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From YouTube: Budget Review Subcommittee on Education (6-2-21)
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A
B
A
A
I
worked
very
closely
with
representative
plessy
and
representative
miller
on
negotiating
these
changes
and
one
of
the
one
of
the
aspects
of
house
bill.
8
deals
with
pension
liability
and
the
ability
of
institutions
to
appeal
their
unfunded
liability
and
with
us.
Today
we
have
president
tim
caboney
from
western
kentucky
and
president
dr
david
mcfadden
from
eastern
kentucky.
So
I'll.
Please
come
forward
and
we
look
forward
to
hearing
your
presentation.
G
G
Well,
chairman,
chairman
tipton
and
members
of
the
committee,
thank
you
for
inviting
me
to
speak
today
when
I
began
my
tenure
at
western
kentucky
university
four
years
ago,
I
learned
very
quickly
what
a
strained
pension
costs
are
on
the
university
and
house
bill.
8
transitions,
the
comprehensive
universities
in
kctcs
who
participate
in
kers
from
a
percent
of
payroll
method
to
a
level
dollar
method.
We're
thankful
for
that.
G
The
bill
also
includes
language,
stating
that
it's
in
the
intent
of
the
general
assembly
to
provide
a
subsidy
to
cover
the
employer,
contribution
costs
increases
and
that
subsidy
will
decrease
each
year
by
10
percent.
Until
we
reach
50
percent
of
the
cost
increase,
the
general
assembly's
expressed
intention
was
to
provide
full
funding
for
the
cost
increase
in
this
budget
year.
G
that
bill
would
have
addressed
the
krs
pension
challenges
we
were
facing
and
while
house
bill,
8
does
not
address
all
of
our
concerns.
It
does
put
us
on
more
stable
ground
and
allows
us
to
plan
our
budget
in
a
more
efficient
way.
The
employer
contribution
increases
had
far
exceeded
a
point
that
was
sustainable
for
our
university
house.
Bill
8
took
our
employer
contribution
rate
from
49
percent
to
75
percent.
G
Now,
let
me
say
this
first
wku
and
all
of
my
colleagues
are
grateful
to
the
general
assembly
for
providing
the
subsidy
to
offset
the
cost
increase
we
have
incurred
due
to
house
bill
8.
and
the
language
included,
describing
the
intent
of
the
general
assembly
to
continue
providing
the
subsidy
until
our
unfunded
liability
is
paid
off
in
30
years.
G
There
are
some
concerns
that
we
have
and
we
want
to
talk
about
those
a
little
bit
today.
The
first
is
that
section
7
of
house
bill
8
in
regards
to
contracted
third
party
who
supply
services
on
our
campus.
G
G
We
create
these
contracts
and
outsourcing
relationships
because
they're
not
part
of
our
core
business
contracting.
These
services
helps
us
increase
our
efficiency,
it's
better
for
our
students,
our
faculty
and
our
staff.
They
have
expertise
that
we
just
don't
facilities,
management,
food
services,
bookstore
operations
and
medical
care
really
are
necessary
to
keep
our
campus
functioning
and
running
smoothly
for
our
constituents.
G
And
if
we
tried
to
deliver
these
on
our
own,
we
believe
it
would
be
an
additional
burden,
not
just
on
the
university,
but
on
the
taxpayer
to
try
to
deliver
the
functions
ourselves.
So
these
four
contracts
have
employees
who
fit
within
the
scope,
though
defined
in
house
bill
8
subsection
2
through
7..
G
So
as
we
renew
these
contracts,
this
will
make
the
university
responsible
for
providing
state
retirement
benefits
to
private
industry
employees,
and
we
think
this
creates
a
reporting
and
financial
hardship
as
well.
It's
an
extraordinary
requirement
places
difficulty
on
us
as
we
manage
our
relationship
with
our
contract
partners
and
so
during
the
next
session,
we're
going
to
ask
that
you
take
a
look
at
and
repeal
potentially
this
portion
of
house
bill
8
in
the
upcoming
session.
G
Now
there's
been
a
tremendous
amount
of
work
on
the
part
of
the
legislature,
representative,
tipton,
all
of
our
university
presidents
to
to
get
kers
more
financially
stable,
and
I
appreciate
that
we
have
an
oversight
board,
the
public
pension
oversight
board.
My
hope
is
that,
as
a
community,
our
oversight
is
more
rigorous.
So
we
don't
wind
up
in
this
position
again,
so
paying
all
of
us
paying
closer
attention.
G
Now,
we've
advocated
over
the
past
three
years
for
our
kers
employees
to
have
a
choice
with
their
retirement
and
we'd
like
our
newly
hired
kers
employees.
To
have
a
choice
between
a
pension
or
our
optional
retirement
plan,
which
is
a
403
b
plan,
our
trs
employees
have
this
choice
and
about
half
of
them
choose
the
optional
retirement
plan
over
the
pension.
G
If
you
think
about
new
employees,
many
of
them
are
likely
to
have
multiple
careers
now
over
a
lifetime.
27
years
with
the
university
really
is
not
in
the
cards
for
folks
that
we
hire
today
and
so
having
that
flexibility
of
a
portable
retirement
plan,
we
think
is
a
good
thing.
G
So
we
would
like
to
work
with
you
to
address
this
issue
in
the
upcoming
session
as
well.
So
in
closing
first,
thank
you
very
much
for
the
opportunity
to
be
with
you
to
explain
the
effect
of
house
bill
8
and
I'm
thankful
for
all.
You
did
to
help
alleviate
the
financial
concerns
that
were
a
burden
on
us
and
with
that
I'll
either
turn
it
over
to
david
and
we'll
both
stand
for
questions
or
I
can
stand
for
questions
now.
A
Can
we
go
ahead
and
let
president
mcfadden
give
his
report
and
just
for
the
members
benefit
and
for
those
who
may
be
watching
at
home?
Other
eight
public
universities
only
six
are
part
of
the
kentucky
retirement
system.
The
university
of
kentucky
and
university
of
louisville
have
their
separate
retirement
system,
so
we
have
our
six
regional,
comprehensive
universities,
plus
our
community
kentucky
community
college
system.
These
are
the
institutions
that
we're
referring
to
today.
So
president
mcfadden,
please
proceed.
E
Well,
thank
you,
mr
chair.
It's
so
good
to
be
with
this
body
in
this
room
returning
to
to
the
new
normal
that
we
find
that
is
upon
us
and
and
happy
to
be
here
talking
a
little
bit
about
house
bill,
8
and
and
the
good
work
that
has
been
done
in
and
around
pensions
for
the
better
part
of
the
last
five
to
six
years
as
we
we
try
to
solve
this
problem
together.
E
Mr
chair,
I
think
these
are
your
words,
shared
sacrifice
and
shared
success,
and
we've
talked
a
lot
about
that
over
the
last
several
sessions,
as
we've
worked
together.
Thinking
about
how
to
fix
this,
this
challenge
that
we
have
here
in
the
commonwealth.
Let
me
touch
on
some
more
specifics.
Everything
that
dr
caboni
has
has
talked
about
are
things
that
that
we
are
very
supportive
of
from
a
from
a
programmatic
and
kind
of
a
moving
forward.
E
Standpoint
I'll
give
a
few
more
concrete
examples
that
are
very
unique
to
eku,
specifically
as
it
relates
to
contested
liability
and-
and
that
was
one
of
the
provisions
in
house
bill
8.
That
was
very
important
to
us
and
very
important
to
several
other
other
agencies.
E
I
would,
I
would
be
remiss
if
I
didn't
start
here,
and
that
is
that
the
the
generous
support
of
the
general
assembly
to
help
really
buffer
and
transition,
this
shared
responsibility
of
the
of
the
long-term
accrued
liability
was
absolutely
critical,
and
so,
as
it
was,
was
seen
in
this
budget
and
we
hope
to
see
in
future
biennial
budgets
that
support
of
that
subsidy
for
this
pension,
for
this
pension
obligation
is
something
that
is
of
critical
importance.
E
And
I
know
that
you
will
see
all
six
of
your
public
universities
plus
kctcs
here
on
a
biennial
basis
advocating
to
to
support
that
subsidy.
So
specifics
on
house
bill
8,
the
actuarial
analysis
used
to
inform
house
bill.
8
was
a
snapshot
data
that
was
on
june
30th
of
2019,
and
that
is
important
as
I
kind
of
go
through
some
of
the
data
here.
So
so.
The
data
that
was
used
to
inform
the
liability
calculations
for
the
agencies,
along
with
the
general
fund
support,
was
snapshoted
on
june
30th
of
2019.
E
kers
has
claimed
that
in
the
documents
that
we
have,
that
eku
has
accrued
239
million
dollars
in
total
liability
for
both
active
inactive
and
retired
employees.
Eku's
total
require
annual
contribution
to
the
system
is
equated
at
13.5
million
dollars
a
year
in
order
to
service
the
normal
cost,
along
with
the
unfunded
liability,
the
arc
that
that
has
grown
over
the
last
20
years
of
that
525
000
of
that
annual
contribution
represents
the
annual
cost,
the
the
annual
normal
cost
so
of
the
13.5
million.
E
Only
500,
oh
just
over
500
000
of
that
is
the
normal
cost.
