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From YouTube: Preservation Commission Meeting 2-11-2020
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A
Good
evening
I'd
like
to
call
to
order
the
February
11
2020
meeting
of
the
Evanston
Preservation
Commission,
we
have
a
quorum
of
eight
commissioners
if
you
wish
to.
If
you,
if
you
wish
to
speak
tonight,
please
sign
up
on
the
signup
sheet
outside
the
room
which
we'll
pull
in
in
a
minute
and
the
procedure
will
follow
will
be
for
each
matter.
The
applicant
will
present
their
package
and
arguments
in
favor
of
the
application.
The
commissioners
can
ask
any
questions
if
anything
is
unclear
and
then
we'll
ask
the
applicant
to
have
a
seat
at
that
point.
A
We'll
allow
any
member
of
the
public
who
signs
up
to
speak
for
two
minutes
and
I.
Think
the
cities
now
got
a
timer
here
and
then
we'll
have
any
discussion
needed
between
the
commissioners
and
take
about
they
are
applicable.
So
the
first
matter
of
business
was
1204
Sherman
Avenue,
which
the
applicant
has
SP
continued.
A
B
D
E
Okay,
my
name
is
Chris
truly
from
Turley
architects,
I've
already
signed
in
and
yet
Carlos's
suggestion,
I
produced
reproduced
a
few
things
from
the
packet
in
a
larger
format
and
I
distributed
that,
if
you
don't
have
one
I
have
a
couple
of
extra
copies,
so
I
thought
what
I
would
do
today.
This
is
our
second
visit
here.
E
We
were
here
a
couple
months
ago
in
November
and
so
I
thought,
since
there
are
a
few
faces
new
faces
here
and
for
the
benefit
of
the
audience,
I
thought
I'd
just
do
a
quick
review
of
what
occurred
then
what's
changed
since
and
then
maybe
go
through
as
a
way
of
explaining
the
building
start
going
through
some
of
the
criteria,
the
standards
for
the
certificate
of
appropriateness,
so
that
we
can
use
that
as
a
structure
to
review
everything.
So
during
that
discussion,
I'll
be
explaining
the
plans
and
other
things
so
I
also
want
to
introduce.
E
We
have
Maria
nanos
here,
who
is
my
client
and
Lynne
brisk
and
could
not
make
it
tonight
so
so
we're
looking
at
5:48,
Judson,
and
so
this
building
is
was
is
in
the
lakeshore
historic
district.
The
excuse
me
pull
that
away
a
little
bit,
so
the
the
building
is
now
to
register
building,
not
a
landmark
building.
It
is
not
listed
on
the
original
1987.
E
Documents
is
that
all
working-
it's
not
listed
under
the
original
incorporation
of
the
district
as
a
historic
building
or
even
as
a
site
or
structure
of
special
significance.
There
are
256
properties
noted
it
was
not
listed
as
one
of
them.
It
was
also
not
listed
as
making
a
major
contribution
to
the
architectural
fabric
in
2011
when
the
area
was
resurveyed,
it
was
noted
as
having
some
historical
features,
specifically
a
side
gable
return
which
I
am.
E
So
there
we
go
so
there
is
a
side,
gable
return
which
occurs.
Just
you
know
in
this
one
corner
here,
actually
two
corners
one
on
either
side.
This
is
viewing.
This
is
viewing
it
from
the
side.
You
can
see
that
it
is
sagging.
They
also
noted
a
front
bay
as
a
historical
element,
just
the
fact
that
it
pushes
out
on
the
front.
That
is
the
side
view
of
it
there
and
then.
Finally,
the
eight
over
one
windows,
so
8
divided
lights
over
a
single
sash
light,
a
single
light
in
the
bottom
sash.
E
The
so
what
we
we
started,
working
with
the
contractor
and
what
we
found
was
that
the
cost
of
replacing
and
repairing
the
building
was
extraordinarily
high.
In
short,
what
would
result
is
a
two
bedroom
building,
given
today's
current
kitchens
and
other
features,
we
would
end
up
with
a
two-bedroom
two-bath
building
at
about
$900,000
of
total
value,
and
that
would
put
it
about
twice
what
the
current
market
rate
is
right.
Now
two
bedrooms
are
going
for
two
hundred
and
fifty
to
five
hundred
and
sixty
thousand
dollars
in
evanston.
E
This
would
be
at
about
nine
hundred
and
if
we
were
to
put
in
addition
on
the
building,
if
that
were
possible,
it
would
probably
add
another
couple
hundred
thousand
dollars
or
one
hundred
and
fifty
thousand
dollars
on
top
of
that.
So
we
had
a
variety
of
contractors,
look
at
it
and
they
agreed
that
this
building
was
really
challenged,
as
well
as
one
person
to
visited
the
site.
This
building
does
everything
wrong
with
it.
E
It
might
have
even
had
cholera
at
one
point,
so
it's
really
been
a
challenge
trying
to
figure
out
a
way
to
bring
this
building
back
up
and
and
usable.
So
we
started
looking
at
replacing
the
building.
We
came
up
with
some
some
elements.
What
I'd
like
to
with
some
design
elements?
What
I'd
like
to
do
is
go
over
the
the
demo
stander
and
explain
how
we
you
know
what
we,
our
opinions
are
on
that
and
then
I'll
go
into
the
new
standard,
so
standard
one
under
demo.
E
It
says
whether
the
and
I
won't
read
word
for
word
the
entire
standard.
You
all
know
what
that
is
so
I'll
just
summarize
it
so
you
know
which
one
we're
talking
about,
whether
the
property
structure
or
object
is
of
such
historic,
cultural,
architectural
or
archaeological
significance.
So
we
don't
believe
it
is.
You
know,
as
we
said,
a
lot
of
the
elements
that
are
actually
noted
are
either
have
to
be
replaced
or
rebuilt
extensively
and
they're,
not
also
they're.
Also
not
rare
elements.
E
You
know
the
front
Bay
on
the
building,
the
the
site,
the
return
on
the
gable
and
the
windows
don't
indicate
a
specific
architectural
style
of
any
kind,
and
it's
that
nor
are
they
rare.
All
of
those
things
are
currently
being
done
in
buildings
today.
So,
on
issue
number
two:
whether
the
property
structure
or
object
relates
to
the
distinctive
historic,
cultural,
architectural
or
archeological
character
of
the
district
as
a
whole,
and
we
don't
believe
it
does.
The
there
is
for
this
district,
not
a
cohesive,
singular
building
style.
E
In
fact,
if
you've
gone
down
this
block
of
Judson,
you
could
probably
write
a
defining
dictionary
of
architectural
styles
just
based
on
this
block.
We
have
just
about
everything
if
anything,
the
architectural
style,
particularly
of
this
block,
is
eclectic.
It
has
a
little
bit
of
everything,
and
so
we
don't
believe
it
is
a
significant
contribution
to
the
district
or
the
neighborhood
or
the
street,
and
we
believe
that,
if
it
was
it
would
have
been
listed
either
in
in
1987
or
in
2011.
E
The
number
standard
3
is
whether
demolition
of
the
property
structure
or
object
would
be
contrary
to
the
purpose
and
intent
of
this
chopped
chapter
and
the
to
the
objectives
of
the
historic
preservation
for
the
applicable
district.
Again,
we
don't
believe
so
would
have
been
listed
previously
number
4,
whether
the
property
structure,
objectives
of
such
old
unusual
or
distinctive
design,
texture
and/or
material
that
it
could
not
be
reproduced
with
a
great
deal
of
difficulty
or
expense.
Well,
this
property
was
originally
two
Lots
that
somebody
split
into
three.
Hence
some
of
our
major
challenges.
E
These
are
33
foot
wide
Lots
in
an
area
where
50
is
the
standard,
and
these
were
built
as
I
think
small
cottages
for
a
single
family.
You
know
they
they
put
three
of
them
next
to
each
other,
and
so
they
were
low-cost
cottages
back
then,
and
there
there
is
nothing
extraordinary
about
any
of
the
materials
within
there.
I
actually
very
modest
number:
five,
whether
the
property
structure
or
object
is
of
such
physical
condition
that
it
represents
a
danger
and
imminent
hazard
condition
to
persons
or
property.
So
the
there
are
several
issues
here.
E
Obviously
we
have
a
lot
of
maintenance
issues
that
were
deferred
for
many
decades,
and
so
there
are-
and
of
course
the
building
is
out
of
date.
It
doesn't
meet
any
of
the
code
provisions
for
structural,
mechanical
electrical
plumbing
or
life
safety,
and
it
also
encroaches
on
the
neighbors
and
it's
is
it
encroaches
into
the
side
yards
and
with
the
large
soffits
that
this
building
has,
which
is
which
are
over
two
feet
wide
and
the
adjoining
buildings
have
over
two
foot
wide
soffits.
E
It
does
present
a
somewhat
some
fire
hazard
for
the
adjoining
buildings,
simply
because
soffits
are
where
you
know
a
lot
of
fires
spread
from
one
building
to
another
and
because
they're
already
encroaching
in
the
side,
yards
they're
actually
closer
than
the
usual
buildings
and
then
of
course,
number
six
is
in
cases
where
there
are
no
plans
for
a
period
of
up
to
five
years.
That's
not
the
case
here.
My
client
intends
to
build
immediately
and
occupy.
This
is
the
family
home.
It
was
inherited,
and
my
client,
you
know,
really
is
for
this
family.
E
This
is
a
magical
part
of
the
city.
This
is
theirs
their
Evanston
residence
now
and
they
are
moving
from
there
they're
quite
suitable
home
right
now
to
this
location
because
they
really
love
this
neighborhood.
So
the
new
design
well
actually
from
the.
Let
me
over
one
more
thing.
At
the
last
meeting,
there
were
a
few
points
that
were
made
and
in
particular,
points
were
made
were
related
to
the
height
of
the
building.
There
were
some
concerns
about
the
actual,
the
the
height
of
the
building,
especially
in
comparison
to
its
neighbors.
E
If
I
go
to
the
site
plan,
so
you
can
see
it
start
to
see
it
here.
The
existing
conditions
is,
they
took.
They
took
two
Lots
splitted
into
three,
and
so
we
have
some
very
narrow
Lots
and
what
this
does
is
it
drives
the
the
numbers
to
be
very,
very
difficult
to
accommodate
a
building
we're
in
an
r1
district
and
so
with
the
lock
coverage,
the
impervious
conditions
etc.
E
E
In
order
to
get
this
the
the
right
number
of
elements
we
would
have
had
to
make
the
building
very
very
long.
In
order
to
do
you
have
avoid
doing
that,
we
put
this
extra
bedroom
downstairs.
So
this
would
be
the
fourth
bedroom
or
fifth
bedroom
and
I'll.
Explain
why
it's
it
could
be
either.
One
we
put
that
in
the
basement
instead
of
up
on
the
second
floor,
so
right
now,
in
the
second
floor
we
have
two
bedrooms
and
a
master
bedroom
up
there.
This
would
be
the
bedroom
for
the
bad
child
that
or
the
teenager.
E
E
Here
is
the
front
setback,
the
front
yard,
setback
and
right
here
just
to
give
you
a
layout
here
we
have
a
handicap-accessible
bedroom
and
bath
now
that
will
actually
be
used
as
an
office
Lin
brisk
and
is
a
realtor
here
in
the
city
or
in
the
area,
and
and
so
we
wanted
to
create
an
office
for
her,
but
we
also
look
at
Aging
in
Place
issues
always,
and
so
we
developed
this
plan
so
that
this
office
could
be
converted.
This
bathroom
also
serves
as
a
powder
room
for
the
whole
floor.
E
E
Our
countertops
did
not
show
up,
but
they
are
in
that
area
and
a
dining
room
and
a
living
room,
and
so
one
of
the
concessions
that
my
clients
made
was
that
they
really
wanted
to
have
separate
dining
room,
living,
room
and
kitchen,
and
so
we
actually
combined
them.
In
order
to
minimize
the
square
footage
of
the
floor
plans
second
floor.
