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From YouTube: Urban Forestry Commission
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A
One
all
right
well
welcome
everybody
to
the
october
meeting
of
the
urban
forestry
commission
city
of
asheville,
like
to
welcome
everybody
here
today
we
will
start
with
some
introductions,
so
my
name
is
amy
smith,
I'm
the
chair
of
the
urban
forestry
commission
and
I'll
just
call
on
some
people.
As
I
see
you
on
my
screen,
starting
with
the
commission
members,
so
ed.
E
F
I
forgot
steve
hendricks
urban
forestry
commission.
A
H
I'm
nancy
watt
hurts
dsd,
stormwater
supervisor
and
staff
liaison
to
early
voice
recognition.
M
Good
afternoon
chris
collins,
division
manager
with
development
services
for
the
city
of
asheville.
D
Hey
good
afternoon
ben
woody
development.
A
Thank
you,
ricky.
A
All
right,
thanks
kim,
if
you
want
to
introduce
yourself.
P
Thank
you,
everyone
for
being
at
this
meeting
today.
My
name
is
kim
rony
and
I
serve
on
the
city
of
asheville
city
council
and
I'm
your
liaison.
A
A
For
being
here,
all
right
did
I
miss
anybody
speak
up.
I
think
I
got
everybody
all
right
thanks
again,
everyone
for
being
here
today
we
will
start
with
calling
the
meeting
to
order
and
approval
of
the
minutes.
Hopefully
everybody
saw
the
action
minutes
in
the
agenda
documents.
So
it's
a
nice
table
layout.
So
I
see
an
emotion,
a
second
to
approve
the
minutes.
D
A
A
You
so
we
will
do
a
roll
call
vote,
starting
with
patrick.
D
A
F
A
B
A
L
Sure
well,
nancy's
pulling
that
up.
They're,
fine
nancy,
so
50
collier
is
a
level
2
project
that
is
in
the
development
review
process.
Right
now
it
has
been
to
trc
and
hasn't
gone
further.
Its
next
stop
will
be
a
development
review
committee.
In
a
couple
of
weeks.
L
You
can
go
forward
and
answer
you
if
you
want,
and
there
isn't
there
any
have
a
small
correction
here
right.
Basically,
the
landscape
standard
is
for
six
large
trees
on
both
millard
and
collier
and
on
both
of
those
streets.
There
are
msd
lines,
I
believe,
and
I
think
there's
even
a
water
line
on
collier
as
well.
So
there's
conflicts.
Those
lines
are
right
in
the
sidewalk
which
creates
a
conflict
next,
so
here's
the
site,
it's
where
the
wake
sculpture
is.
L
I
guess
I
just
read
that
it's
currently
being
it's
in
the
process
of
being
removed
from
the
site
keep
going,
and
you
can
see
actually
here
the
sorry
that
the
power
lines
there
on
collier
kind
of
in
the
last
couple
weeks,
we
became
aware
of
that.
The
power
line
is
being
relocated,
so
now
they
can
actually
put
large
trees
instead
of
small
trees.
Here,
so
that's,
why
there's
some
inconsistency
in
the
presentation?
T
L
Here's
the
site
plan-
and
I
highlighted
the
water
and
msd
lines
for
you
all,
and
this
is
their
proposed
site
plan
where
you
can
see
the
tree
planting
scheme,
so
they've
worked
with
both
asheville
water
and
msd
to
approve
the
planting
of
these
street
trees
so
that
that
was
really
great
news,
because
I
was
worried
that
we
were
going
to
end
up
with
planters
instead
of
street
trees.
So
next
so
really
the
the
main
issue
here
and
these
are
silva
cells.
L
The
main
issue
is
just
the
spacing
of
these
three
trees
on
the
southern
end
of
collier
and
they're,
very
close
to
15
feet,
and
I
was
kind
of
hoping
to
not
have
to
come
to
you
all.
But
I
guess
we.
We
don't
have
that
ability
to
just
kind
of
wave
that
so
you
can
see
on
the
on
the
first
two
trees,
there's
a
spacing
of
14
feet
and
11
inches
and
the
second
two
trees
is
14
feet,
six
inches.
L
So
that's
really
the
only
thing
we're
here
for
next
and
they're,
placing
the
trees
to
frame
the
windows
and
there's
also
entrances
and
exits.
So
I
feel
like
they're
placed
appropriately
and
staff
basically
is
supporting
this
request.
I
guess
the
last
slide
is
just
for
your
discussion
and
that
summer.
That's
the
end
of
my
presentation.
A
All
right,
thank
you,
did
anyone
else
want
to
speak
about
the
project
before
we
ask
questions.
Q
B
Q
Overlap
but
it's
the
oh
look
at
that
if
the
250
is
required
or
500
is
required
per
tree.
I
would
have
to
look
back
at
that,
but
I
know
so.
Q
The
big
rectangles
you
see
are
the
required
acquired
minimum
soil
volumes
and
then
we've
had
to
go
long
and
linear
with
them,
because
we
talked
with
water
and
sewer
about
what
what
sort
of
encroachment
they
would
allow
for
us
to
get
into
those
easements
which
normally
it's
zero,
but
because
it's
existing
lines
under
the
sidewalk
and
actually
the
the
project
is
going
to
incur
the
cost
of
moving
the
water
line
out
into
collierville.
So
water
is
no
longer
an
issue
for
us,
it's
just
the
sewer.
Q
They
will
be
yeah
and
you
can
sort
of
see
the
overlaps
I
can
screen
share
if
you
want
to
zoom
in
on
these.
Q
B
That's
that's,
okay!
I
I
could
see
it
pretty
well.
So
so
I
have
one
last
question:
the
species
is
a
columnar
carpinus
species.
Q
We've
got
columnar
carpinus
and
then
we've
got
slender
silhouette
sweetgum,
because
these
I
mean
essentially
the
back
of
the
grate,
will
be
against
the
face
of
the
building
right.
So
we
sort
of
you
know
we're
out
of
the
like
red
maple
and
trying
to
find
things
that
one
are
gonna
stay
more
columnar
and
two
that
can
handle.
Q
You
know
corrective
pruning
to
be
up
against
that
face
of
that
building.
O
C
C
To
visualize,
looking
at
the
photograph
of
that's
provided
before
the
site
maps,
I'm
trying
to
visualize
where
on
this
photograph,
these
cells
would
go
in,
and
I
I
think
what
you're
proposing
and
just
tell
me
if
I
got
this
right,
you
would
be.
This
would
be
inside
the
existing
sidewalk
and
and
up
against
the
building
right.
These
aren't
going
to
be
planted
in
the
sidewalk.
Are
they
that's
correct,
because.
Q
The
it's
sort
of
on
it's
not
common
to
have
the
sewer
being
under
the
sidewalk.
You
know
normally
it's
out
in
the
road
and
so
on
this
one.
It
literally
goes
almost
down
the
middle
of
the
sidewalk,
so
the
okay
inside,
I
think
the
closest
we
are
to
the
sidewalk-
is
like
12
foot
less
than
here
in
the
center
12
foot
4
inches.
Maybe
so
we'll
still
have
the
full
10
foot
sidewall
clear.
I
guess,
if
that's,
if
that's
sort
of
where
you
were
going,
we
won't
be.
C
Creating
trees
in
that
zone,
okay,
are
so
there's
going
to
be
a
sidewalk
on
either
side
of
the
on
both
collier
and
millard.
Yes,
sir
okay
and
then
so
you
basically
you've
narrowed
your
building
to
make
space
for
the
trees.
It's
what
it
sounds
like
or
you're,
using
your
setbacks
to
get
the
trees
in
there
correct.
C
Right,
okay,
all
right,
and
then
just
so
I
understand
what
what
ed
was
asking
you
about.
The
the
green
area,
that's
shown
on
the
slide.
Seven,
the
entire
green
grid
is
that
all
soil
is
that
what
you
were
saying.
Q
That
is
all
the
silva
cells,
so
that'll
be
the
below
ground
structural
soil
system.
Right,
okay,
you
know.
Normally
you
would
have
them
like
a
square,
the
10
by
10
and
again
we
just
they
won't.
Let
us
bring
that
structural
element
out
into
that
easement.
We
had
to
negotiate
to
get
the
four
foot
that
we
did
get
yeah,
but
kevin
you
know,
was
gracious
to
work
with
us
on
coming
up
with
a
solution,
because
otherwise
we
were
going
to
be
in
containers
for
this.
Okay.
F
Yeah,
I
I
have
a
question
for
maybe
from
mark
and
others
sweetgums
tend
to
do
pretty
well
as
street
trees
in
city.
E
F
O
A
Are
there
any
other
questions?
The
only
technical
aspect
that
we're
actually
voting
on
is
the
spacing
of
these
three
trees
here,
which
is
only
slightly
off
of
the
standard
because
of
the
use
of
silver
cells.
They
were
able
to
meet
all
other
standards.
So,
if
we're
ready,
we
can
have
a
motion
to
approve.
C
D
A
D
A
I
A
A
I
I
A
A
Yeah,
that's
good.
We
still
have
a
quorum
perrin
all.
S
A
And
I've
don
did
you
make
it
in
yeah.
V
I
A
A
You,
okay,
so
we
are
moving
along
to
424
sunset
drive
and
this
is
sort
of
a
non-typical
alternative.
Compliance
for
the
ufc.
We're
gonna
get
some
background
information
from
members
of
the
commission
who
have
been
working
with
the
homeowners.
This
is
a
private
residence
with
steep
slope
and
some
grading
issues,
and
so
this
request
is
to
bring
the
site
into
some
sort
of
compliance
past
the
grading
issues.
So
I
believe
sharon
did
you
want
to
start
with
some
information
on
this.
G
Sure
nancy
want
to.
G
I
guess
pull
up
the
I
I
don't
know
the
design
are
the.
I
guess
this
is
what
the
only
thing
we
have
is
the
written
we
had
some
water
soil
wash
out.
That
was
happened
due
to
some
grading
issues
on
the
property.
There
were
unbeknownst
to
the
owners
at
the
time
that
happened
to
be
done
by
the
contractor,
and
I
was
notified
by
several
neighbors
actually
that
there
was
an
issue
up
there.
G
I
contacted
zoning
so
astronaut
to
trespass
on
the
property
to
see
what
was
going
on.
I
made
a
site
visit
and
looked
like
that.
There
had
been
from
the
road
a
more
clearing
that
was
allowed
on
the
that
was
allowed
for
them
on
the
previous
alternate
board
of
adjustments,
and
then
zoning
enforcement
went
up
and
measured
and
found
that,
yes,
indeed,
there
was
a
a
fair
amount
over
the
allotted
from
the
alternative
compliance,
I
mean
the
board
of
adjustments
request,
so
it
triggered
a
alternative
compliance.
G
Remediation
ricky,
hurley
and
zoning
reached
out
to
me
because
I've
been
dealing
with
the
neighbors
on
this
issue
and
said
that
ed
and
I
would
be
happy
to
go
out
and
take
a
look
and
walk
the
property
with
the
applicants
and
homeowners
agreement.
G
And
we
did
a
site
visit
and
did
a
written
report
with
what
we
thought
would
help
the
remediation
of
the
soil
wash
out
and
the
tree
removal
that
had
happened
in
less.
G
Trees
that
had
died
subsequent
required
of
the
planning
of
their
steep
slope,
a
that
was
a
roundabout
way
to
say
something
that
had
been
at
least
a
couple
years
in
the
in
the
works.
G
So
we
made
a
recommendation
and
by
the
looks
of
things
it
looks
like
the
hummels
are
in
agreement
with
it
and
we
submitted
it,
and
here
we
are
so
that's
the
short
version
of
it.
If
anybody's
got
any
question,
ed
has
probably
got
some
more
input
on
this
as
well.
G
A
All
right
I'll
give
the
hummels
opportunity
to
speak.
W
Yeah,
I
want
to
want
to
thank
you
all
for
the
time
and
again
for
helping
us
to
make
this
correct
and
make
sure
we're
getting
in
compliance,
and
we
appreciate
sharon
and
ed
coming
out
making
some
great
recommendations.
As
you
know,
new
homeowners
in
asheville
we're
learning.
You
know
it's
different
vegetation,
different
areas,
so
the
species
types
are
helpful.
We've
been
doing
a
lot
of
research
and,
as
you
can
see
by
our
site
plan,
we
made
all
the
changes
they
recommended
and
a
lot
had
been
completed
already.
W
They
did
send
us
a
very
nice
write
up,
I
think,
with
about
11
different
recommendations,
so
they
came
in
on
may
20th
and
did
the
visit
and
then,
on
august
5th
we
finally
got
the
suggested
plan.
At
that
time
we
went
into
action.
We
had
the
large
dead,
poplar
removed
from
behind
our
porch.
The
gentleman
was
a
tree
service
expert.
W
W
Those
have
been
replaced
at
this
point
so
far
with
ten
elderberry
shrubs
and
we
used
all
the
recommendations,
of
course,
six
dog
hobbles
and
then
several
allspice.
We
did
not
do
the
columbia
species,
yet
we
did
not
do
the
white
oak
tree
placement
yet
they've
been
ordered
and
are
on
order.
I
did
add
several
tons
of
rock
actually
four
tons
of
rock
by
hand
to
bolster
both
of
the
stabilizing
backs.
If
anybody
ever
wants
to
come
and
check
the
backyard
out
with
me,
we
can
slide
down
the
back
hill.
W
It
is
a
it
is
a
steep
monster,
but
I
did
get
those
stones
down
there
and
some
up
there
and
so
we've
gone
the
stabilize
stabilizing
efforts
there.
In
the
meantime,
we've
kept
the
erosion
mat.
I've
done
some
over
seeding
just
to
kind
of
generally
help
that
area,
while
we're
waiting
for
the
remainder
of
the
trees
and
the
columbia
species
to
come
in
for
planting
and
again
I
know
it.
We
had
this
initial
disagreement
with
what
how
the
measuring
was
completed.
W
Now
that
all
didn't
didn't
go
as
we
had
thought,
it
would
and
that's
why
we
wanted
to
quickly
make
make
amends
for
this
and
again
we
do
appreciate
y'all
coming
out
and
helping
us
with
some
great
suggestions
to
help
stabilize
the
property.
W
The
last
thing
we
did
as
of
last
week
was
we
did
a
whole
nother
round
of
stabilizing
mulch
on
the
front
sides
of
the
house
around
the
new
elderberry
plantings
and
the
new
fur
trees
that
were
planted
and
around
the
new
dog
hobble
as
well.
We've
had
no
washouts
note
on
the
property
and
I
walked
it
fully
fully
the
other
day,
and
I
actually
got
to
see
some
of
our
bear
friends
while
I
was
out
there
and
they
seemed
to
have
a
thumbs
up
for
us
as
well.
W
The
work
done
so
far
and
we're
looking
forward
to
getting
those
trees
in
over
the
next
two
to
three
weeks
and
then
those
bushes,
hopefully
in
before,
excuse
me
before
halloween,
is
our
goal
for
getting
the
remainder
of
the
communist
species
in.
G
Thank
thank
you.
I've
got
a
couple
questions.
Thank
you
for
doing
that
so
quickly.
I
haven't
been
up
there
to
take
a
look.
Did
you
deal
with
the
furs
that
are
too
close
to
the
road
in
the
front.
W
Yeah,
we
have
not
that's
one
reason.
I
want
to
talk
with
you
all
today
they
are
doing
they
are.
They
are
a
little
close
to
the
road
they're
doing
very
well.
They
are
on
huge
root
balls.
I
did
try
to
kind
of
you
know,
they're
on
the
edge
where
that
slope
gets
very
steep
and
I
kind
of
was
like.
