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From YouTube: Interim Joint Committee on Education (11-15-21)
Description
This is a re-upload of the Monday, November 15th IJC Meeting on Education. The original live-stream had technical difficulties
A
She
made
by
senator
west-
and
there
was
a
second
by
representative
killian
timoney.
All
members
be
seduced
by
saying
aye
those
opposed
minutes
pass.
We
have
a
very
robust
agenda
for
today,
and
the
first
thing
on
the
gen
is
something
that's
not
new
to
the
kentucky.
Legislature
is
the
save
the
children,
and
I
would
like
to
ask
for
those
that
are
presenting
this
morning
to
make
their
way
to
the
to
the
table.
B
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
members
of
the
committee.
I've
said
this
on
quite
a
few
occasions
that
I'm
one
of
the
historians
or
older
people
here
and
I'm
actually
looking
in
the
room,
and
I
don't
think
there's
a
single
person
in
the
room
that
has
actually
served
longer
in
either
chamber
than
I
have.
B
Mark
shriver
is
here
with
me
with
madison,
who
is
a
young
student
from
the
whitley
county
school
system.
As
chairman
huff
said,
you
know
it's
been
a
great
experience.
You
meet
a
lot
of
people
back
in
2000
and
six
five
there's
something
that's
way
back
there
get
this
old.
You
forget
how
many
years
ago
it's
been,
I
had
a
unique
opportunity
to
hear
about
save
the
children
and
what
they
were
going
to
do
or
try
to
do,
and
I
want
to
tell
you
about
the
seriousness
of
this
since
that
period
of
time.
B
I've
gotten
to
know
mark
shriver
very
well,
and
I
think
it's
kind
of
unique
and
one
of
the
experiences
that
you
have
is
that
most
people
probably
consider
me
a
pretty
staunch
republic
knowing
who
mark
is
and
his
family.
I
think
they
would
probably
be
considered
pretty
staunch
democrats,
but
this
is
an
area
that
we
got
together
on
years
ago,
that
there
was
no
difference
of
opinion
about
how
this
group
could
help
in
the
educational
realm
by
doing
supplemental
services.
B
There
was
another
instance,
and
I
said
if
this
is
the
group
that
save
the
children
is
hiring
people
like
this,
I'm
adamantly
opposed.
I
got
a
call
from
mark
that
weekend
having
never
met
him
before
asking
me
what
the
problem
was.
I
explained
it
that
person
was
no
longer
in
their
employee
by
monday
they're
serious
about
this.
B
They
generally
match
it
with
10
to
12
of
their
own
that
they
do
in
private
fundraising,
as
I've
said
over
this
period
of
time,
it's
been
a
wonderful
experience
to
get
to
know.
Mark
he's
been
with
me
he's
traveled
with
me
when
I'm
in
dc,
we
have
lunch
or
dinner
together
to
talk
about
educational
issues,
and
it
has
been
a
true
pleasure
to
have
gotten
to
know,
mark
and
the
whole
save
the
children
group
and
see
what
they
have
done
in
the
state
of
kentucky.
B
C
C
I'm
joined
by
alyssa
taylor,
who
runs
our
programs
in
kentucky,
and
I
was
a
member
of
the
legislature
way
back
when
and
and
heather
stewart
is
joining
us
from
whitley
county
as
well,
and
I
know
how
precious
this
time
is.
So.
Thank
you
very
much
for
having
me
here.
I
do.
I
just
want
to
make
one
quick
correction
from
senator
cyrus.
We
match
the
money
that
comes
from
the
state
legislature
14
to
one
it's
actually
not
10
or
12.
C
It's
14
matched
in
here
and
we
do
focus,
as
the
senator
said,
on
early
childhood
education
and
to
really
focus
in
on
that,
and
when
I
came
on
board
some
17
18
years
ago.
We
did
refocus
it
because
when,
when
I
was
in
the
legislature
in
maryland,
we
understood
the
importance
of
investing
early
and
the
brain
growth
in
those
first
five
years
of
life
up
through
and
including
third
grade.
C
If
a
kid
is
not
reading
at
grade
level
by
the
end
of
third
grade
that
child
in
many
cases
is
going
to
struggle
through
elementary
school
high
school
and
beyond.
So
it's
a
huge
investment
center
stivers
encouraged
us
to
be
focused.
We
did
and
we
also
fired
our
evaluation
company
because
they
were
not
producing
data
that
we
could
produce
to
legislatures
to
governors,
secretaries
of
education
acro
across
the
country
that
showed
whether
the
monies
that
you
all
are
investing
really
make
a
difference
in
children's
lives.
C
C
We
now
are
doing
both
food,
which
alyssa
will
walk
you
through
and
early
childhood
education
services
as
well,
and
we're
so
proud
to
be
in
14
counties
employing
almost
500
kentucky
kentuckians,
kentuckians,
yeah
kentuckians,
not
only
in
rural
kentucky,
but
in
berea
and
in
lexington
as
well.
We've
moved
a
lot
of
our
functions
from
save
the
children
down
in
connecticut
to
here
in
kentucky,
because
this
really
is
our.
C
If
you
will
home
away
from
home
and
alyssa
will
go
through
some
of
those
details.
I'm
joined
as
the
senator
said
by
madison,
who
is
a
sixth
grader
at
whitley
intermediate
right
and
she's,
going
to
put
her
microphone
on
and
she's
going
to
tell
us
a
little
bit
about
the
programs,
because
I
can
tell
you
about
them,
but
it's
kind
of
boring.
So
you
participated
in
the
in
school
and
after
school
programs
that
we
run
for
when
you
were
in
third
grade
right.
Yes,
and
did
you
like
him.
D
C
Okay,
well
now
I
don't
know
whether
that's
the
first
time
we've
ever
exaggerated
in
the
in
the
frankfurt
legislation.
Did
you
really
like
a
murray?
You
just
saying
that
cause
heather
told
you
to
say
it.
I
liked
him,
you
did
okay,
and
what
do
you
like
you
like
rea,
so
we
do
math
and
reading
right?
Yes,
and
do
you
like
one
more
than
the
other?
Yes
math,
better,
you
like
math,
better
than
reading?
Oh
my
god,
I
can't
stand
math
right.
C
D
C
Right,
okay!
Well,
I
didn't
get
a
lot
of
hundreds
when
I
was
in
sixth
grade,
so
that's
pretty
good
right
and
then
so
you
we're
dealing
with
in
in
whitley
county
and
in
the
other
13
counties
we
work
in
right.
Alyssa
is
students
that
are
behind
in
first
second
or
third
grade,
so
you
were
a
little
bit
behind,
but
by
reading
those
books
during
the
school
day
and
then
after
school,
two
you're
reading
books
walk
everybody
through
what
happens
after
school.
D
D
C
C
So
what
we
were
we're
trying
to
focus
in
on
giving
kids
healthy
food
like
carrots,
broccoli,
they
can't
here
yet,
yes,
okay,
so
we
were
running
those
pro.
We
run
those
programs
during
the
school
day
to
pull
kids
out
that
are
struggling
on
school
day
and
they're
tested
as
you'll
hear
from
the
list
at
the
beginning
of
the
school
year.
So
you
know
exactly
what
level
of
book
you're
reading
at
right
yeah,
so
some
of
your
friends
might
be
reading
different
books
than
you
were.
C
And
you
could
tell
that
by
your
test.
Is
that
right,
yeah
and
then
so
and
then
you
would
would
you
when
you
got
better
and
better
you'd,
read
different
books
that
are
more
challenging
and
you
take
the
quizzes
yeah
gotcha.
So
we
are
running
those
programs
during
the
school
day
and
were
you
in
the
summer
program
as
well
yeah
and
what
happens
tell
them
a
little
bit
about
what
happens
in
the
summer
time
in.
C
Do
you
like
taking
tests
in
the
middle
of
the
summer?
No,
no
okay,
but
what
we're
talking
about
is
education
right,
yeah,
and
that
is
part
of
what
we're
we're
trying
to
make
it
fun.
So
there
are
different
ways.
So
when
you
did
the
independent
reading
you
and
then
would
you
play
games
that
are
literacy
games,
yeah.
E
C
So
what
we're
trying
to
do
members
of
the
legislature
is
pull
kids
out
during
the
school
day,
with
obviously
a
relationship
with
the
school
which
alyssa
will
walk
you
through
then,
after
school
and
in
the
summertime
supplementing
that
education
work,
and
that
happened
during
covid
in
unique
and
different
ways.
It
happened
obviously
before
covid
and
it's
happening
in
those
14
counties
and
the
results
are
really
really
exciting.
Chair,
wise
and
sheriff,
as
alyssa
will
walk
you
through
are
profoundly
positive
despite
covid,
and
it's
because
of
the
work
of
of
heather.
C
That
students
like
madison,
are
getting
these
services
really
all
year
long,
both
in
the
school
year,
but
also
in
the
summer
as
well
alyssa.
Do
you
want
to
walk?
Thank
you
very
much.
Is
there
anything
that
we
missed
or
that
you
wanted
to
say?
No,
was
I
very
good?
I
was
okay.
Thank
you.
Nothing
else.
Okay,
she's
done
you're
on
alyssa.
Tell
us
a
little
bit
about
what
save
does
in
the
results.
Please.
F
Sure
I
want
to
thank
you
all
for
your
time.
