
and
there
I
can't
remember
the
exact
sections,
but
there
are
sections
in
the
section
300
for
transfers
and
those
are
the
additional
amounts
I
think
for
this
by
name.
It's
the
school
foundation
program
reserve
account
the
school
land
and
mineral
royalties
account
the
sipa,
major
maintenance,
subaccount
and
then
additional
cipa
that
are
all
transferred
to
the
school
capital.
C
Construction
account,
there's,
not
an
automatic
deposit
of
those
funds
into
the
school
capital
construction
account.
The
legislature
has
to
direct
those
funds
to
the
school
capital
construction
account,
but
we
don't
earmark
specific
dollars
out
of
those
transfers
for
specific
projects.
We
just
we
just
deposit
it
into
the
school
capital
construction
account
and
make
all
appropriations
out
of
that
account.
C
I
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
I
can
get
a
better
understanding
of
this.
Is
our
funding
having
to
do
with
coal
and
minerals
having
to
do
with
getting
the
leases
to
do
the
digging
and
drilling,
or
is
it
having
to
do
with
the
actual
shipping
and
afterwards.
C
Mr
chairman,
senator
james
historically,
the
federal
coalition
bonus
revenues
were
on
just
the
bonus
to
produce
or
mine
that
coal
other
revenues
came
from
the
price
and
the
production,
but
the
coley's
bonuses
were
just
the
bonus
awarded
to
the
state
and
the
federal
government
on
the
ability
just
to
mine
it.
The
federal
royalties,
are,
are
just
the
production,
the
price
of
that
commodity.
I
A
Senator
james,
I
I
would
mr
d
is
here:
he
could
probably
enlighten
us
a
little
bit,
I
think,
nobody's
buying
leases.
I
mean
that
yeah,
mr
e
ty.
Do
you
want
to
try
to
help
us
with
that?
Mr
dita
is
here
from
the
mining
association
and
if
and
it's
he
could
probably
illuminate
this
better
than
we
can
go.
P
P
Members
of
the
committee
travis
ditai
executive
director
of
the
wyoming
mining
association,
happy
to
to
visit
with
you
about
this.
I'm
going
to
have
to
rack
my
brain
a
little
bit
because
I
haven't
talked
about
leases
for
such
a
long
time,
but
to
answer
senator
james
question.
P
The
coal
lease
bonus
comes
when,
when
a
a
company
actually
wins
the
bid
for
a
lease
right
now,
there
may
be
one
or
two
lease
applications
in
the
hopper
that
aren't
going
anywhere,
but
when
the
company
actually
is
awarded
the
bid
for
that,
that's
when
the
bonus
bid
is
awarded
and,
for
instance,
if
a
company
bids
a
dollar
per
ton
for
a
hundred
dollars
or
a
hundred
tons
of
coal,
the
bonus
bid
in
total
would
be
a
hundred
dollars
awarded
in
five
annual
payments
of
whatever
two
hundred
dollars.
P
Mr
chairman,
I
that
is
correct.
I
think-
and
I
would
note
that,
given
where
we
are
today,
we
do
have
a
couple
of
companies
that
are
actually
exploring
new
leases
right
now,
but
they're
not
the
size
of
the
tracks
that
that
we've
seen
in
the
past
20
30
years,
you
may
have
a
bonus
awarded
on
a
lease
modification
where
they
loop
in
a
couple
more.
You
know
small
tracks,
but
right
now
for
the
for
for
coley's
bonuses.
P
I
think
there
was
a
little
bit
of
just
some
final
payments
in
the
last
fiscal
year,
but
right
now,
if
we
get
another
lease
and
we
see
that
those
bonus
bids
coming
back
in
it
takes
a
long
time
to
get
a
lease.
P
You
know
five
years
six
years,
so
that's
kind
of
where
we
are
right
now
and-
and
I
I
think,
the
bottom
line
and
to
answer
senator
james
question
is
the
reason
why
we're
not
getting
those
bonus
bid
payments
is
we're
not
leasing
any
more
coal
right
now,
so
senator.
A
P
Mr
chairman,
to
add
on
to
that,
it
is
a
demand
issue,
as
utilities
plan
ahead
and
they
may
loop
in
some
more
coal
in
their
future
plans.
You
may
see
some
more
coal
leased,
but
right
now
demand
has
gone
down.
I
mean
we're
down
fifty
percent
from
what
we
produced
over
a
decade
ago,
senator
james
last
word.
I
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
so
it's
just
a
matter
of
the
demand
has
gone
down
and
like
even
shipping
overseas
and
everything
that,
like
even
that
demand,
has
gone
down.
I
P
Our
coal
is
almost
used
exclusively
domestically
in
from
wyoming
there.
There
are
a
few
tons
that
are
exported,
but
it's
almost
a
rounding
error
and
so
the
the
the
exports
and
shipping
really
is
not
a
factor.
Our
we've
seen
the
decline
in
our
coal
numbers
because
domestic
utilities
have
been
shifting
away
from
coal.
I
think
that's
fair
enough.
Why
don't
we
get.
A
E
C
Mr
chairman,
slide,
40
is
what
chairman
harshman
was
referring
to,
and
this
expands
the
previous
non-mineral
versus
mineral,
but
it
includes
both
the
school
foundation
program
account
and
the
school
capital
construction
count,
revenues
for
minerals
and
non
minerals.
So
the
change
here
is
I've
added
in
the
fmrs
that
are
deposited
in
the
school
capital.
C
C
The
courts,
especially
wyoming,
have
really
shaped
how
the
state's
support
for
education
and
financing
in
wyoming
and
the
level
support
in
our
funding
for
for
k-12
education
really
across
states.
As
we
looked
at
the
examples
in
new
mexico
hawaii
as
compared
to
wyoming
their
policies,
their
local
policies
really
dictate
the
proportion
of
their
state
funding
versus
local
funding,
whether
or
not
they
have
lower
property
taxes
compared
to
wyoming's
43
mill
levees
across
the
u.s
80
of
local
property
taxes,
support
k-12
education
very
similar
to
wyoming.
C
C
As
we
all
know,
wyoming's
revenues
have
been
very
volatile
as
we
were
live,
especially
for
k-12
education
on
a
mineral
based
economy
in
the
school
foundation,
program
account
and
school
capital
construction
account.
It
has
shifted
a
majority
of
79
mineral
related
down
to
54
non-mineral
related,
and
then
we
have
in
the
school
foundation
program
account
benefited
from
increased
investment
earnings
as
a
result
in
lower
fmrs
we've
kind
of
shifted
that
burden
there
and
school
capital
construction
count.
C
The
whole
left
by
coley's
bonuses
has
been
replaced
in
part
by
the
full,
one-third
and
state
royalties
and
in
part
again
by
investment
income
from
the
cipa.
So
with
that,
mr
chairman
members
of
the
committee,
I
appreciate
your
time
I'll
be
available
for
any
additional
questions.
Questions
at
this
point.
D
D
I
think
that's
pretty
arguable
that
that's
an
ordinary
operation
in
government,
but
appropriating
for
school
capital,
construction
and
the
budget
when
we've
kind
of
made
the
decision
that
we're
going
to
separate
out
the
state
capital
construction,
I
mean
what
have
been
the
discussions
to
either
fold
that
in
the
state
capital
construction
bill
or
do
a
third
bill,
because
I
I
just
I've
always
had
issues
with
that.
Thank
you,
mr.
C
Chairman
and
represent
great
I'll
defer
to
mr
anderson,
lso
legal
staff,
but
the
constitution,
I
believe,
is
leaves
schools
actually
allowable
to
be
in
the
budget
bill
regardless
if
it's
school
I'm.
I
am
paraphrasing,
but
mr
answering
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong,
but
schools
aren't
even
capital
construction
aren't
held
to
that
same
standard
as
the
general
operations
of
government
schools
can
be,
and
it
has
to
do
with
just
the
language
and
the
constitution.
C
B
C
K
C
Mr
chairman
and
representation
yeah,
though
two
areas
where
growth
is
occurring
is
investment
earnings,
so
the
the
common
school
land
income
account
investment
earnings,
but
also
the
non-mineral
assessed
valuation
on
the
12
mill
and
also
the
so
the
recapture.
So
how
I
took
the
school
foundation
program
account
revenues
on
property
taxes
was
assumed
the
proportion
of
the
assessed
valuation
attributable
to
minerals
and
non-minerals
and
apply
that
to
the
revenue
collected
in
that
fiscal
year.
C
K
Follow-Up
representative,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
mr
wilmart,
so
I
I
mean
I
guess
my
question
is
what
is
growing
faster
on
that
non-mineral
growth?
Is
it
the
assessed
property
valuations,
or
is
it
the
investment
income
that
we're
getting
from
the
investment
income
account?
Mr
wilmore.
C
Mr
chairman,
representing
I,
don't
know
I'll
I'll
look
into
that
and
let
you
know,
I
also
think
the
other
side
of
it
is
fmrs
have
decreased
and
the
mineral
assassination
has
decreased
and
I
don't
know
what
at
what
rates.
Those
are
in,
in
contrast
to
the
non-mineral
side
as
well.
So
there's
a
couple
couple
layers
of
that
that
we
we
can
certainly
identify
okay.
A
I
A
Lot
of
people
in
the
room,
senator
james.
C
I
A
C
Ms
sherman,
that
is
correct.
It
includes
everything
now
in
terms
of
you
know
in
natchez
revenues,
if
you
look
at
expenditures
of
districts
and
so
there's
a
couple
ways
you
can
look
at
this.
C
If
we
look
at
just
kind
of
what
the
national
center
for
education
statistics
looks
at
on
what
they
deem
current
expenditures,
which
is
really
the
operations
because
revenues
per
people
can
fluctuate
due
to
capital
construction,
which
are
one-time
costs,
wyoming's
current
expenditures
in
the
most
recent
we
have
for
a
national
level
is
about
sixteen
thousand
two
hundred
and
twenty
eight
that's
fiscal
year.
Nineteen,
sixteen
thousand
two
twenty
eight,
but
that's
expenditures
of
you
know
on
a
per
pupil
basis
that
ranked
wyoming
twelfth
in
the
nation
as
compared
to
revenue.
A
Senator
james
we're
going
to
go
back
to
you
in
just
a
second,
but
it's
important
for
people
to
understand
the
difference
between
these
two
numbers.
Yeah.
A
J
Hence
we're
here
looking
at
your
information,
but
we've
just
had
two
years
of
a
have
a
tremendous
social
experiment.
Let's
say,
and
so
I
look
at
this
and
I
think
we're
on
a
path
that
is
unsustainable
and
we're
looking
at
education
as
if
it's
going
to
be
the
same
way,
it
was
20
years
ago.
It's
going
to
be
that
way,
20
30
40
years
ago
was
there
any
when
you
were
gathering
the
data
for
this.
J
Was
there
any
conversation
that
maybe
the
paradigm
should
be
looked
at
a
little
differently
that
maybe
we
maybe
we
do
take
some
of
the
information
we
learned
in
this
last
two
years
and
we
change
our
expenditures
so
that
it
changes
the
need
for
the
revenues.
Was
there
any
any
debate
about
any
of
that?
Mr
wilmer.
C
A
C
Mr
chairman,
to
a
small
degree,
this
legislature,
weimar's
legislature,
has
a
process
established
in
its
law
called
recalibration
that
requires
the
legislature
every
five
years
to
review
the
costs
or
how
to
fund
the
cost
to
fund
education,
and
so
that
is
really
a
charge
by
statute
that
the
legislature
does
that
every
five
years,
the
most
recent
one
occurred
in
2020
the
education
committee.
This
interim
is
studying
two
aspects
related
to.
C
I
would
say
three
aspects
related
delivery.
Education,
one
is
their
their
first
priority
is
the
retention
recruitment
of
personnel
across
all
positions
in
in
districts.
There's
a
national
discussion
occurring
about
teacher
shortages,
and
so
that's
on
the
radar
of
the
education
committee.
The
second
aspect
is:
they
are
studying
virtual
education
and
how
that
delivery
is
being
provided
amongst.
Our
school
districts
has
changed
dramatically,
especially
since
the
code
19
pandemic,
and
then
third
is.
They
are
having
a
discussion
on
delivery,
particularly
in
the
primary
grades
and
k
through
three.
C
How
are
students
being
delivered
that
education
and
it's
an
extension
of
their
lasting
terms,
topic
on
k3
reading
and
evaluating?
So
those
are
the
three
areas,
but
the
legislature
in
terms
of
expenditure
side
and
what
it
costs
has
a
process
established
for
the
recalibration
of
the
school
finance
system,
follow-up.
J
Before
we
before
we
make
this
decision
on
revenue
sources,
the
the
actual
need
I
mean,
none
of
us
would
have
thought
when
you
look
at
the
graph
that
you
provided
a
hundred
years
ago,
it
was
45
in
the
last
40
years
that
trajectory
has
dramatically
changed.
One
of
those
things
that
you
pointed
out
in
your
presentation
is
school
capital
construction.
J
But
if
we're
going
to
change
the
paradigm
of
how
we
do
that,
perhaps
school
capital
construction
is
not
something
that
we,
you
know
we're
we're
in
a
we're
caught
in
and
looking
at
this
one
way,
the
way
it
is
today
or
the
way
it's
been
for
40
years,
but
wouldn't
it
make
more
sense
to
maybe
talk
to
the
education
committee
and
see
where
they're,
why
they're
not
looking
into
that
more
if
they're,
not
so
that
we
can
make
good
good
use
of
our
time
on
the
revenues.
