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From YouTube: Planning & Economic Development Committee
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A
All
right,
you're
live.
Thank
you
good
afternoon,
I'm
gwen
whistler,
I'm
the
chair
of
the
planning
and
economic
development
committee
and
I'd
like
to
welcome
you
to
our
march
8th
meeting.
All
council
members
and
staff
are
participating
virtually
to
help
our
audience
follow
along
I'll
state.
Each
section
of
the
agenda
aloud.
A
We
are
streaming
live
on
our
virtual
engagement
hub,
which
is
accessible
through
the
virtual
engagement
hub
link
on
the
front
page
of
the
city's
website.
We
also
have
an
option
for
the
public
to
listen,
live
by
phone
by
dialing,
855
925
and
entering
the
code
8187
for
those
of
you
out
there
today
with
us.
A
A
855-925-2801
meeting
code
8187,
your
phone
will
be
muted
and
you
will
hear
the
meeting
live
at
this
point.
Callers
will
hear
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Press
star,
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3
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live
and
join
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queue
if
you
are
watching
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live
stream,
while
you're
listening
to
the
meeting
by
phone,
please
be
sure
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turn
down
the
volume
on
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device
before
speaking.
A
A
No,
oh,
give
me
the
high
sign:
okay,
councilwoman
sage,
turner,.
A
C
A
And
a
second
we'll
roll
call
to
approve
the
motion
end.
Second,
when
I
say
your
name,
please
say
aye
to
approve
the
minutes:
councilwoman
kilgore,
aye,
councilwoman,
turner,
hi,
and
I'm
also-
and
I
minutes
have
been
approved
and
then
the
second
thing
on
the
agenda
is
the
revisions
to
the
homestay
ordinance,
so
we're
we're
gonna
get
an
update
on
the
draft
zoning
text.
Amendment
regarding
homestays,
shannon
tuck,
will
start
us
off
on
this
item,
so
everybody
should
mute
other
than
shannon.
E
Thank
you
councilwoman
whistler
and
committee
members,
so
the
subject
of
homestays
is
one.
That's
been
before
the
ped
on
several
occasions
in
the
past
couple
years,
and
the
last
review
of
homestays
and
related
concerns
was
back
in
june
of
2019
and
the
ped
members
at
that
time
wanted
to
move
forward
with
a
change
in
the
city's
definition
of
kitchen.
E
So
today
that
definition,
which
is
still
in
place
today,
classifies
any
space
that
has
any
one
of
the
three
main
components
of
a
kitchen,
a
kitchen.
So
if
you
have
any
one
of
those
three
things
which
is
a
stove,
a
full-size
refrigerator
or
a
sink,
you
are
classified
as
a
kitchen.
So
what
this
meant
for
home
stays
because
home
stays
by
definition
were
part
of
a
home
and
not
a
separate
dwelling
unit.
E
It
meant
that
they
couldn't
have
a
kitchen.
This
definition
allowed
them
to
have
what
we
sort
of
refer
to
as
a
convenience
center.
So
what
you
typically
find
in
your
sort
of
average
hotel
room.
You
know
you
might
have
a
mini
fridge,
a
coffee
pot,
a
microwave
things
of
that
nature.
That
was
permitted,
but
these
larger
sort
of
kitchen
amenities
or
permanent
kitchen
amenities
like
the
stove,
the
refrigerator
and
the
sink
were
not
allowed.
E
So
ped
had
heard
well.
The
full
council
had
heard
from
a
number
of
members
in
the
community
that
that
was
really
restrictive.
They
wanted
us
to
reconsider
the
definition
of
kitchen
to
allow
a
sink,
and,
in
the
end,
back
in
june
of
2019,
the
ped
recommended
that
we
revised
that
definition
to
allow
a
sink
in
a
refrigerator
but
to
not
allow
the
stove
to
use
the
stove
as
that
defining
feature
that
made
a
kitchen
and
that's
where
we
last
left
off
in
2019.
E
That
would
better
address
these
community
and
staff
concerns.
So
we
came
up
with
a
slightly
revised
proposal,
so
we
do
recommend
revising
the
definition
of
kitchen,
but
rather
than
just
allow
the
sink
in
the
refrigerator,
we're
recommending
that
we
consider
allowing
the
stove
as
well.
So
one
thing
that
we
saw
during
the
pandemic
is
that
there
was
greater
interest
and
flexibility
that
would
allow
these
spaces
to
be
used
for
long-term
housing.
E
When
that
short-term
demand
wasn't
there.
So
it
gave
everybody
more
flexibility
to
adapt
to
changing
conditions,
both
whether
it's
personal
conditions
like
you're
in
a
different
life
stage,
and
you
don't
want
to
rent
short
term
any
longer.
And
now
you
want
to
turn
into
a
long-term
unit
or
if
it
was
something
more
societal
like
this
pandemic.
E
It
also
helped
us
with
an
enforcement
challenge
that
staff
was
having
with
stoves,
because
it
was
a
problem
we
had
experienced
in
the
past
before
we
adopted
the
definition
of
kitchen.
You
know
a
lot
of
people
would
just
take
out
the
stove
to
get
their
home
state
permit
and
then,
as
soon
as
they
got
the
permit,
they
would
put
the
stove
back
in,
and
you
know
it
was
something
that,
from
on
a
practical
level,
was
just
very
difficult
to
enforce.
E
We
also
saw
a
lot
of
people
bringing
in
other
kinds
of
cooking
appliances,
some
of
some
of
which
are
probably
fine
and
safe,
but
others
that
were
more
concerning.
So
we
just
thought
this
was
easier.
It
provided
that
flexibility
and
it
kind
of
resolved
that
enforcement
issue.
E
The
second
big
change
that
we're
proposing
is
to
require
that
a
property
owner
participate
in
the
management
of
the
home,
stay
with
the
tenant
manager
or
resident
manager
when
the
owner
doesn't
live
on
the
property.
So
when
the
owner
isn't
the
one
running
the
homestay
living
there
managing
things
they
were
under
today's
rules
really
not
supposed
to
participate
in
the
homestay,
it
was
whoever
was
that
per
permanent
full-time
resident
was
supposed
to
be
the
manager
of
the
homestay.
E
We
had
a
lot
of
property
owners
wanting
to
participate
and
just
sort
of
work
cooperatively
with
that
tenant,
and
that
was
another
enforcement
challenge,
was
sort
of
you
know,
keeping
owners
out
of
the
picture
it
just
again
wasn't
particularly
practical,
and
also
there
was
a
benefit.
So
not
only
does
it
allow
the
property
owners
to
participate
in
the
management
of
the
home,
stay
and
work
out,
whatever
arrangements
with
the
resident
manager
that
they
felt
were
appropriate.
E
It
also
gave
us
the
opportunity
to
identify
all
of
the
owners
on
the
application
and
then
limit
the
number
of
homestay
permits
to
one
person
or
household
llc,
trust
or
legal
entity.
So
how
this
would
work
is
you
would
apply?
