City of Portsmouth, New Hampshire Historic District Commission, 6 Jul 2022

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7.6.2022 Historic District Commission

A

To order welcome to the july 6 2022 meeting of the historic district commission, the board's.

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Actions in these matters have been deemed to be quasi-judicial in nature. If any person believes.

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Any member of the board has a conflict of interest. That issue should be raised at this point or would.

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Be deemed waived so I'd like to introduce at my far right, dr dan brown good evening.

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Yes, martin ryan, good evening I am john wyckoff. This is nick cracknell.

B

Good evening, all right- and this is uh rich blalock city council rep good evening- margo doring, hello,.

A

Mr david adams, good evening in person- I might add, love it here. I know it and karen buffer.

A

Good evening good evening, um so the first order of business is our approval of minutes.

C

Mr chairman, I move that we approve the minute says, uh presented.

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Second, all righty, all those in favor aye aye against quickly whip through that.

A

Administrative approvals with nick cracknell reading announce any of these first things.

B

All of them yeah in case somebody's waiting for it. um Okay, you have a number of postponements.

B

So we have a correction and I'm uh I'm out on number five yeah we'll come back.

B

To the admin approvals, all right excuse us. Well, we do a little office work here.

A

So we have a number of postponements and in case somebody is waiting to listen to this.

A

I'm going to read them now so uh under public hearings, petition of 531 islington street.

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Portsmouth llc for the dunkin donuts. You think, that's enough that I read it all right, so we're.

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Postponing that until next week um that's a work session public hearing by the way.

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Petition of chief street condominium association, owner smith, family declaration of trust, todd c.

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Smith, trustee um we're postponing that until october request to postpone from petition of.

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Sandra l smith weiss owner for property located at 138 gate street that gets postponed till august.

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Request to postpone petition of 33 richmond real estate owner for property located at 33.

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Richmond street, that is august and a work session, public hearing uh request to postpone petition of.

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Seacoast management, consulting llc owner, that's postponed till august, and I think there is some.

A

There are two more excuse me: 23 homes, 30 43 homes, in one congress, which is not written on there.

B

One congress is number four yes petition of one market street llc owner for property located at.

A

One congress street that is um postponed until august 3rd and a request to postpone petition.

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Of 43 homes, court llc, owner for property located at holmes court and that's postponed till august.

A

So with that in mind, we'll go through our administrative rules and pull out number five.

B

Okay is that correct? Does anyone have to vote on those who yeah vote on the postponement tonight.

A

All right, let's have a motion to post um so codify these postponements so offered.

A

Seconded all those in favor hi, hi hi thanks sean okay. There. There are nine administrative approvals.

B

uh We'll do those obviously before we get to the extension request and the request for re-hearings.

B

So I have two of them marked uh to be determined to be determined by you, folks, 238 deer street. I.

B

Know there's somebody here that can present the miscellaneous changes to that project to 238 deer.

B

And then the other one I I thought might generate at least a little discussion is 266.

B

Middle um karen, you are recusing from 114. Maple would have correct any any other recusals.

B

So we'll we'll pull those three out right, john four or five. Certainly, eight.

B

I got my numbering right, we'll start at 10 prospect if that works. This is a uh railing.

B

That is proposed at 10 prospect prospect street I'll share my screen here. Sorry.

B

All right so there's the railing. That's proposed.

B

For 10 prospect, I'm not sure who the fabricator is, but that's the uh the request. Mr cracknell.

C

Correct me, if I'm wrong the building that they're suggesting that that railing goes.

C

On to doesn't exist is that correct uh there being no 10 prospect street at this moment.

B

You're saying that's a facsimile of it, don't know where the building is. Did anyone else go.

C

There and look at the building on ten prospects. No, I didn't either construction, the one on the corner.

C

I pardon I took this to be the one on the corner which we have been had been produced to us as zero.

C

Maple wood. At one point: when we were yes, yeah, okay, you're right: this is the place. This is the.

B

Empty lot, so they must have found out that they couldn't get their side entry stairs without me,.

B

So they just sent this exactly. That is the railing that is correct or they're testing an old man here.

C

Right and the old man came and worked, okay, all right great, so they want to put that railing and.

B

I believe that's on the side street um is it prospect that goes up and turns prospect. Yeah.

B

Excellent, that was an administrative approval requirement in the original approval that the.

B

Railing system should they need it because of the number of stairs would come back for admin.

B

Approval, thank you very much now. That's why you get the big buck here. Nothing where you get the.

A

Big bucks, yeah or not. um Thank you are we good on that yeah? Is that railing work? Okay, it looks fine.

B

82 congress: this is a request to replace, I believe, three existing condensers that are.

B

In the back alley, if you go in off porter street and behind the buildings on chestnut.

B

And congress- and I guess fleet, with the macintosh building or in and around on the left, are these.

B

uh Condensers they want to replace three and add a fourth, as well as a louvered vent.

B

As shown on the the plan here, nick, the only thing that wasn't clear to me is: where is the.

D

Fourth, condenser going they've located the vent, but I didn't see where the condenser is going.

B

uh I I would have guessed it was going where the three are now yeah. Thank you. If.

E

You don't mind um the plan actually changed. So what's what's shown in the package here is the.

E

Three of the existing condensers are being replaced, but they're being moved to the roof.

E

So they want those three that are hatched. There will be gone okay and then uh on the bottom of.

E

The page we're proposing adding a louver, that's so there isn't a fourth one. The fourth one will.

E

Be going to the roof? Okay, so all four are on the roof. Three are moving from the ground to.

B

The roof correct or this lower plane have you got anything that shows where those are going to be.

E

Right, probably right in the middle of the roof, so you won't see it. Okay, let me go back.

C

Just to keep the record straight, I think they should also.

C

State their name and the reason that they're here exactly yeah. Sorry, who are you guys who are.

E

You uh mark giannini and richard desjardins from mckinney architecture. All right, I'm just going to.

B

Be I want to be really clear where you're going to put them, I'm using your your roof plan here.

B

Don't touch the screen, but if you could at least point out uh where they're going to be.

E

There's an existing shaft right in the center, uh where richard was pointing. So all the condensate.

E

Lines will come up that that shaft and then they'll disperse the four condensers in that.

E

Area so they'll be right in the center of the building and not visible from the street.

F

Okay, that's fine, and I'm okay with that. If nick has the chance to just take a look at an x on the.

D

On the plan, if you could just give nick a plan with an x mark.

D

For the record, yes, can you do that we can do that? Okay, okay, so why don't we stipulate.

B

For 82 congress that you um submit a revised route plan showing the locations.

A

Okay, what happened to uh haven school? I don't know south school yeah. It wasn't in the order.

B

Here um that was number two right now yeah, I'm using the uh no you, presumably the online.

B

uh List and I'm not seeing 50 sell school street. Do you have it on your own? um Your ipad? No do.

F

You have it on your ipad. Yeah cause isaac gave me a jump drive and I'm not seeing it on here.

F

Yeah well I'll, do it from my own notes: uh 50 cell school street is an ac condenser.

B

At the rear of the building um seemed pretty straightforward to me, this is not particularly.

B

Visible, certainly not from a public way, the location is shown in the photographs that were.

B

Edited by the applicant and that location is up on a second floor on the roof of a uh on the second.

A

Floor of the bay back of the building correct and it's a big old school building right and the.

B

Conduit is going directly through the wall. There's nothing going up the outside that's hard just to.

C

Keep it classy, while I was there doing my sight walk today, uh they were actually installing it.

F

Oops, okay! Well, hopefully, it's okay! uh Anybody having this up we're gonna.

A

Have to give you a bag yeah. What were you doing over there yeah your knee.

C

Exercising my knee yeah yeah good, oh I'll, see if I could do paving 50 anything else on school street.

B

50 schools so now we're going to leave deer street out and have a presentation for that all right.

C

We'll leave 114 out for a minute and we'll go to 454 marcy, which is a ground mounted hvac. It's out.

B

Of public view, there is conduit that goes up the back of the building, so we need a stipulation well.

B

It says it'll be painted to match the house color because of conversations with us, but that will not.

B

Be visible in that location. The tax map- that's in here is a little bit faded, but I did go look at.

B

uh A better quality map- and that is definitely back a house in the middle of the triangular.

B

Set of streets that that frame that block mr wyckoff, you have an attachment to this building.

C

uh Yes, I do and did you approve this location I couldn't get in the backyard. I would because it.

A

It really is um not viewable, except for maybe the playground by the haven school condominiums. You.

A

Know because you're looking down in between building, I think it's fine. Thank you. Yeah.

B

Okay, so 10 commercial alley. This is another mini split, they're everywhere.

B

The existing conditions are on the screen up there of where it's going to be located.

B

They're proposing to put it underneath this bay window next to the parking off pan hollow street.

B

uh There it is there, which I I'm questioning, why they're.

D

Putting it up underneath the bay window instead of down, it seems to.

B

The the the down has already got those three meter sockets under it to the left in between.

B

It may be possible to put it there. They they are going to paint the entire unit.

B

The color of the brick, uh so you won't have that box of white around the fan they just.

B

That's just the way they colored it, but um that's good. Let's make that a real stipulation. I mean.

B

If, if everyone felt there was a better location and they have the ability to do it with.

B

The electrical meters there and the gas meters, then I'm sure and the landlord it's just the.

D

Bay window is such a beautiful feature and that thing sitting underneath it it's too bad.

A

It's a feature they could at least center it yeah. Well, I don't. I can't see, what's to the.

B

Left of it, but I think there are some other vents there's two holes that are just the left of the.

F

Center of that bay window, underneath it looks like yeah, there are events, something on there.

C

Mr cracknell, could we empower you to try to negotiate that into a more.

C

uh Center, oh perfect, I saw you there at the beginning. What options do you have to I'm the.

G

Tenant of that of the elephant time bakery that is proposing, my name is sheree farig.

G

To the left of that between the meters and where we're proposing our two vents.

G

That vent out um steam and heat from our kitchen. So that's why I can't go further.

G

To the left, we could drop it lower in here. Can you see my grabber? Could you put it down there.

G

We can certainly explore putting it down there when we had the um hvac contractor come by. He.

