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B
A
C
C
This
particular
bio
updates
the
statues
governing
kaiga
for
the
first
time
since
1998..
Basically
a
cleanup
bill,
it
more
closely
aligns
the
governing
statutes
to
those
in
the
current
National
Conference
of
insurance.
A
C
So
the
committee
sub,
just
since
we
talked
about
that
real
quick,
there's,
two
changes-
we
made
the
education
labor
cabinet
reached
out
to
us
when
a
little
Clarity
there.
So
there's
a
couple.
Changes
due
to
language
relating
to
any
obligation
of
in
Sovereign
ensure
a
rising
out
of
insurance
reinsurance
contract
and
then
the
other
one
is
an
obligation
to
a
state
or
federal
government.
This
draft
inserts
the
following,
basically
saying
an
obligation
to
a
state
other
than
Kentucky
or
the
federal
government.
C
C
That
self-insurers
are
barred
from
recovering
from
kija
simply
because
they're,
not
members
of
the
association,
just
to
make
sure
everybody's
clear
on
that
updates
to
the
definition
of
a
covered
claim,
establishes
limits
on
cyber
security
claims
and
then
makes
a
number
of
non-sub
subsidive
updates
to
the
kaiga
statutes
to
bring
them
into
compliance
to
up
to
date.
So
that's
basically
what
the
Bill's
about
Mr
chair.
A
A
All
right,
our
next
bill
is
one.
We've
got
to
spend
plenty
of
time
here
lately
talking
about
and
we're
ready
to
get
started
on
this
one
because
of
some
health
issues
going
on
and
representative
Duvall's
family.
We're
we're
glad
to
have
US
Representative
Meredith,
my
co-chair
in
the
house
to
discuss
and
talk
about
this
bill
and
also
Senator
Hal.
He's
gracious
enough
to
to
help
his
his
colleague
in
discussion
of
this
bill.
So
there
is
a
committee
sub
and
well
I'll.
I'll
have
a
motion
on
the
sub.
A
E
Yes,
Jason
Howell
Senate
District
one.
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
members
of
committee.
This
bill
comes
over
from
the
house
from
representative
Duvall,
who,
unfortunately
couldn't
be
here
today.
E
This
bill
deals
with
a
space
of
Public
Adjusters
and
made
some
makes
some
technical
changes
and
then
some
substantive
changes.
One
major
change
in
this
is
it
sets
maximum
cap
for
what
they
can
charge
on
a
claim
with
10
for
catastrophic
and
those
are
defined
in
the
statute
and
15
percent
from
non-catastrophic.
It
also
cleans
up
some
issues
involving
the
storm
chasers
that
come
in
and
take
advantage
of
people
in
their
weakest
moments.
E
I
know
we've
seen
some
instances
of
that
in
Western
Kentucky,
with
the
tornadoes
from
last
year,
two
years
ago
now
and
Eastern
Kentucky
and
the
floods
this
year,
and
this
kind
of
sets
that
out
to
kind
of
help
the
good
actors
that
help
can
to
kentuckians
all
along
and
some
of
the
people
that
come
out
from
from
out
of
state
that
want
to
do
it
right,
it
kind
of
separates
them
out.
It
also
helps
the
Department
of
Insurance
monitor
some
of
this
stuff.
It
gives
some
good
transparency.
Excuse
me.
E
With
having
people
register
and
have
written
contracts
before
they
before
the
Public
Adjusters
get
to
work,
it
eliminates
some
of
the
extra
fees
that
some
of
the
Public
Adjusters
in
this
space
Did
In
addition
to
what
they
were
contracted
to
do
for
a
percentage,
and
that
is
the
basics
of
it.
I'll
turn
this
over
to
representative
Meredith.
