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A
A
Thumbs
up
melania
can
we
do
a
quick
little
roll
call.
C
Absolutely
chris
good
evening,
everyone
and
welcome.
We
have
chris
renee
julie,
bruce
emily,
annie
marcella,
and
then
we
have
presenters
caitlyn
c,
and
I
am
so
sorry
if
I'm
get
to
not
pronounce
your
name
correctly.
Anna
jane
yolkin
welcome
everybody.
If
I
missed
anyone,
please
let
me
know
so.
I
can
capture
that
in
a
roll
call.
Otherwise
we
can
move
forward.
A
We're
missing
gino,
zamora
and
mary
louise.
A
Sounds
good
we
weren't
going
to
do
approval
of
the
minutes,
but
we
have
to
make
some
additional
corrections
to
that.
So
we're
skipping
that
so
we're
on
the
communications
from
the
co-chairs.
E
D
No,
I
just
I
I'll
be
sending
well
I'll,
save
that
for
the
working
group
updates.
I
don't
have
anything
yeah.
A
I
just
wanted
to
thank
valedia
for
the
presentation
and
everyone
that
either
gave
input
or
clearly
participating
in
this
committee
is
part
of
that,
but
it
went
well
there
weren't
any
questions,
not
many
questions
anyway.
You
know
looks
like
everyone
seems
to
be
pretty
happy
with
our
work
and
I
think
julia
at
the
meeting
where
we
did
the
presentation.
A
Oh
there's
gino,
hi
gina.
We
can
mark
gina
down
julie,
informed
us
that
the
contract
with
unm
had
finally
been
approved.
Do
we
have
any
more
updates
on
that
julie.
A
F
A
So
our
legal
approved
the
changes
that
they've
made,
so
they
should
just
they
should
be
okay
with
it.
But
julia
will
keep
us
updated
on
that
any
communication
from.
C
Yes,
hi
everyone
again
and
welcome
gino
I
will
be
sending
as
you
are
action
item
email,
follow-up
tomorrow
and
I
would
just
like
to
have
some
confirmation
for
upcoming
presentations
for
the
remaining
of
august
and
september
and
whatever,
wherever
possible
for
october
and
november,
so
expect
an
action
item.
Email
from
me.
Thank
you.
So
much.
A
Oh
sorry,
did
you
have
any
anything
else
from
communications.
F
I
was
gonna,
go
ahead
and
send
an
updated
calendar
with
all
the
calendar
dates
coming
for
the
rest
of
this
calendar
year
and
I'll
go
ahead
and
send
that
out
on
friday,
I
did
get
the
closed
captioning
on
zoom,
which
was
a
work
of
technological
magic.
So.
F
That
set
up
for
better
access
and
I
believe,
that's
it
and
I'll
have
the
meeting
minutes
adjusted
for
the
next
meeting
in
two
weeks.
Great.
A
Thank
you
next
we're
on
to
a
presentation,
the
overdose
prevention
center
expert
panel.
Emily
did
you
want
to
say
anything
before
we
get
started
with
the
presentation.
H
Yeah,
thank
you
and
good
to
be
here.
I
want
to
welcome
kaylynn
and
anna
jane.
They
have
agreed
to
present
tonight
they're
both
on
the
east
coast,
so
we
have
to
big
big
props
for
coming
out
so
late
for
this
important
work
I
wanted
before
I
introduced
them
and
they'll
they'll
talk.
H
I
just
wanted
to
remind
folks
that
we
did
have
a
present
mini
presentation
on
the
alternatives
to
policing
drug
use
and
one
of
those
recommendations
was
to
expand
harm
reduction
services
in
the
city
of
santa
fe,
which
included
overdose
prevention.
Centers
folks
may
have
heard
it.
You
know
it's
often
called
supervised
consumption
services
or
overdose
prevention
programs,
we're
referring
to
it
tonight
as
overdose
prevention,
centers,
and
just
a
reminder
of
what
we
mean
by
overdose
prevention
centers.
H
These
are
legal,
safe
spaces
for
people
to
consume
pre-obtained
drugs
under
the
super
supervision
of
trained
staff,
without
fear
of
arrest,
with
access
to
sterile
consumption,
equipment,
overdose,
reversal,
medication,
drug
checking
tools,
as
well
as
connections
to
critical
health
and
social
services.
H
So
with
that
I'd
love
to
do
a
I
I
know,
kaylynn
and
and
jane
will
do
their
own
introductions,
but
both
anna
jane
and
caitlin
are
important
allies
and
partners
to
the
drug
policy
alliance,
and
so
our
organization
has
worked
closely
with
both
of
them
for
many
years
and
just
thrilled
to
support
their
advocacy
and
success
in
this
space,
because
it's
it's
really
they're,
really
leading
the
way
for
the
rest
of
the
country
on
the
implementation
of
these
really
important
sites.
H
Support
services
and
kaelyn
c
is
the
senior
director
of
programs
for
onpoint
nyc
and,
as
we
talked
at
our
last
presentation
on
this
subject
in
2021,
new
york
city
opened
two
supervised,
or
I
need
to
get
that
overdose
prevention,
centers
one
in
harlem
and
one
in
washington,
heights,
east,
harlem
those
neighborhoods
and
so
we're
gonna
very
excited
to
hear
how
that
has
been
going
opportunity
for
us
to
think
about
whether
this
is
a
model.
H
That's
right
for
santa
fe
and
what
that
might
look
like,
and
anna
jane
really
led,
the
being
the
first
state
to
actually
pass
statewide
authorization
legislation
to
authorize
the
opening
of
overdose
prevention
centers
in
rhode
island.
So
we
have
a
lot
to
learn.
Thank
you
both
for
being
here
and
also
I'll
just
mention
that,
just
yesterday
afternoon,
california
sent
their
bill
to
the
governor's
desk,
so
yay
rhode
island,
usually
it's
california
or
new
york,
that
those
two
states
that
often
lead
in
some
of
this
reform.
H
But
thanks
to
rhode
island
for
paving
the
way
there
so
with
that,
I'm
going
to
hand
it
over
to
kailyn
and
then
anna
jane
and
then
we'll
open
it
up
for
discussion.
J
I'm
going
to
jump
into
a
presentation
sort
of
halfway
through
it
because
we
don't
have
a
ton
of
time.
Do
I
have
sheen
screen
share
abilities.
I
think
I
do
oh.
I
don't.
I
J
So,
as
I
said,
we're
gonna
jump
in
kind
of
at
the
halfway
mark
for
a
much
bigger
presentation,
because
we
don't
have
a
ton
of
time,
but
I
just
wanted
to
touch
on
a
few
things.
One
that
overdose
prevention
centers
are
an
infinitely
scalable
and
adaptable
intervention,
and
that's
one
of
the
things
that
make
them
such
a
an
important
resource
for
our
strategic
planning
around
the
public
health
crisis
of
the
overdose
intervention
or
sorry
overdose
crisis.
They
can
be
fixed
site
like
the
ones
that
we
have
in
new
york.
J
They
can
also
be
a
medical
model.
We
have
that.
We
also
have
a
peer
and
consumer-led
model.
That's
our
washington
heights
site.
They
can
also
be
co-located
within
housing
and
shelter,
and
I've
worked
and
helped
open
examples
of
this
in
vancouver,
canada.
I
know
that
this
is
a
model
that
santa
fe
might
be
interested
in.
It
can
also
be
co-located
within
a
medical
facility
or
a
hospital.
J
We
have
a
hospital
here
in
new
york
city
that
is
considering
this
option.
There's
also
an
opc
embedded
within
a
hospital
in
paris
also
embedded
within
a
hospital
in
vancouver
canada
as
well,
and,
what's
so
amazing
about
that
model?
Is
we
find
miraculous?
J
Things
can
happen
when
you
actually
enable
drug
users
to
access
health
care
a
little
bit
more
on
their
terms
that
bouncing
away
from
health
care
discharging
ama
is
really
reduced
when
people
can
access
and
utilize
their
drugs
of
choice
safely,
while
while
sort
of
engaging
in
care
which
is
a
human
right,
it's
a
human
right
to
access
medical
care
and
to
finish
medical
care,
and
that's
often
a
really
difficult
kind
of
tension
or
point
of
tension
for
people
who
use
drugs.
J
Except
for
in
these.
In
these
unique
circumstances
it
can
be
co-located
within
a
detox
or
treatment
program,
and
this
is
my
favorite
thing
to
talk
about.
This
is
insight
where
I
used
to
work
in
canada
on
the
ground
floor
is
the
safer
consumption
site
that,
at
its
height,
was
seeing
1500
visits
a
day.
J
The
second
floor,
operated
by
the
same
harm
reduction
program
operated
by
the
safe
consumption
site,
was
detoxification
services
and
then
on
the
top
floor
was
long-term
treatment
treatment.
It
isn't
antithetical
to
co-locate
these
kinds
of
services
together
harm
reduction
services
and
more
abstinence-based
services.
In
fact,
it
works
really
beautifully
because
it
allows
to
capitalize
on
that
very
short
window.
When
some
sort
of
conversation
around
recovery
may
be
happening,
post-overdose
we're
no
longer
needing
to
refer
out
or
add
people
to
wait
lists.
J
There
can
be
a
mobile
model
and
this
can
look
a
lot
of
different
ways.
So
I've
got
a
couple
examples
up
here
of
our
old
mobile
model
and
then
the
mobile
model
in
montreal
on
the
right.
You
see
the
aftermath
of
an
overdose
intervention.
J
This
was
a
morning
where
we
had
11
overdoses
within
an
hour
and
a
half
and
two
simultaneous
cardiac
arrests.
Somebody
had
put
borax
in
the
drug
supply,
one
of
the
dealers
came,
and
let
us
know
that
this
was
happening
and
people
started
just
dropping
one
after
another
at
our
mobile
vehicle.
There
everybody
survived,
and
we
had
feedback
from
ems
that
they
would
no
longer
be
dispatching
ambulances
to
us,
because
our
team
was
so
effectively
triaging.
J
This
intense
and
unrelenting
medical
emergency
emergency
that
they
were
going
to
divert
their
their
rates,
their
ambulances
to
other
parts
of
the
neighborhood
to
triage
those
folks,
so
the
mobile
model
can
be
very,
very
effective
and
then
the
virtual
model-
you
all
know
about
this
here-
are
a
couple
examples
of
some
of
the
virtual
programs
that
are
popping
up.
J
Never
use
alone
is
operating
across
the
u.s
in
puerto
rico
and
then
the
brave
app
is
an
example
of
what's
happening
in
canada,
and
this
is
essentially
sort
of
a
souped-up
version
of
facetime
with
some
patient-directed
functions.
So
you
can
see
in
the
middle
of
your
screen
that
the
caller
is
notified
if
the
user
is
not
responsive,
but
the
person
who
is
consuming
drugs
controls
the
interaction,
so
you
can
press
I'm.
J
Okay,
the
green
button
there
you
see
in
the
center
of
your
screen,
but
if
you
don't
within
a
certain
number
of
seconds,
the
next
phase
of
the
initiative
will
be
activated,
which
is
dispatching
an
ambulance
to
your
geolocation
so
that
you
can
get
care.
These
are
all
versions
of
safer
consumption,
so,
specifically
in
new
york,
how
do
our
sites
work?
There
are
a
couple
very
unique
features
of
our
sites
that
are
a
little
bit
uncommon
and
safer
consumption.
J
J
J
Splitting
is
permitted.
This
means
you
can
come
in
with
a
friend
and
split
a
dose.
This
is
our
answer
to
people
who
are
in
survival,
drug
use
or
really
entrenched
in
poverty
and
sort
of
the
street
scene
who
may
need
to
engage
in
dangerous
behaviors
to
require
money
to
purchase
their
drugs,
so
this
would
be
women
in
the
survival
sex
trade
people
who
are
stealing
from
local
businesses.
J
This
is
an
effort
to
sort
of
really
address
the
community's
safety,
as
well
as
the
safety
of
the
people
who
are
consuming
drugs.
This
is
also
our
measure
to
control
drug
dealing
in
and
around
the
sites.
Safer
use
assistance
is
permitted.
J
There
are
no
time
limits
in
our
side,
our
site
time
limits
are
a
luxury
of
having
an
overdose
prevention
center.
They
allow
people
to
relax,
engage
with
our
health
educators.
Our
nurses
really
take
a
moment
to
practice
safely
and
to
think
about
dosing
to
prevent
overdoses.
J
All
of
our
staff
are
highly
trained,
even
at
our
washington
heights
location,
which
is
our
consumer-led
location,
meaning
most
of
the
folks
working
on
that
team
are
active
drug
consumers
themselves.
All
of
our
staff
are
trained
to
respond
at
the
level
of
a
registered
nurse.