G

Recommended from the perspective of the plumbing and mechanical inspection, that was the best.

G

Location to put it, but I'm certainly happy to um to revisit that with him. And if we need to.

G

Lower it, we can certainly I'm actually wondering about that. um If, because he must know the code, but.

A

These uh units, when they sit out on their wall, mounted brackets, they sit a good 10, 12 inches away.

A

From the wall, and I'm wondering with all that's going on at there anyways, what does this vent.

A

Mean you know, what is this vent a dryer vent or what is this thing? It's basically, an exhaust from.

G

The uh from the oven and the kitchen, so it's really hot yeah, so it's blowing out! um I think.

A

Part of that exhaust from a commercial oven, you mean yeah, it's an electric oven, yeah. I think also.

A

Part of the under the bay yeah well sharif. Is it at all possible that it go in this area over here.

B

Which is, I think, where margot was originally suggesting, or even this side either side. I.

B

Think would have a similar effect. I mean it's clutter along the bottom, no matter where it goes.

B

Yeah, but there appears to be a space here or here, no there's more room on the left yeah a little.

B

More room on the left, but that the box will fit in either spot unless you folks have a preference.

B

I I would agree with margo myself. I think it would be it'd, be better centered and if you have.

B

The vent there and you can't center it. It might be better down here and I think, to john's point.

B

If it's on standing brackets rather than the wall, it might be able to be a little closer to the wall.

B

But it sounds like: let's make a deal, my only concern about um if it has to go through that.

F

Part of the wall, we wouldn't want an extra, you know what I mean like is it? I think the pipe.

B

Coming you can still be able to go straight through and then run any conduit up. The wall.

B

From the inside right, because you're going to have to run something from the inside, that's a.

G

Great question: I wish I had an answer. I know the initial thinking of the hvac contractor was if we.

G

Mounted it at that level, then everything could go in right directly behind it and actually the.

G

First, mini split would effectively be on the inside. What's on your inside wall, behind that.

G

The brick is just a facade, so it's just one layer of brick and then it's concrete and then on the.

G

Other side it's sheetrock with um patinaed mirror, so we would just go through that. So that's.

B

You'd be going through that anyway, just at that height correct. So if you went lower to the left.

B

You would still go through the same material and then just have to run a chase up to the unit in.

B

Indoors, that's right. I think I think the contractor has chosen the simplest easiest for him.

D

And that's understandable, but it doesn't mean that other locations are not possible. Just a little.

D

More inconvenient sure I'm happy to go back with whatever the recommendation. Thank you is to ask.

G

So is it you could approve it in the better, the better location and you're welcome to you could.

B

Even come back next week, if there was some serious deficiency with putting it in the lower left.

B

Right, yes, can I bring up um the fact that this is so visible that we need screening? Well, he's he's.

B

Because it's difficult to screen with the parking and well because there isn't a lot of space there.

A

Well, the cars I mean, there's uh the three posts that the gas company put in so right.

A

That's a definite end, so if somehow, a screen type fence could be put across right where those three.

A

Posts are they're not going to lose anything yeah. So a screen to screen the gas meters as well as.

B

The and the electric trainers- well, electric meters- are pretty: let's win, let's win win.

B

It's pretty big, but yeah. I think one concern is that the depth with the mounting of the.

G

Unit would actually extend past the depth of the electrical meters and pass the depth of the gas.

G

Protectors, pole protectors, so the screen would actually have to be mounted further out.

F

Exactly so as strange as it may sound, and as much as I love screening, this is actually one.

D

Place where I might actually excuse it between painting it, the color of brick and the fact that.

D

You already have these meters already there. It's not. I don't think this is adding one more thing.

D

In between them down low is going to add to the noise. However, if I were you, I would be worried.

D

About it being plowed into and I'd want something to protect it from snow, so just to make that point.

B

Because I'm the one that recommended it be painted to match the brick, because we haven't really done.

B

That much, if you look at the image up there and it's not easy to see but they've already done this.

B

With this sort of dryer vent here, yeah that's been painted the color of the brick and you can see how.

B

It disappears, unfortunately, the burgundy he chose here isn't even close to the brick. So it looks.

B

Like it still stands out, but it'll have a similar effect to this and the whole thing. As I understand.

B

It, I would hope, is the case. This entire unit would be painted that color, I think it'll it'll be less.

B

Less of an eyesore without a screen, if it's it's worth a try right, we got to do better than we are.

B

uh And I think it's worth in this location trying that. But I I agree with what I think most people.

B

Are saying here, okay put it in another location yeah. If it can work all right, so does that work.

B

For you, if we lower it to this location over here- and you can come back in a week and tell us why.

B

It doesn't work if if it doesn't work, otherwise you can proceed over here. I am certainly fine.

G

To do that, I think the only counter I would say if you zoom back out um of the picture.

G

And show the full thing: there's actually several elements on there that initially, like the three.

G

Vents to the left, which were not even yep yeah we're talking about down here right right, I was.

G

Just saying, because I'm not good at the digital mock-up of this, I do think it would blend in.

G

Quite well and I left the fan white, which would be painted red, but that was just for the purposes.

G

To see the contrast and then if you look to the right hand, side the.

G

Additional electrical meter, there is actually a conduit on the right hand, side on the over.

B

Here, yeah at the top there's a conduit above the second gray box that runs up the building.

G

That's painted the same okay, yeah, so well hidden yep. So I think nick's idea makes a lot of sense.

A

So I think we might have to pull this one out well, yeah! Well, we'll just put a stipulation there. I.

B

Think we got one for the uh the roof plan that he come in next week. No, that he can proceed if.

B

It goes in that location and if he can't put it in the preferred location, then he comes back with a.

B

Revised plan and just to make sure that I understand the preferred location, is it.

G

Still mounted on the wall, or is it mounted on the ground? I think it's, it could be either it just.

B

Needs to be against the wall, okay, so between the the leftmost pole and the electrical needs there.

F

He is going to have to consider snow in the water. They'll put it on a stand: okay, so it'll.

B

Be at least 18 inches off on a stand or on the wall. I don't think it matters how they.

B

You know not not up here but as low as you can get it. Okay. Thank you all right. Thank you.

B

Okay, just writing it down yeah all right. So the last one on the short list is 12.

B

Seconds, which I think is the taller, chimney right. The.

B

um They're increasing the height of the chimney from three feet to.

B

uh Above the ridge to seven- and this is required by the mason in order to get adequate draft for.

B

The chimney so boy, it's probably the first time in 11 years, I've seen somebody extend a chimney.

A

And either shorten it or remove it like that, so it seemed good to me. But what do you guys think.

F

That's fine, really good. Martin, all right sounds good, so we've gone through one two: three.

B

Six, seven and nine and there's a stipulation that we get a revised roof plan showing the.

B

Exact location of those uh four roof mounted condensers under 82 congress and then a.

B

Stipulation on 10 commercial alley unit 2 that the applicant relocate the proposed condenser to be.

B

Situated between the electrical meters and the gas meters uh as low as possible on the wall, okay, so.

A

Nick has given us a nice little synopsis. Can we have a some movement? Second, all those in favor.

A

Against all right, so now we have 238 deer. If we could have the applicant.

B

Or the representative present the miscellaneous changes that would be good.

E

Good evening mark giannini and richard desjardins from mchenry architecture.

E

Back in november of 2001, we were here together and got approval for the.

E

Mixed use, project of 238 2 street as part of that approval, there was two stipulations.

E

To come back with redesign one being for the the brick type that we had shown as.

E

Proposed at the time and also a redesign of the parapet, so in your packet here tonight we have.

E

The proposed and the previously approved, which shows the original design intent for the parapet.

E

As you can see, we basically the intent, was to reduce the size of the parapet.

E

Overall, so we, instead of having it uh step down and kind of cascelated in the original design,.

E

We've lowered the parapet all the way across around the the front and also the deer street side.

E

Or deer street I'm sorry and bridge street.

E

And then to get the the safety height that we need the three foot six inches for a railing.

E

We have a short railing that sits on top of the parapet, similar to what we were showing in.

E

Previous designs, but now this wraps all the way around the two two and a half sides.

E

And then, in addition to that, we brought in brick samples that was a stipulation of the original approval right that you, which show samples yeah.

B

We show samples, yes, and we are, we show the the new proposed brick in this case.

D

Which one we have one, are they all the same? Those are all the same, so they are all the.

E

Same, can you get one out of there, just I'm working on it? No, I meant him. Oh look at that.

D

So here we go so these are. This is a set of different multi-colored. It's the same. It's.

E

The same, it's the same brick, it's showing the full range yeah. This is showing the range of the colors.

B

I'm good yeah, I don't want it.

C

What I like, is it's not ringers and they're on heavy black lines across.

C

I'm just commenting that they've selected, a brick that doesn't have.

C

Heavy uh burnt lines around the edge which is in the trader called ringers.

C

It's a very modern look, um you know a modern rusticated. Look. I think it's a very natural.

C

Look to a brick, I'm I'm very comfortable with this. Sorry, you yeah. Did you see it yeah? I did.

F

It's a brick all right, keep going all right uh in addition to those two items um since design.

E

Is now fairly complete, you know, we've there's a couple other mep items that we've added to the set.

E

um Regarding railing or I'm sorry, uh metal roof access. So if you go to uh sheet a3.

E

Problem one: oh okay order. Oh sorry, this is yeah, go down one more right! There we go.

E

You can see we have a roof access ladder uh at the top of the page there. This is.

E

This will really only be visible on this side of the building because it's kind of centered, but it.

E

Provides access to the upper part of the roof and the elevator overrun there's also a louver.

E

On the bottom left page there and then and we removed at one time, we had envisioned meters.

E

And stuff a meter bank and stuff in this vicinity, so we had an overhang to protect that.

E

Currently, most of those meters are going to be inside, so there was no need for a larger meter.

E

Bank and overhang so that's been removed and then, if you go down two pages to a4.

E

On the back of the building, there is another louver in the bottom right. There that's been added.

E

For mechanical equipment, I think all these changes are for the better.

F

Anything else, that's it and there's the brick. Yes, that's the uh brick and then a section. What's the.