The
balance
of
that
13
million
is
the
amateurized
liability
that
has
grown
through
the
arc
over
the
better
part
of
the
last
20
years.
E
Eku's
pension
subsidy
for
2021
2022
was
8.9
million
dollars
and
again
I'll
reinstate
to
this
group
that
we
are
very
grateful
for
that
support,
as
we
transition
into
this
normal
to
this
more
normalized
and
level
dollar
approach
for
funding
this
liability.
So
some
context
as
it
relates
to
retirement
on
university
campuses.
This
may
be
an
old
hat
for
some.
This
may
be
new
information
for
others,
but
on
our
university
campuses,
we
have
three
classifications
of
employees.
E
If
your
position
on
our
campus
requires
a
post-secondary
credential
or
you
have
a
post-secondary
credential,
those
employees
fall
into
into
what
we
consider
our
exempt
employee
class
and
they
have
a
choice
of
which
retirement
system
to
participate
in
and
they
have
a
five-year
window
to
make
a
permanent
election.
So
they
can
either
participate
in
the
ktrs
system
and
we're
all
aware
of
kind
of
what
that
system
is
separate
from
kers
or
they
can
use
our
optional
retirement
plan.
E
Our
403
b
from
from
a
non-classified
employee
standpoint,
meaning
the
position
on
campus
does
not
require
a
post-secondary
credential.
Those
employees
must
participate
in
the
kers
defined
benefit
plan
and,
as
dr
caboni
highlighted,
we
would
appreciate,
as
we
think,
about
the
portability
of
higher
education.
E
The
fact
that
not
all
public
institutions
in
kentucky
participate
in
the
retirement
system
and
the
interplay
between
private
private
universities
and
colleges
and
public
institutions
that
the
portability
is
something
that
is
of
critical
importance
not
only
to
our
professional
staff,
but
also
to
our
classified
staff
as
well
as
they
look
for
career
opportunities
just
to
break
down
our
employment.
So
folks
know
here
we're
about
900
trs
employees
on
our
campus
about
563,
orp
employees
and
151
kers
employees.
E
Now
I
will
tell
you
that
in
the
last
five
years,
as
we
have
made,
new
hires
on
campus
employees
are
choosing
on
about
a
ten
to
one
ratio
to
participate
in
the
orp
defined
benefit
or
defined
contribution
plan,
as
opposed
to
participating
in
the
trs
to
find
benefit
plan.
So
I
think
we're
seeing
shifts
in
the
marketplace
as
to
what
the
employee
is
looking
for
in
our
retirement
plan
talk
a
little
bit
about
contested
liability.
E
Let
you
know
that
we
have
submitted
our
letter
to
the
krs
board
of
directors
to
to
contest
351
employees
who
were
listed
on
our
liability
of
the
3
000
3200
employees,
who
are
affiliated
with
eku
as
means
of
being
active
employees
and
active
employees
or
retired
employees.
273
of
the
351
individuals.
Liability
should
reside
with
an
executive
branch
as
we
were.
E
The
additional
78
individuals
that
were
on
our
liability
are
individuals
that
not
by
electronic
record,
not
by
paper
record.
We
have
no
record
of
those
employees
working
on
our
campus
at
any
point
in
time,
and
so
we
are
requesting
a
kers
that
either
they
provide
some
validation
as
to
the
time
period
and
and
what
role
that
employee
worked
in
or
we
would
ask
that
they
would
be
removed
from
from
our
liability,
as
we
cannot
validate
that
through
any
of
the
records
that
we
have
on
campus.
E
We
have
had
a
team
of
about
12
to
20
people
working
for
the
better
part
of
the
last
four
months,
combing
through
both
electronic
and
paper
files,
trying
to
validate
all
of
this
information
with
the
with
the
limited
information
that
we
have.
E
While
it
is
possible
that
that
individuals
have
had
retired
from
the
institution
prior
to
to
to
the
turn
of
the
century,
we
feel
that
you
know
we
need
to
work
with
kers
to
be
able
to
validate
that
data
before
that,
we
would
book
that
that
liability,
long
term,
a
couple
of
general
concerns
and
observations
and
then
I'll
kind
of
wrap
up.
E
The
liability
does
not
reflect
the
most
up
to
up
to
date,
data,
and
that
is
one
concern
that
we
had
basing
the
liability
assignment
on
the
2019
valuation
instead
of
the
2020
or
the
2021
valuation.
A
snapshot
of
this
year
has
cost
participating
employers
any
recognized
market
gains
and
what
has
been
one
of
the
strongest
markets
that
we've
seen
in
any
of
our
lifetimes.
E
The
outdated
liability
validation
also
fails
to
reflect
any
of
the
efficiencies
that
perhaps
a
participating
agency
may
have
gained
during
that
period
of
time.
So,
as
we
have
set
this
at
this
point,
one
one
thing
that
we
would
advocate
for
would
be
a
regular
review
by
a
legislative
body
to
validate
how
the
how
the
system
is
performing
and
then
to
evaluate
whether
those
liability
calculations
in
the
level
dollar
could
be
adjusted
based
on
a
number
of
factors.
E
Everything
from
market
performance
to
mortality
rates
to
any
number
of
other
things
due
to
the
june
30th
snapshot
calculation.
I
would
say
that
the
the
impact
to
eku
this
year,
independent
of
the
8.9
million
dollar
contribution
from
the
general
fund
to
support
eku,
represents
a
2.3
million
dollar
increase
for
us
year
over
year.
E
So
our
net
contribution
to
kers
you're
over
you're,
independent
of
of
the
appropriated
dollars
by
this
body
is
2.3
million
in
additional
funds,
so
that
for
us,
is
going
to
impact
our
operating
budgets
and
we
will
that
will
be
2.3
million.
We
cannot
invest
in
student
outcomes.
E
Hospital
heat
also
expanded
the
power
of
kers
as
it
pertains
to
decision
making
on
data
and
being
able
to
assign
data,
and
so
we
would.
We
would
encourage
this,
this
committee
and
the
general
assembly
to
continue
to
to
work
with
kers
to
provide
some
additional
oversight
and
guidance
as
it
pertains
to
that
data,
verification
and
the
assignment
of
liabilities
going
forward.
E
Most
of
all,
we
feel
that
it
is
imperative
that
the
general
fund
support
be
maintained
in
years
to
come.
I
can't
say
this
enough
that
it
would
be
a
catastrophic
impact
to
any
of
our
institutions
to
have
beared
the
weight
of
this
transition
from
what
has
historically
been
nearly
70
years
of
percentage
of
payroll
participation
to
the
level
dollar
calculation.
E
While
we
are
understanding
that
this
is
the
beginning
of
a
journey
toward
a
promise
of
a
sustainable
and
solvent
k-e-r-s
retirement
system,
we
would
just
encourage
us
all
to
be
good
fiduciaries,
that
we
would
all
be
committed
to
good
governance
and
leading
in
a
way
that
we,
we
would
all
be
committed
to
seeing
through
the
hard
work
that
has
been
laid
to
set
us
on
this
path
and
I'll.
Stop
there,
mr
chair,
and
perhaps
we
can
entertain
any
questions.
A
Thank
you,
mr
president.
I'll
just
make
start
off
a
few
comments
about
your
last
points
about
the
the
review
of
the
analysis
performance.
We
already
have
the
public
pension
oversight
board
and,
as
a
member
of
that
board,
I
will
certainly
relate
to
the
co-chairs.
The
need
to
keep
this
on
the
radar
to
obviously,
representative
plessy
is
one
of
those
co-chairs
sponsor
of
house
bill
8..
I
believe
he'll
be
very
responsive
and
understanding
of
the
need
to
continue
the
performance
just
to
put
things
in
perspective.
A
A
We
can't
rely
on
that,
and
so
there
are
pensions
are
very
complex,
but
they
have
a
big
impact
in
university,
so
I
felt
like
it
was
important
one
question
that
I
have
and,
and
president
cabone
you
referred
to
a
lot
of
your
third-party
vendors.
Historically.
A
Have
a
lot
of
these
positions
been
part
of
the
pension
system.
G
Oh,
they
have
been,
and
one
of
the
things
that
sodexo
and
aramark
were
outsourced.
Those
functions
before
I
arrived,
I
think
sodexo
was
in
2016.,
and
so
the
question
is:
why
would
you
we
did
the
the
bookstore
just
last
year?
Why
would
you
do
that?
The
reality?
Is
we
drive
down
our
costs
by
contracting
with
companies
that
have
that
outside
expertise,
so
they
have
historically
participated.
G
There
are
some
advantages
and
disadvantages
both
to
the
I
think
to
the
the
employee,
sometimes
for
doing
that.
We
made
allowances
for
those
who
had
been
with
the
university
for
a
long
period
of
time
to
be
able
to
remain
university.
G
Employees
participate
in
the
pension,
new
hires
were
hired
by
the
outside
vendor,
and
so
we
were
really
sensitive
to
those
those
families
and
those
individual
needs
at
the
same
time
as
we're
similar
to
what
president
mcfadden
says,
we're
going
through
hiring
process
we're
seeing
folks
choosing
that
403
b
option,
and
also
looking
for
actually
looking
for
ways
to
reduce
the
number
of
folks
that
participate
in
in
the
pension
system.
