City of Punta Gorda 2022 Burnt Store Isles Canal Advisory Committee, 12 Apr 2022

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From YouTube: Burnt Store Isles Canal Advisory Committee 04-12-2022

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Burnt Store Isles Canal Advisory Committee 04-12-2022

A

B

So are there finished plans for this now? Have they decided what they're going to do.

C

So now what they're going to do now that we've got people moved out, they're going to come in so that end down? There is gonna, stay historic, they gotta start doing some probing and seeing what kind of materials and all that good stuff. So they can put it back to historic and then they're still working on this. You know, what's gonna.

B

Are they guessing this to be a two-year three-year project.

C

I think the average.

C

C

You know we're experiencing things now that we've never experienced before with the supply.

B

They just finished a house down the street for me and I think I think it took every bit of two years to build.

D

Bernster house yeah yeah on uh madrid, okay, yeah yeah they're, taking forever yeah.

B

And I got a friend who's building a house, he said windows, they said we're nine months and he's he's a year out right now,.

A

B

They don't have an answer for him. Yeah.

D

I talked to our builder uh six months ago and he says they're telling people to two years playing on two years. If we.

C

Get done earlier, you know.

D

Great but don't count on yeah that took.

E

A year year.

D

To build ours for 13.

F

I found a spot like I gotta, go like a certain way and it'll all of a sudden go on, so that might be okay.

B

All right we ready to get going here.

B

Okay, so we call this meeting to order um kathy. Could you please do the roll call.

F

A

Rick daughtry, okay, shawn harrigan; yes,.

B

A

Ian milne here dave perkins mike petrov here.

B

All right can we all please stand for the pledge of allegiance.

A

Agents to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands. One nation, under god, indivisible with liberty and justice for all.

B

uh I'm assuming we don't have any announcements. uh The next meeting is going to be. May 16th is everybody available for that looks like we've got everybody all right. Approval of minutes.

G

I move, we approve the minutes as published, wait a second.

B

Okay, so ian is approved and mike has seconded uh that, and we go now to the finance reports for march of 22..

G

We have to vote on approving the minutes.

A

Yes, you have to vote on.

G

B

Sorry, all in favor all right, hi.

A

Okay, good afternoon kathy miller canal maintenance in your agenda, packets was this month's finance reports. Were there any questions or concerns.

A

Okay, none being said we'll move on to the next item budget utilization report.

A

Any questions or concerns with that.

A

I do want to share with you. Mangrove is um scheduled to be done. Mangrove trimming is scheduled to be done in may, and inlet dredging is scheduled to be done in june. So that's why those funds have not been spent.

B

And the inland trenches kathy is going to be where.

A

And um so typically, we have siltation over there by mayer's cut and a little bit south of that I call it the lagoon, so those two areas is where we typically silt in we'll go and do a sonar reading to see if there are any other high spots. But typically those are the two areas that we target, because we have a constant flushing yeah right there yeah.

D

Kathy? What's the depth that they try to achieve when they do that negative.

A

Six mean low water.

A

Okay, moving on the seawall replacement status report, it's a little slow going right now. I just wanted to let you guys know that our contractor is having a hard time scheduling, concrete concrete's in big demand right now, getting a hold of some sod. Now that rainy season is coming upon us, we're hoping that saddles start looking a little bit better. I just refuse to put anything brown on the ground.

A

You know people get pretty upset with me. So so sorry.

H

I had a frost issue too: didn't they whether they killed it.

C

A

So it's slow going, but we're still we're still on it.

A

Okay, next item on the agenda is the permits authorized by city staff.

A

Looks like we have eight nine permits that were issued any questions or concerns with those.

C

Okay, thank you so much.

E

Thank you for the record gary edition um on our capital improvement status report. Not much has changed since last time. Any any questions on that.

E

And then on the master permanent agreement status report, any questions on any of those we're still moving forward through the agencies, with our permitting.

B

That's crazy, okay, so I have one question on permanent. Perhaps this is the wrong person to ask it to carry, but you know if we move forward with the rip-rap permit in in canal, I'm confused- or I don't remember part of that originally, I believe, was supposed to be funded by way of fema.

E

Correct they haven't given us a definitive that we will have funding at this point, we're still hanging our hat on the fact that we've got that fema funding in line coming our way, um but we don't yet know because they won't give us a definitive until we give them a permit. So, okay.

B

And is that it like 85, or is that 100 that.

E

Was 100, I think it was like six million dollars or something like that: six or eight million dollars? Okay, if I recall correctly, no no.

F

Kristen close it'll be 95 total, it's um percent from the federal five percent from the state. Five percent from the fund.

C

E

And their match was that 68 million mark.

F

Yes, so the the match was about 7 million, um but that was for both pgi and bsi. So only a portion is for the bsi is shown in your your fund data.

B

F

Yep, thank you.

B

Any other questions on.

B

Move on to the 2022 operating budget.

F

Good afternoon kristen simeone finance director this is to get our conversation started and get some direction on the fiscal year. 2023- and I should have said this- is fiscally a 2023 budget workshop. um It starts in 2022, but it's for the fiscal year 2023 budget, I'm so sorry about that.

F

Let's see and get this slideshow going.

F

So first I want to give you a history of the assessments. um As you know, when you had the rim canal dredging project um that occurred in the 2017 time frame, there was the additional assessment for that and then it went through 2020. So we were able to cut it off a little sooner just because we had additional savings, and so we were able to pay that debt off um quicker than expected in 2020..

F

Then in 2021 we went back to just the regular operating assessment of 460 and last year, based on the seawall study.

F

The board and council did agree to increase it. The 100 assessment wasn't necessarily what the study recommended, but that was um what was currently palatable at the time. So it went up a hundred dollars last year.

F

So for the fiscal year, 22 operating assessment again we're at 560 dollars and we'll be talking about um what we might see for fiscal year, 2023 based on various things. So we're going to review our current expenditures and costs, um we'll review the annual sea wall replacement program and the special projects.

F

So on our we're going to give you a base pro forma, which is basically keeping things, as is the 560 assessment rate, the current um length of seawall that we put into place last year, so there that's why the performer will show no rate increases.

F

Special projects were again below the line they were not approved, so there's no funding showing for those particular projects. The federal and state assistance percentage we just talked about for the rip mitigation was 95 percent. It's in this fiscal year fiscal year 2022, however, we're still waiting for that permit. So we can't start the construction, but because it's already budgeted in 2022, if we don't get it done in 2022, we'll carry it over to 2023 rather than taking it out of this year and then re-budgeting it for next year.

F

So our assumptions for fiscal year 2023, are on the operating side. Are four percent merit increases? The pension is per schedule that we do there's a 10 percent match on employees that are in the defined contribution plan.

F

There's estimated increases for health insurance of 6 percent, 10 percent on workers, comp insurance, 5 percent on general liability insurance and the seawall replacement program, as it stood last year, was approximately 1227 linear feet of sea wall replacement.

F

We do estimate a 5 increase overall in the costs, so that is built in on the administration side. It's estimated at a three percent increase. However, every year, once all budgets are in, we do look at that and based on others budgets. You may see a decrease or an increase depending on where you stand, because it's based on all budgets for fiscal year 24 through 27, you have inlet dredging flat at 30 000 per year.

F

The staff is recommending a contracted seawall assessment and for bsi that would be ten thousand dollars every other year. It would start in 24, because you just had yours done um by staff this year, so you would skip a year in 23 and then it would start in 24..

F

There's estimated increases for sea walls of 3 percent on the payroll side. It's the same type of estimates merits at four percent pension at four percent: health insurance, six percent workers, comp at ten percent liability insurance, five percent and all other operating three percent.

F

We just talked about the riprap mitigation project and for the special projects you're going to see them on the next page, so that we can kind of discuss the costs that are involved there and again, except for one project. All of them are below the line, but even the one that was above the line, we're gonna discuss further. um Due to the um we went out to bid for the project and the cost came in substantially higher than what was budgeted.

F

So here's the five-year special project program that your canal, maintenance staff is recommending. You've got special and you've got the land acquisition for staging and they would like to start setting aside a hundred thousand dollars per year to accumulate those funds to to purchase some land.

F

You've got the inlet whiting barge access, and this is the project that was in the budget for this year. So you see the prior years 580 000. That was the permitting, and that was also the construction staff- has put it in 150 000 per year over 23, 24 and 25.

F

If you want to accumulate additional funds or we're going to talk about again, possibly if you did want to go ahead and complete that project, doing something similar to what we did with the canal, the rim canal, dredging, you know we could do a interfund loan and pay it back over time if you wanted to move forward.

F

So that could be all in 2023. If you had wanted question yes,.

H

On the first line, then I planned acquisition for staging. Yes, it's a hundred thousand here. That's based upon what numbers, because the way property, values and stuff are here- they went up exponential, then so does that account for what's projected or is that just today's cost and those numbers could go up significantly.

F

So I believe, staff.

F

E

For 23 is when the bubble, pops and we'll be able to buy 10 lots for 580 no.

D

Let's open that.

E

D

The stuff you're taking right.

E

Yeah for sure now the uh I'd have to dig back in on on what we had for the cost of that, and it was that one little commercial parcel we were looking at. It was a small piece, but I don't recall exactly what that um that.

H

Would happen, I would be interested in that because.

D

Yeah, I agree, I don't know where we're agree. 100.

C

I just like to.

H

See what's projected and.

E

H

I'm sure you've got, I mean.

E

We did put some safety factor on it, but obviously you know.

H

E

Crazy, this is absolutely gorgeous. I.

H

Mean my house has gone up like three hundred three four hundred thousand. Like really that's amazing just live there. So I just question: if that's that's a realistic number that we can live to or we get a couple years out and it's like oh no, we're gonna have to double it or something. I don't know: okay, great, okay and.