I'm
from
estell
county
born
and
raised
appreciate
the
work
that
we
get
to
do
in
rural.
I
feel
very
honored
to
work
for
save
the
children
and
give
back
to
these
small
communities
like
I
grew
up
in
so
at
save
the
children
we
work
in
with
71
schools
across
14
counties
and
we
are
true
partner
to
the
school
district.
F
F
So
the
coordinators
that
are
hired
to
work
in
the
school
districts
are
employees
of
the
district,
so
they're
local
community
members
who
are
engaged
with
the
schools.
They
know
the
communities,
they
know
the
families.
We
provide
these
additional
resources,
training
and
materials
to
help
these
children
get
up
to
grade
level
so
that
they
don't
continue
to
fall
behind.
We
know
that
we
they
really
need
to
be
reading
at
grade
level
by
third
grade,
to
continue
on
a
successful
trajectory.
F
So
talk
a
little
bit
about
the
programs.
They
are
evidence-based
components
read
aloud,
guided
independent
reading
and
heather
can
talk
a
little
bit
more
about
those
as
well,
but
throughout
the
pandemic
we
realized
we
needed
to
adapt,
and
so
that's
what
we
did.
We
know
that
many
of
the
school
doors
were
closed.
They
were
offering
virtual
classrooms,
and
so
what
we
focused
on
was
growth,
creativity
and
continued
outreach.
F
So
creativity
was
how
do
we
get
resources
into
the
hands
of
kids
and
families?
We
know
that
parents
were
also
serving
in
the
role
as
teacher
during
that
time,
and
so
we
provided
support.
We
called
them
on
the
phone.
We
worked
with
the
school
district
to
identify
families
who
needed
some
additional
help,
as
well
as
the
participants
in
our
program,
and
we
just
had
continued
outreach.
We
offered
zoom
programs,
so
one-on-one
in
small
group
read-alouds
with
children
to
make
sure
that
they
were
continuing
to
read
books
throughout
the
day.
F
C
C
Okay,
so
there
wasn't
a
loss,
there
was
actually
a
gain.
What
we
had
done
prior
to
the
pandemic
is
average
roughly
seven
months
of
additional
academic
growth
over
the
regular
school
year
right.
It
dropped
down
from
seven
months
of
additional
growth
down
to
two
months,
but
they
didn't
slide
backwards,
and
that
is
not
true,
as
you'll
hear,
from
heather
of
students
who
didn't
participate
in
the
program,
and
that
is
really
critical.
C
It
is
actually
having
an
impact,
and
I
just
want
to
sorry
to
cut
you
off
there.
But
it's
just
to
re-emphasize
that,
because
you
know
I
flew
down
from
washington,
this
is
really
exciting
stuff
I
mean
the
schools
are
struggling.
Our
kids
are
struggling
in
schools
in
maryland
in
our
home.
This
is
through
her
creativity
and
the
staff
on
the
ground,
all
of
whom
are
from
kentucky.
All
of
them
are
locally
hired,
all
of
them
who
are
trained
by
save
the
children
and
evaluate
it
independently.
F
We
incentivized
children
to
complete
their
daily
activity
sheets
by
offering
rewards
for
those
that
completed
for
each
week.
Their
name
was
entered
into
a
drawing
for
a
prize
just
continuing
to
think
outside
the
box
and
working
weekly
with
our
school
districts
to
see
how
many
kids
were
showing
up.
How
many
were
you
hearing
back
from
who
has
fallen
off
the
radar
and
making
those
phone
calls
and
driving
out
to
homes
to
make
sure
that
they
were
being
served?
F
So
now
I'd
like
to
introduce
you
to
heather
stewart
heather
is
a
district
instructional
coach
for
whitley
county
school
district,
she's
well
versed
in
all
things,
programmatic.
She
also
supports
the
save
the
children,
programs
and
she's
going
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
what
she's
seen
in
whitley
county,
specifically
with
our
programs.
G
Throughout
the
entire
year,
like
she
said
they
work
in
our
community.
Save
the
children
does
every
day
with
birth
age.
Actually,
when
they're
pregnant,
we
start
save
the
children
start
serving
families,
and
we
start
targeting
those
girls
who
may
struggle
and
they
want
to
help
their
children,
but
they
don't
know
how
to
teach
their
children
so
save
the
children,
trains,
people
in
our
schools.
We
actually
have
about
35
whitley
countians
employed
through
the
funds
that
save
the
children
for
rides
in
whitley
county
full-time
staff.
G
G
But
there
was
a
gap
we
saw
that
they
weren't
getting
preschools
say
the
children
listened
to
us,
and
now
they
provide
kindergarten
readiness,
because
a
lot
of
our
parents
don't
know
what
really
what
kindergarten
is
and
what
they
need
say.
The
children
provides
that
for
us
they
do
amazing
activities
weekly
things
they
do
the
drop-offs
just
like
she
was
talking
about.
Then
we
also
have
in-school
reading
and
now
thank
you
save
the
children.
We
recently
added
math
that
senator
stivers.
G
We
appreciate
that
save
the
children
funds
all
that
it's
an
amazing
math
program
that
we
are
now
doing
with
that's
hands-on
fun,
getting
those
kids
brains
that
are
behind
you
have
to
get
kids
who
are
behind
to
love
it.
That's
the
only
way
you
can
ever
teach
them.
If
they
don't
love
something.
If
they
can't
visualize,
they
can't
work
with
it.
They,
they
won't
learn,
say
the
children
understands
that
they
they
call
this
during
the
pandemic
literally
every
week
and
say
what
do
you
want
now?
What
do
you
need
now?
G
They
listen
to
us
and
I
don't
know
how
many
of
you've
ever
worked
with
grants
or
failure
grants.
That's
not
what
happens.
They
tell
you
what
they
want
you
to
do
and
you
have
to
do
it.
That's
not
what
say
the
children
does
for
us
say
the
children
ask
us
what
we
need
and
they
help
us
fix
that
need
in
our
district.
G
Our
children
live
in
an
area
that
did
not
have
internet,
they
didn't
have
cell
phone
service
say
the
children
helped
us
provide
transportation
for
the
food
for
the
resources,
the
packets
and
handed
those
out.
I'm
going
to
get
emotional
because
our
kids
live
in
areas.
They
don't
have
this.
They
don't
see
this
save
the
children
and
our
superintendent
worked
so
that
families
were
provided
food
every
day.
Kids
would
wait
hours
to
come
to
get
the
food
for
two
days
and
the
activities.
Let's
say
the
children
sent
them.
G
This
was
a
time
they
weren't
seeing
anybody
else,
because
they
don't
have
internet,
they
don't
have
cell
phone.
They
don't
have
anybody
that
cares,
but
during
the
pandemic
they
saw
that
say
the
children
cared
about
them
and
whitley
county
schools
cared
about
them
and
now
that
we're
back
in
session
save
the
children
is
continuing
to
support
us
and
all
the
counties.
Well,
however,
we
need
it
so
that
those
kids
who
are
behind
they
aren't
going
to
be
behind
anymore
they're
going
to
catch
up.
G
So
I
am
so
thankful
for
the
time
that
you've
given
us,
but
I
also
want
you
to
really
think
about
what
they
can
do
for
our
schools
and
if
you've
ever
worked
in
a
school,
you
know
how
hard
it
is
if
you've
ever
had
a
child
go
to
school.
You
know
how
hard
it
is.
So
I
really
appreciate
your
time
and
I
look
forward
to
working
with
you
on
more.
C
Thank
you.
It's
beautiful
we're
happy
to
take
any
questions.
I'm
sure
I
talked
too
long.
I
just
want
to
say
one
last
thing:
when
heather
talks
about
the
importance
of
math,
that
was
feedback,
we
were
focused
really
heavily
on
literacy
and
we
heard
from
the
senators
divers
and
from
other
folks
across
the
country
and
across
kentucky
about
the
importance
of
doing
math.
So
we
broaden
the
programs,
and
I
will
say
senator
steir
has
made
reference
to
the
fact
that
he's
a
republican
and
I'm
a
democrat.
C
C
A
D
Thank
you
co-chair
wise.
I
just
want
to
welcome
madison
lunsford,
I've
known
madison,
most
of
her
life,
and
I
want
to
and
she's
a
fine
young
lady.
I
want
to
speak
to
the
passion
and
effectiveness
of
save
the
children
and,
as
I
said,
I've
worked
with
heather,
but
and
this
position
I
hold
now
I've
been
invited
to
their
trainings
and
to
speak
with
the
group
and
the
thing
I
love
about.
It
is
they're.
D
They
allow
their
data
to
guide
their
instruction
and
then
the
data
drives
the
theory
that
they
put
into
practice
and
they've
worked
tirelessly
to
provide
a
print
rich
environment
for
our
district
to
the
younger
children.
That
would
never
have
this
opportunity
as
well
as
nutrition,
so
I
just
can't
say
enough
about
the
effectiveness
and
the
passion
that
all
of
these
people
have
working
to
to
give
hope
and
increasing
the
content
of
what
these
children
are
receiving.
So
thank
you
very
much.
D
Yes,
thank
you.
So
my
first
comment
is
for
madison
madison,
I'm
a
special
education,
elementary
teacher
and
I
have
a
subscription
of
spelling
city,
and
so
my
kids
get
to
do
the
same
thing
that
you're
doing
just
to
reiterate
about
the
importance
of
early
childhood
education.