W
Oh,
I
can
just
knock
these
back
a
couple
feet
and
really
with
how
steep
it
is
from
how
we
decide
to
do
the
front
landscape
because,
again
in
front
of
the
house,
you
have
that
giant.
You
know
24
foot
in
foot
and
a
half
thick
retention
wall.
That's
holding
that
portion
back.
W
I
was
scared
to
try
and
move
or
adjust
those
trees
at
all,
because
they
are
huge
and
inevitably
they
were
going
to
tumble
down
the
hill
and
hit
our
house
they're
doing
very
well
there,
and
I
just
didn't-
have
it
in
me
to
cut
them
down
at
this
point,
because
they're,
beautiful
and
doing
well,
and
that
that
is
one
that
I
honestly
have
to
throw
my
hands
up.
I
don't
know
what
the
best
way.
R
S
R
Not
these
gigantic
obstructions,
especially
in
the
street.
We
would
love
to
keep
them
that
size,
but
I.
B
S
B
Yeah
yeah
no
problem.
My
question
is:
can
you
live
with
the
fir
trees
being
as
close
to
the
road
as
they
are
given
the
fact
that
the
homeowners
said
that
they
plan
to
manage
their
size.
W
So
again
I
am
going
to
keep
those
grooms
and,
if
you've
been
by
the
property,
I
I
I'm
very
meticulous
about
maintaining
our
yard,
our
house
in
in
in
wake
forest
where
we
reside
the
other
part
of
the
time
we
we've
been
in
the
the
towns
of
kind
of
garden
club
tour
for
a
bunch
of
years,
because
I
I'm
a
meticulous
homeowner
and
it
means
a
lot
that
the
house
looks
nice
and
that
we're
doing
everything
correctly.
W
So
I
would
love
to
keep
those
trees
and
I
will
keep
those
maintained
and
if
they
have
to
go,
then
you
know
I
will
shed
a
tear,
but
they
will
make
indoor
christmas
trees
for
a
lot
of
people.
O
Right,
we
do
definitely
need
two
usable
lanes
in
the
road
there,
so
that
would
be
the
city's
expectation.
Yes,
sir,
I.
G
G
W
I
mean,
if
you
see
where
they're
at
now
sean
they
look
very
nice
and
I
was
going
to
kind
of
keep
them
miniaturized,
and
in
that
form
I
mean
I
feel
like
very
capable
doing.
I
I
can.
I
can
access
them
very
easily
in
my
state
of
current
good
health,
and
if
something
happens
to
me,
I
can
hire
a
landscaper
and
they're
very
nice-sized
trees.
They
present
very
well
from
the
road
and
I
can
absolutely
keep
them
off
the
road.
W
If
that's
the
what
the
town
would
like,
I
can
absolutely
do
that
and
again
they
look
very
nice
and
they're
gonna
and
they're
doing
very
well
they've
been
planted
over
a
year.
Now
I
put
those
in
in
september,
9th
of
2020
of
2020,
and
so
we
got
a
year
track
record
on
those
replaced
trees
and
they
look
just
so
super
good
and
I
will
keep
them
trimmed.
If
you
give
me
the
opportunity.
A
G
B
Was
for
as
a
western
species
so
and
and
they
can
be
sheared
and
the
thing
is
if
they
start
getting
tall,
which
is
not
as
much
a
problem,
you
can
start
raising
the
lower
branches
right
and
so
in
time.
If
the
trees
are
managed
correctly,
we
can,
you
know,
maintain
the
trees
and
still
have
clearance
with
the
road.
B
It's
just
incumbent
upon
the
homeowner
to
maintain
the
trees
so
that
we
have
that
clearance
and
I'm
inclined
to
you
know
it
sounds
like
the
city.
Is
you
know,
sort
of
in
the
same
boat?
You
they're
just
concerned
about
clearance.
B
I
I
think
we're
really
more
about
trying
to
keep
vegetation
on
steep
slope
areas
rather
than
removing
them.
So
you
know
we
could
always
recircle.
If
there's
a
problem
with
the
trees
on
the
road
like
we
would
with
anybody
else.
G
O
I
don't
picture
them,
I
don't
picture
them
being
contained.
Ultimately
they're
going
to
have
to
be
able
to
mature.
O
You
know
there
are
too
many
places
around
town
where
white,
pines
or
hemlocks
or
whatever
were
used
as
a
hedge
many
moons
ago
and
at
some
point
somebody
lost
interest
in
that,
and
the
tree
became
what
it
is
you
know,
and
so
I
don't
I
don't
see
it
being
something
you
can
keep
pruned
indefinitely.
Nothing
else,
eventually,
there's
going
to
be
another
owner
of
the
property
and
their
maintenance
habits
might
be
different
than
yours.
B
Right
they'll
get
tall
and
you
know
you'll
you'll
be
pruning.
The
lower
limbs
and
they'll
look
like
trees
after
a
while
there's
nothing.
You
can
do
about
that
mark's
right,
but
there's
a
point
where
the
limbs
will
be
elevated
high
enough
to
allow
clearance
from
trucks
cars,
those
lanes.
So
that's
just
going
to
take
some
mindful
maintenance
for
several
years.
R
We're
prepared
to
do
that.
I
would
like
to
bring
something
to
the
city's
attention,
or
maybe
the
commission's
attention.
R
X
X
I
think,
your
prior
architect,
your
contractor
about
the
variance
request
in
december,
and
we
started
in
earnest
on
the
variants
and
worked
in
through
midwinter
to
get
to
the
eventually
got
to
the
board
of
adjustment
in
march
and
obviously,
at
that
meeting,
we
we
had
the
decision
that
the
variance
request
to
enlarge
it
or
make
a
little
bit
larger
area
of
disturbance
allowed
was
denied
and
at
that
meeting,
instead
of,
as
we
talked,
we
instead
of
y'all,
going
immediately
to
an
alternative
compliance.
Yeah.
X
I
spoke
to
a
couple
members
and
ms
sumrall
and
mr
macy
were
agreeable
to
work
with
y'all
to
visit
the
site,
and
so
we've
just
allowed
some
time
for
the
commission
members
to
coordinate
with
y'all
and
to
visit
the
site
and-
and
so
obviously
it
took
a
little
bit
of
time
to
get
that
coordinated
to
get
a
plan
drawn.
X
W
X
Sure
we
worked
very
quickly
yeah.
It
wasn't
the
fact
that
you
didn't
execute
the
plan.
It
was
that
we
needed
to
get
you
all
to
this
meeting
here
so
that
we
could
get
this
because
you
know
obviously
mrs
sumrall
and
mr
macy
were
working
as
kind
of
representative
of
the
group,
but
the
to
basically
help
kind
of
bring
closure
to
the
violation
and
get
a
plan
quote
approved
to
basically
be
an
approved
remediation.
X
It
was
because
there
had
not
been
any
action
towards
applying
for
this
meeting,
and
so
obviously
I
wasn't
involved
with
that.
So
any
additional
removal
was
just
appears
to
you
know
we
got
a
report.
We
actually
had
some
neighbors
seeing
additional
removal
and
concern
and
they
reached
back
out
to
our.
Y
O
I
X
And
so
once
you
have
made
the
application
for
this
meeting,
we've
kind
of
you
know
stopped
the
fines
accruing
at
that
point.
So
hopefully
we'll
have
resolution
today
and
then
we'll
get
you
all
started
and
once
we
get
kind
of
all
the
work
completed,
we
can
talk
about
the
accrued
citation.
So
once
we
get
that
kind
of
buttoned
up,
we
can
come
back
later
to
me.
Okay,.
A
And
if
I
could
clarify
something,
the
enforcement
side
is
separate
from
what
we
do
at
the
ufc,
and
this
sort
of
work
is
very
uncommon
for
us.
You
know,
as
far
as
making
the
plan
approving
plans
things
like
that,
the
original
plan
with
ed
and
sharon
going
out
was
just
volunteer
work.
It
wasn't
actually
anything
formal
as
far
as
being
through
any
sort
of
compliance.
So
that's
why
those
things
overlapped
because
they
weren't
they
were
separate.
A
A
And
so
then,
this
point
here
and
we
can
continue
discussion
and
questions
if
there
are
any,
is
to
then
have
a
plan
in
place
so
that
your
enforcement
side
can
be
wrapped
up
again
separate
from
the
commission
or.
C
Well,
I
yeah.
If
we're
moving
to
approval,
I
think
we
do
actually
need
some
discussion
of
the
terms
that
were.
C
On
that
last
slide,
amy,
you
had
started
to
to
suggest
that
we
look
at
this
variance.
We're
here
to
approve
a
variance.
Is
that
correct.
A
C
Well,
you
know,
as
someone
who
knows
less
about
this
because
I
haven't
visited
the
site,
I
could
start
asking
questions
blindly,
but
I
know
that
ed
and
sharon
have
so
much
experience
with
this
plan
that
it
probably
will
go
faster.
If
you
all
want
to
summarize
your
thoughts
about
where
the
plan
is
right
now
and
if,
if
it's
acceptable
to
you,.
B
Yeah,
I
I
think
that
we're
making
very
good
progress.
I
think
the
plan
obviously
addresses
the
issue
and
the
homeowners
are
making
good
progress
towards
fulfilling
what
we
outlined
in
the
plan.
So
I'm
inclined
to
encourage
approval
with
the
condition
that
those
furs
be
maintained,
as
stated,
and
it's
just
time
to
move
on
with
this.
G
And
also
we've
had
an
additional
report
of
a
tree
being
removed.
I
got
a
call
from
an
another
neighbor
that
there
was
a
a
arborist
out
or
not
an
arborist,
a
guy
in
a
chainsaw.
S
W
G
You're
in
a
zone
where
any
trees
that
need
to
be
removed
need
to
have
a
permit
at
the
on
the
steep
slope
requirement.
G
Now
I
understand,
because
I
live
in
a
steep
slope
highest
also
and
it's
a
pain
in
the
neck
for
me
to
have
to
get
an
arborist
out
to
pull
a
permit
to
take
a
dead
tree
down,
but
they've
got
to
with
the
condition
authorize
that
this
tree
is
dead.
G
I
completely
believe
you,
but
with
the
amount
of
soil
wasp
washout
and
for
it's
been
a
two
year
process
and
most
of
the
neighbors
don't
know
what's
going
on
and
then
when
they
went
out
to
talk
to
this
gentleman
whomever
he
was-
and
I
believe
you
when
you
say
was
an
arbus
arborist.
He
just
turned
around
so
that
I'm
cutting
down
a
tree
and
he
didn't
have
any
name
on
his
truck
he's.
And
I
I'm
I'm
agreeing
with
you.
G
I'm
just
saying
that
if
you're
going
to
remove
any
trees
on
this
property
because
they're
dead
and
you
need
to
bring
an
arborist
out,
then
I'm
suggesting
you
follow
the
letter
of
of
what
you
need
to
do
to
do.
G
This
so
that
everybody's
comfortable,
with
what's
going
on
out
there
and
that's
just
to
protect
all
of
us
getting
phone
calls
and
us
responding
back
to
you
and
then
letting
the
neighbors
going
on
and
me
having
to
contact
zoning
to
find
out
if
it
was
an
appropriate
removal
and
I'm
just
suggesting-
and
I
I
believe
you
that
he
was
a
licensed
arborist.
But
there
is
regulations
on
steep
slope
on
removing
trees.
W
H
G
Yeah
and
now
that
I
know
you're
implementing
the
plan,
because
I
did
not
know
that
then,
if
I
get
a
phone
call,
I
can
say
the
plan
is
being
implemented
and
go
out
and
check
and
make
sure
that's
the
case.
But
I
had
no.
I
hadn't
been
following
that
you
were
implementing
it
so,
and
I
appreciate
you
following
through
on
this
and
thank
you.
Yeah.
W
J
W
Had
to
do-
and
I
said
it's
funny
because
we
talked
with
architect-
he
said
they're
going
to
penalize
by
playing
some
trees
like
I
don't
see
that
as
a
penalty,
I'm
we're
happy
to
plant
trees
and
I
I
like
trees
as
much
as
as
much
as
y'all,
maybe
like
trees
or
not,
maybe
not
that
much.
But
if
you
saw
my
house
at
home
we
have
a
beautiful
landscape
yard
and
we're
gonna
have
the
same
plan
for
moving
forward
here
at.
C
Question
for
the
hurleys
so
looking
at.
I
think
that
maybe
you
drew
this
map
and
I'm
having
a
hard
time
telling
the
difference
between
the
erosion,
air
symbol
and
the
seated
grass
symbol.
So
I
think
your
erosion
areas
are
these
two
yeah,
these
two
hatched
sort
of.
W
They
look
actually
the
rock
guards,
I'm
sorry
yeah.
No,
those
are
the
rock
gardens.
This
is
a
rock
garden,
that's
a
rock
garden.
It
was
seated
here
and
I
actually
had
it
reseeded.
I
actually
reseated
it
myself
two
weeks
ago,
because
you
know
that
ryan
died
off
clearly
just
to
help
stabilize
it
again,
while
the
kami
was
put
in
these
are
those
erosion
baffles
that
are
still
held
in
by
the
rebar,
which
I've
almost
pierced.
W
Yeah,
the
entire
area
behind
the
house,
really
the
entire
distance
of
the
house
down
to
the
first
natural
tree
line
where
you
know
the
clearing
stop
for
for
the
actual
building
of
the
house.
All
the
way
down
the
utility
channel
was
initially
seated.
I
did
not
reseed
down
the
utility
challenge,
it's
doing
pretty
good.
I
did
do
up
kind
of
high
by
the
house
where
it's
a
little
thinner
and
dead,
we'll
see
how
that's
going
to
play.
It's
been
real
dry
lately.
W
C
W
Yeah,
so
those
are
the
erosion,
boulder
gardens,
boulder
third
one
yep,
so
there's
area
here
and
then
the
air
across,
and
I
added
a
little
third
one
actually
right
here
with
some
of
the
extra
stone
that
I
had
and
then
those
are
those
kind
of
those
kind
of
rolled
hay
baffles.
I
call
them
erosion
baffles
that
are
in
with
the
rebar
stakes.
C
S
W
Put
in
a
few
more
rocks
in
the
front,
and
then
we
had
everything
re-re-mulch.
That
was
the
third
time
we've
actually
had
the
property
mulch.
We
went
with
very
big
mulch
first,
like
prime
cut
mulch
to
hold
bigger
pieces
almost
like
little
logs,
and
they
went
with
finer
another
time
they
put
on
kind
of
a
finish
mulch
to
try
to
get
all
the
layer
in
and
kind
of,
take
some
hold
there,
and
that
was
just
completed
two
days
ago
to
the
back
corners
of
the
house.
W
W
That
was
graded
once
by
the
by
the
former
property
owners
and
then
again
when
we
had
first
purchased
the
property,
and
so
that's
where
those
giant
there's
three
24-inch
grates
with
18-inch
perforated
pipe
that
actually
run
all
the
way
down
to
macon
that
are
managing
the
water.
That's
on
that
level,
okay,.
W
A
U
Hey
thanks
I'm
here
good
afternoon,
my
name
is
jake
quinn
and
I
live
at
428.
Sunset
drive
immediately
next
door
to
the
subject
property
and
I
thank
you
all
for
this
opportunity
to
offer
my
testimony.
U
A
good
development
occurs
when
property
owners
respect
local
ordinances
when
they
undertake
to
develop
their
property.
Good
development
occurs
when
general
contractors
are
knowledgeable
about
development
rules
and
constraints
and
abide
by
them.
Good
development
occurs
when
the
city
takes
seriously
the
laws
that
have
been
passed
governing
development.
U
Steve
williams
was
the
general
contractor
on
this
project.
