►
Description
00:00 Meeting Commences, Attendance/Apologies, Leave of Absence, Conflict of Interest Declarations, Committee Forward Planning Schedule
07:00 Closed Session
44:00 Open Session Reports 7.1, 7.2
48:00 Confirmation of Minutes
49:00 Report 6.1
2:19:00 Report 6.2
3:32:00 Closed Session
4:00:00 Open Session, Report 6.2
4:34:00 General Business
A
A
B
B
Right
so
in
2011
12
years
ago,
Anning
donated
675
dollars
to
my
election
campaign
in
this
item
today.
There's
another
company
called
RPS,
Australia
East,
proprietary,
Limited
I,
don't
know
who
they
are
and
I've
had
no
contact
with
RPS
planning
for
years
many
years
so
I'm
seeking
to
remain
in
the
room
and
participate
in
the
decision
today
due
to
the
Strategic
nature
of
the
project,
but
I
felt
obliged
to
make
this
declaration
given
I,
don't
know
whether
there
is
whether
they're
connected
in
any
way.
Okay.
D
B
F
B
No,
but
I
did
send
a
request
through
to
general
counsel,
who
did
a
company
search
a
waste
of
time,
but
anyway
she
did
a
company
search
and
suggested
I
still
make
the
Declaration,
but
I
don't
know.
I've
had
no
contact
with
them
for
many
years,
so
I
don't
know
and
I've
never
heard
of
RPS
Australia
East
proprietary
limited,
but
in
an
abundance
abortion
I'm,
making
the
Declaration.
A
Yeah
and
further
to
that-
and
they
probably
don't
need
to
edit
counselor
Gates-
isn't
even
aware
of
whether
she
does
have
a
conflict
with
this
new
company
anyway.
So
if
she
doesn't
know
that
she's
got
a
conflict,
I
wouldn't
think
she's
conflicted,
but
I
understand
why
councilor
Gates
wants
to
wanted
to
raise
it.
A
A
So
we
probably
need
to
call
everyone.
Don't
we
so
councilor
Patterson
counselor
chose
a
counselor,
Taylor
counselor
young,
councilor,
McDonald
and
myself,
and
please
note
the
counselor.
Oh
sorry
against.
There's
nobody
against.
So
please
note
that
counselor
Gates
did
not
vote
yeah.
Thank
you!
Okay,
counselors.
A
So
if
the
committee
is
happy
with
that,
I'm
happy
to
move
us
into
closed
session,
because
the
matters
are
what's
the
wording,
but
would
would
certainly
impact
on
the
discussions
would
impact
on
the
budget
and
also
will
involve
commercial
incompetence.
So
so
I'll
move
this
into
close
thanks,
councilor
Gates,
it's
the
second
all,
those
in
favor
that
is
carried.
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
H
A
B
And
what
I
want
to
declare
counselors
is
that
I'm,
a
beneficiary
of
hachoma
proprietary,
limited
trading
as
the
gates
family,
discretionary
trust,
which
operates
primarily
at
Sanctuary.
Cove
I,
therefore,
will
not
participate
in
the
debate,
given
that
the
report
mentions
Sanctuary
Cove
as
a
participant
in
the
program
and
I
will
provide
this
to
the
minute
secretary
and
leave
the
room
five
five,
seven.
Oh
six,.
A
A
B
A
A
Thanks
councilor,
hey,
it's
Castleton,
yep,
all
good,
all
right
councilors!
We
would
take
the
vote
on
that.
All
those
in
favor
that
is
carried
I
did
mention
at
the
beginning
of
the
meeting
confirmation
of
minutes,
but
I
never
actually
got
a
mover
and
a
seconder
because
then
the
conflict
came
up,
so
we
didn't
actually
do
that
one.
So
I
am
looking
for
a
mover
for
the
confirmation
of
the
minutes.
A
Counselor
chose
a
second
to
counselor
young
everyone's
happy
to
take
the
vote
on
that
all
those
in
favor
that
is
carried
Council
as
we
come
back
to
the
to
the
two
items
that
are
in
open
the
first
one
is
the
Springbrook
cableway
update
report
and
I.
Think
Jeff
is
going
to
I.
Think
it's
pretty
self-explanatory.
Unless
you
just
got
questions
for
Jeff
and
sgf
actually
wants
to
make
a
bit
of
a
presentation
on
it.
A
I
I
Good
afternoon
councilors,
so
at
our
last
update
to
you
on
this
matter
in
July
last
year,
Council
resolved
to
seek
confirmation
that
the
state
would
endorse
a
future
referral
under
the
upbc
ACT.
That's
the
environment,
protection
biodiversity
conservation
act
prior
to
progressing
efforts
on
the
concept
of
a
cable
way
to
Springbrook.
So
the
state
responded
to
the
request,
acknowledging
that
the
city
was
being
very
proactive
and
preparing
the
way
for
this
opportunity
to
go
forward
and
confirming
that
it
wanted
us
to
undertake
consultation
with
traditional
owners
and
with
the
wider
community.
I
The
state
are
reaffirmed,
it's
a
previous
View
that
it
will
consider
the
outcomes
of
the
consultation
with
traditional
owners
and
with
wider
stakeholders
as
part
of
any
request
for
State
involvement
in
the
concept.
So
in
the
report
before
you
today,
we're
recommending
that
we
commence
that
consultation
with
traditional
owners
and
that
we
develop
a
draft
Community
consultation
strategy
to
bring
back
to
you
for
consideration
and
decision.
I
You
need
to
keep
bringing
online
new
attractions
and
we
know
over
the
last
10
to
15
years
Queensland
and
the
Gold
Coast
is
included
in
this.
We
have
been
losing
market
share
to
Interstate
competitors,
particularly
down
south,
because
we
haven't
been
bringing
online
new
attractions
in
the
same
way
our
Interstate
competitors
have
been
so.
I
This
has
seen,
for
example,
the
rate
of
international
visitor
expenditure
on
the
Gold
Coast
and
the
five
years
before
covert,
obviously
when
the
whole
world
changed,
but
during
those
those
five
years
up
to
2019,
when
globally,
tourism
was
booming,
our
rate
of
growth
of
international
visitation
and
visitation
expenditure
was
a
lot
lower
than
that
of
comparable
Interstate
destinations.
So
we
were
less
than
half
that
of
Sydney
and
less
than
a
third
that
of
Melbourne
in
terms
of
the
growth
through
that
period.
I
So
just
in
terms
of
looking
around
at
what
others
are
doing
in
Australia,
if
you
look
at
Google
Google
how
they
rank
the
top
attractions
in
Australia,
the
Gold
Coast
currently
does
not
have
one
listed
in
the
top
25,
so
our
highest
attraction
starts
at
number
27
and
then
we've
got
the
theme,
parks
and
as
well
as
q1
and
then
spring
brought.
Interestingly,
is
the
next
one
which
comes
in
at
number
36
on
Google
for
the
Lonely
Planet.
I
So
another
obvious,
you
know
source
for
prospective
travelers
to
look
at
in
terms
of
developing
their
itineraries.
So
in
the
top
23
for
Australia,
we
don't
have
the
Gold
Coast
listed
in
the
top
23..
The
first
three
places
go
to
Sydney
with
their
iconic
attractions
and
then
interestingly,
I
thought.
Brisbane
South
Bank
is
actually
number
four
in
Australia
at
the
moment
on
Lonely
Planet.
I
So
in
terms
of
council
strategy,
if
we
want
to
make
this
the
best
place
to
visit
in
Australia
and
if
we
want
to
increase
visitor,
spend
on
the
Gold
Coast,
we
need
new
attractions
and
then
this
is
one
opportunity
to
do
that.
And
then
we
also
have
in
the
council
strategy
an
outcome
around
sustainable
transport
and
providing
our
people,
which
includes
our
visitors,
that
we
host
as
well
choices
to
move
around
the
city
easily.
I
So
if
we
look
at
springbrock
in
terms
of
how
visitors
get
up
there,
we
currently
have
very
high
volumes
of
cars
and
coaches
driving
up
and
down
the
mountain.
There's
also
a
significant
cost
to
rebuilding
that
road
when
it's
damaged
from
flooding
as
it
has
been
recently,
and
we
now
have
a
two-year
plus
rebuild
of
that
road,
including
a
road
diversion
so
for
Mobility
challenged
visitors.
I
So
we're
thinking
about
you
know
either
whether
it's
people
with
disabilities
or
elderly
visitors
as
well
as
residents,
it's
not
an
easy
place
to
access
so
again
in
terms
of
going
to
that
outcome
and
how
we
might
be
able
to
achieve
it
across
the
city.
A
cableway
would
provide
a
more
sustainable
way
for
people
to
get
to
springbrog,
and
it
would
also
be
an
easy
way
to
access
that
National
Park.
I
So
in
terms
of
some
of
the
risks
around
this
project
and
I'm
sure
we're
going
to
be
talking
about
that
very
shortly.
Obviously,
there
are
environmental
and
Commercial
risks,
and
these
are
something
some
things
that
we
would
look
at
and
we
would
address
through
a
detailed
business
case
and
detailed
design
of
a
project.
I
I
guess
I
should
also
clarify
too
in
case
there's
been
sort
of
any
misunderstander.
At
least
this
is
my
view
that
this
is
not
a
project
that
Council
would
fully
fund.
My
strong
advice
would
be
if
Council
can
de-risk
this
project
for
proponents,
it
would
be
a
very
attractive
project
commercially
and
we
would
go
to
the
market
and
we
would
find
an
industry
proponent
that
would
build
it,
such
as
we
have
seen
go
forward
already
in
Queensland
and
in
other
parts
of
Australia.
I
So
we
might
just
mention
the
next
slide
now
and
talk
about
the
process
that
we're
outlining
and
to
be
clear
that
at
this
point,
what
we're
seeking
your
endorsement
of
is
to
consult
the
community
one
risk
there.
Obviously
that
we
do
need
to
be
mindful
of
is
given
the
number
of
high
priority
projects
that
we
have
across
Council
and
the
level
of
consultation
currently
underway
on
those
is
that
we
may
be
overwhelming
some
of
our
residents.
We
might
be
confusing
residents
about
priorities
and
the
way
that
we
would
address.
I
This,
obviously,
is
coordinating
within
those
consultations
that
are
underway.
We
might
be
able
to
piggyback
on
an
existing
consultation
and
also
to
contextualize
it,
as
I
have
talked
about.
I
think
there
is
a
risk
where
we're
not
to
consult
traditional
owners,
at
least
given
the
state
has
asked
us
to
do
that.
I
We
know
tourism
is
one
of
the
few
Economic
Development
opportunities
for
where,
for
which
traditional
owners
have
comparative
advantage
in
terms
of
ownership
of
land
and
Avenue,
to
tell
and
share
their
traditional
stories,
and
they
have
demonstrated
this
through
increased
interest
in
tourism
development
in
Queensland
that
are
very
well
placed
to
lead
or
benefit
from.
So
there
is
a
risk
there
will
be
to
assume
that
we
knew
what
they
thought
and
not
at
least
Consulting
them
so
I'll
leave
it
there
and
I.
I
C
Thank
you
through
you,
so
the
first
question
I've
got
I
remember
when
we
were
last
discussing
this,
that
the
CEO
mentioned
that
there
was,
and
there
hasn't
been
a
potentially
a
clear
analysis
by
the
city
of
who
the
traditional
owners
are
for
what
areas
and
that
there
was
going
to
be
a
full
review
of
that.
Prior
to
this,
has
that
been
done
is
that
is
that
work
been
done
to
identify
traditional
owners
of
specific
areas
thanks.
I
For
the
question
and
through
the
chair
and
I'll
throw
to
Darren
shortly
in
terms
of
the
specifics,
but
I
can
say
that
we
have
identified
at
a
high
level
who
the
keys,
traditional
owners
or
indigenous
stakeholder
groups
are
and
I
know
from
a
state
perspective
that
the
expectation
would
be
regardless
of
which
claims
might
have
precedence
at
the
moment.
And
we
all
know,
there's
no
native
title
determination
over
this
area.
But
the
expectation
from
the
state
is
that
we
consult
with
everybody
and
anybody
who
expresses
an
interest
in
this
project.
J
Through
you
Mr
chair,
so
the
understanding
is
that
there's
actually
three
layers
to
the
consultation
piece
with
the
traditional
owners.
So
the
first
one
is
with
Native.
Title
is
directly
with
dangan
Balon,
all
the
Five
Rivers
people
and
they're
the
registered
date
or
native
tidal
climate
for
the
Gold
Coast.
So
quite
specific,
we
have
an
Avenue
direct
with
them
as
the
first
layer
in
terms
of
the
second
layer
and
that's
around
cultural
heritage
is
with
debris
and
with
the
Danga
Balan
people
again
and
that's
for
the
specific
area.
C
I
J
Sorry
through
the
chair,
the
with
Native
title,
it's
actually
through
the
Queensland
Services
NATO,
Queensland,
South,
Native,
title
services,
so
they're
actually
the
legal
representation
for
that
group.
At
the
moment
we
have
been
just
emailing
and
keep
them
up
to
date.
With
the
progress
of
this
particular
issue,
we
haven't
had
Direct
engagement
per
the
council
Direction
in
terms
of
cultural
heritage.
C
J
Through
the
chair,
the
I
guess
the
best
answer
to
that,
and
that's
probably
the
only
the
learnings
from
dealing
with
the
cultural
Precinct
design
process
is
that
the
relationship
goes
back
to
Jenny
Graham.
Who
is
the
original
and
then
there's
a
number
of
families
under
that
that
Cascade
down
I
wouldn't
be
able
to
comment
on
all
the
different
layers.
I
Could
I
just
add
to
that?
If
there's
a
concern
given
I
guess
you
know
it's
not
clear,
because
we
don't
have
native
title
determination
just
by
way
of
example,
in
the
last
major
ecotourism
development
I
led
in
my
last
role
with
the
state
government,
this
can
be
done
through
groups,
so
we
had
quarterly
consultation
meetings.
Different
people
from
the
Aboriginal
groups
turned
up
at
different
times,
but
we
considered
once
we'd,
run
for
quarterly
consultation
meetings
that
we
had
consultate
consulted
sufficiently.
D
I
I,
don't
think
we
could
put
a
time
frame
on
it
until
we
had
actually
engaged
with
like
I
was
saying
Queensland
South,
Native
title
services
and
got
some
advice
around
how
we
should
do
this.
So
I
was
talking
about
a
different
part
of
Queensland
I.
Think
that
sounds
like
a
reasonable
time
frame
in
terms
of
the
full
consultation.
I'd
hope
we
might
be
able
to
engage
with
the
key
people
and
get
a
top
level
view
before
that.
D
And
given
that
there
isn't
any
substance
around
the
built
form
around
this
idea
and
just
the
picture
we're
looking
at,
what's
the
what's
the
nature
of
help,
help
us
understand
what
a
traditional
owner
consultation
looks
like
when
we're
really
just
kind
of
looking
at
a
grayed
out
area
on
a
map.
What
is
that?
What
are
we
asking
them?
What
sort
of
things
are
we
talking
about.
I
I
You
know
there
is
an
opportunity
here
to
have
a
cable,
Way,
Type
development,
but
really
the
significance
of
the
place
hear
their
stories,
including
you
know,
the
histories
of
the
different
families
that
move
through
there,
who
we
should
be
talking
to
and
generally
get
their
their
feel
for
if
this
is
something
that
they
would
support,
talk
about
their
aspirations
for
economic
development
for
their
peoples.
You
know
how
tourism
fits
within
that
if
this
is
something
that
would
align
with
their
aspiration
for
tourism
development
within
their
country,.
D
And
just
to
follow
one
question
from
that
at
the
moment:
you're
getting
your
presentation,
you
kind
of
talked
a
little
bit
about
there
being
other
concurrent
consultations.
Having
only
recently
occurred,
Darren
talked
a
little
bit
about
the
cultural
Precinct
one,
and
you
mentioned
there
was
others
off
the
top.
My
head,
there's
the
light
rail
there's
green
heart.
There's
the
spit,
there's
a
few
different
things
going
on.
How
many
are
there
in
the
city
where
we're
engaging
with
traditional
owners
at
the
moment.
D
Yes,
sir,
or
maybe
I'll
notice,
if
that's
all,
maybe
we'll
take
it
on
notice
and
is
there
in
our
experience
with
those
consultations,
have
we
observed
traditional
owners
leveraging
one
project
off
others?