E

That's almost the same with um you know, that's.

H

Everything everything.

E

On the page, you've got right, you know how.

H

E

Guesstimate, what the prices are going to do.

H

But that one it's based upon buying land, correct and that one that's an unknown to me for anybody else.

E

Right right, yeah we'll go back and look at those numbers.

H

Of course, if you talk to realtor, that's probably half of what we mean.

H

Okay, thank you.

D

I just had one question: um could somebody explain what the channel corner widening is exactly.

E

Yeah, the channel corner widening is a project. There are some pinch points like when you first come in the lock and if you go to the left that first bin there there's a couple of those kind of bins: okay, that in the winter months or lower tide months or in the case of a eleventh, being put right there at the corner, the barge can't get around those corners with the lower tides. um Actually, mcg just got a barge hung up, um they were down there.

E

It was a couple weeks back within the last month, santander they got down there, we're trying to make the corner and the barge got hung, so they were just stuck and we blocked the whole waterway because they couldn't make that corner. So those in order for us to once all the staging lots are gone. We need to make sure that fully assembled barge can make it into every every nook and cranny, and that's what that project will. Let us do.

G

Got it? Thank you. Page. 46 of the uh presentation has a map showing the four chokers. Oh, does it? Okay,.

F

And I can bring them up on the computer if you'd like to see the pictures, and so just talk about the barge access and the channel corner widening and again, this would be a multi-year project getting the permitting getting the.

F

Engineering done- and things like that, so they have split it again over the four years and you can see it was 725. 000 was the current estimate just for um talking points. Every hundred dollar assessment equal in in bsi equals approximately a hundred and three thousand dollars in revenue. So when we're talking about these projects and what you want to put in or what you want to see, I just want you to keep that in mind.

F

Okay, so some things that are not currently in the pro forma, because they're still being looked at um any changes that may occur from a pain classification study that is underway.

F

So the city has hired a contractor to do that. It's just starting, we hope to have the information during this budget process, but it might not be until june or july where we really have a recommended plan from them about what we could possibly do, and it may be something that is phased in over several years, but that is something that could affect the proforma increase in seawall panel costs.

F

If an additional worker is approved for panel production, so the staff is going to be requesting an additional staff member to help with the panel on construction, because again, both bsi and pgi have ramped up how many linear feet they're doing every year. So that means more panels need to be done.

F

So if that does get approved, that would add an approximately seven percent increase to the panel costs line.

B

B

Have we considered putting these panels uh the panel production out a bit as well.

F

um I I don't think we have at this time. I think the city has they like to have a little bit of control, knowing the quality that is being produced, but we could look at that. um We would have to go out to bid and see right.

A

Now we feel pretty confident with the prices that we're paying for concrete and for steel because we're buying such a large volume. um There were a couple projects where we had to have special panels made and cast systems did it for us and their their quality of work. um They were under constant inspection.

A

So we just feel good that um you know we we're putting that quality control together and we know what we're putting in the ground so.

B

I'm just kind of thinking ahead to may 2nd, where we have this public meeting at twin isles, trying to anticipate the questions that we will probably face.

A

There is also the factor that the contractor now is required to pick up those panels at our yard. If we have them manufactured at another yard, it might increase travel time for them, so it might increase our sea wall replacement cost just because they have to travel farther to go pick them up. Okay,.

B

So I I think we just.

A

Want to think through.

B

These kathy to.

A

Yeah, no, that's a good idea! Yeah! That's a good idea! I'll put that down.

H

Okay, how long has learned thinking where they're at now is there plenty of storage? In other words, they they build them, and I don't think they go right out the door as soon as they're built or do they.

A

So right now, no right now our yard holds about 685 panels. We typically have to flip the yard three to four times and we're managing the amount of volume that we do right now. We can expand the yard. The yard actually has room for expansion. We just you know, have to coordinate with other departments at the facility.

H

That we're at concerned, if you did move it off-site, because I kind of did some of that for a living. If I brought too much equipment in for parts, I had to go pay to have it stored.

H

So if you don't have a good volume going out and they get all this stuff wrapped in stock they're, going to charge us more to build this area and to maintain the area waiting for the basically the installation to see while we're here, it doesn't cost anything. Just a thought. There.

A

Yeah well we're keeping up with production and with demand right now um and that's why we're looking at adding another person, because in a 20-day work month, we're probably casting panels 13 of those days, 13 14 of those days, if we amp up our production, we're going to have that yard in full production. All the time so and and let's not forget during hurricane irma, we contracted out the uh panel production and our yard was stacked all the time all over the we had thousands of panels all over the place.

H

So if you had to the your answer, would be we'll store it here until they come and get it yep. That would be the worst case.

A

H

And you have to pay for that move twice.

C

A

F

um And then, of course, the last thing is, if um there's any increase to the seawall program based on the previous study and the current assessment that was received um to replace more lineal feet per year. So that's not included it's just what we did in fiscal year. 2022 is what is being carried forward right now in the pro forma in the base.

F

As you know, bsi had a um a policy when they went from um to the 460 operating assessment that 45 000 of that rate was being used to increase a separate reserve. That was either going to be used for seawall projects or for increased seawall costs so based and then, when we talked last year when they decided to move forward with the um barge inlet access widening project, it was determined.

F

We were about 225 000 accumulated at that time that we had enough reserves that we could go ahead and do that project, but to pay that back that 45 000 over the next year. So that's why you'll see zero under that line, but also based on our current rates and over the five years costs increasing.

F

We really wouldn't be able to implement that back, because unless you were to increase the assessment rate okay, so I just wanted to point that out so um you'd have to either deak or you'd have to decrease your program. Those are those are some of the options.

F

So here's our base pro forma and as you can see um our reserves with just the barge access inlet widening at the 580 000- that's in there, but the extra 450 000 estimate is not so that we'll talk about that in just a minute. But um you can see we have the 50 000 reserved for contingency that we add in there. That was a new policy added last year because there was a seawall failure after the program had already been completed and they needed additional funds to complete that emergency repair.

F

So now, there's an emergency contingency that the city manager can authorize that use without having to wait to go to council to appropriate those funds. This year already they did have one extra failure, so they used approximately 25 000 out of that contingency.

F

If there's no more failures that 25 000 will move back down to your reserve line and same in any of the other years, so that 50 000, if it's not used, will go back to your reserves.

F

um You can see that when you get to fiscal year, 2026 reserves are just a little bit too low and when you get to 2027 um we're in the negative, so at some point as we move forward over the years, regardless of decisions that are made now, you would have to say you just did nothing at all and said: hey we're just going to go like this.

F

We would have to do something starting in probably 25 or 26, to get those reserves back up and again when you got that reserved for contingency, if you don't use it, that could be another 250 000. That would go back. So it's hard to say that. Yet, though you know because we're putting that in there, you can see all the things that are below the line. So we talked about the increase in the panel cost, so that part is below the line right now, because we just don't know if that's happening yet.

F

We've got the barge the additional funds for the barge access, inlet, widening the channel corner, widening and the bsi land acquisition and say you were to add all of that to the pro forma. Well, what would that do you can see what would happen to your pro forma through fiscal year 2027, if you did all of that, and we would have to find a way to fund all of that.

F

So here's the discussion part to come up and um kind of give us some direction on so the first one we should probably talk about is the barge access access, inlet, widening project.

F

So we can delay the project and we can either accumulate the additional funds um over that time. 23 24 25, um or also be hoping that there's a change in the current market conditions and some of these prices will come back down. So if you wait a few years, maybe if the market changes, maybe we'll get to um might not go down all the way, but maybe it'll be a little bit less than what we're currently seeing in the current market.

H

On the whitening thing, who owns that land that we want to encroach upon.

H

The county on it or city.

A

No, the the lock belongs to your district.

H

Stand but okay, I got petty the corner. Whiting. I guess.

A

Oh, the corner, widening we would be purchasing, I think, that's from charlotte county is that correct, yeah, charlotte county owns that land, so.

H

We have and that money is included in this.

C

F

um The other option- and I think um I should mention also when we're talking about delaying the project- we do have the permit in hand and it's good for five years, so we could delay not too long, because obviously we don't want the permit to expire. If you did want to move forward with it at some point, but that's an option or we could request, like I said earlier- request to borrow the additional funds: go out to bid staff would review the scope again try and see.

F

If there's anything, they could clarify more or decrease just to try and get those numbers down a little bit more.

F

But then you could pay over time again like that, an additional assessment over a few years, probably four to five years um to cover that additional 450 000..

F

Okay. So do we want to stop here and talk about this project? First, you.

B

Know actually what I'd love to do is just go to the very next page and talk about the um the total cap and wall condition and like okay and and I I guess I have one question- that if we go to the category five, which I believe is a failed sea wall or cap right um so.

A

B

Is like as good as gold.

A

Kathy miller for the record, so zero is a brand new wall.

B

A

When I was out there doing the inspection, all of our walls were under construction. That's why that says: zero! Okay, even the walls that we installed last year, have some cracking in them. Concrete's made to crack okay. So you don't. We didn't, have a perfect wall in the system at the time of inspection.

B

A

um And, let's not forget that last year, when we reviewed, we reviewed the sea wall study, we agreed that we would take on. We would start the sea wall assessment. We we looked at different elements as far as raiding the sea walls, so all water line crackings we figured that was our worst condition. So all water line cracking was either rated a four or a five.

A

All of those fives that you see there. I can guarantee you, they are water line. Cracking it doesn't mean that five is a failure. It's in the water. It just means that that water line cracking probably encompasses the entire property.