He
regularly
ignored
city
ordinances
during
the
two
plus
years.
This
project
occurred
so
when
additional
unauthorized
land
clearing
began
after
the
exterior
of
that
new
house
was
finished
about
a
year
ago.
I
have
to
admit
I
was
not
all
that
surprised
over
the
course
of
this
project.
U
U
Now
I
had
pretty
much
figured
that
these
violations
were
driven
by
the
general
contractor,
but
recent
events
have
suggested
that
the
non-resident
property
owners
might
share
some
culpability
shortly
after
9
00
a.m.
On
august
sunday
august
15th
less
than
two
months
ago,
and
many
months
after
this
controversy
started,
two
men
went
on
to
the
property
of
424
sunset
drive
and
cut
down
and
removed
healthy
trees,
including
at
least
one
oak
9
a.m.
W
U
A
All
right,
thank
you,
caller
I'll
take
a
moment
there.
We
appreciate
the
comments
and,
as
far
as
trees
and
enforcement,
this
commission
is
aware
that
there
are
issues
you
know
throughout
the
city,
with
enforcing
landscape
plans
and
development.
We're
working
our
part
to
address
that.
I
know
that
these
homeowners
you'll
have
to
be
neighbors
with
your
neighbors.
So
it
sounds
to
me
personally,
like
you
are
trying
to
improve
your
property
from
this
point
forward.
You
know
I
can't
speak
to
the
past
infractions
if
you
want
to
take
any
time.
C
It
does
seem
like
these
street
side.
Trees
are
a
problem
in
the
making,
so
I
just
you
know
I
I
ultimately
defer
to
ed
and
sharon
about
that,
but
it
seems
like
we're
gonna
end
up
with
a
really
different
situation
in
a
handful
of
years
from
now
than
we
have
today,
and
it's
going
to
it's
going
to
run
away
from
property
owners.
So
at
one
point
or
another,.
S
E
C
The
meristem
grows
from
the
the
top
of
the
tree
and
and
that's
unavoidable,
so.
E
A
Understood
I
see
a
hands
up,
it
seems
to
me
with
the
street
tree
question
with
the
furs.
We
have
two
questions
or
problems.
You
know,
do
you
leave
it
now,
because
they're
holding
up
the
soil
and
address
it
in
the
future?
A
If
it
becomes
a
problem
or
do
we
ask
them
to
take
that
out
now
when
we're
still
trying
to
remediate
the
site
when
these
trees
are
there
trying
to
hold
the
land
in,
it
seems
to
me
like
it
might
be
a
better
current
situation
to
leave
those
trees
for
the
moment,
but
obviously
open
for
further
debate.
So
I
saw
cecil
and
ed
cecil.
You
want
to
go
ahead.
K
Yeah
sorry,
I've
been
in
and
out
of
this
meeting,
I've
been
having
a
computer
problem
here,
but
regarding
jake
quinn's
objections
that
he
he
raised,
I've
got
to
say
there.
There
is
no
more
demanding
argument
for
having
a
an
urban
forester
than
the
entire
lack
of
enforcement.
K
That
we've
had,
I
mean
you
know
y'all
have
known
that
in
my
neighborhood
here
across
my
street
and
up
the
hill,
an
absolute
violation
of
of
the
steep
slope
and
and
all
that,
and
what-
and
I
argued
that
through
the
tree
commission
here
in
the
urban
forestry
commission
and
and
what
it
ended
up
was
the
city
finally
went
and
spoke
to
my
neighbor.
K
That
was
the
enforcement.
They
said,
oh
you
didn't
do
it
right.
There
was
no
fine.
There
were
no
ten
thousand
dollar
fines
for
people
there.
There
is
nothing
going
on
with
jake's
neighbor
right
now
about
this.
That
is,
is
enforcing,
there's
no
enforcement
and
to
me
that
the
lack
of
enforcement
is
why
we
absolutely
need
a
an
urban
forester
who
will
take
over
that
function?
K
I
I
mean
I'm,
I
I've
been
I've,
been
on
this
commission
eight
years
on
council
and
now
two
and
a
half
years,
or
something
as
actually
a
member
here,
and
it
is
it's
like
stupid.
It's
like
totally
stupid.
We
we
have
all
these
great
ideas
and
nothing
happens,
nothing
happens
so
anyway.
That's
where
I
am.
A
Thank
you,
cecil
ed.
B
Yeah
regarding
those
fur
trees,
you
know
it's
a
bit
of
a
dilemma
because
we're
trying
to
encourage
education
vegetation
to
stabilize
at
the
same
time
we're
removing
vegetation
because
it
it
might
potentially
conflict
with
something
in
the
future,
and
you
know
from
an
old
forester's
perspective.
It's
it's
always
a
good
idea.
If
something's
established
to
leave
it
until
other
things
get
established,
and
then
you
can
make
a
decision
whether
or
not
to
remove
it
down
the
road
and
those
trees.
Aren't
very
big
and
they'll
be
easily
removed.
B
Three
years
from
now,
there's
a
lot
of
other
instances
in
this
town
that
I
can
point
my
finger
to
where
there's
conflict
between
vegetation
and
roads
and
signage,
my
old,
my
own
neighborhood
included.
You
can't
you
can't
see
the
stop
signs
because
of
the
the
trees
that
are
growing
growing
on
the
on
the
street
side.
So
I'm
inclined
to
say:
let's
let
things
get
established,
we
have
new
plant
material
coming
in.
If
these
trees
become
a
problem,
we
can
address
them
two
or
three
years
down
the
road.
A
All
right,
thank
you
ed.
I
saw
the
hummels
had
their
hand
up
next.
R
I
just
wanted
to
say
that
I
am
obviously
with
ed's
position
and
that
these
trees
have
established
roots
in
them
and
they
are
really
stabilizing
one
potential
area
of
erosion,
and
so
I
would
just
welcome
the
members
to
come
and
take
a
look
at
what
we're
talking
about
before.
They
would
offer
up
a
vote
to
get
rid
of
these
trees
that
were
trying
to
establish
and
try
to
with
the
hopes
of
stabilizing
the
property.
R
That
is
our
whole
focus
of
executing
on
the
plan
that
was
delivered,
and
my
my
also
is
my
hope
that
mr
quinn
is
our
neighbor
and
that
he
could
have
a
friendly
conversation
with
us.
Moving
forward
to.
A
Thank
you
mark.
O
Well,
I
thought
ed
did
a
fantastic
job
of
pointing
out
how
there
are
already
so
many
situations
around
the
city
where
trees
are
overgrown
and
they're
beyond
what
our
existing
resources
can
manage
to
me.
That
doesn't
seem
like
an
argument
for
keeping
the
trees.
It
seems
like
an
argument
for
going
ahead
and
cutting
them,
while
they're
small,
but
whatever
I
have
one
tree
crew
for
the
entire
city.
O
A
G
All
right,
the
trees
have
been
in
a
year
and
there
were
b
and
b,
balled
and
burlapped,
and
so
for
me,
that's
not
established.
They'll
have
some
feeder
roots,
but
not
a
lot,
and
I
think
the
problem
is
is
that
you
can
get
a
small
skid
steer
out
there
and
you
can
move
them
back
now
and
then
possibly
use
some
lawn
mat
to
hold
down
those
areas
and
just
move
them
back
further
on
the
property.
You
could
probably
even
not
knowing
how
big
the
bnb
was.
G
You
can
probably
even
scoot
them
on
either
side
and
not
damage
the
trees
and
a
little
bit
of
excavation
you're
going
to
do
with
the
skid
steer
can
be
dealt
with
with
matting,
and
I
would
like
to
see
those
moved
because
I'm
agreeing
with
mark
that
they're
going
to
be
a
potential
problem,
and
I
don't
see
I
see
one
tree.
I
remember
one
tree
in
the
area.
That's
on
a
slope
and
the
other
ones
are
sitting
right
up
in
front
of
the
house
which
is
flat
so,
and
I
really
don't
other
than
a
cost
burden.
C
Please
so
so
I'm
sensitive
to
the
concerns
about
erosion
and-
and
I
appreciate
all
the
planting-
that's
been
done
here
to
to
deal
with
erosion-
I'm
also
you
know.
I
also
appreciate
your
aesthetic
concerns,
I'm
speaking
to
the
hummels
now
about
you
know
the
the
type
of
vegetation
you'd
like
to
have
in
front
of
your
property,
so
in
terms
of
accounting
for
the
erosion
control,
benefits
of
that
of
those
trees
and
accounting
for
these
potential
conflicts
with
the
roadway.
S
C
Be
moved
or
cut,
or
whatever
the
case
may
be
in
order
to
in
order
to
make
sure
that
that
soil
is
being
held
in
place
that
that
that
was
my
idea.
C
It's
a
way
to
go
without
bare
ground
at
any
time
at
any
point
in
time,
and
it's
also
a
way
that
we
could
make
this
decision
now
and
finalize
the
plan
and
not
have
to
revisit
that
particular
issue
in
three
or
four
years.
So
that's
that's
my
idea.
That's
my
suggestion
for
dealing
with
that.
I
I
hear
what
you're
saying
sharon
that
there's
a
way
to
do
it
without
creating
a
major
erosion
event
to
actually
move
the
trees
now
so
that
they
do
have
adequate
clearance.
G
Problem
with
that
parent
is
that
it's
a
small
area
widthwise.
So
if
you
get
any
equipment
in
there
to
move
it,
you're
going
to
destroy.
J
G
You've
done
on
top
of
it,
so
it's
not
very
wide
at
all.
So
if,
if
they
have
to
come
out
and
that's
how
we
vote,
we
can't
have
planting
around
it
because
we'll
just
destroy
all
the
planting
trying
to
get
those
out
at
because
it
is
not
very
wide.
It
could.
C
G
Well,
they
could
be
well,
they
could
be
chainsawed
out,
but
you're
still
going
to
have
damage,
because
it's
very
narrow,
you're
still
going
to
have
damage
to
anything.
You're
planting
around
some
of
it'll
come
back
and
yeah.
It
depends
on
how
dense
you
plant
it,
but
it's
very
narrow,
so
you're
going
to
have
whatever
you
plant
in
there
you're
going
to
have
damage.
W
Okay,
you
know
a
pair
of
apparently
share.
My
my
one
concern
is
that
steep
slope
is:
is
the
front
right
behind
those
trees?
Is
so
steep,
there's
no
way
to
plant
those
trees
in
the
ground
unless
they're
angled
back
and
poking
our
house,
there
is
no
purchase
to
remove
those
trees
back
on
that
hill
at
all,
because
there
is
no
soil
there
because
of
the
intense
steepness
of
that
slope,
which
is
why
I
went
to
the
boulders
and
that
three-layer
mulch
to
kind
of
hold
things
back
right.
W
It
and
and
again
it
may
be
worth
coming
out
to
see
this
like.
I
could
just
tell
you.
I
tried
to
put
the
trees
back
as
far
as
they
could
before.
They
could
no
longer
be
supported
by
the
earth
behind
it
because
it
drops
off
sharon
very,
very
steeply,
from
three
of
those
four
trees,
and
I
I
I
I
love
the
idea
of
moving
them
back.
W
I
just
know
how
kind
of
gravity
and
physics
works
and
there's
no
way
that
those
trees
can
move
back
just
because
I'm
tending
them
every
weekend
and
I'm
ordering
them
and
I'm
mulching
around,
and
there
is
no
earth
for
them
to
go
back.
They
would
literally
be
buried.
You
know,
they'd
have
to
be
buried
up
to
their
tips,
to
have
any
soil
purchased
there
because
of
the
steepness
of
the
slope,
which
is
what
my
main
concern
is.
G
Yeah,
my
misnomer
is
back
it's
to
the
other
side
of
the
property,
that's
flatter
in
other
areas
that
can't
where
they
can
go
so
the
mine
this
my
misplace
is
moving
back.
I'm.
G
Mean
yeah?
No,
you
don't
have
the
room
to
do
that.
They'd
have
to
go
down
in
the
back
somewhere,
but
I'm
torn
either
way.
I'm
torn
with
ed
and
I'm
torn
with
the
physical
restraints,
and
I
know
where
it's
gonna
go.
It's
gonna
be
a
burden
on
the
city.
I
can.
I
can
see
it
in
the
future,
but
I'm
torn
with
ed
as
a
person
who
doesn't
like
to
remove
trees
to
keep
things
there.
So
I
am
at
this
point
in
time.
I
don't
know.
W
And
they're
400
pound
root
balls.
They
took
three
of
us
to
literally
slide
them
into
position.
There's
a
lot
of
stabilizing
earth
around
that
tree.
I
mean,
if
you
want
me
to
sign
a
prenup
that
I'll
cut
them
down
in
three
years.
I
just
hate
the
idea
of
losing
all
of
that
mass
there's
a
lot
of
mass
holding
a
lot
up
there,
and
that
was
part
of
our
initial
plan
before
the
city
was
involved.
W
When
I
went
through
this
with
multiple
landscape
architects,
my
partner
was
get
some
trees
with
gigantic
root
balls
there
and
put
them
in,
and
you
know,
hold
as
much
of
that
road
up
as
you
can,
and
so
I
do
see.
There's
these
two
sides,
and
I
mean
I
I
I
totally
understand
why
this
is
a
dilemma
I
just
having
having
walked
the
property
and
I've
lived
there
for
a
year.
W
Now,
I'm
I'm
personally
very
concerned
if
those
trees
come
out
that
that
road's
going
to
crumble
right
behind
it,
because
you
saw
what
happened
down
the
road.
B
I
I
think,
there's
a
greater
risk
from
removing
those
trees
than
there
is
leaving
him
at
this
point.
That's
just
my
opinion.
After
seeing
it.
G
Yeah-
and
I
also
can
see
that
we
can
plant
on
top
of
it
and
stabilize
the
top
and
not
have
that
you've
also
got
berms
and
curbing
up
there,
but
yeah.
I
mean
I'm
more
leaning
towards
ed's
philosophy
than
the
the
landscaper
in
me
and
the
future.
Seeing
so
I
am
leaning
more
towards
ed.
A
K
Well,
I
I
would
hope
so,
but
what
I'm?
What
I'm
hearing
here
is
arguments
against
what
the
whole
point
of
our
work
is.
So
we're
we're
hearing
that
oh
well,
this
would
not
work.
This
would
not
work.
This
would
well.
K
Of
course
it
would
not
work
because,
because
of
the
reasons
why
we
have
the
steep
slope
ordinance
and-
and
so
I
mean
so-
we
we've
have
a
an
applicant
battling
against
physical
reality,
and
I'm
anyway
I
I
it
just
it
appalls
me
that
people
keep
going
oh
yeah,
but
if
we
just
did
oh,
but
you
know
this
a
little
bit
too
sleek
too
steep
anyway,
I
keep
getting
blown
away
by
this
stuff,
especially
when
my
neighbor,
you
know,
bulldozed
his
property
and
then
it
all
ran
down
on
mine.
R
Okay
shelley,
I
just
want
to
remind
everyone
that
we
again
have
taken
the
plan
which
was
again
done
by
ed
and
sharon
on
their
own
volunteer
time,
and
we
appreciate
it
because
it
helps
us.
You
know
neither
one
of
us.
I
mean
joe's
kind
of
a
landscaper
because
he's
out
there
way
more
than
me,
but
we
are
implementing
it
to
the
full
extent,
and
I
just
I
I
want
that
point
to
be.
No,
I
don't
with
all
of
the
details
and
all
of
the
back
and
forth
that's
happening.
W
Yeah
and
then,
and
and
and
if
mr
bothwell
or
mr
dijon
like
to
come
out
and
walk
the
property
and
and
see
what
what
we're
up
up
to,
I
would
be
more
than
happy
to
to
walk
them
and
show
them
what
we're
doing
to
try
to
make
it
better.