Do
they
see
government
in
general
and
or
are
they
able
to
be
quite
targeted
in
the
way
they
provide
feedback
about
a
specific
project.
D
D
I
Illua
processes
are
are
difficult,
and
so
that's
why
you
see
governments
across
Australia,
leaning
in
and
de-risking
these
projects
before
proponents
come
forward
because
there
are
easier
opportunities
for
the
companies
of
the
scale
that
we're
talking
about.
So
it's
not
going
to
be.
You
know
in
terms
of
the
big
resources
companies-
and
you
know
the
major
infrastructure
companies
they're,
not
the
ones
that
would
be
running
a
cable
way
to
springbrock
for
the
type
of
company.
It
really
requires
government
to
de-risk
it.
So
it's
been
too
early
to
have
that
conversation.
K
B
I
Read
a
good
question.
Thank
you
through
the
chair,
so
we
obviously
do
want
to
do
this
in
a
fiscally
responsible
manner.
We
do
feel
for
the
stage
of
this
concept
and
for
conversations
with
traditional
owners.
We
know
enough
about
the
environmental
values
from
the
designations.
You
know
we
know
that's
National
Park.
We
know
that's
world
heritage
area.
J
So
through
the
chair,
the
original
report
to
council
around
Community
consultation
and
the
traditional
owner
engagement
was
the
500
000..
The
environmental's
audit
was
an
addition
that
was
added
on
the
floor
of
council
for
that
one,
as
Jeff
pointed
out,
we'd
probably
have
to
come
back
if
counselor
do
want
to
proceed
with
that
body
of
work.
In
parallel
with
the
consultation
piece,
we'd
probably
have
to
come
back
and
actually
just
determine
what
the
brief
is.
The
scope
is
and
the
cost
to
do
that
additional
body
of
work.
J
Through
the
chair,
we'd
have
to
take
it
away
and
actually
scope
it
up.
We
did
have
some
preliminary
conversations
with
our
natural
areas
unit
around
what
that
would
actually
look
like,
and
we
did
go
back
to
our
original
Consultants
around
the
feasibility,
okay,
but
it
would
be
a
scoping
exercise
and
coming
back
to
council
with
the
actual
cost
for
that
particular
item.
It's
such
a
big
area.
B
B
On
our
report
on
page
17,
it
says:
City
officers
are
re-looking
at
the
concept
for
the
cable
way
to
consider
public
transport
and
environmental
benefits,
and
then
it
says,
information
on
Dual,
Purpose,
cableways
passenger
Transport
Systems
in
similar
environments
in
other
countries,
is
also
being
sought.
So
I
just
wondered
how?
How
is
that
being
sought
for?
Is
someone
visiting
or
answer.
I
The
question,
no
it's
more
simple
than
that,
so
we're
just
talking
to
the
likes
of
doppelmeyer
around.
Obviously,
this
has
originally
been
conceived
as
a
tourism
industry,
development
project
and
obviously
you
know
we've
all
seen.
The
purpose
report
want
to
find
some
of
the
economic
benefits,
but
I
think
it's
also
worth
looking
at
it.
I
As
I
indicated
in
my
introduction,
as
a
public
transport
project,
we
don't
know
in
terms
of
the
benefits
there
yet,
but
we
wanted
to
look
around
it's
more
common
in
urban
environments,
so
you
might
have
heard
about
some
in
South
America
moving
people
through
cities,
but
there
are
also
some
examples
and
we
just
wanted
to
do
some
benchmarking
around
where
you
might
might
have
it
for
visitors,
but
also
there's
a
resident
access
component
to
to
the
cable
way
to
like
a
public
transport
benefit.
How.
D
H
Thank
you
through
the
chair.
There
are
some
studies
online,
there's
quite
a
few.
You
can
look
up
in
terms
of
the
public
transport
benefit
of
cableway
systems
and
some
really
good
case
studies.
So
Paris
is
in
the
process
of
installing
one.
Now,
it's
a
very
good
one
in
Northern
Italy
from
the
town
of
boatson
to
Ober,
boatson
and
there's
some
very
good
information
and
pictures
and
contexts
available,
which
is
not
dissimilar.
Context
to
here.
I
Might
just
add
also
in
terms
of
my
introduction:
I
talked
about
the
cost
of
rebuilding
that
road
and
you
know
that's
a
increase
in
occurrence.
So
it
was
in
terms
of
the
obviously
I'm
not
talking
about
a
large
resident
population.
But
if
you
think
about
the
costs
going
forward
over
the
next
30
years
of
maintaining
that
road
to
springbrock,
whether
there
could
be
some
advantages
and
supplementing
that
and
for
resilience
with
a
cable
wire.
But
we
need
to
look
at
it.
C
I
I
did
have
some
other
questions
and
I'll
just
go
back.
So
my
my
my
biggest
issue
with
this
is
that
we
brought
this
to
resolution
last
time.
The
resolution
was
there
to
go.
Look
let's
see
if
we've
got
any
agreement
from
the
state
government
that
if
we
meet
this
and
this
that
they'll
come
on
the
journey
with
us
before
we
start
that's
what
we
wanted
so
now,
they've
said:
no,
we
don't
want
to
and
the
Communications
that
we're
hearing
from
the
environment
Minister
are
really
not
very
promising
at
all.
C
Because
that
doesn't
I'm
I'm,
it
happened
at
an
officer
level,
but
that
doesn't
actually
Express
what
the
request
was,
which
was.
Will
you
enter
into
an
mou
with
us?
If
we
promise
we'll
do
the
traditional
owner
consultation,
we'll
also
do
the
environmental
audit,
and
if
we
can,
we
just
have
an
agreement
that
if
we
do
that
you're
gonna
you're
happy
to
take
this
forward.
C
Well,
the
state
government
are
pretty
much
saying
they're,
not
very
interested
they're
pretty
concerned
and
when
we
wanted
to
just
to
get
a
bit
of
comfort
from
them
before
we
started
and
now
we're
we're
just
going
on
assuming
as
normal
that
we'll
just
we'll
just
do
it
anyway,
even
though
that
was
the
point
of
our
last
resolution.
So
if
you
could
just
speak
to
that,
I'd
appreciate
it.
I
Sure,
thanks
for
the
question
through
the
chair
and
I'm,
going
to
throw
it
down
shortly
because
I
wasn't
here
then
in
July
last
year,
but
my
recollection,
including
having
received
the
correspondence
on
the
other
side,
was
that
there
was
a
the
request
for
a
memorandum
of
understanding
predated
this
July
request.
This
was
the
second
request,
so
the
state
declined
to
enter
into
an
mou
with
the
City
of
Gold
Coast.
So
and
then
there
was
this
request
in
terms
of
a
commitment
to
epbc
act,
referral
which
and
what
it
was
declined.
I
I'd
say
we
do
understand
that
the
state
has
concerns
around
community
support
for
the
project
on
the
Gold
Coast,
but
receiving
the
proposal
at
a
high
level
from
the
City
of
Gold
Coast.
They
are
saying,
could
you
please
engage
with
your
community
and
show
us
the
level
of
support
for
the
project,
so
they
can
understand
where
the
concerns
lie.
J
J
If,
in
the
future,
the
city
was
to
make
some
kind
of
City
or
proponent,
make
some
kind
of
referral
regarding
epbc
and
then
your
correct
counselor,
the
the
feedback
from
the
premier's
office
wasn't
very
clear
in
terms
of
saying
they
wouldn't
support
or
would
support
the
epbc,
but
they
reiterated
that
they
expected
us
to
go
away
and
do
our
community
consultation
and
traditional
owner
engagement.
We
did
follow
up
with
a
phone
call
just
to
clarify
that
particular
with
departmental
offices,
and
they
did
confirm
that
is
the
intent
of
this
letter.
G
Through
the
chair,
so
I
think
my
recollection
of
that
request
was
for
the
city
to
attempt
to
de-risk
some
of
the
proposal
right.
So
we
talked
a
lot
today
about
de-risking
and
I
think
that
at
the
time
we
all
saw
the
need
for
the
state
and
the
federal
governments
to
be
on
board.
Otherwise
we
were
at
risk
and
and
the
fact
that
that
replied
to
us
in
the
nature
that
we
can't
quite
understand
what
they're
saying
other
than
to
say,
go
and
do
some
Community
consultation
I
think
actually
emphasizes.
G
For
me,
the
the
risk
is
still
there.
You
know
so
and
having
experienced
the
same
type
of
conversation
in
2013-14
from
the
other
side
of
politics
in
Queensland.
In
regards
to
the
level
of
support
that
the
state
government
provided
for
the
Broadwater
Marine
project,
it
sounds
frighteningly
similar
in
regards
to
keep
on
spinning
your
wheels
and
we'll
be
there
in
a
moment.
You
know
so.
G
Think
it's
something
that
I
said
last
time
as
well,
that
without
the
state
and
the
federal
government
being
prepared
to
give
us
a
clear
indication
of
their
support
and
basically
saying
go
and
do
your
consultation
I
think
that
at
the
very
least,
we
should
start
by
engaging
in
a
respectful
manner
with
the
First
Nations
along
the
lines
of.
Are
you
interested
in
being
a
proponent
and
in
fact
the
lead
proponent?
G
You
know
so
because
otherwise,
I
I
just
I'm
frustrated
that
we
didn't
get
what
we
asked
for
last
time
and
we
still
remain
at
risk
and
we're
talking
about
committing
half
a
million
dollars
to
a
conversation
that
it
won't
achieve.
What
we're
looking
to
achieve
and
if
you
can
make
a
question
about
that,
that'd
be
great
but,
like
I
mean
is
in
so
the
the
fundamental
question
is:
have
we
given
any
consideration
to
Leading
with
a?
Would
you
like
to
be
a
proponent
or
involved
as
being
a
proponent.
I
Great
question
through
the
chair:
absolutely
so
that
would
be
one
basis
for
engaging
with
traditional
owners
to
test
if
they
had
interest
if
they
had
capability-
and
this
is
not
a
tomorrow
project-
so
it
might
not
be
capability
now,
but
it
could
be
capability.
That's
built
towards
being
a
lead
proponent,
for
this
I
think
if
that
were
to
eventuate,
it
would
significantly
change
the
equation
on
the
state
government's
perspective.
So
definitely
a
conversation
angle.
We
would
want
to
pursue.
D
D
D
G
D
D
D
I
think
Council
Owen
James
made
some
really
good
points
about
the
idea
of
our
objective
in
undertaking
this
body
of
work
is
to
de-risk
the
project,
and
it
occurs
to
me
both
the
state
and
anecdotally.
The
federal
government
don't
seem
very
interested
in
going
down
this
de-risking
process
with
us
and
I'm,
not
reassured
based
on
the
officer's
response
to
the
questions
today
that
the
traditional
owner
consultation
will
satisfactorily
de-risk
the
project
for
a
proponent.
D
I'm
actually
really
excited
about
market-led
proposals
that
drive
economic
outcomes,
but
I
also
don't
want
to
spend
half
a
million
dollars
of
rate
payers
money
on
something
that,
frankly,
a
market
proponent
probably
should
spend
their
money
on
I.
Don't
really
want
it
to
be
secret,
I,
don't
I,
don't
think
it's
satisfactory!
That
someone
makes
an
unsolicited
private
approach
to
the
council
or
to
an
elected
official
I
think
it
should
be
a
public
market-led
expression
of
Interest.
They
need
to
be.
They
need
to
put
their
skin
in
the
game.
A
Yeah,
so
I
have
to
be
careful
that
we
don't
get
into
debate
unless
we've
got
a
second
to
Castle
McDonald,
your
your
second
emotion,
okay,
all
right!
So
if
that's
the
case,
I
will
then
just
open
it
up
to
questions
because
I
think
councilor
Patterson's
got
a
question
and
I.
Think
councilor.
Hamill
has
a
question
too,
which
I'm
gathering
is
through
me
to
you:
councilor
Tozer,
I'm,
I'm,
guessing
yes,
so
councilor
Patterson.
C
So,
and
through
you
to
councilor
toza
I
think
he's
changed.
Recommendation
I
have
more
comfort
with
it
than
the
proposed
recommendation,
even
though
well
this
one
element
of
it.
The
word
public
I
think
I
can't
think
of
a
company.
That
would
do
that,
there's
just
so
much
risk
for
them.
Why
why
on
Earth?
Would
they
do
that
and
then
allowed
to
actually
just
say
to
Chief
investment
officer,
hello,
we'll
be
interested
in
this
I
mean
that
means
we
get.
No
one
that
that
word,
but
I
am
interested
in
it.
C
I
am
also
interested
in
a
potential
other
recommendation
where
we
do
go
down
the
communal
consultation
strategy
if
it
is
with
the
intent
of
the
traditional
owners
being
the
proponent,
because
I
think
that's
the
only
way
that
it
does
de-risk
it,
but
I
think
it's
probably
too
soon
for
that
I.
Don't
think
that
they're
probably
ready
for
that
I'm,
not
sure.
So,
unless
you
could
give
me
a
persuasive
argument
as
to
why
that
may
be
suitable
now,
I'd
be
supporting
councilor
tozas
recommendation.
I
Jeff,
just
on
that
last
Point,
around
proponent
capability
realistically,
would
probably
be
a
JV
try
and
Venture
type
operation
where
you
would
have
the
traditional
owner.
That
would
be
a
co-proponent
with
an
established
operator
and
also
just
to
clarify
the
proposal
is
not
the
500
000
for
spend
on
traditional
owner
consultations.
That
would
be
part
of
the
500
000.
Probably
the
minority
part
there's
also
the
environmental
audit.
The
deputy
mayor
asked
about
and
there's
the
development
of
The
Wider
Community
consultation
strategy
that
would
be
brought
back
to
council.
L
D
Will
be
answering
the
question?
Yes,
so
my
primary
reason
that
I
think
it
needs
to
be
market-led
and
not
Council
letters,
because
we
don't
own
any
assets
on
which
this
this
project
will
be
delivered.
I
think
it's
National,
Park,
primarily
I,
think
99
of
the
the
land
that
we're
talking
about
is
National
Park
land
and
I
I'm,
neither
here
nor
again,
I'm
not
neither
for
nor
against
a
proposal,
because
there
isn't
enough
substance
in
the
proposal
for
me
to
form
a
view.
D
What
I
do
think
this
motion
seeks
to
do
is
basically
halt
the
process
until
we
have
actually
something
we
can
consult
and
talk
about,
because
at
the
moment
the
I
have,
as
you
might
imagine,
in
division.
Nine
I
have
lots
of
conversations
about
the
cableway
being
a
good
or
bad
idea,
but
unfortunately,
there's
no
detail
around
what
it
might,
how
it
might
impact
world
heritage,
biodiversity
areas
which
lots
of
people
say
are
really
precious
to
them.
D
L
Interested
to
hear
other
counselors
thoughts,
chair
I,
can
see
the
positives
and
negatives
in
this
in
in
not
leading
it,
but
that
also
means
we
don't
have
any
control
over
the
scope
of
it
and
counts.
The
toes
are
just
posed
a
few
very
reasonable
questions
that
his
community
regularly
raised
and
I
regularly
hear
from
our
colleagues
as
well
that
if
we
were
to
lead
it,
the
expression
Matrix
campaign,
at
least
they
could
be
direct
questions
that
we
made
respondents
submit
to
but
I'm
interested
to
hear
from
others.
Well,.
A
Okay,
I
Gotta
Throw
throw
my
one
box
worth
in
for
me
whether
we
lead
it
or
whether
we
don't
I,
don't
I,
don't
really
see
I,
don't
really
agree
with
going
down
the
track
that
councilor
toes
are
on
probably
on
my
own
here
from
listening
to
everyone
else.
It's
for
me.
It
looks
very
much
like
a
chicken
and
egg
situation.
A
The
fact
is,
if
you
don't
go
out
to
the
traditional
owners
and
consult
and
and
and
find
out
whether
it's
something
that
they
would
support,
we
need
to
know
what
that
land
means
to
them.
We
need
to
know
whether
they
are
potentially
going
to
be
part
of
a
joint
venture
or
not.
We
need
to
know
because
nobody,
what
I'm
saying
is
nobody
is
going
to
come
forward
with
an
idea
if
they
don't
know
that
they're
going
to
have
the
support
of
the
traditional
owners,
so
it's
just
dead
in
the
water
to
me.