We
have
a
master
suite
in
this
area:
master
bedroom,
a
small
reading
room,
a
couple
of
closets
and
a
bathroom.
E
Then
we
have
one
bedroom,
two
bedrooms,
a
shared
bathroom
and
a
laundry
and
then
this
room
up
here
is
mechanical.
Again
we
have
a
second
mechanical
room.
So,
as
you
can
see,
it's
a
modest
program,
a
modest
scope,
we're
not
putting
in
tennis,
courts
and
swimming
pools
and
things
of
that
sort.
We
really
did
try
to
strip
it
down
and
get
it
to
fall
as
close
as
we
could
within
the
restrictions
of
the
r-1.
E
So
we
started
to
develop
the
style
of
the
building.
I'm
gonna
go
back
to
the
very
beginning
here
and
so
the
when
we
started
working
with
the
client.
As
I
said,
my
client
is
a
realtor.
She
has
seen
thousands
of
buildings
and
right
from
the
start,
she
gravitated
towards
a
more
updated
modern,
farmhouse
style,
a
very
simplified,
elegant,
simple
materials,
horizontal
siding
and,
just
as
I
said,
very
simple
materials.
Well,
we
have
developed
here
that
has
changed
and
will
go
for
this
in
a
second.
Is
we
have
a
broader
base?
E
This
is
stripped
clear
of
any
landscaping,
so
forgive
the
abrupt
wall
to
a
site
connection,
because
obviously
there
will
be
some
some
landscape
meet
here,
but
I
wanted
to
be
able
to
show
that
we
have
a
plinth
base.
Here,
that's
about
an
8-inch
sighting.
We
have
a
horizontal
band
of
8
inch.
We
have
six
inch
sighting
going
up
with
periodic
horizontal
bands,
and
then
we
have
a
the
gable
roofs,
the
roofs
step
back.
We
have
a
front
roof
here.
E
We
drop
that
down
as
much
as
we
could
to
at
the
front
of
the
property
and,
as
I
said,
we
pushed
everything
back
on
the
site.
We
pushed
the
whole
building
back
eight
feet
since
the
last
time
you
saw
it
and
so
and
we
stepped
this
roof
down.
So
let
me
just
briefly
go
over
some
of
the
changes
that
we
made
since
the
last
one
and
again
I'll
point
these
out,
so
we
moved
the
building
back
eight
feet.
We
lowered
this
the
first
floor,
a
few
inches
about
six
inches.
E
We
reduced
the
ceiling
heights
on
the
second
floor
on
the
front
Bay.
Originally
we
had
one
facade.
We
had
no
real
porch
on
it,
but
we
have
one
facade.
We
have
now
created
a
front
Bay
in
this
area.
Here
we've
pushed
back
that
area
and
then
even
further
that
area
you'll
see
that
in
the
perspectives
in
a
few
minutes
and
we
indented
the
front
door,
we
reduced
the
second-floor
size
on
the
south
side
of
the
building
in
that
area.
E
Actually,
let
me
see
if
I
can
you
can
see
that
here
the
front
porch
this
lines
up
with
some
of
the
with
the
adjoining
properties,
the
front
of
the
steps,
but
the
roof
is
stepped
back
further
and
then
we
step
back
the
first
roof,
the
second
roof
and
the
third
roof.
So
the
porch
of
the
fruit
of
the
roof
of
the
sorry,
the
roof
of
the
porch,
is
set
back
from
the
edge
of
the
porch
and
then
the
front
bay
was
lowered
from
34
foot,
ten
to
twenty
seven
foot,
nine
so
quite
substantially.
E
The
intermediate
second
roof
was
lowered
from
thirty
four
feet.
Ten
to
thirty
one
foot,
seven,
the
rear
portion
was
lowered
from
thirty
four
foot,
ten
to
thirty
two
foot,
eight,
so
it's
well
under
the
maximum
that
were
permitted
to
have
the
in
the
previa.
So
in
the
previous
one
we
were
right
at
that's
almost
at
the
thirty
five
feet.
E
Other
elements
that
we've
changed
originally
we
had
two
sets
similar
to
this.
We
had
two
sets.
We
had
total
of
four
windows
on
the
facade.
We
felt
that
that
was
reinforcing
a
verticality
that
we
didn't
want,
and
so
we
changed
that
to
three
windows
and
we
put
them
in
a
band
we
connected
them
all.
Together
we
actually
made
the
window
slightly
smaller.
We
increased
some
of
the
siding
to
better
match
some
of
the
neighbors
buildings.
We
kept
the
trim
around
the
window,
we
kept
the
trim
that
was
horizontal.
E
E
I
can
go
over
the
materials
that
we
selected
an
hour.
I
can
wait
until
I
go
through
all
of
these
standards.
It
probably
is
better
to
add
to
respond,
as
you
ask
questions
so
I'm
gonna
I'd
like
to
go
through
the
standards.
The
sixteen
standards
right
now
and
I
think
that
will
help
bring
us
all
up
to
speed.
So
I
gave
you
some
packets
I'll,
be
referring
to
some
of
those
in
the
course
of
this,
so
in
related
to
the
height,
so
height
shall
be
visibly
visually
compatible
with
property
structure,
sites,
etc.
E
If
you
look
at
the
first
two
or
three
sheets,
a
three
point,
one,
a
three
point:
two:
these
are
similar
to
each
other,
one
assist
in
enlargement
and
I
photoshopped
in
a
and
I'm
sorry
that
these
aren't
on
the
screen.
Iphoto
show
this
is
where
Carlos
thought
that
maybe
a
little
bit
larger
scale
drawing
was
useful.
So
it's
the
same
building
just
a
little
bit
larger,
so
you
can
see
them
so
I
photoshopped.
E
E
There
are
a
few
that
are
taller
and,
of
course,
we
have
the
apartment
building
on
the
corner,
so
we
think
that
the
height
that
the
issue
of
the
height
was
mitigated
by
reducing
the
total
height
of
the
building
and
also
by
pushing
it
back.
So
this
perspective
actually
shows
that,
from
the
perspective
of
the
sidewalk
this
these
perspectives,
his
photos
were
all
taken
and
the
perspective
creative
from
somebody
standing
across
the
street
so
that
they
would
see
the
maximum
amount,
not
the
minimum
amount.
E
Item
to
the
standard,
to
proportion
of
facades,
relationship
of
the
width
to
the
height
of
the
facade
shall
be
visually
compatible
with
property
structures,
sites,
public
ways,
objects
and
places
to
which
it
is
visually
related.
So
we
think
that
the
building
the
building
to
the
north
has
already
had.
In
addition,
and
so
you
can
see
that
there
is
not
a
substantial
difference
between
that,
the
height
of
that
building
and
our
building,
and
in
fact
the
top
of
the
roof
of
the
building
to
the
south,
is
actually
about
midway
up
the
second
floor.
E
So
we're
not
putting
in
a
maxed
out
building
right
now.
We
think
that
it
does
relate
to
the
the
two
that
are
adjacent
and
it
is
certainly
not
as
tall
as
most
of
the
buildings
on
the
on
the
block.
We
think
it's
fairly
modest
number
three
proportion
of
openings
so
I
have
some
fun
statistics
for
you
all
related
to
windows,
because
I
know
you
guys
really
like
so
20
out
of
the
23
properties
on
the
street,
have
double-hung
windows,
so
we
maintain
that
element.
E
E
35%
of
the
properties
do
not
have
divided
light,
so
it's
not
universal
and
in
fact,
in
the
two
adjoining
properties
that
you
know
we
talked
about
how
these
were
three
identical
properties:
they're,
really
not
three
identical
properties,
not
just
because
the
one
to
the
north
has
been
renovated.
It's
no
longer
sighting,
it's
no
longer
a
one-story
building,
it's
been
radically
changed,
but
the
windows
on
it
I
actually
are
very
different
they're,
not
the
eight
over
one
windows,
and
so
that's
you
know.
Most
of
the
you
know
about.
E
35%
of
the
properties
have
windows
that
do
not
have
divided
lights
and
about
50%
48%
have
very
large
amounts
of
of
glass
compared
to
compared
to
the
amount
of
facade
check
something
here,
and
you
can
actually
see
that
on
a
zero
one
point
three
point:
four,
there's
just
a
huge
variety:
we
run
from
a
building
that
has
almost
no
openings
at
all
on
the
facade
two
buildings,
the
empire
building
style
building
in
the
upper
right
corner
has
isn't
in
it.
Just
has
an
enormous
amount
of
glass
for
a
more
classic
building.
E
E
What
is
already
there
right
now
we're
the
building
that
is,
there
presently
encroaches
onto
the
side
yard,
and
so
we're
actually
mitigating
that
simply
by
going
with
following
the
code,
and
we
believe
that
by
indenting
part
of
the
building
etc
we're
trying
to
create
a
little
bit
more
space
between
the
buildings,
but
it's
a
tight
site.
We
don't
have
a
whole
lot
of
flexibility
of
where
to
place
the
building
on
the
site.
E
Again,
we
I'm
going
to
refer
you
to
the
street
plan,
which
is
a
one
point,
three
point:
five
and
there's
two
versions
of
it.
One
shows
the
entire
block
and
the
other
shows
an
enlarged
section,
and
in
this
you
can
see
that
again
we
don't
have
a
whole
lot
of
choices
on
where
to
place.
The
building
on
the
site
at
least
side
by
side
sideways
north-south
direction,
like
some
of
the
other
properties,
have
a
lot
more
room
around
them.
E
So
we
have
to
work
within
that,
but
you
can
see
that
the
facade
of
the
building
we
did
hold
it
back
from
the
the
street.
We
did
match
our
porch
to
align
with
the
bays
on
the
adjoining
buildings
and
they
had
all
the
buildings,
with
the
exception
of
the
apartment
building
at
the
north
west
corner,
all
of
them
form
a
wall.
They
all
kind
of
line
up
along
the
same
facade
or
the
same
line
on.
E
The
issue
of
the
rhythm
of
entrance,
porches,
storefront,
recesses
and
other
projections.
We
have
a
one
point
three
point:
six
I
just
showed
for
you
of
the
porches
that
occur
in
the
neighborhood.
It's
interesting.
We
think
of
this
neighborhood
as
having
just
a
lot
of
porches,
and
only
about
thirty
percent
of
them
do
so
we,
but
we
actually
did
carry
that
into
our
building.
We
like
porches.
We
think
they
welcome
the
neighborhood.
E
E
We
have
photos
of
some
of
the
different
varieties
of
the
different
textures,
so
57%
of
the
of
the
properties
on
the
street
have
horizontal
wood
sighting.
So,
of
course
we
did
adopt
that
and
they
also
or
they
have
very
strong
horizontals
a
few
have
vertical
sighting,
but
we
picked
up
the
sighting
just
to
reinforce
that
that
element
we
mimicked,
we,
we
went
out
and
looked
at
the
different
sizes
of
sighting
and
we
adopted
some
of
that
for
our
buildings.
So
it
relates
to
some
of
these
joining
buildings.
E
Roofs
shapes
so
the
the
roof
shape
of
our
structure,
including
any
roof
mounted
equipment,
shall
be
visually
compatible.
So
in
a
one
point
three
point:
seven,
we
just
have
some
photos
of
the
different
gable
roofs,
so
twelve
out
of
the
23
properties
have
one
or
more
gable
roofs,
so
we
did
adopt
that
that
was
part
of
the
original
design,
but
we've
kept
them
and
so
and
there's
also
a
variety
of
what
the
roofs
look
like
on
this
tree.
We
have
sloped
roofs,
flat,
roofs,
hip,
roofs
and
gable
roofs.
E
So
it's
it's
an
architecture,
professors,
dream
of
showing
the
students
what
things
look
like:
the
number:
nine,
our
walls
of
continuity,
facades
and
property,
and
sites
and
structures
such
as
masonry,
walls,
fences
and
landscape
masses,
shell,
when
in
characteristic
of
an
area
form
cohesive
wall.