I
mean
we,
we
would
be
the
worst
impacted
if
our
steep
slope
went
down
right.
I
mean,
let's
be
honest
about
this.
W
If
our
house
goes
sliding
down
the
hill,
I
think
we
would
suffer
more
than
most
others
and
it's
very
important
that
we
get
along
with
the
town.
We
are
now
officially
tax
paying
citizens,
and
you
guys
gave
us
a
good
tax
bill
on
the
house
and
we're
happily
paying
that,
and
we
want
the
town
to
be
nice.
We
want
to
add
to
it,
and
you
know
we're
doing
what
the
ufc
is
asking
us
to
do
and
we're
doing
it.
Happily,
there's
no
begrudging
what
you're
all
trying
to
do.
W
It
was
never
our
intent
to
get
to
this
place
this
spot.
In
the
first
place,
it
was
a
calculation
issue.
It
seems
like
from
the
engineer
and
the
measures-
and
that
has
nothing
to
do
with
me,
but
we
want
to
make
everything
right
do
our
best
and
again
we
appreciate
sharon
edwaying
in
on
this
because
I
think
their
their
approach
is
is
is
is
doable
and
it's
cost
effective
and
I
think
it's
going
to
stabilize
a
property
for
years
to
come
and
also
look
real
nice
and
that's
all
we
can
say.
B
Yeah
and
there
there
are
two
two
separate
issues
here:
one
is
whether
or
not
we
approve
the
plan
or
not,
and
and
I'm
inclined
to
make
a
motion
that
we
do.
The
second
is
the
issue
related
to
the
fir
trees
and-
and
I
think,
that's
a
decision
we
can
defer
for
a
while
and
until
we
see
what
happens
out
there.
B
So
I'd
like
to
make
a
motion
that
we
approve
the
plan
as
prepared
by
sharon
and
I
and
that
we
defer
our
decision
on
the
for
per
trees
until
until
a
later
date
to
see
how
well
they're
maintained
and
whether
or
not
they
become
a
problem.
A
O
I
do
per
chapter
20:
are
the
trees
along
the
road
within
the
street
right
of
way,
and
if
so,
are
they
not
within
the
jurisdiction
of
the
public
works
department?.
H
O
O
Should
look
that
up
for
you
if
you
like,
if
you
want
me
to
take
the
time
either
way
to
me,
you
have
two
separate
issues:
the
site
plan,
which
is
the
private
property,
and
you
have
the
trees
perched
on
the
edge
of
the
road
potentially
in
the
right
of
way.
Those
are
two
separate
situations
governed
by
two
separate
city
agencies.
A
S
A
All
right,
then
we
will
vote
patrick.
D
A
D
Y
V
A
And
I
vote
I
so
the
motion
passes
and
I
want
to
thank
you
very
much
to
the
hummels
and
to
the
city
staff
and
edin
sharon.
Everyone
who
worked
on
this
project
we'll
keep
an
eye
on
it
and
as
a
commission,
we
are
available
for
questions
in
the
future
and
I
will
continue
to
work
with
mark
as
well
on
the
those
street
tree
potential
issues
so
appreciate.
W
W
A
All
right,
thank
you,
everybody.
We
know-
and
this
actually
brings
up
somewhat
of
a
separate
point,
but
we
know
that
these
issues
on
steep
slope.
They
do
come
up
and
so
one
piece
of
potential
ordinance
revisions.
We
probably
want
to
continue
to
take
a
look
at
how
these
are
handled
both
from
the
ufc
and
from
the
city
and
enforcement
side.
A
A
Nope,
okay,
so
then
staff
reports
mark
we
got
your
report.
If
you
want
to
highlight
anything
there.
A
All
right
mark
notes
that
he
went
to
the
north
carolina
urban
forest
council's
great
north
carolina
treat
conference.
I
was
also
in
attendance.
It
was
really
really
great
a
lot
of
information,
bits
and
pieces
that
I
think
will
tie
in
to
the
work
we're
doing
here.
It
was
really
fantastic
and
obviously
he
is
short
staffed,
as
he
pointed
out
already.
So
if
anyone
knows
any
potential
arborist
needing
jobs,
yeah
good.
C
If
I
may
ask
a
question
mark
you
last
month
you
gave
us
a
really
helpful
update
about
how
many
trees
were
lost
and
how
many
trees
were
planted
in
the
city.
I
don't
know
if
you
keep
a
running
tally
of
that.
If
that's
more
storm
related
when
you
run
around
and
tell
you
how
many
trees
fell
in
the
city,
but
that's
if
you
have
those
numbers
handy
I'd,
love
to
hear
them
for
the
last
month.
O
O
O
C
So
so
am
I
correct
in
understanding
that
when
you
gave
us
that
update
last
time
about
how
many
trees
had
fallen,
that
was
a
tally
you
did
because
of
the
storm
and
that
you.
O
C
C
A
All
right,
thank
you.
Next
dsd
provided
a
report
in
a
very
nice
table.
Thanks
nancy
on
the
tree
protection
ordinance.
We
can
see
canopy
planted
and
preserved
based
on
number
of
projects
and
where
fee
and
low
money
has
been
collected.
So
are
there
any
questions
for
nancy
on
that
data?
You
can
see
in
the
agenda
there.
A
B
Y
Y
Our
goal
is
to
bring
something
to
pnz
in
december,
so
the
council
can
take
a
look
in
january.
There
are
lots
of
changes.
We're
proposing.
I
think
some
of
the
biggest
ones
that
have
the
potential
for
most
impact
for
the
benefit
of
the
city
include
one
moving
to
requirements
for
minimum
uncompacted
soil
volume
requirements
for
trees.
Y
That
is
something
that
few
cities
have
and
I
think
the
cities
that
have
them
don't
do
a
very
good
job.
They
may
have
it
on
the
books,
but
they
actually
don't
have
a
process
to
ensure
that
it's
done
well.
So
a
second
part
of
the
benefits
that
we
are
going
to
roll
out
include
third
party
inspection,
which
will
not
guarantee
we
can't
guarantee
anything,
but
it
will
help
to
ensure
that
these
trees
and
projects
are
planted
according
to
our
specs
and
the
process.
Y
Will
require
that
a
project
hires
a
licensed,
arborist
or
registered
landscape
architect
that
would
be
part
of
the
project
and
would
have
at
least
three
inspections
pre-construction
in
the
middle
when
you
are
preparing
the
plantings
and
planting
them
and
then
a
final
inspection
and
we've
never
had
that
before.
That's
why
you
can
have
the
best
designs
and
they're
planted,
and
you
wonder
why
things
don't
grow
well.
Y
Well,
it's
because
we
get
a
fly-by-night
landscape
contractor
who
digs
a
two-two
foot
hole
in
the
ground,
puts
the
tree
in
and
it
doesn't
die
at
least
for
five
years,
and
but
it
doesn't
really
grow
so
that
I'd
say
the
two
biggest
things
in
in
these
changes
will
be
third-party
inspection,
minimum
soil
volume,
minimum
uncompacted
soil
volume
standards
and
then
we're
going
through
every
bit
of
the
landscape
code
and
trying
to
see
what
doesn't
quite
work.
B
Right,
that's
good
thanks
a
couple,
a
couple
other
things:
we
we
had
a
discussion
last
week
about
involving
alternative
compliance
discussions
with
some
adaptive
uses
to
sites
where
soil
volumes
may
not
be
met
because
of
existing
site
constraints.
So
we
some
of
the
changes
of
code
in
in
the
seriousness,
with
respect
to
soil
volume
that
the
group
is
taking
we'll
bring
in
the
urban
forestry
commission
in
an
alternative
compliance.
B
If,
if
these
standards
can't
be
met,
one
thing
we
haven't
talked
about
vadilla-
and
I
think
we
should
add
to
our
discussion-
is-
is
standards
and
specs
related
to
the
quality
of
plant
material,
which
is
also
a
problem
that
I'm
seeing
with
newly
planted
trees
on
our
streets
and-
and
that
should
be
a
pretty
easy
issue
to
to
raise,
because
there
are
antsy
standards
for
plant
material
selection
that
we
can
incorporate
into
into
this
code.
Y
Yeah
we
can
do
that
and-
and
one
other
thing
I
just
want
to
highlight-
because
it's
another
agenda
item
of
yours-
is
that
this
is
coming
out
of
the
open
space
task
force,
which
you
guys
have
been
a
big
part
of,
and
I
just
want
you
to
remember
to
remind
you,
as
you
look
at
open
space,
and
you
know,
might
revise
your
recommendation
for
how
we're
moving
forward
in
that,
because
this
is
going
to
have
probably
more
overarching
impacts
to
the
city
than
I
think
that
will.
B
Right,
well
specifically,
the
discussion
was
regarding
the
the
waiver
of
open
space
requirements
for
central
business
district
and,
and
our
position
was
well,
if
we're
not
going
to
require
open
space
in
the
central
business
district,
let's
at
least
make
sure
our
trees
grow
when
we
plant
them
and
to
do
that,
we
have
to
look
at
our
standards
and
specs
and
inspections,
and
things
like
that.
Y
That's
right
and,
and
so
this
started
as
basically
an
a
central
business,
district,
central
business,
zoning
district
review
and
then
with
the
task
force,
requests
we
expanded
it
and
it
became
a
city-wide
review.
So
a
pretty
powerful
tangent
move
from
the
open
space
task
force
that
will
have
big
impacts.
A
K
Yeah
yeah
yeah,
the
thing
I
keep
returning
to
is
enforcement.
You
know
we.
We
come
up
with
all
these
rules,
all
these
ideas
that
this
should
happen,
and
that
should
happen
and
and
there's
no
there's
no
reliable
enforcement
of
these.
These
rules.
B
You're
right
and
that's
that's
the
point
that
we
raised
earlier
on
and
and
the
city
came
back
with
this
suggestion
for
a
third
party
inspection
requirement
and
and
vadilla
started,
putting
together
the
documents
that
would
be
used
for
the
third
party
inspection
and
just
just
last
week
we
moved
away
from
using
landscape
contractors.
B
You
know
from
being
eligible
to
do
those
inspections,
because
that's
like
the
fox
guarding
the
hen
house
to
using
registered
landscape
architecture,
certified
arborists,
so
they're
independent
third
parties-
and
you
know,
I'm
kind
of
optimistic.
You
know
given,
given
that
the
city
doesn't
have
their
own
resources
to
do
this.
I
think
it's
a
good
solution
and
we'll
just
see
how
it
goes
if
it
doesn't
work,
we'll
look
for
something
else.
Y
Yeah,
I'm
just
typing
in
a
couple
of
things
here,
so
you
can
take
a
look
of
just
what
we're
doing
you
know
just
fyi.
This
isn't
required,
but
these
are.
These
are
some
of
the
ideas
of
the
certificates
that
will
be
required
as
part
of
the
process
and
you're
right
cecil.
The
biggest
lesson
from
all
of
this
is
that
we
need
to
have
a
way
to
ensure
that
what
is
on
the
books
happens
on
the
ground
and
that's
the
point
of
third
party
inspection.
Y
At
least
today
we
don't
have
inspection
guarantee
tomorrow
we
will
and
aside
from
the
requirement
of
the
inspection,
if
somebody
doesn't
do
it,
we
can
charge
them
a
hundred
dollars
a
day
for
failure
to
comply
and
we'll
see
how
it
goes
like
ed
said,.
B
D
Yes,
at
one
time
when
this
task
force
first
started
discussing
the
idea
of
a
third
party
inspection,
I
know
that
sharon
ray
some
concerns
about
third-party
inspections
and
I
would
just
like
to
ask
her
if
she's
now
comfortable,
with
what's
being
proposed
in
that
area.
G
Yes,
I
am,
but
it's
kind
of
like
our
tree
protection,
our
tree
canopy
protection.
We
know
what's
falling
through
the
cracks
by
working
with
it
and
but
I
think
fidella's
worked
out
and
the
task
force.
We
have
worked
out
a
way
that
it
seems
a
little
more
foolproof
than
it
did
in
the
beginning.
A
J
O
O
No
problem,
I
just
wanted
to
mention,
as
somebody
who
has
gone
through
the
budget
process
annually,
trying
to
get
additional
staff.
That
is
an
extremely
challenging
occupation
in
the
city
trying
to
get
the
staff
you
need
to
do
what
you
want
to
do.
It
is
way
easier
to
meet
at
commission
meetings
and
talk
about
the
things
that
you
want
to
have
or
the
things
you
demand
to
have
it's.
O
O
Obviously
it
would
have
to
be
somebody
else,
not
city
staff.
If
you
can't
even
get
city
staff
to
maintain
the
basic
things,
you
know
the
simple
things
in
life,
the
the
maslow's
lowest
level
hierarchy
stuff,
not
even
the
higher
things.
Okay,
and
I
also
feel
a
great
deal
of
compassion
for
the
urban
forester.
O
If
that
position
is
ever
funded,
they're
going
to
have
to
be
able
to
leap,
tall
buildings
in
a
single
bound
and
see
through
walls
and
from
all
the
the
things
that
your
all
the
hopes
and
and
wishes,
you're
keeping
upon
that
position,
I
don't
envy
them.
A
The
urban
forest
master
plan-
I
was
gonna,
see
if
greenworks
I
know,
had
been
working
on
some
funding
for
some
initial
stages
and
I
was
looking
for
an
update
on
if
anything
else
is
going
on
with
that.
V
Well,
we
were
looking
for
funding
and
we
have
been
awarded
funding
both
through
our
contract
with
the
city
of
asheville
and
for
from
the
north
carolina
forest
service's
urban
and
community
forestry
grant
program.
And
so
we
have.
V
To
work
on
holding
community
meetings
and
working
with
city
staff
and
others
elected
officials
to
get
their
input
on
an
urban
forest
master
plan
and
we've
had
greenworks
has
hired
with
the
funding
from
the
city
an
intern,
a
college
intern.
That's
working
with
us
for
several
weeks
to
look
at
all
of
the
different
resolutions
and
plans
that
are
in
place
at
the
city
of
asheville
to
see
what
connections
there
are
for
an
urban
forest,
a
comprehensive
urban
forest
program
to
support,
and
so
it's
building
further
providing
evidence
for
why.
G
I
I
have
a
really
idiotic
point
to
make
it.
Is
it
not
obvious
with
all
the
reports
that
we've
had
into
urban
forestry
commission
stacy
and
everything
that
we've
done,
that
we
need
of
a
master
plan.
V
It
it
might
seem
obvious
to
some
of
us
who,
especially
those
of
us
who've,
been
closest
to
there
are
several
new
council
members
that
we
haven't
met
with
to
talk
about
this,
specifically,
so
maybe
don't
understand
or
comprehend
the
urgency
of
it
there's
also
to
provide
the
the
not
just
the
evidence
that
it
makes
sense
in
theory,
but
that
there
are
goals
that
would
be
more
effectively
met
through
an
urban
forestry
program
that
are
already
priorities
in
the
city
that
have
been
expressed
in
the
comprehensive
plan
or
in
the
sustainability
plan.
V
A
We
know
that
we're
continually
discussing
the
rollout
of
this
amendment
to
ensure
you
know
that
it's
working
in
the
way
we
intended
to
look
for
possible
needs
for
revision
and
then
to
discuss
the
possibility
of
the
spending
the
fee
and
lieu
money
at
some
point
down
the
road.
A
I
don't
have
a
more
detailed
update,
I'm
still
working
with
the
city
on
gathering
what
parameters
are
available
as
far
as
creating
a
framework
for
spending
that
money
like
we
talked
about
last
time,
some
of
the
things
we're
looking
at
that
are
available
with
mapping
programs.