B

A

We have a rain event or a hurricane, or something like that. It's possible that that wall could fail. Just from that water line, cracking.

B

A

B

I guess in a second question, so we have 1 624 linear feet of that and this year we're going to complete 1 351 is, I believe, which is about 70. Is that correct, so we'll be left with.

A

Some sea walls that we're going to have to replace in the next fiscal year. Yes, we may have a portion of a sea wall, we might have on an 80-foot lot. We may only have 20 or 30 feet that has water line cracking so that might last us a couple more years than we anticipate, but it was still rated a five can.

F

I ask a question, and I this is just to clarify: are you asking if what they're doing in fiscal year 2022 is off that five? Yes, I think thank.

A

You, no, that is no, there may be one or two projects that are on here, um because, as and again I was in the boat doing this, you know we're not really familiar with what street we were on we're just looking at sea walls in a boat and we're evaluating them right at eye level right, so we may have passed a project that was on our schedule to be replaced this year and we just didn't realize it and it was probably rated.

A

So I would, I would say, maybe 160 feet of that might be this year's replacement. So.

B

Roughly, we've got about 1500 linear feet of seawall to go and just to be clear when we classify this as a five, how do we title that five? What do we call that.

A

um It just means like made like the cracks are a certain width like your cracks are like an eighth of an inch thick. You know they're substantial cracks like you could stick your finger in there. You could stick a pencil in there.

E

B

E

It's basically the um the fives are the overall system, because now remember: we've lumped in the system. We're not we're assessing the cap separately, we're assessing the wall separately, but then we blend that data set. So we're looking at the overall system now which came out of that system. So five is basically it's it's.

E

It's failed to to maintain. You know it's structural integrity across the board. It's it's not that it's in the water failed, but that it's got a very good likelihood to do that.

A

It puts it as a priority on our replacement program and.

E

Then now all these fives that are there remember we could have an 80 foot property that 40 feet of. It is a five, but then the other 40 feet of it may be a two with some bottom cracking. But we don't want to leave that other 40-foot gate there. So we'll go in and do that property. So we don't as we chip away it's not taking care of just the fives on every project. We close up the gap from like a new wall to a new wall or from good to good.

E

So you will not one for one reduce that number with every replacement foot that you do.

B

So, as a matter of course, gary, I think in terms of two things one: how do we deal with it and the second part is how do we communicate it?

B

Wouldn't we be well served by looking at this from the perspective of five being a failure, that's about to happen as as opposed to a failed system and- and I think, looking at this- my inclination would be while we're either waiting for marking conditions to hopefully address this wild hyper.

B

uh If I mean I've never seen anything like this and I've lived in some big cities.

C

B

Don't we just throw our resources at addressing the fives and the adjacent pieces over the next year and and get ahead of it while we examine or look at more closely the assumptions that we held on these previous items, you know the love to get the lock uh widened, because I think that would be a major win for everybody, um but at 1 000 or a million dollars.

B

You know we started three hundred thousand dollars, uh and that was a scant three years ago or it might have been four, but it wasn't that long ago, right.

E

Never saw this coming no.

B

The channel widening project- you know I have some angst over that because I'm not sure the money we spend in that is well served in every location and and what I would love to see is us address this in front of a largely new board from the people who first went through this and and say all right. Does this make sense? You know if we're going to go all the way you know there's some places down at the bottom of the canal system.

B

I don't think you could get a barge down there, even if you widen the corner um so does it make sense for the 40 homes back there to take out that corner and to probably have to dredge into the mangroves to get a 28 or 30 foot uh barge with spuds on it through that? So as an agenda item going through, I think we ought to take some more in-depth views of some of these items.

B

I don't want I'm not trying to kick the can completely, um but I think we need to have a fresher set of eyes on this than okay.

E

Always step back like we did before.

H

I think what I'm hearing I could be wrong is instead of five categories. We may need six I wrong in that, because or else evaluate what the fives have done and try to build a trend, because I know that even in pgi, I've got some friends live over there when that seawall washes out in the back they're walking along the yard. Next thing, one lady was up to her waist in a hole and it was covered by a stupid grass that grows like a weed poor, tammy yeah.

C

You know bridged it.

H

Is any of these cracks big enough to physically cause erosion on the homeowner's side of the seawall, as opposed to the other, and that's fleshing out good? That could say hey. We maybe need to address this even more, because those cracks are even more secretive. Is that kind of where you're.

B

You know I find in how they're assessing it- and I think I love what you're doing and using the um the process that the navy and whatever that book was that you talked about. Okay, we've got a definition, you know, let's use that, that's great, um I I'm just thinking.

B

These are big numbers, these are really big numbers. You know, and I did a back in the envelope last night and I came up with- I think, a seawall assessment of a million six a year or I'm not a million cents, uh uh one thousand six hundred dollars to one thousand yeah. One thousand three hundred fifty one dollars a year, three years out um the homeowner for the homeowner to cover that you know that's a huge change and.

A

That's why we're having this conversation yeah? How do you guys want to budget this? How do you want to schedule this.

B

Well, I think the first thing I'd love to see is is what do you recommend.

C

B

Yeah I mean because I think we're an advisory group we're not um you're the experts, we're not the experts.

A

So, and- and I also want to mention- is, as you said before, we're having our public meeting may 2nd. You know it'll be nice to hear from the public and what they have to say about that. Obviously, nobody likes their taxes in greece. You know what I'm saying: um I'm.

B

A little worried about that, I am we all.

C

B

Yeah I wish it was earlier number one. um I think. 5 30 is a dangerous hour.

A

Well, we're trying to accommodate the working class.

B

B

I also understand how much of that population is not working class, um so yeah I just like for us to be in a better position to communicate uh what we're doing to go in with the plan says: hey this year, we're going to do this, whatever it is, and here's what we have to contend with, and here's how we're looking at it- and I think, a good way to do that would be to talk about the immediacy of the issue in front of us this category, five, whatever we want to call it and the adjacency walls that tie into that.

B

This is what we're going to try and address over the next year, and here are the steps we're taking to address these other concerns that you folks have and then open it up to questions. I don't think we go in with a defined program if we want to walk out of there with the back of our pants still on.

G

Will we have this presentation available to us for that meeting.

F

Yes, I don't is there, I should ask, I mean I'm not familiar with the place.

H

F

It is there av.

H

Yeah, the speaker system ain't, the greatest.

A

Yeah, that's what they told me um they do they. They said that they would provide a drop down screen. I think we're going to provide like a laptop or something I still have to get with it, but we're planning on doing a powerpoint presentation- okay, yes and stuff, like that, so I'm already working on a a little bit of history of the seawall study to try to educate the people in your area.

A

We know that your sea walls were built in the 80s and they have a life expectancy of 40 years or at the end of that life expectancy, things are going to start moving rather quickly. We want to be proactive, not reactive. Okay, if you want to do more sea walls this year and hold off on the lock widening. We can certainly consider that if you wanted to do both and just raise the taxes up more, we could certainly do that. You know I that the purpose of today is to talk about those things.

B

Okay, do we have any other.

D

Well, I just I have a question regarding the and kathy you mentioned that even some of the the newer sea walls that were put in or cr had cracks in them right and- and I.

I

D

In left field on this completely and if so just tell me to be quiet, but have we ever looked at using a different material other than cement to build the sea walls? Something that's more durable than well.

A

We did that was part of the seawall study, and I also want to mention to you guys when you're talking to your constituents. Let them know that the seawall study is on the website under canal maintenance. If they want to read it. Okay, we looked at different um different materials, different concepts that was the whole purpose of hiring. The consultant was to analyze the way we were doing business.

A

The way we were replacing the sea walls and- and that's you know, their report came back with um you know they wanted to use stainless steel rebar instead of this chromated uh water-resistant steel, but the price of that was astronomical.

A

Okay, so so we looked at all that and boards prior to you, recommended certain things and they gave us a direction to go in we're going to stick with the concrete sea walls. Okay, caps are an issue because, if you're out there on the water and the wind is blowing- and you just poured a cap you're going to have cracks in the cap, okay, should we re we're, also looking at maybe requiring the contractor to use some kind of water retardant on the caps to prevent some of that that cracking from happening.

A

The problem is, though, is is the face of that? Cap is still covered with wood. You know, so it's really there's a lot of different things that we are looking at. Okay, to prevent that cracking bottom line is, is the purpose of doing the sea wall assessment? Is we want to document the cracks that we have so if they are getting bigger, there's a problem happening there all right and that's the whole purpose of the sea wall assessment is to inventory all the cracks and spalls and condition of the sea wall.

G

I like what you're saying about uh the immediacy of repairing the sea walls. I mean everybody is asking us questions about. When are we going to widen the lock and when we're going to do this, and how long is that going to take and they're not asking us, you know, because they don't know about the sea walls I mean kathy, tells us about the sea wall.

G

I like that idea. I think that's what we need to tell them and we're going to get yelled at for not widening the the lock, but I think that's going to be a whole lot better than being yelled at when our sea wall comes down and we didn't take care of it right. So I like that approach.

D

And and how many people really are impacted by you know the lock it at the current width? Well, everybody.

E

Would be a minority.

D

Of the people that live in the area.

E

It's it's not because of the boaters that are there it's because of getting a fully loaded barge in and out when we don't have a staging lot anymore. To put the thing together, that's the it wasn't to make bigger boats go through, I mean yeah, that's a side benefit. The big thing is making an assembled barge without.

D

G

Carrying but but we have staging lots still right.

E

We do still have staging lots, I mean they're getting fewer and fewer as everybody.

H

E

Build out happening they're, you know they're diminishing quickly, well,.

H

That's something you could probably throw up, how many lots are left and how many are sold or being sold, that they're got paperwork in to start building a house on so that'll kind of give you your attrition if you've got a hundred lots left, you're doing 20 a year five years out, you're screwed, so I mean that's.