A
It's
we
need
to
go
down
that
path
that
we're
serious
about
looking
at
at
a
cable
way
as
another
tourism
offering
which
we
desperately
need.
Whether
this
is
the
right
place
for
it,
I
mean
there
are.
There
are
other
other
sites
that
have
been
touted
over
the
years
as
well,
but
first
and
foremost
and
I,
don't
think,
as
Jeff
said,
we're
going
to
spend
500
000
Consulting
with
the
traditional
owners,
but
that
to
me
the
the
report
I
think
we're
getting
called
up
on
the
money
in
the
sense
that
you
know
it.
A
It's
not
saying
we're
going
to
spend
half
a
million
dollars,
but
we
have
to
have
that
conversation
first,
because
if
they
say
no
we're
not
interested
it's
dead
in
the
water
if
they
say
yeah,
you
know
what
we'd
like
to
look
at
that.
We
think
this
is
something
of
forgive
me
if
I'm
wrong
and
correct
me
if
I'm
wrong,
but
I
believe
in
Cairns
I
think
the
traditional
owners
were.
Is
it
cancer,
but
were
very
supportive,
we're
actually
very
supportive
of
the
idea
of
a
cable
way.
A
Contrary
to
what
a
lot
of
people
thought,
they
actually
said.
Look
we
think
this
is
fantastic
and-
and
that
was
a
the
Catalyst
for
getting
it
up
quite
honestly,
because
we're
not
going
to
go
anywhere
so
I
think
we
have
to
go
out
and
ask
a
question.
So
that's
that's
my
view.
So
I
can't
really
enter
that
debate
of.
Should
it
be
publicly
LED.
Should
it
be,
you
know
privately,
because
I
don't
support
either
I
think
we
need
to
go
out
and
ask
for
those
reasons.
I
I
was
before
my
time
since
early
90s,
but
I
understand
it
was
developed
by
skyrail
who
continued
to
operate
it.
So
that's
the
Chapman
family
and
the
local
traditional
owners
of
the
job,
people
in
kuranda
and
so
they've
always
been
very
supportive
of
Tourism
development
in
the
tropical
North.
So
they
have
employment
agreements
with
skyrail
and
significant
numbers
of
their
people
are
employed.
They
also
have
agreements
around
storytelling
and
interpretation
throughout
the
attraction.
I
I
The
key
questions
around
a
project
like
this
are
going
to
be.
Is
their
market
demand
I?
Think
the
abyss
report
showed
that
there
is
I,
think
we
know
intuitively.
That
there
is.
Is
there
tenure
well,
most
of
the
proposed
alignment
is
as
sort
of
broad
as
it
is,
is
public
land.
So
yes,
in
theory
there
is
tenure.
Is
there
funding?
I
We
know
commercial
Enterprises
want
to
develop
something
like
this
and
then
the
last
question
is:
are
there
approvals
and
that's
the
biggest
question
as
I
said
before,
will
the
traditional
zone
is
support
it
in
terms
of
their
native
title
interests
and
what
we'd
be
able
to
get
an
epbc
Federal
approval
for
a
project
like
this?
So
if
you
ask
industry,
they
will
come
back
and
say
we
are
not
confident
that
those
approvals
or
that
they
themselves
are
able
to
secure
those
approvals.
So
government
needs
to
lead
it.
F
So
just
listening
through
it
to
unlock
it
all
somebody
needs
to
do
a
body
of
work
to
see
whether
traditional
owners
will
be
part
of
it
to
unlock
it,
whether
it's
ourselves,
private
Enterprise
or
state
government
or
Federer.
That's
the
that's
the
core
of
it,
unlocking
whether
this
type
of
project
will
go
under
move
forward.
I
That's
it
exactly
so
it's
de-risking
it.
So
we
know
in
terms
of
the
threshold
questions
and
Indigenous
approval
and
environmental
approval.
We
need
to
be
clear
that
they
can
be
obtained
before
progressing
further,
and
we
don't
know
if
we
can
get
indigenous
approval
in
Lua
indigenous
land
use
agreement
until
we
talk
to
them.
M
You
can
either
take
that
as
a
positive
or
A
negative
and
yeah
they're,
not
clear.
It's
a
bit
disappointing,
but
I
guess
I'm
with
councilor
Taylor
in
somebody
who
has
to
start
this
process.
But
is
it
necessary
at
this
stage
to
talk
about
an
environmental
audit
unless
until
we've
actually
done
the
consultation?
Because
really
if
the
consultation
is
quite
negative
from
those
stakeholders,
it's
it's
probably
dead
in
the
water
as
far
as
I'm
concerned?
I
Thanks
for
the
questions
counselor
so
through
the
chair,
absolutely
we
want
to
do
that
sequencing.
So
those
two
threshold
approvals.
Let's
talk
to
the
indigenous
people
first
and
see
if
we
can
get
that
approval
before
we
go
deeper,
I'm
looking
at
epbc
approval,
when
we
feel
we
have
enough
of
a
sense
of
the
threshold
issues
there
and
we
know
that
it
will
require
epbc
approval
because
as
matters
of
national
significance,
National
Park
world
heritage
area
and
then
in
terms
of
the
Quantum
of
funding
I'll,
see
if
Darren
has
some
sense
of
that.
J
So
through
the
chair,
the
2020
report
outlined
a
cost
estimate
of
the
five
hundred
thousand
dollars,
and
that
was
to
do
the
traditional
owner
piece
and
also
to
do
the
community
consultation
piece
based
on
a
brief.
Obviously
it's
2020
figures,
but
obviously
we
can
build
the
process
to
suit
the
budget.
B
A
G
G
D
I've
made
some
assumptions
about
that
and
I
I
would
prefer
it
was
returned
for
a
into
a
reserve
that
is
used
for
a
similar
purpose,
as
tourism
activation
and
or
whatever
it
was
right.
That's
where
I
would
like
it
to
be
I
kind
of
thought.
That
would
be
that
right
reserved,
but
evidently
maybe
not
it's
exactly
right.
Oh
hello,
so.
D
D
I
think
what
I'm
hoping
to
not
do
is
retain
that
amount
of
money
for
this
purpose
until
yeah.
But
one
thing
I
was
going
to
raise
is
I've
heard
the
our
colleagues
talk
about
the
public
nature
of
what
I'm,
what
a
market-led
expression
of
interest
and
I'm
gonna
I'd
like
to
take.
Take
that
and
incorporate
that
General
feedback.
I,
wonder
if
Council
Madonna
would
accept
if
we
just
remove
the
word
public.
D
D
I
think
it
is
respectful
of
traditional
owners
that
they
might
ask
us
questions
about
environmental
impact.
I
think
it's
respectful
of
us
to
think
about
that
being
important
to
them,
because
the
land
is
very
precious
to
First,
Nations
people
and
I.
Don't
think
we
have
sufficient
information
about
that.
D
I
think
it's
reasonable
for
traditional
owners
to
ask
a
proponent
or
the
council
about
possible
employment
agreements
similar
to
those
that
have
been
struck
in
coranda
in
Cairns
that
both
that's
both
reasonable
and
it's
a
fair
expectation
of
either
a
proponent
or
Council
to
be
able
to
provide
some
information
about
that
I.
Don't
think
we
have
satisfactory
insights
about
that.
D
I
think
all
of
those
things
are
reasonable
and
I
think
Council
Lacks
any
sort
of
substantial
information
about
that,
and
it's
for
those
reasons,
I
think
that
we
we
have
been
effectively
trapped
by
the
state
government
by
asking
us
to
do
a
traditional
owner
consultation
with
the
state
government,
fully
understanding
that
we
can't
give
the
information
that
we
need
to
because
this
project
or
this
proponent
at
this
point
in
time,
is
not
mature
enough
for
us
to
do
that
with
any
sort
of
any
sort
of
substance.
Any
sort
of.
D
Yeah,
it
can't
be
done
in
the
way
that
it
should,
with
that
in
mind,
I
think
councilors
should
support
that
the
500
000
should
back
into
a
project
that
it
was
raised
for
the
tourism
Levy
is
intended
to
to
diversify
our
tourism
product.
There
are
lots
of
products
that
we
could
potentially
deliver
in
our
city,
even
many
in
the
hinterland
that
are
at
various
stages
and
I'm.
D
Looking
forward
to
hearing
from
the
economic
development
team,
the
chief
investment
officer
over
coming
months
about
those
sort
of
proposals
and
I
think
that
any
number
of
those
other
proposals
would
be
a
better
spend
of
our
half
a
million
dollars.
That
is
that
is
proposed
to
go
to
the
cableware
project.
Here,
yeah
I'd
like
us
to
support
this
motion
and
choose
to
go
in
a
different
direction
at
this
time.
B
Now
is
consultation
with
the
traditional
owners
Because
unless
we
actually
go
there
and
do
that
we're
nowhere
and
I
I
think
that
there
will
be
a
great
reluctance
for
any
private
company
to
come
forward
and
make
this
proposal
with
the
level
of
uncertainty
that
exists
around
this
chamber
today.
I
mean
there's
not
one
of
us
here
who
is
totally
confident
that
this
project
can
proceed,
but
we
will
never
ever
know
unless
we
go
and
do
the
necessary
consultation
with
the
traditional
owners
of
the
land.
It's
it's
so
important
that
we
do
that.
B
So
I
might
change
the
foreshadowed
motion
just
slightly
if
councilor
toza's
motion
fails
but
and
I
would
like
to
suggest
in
that
that
we
could
restrict
the
spending
to
a
lot
less
than
half
a
million
dollars
to
consult
with
the
traditional
owners,
but
I
just
felt
that
I
needed
to
explain
my
reasons
for
opposing
the
motion.
That's
before
us
at
this
point
in
time.
A
F
Taylor,
thank
you
and
I
just
want
to
so
that
I
won't
be
supporting
the
current
motion
and
I
I
do
agree
with
councilor
Gates
I.
Think
when
I've
taken
over
today
is
a
bit
of
unlocking
of
the
de-risking
needs
to
happen
at
some
point
for
us
to
understand
whether
it's
a
realistic
project
for
the
city
moving
forward,
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
work
to
be
done
in
in
that
space
to
get
there,
but
I'll
be
really
interested
in
what
type
of
investment
we
are
looking
at
to
to
do.
F
Is
it
going
to
be
a
feasible
project
for
the
city
in
the
medium
and
long
term,
and
unless
someone
actually
grabs
that
that
ball
I
think
we're
just
going
to
keep
talking
about
it
for
the
years
to
come,
so
I
think
if
we
can
come
up
with
a
small
investment
to
try
and
unlock
that
to
give
us
more
clarity,
I
think
I'll
be
more
in
support
of
that.
So
thank
you.
D
Thank
you
chair.
There
are
lots
of
exciting
ideas
in
the
hinterland.
There
are
market-led
proposals
for
some
of
the
longer
zip
lines
in
Queensland,
Adventure
tourism.
That's
unbelievable,
there's
already
two
locations
that
that
have
active
mountain
biking
and
then
probably
five
locations
that
people
mountain
bike
on
a
regular
like
on
a
regular
occasion
and
I
think
that's
a
growing
and
an
opportunity
untapped,
currently
for
our
city,
and
even
just
today,
I
was
meeting
with
the
CEO
and
talking
about
some
of
the
untapped
opportunity
with
walking
walking
trails.
D
I
think
this
idea
doesn't
have
a
proponent.
It
doesn't
actually
have
any
skin
in
the
game.
Currently,
there's
just
it's
just
an
idea
that
someone
came
up
with
25
years
ago
that
knock
got
knocked
back
from
the
state
right
now
and
right
now
we
can't
even
get
the
state
and
federal
government
on
board
with
our
letters.
They
can't
even
respond
to
our
letters.
D
Actually,
even
no
the
request
that
they're
sending
us
back
frankly,
this
half
a
million
dollars
that
we're
talking
about
setting
aside
for
this
purpose,
whether
it's
a
traditional
owner
consultation
or
a
future
Community
consultation
strategy
or
any
number
of
other
activities
that
might
draw
on
these
funds.
Those
funds
are
better
driven
towards
other
ideas
right
now.
There
is
no
reason
we
have
no
signals
from
the
state
or
the
federal
government
that
that
they
would
look
at
any
sort
of
proponent
for
this
project.
D
It
actually
undermines
our
reputation
in
engaging
with
traditional
owners
when
we
we
don't
have
the
information
that
I'm
confident
they
will
ask
for
in
order
to
form
a
view
and
provide
us
feedback.
Frankly,
we
are
not
yet
at
the
stage
where
we
should
be
undertaking.
This
I
think
the
state
know
that
and
they're
sending
us
down
the
Garden
Path,
because
they
don't
want
to
deal
with
it
and
that's
okay.
If
they
don't
like
it
right
now,
we
shouldn't
waste
rate
payers
money
on
it.
D
I
hope
councilors
support
this
motion
to
take
no
further
action,
I
think
it's
the
right
thing
to
do
right
now.
I
think
it
has
respect
for
ratepayers
money,
I
think
it
has
respect
for
traditional
owners
and,
frankly,
it
allows
us
to
free
up
those
funds
to
advance
other
projects
in
our
Hinterland
that
are
going
to
better
right
now.
Support
the
diversification
of
our
tourism
economy
in
the
city,
yeah
and
I'll
call
the
division.
A
B
A
B
B
Sorry,
so
there
was
a
change
recommendation
that
councilor
toza
proposed,
which
was
voted
down,
but
I
had
foreshadowed
the
the
officer's
recommendation
but
which,
when
I
spoke
to
it,
I
was
going
to
change
it
slightly.
So
shouldn't
then
now
be
under
that
shouldn't
that
foreshadowed
motion
now
just
simply
move
down
below
the
changed
recommendation.
A
G
B
Expensive
to
me
so
chairman,
in
speaking
to
it,
I,
think
we're
selling
ourselves
short.
If
we
don't
take
this
step,
there
has
I
agree,
been
negativity
in
the
response
from
the
government
and
I'm
absolutely
certain
that
this
that
any
development
of
a
cable
way
needs
to
be
basically
led
by
the
private
sector,
but
perhaps
in
consultation
with
the
traditional
owners.
But
we
have
the
most
magnificent
world
heritage,
biodiversity
area
and
I
I
recently
traveled
to
someone
who
had
rented
an
Airbnb
at
at
Springbrook
and
to
look
down
from
Springbok.
B
You
would
not
see
a
view
like
that
anywhere
in
the
world,
so
we
we
firmly
believe
from
the
reports
that
we've
seen
over
many
many
many
years
and
especially
in
the
development
of
the
destination
management
plan,
which
we
haven't
looked
at
for
a
little
while
now.
But
it's
still
firmly
in
my
mind
that
a
cable
way
is
something
that
would
make
a
really
big
difference
to
our
tourism.
Offering
and
I.
Don't
know
that
we'll
get
there.
B
There's
been
government
opposition
for
decades,
as
we
know
because
of
the
sensitivities
involved,
but
I
firmly
believe
that
unless
we
take
this
next
step,
we'll
never
know
and
I
think
it's
a
responsible
step
for
us
as
the
local
government
to
take.
Given
that
the
state
has
encouraged
us
to
do
so
in
the
correspondence,
despite
not
putting
their
their
full
support
behind
the
project.
G
Think
if
there's
to
be
any
chance
of
the
cable
car
at
all,
it
needs
to
be
actually
a
proponent.
That's
led
by
the
First
Nations
people
and
I
think
that
the
interesting
thing
about
today
is
that
it
might
be
actually
some
first
and
important
steps
from
this
counseling
engaging
with
the
traditional
owners
and,
ultimately,
if
they
show
an
interest
in
exploring
the
idea
of
a
cable
car
through
land
that
that
that
they've
got
an
intimate
relationship
with
that's
something
that
I
think
that
we
should
explore.
G
We've
spoken
today
about
stakeholders,
who've
spoken
about
de-risking,
we've
spoken
about
governments
but
I.
Think,
fundamentally,
the
key
stakeholder
is
actually
the
stewards
of
the
land
that
have
been
there
for
longer
than
anybody,
and
the
fact
that
we've
commenced
a
conversation
without
starting
there
in
a
way
is
probably
a
mistake,
and
it's
probably
a
mistake.
That's
happened
for
20
or
30
years.