B

Name of the brick that you just showed us, that is, the glengarry red flash, the one that's here: okay,.

F

You never know does this building have a central heating system and air conditioning uh it's gonna.

E

Have heat pumps? Oh, it has heat pump yep, so uh so they're coming off of a boiler and.

E

uh No though so there'll be a set of condensers that we've been showing all along that are kind.

E

Of along the alleyway on the lower roof, if you go up yeah right there, so there's a set of condensers.

E

So where are they up here, yeah right up behind here, yep, okay, there's a set of condensers there.

E

That run, you know two heads in in each of the units, so there's one for each unit. Okay, thank you.

B

Anybody have any other questions for these guys.

B

Any okay: do you want to vote on 238? I think we should yeah. So would somebody.

A

Make a motion for 238 I'll make a motion to approve all. Second, all those in favor.

A

Oh karen, you come back.

F

I'm back I'm back all right, 266 middle is anybody here for 266 middle.

B

You are all right, so can you just explain in a little more clarity than the application.

B

I will do my best, what's being done here um again, mark gennady from academy architecture.

E

I'm helping fill in for mr bose and the applicant who had planned on presenting tonight.

E

But his since we were here several months ago to get approval for window.

E

Replacement and sighting restoration, the work has begun about. 90 percent of the windows have been.

E

Installed and they've also peeled back about three quarters of the vinyl siding.

E

Or maybe half of the vinyl siding at this point and in doing so they discovered you know, there's.

E

A significant decay in the building structure, particularly in the back of the building.

E

From rotten sills to studs that are rotten, original sheathing, that's rotten.

E

So it's become a much more extensive project than the applicant had originally intended.

E

So at this point, his thought is, though, the windows will continue to be installed and.

E

The they're going to continue removing all of the metal brake metal that was around window trim and.

E

Other trims on the building, so they're going to restore all the wood wind or all the wood trim.

E

Window trim add back corbels that were missing around some of the window, sills and stuff, and then.

E

They're looking for to repair and replace and kind the vinyl siding that was on on the building.

E

So the intent it would be to replace all the vinyl sign. That's on the building.

E

So, like the kind of sky baby blue, that's there now would be replaced with something that would.

E

Hopefully be a little more complementary in color, but basically repairing replacing.

C

Why I'm sorry? But why use word repair? Well, I guess replacing kind. It's not really repair. Okay,.

A

We got some more comments on this particular piece. We don't infrequently.

A

Look at the installation of vinyl siding.

F

Anybody down here um I mean I would hate to see a.

F

Vinyl on this I mean I've noticed the vinyl falling off from the side. um I either walk or.

F

Drive by this house every day, pretty much um it's really front row and I hate to see vinyl there. It.

F

Doesn't it's hard because I.

F

Anyone else about over here, I would just ask I understand that this is about economics.

H

And the expense, what about just doing the front, facade and wooden clap board and.

H

Would compromise and consider the sides final for replacement.

E

Without the applicant being here I mean it sounds reasonable to me, but all right so.

E

It's a deal I mean, I think my concern is that um once the underpinnings are fixed.

D

And the vinyl is put on top. There isn't going to be any future near future opportunity to bring.

D

This building back to where it should be, and the vinyl siding, is going to last a really long time.

D

And it could be another 20 or 30 years before this building has an opportunity to be the showcase.

D

That it is without being covered up with vinyl siding, so I'm very sympathetic to the economic.

D

Issue, but this is a front and center house with a lot of really special details that I appreciate.

D

Mr boson is replacing and taking care of, but I think it's a shame to fall short.

D

At this point, so I that's very, very well said I I I would agree with uh martin's comment um and.

A

David's making a compromise on this, and so what we, what well martin and I, for instance, might be.

A

Asking is 25, so we want the front to be restored. No, it doesn't have to be new clapboards. You could.

A

Take that vinyl off and and repair and paint the front, along with all of the trim which you.

A

Have pledged to restore that would go a long ways and then the back and the sides do the trim with.

A

Some kind of matching vinyl, um that's a compromise, I don't know if everybody likes it, but it's.

A

A compromise, maybe with that feedback, we could ask mr boson to come back with a definitive plan.

E

Is it possible to get approval for that at this point and then, if he wants to come back with other.

E

Changes or no well, it is possible to approve that particular. If we did, you could certainly.

B

What's happening, you got to wait another week. That's not a typical.

B

Outcome yeah: well, we have done this before some building. Yeah we'll see you next week, um so.

A

I guess we need a motion to continue motion to continue seconded until next meeting yeah.

F

Yes, next week, all those in favor aye, all right and it'll, be at the beginning of the meeting. So.

A

We won't keep you up all right like that that 114 114 114 yes.

B

Okay, 114. sorry fishing it out here. This is a change in windows.

B

From the previously approved windows and the the bracket detail, I guess is whoops.

B

This is ann, whitney's project looks familiar, I'm sure to most of you. This is the uh the.

B

Back building there 114 maplewood and she is proposing to change a couple of the windows.

B

I can't read that yeah yeah, perfect she's here.

I

um Let's you don't have the drawings up.

B

Oh I'll get it anyway, um um there's one window that the size has changed. It's on.

I

The back elevation and we had a double if you're, looking at your one of two.

I

On the left side elevation, you can see a double double hung, an a unit we originally yeah. I.

I

Actually go to the next page. um Second page: there we go. Is it moving? It seems to be frozen. Yeah.

I

There we go this one: okay, you see uh where I've got the red that there are two.

I

Larger um six over one double hungs, eight over ones, and we ran into an issue with the.

I

Property line, you know we had to ship the double window such that it was just looking at the.

I

Building next door, so we decided to get rid of the double window and just do a slightly wider single.

I

Window that would have the better view of the of the mill pond. That's on the back of the building.

I

The other window changes that the window sizes, the c and d window sizes are the same size. But I.

I

Inspect them as awnings and they want to go change those to casement windows. So it's the exact same.

I

Window, it's just how it opens has changed, and the other stipulation that was on the original.

I

Hdc approval was a little more information about the entry record and we they wanted.

I

To have five quarter trim behind the bracket which I've shown and then I've actually chosen.

I

A bracket size there'll be a painted bracket, so those are the three items.

F

I have no questions.

A

So we have a very decent uh bracket, showing here specked out.

D

I'll make a motion to approve, as presented a second.

A

All right, all those in favor aye against very good.

B

Okay, that's it okay! That is it for our administrative approvals. Please please, please.

F

121. I'm getting here.

A

A petition of bow street theater trust owner for property located at 125 bow street.

A

Wherein permission is requested for a second one-year extension of the certificate of approval.

A

Originally granted on july 10 2020 to allow new construction to an existing structure.

A

Replace roof and add insulated cladding on walls as per plans on file in the planning.

A

Department said property is shown on assessor map 105 as lot 1f lies within.

A

Character, district 4, downtown overlay and the historic district, and who is here to present this.

J

Good evening, mr chairman, members of the commission and planning department, tracy kozak,.

J

Arcove architects, here on behalf of the applicants, seacoast repertory theater.

J

As just mentioned, this was approved two years ago we had a one-year extension and now we're.

J

Asking for a second one-year extension- and we have the full application here.

J

Basically, it has been progressing in small incremental stages. The interior work was completed.

J

First, with handicapped bathrooms, in a new lobby, the that was followed by the mechanical system.

J

Replacement there is a mechanical platform which is newly constructed on the back that that was an.

J

Amendment to the application, which is included in your packet.

J

That is done and then third and final phase is the new roofing and siding which has not yet started.

J

It has been delayed due to procurement and material market volatility. It is intended to start.

J

Sometime this year, I don't have an exact date, but nothing has changed. This is as presented and.

J

Approved previously, we are for those who may not have been on the commission at that time. We are.

J

Trying to find a solution to a very leaky roof, that's been there since 1980. They spend a lot of.

J

Money every year fixing the leaks and the lifespan of that glass roof system has has finished. It's.

J

Time to be replaced, they are looking to replace it with an insulated, solid, opaque system to.

J

Improve energy efficiency: it complies with the current energy code. You cannot reconstruct what.

J

Was there in the 80s with the current energy code, and they also had to put in a new fire suppression.

J

Sprinkler system in the lobby, which freezes against the glass, so insulation is important.

J

The glass storefront facing bow street will remain, except for the far right panel, which.

J

Is where the sprinkler main entrance is so we need a solid panel there, but everything else that the.

J

Glass stays on the vertical wall, but on the side alley going down to the back the building that is.

J

As you see here proposed it's a it's a solid wall, it is a fiber cement panel system.

J

With a composite trim that replicates the current existing storefront, the metal roof is a standing.

J

Seam but it's a it's a baton, seam, so it's a two inch tall two inch wide batten, which is in a black.

J

Finish: color and the field. The flat panels are blue to try to mimic the current effect. You get.

J

With the glass reflecting the sky and the black frame of the skylights and two snow rails across.

J

um That's pretty much it so no changes and we're hoping for another one-year extension.

J

So we can get this rolling teresi. I just have a question. Was that um the was this standing theme.

A

I mean with the batons: was that what we approved two years ago, yes and was the colors the same.

J

Colors we we came in with actual samples for the work session and.

J

Same colors, we're not changing it. It's the blue field with the black patents.

A

um Okay, so this is um a second extension request. um What do you think should be the next step? Let's.

B

Here take public comment, it's public hearing, so uh ask any questions. Take public comment and.

A

All righty, so um if anybody in the public would like to make any comments uh concerning.

A

This renovation of the lobby of the seacoast rep stand up.

B

Or raise your hand if you're watching virtually, I don't see any hands up. Okay, so I'll close, the.

A

Public hearing and we'll have a discussion and a vote. If anybody just wants to john, I.

H

I will have to vote no to be consistent with my previous vote. No, I just feel that this is.

H

Too much of a change in the envelope- and you know I understand- that the hardship of the.

H

Applicant, but you know this is this- is a very unique uh glass enclosure and it's just not.

H

Going to be the same, and I don't think we'd consider such a radical change for any other.

H

Type of architecture here in this community, so I'm going to be voting now all right. That's.

A

Good, would anybody like to um make a motion? Mr chairman question question? Oh I'm sorry yep we're.