E

Going to be I've done some studies like maybe something.

H

Worthwhile to putting up on that chart that shows the population hey.

C

H

A big, oh, coming, it's only five years down the road.

E

And the big thing is a lot of people see. Oh look at that nice big lot. They can stage on that one. That's a nice big lot and they're. Looking at the roadside, it's on a corner.

C

E

Nothing for us in the backyard when it's 30 feet wide or 40 feet wide, because you need to swing the crane radius around and things like that. So a lot of the lots that are out there. We can't use anyways.

A

Right because there's a lift, there might be a lift in the way and we're not going to park a barge next to a dock. That's got a lift.

C

A

You know so and and the depth of the canal that has a lot to do with it. We know we have a lot of rock, so we know that the slopes of our canals that are that are armored with rock. We can't get a barge close to those the side of that sea wall.

H

And it's probably slim to no chance whatsoever to go to the environmental tree huggers and say I want to take out and make this channel square.

H

You know like on the mangrove side where you could go in and crouch, but you can only get within five or ten feet because you've hit hard ledge you've got the waterway there surface, but you don't have the depth going across that allows like you guys to see in the board. So that's.

E

Yeah- and we were able to do that with that dredge project, we were able to take that side slope. They were going to make us hold a berm out from the mangrove drip edge out seven feet and then come down at the three to one. We got them to agree to back that all the way to the trim edge and go down at a two to one slope, but we couldn't remove any hard bottom. So when the dredge.

C

E

Hit the hard bottom, we had to stop.

H

E

So that's why there's a shelter I.

H

Still struggle with the hard bottom because they want to protect that fish. These canals were not here and mother. Nature didn't make them. So why have we all of a sudden said that god came down with these cranes and all this stuff and drag lines, and they made these things and it's natural? It's not man did it, so they screwed up. They didn't do what they were supposed to do. So why is there this big heartburn.

E

Just did I mean we've, I don't.

H

Know we've just seen this mind-boggling to me. Yeah man made the canals he didn't. Do it right, let's go fix it.

E

H

Created, that's what you're going to be up against all these meetings guarantee you that.

E

Yeah us creating- or you know, the people that dredged the canals created, habitat, maybe unknowingly, they created the habitat and now that it's all coming.

H

In environmentalists are saying: oh yeah, this is their habitat. Now yeah, it has been for 20 years. It wasn't before that sport fans right.

C

H

You know it was just swamp.

E

If even that, yeah.

H

And the reason I'm sure that they'd take a ledge hard bottom out. It would take dynamite or an auger bit to grind that out.

C

H

That's they I guarantee they didn't, have the funds they had drag lands exactly how they probably built those.

C

H

Lights or a back, but you know big backhoe big experience.

G

What I'm hearing from staff is, the widening of the lock is still very important.

B

I think it is very important, but um I I think we're going to have a contentious issue on our hands and you know I think you were here. I don't know if you were here for the uh the dredging um I lived here. Okay,.

H

B

H

That wasn't bad. I threw some things out because you know I said I hope you guys the committee that was doing it we'll do a post survey to make sure we at least got what we paid for this time and we.

E

H

Time no, we did a post survey and I said I used to work for the corps of engineers in florida. When I was younger and we went behind every dredge project and we went first and said this is what you got and then it was over and done with. We went back to verify. We got what we paid for right and I don't care if you're, the federal government or a state or a city government yeah, it's going to cost a little bit extra money in the overall budget, but at least it verifies.

H

You got what you paid for. You know and you wouldn't be dealing with this hard glitch now, because you'd have forced them to dynamite or take an auger, dredge and hog it out.

E

Well, our permit didn't allow us that, because we did do the post bath metrics, the pre and post bath metrics of.

H

The last one of.

E

H

Week I'm talking the original one.

E

H

Has got us into this mess to a certain extent, gotcha gotcha they didn't. I.

E

Don't even know if they were permitted back then, because that was almost pretty perfect.

H

Whatever it is well, they had hard legs at all. That's too much money above my finger. I didn't play in that they.

E

Didn't need to.

H

Go to sell the holes in bigger places where you got exactly.

E

H

Foot holes plus one might understand, and some of these big basins.

E

All they were looking at is turning dirt to sell house sites, and that was it and it looked pretty from the top side. All they saw was water and back then the fishing boats were small and nobody had the boats that they had nowadays.

H

They have 45 foot boats coming in.

E

I mean that lock was what 45 foot gate to gate. So, even if you put a 30 foot boat in there, you were running tight and yeah. You just didn't have those kind of runabouts or you did, but they weren't that prevalent like they are now.

H

And they weren't in bsi right.

E

Because alligator creek was only dredged to five feet back in the day, and um so we were almost a hole back then, at six.

B

Okay, so as a board can can we agree that we think the right thing initially to do is to address the category fives and the adjacencies, whatever they might be gary to to present to accomplish uh you know getting these things fixed and use that as a point of this, is you know what we're doing to the town is doing to to address this problem and then, as a second priority, uh address the the widening of the walk um and- and I still see that as a huge priority for everybody here, I don't.

B

I don't know that anybody would disagree with me and then can we schedule, perhaps for the next meeting, to look again with a fresh set of eyes at the corner widening and what the implications are for that number one is a priority in in to the land purchasing, because I remember when I first joined this committee seven years ago or six years ago, um that was a hot button issue too. I mean that got shockingly emotional.

I

B

People in terms of staging lots in neighborhoods.

E

That's why we wouldn't buy residential lots, yeah.

B

I mean that was wildly unpopular, so I think yeah.

E

I think we have that discussion on corner widening is the mangrove mitigation has gone through the roof? So if we go through there and start, you know every bit of the mangroves, we pull it's not really. The land cost, maybe charlotte county, will give that to us or donate it to us. It's going to be the mitigation costs that are going to get us.

H

So I have to go plant somewhere.

E

What we have to pay into the little pine island mitigation bank for any mangroves you mess with so say that again.

D

E

Missed that when you destroy a mangrove like for a project like this, when we go and have to remove mangroves, you have to pay mitigation, you have to buy mitigation credits from a forested saltwater, mangrove system and the one that's our local one is little pine island mitigation bank and I think it's over gosh. What was it? I think, we're nearing them like a 300 000 per acre charge on mitigation credits and we did buckley's pass. I thought it was like around 90 around 190 somewhere. It was far far lower.

E

They know what they've got now and the explosive growth that's happening around. Our area is just to just run the bank up big time on that. One.

B

And my concern with that too, gary is that I went through there the other day on a powerboat around deluca in that corner there, I'm not sure you got 30 feet um between the mangroves and the.

E

B

E

Shelf too, if I'm.

B

Not mistaken yeah you're right, yes, yep, that's yeah! So you know that's one of the that's the second corner.

E

I think yeah yeah you make that that's that next left, then that's a tight one. We could always say that we're going to go back to the way it was. I mean I guess, pre-kathy back in my day.

E

We didn't do any work in bsi until it was summer when we had a big heavy flood tide and if a wall fell down in the winter, that wall was down until we could get the barge in there the next summer- and that's I mean if worse comes to worse, we could, you know, go back to that kind of system. It kind of hey. If a wall goes down, we're stuck we're only going to dig in bsi in the summer.

H

And for what it's worth on the lot widening of the corner lighting and buying land? What about throwing a? What? If on the table.

H

I'll think of it it just. I would think, there's some better way that we can present them that, because the amount of logistics, if we lose all the lots and widening the canal, that's not going to be free money either down the road. Because now, where is your staging lot going to be and you've got to have a hopper, dredge or hopper barge? Where you take all that dirt?

H

You put it in that hopper barge and you haul it to wherever the hell it's going to be, and then, when you need it back, you got to go out there again and retrieve it and bring it back. That's logistics, a lot of people don't understand or even comprehend, so widening is one thing the lock. I don't disagree with that.

H

However, if you widen- and we don't get the other stuff, that cost is going to go up exponentially because where are they going to stage how long it's going to take them to haul it over bring it back where they're going to stage the the panels and how they're going to get them in so is it definitely a two-edged sword that you're dealing with here- and I don't know if that's worth throwing up.

H

You know saying that you know, and now, instead of going two hours to get it, it's two days to whether here's where our staging is now so we got all that dirt that we pulled out from the back. Then all the panels yeah. We.

E

Just do separate.

H

Trips and then you can do all that over again.

E

Yeah we talked about having like a 14.

H

E

People may see barges floating in their backyards when we have nowhere to take this stuff, maybe they're just piles of dirt on barges and stuff and sea wall panels that you push in every now and then.

H

I'm sure, if you come into those big holes out there, they won't let you dig it back up and hold.

E

H

Once it's there, they own.

C

H

You're done yeah, so you've got to put it on dirt, where you get it back and recover it, and how far is that logistically from burnt store owls? Is it one of the ones that pgi was developed.

E

H

Where they have to haul them too, that was the one site. That's the.

E

Only one that we can think of is the one at central palms up.

H

I mean what does that thing? Do like six to eight miles an hour, how.

E

About less than that, you.

H

Know I'm so you do the math of how far you got to go. Then when you get there, you gotta unload it. All that I mean it's just I don't think it's a logistics. The people who live there could understand or know like why go five miles an hour, and then you start paying eight guys on that barge or something right that are some of my guys, leaning on shovels, wait for it to come back and the other's gonna be riding with it and they don't understand they have a huge problem: price stacking.

H

When you start going days instead of hours.

E

And that's something that our contractor he came and spoke to the boards before we even did the seawall study and said just that. Look if we run out of staging lots, it's going to cost you guys way more because.