Sure.
E
I
might
add
to
that,
and-
and
we
do
have
some
outsourced
services
as
well-
is
that
the
market
buying
power
of
some
of
these
third-party
vendors
is
immense
and
covid
really
ex.
You
know
for
us.
The
ability
to
have
a
third
party
partner
who
could
get
into
the
supply
chain
be
able
to
acquire
everything
from
hand
sanitizer
to
cleaning
substances
that
would
that
would
impact
that
really
gave
us
an
economy
of
scale
that
we
would
have
never
seen
as
an
institution
standing
alone,
and
so
there
is
obviously
the
employee
impact.
E
But
from
an
institutional
standpoint,
I
think
that
being
able
to
to
have
a
partner
who
is
able
to
to
bring
those
economies
of
scale
on
a
global
on
a
global
way
to
the
to
the
table,
something
that
is
impactful.
H
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
didn't
have
any
question
prepared,
but
your
last
comment
kind
of
cued,
my
brain
a
little
bit
these
third-party
vendors.
They
have
to
go
through
the
rfp
process.
Absolutely,
and
so
are
these
contracts,
usually
three-year
contracts
or
five-year
contracts.
G
G
Now
it
provided
30
million
dollars
of
investment
for
facilities,
so
it
is
a
deep
partnership.
These
are
not
short-term
contracts,
they're
long-term
relationships
right.
H
There's
I
would
just
say
that
I
think
that's
the
wish
of
all
the
members
that
they
remain
competitive
and
you
know
that
that
to
provide
that
level
of
service
and
accountability,
we
need
them
to
be
competitive.
Rfp
contracts.
G
A
good
example
would
be
we
just
bid
out
the
operations
of
the
bookstore
we'd
operate
our
bookstore
for
75
plus
years
on
campus,
and
we
went
to
all
the
national
vendors
follow
it.
We
had
a
local
vendor
and
we
also
had
barnes
and
noble
the
barnes
and
noble
package
drove
down
our
costs
to
operate
the
bookstore.
G
They
create
a
scholarship
fund
for
us.
They
help
us
renovate
the
bookstore
and
they
can
do
it
more
efficiently
again
because
of
economies
of
scale
access
to
supply
chain,
but
also
a
a
software
platform
that
allows
them
to
deliver
textbooks
and
electronic
materials
that
you
just
can't
grow
your
own
as
a
regional,
comprehensive.
Thank
you.
A
So
the
members
understand
the
context
of
this
discussion
house
bill
8
had
provisions
that
participating
qualified
entities
would
have
to
have
a
certain
percentage
of
their
employees
in
these
categories
as
part
of
the
kentucky
retirement
system,
I
believe
it's
60
percent
and
then
eventually
moving
up
to
80
percent.
So
this
is
an
important
conversation.
C
Yeah
from
the
beach,
so
this
is
relating
to
the
you
know,
having
to
pay
pensions
for
third
party
employees.
Are
any
other
government
entities
required
to
pay
pensions
for
for
subcontracted
employees
to
your
knowledge.
G
Well,
because
it's
a
new
arrangement,
we
haven't
had
those
conversations
yet,
but
I
think
we're
going
to
enter
into
those
conversations,
certainly
as
we're
negotiating
the
next
contract
they'll
be
an
important
point
for
us,
but
they
typically
would
offer
on
their
own
retirement
benefits.
Health
care
benefits,
other
benefits.
C
G
Their
employees-
and
I
will
tell
you,
we're
in
in
conversations
with
sodexo
right
now,
they're
gonna
actually
increase
because
of
competition
in
the
local
marketplace.
The
wages
of
their
employees
may
even
outstrip
the
university,
which
is
a
competitive
challenge
for
us
as
we're
fighting
for
talent,
but
there
there's
some
benefits
again
to
being
partnered
with
a
multinational
corporation.
A
G
So
we
could,
we
could
pull
information
for
you.
I
think
it's
it's
the
difference
in
the
two.
I
think
it's
kind
of
apples
and
oranges
right.
So
if
you
have
a
defined
benefit
plan,
you
know
it's
going
to
be
a
payment
per
month
or
payment
per
year,
it'll
grow
up
by
by
some
percentage.
If
you
have
a
defined
contribution
plan,
that's
portable.
G
Those
folks
have
an
asset
that
they
can
take
with
them.
They
may
draw
it
down
at
a
rate
that
they
decide
is
appropriate
for
their
their
level
of
of
living,
but
at
the
end
of
their
life
they
have
an
asset
there
they
may
be
may
pass
on
to
the
next
generation.
So
it's
a
little
bit
of
apples
and
oranges.
G
I
think
more
more
appropriate
would
be
a
comparison
between
those
folks
who
decide
to
take
their
their
accumulation
and
create
an
annuity
with
it,
that's
more
similar
to
the
pension,
but
we
can
pull
information
on
that.
C
I'd
be
very
interested
because
one
of
my
concerns
is
as
we
shift.
I
mean
our
people
and-
and
I've
been
kind
of
looking
for
this
data
in
a
lot
of
different
ways,
is
our
people
who
are
in
a
defined
contribution
plan,
actually
saving
enough
for
their
retirements
and
what
are
we
doing
as
a
society
if,
if,
when
our
our
loved
ones
are
elderly,
if
they're
not
taken
care
of
and
and
that's
kind
of
the
premise?
But
I
haven't
gotten
any
data
on
on
that
specifically.
But
I
would
appreciate
that.
E
Thank
you,
representative
bojanowski.
One
thing
I
would
add
is
you
know
we
just
did
some
workforce
analysis
and
you
know
the
data
indicates
that
our
graduating
seniors
this
year,
that
just
you
know
we
were
able
to
graduate
in
person
at
roy
kid
stadium
a
few
weeks
ago,
are
going
to
have
17
careers
along
the
span
at
17
different.
E
You
know
careers
across
the
span
of
their
working
life,
and
so
I
think
the
portability
aspect
is
something
that
is,
that
is
critically
important
for
them
to
not
lose
with
every
with
every
trade
as
they
think
about
whether
they're
gonna,
you
know,
have
a
life
of
public
service,
whether
it's
gonna
be
confined
to
the
commonwealth
of
kentucky
and
which
system
they
would
be
participating
in.
E
So
I
think
that
some
of
that
choice
is
is
really
a
a
resonating
kind
of
chorus
that
we're
hearing
from
employees
that
that,
if,
given
the
choice
today
that
that
having
more
control
is
something
that
they
want
to
over
their
own
over
their
own
future.
So.
G
If
I
could
add
just
a
little
bit
to
dr
mcfadden,
one
of
the
reasons
folks
choose
to
come
to
work
at
wku
is
both
flexibility
and
the
benefits
package
that
we
do
have
a
generous
match.
You
know
indiv,
seven
and
a
half
percent
by
them.
Seven
and
a
half
percent
from
the
university.
A
15
match
of
your
salary
over
a
career
is
a
tremendous
investment
and.
G
A
B
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
appreciate
the
opportunity.
I
have
two
really
unrelated
questions
and
that's
good
to
see.
Dr
kimboni
had
seen
you
in
a
while
time
looks
like
you're
still
fit
and
trim,
and
but
I
want
to
ask
there
both
of
y'all
dr
mcfadden.
I
know
you
have
aviation
program
and
so
forth.
Could
you
describe
what
the
senator
mentioned
in
terms
of
contracting
so
forth?
B
Could
you
describe
how
that
works
in
the
aviation
of
I
guess
field
that
y'all
offer
in
terms
of
contracting
and
working
with
with
the
private
sector
and
where
I'm
going
this,
and
if
you
don't
mind
doctor,
if
you
can
shed
some
light
on
the
aviation
and
in
terms
of
employees,
you
have
there
that
will
help
out
as
well,
because
we've
formed
an
aviation
caucus
and
there's
three
components.
B
We're
looking
at
education
is
the
main
component
of
this
to
help
the
workforce
to
supply
the
600
plus
job
companies
that
we
have.
So
if
you
can
share
just
a
little
bit
of
light
about
that,
and
then
I
also
want
to
dovetail
that
and
I'll
ask
this
question
as
well
performance
funding.
E
So
let
me
take
aviation
first,
I'm
not
sure.
If
president
caboney
is
happy
or
sad,
he
doesn't
have
a
flight
program
we'll
let
him
open
on
that.
But
we
are
excited
to.
E
The
only
four-year
flight
program
in
kentucky-
and
it
is
a
program
that
has
continued
to
grow
for
us.
This
body
has
made
a
substantial
investment
in
that
program
over
the
last
three
years,
and
we
are
very
appreciative
of
that.
We
operate
out
of
central
kentucky
regional
airport,
where
we
have
right
at
300
flight
students
who
are
flying
every
day
we
are
preparing.
E
We
have
100
job
placement
rate
for
for
those
students,
and
then
we
try
to
keep
some
of
them
around
to
be
our
flight
instructors,
because
that
is
kind
of
a
a
workforce,
choke
point
for
us
to
make
sure
that
we
have
one
flight
instructor
for
every
10
students
who
who
are
flying
with
us.