F

Simply proving the extension or changes too, no, we are approving the extension okay. These.

A

Right so this was previously approved. It was right so they're just asking for an extension.

B

Yeah with no changes to the previous design doesn't mean you can't change something, though.

C

Mr chairman, I'd like to say that I I was not here, as you can imagine, uh for this. The first time.

C

It came by, nor was I here, it seems for the one year extension and I don't understand that part.

C

But when I go back in my way back machine uh to the 80s, when this was proposed to.

C

Be put on this building the drama of being able to see through it. The opacity of this.

C

Was was part of the charm in the raison for its connection to this building being an angular in.

C

In in many ways, obtuse addition to this brick building that was there so honestly.

C

I can't see supporting this uh at all. I think that the the loss of the glass.

C

Means that if they that this design is no longer valid, so I I won't support this.

A

I'm not going to jump into this at this point, but would anybody else like to.

A

Make a motion or do something here, have a question: um no, I'm just going to state.

F

That I'm, I will be supporting just because it was previously approved. I know I wasn't part of that.

F

um But I feel, like the apple kind of stated, they've already been doing it in pieces.

F

And it just, I don't feel like it's fair that that has been approved and then I know construction has.

F

Been very challenging last few years, that's my life. I I hate to bring any kind of construction.

A

Experience to this sort of thing, however, as soon as somebody touches this roof excuse me, I'm just.

A

Going to complete my statement here as soon as somebody touches this thing, it has to be brought.

A

Up to code, which, unfortunately, is not r2 or r3, which is what these panels are, and the walls I.

A

Can't I don't understand how they were allowed. Basically, I don't know how a building inspector.

A

Approved this back in the day, because even back in the 80s, there was r19 insulation in the walls and.

A

Our r19 and the ceilings, and at least r11 and the walls, none, is met here, and so I would say that any.

A

Touching of this, as far as repairing and putting in new etc is going to lead to.

A

Trouble with the building inspector also the fact that they've sprinkled this lobby, which is a very.

A

Safe and good idea for having a hundred people milling around waiting for the show to start.

A

And being told that the sprinkler system is in danger because of these glass panels,.

A

And we have approved it, however margo I I think I was gonna say pretty much what you said that.

D

The requirements of the code for this public venue, um it's a life safety matter and while.

D

I understand martin's point of losing a particular point in time and I've made this argument on other.

D

Buildings that just because it's not old, doesn't mean that it isn't isn't important.

D

um The applicant and has not been able to come up with anything that can be, it can be similar.

D

In design and accomplish what needs to be done for life safety- and I think we in the past have.

D

Lost given given way in in the name of life safety before so, I think the applicant has come.

D

Up with the best solution, trying to maintain the shape and the feel of what was there in.

D

The 1980s, while bringing it up to code, so I would support an extension all right.

A

Would somebody like to make a motion I'll make a motion to approve, as presented.

A

Wait a minute one! Second, I'm sorry, that's very good! Thank you.

A

um I should ask the public if they want to speak on that they did already yeah. That's all.

A

Going by yeah all righty motion, please uh some motion to prove as presented any second. Second.

A

So uh unless there's any more discussion, I will just ask for a vote all those in favor, aye, aye, aye,.

A

And against I opposed or no okay, so that's true opposed. Okay did we need findings of fact or no.

D

Yeah yeah, I would yeah yes do that all right. We need findings of fact from the motion maker, yeah.

A

We do need some findings of fact here. Do you have the for an extension let's get in there.

F

To promote educate, pleasure welfare, the district to see residents and visitors.

F

F

Yeah compatibility um compatibility of innovative technologies with surrounding properties.

F

Very good okay, so we have had our vote and you have your permission. um Okay, so rehearing requests.

K

On a re-hearing 129., all right so now we've got requests from for a re-hearing from jonathan.

A

And valerie sobel for property located at 129 state street 129 state street llc owner wherein.

A

Permission was granted on may 4th 2022 to allow renovations and new construction to an existing.

A

Structure, removal of the shutters addition of dormers roofing and siding changes as per plans.

A

On file in the planning board department said, property is shown on assessor map 107 as lot.

A

47 lies within character, district 4 in historic districts. So what we have here is.

A

Two requests for rehearings and essentially what we're looking at is. If you feel that there is.

A

A mistake in our decision as far as the nuts and bolts of it go, um it's not whether your opinion of.

A

Of one particular item um you like or whatever we're looking at the meeting, our.

A

Criticism of our own meeting so to speak and with that said, I'd if there's any discussion.

A

Everyone is familiar with that. I know I don't have any regrets or secondary thoughts. So the question.

B

Is whether anything has been done unlawfully, which is either procedurally or subjective.

B

Or more general than that, whether the outcome was unreasonable. Just to add to what john was saying.

B

Yeah and it's a little a little less clear what unreasonable might mean it's in the eye of the.

B

Viewer but I think it's the outcome based on the evidence that was submitted, presented.

B

In the testimony given was your conclusion using your own regulations, unreasonable.

B

Based on that evidence, I think those are the two standards you want to look at and if you answer.

B

Yes to either one of those or both, then you would be voting to re-hear this at a subsequent meeting.

B

There's no presentation tonight from either party the applicant or the the moving party here seeking.

B

A request for rehearing so you're reviewing that written correspondence from mr sobel.

B

uh Valerie and jonathan, and determining from your either review of the record or your memory.

B

Of the application, whether something unlawful or unreasonable, occurred as uh alleged it's in the.

B

Complaint from the sobels that um you know there were certain deficiencies in their mind.

B

In your decision making and your review process that led the commission to an outcome of approving.

B

The project- okay, thank you! That's a nuts and bolts. May I ask him: is there a particular uh example.

H

Of where we failed to properly hear this well, if you read the letter well, can it be stated outlet.

H

Well, I I I can, I can try and summarize the allegation uh as to what was unreasonable. I guess.

B

Whether not less so unlawful, but it doesn't matter either either of those is a trigger.

B

Not wanting to speak for jonathan and valerie, certainly I'm just using their correspondence.

B

I think they felt like the information submitted was incomplete, an example they.

B

Offer of that was the lack of a property survey that clearly documented what was presented to you.

B

Was correct, which is uh the question was raised by, I believe, the sobels in the public hearing.

B

Process that the extension of the rear edition, the previous edition was going to crowd and.

B

Create issues of visibility or encroachment on the chief street right away and the applicant in my.

B

Recollection made it clear to the commission and the audience that the expansion was an additional.

B

Three feet on the back of the existing building and that there would be approximately three feet.

B

Left between that building wall and the edge of the right-of-way so uh currently, today, they're.

B

Six feet approximately between the back wall and the edge of the right-of-way they'll be three feet.

B

The the zoning code, as we discussed at the meeting, does not require any setback.

B

It's a front: the building has two fronts, a chief street front, even though it's perceived.

B

As the back of the house back a building, it's a front, there is no setback. I did look at the 96.

B

Survey which was referenced in the meeting as the controlling document, and in fact there is.

B

A six-foot setback and approximately a three-foot setback from the approved plan. If you haven't lost.

B

Anybody that's an example uh that I think was was aired in general. The massing of that girl, so the.

B

Ma, I think, that's a secondary issue. The massing and scale of the of the garage was questioned.

B

As to whether it was subordinate enough to the historic structure and there's some suggestion,.

B

That, when this was reviewed, 11 or 12 years ago, in the previous approval, when the addition was.

B

Perhaps added perhaps it was earlier than that, I'm not the expert on the history of the property.

B

But that the the scale of massing was a really important aspect. The commission, in this person's.

B

Mind may have gotten better or more right than you guys did adding a little more volume to the back.

B

uh Again, just trying to what about this double jeopardy stuff. Well, okay, then- and I have on my.

B

List the uh there's a suggestion: the elevations were either incomplete or inaccurate, or just in.

B

Not enough information on the four sides of the building.

B

I think the submission speaks for itself in respect to uh those elevations they're.

B

Pretty well detailed again, I'm not advocating one way or the other, I'm just telling you what the.

B

Review of the record seems to represent in respect to the elevations.

B

There's a very detailed elevation of all four sides. I think any of you that were here know that.

B

um And then the last last thing I saw jump out from the letter. That's on the screen was that.

B

The suggestions being made that the 2011, if that's the correct year, the previous decision that put.

B

The decorative window, uh hoods or lintels um and put the addition on the back of the building was.

B

Somehow, a permanent fixture that would encumber the current hdc's ability to deviate from that.

B

Decision back in 2011.- and I think you can come to your own conclusion on whether things can adjust.

B

And the fact that that was raised uh at several points in the review process is is not unimportant.

B

And uh john, in fact, I think was here when the last one was approved and asked me to go back and pull.

B

It out and show him and others the uh you know the the application and the approval so that that's.

B

Some examples again, I'm not going to say it's all inclusive, but I think those are the high points.

B

Of what mr and mrs sobel are uh suggesting good, I'm glad you throwed all that out. I you know I.

H

Feel like we were just going to jump into this cold, and I I would just say that we don't look.

H

At precedent we just don't, I never have I'm not sure we're required to. I don't see it in our.

H

I don't see it as a requirement. We judge it based on what is presented to us.

H

In at this time, so um it's not like we're the supreme court and we're looking at.

H

You know case law and what went down before, and it just doesn't work that way now, if, if an applicant.

H

Misrepresented drawings, you know, scale drawings, maybe took liberties with with the the scale of.

H

The drawings of the presentation of the drawings and things like that, that's a whole different.

H

uh Accusation it could have been an error it could have been. You know we look at renderings.

H

Renderings do not have a an accurate. uh You know there there's some artistic license involved so.

H

I'm not I'm not comfortable with the notion that.

H

We're being asked whether we really meant what we meant when we came down with the decision, we did.

H

I'm comfortable with the decision we made and I'll I'll be voting to.

H

Not have a re-hearing, so just two quick follow-ups to what martin said. I think in respect.

B

To precedent, you may not be obligated to look at it, but I think in fairness to yourselves, you did.

B

You you, we actually got the files you looked at it. I think it would. The the concern expressed.

B

During the hearing to my eyes as an observer was taken very seriously seriously enough and.