H

I would say because it's unless you're here or you understand some of that.

E

Another massive.

C

E

B

So kathy what to to get to the 1624 feet, plus some percentage here? um How much would we need to increase the assessment? Any idea: can we just ballpark that.

A

Hold on she's she's, the calculator of the human calculator.

F

So we know at the current rates it was 200. 100 um 100 assessment would get us 270 lineal feet. So if we take the 1622 1 624, just as let me see, I could find my calculator on here.

F

1624 minus the one two two seven already in the budget. You need 397 uh linear feet, additional.

B

Plus some percent extra.

F

Yeah, so we could round it to say you want me to round it to 500.

F

Do you think that's enough so 397 that just gets you 6 20 16 24, but if you have to um sometimes do a little extra, what percentage do you think you have to do extra, sometimes I'd.

E

Say at least 50 percent right.

F

E

Find good wall on either side.

F

1.5 so you're looking at 595 lineal feet so 270. Let me just see if we just did simple math times. 2 is 540. It's close. I mean it's not quite enough, but if you said that would be 200 additional assessment to pretty much get you through the fives plus some, maybe not the full 50 that he's talking about, but.

B

So that brings.

F

Or we could bring it up a little more to.

B

F

D

B

Okay, I have an opinion, but uh my opinion is that we really don't have a choice.

H

I have I have another concern: maybe this ain't the right place to bring it up, but if we bring all this up in front of the the whole audience there are. Some people are theoretically getting a hell of a deal on this because.

G

They only have one.

H

Ian, I think, is one of the guys. That's got that 30 or 40 foot lot and he's going to be paying the same as the guy with a 200 foot assessment right, and I think people are going to probably go ballistic on that and to me it's we pay by linear foot city. They pay the contractor by linear foot. Why isn't the city charging us by linear foot to me?

H

That's apples and oranges, unethical as hell, because that means a guy with ian's front lot of 50 feet is his is going to go up exponential really to the guy. That's got 200 feet. If you do the threat assessment, you know what is the risk that, because we're basically acting as an insurance company for the for the homeowner, the city has basically took on that title. I'm the insurance company, if it breaks you're, paying me a yearly insurance fee to protect this and the guy that's got 200 feet.

H

Waterfront is paying the same as ian with 50 feet or 40 feet whatever it is. I don't know how that passes an ethical test to me yeah when.

A

H

Arrive at the same.

A

Methodology for your property tax, though your property taxes are based on erus, equivalent residential units. So say you do have a piece of property: that's on a radius or you have a piece of property. That's um at the end of a canal. Your taxes are the same based on the eru, your base tax.

A

So it's not based on square footage of property that you own.

H

But again it's exposure having all that land out there doesn't expose you to anything that you need an insurance policy. For my opinion, this has bugged me for about eight years now.

E

And we've had, were you part of the this has been talked about before.

B

Multiple times there was a huge lawsuit involved. I mean.

E

Yeah we had the lawsuit involved in it yeah. This has definitely been dealt with.

H

I understand dealing with but to me is still unethical.

H

It is literally unethical because if I had a two million dollar house, my insurance for hurricane, my insurance for flood and the overall replacement cost of the house is going to be based upon a 200 billion or two million dollar house.

H

I'm not gonna pay for that two million dollar house to save my own insurance on a four hundred thousand dollar house. So to me, it's the exposure. What is your risk as an insurance company pearl in your foot, because that's what you're replacing pearl in your foot? You're, not re, doing anything based upon how many square feet you have property value on right.

E

Now that's another.

H

Tax totally separate.

E

And then that same person that has the small seawall, I'm not not doubting what you're, saying or anything, but that person with a small sea wall now has 200 feet of road frontage and when we go into pave, they cost that much more to pave the swale maintenance. Everything that goes out on the front side. So it was kind of like a tip for a tap thing. But I know that's two different fun.

H

Settings it don't cost near to replace that road. That's going to cost.

E

H

Now you're, oh.

E

Yeah and that's something that, but that's some of the some of them see.

H

This is only used by the homeowner that he's in front of this house yeah I'll.

B

H

B

Because seawall is used by the entire community because there are a number of people who have to safely be able to pass by that. If that sea wall fails, you're, reducing the navigation of the ability for people to navigate through that area and.

E

That's also why this the values are, so I think buoyant here is because we keep these sea walls up. It maintains not just that one person's property values but everybody's, because that's part of the lower of this community is hey, the sea walls are paid for and um the canals are maintained and and things of that nature. It helps.

B

And there's a can of worms that are damaged and.

H

I understand it yeah, but to me I think it's unethical as a government entity or whatever, because you're literally to me, you're, acting as an insurance company to replace that seawall, because if you went to an insurance company and insured that you got to pay by linear foot of your exposure because that's the insurance companies risk which, in my opinion, is your risk.

F

So I I want to bring up a point I mean, and I totally understand where you're coming from and again it has been looked at well before my time and many times and even when they set up the district. However, um remember this, this district does not just maintain the sea walls, they maintain the canal system.

F

So whether you have a small boat or a big boat, we still have to maintain that it doesn't matter what size frontage you have for maintaining the that, as well as like, when we're talking about like, say the lot project or these other projects.

F

These projects are for the entire canal system and it doesn't matter how many linear feet you had in your in your thing, so there's really kind of two components. So you know when you're just talking about this, you I can understand where you you know.

H

And the way, I would look at that. Okay is it's the waterfront piece that is the real exposure here, no way getting out of it.

H

You know- and I don't see where the road and all those come into play to the extent and the impact of cost that you're you're basically subsidizing the guy with a 200 foot waterfront and the waterway.

H

Everybody owns the waterway, but the sea wall. No, I mean, are you just gonna? Let it fall down? No you're, not gonna, let it fall down, but I'm just saying make it equitable, because we pay for linear foot, that's the risk of the homeowner should be linear foot. Not I own a lot or I own, a big boat right. No, it's based upon what your exposure is to replace that, because that's what you're buying the insurance for, but.

F

The thing is, you've got this million dollar project and you're going to say the person who is got the smaller fee or the smaller linear foot is going to have a lot lower cost towards that project than the person with a larger cost. So I mean again it's it's six to one half a dozen of.

E

The other in some respects, but again.

F

E

Any special product.

F

Any special projects, so you talk about the lock whiting dredging anything like that. It.

H

And to me that's maintaining on the waterway, not maintaining the sea wall.

F

But see this district does both.

H

B

H

Arguing that so.

B

Can can you could do a lot of try and put an end to this? This has already been litigated in the community. I mean we spent a lot of money. I don't know how much we spend on legal fees that was settled three four years ago. I, I think we're really eating.

I

A

I

Beating a dead.

A

Course this is.

B

Not gonna uh not gonna,.

A

B

At all dave, unfortunately, right- and you know that was a collective decision made at a level far different from where we are right here, and I think our task is to it is to one keep the community uh vibrant and whole and and to keep the communication with the community positive in terms of what we're trying to do. So, let's not divert off into a just something. That's already.

H

Been because you're going to have this meeting I'll get of a gut feeling.

B

So it- and I think the answer would be very simple when we've already litigated this- this has already been determined. You may not like it, but it's already been determined. um So did we say two hundred thousand dollars or another two hundred dollars.

C

F

B

Big numbers are driving me crazy, even.

F

Get you very close with that a little bit of extra, maybe not 50 extra, unless you wanted to go more but again, if you're trying to keep it somewhat, you know it depends on how big a bite you really want to try and do you know, but it would get you close. You could.

A

G

And then those other properties could roll over 140.

A

G

E

A

B

Know my concern with that and I ian I would agree with that. My concern is that we keep nickel and diming this and look what happens to the numbers every time we do.

G

um And my concern is, if we jack it up too much we're going to get pushed back from hell.

B

And we got the pushback from hell. Last year I mean city council turned us down, 150 we recommended originally. They said no.

F

I think pgi had the same issue like they had recommended a higher amount and they wanted in their performance. They actually wanted to keep showing the increase and council wanted it flat in the performa. Well,.

G

B

We're kidding ourselves talk.

G

About city council city council shot themselves in the foot by doing the same thing, they kept the millage rate at a very low level for years and years and years, and they were very proud of that and then all of a sudden we got a new city manager. That said we're broke and he jacked up the millage rate big time and and the community went nuts.

G

So what we should have done is move it up a little bit at a time, so people didn't go whack and that's what I think two hundred dollars will do. It's not.

B

Black, so let me let me uh counter that with saying: let's talk about one thousand three hundred and fifty one dollars.

G

One thousand three hundred and fifty one because.

B

To do the projects that we're talking about that's what the rate's gonna be.

G

And we can gradually get up to that if we have to okay.

B

How slow it's slow.

G

Well, let's do a hundred dollars a year if we have to. Maybe we can't do 1600 of number five over.

C

G

I don't I just I just know: what's going to happen when we go in there may 2nd and say we're going to jack it up we're going to recommend that we jack it up. 200.

B

All right do we have a motion for a different number.

F

And you don't even have to make a decision today you can, I mean we're going to present this to the community as well right and then we can say maybe what you're thinking as a board, if that's so, if you do want to make a motion to say hey this is this would be our recommendation. We could present that to the community and also get their buy-in or input as well, but you know um we plan on even after the community meeting coming back here again to the board to again finalize what we're. Really.

F

Where do we stand and where? What do you really want to see? What did what did you think you heard the community say you know and stuff like that. So again, you can say hey we're thinking. This is what we want to do. It's up to you guys or you can say, hey. Let's hear the community input first and then decide.

G

Are you going to be there.

F

I will be there.

G

Will you go through the math like you just did with us? We can talk about the need to fix the 1600 uh linear feet.