So
from
that
perspective,
contract
services
really
have
no,
no
major
bearing
on
on
the
program
that
is
all
taught
by
our
faculty.
Our
staff
on
campus,
really
our
contractual
services,
are
for
grounds
of
custodial
work.
E
It
is
for
our
bookstore
and
for
our
dining
partnership,
and
that
really
is
kind
of
inclusive
of
that
and
both
our
our
bookstore
and
our
dining
services
were
outsourced
probably
25
years
ago.
So
we
have
not
operated
those
those
functions
in-house
for
for
quite
some
time,
but
from
an
aviation
standpoint,
our
partnerships
really
kind
of
more
go
to
the
workforce
side
for
our
partnership
with
atlas
air.
E
Our
partnership
with
with
you
know,
boeing
our
partnership
with
with
delta,
with
with
american
trying
to
make
sure
that
we're
helping
feed
that
pipeline
for
for
the
600
000
pilots
that
are
going
to
be
needed
about
you
know
over
the
next
10
10
years
is
something
that
we're
focused
on.
We
also
kind
of
have
partnered
with
the
kctcs
campuses
on
the
amt
programs,
and
so
there
are
two
programs
here
in
kentucky
one
in
somerset,
one
one
in
jeffersonville
that
continues
to
be
a
conversation.
E
That's
going
on
and
as
aerospace
is
still
the
number
one
export
for
kentucky.
We
want
to
be
a
part
of
that,
and
so,
if
we
can
be
a
part
of
that
economic
recruitment
package
as
we're
educating
pilots
to
try
to
bring
more
air
service,
more
aerospace
investment
to
kentucky,
we
would
love
to
to
be
supportive
of
the
caucus
in
any
way
that
we
can.
E
E
If
you
talk
to
every
president,
you're,
probably
going
to
get
a
little
different
take
on
every
different
metric,
but
I
think
the
most
important
part
rather,
as
we
created
what
I
consider
to
be
a
safeguard
a
floor.
I
think
that
was
a
very
responsible
decision
and
we
were
advocates
and
supportive
of
the
bill
that
was
passed
this
year,
senator
givens
representative
tipton.
So
many
people
worked
on
that
throughout
the
process.
We're
very
supportive
of
that.
E
We
are
hopeful
that
what
we
see
perhaps
is
is
a
period
where
we
can
continue
to
see
sustainable
investments
in
higher
education
in
kentucky,
and
we
can
can
kind
of
get
back
and
gain
some
ground
back
that
maybe
we've
lost
over
over
the
last
several
years,
as
we've
kind
of
seen,
the
economic
you
know
up
and
down,
and
then
the
the
pressures
on
the
budget.
E
We
are
sensitive
to
the
fact
that
there
are
a
lot
of
needs
in
this
state,
from
pensions
to
corrections
to
health
and
human
services
to
to
education,
whether
it
be
k-12
or
post-secondary.
We
understand
that
there
are
a
lot
of
demands,
and
so
we
want
to
be
good
stewards
of
that
investment
and
we
always
want
to
come
and
make
sure
that
you
see
that
you're
getting
a
substantial
return
on
that
investment
and
had
you
been
on
either
of
our
campuses
in
the
last
three
weeks
to
see
the
the
you
know
nearly
3
000
graduates.
E
G
I'll
add
to
what
dr
mcfadden
said.
First,
thank
you
to
representative
tipton
and
senator
gibbons
for
their
good
work
to
help
revise
the
performance
funding
model.
We
also
were
very
supportive
of
creating
that
floor.
So
some
of
our
institutions
that
might
be
more
challenged
have
a
a
sustainable
floor
where
they
know
that
their
operations
will
and
their
funding
will
not
fall
below
and
at
the
same
time,
you've
heard
me
say
for
four
years
that
I
believe
in
competing
and
being
measured
for
the
work
that
we
do.
G
The
taxpayers
deserve
to
know
what
the
outcomes
are,
that
they're
paying
for
and
how
we're
doing
and
how
we're
doing
compared
to
other
universities,
and
I'm
thankful
for
the
additional
investment
that
the
state
has
made
in
higher
education
four
years,
in
particular
through
the
performance
funding
model,
and
I
think
that,
as
dr
mcfadden
said,
the
what's
important
for
us
is
a
sustainable,
predictable
increase
in
that
investment
over
time.
G
What
we
know
is
that,
if
we're
going
to
elevate
kentucky's
economy,
we
need
folks
who
have
post-secondary
education,
a
certificate,
a
two-year
degree,
a
technical
degree,
a
four-year
degree,
a
master's
degree
a
phd,
but
for
us
to
compete,
particularly
with
the
states
around
us,
and
we
feel
it
every
day
with
tennessee
to
our
south.
We've
got
to
continue
to
invest
if
we're
going
to
continue
to
attract
the
businesses
that
we
want
to
attract
as
a
state,
and
so
I'm
very
pleased
with
where
we
wound
up
again
as
presidents
or
want
to
do.
G
We
can
quibble
over
certain
metrics
and
how
things
are
measured,
it's
kind
of
how
we're
built,
but
at
the
same
time,
I
think
we're
all
of
the
opinion
that
the
formula
is
fair
and
particularly
with
the
tweaks
that
we
made
this
year.
E
You
know
one
one
thing
I
would
add,
and
this
will
be
a
preview
for
dr
thompson
as
he
gets
up
here.
Is
you
know
one
challenge
we're
seeing
here
in
kentucky's
college
going
right
of
our
graduating
seniors:
fafsa
applications.
You
know
there
are
some
concerns,
as
we
come
out
of
the
other
side
of
this
pandemic,
that
we
don't
want
to
have
a
lost
generation
here,
and
we
want
to
make
sure
that
we're
providing
opportunities
and
meet
students
where
they're
at,
and
so
I
know
that
we're
on
the
road
every
day.
E
I
know
president
cabone
is
on
the
road
every
day
trying
to
to
make
an
impact
on
our
kentucky
graduating
seniors,
but
there's
there's
a
lack
of
engagement
there
that
that
we
need
to
you
know
we're
going
to
have
to
figure
out
this
p20
partnership
and
make
sure
that
it's
a
seamless
transition
between
our
public
school
systems
and
our
public
universities,
along
with
our
private
institutions
as
well,
but
specifically
our
public
institutions.
So
we
we
should.
We
should
be
accountable
to
one
another
for
that.
So.
G
However,
we
can
contact
those
families.
We
can
do
our
part
to
educate
them
about
the
benefit
of
a
university
degree
of
a
technical
degree
of
continuing
their
education
and
right
now,
my
understanding
is,
we
don't
have
access
to
those
data
and
we've
got
to.
We
got
to
work
together
and
deepen
that
partnership,
so
it
becomes
more
seamless.
H
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I'll
wrap
it
up
here.
Switching
gears
completely
just
want
to
put
this
on
your
radar
different
topic.
I'm
sure
you've
read
the
papers
and
understand
that,
there's
this
mounting
pressure
for
us
to
look
at
curriculum
at
our
universities
and
what
is
what
is
being
taught,
you
know
to
our
kids
and
should
the
state
be
supporting
such
initiatives
and
those
sorts
of
things
and
I've
been
in
several
discussions
with
other
members
about
this
topic.
H
How
can
we
make
the
curriculum
more
transparent
to
not
only
this
the
parents
or
the
students,
but
the
taxpayer,
and
so
that,
rather
than
controlling
curriculum,
maybe
that's
a
way
that
we
can
hold
our
universities
accountable.
So
I
just
want
to
lob
that
out
there
and
give
you
some
time
to
chew
on
that
and
think
about
that.
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
A
President
caboni
president
mcfadden,
thank
you
for
your
time
today
and
your
input,
and
I
am
confident
we
will
be
talking
again
several
times
before
the
22
session,
our
next
segment
on
the
agenda.
We
have
actually
three
separate
presentations
from
the
council
on
post,
secondary
education
as
president
thompson
and
his
team
are
coming
forward.
I
will
remind
the
members
that
the
meeting
will
adjourn
at
12
30
if
not
before,
but
we
have
to
have
the
room
available
for
a
meeting
at
one
o'clock.
A
So
may
be
becau.
Be
aware
of
that
in
your
questions
and
comments
and
what
I
would
suggest
president
thompson
is
we
deal
with
one
topic
and
then
give
the
members
an
opportunity
to
ask
questions
on
that,
because,
even
though
they
are
related,
they
are
different.
So
president
thompson,
your
team,
please
introduce
yourself
for
the
record
and
proceed.
F
Thank
you,
chair
tipton,
aaron
thompson,
president
of
the
council,
on
post-secondary
education
to
my
right.
Here
we
have
dr
bill
payne
who's,
our
vp
for
finance
and
budget
to
my
left.
We
have
sean
mccarron,
who
is
our
budget
director
and
we're
happy
to
be
here
committee
to
talk
to
you
about
these
three
separate
topics.
I
I
will
tell
you
my
colleagues,
dr
caboni
and
dr
dr
mcfadden
actually
took
some
of
my
introductory
remarks,
so
it's
shorter
for
me
speaking
a
couple
of
things
I
do
want
to
say
I
want.