If
you
have
any
doubts,
you
need
to
read
james
heckman
he's
a
nobel
prize
winning
economist
and
the
number
one
dollars
that
we
can
spend
in
public
education
would
be
for
early
childhood.
D
I'm
trying
to
go
really
fast.
Senator
weiss.
I've
been
doing
a
lot
of
research
on
reading
pedagogy
and
if
I
could
I'd
like
to
sit
down
with
someone
from
the
group
to
really
get
in
the
weeds
on
on
what
you're
doing
for
teaching
reading,
if
that
would
be
possible
and
then
finally,
my
question
is:
did
you
when
you,
when
you
assessed
the
progress?
Did
you
control
for
the
fact
that
these
students
were
getting
a
one-on-one
intervention
versus
the
other
children,
not
having
a
pull-up
time
or
a
one-on-one
time?
F
Thank
you
for
your
questions
and
your
support,
and
I
would
be
happy
to
meet
with
you
and
talk
more
about
this.
We're
always
wanting
to
learn
more
and
and
talk
about
our
component
approaches.
We
did
consider
that
in
a
lot
of
the
schools
where
we
work
during
the
pandemic,
we
did
classroom
push-ins
when,
when
that
was
happening,
it
helped
the
teacher.
We
worked
at
the
school
to
figure
out
what
would
be
the
best
approach
when
small
group
sessions
weren't
possible.
So
in
some
cases
there
weren't
that
one-on-one.
C
And
thank
you
for
the
reference,
dr
hackman
who's
from
a
nobel
prize
winning
economist
from
the
university
of
chicago,
which
is
not
a
you
know,
flaming
liberal
organization,
and
he
looked
at
that,
and
the
data
is
very
strong
that
it's
the
best
public
investment
in
high
quality,
early
childhood
education,
and
that,
mr
chairman,
madam
chairman,
is
the
key.
It's
got
to
be
high
quality.
It's
got
to
be
chairman
huff,
as
you
said,
driven
by
the
data,
and
it's
got
to
be
driven
by
evidence-based,
as
both
senators,
divers
and
alyssa
just
spoke
about.
A
H
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
appreciate
all
of
you
being
here
today
madison.
I
realized
it
was
a
great
sacrifice
not
being
in
school
today
to
to
be
with
us,
but
we
appreciate
you
sharing
with
us
about
your
experience
in
these
programs
and
and
I'll
just
have
a
couple
of
brief
questions.
If
I
could
mr
chair
in
these
programs,
are
they
more
intervention
based
or
is
there
a
component
of
tier
one
instruction
involved
in
your
programs.
F
They're,
mostly
intervention
based,
but
we
are
expanding
more
into
the
tier
one
instruction
by
providing
technical
assistance
and
ta
training
and
technical
assistance
to
school-wide
staff
as
well
so
working
with
them,
we're
always
partnering
with
the
school
district.
We
want
to
be
a
true
partner
to
identify
what
works
best
and
some
of
these
components
and
approaches
will
work
for
whole
classrooms.
F
H
H
C
There
isn't
the
civic
infrastructure
of
you,
know:
food
banks,
boys
and
girls
clubs,
libraries
right
a
lot
of
the
you
know:
civic
infrastructure,
isn't
there,
so
we
tried
to
stay
focused
on
that
and
not
be
all
things
to
all
people.
We
have
experimented
in
a
couple
of
urban
settings.
Those
have
gone
well,
but
again
I
don't
know
listen,
you
can
disagree
with
me,
but
you
know
so
we're
looking,
there's
plenty
of
need
in
rural
kentucky,
which
we're
always
happy
to
talk
about
spending
more
of
your
money.
D
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
I
don't
know
if
our
guests
can
speak,
or
this
might
be
the
president's
divers
little
bit
all
the
programs
that
I've
heard
about
that
kind
of
come
together
to
make
save
the
children
the
names
that
I
know
a
lot
of
these
similar
things
by
are
friskies,
and
we
were
talking
about
food.
We're
talking
about
reading
interventions.
Reading
chief
comes
to
mind,
hands
program
talking
about
trying
to
target
mothers
even
pre-birth,
and
so
I
want
to
get
clarification.
Is
this
save
the
children
work
alongside
those
other
programs?
F
So
we'll
work
alongside
those
other
programs
we're
not
a
contractor
providing
those
direct
services.
So
again,
once
I
say
we're
a
partner
to
the
district,
I'm
familiar
with
all
of
those
organizations
and
programs,
and
we
work
with
them,
so
selecting
students
and
our
participants
for
our
programs
are
participants
that
don't
fit
in
with
the
targeted
approach
for
those
other
programs
that
are
offered.
So
we
don't
want
to
duplicate.
What's
already
being
done,
we
want
to
offer
a
side-by-side
approach
to
make
sure
no
children
fall
behind.
G
Typically,
senator
I
also
oversee
the
rta
grants
in
our
district,
and
so
my
job
is
to
make
sure
that
every
child
that
can
fit
into
the
the
either
grant
that
we
have.
We
are
able
to
service
more
children
that
way,
because
both
of
those
are
very
limited.
As
you're
well
aware
of
the
rta,
it's
very
minimal
of
the
number
that
the
one
person
could
serve.
So
what
we?
G
B
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
very
good
question.
You
know
when
this
is
applied.
I've
actually
been
out
with
mark
looking
at
a
young
lady
who
needed
various
types
of
helps
but
didn't
qualify
in
certain
areas,
but
working
with
the
family
resource
centers.
They
had
identified
this
young
student
and
we
went
to
the
home
where
the
father
was
working
in
the
timber,
not
making
a
lot
of
money
mother
trying
to
take
care
of
the
child,
but
didn't
qualify
for
various
things
and
through
save
the
children.
B
I
don't
know
if
you
remember
that
day,
the
young
lady
started
singing
because
of
some
of
the
materials
you
gave
to
them.
This
mother
was
working
with
the
child,
who
was
a
student
in
the
clay
county
system
on
various
reading,
functions,
math
functions
and
finding
gross
motor
skills,
and
they
would
rotate
the
materials.
B
C
And
we're
happy
to
go
through
that
in
more
detail,
because
that's
a
really
important
question
and
when
we've
expanded
to
other
states
when
we
expanded
to
west
virginia
governor
manchin,
now
senator
manchin
governor
manchin
actually
flew
down
to
see
the
programs
because
he
was
very
concerned
about
redundancy
and
overlap
and
didn't
want
to
be
spending
precious
dollars.
Taxpayer
money
on
redundancy
and
we
can
work
through
that
offline
with
you
or
any
members
of
the
committee,
because
we
do
not
do
redundancy
and
we
provide
services
to
a
distinct
niche.
As
senators
divers
just
said.
A
G
E
A
G
Yeah,
so
they,
the
the
students,
get
to
select
the
books
that
they
want
based
on
their
level,
and
we
we
also
use
different
things
that
renaissance
place.
I
don't
know
if
you
are
familiar
with
that.
They
they
tell
us
what
this
the
books
are,
that
most
kids
are
liking,
and
so
those
are
the
books
we
that
we
try
to
select,
say
the
children
also
funds
a
lot
of
our
library
books
that
our
libraries
would
not
be
able
to
have.
H
You
very
much
senator
west.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
Congratulations
on
your
success,
especially
during
covet.
My
question
is
specifically
for
mrs
stewart.
You
mentioned
the
coaching
model
and
you
mentioned
that
you
were
coaching
parents
and
your
people
were
coaching
parents.
Does
that
apply?
Were
you
doing
any
coaching
for
your
teachers
as
well?
Yes,.
G
G
Yes,
I'm
a
district
instructional
coach,
so
I
I
actually
work
birth
to
high
school,
but
everybody
knows
that
my
area
of
emphasis
is
the
elementary
area,
particularly
the
k-3,
but
save
the
children
will
provide
trainings
for
their
staff.
Then
they
also
allow
our
staff
to
attend
those
trainings,
and
then
we
can
train
the
rest
of
the
staff
based
on
what
they've
they've
paid
for
things
for
us
and
those
kind
of
things
and
now
with
the
families.
G
What
we're
trying
to
teach
the
families
is
to
do
is
to
be
their
own
teacher
like
a
lot
of
our
families,
don't
feel
secure
in
knowing
what
the
kids
are
supposed
to
know.
So
they
help
tell
those
parents,
what
are
those
developmental
milestones
and
what
are
the
things
that
they
should
be
doing
at
three
months?
What
should
they
be
doing
at
five
months?
They
come
into
the
home
and
they
demonstrate
it.
They'll
get
on
the
floor
with
them.
They'll
show
those
parents,
they
teach
the
parents.
G
H
C
C
You
it's
a
little
complicated.
It
varies
from
state
to
state
and
and
people
it
gets
confusing
at
times
about,
because
some
of
the
greatest
entrepreneurs
are
in
your
school
system
and
they're
cobbling
together
resources
in
order
to
pay
for
the
services-
and
we
do
you
know.
As
alyssa
said,
our
staff
on
the
ground
actually
works
for
the
county
school
system
right,
but
they
are
paid
for
by
save
the
children,
so
they
have.