You
would
have
both
the
resident
manager
identified
as
one
of
the
hosts,
and
then
anybody
who's
listed
as
a
property
owner
would
also
have
to
be
an
applicant
or
a
co-applicant.
E
So
you
could
have
one
or
four
it
doesn't
really
matter,
and
if
it's
an
llc
or
a
trust
or
corporation,
then
the
applicant
would
have
to
identify
who
the
individuals
are.
We
can
actually,
we
have
ways
of
checking
that
and
if
so,
if
there
is
a
home,
that's
owned
by
an
llc
with
three
different
individuals
who
are
all
managing
members
or
members
of
that
llc,
then
we
would
have
all
we
would
have
those
three
people
plus
the
resident
manager
listed,
and
then
those
llc
members
or
investors
wouldn't
be
able
to
get
any
more
homestay
permits.
E
So
if
their
name
popped
up
on
any
other
applications,
they
would
bar
them
from
being
issued
a
home
state
permit
for
any
of
those
other
properties.
So
this
was
another
thing
that
we
were
very
interested
in.
Trying
to
control
for
and
manage
on.
The
city's
part
was
to
limit
the
opportunity
for
property
investors
to
be
able
to
just
kind
of
install
a
resident
manager
in
you
know
any
one
of
their
multiple
properties
and
get
a
homestay
permit,
because
everybody
was
working
out.
E
This
would
we
had
a
couple
instances
where
people
took
accessory
dwelling
units
or
detached
accessory
dwelling
units
and
sort
of
disassembled
or
deconstructed
the
kitchen
so
that
it
it
redefined
it
as
no
longer
a
dwelling
unit,
but
rather
just
a
detached
accessory
structure
which
then
allowed
them
to
use
it
as
a
homestay.
We
didn't
really
want
people
using
these
spaces
that
were
better
suited
for
long-term
living.
E
A
Okay
does
do
the
committee
members
have
any
questions
for.
B
B
I
guess
a
little
background
first,
so
why
are
we?
Where
did
this
need
to
address
this?
Come
from
from
people
that
are
within
their
home
state
currently
have
homestays
and
they're
requesting
that
they
be
able
to
have
more
flexibility
within
them
or
did
staff
want
this
initiative?
How
did
we
get
here?
I
think.
E
It's
a
little
bit
of
both
we
before
the
adoption
of
the
kitchen
definition
we
had
defined.
You
know
kitchen
informally,
like
we
sort
of
determined
so
that
let
me
back
up
a
home
state
by
definition,
is
just
a
portion
of
somebody's
home.
So
if,
if
you
have
a
private
living
space
and
you
have
a
a
sleeping
room,
a
bathroom
and
a
kitchen,
you
are
by
by
definition
a
dwelling
unit
and
that
cannot
be
used
as
a
homestay.
E
A
homestay
has
to
be
spaced
within
the
dwelling
unit,
so
it's
very
common
in
these
private
living
spaces
to
have
the
bedroom
in
the
bathroom.
It
was
less
common
to
have
the
kitchen,
and
certainly,
if
you
think,
of
a
typical
hotel,
you
don't
a
hotel
room,
you
don't
usually
have
a
kitchen,
so
we
so
before
we
had
a
definition
of
kitchen,
that's
how
we
defined
it.
So
people
would
just
in
order
to
get
a
homestay
permit
for
that
accessory
living
space.
E
E
E
E
So
when
the
ped
heard
this
back
in
june
of
2019,
I
think
I
think
it's
fair
to
say
they
basically
agreed
with
that.
They
said
yeah,
we
get
it
sync's
important.
Let's
let
them
have
the
sync,
but
we
don't
want
these
spaces
to
be
turned
into
dwelling
units,
so
we're
not
going
to
love
a
stoke.
E
E
How
do
we
preserve
housing?
Is
it
really
like
keeping
a
stove
out
of
these
spaces,
or
is
it
really
trying
to
limit
the
number
of
investors
coming
in
and
buying
up
properties
and
turning
them
into
home
stays?
What
is
it
so?
It
was
also,
I
think
something
you
know.
I
think
the
pandemic
also
taught
us
a
lesson
that
it's
kind
of
nice
or
it's
beneficial-
to
have
the
flexibility
to
go
between
long
and
short.
E
It's
perhaps
not
perfect
solution,
but
it's
something
that
I
think
we
felt
like
we
could
live
with
and
it
resolved
that
enforcement
issue
and
we
focused.
Then
we
then
turned
our
attention
to
these
other
things.
You
know
protecting
the
accept,
detached
accessory
dwelling
units
and
then
trying
to
control
the
investors,
so
those
are
the
other
two
sorry.
B
That's
kind
of
a
it's
okay.
I
think
it
helps,
and
I
think
you
know
there
might
be
some
folks
watching.
That
would
like
to
hear
all
that
again.
Can
I
ask
brad
a
question.
Brad
in
your
knowledge,
can
an
llc
be
established
without
the
entire
ownership
being
public
information.
C
I
think
that's
a
that's
a
good
question
and
let
me
say
that
the
way
that
north
carolina
handles
llc's
is
that,
generally,
you
must
file
your
documents
publicly.
With
the
secretary
of
state's
office
establishing
who
the
quote
members
are.
Members
are
just
the
term
given
to
ownership
individuals
within
a
limited
liability
company.
Much
like
shareholders
would
be
established
for
a
corporation,
so
you
have
to
at
least
provide
on
an
annual
basis,
a
list
of
those
members.
C
Now,
unlike
a
corporation,
that
could
have
many
many
stockholders,
generally
speaking,
llcs
are
going
to
be
limited
to
fewer
members
and
those
members
do
have
to
register.
So
you
could
set
up
an
llc
with
multiple
agreements
in
place
where
someone
would
have
an
interest
in
the
llc,
but
the
members
themselves
are
supposed
to
be
registered.
B
I
mean
I
so
personally
I'll
just
put
my
opinion
out
there.
I
am
very
worried
about
freeing
up
and
creating
more
flexibility
that
could
impact
long-term
rentals
becoming
short-term
rentals.
So
I
would
you
know,
I
understand
this
is
a
long,
ongoing
conversation.
I
should
actually
step
back
and
say
I
am
a
homestay
owner.
I
have
a
homestay
okay,
so
I
feel
like
that's
a
fair
thing.
I
have
a
homestay
without
a
kitchen
that
has
a
bathroom
with
a
large
sink
and
all
my
years
I've
never
had
a
complaint
from
a
guest.
B
So
in
some
ways
I'm
coming
from
a
place
of
experience,
saying
there's
a
lot
of
flexibility
in
the
existing
ordinances
and
options,
and
I
know
from
first
hand
that
it's
not
actually
a
complaint
that
can
come
from
guests.
Some
people
might
be
getting
complaints
and
I
wouldn't
know
that,
but
I
would
like
for
us
to
know
before
we
take
such
a
leap,
because
I've
gotten
only
about
12
emails
or
calls
about
this
from
folks
with
home
stays
that
would
like
to
have
nicer
home
stays.
