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From YouTube: Will COVID-19 lead to a permanent shift to remote work? What skills should managers learn to lead?
Description
Danielle (Senior Manager, Content Marketing at Ceridian) and Darren (Head of Remote, GitLab) discuss a variety of topics related to remote work, and the societal/cultural shifts that we'll see following COVID-19.
As more companies become suddenly remote, thrust into a work-from-home environment for the first time, there are natural questions related to process, culture, leadership, and tools.
Topics discussed include:
➞ Do you think the coronavirus pandemic will lead to a permanent shift to remote work for some companies?
➞ Lack of trust is a key issue - and perhaps an obstacle - for some companies to shift to a remote work model. What have you learned, or what would you recommend to both leaders and employers to shift their mindset?
➞ If you were speaking to a leader or person leading a remote team, what skills would you recommend they develop?
➞ A lot of people are talking about business continuity right now. How can remote work support business resiliency?
➞ The cultural shift to managing a remote team
➞ People likely ask you lots of questions about remote work (and you note which questions are asked often in your All-Remote guide). What’s a question that people don’t ask, but you feel they should, about remote work?
###
➞ Learn more about Ceridian: https://www.ceridian.com/
➞ GitLab's Suddenly Remote Handbook: https://handbook.brownfield.dev/
➞ All of GitLab's guide to remote work: http://allremote.info/
➞ GitLab's values and sub-values: https://about.gitlab.com/handbook/values/
➞ Remote work emergency plan: What to do (and where to start): https://about.gitlab.com/company/culture/all-remote/remote-work-emergency-plan/
➞ GitLab's approach to handbook-first documentation: https://about.gitlab.com/company/culture/all-remote/handbook-first-documentation/
➞ What not to do when implementing remote: don't replicate the in-office experience remotely: https://about.gitlab.com/company/culture/all-remote/what-not-to-do/
➞ How to use forcing functions to work remote-first: https://about.gitlab.com/company/culture/all-remote/how-to-work-remote-first/
➞ Gartner CFO Survey Reveals 74% Intend to Shift Some Employees to Remote Work Permanently: https://www.gartner.com/en/newsroom/press-releases/2020-04-03-gartner-cfo-surey-reveals-74-percent-of-organizations-to-shift-some-employees-to-remote-work-permanently2
A
Hey
this
is
urine
remote,
ed,
get
lab
and
today
I'm
joined
by
Dani.
She
has
some
pretty
fascinating
questions
related
to
remote
and
HR,
and
now
we're
pretty
interesting
time
so
I
think
it's
a
fairly
timely
topic,
so
Dani.
Thank
you.
So
much
for
joining
me
give
the
audience
a
bit
of
an
overview
of
who
you
are
what
you
do
and
feel
free
to
dive
into
your
questions.
Sure.
B
Thanks
Darren,
my
name
is
Dani
I'm.
The
senior
manager
of
content
marketing
at
Ceridian
Sweden
is
a
global
human
capital
management
company
and
our
flex
flagship
solution.
It's
called
de
force,
it's
a
single
human
capital
management
platform
and
our
customers
use
it
to
manage
their
employee
lifecycle
from
from
end
to
end.
So
we
work
a
lot
with
people,
leaders,
CFOs,
HR
leaders,
CEOs
about
you
know
how
best
to
drive
value
by
making
intelligent
people
decisions.
B
A
B
Exactly
so,
let
me
dive
into
I
think
a
big
question
and
I've
seen
a
lot
of
articles
about
this
and
people
calling
this
this
big
massive
working
home
experiment.
But
you
know
what
do
you
guys
think
like
do
you
think
this
pandemic
is
going
to
lead
to
a
permanent
shift
to
remote
work
for
some
companies
yeah.
A
A
Earlier
today,
they've
been
kind
of
forced
to
work
from
home
for
about
three
weeks
now,
and
a
lot
of
them
said
I'm
kind
of
just
feeling
drained
and
zapped,
like
everything
takes
so
much
effort
and
I
said
that
has
less
to
do
with
working
remotely
and
more
to
do
with
your
entire
world
shifted
over.
You
were
thrust
into
an
work
environment.
That
is
nothing
like
the
one
that
you
came
from,
not.