We
really
believe
in
giving
those
professional
skills,
or
these
professional
skills,
to
paraprofessionals
to
be
very
effective
in
our
programs,
we're
very
low
threshold.
We
don't
ask
for
id
or
any
proof
of
identification,
and
our
registration
into
the
program
is
minutes
long.
That
doesn't
mean
that
it's
not
thorough.
J
We
have
strong
policies
around
conflict,
de-escalation
and
we
we
do
something
called
the
opportunity
to
correct
and
we
use
the
24-hour
clock
and
we
don't
really
have
too
much
time
to
get
into
that,
but
it's
a
very
holistic
approach
to
behavior
modification
that
works
very
well
in
our
sites
and
allows
us
to
be
very,
very
busy.
Working
with
you
know,
a
population
who
is
not
without
their
challenges
without
relying
on
traditional
security
mechanisms.
J
This
means
way
less
public
injection
way
less
discarded,
syringes
on
the
ground
way,
less
use
in
parks
and
public
spaces.
We
often
say
the
least
interesting
thing
that
happens
in
the
overdose
prevention
center
is
the
actual
drug
consumption.
The
most
interesting
thing
that
happens
is
the
beautiful
booth
side
care
that
becomes
very
fluid
and
organic.
When
you
have
a
captive
audience
consuming
drugs,
the
way
they
want
to
in
a
safe
environment
with
no
time
limit.
Suddenly
we
could
have
an
hour
to
work
with
someone
on
housing.
J
Mental
health
wound
care
hiv
care
whatever
it
may
be,
and
we're
really
seeing
that
in
the
overdose
prevention
centers
that
they
are
because
all
of
the
anxiety
and
the
stress
around
drug
consumption
is
gone,
the
readiness
to
engage
in
further
care
has
increased
significantly
and
both
of
our
overdose
prevention.
Centers
are
co-located
within
our
larger
program
and
for
for
us
that's
a
very
important
and
very
critical
piece.
J
Washington
heights
site,
as
I
said,
is
our
consumer-led
site.
It's
the
cheaper
of
the
two
models.
It's
also
a
little
bit
more
nimble
from
a
regulatory
perspective,
meaning
we're
not
dealing
with
clinician
licensing
issues,
given
that
we
don't
have
federal
or
state
permission
to
operate
in
our
program.
The
washington
heights
folks
are
quite
young.
J
The
average
age
is
26.,
they
are
a
high
volume
heroin
and
cocaine,
speed,
ball
population,
mostly
encampment
dwelling
or
otherwise
unhoused,
and
they
represent
the
majority
of
the
overdose
occurrences
in
our
program,
despite
fewer
registered
users
and
we'll
touch
on
that
in
a
second.
This
is
what
it
looks
like
you
can
see
very
simple
table.
Chair,
set
up
nice
clean
bright.
You
can
see
the
overdose
intervention
carts
there
and
a
little
bit
of
a
close-up
in
terms
of
what
supplies
are
located
in
there.
J
That
allows
us
to
intervene
so
effectively,
but
it's
a
very
simple
setup:
don't
have
time
to
watch
the
video
so
we're
just
going
to
skip
on
through
the
east.
Harlem
site
is
our
more
traditional
medical
model.
That
means
it's
a
higher
threshold
of
staff.
It's
also
the
more
widely
known
design,
build
big
stainless
steel
boost
the
big
mirrors,
etc.
J
We
have
registered
nurses
and
care
coordinators
working
on
that
team.
It's
an
older
population,
many
veterans
on
that
team.
It's
a
very
high
volume,
inhalation
population
smoking,
so
lots
of
smoking
heroin,
crack
fentanyl,
k2
meth,
you
name
it
mixed
in
terms
of
housing,
status,
summer,
house,
shelter,
dwelling
or
homeless,
and
it
has
a
much
lower
overdose
occurrence
rate
compared
to
the
washington
heights
program,
despite
a
very
much
significantly
higher
registered
users-
and
this
is
predominantly
because
of
the
mode
of
administration.
J
Smoking
is
less
risky
than
injection
from
an
overdose
standpoint,
and
this
is
what
the
east
harlem
site
looks
like
you
can
see
in
the
back
there.
You
can
see
the
smoking
room
in
the
back.
It's
got
eight
booths
a
smoking
room
that
can
accommodate
four
to
six
smokers
at
a
time
and
an
individual
smoking
vestibule
for
anyone,
who's
experiencing
a
mental
health
crisis,
an
overamp
or
just
really
needs
some
privacy
and
here's
the
smoking
room
a
little
more
in
depth
there.
J
It's
got
a
very
specialized
ventilation
system,
an
air,
a
double
airlock
door,
entry
system
and
an
intercom
to
keep
all
of
the
vapor
and
the
particulate
matter
in
the
smoking
room.
Don't
have
any
time
to
watch
the
video
I'm
so
sorry
we
gotta
fly,
we
gotta
go
since
launching.
Basically,
on
december
1st,
we
have
1500
over
1500
registered
users
and
the
sites
have
been
used,
as
you
can
see
just
under
30
000
times.
J
I
want
you
to
notice
that
there
are
over
a
thousand
people
registered
to
harlem
and
just
over
400
registered
to
washington
heights
and
a
lower
utilization
rate
for
washington
heights,
but
look
at
the
overdose
occurrence
rate
400
overdose
interventions.
250
of
them
are
in
washington
heights,
amongst
that
very
young
injection
population.
Who
is
utilizing
the
site
less
frequently
on
the
left.
Here
this
is
a
real
overdose
intervention.
This
photo
is
used
with
permission,
but
you
can
see
the
team
with
the
ambu
bag.
The
naloxones
out
is
a
very
skilled
and
coordinated
response.
J
J
The
real
tragedy
of
that
eight
hundred
and
nine
thousand
lost
lives
to
overdose
last
year
is
that
an
overdose
is
a
hundred
percent
reversible.
If
somebody
is
there
when
it
happens,
and
certainly
just
in
our
few
short
months
of
operation,
you
can
see
that
here
massive
cost
savings
to
emergency
services,
police
and
the
hospitals
that
we
have
taken
this
piece
of
work
completely
off
their
plates
and
they're
grateful
to
us
for
it.
J
J
Early
impacts
and
then
I'll
be
quiet.
It's
very
early
days
we're
just
seven
eight
months
in,
but
eighty
percent
of
the
opc
participants
have
been
connected
into
other
care
via
the
overdose
prevention.
Centers,
that's
huge.
J
Today,
eight
months
after
opening
the
overdose
prevention
centers,
we
have
hired
three
people
who
were
overdose
prevention
center
participants
who
overdosed
with
us,
survived
stabilized
and
have
now
joined
our
team
at
entry-level
positions
very
early
days.
Who
knows
what
happens
with
those
hires,
but
the
the
fact
remains.
J
How
did
we
do
it?
I
think
I'll
pause
here
and
pass
it
over
to
anna
jane,
because
I
know
we
want
to
make
sure
that
we
get
enough
time
to
talk
about
how
they
got
the
law
passed,
and
then
we
can
circle
back
to
how
new
york
squeaked
this
through
without
a
law,
but
with
this
I'll
hand
it
over
to
the
wonderful
anna
jane
to
fill
you
in
on
on
her
part
of
the
story.
Thank
you.
K
Thank
you
so
much
kyle.
I
was
taking
a
lot
of
notes
and
just
thinking
about
how
you
know.
Last
friday
I
worked
at
a
harm
reduction
organization
and
we
had
someone
who
came
into
our
center.
We
don't
currently
offer
supervised
consumption.
We
had
someone
who
came
into
our
center
left
used
their
substance
overdosed
on
the
sidewalk.
K
It
took
someone
who
was
walking
by
to
run
in
yell,
get
the
narcan
everyone
to
go,
call
9-1-1
and
just
how
how
that
all
could
have
been
avoided.
All
that
stress
all
that
trauma
all
those
emergency
services,
so
thank
you,
kaitlyn,
so
rhode
island
took
a
different
approach,
so
in
rhode
island
last
year
a
law
was
signed.
That
was
the
first
law
in
the
country
that
authorized
the
use
of
safe
consumption
services.
So
we
called
these
harm
reduction
centers.
So
I
will
be
using
that
term.
K
I
know
there
are
a
lot
of
different
terms
going
on,
but
that
is
the
term
in
our
law,
and
so
I'm
going
to
use
that
and
that
term
was
chosen
intentionally
to
really
highlight
that.
Yes,
these
are
places
where
people
can
consume
pre-obtained
substances.
But
more
importantly,
these
were
comprehensive
places
where
people
could
access
many
different
services.
K
Many
of
the
services
kailyn
mentioned
around
medical
care,
education,
hiv
and
hepatitis
c
services,
clean
supplies,
basic
needs,
food,
water,
clothing,
just
so
many
different
services
under
one
roof,
and
so
yes,
the
guests,
supervise
consumption,
but,
more
importantly,
a
holistic
approach,
which
is
again
why
they're
called
our
production
centers.
K
So
we,
the
law,
getting
passed,
was
an
interesting
journey.
It
was
introduced
over
the
course
of
three
different
years,
so
it
was
introduced
three
times
before
it
was
actually
passed
and
signed
into
law
and
what
the
law
does
is
it
authorizes
the
use
of
supervised
consumption,
which
is
very
important
because
the
federal
law
is
not
crystal
clear
and
also
in
our
state
law.
K
The
law
also,
it
told
the
department
of
health
that
they
need
to
create
a
regulatory
infrastructure
for
creating
a
harm
reduction
center,
so
for
actually
having
regulations
and
licensing
the
harm
reduction
centers,
so
harm
reduction,
centers
in
rhode
island
they
are,
they
are
very
regulated,
and
that
was
intentional
because
we
felt
like
that
would
be
a
much
easier
pitch
and
also
that
people
who
use
these
facilities
deserve
to
be
in
places
that
are
up
to
a
high
quality
I'll
get
more
into
the
regulations
later,
because
I
think,
with
the
regulations,
there's
always
a
tension
between
making
sure
that
standards
are
met,
but
also
that
they're,
not
the
standards
are
so
high
that
people
can't
actually
implement
them,
and
the
last
thing
the
law
did
is.
K
It
is
a
two-year
pilot,
so
that
pilot
the
law
does
sunset
in
march
of
2024,
and
it
also
required
city
or
town
council
approval
to
actually
open
a
harm
reduction
center.
So
the
city
or
town
council
will
need
to
approve
the
very
specific
location
of
that,
and
that
was
something
that
was
put
in
last
minute
to
get
the
law
passed.
K
So
in
2021
our
governor
signed
that
bill
into
law
and
then,
since
then,
the
department
of
health
worked
to
create
those
regulations
that
I
mentioned.
They
did
a
very
thoughtful
job
about
trying
to
balance
having
a
regulatory
infrastructure
without
it
being
over
regulated
to
the
point
where
it
was
unattainable.
K
We
can
think
of
other
instances
where
medical
services
are
over
regulated,
so
that
people
cannot
access
them
and,
as
part
of
those
regulations,
you
know
they
have
things
like
making
sure
the
hallways
are
wide
enough
for
a
stretcher,
also
ensuring
that
safer
smoking
is
a
requirement
of
a
harm
reduction
center,
and
this
is
something
that
was
really
advocated
for
by
my
colleague,
who
is
a
former
crack
cocaine
smoker,
who
wanted
to
make
it
very
clear
that
he
and
others
like
him,
need
to
be
welcomed
in
these
facilities
and
that
this
is
not
only
an
issue
of
access.
K
But
this
is
a
racial
justice
issue.
So
now
any
facility
that
were
to
get
licensed
in
rhode
island
needs
to
have
safer
smoking,
so
those
regulations
were
promulgated
about
six
months
ago
and
now
we
are
working
to
actually
open
a
harm
reduction
center.
So
we
have
not
actually
opened
one
unlike
new
york,
but
we
are
honing
in
on
a
specific
location
in
the
city
of
providence
and
just
last
week,
maybe
two
weeks
ago,
time
is
really
flying.
K
At
this
point,
our
state
allocated
over
two
million
dollars
of
our
opioid
settlement
funding,
specifically
for
a
harm
reduction
center
which
we're
hoping
to
use
to
purchase
a
building
which
we
would
not
have
otherwise
had
access
to
that
type
of
funding,
especially
given
the
federal
challenges
and
constraints
of
accessing
funding
for
hard
production
center.
So
we're
really
excited
that
the
state
actively
agreed
to
to
allocate
that
funding.
That
funding
is
not
to
go
to
one
organization,
but
any
organization
can
apply
for
it.
So
that's
where
we're
at
now,
and
so
with.
K
We
have
a
specific
location
in
mind,
we're
starting
stakeholder
engagement
around
that
location.