D
Michael
married
at
state
representative
for
the
19th
house
district,
chair
of
the
house,
Banking
and
insurance
I,
just
want
to
make
note
of
the
fact
that
this
has
been
an
open
dialogue
process
through
the
entirety
of
from
the
time
this
bill
was
filed
until
what
you
see
before
you
today
and
I
think,
there's
probably
one
more
amendment
that
will
come
on
the
floor
before
this
process
is
complete
in
working
with
a
big
group
of
stakeholders
from
the
insurance
industry,
the
department
of
insurance
for
the
state
and
the
folks
in
the
public
adjuster
space
who
are
trying
to
do
this
the
right
way.
D
This
is
really
a
consumer
protection
piece
of
legislation
to
make
sure
that
consumers
are
protected
and
they
get
the
proceeds
that
they
need
to
maintain
their
homes
and
it
make
the
the
the
fixes
that
they
need
to
make
through
their
insurance
and
I
will
say
through
this
process,
you've
seen
a
lot
of
changes.
One
of
those
big
changes
was
was
mentioned
by
Senator
Howe.
We
started
on
non-catastrophic
claims
below
25
000,
with
a
two
and
a
half
percent
cap
that
was
suggested
by
the
department
of
insurance.
A
Appreciate
that
I
agree,
you
know
this
is
an
issue
that
was
you
know,
it's
really
one
of
those
issues
that
you
don't
even
think
about
it
until
it
gets
brought
to
you
as
being
a
concern
and,
like
my
co-chair
representative
Meredith,
said
people
from
all
across
the
the
issues
have
come
to
us
now.
A
If
there's
a
twelve
thousand
dollar
claim
you
get
10
of
that
you're
going
to
make
1200
bucks.
If
you
have
to
go
out
and
to
the
job
site
three
or
four
times,
there's
not
a
lot
of
money
there
to
be
made,
but
on
something:
that's
not
a
non-catastrophic
deal.
There's
not
a
reason
to
have
to
make
multiple
trips
because
you
know
a
roof
is
a
roof,
is
a
roof,
as
so
many
people
sometimes
tell
us,
but
there
is
different
situations.
A
If
it's
a
catastrophe,
that's
going
to
require
more
in-depth
work
and
so
I
think
that's
why
we've
increased
that
challenge.
We've
had
folks
from
the
Public
Adjusters
come
in
and
talk
to
us
about
the
issue
to
explain
this
bill
explain
what
their
business
entity
is
because
I
really
didn't
understand.
I've
got
a
lot
of
insurance
on
a
lot
of
different
property.
A
I've
never
had
to
call
a
public
adjuster
because
I'm
able
to
do
that
stuff
myself,
but
there
are
folks
out
here
that
may
not
understand
the
process
have
after
wind
damage,
have
storm
damage
and
need
somebody
that
can
help
them
make
a
decision
and
help
them
get
something
done
and
I
understand
the
need
for
them
and
the
purpose
they
serve
and
I
think
they
do
that.
A
So
it's
kind
of
one
of
those
tricky
tricky
trails
that
we're
trying
to
figure
out
what's
right
for
for
everybody
involved
to
make
sure
we're
protecting
people-
and
you
know
we're
not
in
in
the
habit
up
here
of
telling
people
what
they
can
charge
or
not
charge.
I
know
that's
going
to
be
some
some
of
the
questions
that
may
be
asked,
but
there's
some
situations
that
we
do
do
that
to
make
sure
that
we
are
fair
for
all
parties
involved
to
make
sure
we're
protecting
the
consumer.
A
So
I
appreciate
everybody's
work
and
I
mean
we
were
working
on
this
five
minutes
before
we
walked
down
here,
and
so
this
hasn't
been
an
issue.
That's
not
been
addressed
and
concerns,
and
and
I'm
sure.
If
we
go
through
the
bill,
there's
going
to
be
a
language
that
somebody
doesn't
like
or
there's
going
to
be
a
some
verbage
that
we
may
have
to
change
or
something
needs
to
be
done
or
once
again
like
I
said
I'm,
not
sure.
A
If
we're
ever
going
to
make
everybody
exactly
happy
I
know,
secretary
Clark
is
back
there
with
the
insurance
department.