So
really
we
don't
have
a
whole
lot
of
options
here.
Pretty
walls
in
we
do
have
some
fencing
on
either
side
of
the
building.
We
hold
it
back
from
the
facade
a
bit
just
to
give
the
client
my
client
some
privacy.
E
The
real
wall
of
continuity
is
the
there's
the
line
up
of
all
the
facades,
and
we
do
maintain
that
scale
of
the
structure.
We
can
go
back
to
1.3.1,
but
I
think
I've
already
addressed
that
directional
expression
of
the
facades.
If
you
go
to
again
a
one
point,
three
point:
nine,
you
see
the
horizontal
sighting
and
you
know
we
think
that
we
have
done
a
pretty
good
job.
Giving
this
building,
even
though
we're
on
a
tight
site,
and
we
have
to
go
up
to
give
it
a
very
horizontal
emphasis.
E
Original
qualities.
Number
12
is
the
distinct
machine,
original
quality,
qualities
or
character
of
a
property
structure
or
site
or
object
again.
We've
already
discussed
this.
The
gable
roof
returned
the
front
bay
and
the
windows.
We
don't
think
our
reparable
they
would
have
to
be
replaced.
Maybe
we
can
do
some
work
to
save
them,
but
in
all
likelihood
we
don't
think
that
that's
possible
and
we
don't
think
it's
applicable
to
this
design.
E
Archaeological
resources,
number
13
doesn't
apply
innovative
design.
So
this
one
was
kind
of
an
interesting
experience.
Ting
conversation
I
had
in
that
the
whole
area
is
this
whole
block,
as
I
said,
is,
is
best
described
as
eclectic,
and
so
we
believe
that
that
this
design
fits
into
the
neighborhood,
whether
it's
exactly
innovative
I,
don't
know
how
to
judge
that,
but
it
is
this.
Neighborhood
is
a
collection
of
a
variety
of
architectural
styles.
I
think
this
building
design
is
very
sympathetic
to
that.
It
is
elegant,
it
is
simple
and
it
is
part
of
the
fabric.
E
It
doesn't
stand
out
as
calling
attention.
It
is
not
intended
to
be
that
my
client
specifically
did
not
want
that.
It
is
not
screaming
for
people
to
stop
and
take
pictures
or
anything
like
that.
It
is
really
intended
to
be
a
simple
elegant
home,
in
which
beautiful
things
can
happen
artwork
on
the
walls
landscaping
outside
and
the
lives
of
the
people
within
number
15.
New
additions
does
not
apply
to
this
project
number
16
new
construction,
again
I
mentioned
the
architectural
style,
is
very
eclectic.
E
Number
17
as
signage
does
not
apply,
so
we
you
know
in
working
with
this
design.
We
really
made
every
effort
to
compress
the
building
as
much
as
we
can
to
reduce
the
footprint
and
to
lower
the
building
as
much
as
we
could
without
affecting
the
interior
in
such
a
way
that
we
were
unable
to
build
it.
So
we
really
did
very
best
to
lower
the
roofs
lower.
The
mass
of
it
set
it
back
from
the
street
even
further,
so
that,
from
a
perspective
of
people
walking
down
the
street,
it
has
less
less
mass.
E
We
understand
that
the
the
neighbor
to
the
south
had
some
concerns
about
this,
and
so
we
did
put
the
indentation
in
the
side
of
the
house
so
that
she
gets
a
little
bit
more
light
and
a
little
bit
more
space
on
that
side.
Our
footprint
of
our
building
is
similar
to
the
footprint
of
her
building.
You
can
see
that
on
the
plan
on
the
site
plan
that
I
just
gave
you,
we
lowered
the
house
right
now.
E
There
is
some
encroachment
on
her
part
onto
our
property
with
a
garden,
and
so
that's
unfortunate
it's,
but
we
will
help
relocate
the
gardening
stuff,
the
garden
items
the
there
were
some
general
comments
about
the
height
in
the
scale.
I
think
we've
addressed
that
with
the
architectural
style.
We
do
believe
that
it
is
an
appropriate
style
for
this
neighborhood.
It
borrows
a
lot
of
the
same
materials,
but
in
a
new
and
different
way.
E
We
think
it's
a
very
clean
and
elegant
and
beautiful
building
to
put
to
build
on
this
street,
and-
and
that's
it-
you
know
so
I
think
that
you
know
this
as
I
said
this
building
we're
very
excited
about
it.
We
want
to
get
underway.
We
believe
that
it
makes
a
real
contribution
to
the
vitality
of
this
neighborhood.
In
addition
to
this
building
replacing
a
building
that
we
believe
is
depressing
the
economic
value
of
the
adjoining
properties.
E
This
building,
we
believe,
will
raise
them,
but
it
also
brings
in
another
element,
and
that
is
the
Adu
on
the
back
of
the
property.
So
above
the
garage
we
have
an
accessory
dwelling
unit.
That
dwelling
unit
is
is
something
that
the
city
is
really
encouraging.
Construction
of
it
provides
affordable
housing
in
this
area
for
associate
professors
or
people
who
work
in
the
area,
because
we
have
a
train
station
nearby,
we're
able
to
minimize
the
parking
issues
in
the
neighborhood
and
so
and
in
fact
one
of
the
members
of
the
nanos
family
is
considering
moving
there.
E
So
again,
it's
reinforcing
that
this
is
a
family
home
and
a
contribution
to
the
neighborhood.
So
with
that
I
think
I.
Think
with
this
is
in
our
opinion,
this
is
a
very
reasonable
design,
a
very
reasonable
project,
given
that
the
building
is
and
such
the
current
building
is
in
such
poor
shape,
and
we
look
forward
to
your
questions.
We
are
looking
forward
and
hope
that
you
will
approve
this.
A
A
E
E
Those
are
those
are
stainless:
steel
bars
yeah.
We
decided
that
you
know.
If
he's,
if
you
look
on
a
1.3.1
o10,
you
will
see
a
in
a
large
section
of
that,
so
we
did
look
at
more
traditional
porches,
but
we
really
felt
like
that.
This
building
a
more
a
more
modern
take
on
a
farmhouse.
You
really
deserved
a
lighter
structure,
some
strong
horizontal
elements
and
so
yeah.
E
So
let
me
just
point
out
in
elevation
first
and
then
I'll
go
to
the
sides,
so
this
is
the
front
bay
here.
This
is
the
second
second
bay.
This
is
an
indented
front
door
and
porch,
and
then
this
is
the
second
bay
apart
above
it,
it's
indented
it
beyond
that
surface,
which
I'll
show
you
in
a
second
and
then
that's
the
back
roof
as
it
rises.
E
So
you
can
start
to
see
some
of
that
here
this
this
line
right
here.
This
is
the
building
beyond
that's
the
south,
the
existing
south
building.
This
is
the
roof
of
the
of
our
porch
right,
and
you
can
see
that
we
have
the
porch
extends
out
to
the
front
yard
setback,
and
then
we
setback
that
roof
a
little
bit.
We
have
this
secondary
this
roof
here.
This
is
a
Cathedral
on
the
inside.
We
lowered
it
on
the
inside
to
get
it
as
low
it.
E
You
know
to
get
the
height
down
as
much
as
possible
beyond
it
is
the
secondary
roof.
So
these
are
in
a
sense
side-by-side,
but
one
is
pushed
back
slightly
and
then
this
is
the
third
roof.
Now
the
reason
there
is
a
jump
here
is
because
of
the
indent:
on
the
other
side,
the
width
of
the
building
is
shorter,
is
narrower,
and
so,
as
we
get
to
the
back
of
the
property,
it
gets
a
little
wider.
And
so
that's
that's
the
that's
what
drives
that.
But
this
is
all
one
flat
surface
here.
E
A
D
H
I'm
also
concerned
about
the
fact
that
the
the
city
has
sort
of
bending
over
backwards
by
considering
additional
variances
to
the
zoning.
There
are
three
variances
that
are
come
to
mind,
which
are
it's
part
of
the
program,
and
one
is
that
well.
First
of
all,
it
is
a
single-family
residence
and
if
you
put
a
garage
coach
house,
you
add
a
car
space
to
the
requirement
for
all
street
parking.
H
So
that's
one
that
I
don't
understand
why
we
would
consider
that
to
this
is
a
lot
coverage
as
maximum
of
30
percent
and
they
are
considering
asking
for
38%,
which
is
a
26
percent
increase
in
the
lot
coverage
of
the
lot
lot.
Coverage
means
less
impervious
surfaces
and
less
than
pervious
services
means
a
lot
of
rain
and
water
runoff
to
the
adjacent
properties
which
could
be
a
problem
to
the
people
north
and
south
of
this
property.
H
H
All
that
in
mind,
I,
just
AM,
concerned
that
there
is
gonna
be
a
lot
of
building
built
there
and
I
think
the
city
is
sort
of
taking
not
advantage
by
taking
exceptions
to
the
request
for
variances
and
I.
Think
what
they
should
do
is
hold
the
developers
to
the
the
proper
lot
coverage
and
variances
and
the
off-street
parking.
Okay.
H
D
I
Just
a
point
of
clarification
for
the
public
and
the
Commission,
the
the
last
variance
was
mentioned.
The
off
street
parking
is
no
longer
applicable
to
this
project.
The
city
has
approved
a
text
amendment
waiving
parking
for
coach
houses
when
within
1500
feet
of
a
transit
stop
and
that
that's
a
applies
to
this
property.
I
A
B
A
B
A
B
Also
I
have
a
letter
from
a
neighbor
to
the
south
Geraldine
Shapiro,
who
sent
an
email
in
a
position
to
the
construction
and
demolition,
mainly
because
she
felt
that
the
proportions
and
the
height
and
the
amount
of
the
mass
of
the
building
was
nodding
not
compatible
with
the
block,
and
you
have
received
this
email
earlier.
Just
for
the
record.
A
C
C
Single-Family
residence
with
a
two
car
detached
garage
and
coach
house
it'll
be
a
separate
motion
for
any
recommendations
for
zoning,
so
I'm
combining
demolition
and
construction.
The
applicable
standards
for
demolition
are
one
through
six
and
for
construction,
one
through
eleven
fourteen
and
I'm.
Sorry,
13,
14
and
16
I'm,
not
actually
sure
that
13
is
applicable
either,
but
that
was
still
being
listed
here
and
a.
A
A
A
J
Oh
can
I
just
say
one
thing
about
the
zoning
I
would
just
encourage
the
new
construction,
the
architect,
to
make
sure
that,
because
the
you're
asking
for
a
variance
for
the
impervious
surface,
that
you
make
sure
that
you're,
that
you
have
a
civil
engineering
you're
looking
at
the
drainage
of
the
property,
because
it
looks
like
there's
a
lot
more
lot
coverage
and
those
are
always
issues.
So
that's
just
something
I
think
is-
might
be
an
issue.
C
A
B
A
F
B
A
K
Interesting
hearing
their
discussion
about
the
Terra
Donna
that
you've
just
approved
in
what
we're
asking
for,
is
reasonably
a
a
big
move
towards
restoration
and
preservation,
as
opposed
to
a
teardown,
not
that
I
disapprove
of
that.
But
we
first
would
like
to
request
that.
We
continue
this
hearing
which
mr.
Mangum
has
said
that
we
have
to
come
and
request
that
in
verses.
K
K
You
all
know
this
is
a.
This
is
a
fairly
complicated
situation
that
involves
many
different
moving
parts
that
all
go
in
together
to
our
wish
and
our
vision
of
restoring
this
amazing
bar
in
this
vanishing
Evanston,
landmark
that
we
have
chosen
to
put
our
hearts
and
souls
into
restoring
and
you
disapprove
the
additional
certificate
of
appropriateness
for
some
fairly
simple
elements
that
had
been
done
20
years
ago,
and
so
we're
here
to
make
a
case
for
economic
hardship.
K
But
it's
tied
up
with
the
city,
throwing
additional
hardships
in
our
way
regarding
the
barn
and
elements
of
it,
and
so
in
my
email,
I
described
that
until
the
city,
the
hardships
are
continuing.