You
know
to
dial
in
locations
where
we
can
do
tree
planting
are
things
like
you
know.
Where
is
their
canopy
or
lack
of
canopy?
A
What
is
the
vulnerability
of
the
population?
Poverty
index,
racial
demographics?
All
of
these
things
that
we
can
put
together
to
create
a
framework
for
decision
making
on
spending
that
money,
no
specific
updates
or
data
on
that
now
I
don't
think
we're
in
a
rush
to
spend
that
fee
in
lieu
money.
There's
not
a
lot
yet,
but
we
do
want
to
make
sure
we
have
a
framework
for
when
we
do
have
a
chance
to
actually
spend
that
we'll
be
talking
more
about
fee
and
lou
in
just
a
moment
in
regards
to
open
space.
A
G
So
I
I
and
I
talked
to
ed-
we've
got
a
trc
going
through
and
what
I'm
finding
is
that
on
tree
protection,
canopy
areas
where
let's
say,
there's
70
percent
coverage
and
only
15
needed
and
the
developer
is
only
is
protecting
considerably
more
than
what
the
15
is.
G
M
Yeah,
that's
that's
good.
I
appreciate
written
comments
on
it
because
it
helps
me
kind
of
track
it
and
if
you
have
a
few
things,
combining
them
into
one
message
would
be
best,
but
we'll
definitely
take
a
look
at
that.
Whatever
y'all
found
there.
G
B
B
It's
pretty
common
to
locate
the
trees
on
the
site
plan
that
are
being
protected,
and
I
think
that's
one
of
the
one
of
the
one
of
the
issues
that
we're
probably
going
to
have
to
look
at
when
we
talk
about.
You
know
patching
up
of
719.
B
B
So
since
we're
on
this
topic,
that's
that's
an
issue
that
I'd
like
to
raise
is
that
we
should
probably
look
to
start
doing
that
and
having
something
in
hand
by
the
beginning
of
next
year.
I
would
think.
A
Yeah,
I
was
definitely
thinking
that
would
be
the
timeline
for
the
goal.
Let's
see
what
eric
had
and
we
can
add
to
that
eric
go
ahead.
N
I
just
wanted
to
clarify
whether
it
was
something
that
had
actually
gone
through
trc
and
had
received
an
approval,
or
it
was
something
that
just
been
submitted
and
they
hadn't
adequately
shown
which
trees
are
being
protected
because,
as
drafted,
the
ordinance
does
require
them
to
show
specifically
which
trees
and
specifically,
what
area
is
going
to
be
preserved
as
the
tree
canopy
protection
area,
and
it
gets
down
to
a
level
of
detail
of
exactly
what
they've
got
to
print
on
their
plat.
That
then
gets
recorded.
N
G
Yeah
they're
at
the
final
trc
was
I've
got
it.
I
think
I
think
it's
a
final,
but
what
I
did
is
I
read
the
the
calculation
on
7193
the
calculation
of
tree
canopy,
depending
on
how
you
measure,
whether
you
do
it
aerially
or
on
the
ground.
G
So
if
they
do
ground,
then
the
measurement
of
a
trunk
of
each
individual
tree
tree,
not
grouped
with
other
trees
or
part
of
a
tree
stand,
and
this
would
be
part
of
a
tree
stand
because
there's
hundreds
of
trees
and
they're,
just
taking
they're,
only
required
to
do
a
percentage
of
those
hundreds,
even
though
they're
protecting
with
tree
protecting
fencing
around
it.
G
So
when
I've
had
this
question
before
with
the
staff
and
planning
saying,
don't
they
need
to
identify
the
tree,
they
said
no
just
the
general
fact
that
they're
going
over
the
15
so
therefore
they're
not
having
to
identify
each
dbh
depending
on
the
measurement
that
was
my
reading
of
it.
If
you've
got
a
better
reading
of
it
and
a
more
definitive
answer
on
it,
then
I'll
take
it
because
that's
a
response
now,
I'm
due
for
it
to
respond
on
at
trc.
N
Yeah,
so
the
the
calculation
methods
are
exactly.
As
you
said,
there,
you've
got
multiple
options,
but
at
the
end
of
it
they
have
to
be
able
to
show
that
they're
meeting
the
percentage.
Regardless
of
what
method
they
chose
to
calculate
it
on
a
final
plat.
So
there
should
be
a
section
and
it
should
it
should
calculate
out
to
whatever
the
percentages
that's
required
for
that
site,
and
it
should
carry
a
note
that
says.
Trees
may
not
be
removed
from
this
area
and
it's
actually
more
different
than
that.
J
N
G
M
E
G
A
K
Cecil
here
then,
the
current
issue
of
harper's
magazine
in
the
harper's
index
shows
the
percentage
by
which
the
wealthiest
neighborhoods
in
the
u.s
cities
have
more
trees
than
the
poorest
65
percent,
by
which
the
widest
neighborhoods
have
more
trees
than
those
that
have
the
least
white
78
percent
number
of
additional
trees
needed
to
fill
this
gap.
522
million
this
sort
of
reaffirms
what
we've
seen
from
our
heat
maps
and
and
our
other
lookings
at
the
city
of
asheville.
K
And
and
the
other
comment
I
need
to
make
right
now
to
chris
actually
looking
at
the
article
in
mount
in
the
citizen
times
this
week
about
about
airbnbs
about
the
short-term
rental
enforcement.
K
The
problems
with
short-term
rental
enforcement
that
you're
dealing
with
are
exactly
the
problems
with
tree
enforcement
that
we're
dealing
with.
We
don't
have
enough
people
on
the
ground.
We
don't
have
enough
enforcement
of
the
rules.
In
my
neighborhood,
we
had
the
guy
up
uphill
from
me
who
raped
his
land.
The
same
man
owns
a
rental
downhill
from
me,
who's
doing
short-term
rental,
multiple,
short-term
rentals,
where
he
doesn't
live
that
have
been
reported
to
the
city
over
and
over
again,
we
got
to
do
something
about
enforcement.
A
Thank
you.
I
can
let
kim
address
this
as
well,
but
yeah.
Your
point
about
where
trees
are
located
in
relation
to
demographics
in
the
city
is
a
point
that
has
been
well
researched
and
is
well
taken.
I
think,
amongst
this
group.
However,
we
need
to
recognize
that
we
can't
just
slam
trees
in
you
know
that
it
is.
A
It
has
to
be
a
program
to
bring
people
on
board
yeah
where
they
make
sense,
and
but
it
is
those
are
the
factors
that
we
need
to
look
at
when
making
our
decisions,
but
kim,
I
know,
gave
us
some
notes
in
the
comments.
I
don't
know
if
you
had
any
comments
to
make
to
that
as
well.
P
We've
talked
about
in
recent
meetings.
I've
heard
a
move
to
start
addressing
some
of
the
the
city's
goals
as
you're
working
on
these
recommendations,
and
so
I've
linked
in
the
chat
new
information,
the
asheville
climate
justice
index
map,
as
well
as
the
presentation
made
by
amber
weaver
of
the
sustainability
office
at
our
council
meeting
on
september
28th
for
any
members
of
the
public
who
would
like
to
see
these
documents.
They
are
linked
by
going
to
ashvalency.gov
clicking
on
the
government
tab.
A
Thank
you,
since
you
brought
up
the
presentation
by
amber
weaver.
We
did
want
to
make
a
point
with
this
group
that
there
was
no
mention
of
trees
at
all
in
her
sustainability,
discussion
and
climate
justice,
and
I
think
that's
a
real
gap
that
we're
going
to
work
on
addressing.
We
are
rapidly
getting
behind
in
this
meeting,
but
I
hope
to
get
to
all
these
key
points
as
we
get
going
don
had
a
comment.
V
V
You're
we're
short
on
time,
but
just
wanted
to
mention
real
quick
that
greenworks
just
submitted
an
application
for
a
grant
from
the
arbor
day
foundation
that
focuses
on
racial
and
climate
inequities
in
cities
and
using
trees.
To
address
these.
So
we
are
partnering
with
the
housing
authority
and
also
with
the
ymi
and
other
community
groups,
to
form
an
advisory
council
to
to
talk
about
the
need
and
desire
to
have
trees
in
neighborhoods
and
communities
of
color.
That
lack
them.
A
So
that's
where
this
commission
can
then
possibly
feed
in
resources
to
those
efforts,
probably
our
best
bet
at
actually
making
change
all
right,
oh
and
back
to
ed's
point
about
the
timeline
for
revision
on
the
tree,
canopy
ordinance.
So
we
know
that
we're
going
into
we're
going
to
talk
about
this
later,
the
holidays
and
winter
meetings
and
usually
there's
a
change
up
in
our
meeting
schedule.
A
So
I
would
think
that
our
goal
for
timeline
for
the
revision
would
be,
like
you
said,
early
2022,
possibly
either
to
have
something
ready
or
close
to
for
our
february
meeting.
A
So
I
don't
know
if
we
want
to
have
the
policy
working
group
work
on
that
or
to
initiate
a
new
working
group
or
regenerate
ignite
the
one
that
we
had
before
to
look
at
those
revisions.
So
I
don't
know
if
anybody
has
ideas
about
that.
B
A
All
right
well,
then,
maybe
put
that
into
your
next
meeting,
and
I
know
it's
something
that's
already
on
your
radar,
but
we
can
continue
to
collect
and
analyze.
You
know
like
what
sharon
was
saying
and
other
places
where
we
know
there's
those
gaps
so
all
right.
So
that
brings
us
to
working
group
updates.
The
first
one
is
the
open
space
amendment
working
group
before
we
get
going
with
that
eric
is
here
and
wanted
to
talk
about
the
fianlu
piece.
C
Will
have
to
respond
to
me,
I'm
afraid.
So
here
is
so.
There
are
two.
There
are
two
big
issues
arising
out
of
the
last
meeting.
The
first
one
is
that
vidyla
asked
us
to
make
a
position
statement
and
write
a
letter
position
on
the
open
space
amendment
to
pass
along
to
planning
zoning
who
has
a
meeting.
C
In
early
november,
which
is
before
our
november
meeting
and
that
that
meeting
is
a
prerequisite
to
sending
you
know
putting
the
pnz
stamp
of
approval
on
the
open
space
amendment
so
that
it
may
reach
council
at
its
currently
scheduled
date
of
december,
the
december
council
meeting
for
council's
consideration.
C
So
the
reason
we
can't
do
that
the
reason
that's
not
on
the
agenda
for
today
for
ufc
is
because
we
don't
have
a
final
open
space
amendment
and
at
the
end
of
our
last
task
force
meeting
last
week.
I
guess
that
would
have
been
vidilla
invited
all
of
us
to
make
edits
on
the
open
space
amendment
draft
again,
and
so
we
don't
know
how,
where
the
open
space
amendment
is
going
to
land,
and
so
it's
sort
of
impossible
for
us
to
say
what
we
think
about
a
document.
C
That's
not
done
an
amen,
a
an
ordinance,
that's
not
actually
written
yet
so
we're
just
going
to
have
to
wait
until
we
have
a
final
ordinance
to
take
a
position
on
what
we
think
about
it.
So
that's
the
that's.
The
first
big
item,
so
the
second
big
item
today
to
tee
things
up
for
eric
to
speak
for
himself,
is
the
fee
in
lieu
provisions
of
the
open
space
amendment.
C
The
the
big
summary
here
is
that
the
city
attorney's
office
has
declined
to
take
a
position
on
what
what
we're
allowed
to
do
with
the
money
for
the
open
space
amendments
fee
and
lieu
funds,
and
you
know
the
the
gist
of
that-
is
that
there's
litigation
ongoing
against
various
municipalities
across
north
carolina,
which
could
end
you
know
years
from
now.
C
We
have
no
idea
when,
when
this
litigation
will
end-
and
so
essentially
the
city
attorney's
office
has
taken
a
very
risk-averse
and
conservative
position
on
the
expenditure
of
fee
and
lieu
funds
for
the
open
space
amendment
and
and
has
actually
declined
to
say
what
the
city
attorney's
office
thinks
about
how
the
city
may
use
these
funds
pending
the
outcome
of
these
various
lawsuits
across
the
the
state
which
have
been
brought
by
this
litigation
mill:
legal
outfit
that
recruited
some
developers
to
be
a
part
of
their
action
to
challenge
the
way
the
fees
were
collected
and
how
the
fees
might
be
used.
C
So
that's
the
summary
of
the
discussion
we
got
from
eric
at
the
open
space
amendment
task
force
meeting
last
week,
and
so
the
issue
here
is
that
so
what
I've
brought?
C
What
I've
put
on
the
agenda
for
today
is
for
your
consideration
is
a
statement
that
I
had
to
get
on
the
agenda
before
I
had
these
discussions
at
the
open
space
task
force
meeting-
and
I
also
spoke
with
dennis
ashley
yesterday
about
about
this,
and
and
actually
it
needs
to
be
modified,
because
at
the
time
that
I
wrote
this
for
our
consideration.
C
Essentially,
we
just
had
an
inconsistent
interpretation
of
the
the
fianc.
What
can
be
done
with
the
fiance
funds
for
the
tree
canopy
amendment?
What
can
be
done
with
the
fee
and
lieu
funds
for
the
open
space
amendment?
So
originally.
What
I
had
suggested
that
we
do
here
today
is
to
vote,
to
recommend
to
city
council
to
give
the
city
attorney's
office
direction
to
come
up
with
a
creative,
imaginative
interpretation
of
the
fee
and
lieu
provisions
and
the
relevant
statutes
that
will
allow
the
city
of
asheville
to
pursue
its
objectives
immediately.
C
So
the
issue
here
is
that,
after
my
conversations
with
eric
and
janice,
it's
very
clear
that
the
city
attorney's
office
is
is
entrenched
in
its
position
to
not
take
a
position
and
to
recommend
that
the
city
not
spend
its
fee
in
lieu
funds
from
the
open
space
amendment
keeping
in
mind
that
this
will
be
a
period
probably
of
several
years.
It
could
be
a
period
of
several
years
before
those
the
relevant
litigation
is
resolved,
that
pro
that's
an
obstruction.
C
You
know
the
city
attorney's
office
has
has
produced
an
obstruction
to
the
city's
objectives,
to
pursue
with
equity,
how
we
provide
services
and
facilities
to
the
residents
of
the
city
of
asheville
and
the
reason
that
that's
an
obstruction
is
it's
not
just
a
temporary
pause
on
when
the
city
can
expend
its
resources?
It's
fianlu
funds
on
buying
park,
spaces,
open
spaces,
green
spaces.
C
The
the
fact
of
the
matter
is
we're.
In
a
race,
the
city
of
asheville
is
in
a
foot
race
with
developers
for
gobbling
up
any
available
real
estate,
which
could
provide
the
best
opportunities
for
parks,
the
most
equitable
opportunities
for
parks
and
open
spaces
for
the
for
the
populations
that
need
them.
C
So,
in
light
of
the
fact
that
the
longer
asheville
waits
to
start
spending
its
fee
in
lieu
dollars
on
acquiring
park
space,
the
fewer
good
options,
the
city
of
asheville,
will
have
for
providing
the
best
possible
parks
for
asheville
residents
and
for
providing
the
most
equitable
locations
for
parks
to
serve
under
underserved
neighborhoods.
C
Originally,
I
thought
that
we
should
urge
city
council
to
issue
a
directive
to
the
city
attorney's
office,
to
say
we
need
you
to
take
a
position
immediately.
We
need
it
to
be
the
most
creative
expansive
imaginative
position.
You
can
provide
to
empower
the
city
to
begin
spending
its
fee
in
lieu
funds
in
the
best
way
possible
that
will
serve
the
the
population.