F
First
of
all,
I
want
to
thank
this
body
as
well
as
the
governor's
office
for
putting
money
forth
for
higher
education.
You
did
last
year
covet,
you
know,
put
it
on
hold,
but
we
had
to
end
up
having
a
flat
budget
this
past
year
we
got
money
put
in
the
budget
for
the
first
time
in
13
years
and
we're
happy
about
that.
F
We're
extremely
happy,
but
we
also
want
to
state
that
we've
been
good
stewards
of
those
dollars
and
even
over
that
time,
where
we
did
not
have
new
money
put
in
and
in
some
cases
cut
what
we
talked
about
was
return
on
investment.
What
we
talked
about
was
the
value
of
higher
education.
What
we
talked
about
was
the
strategic
investment
and
not
just
being
looked
at
as
something
that
you
have
to
fund
and
you've.
F
If
you've
been
looking
at
any
of
our
data,
we
put
out
you
talk
about
senator
west
transparency,
you
know
I've
been
accused
of
being
too
transparent,
but
you
know
we
put
out
there
and
we
talk
about
truly
what
it
means
to
be
invested
into
the
future
of
the
state
of
our
workforce
of
the
economy,
and
it's
important
to
understand
that
the
most
direct
correlation,
I'm
a
statistician
by
trade,
I
can
even
show
causality
between
a
strong
workforce
and
a
strong
economy,
is
how
higher
ed
is
directly
associated
with
that
and
we're
proud
to
say.
F
That's
what
we've
been
doing
and
in
this
presentation
today
you're
going
to
see
a
variety
of
things,
we're
going
to
talk
about
performance
funding,
the
impact
it
has
had
you're,
also
going
to
see
some
of
the
pieces
of
the
federal
money
that's
been
given
to
us,
as
well
as
how
we've
used
your
state
dollars.
But
I
will
say
before
I
get
started
just
pick
up
on
what
dr
mcfadden
said.
You
know-
and
I
talked
about
this
yesterday
in
in
our
testimony-
we're
going
to
have
to
create
a
better
pipeline
to
get
folk
into
our.
F
Yet
when
you
have
a
50.5
college,
going
rate
of
those
that
graduate
we're,
leaving
almost
half
of
our
body
on
the
table
of
not
being
fully
engaged,
and
some
of
those
may
have
a
cte
certificate
coming
out
of
high
school
small
portion,
so
we've
got
to
figure
out
somehow
how
we
make
this
transition
similar
in
in
ways
of
thinking
about
those
outcomes,
and
we
have
to
think
about
how
we
do
this
in
a
way
that
truly
builds
where
kentucky
needs
to
go.
So
I
appreciate
the
investment
representative
tipton,
I
think
you
were
on.
F
I
know
you
were
as
well
as
senator
gibbons
on
this
performance
funding
task
force.
I
think
dr
capilouto
and
myself
were
the
only
two
holdovers
from
several
years
ago,
but
this
bill
was
good.
It
really
allowed
us
to
see
exactly
how
we
could
use
those
incentives,
those
strategic
inputs
to
get
the
outputs
that
we
argue
that
we
need
to
get
so
I'm
going
to
shut
up
and
I'll.
Let
these
guys
take
over
and
I'll
interject
as
we
go
along.
We'll
do
one
topic
at
a
time
as
he
suggested.
Okay,.
I
The
the
first
topic
for
that
this
committee
asked
us
to
to
cover
is
the
federal
funding
related
to
the
coronavirus
and
its
availability
to
the
postsecondary
institutions.
I
As
you
may
know,
there
are
three
pieces
of
federal
legislation
that
have
provided
funding
to
the
postsecondary
institutions
to
respond
to
the
pandemic.
The
cares
act
passed
by
congress
in
march
2020
cyrissa,
the
coronavirus
response
and
relief,
supplemental
appropriation
act
passed
in
december
of
2020,
and
the
american
rescue
plan
passed
this
past
march.
I
The
cares
act
sarissa
and
arp
have
provided
over
750
million
dollars
to
the
kentucky
universities
and
community
colleges
in
total
about
40
percent
or
296
million
dollars.
Of
this
funding
has
to
be
provided
to
students
through
emergency
financial
aid
grants.
The
remaining
456
million
can
be
used
to
offset
costs
incurred,
or
revenues
lost
as
a
result
of
the
pandemic.
I
Campuses
can
claim
costs
related
to
covit,
19,
testing,
personal
protective
equipment,
cleaning
moving
to
online
instruction
refunds
of
room
and
board
and
parking
fees.
They
can
also
claim
foregone
revenue.
That's
directly
related
to
the
pandemic,
such
as
the
reduction
of
enrollment
or
facilities.
Rentals
institutions
have
access
to
this
funding,
primarily
through
the
higher
education
emergency
relief
fund,
or
here
the
governor
was
also
provided.
Funds
for
education
through
the
cares
act
and
cyrissa
the
governor's
emergency
education
relief
fund
or
gear
funds.
I
I
I
The
private
institutions
received
a
million
dollars,
a
million
and
a
half
were
set
aside
for
pressing
need
and
ultimately,
that
pressing
need
was
determined
to
be
mental
health
for
the
institutions.
F
F
So
these
dollars
that
we
asked
the
governor
for
went
mainly
to
build
that
process
around
how
we
can
help
many
of
these
folks
who
are
dealing
with
these
issues.
I
Cyrissa
provided
another
19
million
dollars
to
kentucky
for
the
gear
funds,
so
we
refer
to
that
as
gear
two,
the
governor
designated
four
million
dollars
for
the
post-secondary
institutions.
F
Now,
once
again,
you
may
ask:
why
would
post-secondary
use
the
money
we've
been
given
to
work
with
our
p12
folk?
Well,
it's
important
it's
what
I
said
earlier.
We
wanted
to
make
sure
that
we
gave
these
students
the
best
chance
possible
to
be
successful
and
post-secondary,
so
we
wanted
to
actually
have
those
summer
programs
that
are
now
in
place
to
make
sure
we
get
the
skill
up
and
the
academic,
as
well
as
the
social
and
emotional
preparation
for
college.
F
I
As
I
mentioned
earlier,
the
institutions
received
40
million
dollars
of
the
coronavirus
relief
fund.
Crf.
You
can
see
the
allocations
to
the
institutions
in
this
table.
The
first
half
of
the
funding,
20
million
dollars,
was
allocated
along
with
a
20
million
dollar
reduction
in
state
general
fund
appropriations
and
that
and
that
reduction
was
a
part
of
house
bill.
I
And
this
chart
is
a
very
detailed
chart,
but
it's
a
very
high
level
summary
of
the
federal
funds
available
to
the
institutions
and
the
costs
and
foregone
revenues
that
that
have
been
identified
last
fiscal
year
through
the
current
fiscal
year.
It
does
not
include
any
of
the
funding
that
the
institutions
must
use
for
those
emergency
grants
to
students,
the
cost
and
foregone
revenue.
Information
was
collected
in
march,
so
it's
a
little
dated
and
we
asked
for
pandemic
related
costs
and
forecount
revenue.
I
So
we
need
to
make
that
very
clear
in
mid-may
the
allocations
to
the
institutions
of
the
american
rescue
plan
were
made,
and
so
we
added
those
those
those
available
funds
in
that
third
column
there
in
in
the
chart,
and
so
hence
the
the
may
12th
date
we
have
up
there
if
you
subtract
column
b,
the
the
eligible
costs
and
fork
on
revenues
from
column,
a
you
get
the
federal
award
deficit
or
or
residual
for
each
institution.
As
of
may
12.
D
And
sean
I'm
just
going
to
jump
in
and
make
sure
that
committee
members
are
aware
the
campuses
have
to
incur
these
costs
or
incur
the
foregone
revenue
before
they
seek
reimbursement.
D
I
But
are
there
any
questions
about?
I
think
we're
finished.
I
A
I
will
I'll
start
off
with
a
question
here
and
part
of
your
recent
comments.
You
referred
that
the
crf
funds
that
20
million
dollars
was
used
to
replace
a
reduction
in
appropriation
is
that,
in
reference
to
the
two
percent
of
the
base
that
went
for
the
performance
based
model
in
the
previous
fiscal
year,.
I
The
the
two
percent
for
the
performance
fund
is
for
next
fiscal
year.
The
two
percent
reduction
in
general
fund
is
is
for
the
current
fiscal
year.
For
this.
A
Current
this
correct
year
we're
in
right
now
there
was
a
two
percent
reduction
to
go
into
the
performance
pool.
So
is
that
where
that
20
million
dollars
is,
is
that
what
that
20
million
dollars
is
referenced
when
it
says
a
replace
a
general
fund
reduction.
I
A
D
So
so,
how
house
bill
192
restores
that
20
million
in
the
upcoming
fiscal
year
and
the
performance
funds
that
were
earned
by
the
institutions
in
the
current
year
were
added
to
the
base
for
next
fiscal
year
as
well.
So
it
does
not
impact
performance
funding.
Okay,.
A
Just
want
to
get
clarification
on
that
in
looking
at
the-
I
guess,
I'm
you
know
I'm
one
of
these
people
like
to
look
at
numbers.
We've
got
a
lot
of
numbers
on
this
last
printout
bottom
line.