We
appreciate
you
being
here
and
we
know
you've
you've
weighed
in
on
this
issue
plenty
as
well,
so
I
guess
I'll
open
it
up.
If
there's
any
other
questions
or
comments,
Senator
Yates.
F
Thank
you,
Mr
chair.
Thank
you
for
your
comments,
yeah
I've
kind
of
gone
back
and
forth
on
this
as
well.
It's
hadn't
previously
working
consumer
protection
litigation.
F
Having
worked
at
the
AG's
office,
you
know
there
is
a
lot
of
fraud
whenever
we
have
a
disasters,
not
just
in
Kentucky
but
throughout,
and
so
there
is
certain
levels
of
protections
that
we
have
to
put
in
place.
For
that
reason,
that
being
said,
a
lot
of
times,
I
see
when
I
see
caps.
I,
don't
like
that
idea,
because
it's
a
big
government
oversight
into
it.
F
But
again
we
have
to
weigh
those
those
Balance,
those
interests,
I'm
thinking
back
early
in
my
practice,
I
had
a
lady
whose
home
had
burned
down
in
my
district
horrific
case,
but
somebody
had
pulled
up
in
a
big
red
truck
that
some
fire
restoration,
adjusted
or
something,
and
she
didn't
understand
what
she
was
doing.
She
just
lost
everything.
She
signed
a
contract
that
was
something
around
22
percent,
something
into
it
and
they
started
working
with
the
you
know:
restoration
everything
else.
F
She
doesn't
have
enough
to
get
it
done
and
so
to
me,
that's
the
kind
of
individual
that
we're
looking
to
protect,
but
there
has
to
be
some
kind
of
balance
whenever
we
don't
want
to
be
big
government,
that's
coming
in
too
deep
into
it
and
so
I
think
I'm
I'm
happy
with
the
compromise.
That's
been
reached,
I'm
looking
at
that
I
know
it's
kind
of
arbitrary
when
you
just
pick
these
numbers,
but
that's
kind
of
the
way
compromises,
work
back
and
forth.
F
I
do
have
concern
you
know
about
how
this
will
play
out
and
how
that
will
be
enforced.
But
I'm
talking
to
the
Department
of
Insurance
I,
think
we're
missing
a
great
asset
that
we
need
to
be
picking
up
the
phone
and
and
snitching
them
out
picking
up
phone
and
having
them
handled
that
way,
because
I
think
a
lot
of
our
consumers
don't
know
they
have
that
option
as
well.
So
I
just
want
to
say
I
appreciate
the
discussion.
I
appreciate
the
compromise
and
kind
of
tell
you
where
I
was.
A
Well,
I
also
have
some
folks
sign
up
to
testify
and
I
want
to
do
that,
and
this
young.
This
young
man
come
to
my
office
actually
to
discuss
it.
Coal,
Klein
I
believe
he
is
here
to
maybe
have
a
quick
discussion.
I'll,
let
him
come
up
just
a
second
Senator
or
you
can
walk
on
up
I'm
sorry
and
you
can
sit
down
right
beside
Senator
Hal.
He
I
was
about
beside
him
and
he
didn't
bite
me
so
I
think
he'll
be
safe.
E
Out
go
ahead,
I'm,
sorry,
one
thing
I
forgot
to
mention
chairman
Meredith
alluded
to.
There
was
some
discussion
in
the
last
bit
of
negotiations
and
there
was
an
agreement
reached
that
wasn't
articulated
the
way
that
it
was
intended
to
in
the
agreement.
So
I'll
be
fine.
If
this
does
pass
out
of
committee
and
goes
to
the
floor,
I'll
be
filing
a
floor
amendment
to
clean
up
the
language.
E
It's
about
mandating
that
anything
that
goes
on
between
the
insurer
and
the
insured
that
the
public
adjuster
that's
involved,
gets
copied
in
on
all
that,
so
they're
they're
engaged
and
involved,
and
that
was
the
intent
of
everybody.
It
was
just
an
inadvertent
drafting
error
that
happens
and
we
can
clean
that
up
in
a
floor.