G
Whilst
these
cable
car
ideas
have
bounced
about
I've,
Googled,
very
quickly,
skyrail
or
sclera
and
Cairns
from
what
I
can
see,
it
was
first
mooted
or
approved
in
1987,
which,
if
Google,
is
correct,
that
was
in
the
dying
days
of
the
national
party
that
led
state
government
of
Joe,
piocca,
Peterson
and
the
reality
in
2023.
Is
this
state,
and
this
country
is
at
a
cusp
of
dealing
differently
with
how
and
why
and
exactly
how
we
should
deal
with
First
Nation
interests
and
if
we
can
encourage
a
proponent
to
come
forward.
G
That
would
be
great,
but
likewise
if
the
traditional
owners
are
not
interested
in
a
cable
car,
that
may
indeed
be
the
end
of
the
entire
conversation,
because,
as
councilor
Gates
has
pointed
out,
we
know
how
special
that
land
is
it's
not
a
world
heritage
listed
piece
of
Australia
for
for
anything
I've.
The
fact
that
it's
amazing,
you
know
so
I
think
it
actually
I
I've,
been
really
torn
today.
G
Listening
because
I
I
appreciate
the
idea
of
not
spending
any
money,
but
I
also
very
much
appreciate
the
idea
that
we
actually
need
to
start
that
conversation
and
it
needs
to
start
from
a
position
of
respect,
and
it
needs
to
not
be
about
what
it's
actually
not
about
stakeholders
and
it's
not
about
government.
It's
actually
about
respect
and
that's
where
we
need
to
start.
C
And
I
will
also
speak
for
it
so
and
like
counselor,
Owen,
Jones
have
kind
of
been
all
over
this
place.
I,
certainly
open
and
persuadable.
This
committee
meeting
I
I
consider
the
Arctic
beach
trees
in
Springbrook,
my
spiritual
home
Antarctic
speech
trees.
My
spiritual
home
is
where
I
go
for
my
spirit,
so
I
can't
imagine
what
that
space
is
for
people
who's
had
their
families
there
for
thousands
of
years.
C
There
is
a
in
my
opinion.
There
is
a
lot
of
tokenism
that
we
have
in
our
society
around
how
we
deal
with
traditional
owners,
which
I
find
quite
frustrating.
This
is
not
that.
So
this
is
a
really
straight
real
conversation
and
it's
not
ever
a
bad
idea
to
communicate
and
to
find
out
what
people
think
and
that's
why
I've
come
to
this
position
that
I'm
supporting
this
recommendation.
D
I'm
really
encouraged
chair
with
the
commitment
to
engaging
with
traditional
owners
in
what
is
almost
entirely
division.
Nine,
you
know,
I've
had
the
luxury
and
the
privilege
of
meeting
lots
of
people
who
live
out
in
my
area,
and
you
know:
I've
talked
to
lots
of
First
Nations
people
I,
don't
presume
to
know
what
they
might
think
about
this,
except
in
the
private
conversations
I've
had
with
people,
and
so
the
idea
that
we're
embarking
on
this
consultation
exercise.
D
You
know
it
doesn't
offend
me
I,
actually
think
it's
a
really.
You
know
a
great
thing
to
do,
and
I
actually
really
appreciate
the
genuine
comments
of
the
councilors
who've
spoken
before
me
about
it.
If
that's
you
know
what
they're
hoping
for
and
then
I
can
see
why
they
would
support
the
motion
with
that
in
mind,
however,
I
can't
support
the
motion
because
I,
don't
I,
don't
think
we
have
enough
information
about
what's
proposed
to
have
respect
for
traditional
owners.
D
I
think
it's
really
good
to
talk
to
people
about
what
they
think,
whether
they're
traditional
custodians
of
the
land
or
whether
they're
just
other
residents
or
whatever
I.
Think.
That's
a
really
good
thing,
but
I
think
when
we
engage
in
that
sort
of
consultation,
we
should
have
enough
respect
for
those
people
to
provide
them
some
very
basic
information
about
what
we're
actually
talking
about
here
and
I'm,
not
convinced
that
we're
at
that
stage.
D
The
intent
of
my
previous
motion
was
to
seek
a
market-led
proposal
or
proponent
that
did
not
preclude
First
Nations
people
from
potentially
being
that
proponent,
but
it
was
enabling
someone
who
has
the
interest
in
delivering
the
project
to
propose
what
we
might
start
Consulting
the
community
about.
We
don't
have
that
right
now.
The
only
thing
that
people
can
find
on
the
internet
is
a
you
know:
a
cable
car
type
service
up
in
Cairns,
that's
in
wet
rainforest
as
opposed
to
what
is
effectively
kind
of
scarful,
Bushland
eucalypt
Bushland,
it's
a
totally
different
environment.
D
We
don't
have
any
other
option
in
our
city
other
than
what
is
a
effectively
a
25
30
year
old
proposal.
You
know
put
to
Aspire
a
consortia
that
still
include
a
state
MP
who
talks
about
it
in
state
Parliament,
I.
Don't
think
that
substance
that
informs
a
good
consultation
I,
don't
think.
That's
the
right
thing
for
us
to
do,
because
I
think,
unfortunately,
that
reality
will
take
the
consultation.
We
do
Undertake
and
it
might
not
be
real
and
it
might
not
be
authentic
and
it
might
not
be
accurate.
C
B
Cancel
the
Castro
said
it
first.
I
simply
want
to
reinforce
that
I
Believe.
By
supporting
this
motion
today,
we
are,
in
fact
correcting
the
errors
of
the
past,
because
we
do
need
to
know
what
the
opinion
of
the
traditional
owners
is,
or
else
there's
no
point
going
any
further,
and
it
just
may
be
that
there's
a
view
that
this
is
preferable
to
any
other
ways
of
accessing
that
magnificent
area.
They
may
just
decide
that
that
this
is
the
best
possible
outcome.
I
also
mentioned
early
earlier.
B
The
environmental
and
amenity
issues
that
are
associated
and
I
want
counselor
toza
to
be
reassured
that
they
are
really
important
factors
as
well.
That
would
need
to
be
considered,
but
this
is
the
first
step
and
in
order
to
ever
see
a
cable
way
delivered
in
this
city,
we
need
to
take
this
first
step
and
I
for
one
don't
want
to
pass
up
the
opportunity
again
at
this
point
in
time,
just
to
find
out
what
the
genuine
view
of
the
traditional
owners
is.
So
so
I
moved.
A
Thank
you
councils.
We
have
one
more
item
in
in
Open
session.
It
is
an
open
session,
but
if
anyone
wants
to
that,
actually
do
you?
Does
anyone
want
to
take
a
break
for
10
minutes
or
yeah?
Would
you
like
a
10
minute
break?
Okay?
Well,
yes,
okay,
we'll
have
a
break
for
10
minutes
and
we'll
come
back.
It's
been
a
long
one.
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
Okay,
streaming
is
back
on
counselors
counselors.
We
have
one
more
item,
it's
the
surface,
Paradise
revitalization.
It
is
an
open
reports,
but
obviously,
if
there's
any
discussion
on
budget
or
anything
to
do
with
budget
or
funding,
we
may
need
to
go
into
close
so
yeah.
As
long
as
everyone
can
be
aware
of
that
over
to
you,
Jeff.
I
Thank
you
chair
good
afternoon
again,
so
Surfers
Paradise
revitalization.
This
is
a
significant
investment.
90
million
dollars
is
a
large
number,
but
it
is
an
investment
that
will
help
Council
achieve
its
strategy
by
delivering
some
key
outcomes
in
the
council
plan.
So
the
first
one
there
that
I'd
like
to
touch
on
is
sustainable
I'm
not
up
to
the
slides
yet
we'll
get
to
the
slides.
Yeah
is
sustainable
economic
growth,
as
well
as
the
best
place
to
visit
in
Australia.
I
We
know
that
Surfers
Paradise
is
seen
by
many
residents
and
visitors
alike
as
the
heart
of
our
city,
while
the
name
of
the
project
is
the
surface
Paradise
revitalization
project
I
see
this
very
much
as
a
city-wide
project
that
will
generate
significant
economic
growth
throughout
the
Gold
Coast
by
stimulating
increased
private
investment
and
jobs.
Indeed,
we
believe
that
this
project
will
pay
for
itself
over
time
and
we
can
share
some
further
information
on
that.
If
you
would
like
to
see
it,
we
know
from
visitor
feedback.
A
B
It
it's
important
to
me,
given
the
whole
report,
can
I
just
have
Clarity
around
when
that
consultation
was
done,
because
in
reading
the
report
it
suggested
that
in
2016
we
first
started
and
that
there
was
a
some
consultation
in
2019
which
is
four
years
ago.
Is
it?
Has
there
been
more
current
consultation
with
the
broader
Community,
both
on
the
Gold
Coast
and
tourists
visiting
the
city.
O
O
You
know
in
Cavill
mall,
with
the
big
heart
painted
in
the
middle
I,
think
it
was
about
a
thousand
and
just
over
a
thousand
respondents,
so
that
data
was
compiled
from
the
city
place
making
and
through
the
presentation
today,
we
can
get
to
I
suppose
where
our
project
by
our
project
started,
and
it
was
essentially
on
the
back
of
that
place,
making
work.
So
the
data
in
here
is
from
that
2019.
K
O
B
I
So
we
all
know
that
there
are
significant
safety
issues
at
times
in
Cavill,
mall
and
Avenue,
especially
at
night,
and
this
revitalization,
as
you'll
see
when
we
get
to
the
slides,
is
intended
to
transform
the
areas
that
it
attracts
all
ages:
different
demographics,
including
families
throughout
the
day
and
night,
which
will
create
a
much
much
safer
precinct
for
the
Gold
Coast
and
then
the
third
strategic
opportunity
that
we
have
here.
That's
part
of
the
council
plan
is
to
leverage
opportunities
around
2032
and
a
key
measure
for
that
is
civic
pride.
I
Just
going
back
to
the
economic
growth
consideration
for
us
here,
we
believe
the
investment
would
be
catalytic.
We
can
see.
We
all
know
how
private
investment
has
been
booming
and
areas
surrounding
Surfers
Paradise.
So,
for
example,
you
know
Chevron
Island,
Main,
Beach,
broad
Beach,
and
we
assess
that
this
is
because
those
areas
have
seen,
or
they
will
see
the
same
kind
of
investment
in
public
realm
public
infrastructure
upgrades.
I
So
in
the
case
of
broadbeach
that
started
around
the
Commonwealth
Games
and
also
the
Star
Entertainment
Group,
responding
with
their
upgrades
of
the
island
in
the
case
of
Main
Beach.
Obviously,
we've
got
the
spit
master
plan,
60
million
commitment
to
infrastructure
public
realm
upgrades
there
in
Chevron,
Island
we've
seen
with
the
Thomas
Drive
upgrades
and
the
hotter
developments
that
we've
taken
for
as
Council
that
that's
provided
confidence
for
the
private
sector
to
invest,
and
we
don't
see
the
same
thing
happening
around
Surfers
Paradise.
I
We
believe
that
this
proposal
will
encourage
and
provide
the
private
sector
the
confidence
that
they
need
to
do
the
same
around
surface
paradise
and
that
we
have
already
seen
in
the
case
of
the
paradise
Center,
which
obviously
went
forward
without
this
kind
of
public
investment
stimulation.
Because
of
its
premium
location
on
the
Esplanade.
We
would
see
that
level
of
retail
uplift
pull
back
right
along
cavel
Mall,
Cavill
Avenue
down
to
the
river.
I
So
we
do
feel
that
there
will
be
a
payback
to
council
from
this
investment
from
The
increased
economic
activity
and
revenue
it
will
generate.
We
have
also
provided
optionality,
as
I
said
right
at
the
outset.
We
recognize
these
are
very
large
figures
in
terms
of
the
investment
that
is
proposed,
and
so
there
are
options
by
both
stages
and
then
sections
within
the
first
stage
that
we
can
look
at
when
we
get
to
the
slides
just
some
of
the
risks
that
we
should
flag.
I
So,
as
we
talked
about,
albeit
it
was
from
2019,
we
have
undertaken
significant
Community
consultation
as
well
as
traffic
modeling
and
engagement
with
our
own
trafficking
transport
colleagues
to
understand
impact
impacts,
and
we
would
continue
the
community
consultation
throughout
the
delivery
of
the
project.
There's
also
options
in
terms
of
when
we
might
look
at
the
southbound
lane
closure.
We
could
do
that
as
a
trial.
It
could
be
in
stage
one
or
it
could
be
at
a
later
stage.
I
I
But
if
we
wanted
to
lock
in
private
sector
commitments,
there
is
an
option
to
do
that
in
terms
of
seeking
contributions
from
from
local
businesses,
and
then
I
know
that
in
the
current
construction
environment,
it's
fun
of
mine
for
any
decision
maker
around
an
infrastructure
project
like
this,
the
risk
of
cost
escalation.
So
we
have
undertaken
cost
estimate,
cost
estimates
utilizing
an
experienced
and
external
quantity
surveyor.
So
we
think
that
this
risk
is
is
has
been
managed
appropriately
and
we
have
made
a
significant
allowance
for
contingency.
I
I
O
Okay,
good
afternoon
councilors,
so
the
presentation
I'll
go
through
is
probably
a
little
bit
more
detail
about
the
concept
Vision
itself
and
it
was
a
really
good
question
before.
Thank
you,
councilor
Gates,
about
what
we're
presenting
today
and
there's
a
slide.
I've
got
that
after
this
one
that
will
show
I
suppose
why
we
got
to
where
we
have
today
and
the
journey
we've
been
on
kind
of
looking
at
surface
paradise
and
the
scope
area.
So
I'll
go
through
that
very
quickly,
but
as
Jeff
reiterated
the
the
three
pillars
of
what
we
described
our
work.
O
Taking
some
of
the
information
we
got
from
the
Surfers
Paradise
placemaking
consultation
was
building
on
Community
Pride
in
a
place
that
locals
love.
We
know
if
locals,
enjoy
a
place
that
also
brings
their
brings
tourism
and
gets
additional
out
to
stay.
So
if
locals,
love
the
place,
visitors
come
as
well,
and
then
you
take
pride
in
taking
your
visitors
to
these
places.
There's
enhancing
small
businesses
by
investing
in
the
public
realm
and
I
think
what
we've
always
said
is
too
is
probably
keeping
up
with
our
brand
promise.
O
Some
of
the
facts
that
Jeff
touched
on,
but
just
very
quickly
flying
these
are
in
the
report,
is
that
we
know
that
there's
2.7
million
people
visiting
service
Paradise
in
2019
and
that
is
certainly
rebounded
post
covered
39
of
accommodation
providers
on
the
Gold
Cup
in
surface
Paradise.
25
of
new
apartment
projects
are
on
the
Gold
Coast
and
are
in
surface
paradise,
and
that
is
bringing
a
different
demographic
to
surface
Paradise
from
what
we
understand.
O
There's
a
new
there's,
11
new
high-rises
Under
Construction,
again
focusing
on
you,
know
more
residential
development,
68
of
the
4217
postcode,
so
surface
Paradise
is
a
big
economic
or
rates
contributed
to
the
gulf
to
the
Gold
Coast,
but
importantly,
the
4217.
You
know
68
of
the
rates
that
come
from
surface
Paradise
within
the
4217
postcode
about
72
million
dollars
last
year
in
rates,
so
some
kind
of
key.
O
You
know
some
key
factors
of
surface
Paradise
at
the
moment
getting
to
today
so
and
I
think
and
those
have
been
around
for
for
a
very
long
time.
We
know
that
we
did
the
I
think
major
projects
back
in
the
day
did
the
surface
products
for
sure
Redevelopment,
which
was
a
wonderful
thing
and
very
adventurous
for
its
time,
moving
the
foreshore
out,
creating
greater
public
realm
and
we've.
Actually,
our
ideas
from
today
actually
leverage
that
idea
of
creating
more
public
space
and
taking
a
little
bit
further.
O
So,
but
it's
that
original
idea
of
creating
more
Beachside
space,
we,
our
team
back,
then
also
did
the
caval
mall
master
plan,
which
was
reduced
in
scope
and
in
budget
in
2012.
And
yes,
there
was
that
upgrade,
but
that
upgrade
was
fairly
minimal.
It
did
remove
some
of
the
Clutter
and
things
like
that.