C
H
This
question
for
ms
taylor,
you
said
on
two
or
three
occasions
that
you're
providing
services
to
to
kids
who
otherwise
wouldn't
qualify
for
other
services
and
I'm
confused
by
that
a
little
bit.
Could
you
elaborate
on
that
that
eligibility
portion-
and
I
guess
what
I'm
struggling
with,
is
you
say,
there's
no
redundancy,
but
it
looks
like
the
redundancy
is.
If
the
services
are
there,
but
kids
don't
qualify
for
whatever
reason.
So
could
you
elaborate
on
that
that
disqualification
qualification
issue.
F
I
can
senator
and
thank
you
and
I'll
also
let
heather
weigh
on
this
as
well,
since
she
sees
this
and
puts
us
into
practice
in
whitley
county,
but
we
focus
on
children
who
we
really
want
to
go
from
novice
to
proficiency,
so
children
who
aren't
reading
at
grade
level
but
aren't
the
farthest
behind
that,
would
qualify
for
interventions
that
the
school
district
offers.
So
it's
important
for
them
to
get
up
to
grade
level,
but
there
aren't
always
the
resources
in
the
district
to
provide
this
service
to
all
children
and
I'll.
G
G
G
We
have
way
more
than
that
when
we
service
k
through
12
or
k
through
6
in
our
in
our
schools,
so
say
the
children
is
able
we
service,
typically
90
students
a
day
with
save
the
children,
with
the
staff
that
we
have
with
save
the
children
just
in
school.
Then
after
school
we
target
about
50.
We
usually
have
an
average
daily
attendance
about
35
and
after
school
is
open
to
anybody.
H
J
G
C
In
most
cases,
as
economist
heckman
has
pointed
out,
kids
that
are
that
far
behind,
if
they
don't
have
high
quality
care
or
not
or
high
quality
early
education
are
not
going
to
get
to
be
at
reading
at
grade
level
by
the
end
of
third
grade.
So
there
are,
you
know,
almost
every
school
we
work
in
is
100
95
percent
farm
free
and
reduced
meals.
C
A
All
right,
thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
Thank
you.
I
can't
thank
you
all
enough
for
their
excellent
presentation
today
from
all
different
aspects.
Thanks
for
the
job
each
and
every
one
of
you
are
doing
madison.
Thank
you.
For
being
here,
you
probably
had
a
great
learning
experience,
we're
happy
to
provide
a
note
back
to
your
school
principal,
your
teachers,
if
you
need
that
but
excellent
job
today.
Thank
you.
Thank.
A
A
Vice
president
director
of
athletics
at
eastern
kentucky
university,
like
I
said,
we
may
not
be
able
to
fit
everyone
there
at
the
table
if
there's
a
way
that
you
all
could
somewhat
circle
around
the
table.
That
would
be
great
and
looking
directly
in
front
of
me
is
my
good
friend
bart,
harden
and
bart.
I
will
allow
you
to
go
first
and,
however,
you
wish
to
for
the
presentation
to
go
from
there.
It's
up
to
you
friend,.
K
Sure,
thank
you
chairman,
wise
chairman,
huff
and
members
of
the
committee.
We
appreciate
the
opportunity
to
be
here
for
the
record.
I'm
bart
hardin,
I'm
the
director
of
government
relations.
I
think
what
we're
going
to
do,
I'm
going
to
make
a
few
opening
comments
and
shannon
is
and
then
we're
going
to
turn
it
over
to
our
four
campus
experts
we
have
with
us
sounds.
A
K
Ideally,
this
is
an
issue
that
probably
would
be
addressed
by
congress
so
that
all
50
states
are
playing
by
the
same
set
of
rules,
at
least
up.
Until
this
point,
that's
not
happened
and,
as
you
know,
we
are
operating
currently
under
an
executive
order
under
the
permission
of
that
order,
and
we
want
to
thank
the
governor
for
doing
that
and
giving
us
the
ability
back
in
the
summer
to
move
ahead
with
some
semblance
of
nil.
K
As
I
said,
we've
discussed
this
this
year
with
you
and
others
for
the
better
part
of
three
years
and
you've
been
very
patient
with
us
and
given
the
opportunity
for
us
to
provide
you
with
a
draft
piece
of
legislation
that
was
primarily
developed
with
the
university
of
louisville
and
the
university
of
kentucky.
I
will
say
it's
been
shared
with
all
the
comprehensive
universities
as
well.
D
K
Chairman
wise,
I
will
say,
with
with
the
university
of
kentucky,
I
have
our
general
counsel
bill,
throw
and
our
associate
athletics
director
for
compliance
rachel
baker
and
at
your
direction
we're
going
to
try
to
keep
this
at
a
pretty
much
a
30,
000
foot
level
and
answer
what
questions
that
this
committee
might
have.
So
with
that,
I'm
going
to
step
away
from
the.
G
L
Chairman
wise
chair
of
set,
let
me
make
sure
my
microphone's
on
here
huff
committee
members.
First
of
all,
it's
really
a
pleasure
to
be
here,
I'm
a
native
of
lexington
kentucky
and
it's
been
a
pleasure
to
not
only
represent
the
university
of
louisville,
but
also
work
with
my
colleague
bill
through
from
the
university
of
kentucky.
L
L
Second,
it
gives
the
commonwealth's
post-secondary
institutions
the
ability
to
place
reasonable
restrictions
on
that
ability
and
then
third,
it
gives
the
commonwealth
institutions
the
immunity
that
we
need
to
navigate
this
landscape.
I'm
going
to
jump
right
in
section.
100
is
really
just
the
definition
section.
It
lifts
many
of
the
definitions
that
are
already
present
in
the
executive
order
that
we've
been
operating
under
since
last
summer.
A
L
You,
yes
merely
proposed
very
much
draft.
The
definition
section
also
adds
definitions
from
the
existing
krs
regulations
as
they
relate
to
athlete
agents,
so
they
provide
clear
common
sense,
definitions
for
to
name
image
and
likeness,
and
of
course
we
can
answer
any
questions
that
you
might
have
section.
200
really
gets
to
the
main
thrust
of
the
legislation.
It
gives
the
student
athletes
at
post-secondary
institutions
in
the
commonwealth,
the
ability
to
be
compensated
for
name,
image
and
likeness.
It
requires
that
the
compensation
be
equal
to
market
value
and
it
carves
out
some
common
sense
definition.
L
It
eliminates
scholarships
from
the
definition
of
compensation,
it
protects
them
in
the
event
that
they
have
their
athletic
or
their
eligibility
jeopardized
by
name
image
and
like
this
compensation
and
make
sure
that
they
have
protection
for
that.
And
then
it
also
allows
institutions
to
consider,
though,
the
compensation
that
they
have
if
there
are
any
need-based
compensation
or
need-based
scholarships
or
awards,
I'm
going
to
move
to
section
300
and
turn
it
over
now
to
bill.
This
allows
the
institutions
to
place
reasonable
restrictions
on
the
ability
to
earn
compensation.
L
M
We
propose
just
simply
saying
that
universities
may
adopt
whatever
restrictions
that
they
believe
are
reasonable,
as
long
as
they
are
in
writing.
However,
it's
important
to
remember
what
some
of
those
restrictions
that
we
would
regard
as
reasonable
would
be.
One
is
simply
disclosing
the
existence
of
a
name
image
and
likeness
contract
to
the
university.
We
do
this
for,
for
two
reasons,
number
one
to
make
sure
that
the
student
athlete
is
not
entering
into
what
the
ncaa
would
regard
as
a
pay-for-play
situation.
That
is
a
disaster
for
both
the
student
athlete
and
for
the
institution.
M
The
second
aspect
is
to
ensure
that
these
name,
imaging
likeness
activities,
do
not
interfere
with
the
student
athletes,
participation
in
team
activities.
Okay,
we
don't
want
some
someone
saying
well,
I
can't
come
to
practice
today,
because
I
have
have
to
do
an
autograph
signing
or
something
along
those
lines.
M
Also,
we
need
to
be
able
to
have
to
discipline
students
under
team
rules
who
do
not
adhere
to
these
rules
and,
finally,
to
the
extent
that
student
athletes
are
using
the
registered
trademarks
of
the
university
of
kentucky
or
the
university
of
louisville
or
any
of
our
sister
institutions
in
their
efforts
to
promote
name,
image
and
likeness,
they
need
to
get
our
permission
and
we
want
to
make
sure
that
they
obtain
that
permission
and
that
it
is
done
appropriately.
So
that's
what
we
have
in
mind
in
terms
of
reasonable
restrictions.
M
M
We
have
young
men
and
women
who
are
barely
out
of
high
school,
who
are
have
an
opportunity
to
make
a
substantial
amount
of
money
relatively
quickly,
but
they
might
not
know
things
about
contracts
about
the
tax
implications
of
all
this.
So
we
at
the
university
of
kentucky-
and
I
know
also
our
counterparts
at
the
university
of
louisville-
are
engaged
in
that
education
already.
We
believe
that
that
would
be
an
important
part
of
any
bill.
A
I
appreciate
so
much
the
information
you
provided
and
thanks
for
being
here,
and
this
is
a
a
topic
that
just
seems
like
every
week
just
keeps
changing
in
the
news.
It
seems
like
it's
almost
like
technology.
Nil
just
keeps
moving
and
ncaa.
My
personal
opinion
should
have
taken
care
of
this
issue
many
many
years
ago.