A
F
F
If
you
want
to
call
it
that
so
in
the
end,
just
like
you
see,
a
research
university
is
already
showing
that
you're
going
to
see
many
of
our
other
institutions
showing
that
now
I
carefully
say
that
without
playing
a
shell
game
and
saying
that
there
may
be
some
residual
dollars
that
we
can't
spend
in
some
areas
because
of
the
federal
guidelines,
but
we
don't
know
that
for
sure
yet,
but
in
a
net
we'll
be
in
deficit.
Would
you
all
agree
with
that?.
D
Yeah,
I
agree
100
dr
thompson
and
a
lot
of
these
dollars
that
were
the
institutional
portion
that
were
allocated
directly
to
the
institutions.
They
have
the
ability
to
spend
those
dollars
on
emergency
financial
aid
grants
for
students
as
well.
D
F
A
Could
you
enlighten
us
a
little
bit
on
the
foregone
revenue?
What
are
the
main
factors
that
attribute
to
the
foregone
revenue,
and
I
assume
we're
talking
about
reductions
in
tuition
and
fees
and
things
like
that
and
other
services?
Could
you
give
us
a
little
breakdown
of
where
this
foregone
revenue
is
coming
from
and
how
it's
determined.
F
F
Is
that
as
we
deal
with
these
wrap
around
services
to
help
students
to
become
everything
they
can
be
with
the
needed
help.
That's
I
mean
they're
gonna
have
to
spend
tons
of
money
on
that
as
they
come
back
face
to
face
in
full
force.
To
be
honest
with
you,
that's
not
even
being
calculated,
I'm
not
even
talking
about
what
it
took
to
make
everything
virtual
and
make
it
work
in
a
manner
that
really
had
some
success
and
how
quickly
we
did
that.
F
A
H
You,
mr
chairman,
I
think
this
is
a
question.
Probably
a
lot
of
members
receive
directly
from
constituents
who
have
students
attending
university
on
and
I'm
referring
specifically
to
slide
five
and
and
slide
seven,
where
it
talks
about
refunds
for
room
and
board
and
parking
that
those
types
of
things.
H
So
a
lot
of
students
signed
up
got
into
the
coronavirus,
and
you
know
they're
not
on
campus
anymore,
but
several
universities
continue
to
charge
for
that,
even
though
the
kids
weren't
staying
on
campus.
So
it
specifically
says
in
here
that
these
funds
can
be
used
for
that
purpose
to
reimburse
for
those
costs.
What.
H
From
members,
I
know
you
can't
speak
for
every
university,
but
what
what
are
the
universities
doing
about
that?
Are
they
are
there
plans
in
place
to
reimburse
students
who
paid
for
on
campus
living
or
parking
and
but
weren't
able
to
to
use
that.
F
Yes,
without
a
doubt
and
they're
doing
it
in
a
variety
of
ways,
some
are
doing
it
and
giving
them
refunds
on
their
bills,
some
giving
direct
call,
I
mean,
giving
it
to
them
and
so
on,
but
absolutely
and
the
interesting
part
of
this,
and
you
may
be
going
down
this
path.
The
interesting
part
of
this
is
even
trying.
F
This
is
another
cost
by
the
way
to
account
for
all
of
these
pieces,
with
that
many
folk
with
people
coming
in
having
to
leave
because
they
got
covet.
You
know
where
does
that
fall
in
and
when
did
they
leave?
What
about
return
to
I
mean
there's
so
many
moving
parts
here,
but
yes,
I
mean
that's
exactly
what
they're
using
those
dollars
for
have
you
guys
heard
anything
different.
I
I
know
last
year
about
this
time.
There
was
a
lot
of
discussion,
housing
credits
versus
refunds,
but
I
I
can't
give
you
any
specifics
as
to.
I
H
F
Absolutely
and
I'm
sure
that
is
absolutely
correct-
I
mean
I
have
a
daughter
who's
in
an
institution
and
she
stayed.
She
went
to
class
stayed
at
home,
but
she
still
had
a.
She
still
had
a
dining
cart
right.
That
was
a
part
of
the
contract.
So
how
does
that
work?
So
there
are
things
that
we're
still
trying
to
work
through.
I
had
a
son
that
went
to
I'm
speaking
personally
here.
F
I'm
just
saying:
had
a
son
that
last
year
went
to
spain,
I
paid
full
everything
for
him
to
go
to
spain,
but
then
he
was
brought
back
after
four
weeks.
You
know
how
does
that
play
into
it
right,
so
I
hear
what
you're
saying,
but
it's
not
uniform,
but
I
do
know
that
each
have
a
plan
to
do
that,
even
though
they're
doing
it
in
a
variety
of
ways,
but
we
could
probably
give
you
even
more
specifics.
If
you
like.
A
I
Chairman,
as
I'm
sure
you
know,
cpe
and
the
institutions
have
been
prioritizing
asset
preservation
projects
over
new
construction
for
the
past
several
biennia,
largely
because
of
the
great
need
and
the
lack
of
state
investment
in
these
kinds
of
projects
in
2007.
A
comprehensive
study
was
conducted
of
all
the
education
and
general
facilities
on
campuses
in
2013.
I
The
firm
that
conducted
that
study
vfa
updated
their
projections
of
the
spending
needed
to
bring
these
facilities
up
to
industry
standards
and,
as
you
might
imagine
as
time
goes
on
facilities,
age
and
these
costs
increase
and
for
the
current
period
2017
to
2021.
I
The
cumulative
need
that
vfa
has
identified
for
asset
preservation
on
our
campuses
of
eng
facilities
is
over
seven
billion
dollars.
Meanwhile,
state
investment
has
been
significantly
less
than
that
amount
over
the
past
several
biennia
about
281
million
dollars
since
2008.
I
Since
1998
2000,
the
state
has
funded
new
construction
over
asset
preservation
at
a
ratio
of
about
three
to
one
about
1.7
billion
dollars
in
state
funding
for
new
and
expanded
eng
space
over
this
time
period
versus
a
little
over
500
million
dollars
for
asset
preservation,
as
you
may
remember,
because
the
need
for
asset
preservation
is
so
great
for
the
current
biennium
20
2022,
a
cpu
requested
400
million
dollars
in
state
bonds
to
be
matched
with
200
million
dollars
in
campus
resources
for
asset
preservation.
I
There
were,
there
was
no
request
for
state
funding
for
new
construction
or
information
technology
projects.
Each
cp's
request
included
a
pooled
approach,
meaning
that
each
institution
would
have
a
share
of
the
asset
preservation.
Funding
pool
that
was
equal
to
its
share
of
the
total
asset
preservation
need,
as
identified
in
the
vfa
study.
So
we
used
a
scientific
approach
to
to
allocate
that
that
asset
preservation
pool
funding.
I
A
I
D
A
A
long
time
and
and
and
we
talk
about
asset
preservation,
you
know
it's
it's
it's
a
lot.
It's
really
nice
to
have
ground
breaking
for
new
facilities,
but
you've
got
a
dorm
across
campus
that
needs
a
new
roof
or
you've
got
an
infrastructure,
a
physical
plant
system.
I
think
murray
state's
an
example,
and
what
is
the
I
guess,
what
is
the
strategy?
What
is
the
process
from
cpe's
perspective
about
how
each
analyzing,
what
projects
need
to
be
done?
A
Let's
say,
for
example,
we
were
to-
and
I
can't
speak
for
general
assembly
authorize
some
type
of
asset
preservation
bond
for
the
next
biennium
and
we'll
come
back
in
22.
What
would
be
the
process
for
prioritizing
from
campus
to
campus?
Which
projects
are
most
essential
and
have
the
most
benefit
to
students?
A
F
Know
you
asked
two
particular
questions.
I
one
is.
How
would
we
go
about
doing
this?
We
would
probably
do
it
similarly
than
we've
done
it
that
we've
done
it
in
the
past.
We
would
ask
for,
let's
say,
a
10
percent
portion
of
the
7.3
billion,
which
is
a
drop
in
the
bucket
right,
and
we
would
ask
the
campuses
to
put
in
their
skin
in
that
game
too,
as
somewhat
of
a
match
anywhere
from
25
to
50.
F
But
it
truly
is
one
of
those
things
like
depends
on
what
the
year
is
to
what
becomes
necessary.
The
point
that
you're
making,
though
and
the
point
that
we're
making
is
that
our
buildings
are
falling
down
around
us
and
that's
not
sexy.
When
you
go
to
a
campus
and
say:
we've
invested
several
million
dollars
into
putting
a
new
roof
on
this
building.
It
doesn't
look
good,
but
it
really
provides
exactly
what
we
need
in
this
state
now
more,
in
my
opinion,
the
new
building.
D
And
I
would
just
add
to
that
chair
tipton,
that
every
two
years,
cpe
staff
works
with
our
campuses
to
develop
their
six-year
capital
plans
and
within
those
plans
they
identify.
F
A
And
you
know:
if,
for
those
who've
gone
through
the
budget
process,
a
lot
of
times,
you'll
see
requests
for
agency
bonds,
and
that's
that's
what
the
president
is
speaking
to
where
the
institution
actually
puts
puts
through
all
the
skin
in
the
game
for
a
project
they
feel
is
important.