B

There was enough questioning amongst ourselves and the larger community as to whether those.

B

Decorative window things uh were original old were on the building and we we did some research so.

B

I think precedent isn't unimportant: it's a question of whether it overrides uh the.

B

Decision at the end of the day- and I think you did your due diligence from as an observer- I'm not on.

B

The commission, but I think that's worth pointing out it wasn't discounted when it was raised not to.

B

Say you suggested that, but I think in fairness to everybody here you did look at it and look at it.

B

For enough time to be fair- and I think I forgot to mention what's not unimportant- is there are.

B

Two stipulations on that approval, and one of them is that if there is any uh problem with the rear.

B

Yard setback and the survey as presented by the applicant they are required to address that prior.

B

To getting a building permit and they need to come back here if it ends up that they misrepresented.

B

What was told to us orally so there's no way they're getting a building permit to demolish.

B

And replace that without that being confirmed with that survey and that it fits within the.

B

Confines of the code, so you guys put that in as a stipulation to to cover the margins in case.

B

There was some misrepresentation, even if it was unintentional. The second thing on the stipulations.

B

Is the uncertainty which wasn't mentioned by the sobels, but it's important for the public to know.

B

How you deal with uncertainty, we weren't clear at the end how the roofs would come together.

B

Between the abutting two two unit townhouse and this building, because they have a continuous.

B

Plane and obviously the fake slate is going to be a different profile than the than the asphalt roof.

B

So we all recognize that and stipulated that the applicant needs to come back with whatever.

B

Solution they come up with if they're, building a little parapet or they're going to do the whole.

B

Roof in the fall slate, they need to come back. So I'm mentioning that because I think this this.

B

Was given a great deal of attention, it's a very important building and it wasn't an easy decision.

B

For some of the members here as to what to do with some of those 2011 improvements, I'll stop talking.

A

Okay, thank you nick. So has a question, marco, yes, not a question. I was going to make a comment.

D

So it seems to me that there were two major issues: two and a half raised by the by the sobels here.

D

One is setback, and the other is mass and the two kind of go hand in hand in terms of.

D

Where the building sits and the mass that it appears on the streetscape, and I was a.

D

Reluctant approver of this application, because I also had concerns about the mass and the setback.

D

But this is a question of procedure and we did look very carefully at setback and we did look.

D

Very carefully at mass there was a lot of discussion back and forth, so I think the.

D

Concerns were addressed by the committee, they were discussed by the committee, and that is what is.

D

Required of us, um so I I sympathize that that you don't always get what you want and I don't always.

D

Get what I want when, um when I vote yay or nay, um but I do think everything was properly considered.

D

Regarding double jeopardy, um the way I looked at this issue of whether the window should should or.

D

Should not be decorated is that this building had been through a lot of different changes in.

D

The past and when you buy a historic building and you look back at the history and you would.

D

Like to take it back to a different point in time, we're not requiring you to go back to the oldest.

D

Or the second oldest or the third oldest, it is up to the person who owns the building.

D

As to what they would like to do, they simply need to show to us that there's a historic precedent.

D

And there's a reason for it. Just because the new owner style preference is different than.

D

The previous owner doesn't mean that the style they've chosen is not appropriate for the building.

D

That's okay! So I'm going to close this public hearing rehearing! uh It's not a public hearing.

B

It's a request for. Are you hearing? Well, you wrote public hearing right. No, I didn't.

A

Okay, so would somebody like to make a motion about this request for a re-hearing.

F

Can I ask a question before certainly, would it be recommended to make a motion to approve or to deny.

F

Just make them to prove okay, yeah uh I'll, just make a motion to approve the hearing or.

F

Or deny the hearing I'll make a motion to deny everything? Okay, yeah deny that I'm not holding.

A

Here, yeah, okay, so we have a motion on on board for to deny.

A

The public can I ask before we go on with the motion, can I ask what would a re-hearing be a work.

H

Session or a public hearing be a public hearing, a new thing again: yeah the whole whole process.

B

You don't need to do work sessions to do anything before the commission. That's optional, yeah. So if.

B

You re-hear this. They will come back we'll do a new notice, we'll notify our butters.

B

And it'll essentially be a redo. The focus of the discussion can be narrowed, but it's.

B

A redo of the application, there's it's not a modification, it's a new application would miss.

C

Mr uh craic, now, with with the uh conversation, be limited to those issues that the.

C

uh Applicant for the re-hearing- I listen. I don't know that. I know that definitively.

B

But I would probably err in the side of caution, saying no, I think if you're going to rehear it.

B

There's public comment: there's so we're back the plating on the uh kitchen faucets, in other words,.

C

Exactly that's a safe place. I apologize. I don't know the exact answer to that, but I'm going to.

B

Assume that um and if I'm wrong, then there's a narrower scope, I I ask that, because I I I'd like.

C

To think that, I'm in favor of as much transparency or sunlight as possible- and I don't believe.

C

That we aired at all in doing it. I do believe that there's someone that doesn't think we came to.

C

The right conclusion: I don't want to discount mr sobel's comments, because I don't want to say that.

C

He just doesn't, we don't agree and he's calling in this because we don't agree. He believes we miss.

C

Something frankly, I don't and I would be willing to go through the thing again if it held no harm.

C

For anyone, but I don't- I don't know that I want to go through the size of the oculus.

C

And the species of roofing and all of that again but excuse me, but we do have a motion. I'm sorry.

C

Look looking for a second I'm just looking to move this on, I'm looking for a reason to second, sir.

A

I will second the motion, so um we have a motion to deny this re-hearing uh all those in favor.

A

Say aye aye, aye aye, chair bow, tie all those against, so um we don't have a re-hearing. Thank you.

A

Request for rehearing from devon quinn and james butler for property, located at 189 gate.

A

Street mirrorbond family revocable trust owner wherein permission was granted on may 4th 2022.

A

To allow new construction to an existing structure construct new addition to existing garage as per.

A

Plans on file in the planning department said: property is shown on assessor map 103 as lot 6 and.

A

Lies within central residence b in the historic district who is here to present this presentation.

C

Oh, I'm very sorry yeah. Mr chairman, point of order. I'd like to recuse myself from listening as much.

C

As I'm in a butter and I'd recuse myself from the decision in the first place, okay, so um this.

A

Is the same criteria that we have here? We all have um a rather lengthy uh letter from lawyers.

A

Pointing out what they feel that we didn't do or didn't follow on this.

A

So if anybody would like to discuss this or I have a question as one of the newer members.

F

I've noticed it, and I understand why that people who come to this commission don't have to have.

F

Finished with the zoning board or finish with adjustments, they all can happen at the same time,.

F

Which looks like happened last time too, and has happened before on this one, though the.

F

Lawyer points out that it all may be made mute if the zoning board nick well say that again, no.

F

The lawyer says that if the zoning, the zoning board is being questioned too, yes, and if they.

F

Change than our discussions yeah, I think what they're saying is it their appeal currently to.

B

The I think, they're appealing the conditional use permit from the planning board and perhaps.

B

Also, the variance to the board of adjustment. I know that they're headed to superior court.

B

They filed documentations. I can't recall whether it's the planning board and or the.

B

Board of adjustment, but if those variances or the conditional use permit is overturned then yes, this.

B

Would be moot because there wouldn't be a project, but that's not what you're here to judge.

B

Deferment of this, or consideration of that is really irrelevant. I think to.

B

The rehearing request, I think you know trying to paraphrase again. This is a much more complicated.

B

uh Document with eight pages here, um but again, this is our project. The standards are, was it.

B

Unreasonable or unlawful what what you folks came to for a conclusion based on your review criteria,.

B

And the design guidelines- some differences in this case from the last one- is that there's.

B

There's questions being raised about whether the guidelines were adequately followed and.

B

Applied by the hdc as a as a sort of sidebar to that, I think it's important for everybody.

B

To recognize their guidelines, not standards, the guidelines are there to help guide the.

B

Decision, rather than be prescriptive, that there's only one way or two ways to do it.

B

But um that's one of the allegations and that the review criteria wasn't appropriately followed.

B

um There's there's suggestions in here about you know: there's there's no real adus in this.

B

Neighborhood so it doesn't really fit. There aren't many accessory structures.

B

That this, this rear lot of the abundant property is unusually large, I'm not sure. Looking at the.

B

Maps, that's really valid, but that's again, my observation of reading this and looking at some.

B

Of the fairly objective tax maps that are there and looking at the rear yards of the buildings.

B

There's there's plenty in here about light and air and I I think that's.

B

Far more a planning board and a boa issue that somehow this 152 square foot addition.

B

uh To the 300 odd square feet, single single story, single car garage, the existing structure- that's.

B

There that the addition is is having, uh in the in the um neighbors mind a very profound impact.

B

Is the allegation on their lightner and the quality of life in the rear yard? It seemed.

B

To me, what's really objected to here uh is the addition uh unless the whole project, I think.

B

When they talk about alternative strategies at the end of the eight page letter, they talk about.

B

Hey, could you just keep it in this in the same in the building, you've got and not add to it.

B

uh Or could you add it a bigger building to what you've already got, so it seems like the 154.

B

Square foot addition to me to my eyes reading through that was the the biggest uh concern.

B

The planning board did put a restriction on this uh or stipulation and their approval that.

B

I think the neighbors asked for a seven foot fence to go along the property line uh and I.

B

I find that a little odd with light and air that that's somehow going to be less of an impact than.

B

152 square foot addition, but that's just an aside. I got involved with the fence very late.

B

In the decision making process, so it's a pretty big barrier because there's a split rail fence out.

B

There that's pretty invisible now between the two properties and putting a seven foot privacy fence.

B

Down there would create a tremendous amount of shadow on these narrow yards uh and again, I think.

B

The applicant the moving party here asked for it, not the applicant asked for that fence, so I think.

A

It's important to say that the the person that is uh looking for this change they can put up their.

A

Own fence, you know what I mean they can, but that was a stipulation of the planning board at their.

B

Request and the applicant is not uh as far as I know it, the applicant uh agreed to that okay, so.

B

That fence was agreed to by the person trying to do the adu that they would pay for it and put it.

B

In place, I'm just raising it as an interesting juxtaposition to the leighton air argument.

