►
From YouTube: Burlington Electric Commission - 11/9/2022
Description
Public Forum 00:00:00
Commissioners Corner 00:12:47
GM Update 00:16:53
FY22 Audited Financial Statements 00:25:16
FY23 September 00:58:03
B&M Renewal 01:03:01
Winter ’22/’23 Update 01:16:19
Commissioners Check In 01:45:10
https://linktr.ee/townmeetingtv
Town Meeting TV is a free speech forum and the ideas expressed do not necessarily reflect the views of the Town Meeting TV trustees and staff. If you have a different perspective to share, we invite you to join the conversation! Create your own program or cover a community meeting or event. Contact maketv@cctv.org or call 862-3966.
Thank you for tuning into Town Meeting TV! Please subscribe to our YouTube channel and visit our website for more videos and information about how we open the doors to local government using community media. www.Ch17.TV
This video belongs to http://www.cctv.org and published with permission under Creative Commons License CCTV Center for Media & Democracy Programming is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 4.0 International License.
A
A
I
didn't
see
anything
via
email,
but
okay
and
commissioner
Whitaker
will
be
coming
in
about
15-20
minutes
or
so
so
next
up
is
the
minutes
of
the
October
26
2022
meeting
wondering
if
folks
have
had
a
chance
to
skim
that
and
if
there
are
any
content
or
substantive,
related
issues
or
modifications
that
should
be
made
now
is
a
great
time
to
raise
them
so
that
they're
on
the
record.
Otherwise,
if
it's
just
technical
edits,
those
are
items
that
you
can
let
the
clerk
know
via
email
or
at
the
end
of
the
meeting.
A
In
favor
aye
excellent
third
up
is
the
public
forum,
and
we
do
have
someone
here
from
the
public
for
folks
watching
at
home.
You're
always
welcome
to
come.
We
meet
on
the
second
Wednesday
of
the
month
and
if
you
can't
come
in
person,
you're
also
always
welcome
to
call
and
speak
with
our
customer
service
team
by
Mike
Kenrick
or
reach
out
to
any
of
the
Commissioners.
But
thank
you
thanks
for
joining
Alan
and
thank
you
for
the
write-up
for
folks,
watching
Alan
joined
us
two
months
ago
and
Alan
feel
free
to
introduce
yourself.
A
C
You
very
much
my
name
is
Alan
bierke
I'm,
a
resident
of
Burlington
and
a
relatively
small
provider
of
apartments
and
I
had
addressed
a
couple
months
ago,
this
issue
of
there
being
a
initial
service
fee
charged
to
landlords
when
the
power
was
put
into
a
landlord's
name
very
temporarily,
in
order
to
clean
and
paint
and
do
things
in
between
tenants
and
I.
Ask
you
to
take
a
look
at
it
and
I,
provided
you
some
information
about
your
authority
to
take
a
look
into
it.
C
C
In
order
for
the
if
a
tenant
moves
out
or
the
power
turns
off
for
any
reason,
it
automatically
goes
into
the
name
of
the
of
the
property
owner
and
when
they
do
that
very
few
of
them,
three
or
four
will
actually
charge
the
property
owner,
something
to
put
the
account
into
the
property
owner's
name,
three
of
them:
Green
Mountain,
Power,
Burlington,
electric
and
the
Washington
Electric
Co-op
do
have
the
ability
to
have
a
standing
order
where
you
don't
nobody
has
to
contact
them.
It
automatically
goes
into
the
property
owner's
name.
C
So
I
don't
want
to
spend
a
lot
of
time
on
this,
but
I
did
want
to
make
sure
that
you
know
that
we're
still
interested
it's
not
showing
up
at
one
hearing
saying
something
and
forgetting
about
it.
I'll
come
visit
with
you
from
time
to
time,
perhaps
provide
something
interesting
to
think
about
it,
and
perhaps
one
day
hear
that
something's
happening
on
it,
but
I
do
know
that
a
tariff
changes
difficult
and
expensive,
and
not
something
that
happens
overnight
so
with
that.
Unless
anybody
has
any
questions.
D
I
just
have
a
couple
of
comments.
First
of
all,
thank
you.
This
is
compelling
second
I
want
to
give
you
an
A
plus
for
just
doing
research
the
right
way,
even
including
the
names
of
the
people
you
talked
with
I,
can't
get
anybody
else
to
do
that,
so
you're
ready
for
at
least
a
master's
degree
at
the
Gun
Institute.
Just
so.
A
A
That
to
your
point,
you
know
we
don't
typically
go
to
the
Public
Utility
Commission
like
every
month,
but
we
did
say
that
we
were
going
to
look
at
it
and
assess
in
particular
how
much
time
and
effort
it
did
take,
and
so
therefore,
whether
or
not
that
thirty
dollars
seemed
appropriate
and
I'm,
not
sure.
If
we
put
a
timeline
on
that
Mr.
F
But
I
I
think
the
timeline
you
laid
out
chair,
Stephens,
is
exactly
right.
I
think
this
is
we
wouldn't
look
at
this
fee
in
isolation?
We'd,
look
at
all
of
our
fees,
so
we've
begun.
The
research
Andy
did
good
work
kind
of
writing
up
the
initial
piece
of
it.
I
think
he's
in
touch
with
James
or
you're
copied
on
the
email.
F
I'll,
take
your
word:
okay,
not
not
with
a
request,
but
we'll
need
to
have
some
coordination
between
James's
group
and
Andy's
group
at
the
appropriate
time
to
kind
of
figure
out
if
it's
Justified
or
not
and
in
terms
of
taking
the
fees,
there's
been
a
long-standing
desire
to
update
the
fees,
but
it's
a
big
undertaking
and
would
likely
be
coincident
with
a
future
rate
case.
So
that's
that's!
Correct!
I!
Don't
I,
don't
see
us
having
the
staff
capacity
to
put
it
together,
absent
something
like
that.
A
A
So
my
point
is
not
that
we're
not
going
to
get
to
this,
but
just
it's
great
to
have
you
come
back
and
to
the
extent
that
you
bring
more
research
and
homework,
that's
great,
because
it'll
just
probably
make
the
filing
for
when
we
do
go
before
the
rate
case.
You
know
more
information
can
be
added
to
that.
But
I
just
want
to
caveat
that
with
that
level
of
vacancies,
it's
a
little
bit
slower
to
look
at
all
of
the
fees.
C
I
completely
understand,
and
just
so
you
folks
know
I,
you
know,
I'm
an
attorney
I
spent
a
couple
terms
in
the
house
on
the
Commerce
Committee
was
on
a
special
committee
that
looked
at
retail
Wheeling,
whether
or
not
to
do
it
in
Vermont
and
our
group
saved
you
saved
consumers
from
doing
that
to
us.
It's
had
disasters,
consequences
for
California
and
Texas,
so
I
know
a
little
something
about
this
and
I
know.
It
is
not
a
small
undertaking
to
do
all
the
financial
analysis
necessary
for
a
a
case
like
this.
G
F
I
think
James
is
probably
needs
to
be
looped
in
with
Andy,
and
we
would
need
to
do
analysis,
but
again,
it's
not
something
that
we
can
necessarily
prioritize
in
isolation.
I
think
we
would
have
to
make
a
concerted
effort
to
go
into
the
next
rate
case
with
a
fee
update
as
part
of
that,
and
so
we
would
probably
start
putting
that
together
in
March
of
next
year,
right
yeah.
G
B
F
This
is
23.,
this
would
be.
We
are
working
towards
having
annual
rate
case.
Certainly,
we've
already
filed
the
FY
23
rate
case,
so
that's
that's
kind
of
underway
and
under
review,
and
this
is
really
different.
This
is
our
fees,
our
operating
guidelines,
which
has
a
number
of
different
pieces
to
it,
several
of
which
we've
been
interested
to
kind
of
look
at
and
update,
some
of
which
could
go
up.
Some
might
go
down.
We'd
want
to
do
financial
analysis
on
what
that
would
do
to
our
revenues
overall.
F
G
I
would
say:
they're
not
directly
linked,
but
if
you
change
your
revenues
from
any
Source,
you
need
to
reflect
that
in
your
Revenue
requirement.