C
However,
in
my
conversations
with
eric
and
my
conversations
with
janus,
it's
been
made
very,
very
clear
that
the
city
attorney's
office
is
is
committed
to
its
position,
to
not
take
a
position
and
to
simply
advise
the
city
not
to
spend
any
fee
and
loot
funds
on
acquiring
real
estate
for
more
parks
and
open
spaces.
And
I
think
that
that's
just
bald-faced.
C
E
A
I'd
like
to
open
it
up
for
eric
to
talk
about
the
where
the
city
is
at
on
the
fianlu,
with
open
space
and
real
quick
right
now,
with
this
discussion
on
the
open
face
task
force,
we're
really
actually
focusing
on
how
that
open
space
amendment
will
come
out
and
whether
or
not
the
ufc
will
support
or
not.
Once
we
have
a
final
version,
the
fee
in
lieu
discussion
and
whatever
motions
we
want
to
take
with
that
are
somewhat
separate
from
our
position
on
the
actual
open
space
amendment
so
make
that
clear.
Go
ahead.
Eric.
N
Sure,
thank
you
so
wanted
to
give
you
all
an
update,
since
this
was
touched
on
at
your
last
meeting
on
how
we
spend
these
and
why
that's
different,
then
the
parameters
around
how
we
would
spend
the
tree
canopy
fee
in
lieu
and
so
we've
had
a
chance
to
go
in
and
look
at
the
recent
amendments
through
160d
and
can
I
can
offer
you
a
fuller
explanation
now.
N
So
the
question
that
came
out
is:
did
160d
change
that
standard
in
any
meaningful
way,
and
so
what
160v
did
is
expanded.
The
instances
in
which
developers
can
pay
open
space
b
and
lieu,
but
in
expanding
those
instances
past
just
subdivisions,
they
incorporated
the
subdivision
standard
by
reference.
So
what
this
means
is
that
they're
subject
to
that
same
restriction
on
serving
residents
in
the
immediate
area
of
the
projects
that
they
come
from,
and
so
what
that
is
is
just
an
inherently
ambiguous
race
and
so
there's,
unfortunately,
no
guidance
on
what
that
means.
N
There's
no
school
government
publications
there's
at
present
no
case
law,
interpreting
that
there
are
no
regulations
that
have
been
promulgated
explaining
what
that
phrase
means.
What
there
are,
however,
are
at
least
three
separate
lawsuits
that
have
been
brought
against
north
carolina
municipalities,
charging
that
they
were
too
liberal
in
how
they
suspended
their
open
space,
be
in
lieu
that
they
did
not
comply
with.
That
quote
immediate
area
requirement
and
we've
looked
at
those
lawsuits,
and
we
know
that
they've
been
brought
by
the
same
firm
that
has
previously
sued
the
city
in
relation
to
its
water
fees.
N
So
we
have
a
pretty
high
level
of
confidence
that
if
we
spend
our
open
space,
fiendly
money
will
be
the
next
municipality
to
be
sued.
Given
that
we
only
have,
I
believe
it's
about
two
hundred
thousand
dollars
in
that
pot
of
money.
It
doesn't
make
a
good
physical
sense
to
take
that
step
when
the
cost
of
any
litigation
is
going
to
be
largely
it's
going
to
be
likely
the
same
amount
as
the
fee
itself.
A
Here's
where
my
thoughts
are,
I
don't
know
what
you
know.
Obviously,
as
a
group,
we
can
make
recommendations
to
council
in
any
way
we
see
fit.
Specifically,
that
would
reach
our
goal
of
enhancing,
preserving
and
protecting
tree
canopy,
and
it
obviously
could
be.
The
case
could
be
made
that
open
space
does
that,
so
it
would
be
within
our
realm
to
make
a
recommendation
on
this
open
space
fee
in
lieu.
A
My
concern
is
that
if
this
is
an
amendment,
that's
currently
being
worked
on
and
going
through
to
city
council
within
the
next
couple
months
is
a
recommendation
on
anything
having
to
do
with
open
space
fee
and
lou
appropriate
in
this
moment,
and
I
totally
understand
what
you're
saying
parent
about
how
real
estate
you
know
is.
It
is
a
timely
endeavor
and
there
are
limited
opportunities,
but
I
just
want
to
put
that
out
there
that
you
know.
Is
this
the
right
time
to
make
that
kind
of
recommendation
to
city
council?
G
Yeah,
I
think
we
could
add
parents
recommendation,
along
with
our
recommendation,
to
counsel
on
open
space
at
the
same
time,
I'm
in
agreement
with
parent.
Only
because
I'm
sitting
on
this
task
force
and
frankly,
I
have
watched
a
city-
spend
money
on
consultants
that
have
cost
a
whole
lot
more,
that
have
gotten
a
whole
lot
less
results.
G
So
I
think
it's
my
a
gamble
well
worth
putting
out
there
and
I'm
in
agreement
with
perrin.
B
I'm
sorry,
I
didn't
raise
my
hand,
but
can
I
ask
a
question
or
make
a
comment?
You
know,
I
think
the
the
real
problem
is
the
ambiguity
of
you
know
the
law.
You
know
defining
what
an
immediate
area
is.
I
mean.
That's,
that's
an
issue
of
scale.
The
whole
city
of
asheville
north
carolina
is
immediate
to
western
carolina.
B
So
you
know
you
can
make
the
argument
that
you
know
it
could
be
anything
that
you
want
it
to
be
and
given
that
we
don't
have
any
immediate
project
to
spend
the
open
space
money
on
you
know,
I
wonder
if
just
like
we
did
with
with
the
sunset
drive
thing,
we
d
decouple
the
fee
and
lou
issue
from
the
rest
of
the
open
space,
revision
and
and
sort
of
table
that
until
we
get
more
information
about,
you
know
where
this
money
you
know
is
intended
to
be
spent
and
where,
where
the
current
litigation
lands,
because
that
will
clear
up
some
of
the
ambiguity,
I
think,
and
rather
than
you
know,
wrenching
ourselves
to
make
a
decision
when
there's
not
enough
information
to
make
a
decision
with.
B
So
I
mean
I
I
I
really
understand
where
parents
coming
from,
and
it's
kind
of
important
to
eventually
have
some
resolution
to
this
issue,
because
it
affects
where
we
stand
on
the
open
space
revision,
but
but
there's
just
not
enough
information
to
go
with
at
this
point,
so
I
think
decoupling.
It
might
be
the
better
thing
to
do
at
this
point.
A
Thank
you,
I'm
not
sure
who
is
next
cecil
are
you
did
you
have
a
question
comment.
K
Am
in
a
vehicle
I
had
to
I'm
running
an
errand
right
now,
but
I
think
perrin
made
the
point
really
well.
F
Okay,
I
I
have
a
point
to
make.
I
I
agree
with
parents
general
thrust
that
we
need
to
deal
with.
F
Using
our
funds
wisely
in
a
in
a
in
a
prioritized
way
to
have
an
organized
open
space
system
for
the
city,
the
whole
green
infrastructure
issue
is
a
major
thing
tree.
You
know
our
urban
forest
is
the
largest
largest
single
element
in
the
city
above
ground,
and
yet
it
gets
probably
the
least
attention
of
anything
else.
F
Noise
going
anyway
cecil,
could
you
mute
maybe.
F
Okay,
but
the
general
idea:
yes,
we
need
to
set
priorities
for
open
space
and
our
whole
green
infrastructure
system.
The
the
city
is
just
not
organizing
in
that
way
to
look
at
those.
F
That's
why
we
need
an
urban
forest
master
plan
to
connect
to
all
these
things,
the
city's
losing
opportunities
continuously,
and
that
I
think
that's
parents
major
point
we're
losing
these
opportunities,
the
future
cities
being
built
right
now,
and
so
that's
I
agree
with
parent
on
the
major
point
and
somehow
we
need
to
get
that
across
that
point
across
the
city
is
part
of
our
recommendations.
A
Thanks
steve
see,
I
think,
patrick.
D
Yes,
it
it,
it
seems
that
we
have
parents
points
which
are
well
taken
and
impending
motion.
On
one
side
we
have
eric
edgerton's
legal
opinion
on
the
other
side,
complete
opposite.
D
So
if
we
were
to
go
ahead
and
move
to
make
a
recommendation
to
the
city
council,
I'd
like
to
get
kim's
take
on
that.
Given
that
dichotomy
and
then
after
that,
I'm
not
clear
to
ed's
point
how
we
decouple
open
space
from
the
fee
in
lieu.
P
Thank
you,
patrick.
That's
why
I
had
my
hand
raised.
So
one
of
the
things
that
I
would
suggest
to
any
advisory
group
is
when
making
a
recommendation
to
counsel
regarding
instruction
a
group
might
consider
focusing
on
the
instruction
or
the
policy
that
needs
to
be
made.
Instead
of
a
specific
argument
against
a
staff
member,
I
think
that
you
might
have
some
success,
suggesting
that
a
policy
would
be
made
around
the
distribution
of
fees
and
open
space
fees
in
lieu,
for
example,
understanding
the
dire
need
and
the
urgency.
P
Additionally,
we
do
have
open
space
funds
that
are
needing
to
be
used
and
they
have
a
deadline.
I
wanted
to
draw
attention
to
the
bond
funds.
We
originally
had
2
million
dollars
allocated
for
acquisition
of
park
space.
That
deadline
is
the
end
of
2023
and
we
know
that
land
is
at
a
premium
cost
there's
not
a
lot
of
it
left
that
can
be
used
for
that
purpose
and
that
a
previous
iteration
of
council
identified
south
asheville
and
east
asheville
with
the
most
need.
So
there
is
a
there
is
a
deadline.
P
There
are
fees
that
need
to
be
used.
There
is
an
urgency
in
the
timeline
and
I
hope
you'll
accept
my
recommendation
as
a
suggestion
regarding
the
language.
A
Thank
you
kim
was
very
helpful.
I
think
vedilla
was
next.
B
Yeah,
the
only
way
I
can
think
of
doing
that
is
to
if,
if
we
approve
with
all
the
rest
of
the
amendments
to
the
open
space
amendment,
then
we
as
a
commission
recommend
approval
to
the
amendment
with,
with
the
exception
of
of
the
fee.
B
You
know
where
we
are
with
respect
to
fee
and
lou
that
we
just
don't
have
enough
information
and
there's
not
enough
clarity
with
with
that
with
that
one
issue,
or
we
recommend
how
fee
and
loo
get
spent
along
with
our
recommendation,
I
you
know,
I
I
think
that
you
know
I
think
we're
we're
pretty
close
to
approving
the
amendment,
and
that
is
just
that.
One
issue:
that's
the
stick
in
the
mud,
so
we
work
around
it
somehow,
with
our
recommendation.
P
And
I
would
definitely
suggest
this
is
kim
again.
I
would
suggest
decoupling
it
because
we
have
a
decision
before
council
that
is
sooner
the
open
space
in
general,
where,
as
you
could
make
a
general
recommendation,
that
we
need
policy
around
distribution
of
open
space
v
and
loo,
but
it
wouldn't
have
to
be
under
the
same
timeline
as
a
decision.
That's
before
council,
this
winter.
A
All
right
so
everybody's
clear
on
that
the
currently
the
urban
forestry
commission
has
a
recommendation
to
council
to
in
opposition
of
the
open
space
amendment
as
it
was
written
previously.
But
since
that
has
been
revised,
we
will
need
to
take
a
look
at
that
at
our
next
meeting.
A
Hopefully,
once
there
is
actually
a
final
version
that
will
go
to
council,
then
we
can
either
vote
to
keep
that
opposition
change,
that
into
support,
or
whatever
that's
for
the
amendment
itself,
then,
as
kim
is
suggesting
we
can
look
at
various
ways
or
recommendations
to
city
council
on
the
actual
spending
of
the
funds
of
open
space
fee
and
loop.
So
those
are
the
two
separate
buckets.
A
So
in
this
moment
we
actually
do
not
have
a
final
version
of
the
open
space
amendment
to
make
any
changes
to
our
opposition
from
the
past,
but
we
can
discuss
moving
forward
with
a
recommendation
on
any
of
these
different
pieces
of
support
for
how
various
funds
would
be
spent
and
what
those
priorities
should
be
for
council.
Does
that
make
sense
for
everybody?
I
see
that
there's
still
hand
up
from
vadilla
and
perrin.
I
think
vadilla
was
next.
Y
Thanks
so
I
just
wanted
to
chime
in,
I
think,
responding
to
god.
I
don't
remember
who
made
the
comment,
but
about
needing
and
a
comprehensive,
open
space
review
just
to
remind
this
commission
that
the
wording
amendment
that
we're
working
on
is
really
just
for
open
spaces,
very
small
locations
related
to
individual
parcels,
and
yet
yes,
you
know
it
makes
sense
that
the
city
at
some
point
should
do
a
larger,
comprehensive
park.
Y
Slash
open
space
plan,
that's
updated,
but
this
is
not
that
just
to
be
clear
and
also
the
you
know,
this
was
initiated
to
talk
about
the
wording
amendment
that
revising
not
necessarily
the
management.
I
mean.
I
think
it's
great,
that
we
expanded
our
review
to
look
at
that,
but
it
doesn't
seem
like
it.
It
needs
to
go
together
because
it's
really
a
separate
item,
but
it
makes
sense
that
you,
you
guys,
would
chime
in
on
that
when,
when
you
make
a
motion
to
counsel
that's
it.
C
Was
a
part
of
our
discussions
on
the
open
space
task
force
until
this
opinion
came
from
the
city
attorney's
office,
which
is
what
separated
it
out
from
the
open
space
task
force's
review?
So
it
was
supposed
to
be
a
part
of
the
same
thing.
The
city
attorney's
opinion
has
prevented
that
from
happening.
C
That
said,
you
know
I'm
fine
with
having
our
recommendations
on
fee
and
lou
go
together
with
our
recommendations
on
the
open
space
amendment
to
city
council.
I
have
no
no
problems
with
that,
and
that
makes
sense
in
a
variety
of
ways
kim.
Your
points
are
well
taken
about
constructive
input,
constructed
feedback
to
city
council.
Thanks
for
that
useful
advice,
so
yeah
I
there
are
there's,
there's
a
lot
to
say
about
all
these
issues.
Suffice
it
to.
C
You
know
the
statute
allows
for
lands
to
be
bought,
like
parkland,
for
example,
to
be
bought
to
serve
multiple
subdivisions,
multiple
developments,
so
it's
clear
that
there's
it's
anticipated
within
the
statute
that
this
could
be
contemplated
at
a
sort
of
a
broader
neighborhood
scale
level,
or
you
know,
resource
management,
district
level,
so
that
multiple
neighborhoods
could
be
or
multiple
developments
could
be
served
by
the
same
park
bought
with
that
money.
C
So
there's
there's
lots
of
room
for
creativity,
flexibility,
boldness,
courage
in
the
in
this
relevant
statutes
that
the
city
attorney's
office
has
interpreted,
but
the
city
attorney's
office
has
a
very
risk-averse
position
on
this
particular
issue.
C
That's
the
bottom
line.
They
don't
want
to
see
the
city
take
risks
and
then
end
up
in
litigation
over
the
risks
that
were
taken.
I
just
think
that
has
to
be.
You
know,
that's
the
consideration
on
one
side.
The
consideration
on
the
other
side
is
this
race
that
we're
in
to
gobble
up
the
available
real
estate
for
parks
and
open
spaces
within
the
city
of
asheville.
So
that's,
I
think,
ultimately,
that's
the
value
judgment
we're
going
to
need
to
bring
before
city
council
to
say
we
need
you
to
be
bold.
C
We
need
you
to
take.