Part
of
that.
A
It's
kind
of
open-ended,
but
mr
wilmar,
though,
do
do
a
comment
on
that.
If
you
choose
and
then
we're
gonna
take
a
break,
you
guys
got
to
yeah.
C
Mr
chairman,
I
the
legislature,
has
committees
established
to
discuss
those
policy
decisions
and
for
school
capital
construction.
You
have
you
have
a
select
committee
on
school
facilities
that
discusses
those
particular
issues.
I
would
just
again
go
back
to
court.
Decisions
in
wyoming
have
really
shaped
this
debate
and
the
legislature's
policies
it
used
to
be
local
mill,
levees
that
built
schools.
The
court
ruled
those
unconstitutional
and
put
the
responsibility
of
that
on
the
state,
and
so
those
those
discussions
and
and
policies
have
been
shaped.
Specifically
I
mean
by
the
court.
A
A
Okay,
we'll
call
the
committee
back
to
order
next,
following
up
on
our
staff
presentation
this
morning.
We're
going
to
do
have
open
mike
session
for
public
comment.
So
folks
that
would
like
to
address
the
committee
on
the
education
funding
issue.
Please
come
forward
who
would
like
to
be
first.
A
P
All
right
looks
like
have
ken
dicario,
who
I
am
promoting
to
a
panelist
right
now,.
A
Well
so
ken
dicario
former
colleague
welcome
mr
dicario,
he's
probably
working
his
way
through
the
transporter
room.
Mr
dakota.
R
R
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
It's
good
to
see
you
all
as
well
and
all
of
you
on
the
joint
revenue
committee.
Mr
chairman,
I
didn't
have
a
lot
of
testimony.
I
was
you
know
when
you
sign
up
online,
you
have
to
sort
of
make
that
call
the
day
before
whether
to
testify,
but
just
a
couple
points
I
think
real
quickly.
Mr
chairman,
when
you
were
looking
at
especially
some
of
that
revenue
and
and
with
the
lands
we're
talking
about,
you
know,
they're,
not
state
lands,
they're
school
trust
lands
which
are
are
very
different
animals.
R
But
on
that
slide,
six,
when
you
looked
at
different
states,
you
could
see
the
big
difference
from
states
that
get
a
lot
of
their
revenue
off
school
trust
lands
from
minerals
which
wyoming
and
north
dakota
obviously
do.
There
are
other
models
and
the
state
of
utah,
which
is
probably
might
be
probably
the
top
because
they
have
an
office
that
does
an
amazing
job.
R
But
when
you
look
at
numbers
of
comparisons,
one
of
the
things
you
have
to
look
at
and
if
I
know
utah
wasn't
one
of
those,
but
if
they
were
they
give
that
money
out
that
they
generate
off
school
trust,
lands
directly
to
schools,
they
use
what
they
call
school
community
councils
and
so
that
money
every
year
gets
is
delivered
to
schools
and
in
some
ways
I
like
that
model
a
little
bit
just
and
the
main
reason
for
that
is.
It
doesn't
go
into
the
school
foundation
and
then
be
just
distributed.
R
Everybody,
parents
and
other
individuals.
Anybody
else
any
citizen
in
any
school
district
can
see
the
value
of
generating
that
revenue
off
school
trust
lands
because
they
see
how
much
money
went
into
their
individual
school.
That
was
generated
from
that
and,
mr
chairman,
just
one
other
thing:
when
the
property
tax
issue
came
up,
you
know,
I
think
it's
important
to
realize
that
there
has
been
no
increase
in
property
tax
rates,
property
taxes
went
up
because
values
weren't.
R
If
your
house
increased
by
50
percent,
assessed
evaluation,
your
taxes
are
going
to
go
up
because
that's
the
way
property
taxes
work,
and
why
so
you
know
I
I
think
it's
a
little
disingenuous
to
you
know
even
think
down
that
road,
that
you
know
the
reason
that
property
taxes
have
increased
is
because
we're
levying
more
property
tax
or
the
rate
has
gone
up
when
that's
not
the
case.
It's
just
gone
up
because
values
have
gone
up
and
correspondingly
property
taxes
go
up.
A
R
Mr
chairman,
I
am,
I
would
have
loved
to
have
been
in
landfire,
I
would
have
been
in
cheyenne.
I
would
definitely
have
been
there.
We
miss.
A
You
you
should
be
enjoying
our
spring
snows.
We
could
use
some
more
any
other
questions
for
mr
dicario.
Thank
you,
mr
carrie,
and
emily.
Why
don't
you
promote
anybody
else?
That's
out
there
and
get
them
in
the
queue.
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
S
Thank
you,
mr
chairman
and
committee.
I
can
I'm,
I
regret
not
being
in
lander,
although
I'll
be
there
tomorrow,
but
you
join
when
the
topic
comes
up
at
your
dress,
and
I
understand
that
most
of
the
morning's
been
spent
on
expenditure
sizes
for
trust,
land
or
school
expenditures,
and
but
you
did
start
out
with
school
trust
lands
and
I
think
you're
going
to
get
back
to
them.
But
I'm
going
to
take
this
opportunity
just
to
drop
in
here,
and
I
hope
it's
relevant.
S
So
I'm
here
as
a
member
of
a
group
called
advocates
for
school
trust
lands.
I'm
a
40-year
follower
of
the
school
finance
saga
in
wyoming
and
I'm
also
a
local
trustee,
and
I
thank
you
and
the
staff
for
this
comprehensive
look
at
school
funding
and
the
role
of
school
trust
income,
especially
income
to
the
common
school
permanent
land
fund
that
produces
investment
income.
I
was
impressed
with
the
proportion
of
our
school
funding
that
does
come
from
that
interest
income.
S
I'm
glad
to
see
this
consideration
in
joint
revenue,
where
the
focus
is
on
exploring
analyzing
and
identifying
potential
revenue
production
from
trust
lands
instead
of
other
other
committees.
Where
it
has
been
assigned
previously,
of
course,
these
lands
are
interspersed
around
the
state
and
there
are
a
lot
of
current
users
who
are
counting
on
continuing
using
that
land
at
the
current
rate,
and
we
don't
want
to
do
something
that
harms
our
ability
to
use
the
trust
assets
in
the
future.
S
S
You've
had
a
suggestion
to
modify
your
revenue
efforts
in
light
of
what
you
might
think
of
the
accounts
payable
side
of
the
ledger,
but
I
suggest
that
school
trust
lands
carry
their
own
requirements
by
law
and
by
constitution,
and
you
should
carry
on
independent
of
possible
charges.
Changes
in
the
funding
model
that
mandate
the
fiduciary.
The
trustee
mandate,
I
think
exists,
independent
of
whatever
changes
might
be
made
on
the
expenditure
side
or
the
the
guarantee
formula,
or
any
changes
that
might
take
place
on
that
side
of
the
ledger.
S
So
with
that
I'll,
just
I'll
take
questions
again,
I
apologize
if
this
doesn't
directly
address
the
what
you've
done
this
morning,
but
I
thought
I'd
step
in
and
and
offer
my
comments
now.
F
Chairman
miss
hermann
thanks
for
joining
this
morning
and
your
group
that
you
talked
about
on
these
trust
lands,
and
I
guess
I
and
maybe
it's
a
homework
assignment
for
you
for
the
committee.
Maybe
that
you
know
are
there
some
really
stellar
examples,
some
things
that
we
could
incorporate
or
learn
from
that
utah
or
new
mexico
or
others.
F
Maybe
it's
a
you
know
a
key
little
tweak
to
our
statute
or
the
way
we
do
things,
and
so
I
don't
want
to
put
you
on
the
spot
now,
but
I
guess
I'd
like
to
get
a
little
homework
down
the
line
for
us.
Maybe
report
back
to
the
committee
on
maybe
some
potential
ideas
on
these,
because
I
I'm
with
you.
I
think
this
whole
it's
an
unbelievable
asset
and
I
think,
as
you
know,
and
we're
not
going
to
change
our
tax
system,
we're
not
nobody's
advocating
income
tax.
F
I
mean
it's
not
going
to
happen
in
our
generation.
Nor
and
you
know,
our
minerals
is
our
third
leg,
but
this
trust
land
thing
is
so
important,
and
so
I
appreciate
you
talking
to
us
about
it
and
if
you
could
do
a
little
homework
on
that
for
us
and
give
us
some
ideas.
Thank
you.
Well,.
S
Mr
chairman,
thank
you.
I
and
you
know
I
think,
there's
a
lot
to
be
learned
from
other
states
again
giving
them
the
the
lead
way
that
they
have
different
ways
of
doing
things
you
taught
has,
I
think,
a
lot
of
good
lessons
and
there
are
some
lessons
that
are
cautionary
like
idaho
kind
of
stepped
on
their
own
toes
a
couple
of
times,
and
so
I
think,
there's
there's
a
lot
to
be
learned
on
both
sides.
Thank
you
and
I'd
be
happy
to
bring
that
information
to
the
committee.
A
N
Go
ahead.
Thank
you,
mr
chair,
jeanine
bateski,
I'm
a
trustee
in
teton
county
and
I
just
want
to
say
that
this
whole
property
tax
revenue
thing
is
sort
of
a
two-edged
sword.
N
So
I
just
caution
you
that
you
know
this
increase
is
contributing
to
the
you
know:
education
funding
right
this
year,
we're
sending
23
million
dollars
back
in
recapture
it's
estimated
next
year,
we'll
be
sending
46
million
dollars
back.
So
I
just
want
to.
Hopefully
you
think
about
this
in
the
context
of
the
totality
and
what
it
really
does
to
folks
in
the
communities
that
this
impacts.
E
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Thanks
thank
you
for
those
comments
and
I
hope
you're
going
to
stick
around
for
state
land
investments
and
because
I
have
some
questions
that,
in
particular
about
the
teton
county
situation
and
how
we
might
work
on
that
via
workforce
housing
and
in
those
type
of
issues.
So
appreciate
your
comments
and
you
being
here.
Thank
you.
A
Okay,
anybody
else,
thank
you
so
much.
Who
else
would
like
to
address
the
committee
in
the
room
who
else
I'm
not
seeing
anybody
else
so
committee?
Let's
pose
public
testimony
on
this
specific
subject.
We
have
a
committee
discussion
and
kind
of
proposals,
I'm
wondering
if
it
might
be
useful
to
to
think
about
that
after
we
listen
to
the
state
lands
part,
but
I
I
don't
actually
know
mr
cochairman.
We
might
take
a
little
bit
of
time.
I'd
be
open
to
your
ideas
and
others.
F
You
know
these
two
two
priorities
that
were
given
to
us
by
management
council
to
how
we're
gonna
figure
out
some
kind
of
proposals,
we're
not
talking
about
raising
anybody's
taxes,
we're
gonna
our
first
priority
is
property
taxes.
You
know
that's
not
certainly
not
to
raise
and
try
to
figure
out
how
we
can
cap
some
of
that,
but
but
thinking
about
new
out
of
the
box
kind
of
things
and
maybe
setting
up
a
system
where
our
citizens
can
come
to
us
with
some
proposals,
ideas
and
then
that
we
can
kind
of
vet
those.
Somehow.
F
A
Mr
coach
gemini,
I
think
that's
a
pretty
good
suggestion
committee
with
your
and
with
everybody
else,
let's
just
kind
of
hold
the
solutions
piece
of
this
until
we
hear
back
from
state
lands
and
we
may
not
have
solutions
proposed
today,
we
might
it
might
take
this
whole
course
of
this
meeting.
It
might
take
the
whole
course
of
this
interim,
but
we
can
start
building
in
the
way
in
that
direction.
A
Let's
move
to
the
next
agenda
item
and
we
have
the
office
of
state
lands
here
with
the
I
guess:
you're,
not
a
new
director
anymore,
but
welcome
and
mr
crowder.
It's
always
good
to
see
you
so
we're
gonna
turn
it
over
to
we
just
we'd,
actually
don't
have
the
director
listed
on
the
deal.
I
guess
we
didn't
have
a
confirmation
at
that
time,
but
we,
madam
director,
welcome,
please
introduce
yourself
to
the
committee.
Q
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
thanks
for
having
us,
I'm
jennifer
scoggin,
I'm
the
director
for
the
office
of
state
lands
and
investments
and,
as
as
the
chairman
alluded
to
most
of
you,
know,
jason
crowder,
our
deputy
director,
thanks
for
having
us
again.
As
I
mentioned,
we
provided
you
all
a
variety
of
different
materials,
things
to
hopefully
heavy.
S
Q
Yeah,
hopefully
some
of
that
will
generate
some
discussion
about
future
revenue
generation.
We
take
revenue
generation
on
state
lands
very
seriously,
as
well
as
preservation
of
the
trust
asset.
It
was
suggested
that
perhaps
we
start
off
with
kind
of
a
state
lands
101
to
kind
of
appoint
people
with
what
state
lands
are
and
what
they
are.
Not
so,
with
your
permission,
we'll
kind
of
dive
into
that
quickly,
and
then
we
can
go
through
just
high
level,
the
other
materials
that
we've
brought
for
the
committee.
Please
go
ahead.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Q
All
right
next
slide:
okay,
when
we
talk
about
state
land,
state
trust
lands.
The
word
that
comes
to
our
mind
is
impact.
State
trust
lands
have
a
significant
impact
on
this
state.
You
can
see
in
the
past
five
years.
Revenue
generated
is
about
910
million
dollars
case
of
that
k-12
funding
has
been
about
810
million
dollars.