A
Would
it
be
possible
for
you
all
to
get
to
the
members,
possibly
a
list
of
these
projects
by
university
so
that
we
as
members,
understand
what
we're
talking
about,
because
I
know
you're
going
to
come
back
and
ask
for
the
bond
again
so
so
we,
as
the
members,
understand
exactly
what
it
is
you're
asking
for
and
what
the
need
is.
Could
you
get
that
to
to
the
members?
I
think
that
would
be
very
beneficial
for
us
as
members
to
know
specifically
what
type
of
projects
and
which
institutions
have
the
need.
B
B
He's
good
at,
but
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
this
type
of
deferred,
maintenance
and
preservation
is
going
to
be
going
through
the
capital,
planning,
advisory
board
or
updating
on
that
list,
and
there
is
a
list
already
provided
in
that.
So
I
know
our
first
meeting
is
june,
the
23rd
at
one
o'clock.
It
just
got
changed
so
and
I
don't
know
if
you
how-
and
this
is
new-
a
new
board
to
me.
B
I
I
I
predict
that
the
the
approach
that
cp
takes
is
going
to
be
very
similar
and
I
look
forward
to
finding
out
the
date
at
the
next
meeting
when
I
get
back
to
the
office.
But
it's
a
constant
process.
The
the
campuses
are
committed
to
the
to
the
process.
I
The
capital
planning
advisory
board
is
a
big
part
of
that
process
and
we
rely
on
that.
The
data
that
the
campuses
present
to
us
through
that
process
as
well
so
every
every
institution
takes
it
very
seriously
and
it's
it's
an
important
part
of
our
work.
F
The
other
thing
I
would
add,
mr
chair,
is
that
we'll
get
you
that
data,
but
if
you
all
want
a
group
of
people
to
sit
down
with
these
guys
who
know
this
probably
to
ad
nauseam,
I
will
be
happy
to
even
sit
down
with
you
and
go
through
the
process.
As
representative
mccool
just
indicated,
the
capital
planning
advisory
group
also
has
a
part
to
play
in
this
conversation.
H
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
think,
mr
chairman,
you
had
an
excellent
idea
as
far
as
getting
us
that
information
for
these.
H
Basically,
these
needs
at
the
universities,
and
one
reason
I
think
that's
really
important
is
hopefully
we
can.
If
we
do
get
this
2.8
billion
or
whatever
additional
money.
That's
coming
from
the
feds.
That's
a
big
pot
of
money.
That's
going
to
have
a
lot
of
there'll,
be
a
little
bit
of
competition
to
or
ideas
to
use
those
funds
and
to
me,
asset
preservation
is,
is
one
great
way
to
use.
H
You
know
one-time
monies
for
non-recurring
expenses.
I
guess
I
would
classify
these
as
non-recurring
expenses,
their
capital
improvements.
Although
there's
we
can
spend
a
lot
of
money
each
year,
they're
they're
supposed
to
be
capital
one-time
expenditures.
So
I
would
ask
that
that
we
round
something
up
fairly
quickly,
which
probably
not
that
hard
to
do.
H
F
D
Well,
that
the
50
cents
on
the
dollar
is
what
cpe
staff
and
our
council
approved,
and
that
was
part
of
our
budget
request,
but
that
was
prior
to
the
pandemic.
So.
H
H
A
F
Well
I'll
cut
down
on
my
introduction
here
just
to
let
you
know.
Once
again,
I
appreciate
the
conversation
we
had
as
much
as
the
outcome.
I
have
to
tell
you
because
it
was
healthy.
We
talked
about
a
lot.
We
learned
a
lot
higher
education,
as
some
of
you
know.
I
mean
a
little
over
three
years
ago.
We
transformed
the
way
that
we
that
we
provide
funding
to
our
institutions.
F
It
was
a
legacy
way
of
doing
it
before
it's
just
whatever
you
had
percentage.
That's
what
you
got
now
it's
about
how
you
perform
with
outcomes,
to
what
you
get,
and
this
past
legislation
really
taken.
Some
of
those
campuses
off
that
cliff
that
financial
cliff
is
crucial
to
the
way
we
need
to
do
business
in
kentucky
with
our
higher
ed
institution.
F
So
I
really
appreciate
that
you're
going
to
see
some
things
in
here
I'll
interject
as
we
go
along
that
you're
going
to
see
some
outcomes,
so
I
do
want
to
thank
the
governor's
office
and
this
legislative
body
for
putting
forth
a
two
percent
into
this
pool
that
we've
been
able
to
distribute
already
and
we're
hoping
to
see
even
better
outcomes.
In
which
we're
going
to
need
for
sure
after
covet,
so
I'm
let
these
guys
take
over
and
I'll
just
interject
as
we
go.
If
that's
okay
bill.
D
Thank
you,
president
thompson
and
I'm
gonna
break
performance
funding
down
into
two
parts.
First,
I
want
to
give
some
background
information
to
the
committee
members
about
the
post-secondary
education
working
group
and
the
recommendations
that
they
made
and
how
that
fed
into
senate
bill
135,
which
was
passed
by
the
house
and
senate
and
signed
into
law
by
the
governor.
And
then
I
want
to
talk
about
the
performance
distribution
for
this
upcoming
fiscal
year
2021-22.
D
The
working
group
was
convened
by
cpe
in
july,
and
we
met
six
times
between
july
and
september
and
that
working
group
was
charged
to
do
three
things,
and
you
can
see
the
three
bullets
on
this
slide
number
one
determine
if
the
funding
models
are
functioning
as
expected,
and
I
say
models
because
there
is
a
university
model
and
a
kctcs
model
identify
any
unintended
consequences
of
the
models
and
recommend
any
adjustments
to
the
models
next
slide
shown
and
and
what
the
working
group
basically
found
was
that
the
models
were
functioning
as
expected,
and
specifically,
they
determined
that
state
funding
is
no
longer
being
distributed
based
on
historical
share,
but
on
student
success
outcomes
produced
and
some
operational
support
activity.
D
Metrics
and,
more
importantly,
the
models
are
providing
the
financial
incentives
to
encourage
student
progression
and
timely
completion
at
our
campuses,
and
there
are
premiums
embedded
in
those
models
for
stem
plus,
h,
degree,
production,
underrepresented,
minority
and
low
income,
degree,
production
and,
and
that
third
bullet,
I
believe,
is
very
important.
Our
our
institutions
are
reacting
to
these
models.
Strategically,
there
is
increased
alignment
between
campus
and
state
goals.
D
D
Dr
thompson
mentioned
that
we
wanted
to
share
some
outcomes
in
one
way
that
this
working
group
assessed
these
models
and
to
try
to
determine
if
they
were
functioning
as
expected
was
to
examine
results
in
terms
of
degree
production
and
that's
what
this
slide
is
showing
and
dr
thompson.
You
want
to
tell
me.
F
If
you
will
to
make
that
happen,
I'm
happy
to
say
that
kentucky
is
one
of
the
leading
states
in
doing
some
of
this,
as
you
well
know,
but
if
you
look
at
what's
happening
with
our
baccalaureate
degree,
production
as
well
as
our
credential
production.
Over
the
last
many
years,
we've
increased
by
17
and
a
half
percent
overall
degrees
and
credentials.
F
Now
I
don't
know
if
you
all
know
how
big
that
is,
that's
big,
but
if
you
take
our
underrepresented
minorities,
it's
over
35
percent,
we're
closing
gaps
in
this
area
as
fast
or
faster
than
any
other
state.
When
you
look
at
these
outcomes,
those
stem
outcomes,
when
you
look
at
what
we're
doing
and
the
areas
are
producing
exactly
what's
needed
for
the
state
and
job
growth,
we've
done
it
as
an
example.
F
During
this
cobi
time,
ninety
percent
of
the
people
on
unemployment
did
not
have
a
higher
ed
credential
as
a
direct
way
of
thinking
strategically
about
where
we
were
needing
to
go
in
the
state.
So
I
won't
take
up
all
the
time
here,
but
if
you
look
at
those
percentages,
this
gives
you
an
example
of
what
we've
been
able
to
do.
So
this
is
about
targeted
effort.
F
This
is
about
strategic
effort,
almost
all
of
our
four-year
campuses,
if
not
all,
now
have
a
promised
program-
a
last
dollar
in
they're
putting
more
money
in
need-based
scholarships
than
they're
getting
from
other
need-based
scholarship
programs
for
the
state.
So
the
point
I'm
trying
to
make
is
that
the
campuses
not
only
shifted
the
way
they
thought
about
funding.
They
shifted
the
way
they
are
doing
business,
and
I
I
have
another
10
minute
speech
on
that
that
I
won't
give
you
now,
but
this
chart
shows
a
lot.
D
Next
slide
sean-
and
this
is
what
president
thompson
was
just
speaking
about
our
north
star-
the
goal
that
guides
all
of
our
work
is
that
60
percent
college
attainment
by
the
year
2030
and
kentucky
is
on
track
to
achieve
this
goal.
D
As
you
can
see
in
the
chart
on
the
right,
the
the
red
line
represents
the
percent
change
from
the
prior
year
and
undergraduate
degrees
and
credentials
produced.