We
need
the
city
attorney's
office
to
defend
litigation
against
the
city
for
the
decisions
that
have
been
made
to
pursue
our
policies
to
the
best
of
our
ability,
and
so
you
know
as
amy
as
you
suggested.
These
things
could
be
bundled
together.
I'm
fine
with
doing
that.
I
think
that
makes
a
lot
of
sense
I'll.
That
also
gives
me
time
to
provide
my
legal
analysis
on
the
statutes
to
the
urban
forestry
commission.
C
So
you
all
can
see
a
different
perspective
on
how
the
exact
same
language
can
be
interpreted
to
courageously
pursue
the
city's
priorities
for
parks
and
open
space
in
an
equitable
way
for
for
all
of
our
residents.
So
we
don't
need
to
resolve
it
today
and
I'll
work
on
that
analysis
of
the
statutes
that
the
city
attorney's
office
has
interpreted
for
the
for
your
review
on
the
commission.
A
All
right,
thanks
parent
and
just
something
to
keep
in
mind,
is
that
we
are
not,
as
a
group
deciding
how
any
money
is
being
spent.
We
are
again
providing
recommendations
to
city
council.
So
that's
one
thing
to
keep
in
mind
is
whether
or
not
the
city's
attorney's
office
supports
or
does
not
support
a
specific.
A
You
know.
Budget
line
item
is
actually
not
necessarily
the
concern
of
this
group.
We,
if
we
have
a
recommendation,
we
see
something
that
we
think
council
can
do
that
supports
their
strategic
vision.
We
can
make
that
recommendation.
Does
that
make
sense
that
they
don't
necessarily
have
to
be
tied
together.
A
I
totally
understand
your
frustration,
especially
as
a
lawyer
you're,
seeing
it
through
that
lens,
but
we
again
we
can
make
our
recommendations,
but
we
really
need
to
be
aware
that
we
have
a
goal
of
preserving
and
protecting
tree
canopy
and
that
those
are
the
recommendations
we
should
send
to
council
in
that
framework
of
how
it
would
meet
their
priorities
and
the
city
priorities
of
urban
forests.
Does
that
make
sense.
C
It
does
make
sense
amy
thanks
for
that,
and
I
think
that's
a
constructive
way
to
look
at
it.
I
also
think
kim,
if,
if
you
would
be,
as
our
council
liaison
you
know,
perhaps
when
this
comes
up
for
discussion,
you
can
give
the
extra
context
that's
needed,
because
I
imagine
the
city
attorney's
office
is
deferred
to
by
city
council,
as
you
know,
regularly,
and
so.
Bringing
these
sort
of
competing
priorities
into
into
relief
for
the
council
would
be
also
be
helpful
as
as
you're
discussing
it
on
council.
P
I
do
appreciate
the
invitation.
I
will
acknowledge
that
as
your
liaison,
I
am
caring
for
recommendations
that
are
official
from
this
body,
so
I
can't
bring
forward
a
recommendation
from
this
body
if
emotion
is
not
made.
Also
note
that
it's
pretty
rare,
that
we
have
a
governance
committee
which
addresses
new
policies
for
the
city
of
asheville
scheduled,
but
we
have
one
scheduled
next
tuesday
at
three
o'clock.
A
N
Yeah,
just
to
note
got
to
push
back
against
the
characterization
of
being
risk
adverse
here.
We
we
take
risks
all
the
time
in
our
office.
It's
just
a
it's
a
risk-aware
situation,
so
when
we
know
that
a
law
firm
that
has
previously
sued
the
city
has
sued
three
other
municipalities
under
just
the
theory
that
there's
no
way
to
define
what
immediate
area
means.
N
We
know
that
we
will
be
sued
again
and
so
there's
always
the
the
calculation
of
whether
it's
worth
it
to
incur
that
cost,
and
that's
certainly
a
policy
discussion
that
can
be
had.
But
to
deny
the
the
outcome
here
would
be
to
just
deny
reality.
I
mean
that
that's
that's
going
to
be
an
incurred
cost.
If
you
do
go
forward
with
that,
that
course,
but
if
that's
one
that
that
big
city
wants
to
bear,
that's
always
always
something
that
we'll
advise
on
and
take
direction
on.
A
Appreciate
that,
thank
you
all
right,
and
so
we'll
look
next
month
for
hopefully
a
final
version
of
the
open
space
amendment
and
have
our
discussion
on
that
and
then
also
if
parent
or
anyone
else
wants
to
frame
a
recommendation
to
counsel
in
regards
to
how
the
funds
are
spent.
We
can
look
at
that
as
well
all
right.
A
That
brings
us
to
the
policy
working
group
before
we
go
there.
It
is
a
little
past,
3
p.m
already,
and
so
obviously
we
are
going
over
schedule
just
wanted
to
offer
up
if
anybody
needs
a
break
or
anything.
Let
me
know
we're
just
going
to
keep
going
and
see
if
we
can
get
through
the
rest
of
the
agenda,
so
the
policy
working
group
ed,
if
you
want
to
bring
us
up
to
date
on
chapter
20
and
the
standards
and
specs.
B
Yeah
we
already
kind
of
updated
you
on
the
standards
and
specs,
and
I'm
going
to
do
this
in
30
seconds
or
less.
The
policy
working
group
met
with
this
city
on
our
proposed
provisions
to
chapter
20.,
public
works
and
development
services
and
the
city
attorney's
office
met
with
us
and
by
and
large
they
like
the
recommended
changes
that
we're
making.
We
have
some
structural
issues
that
we
have
to
deal
with
and
we're
probably
going
to
schedule
a
meeting
within
the
next
seven
days
to
start
addressing
those
recommendations.
B
Patrick,
do
you
have
anything
to
add
to
that?
No
okay,
we
can
move
on
amy.
A
Thank
you.
I
would
say
that,
if
we're
close
to
a
point
where
maybe
the
entire
group
could
see
the
revisions
or
comment
on
them,
I
know
you
know
there's
that
fine
line
with
a
bunch
of
drafts
and
not,
but
maybe
keep
that
in
mind
that
we
do
at
some
point
need
to
bring
this
to
the
entire
group.
A
Perfect,
thank
you
all
right.
Next
is
the
trc
working
group,
which
is
me
and
sharon,
and
I
just
wanted
to
update
everyone
that
we're
going
to
be
taking
this
working
group
off
for
now.
I
think
I've
seen
what
I
need
to
see
at
trc
and
again
I
cannot
say
enough
about
the
work
that
sharon's
doing
it
really
needs
to
be
a
staff
level
job.
A
The
the
work
that
she's
putting
into
that
and
so
that'll
be
the
I
guess
recommendation
going
forward
is
that
it's
good
to
have
a
seat
at
the
table
to
have
the
oversight,
but
it
is
a
lot
to
put
on
a
volunteer
so
we're
going
to
take
this
working
group
off
for
now
and
see
if
we
can
find
other
ways
to
address
that
workload
between
the
ufc
and
and
the
city.
B
Just
to
comment
sharon's
work
with
trc
is
proof
that
somebody
is
able
to
leap
tall
buildings
with
a
single
bound.
So
thank
you.
A
Absolutely
absolutely
it's
amazing.
Thank
you
exactly
all
right.
The
budget
request
working
group,
so
we
do
have
some
discussion
here.
Patrick
did
you
want
to
get
us
started
on
where
you're
at
with
that.
D
Yeah
so
based
on
some
communication
back
and
forth
between
our
council
liaison
kim
roney
and
amy
myself,
and
I
believe
parent.
D
Kim
was
suggesting
that
the
urban
forestry
commission
be
a
little
more
proactive
in
terms
of
sending
resolutions
and
recommendations
to
the
city
council
to
show
that
we
are
an
active
group
in
terms
of
making
recommendations
and
giving
advice
to
the
city
council.
D
E
D
We
came
down
on
the
side
of
a
recommendation
because
it
says
to
the
council
our
intent
in
terms
of
recommending
a
comprehensive
urban
forestry
program,
which
would
include
an
alberta
forester,
an
urban
forest
master
plan,
as
opposed
to
a
resolution,
because
you
know
resolution
would
then
get.
D
D
M
A
Wait
till
we
get
there,
so
I
guess
for
right
now,
whatever
other
work,
the
working
group
is
doing,
we
can
update
now
and
then
we'll
we'll
circle
back
around.
D
Right,
so
that's
that's
our
main
focus
right
now,
I'm
going
to
ask
nancy
if
she
could
and
I'm
going
to
do
this
very
quickly,
because
I
know
time's
a
a
factor
here
to
put
up
the
powerpoint
presentation
that
I
sent
to
her
and
haley,
and
I
I'm
doing
this
because
I
would
like
this
powerpoint
presentation
to
be
part
of
the
documents
for
this
meeting
and
I
believe
that.
D
Amy
mentioned
earlier
in
the
meeting
that
there
was
a
powerpoint
presentation
on
climate
justice
given
to
the
city
council
meeting
last
tuesday
on
climate
justice
initiative
and
I'm
just
going
to
bc.
D
I
was
going
to
go
through
the
presentation,
but
I'll
only
beseech
the
commission
members
to
please
once
this
posted
to
go
back
and
look
at
it
because
it
does
represent
missed
opportunities
for
us,
for
the
office
of
sustainability,
for
the
sustained
sustainability
advisory
committee,
on
energy,
in
the
environment
and
for
development
services
to
better
integrate
our
respective
priorities
and
initiatives,
and
I
will
be
addressing
this
at
the
next
budget
working
group
meeting,
but
I'll
leave
it
at
that.
D
And
if
anyone
has
any
questions
I'll
be
glad
to
answer
those
and
we
can
move
on
to
new
business.
I
also
wanted
to
bring
this
up,
because
I
have
an
amendment
to
the
proposed
letter
of
recommendation
to
the
city
council.
Thank
you.
A
All
right,
thank
you,
patrick
somebody
else
have
any
comments
at
this
time
on
the
budget
request
working
group.
My
only
thing
to
ask
of
the
working
group
is-
and
I'm
sure
you're
considering
this,
but
in
what
ways
do
we
plan
to
leverage
community
support
and
engagement
for
our
budget
requests?
I
don't
know
if
there's
any
current
plans,
you
know.
Do
we
have
another
tree
symposium
of
some
sort
or
something
like
that?
A
You
know
what
other
ways
can
we
engage
the
community
to
have
that
bottom
down
or
bottom
up
effect
to
to
push
up
to
city
council?
So
just
some
ideas
at
this
point,
but.
D
D
Yeah
we
were,
we
were
sort
of
moving
in
that
direction
until
we
got
sort
of
sidelined
on
working
on
this
recommendation.
A
Understood
all
right
anything
else
there
for
now
we'll
revisit
this
in
a
moment
which
brings
us
to
a
legislation,
update
patrick
well,
we
have
you
just
really
briefly.
What
can
you
tell
us
about
if
there's
anything
new
on
sb,
349
and
hb
496.?
I
know
they
got
rolled
over
a
bit.
D
No
update
or
additional
information
on
sb
349
on
house
bill
4996,
as
I
mentioned
in
previous
meetings
that
got
rolled
into
the
major
appropriation
or
budget
bill
senate
bill
105
that
passed
the
senate.
There
was
differences
between
the
appropriation
bill
passed
by
the
senate
and
the
house.
It
went
to
a
conference
committee
as
far
as
I
know,
the
the
language
for
496,
which
would
require
local
governments
to
to
pass
tree
or
prevent
local
governments
from
passing
tree
protection
ordinances
without
the
express
local
enabling
authority.
D
D
D
The
conference
committee
by
republican
control
rules
are
secret,
so
nobody
has
seen
the
appropriation
bill
that
went
to
the
governor
and
we
don't
know
what
the
outcome
of
the
discussions
between
the
conference
committee
and
the
governor
has
been.
My
last
email
that
I
got
from
senator
julie
mayfield,
which
was
yesterday
said
essentially
we
know
nothing.
A
Okay,
well,
thank
you
for
the
update,
we'll
keep
an
eye
on
it
all
right.
Last
on
old
business
is
the
urban
play
studio?
Where
are
we
at
with
that?
Has
it
been
to
city
council,
and
I
was
in
the
news
again.
D
So,
yes,
the
urban
place
form
code
went
before
the
city
council
last
week,
both
the
form
code
and
the
redistricting
language
redistricting
maps
that
correspond
with
the
phase.
One
of
urban
center
proposals
were
all
approved
by
the
city
council.
D
The
city
did
take
out
one
proposed
location
because
of
concerns
from
the
local
neighborhood
association,
which
is
comprised
mainly
of
people
of
color.
D
The,
and
I
don't
know
if
vedilla
is
still
here
and
can
advise
us
on
this,
but
last
I
talked
with
planning
and
urban
design.
They
were
going
to
go
to
the
city
council
with
phase
two
of
the
urban
center
initiative,
probably
either
sometime
late
this
year
or
beginning
of
next
year.
D
D
We
do
have
a
proposal
on
the
table
that
would
instead
of
dealing
with
that
in
the
form
code,
language
that
we
would
deal
with
that
in
the
tree.
Canopy
preservation,
ordinance
section
719
by
establishing
a
third
category
of
urban
centers
and
requiring
in
that
category
a
minimum
urban
tree
connecting
coverage
of
25
percent.
We
need
to
go
back
with.
D
To
planning
and
urban
design,
along
with
eric
edgerton,
to
work
out
the
details
on
that,
so
that
we
can
get
that
udl
amendment
to
719
ready
to
include
in
the
package
of
other
udo
amendments
related
to
the
tree.
Canopy
preservation,
ordinance
that
would
like
to
present
to
council
sometime
early
next
year.
A
P
Sorry
to
keep
interrupting,
I
just
wanted
to
let
y'all
know
that
we
have
a
like
a
draft
planning
calendar
and
the
phase
two
for
urban
place
is
penciled
in
for
november
9th,
so
it
may
be
before
next
year.
P
A
All
right,
so
that
brings
us
to
new
business.
First,
we
had
a
request
to
talk
about
the
ravenscroft
reserve
initiative
from
dawn.
A
Thank
you
all
right.
Next
is
the
budget
request,
recommendation
and
resolution
that
patrick
mentioned
before,
so
we
have
the
draft.
Hopefully
everybody
had
a
chance
to
take
a
look
at
it
and
then
patrick,
you
said
you
had
a
revision.
A
Nancy,
do
you
think
you
could
put
that
up
for
us,
sorry,
the
the
draft
resolution
or
recommendation
pardon
me.
A
Most
people
are
aware,
as
was
mentioned
previously,
that
we
were
looking
at
letting
city
council
see
us
a
little
more
visibly
and
the
first
of
these
current
set
of
recommendations
that
we
thought
would
be
appropriate
to
move
up
to
city
council
is
a
recommendation
that
supports
our
budget
request
of
an
urban
forester
and
an
urban
forest
master
plan.
So
patrick
wrote
up
this
recommendation,
patrick
you
want
to
go
ahead
with
your
change
or
revision.
D
Yeah,
if
we
could
scroll
down
to
goals
for
a
greener,
asheville.
D
And
specifically,
to
item
four,
so
this,
what
I'm
going
to
propose
goes
to
my
comments
previously
about
the
powerpoint
presentation
by
the
office
of
sustainability,
in
conjunction
with
the
sustainability
advisory
committee
on
energy
in
the
environment,
which
is
amy,
pointed
out
made
no
reference
to
urban
forest
urban
forestry,
a
comprehensive
urban
forestry
program,
an
urban
forester,
an
urban
forest
master
plan,
the
urban
forestry
commission
or
just
plain
trees,
importance.