Wyoming's
trust
lands,
unlike
others
in
the
nation,
have
the
capacity
to
serve
the
children
and
citizens
of
the
state
for
many
generations
to
come.
Q
Q
A
lot
of
people
don't
understand
exactly
what
we
do.
We
wear
many
hats,
the
land,
the
state
land
side
is
just
one
of
them,
but
our
mission
is
effectively
managing
natural
resources
and
funds
for
current
and
future
generations,
and
hopefully
that
will
make
more
sense
to
you
as
we
get
through
the
materials.
Q
So
let's
just
have
a
quick
history
lesson.
I
think
some
of
this
may
have
been
explained
in
the
previous
presentation,
but
following
the
american
revolutionary
war
congress
began
preparing
for
a
unified
nation
of
states.
It
was
believed
that
free
public
education
was
really
the
key
to
a
successful
democracy
and
educated
citizenry.
Q
It
was
recognized
that
new
states
really
didn't
have
a
tax
base
on
which
to
fund
schools,
so
in
order
to
place
new
states
on
equal
footing
with
the
other
states,
congress
looked
at
ways
to
compensate
for
this
inequity
by
granting
the
territorial
states
fee
title
to
portions
of
the
federal
estate
for
the
purposes
of
supporting
public
schools
to
ensure
that
the
lands
would
remain
the
resource
for
public
education
congress
mandated
that
territories
agree
that
these
lands
would
be
reserved
for
the
maintenance
of
public
schools
and
management
of
these
lands
has
been
repeatedly
interpreted
by
both
federal
and
state
courts
as
a
trust
or
a
trust.
Q
Responsibility
and
what's
changed
over
time
is
some
of
the
initial
states
that
came
into
the
union
in
the
19th
century.
They
received
some
state
lands,
but
their
their.
The
requirements
put
on
them
by
congress
were
a
little
bit
loose
and
as
state
more
and
more
states
joined
the
union
congress
kind
of
tightened
up
how
state
lands
could
be
used.
Excellent,
so
you'll
see
here.
Q
Q
Most
recent
was
alaska
in
1958
and
as
mentioned
earlier,
when
some
of
the
earlier
states
came
in
there,
they
made
a
solemn
promise
to
congress
that
they
would
manage
their
state
lands
for
the
benefit
of
common
schools,
but
by
the
time
some
of
the
later
states
came
in
like
arizona
and
new
mexico,
it
was
essentially
imposed
the
congress
imposed
a
federal
or
constitutional
trust
on
the
management
of
those
state
lands
to
generate
revenue
for
for
the
the
schools.
Today,
there's
23
remaining
states.
Q
We
collectively
manage
a
total
of
156
million
surface
acres
and
177
million
subsurface
surface
acres
thanks
okay,
so
you
probably
heard
a
little
bit
about
this
earlier
today.
The
organic
act,
which
was
an
act
of
congress
that
established
territories
in
the
u.s
and
specified
how
they
will
how
they
would
be
governed.
Q
The
wyoming
organic
act
was
approved
by
congress
on
july
25
1868
provided
for
the
temporary
government
for
the
territory
of
wyoming,
and
in
that
organic
act
it
provides
that
sections
16
and
36
in
each
township
and
the
territory
would
be
reserved
for
the
purposes
of
being
applied
to
public
schools,
whether
in
the
state
or
future
states
would
be
additional
states
to
be
created
out
of
the
territory.
Q
So,
a
little
bit
later
from
september,
2nd
of
1889
to
september
30th
of
1889,
there
was
a
constitutional
convention
that
was
convened
in
cheyenne
where
the
wyoming
constitution
was
framed
and
the
constitution
was
ratified
by
wyoming
voters
on
november
5th
of
1889.
Q
Q
Funds
belonging
to
the
state
for
public
school
purposes
are
deemed
trust,
funds
and
income
from
the
perpetual
funds
and
all
rents
from
unschooled
school
lands
shall
be
exclusively
applied
to
the
support
of
schools
in
every
county.
Next,
the
constitution
also
addresses
sort
of
how
trust
lands
are
administered.
Q
The
constitution
and
the
legislature
direct
the
board
of
land
commissioners
to
manage
the
trust
asset.
You'll
see
article
18
section
1,
the
state
accepted
formally
the
grant
of
the
lands
made
by
the
u.s
to
the
state
for
educational
purposes,
and
then
it
was
later
amended
to
add
public
buildings
and
institutions,
because
additional
lands
were
provided
to
the
state
through
the
act
of
admissions.
A
little
bit
later
on
article
18
section
3
provides
that
the
board
of
land
commissioners
shall
have
the
direction,
control
and
disposition
and
care
of
lands
granted
to
the
state
of
wyoming.
Q
So
importantly,
as
stated
earlier,
the
state
trust
lands
are
owned
by
the
state
and
held
in
a
trust
for
the
benefit
of
public
education
in
the
state
and
for
the
benefit
of
other
specific
enumerated
institutions.
So
next
slide.
So
who
are
the
board
of
land
commissioners?
The
board
of
land
commissioners
is
composed
of
the
five
top
electeds
that
would
be
the
governor,
the
secretary
of
state,
the
auditor,
the
treasurer
and
the
superintendent
of
public
instruction.
Q
Q
So
now,
historically,
we
come
to
the
act
of
admission
wyoming's
active
admission
provided
for
the
admission
of
the
state
of
wyoming
into
the
union.
It
was
approved
july
10
of
1890,
and
this
act
of
admission
ratified
the
wyoming
constitution.
As
I
mentioned,
the
act
of
admission
again
addresses
state
trust
lands.
It
grants
again
section
16
and
36
in
each
township
for
purposes
of
maintaining
common
school,
and
it
also
provided
lands
to
support
certain
other
state
purposes,
including
the
university
of
wyoming,
the
veterans
at
home
veterans
home
the
state
hospital,
the
penitentiary
things
like
that.
Q
The
act
specifies
that
school
lands
may
only
be
disposed
of
at
public
auction.
It
provides
that
the
legislature
has
the
power
to
regulate
leasing
of
lands
so
long
as
the
term
of
an
agricultural
and
grazing
lease
does
not
exceed
10
years,
so
stepping
away
from
the
act,
the
organic
act,
the
constitution,
the
act
of
admission
since
that
time.
Obviously
the
legislature
has
passed
some
statutes
that
impact
the
way
state
lands
are
managed.
Q
Q
Next,
the
legislature
also
passed
certain
statutory
statutes
that
include
statutory
principles
under
which
we
osli
and
the
board
of
land
commissioners
are
to
manage
the
state
trust
lands
so
you'll
see
state
trust.
Lands
are
to
be
managed
under
a
total
asset
management
policy.
The
land
trust
is
intergenerational
and
must
be
managed
with
the
focus
on
protecting
the
corpus
for
the
long
term.
It
should
remain
a
sub.
The
land
itself
should
remain
a
substantial
component
of
the
trust
portfolio.
In
other
words,
don't
just
sell
it
all
and
invest
the
money.
Q
Q
So
the
office
of
state
lands
and
investments,
who
are
we
and
what
do
we
do?
We
are
the
administrative
arm
of
the
board
of
land
commissioners
and
also
the
state
loan
and
investment
board,
and
so
we
have
the
statutory
responsibility
to
carry
out
the
policy
directives
of
the
board
so
we're
essentially
their
staff.
Q
Who
exactly
are
the
trust
land
beneficiaries?
I
don't
know
if
you
can
see
this
very
well,
but
you
can
see
most
of
them
enumerated
there,
as
we
mentioned
before,
we're
mainly
working
for
public
schools
k
through
12
education,
but
there
are
some
other
beneficiaries
there,
so
the
trust
asset.
I
think
you
heard
this
earlier
today:
3.4
million
surface
acres,
3.9
million
mineral
trust,
acres
and
the
state
permanent
land
fund,
which
the
majority
of
revenues
collected
from
the
trust
lands
are
deposited
into
this
fund
and
it's
over
4.5
billion
dollars.
Q
Q
You'll
see
here
that
the
trust
asset
includes
several
ranches,
which
are
managed
by
the
board
of
land.
Commissioners
jason
did
you
want
to
include
anything
on
that
he'll?
Get
there
next
slide,
please
so
the
how?
How
do
we
do
it?
How
do
we
make
money
for
k-12
education
and
the
other
trust
beneficiaries?
Q
There's
a
number
of
different
ways:
grazing
and
agricultural
leasing?
I
think
that's
self-explanatory
easements.
These
are
these:
provide
legal
authority
and
recordable
easements
across
state
lands
for
various
things,
such
as
pipelines,
power
lines,
roads
that
sort
of
thing
temporary
use
permits
they
provide
short-term
authority
and
echo
for
economic
benefit
and
activities
to
the
beneficiaries.
Q
Examples
of
temporary
use
permits
they're
issued
for
things
such
as
construction.
Staging
areas
stockpile
sites
organize
organizational
organized
recreational
activities.
Then
we
move
down
to
special
use
leasing.
Those
are
longer
term
leases
for
activities
that
provide
economic
benefit,
usually
competitive
commercial
activities,
competitive
recreational
and
industrial
leases,
cabin
sites
secondary
oil
and
gas
activities.
Those
sorts
of
things
are
permitted
under
the
special
use
leases.
Q
Then
we
have
land
sales,
exchanges
and
acquisitions,
we're
looking
to
optimize
opportunities
that
provide
the
state,
trust
land
ownership
patterns
which
are
conducive
to
effective
management,
we're
looking
to
increase
land
values,
increase
income
generation
potentials
and
also
we
look
at
public
access
opportunities.
We
also
have
some
renewable
leasing.
Currently
we
have
a
number
of
wind
energy
leases.
Q
I
don't
believe
we
have
any
solar
at
this
point
we
haven't
been
approached
and
we
haven't
identified
that
as
as
a
priority
at
this
point,
but
would
certainly
entertain
that
mineral
leasing,
as
you
can
imagine,
everything
from
oil
and
gas
to
coal,
to
you
name
it
and
then
forest
product
sales
or
timber
sales.
That
sort
of
thing
we're
always
looking
for
new
opportunities
both
for
compatible
uses-
and
you
know
so.
Q
You
can
have
multiple
things
on
one
site,
but
that
is
not
always
a
requirement,
so
one
other
important
thing
that
the
legislature
has
directed
us
to
do
they
ex
they
establish
trust
land
management
objectives
for
state
lands.
So
when
we
evaluate
a
course
of
action
with
state
trust
land,
we
follow
what
are
known
as
the
trust
land
management
objectives.
There
are
three
of
them:
a
proposal
doesn't
need
to
meet
all
three
objectives.
Q
The
board
of
land
commissioners
has
prioritized
these
three
management
objectives
from
highest
to
lowest
we'll
get
into
those
next.
So
the
most
important
land
management
objective,
as
established
by
the
the
board,
is
to
better
meet
the
beneficiary
short
and
or
long-term
objectives,
and,
as
you
can
imagine,
that's
generally
revenue.
Q
We
look
to
improve
those
revenue,
generation,
potentials
and
opportunities
again
alone
or
single
uses
using
other
state
lands,
additional
state
lands
and
we
look
at
investment
values.
What's
going
to
improve
returns,
what's
going
to
help
diversify
our
portfolio,
we
look
at
appreciation,
potentials
and
increasing
natural
resource
values.
Q
The
second
management
objective
is
to
improve
the
manageability
of
the
land
assets.
So
you
know,
as
you
saw,
there's
a
lot
of
different
lands
all
across
the
state
and
it's
it's
hard
to
keep
track
of
them
all
and
manage
them
all
when
they
are
that
spread
out.
So
we
do
look
when
we're
looking
at
opportunities.
Q
Q
Q
You
know,
constructing
schools
to
improve
stability,
providing
growth
opportunities
by
constructing
school
or
schools
on
school
lands?
Can
we
improve
access
for
hunting
and
recreational
opportunities,
so
anytime
we're
we're
looking
at
disposal,
exchanges,
acquisitions
of
land
or
even
other
aspects
of
trust,
land
management?
We
do
have
to
keep
these
management
objectives
in
line
and
make
sure
that
the
board
is
aware
of
our
analysis
when
we
look
at
them
and
if
you
don't
get
anything
else
out
of
the
presentation
today,
I
think
this
was
alluded
to
earlier.
Q
Conversely,
state
lands,
as
I
mentioned,
are
managed
with
consistent
trust
principles.
We're
looking
for
long-term
growth
and
value
and
optimum
sustainable
revenue.
Production
doesn't
mean
we
don't
care
about
the
other
values,
but
ultimately
we're
about
the
the
revenue
generation
and
preserving
the
trust
asset
and
then
just
real
quickly.
I
think
we're
kind
of
to
the
end,
but
a
lot
of
times
you
know
uses
of
state
land
are
a
question.
We
would
just
highlight
that
the
board
of
land
commissioners
rules
and
regulations
speak
to
recreating.
Q
If
you
will
on
state
lands
and
most
people
don't
realize
that
the
board
has
extended
the
to
the
public.
The
privilege
of
using
legally
accessible
state
lands
for
casual
day
uses
how
and
the
casual
day
uses
you
can
switch
to
the
next
slide.
Q
You
know
they
are
for
things
such
as
hunting
fishing,
recreating
horseback,
riding
photography,
hiking
wildlife,
observation
camping
is
not
allowed
on
trust
lands.
Fires
are
not
allowed
unless
there
are
areas
that
are
authorized
by
the
board.