It's
a
really
fun
time,
because
it's
right
before
a
primary
and
because
we
will
need
city
council
approval,
we're
trying
to
really
engage
city
council
candidates,
as
well
as
current
city
council
members,
so
that
we
can
hit
the
ground
running
after
the
election,
which
is
in
mid-september,
and
the
city
of
providence
has
been
super
super
supportive
of
these
efforts.
K
So
the
city
of
providence,
our
mayor,
who
is
term
limited,
so
he's
about
to
leave
office
at
the
end
of
the
year.
He
came
out
and
testified
at
the
state
house
saying
how
important
these
efforts
were.
We
also
have
we
don't
have
like
a
city
level,
health
department
because
rhode,
island's,
really
small,
so
everything's
at
the
state
level,
but
our
the
sort
of
like
what's
health
component
of
our
of
our
city,
our
health
office.
K
I
guess
they're,
not
really
a
department,
but
they
coordinate
health
stuff
they've
been
super
supportive
and
the
city
has
convened
an
internal
working
group
to
think
through
some
of
the
logistics
of
a
harm
reduction
center.
Things
like
what
will
zoning
look
like.
You
know,
making
sure
that
law
enforcement
has
say
on
what
their
response
will
be.
K
Making
sure
that
ems
has
say
in
terms
of
you
know
what
the
location
or
whatever
you
know,
their
needs,
or
whatever
the
case
may
be
city
council
has
say
in
terms
of
what
authorization
of
a
location
looks
like
if
it's
a
resolution
or
if
it's
an
ordinance
things
like
that,
so
the
city
has
been
super
super
supportive
in
terms
of
actively
thinking
through
their
role
at
the
municipal
level,
to
approve
this
now
that
we
do
have
the
state
law
and
just
sort
of
I
heard
that
new
mexico
is
interested
in
also
pursuing
a
state-level
law.
K
So
I
just
wanted
to
talk
about
some
like
lessons
learned
and
things
that
were
really
successful
in
terms
of
us
getting
the
law
passed.
I
think
one
thing
that
was
helpful
was
that
we
had
people
at
the
state
house
every
single
day
talking
to
lawmakers
and
a
lot
of
people
really
connected
with
lawmakers
around
this.
As
a
personal
topic,
many
lawmakers
have
friends
and
family
members
or
personally
impacted
themselves
by
overdose
and
so
able
being
able
to
connect
and
really
talk
about
how
these
are
evidence-based
solutions,
and
at
that
time
there
were
none
in.
K
In
the
united
states,
but
we
could
talk
about
the
evidence
from
canada
or
we
could
talk
about
the
evidence
from
you
know,
places
in
europe
and
that
we
were
in
a
crisis,
and
this
is
something
that
really
needed
to
happen
and
we
were
able
to
get
some
stakeholders
along
the
way
like
the
head
of
our
health
committee,
who
is
an
emt
in
a
town,
that's
very
much
impacted
by
overdose.
K
So
we
were
able
to
connect
with
lawmakers.
We
also
had
a
pretty
unified
voice.
We
have
a
strong,
both
harm
reduction
and
recovery
community
in
rhode,
island
and
people
really
banded
together
to
say
this
is
what
we
want
and
to
advocate
together,
and
then
our
department
of
health
also
really
supported
us
from
so
oftentimes
behind
the
scenes
to
really
push
this
forward
as
well.
So
that
was
also
really
helpful
in
terms
of
getting
it
passed.
K
K
K
You
can
sit
with
people
and
those
researchers
being
gracious
enough
to
do
so
was
also
really
helpful
so
now
that
our
laws
passed
and
we
have
regulations
we're
working
on
opening
and
definitely
really
grateful
for
the
work
that
folks
in
you
know,
canada
and
folks
in
new
york,
like
kaelyn,
have
been
doing
to
help
us
think
through
some
of
the
operational
the
operations
of
this
as
we
move
forward.
So
thank
you
and
happy
to
talk
for
their
answering
questions.
J
Back,
it's
sort
of
like
a
now
for
something
completely
different
moment.
It's
just.
We
we,
as
in
the
entire
community
in
new
york
that
had
been
advocating
for
this,
had
had
tried
at
a
state
level
a
couple
different
times
and
it
just
was
was
fairly
obvious.
It
wasn't
going
to
shake
out
for
us
that
way,
so
I'll
just
share
my
screen
again
we'll
pop
back
to
this.
J
So
we
we
went
a
different
route
route
route.
We
we
had
a
very
unique
political
window
and
it
was
very
finite,
very
short,
and
we
snuck
through
it.
This
is
pretty
common
in
the
safe
consumption
story
in
other
parts
of
the
world.
It
doesn't
always
happen
this
way,
but
you
can
definitely
find
five
or
six
examples
where,
where
this
was
a
key
moment,
usually
a
transition
of
power
that
was
certainly
true
in
new
york.
J
So
we
had,
you
know
governor
como,
at
the
time
sort
of
over
here,
being,
you
know,
held
accountable
for
being
a
little
handsy
and
the
entire
state
kind
of
in
a
hubbub
over
what
como
was
doing.
So
no
one
was
looking
at
us
and
then
we
had
mayor
de
blasio,
an
outgoing
mayor,
who
was
feeling
a
little
bit
and
being
criticized
for
being
a
lame
duck
mayor,
so
mishandling
of
black
lives
matter.
Mishandling
of
so
many
things.
J
Two
months
left
in
office
really
wanted
a
legacy
and
felt
like
he
could
throw
his
weight
behind
this,
as
he
was
on
his
way
out
the
door,
and
we
made
the
most
of
that
moment.
So
that's
exactly
what
we
did
we
got.
We
knew
I'm
just
going
to
be
very,
very
transparent.
Were
we
sort
of
being
used
by
the
de
blasio
administration
to
give
an
outgoing
mayor
a
legacy?
Absolutely,
but
did
we
allow
it
to
happen
on
our
terms
to
get
these
two
centers
open?
Yes,
we
did
so.
J
I
want
to
be
very,
very
clear.
We
have
incredible
support
from
the
city
and
state
health
department,
particularly
the
city
health
department
and
in
city
hall,
even
post
de
blasio.
Now
that
adams
is
in
office,
we
also
have
continued
support
from
city
hall
want
to
be
very
clear,
though,
that
technically
all
we
had
in
terms
of
formal
protections
was
a
letter,
a
rather
mealy
mouth
letter.
J
We
knew
that
this
was
going
to
be
a
possibility
for
us,
because
we
knew
de
blasio
was
on
his
way
out.
We
knew
hokel
was
likely
going
to
be
taking
the
helm
at
a
gover
at
a
state
level,
and
we
thought
we
knew
because
hocal
has
personal
experience
in
her
family
with
loss
from
the
opioid
epidemic.
We
thought
she'd
be
soft
on
the
issue.
J
We
did
a
lot
of
work
with
adams
before
he
took
office
to
see
if
he
was
going
to
come
after
us.
Was
he
not
going
to
come
after
us?
Was
he
neutral?
Was
he
going
to
be
pro
and
we
felt
fairly
confident
that
he
would
let
us
rock
once
the
sites
were
open?
J
Although
it's
been
very
important
for
us
to
control
the
public
narrative
to
not
sort
of
push
him
into
a
corner
and
and
sort
of
to
force
him
to
speak
on
the
overdose
prevention
centers
before
he
was
ready
to
do
so
himself,
and
that's
one
of
the
reasons
why
we've
done
so
much
media.
We
need
to
keep
the
story.
We
need
to
make
sure
that
our
successes
are
widely
known.
This
softens
the
grounds
for
the
feds
softens
the
grounds
at
a
state
level
and
certainly
keeps
the
mayor
in
in
a
nice
sweet
spot.
J
We
did
a
risk
analysis
at
a
local
state
and
federal
level,
and
what
that
means
was
looking
at
the
two
precedents
we
had
at
the
time,
which
was
philadelphia
and
rhode
island.
J
We
knew
philadelphia,
didn't
have
sites
built,
they
didn't
have
staff
trained,
they
hadn't
written
policies
and
procedures
and
under
trump
they
were.
You
know
they
received
a
very
nasty
cease
and
desist
letter,
which
still
gave
them
six
months
to
demonstrate
that
they
were
no
longer
mobilizing
to
open
an
overdose
prevention
center,
and
we
all
know
the
safe
house
case
is
still
pending
and
then
rhode
island.
I
you
know
you
guys
got
a
couple
visits
from
the
feds.
Did
you
not
like
a
little
bit
of
it?
Wasn't
you
guys?
J
No,
we
knew
that
you
guys
didn't
get
visits
from
the
feds.
We
knew
that
rhode
island
had
this
law
passed,
no
site
identified
right,
no
staff
hired
expressly
for
the
purpose
of
overdose
prevention,
centers
and
yet
were
were
not
really.
There
was
no
real
interference
right
from
the
federal
level,
so
we
looked
at
those
two
precedents
as
favorable
for
us.
From
the
federal
perspective
we
also
looked
at,
who
was
in
power
now,
who
was
on
their
way
out?
J
The
last
thing
we
did,
which
I
think
was
one
of
the
smarter
things
that
we
did
was
we
leaked
our
policies
and
procedures
and
and
photos
of
the
sites,
as
they
were
being
built
at
a
fairly
high
level
within
doj,
not
too
high,
but
just
high
enough
that
you
know
it's
going
to
get
taken
up
the
chain
and
same
with
the
on
dcp,
not
too
high,
but
just
high
enough.
J
So
we
really
gave
them
everything
they
needed
to
sort
of
come
out
of
the
shadows
and
let
us
know
what
they
thought
and
we
heard
absolutely
nothing.
We
had
a
long
and
short-term
community
engagement
strategy.
The
long-term
strategy
was
really
centered
around
the
fact
that
we'd
been
operating
an
unsanctioned
program
at
both
our
locations
for
six
years.
J
This
was
really
pivotal
because
it
helped
address
head-on
any
sort
of
perception
of
nimby,
no
new
programs
and
not
in
my
backyard.
We
were
long-standing
existing
programs
in
both
of
our
neighborhoods
who
had
formalized
an
existing
program.
It
wasn't
new.
This
was
the
number
one
sort
of
strategy
for
countering
any
sort
of
nimby
sentiments
that
cropped
up
over
the
course
of
our
six
years
operating
the
unsanctioned
programs.
We
invited
key
stakeholders
in
to
see
what
we
were
doing
at
very
strategic
moments,
so
we
sort
of
allowed
people
behind
the
curtain.
J
This
included
law
enforcement,
elected
officials,
principals
from
the
area,
schools,
family
members
who
had
people
using
and
overdosing
in
their
stairwells
of
their
buildings.
Anytime.
There
was
a
negative
media
story
about
the
drug
crisis
in
new
york
city,
the
overdose
epidemic.
We
would
say
why
don't
you
come
and
see
what
we're
doing.
We
think
this
could
be
a
part
of
the
solution.
J
This
sort
of
strategic
revealing
of
our
cards
really
allowed
us
to
reframe
the
issue
of
safer
consumption
with
community
members
in
both
of
our
neighborhoods
one,
at
a
time
really
playing
to
the
issues
that
were
closest
to
their
hearts.
Personally
and
the
last
thing
was,
and
god
bless
you
rhode
island,
we
needed
a
little
bit
of
federal
protection
and
how
do
you
get
that
you
do
a
federal
research
study?
J
We
didn't
have
any
time
to
get
nida
on
board
as
an
evaluator,
because
the
from
the
minute
we
decided
to
open
the
sites
to
the
day
they
opened
was
six
weeks
that
included
building
two
consumption
sites,
training
all
the
staff
buying
all
the
gear
getting
it
all
set
up.
So
we
are
forever
indebted
to
our
friends
in
rhode
island
who
allowed
us
to
be
sort
of
an
add-on
to
their
nida
evaluation.
J
And
now
we
are
technically
a
part
of
a
federal
evaluation
of
safer
consumption.
Then
that
gives
us
a
modicum
of
protection
at
a
federal
level,
so
forever
indebted
to
you
guys
always
for
that
separate
from
that
nyu
and
the
new
york
city
department
of
health
are
also
evaluating
the
operations,
but
that's
a
little
bit
just
very
quickly
on
how
we
managed
to
sneak
through
and
since
that
time.
J
There's
this
reassessment
of
what
the
ruling
is
going
to
be
because
the
old
ruling
is
sort
of
like
it's
obsolete,
so
the
legal
team
has
had
to
step
back
and
rethink
how
they're
going
to
rule
on
this
case
now
that
there
are
sites
operational
in
the
u.s.
So
it's
all
very
favorable,
the
federal
climate,
in
particular
we're
seeing
lots
of
signaling
that
things
are
going
in
a
very
positive
direction.