So
you
know
and
they
also
share
the
same
staff.
The
same
people
are
doing
both
rate
cases
and
this
kind
of
work
too.
So,
but
so,
for
example,
you
know
revenue
from
Services
is
a
line
item
that
offsets
the
revenue
you
need
from
retail
rates
for
electric
service.
So
if
you're
going
to
change
that
it
changes
your
Revenue
requirement.
G
A
D
F
Packetized
no
longer
exists
as
a
standalone
entity.
They
were
required
acquired
by
a
company
called
Energy
Hub.
So
we've
been
working
concertedly
to
remove
the
devices
from
the
water
heaters
that
was
part
of
their
their
mellow
device.
That
was
on
the
water
heaters
because
we're
not
able
to
continue
with
that
program,
their
EV
Chargers
are
still
installed.
We
had
a
number
of
EV
Chargers
that
were
packetized
equipped
that
are
still
installed
and
James,
and
his
team
have
done
good
work,
making
sure
that
those
can
continue
to
be
compatible
with
our
EV
rate.
D
Okay,
a
question
based
on
something
you
said
during
last
time
in
the
minutes:
the
idea
that
if
people
had
Chargers
and
heat
pumps
and
so
on
and
so
on,
100
amp
service
might
not
be
enough.
They'd
have
to
go
to
200,
something
like
that
and
as
I
was
reading
through,
that
I
thought
yikes
we're
back
to
the
question
maybe
of
time
of
day
rates.
So
I
wonder
if
that's
a
potential
solution
rather
than
more
technology,
just
not
to
be
answered
instantaneously.
D
H
A
We
have
identified
sometime
in
December
that
we
will
be
talking
through
how
we've
been
approaching
implementation
and
interpretation
of
the
IES
standards
with
our
local
Burlington
electric
energy,
efficient,
Engineer
Expert,
who
happens
to
be
a
rate
payer
just
to
get
an
additional
perspective
instead
of
eyes
on
it.
So
that's
scheduled
for
early
December.
H
B
A
H
A
B
F
F
We
were
talking
a
little
just
prior
to
the
meeting
about
the
orb,
which
is
in
place
now
at
the
airport.
This
was
the
Delta
climb
incubator
project,
one
of
the
pilots
that
went
forward.
There
was
great
news
coverage.
We
had
a
really
nice
event
with
the
mayor,
Arc
turbines,
which
is
the
company
and
a
number
of
folks,
the
airport
team.
The
bed
Team
Delta,
climb,
Energy
Vermont
we're
all
there
and
you
can
go
see
it
if
you're
interested.
Hopefully,
it's
spinning
when
you
do.
I
F
Turbines,
logo
and
some
of
the
different
labeling
and
it
spins
relatively
slowly
and
is
capable
of
generating
potentially
what
we
think
7.8
megawatt
hours
per
year,
which
for
a
three
kilowatt
device,
is,
is
about
two
and
a
half
times
as
much
as
you
would
get
from
solar
of
an
equivalent
capacity.
So
we're
eager
to
learn
more
see
if
this
can
be
a
success,
see
if
they
can
lower
their
price
and
in
a
year
we
have
the
option
to
purchase
that
unit
or
revisit
the
terms
of
the
agreement.
F
So
we'll
keep
the
commission
updated
on
how
we're
doing
relative
to
that
and
then.
Lastly,
District
energy
project
work
has
been
picking
up
pace
again.
We've
got
a
number
of
developments.
We
had
the
Evergreen
team
in
town
in
person
last
week,
I
had
a
chance
to
meet
with
them
and
with
vgs
in
person,
and
we
had
multiple
meetings
with
bgs,
the
501c3
organization.
That's
been
formed
or
it's
not
I
think
it's
under
process
of
being
certified
as
a
501c3,
but
it's
a
non-profit.
Currently
that's
been
formed.
Burlington
District
energy.
F
We
have
a
resolution
to
try
to
allow
for
the
non-profit
to
seek
financing
terms
for
the
project
working
with
Vita
at
the
state
level.
We're
also
having
some
conversations
with
the
state
treasurer's
office
as
to
whether
or
not
the
local
investment
advisory
committee
might
be
an
Avenue
to
finance
a
portion
of
the
project,
potentially
so
we're
pursuing
financing
options
with
the
state
we'll
be
having
some
meetings
over
the
course.
The
next
few
weeks,
with
UVM
and
UVM
medical,
we
have
an
RFP
for
construction.
Pricing,
that's
out
with
I.
F
Believe
four
bit
is
responding,
so
we'll
hopefully
have
some
more
information
on
construction
pricing
which
is
based
on
the
actual
designs
and
drawings,
and
this
is
an
actual
RFP.
So
we'll
get
not
indicative
but
actual
construction
pricing
to
go
off
of,
and
we've
done,
a
bunch
of
work
to
engage
with
the
agency
of
natural
resources
on
the
permitting
process
and
I
think
it's
not
far
off
where
the
project
will
be
ready
to
begin.
F
The
permitting
process,
which
is
you
know,
distinct
from
the
financial
agreements,
which
would
still
need
to
be
finalized
and
be
in
place,
but
to
keep
on
the
time
frame
of
moving
the
project
forward
for
construction,
23
and
24,
which
is
what
we
originally
contemplated.
It's
possible
that
may
be
ready
to
go
to
permitting
sooner
rather
than
later.
So
we'll
keep
you
updated
on
that
as
well.
But
that's
that's!
What
I've
got.
C
A
I
I
did
have
one
question
with
regards
to
the
this
is
probably
a
question
for
Emily,
but
in
terms
of
monitoring
the
receivables
in
response
to
covet
19.,
so
we're
just
greater
than
60
days
or
just
under
half
a
million.
Remind
me
I
feel
like
we're
past
the
point
of
being
able
to
get
any
federal
support
for
that
right.
A
F
H
H
A
H
E
F
A
E
F
F
Yeah
we're
looking
at
adding
several
positions.
Potentially
we
haven't
put
a
package
together,
yet
it'll
probably
be
at
least
until
January,
before
we
bring
that
forward
to
the
council.
But
there
are
several
areas
where
we're
looking
at
adding
staff
so
yeah,
hopefully
we'll
get
fully
staffed
and
we'll
be
able
to
add
some
capacity
and
then
we'd
be
in
a
great
position.
But
you
know
realistically
I'm.
You
know
aware
that
the
labor
market
challenge
is
not
unique
to
bed
and
is
likely
to
persist
for
a
period
of
time.
E
A
E
A
B
J
But
what
you
have
is
marked
draft
because
they
are
in
fact
draft.
They
are
not
officially
issued.
However,
at
this
point,
I
do
expect
issuance
very
soon
and
I.
Don't
expect
the
numbers
here
to
change
if,
for
whatever
unforeseen
reason
they
do,
I
will
update
you
next
meeting
and
once
the
financial
statements
are
issued,
I'll
have
Lori,
send
them
to
you
in
their
final
form,
so
you'll
have
that
for
your
for
your
records,
okay
actually
wanted
to
start
here.
J
So
I'm
going
to
start
actually
in
a
bit
of
a
different
place.
I,
don't
remember
if
we've
shared
this
before
or
not,
but
you're
accustomed
to
seeing
budget
versus
actual
results.
So
I
thought
it
would
be
perhaps
useful
just
to
briefly
touch
on
how
did
we
land
versus
budget
and
then
I'll
go
through
the
details
of
the
financial
statements
themselves
so.
J
For
the
fiscal
year
ended
June
30
2022
we
had
a
positive
net
income
of
almost
two
million
dollars,
one
one
million
nine
hundred
and
thirty
seven
thousand
that
was
favorable
to
budget
by
quite
a
bit.
1.129
million
so
yeah.
Definitely
an
excellent
result
for
the
Department
and
major
contributors
to
that
were
rate,
increase,
increased
sales
to
customers
and
then
power
supply
expense
was
favorable
mostly
due
to
the
strong
winter
Energy
prices.
So
those
were
kind
of
the
two
big
big
drivers
and
we'll
go
through
details
of
this
on
the
income
statement.