But
the
finishes,
as
we
know,
are
asphalt.
O
Low
quality
finishes
things
like
that,
but
it's
done
it's
done
its
job,
but
it's
probably
you
know,
that's
why
big
resume
looks
tired,
Patrick's
team,
CityPlace
banking
did
the
place
making
plan
and
did
some
consultation
and
councilor
Taylor
provided
300
000
from
Division
10
to
do
the
body
of
work
the
represented
today,
which
really
was
taking
the
ideas
and
the
foundations
of
the
place
making
plan
and
turning
that
into
a
defined
concept
with
defined
staging
and
a
cost
estimate
to
bring
today.
So
there
can
be
decisions
made.
O
Some
of
the
main
ideas
that
came
out
of
the
place
making
and
I'll
try
and
go
through
these
fairly
quickly
that
were
active
public
spaces,
setting
a
meeting,
shading
trees,
family
friendly
pedestrian
mobility
and
Public
Safety.
So
there's
some
of
these
key
ideas
that
came
out
of
the
consultation.
What
we
did
was
we
wrapped
up
a
design
vision
and
then
also
some
place
making
pillars
for
to
inform
our
design.
This
is
some
of
the
the
advice
back
in
the
2019
consultation.
O
O
What
we
wanted
to
say
was
from
River
to
Coast
so
identifying
that
strong
link
from
the
narang
river
right
through
to
the
beach
and
that
Narrative
of
the
Gold
Coast
that
that
Narrative
of
Headlands
Bushland,
that
that
kind
of
and
the
way
that
the
Sea
and
the
river
move
so
that
kind
of
organic
that
organicness
from
there
we've
developed
some
concept,
design
strategies,
four
of
them
so
four
pillars
to
continue
to
see
how
the
concept
design
could
progress
and
they
would
grow
the
green.
So
that's
again
shade
and
comfort
creating
places
attractive.
O
We
know
that
places
like
Hasting
Street
and
those
kind
of
streets
are
welcoming
because
of
that
that
canopy
and
shade
supercharging,
The
Experience
so
surface
Paradise
has
always
been
playful.
How
can
we
can?
How
can
we
play
on
that?
And
how
can
we
make
sure
that
we
supercharge
that
surface
Paradise
experience
and
be
unique?
Surfers
Paradise
has
a
unique
offering
compared
to
the
rest
of
the
Gold
Coast
open
for
all,
so
that's
again
bringing
a
different
demographic
back
to
surface
families.
Things
like
that
and
amplify
brand
surface.
So
it's
very
similar
to
supercharged
experience.
O
O
Okay,
so
I'll
just
break
down
the
different
areas
and
then
we'll
get
to
the
staging.
So
the
Esplanade,
as
I
described,
was
a
series
of
Headlands
or
areas
where
you
could
sit,
relax
and
dwell
in
some
of
the
findings.
Were
that
the
longer
you
have
a
place
of
an
environment
of
which
you
like
to
dwell
and
sit
you're
more
likely
than
to
spend
money
in
a
retail
environment.
So
these
we've
created
pockets
of
which
people
can
to
sit,
buy
food.
Things
like
that
and
dwell
pockets
of
activation
for
temporary
pop-ups.
O
O
We
know
that
southbound
closure
land
closure,
Works
in
a
traffic
modeling
sense
provided
there's
some
other
network
changes
to
happen,
which
we've
considered
into
our
estimates
and
by
and
also
having
dedicated
cycle
Lanes
I'm
from
an
engineering
perspective,
we're
using
very
similar
technology
to
what's
out
there
at
the
moment
for
the
sea
wall
a
sacrificial
sea
wall.
But
if
they
do
not
project
well,
they
only
predominantly
project
further
than
the
current
wall.
O
O
O
Okay,
thanks
as
I
described,
there's
plazas
that
have
or
shade
structures
that
have
been
architecture
designed
that
allow
for
for
shade
for
for
places
to
dwell,
but
also
for
pop-ups
foreign
other
areas.
We
think
are
important
to
things
like
water
play.
So
these
these
elements
are
again
for
families
to
to
enjoy,
but
also
can
have
a
nighttime
experience,
so
could
be
lit
up,
have
projections
things
like
that,
so
you
do
get
that
full
day
in
the
life.
O
So
you
can
go
down
to
your
family
at
the
beach
play
in
the
water
play
for
your
young
family,
but
also
come
back
at
night,
and
it
can
look
very,
very
different.
What
we
also
know
is
that
not
all
families
love
to
be
in
the
sand,
but
they
also
like
to
be
close
to
the
ocean,
so
this
design
allows
that
ability
to
be
close
to
the
ocean,
but
not
have
to
be
in
the
sand
and
also
get
shade
and
that's
representative
of
kind
of
the
diverse
tourism.
O
You
know
the
demographic
and
the
type
of
people
that
come
to
surface
Paradise
and
some
architectural
intent
there's
an
ability
to
play
with
some
of
these
forms.
So
the
forms
hark
back
to
some
of
the
things
of
the
older
era,
but
also
to
include
interesting
tile
patterns
underneath
these
structures-
and
things
like
that-
that
you
know
that
allow
a
little
bit
of
of
interest
and
color
back
to
surface
paradise,
and
these
are
all
to
be
designed.
O
But
there's
that
ability
to
really
you
know
brighten
it
up
and
just
a
bit
of
a
cross-section
so
cover
more
cover
more.
We
call
this
a
bit
of
an
organic
shape.
It
does
it.
It
allows
a
series,
it's
almost
a
bit
like
a
sand
dune.
It
allows
people
to
weave
in
and
out
if
they
like
to,
but
also
creates
a
main
thoroughfare
of
around
seven
meters
down
the
middle
for
those
large
events
and
those
people
moving
through
the
space.
But
it
gives
that
feeling
of
organic
moves,
so
you
can
move
in
and
out.
O
It
creates
places
for
people
to
sit
to
dine.
We
have
created
that
space
through
a
number
of
ways.
One
is
removing
the
dining
shelters
underneath
the
two
restaurants
to
the
north,
giving
McDonald's
playing
with
the
levels
at
McDonald's
so
giving
them
their
own
little
dining
area
and
crate,
taking
back
some
of
that
public
realm.
O
But,
most
importantly,
what
we've
done
is:
we've
looked
to
shift
the
road,
Orchid
or
Road
here,
just
a
little
bit
further
to
the
north,
by
taking
out
three
loading
bays
and
removing
the
dog
leg
of
the
road
as
it
comes
into
Orchid
Avenue,
and
that
is
allowed
in
another
five
meters
of
public
space,
so
the
mall.
Now
you
can
drag
yourself
all
the
way
from
from
the
Esplanade
right
down
to
surface
paradise
and
kind
of
get
that
one
creative.
O
What
one
design
language
through
and
wind
it
out
so
at
the
bottom
of
surface
Paradise
Boulevard,
you
can
almost
get
a
view
to
the
very
end
and
there's
some
architectural
shade
structures
that
are
identified
before
that
are
there
to
kind
of
lead
you
through.
So
you
you
know,
you're,
always
looking
at
this
next
structure.
This
next
structure
and
again
those
structures
have
been
designed
to
have
a
nighttime
character
as
well
through
projection
and
Lighting,
and
these
are
just
some
renders
of
those
those
type
of
things.
The
shade
structures,
there's
there's
large
ones.
O
So
there's
these
large
elements
that
allow
you
to
travel
down
your
path,
see
the
next
one
see
the
next
one
and
these
other
structures
that
allow
for
shade
and
and
there's
some
views
that
could
be
silk
printed
with.
You
know,
photos
of
yes,
the
year
of
surface
Paradise
or
what
that
might
be
to
create,
create
interest.
O
And
again,
a
bit
of
a
cross-section
that
these
spaces
are
fairly
live,
so
it's
hard
to
just
gather
scale
which
I
thought
these
are
important.
With
regards
to
you
know
you
do
have
that
main
spine
and
then
Cavill
Avenue
down
to
the
West.
There's
not
a
lot
of
intervention
here,
other
than
really
just
Street
just
make
just
improving
the
street.
O
The
street
characteristics
there
and
ability
to
drag
some
of
the
finishes
from
the
further
Eastern
part
down
down
through
and
probably
having
a
look
at
the
park
there
about
how
you
might
improve
that
create,
potentially
a
dining
District
or
an
area
for
dining
pop-ups
with
the
restaurants
that
surround
it.
Obviously,
we've
got
the
remembrance
trying
this,
obviously
maybe
even
making
that
more
important
and
creating
a
space
that
could
be
that
could
be
used.
O
O
Right
and
staging
so
as
Jeff
as
Jeff
went
through
there's
a
number
of
ways
to
Stage
the
project.
We've
shown
a
stage,
one
which
runs
from
which
runs
all
of
Avenue
and
Cavill
mall
to
two
Headlands
and
then
the
further
stages
of
the
Esplanade,
but
that
can
also
be
broken
up
between
the
Avenue,
the
lower
western
part,
the
mall
itself
from
Surfers
Paradise
Boulevard
to
the
Avenue,
and
then
you
could
potentially
do
the
Esplanade
as
one
stage
or
multiple
stages,
as
well
as
Jeff
said.
B
B
Well,
on
the
page
before
it
says,
the
population
is
currently
27
000.
and
at
the
moment,
there's
32
000
at
kumara
upper
kumara,
so
I
just
don't
get.
There's
been
a
33.6
increase
in
the
population
at
upper
kumara
over
between
the
2016
census
and
the
2021.
So
I
just
I'd
just
like
to
know
where
the
information
came
from,
so
that
we're
dealing
with
fat.
O
B
F
C
Our
conversations
because
I
was
quite
fascinated
by
the
population
targets
that
even
I
don't
think.
These
words
are
actually
correct
because
rate
of
growth
is
much
higher
up
North,
but
the
increase
in
population
numbers
is
higher
in
South,
Portland,
Surfers,
Paradise,
so
I
agree.
I,
don't
think
those
numbers
are
right,
but
still
we're
expecting
population
to
be
to
grow
by
more
actual
people
in
surface
in
Southport
than
other
areas.
A
N
Oh
thanks,
Mr
chair
with
surface
Paradise,
it's
a
problem
child.
It
always
has
been.
If
you
remember,
we've
been
through
this
episode,
I,
don't
know
how
many
times
now
with
surface
Paradise.
The
argument
always
comes
up
about.
You
know
the
rates
income
that
service
Paradise
brings
in
most
rates
throughout
the
city
and
foreign.
N
Look
I
like
a
lot
of
aspects
of
this
I.
Think
it's
very
good
and
the
only
issue
that
I
have
is
that
I
have
spoken
to
cancer.
Tell
about
it
is-
and
this
has
come
up
before-
that
Council
puts
in
all
this
money
to
or
the
rate
pays
put
in
this
money
to
upgrade
surface
Paradise,
what
the
property
owners
doing,
because
I
can
remember.
N
Last
time
we
put
a
lot
of
money
into
this
area.
The
streets
look
beautiful,
but
some
of
the
properties
were
dilapidated
and
they
brought
the
whole
area
down
and
I
think
that,
if
we're
going
to
invest
as
a
city,
this
money
into
this
area
of
surface,
we
want
to
guarantee
that
those
property
owners
are
going
to
do
something
with
their
buildings,
because
it
has
to
be
a
partnership
between
the
city
and
the
and
the
property
owners
to
have
a
really
good
sparkling
finish
project.
Because
I
can
remember.
N
A
B
N
Well,
you
know
before
we
as
a
city,
we'd
spent
a
lot
of
money
and
you
probably
remember
it
too
doing
up
the
streets,
but
the
buildings.
Whatever
you
know,
the
property
owners
of
those
buildings
never
did
their
facades
or
interior.
They
just
left
it
and
I.
Think
we'd
like
to
have
a
oh
I'd
like
to
have
a
guarantee
that
those
discussions
have
taken
place
and
that
those
property
owners
are
going
to.
You
know,
spend
the
money
to
upgrade
their
facades
and
make
the
buildings
look
good.
B
O
So
I'd
love
it
I,
don't
I,
don't
I
can't
answer
the
guarantee
question
counselor,
but
I
can.
Certainly
during
this
process
we
did
engage
with
the
businesses
through
the
scope
area.
We
spoke
to
Challenger
group
who's
bought
the
majority
of
them
all.
You
know
that
that
whole
portion
and
they
certainly
have
a
vision
to
continue
what
they've
done
at
the
East
through.
O
F
The
fact,
if
we're
doing
this
work,
they're
prepared
to
do
it.
In
some
cases
we
had
some
of
the
owners
looking
at
purchasing
other
properties
and
to
the
fact
of
saying
that
they
want
to
start
designing
based
if
we
got
an
endorsement
on
what
we've
got
here
now.
So
we
have
spoken
to
quite
a
few
of
the
owners
through
that
area.
P
Thank
you,
chair
and
probably
either
through
to
Trent
water
Darren,
but
I'm,
just
getting
back
on
that.
Getting
to
today
2011
surface
Paradise,
foreshore
Redevelopment
was
25
million
dollars,
so
that
was
11
years
ago,
and
our
visitation
to
surface
hasn't
really
changed
with
that
sort
of
25
million
dollar
investment
and
I
would
imagine.
Well
the
talk
of
you
know
what
we're
looking
to
be
different
in
there
and
in
today's
dollars.
I
would
imagine
that
25
million
dollars
May
equate
to
the
48
million
dollars.
P
That's
up
there
on
the
screen
now,
so
in
spending
that
sort
of
dollars
back
in
2011
to
see
changes
in
the
area
and
like
I
bet,
I'm
a
very,
very
long-term
local.
Yes,
the
foreshore
is
amazing.
Has
it
changed
my
thoughts
on
returning
to
Surfers
Paradise
snow?
So
I
don't
know
yes,
it
does
look
good,
but
I,
don't
know
whether
we
got
the
city
got
an
economic
benefit
out
of
spending,
25
million
dollars
back
in
2011
and
then
I
look
up
there.
We
want
to
spend
another
48
million
dollars
in
today's
dollars.
P
Is
that
going
to
increase
the
economic
benefit
to
everybody
in
the
whole
of
the
city
or
even
to
those
that
choose
to
go
into
surface
Paradise?
To
that
foreshore
looks
magnificent
now
the
thought
of
spending
another
50
million
dollars
or
48
million
dollars
based
on
what's
on
that
screen.
There
now
does
not
give
me
Comfort
and
when
I
look
at
that
sort
of
dollars
as
to
140
million
dollars
there
on
that
screen
at
the
moment,
I
would
not
be
able
to
support
that
today.
P
Knowing
that
there's
projects
in
everybody's
division
that
would
increase
the
value
of
their
division
to
their
residence,
could
I
comfortably
support
that,
knowing
that
potentially
projects
in
my
area
itself
would
lose
priority
in
the
scheme
of
things.
So
it's
to
me
it's
a
big
yes
I'm
I'm
most.
Definitely
we
need
to
do
some
sort
of
work
there,
but
I
actually
don't
think.
There's
enough
data
in
this
to
tell
me
that
spending
140
million
dollars
in
surface
Paradise
is
really
going
to
change
the
appeal
for
local
residents
to
go
in
there
and
and
I
know.
P
I
was
only
one
of
the
two
people
that
didn't
support,
not
selling
the
Bruce
Bishop
car
park.
But
realistically,
if
to
me,
that's
a
loss
of
a
a
lot
of
money.
Probably
one
of
those
figures
up
there
on
the
screen
plus
then
we're
having
another
ask
here
for
140
million
dollars.
So
to
me,
that's
a
couple
hundred
million
dollars.
I
can't
see
myself
supporting
it
today,
even
though
I
think
what
you've
presented
here
is
great.
Is
it
going
to
change
it
not
for
me.
C
Thank
you
through
you,
counselor
Castro
I've
got
a
few
questions,
some
on
the
actual
plan
and
then
what
it
intends
to
achieve
before
I
get
to
budget
and
I
would
start
by
as
I
see
that
there
is
definitely
a
need
in
surface
but
I'm,
not
feeling
particularly
confident
with
what's
presented
at
the
moment.
So
just
the
first
one
on
the
the
at
what
these
visuals
to
me,
it
does
look
a
bit
like
it
could
be
anywhere.
I
could
be
in
Singapore.
I
could
be.