Okay,.
G
The
record,
if
you
don't
care
yeah
hello,
my
name
is
Cole.
Klein
I
am
here
on
behalf
of
appiao,
which
is
the
American
Association
of
public
insurance.
Adjusters
I
also
run
a
public
adjusting
firm.
We
do
quite
a
bit
of
work
here
in
the
state
of
Kentucky
and
so
I
wanted.
To
start
by
saying
we
appreciate
the
work
of
chairman
Meredith
and
chairman
Carpenter.
All
the
effort
that's
been
put
into
this
bill.
G
G
I'd
like
to
note
that
Most
states
do
not
have
a
fee
cap
and
only
13
of
the
50
do
examples
of
states
that
do
have
fee
caps
are
Florida,
which
has
a
20
fee
cap
and
Georgia,
which
has
a
33
fee
cap
we'd
like
to
continue
to
work
with
to
work
on
the
fee
cap
with
the
proponents
of
this
bill.
While
we
don't
like
vcaps,
we
have
proposed
close
to
20
percent
fee
cap,
which
would
allow
Public
Adjusters
to
continue
to
work.
Small
claims,
Public
Adjusters,
can't
take
smaller
claims
for
15
percent.
G
In
addition,
from
2014
to
2018,
the
average
size
homeowners
claim
nationally
was
13
687
dollars.
This
is
from
the
insurance
information,
Institute
2021
Insurance
Factbook
on
page
105..
It's
information
published
by
insurance
companies
Our
concern
here
is
that
the
bill
limits
the
resources
of
consumers
and
your
constituents
on
claims
that
are
of
smaller
size
and
take
away
the
choice
of
consumers
to
work
with
firms
that
may
be
just
better
equipped
to
help
them.
We
ask
that
you
vote
no
or
continue
to
work
with
us
on
an
acceptable
fee.
Cap.
A
Thank
you,
I
appreciate
you
coming
to
the
office
the
other
day
and
helping
us
work
on
on
the
issues
as
well.
I
think
Senator
girdler
had
a
question
or
comment
as
well.
H
As
being
in
the
insurance
business
for
40
years
I'm
over
this
way,
sir,
as
being
in
the
insurance
business
for
40
years
and
property
casual
agency,
we
have
a
lot
of
bad
characters
come
in.
They
read
about
a
hail
storm
and
they
stand
one
man
didn't
know
who
I
was
and
was
standing
down
on
the
road
and
saying
you
got
hail
damage
your
roof.
H
How
can
you
tell
that
you
know
I
want
you
to
go
hunting
with
me,
because
you
got
eagle
eyes
anyway.
We
we
have
a
lot
of
this.
My
question
is,
you
know
the
consumer
himself
is
about
the
insurance.
The
insurance
company
chose
to
insure
the
property.
The
bank
that
chose
to
finance
the
property
has
as
much
or
more
insurable
interest
in
that
property
than
the
insured
or
anybody
else.
H
G
You
know
I'm,
really
it's
a
really
great
question
and
a
reasonable
one.
A
lot
of
what
we
do
is
Public
Adjusters
is
present
coverage
under
under
the
policy.
G
So
we
take
a
lot
of
claims
where
there's
zero
payment,
but
they
they
should
have
been
and
the
insurer
has
to
come
out
of
or
the
policy
holder
would
be
coming
out
of
pocket,
100
percent
and
with
the
help
of
a
public
adjuster
they're
able
to
find
resources
to
get
in
your
example,
the
Roof
System
replaced-
and
you
know,
we've
done
a
lot
of
work
in
Kentucky
with
the
tornadoes
and
even
the
recent
wind
damage.
So
you
know
missing
completely
just
missing,
shingles
or
or
that
kind
of
thing.
G
Hopefully,
that
answers
answers.
Your
question.
H
Not
really
well
yeah,
if
you're
saying
that
Public
Adjusters
come
into
play
when
the
insurance
companies
offers
zero.
Is
that
what
you
just
said.