G

Number five and uh kristen can say that's going to cost you 200 more a year per lot and then we can hear what they have to say and they, if they don't lose their mind, then we can do the 200..

G

But if they hear 200- and we come down from that they're going to be so happy with us.

E

Let's go three to start.

D

Well, you know, I agree with the with the 200 um increase 100, but in defense of what ian's saying I think the community will be up in arms. You got to look at their taxes, what they're paying taxes right now with their what their insurance is going up annually. I can speak for myself, it's ridiculous, the the increases that I'm experiencing in both and, I think, a lot of the community.

D

You know trying to get just trying to get insurance for their houses they're paying two to three times what they're currently paying you know this year to get insurance for next year and replacing the roof and replacing the road and having to replace the roof to get insurance out of their pocket and.

E

D

Think you know we're throwing fuel on the fire bite, telling them 200 bucks, but.

E

Then, there's that ratio of house value to what you're paying in taxes going back to the sea wall assessment, your house went up four hundred thousand dollars the proportion of what you paid before for a sea wall assessment. You know what is that increase if that track the increase of the value of your home?

E

What's the correlation there, just out of curiosity, you know too yeah.

D

But I don't think the the general.

E

They won't think that way, but I'm just saying you know the valuation of your home has gone up as well everything's more expensive from the loaf of bread to that.

H

May be something you're going to have to deal with too is the overall. All of your cost of living has just gone crazy nuts in the past two years. So now you're saying you got to help with this so they'll be saying you know where to get what everything else do. So it's a double business yeah.

B

H

B

It in a swamp yeah. No, I didn't realize that so I I would love to see us go in there with a recommendation and- and you know, if it's 140- to bring it up to 70 700, um but again that 140 doesn't address the uh the category 5 uh area there.

G

B

So perhaps uh I'm warming up up to your proposal here ian.

G

I, like kristin, saying it's going to cost 200 more a year and they're going to yell at her.

G

B

Not a bad, that's a bad thing too. You're.

G

B

For city council, what that's a bad bad move too, because you know you just start turning people against the people that are supporting them. I mean that's right. What do you want to do? Do you want to.

G

Go in there with the 200.

B

uh You know I quite honestly, I would I I think. That's I think, if that's what it's going to take, we have to start being honest with ourselves and saying this is what it's going to take. This is.

E

This is the number it's not everything it's going to take, but that's a it.

F

E

In the right direction,.

F

Let me just throw something out there because, as as a thought, um if you're only just discussing or saying hey, we think the priority is the sea walls and maybe not the lock right. The lock widening project.

F

This is where you've got 500 000 that we have set aside for construction right now,.

C

F

You're delaying that you could maybe phase it in you know, but we don't know what's going to happen, we don't have a crystal ball either. So do you protect that 500 000 and just leave it alone and say: hey we're still leaving that aside, hoping that the prices are going to come back down or do you say, hey we'll use that to kind of offset this for now and then use the other funds say. The increase is really for the lock winding project.

F

You could kind of do it one of two ways, you know say: hey we're going to take some money that we already had set aside for a project. We don't have enough for right now, we'll use that for the sea walls, but we have to increase your assessment, but now that's for the lock widening.

F

You know you could kind of do it. Whichever way you want to look at it because you do have that money, that's not being spent right now, because we don't have enough funds to complete that project.

B

You know that's a a great suggestion.

B

I'm still more biased to being uh totally honest with folks and say: hey look! This is what it's going to take to do this, oh.

F

Yeah, we definitely think at least. We definitely think we're going to.

E

F

I'm just saying you're doing.

E

An inner fund loan to itself right.

F

E

To start the process of the walls faster.

F

Right but like.

E

Still do the same increase you're.

F

Still going to need some kind of increase, but you're just saying it's, what are you some people will say well, why are you keeping that 500 000 for three years?

F

Okay in your reserve, so that's the only part, I'm trying to say yeah.

G

Yeah so use part of the five hundred thousand to augment the income.

F

As a possibility, depending on what comes out as the priorities right, so if you're saying the lock whiting project, we've got a five year permit, we don't feel we can do it right now, we're gonna hold off a couple years. You could use your reserves and then start building the amount. The amount that you, the amount that you start taking in.

F

You still would need like the increase, but you could start building it towards your lock project or some of your other projects, so that way, you're not showing 500 000 in reserves for five years or three years say three years, because we want to start the project. Before we run the permit runs out.

F

um You wouldn't be showing that 500 000 just sitting there waiting for the economy to turn.

E

We still need to throw money at that. You still.

F

Have to throw money at it, you can't say that we wouldn't need a rate increase. It's just that you could say we're going to start using the reserves for the sea walls and start we now. The rate increase that is needed is to to do your second priority, your lock-winding project, it's like. What's the priority.

B

No, I get that you know what I'm afraid of is. If I look at this and put a different hat on you know, every year I get five percent less seawall accomplished for the same money that I'm spending and at what point do you double that? That's nine years I think is like you know you have half as much in nine years as as uh you have that time, I'm more anxious to.

F

Don't have to say it that way, like I said, I was just throwing it out there, because some people look at your reserves. You know, would look at your reserves if you're showing the 500 000 set.

E

F

For the project, as long as they understand, hey, that's for a specific project that just couldn't happen because of that we can just still present it as the 200 is for the seawall. I just wanted to share that, because um I've gotten beat up by the utility advisory board, sometimes because we have a large reserve but they're first for projects and they go. You got too much reserves and it's no. We have projects scheduled for it, but yeah.

H

And this may help too, I just made thinking the land acquisition for staging and the corner widening in my opinion, are tied at the hip. That's signing these twins, you don't want one without the other. Well,.

E

You really can't have one without the other.

H

Because you've got one parcel up in the north corner, because that's 1.2 million we're saying 1 million to widen the inlet. Has anybody said what if we don't get the quarters, if we bypass that- and we just do the inlet widening and we run out of lots again, I'm going back to the logistics thing. What does that number become.

B

So we cover 80 over 80 percent of the residents, as seawall residences in the community get covered without widening the corners. So.

H

Understand so I'm just saying that to me they're kind of hitched together. Why are you widening the inlet if you're going to want the staging areas and the corner way, because.

B

When we had hurricane irma, we couldn't get anybody to bid working on this and.

H

Let me understand that so, which one is the better to do. Is it better to develop internal because then we're not hauling all the crap through the inlet to go, find another place to put it and how much is how much a year would our assessment go up because that's the logistical envelope we decided to go with you know and not do the quarters so yeah, you spent a million dollars, but now every year it's going to cost you another 300 000 in travel time and logistics, so kind of. Where does that pay off?

H

And you know that I'm just.

E

Yeah that got to a guaranteed staging site, the other one we don't even know if that person will be willing to sell the parcel and there's only one parcel. You know in essence,.

H

And you don't want.

C

To check your hand.

H

E

H

Said he wants to buy this for.

C

H

Land, that's the st the county owns and go try to buy that from them.

E

No road access, though, for theirs to you know so it makes.

H

It just say no road access. Does that mean there's mangroves between where that's at and the road.

E

That means that we would have to buy someone else's property to get to where the county's property starts.

H

It's I don't know if the whole, if you put them all in neat little packages, what's the lowest cost, if you do it that way, in other words, what's our logistics because we're moving over there and do this and then what's our logistics if we have to go out of town over to pgi or wherever the store or.

C

H

Somewhere between here- and I guess, 75 bridge- is what they're looking at, because they even look at that marina. That's over what I heard.

E

That was one thing that was looked at yet right on.

H

That canal assessment, that the contractor did.

E

Well, that's like the only commercial yard around really I mean there's slim.

H

E

H

So it's I don't know if the exercise has been done and say what it's going to cost. If we just do the inlet widening and we don't do the other versus if we did buy the land and did the corn of whiting in the long run, that yearly increase may go down where, if you don't it's just going to keep going on, because logistics is going to get any cheaper year after year and once they get the taste, they ain't going to give up that money.

F

So question because I I'm just going to try and paraphrase so: if you did the inlet one whitening project but didn't do the others. What are the consequences? But I thought you need all three if you're still trying to get a barge in there during the low tides right, like not the non-summer months right.

E

Then that would allow mcg to come into the system, but they would I mean they could do what they do now: break everything down on lowboy and mobilize it into the staging yard and splash it there possibly and then push in a sectional barge piece by piece through the narrow, lock, okay,.

H

So they're not set up, they could permanently anchor or moor up against a dock. On that.

E

H

E

Want to leave a barge there year round. I.

H

Understand that would be the other question. They really need that extra attention.

E

They're not in there working often enough to warrant.

H

Keeping a piece of it and that's another thing there too, so yeah yeah they'll, have to splash slumbers.

B

So the thinking at least four years ago, dave was that you can cover over 80 percent of the community without um without widening a corner. At this point, all right so and I don't remember exactly what the number was, but it was like 80 or 82 percent sticks in my head and um of the community by way of doing that, so the priority at that time, yep and the history saying hey. If nobody's going to quote doing business in here because they're busy in easier places, we waited a year.

B

I think before we got the seawall, maybe a little bit longer um addressed. That was.

C

B

They're thinking that I mean you know and it could change, but.

H

But do you understand what I mean if, if we don't get performers.

C

H

We don't get that piece of dirt every year, you're still gonna make four trips in and out to do, each lot or.

B

Yeah we gotta, we gotta, look at some place uh else to do that when the lots completely disappear. That's right and that's.

H

What I was saying too, if you could have a some real or imagine somebody on the board, maybe a realtor. You know council or have access to that. What is our projected lot consumption in bsi and when does that become a hard wall.

E

And I was running those analysis when I got data sets that come in from the county, and then I was running those um I haven't been able to do one in a bit now. I've got two different sets of data sitting there in my email that I need to get.