C
O
So
through
the
chair,
so
I
suppose
to
answer
the
tree
question.
First,
what
we've
tried
to
do
and
it's
difficult
to
display
and
renders,
but
the
landscape
would
be
very
much
the
Gold
Coast
and
those
those
kind
of
Journal
Mounds
that
are
kind
of
showing
through
are
supposed
to
you
know
kind
of
bring
that
Coastal
character
back
through
and
also
pick
up.
Some
of
that
language
of
you
know
why
the
streets
are
named,
certain
certain.
You
know
ways
because
they're
actually
about
you,
know,
rainforest
and
things
like
that.
O
So
there's
an
intent
to
create
a
landscape
that
does
feel
like
the
Gold
Coast
and
that
kind
of
journey
through
a
journal
system.
The
shading
opportunity
is
probably
not
very
large
trees
for
the
mall.
As
you've
rightly
said,
it's
probably
lower
smaller
scale,
vegetation
that
creates
a
lower
level
canopy
and
that's
why
there's
different
levels
of
shade
so
there's
the
structures
with
potentially
the
silk
screens
that
provoke
or
invoke
memories
of
the
of
surface
Paradise,
but
also
those
larger
structures
we
get
for
the
larger
trees
on
the
Esplanade.
O
C
Yeah
well,
I
think
one
of
the
things
that
I
liked
about
at
the
moment
the
most
was
there
were
a
lot
of
trees
down
it,
but
my
understanding,
and
certainly
having
a
look
in
the
CBD,
the
inability
to
plant
trees
where
there
is
infrastructure
underground,
so
I
don't
know,
but
that
one
would
have
to
be
addressed.
My
other
concern
is
whether
this
would
actually
achieve
what
it
sets
out
to
achieve,
particularly
regarding
safety.
C
So
I've
had
feedback
from
residents
that
if
the
nightclubs
are
still
there
in
the
same
place
and
we're
not
altering
or
influencing
that,
what
really
changes
other
than
a
pretty
place
to
go-
and
you
know
potentially
I
won't
go
there,
but
and
and
I
I
appreciate
this
one's
very
difficult,
because
you've
got
property
owner
rights.
People
can
do
what
they
want.
We
don't
have
a
PDA
over
this,
but
I
would
be
more
interested
in
seeing
precincts
where
okay.
This
is
where
we
want
to
see
our
our
nightclubs,
our
clubs.
C
O
Through
the
chair,
it's
a
complicated
question
regarding
you
know
the
the
surface,
Paradise
I
suppose
it's
brand,
but
we
do
think
that
improving
particularly
I
think
the
mall
to
public
cancer
councilor
Young's
question
earlier
too,
is
probably
one
of
the
biggest
catalytics
like
that's
for
us.
That
would
be
one
of
the
biggest
changes.
O
So,
yes,
we
had
the
Esplanade,
but
we
never
connected
it
appropriately
and
I
think
we're
one
thing
from
this
could
be
the
more
in
that
that's
a
very
important
connector
and
a
high
quality
public
realm
fixing
up
the
finishes
allowing
places
for
family
to
come,
but
also
be
welcomed.
At
night
it's
lost
a
bit
of
that
nighttime
Family
character.
A
B
I'm
just
wondering
given
this,
this
whole
document
is
really
the
basis
for
it
was
the
2019
Place
making
report.
Did
we
ever
embark
on
that
Journey
with
the
property
owners
for
a
place
making
project
where
the
owners
made
the
contribution
and
Council
matched
it
to
make
improvements
and
I'd
also
like
to
know
where
the
architectural
intent
was
developed
from
because.
B
We
don't
have
good
runs
on
the
board
in
terms
of
our
our
features
that
we
have
provided
in
the
city,
our
yet
the
lights.
For
example,
we
just
have
a
very
poor
record
in
delivering
this
type
of
product,
which,
again
to
me,
appears
like
it
may
be
terribly
dated
and
controversial.
So
I
I
want
to
know
whether
we
ever
did
any
consultation
with
the
property
owners
about
perhaps
participating
in
a
place
making
opportunity
with
Council
first
off
did
we.
J
O
Foreign,
we
spoke
to
the
businesses,
so
we
did
speak
to
a
number
of
the
businesses
that
I
went
through
earlier
about
what
their
views
were
about
the
road
and
the
road
closure,
and
it
was.
It
was
mixed
so
regarding
whether
or
not
they'd
support
it
or
not.
But
what
was
consistent
was
that
environment
to
be
softer,
so
whether
it
remained
One,
Way,
foreclosure
or
two
was
it
to
feel
less
like
a
road.
So
at
the
moment
it
does.
It
feels
like
a
road.
O
It
looks
like
a
road
and
it
definitely
is
a
barrier
between
the
mall
and
the
Esplanade
and
again
I.
Think
that
is
a
real
concern
in
softening
up
that
connection
of
where
the
more
comes
up
and
meets
the
Esplanade
and
tying
those
things
together
to
make
it
a
more
safe
environment
so
and
that
can
be
achieved
in
both
two-way
or
one-way.
But
that
was
very,
very
consistent
feedback
for
us.
B
B
When
there's
been
no
consultation
with
you
know,
the
people
that
are
supporting
the
funding
that
everyone's
telling
me
is
generated
in
this
sector
haven't
been
consulted,
so
I
think
we're
way
ahead
of
ourselves.
In
thinking
we
can
recommend
a
one-way
road
closure
when
and
and
allocating
funding
to
this
extent,
when
the
people
just
simply
have
not
been
asked.
F
Yeah
and
I
just
want
to
give
everyone
a
Clarity
of
the
process.
We've
got
to
get
there
because
there's
a
lot
of
questions
going
so
just
from
my
perspective
of
how
how
it
came
about
and
how
we've
arrived
to
this
particular
point,
and
it's
one
that
we've
all
got
to
realize
that
everyone
recognizes
in
this
room
that
surface
Paradise
needs
something
doing
to
it
and
I,
and
this
has
been
spoken.
Sorry
yeah.
A
F
Sorry
part
of
the
process
was
to
do
a
body
of
work
that
actually
understood
the
for
the
foreshore
and
do
we
could
we
have
no
traffic?
Could
we
have
one
lane
or
could
we
have
two
lanes
options,
and
we
did
the
body
of
work
to
understand
that
particular
situation
and
what
came
out
of
the
body
of
a
report?
The
work
that
was
done
was
one.
We
realized.
We
cannot
actually
close
it
down,
it
would
gridlock
it.
F
The
current
concept
here
at
the
moment
is
talking
to
one
lane,
but
it
doesn't
rule
out
the
fact
that
we
have
looked
at
what
two
lanes
would
be
and
the
big
Community
consultation
to
talk
to
that,
so,
whether
it's
one
lane
or
two
lanes
in
relation
to
the
design
and
feel
that
can
be
teased
out
and
spoken
at
some
point,
so
the
body's
work
was
to
do
with
transport
in
that
particular
area
and
the
concept
drawings
that
we
provide
here
today
is
talking
to
an
opportunity
of
being
one
lane.
And
what
does
it?
F
A
L
Mr
chair
through
you
to
offices
I'm,
trying
to
think
of
an
example
where
a
project
like
this
has
been
done
around
Australia
recently
so
in
through
all
this
work
being
done.
Is
there
a
relevant
example
where
this
kind
of
Project's
been
undertaken
by
an
LGA
or
by
a
state?
Recently,
everything
I
can
think
of
is
much
bigger
than
this,
like
it's
kind
of
South
Bank
size.
But
did
you
have
an
example
where
this
has
happened
or
in
Australia
recently
as
a
real
world
example,.
O
Ipswich
have
just
done
their
Nicholas,
Street
I,
believe
so
they've
just
they've
done
a
very
big
public
reliabalization,
along
with
their
Library,
so
they've
pedestrianized
it.
You
know.
High
quality
finishes
things
like
that
for
exactly
the
kind
of
reasons
we
have.
So
that's
one
very
small
scale,
but
one
very
local
example
I
mean.
O
Sure
it
wasn't
a
40
million
project,
for
example,
but
again,
but
the
intent
is
the
same.
High
quality
finishes,
create
a
more
pedestrianized
area
for
events
and
for
for
restaurants,
and
things
like
that,
so
it's
Nicola,
Street,
Ipswich,
obviously
Queen
Street,
Mall,
Quest
Street
mall
is
a
good
evidence
of
having
high
quality
public
realm.
It
still
looks
great,
they
continue
to
evolve
and
they
continue
to
upgrade
it.
So
it
does
has
managed
to
put
in
Fairly
large
trees
in
planter
boxes.
Things
like
that,
and
also
neither
behind
darling
Harbor
in
Sydney.
O
L
Mr,
chair
I'm,
not
sure
how
but
I'm
interested,
because
the
report
talks
to
economic
assumptions
of
invest
money.
You
know
this
is
economic
outputs
that
can
come
from
it
if
there's
lived
examples
in
other
parts
of
the
country
at
the
moment
that
could
actually
provide
some
data
back
to
prove.
Those
assumptions
would
be
interesting
of
why
investment
in
these
kind
of
public
spaces
hasn't
actually
worked
and
others
of
what
their
assumptions
were
in
the
first
place
and
to
generate
that
kind
of
money.
Be
interested
in
that.
L
Chair
I
can
I
can
say
for
a
fact
that
I
would
have
a
massive
problem,
supporting
any
money
being
invested
until
I
had
more
confidence
around.
That
is
part
of
the
problem,
for
me
is
that
it
looks
even
worse
when
you
do
get
some
private
investment
and
then
the
building
next
door
to
it
does
something
different
and
they
don't
look
like
they
ever
looked
to
be
in
the
same
realm,
it
looks
terrible
it's
something
we
can
do.
L
J
Through
the
chair,
I
think
the
council
direction
to
us
would
be
that
as
part
of
this
process,
we'd
look
at
some
guidelines
that
could
be
I,
guess
considered
in
any
future
changes
in
planning
scheme.
That
would
be
the
way
to
do
it
that
we
would
take
that
on
as
part
of
this
body
of
work,
but
it
would
be
up
to
the
planning
process
to
actually
capture
those
guidelines
and
and
put
them
put
them
in
planning
yeah.
O
It's
Paul.
The
very
simple
question
to
this
I
suppose
was
that
when
we
Define
the
scope
boundaries,
the
surface
Paradise
follow
us
and
plan
looked
at
Cabo
mall,
and
we
did
really
strongly
believe
that
the
link
that
the
that
that
more
piece
linking
to
the
Esplanade
was
what
was
was
missing.
So
we
did,
we
had
to
define
the
scope
boundary
some
way
and
I.
Suppose
we
see
that
the
more
and
yes
is
that
catalystic
project
that
then
you
could
drag
down
down
awkward
Avenue
if
you
needed
to
yeah
I
suppose
it's.
O
L
O
So
so
surface
Paradise,
Boulevard,
I,
suppose
the
question
regarding
access
from
the
track,
the
the
stop
through
to
the
stuff.
But
we're
certainly
trying
to
do
that
through
that
road.
Realignment
I
spoke
about
and
also
trying
to
make
that
that
entrance
into
the
mall,
far
more
attractive
and
far
more
open
for
people
to
be
drawn
drawn
into
them
all.
But
with
regards
to
the
to
the
service
Paradise
Boulevard
in
its
length,
which
was
not
part
of
the
scope
study.
F
To
that,
thank
you,
and
at
the
time
of
us,
looking
at
what
scope
of
area
that
we
had
to
Define
at
the
time
the
the
important
bit
was
the
actual
intersection
of
the
mall
where
Light
Rail
comes
in,
and
our
challenge
with
light
rail
is
very
heavy,
with
state
government
control
in
light
rail,
Corridor
and
us
getting
any
work
down
that
area.
It's
a
big
challenge
for
the
city
and
by
actually
adding
that
into
it.
It
could
have
made
some
more
complicated
challenges
moving
forward
because
of
Light
Rail.
F
It
doesn't
mean
down
the
track
that
we
don't
have
the
opportunity
to
do
body
of
work
at
that
particular
point,
and
the
idea
of
pulling
this
through
is
one
we're
actually
not
just
having
a
more
we're
pulling
people
through
to
the
river
two.
It
gives
us
opportunity
at
a
future
point
to
review
the
corridor
in.
However,
that
could
look
because
we're
talking,
State,
Light,
Rail
and
obviously
the
riverfront
is
something
that
at
some
point
down
the
track.
F
We
could
reimagine
that,
but
the
whole
idea
was
to
pull
it
through
to
the
river
instead
of
people
just
getting
to
the
end
of
the
mall.
The
other
part
of
it
was
that
the
nightclub
section
area
we've
had
work
done
down
there
previously
and
it
is
like
the
nightclub
section.
This
is
more
of
a
a
family
feel
through
here
into
the
foreshore,
and
the
other
challenge
was,
and
we
talk
about
the
the
road
through
surface
paradise
and
why
it
looks
like
this
we've
done
a
bit
of
this.
We've
done
a
bit
of
that.
F
We've
done
a
bit
of
this
a
little
bit
of
a
bit
of
that
and
that's
why
we
have
a
city.
That's
got
a
whole
load
of
little
bit
of
projects
done
here
and
there
that
even
in
2012,
we
had
a
budget
of
11
million
and
the
the
council
budgeted
to
six
thousand.
So
the
idea
of
this
project
was
to
come
to
council.
F
Let's
grab
everything
we've
done
before,
don't
imagine
what
we've
done
for
the
last
30
years,
let's
reimagine
what
it
could
be
for
the
next
10
to
20
years,
and
it's
really
important
that
we
did
roll
up
talking
to
councilor
Gates
information.
That's
been
part
of
that
Journey
we
weren't
going
to
throw
it
out.
The
20
years
is
about
that
history
of.
Why
we're
here
today,
everyone
in
this
room
talking
about
we
don't
go,
don't
go
into
Surfers
Paradise,
it's
a
mess,
it
needs
work.
F
Doing
we
could
have
cried
easily,
come
back
to
the
room
and
guess
what
put
some
more
paint
over
it
and
done
a
little
bit
here
and
a
little
bit
there.
This
here
is
gives
an
opportunity
for
Council
to
have
a
really
good
look
at
the
area
and
make
some
defining
changes
that
connects
them
all
right
through
connects
the
Esplanade
that
gives
a
real
common,
easy
feel
for
that
whole
area.
F
When
you're
going
in
when
I
actually
came
into
Council
I
did
a
a
survey,
and
it's
been
mentioned
in
the
in
the
council
room
right
here:
I
don't
go
in
there,
people
were
asked.
Would
you
go
to
surfers
paradise
and
50
said
no.
The
biggest
question
for
me
was:
if
we
asked
residents
not
talking
Division
10,
would
you
take
a
guess
to
surface
Paradise
less
than
50
said
they
would
take
someone
to
surface
Paradise?
F
That
indicates
that
we've
lost
the
love
of
surface
paradise
and
I
don't
want
to
be
in
here,
and
it
was
mentioned
in
the
chamber.
Just
then
that
I
don't
go
into
Surfers
Paradise.
We
can
keep
licking
paint
over
it
and
keep
having
the
conversation
in
10
20
years
time,
but
at
some
point
this
Council
has
got
to
grab
it
by
the
the
Scruff
of
the
neck
and
say
is:
are
we
going
to
do
something
with
the
heart
of
our
city?
F
Are
we
going
to
be
proud
of
it
and
that's
the
decision
for
this
room
right
here
we
talk
to
business
every
day.
The
consult
consultation,
work
we've
done
at
a
higher
level
is
with
business.
It's
with
residents.
We
bought
our
destination
Gold
Coast.
We
brought
in
major
events
because
they
had
to
be
part
of
the
process
of
ensuring
that
it's
right
designed
for
what
surface
Paradise
moving
forward.
Yes,
we
are
have
a
nightclub
Precinct.
A
O
With
regards
to
the
foreshore
area,
it
probably
provides
less
blank
square
meter
Ridge
than
there
is
there
at
the
moment,
with
again
with
the
with
the
with
the
desire
to
bring
families
back
90
of
the
time.
For
those
you
know,
but
we
have
done
overlays
with
things
like
the
major
events
that
can
fit
there
just
in
a
different
Arrangement,
but
the
intent
of
the
layout
is
to
remove
is
to
remove
some
of
those
strong
linear
kind
of
harder
space
of
the
Esplanade
and
bring
back
that
softer
feel.