G
Yeah,
absolutely
so,
on
smaller
claims
say
it's
just
an
average
sized
roof,
a
lot
of
adjusters
that
work,
those
have
lower
levels
of
authority
and
they
are
on
those
claims
because
a
lot
of
them
can
be
you're,
saying
public
adjuster.
G
Why
they're
working
these
smaller
claims,
and
so
we
we
work
with
a
lot
of
these
guys
that
or
even
in
CAD
events
where
they
just
get
a
bucket
of
claims
to
go
out
and
run
to,
and
it's
it's
one
after
another
after
another
and
there's
oversights
on
on
claims
I,
don't
think
that
a
lot
of
insurance
companies
are
intentional
by
any
means,
but
but
they're
all
humans,
so
things
get
denied
or
incorrectly
adjusted
and
in
those
circumstances,
don't.
H
You
think
that's
where
the
department
of
insurance
comes
into
play:
I,
I've,
I've,
again,
I've
been
40
plus
years
profiting
casuals.
All
I
ever
did
I've
yet
to
run
into
where,
when
a
public
adjuster
got
more
money
or
anything
else
for
an
insured,
maybe
my
company
will
just
give
it
out.
I,
don't
know
you're
talking
about
in
a
like
in
tornado
damage
and
Mayfield.
G
H
I
promise
you,
the
insurance
companies,
don't
want
a
bad
name
and
I
promise
you
they
went
in
wrote,
checks
to
everybody
and
give
them
everything
they
ever
wanted.
They
did
not
from
my
experience
with
my
company
and
all
the
other
companies.
I
I,
don't
see,
I
understand
where
you
know,
Center
Yates
got
into
the
thing
of
you
know
they
go
and
get
this
contract
signed,
and
then
they
call
us
and
say
you
can't
deal
with
you're
in
church.
You
got
to
deal
with
us.
H
Well,
the
insurer
bought
the
insurance
from
the
insurance
company.
All
right.
We
can't
negate
that
we
can't
negate
the
mortgage
company
I
know
that
there's
a
need
for
adjusters
I
know
that
I
know
that
Beyond
any
doubt
but
to
to
when
you
say
you
add
the
bill,
you
add
12,
15
or
20
whatever
it
is.
H
The
insurance
is
only
going
to
pay
for
the
damage.
That's
done
and
if
there's
a
mortgage
they're
going
to
pay
that
you
know
so
I
I
how
many
Public
Adjusters
are
there
in
Kentucky.
G
So
I
believe
there's
for
Resident
adjusters
I,
don't
know
about
the.
G
Yeah
I,
don't
know
total
but
resident
I
believe
there's
about
20.,
yeah
and
I.
You
bring
up
some
good
points,
I
think
the
department
of
insurance
does
a
great
job
yeah
and
an
insurance
company
is
not
going
to
pay
more
money
just
because
a
public
adjuster
is
on
the
claim
they're
going
to
pay
more
money,
because
the
policy
elicits
coverage
for
those
items
it
was
just
presented
by
the
public,
adjuster
and
and
I.
Don't
think.
Insurance
companies
are
maliciously
out
doing
that
either.
G
I
think
that
they
all
have
good
intentions,
a
lot
of
times,
they're
just
oversight
and
a
necessity
for
Public
Adjusters,
so
especially
on
small
claims,
which
an
average
of
you
know,
13
600
as
a
firm.
We
we
just
have
a
we'd,
have
a
really
hard
time
taking
those
on
at
15.
Just.
G
H
13.1
billion
dollars
last
year,
13.1
billion,
and
they
didn't
do
it
through
any
other
system
other
than
their
own
system
and
I
think
they,
the
insurance
companies
I've
dealt
with,
have
always
been
Johnny
on
the
spot.
Now
do
y'all
do
y'all.
Do
any
bi
claims
because
I
don't
know
we
got
some
lawyers
up
here.
Do
you
are
you
allowed
to
do
bis.
G
Oh,
we
don't
no
yeah,
no,
no
third
party,
just
first
party.