We
wouldn't
be
dealing
with
this
well
with
the
kentucky
legislature
what's
before
us,
but
at
the
same
time
we
also
know
we're
not
dealing
with
20
years
ago.
Athletics
is
different.
A
Today,
things
are
moving
in
a
very
fast
direction,
and
that's
why
we're
we're
here
to
look
at
this
issue?
I
guess
one
of
the
questions
that
I
have
for
you
all
is
with
what
you're,
looking
at
with
with
draft
legislation
where
we're
going.
Will
this
provide
a
framework
for
flexibility
as
it
relates
to
nil
and
as
it
relates
to
putting,
I
think,
student
athletes
as
a
priority,
but
at
the
same
time
protecting
institutions?
L
Yeah
one
of
the
things
that
the
proposed
legislation
does
is:
it
gives
institutions
the
right
to
decide
whether
or
not
they're
going
to
apply
reasonable
restrictions.
In
other
words,
it
doesn't
prescribe
that
they
do
one
or
all
of
the
things
that
bill
has
just
described.
It
depends
on
what's
going
on
in
their
particular
institutions
and
what
their
student
athletes
need
bill.
Now,
if
you
wanted
to
add
something.
M
M
M
A
Thank
you.
I
know
in
mr
hardin's
comments
earlier.
You
know
in
terms
of
legislation
that
we've
had
pre-filed
before
on
the
senate
side.
I
also
want
to
make
note
representative.
Koenig
is
also
excuse.
Me
representative,
adam
boling
has
worked
on
some
legislation
in
the
house
before
on
this,
so
it
is
timely
and
it
is
something
that
you
know
we're
taking
very
serious
as
we
go
forward.
We
have
a
few
questions
of
members.
N
Yes,
thank
you.
Thank
you
very
much.
As
a
native
kentuckian,
it's
very
much
an
honor
and
privilege
for
me
to
be
here
today,
so
I
do
appreciate
the
opportunity
to
share
some
on
the
ground
boots
on
the
ground
perspective
of
name
image
likeness.
It's
been
a
crazy
couple
of
months
in
athletic
compliance.
N
I
think,
as
my
counterpart
will
attest,
as
we've
tried
to
navigate
the
changing
waters,
and
so
your
question
and
point
about
the
need
to
be
flexible
is
very
important
because
we've
had
to
exercise
that
through
the
last
couple
of
months,
and
we
know
that
more
change
is
coming
as
well.
One
of
the
key
principles
that
I
think
is
also
important
from
the
compliance
lens
that
we
maintain,
whatever
legislation
we
end
up
with,
is
that
this
not
be
used
as
recruiting
inducements
to
attend
particular
institutions.
N
That's
something
that
I
think
that
is
is
a
whole
piece
of
this
and
that
we
very
much
need
to
make
sure
that
we're
protecting
once
the
executive
order
had
been
rolled
out
last
year.
Actually,
a
couple
of
months
prior
to
that,
mr
barnhart
asked
me
to
organize
an
nio
working
group
within
athletics
to
help
us
figure
out
how
to
roll
this
out
at
kentucky
and
senator
wise.
You
mentioned
the
ncaa
matt
and
I
had
the
fortunate
or
I
don't
know
unfortunate.
N
It
was
fortunate
experience
to
both
work
in
the
national
office
for
several
years,
and
I
like
to
share
the
perspective
that
I
worked
specifically
in
the
amateurism
area
of
the
ncaa
and
the
first
working
group
on
name
image
and
likeness
was
formed
right
before
my
oldest
daughter
was
born.
I
very
much
remember
that,
because
I
remember
being
on
maternity
leave
and
participating
in
committee
calls
to
talk
about
name,
image
likeness
and
just
to
give
you
a
little
bit
of
perspective.
N
She
will
turn
15
in
january,
and
so
this
very
much
has
been
a
long
debated
issue.
What
we've
seen
at
kentucky
within
the
last
couple
of
months
of
name
image
likeness,
is
we're
about
right
under
500
total
transactions
that
our
student
athletes
have
entered
into,
and
so
I
would
also
say
that
the
disclosure
element
of
this
legislation
is
very
important
because
it
does
help
us
get
an
idea
of
what
our
student
athletes
are
engaging
in
and
what
what
they're
doing?
N
We
knew
that
our
revenue,
generating
sports,
men's
basketball
and
football
would
have
a
lot
of
opportunities
in
this
space
and
specific
student
athletes
would
what
we
weren't
sure,
but
hopeful
for
was
that
the
other
olympic
sports,
and
particularly
our
female
student
athletes,
would
have
opportunities
as
well,
and
I'm
very
pleased
to
report
that
football
and
men's
basketball
are
the
first
and
second,
most
transactions
at
kentucky,
but
coming
in
third,
is
our
national
champion.
Volleyball
team
with
those
young.
Ladies
those
student
athletes.
N
Fourth,
is
one
that
might
surprise
you
at
kentucky.
It's
our
women's
track
team,
but
that's
because
we
have
an
international
tick
tock
star
on
our
women's
track
team
that
has
about
a
half
a
million
followers
and
so
she's
been
able
to
capitalize
through
some
promotions
on
social
media
and
then
right
behind
that
you
see
several
of
our
other
female
sports
as
well,
so
that
that
just
gives
you
a
little
bit
of
perspective.
Every
sport
has
had
some
opportunity,
there's
been
at
least
one
student
athlete
in
every
sport.
N
N
Helping
student
athletes
understand
what
exclusivity
is
in
contracts
and
why
that
might
not
be
a
good
thing
for
them,
helping
them
understand
the
tax
implications
and
then
building
their
brand
as
well.
So
that's
just
a
little
bit
from
the
uk
lens,
but
I
know
matt
has
some
perspectives
that
he
would
like
to
share
as
well.
O
Thanks
rachel
and
and
thank
you,
chair,
wise,
chair
hoff
and
members
of
the
committee
for
the
opportunity
to
meet
with
you
today,
as
rachel
has
shared
things,
have
evolved
very
quickly
in
the
the
college,
athletics
landscape
and
to
really
hit
on
the
last
point
she
made
about.
Educating
and
empowering
our
student
athletes
has
been
our
priority
at
the
university
of
louisville.
O
We
too
are
very
excited
about
the
opportunities
that
have
already
come
in
the
first
four
months
of
nil
since
july
1
when
the
executive
order
came
into
being
and
that's
been
across
over
20
of
our
sports
and
similar
results,
very
enterprising,
very
interested
student
athletes
who
want
to
figure
out
how
to
elevate
their
brand.
We
are
in
a
social
media
driven
world.
O
O
A
P
Thank
you
chair.
I
have
one
question,
I
guess.
As
a
lawyer,
I
always
hear
the
word.
Immunity
makes
my
ears
pop
up
because
even
a
lawyer
has
to
eat,
but
that
being
said,
I
have
a
little
bit
of
concern
about
the
immunity
thing.
What
if
there's
an
intentional
tort
or
an
intentional
breach
of
contract?
Something
of
that
nature?
It
seems
to
me
that
making
it
so
broad
as
to
eliminate
any
prospect
of
litigation.
M
M
Certainly
if
a
student
athlete
enters
into
a
contract
with
a
corporation
and
that
corporation
breaches
the
contract,
then
we,
the
student
athlete,
would
have
the
ability
to
go
after
the
corporation
for
the
breach
of
contract,
and
I
think
it's
fair
to
say
that
our
law
school
legal
clinics
at
both
institutions
would
probably
assist
them
in
in
in
doing
so.
Rather,
this
has
to
do
with
the
prospect
of
the
institution
itself
being
sued.
Now,
as
you
know,
the
general
assembly
has
waived
sovereign
immunity
for
claims
based
upon
a
written
contract.
M
Written
contract,
I
think,
is,
is
clearly
defined
as
a
document
that,
in
its
four
corners
or
in
its
four
corners
and
the
attachment,
comprises
all
terms
of
the
contract,
but
there
is
a
possibility
that
a
court
would
take
a
broader
view
of
a
written
contract
and
we
just
want
to
ensure
that
we
are
not.
We,
the
institutions
and
our
individual
agents
and
employees
are
not
being
sued
by
that.
B
B
And
through
this
I
have
been
sent
one
that
basically
tried
to
create
a
situation,
and
I
think
you're
going
to
see
this
more
with
an
anthony
davis.
Who
was
6'2
that
grew
9
inches
or
david
robinson,
who
was
similar
in
the
navy,
who
grew
six
or
seven
inches.
You're
gonna
start
seeing
people
cast
nets
out
there
at
the
high
school
level.
B
Youth,
leagues,
promissory
or
youth,
leagues
or
entities
like
that
that
were
some
type
of
promissory
relationship
could
be
made.
I
would
ask
you
all
to
think
through
that
process
as
well,
because
I
don't
want
you
all
getting
stuck
with
a
17
year
old
that
when
they
walk
into
your
institution,
they've
already
got
a
contract
that
their
guardian
has
signed
for
them.
Then
you're
all
going
to
deal
with
it
or
somebody's
going
to
have
to
deal
with
it.
H
Senator
west,
thank
you,
mr
chairman,
one
quick
question.
It
appears
to
me
that
most,
if
not
all
the
items
that
you
listed
in
your
presentation,
I
think
are
things
you
can
already
do
as
a
university
within
your.