A
Else
going
on
around
you
in
the
world,
so
it's
different
and
I
think
as
we
get
through
this
I'm
actually
really
proud
of
humanity
for
how
quickly
we're
adapting
and
how
agile
were
being
I
do
think
that,
on
the
other
side
of
this
people
will
be
more
comfortable
with
it.
They'll
figure
out
what
works,
what
doesn't
work?
There's
a
lot
of
forced
iteration
on
trying
things
out
right
now,
I
think
that's
gonna
yield
some
pretty
awesome
benefits
on
the
other
side
of
it.
The
second
part
of
that
question
is
the
more
interesting
one.
A
B
A
Jobs
that
is
not
the
case
and
we're
seeing
that
play
out
in
real
time,
even
highly
regulated
industries.
It
is
possible
now
this
isn't
the
ideal
situation
for
it
to
happen.
Definitely,
ops
and
business
IT
leaders
have
to
work
on
some
access
issues
and
things
like
that
to
make
it
more
seamless,
but
it
is
possible
and
the
way
I
see
it
is
you're.
Never
gonna
put
this
genie
back
in
the
bottle.
A
On
the
business
side,
you
have
business
leaders
right
now
that
are
looking
for
ways
to
cut
costs
to
kind
of
manage
through
this
situation,
one
of
the
obvious
ones
that
comes
up
is
real
estate
and
we're
now
having
this
great
awakening
to
the
reality
of
decoupling,
geography
and
results,
you
can
de-risk
your
business
if
you're
not
tied
to
a
specific
geographic
region.
We've
seen
some
hot
spots
like
Milan
businesses
in
Milan
have
suffered
even
more
than
other
places,
has
nothing
to
do
with
their
business
fundamentals.
A
It's
just
because
they
happen
to
be
based
in
the
law
and
so
you're.
Seeing
this
is
an
opportunity
to
de-risk
your
business
by
decoupling,
the
geography
side
of
it
I
actually
mentioned
one
other
thing.
There's
a
there's
been
a
recent
survey
from
Gartner
and
they
surveyed
over
300,
CFOs,
globally
and
74
percent
of
them
said
that
they
intend
to
shift
some
of
their
workforce
to
remote
permanently
through
this,
and
this
is
really
amazing
to
me
because
again,
this
is
a
suboptimal
situation.
A
This
is
not
an
ideal
time
or
place
or
scenario
or
environment
to
just
thrust
everyone
into
remote,
and
even
despite
that,
businesses
are
still
seeing
the
benefits
and
even
despite
having
to
be
at
home
and
essentially
double
duty.
As
a
home
school
teacher
for
parents
with
kids
they're
still
seeing
the
benefits
of
not
having
the
commute
and
more
time
with
family
and
more
time
to
I
am
optimistic
about
the
future.
I
think
that
more
positives
will
be
seen
of
this
than
negatives,
but
I
don't
think
work
will
ever
look
quite
the
same.
B
Let's
talk
about
that
a
little
bit
more,
what
you
were
just
saying
around,
you
know
how
businesses
are
looking
at.
You
know
what
they
can
change
or
shift
for
the
longer
term,
and
also
a
lot
of
people
are
just
talking
about
business
continuity
right
now.
Can
we
talk
a
little
bit
more
about
how
remote
work
can
kind
of
support
business
resiliency?
You
talked
about
real
estate
a
little
bit.
You
know
what
are
some
other
ways
it.
A
The
mothership
have
the
centralization,
but
they're,
realizing
that,
while
there
are
some
perks
to
that,
there's
a
lot
of
risk
that
comes
with
that
and
this
this
Cove
in
1914
the
reality
that
we
were
always
a
lot
closer
to
being
able
to
function.
Well,
as
a
society
remotely
than
we
ever
gave
ourselves
credit
for
ubiquitous
LTE
laptops
that
can
last
all
day.
Essentially
anyone
in
the
working
world
right
now
even
communicates
with
their
family
through
text
message,
you
don't
necessarily.
B
A
A
I
think
a
lot
of
people
thought
and
frankly,
we've
companies
have
been
remote
for
a
long
time.