B

uh Given the size and the square footage of that wall, they would know in the future that they.

A

Would have to come in front of us as that fence needs to come in.

B

Both parties know that just to look at that, that's what got me involved because yeah.

B

Yeah, um you know so it's generally inconsistent in their minds with the neighborhood character again.

B

This is rather complicated. In fact, I've been through a few of these re-hearings.

A

And uh requests for rehearings and actual having the rehearings one of them was forced on us.

A

By the zba way, back in the day on lower market street, and that's the way that the.

A

System works is they can ask the zba to overthrow our decision. However, they are also apparently.

A

Taking the zba to court also as well as the zoning board, so there's quite a few pies here that are.

A

Being taken apart, and so I think at this point we might as well just have our vote and.

A

Move on to a public hearing, can I say one more thing that I've done. I mean it seems to.

B

Me at the end of the day, what you really need to focus on is whether the the overall design style.

B

Of the accessory structure and its addition were appropriate for that property. In that context,.

B

And then number two in the for what it's worth column was the addition to the accessory structure.

B

Subordinate to the accessory structure, uh I think those are within your guard rails.

B

Versus a lot of the stuff that's raised that, I think, is more planning board and boa related.

B

But that's just my two cents: yeah okay yeah margot, yes markup. So I agree with what nick has just said.

D

The question is: does the shape and the size and the um style and design of the enlarger.

D

Adu comport, with these other structures on the site and in the neighborhood, and I think we had.

D

Long discussions on that- and I think that that is is true. um The other question raised, which is.

D

And I think they're they've cited here uh maintaining of the building to lot proportions as.

D

Found in adjacent lots um and adapt functionality functionally obsolete buildings for new uses.

D

So looking at the tax maps and the google map, the google earth map of this area.

D

Yes, next to and behind are some very open lots that are unique to that particular neighborhood.

D

But the overwhelming majority of the lots in that neighborhood are not like that. These are outlying.

D

And so the question is, is this particular project should it be prescribed by the two other lots in.

D

The neighborhood, as far as I could tell there, were just two that are similar to it, or should.

D

It be held to or or considered in the light of, the 20 other properties that are around it and I think.

D

The question for me is: did we talk about that and did we have? Did we take that into consideration.

D

If we didn't, if we think we're, I think we were wrong and not doing that, then we, I think we.

D

Should think about a rehearing, but I think if that was uh if that was either part of the discussion.

D

Or people don't feel that the two lots should override the other 20 lots. Then we should not.

F

Okay, anybody else.

F

All right, um so I guess I'll call for another vote the same way. We did the last one.

A

So a guest boat would be to motion fair state yeah. We need the motion right.

F

I'll just make a motion to deny the.

D

A rehearing it all right, um I guess we have had enough discussion. So um all those in favor of.

A

Denying the rehearing say: aye aye aye and against all right, so that rehearing request is denied.

A

So, essentially, with um all of our opponents, we only have two and three left yeah. We got.

B

250 market and let 111 state; okay, all right petition of port owner harbor llc owner for.

A

Property located at 250 market street, wherein permission is requested to allow new construction.

A

To an existing structure, create egress doors off existing conference room and construct a new patio.

A

As per plans on file in the planning department, said, property is shown on assessor map 119, as.

A

Lot 1-1 c lies within character, district 5, downtown overlay and historic districts.

A

Introduce yourself hello good evening: my name is shannon alther from tms architects.

K

And I'm here representing the ownership group, just a quick update as nick gets the drawings.

K

Up on the sheridan hotel was purchased a couple years ago by my client they've been working.

K

With the city and the fire department to make some internal upgrades and one of the things.

K

Kind of just this govid hit- and we didn't really get to it at the time but was to.

K

Work on a couple of egress doors: get this correct, yeah hold it down. I think the circle.

K

There we go so two egress doors right here, based on the there's one. There number two and number one.

K

Based on the existing facade, what we would like to do is create these two new doors.

K

In the same material and color white of the existing storefront glass system, that's there.

K

We would require removing a little bit of the brick so that we can actually put in the door.

K

The building needs code, but it was an older building and the design basically passes. One.

K

Of the second means of egress through a stairway, we try not to do that in the newer code versions.

K

So adding these two doors would help satisfy that egress component as well.

K

As make the spaces a lot more amenable in terms of people coming in and out from the building.

K

So that's what our request is: we're not changing the style or the context of the building. I'm just.

K

Adding asking to add these two new doors, and then we have a patio area just so that we can treat.

K

That space as a public, basically space or right public gathering space in the event of emergency.

K

The ownership group, but also talked about using that space for gatherings, but we hadn't programmed.

K

That yet first it was to see if we could get the two egress doors put in per year. Group.

D

I'm sorry, I'm a little fuzzy on exactly what the doors look like.

K

Okay, it's okay! If I go a little closer to the screen.

B

uh Take the mic: if you're gonna speak over there, and is this still okay, it works yep all right.

K

So the this is the inside of one of the rooms and basically there's a storefront glass system.

K

And what we would be doing is basically taking out a portion of that to create the door and the new.

K

Door itself, the egress door three feet wide: six or seven feet, six foot, eight or seven feet high would.

K

Be of the same material um metal, white metal as the storefront, so basically we'd be kind of.

K

Cutting a little bit of the brick away to put in that new door. Is that, oh, so it's metal and glass.

D

Correct yeah, the existing window system- this is another window here um right here. Basically, is the.

K

Same product and material we're just putting a door um in place of a window. That's there.

C

So when you, you can't cut the glass to fit in to fit the door in, so you can actually take down the.

C

Metal frames of the that make up the storefront and put in new pieces that will become the jams of.

C

The door yes and those new jam pieces will match what's there and it's actually within a couple of.

K

Inches of space in terms of taking out the glass panel and then putting in the new door system.

C

And because the current windows are on a brick sill above the floor level, you're going to cut a.

C

Notch down through the brickwork and insert a new threshold lower than the bottom of the current.

C

Window location, that is correct and the door isn't as tall as the existing window opening and.

C

So you'll be putting a new sort of header frame across at the top of the door opening. I think.

K

We can actually get that new header frame of the door to line up with one of the existing mullions.

K

That are already up at the top here, so it may be. You know a seven foot, two or seven foot three.

K

High door wouldn't be a standard door, but we use it to fit in now, just off the top of your head.

C

Can you discuss how the door will look different than the storefront, the mullions of the storefront.

C

Are two inch and the door will have styles on it? That were our four inch? Will there be crash bars.

C

And sirens and handles and yep good questions. The existing storefront width is about two and.

K

A half to two and three quarters in terms of its style or rail, thickness or width, we'll try.

K

To match that with the door, which I think we can do, may have to be a half of an inch bigger.

K

There will be a panic bar on the inside, but we'll try to paint the kind of outward facing.

K

Edge of it black, so it kind of blends in with a glass plane or a color that matches the glass.

K

And then obviously, we'd have some sort of signage on the outs or the inside of the door. Saying exit.

K

For emergency access, there'd be some handle hardware associated with the door as well.

D

What is the material for the new patio right now? We had it's set up as either a brick paver.

K

Or a pervious paver, you know some sort of a kind of a modular uh brick element and.

D

uh Is there an elevation change where you need to put some steps or railings down.

K

The goal is that when we come out of those two egress doors to have that as a handicap,.

K

Threshold or access pad there so that way, anybody coming out of those two rooms.

K

Would come out at basically at the same surface level as the interior floor level.

K

Okay, so there'll be a threshold there, but our goal is to basically have an even transition. Okay,.

D

Do we need to have I'm sorry, martin go ahead, you sure go ahead finish. I just.

D

Says do we do we need to have a sample of the actual patio materials? Is that in our purview.

B

Not really, but it depends on the height whether there's railings and steps and yeah martin. I would.

H

Just say I I can totally support these egress stores and I can see them. I just I think we just.

H

Should have cut sheets to for final approval as a stipulation yeah see what it really looks like.

A

um I would just like to say the only thing I'm concerned about would be um a railing around.

A

This patio, why? Because it's perched on top of a cliff and it's I mean it's a relatively dangerous.

A

Place up there and if somebody is out there from a high school reunion or something like that,.

A

Goes out to have a cigarette, you know it's just an odd place and I think they're going to end up.

A

With a railing but they're not asking for a railing yep, um I would agree with you chair.

F

It looks like on the sides, especially where it starts the the highest point of the.

F

Walkway would probably, if you fell towards the river yeah you're, going to do a somersault.

F

You're going to go over the rocks, you're going to remember some assault and then you're going to be in the middle of the street middle of the market. You might even be in the other train um but yeah.

F

I would agree with those stipulations, though it sound, like you know what you're talking about.

A

Okay, would anybody in the public like to speak about this sheridan improvement.

A

And there's nobody online.

A

No, no I'll just close the public hearing and look for a motion.

H

Motion to approve, as submitted with the stipulation that a cut sheet of the final door.

H

And and surrounding panels be presented uh so elevations of those.

H

New entrance systems I'll be part of the uh be part of the submission you want it as an admin.

F

Approval or you or you, it could be an admin approval, I'm asking I'll. Second, that motion.

D

All righty, do you want findings of fact? Certainly um it is uh preserves the integrity.

H

Of the district and is consistent with the special and defining character of surrounding properties,.

H

Very good, all right, all those in favor aye against all righty. You have your approval.

K

Great. Thank you very much. You're welcome.

A

Okay, the petition of coventry realty llc owner for property located at 111 state street.

A

Wherein permission is requested to allow renovations to an existing structure.

A

Replace the doors and windows and new construction to an existing structure.

A

Construct a rear addition, as per plans on file in the planning department, said, property is shown on.

A

Assessor map 107 as lot 50 and lies within character, district 4 and historic district.

A

Please introduce yourself again good evening: tracy kozak architecture, our coup, architects,.

J

Here, on behalf of the application coventry realty, um thank you for having us back. We had.

J

Some work sessions and made a few little changes and added some more details.

J

I do have a color version of the renderings that are in the packet same.

J

View I know color is not in your purview, but if you'd like to see them, I can hear them.

J

Existing building was recently repainted and that reflects the color. So uh with that going through.