Motorized
vehicle
use
must
be
confined
to
establish
roads
and
the
board
may
close
any
parcel
for
failure
to
abide
by
the
the
rules
for
uses
of
state
lands.
They
don't
like
to
do
that.
Q
They
try
everything
not
to
do
that,
but
there
are
parcels
around
the
state
where
people
have
gone
in
there
and
shot
things
up
or
just
generally
mismanaged
their
use
of
state
lands
created
additional
roads.
That
sort
of
thing
where
the
board
is
obviously
trying
to
to
protect
the
trust
asset.
D
D
So
one
does
do
we
have
to
repeal
the
statute
for
could
could
osley
do
it
on
its
own,
because
someone
told
me
they
could
and
two,
and
I
think
it
goes
to
the
way
the
statutes
worded,
but
I
don't
know
if
you've
looked
at
that,
so
I
wanted
to
get
an
opinion
on
that
and
two,
what's
your
I
mean
I
what's
your
opinion
on
that
issue
and
the
legislative
history
on
it,
because
I
I
really
think
that
we
need
to
work
on
this.
Thank
you,
director,
scoggins.
Q
Mr
chairman,
I'll
defer
it
most
of
this
to
jason,
because
some
of
this
was
before
my
time,
but
I
guess
I
would
say
I
haven't
read
the
statute
recently
but,
as
I
understand
it,
the
board
of
land
commissioners
has
the
ability
to
sort
of
authorize
areas
where
campfires
can
be
had
and
that's
usually
associated
with
outfitting
exclusive
outfitting
rights
and
that
sort
of
thing.
Q
With
respect
to
my
opinion
on
it,
I
think
we
have
to
be
a
little
bit
careful
because
again
we're
managing
a
trust
asset
and
with
as
dry
and,
as
you
know,
drought
and
everything
else.
Obviously
we
don't
want
to
keep
state
forester
bill.
Craps
are
too
busy
over
the
summer
months,
but
jason,
if
you
could
add
some
color
to
that
I'd
appreciate
it.
Mr.
T
Crowder,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
representative
gray.
It's
a
great
question.
When
we
looked
at
that
in
in
past
legislative
efforts,
it
was
to
just
remove
the
prohibition
of
camping
from
the
statute,
but
there's
a
second
step
to
that,
and
it's
in
the
borderline
commissioner's
rules
and
regulations
in
chapter
13,
where
they
also
prohibit
camping,
so
simply
removing
it
from
the
statute
made
it
to
where
that
infraction
against
the
board's
rules
was
no
longer
enforceable
as
a
misdemeanor.
T
It
was
just
an
act
against
the
board's
rules
and
we
couldn't
ask
law
enforcement
to
cite
somebody
and
give
them
the
750
fine
and
move
forward
with
that.
So
I
think
that
when
we
were
working
on
it
several
years
ago,
that
was
the
piece
that
we
represented
to
the
legislature.
All
you're
doing
is
removing
it
as
a
as
a
misdemeanor.
The
borderline
commissioners
still
haven't
made
any
effort
to
allow
camping
as
well.
D
Mr
chairman
representative,
chris
one
fault,
thank
you.
We
could
have
a
proactive
statement
in
statute
saying
there
shall
be
correct.
I
mean
in
preempting
right
that
wouldn't
or
would
your
argument
be
that
maybe
there'd
be
some
constitutional
concerns
on
it?
I
mean
I
I'm
just
curious
on
the
way
that
would
go.
You
just
stat
a
sentence
repeal
and
add
a
sentence
saying
there
shall
be.
T
Grad,
I
think
what
we
would
like
to
do
is
work
with
you
to
find
a
solution
that
best
fits
all
of
the
parcels
across
the
state.
Every
single
parcel
brings
unique
attributes
that
are
agreeable
to
camping
and
that
are
not
agreeable
to
camping
if
we
could
come
together
and
find
a
good
place
where
camping
can
be
done
and
bring
in
our
partners,
our
other
paying
users
and
the
most
prolific,
one
being
the
ag
and
grazing
community
into
that
conversation
to
see
how
both
of
those
uses
can
be
done.
T
Q
So,
let's
talk
just
briefly
about
state
trust,
land
revenue,
so
I
think
this
was
brought
up
earlier
about
86
percent
of
state
trust
lands
are
classified
as
common
school
trust
lands,
so
they
support
k
through
12
education,
14,
generate
revenues
to
support
those
other
institutions
and
beneficiaries
that
we
mentioned,
as
you
might
imagine,
grazing,
is
the
most
prevalent
use
of
the
surface.
We
have
approximately
4
000
grazing
leases
that
cover
over
98
of
the
state
trust
land
surface
acreage.
Q
So
obviously
we
do
have
to
rely
on
our
grazing
lesses
to
help
us
manage
that
part
of
the
asset
and
also,
as
was
discussed,
mineral
development
generates
the
most
income
for
the
state
trust
land
beneficiaries
that
was
discussed
earlier
jason.
Do
you
want
to
go
ahead
and
go
through
the
the
graphs?
Please
sure?
Mr.
T
Crowd,
mr
chairman,
these
are
rosy
graphs,
I'm
kidding,
as
you
can
see
in
this
graph,
we've
had
a
steady
decline
in
revenue
over
the
last
five
years
and
we
can
attribute
that
to
a
lot
of
impacts
and
a
lot
of
things
that
have
happened
to
us
over
these
five
years.
The
most
important
thing
is
that
in
2017,
the
256
million
dollars
is
a
somewhat
artificial
number.
It's
not
a
sustainable
number.
T
That
is
the
year
as
lso
mentioned
earlier,
that
we
sold
a
parcel
to
the
teton
national
park
for
46
million
dollars
so
that
greatly
influenced
our
revenue
numbers.
But
through
time
we've
been
influenced
by
oil
and
gas
revenue
to
the
state.
We
are
very
subject
to
the
royalties
that
that
we
receive
and
the
price
per
barrel
of
that
oil
that
is
sought
on
the
market.
Gas
prices
were
heavily
impacted
by
that,
and
probably
mostly
in
these
numbers
is
the
coal
market.
The
coal
industry,
as
the
coal
industry
has
declined.
We've
seen
our
revenues
decline.
T
Obviously,
the
covet
pandemic
has
further
impacted
our
revenue
numbers
and
with
negative
oil
and
gas
prices,
we
saw
severe
severe
drop
in
our
oil
and
gas
revenue,
which
is
the
major
component
of
the
royalties
we
we
receive
coming
into
the
state.
What
I
can
say
out
of
this
graph
is
I'm
very
hopeful
or
not
hopeful,
but
I'm
very
excited
to
throw
fiscal
year
22
on
that
we
are
on
pace
to
hit
150
million
dollars
just
off
of
royalties
if
the
prices
remain
steady
and
strong
as
they
currently
are.
T
T
A
couple
other
things
that
may
be
impacting
these
numbers
as
we
go
forward
and
looking
into
the
long-term,
our
federal
policies.
Obviously,
the
the
moratorium
on
leasing,
federal
oil
and
gas
has
an
impact
on
our
development.
T
We
sit
adjacent
to
a
lot
of
federal
minerals
and
it's
un
inefficient
to
produce
a
parcel
of
state
land
with
a
two
mile
lateral.
Well,
if
you
can't
finish
that
second
mile
of
the
lateral
well,
obviously,
we
stand
ready
and
willing
to
produce
that
oil
and
gas,
but
if
our
federal
neighbors
aren't,
then
we're
stopped
right
there.
T
L
T
Sorry,
approval
for
permit
to
drill
on
federal
lands
and
when
those
things
slow
down.
Obviously,
drilling
slows
down
as
well
and
and
we've
been
working
with
our
federal
partners
to
indicate
to
them
that
that's
not
how
we
interpret
that
moratorium
and
to
move
forward
with
that
action
as
much
as
they
can
and
obviously
they
give
us
the
credence
that
that
you've
seen
in
these
numbers-
I
guess
they
they
manage
to
their
bosses
and
not
to
us.
A
This
might
be
a
a
good
time
for
a
question
about.
Do
you
forecast
the
future?
Do
you
forecast
things
like
carbon
risk
or
carbon
policy
risk,
or
you
may
not
call
it
that?
But
a
lot
of
this
is
a
carbon
policy
decline,
even
though
it's
shattered
in
different
pieces
like
the
moratorium
or
other
things,
do
you
think
about
that
in
the
future
formally
for
the
for
the
board
of
line
commissioners
or
how
does
that
work.
T
Mr
chairman,
I
think
that's
a
very
good
question.
Formally
we
don't
it's
hard
for
a
crystal
ball
for
us
to
look
into,
but
what
we
try
to
do
is
normalize
revenue
streams
as
much
as
possible
and
look
at
other
areas
that
may
be
on
the
other
side
of
the
the
carbon
battle,
carbon
sequestration
and
it's
wildlife,
habitat
problems
as
well,
and
so
we
look
at
banking
and
can
we
generate
revenue
on
that
side
of
the
table
as
well
to
kind
of
mitigate
both
sides
of
these.
A
T
A
T
U
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
just
a
quick
question:
it's
probably
more
for
my
education
than
anything
else,
but
I
wondered
about
how
often
the
board
of
land
commissioners
meet
to
analyze
this
information,
and
then
you
mentioned
on
one
of
your
slides
about
the
fact
that
the
trust
is
is
their
focus
is
on
protecting
the
corpus
for
the
long
term.
I'm
wondering
how
does
that?
U
How
does
that
work
with
revenue
generation
versus
protecting
the
corpus?
I
don't
know
if
that's
a
good
question
or
not,
but
can
you
answer
that.
U
Q
The
board
of
land
commissioners,
they
meet
every
other
month,
so
it's
pretty
regularly.
We
also
do
special
meetings
when
required.
We
also
do
working
sessions.
You'll
hear
a
little
bit
about
one
of
those
a
little
bit
later
on.
We,
the
staff
at
osli,
we're
always
trying
to
stay
ahead
of
this,
and,
as
deputy
crowder
mentioned,
we're
trying
to
figure
out
how
to
normalize
revenues
and
predict
the
future
and
figure
out
how
new
and
different
things
that
we
can
do
for
revenue
generation.
Q
We're
trying
to
be
a
little
more
proactive
in
that
regard,
not
just
waiting
for
the
opportunities
to
come,
but
we're
looking
for
areas
within
the
state
that
are
hot
areas
for
different
things
and
do
we
have
lands
that
have
that
are
publicly
accessible.
If
you
will,
that
could
provide
good
opportunities
and
new
and
different
opportunities,
I
think
part
of
the
problem
is:
is
that
not
everybody
has
caught
up
to
revenue?
Generation
is
very
important
for
state
trust
lands.
I
think
it's
a
it's
a
delicate
balance.
Q
A
lot
of
people
are
used
to
wyoming
being
more
rural
and
used
to
enjoyment
of
state
trust
lands
as
well
as
they
utilize
them
for
other
things,
such
as
grazing
and
and
whatnot.
So
it's
kind
of
a
complicated
problem
where
there's
a
lot
of
different
stakeholders
who
have
a
lot
of
views
and
viewpoints
that
we
try
to
consider
and,
as
I
mentioned,
we'll
talk
about
what
we're
doing
in
teton
county
in
a
little
bit.
Q
But
but
it
is
a
delicate
dance
and
we
do
not
want
to
do
things
that
are
going
to
diminish
the
value
of
the
trust
assets
so
that
it
can
keep
being
fruitful
over
time.
M
Ahead,
director,
scoggins
and
and
jason,
I
was
just
wondering
how
the
slip
board
interacts
with
counties
when
I
know
there's
one
county,
that's
dealing
with,
they
have
their
own
specific
problems,
and
so
the
proposals
that
come
in
may
affect
the
problems
that
they
have,
such
as.
M
Let's
see
it
would
be
workforce
housing
or
you
know,
traffic,
gridlock
and
stuff,
like
that.
Now.
M
If
it's
you
know,
the
counties
need
to
just
pay
attention
and
and
get
with
you
guys
about.
You
know
their
problems
and
how
maybe
these
proposals
you
could
you
know,
find
a
some
sort
of
a
compromise.
Thank
you.
Q
Mr
chairman,
I
believe
you're
talking
about
teton
county,
but
that's
fine.
Q
Yes,
we
we
osli
and
the
board
try
to
include
the
viewpoints
of
the
local
folks,
because
that's
very
important,
we
don't
want
to
just
storm
in
there
and
do
things
that
are
not
compatible
with
how
they
view
things
or
that
are
really
going
to
kind
of
muck
up
other
things
that
they
have
planned.
Q
But
it
is
difficult
because
a
lot
of
people
don't
want
to
see
commercial
development
of
state
lands
and
all
so
it's
it's
a
difficult
discussion.
We
continue
to
have
them.
We
realize
that
not
everybody
is
going
to
be
happy,
but
we
do
want
input
from
the
local
communities,
the
local
governments,
all
of
that
and
try
to
come
to
a
consensus,
to
the
extent
that
we
can.
Q
But
again,
I
think
we
all
have
to
understand
the
purpose
of
state
lands
and
and
so
yeah.
We
want
to
have
those
discussions
and
we
will
continue
to
as
we
move
into
additional
projects
that
we
think
will
generate
revenue
for
for
the
trust
beneficiaries
and
also
you
know,
some
of
it
I
understand
is:
we've
had
some
communication
breakdowns
between
staff
and
local
governments
and
whatnot
that
we're
really
trying
to
work
on.