J
J
There
are
multiple
paths
emerging
to
get
these
life-saving
services
up
and
running
in
your
jurisdiction?
If
you
decide
to
do
that-
and
I
think
I
speak
for
anna
jane
as
well-
we're
obviously
here
to
help
in
any
way
we
can
through
that
process.
H
Caitlin
anna
jane,
thank
you
so
much.
It's
amazing.
I
think
you
gave
us
such
a
good
picture
of
both
what
happens
day
to
day
on
the
ground
and
sort
of
the
political
climate
and
some
of
sort
of
the
implementation
issues.
We
have
to
think
about
so
appreciate
we're
really
honored.
You
joined
us
and
really
thankful
that
you
two
are
paving
this
path
forward
for
the
rest
of
us
and
that
really
it's
about
saving
lives
and
connecting
people
to
services,
and
so
all
that
other
stuff
is
great.
H
Like
the
you
know,
syringe
litter
that
gets
picked
up
and
you
know
not
having
public
drug
use,
but
really
it's
about
the
people
that
are
utilizing
these
services.
So
thank
you
so
much.
We
would
love
to
open
it
up
for
for
questions.
A
Thanks
we'll
just
take
questions
as
they
come
up.
I
think
bruce
was
the
first
one
to
raise
his
hand.
So
bruce
you
have
the
floor.
You
just
need
to
unmute
yourself.
B
Thank
you
awesome
presentation
both
thank
you
very
much
so
very
informative.
I
have
a
quick
question,
though,
as
far
as
safety
of
the
drug
use
in
the
facilities.
B
J
Yes,
so
we
we
use
two
different
modalities.
We
have
a
mass
spectrometer
and
we're
seeing
some
something
very
troubling
which
I'll
talk
about
in
a
quick,
quick.
Second,
we
also
use
five
different
testing
strips,
so
everybody
knows
about
the
fentanyl
testing
strips
right,
pretty
old
news
at
this
point
we
also
use
benzodiazepine
testing
strips
morphine
testing
strips
because
morphine
is
the
closest
molecular
compound
to
heroin.
So
that's
essentially,
is
there
heroin
in
the
heroin.
Is
the
question
we're
asking
there:
cocaine,
testing,
strips
ketamine
testing,
strips
and
methamphetamine
testing
strips?
J
We
are
really
curious
in
the
prevalence
of
plant-based
drugs
in
the
current
drug
supply,
namely
heroin
and
cocaine.
The
theory
is
they've
been
predominantly
replaced,
of
course,
by
fentanyl
and
methamphetamine,
and
and
we
really
need
to
have
a
handle
on
that-
we're
also
concerned
about
other
adult
adulterants
xylazine
vamisol
borax.
I
mentioned
all
of
the
cutting
agents,
but
our
one
of
the
reasons
our
site
has
been
so
successful
and
any
overdose
prevention
center
is
going
to
be
so
successful.
J
We
had
five
doas
in
marcus
garvey
park,
which
is
a
stone's
throw
from
our
east
harlem
location,
all
during
the
hours
when
we
were
not
open,
we're
working
to
get
both
programs
to
24-hour
operations
and
the
city
is
backing
us
to
do
that.
But
that
is
a
huge
lift
for
a
small
organization.
We're
not
just
talking
about
one
building.
We're
talking
about
two
getting
two
programs
to
24-hour
operations
is
a
lot
of
work,
we're
getting
there,
but
it's
slow.
These
people
died
when
we
weren't
open.
J
We
responded
by
expanding
our
hours.
The
following
day,
we
pulled
a
bunch
of
samples
out
of
marcus
garvey
park
picked
up
drug
baggies.
Crack
files
went
to
the
dealers
that
we
know.
We
also
pulled
any
sample
from
the
overdose
prevention
center,
where
people
dropped
really
immediately
and
really
seriously.
J
We
ran
those
through
the
mass
spectrometer
and
what
we're
seeing
in
new
york
city
are
fentanyl
purity
levels
between
13
and
15
percent.
This
is
the
highest
new
york
city
has
ever
seen.
It
is
easily
high
enough
to
have
killed
many
many
people,
the
concentration
of
fentanyl
in
the
drug
supply
in
new
york
city,
is
usually
between
three
and
nine
percent.
J
B
One
more
question:
I
didn't
see
it
in
the
bullet
points.
It
was
there.
I
apologize.
How
do
you
regulate
time
in
the
centers?
Is
there
any
time
limitation.
J
Yeah
great
question:
there's
not,
however,
this
is
where
the
training
of
the
staff
is
really
really
key.
You
have
to
manage
flow
in
those
rooms
very,
very
carefully.
We
staff
at
a
four
to
one
ratio.
That
means
four
participants
to
one
staff,
plus
a
position
that
we
call
the
our
pick,
which
is
the
responsible
person
in
charge.
J
If
you
have
an
overdose,
maybe
you
have
two
or
three
people
triaging
that
overdose.
Your
ratio
is
immediately
impacted
if
you
have
more
than
one
overdose
at
once,
which
is
common.
If
the
drug
supply
there's
a
particular
batch
on
the
street,
which
is
really
adulterated,
we
call
those
dominoes
in
the
opc.
J
Your
ratio
really
takes
a
hit
if
you're
not
dealing
with
that,
you
just
have
a
full
house
and
you
have
a
lineup
outside
you're.
Not
you've
got
a
flaw
in
your
service
right
because
the
point
is
to
not
have
anyone
who
is
dope
sick,
wait
for
access
to
the
site
because
they
won't
wait.
We
know
this
they're
going
to
leave
and
go
use
outside,
so
managing
flow
is
really
key.
J
That
means
there
are
certain
behaviors
that
are
permitted
in
the
opc
and
there
are
certain
behaviors
that
aren't
it's
really
about
drug
consumption,
so
you
can't
unpack
your
bag.
You
can't
do
your
hair,
you
can't
call
your
mom.
You
can't
do
that
kind
of
stuff.
You
really
do
have
to
focus
on
your
dose
as
defined
by
you.
That
doesn't
mean
one
injection
if
you're
doing
a
speed
ball
and
that's
going
to
be
three
injections
and
a
trip
to
the
smoking
room.
That's
okay!
J
But
once
you're
done
that
dose,
you
gotta
go
so
somebody
else
can
come
in.
So
it
really
requires
incredible
relationship,
building
from
the
staff
to
the
participants,
incredible
management
of
the
room
and
the
flow
of
the
room
to
manage
the
wait
times
and
get
people
through
safely.
It's
also
a
design
element.
If
you
don't
design
your
site
big
enough
to
accommodate
the
needs
of
your
particular
population
where
you
are
in
some
ways,
you've
lost
before
you
started,
build
it
to
be
big
enough
and
allow
for
growth.
A
Anna
jane
did
you
want
a
chance
to
respond
to
any
of
bruce's
questions.
K
J
We
do
oh
go
ahead.
I
was
just
going
to
say
anna
jane
before
you
go
because
I
know
you've
got
a
site
kind
of
in
your
in
your
sights.
The
real
hero
of
this
story
is
the
landlords,
and
it
will
be
for
anna
jane
too.
These
are
very
special
people
who
really
stick
their
necks
out
and
take
a
a
big
risk.
Our
landlords
in
harlem
he's
a
hasidic
jew.
J
So
certainly
somebody
who
understands
oppression
and
suffering
and
our
landlord
in
washington
heights
is
a
cuban
refugee
who
got
his
family
here
on.
You
know,
on
a
on
a
boat
on
a
dinghy
another
somebody
who
understands
oppression,
we
have
30-year
leasehold
condo
agreements
in
both
of
our
buildings,
which
means
we
are
not
going
anywhere
and
we
have
landlords
who
are
fully
aware
of
what
we're
doing
and
have
our
backs
completely,
and
that
will
be
very,
very
important
for
anna
jane
and
that'll
be
very
important
for
you
as
well.
J
So
if
you
are
at
the
stage
where
you
have
a
landlord
or
a
possible
building,
just
know
that
our
landlords
are
very
open
to
speaking
to
their
kin
in
other
parts
of
the
world
they've
been
getting,
you
know,
lots
of
phone
calls
from
philly
and
lots
of
phone
calls
from
los
angeles
as
other
jurisdictions
are,
are
making
moves
to
get
these
up
and
running,
but
it
is
possible
even
with
the
croc
crack
house
statute
looming.
There
are
people
who
will
say.
J
Yes,
you
can
do
this
in
my
building
with
my
blessing,
so
don't
give.
A
Okay,
anyone
else,
gina.
L
I
you
know
to
to
both
you
caitlyn
and
and
anna
jane,
and
I
want
to
say
to
the
overall
group
these
presentations,
just
every
meeting
knocked
my
socks
off
and
they
blow
me
backwards
as
to
what's
available
and
I
get
lost
up
in
my
head
about
how
how
we
progress
towards
getting
those
those
types
of
services
in
santa
fe,
and
so
I
I
have
two.
L
You
know
I
tend
to
ask
some
funding
questions
typically
in
these
presentations,
but
just
on
one
of
your
answers,
caitlin,
you
talked
about
the
the
importance
of
the
flow
in
the
in
and
out,
and
I
I
realize
there's
there's
a
difference
with
urban
settings
and
more
rural
settings.
We
tend
to
be
a
little
bit
more
rural
and
spread
out
comparatively
the
you
know.
L
Are
there
models
that
have
an
area
or
their
plans
to
develop
an
area
after
dosing
that
people
aren't
necessarily
flowing
out
of
the
building
but
flowing
into
an
area
that
they're
safe,
they're
comfortable,
but
at
the
same
time,
are
posing
a
danger
to
themselves
or
others?
If,
if
they're
exiting
out
into
the
general
public.
J
J
There
is
one
criticism
of
over
safer
consumption
sites
that
I
actually
think
is
true,
and
it's
exactly
what
you're
talking
about.
We
all
sort
of
wave
our
hands
around
and
get
on
our
soapbox
and
say
you
know
in
36
years,
with
130,
safer
consumption
sites
operating
all
around
the
world.
No
one
has
ever
died
from
an
overdose
in
a
safer
consumption
site.
True,
but
what
the
criticism
is
is
yeah.
J
If
I
need
to
within
our
program
not
onto
the
street
and
I'm
hopefully
building
a
dynamic
enough
program
that
the
person
I'm
working
with
is
not
going
to
want
to
leave
and
go
back
outside,
where
they're
visibly
under
the
influence
at
risk
of
arrest
or
where
you
know
a
drug
involved,
medical
emergency
could
return
so
our
program.
J
I
wish
we
were
in
it
right
now,
so
I
could
show
you,
I
should
say
open
invitation
to
all
of
you
to
come
and
see
it
because
it's
very
helpful
to
see
it
to
sort
of
conceptualize
some
of
what
we're
talking
about.
J
But
we
have
food,
a
huge
lounge
with
a
tv
on
and
it
feels
like
a
living
room.
We
have
highly
trained
staff
in
every
part
of
the
building.
We
have
a
respite
room
with
hot
water
bottles
and
heating,
pads
and
aromatherapy,
and
blackout
curtains
and
a
big
moon
on
the
wall.
So
if
you
want
to
sleep,
you
don't
have
to
do
that
on
the
sidewalk
in
harlem,
I'm
going
to
put
you
to
bed
somewhere
safe
and
I've
got
pulse
oximeters
and
oxygen.
J
It's
literally
the
only
space
in
the
country
where
an
active
drug
user
can
sleep
because
they're
not
welcome
in
the
shelter
system,
they're,
not
housable.
So
that's
what
you're,
seeing
in
the
parks
and
the
subways
or
in
your
you
know,
in
your
rural
municipalities,
it's
the
same
different
setting
but
same
principle.
We.
J
So
if
we
discharge
you
discharge,
you
like
green
stamp,
you're
good,
you
can
go.
Those
are
you
you
can
get
out
of
here.
Go
do
what
you
want
to
do.
Go
to
work,
go
pick
your
kids
up
for
school
or
whatever
you
need
to
do.
If
that's
not
the
case,
you
we
are
transferring
care
to
someone
else
within
our
program
and
doing
our
best
to
hold
you
for
as
long
as
we
possibly
can.
J
L
So
with
all
of
that
in
mind-
and
you
know
forgive
me
if
you
covered
part
of
this,
but
as
it
relates
to
funding
and
and
I
know,
the
budget
of
santa
fe
will
be
dramatically
smaller
than
a
budget
needed
in
new
york
or
new
york,
city
or
rhode
island,
but
broadly,
what
are
the
budgets
and
if
it
were
a
pie,
what
are
your
funding
sources.
J
No
city
or
state
dollars
can
be
used
to
fund
the
overdose
prevention
centers.