H

E

They're, probably gonna want to know.

H

That you know, when is all this yeah.

E

And I made it yeah, I'm hoping I can get that processed in time for that public meeting. But I do have that down to um to see where we're at staging wise.

B

And gary speaking of the meeting I mean: do you have the map.

B

Is it a wise thing to even display that that says here's the assessment of the sea walls as they stand? Is that something we even want to present.

A

We talked about that. I think it would put some people in a panic.

B

Maybe that's a good thing.

E

Inspire some votes well.

D

I found out mine was a category five, if you were right, didn't put me into a panic. Of course. It's kind of made me more aware that at some point time, something's going to have to be done. You know it's not like it's falling into the canal right now, but I agree that if we show that to everybody, I think they're just going to fly off the handle and demand stuff to get done like instantly.

H

D

H

D

200, that's right, yeah, which truly is a bargain. In my opinion,.

B

Okay, so what are we going with here?.

G

Sounds like 200.

A

I agree, I think what we need to prepare for the public meeting is some kind of recommendation from you guys um how you want to do it. We've already discussed priorities. We know the c-ball replacement is a priority. The lock widening is the next priority all right. I think we just need a recommendation as to what you want to present. As far as how much you want to increase the assessment, I think I.

F

Think that's what they were just discussing. Do you have any.

G

Questions I like the idea of leaving the 500 000, where it is. I do too so.

A

I didn't know if you.

G

Wanted to take advantage.

A

Of the scenario that kristen presented to you about your reserves with that 500 000.

C

A

We currently have in the account using that as a partial which might reduce your assessment rates.

E

But they almost need to, they almost would have to step.

F

Up because we still need to fill that reserve back up yeah, we still have those just shuffling it, so it.

E

Still has to go up.

F

I guess it doesn't matter unless someone brings it up, you know what I mean. um That's how we would answer.

G

F

G

Robbing peter to pay paul yeah and unless.

F

Someone just says: hey: we need to put this lock lining project on hold for a long time. You know what I mean they decide that that would be the only case that someone would if it became not a priority at all,.

B

So let's do this, then. So, let's go with the recommendation for the 200 increase in the assessment. Let's focus on a large portion of the sea walls this coming year that need to be addressed.

B

Let's keep the channel uh uh widening the barge access and let's talk about in terms of barge access, not although there's a huge safety issue there too, that we ought to point out um as a priority and in the next meeting or the meeting after that, whichever is convenient to to you folks for your schedule.

B

Let's take a deeper dive on the um the channel corner, widening and- and you know again, my question would be: can you even get to those corners based off of um gary? You had that really good uh presentation. You did um six months ago that talked about where all the rock ledges and stuff were.

E

Oh, I remember that yeah, you remember.

B

E

uh That esri link up with that uh mapping that I built.

B

Yeah with the bathroom metrics.

E

And stuff terrific.

B

I mean that was just nice job. That was a really nice job. Let's, let's take a deeper dive on that and say. If we even did straighten out this corner, could I get a 28 foot barge with spuds on the side through this? I don't know that you you know I was. I haven't been through there in four or five years. I was like.

E

It depends on how I mean the channel corner widening. We didn't set a level on that, so I mean we can make if, if that project is selected to move forward, we're going to make the corners wide enough to get that barge around so no matter where it is now, we can just dig back further, but the costs go up mangrove mitigation. If it's all rock, then we're you know you're trying to get through the rock we're.

H

Gonna move the rock right well, and- and do we even know that do you even.

E

H

What the the topography is there.

B

E

Yeah yeah, he does so you know it's.

H

Ledge or it's sand.

E

Well, just based on some of the contouring, you can see what and then I've got them identified. Based on what we found when we did our post bathymetric survey and we were doing our soundings, they had like a pole and we were going down and you know, hey.

C

You could tell that's.

E

Rock yeah, and so those.

H

Is more identified, 20 30 foot pipe with a one inch hose or off it.

E

Like a jet one, don't.

H

E

H

It takes you down it'll just blow right through the sand till you hit hard bottom. So you know here hard bottom is a foot below the silt or the sand level. Another place it could be five feet and you're good.

E

H

E

That kind of thing.

H

And I don't just.

E

Let me know if it's worth.

H

Pursuing unless we know you can really even do it, what do you think, john? You.

B

Know I I completely agree, I I you know it's just south of deluca, that's skinny! That's a skinny uh body of water.

C

B

I I'm not sure it's even 30 feet wide. In there I mean there's even ledge.

H

On the landowners right behind their seawall, I know there's one place they can't put on a freaking boat, lift because it's.

C

H

They could never get the boat down. Yeah we've.

E

Seen one that someone put a boat lift in in elevert and the bottom of it was on top of the rock wedge. They punched two holes for the arms yeah and how'd you get away with that. The boat will never float off that lift in the winter yeah.

B

Yeah so let's schedule that for uh one of the next meetings coming up and then that's our answer for how we're addressing this and the public's invited come sit and listen to us.

A

So I do want to mention to you our schedule. Okay, so today was a workshop to discuss what we're discussing today and then we're going to have our public meeting on the second and that's just a public education information meeting. No, no decisions will be made publicly okay and then we're going to meet again in may and that's when we're going to decide on the budget, because kristin still has to present the budget to council.

A

She has a schedule.

A

So so we have to make a decision at our at our main meeting, but I think you guys will have a better idea of what you want to do and how you want to move forward.

B

So, let's move forward with the understanding that we're going to increase it by two 200: um let's listen to people now kathy. How do you want to manage this meeting? How do you see the agenda developing.

A

uh So we're going to have a representative from taylor engineering there to field questions about the seawall study. If people had questions about that, I have a little. I have a small uh powerpoint presentation, I'm going to give the history of the seawall assessment, the history of bsi kristin's, going to have us a powerpoint presentation over the budget and then we're going to field questions.

E

It's almost like an education campaign is what we're going for, because that's what council's asked us to do is right. So the goal there is to educate, you know, educate them on why we need to increase the assessments and, what's the background before behind it, and what's going.

A

On in your neighborhood and then.

E

It becomes a fluid conversation from there.

B

So, are you anticipating that any of the uh canal advisory committee, I'm assuming we'll all be there number one but you're, not assuming a presentation or questions and answers from.

A

Nope we we we're not expecting any participation from you guys. Okay, all right, we hope you'll be there. So you can hear everything. That's being said, it will not be tape recorded okay. So it's not like you can go back and and look at it because we don't have the electronics for that. Okay are.

F

You I would ask, though, are you okay with us, saying that we have presented this to the board and the board was recommending a 200 assessment based.

H

Upon what we know, based.

F

On what you know at this time? Yes, okay, just because this way they know what you're thinking you know what I mean or what possibly and that way we get additional input. um What was I going to say um oh to address? I know you mentioned about people that maybe want to come during the day so like these, these meetings are always here during the day and they're advertised, but you don't get a lot, but at that meeting or if you know people they could come to the the may meeting.

F

You know the next meeting um to give their additional input as well. So if you feel like there's people that weren't able to make the 5 30., you know it's better to have the conversations now than later, so if they would be willing to come to one of your meetings at 1 30, um that would also be okay.

B

And my final question is: how have we taken to advertise this? I think we're looking for a bigger turnout rather than a smaller turnout.

A

Correct so I am working with melissa, who's assistant city manager to do the advertising the city manager has already put an article in the newspaper about it. I was going to get to it when, on that agenda item, I'm asking that the burn store aisles advertise it on your website. Okay, we're going to do everything we can to just start putting this out.

B

Have we considered sending a letter? I know it's expensive, but.

A

It is expensive.

B

A

It is expensive, I I was really hoping that we could do it through your website, but if that, if that's what you want, we can do that.

B

What do you guys think.

H

I think the only ones you get pushback are the the snowbirds that won't be here and don't even know it, because they could care less. What's going on vsi when they're in michigan.

G

Yeah right, the bsi website only goes out to the members of the assistant.

C

And these only members and that's not 100.

H

C

H

Yeah looks like it's half of us.

E

The council member, we were asking the council members to hit their distribution list facebook yeah, um whatever other means of our normal.

D

Next door, next door website. Yes, that's part.

A

Of it yeah yeah, that's part of our facebook stuff, so.

B

Okay, to send a letter to everybody, I think the cost was two thousand or twenty four hundred bucks is that right.

A

Stamps have gone up since the last time we talked.

H

About so I don't know, plus you got the the person, that's the stuff, the envelopes and look at the stamps yeah.

C

H

Though you don't look at me, you know what I'm talking about so you're gonna pay their salary and you gotta have. However, many copies.

C

H

Envelopes, so that's I don't. I don't even know if you can do it for two thousand dollars or about a postcard yeah.

A

And and here's another issue that I face in pgi, a lot is uh the rentals okay, so we're sending the letter to the address, but they may be a rental. So now I've got to try to send the letter to the property owner who is out of state? We don't know if they're in flocks of traveling or wherever they're at okay.

E

All within a week, right.

A

B

Okay, so um ian, could you follow up with the uh um the community association um I'm? I was on next door. I'm no longer on next door. um Can somebody we.

A

B

Did they cut you off? Oh, I got so pissed off.

C

Oh, that happens.

H

To me all the time too, yeah.

H

There's something that says: hey, because that's probably some people that aren't member of the association, because it's not mandatory to be either one.

E

We all got two entrances right. We can always set like we do for zoning notices.

C

Put a little sign.

E

Out of the two entrances just to let them know, I mean that's something.

A

Everybody pay attention, I mean that's.

E

That's a challenge, I'm just thinking yeah, that's true.

A

Yeah: okay, we could do something 50.