Q
But
the
the
board
went
up
to
teton
county
and
toured
some
of
the
parcels
we
were
talking
about
with
respect
to
develop
potential
development
and
they
met
with
folks.
They
took
a
lot
of
public
comment.
In
fact,
I
think
the
bulk
of
the
afternoon
was
spent
on
public
comment,
touring
the
parcels
with
interested
stakeholders
and
all
of
that
to
make
sure
again
that
they
have
a
bead
on
what
people
are,
are
thinking
and
feeling,
and
is
there
a
way
that
we
can
all
work
together
here
with
respect
to
revenue,
generation,
opportunities.
O
O
O
Appreciated,
thank
you,
representative
henderson.
Well,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
thank
you
for
this
opportunity.
You
mentioned
you're
looking
for
new
ways
to
to
to
make
use
of
the
of
the
available
land,
and
my
question
has
to
do
with
you
know
across
the
state
we
have
in
the
counties.
We
have
a
planning
and
development
process
ongoing
all
over
the
place
we
have
at
the
uw.
We
have
the
enhanced
oil
research
and
so
on,
you're
a
small
staff.
How?
O
Q
Are
you,
mr
chairman,
it
is
difficult
to
kind
of
look
at
all
the
blue
squares
and
figure
out
how
to
put
them
all
together
and
you'll
see
as
we
get
into
some
of
our
additional
meeting
materials.
Q
The
last
item
we
have
is
is
a
map,
if
you
will,
where
we've
kind
of
looked
at
some
of
the
squares,
and
there
are
purple
watches,
if
you
will
on
the
map
where
we
think
that
the
market
could
be
ripe
in
the
future
for
a
development
opportunity
there
and
so
we'll
be
looking
at
some
point
to
pursue
them.
I
don't
want
anyone
to
panic.
We
don't
have
anything
on
the
books.
Q
We
also
send
staff
to
the
the
counties
to
talk
with
their
planning
folks
to
find
out,
what's
going
on
there
to
figure
out
if
there
are
opportunities,
local
opportunities,
that
we
can
and
should
be
taking
advantage
of
again,
as
you
mentioned,
the
carbon
sequestration,
that
sort
of
thing
we're
trying
to
keep
our
finger
on
the
pulse
of
that
we're
working
with
you
know
various
folks
who
are
interested
in
doing
that
activity
and
exploring
ways
to
do
that
again.
Some
of
it
is
staffing
that
takes
these
things,
take
a
lot
of
time
and
also
expertise.
Q
We
don't
always
have
the
appropriate
expertise,
so
we
have
to
develop
that
in
our
pursuit
of
some
of
these
more
complicated
things
like
carbon
sequestration,
but
we
certainly
have
tried
to
identify
things
and
communicate
with
people
about
what's
hot
and
and
where.
L
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Thank
you,
madam
director.
L
Have
you
given
thought
to
leasing
property
on
some
of
these
hot
properties
and
say
teton,
county
leasing,
these
properties
out
on,
say,
20-year
loan
or
20-year
leases
and
that
and
not
sell
the
property
say,
leasing
it
for
periods
of
time
on
subdivisions
of
maybe
a
quarter
or
maybe
a
half
acre,
or
an
acre
and
leasing
them
out
and
getting
their
revenue
from
them
by
leasing
rather
than
selling,
I
think
selling
property
kind
of
forecloses
the
future
revenue
gain
that
the
state
would
have,
but
if
they
just
leased
these
properties,
they
might
be
able
to
make
more
money
now
and
still
maintain
the
possibility
of
making
more
money
in
the
future
when
it
when
it
appreciates
further.
Q
Chairman
representative,
yes,
we
have
given
thought
to
that
process.
That's
a
very
good
point.
Q
One
thing
that
I
don't
think
some
people
know
is
that
with
respect
to
state
lands-
and
I
think
I
may
have
covered
it
a
little
bit
in
some
of
the
introductory
remarks-
that
the
legislature
has
directed
us
to
keep
lands
as
part
of
the
corpus
of
the
trust
not
to
sell
it
off,
you
know
for
big
dollars
and
that
sort
of
thing
there
may
be
opportunities
for
that,
but
we
try
to
stay
within
a
certain
range
plus
or
minus
a
few
thousand
acres.
Q
But
with
respect
to
your
question
about
leasing
versus
selling,
yes-
and
we
are
we're
interested
in
proposals
that
people
have
for
that-
we
also
have
talked
internally.
We
know
that
conservation
values
are
important
to
certain
people
in
different
areas
of
the
state.
Is
there
a
way
for
them
to
pay
for
a
conservation
lease?
If
you
will,
that
would
maintain
the
surface
other
than
you
know
grazing
or
whatever
the
current
activity
might
be,
but
yes,
we're
trying
to
figure
out.
Q
What
are
what
are
things
we
can
do
to
help
facilitate
those
sorts
of
things,
but
also
generate
revenue
from
them.
I
think
some
people
are
used
to
not
having
to
pay
for
those
values,
but,
as
you
can
see,
with
minerals
in
the
decline,
we're
trying
to
think
of
new
and
different
ways
and
and
leasing
is
certainly
an
option
for
us
and
we're
trying
to
do
some.
Q
T
A
T
E
In
it,
mr
chairman
representative,
sweeney
one
quick
question
before
we
leave
this
packet,
this
this
chart
or
spreadsheet,
so
my
understanding
is
beneficiaries.
I
don't
see,
I
I
see
the
university
of
wyoming
a
few
times,
but
does
that
also
commit
any
dollars
to
our
community
colleges
or
just
the
university?
E
T
Doesn't
include
anything
to
do
with
the
community
college,
it's
just
a
land
grant
university
of
wyoming
peace.
T
Mr
chairman,
as
I
was
indicating
the
next
report
that
we
provided
to
you,
that's
off
the
state
lands
trust
land
management
report.
I
wanted
to
not
go
through
this
in
detail,
because
a
lot
of
it's
already
been
spoken
about
in
our
101
presentation,
but
I'd
like
you
to
turn
to
the
I
apologize.
These
don't
have.
T
They
do
have
page
numbers
page
number,
five,
which
is
the
fiscal
year
comparison
inside
that
report
and
it
compares
2018
to
2021
and,
as
we
showed
in
the
graph,
there's
a
steep
decline
from
those
years
and
what
we
wanted
to
provide
was.
This
does
look
like
the
bottom
of
of
of
that
curve.
We
anticipate
this
going
up
and
this
is
how
the
revenue
was
split
among
all
of
those
different
rep
beneficiaries.
That
representative
sweeney
spoke
about.
T
So
if
you
wanted
a
comparison
of
those
two
years
of
2018,
which
is
relatively
normal
year
to
2021,
which
we
feel
is
the
bottom,
this
is
a
good
place
to
look
to
there's
a
lot
of
good
information
within
this
report.
Mr
chairman
and
we're
happy
to
answer
any
questions
on
it,
but
don't
necessarily
need
to
go
through
it
with
you
right
now,
unless
you'd
like
us
to
any
community
questions,
we're
good,
mr
crowder
good
job.
T
The
next
thing
that
we've
provided
the
committee
is
a
report
on
the
trust
state
trust
line,
grazing
fees
that
we
completed
back
in
2018.
We
provided
this
to
the
join
ag
committee
back
then,
at
their
request.
We
haven't
updated
this
report
since
then.
So
it's
rather
dated
information,
but
we
feel
the
information
is
still
valid.
It
shows
where
the
state
of
wyoming
currently
sits
as
far
as
grazing
fees
on
state
trust
land
in
comparison
to
private
fees
across
the
state.
T
It's
important
to
note
that
the
grazing
fee
is
derived
from
a
formula
that
the
legislature
provided
us.
It
said
that
each
each
grazing
fee
needs
to
be
determined
by
by
a
formula.
The
formula
needs
to
include
data.
That's
readily
available
averaged
over
an
adequate
number
of
years
to
remove
any
radical
fluctuations
factors
which
reasonably
reflect
the
true
market
value
of
state
leases
and
parameters
within
which
the
board
can
be
responsive
to
changes,
changing
resource
conditions,
market
demand
and
industry
volatility.
T
That's
averaged
over
five
years
and
includes
with
that,
multiplies
that
by
a
five-year
weighted
average
of
the
beef
cattle
per
hundred
weight
and
that's
what
we
call
the
parity
ratio
in
this
equation
and
that,
essentially
over
time,
has
reduced
that
private
land
lease
rate
by
about
35
to
40
percent
each
year,
and
then
it's
to
further
adjust
the
lease
rate
in
a
downward
way
by
20
to
reflect
the
contributions
made
by
the
lessee.
So
we
start
with
a
private
land
leash
rate.
T
We
reduce
it
by
the
cost
to
produce
that
100
weight
of
beef
cattle
and
then
reduce
it
again
for
the
20
for
the
lessee's
contribution
to
the
lease
and
that's
how
we
derive
the
state's
aum
fees.
And
this
report
does
a
good
job
of
comparing
that
formula
with
all
the
other
western
states
that
the
director
mentioned
when
they
have
grazing
programs
as
well
and
how
they
determine
it
and
how
we
sit
in
the
back
of
that
report.
You'll
find
a
couple
graphs.
T
J
J
So
do
you
take
that
into
account
and
then
you
average
that
out
over
a
five-year
period-
or
I
mean,
do
you
see
those
going
up
like
the
private
property
taxes
because
it
seems
like
you
know
it
was
brought
up
earlier.
You
know
that
people
who
own
property,
then
they're
going
to
have
to
raise
the
rent
to
help
pay
those
property
taxes,
and
how
does
that
affect
your
formula
of
how
your
or
does
it
affect?
Maybe
it
doesn't
affect
it
at
all.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
mr
crowder.
Thank
you.
T
Go
ahead,
these
are
questions
that
we're
not
accustomed
to
answering.
Yes,
it
does
have
an
impact
on
the
formula.
It's
a
delayed
impact.
Obviously
we
take
a
five-year
weighted
average
of
those
private
land
lease
rates
and
we
are
assuming
that
those
private
land
leash
rates
have
some
impact
on
local
taxes
or
any
other
influences.
And
of
course
this
is
statewide,
so
it
it
varies
across
the
whole
state,
but
also
when
the
national
agricultural
statistics
service
provides
us
the
information
for
the
parity
ratio.
T
We
understand
that
that
should
have
a
component
of
of
what
the
inputs
are
to
raising
that
one.
Beef
cattle
is,
and
hopefully
that
are
the
ancillary
inputs
like
taxes
and
the
land
costs,
and
things
like
that.
We
don't
have
a
direct
line
to
show
you
exactly
what
that
is,
but
as
private
lease
rates
go
up
two
years
later,
our
grazing
fees
go
up.
As
beef
cattle
prices
go
up
two
years
later,
our
aum
fees
go
up
and
vice
versa,
when
they
start
going
down.
Two
years
later,
our
aum
fees
go
down.
T
So
in
2000-
and
I
don't
have
this
right
in
front
of
me-
but
I
believe
2017
2018-
we
had
the
highest
aum
fee
that
we've
ever
had.
It
was
six
dollars
and
fourteen
cents
per
aum
and
that's
because
of
the
influences
that
were
had
five
years
prior
to
that
year
on
our
formula.
But
since
then,
as
the
cost
of
beef,
cattle
price
or
beef,
cattle
on
production
has
gone
up.
Our
aum
fees
have
gone
down
to
where
we're
at
five
dollars
and
fourteen
cents.
I
believe
five
dollars
and
twenty
eight
cents
this
year.
K
Yen,
mr
chairman,
thank
you,
deputy
director,
so
to
clarify
on
that.
That's
that
that's
based
on
the
statewide
market,
lease
rates
and
not
county
specific
market
lease
rates.
So
if
you're
in
a
county
with
higher
agricultural
property
tax
values,
you
may
be
getting
a
deal,
leasing
from
the
state
than
you
would
leasing
from
a
private
person
in
in
that
higher
valued
county.
Is
that
correct.
A
T
T
T
And,
mr
chairman,
I
that's
everything
that
we
provided
to
you.
I
believe,
for
the
state
land
101,
the
next
component,
that
we
had
pro
bit
of
information
that
we
have,
for
you
are
new
revenue,
generating
ideas
and
the
efforts
we've
taken
today.
For
that.
E
We
get
there.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
a
quick
question.
So
how
would
we
had
the
revenue
committee
had
a
ag
land
qualifications
annual
gross
revenues
bill
that
failed,
taking
basically
it
from
five
hundred
dollars?
E
A
Small
timeout
just
a
little
bit
of
a
timeout
so
assessors
they
they
can't
extend
the
ag
exemption
to
a
property
unless
they're
trying
to
run
it
as
a
viable
concern.
So
a
trophy
ranch
that
has
one
cow:
they
don't
get
the
benefit
theoretically
of
a
lower
property
taxes.
So
I
just
throw
that
out
there
as
a
preference.
T
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
don't
believe
that
that
has
any
impact
on
our
grazing
fee
formula.
It's
a
statewide
average
given
to
us
by
by
nass,
but
we
do
track
that
information,
especially
in
the
real
estate
transaction
program.
We
want
to
have
known
it.
We
want
to
know
what
our
impact
is
to
the
county
tax
base
and
whatever
land
tax
regime
is,
is
related
to
the
properties.
We're
looking
at,
obviously
we're
paying
attention
there.
F
T
Crap,
mr
chairman,
I'm
not
sure
how
long
it's
been
in
effect
functionally.