B
Do
we
have
any
idea
because,
on
the
one
hand,
we're
trying
to
help
a
dozen
or
so
people,
even
if
it's
50
people
convert
back
and
forth
to
long
term
and
short
term,
and
on
the
other
hand,
we
have
potentially
thousands
of
units
that
could
be
at
risk,
and
you
know
we
know
we
have
an
enforcement
issue,
as
is
we
estimate,
we
have
hundreds,
if
not
over
a
thousand
illegal
units,
and
I
just
you
know
last
time
we
brought
this
up.
I
think
it
was
in
pd,
I'm
not
even
sure
we
said
you
know.
B
B
How
can
we
get
there
before
we
just
create
more
opportunities
for
more
short-term
rentals,
and
I
think
we
all
know
we
have
an
enforcement
issue.
I
think
we
all
know
we
have
legalist
rentals
in
our
neighborhoods.
I
could
tell
you
about
five
in
my
block,
and
I
mean
maybe
some
examples
would
help.
I
have
a
neighbor
with
a
walk-out
basement
who
houses
an
elderly
woman
who
needs
to
have
other
family
members
around
or
people
around.
In
case
she
falls.
Would
she
lose
her
apartment?
B
You
know,
would
my
neighbors
across
the
street,
they
keep
a,
I
should
say
across
street
and
a
block
over.
They
keep
a
kind
of
a
personal
helping
assistant
in
their
basement
and
that's
the
they
help
them
with
the
house
and
that's
how
they
get
their
rent.
Would
that
person
be
subject
to
possibly
losing
their
rental?
I
mean
you
know.
These
are
the
risks
that
I'm
trying
to
weigh
because
I'm
a
lot
more
concerned
about
the
people
who
are
facing
housing
in
security,
not
able
to
find
apartments
seeing
it
explosive
prices.
B
Just
economics
is
telling
us
right
now.
Price
has
gone
up
900
in
three
years
or
something
and
I'm
not
more
worried
about
them.
No
disrespect
to
the
folks
with
the
existing
home
stay,
I'm
worried
more
about
the
renters
and
people
that
could
be
impacted
than
making
sure
these
few
can
have
a
better
experience
with
their
home
stay.
E
Well,
it's
a
really
tough
question
to
answer.
I
think,
while
the
flexibility
could
potentially
displace
somebody,
because
now
a
space
that
might
have
been
used
long
term
could
be
attracted
to
a
property
owner
as
a
homestay.
E
It
also
gives
people
an
incentive
to
create
more
of
these
spaces,
so
while
one
person
may
just
be
displaced,
there
could
be
more
options
for
this
kind
of
long-term
housing
out
there.
Now
how
that
really
manifests?
It's
it's
hard
to
say.
You
know
it's
hard
to
have
that
crystal
ball
and
know
exactly
what
the
outcome
might
be.
B
It's
true-
and
I
was
thinking
about
you
know
in
the
affordable
housing
world
we
talk
about
noaa's,
naturally
occurring
affordable
housing.
So,
as
these
knew,
we,
you
know
tend
to
beat
up
these
new
expensive
apartments
coming
on
the
market
say:
well,
no
one
can
afford
it,
but
over
time
they
become
affordable
because
newer
things
hit
the
market.
So
follow
me
for
a
second.
So
now
we
say:
okay,
you
can
have
a
kitchen,
you
can
have
a
stove,
you
can
have
a
fridge,
you
can
have
a
sink.
B
Have
we
just
then
impacted
those
folks
who
have
a
bedroom,
they're,
renting
and
we're
using
it
to
get
by.
You
know
I
mean,
is
there
like
a?
Did
we
just
create?
Do
we
take
our
nicest
units
and
give
them
to
tourists,
leave
the
lesser
quality
ones
for
locals?
I'm
just
really
worried
about
it.
I
would
feel
better
if
we
had
enforcement.
I
would
feel
better
if
we
knew
how
many
apartments
and
units
we
were
putting
at
risk.
B
I
would
feel
better
if
I
understood
why
these
folks,
with
the
homestays,
can't
be
more
creative
and
put
big
sinks
in
their
bathrooms.
I
just
am
a
little
confused
about
why
we
keep
bringing
this
up,
but
I
can
I'll
be
quiet.
I
have
a
long
list
and
I
would
love
to
hear
from
the
others,
because
I
may
just
be
talking
in
vain.
Maybe
there's
not
support
for
this,
and
I
don't
realize
it.
A
I
just
wanted
to
clarify
something
I
was
reading,
so
in
section
k,
shannon
it
says,
detached
structures
connected
by
a
breezeway
or
other
enclosed,
but
unheated
space
shall
not
be
deemed
one
dwelling
unit
for
the
purpose
of
this
subsection.
I
think
what
that's
saying
is
like
if
I
have
a,
if
I
have
a
garage
apartment
and
I've
got
a
little
breezeway
between
the
house,
you
know
the
main
house
and
the
garage
apartment
just
because
I've
got
one
connection
that
doesn't
that
doesn't
allow
that
garage
apartment
to
be
a
homestay.
A
Is
that
right?
Okay,
that
I
think
that
wording
could
be
better,
but
I
I
mean,
maybe
I
don't
know,
maybe
something
like
you
know
to
consider
it
not
detached
it
has
to
be
connected
with
under
air
conditioning
or
heating,
or
something
like
that.
But
you
you
guys
I'm
sure
brad's
looked
at
the
word,
so
he's
probably
saying
gwen,
you
don't
know
what
you're
talking
about,
but
okay.
A
Go
ahead,
sage,
just
keep
going
with
your.
I
mean.
I
think
it's
important
to
you
know,
get
your
concerns.
Yeah.
B
They
did
well-
and
I'm
really
concerned
about
this,
because
you
know,
on
the
one
hand,
we
are
doing
everything
we
can
taxpayers
committed
to
25
million
dollars
in
bonds
to
build
affordable
housing,
we're
saying
things
on
one
hand
over
affordable
housing.
It
takes
as
much
as
80
000
in
subsidy
to
create
one
affordable
household,
but
we'll
give
away
our
basement
apartments.
I
I
just
don't
get
it
personally.
B
I
struggle
with
the
philosophy-
and
I
maybe-
and
this
is
what
I
tell
the
homestay
network-
I
mean
jackson,
if
you're
listening,
I've
always
been,
you
know
straightforward.
If
we
can
get
airbnb
to
help
us
or
any
short-term
rental
platform,
I
don't
think
expedia
is
as
relevant
because
they're
vrbo
and
those
are
long
longer
things,
but
these
short
rents
these
two
nights.
This
is
airbnb's
world.
B
If
we
can
get
them
to
work
with
us
on
data
like
they
do
in
other
cities,
and
we
can
call
all
the
illegal
ones,
we've
seen
at
least
five
illegal
ones
this
past
few
days,
and
we
could
get
a
better
understanding
of
how
much
inventory
of
our
housing
stock
we're
putting
at
risk.
I
mean
we
might
have
more
success
in
moving
forward,
or
maybe
we
were,
we've
built
a
few
thousand
units
in
five
years
and
we're
in
a
better
state
with
our
housing.