You
have
executives
that
are
on
planes
every
week
when
you're
working
on
a
presentation,
deck
30,000
feet
above
the
Atlantic
you're
working
remotely.
You
might
not
call
it
that
but
you're
working
remotely
and
then,
when
you
land
in
an
office
in
London,
but
you're
communicating
with
staff
back
in
Phoenix
your
remote
to
each
other.
So
this
has
been
happening
for
a
really
long
time.
There's
just
been
this
awakening
of
okay.
We
can.
B
Talk
about
that
a
little
bit
more,
the
idea
around
you
know
a
lot
of
companies
are
actually
remote,
but
they
might
not
see
themselves
that
way.
So
there
is
this
Atlantic
article
recently
and
someone
was
quoted
in
there
saying
well,
yeah
remote
work
isn't
necessarily
working
for
people
right
now,
because
we
spent
the
last
120
years
learning
how
people
can
be
productive
in
an
office.
B
So
you
know,
and
that
article
also
talks
about
how
remote
work
is,
is
a
different
kind
of
work
and
people
have
to
learn
like
new
habits,
new
ways
of
working
new
ways
of
tracking
productivity.
All
of
that,
so
you
know
this
sounds
like,
and
you
know,
we've
we've
just
talked
about
this
like
there's,
this
big
kind
of
mindset,
shift
or
attitude
shift
that
needs
to
take
place
in
the
way
that
people
kind
of
look
at
work
within
this
existing
framework.
A
It's
a
very
interesting
topic.
The
first
thing
I
would
say
is
acknowledge
to
yourself
that
it's
different,
so
I
think
there's
this
fallacy
that
having
an
entire
team
or
a
company
working
from
home,
it's
actually
the
same
as
it's
always
been.
It's
just
that
your
desk
looks
a
little
different
and
I
here's.
A
What
I
liken
it
to
if
you're
driving
a
vehicle
with
the
steering
wheel
on
the
left
side,
and
you
just
magically
switch
countries
and
you're
still
in
the
same
car,
but
you
have
to
drive
on
the
opposite
side
of
the
road
it's
familiar,
but
still
oddly
difficult
you're,
not
quite
sure
why
it
still
doesn't
feel
quite
in
sync:
it's
like
you're
still
driving
the
car,
but
the
the
rules
of
the
road
have
changed
quite
a
bit
and
everyone
around
you,
that's
in
this
new
country.
They
seem
to
just
get
it.
A
It's
like
well
they've
been
motoring
around
on
these
streets.
Why
am
I
the
only
one
that
can't
quite
figure
this
out
I
think
remote
is
is
much
like
that
so
I
think
the
first
thing
leaders
need
to
do
is
understand
that
you're
you're
thrusting,
where
your
team
has
been
thrust
into
this
situation
without
everyone's
desk,
looks
different.
Everyone's
access
and
connectivity
is
different.
There's
a
lot
more
variables
now
so
you're
gonna
have
to
communicate
more
than
you've
ever
done
in
the
past
and,
more
importantly,
you're
going
to
need
to
be
more
receptive
to
feedback.
A
Then
you've
ever
been
in
the
past,
because
everyone
has
different
blockers.
What
used
to
be
uniform
or
what
you
thought
was
uniform
is
no
longer
the
case,
and
so
it's
there's
a
higher
burden
than
ever
now.
I
think
on
managers
to
be
open
to
feedback,
be
receptive
to
feedback
and
help
unblock
and
solve
challenges
that
are
new
to
the
remote
world.
A
Want
to
mention
one
other
one
other
thing
quickly
on
the
what
we're
used
to
I
had
this
conversation
with
someone
the
other
day
even
from
a
young
age
in
education,
were
put
into
classrooms
and
we're
taught
how
to
function
in
this
box
essentially
grade
school
is
office,
work
for
kids,
but
no
one
ever
teaches
us
how
to
do
school
at
home.
It's
like
here's,
some
homework
figure
it
out
and
we
all
just
kind
of
like
fumble
through
it
at
home.
No
one
really
has
any
guardrails
around
it.