It
looks
at
the
previous
five
years
to
come
up
with
that
average.
I
do
believe
it
would
be
a
rule
change
and
not
a
statute
change,
but
the
statute
does
require
us
to
be
flexible
to
changing
market
conditions,
and
I
don't
know
if
we
can
find
another
measure
that
would
give
us
as
good
of
a
an
indication
of
changing
or
fluctuating
market
conditions,
as
that
does,
but
we
could
look
into
it
so.
F
T
F
T
T
Dated
but
we
know
that
that
for
us
it's
no
longer
21,
it's
closer
to
26
dollars
so
and
then
okay.
F
T
F
F
T
We
are
30
of
the
private
lease
rate.
South
dakota
is
62
percent
of
their
private
lease.
Oh
okay,
so
just
sort
okay,
very
good.
F
And
then
just
mr
chairman,
before
we,
you
know,
mr
chairman,
and
I
were
talking
in
a
sidebar
here,
just
thinking
back,
if
you
have
this
information,
you
know
at
statehood.
How
many
trust
acres
did
we
have
and
we've
got
the
3.4.
F
F
A
T
Mr
chairman,
we've
already
accounted
for
that
and
we
do
that
through
the
aum
assessment.
So
each
and
every
parcel
in
each
and
every
grazing
lease
has
had
a
field
sheet.
What
we
call
a
field
sheet
conducted
on
it
by
field
staff
and
they've
determined
how
much
carrying
capacity
is
there?
What
is
the
quality
of
the
forage
and
has
placed
a
certain
amount
of
aums
on
that
lease?
So
something
in
the
red
desert
obviously
has
much
less
than
something
in
goshen
county.
So
I
think
we've
equalized
the
value
you're.
A
T
Do
have
a
trust,
preservation
and
enhancement
account,
and
we
also
work
with
our
grazing
lassies
to
put
as
much
improvement
to
the
land
on
there
as
possible
to
their
benefit.
We
pay
for
wells
to
be
placed
to
increase
utilization
in
areas
that
aren't
currently
utilized.
We
help
with
some
range
improvements,
specifically
weed
spraying
and
cheat
grass
mitigation,
and
things
like
that
and
allow
the
grazing
lesses
to
do
that
as
well
and
to
be
compensated
should
they
ever
lose
the
lease
for
those
efforts.
Gotcha,
please.
Oh,
we
got.
J
T
Chairman,
that's
a
good
question
right
now
we
have
a
little
over
3.4
million
surface
acres
and
3.9
million
subsurface
acres,
okay.
So
it's
less
than
a
million
that
we've
lost
yeah,
but
not.
A
You
don't
have
the
two,
the
they're,
the
same
lands,
we
might
have
the
surface
estate
and
then
we
might
have
them.
We
would
have
the
mineral
estate
too,
but
we
have
probably
sold
lands
in
the
past
and
retained
the
mineral
estate.
So
that's
why
the
the
the
two
things
started
out
the
same
and
now
they're
not
the
same,
but
we
definitely
have
fewer
plans
than
we
used.
A
J
J
To
ask
that
I
understand
it's
the
same
there,
but
we've
got
3.9.
J
Subsurface
and
3.4,
so
I
understand
that
we've
lost
surface
surface,
but
we've
also
developed
more
on
the
on
the
other.
No
and
that's.
T
T
When
the
borderland
commissioners
issued
a
lot
of
farm
loans
and
had
to
unfortunately
foreclose
on
those
loans
back
in
the
80s,
we
received
everything
that
they
had.
Some
of
that
was
mineral
estate
as
well,
and
as
we
went
through
the
effort
to
dispose
of
those
properties
to
satisfy
the
foreclosure
process,
we
sold
the
minerals
as
well.
The
legislature
didn't
think
that
was
appropriated
and
passed.
A
statute
that
we
could
only
sell
the
surface
estate
in
those
instances.
A
F
Mr
chairman,
mr
coach,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
mr
crowder,
so
the
20
deduction
on
the
lease
for
contributions
I
mean.
Have
we
always
done
that?
I
don't
see
any
other
state.
I
mean
in
this
summary
really
do
that
you'd
think
that'd
be
part
of
the
lease
or
how
it's
going
to
be
maintained.
T
Mr
chairman,
in
in
an
effort
to
comply
with
the
legislative
intent
and
provide
the
borderland
commissioners
with
a
good
formula
that
we
can
use
consistently
across
the
state
it
that
was
what
was
brought
was
20
percent
across
the
state.
It's
not
negotiated,
at
least
by
lease.
It's
it's
expected
to
be
an
average
of
the
lessee's
contributions
to
that
lease
and
and
to
comply
with
the
legislative
intent
there.
T
F
Sure,
mr
chairman,
keep
going
just.
Are
we
still
appropriating
money?
We
started
this
mid-2000s
for
the
improvement
of
trust
lands.
You
know
eight
nine
million
dollars,
I
think
a
biennium.
We
used
to
pay
for
all
of
it
out
of
the
common
school
or
school
foundation
dollars.
Now
I
think
we
split
at
that
84
16.
Are
we
still
making
that
appropriation?
I
can't
remember
that
make
it
through
budget
cuts
in
the
last
round
or.
T
Mr
crowder,
mr
chairman,
you
are
you
have
initially,
I
want
to
think
back
in
2005
funded
that
program
at
750,
000
for
the
biennium
and
through
time
and
all
of
the
budget
cuts
that
the
office
has
suffered.
That
program
has
also
suffered
down
to
340
330
thousand
dollars
for
the
budget.
Okay,
it's
not
my
millions!
No!
No!
But,
mr
chairman,
in
this
most
recent
budget,
you
did
pass
another
750
dollars
for
us
to
move
forward.
T
With
that,
the
one
caveat,
if
you
may
remember,
we
had
a
very
large
dump
in
the
bighorn
basin
that
we
needed
to
clean
up.
We
couldn't
find
a
responsible
party
that
did
cost
millions
of
dollars
and
we
went
back
to
the
legislature
and
saw
very
specific
funding
for
that
specific
dump.
Cleanup
very
good.
Thank
you.
A
So,
let's
talk
just
a
second
about
housekeeping
okay,
everybody
just
about
so
we
have
a
break
scheduled
at
12
30
for
lunch,
but
I
would,
I
would
rather
see
if
we
could
finish
this
presentation
before
we
go
to
lunch,
and
but
I'm
asking
you
I'm
not
I'm
not
trying
to
impose
on
you.
Do
you
think
we
could
maybe
get
done
with
this
part
by
one
o'clock,
and
I
realized
that
the
committee's
questions
are
one
of
the
bus
drivers
here.
What
do
you
think?
Q
Okay,
mr
chairman,
members
of
the
committee,
that
brings
us
into
the
next
sort
of
round
of
documents
that
we
provided
to
you.
First,
we
have
the
teton
county
commercial
development
proposals,
that's
behind
tab,
2a
and
essentially
this
report
is
a
little
dated
it's
from
october
of
2020..
You
may
recall
that
during
the
legislative
session
in
2020
house
bill
162
directed
osli
to
solicit
proposals
for
develop
development
of
certain
identified
parcels
in
teton
county.
We
did
do
that.
Q
We
received
30
responses
to
the
solicitation
and
again
this
was
not
an
rfp.
It
was
more
of
a
hey.
You
know
here.
If
these
lands
were
available
for
development
in
teton
county,
what
sorts
of
ideas
do
you
have
to
develop
them?
And
if
you
look
in
your
packet,
you'll
see
there's
everything
from,
I
think
a
housing
development
with
golf
course
to
glamping
to
conservation.
Q
Q
2B
is
our
teton
working
group
summary.
As
I
mentioned
earlier,
the
board
of
land
commissioners.
We
thought,
in
order
for
them
to
make
informed
decisions
about
potential
development
of
these
parcels.
They
probably
should
should
see
them.
We
should
take
them
out
there
to
see
them,
so
staff
put
together
a
working
group
session
in
teton
county,
along
with
some
stakeholders
who
contributed
to
meals
and
things
like
that.
We
took
them
out
there.
Q
Q
We
did
a
tour,
I
think
two
of
the
parcels,
the
teton
village
or
highway
390
parcel
as
we
call
it
and
then
also
the
kelly
parcel,
which
is
that
parcel
that's
right
next
to
grand
teton
national
park,
so
they
went
out
there
and
were
able
to
kind
of
get
boots
on
the
ground
and
see
what's
out
there.
As
you
can
imagine,
the
kelly
parcel
beautiful
scenic
views.
Q
The
teton
village
parcel
the
highway
390
there's
some
existing
commercial
uses
on
those
parcels,
largely
landscaping
and
stockpiling,
and
things
of
that
nature.
So
they
they
kind
of
got
to
see
a
little
bit
of
everything
jason.
What
else
should
we
bring
up
about
at
least
the
proposal
process
before
we
talk
about
the
rfp.
T
Thank
you
director.
I
think
it
was
a
fantastic
process.
Obviously,
the
borderline
commissioners
hasn't
done
much
work
in
teton
county
and
for
them
to
be
able
to
go
out
on
the
ground
and
walk
it
and
understand
what
the
visual
impacts
are.
The
conservation
measures
that
the
county
holds
dear
and
then
to
have
those
one-on-one
conversations
was
extremely
important,
as
the
director
mentioned
earlier.
T
We
do
need
these
assets
to
perform
at
their
most
optimal
level
and
obviously
right
now
they're
not,
but
you
can't
do
that
in
a
sustainable
way.
Unless
you
know
what
the
parcels
are
and
what
the
community
thinks
of
them-
and
it
was
a
great
effort
to
get
that
understanding
and
move
forward
in
their
decision-making
process.
A
So
I
I
got
to
confess
that
about
20
years
ago
I
was
asked
by
the
board
of
state
land
to
be
on
an
advisory
board
on
section
36
along
the
the
village
road
and
we
entertained
all
sorts
of
development
proposals
for
it
and
we
got
our
heads
hammered
handed
to
us
by
the
mad
people
in
teton
county.
But
that's
my
memory
of
that.
I
can
imagine
what
this
went
like.
Q
Mr
chairman,
so
after
we
went
through
the
proposal
project,
as
instructed
by
the
legislature,
we
spoke
internally
and
also
with
the
board
and
realized
that
okay,
we
should
take
baby
steps
and
try
next
for
the
the
next
phase
of
this,
which
is
to
actually
do
an
rfp
process
for
potential
revenue
generation
opportunities
on
at
least
one
of
those
parcels
and
the
one
we
as
you
just
alluded
to,
that
teton
village
parcel.
Q
We
decided
that
would
be
the
the
safest
one
I
think,
to
kind
of
wade
into
as
there
was
existing
commercial
uses
on
that
property.
So
staff
put
together
an
rfp
process
and
got
the
word
out
on
that.
We
did
receive
quite
a
number
of
a
number
of
folks
interested
in
it
everything
again
from
glamping
to
storage,
to
stockpile
and
additional.
Q
Well,
I
think
that
the
counties
rockpile
for
their
stream
bank
protection
is
there
all
kinds
of
different
proposals,
but
in
any
event,
staff
analyzed
the
proposals
and
came
to
the
board.
I
think
it
was
in
the
last
meeting
in
april
with
some
proposals
for
tups
and
what
tups
you
may
recall
from
the
101.
Those
are
temporary
use
permits.
They're,
not
long-term
development,
they're,
not
long-term
leasing,
and
in
this
effort
this
endeavor
we
were
offering
tups
for
a
term
of
five
years
with
no
promise
of
reissuance.
Q
Q
As
you
can
imagine
a
lot
of
different
ideas
with
respect
to
what
should
happen
on
the
teton
village
parcel
the
board
did
approve
tups,
for
I
think
three
right,
three
proposals
which
were
largely
what's
going
on
with
existing
uses
there,
which
were
the
landscaping
and
stockpiling
there
were
a
couple
of
tup
proposals
that
they
asked
us
to
go
back
and
get
some
additional
comment
on.
One
was
the
glamping
which
is
glamorized
camping
for
those
who
don't
know
what
glamping
is
and
for
the
the
storage
project.
Q
So
we
have
initiated
that
pro
process
the
proposal
we
brought
to
the
board
for
approval
of
the
tups,
if
approved
by
the
board,
the
annual
revenue
generated
off
that
little
teton
village
parcel
would
go
from
twenty
thousand
dollars
a
year
to
almost
600
000
a
year.
So
this
was
a
a
great
endeavor
for
us
to
kind
of
test.
The
market
see
what
the
market
was
going
to
bring.
Q
I
think
there
were
a
lot
of
different
creative
proposals
and,
as
I
mentioned,
when
you
have
change,
sometimes
it
takes
a
little
bit
longer
for
people
to
understand,
what's
going
on
and
to
bring
their
views
to
the
board
and
so
again,
that's
why
we've
extended
the
comment
period
on
the
two
tup
proposals
that
the
board
did
not
vote
on
at
the
last
meeting
jason.
What
am
I
missing?.
T
Thanks
director,
I
I
don't
think
you're
missing
much.
I
would
just
say
that
this
type
of
an
effort
is
not
isolated
to
teton.
County
tecon
county
is
a
great
conversation
piece,
and
it
has
a
lot
of
focus
on
it
right
now,
but
we've
got
several
other
parcels
that
we're
looking
at
and
have
done,
rfps
on
for
development
and
will
continue
to
do
so
moving
forward.