J

Our document's just a reminder of the scope: we are adding an infill to the rear courtyard, where there.

J

Is a wooden deck and wooden fire escape that will be removed and replaced with an elevator and a.

J

Fire stair: this is being done for code life, safety purposes, per request of the portsmouth inspections.

J

Department, they will not give an occupancy permit building until there is a code-compliant egress.

J

Stair interrupt sure, because we were passing this thing around. I missed the last minute.

A

You're rolling right along, I uh absolutely I said that they painted the building blue recently, a few.

J

Days ago, so this rendering shows the new paint color on the corner of chapel and state street.

J

And just to reiterate, the scope of the project is an infill addition on the rear, where there's.

J

Currently, a courtyard there's, a wooden deck and wooden stairway there that will be removed.

J

And replaced with an elevator and a fire stair, this is being done in order to get a occupancy.

J

Permit for the inspections department, it's a requirement of life safety to occupy the building.

J

So that's pretty much the scope. uh We made a few changes.

J

And added some more details since last time, we're happy to walk you through that.

J

uh Assisting existing existing for reference, we have all the existing.

J

um You can see on this drawing the uh whoops yep right back there. That's the stair! That's.

J

Coming down and that's the area where the new uh fire, stair and elevator will go we're adding.

J

Some three new dormers too, which show yup two on chapel street, one on state street.

J

And that is the new roof plan, so the info edition in the middle yep and the three new dormers.

J

This is the state street elevation. We took your comments to heart last time on the storefront.

J

First floor, facade of the corner building we had previously shown replacing the two windows.

J

In one door with a two sets of nanowalls, we have reduced the size of those nanowalls and.

J

Maintained the central door to reinforce that corner building as its own independent building.

J

We've kept that door, it we're replacing the door. That's there now is kind of trashed.

J

And but we are replacing it with the same size, it will have glass on the top and solid panel below.

J

And then flanking that on either side are wooden, nano windows to match the ones on the building.

J

Next door, just smaller, as I mentioned last time, the upper floor windows would be replaced.

J

There are cut sheets in the back of your packet, we are proposing an all wood pellet.

J

The roofing would be replaced with an app discuss. Those top windows. Pardon me: can you.

A

Discuss those windows- yes, they're uh pella, um architect, series, traditional, all wood.

A

So normally we're talking in the third floor right. uh This is the second and third floor.

J

Of the existing building right normally, the third floor would be six over ones.

A

Six over three excuse me, I'm very sorry, six over three.

A

With that, with that bottom sash moving up and down, so you probably have to have some sort of egress.

F

Are these new windows or matching that.

B

Those are casement windows number one. We are showing those as casement.

J

um But we have we'd be happy to do a three over six or six six over three six over three.

A

The building will be fully sprinklered, so we are not required to use those as an egress.

A

So are these going to be.

A

Double hung or single hung windows with that traditional muntin pattern, or are they a double.

J

Hung on the second floor in the first floor of chapel street and the top floors are shown as.

J

Casements they're casements yep, so you're going to turn those into six over three casements. Oh.

J

Right now it's a nine light, yeah sash. So if, if it is preferred, we can certainly make that a six over.

J

Three, yes, I think you can sure, and if you did that, would it make more sense to be double-hung.

J

Oh right, yeah just making sure and with that, what what's the does that? What's.

B

Going on in the dormers, is that good as a nine light, or should it be the same.

B

In those four dormers, oh, you have them only again.

A

What you found again, don't worry, not those two, I'm still on the on the screen. Oh.

B

Are there nine lights in the existing three dormers.

J

I do have a photo yeah there's a photo in here. It is a nine light, but it is a six over three.

B

So you, presumably you do the same thing yeah, because you match that that's a good idea! Yep.

A

Okay, so we're just going to stipulate that that is a six over three traditional double.

A

Double hung: wood window I'd be happy to do that. Okay,.

A

And it continues around, I noticed um through what is that string, chapel street chapel street? Yes,.

J

On the next sheet, sorry, I'm trying to write.

J

Two dormers on the top and the same thing those are shown.

J

Currently, as nine light casements, we would change those to a six over three double hung.

J

The dormers and the bottoms are replaced with the same style and size. Those are double hungs.

J

The current door has a solid board storm door on it, which we would like to.

J

Replace with this four panel door and the upper two panels would be glass and.

J

The bottom would be solid that is similar to how the front door on state street is treated.

J

And you can see that also on the next door, building where agave was and seoul was.

J

And I think the rosa has it across the street too, and the new stairway addition. That's in the.

J

Background is on the far right of that drawing you can see the elevator overrun in the distance.

J

The three-dimensional views show that you can't really see that from the street, but in the two.

J

Dimensions there it is tracy. Are these openings the way they are today? That is where they are now.

J

It's not a symmetric facade, you think it is until you actually look at it.

D

So tracy, I'm sorry the front door now has the four transom lights across and then the.

D

Wonderful old-fashioned, solid storm door right and you're suggesting getting rid of that.

D

Completely leaving the four lights up, top the transom lights up top would stay and.

J

The door being replaced just to get a little more natural light in the space.

J

Instead of the solid storm door, so it's a wooden door with it's a four panel wooden style and.

J

Rail door, the two upper panels are glass and there's a picture of that on the very back page.

J

A similar example of how that's done, and also it's on some of the existing buildings next door.

A

Anybody else have some questions comments, mr chairman, thank you very much for the opportunity.

C

um Looking at the handout that you've given us, the chapel street windows do not appear to have.

C

Any casings, yes, um there are some discrepancies between the elevation details and the renderings.

J

The two dimensional drawings in your packet prevail. There is casing trim on every window.

J

uh Those all those trim pieces are dimensioned in your packet on the elevations, and that is exactly.

C

The handle is just a rendering it's just a rendering, uh don't take it too, literally more the.

B

Color and then it's more more to show color and color, which is something that's not in our purview.

H

Clever uh uh on the chapels on the chapel street side of the building, but uh on the.

C

Chapel street yeah uh there's a side door into uh the thing with the shed dormer on it. The.

C

Piece with the shed dormer there we go, the door has a hood over it. The hood seems like it's.

C

You know I know like like it's: it's insufficient disappeared. I know I agree.

J

It was bigger, it was a big porch last time and ideally it would be bigger.

J

But we are limited in uh percent coverage of lot, otherwise we get kicked into a variance.

J

Requirement so that is the maximum size we can do without needing variance maximum size of what.

J

The hood canopy over the um that's just not enough the awning, so it's it's.

J

I believe four feet wide and six out two feet, which is the maximum allowed, as uh an exception.

B

To what coverage to coverage right, um there's an exception for awnings for life.

B

Here, yeah I'd love to look at that. But are you opposed to that being a little more.

B

Traditionally, designed than that, we would love for it to be bigger, but we felt we couldn't.

J

Without a variance, it just looks really is there? Is there a reason it has to be covered.

J

uh It's it's simply there to help keep snow away from this outswinging door, which is fire egress.

J

So you don't want to have snow banks blocking your door when people need to leave.

A

But is the door used it's a fire fire door yeah? Hopefully it's not used.

J

It needs to be operable and maintained as an egress.

C

um I I I did not have the pleasure of attending the last work session uh and so uh the side.

C

Of the building, the wooden building on chapel street is currently collaborated.

C

The rendering, once again, I'm sorry to do this. It looks like it's, of course, for shingle. That's just.

C

A rendering issue um the clockwork stay, we're not resigning it thank you. uh That will be therefore.

C

You're setting up a pattern of the cloudboard extending across all of these surfaces, correct.

C

One more possible: this is: this- may be the silliest question of all.

C

If you look at the old federal brick building from the street.

C

State street and trot a little bit to the left, like you're in front of the agave building and.

C

Look up this little teeny triangle of the side, wall of the brick building.

C

That, oh, it sits over the sloped roof of the building, agave being shorter than the three-story.

C

Brick building and in that space that triangle there's a piece of glass, is that going to remain.

I

I did not, I did not. I've been in awe of whoever did do it, but because I don't know how it works.

C

It just sits there: how do they flash it? huh Hi members of the planning board mark mcnabb.

L

um That window, what? Oh sorry, they're, not the planning board htc um that window that got added.

L

There, somewhere um I'd, prefer to do away with it um then to replace it. It would have to be replaced.

L

Because it's not insulated and it's not properly installed, but I don't I don't like it there so.

C

Just because you're right there, I want to ask you the next kind of led yourself into this question.

C

But sure what will you replace it with? Is it wood on that side like or is it like, like kind whatever.

L

The field is, if it's brick there, I would do brick real quick. I've always assumed that it was the.

C

Brick party wall between the two buildings it is, it is brick and- and I would replace it with brick.

L

But the representation would be whatever that field is there, which it is brick would be replaced.

L

With that well, thank you and also that awning in the back. You know it. It got highly technical. This.

L

Edition is permitted by a certain section of the code. That's rarely used. um That's this.

L

Section 10.323, which allows, in addition, if it's code related and the building department, has to.

L

Sign off and the fire department has to sign off and um everything's non-conforming unlock coverage.

L

And they they just have this section that those awnings can't be that design that we.

L

Originally had it can't, it can't be any bigger than that. I am okay in this instance. If the.

L

Htc, not the planning board. If the htc prefers to see that go away over that door, I'm willing.

L

To eliminate that it just doesn't look right, I'm here yeah, I I'm struggling with it myself. I tend.

L

To rather not have it than have it that way, but it is definitely caught in any bigger than that.

L

Needs a variance all right. My one more question: I don't care which of you feel that chances are.

C

You're involved in this, if you don't mind, uh mr chairman, uh on the front facade you're, proposing.

C

To take this uh simulated, brick or simulated stone off and the assumption my assumption now for.

C

55 years um has been that something horrible happened to the front of that building the.

C

Process of changing the original windows and doors and some terrible piece of steel.

C

Was put in over that and that material that stone material covers all that over and has.

C

Handsomely for some time um you are going to inherit the whirlwind here when you pull that down.

C

uh Suggestion, just from uh you know, a guy down the street is be prepared to have some brick.

C

To uh put back in that location because it's going to be wanting, but my question.