A
A
Levels
of
what
I
call
remote,
fluency,
different
levels
of
appreciation
and
understanding
and
comfortability
with
doing
something
outside
of
the
workspace,
then
there's
the
reality
that
not
everyone's
home
is
equally
amenable
to
being
an
ideal
workspace.
So
it
get
lab
people
opt
into
this
and
they're
able
to
expense
their
home
office
and
set
their
home
office
up
to
be
economic
and
comfortable,
and
so
we
have
pretty
amazing
workspaces.
A
I
would
say
better
than
what
you
would
find
in
the
office,
but
for
someone
that
on
Monday
was
working
in
the
office
and
now
day,
henceforth
they're
working
in
their
one-bedroom
apartment
with
their
spouse,
with
their
kids
with
essentially
one
room
for
everything
to
happen.
Obviously,
they're
going
to
be
at
a
disadvantage,
even
if
you
carve
out
some
sort
of
curtain
off
space
where
they
can
work,
it's
not
going
to
be
ideal,
and
so
productivity
metrics
have
to
change.
A
Expectations
have
to
change
the
flow
of
communication
and
feedback
has
to
change
it's
not
the
same,
and
not
everyone
is
on
the
same
playing
field
and
I.
Think
it's
it's
important
for
leaders
to
understand
that
and
do
whatever
they
can
to
level
the
playing
field.
In
that
instance,
I
just
gave
even
being
more
lenient
on
expensing,
like
let
people
expense
a
nice
keyboard
and
a
secondary,
monitor
and
noise
cancelling
headphones.
So
they
can
actually
be
productive
and
do
work.
B
Brought
up
a
great
point
more
broadly
there
too
about
you
know
there
are
a
lot
of
I
guess,
traditional
frameworks
that
we
work
in
and
operate
in,
and
that
that
people
maybe
need
to
get
more
comfortable
with
working
outside
those.
Whether
it's
work,
whether
it's
pay
day,
you
know
getting
paid
every
two
weeks
or
on
the
same
frequency
versus
you
know,
with
the
rise
of
the
big
economy
and
other
types
of
workers,
you
know,
there's
an
expectation
to
be
paid
differently
or
we're
talking
about
learning.
B
Now
that
suddenly
we
find
ourselves
not
with
kids
not
being
able
to
go
to
school
or
like
the
need
for
upscaling
like
how
do
we
do
that
differently?
So
this
is
this?
Is
you
know
a
big
kind
of
shift
that
to
your
point?
People
need
to
maybe
open
their
minds
to
a
little
bit
or
try
and
get
more
comfortable
with
this
yeah.
A
Well,
one
of
the
biggest
tips
I
have
is
is
to
just
get
comfortable
with
the
uncomfortability
there's
as
much
to
unlearn
about
working
as
there
is
to
learn
when
you're
coming
into
a
remote
environment
and
the
tighter
you
try
to
cling
on
to
what
worked
in
the
office
and
the
more
closely
you
try
to
press
copy
from
the
office
norms
and
paste
them
into
a
virtual
world.
The
worse
it's
going
to
go
and
I
will
say
there
are
different
phases
of
remote.
The
skeuomorphism.
A
The
kind
of
copy
and
pasting
is
phase
one
where
you're
just
trying
to
make
it
work.
You
had
a
meeting
in
the
office,
let's
try
to
have
that
same
meeting
virtually
and
but
but
the
point
is
that
you
should
strive
to
get
beyond
that.
You
should
strive
to
move
to
a
more
a
synchronous
model
and
a
model
where
there's
more
transparency
and
I
think
this
is
a
huge
one
in
the
office.
Transparency
is
not
only
not
necessary
for
some
things.
It's
actually
actively
avoided
for
many
things.
A
A
An
engineering
knows
what
HR
people
ops
is
aiming
for,
and
if
that
spooks
you,
you
really
need
to
get
introspective
and
ask
why
why
you're
one
company
you're
all
marching
towards
one
common
goal
and
if
there's
some
fear
in
transparency,
it
might
be
because
you
need
to
work
some
things
out
like
that.
What
you're
feeling
is
accountability
and
on
the
whole
remote
forces
you
to
be
a
lot
more
disciplined,
then
you
otherwise
can
get
away
with,
and
the
important
point
there
is.
Every
company
should
be
this
discipline.