E
J
Would
I
would
say
yeah
the
supply
chain
of
vehicles
has
been
a
concern
and
we've
been
trying
to
mitigate
that
and
try
to
plan
and
keep
up
with
it,
but
we're
certainly
watching
the
fleet
and
its
age,
and
we
want
to
Electrify
the
fleet
right.
So
we're
making
decisions
to
purchase
electric
vehicles,
but
availability
is
challenging.
I
meant
more
writ
large,
oh
I,
don't
no
I,
don't
think
so.
Yeah.
J
I
also
will
just
say
that
I
expect
no
changes.
I
still
expected
on
modified
opinion.
I
haven't
learned
anything
new
from
kpng
that
differs
from
what
you
what
they
communicated
with
you
last
meeting
and
I
also
before
I
go
through
these
just
want
to.
Let
you
know
that
the
Finance
and
Accounting
team
has
just
done
an
amazing
job.
This
year
we
went
through
the
audit
without
a
finance
director
last
year,
but
I
think
this
year
actually
was
even
more
challenging
last
year.
J
It
was
only
me
who
was
new
to
the
process
and
they
were
all
experienced
and
had
been
through
it
before
and
I
could
really
you
know
they
pulled.
They
did
everything
right.
This
year
we
had
a
number
of
new
people
on
the
team,
a
promotion,
a
new
hire,
a
vacancy
right,
around
August
1st
right,
so
Everybody
pulled
together
and
and
really
worked
as
a
team
to
get
it
done.
J
So
I
just
want
to
mention
Cheryl
Mitchell,
the
financial
analyst
who's,
usually
not
very
involved
in
the
audit
stepped
in
to
help
out
Melissa
Legg,
the
payroll
administrator
Heidi
grollinger.
The
new
AP
administrator
Aaron
Cushing,
promoted
from
AP
to
fixed
asset
accountant,
her
first
time
dealing
with
fixed
assets
in
the
audit
and
then
new
hire
Amanda
hurlbutt,
who
started
in
mid-september
very
quickly,
came
up
to
speed
to
kind
of
put
finishing
touches
on
things
and
final
reconciliations
and
then
really
the
linchpin
senior
staff
accountant
for
McNeil
Yin
Liu.
J
J
So
with
that
stepping
into
the
balance
sheet
has
two
pieces.
Two
pages
assets
and
deferred
outflows
on
one
side,
liabilities
and
deferred
inflows
on
the
other
side
and
I'll
just
go
through
kind
of
some
of
the
biggest
changes
here
from
year
to
year.
To
highlight
for
your
attention.
Capital
assets
did
not
change
that
much
relatively
minor
decrease
of
51
680.
J
J
The
rest
of
these
current
assets
did
not
change
very
significantly.
The
next
one
I
want
to
call
your
attention
to
is,
in
other
non-current
assets,
restricted
Investments
with
Bond
trustees.
That
number
did
go
up
quite
a
lot
because
we
issued
the
2022a
revenue
Bond
right.
So
there
is
where
you
can
see
the
additional
20
million
dollars
on
the
balance
sheet,
I'm,
just
seeing
if
I
can
get
rid
of
that
light
bulb
thing.
J
Moving
on
next
row,
I'll
highlight
is
regulatory
assets
that
has
increased
218
000
from
fiscal
21
to
22.
a
couple
new
things
that
we
received
approval
to
book
as
regulatory
Assets
in
the
2021
rate
increase
one
was
to
amortize
the
IBEW
pension
back
payment
over
a
number
of
years.
The
second
was
to
amortize
the
triennial
Consulting
engineer
review
that
we
are
required
by
Bond
resolution
to
have
performed
of
the
Electric
System
and
the
McNiel
station.
That's
an
every
three
year
expense.
It's
fairly
significant.
J
We
received
approval
to
amortize
that
over
three
years
and
then
also
in
fiscal
22.
We
received
approval
of
an
additional
accounting
order
or
a
modification
of
a
previous
accounting
order
to
amortize
additional
non-capitalized
labor
that
was
unable
to
be
spent
on
capital
projects
due
to
covet
delays.
J
So
the
next
item
that
is
new
on
the
balance
sheet
this
year
is
this
one
res
inventory
and
you'll
notice
at
the
top
of
the
page.
Apologies
for
not
highlighting
this
off.
We've
restated
2021
results.
Okay
and
the
restatement
for
the
balance
sheet
essentially
consists
of
this
new
asset
inventory
asset
for
wrecks
and
tier
three
credits
that
are
available
for
use
for
compliance
with
the
Vermont
renewable
energy
standard.
J
J
The
tier
three
credits:
don't
have
a
market
right
now,
in
theory,
maybe
someday
they
could
right,
but
there's
no
sort
of
active
or
Standard
Market.
For
them.
The
only
sort
of
way
to
use
them
is
to
file
with
the
the
puc.
That
says,
you
know:
here's
how
many
credits
we
generated
and
and
here's
what
we
need
to
comply
based
on
our
load
for
the
previous
calendar
year.
C
J
So
what
we're
doing
is
we
are
incentivizing
all
of
the
Strategic
electrification.
We
can
right
and
we're
paying
customers
we're
paying
out
cash
for
those
incentives
and
then,
instead
of
expensing
one
to
one
every
dollar
for
every
dollar
we
pay
out
in
cash.
We
are
putting
them
all
in
an
inventory
Bank
and
then
we
are
only
expensing
the
amount
equivalent
to
what
we
would.
What
we
need
to
expense
for
compliance
versus.
E
J
Yes,
so
just
theoretically,
like
hypothetically
in
a
year
or
a
yeah
in
a
calendar
year
when
we
underperformed
right
or
had
a
terrible
year
for
tier
three
programs
right,
we
could
go
to
the
bank
yeah
right.
We
could
use
those
credits
in
inventory
to
comply
for
a
year
where
we
didn't
generate
enough
from.
J
Okay,
next
line
to
call
your
attention
to
is
another
new
one,
other
non-current
assets.
This
is
the
Moran
frame.
It's
the
other
side
of
the
Moran
frame
liability.
That
is
the
uncorrected
audit.
Difference
right,
we'll
be
seeking
approval
from
the
Public
Utility
Commission
to
book
this
as
a
regulatory
asset,
and
then
the
changes
here
in
deferred
out
flows
of
resources
are
mostly
actuarially.
Driven
projected
investment
earnings,
the
pension.
J
J
So
liabilities
current
liabilities
here
this
12.8
million-
that's
an
increase
of
about
2.7
million
from
FY
21..
Most
of
that
is
due
to
an
increase
in
accounts
payable.
You
can
see
this
line
here
is
up
about
1.9
million
versus
FY
21..
Most
of
that
is
due
to
timing
of
wreck
purchases
that
we
made
late
in
the
fiscal
year
where
they
were
still
payable.
As
of
June
30.,.
J
The
non-current
liabilities
section
the
long-term
debt:
that's
there
are
revenue
bonds,
our
Geo
bonds,
that's
driven
by
the
maturity
schedules,
the
payment
schedules
of
the
bonds,
other
non-current
liabilities
increased
fairly
significantly
up
1.2
million
from
FY
21.
That's
that
increases
composed
of
two
parts.
One.
We
took
out
an
equipment
financing
note
to
help
Finance
the
new
meter
data
management
system,
which
we
executed
in
July
2021.
J
Net
pension
liability
went
down
quite
a
bit
this
year,
5.8
million
again
those
changes
are
actuarially
driven
and
then
just
I.
Think.
The
important
thing
here
to
see
is
that
the
total
net
position
increased
by
1.94
million
dollars
compared
to
FY
21.,
and
that
is
that
is
really
that
net
income,
the
positive
net
income
we
talked
about
when
we
talk
about
budget
to
actual
sort
of
falling
to
the
bottom
line.
Here.
D
J
J
J
So
the
the
top,
the
current
liabilities
at
the
top
of
the
page,
where
you
see
the
1.85
million
for
revenue,
bonds
and
3.575
for
go
bonds
that
represents
the
amount
of
debt
service
that
we
are,
will
pay
an
FY
23..
So
it's
the
portion
of
the
whole
debt
that
remains
that's
going
to
be
next
be
paid,
and
then
the
long
term
under
the
non-current
liabilities
is
sort
of
the
rest
of
it.