So
as
it
stands
now
they
are
being
funded
by
foundation,
money,
private
donations
and
just
our
discretionary
funds.
This
is
obviously
not
a
sustainable
funding
pot
going
back
to
sort
of
the
frantic
six
week
launch
period.
J
The
city
city
hall
and
the
health
department
really
tried
to
fund
our
overdose
prevention
centers.
They
just
couldn't
quite
get
their
heads
legally
cleared
to
do
it,
but
they
have
every
intention
of
of
coming
on
as
a
sustainable
funder
as
soon
as
they
possibly
can
they're
working
on
it
as
as
we
speak,
but
for
now
no
city
and
state
money
can
be
used
to
fund
the
overdose
prevention
centers
everything
else.
The
vast
majority
of
everything
else
is
city
and
state
dollars.
J
J
What
does
that
look
like
for
us?
It's
in
the
millions?
It's
it's
in
the
millions.
Remember
that
we
are
working
towards
expanding
to
24-hour
operations,
I
will
say
our
two
overdose
prevention.
Centers
and
again
you
pointed
this
out
you're
totally
right.
Oh
here
she
comes,
you
guys,
knew
emily
knew
she
might
be
joining
us.
J
Is
this
is
johnny
everybody?
This
is
my
daughter
to
run
both
of
our
overdose
prevention
centers
right
now,
which
is
the
two
shift
model
so
seven
in
the
morning
until
11
30
at
night
is,
you
know
close
to
four
million
dollars
a
year,
but
they're
busy,
they're
busy.
You
know
harlem,
is
seeing
several
hundred
visits
a
day.
J
I
do
a
lot
of
technical
assistance,
I'm
working
with
nevada
right
now,
another
very
rural
setting
outside
of
reno
in
las
vegas.
Who
is
really
grappling
with?
How
do
we
do
this?
How
do
we
do
safer
consumption
when
so
many
of
our
folks
are
in
this
rural
setting
and
we're
looking
at
a
hub
and
spoke
model
for
them?
J
A
combination
of
fixed
sites,
small
fixed
site,
mobile
and
virtual,
and-
and
we
can
you
know
if
you
want
help
thinking
through
something
like
that
and
costing
it
out-
I'm
I'm
happy
to
help
with
that
too,
because
I
think
it's
a
little
bit
comparing
apples
and
oranges
right
like
when
we,
when
we
open
our
doors
in
the
morning,
we
got
a
crowd
outside
people,
don't
want
to
die.
We're
in
very
high
need
neighborhoods
in
the
middle
of
a
crisis.
That's
not
going
to
happen
for
you.
J
L
Okay,
thank
you
for
your
transparency
on
that
and
and
by
the
way,
a
surprisingly
low
over
a
surprise.
L
L
Okay,
but
still
for
what
you
provide
yeah,
I'm
pleasantly
surprised.
J
L
B
K
Yeah,
absolutely
so,
when
we
passed
the
law,
we
made
it
very
clear
with
lawmakers
that
state
funding
would
not
be
used
for
the
overdose
or
for
the
harm
reduction
center.
Like
caitlin
was
saying
a
lot
of
our
other
services
that
we
plan
on
providing
hiv
testing
are
syringe
services.
Those
are
all
currently
funded
by
our
department
of
health.
We
have
outreach
services
where
we
spread
the
word
about
these
things.
K
Like
you
know,
we
are
not
going
to
reinvent
the
funding
wheel
for
the
services
that
we
already
offer
that
are
already
authorized
for
the
state,
but
we're
definitely
on
the
earlier
part
of
our
venture
around
funding,
recognizing
that
for
the
safer
consumption
pieces
we
will
need
to
have
specifically
non-federal
or
state
funding
in
rhode
island.
All
of
our
state
funding
is
federal
funding
anyways
because
it's
all
just
federal
pass
through,
so
we're
basically
trying
to
invite
any
state
dollars
as
well,
but
we
I
alluded.
I
mentioned
it
briefly.
K
Going
to
be
the
first
of
a
19-year
payout,
so
it'll
be
about
20
million
dollars
every
year,
and
that's
just
at
the
state
level.
The
state
is
getting
80
of
it
to
distribute,
but
cities
and
towns
are
also
getting
20
of
it.
So
because
providence
is
the
largest
city,
they'll
be
getting
a
large
chunk
of
that
as
well,
and
that
is
funding.
That
is
a
lot
more
flexible
to
be
used.
K
So
we
were
able
to
receive
2.25
million
dollars,
which
we
plan
to
use
for
the
initial,
a
down
payment,
we're
looking
at
purchasing
a
building,
because
we
have
not
had
a
successful
landlord
as
generous
landlords,
as
caitlyn
has
been
able
to
find
in
new
york.
K
So
we're
looking
at
purchasing
a
building
which
the
real
estate
market
is
just
like
totally
wild
right
now,
horrible
time
to
be
purchasing
a
building,
especially
when
you
have
all
the
neighborhood
considerations,
all
the
bus
accessibility,
all
the
zoning
like
don't
recommend
it
so
we're
so
they're
going
to
use
part
of
that
funding
for
the
the
down
payment
purchase
and
then
part
of
that
funding
for
the
initial
build
out
safer
smoking
areas.
K
Just
all
the
initial
stuff
we'll
need,
in
addition
to
initial
staffing
as
well,
so
we're
planning.
So
we
have
that
cushion
which
is
really
great
and
then
supplement
that
with
the
state
funding
we
have
for
our
current
services
and
then
also
we
do
have
some
generous
donors
which
is
really
helpful.
And
then
we
have
researchers
who
are
being
very
open-minded
about
how
to
think
about
research
funding.
So
they
have
research
funding.
K
And
yes,
it
is
going
to
be
used
for
research,
but
there
are
ways
that
it
can
also
overlap
with
operational
needs,
which
is
really
helpful
to
leverage
that
is
federal
funding
and
some
private
sort
of
foundational
funding
specifically
for
research,
so
that
we
can
really
try
to
try
to
optimize
our
options.
G
Sorry
counselor,
just
for
anna
jane,
I
mean
you're
sort
of
starting
the
idea
of
building
purchasing
a
building
started
starting
from
scratch,
and
are
you
planning
because
it
seems
like
a
lot
of
the
extra
cost
comes
along
with
all
of
those
other
wrap
around
services
and
all
of
the
other
things
that
kalyn
mentioned
right
that
really
take
up
the
vast
majority
and
that
lends
to
it
seems
the
success
of
the
whole
operation.
G
Are
you
planning
on,
including
all
of
that
in
your
initial
building?
Yeah?
Absolutely
you
have
the
extra
funding
to
be
able
to,
because
it
it
how
much
of
it
is
because
of
all
of
those
other
things
that
you
all
provide
in
conjunction
with
the
center
and
and
so
because
we
would
here
in
santa
fe,
probably
be
doing
it
from
scratch.
Like
you
in
rhode,
island.
K
Yeah,
so
we
we're
well
positioned
because
we
currently
operate
several
drop-in
centers
already,
many
of
which
are
very
bustling
and
basically
have
men
all
the
surfaces,
not
the
not
the
blackout
room
with
the
moon.
That's
a
good,
that's
one!
I
have
to
think
more
about,
but
you
know
a
lot
of
the
services
already
and
are
already
highly
utilized.
We
have
peer
staff
who
have
really
many
of
them
are
former
clients
themselves
who
really
have
really
strong
relationships
with
our
with
the
folks
we
serve,
so
we
are
building
from
that
base.
K
We
also
have
like
a
outreach
worker
who
is
based
at
district
court
who
provides
court
support.
We
have
a
mobile
unit
that
is
in
our
downtown
area,
which
is
like
our
bus
hub
and
because
rhode
island
is
tiny.
It
serves
people
from
across
the
state,
so
we're
we're,
starting
with
that
foundation
and
we've
been
rapidly
expanding
over
the
past
few
years.
So
starting
a
new
site
is
something
that
is
more
familiar
to
us.
Even
though
we
don't
have
this
specific,
the
supervised
consumption
service.
K
We
have
many
of
the
other
services
already
and
I'm
pretty
excited
because
of
one
of
like
our
sort
of
main
contender
for
a
building.
It
has
a
top
floor
that
has
it
sort
of
has
like
two:
it's
like
a
u-shaped
and
they're
sort
of
like
mirror
images
of
each
other,
so
people
could
go
on
one
side
for
one
set
of
services
on
another
side
for
another
set
of
services,
and
then
it
has
a
downstairs
facility
that
used
to
be
in
urgent
care.
K
I
should
have
also
mentioned
much
earlier
that
we
are
planning
to
partner
with
a
a
medical
provider
who
can
provide
things
like
suboxone
prescriptions,
clinical
care
services
that
we
don't
currently
offer
in-house,
because
we're
not
a
clinical
organization,
we're
a
peer-based
harm
reduction
organization,
but
we
felt
like
co-locating
those
things
and
partnering
with
an
organization
where
that
is
really
their
specialty
and
they
have
similar
values
to
us
in
terms
of
yes,
they
provide
treatment
but
they're
much
more
harm
reduction.
J
I
want
to
add
one
thing
to
that:
you
just
reminded
me:
oh
yes,
uh-oh
your
provider
is
so
key.
Who
you
choose
to
be
your
operator
is
going
to
be
one
of
the
biggest
and
most
important
decisions
that
you
make,
and
I
think
this
is
something
that
anna
jane
and
her
team
have
done
really
really
well.
J
These
are
experienced
providers
very
enmeshed
in
the
community,
already
very
literate
in
in
sort
of
harm
reduction,
philosophy
and
technique,
and
it's
something
that
some
of
the
other
jurisdictions
are
really
struggling
with
that
tension
between
like
should
the
health
department
be
the
operator
or
should
a
harm
reduction
agency
be
the
operator
should
a
clinical
team
be
the
operator
there
are
pros
and
cons
to
each
and-
and
you
know
we
can
discuss
those
more,
but
that's
a
question
you're
going
to
have
to
grapple
with.
G
And
then
yeah,
when
I
just
have
a
another
question
for
you
just
in
relation
to
law
enforcement-
and
it
sounds
like
you-
haven't-
had
any
issues
with
law
enforcement
in
any
of
these
operations.
But
are
there
any
that
you
were
anticipating?
Do
you
have
an
acquired?
Do
you
have
like
an
agreement
with
law
enforcement
and
is
that
something
that
was
of
concern
or
how
has
it
played
out.
J
J
We
were
like
what
can
we
reasonably
assume
we're
gonna
get
from
the
nypd
and
at
how?
What
level?
How
high
for
a
couple
different
reasons?
One
it's
one
thing
to
get
assurances
from
the
brass,
but
when
you
rank
and
file
officers
or
beating
people
up
and
arresting
people
and
put
you
know,
stationed
outside
your
site,
you're
not
going
to
be
successful.
J
So
we,
I
think
we
approached
the
nypd
with
sort
of
the
blinders
off
and
we
didn't
require
them
to
put
anything
in
writing
because
we
knew
if
we
forced
that
we
wouldn't
get
anything
and
and
really
without
federal
permission
without
the
state
backing
and
and
to
be
very
honest,
because
I
think
it's
important
to
be
honest
and
transparent
around
these
conversations,
the
nypd
had
no
respect
for
the
de
blasio
administration.
J
So,
yes,
they
would
do
what
he
said,
because
the
mayor
controls
the
police.
They
were
definitely
not
going
to
step,
stick
their
necks
out
any
further
than
they
absolutely
had
to
so
we
needed
sam
and
I
my
executive
director
and
I
we
needed
to
figure
out
how
comfortable
could
we
be
as
the
provider
taking
all
of
the
risk
to
be
clear,
we
assumed
all
of
the
risk
the
feds
aren't
going
to
go
after
the
health
department,
the
health
department's
just
going
to
say:
listen,
I
don't
know
we.
The
provider
took
all
the
risk.
J
We
had
to
really
think
how
comfortable
would
we
be
opening
if
we
had
back
channel
conversations
with
nypd
officers
fairly
high
up,
who
said
they
would
not
prosecute
and
they
would
not
fish
the
sites
for
warrants,
etc.
J
I
want
to
tell
you
that
we
were
pleasantly
surprised
by
how
those
conversations
went
and
have
been
absolutely
blown
away
by
the
level
of
partnership
and
commitment
we've
received
from
the
nypd
since
we
opened
it.
It
blew
me
away
after
the
initial
sort
of
shock
that
we
approached
them
with
this
question.
It
was
really
what
do
you?
What
do
you
see
our
role
as
being?
J
How
do
you
want
us
to
interact
with
the
site?
How
do
you
want
us
to
be
in
the
area
and
from
us
it
was.
You
need
to
continue
to
do
your
jobs.
You
have
to
continue
to.