You
can
choose
to
do
those
things.
What's
the
need
for
the
legislation
to
mandate
or
to
set
out?
What's
there.
M
I
well
senator.
Thank
you.
Thank
you
for
your
question.
The
we
have
entered
into
a
a
new
era.
I
agree
with
you
that
we
have
the
authority
to
do
that.
I
think
the
executive
order,
which
we
are
very
grateful
for
largely
confirms
that
I
think
it
is
helpful
for
the
general
assembly
to
confirm
that
number
one
students
can
earn
these
things
number
two
that
we
can
impose
reasonable
conditions.
M
There
will
be
some
debate
over
what
reasonable
conditions
are,
and
that
may
someday
be
be
a
matter
for
the
court
and
number
three
that
we
insulate
and
protect
the
universities
as
we
all,
as
we
already
do
against
lawsuits
through
the
form
of
immunity.
So
I
think
you're
in
effect,
codifying
something
that
I
think
arguably
already
exists,
but
it
is
necessary.
I
think,
to
codify
that,
particularly
with
legislators
in
our
sister
states,
enacting
various
statutes.
H
H
I
just
want
the
panel
and
and
the
members
of
this
committee
to
know
that
a
week
and
a
half
ago,
at
the
national
conference
of
state
legislatures,
we
passed
a
policy
stating
that
we
think
this
is
better
handled
to
the
states
rather
than
the
federal
government,
and
I
happened
to
be
the
guy
that
developed
that
and
and
ran
it
and
and
got
it
at
it.
So
we
just
want
everybody
to
know
that
and
and
to
one
point
that
you
all
made
with
regards
to
federal
preemption.
H
I
I
you
know,
I'm
not
an
attorney,
but
I
would
be
reluctant
to
put
that
in
there,
because
whatever
the
federal
government
does,
by
definition,
preempts
what
we're
doing-
and
we
may
have
items
in
our
bill
that
you'll
like
as
well
as
we
do
that
maybe
isn't
spoken
to
in
the
federal
and
would
continue
to
live
on
here
in
kentucky,
because
what
we,
what
we
do
need
in
kentucky,
is
probably
different
than
what
they
need
and
do
in
wyoming,
and
it's
probably
different
than
what
they
need
and
do
and
say
california.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
M
I
I'm
very
pleased
to
hear
about
the
direction
for
our
female
athletes.
You
know
we
can't.
We
can't
turn
on
any
olympics
without
hearing
that
message
about
fair
compensation
and
as
the
the
loving
spouse
of
a
division.
One
athlete
I
understand,
you
know
how
much
work
that
she
put
in
and
with
her
finish
line
being
college
graduation.
So
I
see
that
a
lot
of
promise
here.
I
think
social
media
definitely
is
going
to
benefit.
I
think
they're,
two
sisters
at
fresno
state
that
have
the
most
followers.
I
I
I
think
that's
tremendously
positive
and
I
think
that
there's
there's
a
huge
upside.
That's
the
part
I'm
focusing
on
I'd
also
like
to
thank
you
for
intent,
your
intentionality
on
standards
and
not
using
this
as
a
recruiting
tool,
because
I
don't
think
I
think
everyone
in
this
room
could
know
there
could
be
a
race
to
the
bottom
with
this
type
of
a
thing,
and
I'm
glad
that
you
all
have
taken
that
that
stance
and
that
position.
I
N
Our
general
counsels,
but
I
will
say
from
a
athletic
compliance
perspective.
Federal
legislation
would
help
us
as
we
send
our
coaches
out
to
recruit
all
across
the
country.
The
the
student
athletes
and
their
parents
are
confused
because
it's
so
drastically
different
from
state
to
state
that
it
would
help
in
the
recruiting
process.
If
there
was
a
consistent
standard
in
this
space.
O
What
we
and
certainly
deferred
to
our
councils
on
sort
of
the
trajectory
of
having
a
federal
bill,
but
I
I
think
it's
more
realistic
to
be
focusing
on
what
the
states
can
do
now,
because
it's
here
and
so
that
that's
just
sort
of
a
thought
that
we're
four
months
into
it
in
knowing
that
the
ncaa
was
actually
also
walking
up
to
actually
legislating
this
within
their
own
governance
structure.
And
didn't
do
that.
Also,
you
know,
gives
you
pause
in
terms
of
thinking
that
a
federal
solution
will
be
around
the
corner.
M
I
L
So
same
way,
we
looked
a
lot
to
the
executive
order
as
a
guide,
so
it
really
provides
some
very
common
sense,
exceptions
and
restrictions.
So
you
know
anything
that
would
impede
the
university's,
copyright
or
trademark
interest,
anything
that
would
impede
the
student
athlete's
experience
as
a
student,
first
and
foremost
anything
related
to
alcohol,
tobacco
sex
related
gambling
advertisement.
So
some
of
those
things
it
was
pretty
low
hanging
fruit.
We
were
able
to
pretty
quickly
gather
consensus
as
a
group,
so
I
think
there
really
wasn't
a
lot
of
debate.
I
don't!
L
I
I
And
I
know
that's
the
direction
of
college
sports
and
my
next
question
is
and
senator
matt
why's.
You
know-
and
actually
even
this
committee
I
mean.
Should
we
be
talking
about
nil
for
high
school
athletes,
I
mean.
Should
we
be
having
that
conversation
about
kentucky
kentucky
high
school
athletic
association?
Should
we
be
bringing
julian
tackett
in
here
and
talking
about
it,
because
we
know
that
there
are?
Second,
graders
that
are
offered
college
scholarships
to
participate
in
sports
in
in
in
this
state.
I
You
know
we
we
have
a
few
of
those,
but
my
concern
is
that
obviously
we're
here
at
the
at
the
college
level?
You
know
it's
going
to
be
knocking
on
that
next
door
to
come
down
and
and
obviously
to
go
along
with
what
president
stivers
point.
You
know
we
have
parents
who
are,
you
know
going
to
want
to
make
sure
that
their
kids
are
taken
care
of
as
they
should,
but
I
just,
I
think,
that's
more
of
a
comment
than
it
is
a
question
you
know
down
the
road.
A
Everything
we're
looking
at
in
terms
of
going
forward
with
pieces
of
legislation
we're
talking
about
current
future
student
athletes,
we're
not
getting
into
past
student
athletes
just
want
to
make
sure
that
is
to
clarify,
because
there's
a
lot
of
people
that
have
said
well
name,
image
likeness,
could
come
from
somebody
that
made
a
shot
in
1993
and
should
we
be
compensating
them
today
for
what
happened
years
ago.
So
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
anything
that's
being
drafted.
We
are
talking
about
present
or
future
student
athletes,
not
royalties
of
a
past.
A
A
Once
again,
we
do
not
have
legislation
in
front
of
us
to
deal
with
this
issue.
If
you
remember
the
senate
education
committee,
this
has
been
a
topic
that
we've
addressed.
I
think
twice
before
in
previous
legislative
sessions,
but
we
look
forward
today
to
hearing
again
from
the
bill
sponsor
and
that's
senator
john
schickel
senator
schickel
welcome
back
to
the
education
committee,
and
I
will
let
you
introduce
your
guests.
Please.
J
J
I'm
not
here
today
to
take
sides
in
any
of
these
important
issues
that
face
our
citizens,
because
I
believe,
as
my
colleagues
believe,
that
these
are
local
issues.
The
kentucky
constitution
is
very
clear
that
the
state
is
responsible
for
school
funding,
but
curriculum
and
school
issues.
We
have
elected
school
boards
and
it's
at
best
that
we
defer
to
those
people
who
are
elected
by
the
public
locally.
J
But
if
we're
going
to
keep
a
straight
face
and
say
that
we
also
need
to
have
credibility
in
our
school
governance
system,
and
at
this
time
we
really
don't
have
credibility.
We
send
our
citizens
to
local
to
the
local
government,
but
we
have
a
system
set
up
that
is
unclear
and
convoluted
with
our
school,
our
current
school
governance
system,
our
school
boards
and
our
site-based
council
system.
I
think
most
of
you
probably
know,
but
some
of
you
may
not
some
of
the
people.
E
I
truly
believe
that
ownership
and
responsibility
makes
every
kentuckian
a
stakeholder
in
our
schools,
and
stakeholder
input
is
important
to
the
success
of
all
our
students.
School
boards
are
the
most
direct
and
accountable
representative
of
the
community
when
it
comes
to
that
ownership
and
responsibility.
E
A
board's
mission
is
to
oversee
the
governance
and
management
of
the
district.
Unfortunately,
in
key
aspects
boards
and
the
superintendents
that
we
hire
have
been
removed
from
the
process
of
decision
making
in
our
districts.
Kentucky
statute
defines
the
responsibilities
of
boards
and
school
councils.
E
E
As
you
can
see,
there
is
a
disconnect
between
sbdm
and
board
roles
that
breaks
the
chain
of
accountability
to
the
community
at
large.
The
result
can
be
seen
in
varying
approaches
to
curriculum
and
even
divergent
goals
across
schools.
Within
the
same
district,
it
is
seen
with
curriculum
plans
and
sequencing
that
is
not
aligned
across
schools
and
upgrade
levels.