J
J
I,
don't
think
you
I,
don't
think
you
could
do
that
because
they
all
have
different.
You
know
coupon
amounts
and
different
interest
rates
right.
Different
maturity
schedules,
different
premiums
right,
and
so
you
know,
the
revenue
Bond
line
represents
the
2014
A
and
B
the
2017
A
and
B
right.
The
22A
and
the
Geo
bond
amount
represents,
you
know,
10
I,
don't
know
multiple
Geo
bonds
right
that
we're
still
paying
off
some
dating
back
several
years.
J
J
F
D
A
12
8
is
the
12
8,
where
it
says
total
current
liabilities,
that's
what
we
would
have
to
pay
in
FY
2023,
but
then
this
also
shows
everything
else.
We're
going
to
have
to
pay
into
the
you
know
past
FY
2020
and
that's
the
next
category.
Non-Current
you're
right,
it's
apples
to
oranges,
I
mean
it's
not
it's
not
saying
we
owe
all
of
that
right
now:
okay,
okay,
thank
you.
D
E
D
J
J
Other
revenues
decreased
modestly
173
thousand
dollars
most
of
that.
Well,
some
of
that
anyway,
declining
wreck
Revenue
due
to
lower
wind
production
and
a
lower
price
for
McNiel
Rex
offset
by
a
higher
volume
of
McNeil
Rex
sold
the
provision
for
uncollectible
accounts.
We
discussed
this
last
year.
We
had
made
a
change
in
our
methodology
for
estimating
that
during
the
pandemic,
because
we
knew
we
had
access
to
Federal
grant
monies
potentially
to
help
with
that.
J
J
Flex
operating
and
maintenance
expenses
that
make
you
know
in
the
gas
turbine
purchase
power.
Very
little
change,
really
holding
steady
from
2021
a
mix
of
pluses
and
minuses
netting
to
almost
zero
change.
Increased
Rec
purchases,
increased
price
for
in
volume
for
Vermont,
wind
and
hydro
Quebec.
That
was
offset,
however,
by
decreasing
capacity
prices
and
sales
of
excess
energy.
This
winter
transmission
expense
increased,
almost
nine
hundred
thousand
dollars.
J
F
J
Most
of
that
pension
and
benefits
cost
so
I
know
you've.
We've
discussed
the
pension
expense
that
we
have
to
take
we've
budgeted
for
that.
It
actually
was
less
than
what
we
budgeted
this
year,
which
was
a
pleasant
surprise,
depreciation
and
amortization
increased
by
719
000,
most
of
that
additional
depreciation
on
the
distribution
plant,
and
so
here
we
have
just
to
look
at
our
operating
income,
positive
operating
income
of
1.9
million,
and
then
we
also
restated
expenses
for
fy21.
J
So
we
had
I
want
to
say,
I
forget
what
our
net
loss
was
in
FY
21
I
think
it
was
a
net
operating
loss
of
like
100
000
or
something,
and
now
it's
20.
It's
a
positive
income.
Positive
operating
income
of
about
30,
000.,
velco
dividends
were
are
pretty
much
in
line
from
22
to
21
interest
income.
Very
little
change.
Grant
income
was
down
significantly,
however,
FY
21
was
kind
of
an
unusually
high
Grant
income
year,
yeah
yeah
and
then
unrealized
loss
on
investment.
J
J
The
reason
it's
more
significant
is
that
we
have
more
funds
invested
right
now
because
of
the
revenue
Bond,
and
so
this
is
the
sort
of
how
up
or
down
we
are
compared
to
our
initial
account
value
and
the
construction
fund.
So
it's
unrealized
in
that
you
know
if
we
were
to
sell
all
the
treasury
bills
today,
you
know
on
June.
30
would
have
had
this
much
loss,
but
the
next
day
you
know
we
might
have
had
an
unrealized
gain
right.
J
J
Okay,
cash
flow
is
busy,
so
I
won't
take
you
through
every
line
of
this,
but
the
big
categories
here
I
think,
are
fairly
intuitive,
so
net
cash
from
operating
activities
that
was
up
by
2.9
Million
from
21
to
22,
makes
sense,
given
the
improved
operating
results
that
we
saw,
cash
flows
from
capital
and
related
financing
increased
by
19
million.
That's
because
we
issued
the
bond,
so
we
had
the
20
million
flowing
in
there.
J
And
then,
similarly,
cash
flows
from
investing.
You
can
see
purchase
of
Investments,
also
Changed
by
20
million.
That's
because
we
invested
the
money
that
we
got
from
the
bond.
You
know
to
to
keep
it
working
for
us
on
the
side
as
we
draw
it
down,
so
total
increase
in
cash
from
21
to
22.
You
can
see
that
change
here
from
9.8
million
to
12.2
million,
that's
a
2.4
million
dollar
increase
and
then
the
bottom
of
this
sheet.
J
The
reconciliation
is
just
another
way
of
showing
how
how
you
whoops,
how
you
got
to
the
difference
in
the
operating
cache
at
the
top
sorry
I
didn't
mean
to
scroll
all
over
the
place,
okay
and
then
finally,
I'll
just
review
quickly.
Again.
This
is
a
reminder,
a
presentation,
change
we
made.
Last
year
we
present
the
Energy
Efficiency
Utility
Fund
as
a
separate
fiduciary
fund.
So
it's
no
a
lot.
It's
not
co-mingled
with
beds,
assets
and
liabilities.
J
Not
significant
changes
in
this
fund
from
22
to
21
cash
increased
by
about
500,
000,
accounts,
receivable
and
payable
changes
are
General.
Basically
speak
are
essentially
timing.
Differences
so
slight
increase
in
net
position
for
the
EU
fund
of
around
three
or
four
hundred
thousand
dollars
and
then
there's
a
sort
of
income
statement
showing
additions
to
the
fund
collections
from
customers
from
the
eec,
charge
on
bills,
forward
capacity
and
Reggie
Market
Reggie
revenues
and
then
the
payments
we
made
for
programs
again,
not
a
lot
of
change
from
FY
21.
J
J
So
when
the
financial
statements
are
issued
tomorrow,
we
will
need
to
send
it
to
a
few
people.
I'll
share
them
with
the
city's
Auditors
I
will
share
them
with
our
bond
trustee
and
probably
with
ISO
New
England,
as
well,
just
as
part
of
regular
reporting.
We
need
to
do
but
there's
a
the
statements
are
issued,
and
then
we
coordinate
kind
of
a
management
representation
letter
that
we
provide
to
the
Auditors
as
part
of
the
issuance
process,
and
then
we
put
them
on
our
website.
J
D
A
J
Okay,
so
for
September
we
reported
a
net
loss
of
about
a
million
dollars
compared
to
a
budgeted
net
loss
of
eight
hundred
and
seventeen
thousand,
so
we
were
223
000
worse
than
budget
of
year.
To
date
we
have
a
net
income
as
of
September
30
of
195
000,
that's
700
000
worth
than
budget
moving
through
kind
of
the
details.
Sales
to
customers
relatively
on
budget,
both
residential
and
Commercial,
were
up
modestly
miscellaneous.
Electric
revenues
were
up.
Most
of
this
is
EU,
so
there
was
no
power
supply,
not
a
wreck.
J
J
A
J
J
H
I
Paul
Alexander
here
for
the
annual
property
boiler,
Machinery
Insurance
renewal,
I-
think
all
of
you
have
sat
through
this
before
so
exciting
stuff.
Okay,
let's
move
this
out
of
the
way:
okay,
not
that
you're
last
in
line.
So
it's
always
a
timing.
Thing
quote:
Jim
I
presented
this
last
Tuesday
night
to
the
board
of
Finance,
so
it
was
passed
there
and
then
went
on
consent
agenda
this
past
Monday
of
this
week,
so
this
line
renewals
on
the
20th
this
month,
so
your
vote
is
still
important.
I
Okay,
so
this
is
property
building
machinery.
This
is
by
far
our
biggest
line
of
insurance.
It's
the
only
one
that
we
come
in
front
of
you.