D
A
D
D
So
in
item
for
begin
erasing
the
disproportionate
impact
of
climate
inequities
on
low-income,
neighborhoods
and
communities
of
color
buy,
and
I'd
like
to
amend
this,
to
add
the
words
working
with
the
city
office
of
sustainability,
the
sustainability
advisory
committee
on
energy
in
the
environment
and
any
other
relevant
city
department,
office
board
or
commission
to
integrate
and
strike
the
word.
Integrating
the
comprehensive
urban
forestry
program,
including
reforestation
plans
for
these
neighborhoods
into
a
climate
justice
initiative.
A
All
right,
so
that
would
be
the
change
there,
so
we
can
discuss
this
entire
document
and
the
intention
or
wording
behind
it.
So
it
looks
like
ed
first.
B
So
I
I
think
revising
point
number
four
is,
as
patrick
suggested
makes
a
lot
of
sense,
and
I
am
I'm
prepared
to
make
a
motion
that
we
approve,
as
amended
after
we
have
some
further
discussion.
F
Better
turn
this
on
yeah,
I
I
appreciate
this
write-up
and
I
in
general
agreement
with
it.
I
have
a
couple
of
questions
as
far
as
we
pat
we,
we
sent
a
resolution
to
city
council
last
year,
zero
net
loss
resolution,
which
is
passed
by
city
council,
and
I
realized
we
have
a
new
city
council
members.
Now
I
the
status
of
a
resolution.
F
It
implies
in
this
write-up
at
the
first
that
the
end
of
the
situation
part
that
that
is
city
policy,
the
zero
net
loss
resolution
that
we
sent.
I
don't
think
it's
actually
city
policy,
it's
it's
by
resolution.
F
We
can
reference
it
if,
if
the
city
council
passed
it
I'd,
be
happy
if
it
was
considered
policy,
but
I
don't
think
it's
technically
city
policy,
yet
it
was
a
resolution
with
the
goal
of
having
zero
net
loss.
F
F
Kim
yeah,
if
you
can,
if,
if
a
city
policy,
then
then
a
lot
of
this
is
already
established.
In
other
words,
the
points
we
made
last
year
in
that
resolution
were
to
have
a
comprehensive
urban
forestry
program,
and
that
is
by
resolution,
the
goal
of
city
council.
Already,
it's
just
a
matter
of
funding
it.
You
know,
but
that
is.
F
New
city
council
members,
so
if,
if
a
resolution
by
a
past
city
council
is
still
intact
when
it
goes
to
new
city
council,
that's
another
issue
also.
P
That's
a
good
point
steve
so
from
my
experience,
but
also
looking
up
the
difference
of
the
two
I
wouldn't
want
to
give
any
misinformation.
So
I'm
happy
to
get
the
information
as
an
exact
answer
and
send
it
forward
to
this
full
group.
When
I
send
forward
my
report
to
counsel,
but
from
my
memory
and
the
definition,
a
resolution
can
be
an
adopted
statement,
affirmation
agreement
acknowledgement
but
is
not
the
same
as
a
policy.
F
Right,
that's
that's
my
understanding.
It's
not
official
policy,
it's
a
kind
of
a
we're
striving
to
do
this
sort
of
thing.
We're
striving
to
do
this,
so
I
would
I
would
change
the
wording
in
here
in
this
statement
to
say
by
resolution.
The
city
agreed
with
this.
F
K
I
would
interject
here
that
one
of
my
frustrations
of
eight
years
on
council
was
that
a
resolution
is
not
policy.
F
Yeah
yeah,
but
I
think
we
need
to
say
the
city
council
isn't
agreed
with
this
with
these
goals,
but.
S
F
We're
reiterating
that
agreement
and
saying
hey:
let's
we're
we're
continuing
to
tell
city
council
and
advise
them
the
same
way
we
have
in
the
past,
but
we
would
like
to
see
follow-through.
I
mean
that's
the
gist
of
what
we're
saying.
D
So,
madam
chair,
it
might
be
helpful
if
steve
would
also
recommend
amending
that
that
language.
F
I
would
just
simply
say
that
the
city
council
agreed
with
stipulation
in
their
city
council,
agreed
by
resolution
of
in
appropriate
wording,
we'll
let
you
on
the
word
just
where.
F
Right
some
words
to
that
effect.
The
rest-
I
I'm
absolutely
fine
with.
I
think
it's
perfect,
because
we
we've
written
some
of
this
before
this
is
kind
of
a
restating.
What
we
said
before
and
just
bringing
forward
once
again
to
the
attention
of
city
council,
say:
hey,
you
guys
agree
with
this
before
we're
just
we're
just
pushing
for
follow
through
here.
D
So,
madam
chair,
I
will
well.
K
F
T
A
Don
I
and
I
vote
I
so
the
motion
to
forward
the
recommendation
to
fund
a
city,
forester
and
urban
forest
master
plan
will
pass
to
city
council
with
the
revisions,
patrick,
and
I
will
get
those
revisions
to
nancy
and
haley
to
get
through
to
city
council.
A
A
You
know
it
made
me
wonder
you
know
why
don't
they
know
what
we're
doing,
how
hard
we're
working,
how
many
hours
we
all
put
in
on
these
issues,
and
so
it
brought
to
my
mind
this
bigger
picture
of
you
know:
how
do
we
increase
our
visibility
and
make
sure
that
this
word
is
getting
out?
The
specific
items
that
were
brought
up
by
kim
was
moving
recommendations
and
resolutions
up
to
council
and
I'm
still
working
on
getting
getting
some
clarification
on
exactly
what
are
the
differences?
A
My
concern
was
always
you
know:
could
we
over
recommend?
Could
we
over
saturate
counsel,
with
recommendations
and
resolutions
to
the
point
where,
if
we
have
one,
that's
really
important,
you
know
if
we
really
want
this
one
thing:
will
that
get
lost
in
the
shuffle
if
we're
always
putting
recommendations
forward,
however,
I
do
think
it's
a
good
idea
for
us
to
be
more
visible
and
ensuring
that
city,
council
and
others
can
see
again
the
work
we're
doing
and
make
sure
that
it
is
out
in
front.
A
A
A
So
this
is
a
working
document
and
then
the
second
part
of
this
is
some
of
the
priorities
and
positions
that
we
have
discussed
starting
well
several
years
ago,
but
that
we
re
iterated
at
our
last
annual
retreat,
and
this
could
be
maybe
the
basis
of
what
our
future
recommendations
to
council
might
look
like
you
know,
I
don't
know
if
we
want
to
set
a
goal
of
you
know
one
per
month
or
just
as
they
come
up,
but
this
included
things
like
this
budget
request.
You
know.
A
So
I
think
this
is
a
great
place
to
start
with
moving
this
up
to
council,
but
do
we
want
to,
for
example,
get
a
commitment
or
put
something
on
the
radar
for
the
importance
of
heritage,
trees
or
the
structure
of
the
fee
and
lou
programs?
You
know
so
all
of
these
things
are
just
on
the
table
as
far
as
discussion
on
how
we
want
to
format
and
frame
these
conversations
going
forward.
So
this
can
just
be
discussion
at
this
point,
so
I
saw
that
perrin
or
patrick-
I
guess,
patrick.
D
So
I
I
agree
with
everything
that
you
said
amy
I
am
going
to
now
that
we
passed
this
letter
of
recommendation.
D
I'm
going
to
recommend
to
the
budget
working
group
that
a
member
of
the
urban
forestry,
commission
and
or
ben
woody
put
together
a
powerpoint
presentation
to
the
city
council.
That
not
only
encompasses
this.
The
points
of
this
recommendation,
but
also
particularly
with
an
emphasis
on
climate
justice,
but
also
emphasizing
the
past
work
that
the
urban
forestry
commission
has
done
to
make
asheville
a
better
city.
A
P
I
have
seen
I
have
seen
presentations
to
counsel
from
a
border
commission
that
usually
comes
with
some
sort
of
annual
report,
but
recommendations
can
certainly
come
to
the
liaison
which
I'll
commit
to
do
and
then
also
any
member
of
this
group
could
reach
out,
especially
the
chair
and
or
the
vice
chair
to
the
mayor,
to
request
that
for
a
future
agenda.
B
I'm
sorry,
I
think
that
timing
is
very
important
too,
as
we're
moving
into
the
budget
cycle
that
you
know,
we
we
get
our
thoughts
on
the
table
as
early
as
possible
and
make
our
points
as
poignant
as
possible.
So.
P
I'll
also
add
a
personal
thing
that
I've
offered
to
do
to
the
chair
and
vice
chair,
but
to
this
whole
group
is
that
when
I
send
these
reports,
whenever
you
make
recommendations
like
you
did
with
the
properties
today
and
with
this
budget
recommendation,
that
instead
of
just
sending
it
to
the
chair
and
vice
chair
I'll,
just
copy
each
of
the
group
members,
so
that
you
can
follow
up
with
each
member
of
council.
If
you
need
to
to
make
sure
that
we
received
it.
K
A
All
right,
we
lost
a
little
bit
of
your
audio,
but
it
sounds
like
you
want
to
work
on
a
presentation
for
council
excellent.
I
do
as
well.
Would
anyone
else
be
interested
in
working
on
that
we
could
form
a
small
working
group
and
then
we
could
bring
it
to
the
larger
group
as
well,
but
apparently.
A
All
right-
and
I
agree
with
ed's
point-
the
timing
is
important,
so
I
would
think
sooner
than
later
would
be
good.
You
know
we
have
this
recommendation
for
the
budget
requests
going
up
if
we
could
get
in
front
of
city
council
and
talk
to
you
know
the
existing
members
sooner
than
later.
I
think
that
would
get
it
on
the
radar
for
this
budget
cycle.
Does
that
make
sense
or.
K
A
Okay,
all
right.
Well,
then,
I
will
reach
out
with
parent
and
cecil
and
we'll
see
if
we
can
put
together
something
rapidly
and
I'll
reach
out
to
the
mayor
and
see
how
we
can
coordinate
to
get
on
the
agenda
and
when
that
might
happen,
all
right.
Any
other
discussion
around
that
feel
free
to
read
my
notes,
and
you
can
reach
out
to
me-
or
you
know,
through
discussion
or
email,
send
future
ideas
and
suggestions.
Yeah
karen.
C
Yeah
so
amy,
I
thought
you
did
an
excellent
job
of
synthesizing.
A
lot
of
the
main
ideas
of
what
we're
after
on
ufc
in
that
document,
definitely
endorse
everything
you
know
said
there
and
in
patrick's
document
as
well.
C
I
and
this
budget
item
I
just
think,
is
a
special
one,
the
urban
forester
and
and
plan-
and
you
know
I
think
we
can
think
about
this
and
to
I
agree
with
you
amy
that
there's
a
point
at
which
we'll
saturate
city
council,
with
our
recommendations
and
then
they'll
all
just
kind
of
blend
together
and
and
lose
some
of
their
punch.
But
I
think
on
the
budgeting
issue.
We
have
to
think
about
this
from
almost
from
a
campaign
mindset.
You
know
this
isn't
just
a
one
and
done
kind
of
a
thing.
C
We
have
to
kind
of,
introduce
it
and
then
reinforce
it
and
continue
to
reinforce
it,
and
so
I
think
it
is
going
to
take
multiple
missives
to
city
council
to
sort
of
make
sure
that
what's
happened
in
prior
years,
which
is
that
we,
by
the
time
we
realize
what's
going
on
we're
so
behind
the
the
work
that
council's
already
done
on
the
budget,
that
we
sort
of
get
left
out
and
and
so
yeah.
C
It's
great
to
see
us
getting
proactive
and
sort
of
getting
an
early
start,
and
I
think
that's
what
it's
going
to
take
to
finally
get
get
our
request
in
line
so
that
it
actually
makes
it
through
the
process
this
time.
So
so
yeah
just
a.
I
think
it's
going
to
be
a
bigger
effort
and
it's
going
to
take
a
long
time
and
that's
a
good
thing,
because
we
need
to
campaign
on
this
with
council.
A
K
Well,
I
would,
I
would
know
that
it's
in
the
citizen
times
this
week
there
was
a
an
article
about
the
the
disparity
in
the
environmental
situation
for
different
neighborhoods
in
asheville.
I
mean
the
same,
and
it
was
amazing
to
me
that
the
article
did
not
mention.
K
The
work
we've
done,
you
know,
for
instance,
the
heat,
the
heat
island
effect
that
was
shown
with
the
nasa
participation,
but
I
mean
it's
it.
It
is
currently
on
the
city's
plate.
A
A
Of
that,
I
pulled
up
one
thing
that
we
can
focus
on
the
city
council
priorities
that
they've
put
in
place
for
the
past
few
years
and
they
update
with
you
know
bullet
points
of
how
they
have
tried
to
meet
their
goals
and
strategies
in
their
focus
areas
and
the
two
that
we
can
focus
on
that.
Unfortunately,
in
all
these
pages
of
notes,
there's
no
bullet
points
about
trees
at
all,
but
under
a
clean
and
healthy
environment
and
a
well-planned
and
livable
community.
A
We
can
easily
insert
bullet
points
on
where
we
have
made
progress
already
to
meet
those
city
council
priorities
and
then
how
working
within
an
urban
forestry
and
green
infrastructure
framework
does
meet
those
priorities
as
well
yeah.
So
we
can
put
that
in
our
presentation
to
council
yep.
Everybody
can
see
it
all
right.
Anything
else.
P
The
last
not
to
take
up
more
time,
but
the
trees
and
the
heat
index
are
both
mentioned
in
the
story
in
the
attached
document,
so
check
out
the
attached
documents.
P
C
H
A
Thank
you
all
right
anything
else.
I
don't
want
to
cut
anybody
off.
Sorry.
Do
we
have
our
last
line
item?
I
just
briefly
wanted
to
mention
that
we
have
the
upcoming
meetings
at
the
end
of
the
year.
Normally
in
december,
we
do
not
have
a
meeting,
we
have
a
get-together,
but
that's
usually
because
our
meeting
fell
later
in
the
month.
A
So
I
wanted
to
get
input
from
this
group
if
we
would
like
to
have
a
regular
meeting
in
december
since
it'll
be
that
first
week
of
december
and
then
potentially
change
our
january
meeting,
because
that'll
be
that
first
week,
right
after
new
year's
day,
potentially
change
our
january
meeting
to
a
non-regular
meeting
and
have
our
annual
retreat
toward
the
end
of
january.
A
So
I
don't
know
if
there's
any
discussion,
we
don't
necessarily
have
to
decide
this
minute
since
we're
really
over
on
time,
but
wanted
to
bring
that
up
to
just
start
looking
at
your
calendar
and
think
about
how
we
might
want
to
structure
those
meetings.
S
F
I'll
be
going
off
of
a
commission
this
year.
This
will
be
my
last
year,
so
you
know
you'll
be
I'm
not
sure.
If
I'm,
I
think,
I'm
going
off,
but
you
know
recruiting
new
member
whatever.
A
Yeah
december
we'll
have
to
talk
about
our
right
officers
and
membership.
That's
right.
K
I've
never
understood
why
we
don't
have
meetings
around
the
holiday,
so
I
have
as
many
meetings
as
possible.
A
H
A
At
the
calendar,
though,
for
january,
because
it
may
not
make
sense
depending
on
how
the
holidays
fall
for
a
meeting
at
the
beginning
of
january,
but
we
could
have
our
retreat,
which
I
think
would
be
nice
to
have
right
at
the
beginning
of
the
year-
maybe
a
couple
weeks
into
january.
So
for
now
keep
it
in
your
mind
and
check
your
calendars,
and
we
can
revisit
and
finalize
that
next
month.
So
we
have
some
time.
H
Also,
just
so
you
know,
the
meeting
in
january
city
city
is
closed.
The
friday
before
and
the
monday
before.