Until
the
city
advises
that
the
bar
may
be
a
licensed
ad,
you,
you
just
approved
an
additional
ad
you
going
up.
This
is
something
that
is
a
perfect
case
or
that,
but
the
city
has
advised
us
that
they
will
not
approve
it
as
well,
as
has
insisted
that
the
permitted
plan
and
zoning
compliant
approved
construction
that
happened
specifically.
K
The
deck
must
now
be
removed
to
be
zoning
compliant
now,
all
that
was
approved
20
years
ago.
So
until
these
elements
are
resolved
with
the
city
and
we've
been
pushing
the
city
to
do
so,
but
the
city
has
proven
to
be
for
whatever
their
own
purposes
are
recalcitrant
and
these
issues
have
not
been
able
to
be
remedied
or
resolved
at
this
time.
So
we
would
like
to
wait
till
it.
You.
A
I
K
A
Sorry
that
you're,
referring
to
moving
parts
and
so
forth,
with
no
reference
that
I
think
I
certainly
can't
understand,
so
the
only
alter
their
are
no
additional
alterations.
You're
applying
to
do
the
alterations
were
referring
to
were
only
to
reverse
the
unauthorized
previous
alterations.
There's
no,
it
just
don't
work
you're
asking
to
do
that's.
K
K
Yes,
we've
we
have
requested
that
they
push
it
to
a
mandate
with
no
with
no
answer.
That's
it's
well
observed.
That's
right!
The
city
has
just
said
that
it's
it's
complicated
and
I,
know
and
I
think
mr.
Mangum
may
better
address
it
for
for
you,
because
it's
been
going
on
sort
of
over
and
over
for
months
and
months
and.
A
I
Sure,
maybe
to
clarify
and
again
try
to
keep
the
the
Commission
focused
on
the
certificate
of
appropriateness
that
was
applied
for
having
to
do
with
the
sky
lights
in
the
windows.
Those
are
those
are
really
the
only
elements
that
apply
to
the
certificate
of
economic
hardship
that
was
submitted
following
that
the
denial
by
City
Council,
the.
As
you
may
recall,
this
Commission
denied
the
certificate
propria
nice
that
was
appealed
to
the
City
Council.
The
City
Council
did
not
take
up
that
appeal.
I
So
there's
a
process
within
the
preservation
award
ins
where,
within
30
days
of
that
that
final
decision,
a
determination,
denial,
the
applicant
may
apply
for
stupa',
give
hardship
having
to
do
with
that
certificate
of
appropriateness
so
again
that
that
CoA
request
only
had
to
do
with
the
windows
and
the
skylights
does
not
have
to
do
with
the
deck
or
other
issues
with
the
property.
Okay,.
A
And
when
we
voted
on
the
certificate
of
appropriateness,
you
know
I
recall
Elliott
specifically
asked
before
we
voted.
What
would
several
months
ago
and
I
remember
interest
singly
what
what
would
be
if
we
don't
grant
the
approval
to
do
the
the
work
that
was
never
approved?
What
will
the
city
do
or
the
consequence
be
and
I
recall?
The
response
was
that
the
city
would
have
to
decide
that
we
don't
know
that
and
I
guess
the
morning.
If
that's
still
the
case,
I
mean
I
know
the
ordinance.
Doesn't
I
mean
it,
you
know
it
doesn't.
A
This
doesn't
usually
happen,
I
mean
people,
don't
usually
do
work
that
wasn't
approved
and
so
I
don't
play.
There's
a
specific
I
mean
the
the
city
has
rights,
but
I.
Don't
know
that
there's
a
specific.
The
city
must
do
this
I
mean,
for
example,
you
know
their
penalties
and
so
forth
the
ordinance
for
violating
the
ordinance,
but
is
that
under
consideration
at.
I
And
this
of
economic
hardship
is
one
of
those
remedies
is
being
sought.
So
the
conclusion
again,
this
process
outlined
in
the
preservation
ordinance
so
once
there's
a
determination
by
the
Commission
that
that
could
be
appealed
to
City
Council
and
then
once
City
Council
has
a
final
decision
that
could
be
appealed
to
court
and
that
would
be
sort
of
running
the
the
process.
There
are
the
administrative
remedies,
okay,.
C
C
I
A
C
C
At
this
point,
I
guess
we
have
to
make
a
decision
about
whether
to
continue
it
any
further.
It's
no
longer
I
hate
to
call
it
pro
forma
or
automatic
in
the
way
that
we
just
sort
of
move
it
to
the
next
meeting
or
whatever
meeting
how
far.
Apart
of
these
requests
been
I'm
gonna
ask
that
of
the
applicant
they're
not
coming
every
month.
I
mean
I.
K
I'd
be
happy
to
address
that
I.
Think
I
believe
it
is
one
month
by
one
month
for
starters,
but
what's
happening
in
the
interim
is
a
lot.
There
are
and
again
clarification
from
city
staff
might
be
useful,
but
there
are
meetings
going
on
with
some
regularity
with
the
city
manager,
some
with
Scott
Mangum
and
City
Attorney.
There
are
many
many
emails
going
back
and
forth
about
the
existing
issues
that
are
intimately
involved
with
this
ad
you
becoming
a
reality
after
22
years
and
the
legality
of
challenging
something
that's
been
existing
for
20
years
as
well.
K
M
But
I
mean
from
a
structural
standpoint,
I
at
least
I
haven't
been
shown
how
reestablishing
the
things
that
were
originally
approved
the
skylights
and
would
affect
whether
the
ad
you
were
anything
is
approved
by
the
other
departments
of
the
city.
I
mean
I'm
unclear
on
how
how
that
affects
them.
I
guess.
K
L
I
There's
no
kind
of
time
limit
associated
with
that,
and
in
this
case
the
certificate
of
economic
hardship
had
to
be
requested
within
30
days
of
the
final
denial.
So
there
is
a
time
limit
associated
with
that.
Additionally,
in
the
public
hearing
section
of
the
the
ordinance
regarding
we
give
a
certificate
of
economic
hardship
states,
the
Commission
shall
hold
a
public
hearing
on
the
application
for
certificate
of
economic
hardship
within
35
days,
following
receipt
of
the
completed
application
form
and
all
information
required
to
be
submitted
there
with
so
with
those
two
continuances.
I
We
are
already
beyond
that
35
days
of
receiving
the
application
in
November
and
finally,
one
other
code
section
just
to
direct
the
Commission
to
that
810
F
for
speaks
to
continuances
regarding
certificates
of
economic
hardship
and
states
that
the
Commission
may
continue
a
proceeding
for
such
additional
time
as
it
reasonably
takes
an
applicant,
any
other
Institute
person
or
the
Commission
to
comply
with
the
request
for
additional
information,
documentation
or
evidence.
So
that
is
a
reason
listed
in
the
ordinance
to
grant
continuance.
A
So
I
think
we
we
could
grant
a
continuance
by
mutual
agreement
with
the
applicant
for
those
reasons,
the
unlike
an
application
for
certificate
of
appropriateness,
McCann
can't
refile
I
mean
because
we
finally
will
be
outside
the
deadline
so
that
it's
not
it
we
can't
say
you'll,
have
to
go
reef.
You
know
you're
taking
too
long
about
to
go
refil
and
you
need
to
see
there
at
that's,
basically
a
denial,
but.
N
A
I
mean
I'm
I'm,
not
sure
that
continuing
serves
a
purpose,
I,
don't
think
there's
any
other
information
and
I'm
I.
Think
the
as
we
got
into
this.
The
main
issues
are
going
to
be
not
so
much
the
you
know
the
kind
of
factual
arguments
that
applicants
making
and
sorting
them
out,
but
really
the
the
standards
first
I
mean
discuss
that
the
certificate
of
economic
hardships
are
rare,
really
use
section.
K
A
C
K
Well,
I've
just
listened
to
you
all,
approve
I,
think
unanimously,
that
tear
down
of
a
home
in
a
historic
district
and
and
what
we're
trying
to
do
here
and
what
we've
tried
to
do
and
with
both
skylights
and
the
windows
is
the
opposite
of
that.
We're
trying
to
preserve
and
restore
this
structure.
We
called
the
barn.
The
barn
is
a
as
an
important
structure
through
frontier
in
North
American.
History
is
a
vanishing
landmark.
K
This
barn,
my
barn,
was
a
vanishing
Evanston
landmark
until
I
purchased
it
some
twenty
four
years
ago
and
began
what
would
become
to
this
day
a
24
year,
long
uphill
battle
to
restore
it
into
a
viable
and
beautiful
structure
able
to
live
yet
another
154
years
of
useful
life,
while
remaining
a
living
testament
to
the
knots
along
rural
and
agrarian
North
Evanston
lifestyle,
as
I've
presented
to
you,
substantial
resources
and
resourcefulness
have
been
required
to
do
so
in
the
city
facing
opposition
from
all
small
sides.
Pretty
much
constantly.
K
We
have
been
working
hard
along
and
at
ever-increasing
cause
to
preserve
and
protect.
This
barn
and
tonight
request
your
permission
to
finish
our
historical
vision
presented
before
you.
In
your
packet
is
our
case
to
leave
the
improvements
made
to
the
barn
at
exterior.
That
is
as
they
exist.
The
cost
heretofore
have
been
enormous
if
you
would
have
undertaken
them
for
the
simple
love
of
restoring
and
preserving
into
the
future.
This
old
and
beautiful
barn.
K
The
costs
have
been
incurred
with
an
eye
to
one
day,
renting
out
the
barn
with
the
house
or
as
an
aiding
you
to
realize
some
small
return.
As
we
have
demonstrated
changing
the
items
before
us
would
have
an
unreasonably
substantial
cost
and
we
have
to
ask
you
for
what
you've
just
permitted
or
agreeing
to
permit
complete
teardown
and
a
new
structure
in
the
historic
district,
with
all
sorts
of
variances
coming
as
well.
K
None
who
have
visited
the
property
none
over
the
last
20
plus
years
have
had
anything
but
complimentary
observations
of
our
historic
dedication
and
thoughtful
restoration
of
the
barn
I
included
today
to
Scott
and
I
assume
in
hope
that
he
passed
on
to
you
in
your
packet
and
a
message
from
a
potential
renter.
This
last
weekend,
smart
articulate
Evanston
people
who
loved
this
place
and
they're
very,
very
complimentary.
They
thought
it
was
insane
there.
K
That
was
their
word
that
we
were
being
asked
to
do
such
a
thing,
but
they
admired
the
historic
preservation
work
that
had
gone
on
inside
and
outside
removing
the
skylights
on
the
east
side
of
the
roof
that
are
barely
visible
in
the
summertime.
What
for
what?
Why
would
we
do
this?
What
what
good
will
it
do?
K
If
you
really
want
to
see
what
this
is
all
about,
removing
them
would
reduce
the
value
of
the
structure,
we're
not
trying
it's
not
about
reducing
the
value
of
the
structure
and
allow
for
a
love
of
sorry
and
the
opportunity
to
find
future
loving
Guardians.
For
this
important
Evanston
landmark,
the
HPC
has
faced
regularly
now
with
allowing
dozens
of
skylights,
far
less
appealing
to
the
historic
I
on
the
roofs
of
landmark
structures,
I
think
every
just
about
every
meeting.
K
Remove
them
for
what
we
want
to
know
to
make
the
structure
less
appealing
and
less
valuable.
The
window
changes
on
the
west
side
of
the
barn
are
all
so
thoughtful
additions,
making
the
first
floor
much
more
agreeable
to
the
existing
second
floor
windows.
Changing
them
is
a
huge
cost,
with
very
very
little
gained.
In
fact,
we
did
assert
nothing
gained
and
plenty
lost
and
at
great
cost.
Why
would
we
do
such
a
thing.
K
This
work
has
existed
for
20
years
or
more
and
has
been
improved
by
inspectors
with
the
city
aware
of
these
skylights,
and
we
knows
for
many
many
years
also
the
city
only
this
last
year,
as
we
wound
up
our
subdivision
request.