So
we
haven't
there's
not
a
calculation.
O
I
N
K
I
N
Where
we
had
cancer,
Bell
and
Barton
and
Douglas
and
the
same
arguments
been
like
this
I
wasn't
here
then.
Well,
it
probably
was
too,
but
you
know
the
thing
is
that
all
of
our
the
sales
pitch
for
the
Gold
Coast
guess
where
it
is
surface
Paradise,
you
know,
and
if
people
fly
into
surface
paradise
and
and
it's
not
upgraded
well,
that's
the
the
first
impression
I
get
and
the
last
impression
that
they
get
with
the
traffic
along
the
Esplanade.
N
At
the
front
there
I
understood
that
there
was
bollards
that
could
be
put
up.
You
know
if
the
roads
need
to
be
closed
for
events,
so
I
just
wanted
to
ask:
how
were
they
working
because
I
feel
that,
maybe
you
know
by
having
those
could
overcome
the
issue
about
closing
off
that
area,
making
it
an
events
area.
H
Through
the
chair
I'll
take
that
one
look
they
are
working.
We've
had
some
issues
with
some
water
Ingress,
but
we've
worked
hard
to
resolve
that,
whether
they're
the
hydraulic,
bollards
or
they're
they're
put
there
manually.
We
have,
in
the
past,
closed
off
the
Esplanade
for
events.
So
it's
it's
something
which
can
be
pretty
easily
done
if
required
things.
G
Thank
you,
Mr
chair,
so
I'm
I'm
interested
through
you,
Mr,
chair
to
Darren
to
the
officers.
Have
we
given
any
consideration
in
regards
to
public
consultation
or
the
next
phases
and
how
we
could
do
that
in
a
non-digital
form
so
and
in
in
particular,
as
like
a
diorama
or
something
along
those
lines,
so
that
people
can
actually
see
what's
proposed
because,
oh,
like
I'll,
look
at
the
mushroom
things
and
I'll
look
at
them
and
I
just
see
the
yellow
lights.
G
G
O
Think
at
the
moment,
from
in
an
architectural
sense,
the
architect
would
be
saying
that
they
are
really
there
as
placeholders
for
that
intent
of
having
something
a
vertical
structure
that
has
a
daytime
presence
and
a
nighttime
presence
through
projection
or
through
lights.
That
draws
you
down,
so
it's
that
and
it
may
be
different
at
night
time.
So
it's
not
meant
to
be
a
piece
of
public
art.
G
I
think
the
challenge
that
we
have
with
the
Esplanade
is
that
it
we
wanted
to
do
a
whole
lot
of
things
yeah.
So
so
we've
got
the
markets,
for
example,
where
we
turn
up
with
the
three
by
three
meter
Marquis
everywhere
and
it
looks
like
it
looks
no,
and
then
we've
got
just
the
daytime
surface
that
the
Esplanade
that
we
want
and
then
I
think
we've
all
been
lucky
enough
to
be
in
in
surface
when
it's
completely
heaving
with
people.
G
You
know
whether
or
not
it's
for
a
Christmas
event
or
any
of
the
old
Surfers
Live
Events.
You
know
I
think
we've
all
been
there
where
this
you
just
couldn't
put
any
more
people
in
Surfers
Paradise.
So
whatever
built
form
we
put
there,
it
has
to
be
able
to
handle
the
extremes
of
what
people
do,
but
then,
in
addition
to
that,
the
extremes
of
what
the
weather
does
so
I'm
actually
really
concerned
about
the
level
of
I'm,
gonna,
say
landscaping
and
because
again,
I've
been
in
surface.
G
When
we've
had
the
carols
and
you
know
20
or
30,
000
people
or
whatever,
and
it
just
gets
completely
trampled
you
know.
So
so
that's
a
real
concern
and
I'd
be
really
interested
in
knowing
whether
or
not
we'd
given
any
consideration
to
and
making
it
a
a
less
of
a
green
space.
In
that.
In
that
regards.
O
So
through
the
chair,
we
it
surface
surface
Paradise
is
very
difficult
to
design
for
those
full
range
of
events
that
you're
speaking
about
you
know
from
quiet
to
one
day:
family
friendly,
full
event,
mode,
New,
Year's,
Eve
catering
for
nightclub
District
having
lots
of
people
walk
through
it
at
once.
There's
the
overlay
of
safety,
all
those
type
of
things,
so
the
design
has
taken
into
account.
We
think
the
majority
of
those
those
things
things
with
regards
to
plant
selection,
its
ability
to
survive,
would
certainly
be
part
of
the
next
stage.
We're
confident
the
landscape.
O
Architect
was
confident.
It
was
a
part
of
a
lot
of
conversations
about
it
with
willingness
to
withstand
those
kind
of
conditions.
At
the
moment,
we
think
we've
got
the
right
balance
and
we
do
think
that
you
can
provide
that
Greenery
and
for
it
to
stay
with
the
right
maintenance
overlay
to
stay
as
its
design
intent.
O
We
really
do
believe
that
and
I
and
we
wouldn't
be
pursuing
a
design
in
the
next
stage
as
if,
if
we
couldn't
achieve
those
outcomes
and
having
a
green
space
was
a
huge
part
of
the
consultation
and
it
certainly
wanted
by
the
community.
So
I
think
we
wouldn't
want
to
not
try
and
Achieve
that
kind
of
outcome.
G
G
G
And
my
final
question
is
just
in
regards
to
to
you're.
Proposing
the
best
I
can
see
is
three
stages.
Could
it
be
broken
into
even
more
stages
than
that
gonna
be
made
considerably
easier
in
regards
to
you
know
from
the
Westpac
Bank
down
you
know,
I
was
have
we
given
any
consideration
to
breaking
it
into
more
manageable
bite
sizes.
O
So
through
the
chair
that
the
staging
was
yeah,
we
did
look
at
all
sorts
of
staging
configurations.
The
Esplanade
would
be
a
little
bit
difficult
to
to
to
Stage
much
further
than
that
because
of
The
Proposal
with
the
road
or
not
depending
on
where
you
want
to
go
with
it.
You
certainly
couldn't
do
it
in
increments
and
also
the
Headlands.
So
the
staging
there's
probably
this
as
far
as
you
could
go
before
it
gets
too
complicated.
O
G
A
M
And
thanks
chair,
my
question
was
about
staging
and
I:
do
like
the
idea
of
some
more
Greenery
but
I
just
felt
when
I
looked
at
the
the
plans.
The
concept
plans
there's
just
too
much
of
everything,
so
I
I,
I'm
sort
of
with
everybody
with
the
parasol
so
and
I.
Darren
knows
this
I've
spoken
to
him,
I
just
didn't
like
them.
I
just
thought
they
were
too
much.
M
They
were,
but
I
thought
the
trees
actually
the
trees
and
the
seeding
I
think
it's
really
important
and
my
question
was
about
whether
and
I
think
the
more
resurfacing.
The
more
is
a
big
thing
that
would
be
tremendous,
so
whether
we
concentrate
on
the
actual
mall
itself
first,
because
the
Esplanade
I
think
you
know
works
really
well
at
the
moment.
It's
it's
still
got
a
great
look.
If
I
go
to
surface
I'd
rather
be
on
the
Esplanade
than
anywhere
else.
M
M
The
one
thing
I
will
say
is
that
I
think
some
of
it
we
need
to
do
need
to
do
a
whole
whack,
maybe
not
90
million,
but
you
need
to
do
a
whole
whack,
because
I
can
I
can
assure
you
being
the
divisional
Council
for
coolangatta,
where
we're
still
finishing
a
center
Improvement
project
that
started
before
I
was
a
counselor
because
I
was
on
the
committee.
It's
not
desirable.
M
A
My
opinion,
just
before
I
go
to
you
Darren,
it's
just
interesting,
because
Elton
I
mean
you're
in
this
capacity
now
with
chair
of
Lifestyle,
but
you
would
have
been.
You
would
have
seen
this
project
I
just
interested
to
know.
You
would
have
been
involved
quite
heavily
and
I
just
like
to
get
your
views
on
it.
It's
silly
not
to
ask
you.
H
Thank
you,
Mr
chair,
look,
there's
there's
a
couple
of
things,
probably
to
note
what,
if
we
can
focus
on
the
concept
of
what
is
what
needs
to
be
done
rather
than
the
artist's
impression,
because
that's
just
an
honest
impression
at
this
stage
and
that
as
you've
quite
rightly
identified,
has
got
some
questionable
aspects
to
it.
That
deserve
a
lot
more
consultation,
a
lot
more
fleshing
out.
But
is
it
really
what's
at
the
heart
of
this?
H
So
as
the
the
previous
asset
owner
I
can
tell
you
that
the
asset
and
the
mall
isn't
in
the
best
of
shape,
so
I'll
Echo
the
sentiments
of
councilor
O'neill.
We
made
the
decision
to
do
stamped
asphalt
and
that
has
a
life
and
look
pretty
well
looked
pretty
good
for
the
time
when
we
did
that,
but
it
is
fast
approaching
end
of
life.
H
It
takes
a
lot
of
effort
to
clean
and
moving
forward
if
you
were
to
compare
it
to
a
different
finish
like
a
really
good
granite,
which
is
easy
to
clean
and
will
last
a
long
time
we
have
a
a
product
which
is
considerably
inferior
to
that.
So
one
of
the
things,
the
things
you
might
want
to
think
about-
and
you've
alluded
to
this
in
some
of
the
the
most
recent
aspects
of
this
discussion-
is
to
focus
on
some
sub
elements
of
this.
H
F
I
just
want
to
respond
to
a
couple
of
points
being
made.
Sorry,
it's
just
a
question.
Was
that
sorry,
just
in
relation
to
the
sign,
that's
up
there.
As
we
said
this
is
a
concept
drawing
concept
design,
whether
it's
artwork,
whether
it's
the
sign.
This
is
community
consultation.
That
I
think
needs
to
be
part
of.
Do
we
like
that
sign
there?
Is
there
another
opportunity,
we're
showing
the
sign?
F
There's
a
lot
of
history
there,
so
it
is
showing
in
there
the
artwork
that
we
see
in
the
mall
again
I
most
probably
could
get
14
different,
15
different
ideas
of
what
artwork
looks.
So
for
me,
it's
talking
about
an
opportunity
of
some
sort
of
artwork.
It
talks
about
lighting.
It
talks
about
how
we
can
change
it
from
day
to
night
and
opportunity.
So
as
a
concept,
that's
what
I
believe
we're
talking
to
here
today.
I
think
where
we
go
with
the
community.
A
C
In
regard
with
regards
to
all
the
other,
quite
Hefty
are
things
that
we've
got
currently
in
our
key
exclusions,
which,
as
a
total,
look
at
two
and
a
half
billion
dollars
and
if
I
look
at
my
wish
list
on
there,
it's
hard
to
come
under
two
billion
dollars
and
that's
some
pretty
basic
and
boring
stuff
like
LG
LGB
upgrades
and
Road
networks
for
Freight
and
all
like.
So
can
you
just
remind
me
if
we're
to
spend
two
billion
dollars
out
of
your
key
exclusions?
Where
does
that
yeah,
two
billion?
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
A
F
Thank
you
and
thank
you
chair.
As
we
all
know,
surface
Paradise
is
the
Heart
of
the
City
and
growing
up
here,
many
of
the
as
well
growing
up
here
and
lived
here
for
a
long
period
of
time.
Surface
Paradise
was
the
destination
to
go,
we've
grown
as
a
city
and
over
the
years
surface
Paradise
has
been
doing
the
heavy
lifting
in
relation
to
rates
and
help
build
this
city
and
many
of
times
we
surface.
We've
always
done
a
bit
of
this
and
a
bit
of
that
and
I,
don't
think.
F
We've
really
committed
to
Surfers
Paradise
in
100
and
100
way
we
could
do
today.
We've
got
the
opportunity
to
look
at
a
bigger
vision
for
surface
Paradise.
It
gives
us
the
ability
to
understand
what
the
community
has
been
saying
for
a
long
period
of
time,
since
the
90s
2000,
2019
I,
think
the
last
Community
consultation
was
people
are
saying
we
need
to
do
something
with
Surfers,
Paradise
I.
Think
everyone
in
this
room
here
since
the
four
years
have
constantly
mentioned
surface
Paradise
needs
to
have
work
done
in
it.
F
The
body
of
work
we've
done
now
is
look
at
how
we
envisioned
surfers
paradise
and
we've
looked
at
not
just
having
service
Paradise
as
Capital
Mall
in
the
foreshore.
We
want
to
pull
people
through
surfers
paradise
back
in
the
80s.
When
I
grew
up,
we
had
the
picture
theaters
we
used
to
come
down
to
the
old
melbas
as
we
knew
and
people
before
me,
Bond
Bay
Rock.
F
The
work
that
we
propose
here
is
going
to
be
done.
Properly
is
going
to
be
done
with
quality,
and
it's
going
to
be
here
for
the
Olympics
when
it's
here
in
2032
and
Beyond,
and
we
don't
want
to
be
back
here
in
10
years
time
or
15
years
time
or
even
five
years
time,
having
the
same
conversation
about
surface
Paradise.
The
opportunity
is
here
right
now
with
the
body
of
work.
F
We've
done
and
all
I
can
say
is
to
the
officers
the
business
community,
our
residents,
whether
it
is
in
surface
Paradise
or
all
around
the
Gold
Coast,
our
major
events,
destination,
Gold
Coast,
that's
all
been
hemming
on
the
same
page
and
I.
Think
in
this
room,
we're
all
been
saying
the
same
thing.
Something
has
to
be
done
and
now's
the
opportunity
for
us
to
make
that
decision
and
all
I'm
saying
here
now.
K
A
E
D
E
B
Oh
sorry
delete
the
existing
two
and
and
then
move
number
three
that
becomes
two
and
but
it's
it
reads
that
the
chief
executive
officer
commences
community
and
business
engagement
for
the
surface,
Paradise
Cavill,
Avenue,
Cavill,
mall
and
Esplanade
concept
design,
so
not
just
take
out
for
stage
one
just
take
out
four
stage.
One
yep
yeah
for
this
is
in
with
a
view.
Sorry,
after
concept,
design
concept,
design
yeah
take
delete
that
the
next
bit
after
design
and
add,
if
you
don't
mind,
sorry
with
a
view
to
staging
the
upgrade
commencing
with.
B
G
B
C
B
So
I
think
we
all
recognize
that,
but
whether
we've
hit
the
right
Mark
in
terms
of
what's
before
us
today,
with
the
lack
of
community
consultation
since
2019
I'm,
not
sure
but
I
could
see
my
way
clear
to
supporting
I.
Think
I
have
to
change
that
to
say
that
the
that
the
matter
the
deferred
for
or
referred
to,
the
2023-24
budget.
You.
A
B
N
B
Believes
that
there
needs
to
be
full
consultation
and
especially
in
regard
to
the
proposed
road
closure
for
the
people
who
live
there,
I
mean
the
one
lane
I
know
it's
only
one
lane
that's
being
proposed,
but
I
I
can't
support
moving
to
send
to
budget
the
full
project,
as
defined
today
before
we
see
the
results
of
community
consultation,
and
we
won't
see
the
results
of
that
Community
consultation
before
we
go
to
budget
it's
the
end
of
February.
By
the
time
we
consider
today's
proposal.
B
It's
unrealistic
in
my
mind
to
think
that
we
can
do
the
level
of
consultation.
That
I
believe
is
necessary
to
make
everything
in
this
report
relevant
it.
It
dates
back
to
the
initial
referral
from
2016
and
it's
2023,
and
we
need
it
to
be
relevant
and
we
need
to
be
certain
that
the
people
who
need
to
be
consulted
have
been
consulted
in
my
view,
rather
than
just
the
divisional
counselor
walking
and
thinking
that
end
should.
G
F
Believe
that
I
can
carry
so
so
the
the
me
for
this
is
what
we're
saying
this
is
concept
drawing
the
community
concept,
so
the
community
consultation
is
the
talk,
we're
still
the
the
report
is
showing
a
concept
of
what
land,
but
one
lane
the
body
of
work.
That's
been
done
talks
to,
can
we
have
no
Lanes
one
lane
or
two
it's
ruled
out
two
and
the
concept
is
either
one
or
two
lanes.
So
the
report
talks
to
it
and
there's
Community
engagement
so
to
add.