You
know:
address
public
safety,
we're
in
a
very
urban
environment,
there's
residential
buildings.
There's
a
daycare
across
the
street
from
our
harlem
site.
There's
huge
apartment
buildings
all
around
our
washington
heights
site.
There's
a
playground
across
the
street
from
our
washington
heights
site,
it's
new
york
city.
J
Is
this,
but
really
trying
to
wrap
their
heads
around
it
and
to
their
credit,
they
came
and
they've
been
an
incredible
partner
ever
since
the
other
thing
I
said
to
them,
is
I'm
not
going
to
call
you
unless
I
need
you,
but
if
we
do
call,
we
need
you
so
really
letting
them
know
that
we
weren't
shutting
them
out,
but
we
were
trying
to
clean
up
our
side
of
the
street
in
terms
of
the
larger
community
safety
issues
and
and
just
sort
of
like
quality
of
life
issues.
J
We
were
trying
to
address
in
the
neighborhood
we're
now
in
a
position
where
we
text
regularly,
where
the
nypd
is
coming
to
us
for
our
spectrometer
data.
They
want
to
know
what
we're
seeing
in
terms
of
overdose
trends,
they're,
saying
god
we're
seeing
a
spike
in
overdoses
in
the
community.
What
are
you
guys
seeing?
How
can
we
help?
We
collected
some
samples
for
you
from
this
park?
Do
you
mind
testing
them
for
us
because
we're
faster
than
the
nypd
lab?
J
It's
a
true
partnership,
we're
working
with
law
enforcement
in
other
parts
of
the
country
we
get
in
the
back
waters
that
these
conversations
are
going
to
be
incremental
and
slow,
but
we
would
never
believe
that
we
would
be
able
to
get
the
nypd
where
they
currently
are
in
harlem
in
washington
heights
yeah.
So
it's
it's
possible.
G
K
Yeah
absolutely
so
we
under
like
caitlyn,
was
saying
we
don't.
We
know
that
our
sites
won't
work
if
there's
law
enforcement
outside,
even
if
they
are
just
parked
outside,
even
if
they're
parked
outside
in
an
undercover
car,
not
you
know
not
in
uniform,
and
we
have
had
some
challenges
with
another
location
of
ours
where
police
were
driving
by
very
frequently.
They
said,
you
know
we're
just
doing
our
job
and
our
clients
were
freaked
out
and
you
know
stopped
coming,
and
so
we
realized
that
this
is.
K
This
is
really
important
for
us
to
think
through
thoughtfully
and
understand
that
we
do
we
we
feel
like.
We
need
to
engage
them
in
very
real
ways,
so
that
no
one
feels
blind-sided
so
that
we
can
have
open
lines
of
communication
and
so
that
we
can
realize
we're
over
here.
Doing
this.
K
You
all
are
over
here
doing
this
and
we'll
connect
when
we
need
to,
but
not
when
we
don't,
and
so
I'm
very
grateful
that
the
city
of
providence,
which
is
the
city
where
our
first
site
is
most
likely
going
to
be
just
because
of
size
and
density
and
municipal
buy-in,
is
that
they
have
put
together
this
working
group
that
has
different
departments.
Thinking
about
what
will
a
harm
reduction
center
look
like
when
it's
open
and
with
that
the
police
were
invited
to
a
seat
at
the
table.
K
They
have
been
part
of
the
process
we
presented
about
the
specific
location.
They
were
there,
and
so
I
think,
just
making
sure
that
they've
been
included
as
any
other
municipal
department,
as
ems
has
been,
as
the
zoning
department
has
been
so
that
we
can
continue.
That
conversation
has
been
really
important
and
then
I
think,
as
we
get
further
into
opening,
what
exactly
that
conversation
will
look
like
will
change.
I
think
you
know.
Obviously
again
the
people
at
the
top
can
say
one
thing's.
K
The
people
on
the
ground
can
say
different
things,
and
so
we
realized
that
it's
not
just
getting
getting
the
okay
of
someone
at
the
top.
I
will
also
say
I
was
quite
nervous
when
we
were
doing
legislative
advocacy
around
this
issue
that
our
police
union
would
be
very
opposed
to
it.
We
were
working
on
another
piece
of
legislation
that
reclassified
drug
possession
from
a
felony
to
a
misdemeanor
and
our
police
chiefs
association
just
really
came
out
in
full
force
against
it.
They
really
hated
it.
K
They
said
you
know
it's
taking
their
tools
from
the
toolbox,
all
the
things,
and
so,
with
that
experience,
although
we
were
able
to
get
that
law
passed,
I
was
nervous
that
they
would
come
out
of
the
woodwork
for
this
too,
and
they
didn't.
I
just
don't
think
they
care.
I
mean,
I
think
they
really
saw
it
as
a
separate
world,
and
so
I
was
really
grateful
for
that
and
it
was
a
bit
of
a
bellwether
to
understand
sort
of
what
their
approach
would
be
as
we
get
further
from
implementation
and.
J
D
I
have
a
few
questions,
though
I
don't
know
if
anyone
else
had
questions,
but
they
come.
It
was
really
just
around
like
how
to.
I
have
a
lot
of
questions,
but
I
I
think
just
as
the
city
councilor
trying
to
understand
it
sounds
like.
No,
no
cities
are
examples
of
these
centers.
No
cities
are
running
it
and
I
guess
I'm
trying
to
understand
when
the
city
is
actually
involved.
Is
it
related
to
the
like
zoning
aspect
of
it
or
the
funding
aspect?
D
J
The
city
so
the
city
hall
and
then
the
city
health
department.
J
In
our
context-
and
I
want
to
be
really
careful
here-
because
one
is
not
better
than
the
other
they're
just
different-
and
we
have
you
know
in
in
the
us-
we
have
all
these
little
political
microcosms
right
so
each
in
each
jurisdiction
we're
going
to
figure
out
a
unique
path
to
the
goal,
and
this
was
just
the
path
that
worked
for
new
york.
Rhode,
island's
is
very
different:
phillies
will
be
very
different.
La
is
going
to
be
very
different
for
us.
We
partnered
with
the
health
department
but
were
very
independent.
J
We
they
knew
so.
These
two
sites
are
the
fifth
and
sixth
consumption
site
that
I've
had
a
hand
in
either
building
an
opening
or
have
been
involved
with
in
some
way.
So
it's
a
very
weird
sort
of
niche
of
expertise
and
knowledge
that
I
have
my
mother.
You
know,
I'm
sure,
is
mortified
that
this
is
the
career
I
went
into,
but
I
know
a
lot
about
this,
so
the
city
trusted
trusted
me
to
do
this,
and
the
city
had
never
done
it
before.
J
So
we
were
in
a
very
unique
position
of
saying,
like
you
got
to.
Let
us
do
this,
you
got
to
let
us
lead
here
and
the
city
to
their
credit,
cause
health
departments.
Don't
often
do
this,
they
they
said.
Okay,
what
can
we
do
and
how
can
we
support
so
what
I
really
needed
for
them
to
do
for
us
was
to
be
to
be
our
pr
to
be
our
clout.
J
So,
as
the
provider
I
needed
to
focus
on
the
ground,
I
needed
to
focus
on
making
sure
the
service
was
tight
was
run
well,
no
one
died
to
really
manage
the
day-to-day
operation,
because
the
stakes
were
very
high.
I
mean
we
did
not
know
if
the
feds
were
going
to
come
and
throw
us
all
in
jail.
We
really
had
no
idea,
but
what
we
did
know
was
the
operations
had
to
be
as
close
to
flawless
as
they
could
be
what
the
health
department
had
to
do.
J
While
we
were
like
this,
just
making
sure
things
happened
was
they
had
to
have
our
back
so
for
if
you
choose
a
provider
that
isn't
the
health
department,
the
health
department
has
to
do
the
pr
for
that
provider.
They
have
to
defend
them
in
the
public
realm.
They
have
to
make
sure
that
their
key
messages
are
strong.
J
They
have
to
robustly
support
them
with
funding
if
they
can
give
them
the
tools,
they
need
to
be
successful
and
kind
of
run
interference
in
the
background,
because
the
health
department
has
various
echelons
of
power,
they
were
able
to
do
that
for
us
at
a
fairly
high
level.
So
we
could
just
focus
on
the
work
on
the
ground
and
I
think
it's
one
of
the
most
special
things
about
the
partnership
and
why
it
worked.
J
So
if
they
were
starting
to
get
flack
from
other
city
agencies,
department
of
sanitation,
department
of
transport
or
whatever,
just
as
an
example
or
the
state
or
the
feds,
we
could
send
the
new
york
city
health
department
to
speak
for
us
rather
than
feeling
like
we
had
to
defend
the
defend
the
turf
so
to
speak,
while
operating
the
service.
Does
that
kind
of
make
sense
so
really
mobilizing
and
and
weaponizing
in
a
positive
sense,
their
power
and
position
both
looking
upward
and
looking
outward
so
that
we
could
just
focus
on
the
work.
D
D
J
It's
a
good
it's
a
good
and
interesting
model.
I
think
it's
where
anna
jane
is
going
as
well
in
rhode
island,
because
there's
a
nimbleness
with
a
non-profit
that
the
bureaucracy
of
the
health
department
can't
always
meet
so
having
a
having
the
operator
be
a
non-profit
embedded
in
the
community
is
often
way
more
effective
than
having
it.
Oh
here's,
the
other
thing
it's
just
you
know
talk
about
the
elephant
in
the
room
having
the
non-profit,
be.
The
operator
allows
for
much
more
flexible
regulation.
J
J
The
city
health
department
did
not
write
them.
We
handed
them
to
them
and
said
this
is
what
it's
going
to
be.
They
had
no
feedback
because
they
they
couldn't,
if
they'd
written
them
on
their
own
and
the
state
health
department.
Is
writing
a
working
on
writing
at
some
regulations
now?
D
I
was
thinking-
and
I
guess
to
emily
this
question
is
too:
do
we
have
to
structure
something
at
the
state
level
for
municipalities
to
actually
have
these
kind
of
centers?
Is
there
something
that
had
to
happen
in
the
state
level
that
would
like
actually
create
an
infrastructure
for
a
city
or
municipality
to
do
that.
H
You
know
this
is
such
an
essential
service
that
the
city
is
gonna,
support
it
and
you
have
a
non-profit
operator,
and
you
just
do
it
right
based
on
you
know,
right
at
this
moment
in
time
it's
less
scary
than
it
was
a
year
ago
prior
to
on
point
doing
this.
So
that's
one
way,
as
I
think
anna
jane
mentioned,
so
we
have
introduced
legislation
like
rhode
island
has
so
that
was
house
bill.
H
So
that
is
definitely
happening
concurrently
and,
as
anna
jane
mentioned,
how
important,
having
that
local
municipal
support,
if
we're
going
to
actually
get
this
state
authorization
bill
through,
is,
is
really
important,
and
I
think
you
know
what
I
have
heard
from
the
governor's
office
is
basically
you
know
in
the
past
not
recently
that
they
would
rather
have
a
bill
on
their
desk
that
and
they
know
that
there
are
local
jurisdictions
that
are
interested
in
opening
right.
H
H
They
are
interested
in
opening
one
as
well,
so
it
I
have
a
feeling
that
you
know
this
is
again
a
good
time
right
now,
perhaps
politically
and
historically
and-
and
I
think,
there's
you
know
political
will.
But
it's
a
question
of
you
know,
and
I
love
caitlyn,
that
you
offered
these
different
types
of
models
around.
You
know
even
the
virtual
I
was
learning
so
much
more
tonight
than
I
had.
You
know
virtual
to
mobile.
H
To
these
you
know
the
hub
and
spoke,
which
is
a
really
interesting
model,
so
I
think
it
just
is
something
for
us
to
think
about,
and
also
that
community
engagement
piece
is
so
essential,
and
you
know
we're
going
to
be
doing
a
lot
of
that,
and
so
it'd
be
interesting
to
sort
of
hear
from
well
essential
to
hear
from
people
who
are
using
drugs
in
santa
fe
about
these
types
of
services
can.
J
J
We
didn't
do
a
ton
of
community
engagement
once
we
decided
to
open,
because
we
didn't
want
to
give
the
opposition
too
much
time
to
mobilize
against
us,
knowing
that
we
would
bear
the
brunt
of
that
backlash
and
be
we
needed
to
be
ready
to
deal
with
it
head-on
when
it
happened
and
sort
of
accept
responsibility
for
the
fact
that
we
didn't
do.
Community
engagement,
you're
gonna,
find
you're
gonna
have
to
split
the
difference
there.
J
I
I
think
there
is
sometimes
some
wisdom
in
asking
for
forgiveness
rather
than
permission,
especially
in
this
crisis.