Finally,
putting
water
and
sewer
into
the
barn
and
huge
cost
huge
cause
to
try
to
get
this
to
a
rentable
spot.
The
permit
alone
to
the
city
of
Evanston,
to
put
the
water
to
the
barn,
was
five
thousand
dollars.
K
At
this
time,
the
antagonism
has
become
more
focused.
We
are
determined
to
complete
now
this
labor
of
love.
We
face
real
economic
hardship
from
from
neighbors
who
are
harassing
potential
and
real
renters
with
camera
out.
In
fact,
the
police
have
been
called
out
twice
in
recent
years
to
request
that
the
harassment
stops.
K
They
don't
want
to
see
the
project
completed
and
rented
out
it's
a
simple
story
period,
but
it's
not
their
call.
Please
allow
these
wonderful
enhancements
that
we've
made
to
this
property
and
thoughtful
restorative
work
on
the
barn
to
remain
removing
any
of
the
work
heretofore
complete.
It
would
be
a
shameful
costly
and
candidly,
an
unreasonable
mistake.
A
D
A
K
A
A
Are
there
any
further
questions
for
mr.
Schweitzer
before
we
moved
to
discussion,
you
know
things:
why
don't
you
have
a
seat?
Thank
you.
Were
there
any
any
members
of
the
public
who
came
to
speak
to
this
matter?
Yes,
ma'am.
If
you
could
have
you
signed
the
signup
sheet,
you
could
introduce
yourself
and
please
try
to
keep
it
just
a
minute.
O
So
first,
thank
you.
My
name
is
Diane
Rosinski
I
live
at
23:54,
Ridge,
Avenue
and
the
problems.
Mr.
Schweitzer
describes
our
problems
of
his
own
making.
If
he
had
followed
the
plan
that
he
had
submitted
and
the
Commission
approved
in
the
first
place,
then
he
would
not
be
enduring
some
of
the
issues
he
has
brought
forth.
The
the
Commission
has
rendered
a
decision
and
it
was
upheld
by
counsel
the
set
of
the
information
that
mr.
O
Your
agenda
lists
seven,
a
quest
for
certificates
for
appropriateness
and
suppose
you
were
to
grant
all
of
those
and
then
suppose
those
to
whom
you've
granted
those
certificates
went
out
and
just
changed
the
plants
and
decided
that
what
they
had
submitted
to
you
was
irrelevant
because
they
had
something
different
in
mine
and
then
at
a
later
time
point
when
you
said
how
come
you
didn't
follow
the
plan
they
said
to
you.
Well,
this
is
going
to
cost
too
much
money
and
I'm
not
going
to
get
a
return
on
my
investment.
O
The
the
integrity
of
your
decisions
and
the
whole
historic
preservation
process
in
the
city
of
Evanston
is
called
into
question.
If
you
decide
at
this
point
to
go
back
on
your
earlier
decision
and
find
for
the
claim
of
economic
hardship
that
mr.
Schweitzer
has
not
demonstrated,
certainly
not
tonight,
nor
in
the
material
that
he
provided
I,
ask
that
the
Commission
not
contuine
tee.
O
A
P
P
Very
short,
my
name
is
Marianne
Wexler
I
live
it
1021,
Colfax
Street,
which
is
midway
down
the
block.
I,
can
see
the
property
from
my
backyard.
I
want
to
point
out
that
the
mr.
Switzer
did
not
abide
by
the
conditions
on
the
initial
permission
by
the
Qaeda
Commission,
and
so,
as
Diane
just
pointed
out,
the
windows
they
were
never
approved
and
they
were
specifically
the
Commission
specifically
said
that
they
wouldn't
approve
anything
that
was
visible.
It
is
visible
all
the
time,
except
when
the
trees
are
in
full
bloom,
that's
not
most
of
the
year.
P
D
D
K
K
A
C
C
You
know,
and
and
I
just
don't
see
this-
that
the
issue
is
the
cost
of
the
other
revision.
Not
not
anything
else.
That's
the
hardship,
I'm,
not
seeing
that
we've
imposed
the
hardship
he
created,
the
hardship.
I've
read
you
know,
I
mean
somebody
cited
the
fact
that
the
architect
doesn't
even
say
anything
about
why
you
know
it
should
have
been
done.
Oh,
yes,
it's
gonna
cost
a
lot
of
money
to
do
it.
There's
a
letter
from
somebody
else.
It's
all
gonna
cost
a
lot
of
money,
but
it's
all
going
back.
C
A
G
Mean
I
guess
that's
my
I
kind
of
feel.
Similarly,
is
that
okay,
yes
it
there
would
be
a
cost
associated
with,
say,
removing
the
skylights
that
were
put
in
contrary
to
the
plan
and
filling
the
hole
and
putting
roofing
on.
Obviously
that
has
a
certain
cost,
but
what
effect
does
that
actually
have
on
the
usefulness
of
the
building?
Does
it
suddenly
make
that
room
unusable
for
any
functional
purpose?
We're
not
we're
not
hearing
that.
Maybe
it's
not
as
pleasant.
You
don't
have
a
window
on
both
sides.
G
A
D
A
That
there
were
whatever
mistakes
made
and
it
wasn't
worth
switching
it
back
and
we
viewed
that
for
assistive
Sanders.
There
was
a
lot
of
debate
and
I.
Believe
I
was
the
only
one
who
voted
in
your
favor,
but
we
made
that
decision.
It
was
certainly
discussed,
it
wasn't
easy
and
we
made
the
decision.
The
arguments
you've
made
here
today,
mostly
not
exclusively,
but
mainly,
went
to
the
wisdom
of
that
decision,
and
that
was
the
decision
people
made
it
was
made.
It
was
appealed
to
the
City
Council.
The
appeal
was
denied.
A
A
I
mean
the
arguments
you're
making
really
go
to
the
decision
that
you
know
again:
I
I
disagreed
with,
but
I
lost
and
the
City
Council
backed
up
the
Commission
and
I
think
that
decision
was
already
made
and
it
you
again,
the
city
I
mean
I,
don't
know
what
the
city
will
exactly
decide.
You
need
to
do
and
won't
do
and
I
think
the
city
hasn't
decided
that
either
but
I
just
think
it.
This
procedure
is
not
available,
for
you
know
this.
The
use
you're
seeking
to
apply
it
to
I.
M
Wanted
to
clarify
for
mr.
Schweitzer
and
reiterate
that
you
were
referring
to
the
structure
that
came
before
you
and
other
houses
or
whatever.
This
is
a
landmark
that
you're
we're
talking
about,
also
that
this
applies
more
to
the
original
decision
and
the
original
decisions
that
were
made
years
ago
and
thoughtful
consideration
of
how
to
help
you
preserve
the
historic
characteristics
of
the
landmark
and
yet
be
able
to
use
the
structure
in
a
different
way.
M
There
was
a
lot
of
thoughtful
consideration
put
into
that
then
there
and
again
that
was
of
your
own,
making
that
you
decided
not
to
to
follow
that
I
think
the
hardship,
the
cost
of
taking
those
few
things
back
versus
I.
Think
the
other
option
is
like
a
daily
fiying
or
something
like
that
I
would
not.
I
would
agree
that
that
wouldn't
that
wouldn't
be
reasonable,
but
the
costs
of
making
those
few
alterations
to
take
back
well
to
take
it
back
to
what
was
originally
approved
is
not
an
economic
hardship.
That
is
a
reasonable
thing.
A
K
The
we're
here
to
address
the
what
evidently
hasn't
been
done
before
it's
the
standards
of
economic
hardship,
we're
not
addressing
the
question
that
some
I've
heard
tonight
that
you've
insisted
that
it's
of
our
own
making
excuse
me
or
or
rather,
if
you've,
it's
already
been
adjudicated.
It's
about
the
hardship
of
return
of
doing
what
has
been
asked
us
to
do
and
the
the
hard
the
standards
have
specific
questions
that
have
been
addressed.
K
It's
asked
for
structural
engineers,
architects,
Realtors,
conte,
licensed
contractors
to
let
you
know
what
the
cost
is,
but
in
fact
the
cost
isn't
just
this.
It's
not
just
the
cost
of
doing
that,
which
is
very
substantial
and
and
for
what
to
do
this,
a
great
great
cost
and
to
limit
the
possibility
to
rent
this
building
for
a
whole
much
longer
time
when
renters
come
in
and
they
need
to
know
what's
going
on
here
and
they're
not
willing
to
rent
when
there's
so
much
compliance
uncertainty.
K
Architects
I
want
to
reread
the
architects
last
paragraph
short,
because
it's
relevant
I
think
and
he's
he's
a
very
experienced
firm
and
man
and
he's
been
doing
this
with
us
from
the
start.
He
says
the
owner
has
been
maintained:
the
structure
to
high
standards
at
his
own
volition,
with
the
goal
of
maintaining
as
many
of
its
original
features
as
possible
since
purchasing
and
renovating
at
20
plus
years
ago.
K
That's
an
element
that
has
forgotten
to
be
rematch,
and
if
it
is,
you
know,
20
years
ago
and
now
redoing
it
the
work
that
was
done,
repositioned
the
barn
for
a
new
generation
of
use
and
gave
it
new
life
and
all
of
these
elements
that
are
a
part
of
what
we're
talking
about
tonight.
Go
to
that
requiring
removal
of
work
that
has
gone
unnoticed
for
20
years,
seems
incredible
and
have
questionable
value
to
anyone
and
the
facts
that
you
heard
before.
K
Aren't
facts
they're
there
they're
not
right
the
certificate
of
economic
hardship,
didn't
follow
the
the
vast
expense
of
the
water
and
sewer
to
the
barn
and
we've
never
received
$6,000
rent
from
the
building.
It's
gone
on
rented
for
$4,500
for
a
very
long
time,
most
of
which
taxes
are
there
and
but
you
heard
from
people
the
neighbors,
the
neighbor,
the
particular
neighbor,
who
also
told
you
they
lived
there
for
25
years
last
meeting,
which
also
wasn't
true.
K
A
I
A
Q
N
B
A
B
N
Hi
I'm
Jayden
I
own
the
property
at
10:37,
Michigan
Avenue,
we've
been
renovating
it
for
over
a
year.
At
this
point
and
with
their
one
run
with
one
contractor,
we
kind
of
shelved
the
idea
of
putting
this
back
door
and
we've
got
a
new
contractor
on
board
and
things
are
going
better
and
so
we're
hoping
to
sort
of
reopen
this
and
see
if
we
can
get
this
approved.
Possibly
so
the
thing.
A
N
All
right,
so
this
is
the
existing
photo
I've
taken
from
the
backyard
I've
kind
of
circled
the
area
there,
where
there's
a
door
in
a
window
coming
out
from
the
kitchen,
and
so
what
I've
done
is
just
photoshopped
a
rendering
of
what
it
would
look
like
with
the
doors
in
place.
So
it's
a
three
panels.
The
panoramic
doors
I
looked
at
a
variety
of
doors.
My
fund
that
this
one
was
the
best
fit
due
to
the
deck,
having
a
hatch
there
and
allowing
the
flexibility
of
it
being
open.
N
N
N
N
N
N
The
proportions
would
be
consistent
with
the
ones
that
are
existing
in
the
house
and
the
windows
back
I
did
indicate
as
far
as
the
muntins
go,
there's
kind
of
a
couple
varieties
on
the
house
and
have
photos
there,
there's
a
couple
varieties
on
the
house
right
now
on
the
left,
and
forgive
me
if
I'm
getting
the
terms
wrong
here,
but
kovin
bead
on
the
on
the
left.
There
you
see,
and
then
this
sort
of
plain
bevel
on
the
right.
H
N
Photos
sort
of
from
the
right
side
of
the
coach-house,
looking
at
the
house
what
you
can
see
visibly
and
then
from
the
outside
of
the
house
and
so
yeah.