T
It's
not
always
going
to
be
a
stockpile
or
a
place
to
put
down
trees
that
we
see
this
parcel
as
having
more
promise
than
that,
and
so,
when
we
issued
our
rfp,
we
indicated
that
to
them
and
we
got
a
lot
of
responses
that
would
advance
the
use
case
out
there
and,
of
course,
we're
only
going
to
advance
as
fast
as
the
market
in
the
neighborhood
would
allow
us
to
go
so
we're
we
haven't
gotten
a
lot
of
those
on
the
ground
or
we're
not
proposing
those
to
the
board
just
yet,
because
they
need
a
little
bit
more
work
and
a
little
bit
more
truthing.
T
One
of
the
proposals
was
an
affordable
housing
response.
It
needs
more
consideration
before
we
provide
that
to
the
board,
but
it's
obviously
something
this
parcel
could
move
forward
into,
but
we
do
want
to
see
it
move
forward.
The
storage
units,
the
the
glamorized
camping
use
cases
are
definitely
an
advancement
from
just
the
storage
and
stockpiles,
and
I
think
what
we
are
taking.
Those
steps
to
moving
that
parcel
into
more
of
a
sophisticated
use
case.
K
Thank
you,
mr
chairman
deputy
director,
director,
the
so
so
when
mr
willmoth
was
talking
about
arizona
state
lands
and
and
how
they
got
urbanized
when
they
were
sold.
K
I
think
that
makes
me
wonder
if
those
considerations
are
presented
to
the
board
when,
when
those
proposals
are
put
in
front
of
the
board
of
whether
or
not
there
is
an
impact
of
those
that
kind
of
commercial
development
in
creating
additional
demand
for
pupils
for
the
school
district
and
how
does
that
impact
a
local
school
district
if
a
specific
parcel
got
developed,
increased
residential
needs
which
increased
population
infrastructure
needs
like
a
school
district
cost,
and
is
that
balanced
by
the
board
when
they
consider
a
proposal?
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
T
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Thank
you
representative
again.
It's
not.
We
don't
have
that
process
in
the
borderland
commissioners
to
really
understand
the
socioeconomic
impacts
that
development
would
have
on
the
community
like
that
and
it
for
good
reason.
We
don't
have
that
available
to
us
in
something
that
we
can
move
forward
with
existing
statute
limits,
our
ability
to
have
retained
ownership
that
was
talked
about
earlier
through
development,
and
we
we
would
propose
some
legislative
changes.
T
K
Follow-Up
representative
again,
mr
chairman,
so
then
I
do
just
want
to
point
out
that
there,
even
though
the
goal
is
to
maximize
value,
if
it
creates
additional
costs
for
a
school
district,
that's
still
something
that
the
state
has
burdened
with
that
it
has
to
balance
with
the
value
it
may
gain
from
any
specific
development.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
E
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
so
in
in
getting
these
materials,
I
think
in
the
last
day,
or
so
I
I
didn't
realize
the
process
was
this
far
down
the
road.
E
On
a
couple
of
these
items,
I
went
off
page
195,
which
is
the
t-town
county
commissioners,
basically
dated
october
23rd,
2020
and
of
interest
to
me,
was
in
particular
the
the
teton
village
parcel,
and
so,
if,
if
I'm
understanding
it
correctly
right
now,
the
storage
units
we're
talking
about
is
800
storage
unit
development
there
in
teton
village,
which
everybody
deserves
storage
space.
E
A
Storage
units
and
represents
representative
sweden,
if
you
don't
mind
I'll
tag
on
and
did
the
five-year
limitation
have
something
to
do
with
this
as
well,
and
maybe
explain
how
that
might
fit
in.
I
could
see
that
being
very
relevant
for
housing,
maybe
not
quite
as
relevant
for
storage,
but
help
me
out.
T
So
it's
not
the
replacement
value,
it's
not
the
market
value,
but
how
much
more
valuable
is
that
lease
with
the
improvement
there
compared
to
when
it's
not
there
and
oftentimes,
it's
substantially
less
and
so
developers
don't
participate
with
us,
because
that's
the
sunshine
they
see
at
the
end
of
the
the
development
period
and
there's
not
much
there
if
they
could
get
compensated
the
market
value
for
that
improvement,
then
I
think
that
we
would
be
participating
in
some
of
these
development
scenarios,
but
specifically
to
the
proposal
we
received
for
affordable
housing.
T
It
didn't
have
a
lot
of
information
tied
to
it
and-
and
I
I
don't
want
to
speak
to
it
specifically
because
I
don't
remember
all
of
the
pages,
but
the
pages
were
few.
It
didn't
answer
a
lot
of
the
questions
that
we
required
of
the
rfp.
It
just
simply
stated
we'd
like
to
put
an
affordable
housing
complex
on
that
parcel,
but
it
also
didn't
talk
about
the
socio-economic
or
any
other
impacts
that
it
would
have
to
the
community.
T
T
It's
also
important
to
note
that
these
sites
that
we
offered
for
permit
have
existing
commercial
uses
on
them.
These
aren't
brand
new
they're,
not
going
to
be
scraping
the
ground
to
place
these
out
there
and
what's
currently
out,
there
is
landscape
company,
business,
site
and
storage,
and
a
lot
of
that
storage
happens
within
storage
boxes,
similar
to
connex
boxes.
T
That
has
all
occurred
and
we're
going
to
be
providing
the
borderline
commissioners
with
a
very
in-depth
analysis
of
all
of
that
information
at
its
june
meeting.
But
I
say
all
that
to
say
that
bringing
in
up
to
800
storage
units
will
not
be
seen
from
the
highway
and
we're
going
to
provide
information
to
show
that.
And
hopefully
our
our
applicant
does
the
same
thing.
Because
a
lot
of
that
is
already
occurring
and
not
seen
from
by
the
public.
E
E
Okay,
that
that's.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
That's
an
interesting
comment,
however,
that
that's
by
rule,
mr
chairman,
if
I
can
answer
one
more
question,
oh.
E
So,
thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
on
the
kelly
portion
section
rather
than
looking
at
that
at
a
state
sale.
E
Is
it
possible
for
for
the
board
to
look
at
a
major
land
swap
in
instead
of
dollars,
and
I'm
thinking
quite
large,
I'm
thinking
swapping
the
entire
powder
river
basin
sections
in
relationship
to
the
federal
government,
for
that
particular
parcel?
Has
I
I
really
think
we
lost
momentum
when
we
lost
the
oxy
potential
purchase,
but
for
the
state,
but
I
don't
want
an
effort
to
slip
by
thinking
too
small.
T
T
We
didn't
feel
it
appropriate
to
stop
the
temporary
use
permits
if
an
affordable
housing
or
some
other
long-term
leasing
conversation
needed
to
be
had.
Obviously,
those
are
very
in-depth,
long-term
discussions,
so
these
are
temporary
permits,
while
we
can
have
those
discussions
going
forward,
so
it
doesn't
stop
us
from
from
having
those
discussions
we'll
make
that
clear.
T
As
we
move
forward
forward
in
that
process,
we
have
been
successful
in
disposing
all
of
those
parcels
to
the
park
service,
subsurface
and
surface
included,
with
the
exception
of
the
kelly
parcel,
and
at
that
time
the
federal
government
simply
ran
out
of
money
and
we
couldn't
just
transfer
that
to
them
for
the
appraised
value
in
an
effort
to
continue
the
the
spirit
of
the
transaction
and
the
spirit
of
the
thomas
legislation,
we
did
speak
with
the
federal
government
about
a
very
large
land
exchange
for
those
of
you
that
were
around
back.
T
Then
we
called
it
the
penguin
that
was
in
the
powder
river
basin.
It
was
a
114
000,
acres
of
blm
land
that
had
known
oil
and
gas
deposits,
some
known
coal
deposits
things
that
we
would
be
able
to
generate
a
substantial
amount
of
revenue
to
the
tune
of
about
14
million
dollars
per
year,
which
is
significant,
and
that
was
a
at
the
federal
royalty
rate
back
then,
and
at
the
the
existing
production
level.
So
it
was
a
conservative
estimate.
T
Obviously,
the
park
service
doesn't
own
those
lands,
it's
still
within
the
department
of
interior
and
the
secretary
of
interior.
At
the
time
did
offer
up
those
blm
lands
in
exchange
for
the
kelly
parcel,
and
we
made
a
lot
of
effort
and
a
couple
trips
to
washington
dc
to
further
that
exchange
process
going
forward
for
whatever
reason-
and
it's
probably
above
my
pay
grade.
T
But
the
solicitors
at
the
federal
level
determined
that
the
value
of
those
federal
lands
in
the
powder
river
basin
had
to
be
reduced
down
to
the
federal
royalty
rate,
which
is
12
and
a
half
percent.
So
they
took
100
percent
of
the
federal
land
value
and
reduced
it
down
to
12
and
a
half
percent
of
the
federal
land
value,
meaning
that
the
number
of
acreage
needed
to
complete
a
value
for
value
exchange
skyrocketed
and
it
was
something
that
they
just
couldn't
get
their
hands
around.
T
Obviously,
that's
not
an
indication
that
the
legislature
gave
them
the
borderline
commissioners
or
us
it's
the
office
that
they
needed
to
devalue
their
lands.
In
that
way,
we
expected
to
receive
the
full
fee
simple
estate,
but
in
any
event,
that's
what
they
did
and
at
the
time
secretary
jewell
told
the
blm
to
put
their
pencils
down
and
that's
where
the
process
stopped
and
we
haven't
resurrected
it
since
then.
But
it's
it's
a
fantastic
idea
for
that
parcel
that
we're
willing
to
to
move
forward
and
analyze.
Again,
let's
go
to
representative
yen.
K
Senator
mr
chairman,
thank
you
w
director
and
director
that
can
can
we
talk
about
what
is
the
actual
potential
of
the
kelly
parcell?
If
we
kept
it
and
didn't,
sell
it
or
didn't
exchange
it,
so
it
is
I'm
looking
at
our
teach
on
county
map
server,
it's
boarded
on
all
four
sides
by
federal
agencies,
there's
no
infrastructure
except
a
single
road
that
goes
through
it
and
if
I
remember
during
our
tour
of
the
parcel,
there's
actually
an
easement
on
the
road
that
prevents
any
development
from
that.
K
So,
given
that
our
only
potential
right
now
is
grazing
leases,
which
is
what
we
have
now,
I'm
I'm
interested
in
what
you
think
the
the
potential
extractive
value
that
we
can
get
from
that
lease
from
that
parcel
other
than
selling
it
or
exchanging.
It
would
be.
T
A
T
Mr
chairman,
I
I
agree
with
that.
The
caveat
is
that
we
could
gain
access,
so
the
easement
is
is
an
easement
tied
to
the
road,
the
forest
service
road
going
through
there
and
tied
to
that
is
a
scenic
easement,
which
is,
I
forget,
the
exact
foot
on
each
side
500
feet,
maybe
on
either
side
of
the
center
line
that
doesn't
allow
for
any
development,
including
the
construction
of
a
new
road
to
get
past
the
scenic
easement.
The
caveat
to
that
is.
T
The
federal
government
is
required
to
give
access
to
in
holders
if
they
apply
and
they
go
through
the
environmental
process.
So
if
we
truly
wanted
to
develop
that
parcel,
we
could
seek
access
around
that
scenic
easement
through
that
adjoining
private
land,
as
you
mentioned,
but
subject
to
that,
we
are
left
with
the
existing
use
of
grazing
and
view
shed
and
if
we
don't
dispose
of
the
parcel,
then
conservation,
easement
or
release
or
some
type
of
conservation.
K
Mr
chairman,
thank
you
so
just
to
be
clear,
I
mean
the
potential
without
any
other
infrastructure
being
able
to
be
built
toward
to
the
parcel.
The
potential
for
development
is
pretty
low
overall
for
commercial
development.
Is
that
correct.
A
Let's
just
put
in
perspective
it's
kind
of
a
poker
game.
If
we're
going
to
get
maximum
amount
of
money
out
of
the
department
of
interior
for
the
project,
we
have
to
act
like
we're
going
to
try
to
monetize
it.
We
have
to
act
like
we're
going
to
get
the
you
know,
apply
for
the
easements
and
and
act
like
we're
going
to
development,
and
once
we
start
doing
that,
then
the
rest
of
the
world
says:
oh,
we
better
buy
this
property
so
that
it
doesn't
get
developed.
It's
a
big
poker
game.
F
Well,
mr
chairman,
I
think
it's
it's
in
it's
in
the
constitution.
I
mean
we're
supposed
to
maximize
the
revenue
that
land
that
that
section
has
a
job
to
do.
It's,
not
public
land.
It's
not
even
it's
a
trust
land
and
it's
all
this
talk.
If
we're
going
to
sell
that,
I
mean
look
at
the
price
of
real
estate
jackson,
it's
5
million
bucks,
an
acre!
F
It's
not
out
of
the
question
for
that.
That's
like
that's,
like
movie,
set
stuff,
it's
priceless
and
for
us
to
say,
we'll,
take
40
million
for
it
or
we'll
grant
some
easement
for
for
no
way
and
just
never
part
with
it,
and
if
we
have
to,
we
have
to
develop
it,
but
they
have
a
job
to
do
and
I
think
it's
important
for
us
we're
talking
about
raising
people's
taxes.
F
I
think
first
of
all
we
maximize
our
investments,
and
I
heard
one
sender
say
we
ought
to
put
a
casino
on
it.
I'm
not
saying
that,
but
I'm
saying
there's
ways
to
maximize
it
over
the
grazing
and
we
can
exempt
the
state.