You
know
your
stakeholders
best.
We
use
all
kinds
of
cheesy
analogies.
We
there
are
some
bears
we're,
not
gonna
poke,
because
why?
J
If
we're,
never
gonna
neutralize
somebody
who
positions
themselves
as
the
opposition,
the
strategy
needs
to
shift
right.
I
can't
necessarily
waste
my
energy
trying
to
flip
somebody.
I
can't
flip
so
ground
softening
was
really
key
for
us,
but
it
wasn't.
J
J
J
J
I
don't
think
we're
going
to
do
we're
not
going
to
host
town
halls,
we're
not
going
to
do
any
of
that,
because
it's
going
to
be
a
no
because
the
community
is
is
too
afraid
they
don't
know
the
intervention.
There's
no
example
to
look
at
in
the
states.
They
really
fear
it.
They
don't
have
enough
information
to
give
a
yes.
J
So
I
just
leave
that
there
as
some
food
for
thought.
That's
what
we
did
in
new
york.
There
was
definitely
people
who
came
out
of
the
woodwork
who
were
not
happy
and
we've
worked
really
closely
with
them
to
bring
them
along
and
we've
had
many
many
successes.
J
D
That's
kind
of
a
sticking
point
that
we
wouldn't
be
able
to
get
into
tonight.
It's
constant
and-
and
I
agree
with
the
community
outreach
piece
because
there's
been
times
of
non-transparency
in
the
city
and
bad
behavior
of
historically
and
so
people-
don't
trust
government
for
a
reason.
So
it's
kind
of
this
weird
balance
that
I
don't
know
how
to
solve
at
this
point.
D
But
and
then
I
guess
the
other
question
is
maybe
backing
it
up
with
data
and
if
people
are
saying
well,
you
shouldn't
be
beating
an
addiction,
and
you
know
all
the
rhetoric
that
actually
occurs
with
opening
centers
like
this.
D
If
there's
actually
data
you're,
showing
that
a
percentage
of
folks
seeking
rehabilitation
that
have
been
using
the
centers
and
showing
that
there
was
this
other
transformation,
as
well
as
a
percentage
or
showing
data
that
that's
there's
a
reduction
of
some
kind
of
crime,
because
if
people
are
trying
to
to
seek
and
are
speeding
or
supporting
an
addiction
and
they're
doing
things
outside
of
your
center
to
try
to
to
support
that,
then
I
guess
I
would
want
to
know
if
there
was,
if
you're,
seeing
a
reduction
of
crime
and
being
able
to
correlate
that.
D
J
That
that
is
the
question
right
like
that's,
that's
what
everybody
wants.
The
only
thing
I
would
say
is
the
reason
I'm
able
to
report
to
you
really
compelling
utilization
data
is
because
it's
immediate
the
more
long-term
outcomes
around
stabilization
maintenance,
safety
connection
to
care,
transitioning
away
from
drug
use.
That's
going
to
take
time
to
really
be
able
to
show
that
have
we
connected
people
to
detoxification
services
and
long-term
treatment
through
the
opcs,
absolutely
I
would
say
well,
over
a
hundred
times,
have
we
gotten
people
onto
buprenorphine
directly
from
the
opcs
absolutely?
J
Has
it
stuck
we'll
see
hard
to
say
what
what
we
do
know
about
the
people
that
are
using
our
overdose
prevention.
Centers
is
a
hundred
percent
of
them
literally,
a
hundred
percent
of
them
have
all
been
on
buprenorphine,
methadone
and
in
and
out
of
treatment,
multiple
times
multiple
times,
sometimes
twenty
to
thirty
times
a
hundred
percent
of
them.
J
It's
not
a
very
popular
thing
to
say,
but
abstinence
fails
every
single
time
until
the
one
time
it
doesn't
and
that's
really
where
harm
reduction
and
these
kinds
of
programs
come
in,
so
those
longer
term
outcomes,
I'm
just
as
curious
as
you
are
as
to
what
they
look
like
a
year
in
a
year
and
a
half
in,
but
it's
it's
a
little
too
early
to
say
in
terms
of
community
impact,
recidivism
safety
things
like
that.
J
We,
those
are
also
being
evaluated
again,
a
little
too
early
to
say,
and
we
have
a
compounding
factor
which
is.
This
is
the
first
summer
in
new
york
city.
After
two
years
of
repeated
lockdowns,
the
city
is
a
mess.
It's
an
absolute
mess
gun.
Violence
is
up
everywhere.
Mental
health
is
off
the
charts
it's
like,
and
we
are
there's
so
much
conflation
with,
like
the
toughest
summer.
New
york
city
has
seen
in
many
years
in
terms
of
crime
and
other
problems.
There's
a
conflation
of
that
and
then
here
we
have.
We've.
J
We've
opened
two
opcs,
and
this
is
our
first
summer.
So
in
our
particular
neighborhoods,
harlem
in
washington,
heights
is
really
trying
to
tease
out.
What's
us
what's
that
what's
other
factors,
but
that's
you
know,
god
bless
our
evaluators
because
that's
really
that's
really
their
puzzle
to.
D
Yes,
a
lot
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
things
to
think
about,
I
guess
and
and
just
really
impressed
by
your
your
commitment
to
this
work.
It's
amazing
and
we're
seeing
the
same
kind
of
stuff
happening
in
santa
fe.
You
know
84
000
population
and
it's
pretty
depressing
to
be
honest
with
you
and
as
elected
officials,
it's
hard
to
kind
of
navigate
that
right
now,
yeah.
D
So
I
have
so
many
other
thoughts,
but
I
will
stop
at
this
point
because
we
have
some
other
items
on
the
agenda
just
want
to
thank
anna
jane
and
katelyn.
Oh,
I
guess
we
have
more
questions
here.
A
I'm
sorry,
I
had
a
couple
questions.
You
talked
about
the
level
of
medical
training
in
the
other
models,
but
not
really
the
peer
model.
Are
they
rns
as
well.
J
So
I
want
to
be
want
to
be
clear.
I
want
to
make
a
distinction.
We
we
personally
because
there's
no
harm
reduction
university,
cranking
out
folks
that
know
how
to
do
this
and
it's
widely
just
not
discussed
in
medical,
school
or
nursing
school.
They
don't
even
touch
on
it,
a
little
bit
more
and
more
these
days,
but,
as
a
general
rule,
nothing
on
harm
reduction.
J
It's
it's
absolutely
paired
with
being
there
at
onset.
It's
the
reason.
We've
only
had
to
call
the
ambulance
five
times.
They
are
incredibly
skilled
at
responding
to
very
complex
overdose
presentations.
Poly
poly
modality
we're
dealing
with
heart
attacks,
strokes,
seizures,
you
name
it.
They
know
how
to
handle
it.
They
also
have
the
wisdom
to
know
the
limit
of
their
abilities
and
that's
also
a
very
big
part
of
this
work.
So
it's
it's
an
intensive
training
that
we
developed
and
we
provide.
We
use
oxygen
oral
and
pharyngeal
airways.
J
We
micro
dose
naloxone.
We
use
sort
of
a
bevy
of
other
tools,
but
our
ability
to
be
effective
is
really
because
we
are
there.
The
second,
the
medical
emergency
presents
we're
not
playing
catch
up
with
the
body.
A
K
Oh
well,
I'm
not
sure
exactly
what
you're
alluding
to,
but
we
we
in
our
regulations,
which
I
linked
to
just
as
like
some
sort
of
here's,
some
text
that
our
state
government
has
provided
that
may
or
may
not
be
useful
for
either
the
city
of
santa
fe
or
the
state
of
new
mexico.
But
the
we
need
a
medical
director
on
paper.
K
That
person
does
not
need
to
be
in
our
site,
and
my
hunch
is
that
they
will
not
be
need
to
be
very
present,
because
our
staff,
who
are
going
to
be
all
trained
in
how
to
do
this
work,
will
know
how
to
do
it.
Sort
of
what
caitlyn
was
saying
and
then
like
not
need
medical
oversight
in
the
way
that
someone
would
need
at
a
hospital
or
whatnot.
K
So
we
are
confident
that,
yes,
we
will
have
a
medical
director
as
per
the
regulations,
and
all
of
that
check.
All
those
boxes
make
sure
that
person
is
there.
If
and
when
we
do
need
them.
However,
we
don't
expect
that
we
will
need
them
because
of
because
of
the
proven
interventions
that
already
exist.
J
We
also
have
a
medical
director,
but
the
medical
director
does
not
technically
oversee
the
site,
and
this
is
what's
really
interesting.
We
have
a
few
emts
that
work
for
us
and
we
had
to
retrain
the
emts,
because
the
emts
arrive
at
overdoses
at
a
very
different
point
in
time
than
we
do
nothing.
The
emt
knew
in
terms
of
how
to
respond
applied
in
our
setting
same
went
for
our
medical
director.
She
is
wonderful,
highly
skilled,
incredible
doctor
didn't
know
how
to
respond
in
this
setting
there.
J
There
is
nothing
in
the
states
to
point
to.
It
is
the
uncharted
frontier,
and
so
our
medical
director
really
deferred
to
to
me
on
what?
What?
How
do
you
intervene
in
this
setting?
J
So
looking
for
a
provider,
a
medical
director
who
is
supportive
of
the
work
but
allows,
but
also
allows
for
the
work
to
happen,
is,
is
going
to
be
really
important,
because
a
lot
of
doctors
get
really
quite
precious
about
this
and
nurses.
This
is
these.
Are
you
know?
These
are
clinical
skills.
You
know
this
is
this:
is
the
the
wheelhouse
of
providers
and
and
that's
that's
not
who
you're
going
to
want
to
look
for
in
a
clinical
partner
for
this
kind
of
work?.
A
Yeah
thanks
and
then
kailyn
said
that
she
has
some
freedom,
because
she's,
a
non-profit
and
managing
you
have
more
regulations
to
go
through.
How
are
you
going
to
get
by
people
wanting
to
visit
your
site
wanting
to
go
there,
knowing
that
you're
regulated
by
government
really.
K
Yes,
that's
a
good
question:
our
staff
has
really
really
really
deep
connections
like
many
of
our
staff
used
to
use
drugs
with
our
clients
right,
they
grew
up
in
the
same
neighborhoods.
They
are
oftentimes
are
like
literally
family
with
people,
and
so
there
is
a
lot
of
trust,
and
there
is
you
know.
Some
of
my
coworkers
are
literally
with
our
clients
like
as
they're
dying
in
the
hospital,
like
the
level
of
trust,
is
really
really
really
deep.
So
will
we
be
regulated?
K
Yes,
we
are
a
non-profit
that
has,
you
know
over
a
decade
of
experience
in
harm
reduction.
So,
yes,
we
will
be
regulated,
we
will.
We
will
make
sure
we
need
those
requirements,
we
will
have
a
license,
but
we
will
not
be
a
government
institution.
We
will
not
be
a
hospital,
we
will
not
be
those
things,
and
so
currently
our
drop-in
centers
don't
have
to
go
through
any
regulatory
processes.
K
Although
we
are
funded
by
the
department
of
health,
the
department
of
health
shows
up
not
infrequently
because
we
do
have
a
good
working
relationship,
so
I
don't
anticipate
it
will
change
just
because
we
do
have
to
submit
an
application
in
our
department
of
health,
as
I
mentioned,
has
been
incredibly
supportive,
both
publicly
and
privately
they've
had
our
backs
with
the
governor's
office.
They've
had
our
backs
with
the
media.
K
They've
had
our
backs
around
funding
allocations
like
they've,
really
really
been
supportive,
and
that
is
a
huge
blessing
and
again
because
we're
rhode,
island
we're
tiny
everything
happens
at
the
state
level.
We
don't
have
a
city
level
department
of
health.
We
don't
have
a
district
attorney,
so
everything
happens
at
the
state
level
there
as
well,
and
so
it
might
be
a
different
type
of
scenario
than
a
state
like
new
mexico.
I
know
santa
fe
is
is
a
relatively
small
compared
to
a
place
like
new
york,
but
obviously
the
state
is
huge,
so.
A
Thanks
and
then
do
you
both
your
groups
plan
on
or
do
you
hand
out
naloxone
as
people
are
leaving
or
can
they
request
it
if
they're
leaving
or
is
the
thought
that
you
come,
do
your
whatever
you're
gonna
do
there
and
then
you're
under
under
your
kind
of
a
watchful
eye
until
they
leave.
J
For
us
it
really,
as
we
get
to
know
people
I
mean
we,
we
are
literally
taping
naloxone
to
some
people's
sleeves.
You
know
people
overdose
for
lots
of
reasons.
J
Suicide
attempts
just
not
knowing
how
to
dose
properly
all
kinds
of
reasons,
so
we
go
through
just
piles
and
piles
of
naloxone
partially
because
we're
not
open
24
hours.