B
I
mean
I
just
don't
understand
why,
in
a
housing
shortage
a
housing
crisis,
we
call
it.
We
would
do
anything
that
could
pull
income
or
units
from
the
environment,
and
I
think
if
the
argument
is
that
the
homestay
user,
which
is
very
valid
and
is
true
in
my
case,
relies
on
that
income
to
remain
in
their
home
affordably.
I
totally
respect
and
understand
that
and
live
it
myself,
but
this
rule
has
not
been
preventing
me
from
doing
it.
So
I
don't
see
the
need
for
the
rule
change.
A
Would
you
would
you
be
willing
to
talk,
I
mean
so
what
your
point
is
is
or
let
me
just
ask
you
would
say
they
shouldn't
be
allowed
to
have
a
stove.
A
B
I
don't
know
what
the
what
a
stove
I
don't
know
other
than
it
being
like
an
extra
electrical
outlet
and
thing
and
a
bigger
object.
I'm
accomplishing
the
same
things
and
frankly,
these
folks
don't
even
really
love
to
cook.
They
go
eat
at
our
restaurants.
If
anything
need
bigger
refrigerators
for
to
go
and
not
everybody's
the
same,
I
don't
mean
to
generalize
every
guest
jackson,
probably
just
grimaced,
but
I
don't
know
about
the
it's
the
whole
kitchen.
It's
the
whole
unit
versus
a
part
of
your
home.
B
I
also
have
problems
with
the
idea
of
someone
acting
in
your
behalf,
the
the
what
is
it
co-host?
You
know,
and
I
had
to
explain
this
to
someone
just
yesterday.
I
said
I
don't
understand,
because
it's
really
it's
in
the
name
itself,
it's
the
home
stay!
It's
you
stay
at
home,
it's
the
homeowner,
it's
the
whatever
the
person
at
home.
I
don't
think
we
need
people
that
own
these
to
be
somewhere
else
with
third
parties
managing
them.
B
I
think
what
we're
trying
to
do
is
allow
for
renters
to
partake
in
this
environment
with
the
permission
of
the
homeowner,
which
we
probably
could
get
at
without
any
of
this
kitchen
stuff,
and
we
also
I
mean
I
just
don't
understand
that
one
either
and
I
think
what
I've
heard
from
some
hosts
in
the
community
is.
It
would
just
be
easier
for
them.
E
I
guess
that
I
think
that's
a
fair
observation
and
what
so,
let
me
just
say
like
today:
we
don't
allow
the
property
owner.
If
you
don't
live
on
the
property
you're
not
supposed
to
participate
in
the
home
stay,
but
they
do
the
bottom
line.
Is
they
do
it's
just
like
just
because
we
don't
allow
you
to
have
a
stove
doesn't
mean
you
aren't
cooking
in
that
space
they
are
they're
using
hot
plates
they're
using
convection
ovens
they're
using
toaster
ovens.
E
So
it's
kind
of
we're
trying
to
trying
to
get
at
a
that,
like
I
think
I
mentioned
before,
like
we're
just
trying
to
kind
of
get
it
out
in
the
open.
We
want
you
to
tell
us
who
is
there
managing
this
space
who
owns
the
property
so
that
we
can
keep
that
owner
from
doing
this
somewhere
else?
Like
you
get
the
one
you
just
get
the
one
so
right
now
we
have
people
who
might
own
five
or
six
or
four
or
however
many
properties,
and
they
do
this.
E
They
install
that
resident
manager
in
each
of
those,
and
then
they
really
they
either
charge
that
individual
more
rent.
So
they
benefit
that
way
or
they're
participating
without
being
like
kind
of
in
name
on
the
the
on
the
website.
You
know
they're
finding
ways
around
it,
so
they're
they're,
a
lot
of
them
are
still
benefiting,
but
just
in
a
way
that
is
difficult
for
us
to
detect.
E
So
we're
thinking
you
know,
but
we
also
recognize
that
those
resident
managers
are
likely
benefiting
in
some
way
they're
getting
either.
You
know
it's
some
deal,
they've
negotiated
with
the
property
owner.
They
get
some
portion
of
it,
they
get
a
break
in
their
rent
or
they
help
with.
Maybe
they
get
some
additional
money
for
cleaning
the
unit.
E
You
know
it
just
depends
everybody's
doing
something
a
little
bit
different
and
it
just
kind
of
it
allows
them
to
continue
to
benefit,
and
it
allows
us
to
regulate
those
property
investor
owners
a
little
bit
more
thoroughly,
that's
kind
of
the
goal,
but
we
can
go
a
lot
of
different
directions
with
regulation.
That's
true
yeah,
so.
B
F
F
44
was
actually
full
house
yeah
rumple.
B
Then
we
think
we
have,
you
know
as
many
as
a
thousand
illegal
I'll
share
this.
Just
because
it's
interesting,
I
have
family
trying
to
come
visit
right
now
and
they
were
looking
at
things
they're
too
large
to
stay
in
my
house
and
numbers,
so
they
were
looking
in
my
neighborhood.
They
kept
sending
me
like
hey.
What
do
you
think
about
this
one?
I
went,
I
think,
that's
totally
illegal.
They
sent
me
oh
well,
that
one's
illegal
too
I
mean
the
enforcement
is
so
challenging.
B
But
if
we,
I
just
don't
see
like
right
now
with
a
homestay,
we
have
people
telling
us
they're
living
in
the
home
and
that
they're
renting
a
room,
and
then
you
go
look
at
their
listing
and
it
says
it's:
the
entire
home
you'll
have
the
home
to
yourself,
so
they
are
leaving
and
their
advertising
and
such,
and
we
can't
do
anything
about
it.
So
now
are
we
giving
them
whole
houses?
B
B
So
I
don't
know
if
that's
like
co-host
their
friends
can't,
I
don't
know
but
they're
from
texas,
renting
places
in
west
asheville,
maybe
they're
the
few
grandfathered
in
maybe
they're
all
illegal.
So
I
have
so
many
flags
around
it
that
I
just
don't
know
how
we
would
move
forward
and
what
I've
been
telling
the
homestay
network
is
encouraging
them
who
have
been
able
with
their
power
to
talk
with
airbnb
and
get
them
to
the
table
and
jackson.
If
you're
listening.
Please
continue
to
do
that,
because
I
think
that's
what
we
need.
B
A
F
Well,
I'm
in
agreement
with
sage
on
that
I
think
it's
basically,
it
seems
to
be
a
regulation
problem
that
we
need
to
get
control
of
before
moving
forward
with
those
changes,
and
that's
just
so
because
if
you
don't,
if
you
can't
count
it
and
measure
it,
then
you
really
have
no
control
over
it.
So
for
that
reason
I
would
like
to
see,
like
I
said,
a
lot
of
the
steps
that
we're
making
to
actually
identify
and
putting
rules
and
regulations.
F
As
far
as
home
stays
like
she
said,
home
stays
should
be
homestays
and
that's
what
it
should
be
and
not
the
idea
of
having
them.