It's
only
one
over
a
hundred
thousand
so
for
multiple
reasons:
the
the
magnitude
of
the
line
itself
and
because
it
crosses
over
a
couple
policy
years
of
City
attorneys
encourage
us
to
go
through
this
process.
So
again
repeat
for
most
of
you,
if
not
all
of
you
what's
covered
commercial
property
building
machinery,
so
that's
really
everything
that's
tangible.
I
When
you
put
your
hands
on
from
the
desk
in
this
building
to
the
McNeil
station
buildings,
Furniture
computers
etc
current
status,
and
it
has
been
for
the
last
several
years,
the
magnitude
of
this
of
writing
our
property
building
machinery,
particularly
because
of
McNiel
station.
We
have
four
different
carriers,
so
all
the
other
lines
are
one
carrier,
one
line
of
business.
These
are
four
the
team
together,
AIG
start
Tech,
Zurich
and
Aegis.
Each
get
a
piece
of
the
pie.
I
If
you
will
and
share
in
those
premiums
and
then
the
losses,
if
we
had
any
knock
on
wood,
we
haven't.
We've
got
a
really
good
history
down
there.
So
again,
this
line
expires
on
November
20th.
We
pay
currently
right
now
an
annual
premium
663
508.14
cents,
as
you
might
call
three
or
four
years
ago,
a
significant
jump.
I
We
were
in
the
mid
200s,
so
what's
in
your
handouts,
the
standard
four
pieces
of
Hickok
and
boardman's
our
insurance
agent,
so
they
had
a
cover
letter
walking
through
some
of
the
pluses
and
minuses
of
what,
while
we're
here
and
what's
going
on,
I'll
cover
a
letter
from
myself,
a
two-tab,
very
brief,
Microsoft
Excel
that
shows
a
history
from
1994.,
some
bar
charts
and
stuff
I'm
going
to
cover
those.
Now,
if
you
want
to
and.
I
Call
quota
share
program,
it's
really
just
a
our
chart,
but
it's
really
a
one
snapshot.
It
shows
all
four
carriers
how
much
that
they
cover
and
their
premiums
that
go
along
with
that
and,
more
importantly,
what
percentage
they're
covering
from
two
columns,
one
with
McNeil
assets
and
one
with
a
non-mcno
and
again
McNeil-
is
a
focus
and
what
makes
it
most
difficult
to
write
this
line
of
business
what's
new
this
year
or
what
points
Hickok
and
barn
wanted
me
to
point
out.
I
I
was
always
headcocking
board
and
works.
They
started
this
around
May,
so
it's
quite
a
process
to
get
this
and
we're
still
not
done.
That's
why?
Jumping
ahead,
this
is
I'm
going
to
ask
you
to
vote
for
a
not
to
exceed
amount,
because
then
they
negotiate
literally
right
up
to
the
last
day,
which
is
November
20th.
We
will
not
go
beyond
the
20th.
Yes,.
I
I
At
the
end
of
this
next
slide,
I'm
going
to
walk
you
right
through
it,
I
do
have
them
attached
to
this
presentation,
so
make
seed
my
10
minutes.
Okay,
apologize
for
that
capacity
is
nothing
more
than
what
the
insurance
companies
are
willing
to
write
or
what
they
can
write.
So
it
takes
the
four
of
them
together
to
write
this
line
of
business.
I
The
good
news
is,
the
renewal
premium
is
going
to
is
anticipated
to
increase
last
year's
amount
of
663
508
with
a
not
to
exceed
683
413.,
that's
nothing
more
than
three
percent
of
what
we
are
currently
paying
and
what
we
budgeted
through
Hickok
and
Boardman.
So
that's
that
is
actually
good
news
compared
to
something
that
increases
yeah.
I
So
next
last
item
here
our
total
and
triple
values.
It's
an
insurance
term.
It
just
means
everything
you're,
covering
What's,
the
total
book
of
business,
that
you
are
writing
covering
again
from
the
computers
to
the
laptops
to
the
McNeil
station.
So
if
you
recall
it's
there's
a
cap,
so
we
have
our
total
book
of
business.
If
you
look
carefully,
the
line
is
two
a
little
over
263
million
dollars.
Okay-
and
it
has
been
capped
for
several
years
now-
at
175
million-
no
concerns
for
a
couple
reasons.
I
One
the
McNiel
station
is
almost
at
that
limit
190
million
and
this
plan,
obviously
our
headquarters
a
little
less
than
three
miles
away
McNeil.
It
would
take
a
huge
event
to
take
both
those
buildings
out
of
commission
at
the
same
time,
so
highly
unlikely,
obviously,
for
many
reasons,
fire
explosion
and
so
on.
So
we're
basically
covered
in
hole.
But
that's
we
are
capped.
I
So
if
both
those
plans
burn
to
the
ground,
we'd
be
coming
up
short,
but
that's
not
going
to
happen
and
I
guess-
and
it's
also
good
news
in
the
in
the
cover
letter
that
you
did
not
get
they
list
a
lower
premium
so
again
that
we're
not
to
exceed
the
683
they
they
as
a
week
ago,
anticipating
still
in
negotiations,
anticipate,
will
come
in
actually
a
little
bit
less
than
that
about
672
000.
about
a
little
less
than
twelve
thousand
dollars
less,
which
is
great.
I
That
would
be
like
a
a
1.35
increase
so
which
is
good
given
that
line.
So
a
couple
really
good
things
going
on
some
considerations.
Every
year
we
talk
about
not
just
ways
to
reduce
this
line,
but
are
those
other
things
we
can
do
with
or
without
the
city?
Hickok
and
Boardman
is
the
same
insurance
agent
for
BD
as
well
as
a
city.
So
one
of
the
things
I
looked
into
was
combining
on
a
cyber
liability
policy
with
the
city,
but
through
Paul
Plunkett
said
at
least
now
for
aligning
the
terms.
I
Conditions
and
pricings
did
not
benefit
either
party,
meaning
bed
cities.
So
we'll
keep
looking
at
that,
but
we're
not
going
to
do
that.
Certainly
this
year
joint
captive,
as
you
know,
Vermont
we're.
Third
in
the
world
for
captives,
Cayman
Islands,
Bermuda
Vermont,
again
talked
to
FM
Global
energy
Insurance
Mutual.
They
have
what's
called
a
minimum
premium,
no
matter
what
they
won't
write
that
below
750
000.
I
So
that's
that
price,
along
with
some
of
the
long-term
risks
to
BD
again
right
now,
we're
not
going
to
pursue
that
and
really
the
biggest
benefit
is
again.
Aig
is
one
of
the
four
carriers,
but
they're
not
shared
equally
their
rate
that
they
charge
us
per
100
of
coverage
is
like
two
and
a
half
times
less
than
some
of
the
other
carriers.
So
the
more
they
write,
the
more
money
we
save
and
the
more
percentage
will
take
away
and
I'm
going
to
show
you
that
chart
in
a
second
here.
I
So
they
came
to
us
and
wanted
to
write
more
than
the
25
they
have,
and
they
we
were
at
one
time
a
month
ago,
looking
at
50
that
would
have
been
significant.
Savings
for
us
didn't
share
all
those
details
with
Darren,
but
it's
really
good
news
because
they
want
more
of
the
books.
So,
at
the
last
minute,
though,
we
they
the
politics
that
may
be,
they
end
up,
writing
only
35,
but
the
10
more.
A
I
A
I
Great
question
so
for
my
notes:
why
is
AG
AIG
so
interesting?
Here
we
go
no
losses,
we've
had
a
loss
free
for
them,
they've
been
with
us
forever
for
over
20
plus
years
McNiel
recommendations.
We've
done
a
lot
of
things
really
kudos
to
Darren
munir
and
the
staff
down
McNeil's.
Getting
all
these
engineering
recommendations
done,
and
that
really
makes
us
look
a
lot
better
on
their
books,
much
lower
risk
and
we're
showing
that
we're
committed
to
being
a
long-term
partner.
D
I
No
speeding
tickets
right,
no
speeding
tickets
and
we've
been
really
flexible
with
them,
we're
changing
our
our
levels
of
coverage,
raising
our
deductibles
and
that
stuff,
so
just
a
real
good
partnership
between
us
and
Hickok
and
Boardman,
and
them
so
they're
one
of
those
four
carers,
but
the
more
they
want
to
write.