E
It
is
also
seen
in
the
fact
that
superintendents,
in
nearly
all
districts
in
kentucky,
do
not
select
the
person
hired
as
the
principal
in
that
district's
schools.
Despite
the
fact
that
the
superintendents
then
serve
as
a
principal's
leader
and
supervisor,
this
management
relationship
is
not
seen
in
other
settings
across
public
or
private
sector,
including
educational
institutions.
E
After
all,
it
is
the
superintendents
who
will
be
leading
and
evaluating
the
principles
and
holding
them
accountable.
It
will
strengthen
the
board's
evaluation
of
a
superintendent
if
the
board
can
consider
the
superintendent's
managerial
skills
through
their
decisions
in
selecting
the
best
people
to
run
our
schools.
E
As
to
the
example
of
curriculum
planning
and
alignment,
this
has
become
increasingly
important
in
recent
years,
as
our
students
have
become
more
transient
in
districts
across
kentucky
alignment
not
only
to
state
standards,
but
alignment
and
sequencing
across
schools
and
grade
levels
is
something
boards
and
superintendents
talk
about
a
lot
yet.
So
many
of
those
decisions
are
not
made
at
the
district
level.
E
An
important
change
would
be
to
have
these
decisions
made
with
more
collaboration
among
teachers,
principals,
district
leaders
and
parents
and
students
not
less
continuous
school
improvement
is
your
goal,
and
it
is
the
goal
of
all
district
leaders
in
statute.
You
recognize
that
state
government,
local
communities,
parents,
students
and
school
employees
must
work
together
and
that
the
cooperation
of
all
involved
is
necessary
to
assure
that
desired
outcomes
are
achieved.
E
In
conclusion,
I
will
say
that
strategic
changes
to
roles
of
the
councils
and
boards
will
foster
more
collaboration
and
break
down
the
rigid
silos
boards
and
councils.
Currently
work
in
this
session
presents
you
with
an
opportunity
to
increase
the
engagement
of
the
entire
community
with
the
student
success.
Thank
you.
Q
Good
afternoon
I'm
dr
sally
sugg
superintendent,
shelby
county
public
schools.
That
is
just
one
role
in
education
that
I've
had
over
a
40-year
career.
I
served
as
a
teacher
in
7-12.
I've
served
as
a
principal,
and
I
was
elected
three
different
times
by
three
different
councils,
elementary
and
also
a
high
school
principal
in
three
different
districts.
Q
I
also
had
the
opportunity
to
serve
as
associate
commissioner
at
the
kentucky
department
of
education,
and
in
that
role
I
mainly
was
working
with
our
lowest
performing
schools
and
districts,
many
of
whom
had
very
dysfunctional
leadership
practices
and
site-based
councils.
So
I
got
to
observe
that
as
well
and
then
I
also
have
a
four-year.
Q
I
was
an
elected,
four-year
school
board
member
in
my
home
county
of
henderson
county,
so
I've
got
a
little
bit
of
a
perspective
from
several
different
viewpoints.
I'd
like
to
reiterate
a
couple
of
things
that
ms
page
talked
about.
First,
the
ultimate
responsibility
does
fall
to
the
count
to
the
school
board
and
also
to
the
superintendent.
Q
They
are
the
ones
that
get
the
calls,
and
I
was
a
teacher
prior
to
sbdm
and
cara,
and
I
believe
one
of
the
things
that
was
intended
is
for
that
spdm
council
to
serve
sort
of
like
a
school
board
where
parents
would
take
their
concerns
to
this
to
the
site-based
council
at
the
school.
That
doesn't
happen
very
often
in
practice
they
usually
go
straight
to
the
principal.
Then
they
go
straight
to
the
central
office,
superintendent
and
school
board.
Q
Q
So
there's
a
lot
of
collaboration
in
a
high
functioning
district
and
a
high-functioning
school
board
welcomes
that
a
high-functioning
superintendent,
who
is
a
leader
that
looks
to
collaborate
not
only
with
those
that
I've
mentioned,
but
also
the
business
community.
That's
a
very,
very
integral
part
of
a
high
functioning
district.
Q
All
of
those
things
help
to
align
what
we
see
k
through
12
in
public
schools
or
preschool
through
12
in
public
schools.
If
that
collaboration
is
not
there,
what
we
see
is
independent
decisions
being
made
that
are
a
deficit
for
students
that,
as
ms
page
mentioned,
are
very
transient,
moving
from
school
to
school
and
district
to
district,
and
if
there
isn't
a
coherent
approach
that
is
facilitated
at
the
very
least
by
the
district
office,
by
the
school
board
and
also
by
the
business
community,
then
those
students
have
big
gaps
in
their
learning.
Q
I
recently
was
able
to
help
with
the
selection
process
at
simpsonville
elementary,
a
very
high
functioning
elementary.
That
council
did
beautifully
as
a
part
of
that
council,
I
was
able
to
watch
them
reach
consensus,
but
the
whole
time
my
prayer
was
what,
if
what
if
they
did
not
reach
consensus,
how
would
we
manage
that
process?
Q
Q
One
size
doesn't
work
so
looking
at
what
the
high-flying
districts
and
very
high-functioning,
high-performing,
schools
and
districts
are
doing,
I
think,
is
a
unique,
unique
opportunity
to
look
again
at
the
balance
of
sbdm
councils
of
superintendent
leadership
and
also
of
kentucky
school
boards.
Thank
you
for
the
opportunity
to
speak
to
this
topic.
H
Now
I
told
you
how
to
turn
this
on
a
hundred
times
and
I'm
the
one
that
didn't
do
it.
I
would
just
say,
as
we've
we've
talked
about
this
a
lot
in
other
interims
in
several
years,
but
if
anything
recently,
these
topics
have
come
even
more
to
the
forefront
of
public
awareness
and
importance.
So
thank
you
again
for
taking
time
in
the
interim
in
this
last
meeting
to
look
at
this
again
and
for
ksba.
We
look
forward
to
working
on
it
during
the
session.
A
P
Wise
first
of
all,
I
want
to
thank
senator
schickel
for
bringing
this
forward
before
I
was
ever
a
member
of
this
body.
I
actually
testified
on
behalf
of
a
bill
that
he
brought
previously,
so
I
know
he's
been
working
on
this
for
several
years.
At
that
time
I
was
still
serving
as
a
board
member
in
boone
county
schools,
and
I
will
tell
you
that
my
experience
with
site-based
councils
is
mixed.
P
That
is,
a
site-based
council
often
is
strong
or
weak,
depending
on
the
principal
leadership
in
that
school
and,
of
course,
there's
a
makeup
that
is
offset
because
there's
three
teachers
and
two
parents,
and
so
I've
had
several
parents.
Tell
me
I
was
a
part
of
a
group,
but
I
really
never
felt
like
I
had
to
say
so,
and
so
we've
talked
about
this
at
ad
nauseam
for
a
long
time,
I'm
not
against
local
decision
making,
I'm
certainly
for
local
control.
P
But
I
will
say
that
school
board
members
are
the
truly
elected
officials
in
the
community,
they're
on
the
ballot
and
they're
responsible
to
their
community,
for
what
their
school
does,
whether
it
succeeds
or
fails,
and
they
are
the
ones
that
are
out
there
doing
that.
So,
when
you
have
a
problem,
when
you
have
some
site-based
councils
that
have
to
beg
people
to
run
to
be
on
the
council,
that's
not
all
cases,
but
in
some
they
actually
I've
been
to
pta
meetings
where
they
were
trying
to
beg
people
to
run
as
the
parent
representatives.
P
Then
you
get
into
situations
that
I
personally
experienced
in
my
own
district
back
then,
where
you
have
something
that
is
a
conflict
between
the
site-based
council
and
the
truly
elected
school
board
members,
and
that
creates
a
very
contentious
issue,
especially
when
a
superintendent
is
trying
to
follow
the
dictates
of
the
kentucky
board
of
education.
But
may
run
awry
of
directions
coming
from
the
site-based
council,
and
so
that
is
a
very
difficult
situation
to
face.
I
know
senator
shekel
and
I
talked
about
making
these
an
advisory
type
group
a
more
balanced
group.
P
I
don't
know,
but
I
do
think
that
now's
the
right
time,
given
the
things
we're
dealing
with,
especially
with
critical
race
theory,
taking
such
a
prominent
role
in
our
discussions
around
the
nation,
and
so
I
think
it's
time
for
us
to
at
least
have
these
discussions,
and-
and
I
want
to
thank
both
of
the
presenters
here
today.
I've
worked
with
eric
kennedy
for
a
long
time
actually
before
I
ever
again
took
this
office,
but
but
for
dr
sugg
and
and
for
devonna.
P
Thank
you
for
being
here
and
giving
your
comments,
because
I
think
that
having
your
leadership
coming
from
the
president
of
ksba
and
coming
from
a
very
well
respected
superintendent,
that
that
really
brings
attention
to
the
fact
that
we
do
need
some
change.
There's
been
some
resistance
on
this,
because
parents
felt
like
they
weren't
getting
a
voice.
I
think
there
are
many
ways
for
parents
to
get
a
voice,
including
school
board
meetings
where
we
often
gave
parents
the
opportunity
to
address
the
entire
board
in
that
formal
setting.