C

uh Having to do that very thing is: did you did you spend a lot of time thinking about.

C

The interpreter interpretation of that first floor because I I walked the street. I stumble.

C

And hobble down the street and there's a majority, I think I think, I'm safe to say a majority.

C

Of this period, brick building on this section of the street have arched doors openings and they.

C

Not only did they have arched door openings, but the windows that flank them.

C

Sometimes two on one side, sometimes one on each side, but the windows that flank.

C

Them all seem to line up very rigidly with the windows on the second and third floors.

C

Now I know over time the storefront industry has expanded that and telling people that.

C

They need more glass and whatnot, but this seems like a kind of two-phase heavy-handed.

C

For a small building to put these two heavy window units in there and, along with that to.

C

Have a rectilinear door opening when so many of the other buildings are have arched doors.

C

So my question is: how did you get here and and is it worth rethinking? um I appreciate.

L

The question- and I you know it's it's funny- I'm chuckling because yeah, you probably remember, but.

L

uh You were on the commission when we did the agave and I voted against it. I am aware of that.

C

And um the only difference on the agave is the two flanking windows extreme right and extreme left.

C

Of that quad unit that you put in line up with the windows on the floor above the the the thing.

L

On this building on the 107 state street section the section that there used to be a door for the.

L

Red door upstairs, which was chunked in there and didn't line with anything and then the center.

L

Door that we have and the hodgepodge of windows now and then the cementus product that they have.

L

On the outside it, it is so been so destroyed over the years. We're trying to pick a vocabulary that.

L

Matches the combining of these two buildings and the storefront and the modernness of what.

L

What seems to be um not seems to be is is very popular, which is being able to bring the.

L

Outside in being able to have windows that open um you know at the time, agave was, I think one.

L

Of the first ones, if not the first one on these uh nano windows, you know and since.

L

There's been quite a few, you know, rosa building is quite historic and I've. Nano.

L

Windows on those, so my answer to your question is: we believe what we're doing to the storefront.

L

Dramatically improves what has been uh destroyed on that storefront, but to try to return it to.

L

Vocabulary the upper floors: when it's not there today, um we we think it it's it's.

L

Right to do what we're doing with it um and modernize it and and um but yet something more.

L

You know better than what it is today um so.

L

I think the scale of it works, I think the scale of it with the agave.

L

Nanowall windows work, I think, they're quite successful. I think they look quite nice.

L

The mahogany windows that we built on those would be the same quality here and that's.

L

What restaurants want they want to be able to open that and bring the fresh air in. So I do know what.

L

You're saying and I and I do appreciate- I don't disagree, I'm just it's just. I think I think the.

L

Design we've picked here is appropriate for the for the building. Thank you very much. Anybody else.

I

I just have a question about the about that center door and and going back to what dave was.

D

Saying about the the circle top doors, is there any consideration, or did you consider putting.

D

um A circle top on that uh we hadn't just because we're trying to fit in the existing opening. That's.

J

There, which has a transom, but I think a arch top- could be kind of cool, um just sort of break up the.

J

Rectilinear frontage yeah, but one thing I do want to point out is the alignment of the nanowalls and.

J

We have mirrored those symmetrically around the center door, which is in its current location, but.

J

As mr adams pointed out, they they don't necessarily align with the windows above.

J

It's not exactly a symmetrical facade, so um we could look at scooching them further away from.

J

That center door to give- and this would actually make sense practically from a construction point.

J

To have a little bit more brick between the door and the window right now, it's only one brick wide.

J

Which is kind of odd, but perhaps we move it over another brick to give that door more.

J

Breathing room, I think those are both really good suggestions um that would get a little closer to.

L

The symmetry that that dave was looking for and I think the arch over the door would be interesting.

L

We fully know that when we pull the cementus stuff up, we have to rebuild that that facade with brick.

L

So, as far as I'm concerned, you know it's an opportunity and a missed opportunity to not.

L

Put a shape if, if the commission prefers in our store, you all know my buildings, I love arches.

L

um So I'm I'm happy to do that and I'm happy if, if emotion wanted to consider that that store front.

L

um And the archdoor comes back for a um you know, a separate.

L

A separate administrative approval, administrative approval that I'm acceptable to that yeah.

B

While you're on that topic, unless is there more to say about the our store.

B

Yeah you know I just looked at the zoning code and I wasn't involved with the previous.

B

Determination about the two feet, the four feet, and I can see where that came from.

B

In coverage- but I would argue, this is more of a roof structure than an awning or a bay or a the.

B

Three examples: a balcony which are limited to the two feet and the four feet in width.

B

You can get 30 inches, which is a big difference over two feet, even though it would be better to.

B

Be more, it seems to me: roofs are allowed to overhang, which this is a roof over a door. 30.

B

Inches off the face of the wall, so yeah, I'm only throwing that out there, so you can consider it. I.

B

Think, with some better brackets and 30 inches, you might be happier with the work with the product.

B

And I think it won't trigger any coverage in boa review, but I can talk to the others that anyway,.

B

Food for thought is this another stipulation, or I think, if you're going to come back with the.

A

Arched opening you could come back with that if, in fact, I'm right, if I'm wrong, you won't.

B

Unless people disagree with it, I mean it's really, you guys. No, that makes sense. So uh all of the.

A

Wooden structures are all um the uh building on chapel street and everything is clapboards. Four.

A

Inches on center wood, correct right and the trim is essentially the same as what is there wood? Yes,.

D

I would just like to be sure we um at least acknowledge that this is protruding more.

D

On to stay on dashif street, it is taking up more space than it did before. I don't.

D

Personally, have a problem with it, but it does put more mass onto sheep street.

H

Oh martin, hey um yeah. I would agree with that. One brick, wife between the door and the window is.

H

Is probably awkward and not appropriate, and you would never see it that way.

H

I'm surprised we're kind of not that's. Formstone. That's been, I grew up with.

H

The garbage um that it's not historically protected anymore, since it's got such a lineage.

H

But anyway, I I think they probably put it on, because people thought it was great stuff.

H

And an uncle clattered his whole beautiful wood, clapboard house in it um because he didn't want.

H

To paint it anymore, so if, if you can't get it off, I bet you you may find the brick is fine. It's.

H

You know restorable but, like you said it's been butchered, it's been it's swiss cheese right now.

H

uh That little door we're talking about yeah, I I would like to see something over that door. I'd.

H

Like to see that um presented at is almost its own little, um you know frontage to the to chapel.

H

Street and not just a little side door, um you'll, probably put dumpsters in front, though won't you.

J

More like a no no monsters, okay, so it would be nice if it had a presence that it was almost.

H

Like its own little separate entrance that that would definitely help you know, keep the rain.

J

uh Off of people using the door, so I I would be for something even if it's just a a cap over.

H

That door to give it some sort of formality. All in all, I think it's a wonderful project.

H

You know, I I think everything you're doing is terrific and uh you're, making a safer building.

H

You're cleaning up that shape straight side of it, and I you know, I think this I can support that.

A

All righty anybody else so is there. Anybody in the public would like to speak about this project.

A

Is there anybody out in outer space, maybe.

B

Nobody's raising their hands a couple people watching, but okay.

A

That's good, no hands all right. I'm going to close the uh public hearing.

B

Oh wait, there's a hand up, there's a hand. Yep mary lou go ahead. I'm reopening wall is in the.

F

Air mary lou, can you hear me? Oh you're muted good go ahead, I'm unmuted! Now I think you are.

D

Okay, hi mary lou mckelway 259 south street just wanted to comment on the back of this.

D

Building on the shae street side, there is a bulkhead, or at least there was a bulkhead.

D

On the uh chapel street end, and also this is where dumpsters have been in the past for.

D

Other restaurants that have been here so I just wanted you to pick up on those two comments. Please.

D

L

Would you like me to address that? I think so, because these buildings have been combined.

L

um We're doing away with all the dumpsters on that side and they're, using the only dumpster corral.

L

We have, which is the mahogany one right behind agave, so there will be no dumpsters there and the.

L

Bulkhead gets removed because this code complying edition brings a stair tower to the basement.

L

So it gets replaced with a code compliant stair tower, which a bulkhead is not an approved means.

L

Of egress so we're removing it because we don't, like the looks of it yeah. Thank you.

B

Anything else, mary lou, that's it! Thank you. Thank you. Okay,.

B

um Let me just confirm: there's nobody else.

B

There there is not okay, I'm going to close this public hearing and look for a motion.

B

With stipulation with stipulations that nick will read after the motion.

H

I'd like to make a motion to approve.

H

With nick listing the stipulations as yeah, I may not have them all, but that the third floor.

B

Windows shall be a six over three double hung wood window as presented.

B

Tonight uh this is no particular order that the the roof canopy or whatever we call it.

B

Over that rear, chapel street door um can be modified if allowed by code uh and resubmitted.

B

For administrative approval, the arch door, you're gonna, have to help me on this one.

B

An arch door for the main entryway on on uh state street right, but it's an excellent.

B

Okay, yeah: well, it's a door uh it'll be designed and resubmitted for administrative approval.

B

That's the kind of job the windows are going to be. There help me out, keep going.

B

And the window's wet further apart from the door, the windows shall be okay,.

G

More than one brick away from the door just include that all the door, the door.

B

Windows as one admin approval together, yep okay got it anything else.

F

Four: what about your removal? What about that little window, but it's not drawn at all, but he.

C

Said he's going to remove it, it's non-compliant now yeah. I think he's going to be forced to do.

C

It so it hardly matters, so it's not in the drawing. We don't need to stipulate it. I don't think it's.

B

Implied it'll be removed and replaced with what whatever is around it. Yeah brick.

F

Apparently, yeah yeah. Second, all right, we have a second um it. uh I will give you findings.

H

Officially, it deserves the integrity, uh maintains the special character of the district and.

H

Is consistent with the special and defining character of the surrounding property, very good.

A

All right, um if there's no other discussion, I will say all those that are in favor of this say: aye.

A

And uh against, do you have your approval.

A

You're welcome making this a safe building, don't go very far.

A

I don't think we have any other business.

F

Isn't there one more? No, that's it. I think we have one in congress. No, that was it. They got postponed.

F

I don't know what to do.

F