It's
much
really
good
news
for
us,
so
fingers
crossed
for
next
year.
Good
question:
okay!
I
This
amount
not
to
exceed
would
obviously
be
a
zero
percent
change
in
our
budget
and
again
reiterating
that
Hickok
and
Boardman
thinks
will
come
in
a
little
bit
less
we'll
know
that
in
the
next
week
or
two,
but
no
matter
what
we
can't
let
the
policy
lapse,
we
will
bind
at
the
not
to
exceed
if
not
something
better
okay
skipping
over
the
motion
for
a
second
now
I'm
going
to
skip
here
are
all
the
handouts.
I'll
make
sure
you
get.
I
I
Property
quota
share
program
structure,
but
you
can
see
here
if
you
follow
my
cursor
here,
two
columns.
This
is
the
assets
other
than
McNeil's.
That's
Pine,
Street
gas
turbine.
We
will
see
when
Hydro
is
all
lumped
them
to
this
column
and
then
the
McNeil-
and
these
are
the
four
carriers
Aegis
Zurich
Star,
Tech
and
down
here
the
most
critical
bucket
AIG-
and
you
can
see
here
that
they're
writing
35
percent.
I
I
If
you
will
and
look
at
the
rate
of
zert
38-1
there's
your
2.2
times,
if
you
will
so
the
more
AIG
writes
and
the
less
these
other
companies,
nothing
against
the
good
partners,
but
until
they
can
meet
meet
that
rate,
we'll
we'll
ask
AIG
to
keep
writing
more
and
more
as
their
capacity
can
handle.
That's
the
slide
that
is
critical
and
again
here's
the
infamous
chart.
You
can
see
what
happened
not
that
long
ago
we
were
running
along
about
two
yeah
and
bang.
That's
when
we
had
an
exponential
increase
in
our
premium.
I
I
I
A
job
for
us
and
the
City,
and
not
to
assume
you're
going
to
pass
it
but
per
the
City
attorney.
This
would
this
happen
before
she
wrote
back
to
me.
You
can
stop
that
the
city
attorney's
office,
because
we
already
have
approval
from
Board
of
finance
and
city
council,
so
someone's
going
to
read
that
you
can
pause
right
there.
B
J
G
Go
right
at
the
beginning,
we
all
thought
it
was
probably
a
good
idea
to
talk
to
you
guys
about
winter
2022,
2023
you're,
going
to
hear
the
term
unprecedented.
It
is
unprecedented
what
we've
been
seeing
in
the
wholesale
markets,
we're
far
from
the
only
people
that
have
been
sort
of
stunned
by
the
wholesale
markets,
but
we
are
not
as
impacted
by
the
wholesale
markets
as
many
people
and
the
way
we're
impacted
is
interesting
and
that's
why
we
thought
it
would
be
reasonable
to
sort
of
call
your
attention
to
this.
G
Something
should
make
this
there
we
go
so
I'm,
just
going
to
remind
you
quickly
that
there
is
a
very,
very
strong
relationship
between
natural
gas
prices
and
electric
prices
in
New
England
I've
spoken
about
that
before
that
has
not
changed.
So
whenever
you
heard
anything
in
the
news
story
recently
about
natural
gas,
that's
hitting
this
Market,
the
Electric
market.
G
Okay,
here
we
go
and
again
we're
not
heavily
impacted
About
It
by
it
directly
at
our
at
our
fundamental
level,
because
we
have
a
renewable
resource
mix.
The
only
two
of
our
resources
that
really
have
any
component
about
the
wholesale
markets
in
natural
gas
is
hydroquo
back,
has
a
a
partial
index
to
it,
and
that
was
part
of
the
2012
deal
before
any
of
this
ever
happened
and
McNeil
indirectly,
you
know
because
of
Transportation
costs
of
wood,
but
not
a
very
big
direct
impact
from
fossil
fuel
changes
there
either.
So
we're
not.
G
This
is
not
a
problem
for
us,
because
the
cost
of
our
resources
is
going
up.
It's
a
different
different
issue
for
us.
If
you
will
so
I'll
remind
you
that
this
is
the
sort
of
the
setup
is
that
we
have
excess
resources
and
we
have
access
resources
from
renewable
resources
for
the
next
several
years,
so
we're
coming
into
this
Market
with
resources,
net
resources
to
sell
as
long
as
our
resources
produce
as
expected.
G
Okay,
that's
that's
a
Proviso
and
it's
an
important
one,
but
if
they
produce
as
expected,
we
are
a
net
seller
of
energy
and
we
are
actually
more
of
a
net
seller
of
energy
in
the
winter,
which
of
course,
is
again
I'm
going
to
show
you
what
that
means.
But
it
means
a
lot
of
money
at
this
point,
but
a
lot
of
volatility.
A
G
Inspiring
things
in
that
2025-2026
window,
you
know
we're
sort
of
looking
ahead
and
I'll
mention
that
at
the
end,
I
can't
talk
about
what
the
results
are
so
far,
but
we
did
Issue
a
broad
erfp
communicated
to
everyone.
We
could
think
of
from
Renewable
Energy
Vermont
to
people
who
own
to
hydrocobank
I
mean
really
the
entire
Spectrum
from
local
in-state
solar
to
large.
You
know,
National
corporations.
G
This
is
what's
been
happening
to
the
prices,
the
if
you
look
on
the
far
right
side,
you're
showing
we're
showing
them.
Essentially,
the
projected
prices
they're
forward
prices
that
what
people
are
selling
power
for
for
the
winter
months
and
we
are
seeing
January
power
in
excess
of
250
a
megawatt
hour
highest
historical
price
in
January
was
just
shyable,
which
was
just
a
little
bit
over
150.
G
A
A
G
You
can
see
right
here
actually
is:
January
has
never
been
probably
well.
January
has
been
down
around
the
the
four
level
if
you
look
back
to
2016
and
2017
and
2020,
but
2020
was
a
covid
year.
So
the
fact
that
it
was
trading
around
four
cents
was
a
little
off,
but
four
is
a
possible
number
and
on
the
other
end
150
is
the
worst.
We've
ever
seen:
okay
and
we're
over
250..
G
So
not
only
has
it
moved
up
a
long
way
in
the
last
18
months,
it's
moved
from
about
six
and
a
half
cents
to
about
25
cents.
So
in
the
last
18
months
it's
quadrupled
so
again
when
people
talk
about
the
prices
being
unprecedented
they're
unprecedented,
and
it
is
a
lot
of
uncertainty
about
the
availability
of
natural
gas
and
the
frequency
and
duration
of
cold
snaps.
G
G
So
the
longer
that
cold
snap
goes
on
and
the
more
heating
load
accumulates
the
less
and
less
gas
is
available
for
the
generating
plants.
Now
they
can
try
to
bring
liquid
natural
gas
into
the
Everett
port
in
Boston
to
help
with
that.
But
the
situation
in
Europe
is
not
throwing
a
lot
of
question
on
where
the
natural
gas
would
go
and
one
of
the
biggest
New
England
companies
has
asked
for
a
federal
waiver
of
the
rules
that
normally
govern
what
type
ships
can
dock
It
Everett.
G
So
again,
this
is
not
a
small
problem,
nor
do
I
see
this
problem
going
away
next
year
or
the
year
after
that
it
would
take
a
gas
transmission
pipeline
or
something
like
that
to
solve
it.
So
for
a
while
we're
looking
at
very
high
winter
prices,
I
suspect
this
is
just
taking
the
previous
data
and
turning
into
a
one
value
for
the
entire
winter
period,
and
there
you
see
even
stronger.
G
You
know
when
you
when
you,
when
you
average
across
December
January
February,
you
can
even
see
a
stronger
effect,
so
highest
there
is
ever
has
been,
maybe
130
and
we're
still
over
200.
On
average,
for
that
period,
so
that's
turned
into
rate
cases
around
New
England.
Obviously
it
has
not
turned
into
rape
cases
in
Burlington
electric,
but
it
has
turned
into
very
large
rate
cases
in
the
areas
that
deregulated
the
electric
industry.