A
It's
just
that
remote
makes
it
clearing
lis
obvious
that
you
have
no
other
choice,
so
I
think
companies
that
wrap
their
arms
around
that
instead
of
run
away
from
that
and
this
time,
even
if
they
do
transition
back
into
the
office,
there'll
be
a
more
disciplined
company
with
better
communication
and
people
will
feel
more
aligned
and
feel
more
tightly
integrated
as
a
team.
Even
if
some
of
them
stay
outside
of
the
office.
I
think.
B
That's
a
great
takeaway
and
building
on
that
a
little
more
tactically
I!
Guess
if
you
were,
if
you
were
speaking
to
a
leader
or
you
know,
a
person
leading
a
remote
team,
whether
they're
brand
new
to
the
game
or
they've
been
doing
it
for
a
while,
like
what
skills
would
you
recommend
that
they
develop?
A
Especially
for
people
that
are
used
to
kind
of
a
command
and
control
type
of
operations
in
an
office,
the
first
would
be
reevaluated
how
clear
the
metrics
are
for
your
direct
reports.
So
I
would
immediately
have
one-on-ones
with
all
of
my
newly
remote
team
members
and
ask
them
straight
up.
Do
you
understand
what
success
looks
like
because
the
funny
thing
about
working
in
office
is
praises
and
promotion
can
be
very
subjective?
You
can
kind
of
get
away
with
not
really
expecting
a
certain
metric
or
take
away
from
someone
in
a
remote
setting
you
can.
A
You
can
only
judge
them
on
results,
trying
to
judge
them
on
our
spin
or
like
how
many
hours
they
spent
in
front
of
a
webcam
is
just
absurd,
and
it's
glaringly
obvious
that
it's
absurd,
so
step
number
one
is
as
a
manager
have
those
one-on-ones
and
ask
your
teammates.
Do
you
know
what
I
need
of
you
and
if
they
say
no,
that's
on
the
manager
to
get
more,
articulate
and
more
prescriptive
about
what
those
objectives
and
key
results
are.
The
second
thing
is
to
lead
with
empathy.
A
I
think
in
these
times
of
crisis
is
very
easy
to
just
default,
to
let's
implement
more
roles.
Let's
put
more
guardrails
around
I
need
to
have
some
sort
of
construct
of
of
command
in
this
situation,
but
you
have
to
realize
that
people
have
a
lot
more
going
on
right
now
than
work
a
lot
and
the
best
leaders
are
gonna,
be
the
ones
that
start
conversations
with
that:
hey
how's,
the
family
are
things
okay
and
after
that's
talked
about,
then.
A
Let's
talk
about
work
because
remote,
combined
with
the
situation
we're
in
makes
more
clear
than
ever
that
we're
humans
first
and
colleagues.
Second,
and
a
good
way
to
turn
a
worker
off
is
to
just
not
recognize
that
I
think.
The
final
thing
is,
if
you've
been
in
a
command-and-control
type
of
situation,
it's
very
difficult
to
switch
your
brain
to
servant
leadership,
but
I
recommend
to
newly
remote
leaders.
A
One
of
the
first
things
you
should
do
is
simply
open
your
arms
as
wide
as
you
can
and
accept
feedback,
because
again,
everyone
is
in
a
different
spot
right
now.
You
think
you
know
what's
going
on,
but
you
actually
don't
and
the
only
way
you're
going
to,
but
a
clear
picture
of,
what's
going
on,
is
to
ask
people
how
it's
going
and
I
advise
people
to
take
as
much
of
that
feedback
as
you
can,
because
you'll
probably
see
some
common
threads.
A
B
A
To
exist
that
we
don't
have
already
so
those
are
the
top
three
things
and
then
you'll
you'll
learn
from
there.
It's
important
to
remember
that
remote
is
a
journey,
not
a
binary
switch
that
you
just
flip
on
and
off
you'll
get
better
at
it.
Just
continue
to
iterate
and
tell
your
team
that
tell
your
team
that
hey
we're
remote
today,
but
we
weren't
yesterday,
so
we're
probably
not
going
to
be
excellent
at
it
right
away
and
for
high-performing
teams.