F

A

G

Yes, okay, so it's.

B

uh Herdsme courtney.

H

I'll call him that's what you're gonna be up against this meeting. Do we do that? Can.

I

We uh not have the side conversations just make sure we're all speaking in the microphone. Okay,.

B

um So we'll take care of the association, um the two of us. If there's other people dave, can you take care of the fishing club you're? Well, the boat club I'll spoke something.

H

Out to him, yeah.

G

Just tell me what you want to.

H

G

Who's doing the science city doing the signs we're doing the sign said.

A

You'll, do the science remember the city will do the signs we'll put the signs up at the two entrances? Okay, not a problem.

G

Engineers, don't can't spell, I got the association I'll call uh well, I can go.

C

G

Information director, okay and you don't do next- I.

D

Do next door just.

G

Can you do let.

B

D

Verbiage yeah, you know exactly what we want to say absolutely.

G

There's a little thing uh at the end of the agenda that you got written there about yeah.

B

I think that would cover it. Let's say.

G

B

C

B

Meeting is scheduled for may 2nd at tornado's country club. It starts at 5 30 to discuss the canal maintenance assessment fees.

B

Okay, all right: okay,.

F

I was going to bring up one more thing, so this is just a small portion of the history of assessments, but I don't know if, when when we talked last year, once we had the seawall study, we had put some extra slides in and I don't know if it's something you would want us to have for the public meeting. But when the district started, you know the fees were very small because of course they were brand new sea walls right.

F

So I don't know if that helps but or paints. The picture of you know the needs now. You know because.

E

When it's 75 bucks, or something or.

F

Yeah, it was very small for years and years for years and years because there were new sea walls, you weren't having failures. You know it's mainly just maintaining the canal system versus the actual sea walls until you get into they.

E

Got a heck of a deal for a lot of years.

F

Yes, so I didn't know if that would be helpful or not so.

B

F

Just direct me and.

B

Yeah, my bias would be to put it in, although the the one thing I would do is I I would go light on content and and long on on snapshot pieces here. You know that's um because we don't need the uh retired accountants to come in and question what you know, process we're using for depreciating.

B

You know whatever um yeah and- and you know my bias would be to be factual and keep it short and throw it out there. Just you know, bullet points.

F

Yeah, so we did try to keep this one short, but yeah.

B

Impossible, you know.

F

It is, but um there really weren't that many slides we've come before the board many times with various scenarios, but we tried to say: okay, that's where we came up with hey. How much does a hundred dollars get you in revenue and here's all your issues? And what do you want to focus on so.

H

And I'm not saying it's gonna, be I'm sure, there's gonna be some people like naysayers. How do we do one have anything in our back pocket when an individual says if if those category fives aren't broke, why we fix them right now, and I don't know if we need some type of verbiage, they are pro.

E

They are broken, that's certainly but they're, not in the water yet, but exactly right. So.

H

E

H

E

Five falls down and it ends up pulling down good wall on either side and now we're not. There.

H

And that's what I'm saying you may need some part of a go-to. You know from here's this slide, you click a little button and it takes you over to how to win that argument on a subset of the powerpoint presentation, because I mean I did that I don't know how many times when I was doing stuff that you knew there was going to be something hit there and you just had a hot key and it took you right to another five pages. That explained why you don't want to do it that way.

H

So I'm just thinking that may be something else they can. We have to volunteer it, but it's in their back pocket. They know where to click. The link and you'll have something to run with that way.

C

H

Because there's got to be people says it ain't broke. Why am I fixed it? Yeah? You say it's it's susceptible to failure, but it hasn't failed. So why do you want another 200, a month or a year or going up to 700 a year?

H

I'm just thinking of the pushback and then you can have those hot, but they can put those easy in a powerpoint presentation and just it's at the back here. It's all in backup.

A

Yeah we'll show them pictures of armor.

E

Yeah we'll come up with something for that.

H

Just something that you've got ammo to shoot back with, instead of loading their gun, all the time you need to load. Yours.

F

Yeah, I mean I totally agree, and so um I think it you know just as a point to that is that again, sometimes it's better to be proactive versus hey. Now it's falling in.

F

Can you get someone to come fix it right away? Yeah.

B

And it took your neighbor's wall down with it, yeah yeah yeah, so.

F

We can put that together and.

E

When walls fail, it usually takes out docks lifts. I mean all those things that could be impacted by a wall falling. That's.

H

That could be part of your get out of jail.

E

And that cost goes right back on the homeowner, so.

H

Let's get it out of the system now when we can get it out and that kind of stuff would be beneficial to support your case. You know: well, here's here's. Why right.

C

H

The whoops, if you don't do it and you got to pay for all this stuff, yeah.

E

That's on them. You.

H

E

At that point, you don't spread the love at all. At that point,.

B

Okay, kristen, we got anything else. You need anything else.

F

From us, no, we kind of talked about everything, so I think we're all set. You know we had the one last slide, but we talked about it as part of our stuff. Thank.

C

F

So much I appreciate you. Oh thank.

H

You thank you discussion. This is old business. Probably um what did the the city lawyer and all that say about the legality? It was up way in the front that it was going to go to the city lawyer to find out who could sit on committees.

G

The revision of the.

H

The definition to be on one of these commitments- oh.

B

It's one of those city minutes. uh I did see that.

H

But we didn't, I didn't see a response of what the city lawyer said, because I had questioned that any it was the way it was written. Anybody could sit on this committee and I said well any.

B

Resident considering any resident.

H

And the resident was defined you own property, but your real residence in which michigan you see.

D

What I'm saying and so.

C

D

H

To be a voting citizen of florida to set on this committee legally.

I

Right, this is uh recording secretary leah hughes for the record. um So as far as that, we I didn't bring. I'm just the minutes, make or you know taker. So I just put it what it was.

H

In there, but I didn't see where it got formed out to anybody, but.

I

That's not part of what I do so, whoever I know I don't have the minutes with me, but whoever takes charge of that or uh if staff does. I just take the minutes. I'm the person on the wall take the minute. So whoever don't get you.

H

I just didn't, I don't know. The city attorney had said.

I

If that was ever brought up to him or not.

C

Hi for the record rick keaney, director of public works that was uh brought up to the city attorney during the discussion by the city clerk's office. He was comfortable with the way it was written that it satisfied your all right.

H

He's comfortable with it.

C

So uh council did uh review. It approve the okay by laws recommended. Thank you.

B

C

B

um Do we have any questions or comments uh from staff.

I

Well so yep under staff comments. um I just wanted to point out that um that there are the meeting dates for 2022, which you guys had already approved of. I just wanted. um This shouldn't affect you guys so much because of where your meetings fall, but as of after july, 13th through august, ninth or no, it shouldn't be till august their um it needs that that whole time to set up the military- oh, my goodness military heritage, museum um to set up to be able to take.

I

I'm sorry have meetings there. So they need that whole month to be able to set that up. So it shouldn't affect you guys, but if it does, we will let you know you might have to have the august meeting cancelled, we'll let you know um now. As far as the 2023 are after august, though, we will be meeting at the military heritage museum. Are you guys aware of that? Ernie? Okay, so did you have any questions about the dates that are.

B

Dates, stay the same right, dates and times.

I

Yeah you there shouldn't be any issues with you guys um because, like I said it's.

H

I don't know why, why is it having to be moved? I didn't really see that they remodeling in here.

I

Yeah this whole, um this section is not gonna, be done until you know july, but um we're all moved out already out of there. So we're down in herald court as of monday, so yeah everything's going to be renovated and so for almost two years, pretty much we're going to be taking or having meetings there now and the reason why it's so important for you guys um to adopt the 2023 dates too is so that is we're giving that to the military heritage museum and they will put that on their calendar.

I

The only thing that will be an issue or that won't be an issue with those dates, is, if there's a cancellation, but if you adopt those dates, that's how it's going to stay. So would you be able to make a motion to adopt the 2023 dates if you had a chance to look at them I'll.

H

Make the motion second.

I

B

All in favor not opposed.

I

All right so, like I said you should all um we'll, let you know if anything changes with august, but as of now it should be good. Okay,.

C

I

C

B

Any comments from the board: anybody could we caught this to death. I think right. Okay and we have no citizens we're good all right, we're done. We.

A

Wanted to um we're not down. Oh, I just wanted to reiterate about the public meeting. I will send um all of you guys a little blurb about the public meeting that way. If you have a way to advertise, it some way shape or form you'll have a little blurb. It's just going to be like public. You know what I'm saying so I'm going to send that to you and we're going to start reaching out and all that other stuff. Okay,.

B

Okay, I need to get this to lead.

C

Just one last thing: uh rick keaney, director of public works. uh So this is my last meeting I retired at the end of the month. Didn't know if you knew or not, but congratulations thank you for 42-year career, so uh so uh very blessed to have worked here and worked with with you, folks and and the folks before you so had a wonderful time, and I appreciate your continued support of this amazing staff that you have in canal, maintenance and engineering and uh they do such wonderful things.

C

So you couldn't have a better team that you're working with. So thank you and uh rick.

H

Thank you, that's your replacement been identified. Yet. Is it good.

C

No, it hasn't only going out, not officially no it's not, but yes, it has been. I'm gonna.

G

Stay in the local area, oh.

C

Yeah I was born and raised here and I'm gonna pass.

B

C

Here so this is my home: oh yeah I'll be around I'm not leaving the area I plan on doing some camping and there you go a little bit of traveling so but uh yeah. Well, congratulations.

H

All right, thank you. So much trust us.

A

You will be seriously missed.

G

By the way, you won't have any time left because you're busier, when you're retired than you are and you're working on that.

H

And that honeydew plant just grows.

D

G

During the meeting I.