J
Yet
looking
at
the
washington
heights
program
and
stigma
is
very,
very
real:
we've
lost,
we
lost,
we've
lost
two
staff
from
the
washington
heights
consumer-led
program,
one
of
our
our
picks
died
of
an
overdose
not
at
the
site
and
another
one
of
our
staff
died
of
an
overdose
in
the
building
beside
the
overdose
prevention
center
directly
attached
to
it-
and
it's
this
thinking
of
you
know,
I'm
a
staff,
that's
not
for
me,
that's
for
them.
J
Stigma
is
incredibly
real
and
I
I
share
that
to
be
very,
very
transparent
that,
yes,
we
have
these
beautiful,
sights
and
we've
saved
so
many
lives,
but
we've
also
lost
people.
So
one
of
our
staff
died
in
the
building
beside
the
overdose
prevention
center
when
we
were
open
and
she
just
she
used
pills
and
she
bought
some
pills
off
the
street
and
she
thought
I'm
not
an
injector.
J
I
don't
need
to
use
in
the
opc
and
she
died
and
then
four
other
people,
including
the
one
staff
I
mentioned,
all
died
in
washington
heights.
While
we
were
closed
overnight
in
the
subway
stations
and
parks
directly
around
the
opc,
so
we
took
great
care
of
them
during
the
day
we
weren't
overnight
and
they
they
died.
So
yeah
a
lot
of
naloxone
still
and
still
a
lot
of
heartache.
To
be
honest,.
K
Yeah
I
mean
I,
we
already
pass
out
a
lot
of
it
and
I
anticipate
that
we
would
continue
and
especially
like
we,
we
know.
G
K
Are
going
to
have
to
start
with
limited
hours
like
we
know
that
we
are
going
to?
We
would
rather
do
something
well
for
a
fewer
number
of
hours
and
have
adequate
staffing
and
be
like.
Oh,
we
can
just
stretch
people
out,
especially
this
work
is
really
really
hard.
It's
really
traumatic,
and
so
we
want
to
be
honest
and
up
front
about
that
and
not
completely
burn
people
out.
So
with
that,
you
know
understanding
that
we
won't
be
open
all
the
time
that
we
will
need
to
continue
distributing
supplies,
as
we
already
do.
J
I
really
appreciate
that
you
said
that
staffing,
our
opcs
is
opt-in,
opt-out,
so
staff
are
allowed
to
move
out
of
the
opc
if
they
feel
like.
I
need
a
minute.
I
gotta
tap
out
sitting
as
anna
jane
said
sitting
and
witnessing
people
consuming
drugs
for
hours
and
hours
and
hours
every
week
is
very,
very
hard.
It's
a
level
of
intimacy
and
witnessing
that
can
be
quite
draining
and,
and
so
staff
do
need
to
have
the
fluidity
and
the
option
of
stepping
back
for
their
own
mental
health.
A
Thanks
so
before
becoming
a
city
council,
I
was
a
paramedic
firefighter
here
in
the
city,
so
I've
seen
firsthand
what
you
guys
are
talking
about.
So
thank
you
and
keep
fighting
the
goodbye.
This
is
it's
been
a
long
time
coming.
So
good
luck
to
both
of
you
and
thank
you
for
being
here
with
us.
H
Yeah
kayla
and
anna
jane.
Thank
you
so
much
and
look
forward
to
working
with
both
of
you
around
the
country.
As
these
start
becoming
more
and
more
well,
the
stigma
will
be
erased
right.
Yes,.
A
Oh
wow,
that
was
a
lot.
It
was
a
good
stuff
thanks
again
emily
appreciate
it
we're
on
to
an
action
item.
G
Yeah,
thank
you,
emily.
That
was
really
great.
I,
and
maybe
this
is
something
we
can
discuss
in
our
working
group,
I'm
wondering
if
you
have
fleshed
out
or
what
we
need
to
get
there,
and
I
don't
remember
if
this
it
was
so
fleshed
out
like
what
the
path
to
something
like
this
is
for
appropriate
to
santa
fe,
and
if
we
got
to
that
in
the
mds
strategy,
I
don't
think
it
was
that
fleshed
out,
and
so
I'm
wondering
what
we
need
to
create
that
viable
plan.
G
Now
I
mean
what
you
know:
no,
no
understanding
what
funding
sources
is
understanding
what
services
are
provided
here
from
the
recovery
community.
I
mean
all
of
these
things
like
how
do
we
get
from
these
ideas
to
this
is
a
smart,
viable
path
in
santa
fe,
for
our
report.
H
Yeah,
I
think
I
think
there
are
two
concurrent
paths
and
we
maybe
we
can
talk
about
it
in
our
subcommittee
and
but
I
think,
there's
one
about
supporting,
what's
happening
at
a
state
level
to
make
this
you
know
have
some
cover,
which
I
think
is
probably
where
most
local
jurisdictions
are
going
to
want
to
have
that
authorization,
but
also,
I
think,
there's
so
much
work
that
has
to
be
done
to
even
start
thinking
about
implementing
and
standing
up
and
what
model
might
be
most
appropriate
and
so
yeah.
H
G
But
but
it
there
are
a
lot
of
options
and,
and
it
just
it
will
take
a
lot
of
work,
and
so
is
it
is
it
the
working
group
like
they
came
up
with,
and
I
forget
which
community
where
they
you
know
created,
I
think,
was
in
rhode
island.
I
mean
what
is
the
like,
I'm
just
thinking
again
towards
what
are
concrete
recommendations
that
we're
going
to
make
at
the
end
of
the
year.
So
thank
you.
Thank
you
for
being.
On
top
of
it.
A
Thanks
marcella
any
other
hands
up
or
any
other
questions
that
don't
see
any
all
right.
We're
honda
for
our
agenda,
an
action
item
for
discussion,
which
is
approval
of
meeting
format
through
the
term
of
the
task
force,
so
julie
basically
put
this
on
to
see
if
we're
okay
meeting
the
way
we
are
right
now
with
in
person
and
zoom
option,
both
available
or
we'd,
rather
just
all
meet
in
person
or
go
back
to
all
on
zoom.
Can
we.
D
Go
back
to,
I
don't
know,
but
essentially
we
have
to
go
through
this
route
to
to
verify
that
we
all
want
to
continue
having
this
meeting
format
of
hybrid
and
we
have
to
vote
on
it
and
we
actually
have
to
track
the
votes.
Valeria
of
people
saying
a
or
a
so
yes
or
no
so.
A
D
A
Feeling
that
this
seems
to
work,
I
think,
or
if
you
can
make
it
you
make
it,
and
if
you
can't
you
get
on
zoom
and
be
able
to
participate
in
that
format,
is
that
what
everybody
wants
to
see?
Moving
forward
yeah.
L
A
L
B
G
A
Really
yes,
and
I'm
a
yes
as
well,
so
we'll
continue
with
this
hybrid
process
through
the
term
of
the
taskbar.
Thank
you.
Next
is
working
group
updates.
D
Sure
I
just
wanted
to
let
our
working
group
know
that,
after
our
presentation
at
the
city
council
meeting
to
update
folks
on
where
we
were
at
and
with
the
working
groups,
it
stirred
a
little
bit
of
energy
around
the
fact
that
we
didn't
feel
like
there
were
some
some
questions
we
still
had
remaining
and
we've.
Actually
I
outlined
it
very
generally
in
the
presentation,
but
in
our
actual
quarterly
report
and
talked
about
some
of
the
things
we're
still
seeking
and
I
kind
of
just
try
to
synthesize
it.
D
We
should
probably
look
at
all
those
questions
and
make
sure
that,
like
the
follow-up
that
we
wanted
a
while
ago
that
we
can
just
get
that
because
I
think
staff
is
ready
to
look
at
it
and
then
now
that
we
have
julie
to
help
us
navigate
that
if
it
doesn't
fall
under
like
pd
or
our
fire
department,
and
we
need
to
get
hr
to
help
us
with
some
data,
then
we
have,
hopefully
julie
will
be
able
to
navigate
and
help
us
with
that.
D
So
I
may,
I
guess
just
wanted
to
let
you
know
that
that
we
were
in
conversation
with
kira
and
she
wanted
to
follow
up
with
us,
but
I
think
it
probably
makes
more
sense
for
us
to
follow
up
as
a
working
group
with
staff
again
so
that
we
can
kind
of
get
all
those
points
cleared
and
understood,
understand
where
we
can
get
info
and
where
we
can't.
D
E
National
association
of
civilian
oversight
groups-
something
like
that.
I
can
look
it
up,
but
I
have
not
heard
back.
I
called
them
and
emailed
them
and
I
don't
know
if
they
followed
up
directly
with
val,
have
they?
I
think
we
need
a
confirmation.
I
mean
they
had.
I
accord
you
guys
what
they
sent
me,
which
was
you
know,
saying
they
were
going
to
present
in
august.
That
have
not
heard
back
since
then.
D
Okay,
so
we'll
just
have
to
keep
trying
to
make
sure,
because
that
would
be
the
next
presentation
for
our
next
meeting
and
that's
the
national
association
association
for
civilian
oversight
of
law
enforcement
mouthful.
So
that's
the
plan
y'all
for
them
to
be
able
to
present
at
the
next
meeting,
but
we'll
keep
you
updated
as
we
try
to
keep
outreach.
Was
there
anything
else
you
all
in
our
working.
C
E
E
I
have
to
go,
but
maybe
counselor
we
can
set
up
a
working
group
meeting.
I
think,
might
be
helpful
just
to
check.
D
I
think
I'm
just
gonna
follow
up
like
to
say
like
what
what
we're
thinking
and
if
you
can
look
at
I'll,
have
to
send
you
the
document
that
we
put
together.
I
don't
know
if
all
of
you
had
actually
looked
at
it
in
detail
and
it
might
help
to
just
narrow
down
some
of
those
still
remaining
data
points,
information
that
we're
seeing
so.
E
G
G
I
don't
understand
why
some
meetings
are
being
canceled
or
not,
and
so
I'm,
assuming
that
the
dates
that
you
put
in
there
valeria
are
the
dates,
and
so,
if
you
could
help
me
figure
out
the
best
late
august
early
september
date,
that
is
free.
That
would
be
great
so
that
I
can
start
putting
that
together.
We
already
have
people
who
are
excited
about
presenting.
D
G
Probably
not
I
can,
I
can
check,
but
you
know
the
truth.
Is
I'm
not
really
meeting
with
one
of
them
until
the
12th?
So
that's
probably
not
going
to
work,
but
it
was
unclear
to
me
if
there
was
this
early
september
date
that
was
free
or
if
that
meeting
was
getting
moved
anyway.
It
we.
I
don't,
have
to
belabor
the
point
here.
If
you
could
just
help
me
figure
that
out
offline
valeria.
That
would
be
great.
D
D
Cool
anything
on
the
other
test
or
sorry.
The
other
working
group
updates
anything.
D
I
suggest
you
all
try
to
connect
soon,
because
the
unm
contract
is
going
to
kind
of
dovetail
with
your
working
group
and
we
need
to
figure
out
if
it
makes
sense
for
dr
sanchez
to
come
here
to
talk
to
us
about
that
or
to
work
with
you
all
kind
of
I
don't
know.
I
don't
know
what
that
looks
like
again.
G
Do
we
have
to
wait
until
the
contract
is
signed
and
ready
to
go,
because
I
know
that
there
were
issues
with
it
because
we're
happy
to
meet
with
him
to
come
up
with
a
proposal
for
the
whole
group,
and
I
know
that
we
already
did
that,
but
to
polish
even
more
that
proposal
and
get
it
ready
with
timelines
and
everything
and
then
bring
it
to
the
next
meeting.
G
D
Think
he
already
has
something
structurally
ready
to
go
is
what
he
told
me
and
just
needs
to
know
where
he
fits
into
this,
even
though
we're
waiting
for
the
contract
to
be
signed
officially,
but
structurally,
he
could
probably
yeah
informally.
I.
G
Yeah,
no,
we
worked
very
closely
our
group
with
him
on
that,
and
so
we
have
that.
I
just
I
don't
know.
If
we've
anyway,
we
can,
we
can
discuss
it
with
emily
and
monica
and
mary
louise
just
on
how
to
how
to
refine
it.
For
the
particular
moment
that
we're
dealing
with
right
now
and
the
time
period
that
he's
going
to
have
to
be
able
to
do
it.
A
Any
matters
from
the
task
force.
A
Don't
see
any
just
a
reminder,
our
next
meeting
is
tuesday
august
16th,
5,
30
and
again
we'll
either.
If
you
can
meet
live,
we'll
be
here
at
market
station,
which
is
at
the
rail
yard.
It's.