B
Think
those
are
some
great
action
items
for
leaders
far
and
wide
and
in
many
different
roles
as
well.
Let
me
ask
you
my
last
question:
people
likely
asked
you
a
lot
of
questions
about
remote
work
and
I
have
read
a
lot
of
the
all
remote
guides.
So
you
note
in
there
you
know.
Typically,
we
get
asked
this
a
lot,
but
what's
a
question
that
people
don't
ask
you,
but
you
think
they
should
ask
you
about
remote
work.
A
A
Even
if
it's
clearly
not
the
ideal
situation
at
home,
they're
just
trying
to
make
it
work,
whatever
rigidity
they
were
used
to,
they
want
to
maintain
that
rigidity
here
and
I
just
want
people
to
give
themselves
permission
to
not
do
that
you're
in
a
whole
different
universe.
Now
you
don't
have
to
commute
anymore,
you
don't
have
the
same
stigma
and
expectations
anymore.
A
You
can
potentially
shift
your
day
to
work
during
your
peak
productivity
hours
and
that
opens
up
hours
that
have
never
been
accessible
to
you
before
to
do
other
things
in
life
with
other
people,
maybe
people
that
you've
forgotten
about
because
the
times
never
were
compatible.
It's
the
ultimate
blank
slate.
It's
the
ultimate
life
cheat
code
and
I.
Don't
think
enough!
A
People
give
themself
permission
to
recognize
that
there's
this
kind
of
remoter
skill,
where
you
feel
like
you
need
to
over
produce
as
a
remote
employee
to
compensate
for
the
fact
you
don't
have
to
run
the
commute
rat
race
anymore,
but
you
got
to
remember.
The
commute
was
never
the
employer's
to
begin
with.
That
was
always
your
time,
so
you
can
do
something
with
it.
You
can
be
innovative
with
it.
You
can
plan
something
with
it,
and
so
that's
that's.
A
What
I
wish
more
people
would
ask
me
is
hey
what
what
could
life
look
like
if
I
never
had
to
commute
again
if
I
did
not
have
to
be
in
this
city
for
work?
What
could
life
look
like
I
think,
there's
a
lot
of
power
in
that.
If
you
have
millions
of
people
asking
that
at
the
same
time,
and
for
me
that's
part
of
the
the
excitement-
that's
coming
from
this
I'm,
seeing
people
rally
around
community
in
a
way
that
I
haven't
seen
in
a
really
long
time.
A
Remote
communities
are
sprouting
up
everywhere,
we're
recognizing
overnight
that
you
don't
need
face-to-face
networking
that
people
are
people,
no
matter
the
medium
in
which
you
meet
them.
It's
exciting
I
think
that
we
will,
as
a
society,
start
to
tap
into
each
other's
imagination
coming
out
of
this,
and
I
actually
think
it'll
make
businesses
stronger.
We've
all
had
situations
where
we
go
off
on
some
vacation
and
we
have
the
best
work
idea.
We've
ever
had
without
ever
even
thinking
about
work
that
shouldn't
be
a
once-a-year
thing.
That
can
be
an
ongoing
thing.
A
A
Absolutely
absolutely
I
mean
leaders.
Are
people
too?
What
could
you
do
as
a
leader?
How
could
you
empower
your
team
to
connect
and
build
bonds
in
ways
that
you
couldn't
do
before
to
me?
It
all
comes
down
to
the
scarcity
versus
abundance
mindset.
If
you
get
thrust
into
remote
and
you
focus
on
what
can't
we
do
because
we
don't
have
access
to
the
office,
that's
the
only
thing.
A
You'll
see
that's
the
lens
in
which
you're
looking
through
everything
with
or
you
can
say
what
opportunities
do
we
have
to
do
things
different
to
be
more
innovative
because
we
don't
have
the
burden
of
the
office.
We
don't
have
the
burden
of
the
commute.
We
don't
have
the
burden
of
you
have
to
look
a
certain
way
when
you
walk
into
the
office.
That's
the
right
question
to
ask
I
hope
leaders
once
things
are
stabilized,
that's
the
second
order
thinking.
Yes,
let's
focus
on
what
we
can
do
now
now
that
we
have
some
continuity
in
place.