You
know
managed
by
someone
else,
because
that
becomes
something
totally
different
so
and
like
I
said,
we
need
to
really
work
on
that
part
of
it
and
and
and
then
once
we
can
control
it
and
know
the
numbers,
then
we
can
more
or
less
move
forward
with
the
changes.
F
I
think
so
I'm
in
agreement
with
that
right
now.
I
would
love
to
see
it
that
we
get
to
a
point
where
we're
able
to
allow
more
open
it
up
more
to
the
general
public,
but,
like
I
said,
I
think
we
just
need
to
take
steps
to
put
control
measures
in
place.
A
So
what
I'm
hearing
is
that
we
don't
have
consensus
to
move
this
forward.
To
counsel
can
I
can.
I
propose
a
friendly
amendment
to
that.
The
the
like
I'm
okay,
with
not
suggesting
this
go
forward
to
council
until
we
get
more
consensus
around
it.
But
can
I
also
ask
that
we
make
the
change
that
makes
it
very
clear
that
homestays
do
not
include
detached
dwelling
units,
because
that
is
for
me
a
big,
a
big
something
and
apparently
it's
not
clear
accessory.
A
Right
that,
if
it's
an
accessory
structure,
it
can
never
be
a
homestay,
no
matter
what
it
looks
like
I
mean
I
would
just
that's
the
one
change
for
me
that
I'd
like
to
see
put
in
place,
even
if
none
of
the
other
things
get
put
in
place.
A
You
know
a
you
know:
it
has
plumbing,
etc
in
it,
and
people
are
using
those
as
homestays
and
or
thinking
they
can
be
used
as
homestays,
and
so
that's
the
one
thing
for
me
that
if
we
don't
do
and
if
we
don't
recommend
anything
else
to
council,
that's
the
one
provision
that
I
would
say
needs
to
be
changed
that
we
just
need
to
make.
We
need
to
make
it
clear
within
the
ordinance
that
a
detached
unit
never
gets
to
be
a
homestay.
A
I
mean
and
I'll
give
you
an
example
in
my
neighborhood
there's
I
mean
this
garage
is
farther
farther
from
their
house,
the
main
house
than
it
is
to
the
house
next
door,
and
so
you
know,
if
somebody's
using
that
as
a
as
a
homestay,
the
homeowner
can't
hear
nearly
as
much
as
the
the
house.
A
Next
door
can
hear-
and
so
you
know
to
me-
that's
just
completely
out
of
the
realm
of
what
makes
sense
so
so
I
would
I
mean,
if
we're
not
going
to
move
this
thing
forward,
I
would
ask
that
we
asked
staff
to
move
that
piece
of
it
forward.
B
How
does
that
feel
to
y'all
and
staff
I
mean
first
chris:
do
you
have
any
idea
how
many
of
these
accessory
structures
are
being
used
as
homestays
and
then
shannon
I'd?
Ask
you:
how
would
that
feel
to
move
just
that
one
piece
forward:
do
you
feel
like
it
would
open
up
a
whole
nother
book
of
worms
and
dwelling
units
and.
E
I
would
say
that's
from
from
an
enforcement
standpoint:
that's
one
thing:
that's
fairly
easy
to
regulate
and
manage,
so
I
I
personally
wouldn't
have
any
concern
about
that.
There
aren't
a
lot.
I
think
chris,
you
probably
have
a
better
number,
but
I
think
we
what
we
were
thinking
like
a
dozen
or
so
of
these
that
might
be
rendered
non-conforming.
E
D
Say
higher
than
that,
I
don't
have
a
real
reliable
number
for
you
just
so
there's
not
a
specific
metric.
We
track,
but
it's
not
like
the
majority
of
them.
That's
probably
a
small
handful
of
less
than
50,
I'm
really
confident
in
saying,
but
probably
far
less.
A
I'm
clarifying
that
because
one
of
the
things
you
know
when
we,
when
we
relax
the
rules
on
accessory
structures
and
accessory
and
accessory
dwelling
units,
we
specifically
said
in
that
ordinance
that
it
was
never
to
be
used
for
short-term
rentals,
and
so
you
know
to
me
that
not
being
clear
to
people
that
they
can't
use
detached
units
as
success
as
short-term
rentals
or
home
stays
really
violates
the
spirit
of
that
previous
loosening
of
those
rules.
G
So,
just
to
clarify
chair
all
right,
our
as
it's
currently
written,
we
would
propose
that
the
existing
ones
be
grandfathered
and
that
that
we
would
not
allow
any
more
at
all
to
become
home
states,
and
I
just
want
to
clarify
that
that
would
be
your
recommendation
and
that
be
I'm
hearing.
You
say
that
that
would
be
your
only
recommended
change
to
the
ordinance
at
this
point
is
that
correct.
A
A
E
E
I
would
ask
that
maybe
we
include
a
few
of
these
little
things
that
I
don't
believe
are
controversial
like
requiring
that
a
applicant
b,
a
minimum
of
18
years
of
age,
there's
a
couple
like
that
that
I
don't
the
homestay
network
didn't
have
a
problem
with,
and
I
don't
think
anybody
else
has
a
problem
with
and
we're
not
really
having
big
problems
with
those
things,
but
just
to
make
it
really
clear.
E
And
then
the
other
thing
that
I
would
ask
if
the
committee
would
be
willing
to
consider
is
just
making
at
least
a
tweak
to
the
definition,
because
today
the
definition
is
very
confusing
around
the
sink.
It
was
written
to
try
to
not
disqualify
somebody
from
having
a
utility
sink
when
it
was
in
a
utility
area,
so
it
used
these
dimensional
requirements,
it's
very
confusing,
and
so
what
people
are
trying
to
do
is
find
a
very
abnormally
non-standard
sink
and
put
it
in
their
home
stay.
E
E
Right
we
could
clarify
that
you
can
have
a
utility
sink
in
a
utility
area,
but
that
the
home
station
we
could
go
back
to
the
2018
definition,
which
is
or
the
intent
which
was
to
allow
a
convenience
center,
but
don't
have
those
more
permanent
kitchen
facilities
like
the
same
stove
and
the
full-size
refrigerator.
So
you
can
have
a
small
refrigerator.
You
can
have
the
microwave.
You
can
have
the
hot
plate.
E
You
can
have
the
coffee
pot,
that's
fine,
but
we
just
want
to
try
to
stop
you
short
from
like
turning
it
into
a
dwelling
which
is
now.
Do
you.
F
Do
you
think
this
a
sink
would
change
the
complexion
of
that
that
much
I
mean
I
can
see
how
a
stove
or
a
full-sized
refrigerator
would
but
a
sink,
especially
in
light
of
what's
going
on
with
the
covet
and
the
and
the
viruses,
and
you
know
not
really
knowing.
I
just
think
it's
it's
just
basically
a
safety
measure
to
have
in
a
homestay
to
have
access
to
a
sink
other
than
the
bathroom
seat.
Oh
so
they.