We
were
hoping
to
include
this
as
part
of
the
project.
It
would
open
up
the
kitchen
area
to
the
deck,
increasing
its
utility
and
value,
hoping
that
the
sticking
with
a
sizing
and
sort
of
the
at
least
I
simulated,
divided
lights
that
keeps
in
sort
of
consistent
with
the
house
and
the
rest
of
the
architecture.
C
No
I
I
want
to
comment,
though
the
door
and
windows
are
original,
and
the
reason
I
can
say
so
is
that
about
12
years
ago,
I
appear
before
this
commission
and
I'm
the
guy
that
did
that
deck
on
both
levels
and
that
whole
thing
that
you're,
showing
there
yeah
so
I'm,
very
familiar
with
the
home,
and
in
fact
the
only
thing
that
got
never
done
is
what
shows
up
there,
which
was
to
replace
those
second-floor
windows
above
the
living
room
on
the
back
I'm.
Also.
C
So,
in
fact,
those
were
those
windows
and
doors
were
there
just
the
way
that
it
was.
That
was
the
kitchen
and
there
was
no
change
made
inside
at
that
point.
In
fact,
they'd
retained
the
original
owner.
The
previous
owners
had
kept
the
kitchen
the
way
it
was
with
the
exception
of
changes.
I
I
do
have
a
question
because
I
don't
understand
in
one
of
your
exhibits
sheet
s1,
but
there
seems
to
be
a
big
note
as
if
the
deck
is
being
structurally
replaced.
N
N
C
N
C
C
N
N
A
B
S
S
We
plan
to
use
the
wooden
window
on
the
inside,
with
just
the
clad
on
the
outside
and
where
we
have
muntins
that
exist
and
the
back
two
windows
that
are
multiples
of
three
and
three
across
there,
one
inch
and
the
window
that
we
are
replacing
them
with
his
one
and
an
eighth
inch.
So
we
used
Marvin
because
it's
as
close
as
we
can
get
to
what's
existing
and
they
are
insert
so
we're
not
taking
out
the
whole
window
and
we're
just
and
we
want
to
keep
the
inside
molding
and
the
architecture
of
the
house.
B
So
so
this
is
part
of
the
application.
They
submitted
the
dimensions
of
the
existing
windows
and
if
he
can
move
forward,
Scot
and
the
location
of
the
windows
to
be
proposed
on
the
front
elevation.
But
are
you
at
a
time
there
was
a
misunderstanding?
How
many
windows
will
be
replaced?
Initially,
they
told
me
over
the
phone
15,
but
then
they
later
told
me
that
they
were
31,
so
that's
only
showing
one
elevation
and
if
you
keep
going
this
shows
the
example
of
the
existing
and
proposed
elevations
with
dimensions
of
the
type
of
Windows.
B
They're
all
double
hung
different
widths,
and
this
is
the
front
elevation
that
shows
some
of
the
windows
that
initially
were
or
discussed
with
my
office
that
to
be
replaced
and
some
of
the
details
showing
the
existing
dimensions
of
different
aspects
of
the
window.
Sash
in
rail,
the
style,
the
rail
and
also
the
brick
mold
or
trim.
B
B
J
So
I
have
a
question,
so
are
they
all
custom
sizes?
How
are
you
putting
them
in
if
you're,
not
you're,
saying
these
are
replacements
ash
so
as
they're
filler?
These.
R
R
I
show
a
sample
if
you
want
to
see
it,
it's
it's
pretty
much
the
same
window,
we're
also
planning
on
removing
the
storm
windows.
That's
one
thing
we
can
do
as
well.
We
wouldn't
possibly
maintain
the
same
color
right,
we're
thinking
about
that,
but
you
know
our
our
biggest
idea
with
Marvin
windows,
I'm,
actually
I
work
for
friendly
windows,
but
I
am
a
product
specialist
for
Marvin
windows
and
it
maintains
the
integrity
of
the
home
super
nice
and
that's
the
whole
idea.
We
don't
want
to
really
change
anything.
R
R
R
L
U
U
Okay,
so
I
just
circled
the
windows
that
we're
replacing
the
notation
of
X's
on
there
notate
the
ones
that
we're
we're
leaving
in
place
so
the
door.
You
know
a
couple
of
the
windows,
the
back
entry
door,
we're
endeavoring
to
replace
like-for-like.
So
the
goal
is
to
keep
the
the
same.
Look
that
is
currently
there
with
Renewal
by
Andersen.
U
We
do
custom
size
our
product
to
a
sixteenth
of
an
inch,
so
we
are
making
these
products
to
fit
and
they
will
be
full
frame
replacements
with
two
exceptions:
we're
doing
the
full
frame
replacements
who
maintain
the
look
of
the
the
building
as
best
we
can.
We
find
that
with
inserts
you
tend
to
lose
a
little
bit
of
glass.
So,
on
the
front
we
want
to
maintain
as
much
physical
glass
as
possible.
U
The
building
was
built
in
1928
from
what
I
understand
the
windows
have
been
replaced
once
before
in
the
1970s.
So
these
are
not
original
windows
to
the
home.
The
all
the
windows
on
the
building
are
covered
by
storm
windows,
with
exception
of
the
picture
windows,
so
even
trying
to
maintain
the
same
same.
Look
it's
going
to
be
tough
because
we're
replacing
the
actual
window,
the
storm
windows
are
going
to
go,
but
any
type
of
winter
that
we
replace
the
storm
is
gonna,
be
be
going
from
that
we
are
maintaining
the
black
exterior.
U
Okay,
so
the
existing
window
is
on
the
left
of
the
screen.
The
proposed
window
is
to
the
right
there's
a
very
little
difference
between
the
two
as
far
as
double
Hung's.
This
represents
a
different
sizes
and
different
widths
of
double
Hung's,
but
the
appropriate
informations
there.
As
far
as
the
meeting
rail
height,
the
bottom
sash
rail
by
anis,
and
we
design
our
windows
to
look
like
a
traditional
wood
window
and
part
of
that
is
trying
to
maintain
that
same.
Look
as
a
traditional
wood
window,
you've
seen
an
historic
home.
U
The
product
is
a
little
bit
different.
I
do
believe.
You've
seen
this
before
we
use
our
fiber
X
material.
The
reason
we've
gone
that
direction
is
it's
much
more
reliable
product
than
the
aluminum
clad
wood
windows.
You
typically
see
in
the
in
the
industry
and
because
of
the
fiber
X,
we've
actually
been
able
to
extend
our
warranty
further
than
you
company
in
the
industry.
U
U
The
picture
windows
that
are
gonna
be
your
place.
There
is
a
little
bit
of
difference
via
the
current
windows
of
what's
called
a
direct
set
window,
so
there's
no
sash
frame
with
the
with
a
current
picture
window
with
our
window,
we
do
have
a
little
bit
a
little
bit
wider
sash
frame
there.
So
there
are
some
visible
difference.
They're
a
little
bit
easier
to
see
on
these.
These
pictures
here.
U
That
window
there
unit
up
105,
the
homeowners
are
wishing
to
put
a
casement
window
to
get
better
ventilation
through
the
home,
so
the
casement
window
that
were
we'd
be
replacing
that
with
is
listed
right
there
and
there's
a
cross
section
of
it.
So
it
was
a
little
bit
of
variance
with
the
with
the
size
of
the
frame,
but
would
give
better
better
ventilation
for
the
homeowners
and
once
again,
that
is
in
the
back
of
the
building
in
the
alley.
U
Person
that
was
in
here
we're
doing
inserts
to
actually
save
cost,
so
the
insert
windows
tend
to
be
a
little
less
cost
cost.
He
didn't
then
doing
the
full
frames.
As
I
said,
the
full
frame
decision
was
really
driven
to
keep
as
much
of
the
front
of
the
house
looking
original
as
as
possible
with
the
back
of
the
house.
If
we
can
do
this
is
inserts
they'd
be
great
if
a
full
frame
replacements
required.
Then
we
understand
that.
U
U
So,
as
I
said,
the
winter
that
we're
going
to
be
putting
and
does
not
have
the
girls
as
a
sample
winner
to
show
the
different
options
that
we
have
available,
it
will
be
black
to
match
the
current
exterior
of
the
the
windows.
But
it
just
gives
you
a
understanding
of
what
the
double
hung
window
will
look
like.
J
U
J
M
A
G
Thing
that's
come
up
on
condo
buildings
like
this
on
in
other
cases,
was
obviously
this
particular
unit
owner
is
just
replacing
the
windows
in
their
own
unit,
as
far
as
to
the
building
doesn't
get
changed
as
the
condo
satiation
have
any
kind
of
standards
for
how
people
go
about
replacing
windows
to
guide
other
tenant.
Other
unit
owners
and
kind
of
keep
a
consistent
look
going
forward
with.
U
U
U
A
as
strike
at
the
costs
down
a
little
bit
so
that
the
insert
replacement
is,
is
the
less
expensive
application
than
doing
a
full-frame
replacement
with
trying
to
keep
the
the
the
windows.
Looking
as
as
much
as
the
you
know,
original
orders
as
possible
doing
a
full
frame
replacement
really
is
the
way
to
go,
especially
on
the
on
the
street
side.
U
A
The
units
you
showed
the
windows
in
you
know
107
and
other
units
around
it.
Yes,.
U
T
U
U
A
U
C
C
T
Amy
rumored
I'm
the
homeowner
I'm
on
the
board,
president
of
our
condo
association.
We
have
had
various
owners
in
the
past
that
have
replaced
back
windows
like
the
one
we're
planning
to
do
on
the
driveway
side,
so
it
would
be
identical
to
the
one
that's
above
it
as
far
as
the
Association
I
can
certainly
have
the
rest
of
the
board
sign
off.
On
a
letter
to
you.
J
C
T
B
For
information
in
the
past
for
similar
condos
in
terms
of
multiple
owners,
we
have
I
guess
encouraged
to
have
a
plan
so
that
it
will
come
would
come
one
time
with
a
proposed
replacement
of
a
unit
and
then
subsequently
the
following
owners
will
set
me
the
same
window,
the
same
material,
everything
that
eventually
all
the
windows
will
match.
T
O
B
The
other
question
is
the
Commission
has
approved
the
aluminum
clad,
because
the
state
of
Illinois
preservation
agency
has
given
the
green
light
to
approve
that
type
of
replacement.
So
when
you're
looking
at
the
standards,
is
you
know
to
match
the
texture
and
other
qualities
and
I
do
not
think
that
the
5x
matches
the
texture
of
the
wood
or
aluminum
our.
T
Building
is
not
a
historic
building,
we're
only
in
the
historic
district
and
being
that
the
windows
are
from
1970s.
We've
had
two
different
companies
come
out
to
do
restoration
instead
of
replacement,
and
one
flat-out
said
these
are
from
1970.
We
will
not
work
on
them
and
refer
to
us
to
another
company
that
will
not
touch
the
double
Hung's
apex,
I
believe
the
name
is
they
will
not
do
the
double
homes,
because
their
1970s
there's
nothing.
They
could
do
to
make
them
better
or
more
efficient
energy
efficient.
They
would
only
replace
the
glass
that
goes.
J
J
D
U
U
U
With
this
aluminum,
clad
idea,
specifically
in
climates,
that
drop
below
freezing
and
an
instance
taking
steps
to
mitigate
that
by
introducing
the
fibrous
material
we're
now.
Looking
at
25
years,
we've
been
making
this
and
selling
it
and,
as
I
said,
it's
an
able
us
to
produce
a
product
with
a
friend
as
a
20-year
warranty
to
be
in
line
with
the
glass
warranty,
whereas
a
lot
of
the
aluminum
clad
products
have
a
10-year
frame,
warranty
and
rots
not
covered
with
it.
So
that's
why
that's
why
we've
gone
with
the
the
5x
material?
It
just
has
longevity.
U
They
were
looking
for,
and
you
know,
comparing
an
aluminum
clad
to
a
wood
window.