So
these
are
some
cited
numbers
from
news
stories.
G
You
know
these
people
are
looking
at
rate
increases
of
30
40
50
60
in
a
single
year.
That's
because
they're
served
at
the
competitive
market
they're,
don't
they
don't
have
a
utility
who
has
holding
a
portfolio
of
long-term
resources
to
average
out
those
effects.
So
again,
you
know
Vermont
right
now
is
looking
very
good.
G
In
terms
of
this
I
mean
we
will
see,
I
suspect
some
Vermont
increases,
and
that
would
be
people
who
are
short,
who
are
not
sufficiently
covered
in
energy
and
we're
planning
on
buying
some
on
the
spot
market
and
are
now
exposed
to
those
spot
market
prices.
They
will
probably
have
to
come
in
for
a
rate
case
and
I
would
not
advise
to
see
that
coming
in
next
month
or
two.
G
This,
though,
is
a
very
is
what
I
really
want
to
talk
to
you
about.
The
dotted
line
is
when
we
filed
the
rate
case
and
what
those
winter
prices
were.
Okay
and
the
line
after
the
dotted
line
is
what's
happened
to
it
since
then,
and
what
that
represents.
Is
the
price
that's
applied
to
our
excess
energy?
G
If
you
weren't
hedged,
if
you
were
sitting
on
the
whole,
you
know
resource
portfolio,
you'd
be
looking
at
the
60,
70
type
of
rate
increases
we're
actually
right
now
exposed
to
low
market
prices.
So
if
we
have
a
mild
winter
and
these
prices
don't
come
in
at
these
levels,
then
actually
what
will
happen
is
we
won't
realize
our
budget
not
because
we're
paying
more?
It's
because
we're
selling
our
excess
for
less
than
we
thought
and
again
you
know
to
see
movement
of
four
million
dollars
in
four
months.
G
You
know
in
your
net
power
supply
cost
due
to
the
monetizing
of
a
15.
Excess
position
is
a
lot
of
movement,
so
you
know
we
need
to
be
aware
that
we
are
certainly
watching
this,
we're
monitoring
it
very
closely.
We
are
looking
for
ways
to
lay
off
some
of
that
risk
of
the
price
is
not
coming
in,
but
it
is
very
difficult
to
do
so
transacting
at
prices
these
high.
This
high
is
not
easy
for
anybody,
because
people
become
exposed
to
Collateral
calls
things
like
that.
G
It's
just
you
know
it
gets
to
be
very
hard
to
transact.
So
we
are
looking
at
one
potential
transaction
that
might
help
lay
off
some
of
this
risk
at
known
prices,
and
then
we
wouldn't
be
exposed
to
the
prices
being
low.
On
the
other
hand,
to
be
fair,
they
could
come
in
higher
than
this.
You
know
that
is
possible
too.
A
colder
than
normal
winter
would
drive
prices
up
in
general.
G
E
Are
you
also?
Are
we
working
at
like
there's
this
financial
piece
right,
but
the
other
thing
is
we're
trying
to
be
more
energy
efficient,
trying
to
Electrify
as
much
as
possible.
So
are
those
forces
large
enough
to
exacerbate
this?
No
it
doesn't.
It
won't
make
because
we're
just
talking
about
like
heat
pumps
and
whatever.
G
Yet
I
mean
you
know,
those
are
anticipated
to
grow
our
load
materially,
but
not
in
the
context
of
by
this
winter.
We're
not
seeing
so
many
heat
pumps
that
that
we're
we're
seeing
a
loss
of
winter
sales,
but
at
some
point
right
now,
if
the
if
the
market
were
25
cents,
is
actually
more
more
economical
or
more
lucrative
to
sell
it
to
the
wholesale
Market
than
to
a
customer
at
16.
right
I
mean
so.
G
F
In
terms
of
you
know,
we've
incentivized
well
over
400
EVs
and
over
a
thousand
heat
pumps,
but
the
usage
is
such
that
you
haven't
really
seen
it
material
impact
our
load
yet
and
we're
starting
to
invest
with
the
revenue
bond
in
preparing
for
that.
But
when
you
look
at
this
challenge,
the
prices
are
going
to
be
high
in
the
winter,
maybe
for
the
foreseeable
future,
solar
isn't
really
helping
us
solve
this
challenge.
Mcneil
is
helping
us
solve
this
Challenge
and
yet
there's
a
lot
of
criticism.
F
D
F
G
That's
one
of
the
reasons
it's
difficult
for
us
to
sell
to
to
lay
off
this
risk.
If
you
will,
if
you
look
at
that
graph,
you
can
see
that
if
we
lose
McNeil
for
any
length
of
time,
we
stop
being
long.
Mcneil
is
the
bottom
resource
and
it
is
enough
that
without
McNeil
we
are
buying
wholesale
market
energy.
G
Okay,
so
you
know:
we've
positioned,
McNeil
and
the
McNeil
Foresters
have
worked
Herculean
efforts.
We
have
the
biggest
wood
piles
I've
ever
seen
looming
over
the
plant,
and
what
we've
done
is
we've
positioned
ourselves
to
run
essentially
Around
the
Clock
we've
we're
doing
preventative
maintenance.
We're
coming
off
of
that
right
now
to
try
to
minimize
the
downtime
and
to
maximize
our
excess
energy
position
during
those
high
price
times.
E
G
Right
right,
but
if
McNeil
went
off,
if,
let's
say
I
sold
a
bunch
of
energy
that
I
expected
to
have
firm,
you
know
committed
to
selling
it
and
then
McNeil
went
offline
unexpectedly,
now
I'm,
not
only
short
energy
I'm
having
to
make
somebody
else
whole
too,
because
I
committed
to
selling
them
energy.
So
again
we
have
a
very
key
resource
sitting
at
the
bottom
of
that
stack
that
can
take
us
from
being
long
to
short
by
losing
the
one
resource.
So
again,
it's
a
huge
hedge
and
the
ability
to
stockpile
a
fuel.
G
E
G
Yeah
Darren
said
it
well,
which
is
it
had.
We
know
the
load.
Is
there
we
it
has
to
be
there.
I
mean
those
vehicles
are
being
charged,
but
we
haven't
seen
a
consistent
increase
in
load
coming
out
of
the
noise
post
covid.
Yet
it
causes
me
to
change
my
expectation
of
having
excess
energy
for
this
winter
or
even
next,
probably
right
right.
It
might
affect
how
much
we
bought
in
a
replacement
contract
for
2026.
F
And
there's
been
resistance
to
bringing
in
new
transmission
for
hydro
from
Canada
correct,
multiple
proposals
to
do
that,
none
of
which
have
gotten
approved
and
then
the
only
other
thing
that's
kind
of
lingering
out.
There
is
offshore
wind
at
scale,
but
that
always
seems
to
be
a
few
years
off
from
kind
of
coming
online.
But.
D
G
F
G
Mcneil,
you
know
the
renewable
resource
that
can
operate
base
load
for
extended
periods
of
time,
which
actually
makes
it
very
unusual
right.
So
you
know,
but
again,
just
again,
it's
important
to
keep
in
mind
that,
because
of
McNeil
we
are
long.
If
McNeil
drops
offline
for
extended
periods
of
time,
then
we're
buying
those
prices.
So
again,
this
is
a.
This
is
a
you
know,
we're
certainly
doing
everything
we
can
to
position
McNeil
for
maximum
reliability.
This
winter
we
pressured
I
saw
very
New
England
very
hard
to
give
us
the
outage
to
get
ready
for
it.
G
E
G
G
The
last
thing
I
just
wanted
to
quickly
mention
is
just
if
you
hear
about
this
winter.
Reliability
is
becoming
a
bit
of
a
concern
in
England.
For
all
of
the
reasons
that
I
just
mentioned,
it
is
possible.
I,
don't
expect
under
normal
operating
conditions.
There'd
be
reliability
problems,
but
the
Pento
does
exist
under
extreme
cold
weather,
particularly
if
it's
extended
period
of
cold
weather
for
that
disruption
of
the
gas
pipeline,
supplied
to
the
generating
become
a
problem
enough
of
a
problem
to
possibly
allow
for
Rolling
blackouts
again.