B
B
Then
it's
not
really
that
we're
saying
to
the
existing
homestay
members:
hey
go
ahead,
you
have
a
sink
and
what
we're
really
saying
is
hey
every
other
unit
in
the
city
that
has
this
makeup
you're
now
eligible
to
be
a
homestay,
and
that,
I
think,
is
the
big
difference
and
I
think
what
we're
getting
at
here-
and
maybe
let
me
ask
this
thought,
because
what
I
hear
from
the
homes
from
not
just
homeschooling
but
from
folks
with
these
home
stays
is
really
they
are
wondering.
How
can
I
be?
B
You
know
more
productive
and
supportive
of
the
things
I
want
to
do?
How
can
I
go
back
and
forth
between
long
and
short
term,
and
I
think
what
we're
saying
is-
or
at
least
what
I'm
saying
is:
I'm
not
ready
for
long
term
to
go
back
to
short
term?
But
if
you
have
somebody,
that's
okay
for
short
term,
how
can
they
go
back
and
forth?
B
And
I
think
these
homestays
should
have
a
primary
kitchen
already
right,
so
they
have,
they
have
a
working
house,
so
their
home
stay
could
be
is
unless
it's
got
a
separate
entrance
isn't
connected
to
the
other
one.
In
some
way
a
homestay
could
become
a
long-term
rental
just
as
legally,
because
it
has
a
kitchen
in
the
house,
but
maybe
our
tweak
is
that
you
don't
lose
your
home
stay
permanent.
I
mean
you,
don't
actually
you
don't?
B
E
And
we
do
we
allow
we
don't
necessarily
if,
if
you
are
a
homestay
permit
owner
and
you
want
to
go
to
long-term
for
a
period
of
time
as
long
as
you
maintain
your
homestay
permits,
we
don't
we
allow
you
to
interrupt
that
use.
C
E
Allowed
people
to
go
back
and
forth,
but
I
think
it
was
the
you
know
the
disassembling
of
the
kitchen
and
reassembling
of
the
kitchen.
That
was
the
thing
that
they
were
hoping
to
avoid.
B
That's
why
I
brought
it
up
because,
as
we're
going
to
talk
about
sinks
that
are
utility
size
sinks
that
are
kitchen
size,
we're
talking
about
plumbing
in
the
wall
sink
in
and
out
whatever
a
pvc
pipe,
that's
a
different
diameter,
so
I
still
am
like.
I
don't
think
we
should
have
kitchens,
because
what
we're
saying
is
that
it's
just
one
more
step
towards
a
long-term
rental
or
short-term
rental
for
a
long-term
rental,
and
we
still
have
no
enforcement.
So
to
me
it's
just
it's
all
the
same
question.
B
I
think
we're
trying
to
make
it
easier
for
a
small
group.
That's
really
going
to
impact
a
large
group-
and
I
I
kind
of
hate
to
say
that,
because
I
think,
as
a
help
us
to
the
home
state
folks,
you
have
creativity,
you
can
do
this
without
a
full-size
sink
and
it
won't
impact
your
income.
So
I
don't.
I
guess
I
just
don't
get
the
push
and
the
underlying
push
seems
to
keep
coming
back
to
taking
some
of
our
long-term
units
and
opening
them
up
to
short
term.
I'm
just
not.
Okay.
With
that.
A
F
Well,
like
I
said,
I'm
still
somewhat,
a
little
confused
is
because
basically
do
we
have
an
idea
as
to
like
she
was
talking
about
as
far
as
numbers
as
far
as
how
many,
how
many
home
stays
that
are
that
are
licensed
or
illegal.
That
actually
would
be
able
to
be
long
terms,
because
a
lot
of
the
homestay
rentals
really
aren't
able
to
be
converted
to
long
stay
right.
So,
but
does
that
make
sense?
F
Because
if,
if
you're,
if
you're
saying
that
you're
taking
homes
from
people
that
basically
would
have
been
long
term,
and
then
you
talk
about
home
stays
as
being
staying
in
the
same
house
using
a
certain
kitchen,
so
I'm
sort
of
getting
mixed
up
with
the
concept
of
how
that
affects
the
long-term
rentals.
Does
that
make
sense.
A
I
think
I
think
what
sage
is
saying-
and
you
know
just
maybe
I'll
enter.
I
think
what
her
concern
is
is,
if
you
know
you've
got
these
historically,
you
know
what
we
have
been
long-term
rentals.
A
You
know
their
basement
apartments
or
whatever,
and
there
and
now
now
they
kind
of
have
to
stay
long-term
rentals
because
they
have
a
kitchen
in
them
and
therefore
you
can't
make
them
short-term
and
so
she's
saying
that
if,
if
you're
allowing
the
full-blown
kitchen
to
remain
in
there,
then
maybe
some
of
these
you
know
basement
apartments
that
mother-in-law
suites
now
they're
gonna
take
they're
gonna
no
longer
be
long-term
rentals
because
we're
allowing
them
to
be
short-term
rentals.
I
think
that's
what
she's.
A
A
So
shannon
well
so
before
before
we
take
a
okay,
so
is
whatever
we've
talked
about
as
a
committee.
Is
that
moderately
clear?
What
no.
G
I
guess
let
me
let
me
ask
a
question.
So
we've
talked
about
three
separate
issues
and
then
we've
said:
there's
these
minor
things
right.
So
what
we're
hearing
is
the
concern
around
the
kitchen
definition
change
that
that
it
may
be
that
making
it
too
too
easy
will
open
up
people.
So
I'm
hearing
that
there's
not
agreement,
I'm
moving
that
part
forward
the
part
with
the
co-hosting.
G
G
We
had
hoped
that
by
allowing
co-hosting
and
putting
in
the
one
natural
person
that
that
could
no
longer
happen,
so
I
will
tell
you
that
the
reason
we
recommended
that
is
because
in
talking
with
brad-
and
I
may
ask
him
to
chime
in
that-
that
meant
that
you
wouldn't
have
people
in
california
buying
up
properties,
several
properties
and
driving
the
market
rate
up
in
the
area.
So
I
will
tell
you
that
was
our
recommendation
for
recommending
the
co-hosting,
so
we
know
exactly
who's
managing
it
and
the
same
person
is
managing
it
on
the
website.
G
It
sounds
to
me,
like
I'm,
questioning
this
from
what
you
all
are
saying.
You
all
are
fine,
with
the
detached
not
being
allowed
to
be
a
homestay
okay,
that
part
of
the
ordinance,
as
well
as
the
minor
changes
you're.
Okay
with
is.
B
A
But
but
now
do
we
have
consensus
around
the
the
residential
manager
and
the
owner
thing.
I.
B
A
But
but
brad's
saying
that
we
can,
I
mean
if
we
require
that
they
they
register
the
owner
of
it,
and
they
that
I
think
what
I
heard
was
that
we
can
enforce
that.
Well,.
A
So
yeah
so
sandra
you're
of
the
opinion
I
mean
just
to
ask
so
you
say
that
like
if,
if
I'm
a
renter
and
I'm
renting
a
home,
I
can't
have
a
homestay
because
it
has
to
be
the
owner.