You've
got
an
aluminum
piece
of
metal
over
top
of
wood,
whereas
our
windows
are
painted
and
or
have
a
finish
on
the
Miss.
That
cements
is
simulate
our
first
we
painted
wood
window,
that's
meant
to
last,
so
it's
actually
a
little
bit
more.
What
you
would
typically
see
what
the
painted
window
versus
an
aluminum
clad
window.
U
O
L
L
A
C
I
think
the
other
issue
becomes
what
happens
because
there
aren't
seemingly
any
standards
for
the
building
I've
seen
and
worked
on
condos,
where
they
at
least
established
it's
going
to
be
all
aluminum,
clad
or
they're,
all
going
to
be
aluminum
or
they're
all
going
to
be
wood.
You
may
change
it
in
terms
of
manufacturer,
but
they'll
all
be
double
hung,
etc.
Here
it's
not
clear
that
the
next
neighbor
says
nice,
that
you
did.
C
B
J
Well,
I
would
just
say
that
this
building
has
already
when
they
did
the
restoration
and
the
renovation
they
were.
They
already
changed
all
the
windows
and
I'm
sure
there
were
muttons
before
and
those
are
all
gone
and
they're
big
panes
of
glass.
So
it
has
a
very
different
visual
characteristic
than
if
it
was
a.
You
know
it's
in
a
historic
district,
but
it
if
you
go
see
the
building,
it
basically
looks
very
contemporary
and
some
level
and
so
I.
J
You
know
I
think
that's
that
some.
We
can't
obviously
tell
you
that
that
must
happen,
but
that
might
be
a
good
plan,
so
if
this
does
go
through
because
I
agree
with
Eliot
as
well
that
we
are
looking
at
all
these
windows
that
are
retreat
and
we're
discussing
all
of
these
things.
So
for
the
preservation-
it's
just,
it's
not
just
the
aesthetics,
but
it's
also
the
material
of
the
windows,
but
they
have.
J
O
G
D
C
O
L
L
C
G
C
V
B
V
V
We've
made
some
plan
changes
so,
rather
than
being
around
5,000
square
feet,
it's
at
four,
so
it's
much
smaller,
not
a
lot
smaller,
but
and
basically
the
big
change
is
rather
than
having
a
formal,
dining
room.
We've
just
opened
up
the
entire
back
of
the
house
to
be
a
family
space
and
have
kept
the
idea
of
a
bedroom,
slash
study
on
the
ground
floor.
The
second
floor
is
essentially
the
same
as
it
was
before.
With
four
bedrooms
and
laundry
area.
V
It's
the
house
of
five
gables
that
at
once
was
the
materials
on
the
exterior.
Now
are
all
stucco
with
a
limestone
base
before
there
was
brick
intermediate
layer
of
brick
between
the
two
standing
seam
roof
with
solar
panels,
geothermal
all
the
sustainable
goodies
that
I
discussed
last
time.
I
was
here
the
the
height
of
the
building
is
here.
You
can
see
a
rendering
of
the
current
design.
It's
32
and
a
half
feet
tall.
V
The
Oscar
Mayer
house
is
37
and
a
half
feet
tall
and
the
marsh
house
on
the
corner.
I
saw
the
original
building
permit
and
this
forty
foot
tall
so
and
I
think
there's
a
height
maximum.
Now,
it's
thirty
five,
so
where
I
guess
where
we
should
be
it's
not
as
large,
but
it's
not
as
big
of
a
lot
and
I
think
to
itself
and
to
its
own
scale.
It's
it's
fitting
for
itself
and
the
neighborhood
now
I
did.
V
V
V
Aluminum,
clad
windows,
standing
seam,
aluminum,
roof
made
from
ninety-nine
percent
recycled,
Post
use
aluminum
and
the
the
roof
we've
intentionally
rendered.
Here
is
a
little
darker
and
we
will
be
using
there's
there's
a
special
grade
of
solar
panels.
They
don't
have
all
the
silvery
stripes
through
them,
they're
solid
black,
so
that
they'll
we
we,
unfortunately
we
drew
them
a
little
reflective
here,
but
that
was
only
just
to
show
that
they
were
panels
but
I
think
they'll
blend
quite
well.
When
it's
finished
I
guess
that's
it
I,
don't
know.
V
V
J
Know
I
just
want
to
comment
because-
and
this
is
about
the
solar
panels,
because
we
are
in
the
process
of
this
committee,
that
the
cities
put
together
of
putting
together
guidelines
for
solar
panels.
So
I'd
like
to
speak
about
this
because
it's
an
new
house,
you
can
weigh
in
elec
after
this
it's
new
house,
the
cladding
of
the
roof
and
the
panels
are
sympathetic
with
each
other,
the
panel's,
because
these
are
the
things
we're
thinking
about
right
now.
J
The
panels
are
set
back
from
the
front,
although
they
are
observable
from
a
public
way
and
and
also
because
it
is
new
construction.
I
would
say
that
it's
handled
very
well
and,
in
my
opinion,
in
terms
of
those
solar
panels,
it
would
move
through.
I
would
vote
for
that
in
favor
of
that
in
terms
of
the
Preservation
Commission
I
just
wanted
to
bring
that
up
since
we're
developing
these
as
we
speak.
So
there's.
V
V
V
J
V
W
Good
evening
my
name
is
Joel:
Hammerman
I
live
in
the
Oscar
Mayer
house
next
door.
We
were
here
a
year
ago
when
there
were
different
plans
seeking
a
certificate
of
appropriateness,
and
there
are
notices
that
were
provided
by
mail
or
at
least
placed
in
mailboxes
of
the
houses
on
on
the
block.
We
didn't
receive
any
type
of
notice
this
time
around
and
that's
not
too
obviously
a
comment
at
all
on
the
plans
themselves
other
than
we
didn't
realize
that
this
was
actually
going
to
be
before
the
board
today
until
Friday
afternoon.
D
W
We
received
an
email
and,
to
be
honest,
we
just
haven't
an
opportunity
to
fully
digest
the
plans
that
have
been
presented.
I
know
that
mr.
Eifler
presented
those
plans
to
you
four
years
ago.
Four
years
ago
we
weren't
living
next
door
and
there
were
actually
some
other
new
people
on
the
block
so
to
speak.
Okay
I
think
it
would
be
just
appropriate
for
the
opportunity
to
fully
understand
these
renderings.
Perhaps
when
you
considered
these
plans
four
years
ago
and
you
discuss
them
with
mr.
Eifler,
there
were
additional.
W
There
was
a
different
additional
information
provided,
but
just
going
through
it
online
over
the
weekend,
it
seemed
a
little
unclear
to
us
exactly
what
was
being
proposed.
As
we
look
at
the
plans,
you
know
there
are
limited
renderings
as
I
think.
You've
just
pointed
out.
The
only
view
that
you
can
see
here
is
almost
presented
from
the
south
in
a
way
that
doesn't
actually
show
the
proximity
of
the
house
to
ours.
W
Looking
at
the
plans,
I
can't
quite
tell,
but
it
looks
like
the
the
overhang
comes
within
four
feet,
of
the
property
line
or
a
four
and
a
half
feet
from
the
property
line.
It's
exceedingly
close,
so
our
review
of
the
plans
have
raised
some
just
initial
concerns
and
we
frankly
just
want
to
learn
a
little
bit
more
how
the
construction
will
fit
into
the
existing
space,
how
the
property
of
the
house
will
drop
within
the
existing
property
line.
The
size
of
the
home
visa
view
this
space,
the
materials
that
are
going
to
be
used.
W
I,
think
everyone
isn't
obviously
in
favor
of
solar
panels.
But
our
house
is
mysterious,
correctly
pointed
out
so
a
little
bit
taller
and
will
be
looking
down
at
those
solar
panels
and
an
aluminum
roof
and
just
to
see
how
it
fits
in
the
orientation
of
the
house
seems
to
be
designed,
specifically
obviously,
for
those
solar
panels
of
the
whole
house
seems
to
be
oriented
towards
the
south,
while
every
other
house
on
the
street,
both
on
the
east
side
and
west
side,
seems
to
be
oriented
actually
towards
the
street,
and
this
one
seems
to
be
actually.
W
If
you
kind
of
look
at
the
renderings
be
oriented
exactly
towards
our
our
home,
and
so
at
this
point
it's
not
that
we
have
an
objection
as
of
yet
there
are
concerns.
But
frankly,
we've
looked
at
these
plans
for
all
of
three
days
and
would
like
the
opportunity
to
look
at
them
a
little
bit
more
with
greater
detail
for
lack
of
a
better
way
of
putting
it
to
bring
them
to
to
bring
the
plans
to
the
attention
of
our
neighbors.
W
B
D
W
That
we
did
receive
that
notice
and
I
know
our
neighbors
did
as
well.
I
mean
if
you
remember
there
were
a
fair
amount
of
us
here
at
the
time
that
had
concerns
and
thoughts
I.
Frankly,
as
I
stand
before
you
I,
don't
know
who
has
seen
those
plans
the
last
time
around,
they
were
well
discussed
amongst
the
neighbors
and.
B
W
You
saw
that
outpouring
of
interest
at
the
time
I
rank
Lee.
Just
don't
know,
we
haven't
had
the
opportunity
to
really
discuss
it
with
the
people
that
live
around
us
and
and
to
kind
of
gather
people's
thoughts
and
opinions
and
concerns.
I.
Think
last
time
you
there's
another
neighbor
who's
new
to
our
block
that
lived
across
the
street,
who
came
in
here
with
very
detailed
concerns
about
how
the
house
fit
in
architectural
II.
That
was
that
those
were
different
plans
and
we
fully
recognized
that
what
I'm
saying
to
you
is
at
least
from
for
us.
W
We
did
not
have
the
opportunity
to
kind
of
fully
evaluate
what
has
been
presented
here
today,
which
was
a
very
short
presentation,
knowing
of
course,
which
actually
didn't
know
that
these
plans
had
been
at
least
an
iteration
of
them
had
once
been
approved
by
this
board.
I
think
it's
a
you
know
appropriate
for
the
neighborhood
to
have
an
opportunity
and
I.
Just
can't
I
can't
speak
to
why
we
did
not
know
till
we
received
the
email
from
this
commission
I
think
on
Friday
can.
J
W
B
O
W
J
Would
just
like
to
point
out
that
this
is
a
lot
that
is
very
narrow,
the
other
Lots
are
the
house
adjacent
to
it
to
the
north
is
a
quite
a
large
house
on
a
very
large
piece
of
property
and
I.
Remember
when
this
property
was
subdivided
to
create
this,
so
this
is
a
complicated
and
difficult
lot
and
I
just
want
to
point
out
that
I
think
this
is
a
very
successful
house,
in
my
opinion,
cited
here.
So.
D
W
W
All
I'm
suggesting
is
that
the
neighborhood
ourselves
included
be
given
an
opportunity
to
fully
digest
them,
and
you
know
to
ask
the
questions
that
may
need
to
be
asked
and,
as
I
said
literally
we
we
did
not
learn
of
this
till
Friday
afternoon.
All
I've
looked
at
up
the
plans
that
are
in
line
I
see
that
mr.
I
Flores
handed
us
a
copy
of.
It
looks
like
if
some
plans
at
this
time
that
beetle
you
know,
we
will
of
course,
look
through
them
and
ask
any
questions
that
we
may
have.
W
A
A
V
F
Yeah
I
guess
I'm
I'm
still
lacking
a
full
information
for
me
to
understand
the
spacing
and
the
siting,
and
so
there
is
a
site
plan.
It's
just
I
think
I
would
just
I
would
prefer
to
have
more
information
about
how
it's
actually
sitting
in
relation
to
its
the
neighbor
here
and
just
how
how
it
does
look
from
different
points
of
view,
similar
to
how
we've
seen
with
the
with
the
other
new
construction
proposal
that
we
talked
about
earlier
today.
A
S
A
F
Look
I'm
talking
about
the
relationship
to
it
to
the
neighbor
I'm,
familiar
that
it's
a
narrow,
narrow,
a
lot
there's
a
lot
of
space
between
it
and
the
North
neighbor,
where
that
house
sits
on
its
lot
so
I
understand.