We
are
sovereign
from
local
building
codes,
development
codes,
development
of
water,
all
those
things,
and
I
think
at
some
point
we're
going
to
say
hey.
F
F
It's
a
hard
deal,
but
I
we
got
to
play
hardball
on
this
and
and
that's
what
we're
part
of
our
oath
of
office
and
so
appreciate
this
conversation.
But
thank
you
and
I
appreciate
your
work.
What
you're
doing
on
that
39
section-
and
I
hope
I
guess,
could
you
update
us?
There
was
some
partial
movement
right
at
the
last
land
board
went
from
like
5
000
bucks
up
to
a
couple
hundred
thousand
now.
But
there's
postponement
is
what
I
kind
of
understand
from
reading
it.
Or
are
you
talking
about
the
kelly
parties.
F
Q
Mr
chairman,
are
you
speaking
about
the
teton
village
parcel
yeah?
I
believe
there
were
three
tups
that
were
approved
by
the
board,
largely
for
similar
uses
to
what
have
existed
out
there
through
time,
the
landscaping
and
the
stockpiling
in
that
there
were
two
that
the
board
directed
osli
to
go
and
obtain
additional
public
comment
on.
That
was
the
glamping
proposal
for
and
the
storage
unit
proposal.
Q
The
board
had
heard
a
number
of
or
they'd
received,
a
number
of
written
comments
and
indicating
that
people
didn't
feel
like
they'd
had
enough
opportunity
to
comment
on
it.
They
asked
us
to
go,
get
additional
comment
and
they're
planning
to
take
that
up
again,
if
you
will
at
their
june
second
meeting,
but
even
with
the
tups
that
were
approved
hundred
thousand
dollars
jason.
I
can't
remember
directly.
F
Q
F
Well
and
mr
chairman
and
I'll
stop
on
this,
get
off
my
soapbox,
but
really
appreciate
your
work,
I
think
the
transparency
the
way
you've
done
this.
The
way
this
whole
bill
is
rolled
out,
and
I
think
I
just
really
appreciate
the
work
you've
done
on
it
and
we'll
continue
to
support
your
work
going
forward
on
this.
We
just
don't
want
to
sell
it
on
the
cheap
or
we
don't
want
to.
You
know.
F
We've
done,
we've
made
all
those
mistakes
in
the
past
and
you
know
that
little
conservation
easement
we
gave
away
you
know
other
640
parcels
and
we
just
don't.
We
just
can't,
and
so
thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Okay,
let's
try
to
get.
Q
Resurrect
the
track
back
back
to
the
office,
mr
chairman,
that
brings
us
to
our
summary
of
our
land
transaction
program.
I
believe,
there's
information
in
your
packet
that
contains
a
summary
of
four
of
our
current
real
estate
transactions
that
are
under
consideration
by
the
board
of
land.
Commissioners.
Jason.
Do
you
want
to
high
level
those
absolutely.
T
And
so
those
are
a
major
component
of
the
the
analysis
process
that
we
go
through
and
just
to
highlight
for
the
committee,
four
of
them
that
are
that
we're
working
through
and
they're
relatively
large,
but
also
in
this
program
since
2006
we've
create
completed
80
transactions,
which
have
increased
the
annual
revenue
by
three
hundred
and
twenty
thousand
dollars
per
year.
And
this
is
conservative.
These
numbers
again,
we
didn't
have
an
opportunity
to
update
them
before
this
committee
are
about
two
years
old
and
we've
done
several
transactions
since
then.
Q
So,
mr
chairman,
that
brings
us
to
our
final
piece
of
information
that
we
supplied
to
you
under
2d,
and
this
is
a
potential
commercial
development
map.
I
just
disclaimer
up
front,
so
we
don't
have
panic
and
pandemonium
we
are.
We
do
not
have
specific
plans
to
pursue
any
of
these.
We,
these
are
areas
we've
identified
internally,
as
maybe
having
you
know,
hot
areas
with
different
types
of
development
going
on
when
the
market's
ready.
We
will
certainly
pursue
those
deputy
anything
else
on
that.
T
Director,
I
think
you
did
that
well,
the
one
thing
that
I'll
mention
is
that
when
we
compare
ourselves
to
the
states
like
colorado
and
utah,
the
map
does
a
great
job
to
show
that
we
don't
have
the
land
ownership
pattern
that
they
do.
We
don't
have
the
populations
that
they
do.
We
don't
have
lands
within
the
city
of
denver
or
even
in
arizona
the
city
of
phoenix,
so
the
commercial
opportunities
aren't
available
to
us
that
those
other
states
may
have
available
to
them.
T
K
Representative
yen
yeah,
I'm
gonna
have
one.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman
deputy
director.
How
far
is
this
so
I
mean
they're,
they're
kind
of
all
over
the
map.
How
far
do
these
parcels
tend
to
be
from
town,
for
example,
the
lander
parcel?
How
far
is
it
from
lander
landers.
K
A
So
representative,
ian
and
everybody-
and
I
need
to
know
part
of
the
area,
possibly
is
what
we
call
institutional
land,
but
not
all
of
it
is
so
you
know
you
all
know
where
the
life
resource
center
is.
It
originally
was
a
a
land-based
farm
supported
people
that
lived
there,
and
now
the
farming
operation
is
largely
done
by
inmates
from
the
honor
farm
and
they
raise
cattle.
A
They
raise
hay,
they
have
good
water
rights,
but
it's
literally
part
of
it
is
right
in
town
now
there
is
a
small
industrial
park
that
the
city
has
a
99
year.
Lease
on
that
is
right.
There.
It
was
more
of
a
commercial
development
part
the
city's
very
interested
in
expanding
and
getting
an
ownership
to
that
commercial
park,
as
well
as
allowing
for
development
of
residential
neighborhoods
in
the
in
the
formerly
the
current
institutional
land,
and
so
I
mean
that
is
a
right
proposal.
Now
people
would
move
on
that
now.
A
If
they
could,
it
would
solve
a
lot
of
problems
for
this
community,
but
so,
when
you
talk
about
this
taking
a
long
time
to
come
out,
there
are
pieces
of
it.
That
could
happen
soon.
If,
if
there
was
the
will
in
the
way,
I
don't
know
about
that,
you
know
a
lot
of
the
institutional
lands
they're
next
to
communities
that
formed
around
the
institution.
So
the
land
is
right.
There
is
kind
of
a
barrier,
I
think
evanston's
kind
of
the
same
way.
H
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
just
briefly
there
was
an
attempt
recently
by
the
state
to
acquire
some
land
along
the
I-80
corridor
in
the
energy.
Could
you
just
give
us
a
brief
update
as
to
what
happened
with
that
land?
Thank
you.
T
Cynical
back
to
you,
mr
crowder,
mr
chairman,
the
state
was
unsuccessful
in
its
bid
to
acquire
that
property.
A
And
I
think
there
was
a
slight
bit
more
than
that
and
correct
me
if
I'm
on
is
that
the
seller
didn't
feel
that
we
were
really
a
responsible
buyer
in
the
end
in
terms
of
the
publicness
of
the
information,
and
we
we
weren't
as
solid
at
the
table
as
others
and
we
sort
of
were
pushed
out.
Should
that
be
fair.
A
Didn't
have
a
public
process
or
we
didn't
have
a
private
process
to
pursue
it.
So
we
our
own
process,
that
we
created
in
conflict
and
and
criticism
about
it
kind
of
discouraged,
the
seller
from
really
wanting
to
go
all
the
way
with
us
and
frankly,
it
was
of
opposition
by
environmental
groups
mostly,
and
the
fact
that
you
know
outrage
actually
that
we
would
even
think
about
doing
that
and
it
did
discourage
the
seller
from
continuing
it's
too
bad
would
have
been
a
great
piece
of
wyoming
history
go
ahead.
Yes,.
E
I'm
sweetie,
I
I
think
my
personal
opinion
also
was
that
the
legislature
way
I
mean
in
if
you're
going
going
to
bid
on
something
of
that
magnitude.
E
A
E
Oh
representative
sweeney,
thank
you
just
one
last
comment
and-
and
I
appreciate
this
map
I
blew
it
up,
but
in
my
conversation
about
the
kelly
portion
again
just
to
add
on,
I
really
am
and
I
don't
care
what
the
appraisal
comes
back
at.
I
agree
with
chairman
harshman
that
you
can't
value
that
particle
and
my
understanding
is
that
we're
in
the
midst
of
some
sort
of
an
appraisal
on
the
parcel,
but
I
I
would
urge
the
message
back
to
the
to
the
board.
E
K
Representative
yin,
mr
chairman,
thank
you
so
just
just
to
be
clear,
you
know
I
I
do
think
that
that
it
makes
sense
to
get
the
maximum
value
of
the
kelly
parcel
and
unless
we
are
ready
to
build
power,
plant
water
infrastructure,
sewer
infrastructure
on
that
land.
K
Q
A
I
think
you
did
a
great
job
and
your
prepared
materials
and
your
dialogue
were
fabulous.
So,
let's
see
if
we
have
any
more
committee
questions
at
this
point,
let's
open
up
the
public
comments
so
that
we
can
tidy
up
this
topic.
So
do
we
have
any
public
comment
emily
do
we
have
any
online,
not
online?
A
A
A
Other
people
can
probably
do
better
on
the
publicness
of
it,
but
we've
got
to
find
a
way
to
make
that
fit
and
make
some
more
money
off
these
lands.
We
really
do
so,
barring
any
further
comment.
I'd
suggest
we
take.
Let's
come
back
at
2
15.
R
Mr
chairman,
believe
me,
I
welcome
I'm
gonna
get
between
all
of
you
and
lunch.
Mr
chairman,
I
I
I
have
to
apologize.
I
didn't
introduce
myself
last
time,
I'm
ken
to
carry
I'm
the
government
relations
director,
director
of
government
relations
for
the
wyoming
school
boards
association,
and
I
just
have
a
few
comments
and
I'll
be
brief.
Mr
chairman,
all
these
other
uses,
I
think
if
you
change
the
conversation-
and
you
say
this
is
a
trust
obligation
and
if
we
were
talking
private
trust
versus
what
we're
talking
about
here.
R
R
Is
there
a
value
for
that
and
I
know
there's
been
proposals
in
the
legislature
in
the
past
to
charge
a
fee
for
recreating
on
on
school
trust,
lands
and
again,
mr
chairman,
these
are
not
public
lands,
they're,
not
state
lands,
they
are
school,
trust
lands
and
that's
the
only
ones
I'm
talking
about
not
the
institutional
lands.
Mr
chairman,
but
I've
sat
in
many
state
land
board
meetings
and
every
time
I
hear
people
say
we
don't
want
you
to
do
anything
with
it,
but
we're
we're
not
willing
to
pay
any
value
for
doing
this.
R
Here's
what
we
want,
but
we
don't
want
to
pay
for
it,
and
I,
I
guess
that's
you
know
to
be
expected
in
in
a
lot
of
these,
mr
chairman,
but
if
you
were
a
private
trustee
and
this
was
your
charge
and
you
didn't
try
to
maximize
the
revenue
on
these
lands,
I
think
you
would
be
in
default
of
your
trust,
obligations
and
and
a
lot
of
these
lands,
mr
chairman,
are
becoming
ownership
by
default,
because
you
know
well,
we've
always
done
this.
We've
always
been
able
to
use
it.
R
We've
always
had
access,
you
know,
and
so
those
that
becomes
problematic
and
mr
chairman
is
even
like
the
t-sun
parcels.
You
know
it's
like
well,
some
use
is
on
there,
but
if
you're
going
to
pile
rock
on
there,
I
guess
that's,
okay,
that
that
doesn't,
you
know,
have
you
know
problems
with
the
view,
but
you
know
if
we
want
to
do
something
else
with
it,
then
that
becomes
problematic,
and
so,
mr
chairman,
I
think
there
is
a
danger
in
a
lot
of
these
pieces
of
property
that
people
have
already
assumed.
R
This
is
what
we're
going
to
do
with
it,
and
this
is
what
we
want
to
do
with
it,
but
by
and
large
we
don't
want
to
pay
for
it.
You
know
we.
We
want
you
just
to
do
that.
It's
it's
our
land,
but,
mr
chairman,
it's
not
and
again,
I
think
you
have
to
go
back
to
the
concept
if
it
was
a
public,
a
private
trust
and
you
were
trying
to
generate
the
revenue
for
it
and
you
were
a
trustee.
L
R
All
those
other
conversations,
mr
chairman,
were
not
part
of
the
the
the
grant
of
state
lands
on
statehood.
I
know
the
state
office
of
state
lands
by
the
way
they
do
an
amazing
job
and
they
have
other
rules
when
they
evaluate.
But,
mr
chairman,
there
was
one
use
and
one
one
purpose,
and
one
purpose
only
for
these
school
trust
lands
and
that
was
to
fund
k-12
education
and
that
gets
often
lost
in
this
conversation,
because
everyone
thinks
they
have.
R
You
know
a
right
to
do
what
they
want
on
these
lands
and,
in
some
cases,
they've
been
around
a
long
time.
People
have
done
that
over
all
this
time,
and
so
again
it's
sort
of
ownership
by
default.
But,
mr
chairman,
I
would
encourage
you
to
continue
down
this
road
and
to
keep
that
the
mind
open
about
how
do
we?
How
can
we
generate
revenue
to
fund
k-12
education,
because
that
was
the
purpose
of
these
lands?
And
with
that,
mr
chairman,
happy
to
answer
any
questions.