A
B
How
to
enforce
it
in
a
way
that
doesn't
it's
the
same
thing
over
and
over
we're
trying
to
make
something
easy
for
good
hearted
people
with
good
intentions,
but
on
the
other
side
we
know,
there's
a
bunch
of
other
people
with
bad
intentions
that
will
take
advantage
of
it.
So
we
have
to
be
smarter.
We
have
to
figure
out,
it
probably
seems
like
airbnb
com.
You
know
helping
with
enforcement.
How
do
we
make
sure
that
only
one
person,
one
renter.
F
B
F
B
I
don't
know,
but
you
know,
there's
a
lot
of
cities
that
are
harping
on
these
short-term
rentals.
There's
some
cities.
We
can
look
to
that,
opened
them
up.
You
know
and
we
can
look
at
portland.
We
can
look
out
in
california
and
washington
and
we
can
see
good
and
bad
and
I
think
we
can
see
why
a
lot
of
cities
haven't
followed
suit.
E
If
it's
maybe
there,
maybe
we
should
go
back
to
the
drawing
board
on
this
particular
item,
and
maybe
I
don't
think
what
I'm
hearing
is.
You
all
aren't
concerned
necessarily
about
us
trying
to
limit
the
number
of
investors
you're
more
concerned
about
the
owners
participating
in
the
management
of
the
home
state,
because
those
are
the
two
I'm
concerned.
B
Concerned
that
the
current
state,
we
can't
prevent
it
from
happening
and
if
you
have
anybody,
that's
selling
a
house
or
a
piece
of
land
right
now.
You
know
it's
all
cash
buyers
from
outside
and
I
don't
want
them
coming
in
and
they
ask
the
same
thing.
I
date
a
realtor.
They
ask
the
same
thing
every
time.
Can
it
be
a
short-term
rental,
yeah
yeah?
I
know.
F
F
Go
ahead,
please
no
anyway,
and
I'm
in
agreement
with
that
because,
like
she
said
it's
what
happened
years
ago,
when
I
was
doing
real
estate
and
I
of
course
deal
with
a
lot
of
real
estate,
that's
in
the
gentrification
areas
and
what
was
happening
every
house
I
put
on
the
market
was
being
bought
up
cash
like
this,
and
they
were.
That
was
when
they
were
doing
the
short-term
rentals.
So
now
we're
finding
that
same
type
of
pattern
being
used
in
home
states.
F
So
we
have
to
find
some
kind
of
way
to
control
it
and
when
city
council
came
out
basically
and
said,
no
no
longer
we're
going
to
allow
short-term
riddles
within
the
city
of
whatever
it
did
die.
It
died
within
the
city.
So
I'm
saying
we
need
to
sort
of
maybe
come
up
with
some
ideas
to
sort
of
stop
the
investor
from
coming
in.
Actually,
you
know
taking
advantage
of
the
home
stays
for
the.
E
E
If
you
just
don't
think
the
way
we're
doing
it
is
right
or
or
is
your
concern
that
it
gives
the
owner
the
opportunity
to
kind
of
like
be
out
in
the
open,
with
helping
to
manage
that
homestay.
E
B
I
would
actually
have
to
say
I
think
staff
have
done
an
enormous
amount
of
work
and
I
greatly
appreciate
the
many
years
you
all
have
done
into
this,
so
I
don't
think
you're
doing
anything
wrong
or
incorrectly.
I
think
we're
all
just
trying
to
brainstorm
the
best
path
forward.
So
I
think
until
we,
I
guess
we
need
clarification
on.
Can
you
always
find
an
owner
of
an
llc,
because
I
don't
think
that
you
necessarily
can
nothing
on
you
brad.
B
E
E
Okay,
so
so
maybe
we
we
put
a
pin
on
that
one.
We
revisit
that
or
explore
that
further.
Can
I
just
also
clarify:
are
you
guys,
okay
with
us,
making
at
least
that
little
change
to
the
the
weird
dimensions
about
the
sink
and
just
clarify
like
this?
Is
you
you
can
have
a
utility
sink
in
your
utility
area,
but
we're
just
going?
I'm
not
I'm
not
okay
with
that.
Well,
because
right
now,
what's
happening
is
that
they
are.
Some
people
are
putting
sinks
in
their
home
states
because
of
the
way
the
definition
is
written.
F
Well,
I'm
not
really
like.
I
said:
I'm
not
really
opposed
to
the
sink.
I
I'm
more
or
less
opposed
to
the
full-sized
stones
and
refrigerators.
I
think
with
the
sink
like
I
said,
in
light
of,
because
I
think,
especially
with
this
kovac
thing,
I
think
you'll
find
more
people
feeling
more
comfortable.
F
You
know
staying
in
these
spaces
and
I
think
you
just
need
a
sink
for
just
safety
reasons
or
just
a
lot
of
sanitation
and
things
like
that,
because
even
if
you
have
a
microwave
or
you
have
you
know
you
bring
food
in,
you
may
need
somewhere
to
you
know.
B
I
would
wonder
you
know
in
the
beginning
what
happened
and
shannon
may
be
able
to
speak
to
this
when,
in
the
beginning,
what
happened
with
enforcement
was
people
would
apply,
they
would
roll
their
oven
and
the
refrigerator
out
the
door.
Hide
it
get
the
permit
roll
it
back
in.
So
the
thing
why
it
got
attached
to
the
sink
is
because
the
sink
can't
be
rolled
out
of
the
house,
so
the
sink
can't
be
pulled
temporarily
and
put
back
as
easily
as
an
oven
or
a
fridge,
and
I
mean
people
were
frankly
very
open
at
pnz.
F
I
mean
okay,
but
the
thing
is
this:
so
we're
going
back
to
rules
and
regulations
that
we
need
to
put
in
place
because
it's
going
to
happen,
it's
going
to
happen
regardless,
okay,
so
I'm
saying
that
what
we
really
need
to
start
working
on
is
trying
to
put
in
an
enforcement
rules
and
regulations
and
getting
some
type
of
people
together
that
actually
work
to
actually
make
sure
we
we
enforce
these
rules
and
regulations,
and
once
you
enforce
these
rules
and
regulations
and
you've
got
hefty
penalties
on
them.
E
Well,
from
an
enforcement
standpoint,
it
is
much
easier
to
say
you
can't
have
a
sink
because,
as
councilwoman
turner
has
said,
it's
you
can
easily
remove
a
refrigerator
or
even
a
stove
much
more
easily
than
you
can.
This
thing,
that's
true,
and
if
it
is
helpful
just
to
remind
the
council
members
that
these
individuals,
the
the
guests,
do
have
access
to
a
sink,
they
typically
have
a
private
bathroom
and
if
they
don't
have
a
private
bathroom,
then
they're
in
the
main
house
sharing
a
bathroom
and
a
kitchen.
E
E
You
know
with
the
guests
and
some
do
and
some
don't-
and
I
think
it's
those
who
kind
of
want
to
preserve
the
privacy
and
the
sanctity
of
their
dwelling
unit
that
they
are
trying
to
offer
full
amenities
in
the
private
living
space.