P
P
D
J
At
the
end
of
the
day,
the
superintendent,
because
he
is
hired
by
the
school
board
and
answers
because
he's
hired
by
the
school
board
and
the
school
board
answers
to
the
community
at
large
at
the
end
of
the
day,
both
principals
and
curriculum,
after
consulting
with
the
site-based
council
and
getting
all
the
possible
income,
we
all
know
good
leaders
always
get
as
much
feedback
and
input
and
advice
as
they
can.
But
at
the
end
of
the
day,
it's
if
there's
a
disagreement.
Those
decisions
would
be
made
by
the
superintendent.
F
Yes,
thank
you.
Well,
I'm
really
excited
that.
You
all
got
to
hear
from
my
superintendent
sally
suggs.
She
is
a
superstar,
as
you
can
tell
in
every
in
every
role
she
plays.
I
do
appreciate
chairman
for
allowing
me
to
ask
a
question
today.
I'm
really
glad
that
this
topic
has
come
up.
It's
come
up
among
citizens
a
lot
this
year
who
is
in
charge
of
our
schools
nationwide,
I
think,
and
in
kentucky
we
do
have
this
odd
system
with
the
site-based
decision-making
councils.
F
F
I
think
the
biggest
reason
is
because
we
we
feel,
like
speaking
as
a
former,
that
we
really
don't
have
a
voice
unless
you
have
a
very
strong
parent
representative,
it
is
as
if
you're
not
even
there.
I
I
had
great
experience
as
you
might
imagine.
I
I
try
to
have
a
voice
where
I
go,
but
we
I
felt
like
we
did
wonderful
things
at
our
schools
with
the
site-based
councils,
but
I
think
most
parents
feel
like
it
is
just
a
token
place
to
sit
and
and
rubber
stamp
what
happens.
F
The
the
elections
are
during
school
days.
You
know
someone
recently
said
that
they
wondered
if
we
could
put
them
on
the
ballot
and
and
be
elected
there,
so
that
people
would
actually
have
a
place
to
to
go
vote.
One
of
the
things
that
you
mentioned,
senator
shekel,
is
that
you
like
to
think
I'm
an
advocate
also
for
local
control
of
various
things,
but
in
education,
we've
spent
lots
of
time
in
kentucky
and
effort
legislatively,
etc,
trying
to
ensure
that
we
have
equal
funding
so
that
everyone
can
have
an
equal
chance.
F
We
want
no
child
to
be
in
a
in
a
situation
where
they
get
a
deficient
education.
One
of
the
reasons
I'm
co-sponsoring
all
day.
Kindergarten
is
because
some
counties
weren't
offering
it.
I
want
all
children
to
have
the
same,
the
same
educational
foundation,
and
so
that
plays
a
role
in
my
thinking
about
control
of
the
schools.
F
All
schools
need
a
baseline
of
education
that
can
get
lost
locally,
so
I'm
playing
in
my
mind
with
these
things
I
like
to
talk
about
it.
I
want
to
hear
more
about
your
thoughts
and
others,
but
I
do
want
every
child
in
kentucky
to
have
the
opportunity
to
have
an
excellent
world-class
education
they're
not
just
going
to
compete
in
kentucky
they're
going
to
around
the
world.
F
I
Thank
you,
chairwise.
Just
a
couple
comments
really
quickly:
senator
schick.
Well,
thank
you
for
bringing
this
forward.
I
think
that
to
you
in
the
education
world,
I
think
the
two
things
we're
hearing
most
now
are
voice
and
choice.
I
think
that
that's
probably
parent
voice
and
student
choice.
I
think
that
again
to
echo
some
of
my
counterparts,
they
now
is
the
time
to
take
a
look
at
it
when
cara
went
into
effect.
In
my
opinion,
the
two
most
important
things
that
came
out
of
it
first
was
a
seek
formula
to
balance.
I
You
know
funding
across
the
state
and
the
second
was
the
creation
of
sbdm
councils.
I
very
fortunately
have
been
able
to
serve
on
two
different
councils
in
two
different
capacities.
I
was
a
teacher
first
before
I
had
tenure
because
I
heard
that
they
couldn't
fire
you
if
you
are
an
sbdm,
so
I
was
the
first
sign
up.
I
was
number
one
I
was
number
one
on
the
ballot
and
I
received
the
most
votes
and
this
the
second
council
I
served
on.
I
was
a
an
administrator
in
a
different
capacity.
I
The
the
first
sbdm
council.
We
had
usually
any
number
of
30
to
50
parents
that
would
sign
up
to
to
run
in
that
election.
The
second
site
based
council
was
on.
I
was
on
a
different
school.
We
had
to
extend
our
deadlines.
We
had
to
literally
pitch
the
importance
to
people
who
would
walk
into
the
building.
I
I've
been
on.
I've
been
on
site-based
councils
that
were
rubber
stamp
committees
where
all
the
work
had
been
done
ahead
of
time
and
they
bring
it
to
us
and
we
just
stamp
it
move
it
along
and
I've
been
in
other
committees
where
I've
been
on
other
site-based
councils,
where
three
hours
in
we
had
to
adjourn
because
we
were
all
exhausted
and
no
one
really
knew
what
we
were
talking
about
at
that
point.
So
there
is
such
diversity
there,
the
kentucky
education
reform
act.
I
Any
good
reform
continues
to
reform
itself,
we're
31
years
in
it's
definitely
time
to
take
a
look
at
it.
I
definitely
want
to
see
how
the
teacher
pl
the
teacher
voice
plays
into
this.
I
think
that
we
definitely
need
to
make
sure
that
we're
we're,
including
that
in
some
capacity
hiring
principals
was
the
big
deal.
I
If
you're
on
sbdm,
we
had
some
people
that
were
just
wanted,
they
just
wanted
to
show
show
up
and
get
their
name
on
on
a
ballot
and
then,
when
all
of
a
sudden,
the
principal
decided
they're
going
to
retire
in
december,
then
they're,
I'm
I'm
off
of
here,
I'm
resigning.
My
position
on
sbdm
put
somebody
else
on
there
and
then
other
people
would
want
to
get
on.
So
obviously,
though,
that's
a
very,
very
important
piece
at
the
district
level,
I
do
see
it
now,
the
the
the
angle
from
the
superintendent's
perspective.
I
I
definitely
see
that
I
do
think
it's
time.
We
take
a
look
at
it.
I
would
definitely
want
to
see
how
this
is
going
to
be
boiled
down
into
specifics,
and
I
want
to
make
sure
that
the
core
values
that
we
established
in
cara
in
1990
are
still
adhered
to
with
this
moving
forward,
but
I
think
it's
definitely
time
for
change.
Thank
you.
A
R
You
and-
and
I
hope
you
got
my
my
information-
I
was
listening
to
you
by
zoom.
I
had
I've
had
a
slew
of
meetings
here
this
morning.
I
guess
here's
my
question
I'll
get
right
to
the
point,
as
we've
seen
recently
in
in
the
election
in
virginia.
You
know,
parents
want
a
say-so
and
and
control
over
how
their
children
are
being
educated.
The
the
the
number
one
polling
issue
out
of
that
raise
in
virginia
was
that
parents
wouldn't
have
a
say
in
their
education.
R
That
was
the
the
the
difference
in
the
victory
in
that
case.
Given
that
I
I
I
don't
understand
why
we
continue
to
see
school
councils
under
attack.
You
know
my
position
has
always
been
and
remains
to
be
that
what
we
should
be
doing
with
regards
to
school
counselors
is
equalizing
number
between
parents
and
teachers.
We
got
to
be
giving
parents
a
larger
voice
in
school
counsels
and
not
a
smaller
voice.
J
Know
that
and
you're
watching,
so
so
so
yes,
I
always
want
to
hear
from
you
you're
one
of
my
favorites
also.
So
it's
good
to
see
you
good
to
hear
from
you
the
my
response
to
that.
The
pacific
situation
you
talk
about
in
virginia
is
parents
are
on
school
boards
in
boone
county,
we
have
the
school
board
every
one
of
them
is
a
parent,
and
I
think
that
you
take
the
message
from
virginia
a
little
bit
too
narrowly.
E
Good
could
I
come
in
as
well
senator
thomas,
I
just
wanted
to
say
that
I
didn't
mean
to
infer
from
my
statement
that
I
wanted
to
cut
parents
out
of
the
process,
which
is
exactly
the
opposite.
I
want
to
make
sure
that
there
is
more
collaboration
and
that
they
do
have
a
strong
voice
in
this
so
and
my
intention
is
not
to
cut
them
out.
H
H
The
timing
couldn't
be
better.
Your
focus
is,
is
spot
on
and
I'm
excited
to
be
supportive
of
it
once
again,
and
I
think
it
stands
a
better
chance
this
year
before
and
on
the
topic-
and
this
is
something
I
remind
myself
of
so
when
I
say
it-
it's
not.
It's
not
a
message
to
anyone
on
the
in
the
body.
Here,
issues
have
timing.
H
We
were
fortunate
years
ago,
through
the
leadership
of
senator
west,
to
pass
some
tribunal
language
that
we
had
tried
at
least
six
sessions
to
get
past.
The
timing
was
right.
The
message
was
right:
senator
west
guided
that
through
the
process,
very
skillfully
made
changes
as
he
had
to
make
them
to
achieve
the
ultimate
goal
and
was
successful,
and
I
feel
confident
we
can
do
the
same
with
this
legislation.
So
thank
you.
Senator.