I
can
better
picture
that
spacing.
But
just
what
I
can't
picture
is
the
space
in
between
it
in
the
southern
neighbor
was.
B
F
A
G
V
C
V
A
V
Side,
the,
but
the
code
allows
for
five
foot
setbacks,
but
because
of
the
overhangs
I,
think
it's
six
and
three-quarters
feet
from
north
parcel
and
I
think
it's
this
forty
feet,
yeah
and
then
it's
the
same
on
the
south
and
then
there's
fifteen
feet
to
this:
the
adjacent
home.
So
in
total
its
twenty
one,
twenty
two
feet
between
the
house
and
I
school
and
examine.
L
Just
just
as
a
comment,
I
was
not
part
of
the
previous
discussion
of
this
property.
I
only
saw
the
one
that
mr.
Eifler
submitted
previously,
but
I
would
like
to
just
agree
with
Julie
that
I
do
think
that
this
this
design
fits
very
nicely
on
this
side
and
I.
Think
it's
it's
a
thoughtful
design
and
touches
base
on
the
issues.
I
think
we
had
on
the
other
more
modern
design.
So
so
I
just
wanted
to
comment
on.
A
A
I
A
O
J
J
Yes,
that
ant
the
meeting
I
think
we
met
and
we
had
only
met
once
we
met
again
and
I
felt
that
at
that
meeting,
that
everyone
in
the
different
committees
were
pretty
supportive
and
had
taken
the
time
to
look
at
all
the
information
that
we
put
together.
So
that
was
useful,
I,
think
and
nice
to
know
that
you
know
that
we
have
something
to
say
so
but
anyway,
so
it
yeah
I
think
it's
it's
been
sort
of
important
committee.
That's
come
together.
A
B
A
About
this
pitch
program
and
I,
think
we've
decided
in
the
last
meeting
that
we
would
write
an
ordinance
to
create
some
kind
of
a
cultural
district
preservation
district
in
starting
in
the
fifth
Ward.
It
wouldn't
be
a
historic
district
within
the
ordinance.
It
would
be
something
which
would
not
focus
really
on
alterations
of
buildings.
A
But
beyond
that,
we've
got
to
actually
get
to
work
on.
You
know:
I've
been
collecting
some
ordinances
from
the
around
the
country
and
it's
harder
than
I
thought
it
would
be
to
decide
whether
it
be
any
steps
to
you
know
have
any
kind
of
procedure
before
buildings,
historic
buildings
could
be
demolished
and
what?
A
But
it
anyway
I
think
we
will
try
to
move
through
and
get
some
kind
of
ordinance
passed
and
then
I
think
the
hope
would
be
that
after
an
ordinance
is
passed,
maybe
there
will
be
funding
of
some
kind
of
a
you
know:
exhibits
walking
tours
things
like
that,
but
I
think
everybody
felt
good
about.
You
know
just
the
fact
that
we
would
get
some
your
City
Council
and
get
it
passed.
The
next
few
months.
B
No
other,
then
we
visited
the
Center
on
retiring,
which
is
the
corner
from
here
to
the
north
on
this
church,
and
we
found
documentation
from
an
oral
and
Mary
McWilliams
the
volunteers
that
have
been
with
the
Commission
since
the
beginning
from
the
1970s.
In
so
far,
we
have
three
binder
books
with
a
lot
of
information
on
each
of
the
buildings.
O
A
Okay,
so
I
circulated
my
ideas
of
a
draft
agenda
and
I
guess:
I
was
hoping
to
tonight
get
feedback
about
whether
these
were
good
topics
and
then
we
really
I
thought
was
we
get.
You
know,
volunteers
to
take
on
different
activity,
discussion
leader
and
do
some
preparation
for
your
topic,
and
we
probably
better
do
that
tonight
because
we're
talking
about
but
six
weeks
from
now
in
the
next
meeting
might
be
a
little
late
too.
For
people
to
get
started
and
I
guess
I
was
definitely
hoping.
J
Just
so
I'll
just
tell
you
what
I'm
doing
right
now.
So
if
you
want
something
else,
but
I'm,
really
just
getting
different
windows
and
I'll
talk
to
someone
cuz
I'm,
not
gonna,
like
lug,
all
of
them
in
so
people
can
only,
but
so
I'm
just
going
to
tell
you
right
now:
I
have
like
a
wood
clad
window
with
SDL.
There's
a
would
window
with
SDL's
there's
I'm
gonna
get
a
vinyl
I,
guess
a
vinyl
window,
where
you
can
see
the
snap-ins
this
like
fibrex
window.
J
If
we
can
get
that
and
then
I
think
someone
makes
something
else.
That's
like
fibrex,
I
think
Marvin
makes
a
different
window,
and
so,
if
there's
any
other-
and
you
know
windows
that
we
wanted
because
I
really
think
it's
all
about
looking
at
them
and
discussing
it
and
and
so
if
there's
anything
else,
I've
got
a
steel
window.
That's
new!
That's
thermally,
broken
that
we
can
look
at
and
so
I.
J
J
Like
a
single
glazed
wood
window,
well
that
well
there's
a
thermal,
so
there's
yeah,
there's
manin
it
true.
Like
so
wood
windows,
I
mean
yeah,
I'm,
Brenda
I'll
bring
a
wood
window
and
I'm
if
with
a
divided
light
window,
it's
like,
if
you
do
not
do
an
sdl,
you're
gonna
get
a
true
divided
light.
Generally
I,
don't
really
they're
thicker.
You
know
you're,
let's
a
discussion
that
you
can't
really
match
the
thin
single
glazed
windows.
J
So
so
you
know
so
I
think
that's
yeah,
so
I
mean
I,
don't
I'm,
not
there's
wood
windows
I
mean
I'm,
bringing
up
I'm,
bringing
a
wood
window
like
people
make
good
windows,
they
make
double
glazed
triple
glazed
I,
don't
have
a
triple
glazed
window.
If
somebody
wants
the
triple
glazed
window,
because
that
looks
a
little
different
when
you're
looking
through
three.
If
that's
something
we
want
to
look
at
because
those
are
really
energy-efficient.
Is
that
something
you
want
to
look
at.
D
A
Mean
speaking
as
the
most
ignorant
person
on
the
Commission
and
Windows,
if,
if
you
couldn't
remember
the
part
of
this
is
educational
of
explaining
to
us,
you
know
what
you
know
the
products
and
why
preservationist
have
decided
certain
things
are
okay
and
not,
and
just
give
us
kind
of
it.
I
mean
you
know
a
lot
more
I'm.
J
A
C
M
We
will
so
because
we're
having
a
meeting
next
week
and
and
the
committee
is
going
to
look
at
the
guidelines
that
we've
put
together
and
we'll
get
the
buy-in
and
discuss
whether
there
are
any
changes
to
that.
And
then
we
had
discussed
with
the
committee
that
before
anything
will
you
know,
go
up
or
go
live
the
entire
Commission
needs
to
look
at
it
and
discuss
it.
M
A
D
A
Can
I
mean
you
know
people
we
can
talk
about
and
he's
different
things,
which
is
with
the
meetings,
what
their
different
formats
different
ways
of
public
comment,
different
ways
of
dealing
with
applicants
but
I
know
I
feel
like
it's
a
real
struggle
to
do
often
and
I've
learned
something
about
it
over
the
last
year,
but
I
think
you
know
again.
I
just
want
to
be
discussion,
group
leader,
not
a
lecture,
but
we
should
it
definitely
worth
talking
about
just.
C
A
C
A
A
A
Again,
anybody
can
email
suggestions.
This
was
something
I
sat
down
in
an
hour,
so
I
thought
construction.
New
homes
just
seems
like
a
really
terribly
difficult
issue,
because
it's
you
know,
there's
that
nasai
reference
points
and
it
just
seems
very
good
and
then
we've
got
a
ton
of
community
input.
That's
just
really
hard
to
know
what
to
do
with
and
so
I
thought
it
was
worth
discussing
more
in
the
conceptual
nonspecific
way
to
help
us
have
a
better
framework
as
people
come
in
so.
A
Mean
nothing
mechanical
I
mean
I
mean
we
have
I
refrained
from
talking
about
specific
projects,
but
we
have
you
know
projects
on
the
locks
of
new
homes
with
our
historic
homes.
Next
to
them,
we
have
projects
more
eclectic
bikes.
We
have
50
neighbors
coming
in
and
not
liking
the
size
of
something
you
know.
That's
the
zoning
ordinance
and
it's
very
hard
because
you
can
I
mean
you
know,
do
compare
it
to
the
house
next
door.
Is
that
the
reference
point?
Is
it
the
block?
A
I
mean
it
it's
much
more
open-ended
and
therefore
much
more
controversial
and
difficult
than
just
an
addition
to
a
house
or
something
and
and
and
and
I
think
it's
it's
very
I
I
find
it
to
be
very
challenging
to
even
know
what
we're
doing
I
mean
like.
Should
we
be
applying
the
same
standards
to
a
house
in
the
middle
of
a
bunch
of
new
homes
versus
one?
You
know
I
lock.
You
know
right
next
to
two
beautiful
historic,
oh
yeah,.
J
I,
you
know
what
I
think
that
sort
I
do
think,
though,
that
our
standards
for
construction-
it's
always
about
the
con
I
mean
I,
would
say
this
again.
It
contacts
contacts
contact.
So
you
look
at
the
block.
If
it's
eclectic,
you
know
and
you're
weighing
all
of
these
things,
there's
probably
more
interpretation,
because
you
only
the
context
around
you
but
I'm,
not
sure
it's
all.
Let's
mint,
these
standards
are
all
really
about
us,
looking
at
them
and
then
making
your
own
interpretation
so
I'm,
not
quite
sure
how
you
get
to
you
know.
J
C
I
think
it's.
Those
difficulty
is
that
there
it's
called
construction
versus
alteration,
but
in
your
right
almost
all
of
the
construction
has
been
additions,
which-
and
a
lot
of
this
is
written
around
that
notion,
although
you
can
read
into
it
that
there's
also
new
construction.
Unfortunately,
technically
speaking
only
one
standard
says
new
construction,
so
we're
inferring
all
the
others
from
from
the
others.
If
you
ever
look
at
it,
there's
only
16
is
the
only
one
that
says
new
construction,
the
rest
of
them
are
all
sort
of
standards.
A
A
D
J
I
I
do
think
that
maybe-
and
this
is
in
the
section
on
the
last
section-
but
it's
not
just
it
I-
think
we
should
just
have
a
little
discussion
about
when
we
think
we're
being
effective
and
when
we
don't
and
how
we
can
work
to
better
together
as
a
commission
and
because
we
really
never
get
to
have
those
discussions
and
I
think
that's
really
important,
I
mean
I'm,
sure
I
know
this.
Retreat
should
probably
have
more
retreats
every
year.
There's
a
new
new
people
coming
on.
J
So
I
would
like
that
to
be
part
of
that
I
think
we
would
be
more
effective
if
we
all
were
doing
it's
hard.
You
know
we
all
have
jobs,
lives,
everything
else,
but
we
all
try
to
do
our
homework
and
show
up,
and
all
of
that
so
I
think
that's
part
of
it
like.
How
can
we
be
more
effective
when
are
we
effective?
When
is
it
problematic
and
how
do
when
we
set?
J
A
A
Yeah
I
mean
part
of
it
is
you
know,
we've
talked
about
it
a
little
about
whether
we
should
publicize
I
mean
it
and
then
the
other
thing
I
guess
is
we.
You
know
just
relationships
with
the
city.
I
mean
we
don't
we
don't
necessarily
have
an
idea.
What
happens
with
our
work
after
it
leaves
here
and
then
we've
got
the
city
council
overturning
us
much
more
than
usual
in
the
last
few
months,
and
we
don't
really
communicate
with
them,
which
makes
it
really
kind
of
an
odd
process.
It's
like
I.