That's
being
used
as
a
homestay,
and
I
think
what
I'm
hearing
is
that
we
want
to
try
to
preserve
those
spaces.
Or
we
don't
want
to
make
it
easy
for
people
to
convert
those
fully
equipped
living
areas.
Long-Term
living
areas
into
homestays.
B
E
It's
it's
not
the
size
of
the
sink.
Really,
that's
it's
the
battery.
E
Definition
has
a
a
certain
size,
diameter
drain
and.
E
E
So
and
if,
if
building
code
reviews
an
application
with
the
sink
like
that
they're
gonna
say
well,
that's
a
kitchen
sink!
So
then
we're
back
to
them
meeting.
G
B
Have
a
strainer
in
it.
I
just
have
a
strainer
in
the
sink
and
I
have
rules
for
the
guests
to
make
sure
things
don't
go
down
there.
I
you
know,
maybe
I'm
just
too
simplistic
about
it,
all
I'm
really
protective
of
our
affordable
housing
and
I've
probably
done
enough
talking
and
I'm
sorry.
If
I
interrupted
you
several
times,
shannon.
E
Oh,
it's
fine!
It's!
You
know!
This
is
a
tough
one.
It's
just
really
tough.
It's
hard
to
navigate
it's
a
difficult
thing.
To
enforce
it's
difficult
to
monitor
it's
yeah!
I
mean
I'm,
not
surprised
that!
There's
some!
You
know
some
some
uncertainty
about
it.
So.
B
I
like
our
intentions,
though
we
want
renters
to
be
able
to
participate.
You
know
we
want
to
protect
our
long-term
housing
and
we
want
enforcement
around
people
that
are
doing
it
correctly.
I
think
we
have
the
right
intentions
and
we're
all
we're
all
struggling
with
the
fact
that
the
platforms
and
the
way
to
get
there
are
not
quite
fluid,
and
it's
really
because
of
these
big
entities
preventing
working
together.
A
A
Okay,
all
right
so
can
someone
make
a
motion
articulating
where
we
are
or
maybe
we
can
ask
shannon
to
make
that
motion,
and
one
of
us
can
back
her
up
on
that.
E
So
what
I
heard
was
a
recommendation
to
move
forward
with
the
minor
revisions,
in
addition
to
the
revision
regarding
detached
accessory
structures
and
prohibiting
their
uses
home
stays
and
grandfathering
the
ones
that
are
existing,
and
I
I
think
I
heard
to
clarify
that
sinks
aren't
permitted.
I
mean
they.
That
was
the
intent
of
the
definition
that's
in
place
now,
but
there's
just
a
funny
little
loophole
and
we
want
to
close
that
loophole.
B
We
try
and
come
up
with
a
way
to
establish
how
many
units
we
might
be
putting
at
risk
if
this
move
forward-
or
maybe,
if
that's,
I
guess
we
don't
have
to
if
it's
not
going
to
council
quite
yet,
but
if
the
kitchen
thing
starts
coming
back
and
ready
for
council,
I
really
want
us
to
have
some
more
data
on
who
would
be
impacting
not
just
who
we'd
be
helping,
but
I
think
moving
forward
minor
conditions,
removing
accessory
or
detached
structures
was
the
two
we
did
agree
on,
but
then
does
the
motion
need
to
include
removing
sinks
as
an
option.
E
E
A
You'll,
take
that
out.
Okay
I'll
make
a
motion.
Chris,
do
you
have
a
sense
in
response
to
councilwoman,
turner's
questions
and
councilwoman's
killcore's
question
about?
Is
there
any
way
to
have
a
sense
of
inventory
about
these
units
that
are
currently
long-term
rentals
that
could
possibly
do
we
have
a
way
to
know
that.
D
So
I
I
think
what
I
kind
of
heard
was
like
finding
out
how
much
housing
stock
we
could
be
affecting
or
how
much
potential
housing
stock
could
be
affecting
through
that,
and
I
want
to
tell
you
that's
really
easy
to
find
okay,
but
it's
it's
not
because
we're
talking
about
you
know
ancillary
basement
spaces
that
may
or
may
not
be
rented,
and
you
know
things
of
that
nature.
B
Yeah
I
mean
maybe
this
is
where
this
is
the
task
right
like
in
asking
y'all
to
investigate
this,
because
we
do
know,
I
mean
we
get
data
around
how
many
people
own
their
homes.
We
know
how
many
white
people
in
their
homes
and
how
many
black
people
in
their
homes-
we
know
you
know.
So
if
we
have
those
numbers,
then
should
we
assume
the
rest
are
rentals?
I
mean.
E
Chris,
could
we
can
you
run
a
report
on
I'm
trying
to
think?
If
there's,
I
guess
I
don't
know
how
we
would
do
this
running
a
report
on
excela
for
the
number
of
like
basement
renovations.
D
You
can
give
us,
let
me
say
this:
anything
we
find
is
going
to
be
a
little
fuzzy
because
we're
not
going
to
catch
everything,
but
we
can
try
to
come
up
with
something
that
will
give
a
sense,
at
least.
D
D
B
And
doesn't
have
to
be
an
adu
right
like
allowing
a
kitchen,
would
allow
an
apartment
in
a
carpet
complex
to
be
a
homestay.
I
mean
it's
just
wide
open
then.
So
it's
essentially
any
rental
we
have
in
the
entire
city
of
asheville
would
be
subject
to
this.
It's
just
a
matter
of
how
many
rentals
do
we
have
and
do
we
know
it
seems
like
a
pretty
big.
A
Right,
but
I
mean
it's
not
legal,
so
it
wouldn't
be
every
rental
unit
in
the
city
that
that
we
are
permitting.
It
would
only
be
if
there's
a
if,
if
there's
two
families
or
two
units
under
the
same
roof.
D
B
I
hate
to
be
the
devil's
advocate
and
assume
that
people
will
do
the
worst
thing,
but
there
are
people
that
will
take
advantage
of
a
system,
so
imagine
that
you're,
an
apartment,
complex
and
the
owner
has
granted
you
the
right
to
have
the
rental
and
or
to
use
your
rental
as
a
home
stay.
And
then
you
just
leave
your
rental
and
you
live
somewhere
else.
The
rental
is
now
it
will
happen,
though.
That's
the
thing,
but.
B
A
B
I
would
mean
that
we
move
forward
to
counsel
this
homestay
revision
ordinances
with
only
the
minor
revisions
who
come
in
compliance
with
160d
little
things,
like
ms
tuck
mentioned
around
18
years
old
and
older,
that
we
remove
accessory
and
detach
structures
from
being
allowed
as
a
home
stay.
A
Okay,
great
so
I'm
gonna
go
through
the
roll
call,
so
councilwoman
turner,
hi
and
I'm
and
I
and
councilwoman
kilgore
hi,
okay,
great
all
right.
So
I'm
going
to
open
this
up
for
general
public
comment
staff.
Do
we
have
anybody
who
just
wants
to
talk
to
us
about
other
things.