You
know
this
is
not
new.
G
There's
been
news
stories
about
it.
If
you
haven't
heard
them
I
have.
We
have
had
calls
at
Burlington
electric
from
customers
asking
about
the
news
stories,
so
we
thought
we'd
at
least
bring
this
up
again.
It's
not
something
we
expect
it's
not!
It's
not.
You
know
a
probable
event,
it's
a
possible
event
and
also
because
it
would
I
think
be
triggered
by
an
extremely
you
know,
an
extended
cold
snap.
It's
not
going
to
happen
without
some
warning.
G
You
know
we're
going
to
have
an
extended
forecast
of
minus
20
degrees,
for
you
know,
seven
days
and
it's
going
to
start
to
look
like
there
might
be
an
issue
the
what
we're
talking
about
happening.
If
that
did
happen,
and
again
not
saying
it
will
happen,
would
be
rolling
blackouts
and
if
you've
never
heard
of
those
they
have
been
used
for
a
long
period
of
time,
I
mean
I.
Remember
when
I
was
a
child
in
the
midwest
50
years
ago
they
were
rolling
blackouts
in
St
Louis
on
really
really
hot
days.
G
It
would
be
an
average
duration
of
say
two
or
three
hours,
and
then
your
power
would
come
back
on
and
the
outage
would
roll
to
somebody
else
to
make
sure
that
nobody
was
sitting
on
you
know
being
without
power
for
days
or
even
significant
parts
of
a
day.
So
the
wrong
utility
has
been
meeting
on
this
for
over
a
year
more
like
a
year
and
a
half
now
coordinating
the
plans
for
outage
coordination,
scheduling
rolling
blackouts
if
it
were
to
happen.
But
again
that
is
a
different
animal
than
saying
we
expect
it
to
happen.
G
G
This
is
also
a
regional
problem,
be
very
clear.
This
is
not
a
Vermont
problem.
This
is
not
something
Vermont
can
solve
and
it
is
going
to
be
triggered
by
the
whole
New
England
region,
calling
for
Rolling
blackouts
regionally.
This
would
not
be
targeted
at
Vermont.
It
would
not
be
targeted
at
Burlington,
it's
not
a
local
problem,
it
doesn't.
A
G
A
G
G
H
G
G
Right
we
have,
we
have
an
interesting
mix
of
generators,
but
he's
you
know
it's
right.
It's
a
circuit,
question
I,
don't
know
that
I
mean
we
have.
We
have
a
gas
turbine.
We
have
a
black
start
unit.
We
have,
you
know
multiple
megawatts.
You
know
we
have
low
generation
in
excess
of
our
load,
but
it
may
not
be
placed
right.
That's
what
I'm
saying
it's
theoretically
possible
for
areas
to
Island
I,
don't
know
if
we
can
do
it
so
well,.
G
There
would
be
repercussions
right,
so
the
last
thing
I
just
want
to
mention
and
throughout
is
what
is
this
doing
to
the
annual
price
of
power?
It's
moving
it
up
to
so
we're
looking
now
at
annual.
This
is
annual
now
wholesale
price
of
power,
not
winter
wholesale
price
of
power,
so
we
could
start
to
see
impacts
from
these
markets
when
we
go
to
replace
our
contracts.
G
G
So
rolling
12
months,
so
what
you're
doing
is
you
basically
pick
up
a
day
drop
a
day?
So
it's
not
like
a
year.
So
it's
it's
12
months,
ending
December,
31st,
2018
12
months,
ending
January,
1st
2018..
So
it's
a
that
way.
You
get
the
constant
motion,
not
the
step
wise
because
it
doesn't
move
stepwise.
G
G
I
mean
again
like
I,
say
we
are
concerned
and
we're
watching
it
and
we're.
You
know
again
we're
we're
sitting
on
the
better
side
of
the
equation
right.
We
have
excess
resources
at
high
price
times.
We
would
like
those
high
prices
to
come
in.
I
suspect
we're,
not
the
we're.
Not
you
know
we're,
not
the
you
know
the
majority
of
people
right
now
who
would
like
those
spices
to
be
high.
G
I
said
it's
difficult
to
hedge
hedging
does
help
if
you
can
get
the
put
the
right
hedge
in
place,
that
doesn't
mean
I
can
find
a
buyer
that
would
buy
the
type
of
hedge.
That
would
help
us
the
most
and
we
have
tried
so
far.
We
have
not
succeeded.
Well,
we
would
like
I,
want
to
be
careful
about
putting
too
much
Market
information
out
on,
but
you
know
again
you're
trying
to
match
what
you
sell
to
the
risk
you
want
to
retain
and
the
risks
you
don't
want
to
retain
and
then
find
out.
D
D
G
Well,
but
if
we
were
short
energy,
for
example,
let's
say
we
took
McNeil
out
of
our
portfolio
and
we
were
therefore
not
selling
energy
excess
energy.
The
last
rate
case
would
have
been
20
higher
in
order
to
purchase
the
wholesale
power.
We
need
to
fill
up
balance
of
our
portfolio,
so
that
would
have
been
worse
right.
D
D
G
G
D
G
G
A
Well
and
I
think
the
important
piece
is
you
know:
energy
is
the
the
pulse
of
our
economy
and
how
we
drive
and
heat
and
cool
our
homes.
And,
frankly,
if
you're
not
preparing
for
the
worst
case
scenario,
then
you're
not
doing
your
job,
so
I
I
think
it's
far
better
to
be
meeting
as
multiple
utilities
and
saying
okay.
How
would
we
address
this?
How
would
we
you
know
deal
with
this
and
we
have
a
war
in
Ukraine?
We
have
you
know
multiple.
A
G
And
the
wind
yeah
so
I
just
want
to
say,
though,
that
we
have
been
attending
these
meetings
for
the
last
18
months,
both
engineering
and
policy,
and
planning
for
both
sort
of
the
market
side
and
the
reliability
generation.
You
know
dispatching
side,
you
know
so
again.
I
just
want
people
if
they
hear
about
this,
to
not
panic
but
to
have
the
frame
of
reference.
E
Really
be
a
good
subplot
here
about
the
benefits
of
being
renewable
and
not
being
tied
to
Natural
Gas
and
having
our
our
own
portfolio
of
energy.
That
like
we're.
Our
only
risk
is,
if
we
don't
sell
it,
the
excess
at
the
price
that
we
thought,
but
we're
still
protected
against
the
external
Market
because
of
the
portfolio
of
energy.
E
E
A
E
D
A
F
F
Think
roughly
150
000
of
that
was
these
charges
from
this
particular
tanker
which
were
unbudgeted
and
unknown,
and
those
were
I
think
utilized
in
the
summertime,
not
because
they
were
needed,
obviously
for
winter
reliability,
but
just
to
enable
a
new
tanker
to
come
in
with
a
full
load
and
so
yeah.
When
we
think
about
it.
That's
part
of
our
Region's
reliability
plan.
F
A
F
I
mean
we're
tapping
geothermal
for
for
ground
Source
heating
in
Burlington,
but
I.
My
recollection
is,
is
New.
England
is
just
not
a
great
geothermal
electric
generating
resource,
unfortunately
so
yeah
when
we
look
at
our
options,
we're
thinking,
Hydro,
wind
battery
storage
could
play
a
role,
obviously,
and
maybe
not
moving
away
from
some
of
those
generators
that
are
low
carbon.
Now,
even
you
know
whether
it's
nuclear
biomass
preserving
what
we
have
and
then
trying
to
build
more.
F
So
really
we
need
to
think
about
winter
time
Renewables,
particularly
in
the
electrification
scenario,
where
more
people
are
using
heat
pumps,
we
may
see
the
region
become
more
of
a
winter
peaking
region
again
and
we
need
Renewables
that
align
operationally
with
that
and
that's
you
know
that
goes
back
to
like
the
orb
at
the
airport.
You
know
that's
going
to
produce
more
energy
theoretically
in
the
winter
time
than
a
solar
panel
might
so
having
that
could
be
a
nice
complement
to
having
solar
in
the
summer.