D
The
green
shaded
area
is
the
average
annual
growth
rate
needed
to
hit
our
goal
in
2030,
and
if
you
look
at
the
where
the
the
red
line
is
above
the
green
shaded
area
for
that
four
year
period,
we're
averaging
about
3.5
percent
growth
per
year
and
what
we
need
to
hit
our
goal
is
1.7
percent
per
year.
So
we're
very
much
on
track
to
hit
that
20
by
30
goal
as
of
right
now,
and
we
believe
that
the
performance
funding
model
has
contributed
to
that
growth.
F
Now,
without
a
doubt,
as
you
all
know,
this
we'll
see
what
kobe
does
to
us
and
we
we,
the
fafsa
rates,
are
down
the
college.
Going
rates
are
down,
the
people
are
graduating
from
high
school
period
are
down,
so
we
we're
needing
to
figure
out
somehow
how
we
build
this
p20
way
of
thinking
about
keep
feeding
this
this
growth,
but
we
we
are
we're
not
just
waiting
to
see
what
happens
where.
As
you
all
know,
we
are
we're
doing
the
things
now,
we're
we're
creating
innovation
as
we
go.
F
I
tell
people
so,
but
the
performance,
my
performance
funding
model,
surely
is
showing
and
driving
a
lot
of
this
growth.
D
In
terms
of
unintended
consequences,
the
working
group
identified
two
main
consequences,
and
you
can
see
that
on
this
particular
slide.
The
first
was
that
for
the
first
four
years
of
implementation
of
the
models,
they
were
applied
with
no
new
funding
from
the
state,
and
you
can
see
that
in
the
table
highlighted
in
the
yellow
column
there
and
just
so
the
committee
knows
year.
Zero
kentucky
state
university
was
not
included
in
the
funding
model
in
that
in
that
first
year,
and
so
we
refer
to
that
as
year.
D
But
for
those
first
four
years
there
was
no
new
funding,
as
you
can
see
in
the
institution
contribution
column,
our
institutions,
either
through
stop-loss
contributions
or
other
institutional
carve-outs,
we're
contributing
money
to
the
performance
fund
over
that
four-year
time
period,
and
you
can
see
the
shift
as
we
move
into
year,
four
2021-22
and
as
a
result
of
senate
bill
135,
which
essentially
and
we'll
talk
a
little
bit
more
about
this.
In
a
moment.
D
It
essentially
for
the
next
three
years
in
in
addition
to
establishing
that
floor,
that
president
mcfadden
spoke
about
it,
establishes
a
zero
percent.
Stop
loss,
which
means
there
is
no
carve
out
from
the
institutions
in
any
in
all.
Funding
that
is
is
provided
to
the
performance
fund
would
be
through
appropriations
from
the
general
assembly,
and
you
can
see
the
17.3
million
dollars
there
at
the
bottom
of
the
yellow
column
and,
as
president
thompson
said,
our
institutions
and
cpe
are
very
appreciative
for
that
two
percent
contribution
from
the
state
for
performance
funding.
D
The
other
unintended
consequence
was
that
in
2021-22,
the
upcoming
year
to
hold
harmless
on
in
the
stop-loss
provisions
were
scheduled
to
sunset,
and
we
had
three
universities
and
six
kctcs
institutions
that
would
have
been
facing
fiscal
cliffs
had
that
occurred.
But
again
that
was
addressed
with
senate
bill.
135
next
slide
shown.
D
So
here's
what
the
working
group
recommended.
They
asked
that
a
general
fund
floor
be
established
equal
to
the
regular
appropriation
in
2021
plus
any
performance,
distribution,
minus
debt
service
and
mandated
programs,
and
that
floor
should
be
prioritized
going
forward
over
providing
new
funds
to
the
performance
fund.
D
Also
going
forward,
there
should
be
no
redistribution
of
base
funding
among
the
institutions,
in
other
words,
no
more
robbing
peter
to
pay
paul,
and
that
was
part
of
the
reason
why
the
working
group
decided
that
we
needed
to
establish
that
zero
percent
stop
loss
and
stop
carving
the
dollars
out
of
institution
based
budgets
and
that
all
of
the
the
new
funding
would
come
from
appropriations
provided
by
the
general
assembly.
Next
slide
sean
there
were
essentially
no
changes
to
the
mechanics
of
either
the
university
model
or
the
kctcs
model.
D
So
in
terms
of
the
current
status
in
response
to
those
working
group
recommendations,
senate
bill
135
was
introduced.
It
passed
the
house
and
senate
with
no
changes
and
was
signed
into
law,
and
it
essentially
amends
the
performance
funding
statute
to
make
it
the
statute
in
alignment
with
those
work
group
recommendations,
cpe
staff
has
already
run
the
performance
funding
model
for
2021-22
the
data
and
the
calculations
have
been
validated
by
the
campus
chief
budget
officers
and
ir
directors
and
that
distribution
was
finalized
on
april.
D
D
If
you
look
at
student
success
components,
we've
got
bachelor's
degrees
with
a
pool
size
of
47.7
million
and
then
on
the
lower
half
of
the
page,
stem
plus
h,
bachelor's
degrees
with
a
pool
size
of
26.5
million,
and
that's
the
amount
of
dollars
allocated
in
2021-22
in
the
funding
model
and
those
first
two
columns
of
numbers.
What
we're
doing
is
we're,
comparing
the
three-year
rolling
average
of
degrees
produced
in
2021
to
the
three-year
rolling
average
of
degrees
produced
in
2021-22.
D
We
show
the
volume
change
and
the
percent
change
by
institution,
but
we
also
show
it
by
by
sector,
and
so
there
were
a
total
of
386
additional
bachelor's
degrees
produced
and,
as
highlighted
in
blue,
that
is
a
1.6
average
increase
for
the
sector
and
the
way
this
model
works.
Each
institution
that
is
highlighted
in
yellow
had
a
percent
change
that
was
above
that
sector
average.
So
at
uk
there
was
a
4.6
percent
growth
in
bachelor's
degrees
produced
at
western,
a
4.7
percent
growth.
D
They
were
above
that
1.6
sector
average,
and
you
can
see
the
impact
in
those
two
columns
of
numbers
to
the
far
right
last
year.
Uk's
share
of
the
bachelor's
degree
pool
was
33.7
for
next
year
for
2021-22,
that
share
has
increased
to
34.7
and
that's
because
they
exceeded
that
sector
average
and
we're
well
above
that
sector
average
at
4.6
last
slide
sean.
D
Uk
was
above
the
average
on
10
out
of
11
metrics
uofl
was
above
the
average
on
7
out
of
11
metrics
northern
above
the
average
on
6
out
of
11
in
western
on
5
out
of
the
11
metrics,
and
that's
what
increases
your
funding
share
in
the
funding
model,
because
it
is
very
much
driven
by
what
you
produce
and
those
student
success
outcomes
that
we're
trying
to
achieve
so
last
slide
sean.
D
So
are
there
any
questions
about
the
performance,
funding
working
group
or
the
the
distribution
for
next
year?
Well,.
A
D
A
H
Is
totally
unrelated
to
performance-based
funding
and
what
what
we
were
just
talking
about.
Are
you
aware
of
this?
H
This
is
for
dr
thompson,
the
initiative
between
kctcs
and
the
university
of
maryland
global
campus
that
that
initiative
on
the
face
of
it
to
me,
that
appears
pretty
troubling,
appears
that
we're
incentivizing
kentucky
students
to
go
outside
of
kentucky.
But
I
don't
know
enough
about
it
to
to
render
judgment,
but
if
you
could
get
with
me
at
some
point
and
kind
of
discuss
that
and
if
you
want
to.
If
you
want
to
comment
today,
that's
fine,
but
if
not,
we
can.
F
And
I'll
go
in
greater
detail
with
you
offline.
Yes,
I
am
familiar
with
that.
Kctcs
sets
up.
I
wasn't
familiar
with
it
until
I
read
it
to
be
honest
with
you
and
that's
a
conversation
that
I've
had
with
the
kctcs
president,
and
he
understands
exactly
where
we're
at
on
that
issue.
The
the
point
is
they
do
a
lot
of
these
with
a
lot
of
different
institutions
in
a
lot
of
places.
F
My
goal,
though
senator
west,
let
me
be
clear-
is
for
us
to
drive
better
partnerships
between
our
two-year
campuses
and
our
four-year
campuses.
That's
I'm!
I
that
that's
the
statement
I'll
make.
I'm
not
saying
that's
not
happening,
that's
happening,
but
we
need
to
be
more
intentional.
Our
transfer
rate's
not
as
high
as
I
wanted
to
be,
and
you
know
dr
zero
polly
who's
new
president.
He
and
I
have
sat
down
and
talked
about
strategically.
F
How
do
we
push
these
other
elements?
I
don't
care
what
we're
doing
in
other
places.
I
care
more
about
what
we're
doing
in
this
state
to
drive
what
we
need
to
drive.
Yes,
we're
going
to
have
to
transport
more
people
to
the
state
to
stay
in
this
state
to
be
a
part
of
the
workforce
without
a
doubt,
but
there's
a
lot
more,
but
they
do
these
things
all
the
time.