F
The
second
lane
into
this
actual
design
is
not
a
a
problem
or
change.
It's
just
changing
that
width
of
that,
but
the
feel
and
how
it
will
be
through.
There
will
be
exactly
the
same,
so
the
community
engagement
is
actually
there.
If
you
look
on
page
35
year,
one
is
part
of
that:
Community
engagement
to
actually
resolve
those
areas
which
talks
two
lanes
talks
to
the
visual
artwork.
If
it's
what
we
want.
Sorry.
B
B
Is
it
budget
it?
You
know
it.
We
can't
even
though
I'm
suggesting
that
that
might
be
the
way
we
go,
but
it
still
needs
to
get
through
budget
and
after
it's
approved
by
budget
at
budget
committee,
then
strategically,
then
we
could
go
to
the
Contracting
plan,
but
we're
certainly
in
my
view
at
this
point
in
time,
not
ready
to
go
to
a
Contracting
plan
for
something
that
you
know
I'm
not
fully
confident
in
and
I'm,
not
questioning
that
your
report
is
not
a
good
one.
B
J
Me
so
through
the
chair
for
number
three,
then
maybe
just
to
clarify,
because
out
of
the
budget
process,
obviously
there's
not
a
recommendation
for
us
to
do
that
body
of
work.
So
maybe
it
would
be
best
to
subject
to
approval
in
the
2023
budget
process
that
and
then
they
continue
with
the
significant
Contracting
plan,
and
that
way
we
would
weight
the
outcome
of
the
approval
of
the
40
million
dollars
and
then
get
on
with
the
significant
Contracting
plan.
If
that
would
make
council's
needs.
C
N
K
N
O
The
check
and
I
just
I
just
wanted
to
clarify
one
more
point
about
the
road
closure
and
noting
the
consultation
is
that
stage.
One
I
said
a
little
bit
earlier
doesn't
need
to
close
the
Esplanade
down
to
one
or
two
that
doesn't
have
to
be
a
decision
now
and
Council.
Taylor
said
it
can
be
both
of
those
things.
O
It's
so
there's
time
in
during
stage
one
either
in
the
90
million
or
the
40
million
option
to
do
trials
using
the
bollards
or
Closing
one
lane
and
then
actually
Gathering
data.
You
know
to
whether
it's
successful
or
not
so
there's,
yes,
we've
done
a
traffic
model,
but
we
can
also
do
further
trials
during
stage
one.
So
just
just
to
you
know,
make
sure
that
was
clear
earlier
that
we
don't
have
to
close
or
do
any
right
alter
occasions
in
stage
one
to
the
Esplanade.
P
And
if
I
could
just
ask
a
question
there
chair
when
it
comes
to
that
the
amendment
there
get
just
rid
of
that
there,
the
chief
executive
office
commences
community
in
business,
engagement,
I,
think
that
is
so
extraordinarily
important
and
we
need
to
be
looking
at
how
we
approach
that,
because
I
believe
what
we
said
before
was
that
18
of
surface
Paradise
rope
has
her
own
occupied
18.
So
that's
not
a
big
representation
of
that
whole
area.
N
Thanks
Mr
chair,
obviously
there's
a
lot
of
work,
that's
being
done
over
the
last
few
years
in
regards
to
this
and
I
see
today
that
the
main
thing
is
for
Budget
consideration
of
an
amount
at
being
a
concept
plan.
Is
there
anything
stopping
to
have
the
budget
allocation
to
be
considered
to
run
together
with
any
consultation
of
the
concept
plan,
the
concept
plan?
It's
only
a
concept
plan:
it
can
be
changed.
N
D
Okay,
I
came
in
with
a
pretty
open
mind.
I
didn't
really
know
where
to
go
here,
but
I
think
Council
Gates
actually
raised
a
really
interesting
motion.
It.
The
officer's
recommendation,
doesn't
incorporate
us
being
being
kind
of
real,
almost
required
to
to
really
consider
it
in
the
context
of
other
competing
priorities
in
the
budget
process
and
Amendment
does
still
include
it.
What
is
it
proposed?
A
90
million
dollar
project
subject
to
us
all,
agreeing
yes
and
it
doesn't
shoot
the
idea
down.
D
Initially
I
was
a
bit
concerned
that
it
might
shoot
the
project
in
the
foot,
but
I
don't
think
it
does
at
all.
In
fact,
I
think
it's
actually
the
natural
Next
Step,
so
I
think
it's
actually
a
good
Amendment
and
you
know
I
think
the
next
steps
will
be
the
next
three
months
of
our
special
budget
committee
and
some
Community
engagement,
which
can
commence
immediately
and
so
the
you
know,
the
business
community
and
surface
can
be
reassured
that
we're
going
to
chat
with
them.
Further
about
these
matters.
D
We're
going
to
talk
a
little
bit
more
about
design
we're
going
to
decide
whether
we
want
mushrooms
or
not,
and
you
know
whether
whether
there's
elements
of
the
design
that
can
be
adjusted
and
it
still
makes
adequate
provision
for
us
to
deliver
the
caval
mall
element
and
potentially
the
the
balance
as
part
of
that
Community
consultation
project
and
subject
to
a
budget
like
a
resolution
at
the
special
budget
committee.
So
yeah
I'm,
going
to
support
the
amendment.
G
D
To
that
so
can
I
clarify
that
just
here
I
mean
it
looks
as
though
this
project
has
been
ongoing
and
on
page
35,
it
says
year,
one
six
months
to
June
2023,
which
is
the
existing
budget
already
adopted.
Yes,
Community
engagement,
Contracting
plan
and
on-site
investigations
utilizing
existing
funds.
So
on
page
35
it
occurs
to
me
that
Council
has
already
resolved
to
allocate
money
to
engage
with
the
community
on
this
project.
Yes,.
A
G
I
said
I
said
that
you
didn't
want
you
wanted
to
make
sure
the
words
of
the
motion
have
community
and
business
engagement.
You
know
with
a
view
to
stage
in
the
upgrade
I,
don't
know
how
much
is
left
for
for
Community
engagement,
utilizing
existing
funds-
oh
that's
an
unknown.
It's
actually
not
on
page
35
other
than
it
says
utilizing
in
existing
funds.
So
may.
D
I,
ask
you
a
question
about
the
motion,
then
please
so.
Are
there
sufficient
funds
in
the
remaining
budget
to
undertake
Community
consultation
and
further
Community
consultation
in
relation
to
this
project?
I
would
have
thought
so,
but
through
the
chair
to
the
director
or
the
the
project
manager,
so.
J
F
Thank
you,
sorry
could
I
could
I
just
establish
that
the
community
consultation
talks
to
the
whole
project
and
just
not
them
all
so
we're
allocating
more,
but
we're
doing
a
consultation
for
the
broad,
because
I've
noted
we're
noting
it
not
endorsing
it
and
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
that
doesn't
hang
tight
a
through
the
project.
Sorry,
the
consultation
of
the
whole
project.
A
I
think
I
think
that
makes
sense
if
you're
going
to
be
doing
it,
you
want
to
be
doing
it
all
at
the
same
time,
but
also
it's
important
to
actually
have
that
consultation
done
for
the
deliberations
for
the
budget.
Otherwise
it's
the
same
thing.
Isn't
it
we're
deliberating
without
speaking
to
the
owners,
in
the
same
way
that
we
don't
want
to
deliberate
without
speaking
to
the
traditional
owners,
as
you
said
in
the
other
one?
So,
yes,
it
makes
sense,
it
doesn't
make
sense.
No,
it
doesn't
because
we've.
G
I
saw
the
amended
motion
as
saying
it's:
an
allocation
of
40
million
dollars
for
the
first
stage,
with
consideration
for
the
rest
as
part
of
the
setting
of
the
budget,
but
I
I
honestly
think
that
that
you
need
to
measure
twice
and
cut
once
right.
So
I
don't
actually
see
any
Merit
at
all.
In
rushing
to
do
an
immediate
bit
of
consultation.
I
don't
need
consultation
in
regards
to
the
special
budget.
G
Conversation
I
need
comp
consultation
to
make
sure
we
actually
get
really
good
outcomes
in
regards
to
what
we
want
and
I
was
critical
of
the
mushroom
elements.
You
know,
because
I
actually
don't
want
to
see
us
misstep
in
regards
to
the
built
form.
I
want
people
to
agree
and
and
be
on
board
for
a
revitalization
of
surfers
paradise
and
look
to
be
honest.
The
former
representative,
Gary
Baldin
in
2019,
was
stood
in
the
mall
with
the
mayor
from
memory
where
the
pink
heart
you
know
and
asked
for
feedback.
G
F
D
So
we
talked
about
there
being
only
utilizing
existing
funds
on
page
35.
There
might
not
be
enough
money
to
undertake
satisfactory
engagement.
What
would
be
a
figure
that
we
could
allocate
to
ensure
that
satisfactory
Community
engagement
can
be
done
not
in
a
fast
time,
but
in
a
realistic
time
frame.
J
Through
the
chair
so
sorry,
the
answer
before
was
probably
to
bring
back
something
through
special
budget
committee,
because
I
thought
that
was
the
intent
and
we
do
have
enough
funding
for
that
right.
If
it
was
to
be
a
bigger
consultation
piece
would
have
to
probably
come
back
unless
Trent's
got
an
actual
figure
that
we
we
derived
for
the
whole
Community
consultation
piece,
foreign.
O
I
think
what
we'd
have
to
do
is
based
on
the
comments
today
about
the
broadness
of
the
consultation.
The
type
we'd
have
to
write
a
consultation
plan
and
get
that
and
get
that
briefed
up.
I
think
the
40
million
dollars
is
sufficient
enough
to
cover
the
consult
consultation
fee.
So
if
it's
to
be
after
a
budget,
then
I
think
we're.
We've
got
sufficient
funds.
There.
We've
got
sufficient
funds
now
to
start
a
process
of
writing
the
plan
and
getting
that
up
and
getting
that
ready
and
I.
O
P
Through
the
chair,
too,
I
think
it's
something
we
have
to
note
too
and
and
I
agree
with
Darren
as
in
you
know,
it's
surface
Paradise
is
the
heart
and
that,
but
there's
such
a
big
offering
on
the
Gold
Coast.
Now
it's
not
surface.
Paradise
is
not
the
only
place
to
go
so.
You've
got
Burley
and
you've
got
Palm.
Beach
and
you've
got
cool
and
gather
and
you've
got
Southport
with
the
increasing
offerings
in
there
and
we're
going
to
have
our
live
music
precincts
and
we've
got
all
of
our
little
bespoked
areas.
P
The
20
years
ago,
when
we
were
talking
about
surface
Paradise,
there
was
very
little
else
on
offer,
but
now
the
city
is
expanding
growing
and
everything
so
we're
getting
a
lot
more
spread
across
the
city
and
just
because
I'm
as
a
local
in
Burley
choose
not
to
go
into
surface
Paradise.
It's
not
that
I
don't
go
out.
It's
just
that.
I
choose
a
different
area
to
go
to
and
I
think
we
need
to.
Keep
that
in
mind
when
we're
talking
about
one
area
in
isolation.
P
Is
that
the
city
700
odd
thousand
people
now
and
we
don't
all
choose
to
go
to
Surfers
Paradise
we
choose
to
to
go
out
to
different
parts
of
the
city
and
to
enjoy
different
parts
of
the
city,
so
I
think
it's
whilst
I
acknowledge
how
passionate
Darren
is
about
it.
There
are
so
many
other
places
that
the
Gold
Coast
is
offering.
Now
that
gives
us
the
opportunity
not
to
always
want
to
go
into
surface
Paradise.
So
it's
not
that
it's
totally
off
limits.
It's
just
that
there's
so
many
other
places
to
go.
N
N
A
Sense
to
do
it
now,
absolutely
it's
yeah!
No,
no!
Okay!
All
right!
We've
got
counselor,
Taylor
and
then
I
think
hopefully
and
I
tend
to
agree
with
councilorowen
Jones
I
think
everyone
seems
to
be
pretty
much
on
the
same
page
now
or
I
may
be
proven
wrong.
Counselor
Taylor
did
you
did
you
wish
to
comment?
Sorry
I
thought
you
had
your
hand
up
before:
no
okay,
all
right,
okay.
A
B
Thank
you
well.
I
I
simply
want
to
say
that
I
want
to
support
the
upgrade
of
the
caval
mall
I
just
want
also
to
have
a
reassurance
that
what
is
being
proposed
and
put
before
us
today
is
what
the
community
actually
wants:
I'm,
not
certain,
yet
that
we
have
the
capability
of
taking
it
all
the
way
through
to
the
river
I'm,
not
sure
that
there's
support
for
that
vision
of
river
to
beach
I,
don't
know
that.
B
There's
been
a
demand
for
that
at
any
level
other
than
as
councilor
Taylor
said,
he
went
for
a
walk
with
his
wife
before
the
election.
I
I
mean
I
think
that
that
could
come
later.
Perhaps
if
there
is
a
level
of
community
support
for
it.
It
also
worries
me
about
Orchid
Avenues
exclusion
from
the
project
I
mean
here.
We
we're
proposing
a
40
million
dollar
upgrade
of
the
mall
section,
and
it's
going
to
look
pretty
much
like
the
poor
relation
if
Orchid
Avenue
doesn't
form
part
of
it.
B
So
my
personal
view,
if
I
were
consulted,
would
be
I'd
rather
see,
Orchid
Avenue
included,
because
the
traffic
is
still
going
to
flow
around
and
the
tram
line
is
an
absolute
divider.
In
my
view,
for
encouraging
people
to
go
to
the
other
end
and
to
the
river
into
a
pill
Park,
you
know.
Maybe
there
is
a
body
of
work
that
needs
to
be
done
there
I'm,
not
sure
that
it
just
needs
to
be
part
of
this
initial
Cavill
Mall
upgrade
so
I.
Think
with
the
motion
before
us.
We
can.
B
The
officers
can
start
work
on
that
consultation
and
we
can
get
some
genuine
feedback,
that's
relevant
to
today,
not
to
2019
for
the
the
consultation
that
occurred
way
back
then
and
I
don't
even
know
what
level
of
Engagement
there
was
at
that
time.
Other
than
I
do
recall
there
being
the
preparation
of
a
a
master
plan
for
surface
Paradise
that
was
done
under
councilor
baildon's
auspices.
At
the
time,
I
I
mean
we've,
certainly
not
seen
any
evidence
of
of
consultation.
B
That
I
think
when
we're
making
decisions
of
this
magnitude,
we
we
actually
need
so
that
we
are
making
the
right
decisions
and
that
we
do
get
the
con
content
right.
Because
I've
heard
a
couple
of
counselors
say
today,
those
mushroom
things
are
hideous,
and
you
know
I
know
that
it's
subjective,
but
is
that
what
the
community
wants
to
see
in
there?
B
That
level
of
embellishment
or
is
there
a
view
that
it
should
sort
of
regress
to
a
degree
back
to
the
surface
of
old
that
did
bring
the
beach
closer
into
the
mall
rather
than
what
sort
of
might
be
proposed
by
the
sort
of
Concepts
that
we've
seen
today,
with
the
the
structures
built
around
some
grass
and
some
quite
large
trees,
so
I'll
be
happy
to
consider
it
further.
Once
we've
seen
the
results
of
the
consultation.
F
Thank
you
and
look
I
thank
the
officers
for
bringing
this
report
here
and
I.
Thank
everyone
for
the
debate.
I
mean
the
amount
of
time
we
spent
here.
Talking
about
surface
indicates
that
we
need
to
look
at
surface
and
we
need
to
do
something
for
surface
and
we
have
got
a
proposal
there
and
I'm
wholeheartedly
in
agreeance
that
the
community
need
to
be
comforted,
whether
it's
the
residents,
whether
it's
business,
they
need
to
be
part
of
this
process.
So
what
today
has
given
us
is
the
ability
to
start
that
Community
consultation,
which
is
very
important.
A
Okay
to
base
closed,
we'll
put
the
amendment
moved
by
councilor,
Gates
and
seconded
by
I,
can't
remember
Council
again,
sorry
so
long
ago.
All
right
all
those
in
favor
of
the
amendments,
those
against
okay,
that
is
carried.
The
amendment
becomes
the
motion,
all
those
in
favor
of
the
motion
that
is
carried
well.
That
was
easy.