H
Claims
I
know
that
was
one
of
their
concerns
is
was
they
was
worried
about
that
and
I?
Don't
think
that
would
ever
happen.
The
department
of
insurance
so
yeah
anyway,
I
still
got
a
motion
on
the
bill.
I.
A
Know
appreciate
Senator
girdler.
Thank
you.
Cole
I
appreciate
you
answering
those
questions
and
I
and
I
think.
That's.
That's
well
said
that
everybody
understands
that
that
you
know
there
are
some
bad
actors.
There's
bad
there's
bad
insurance
companies
there's
bad
agents.
Senator
girdler
was
not
a
bad
agent.
We
know
that
and-
and
that
does
make
a
difference
on
who
your
agent
is
and
your
personal
relationship
on
getting
some
things
accomplished.
A
We
all
we
all
I
think
we
all
understand
that
better,
but
but
I
we
all
understand
there
is
a
need
for
what
you
guys
do.
That's
why
we're
trying
to
make
it
as
as
workable
as
possible
to
protect
everybody.
We
do
have
a
motion
on
the
bill
by
Senator.
Girdler
do
I
have
a
second.
A
I
I
appreciate
all
the
work
that
these
I
guess
insurance
people
have
done
in
this
on
this
bill.
I
got
the
copy,
I,
guess
kind
of
late,
but
I
find
there's
a
lot
of
legalese
I
hope
that
somebody
will
get
in
and
work
out
because
under
the
bill
is
it
stands
now
it
would
this
question
that
was
asked
about
what
you
can
do.
There's
a
provision
here,
that'll
prevent
anybody.
Basically
from
discussing
non-economic
damages
and
as
a
lawyer
of
43
years,
I've
been
alone
a
little
bit
longer.
I
My
good
friend
has
been
Insurance
and
Mr
Neal.
Some
of
us
in
here
there's
some
language
that
even
prevents
you
the
insured
from
having
the
right
to
be
present
when
your
insurance
company's
adjuster
is
in
there
and
I
can
I
can
go
on,
but
I
don't
want
to
there's
a
number
when
you
got
directive
says,
shall
that
means
it's
enforceable
and
you
can't
do
it
I
think
there's
a
question
of
about
72
hours,
I
hope,
there's
not
a
four
day
holiday.
I
That
would
invalidate
a
contract
under
this
bill
because
it
says
you
got
to
do
that
within
72
hours,
I'm.
Just
speaking
legally,
my
good
friend
spoke
insurably
I'm
speaking
legally.
It
needs
cleanup,
okay
and
I
hope
that
that
gets
done.
Mr
chairman
I'm,
going
to
vote
I
on
that
Good
Will
that
everybody
and
I'll
be
more
glad
to
put
my
input
into
it.
A
A
F
Explain
my
yes
vote,
please
in
my
17
years
of
practicing
injury
law,
kid
part
of
it
is
as
I
look
at
it.
I
get
real
antsy
when
I
see
anything
that
I
say
that
would
even
allow
a
layperson
to
practice
in
an
area
that
I
would
almost
look
like
practicing
law
without
a
license.
What
I've
seen
is
it's
already
happening.
F
We
already
have
people
and-
and
it's
happened
to
the
point-
it
is
a
problem
and
so
when
I
look
at
this
bill
as
a
way
of
limiting
that
and
trying
to
protect
consumers,
I
think
we'd
be
really
careful
to
let
that
be
expanded
on
I.
Do
think
that
there
are
already
in
law
that
there's
Provisions
in
the
event
that
some
of
our
constituents
are
taking
advantage
of
by
some
ill
motives.
F
A
A
Knew
that
so,
and
that
just
means
our
good
friends
that
are
keep
pulling
our
our
jacket
arms
as
we're
walking
down
the
hallways,
we're
going
to
continue
that
for
a
few
more
days,
so
hey
makes
everybody
excited,
but
I
do
appreciate
everybody's
hard
work.
Representative
Meredith.
We
appreciate
you
coming
over
to
the
Senate.
Thank.