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From YouTube: Bourbon Barrel Taxation Task Force (10-21-22)
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A
All
right
good
morning,
everybody
I
think
we're
ready
to
get
started.
This
is
the
October
meeting
of
the
task
force
before
we
start
I.
Guess
real,
quick!
Well,
let's
take
the
roll.
We
can
do
that
and
then
we
can.
C
F
A
Here
before
we
start,
we've
got
a
lot
of
guests
in
the
audience.
I
want
to
recognize
my
my
mayor,
my
Independent
School
board
super
the
superintendent
candidates
that
are
running
for
for
judge,
executive
I,
don't
know
if
there's
anybody
else
out
there
and
then
representative
Huff.
You
want
to
introduce
some
guests.
Please.
G
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
I
I.
Have
my
County
Judge
want
to
want
to
say,
welcome,
he's
I
think
been
at
every
one
of
these
meetings.
Dan
and
I
send
Deputy
County
Judge
John
Park
is
here
Sheriff,
Mark,
Moore
I.
Think
he's
also
been
at
every
single
session.
We
have
someone
here
from
the
Shelby
County
Public
School
System.
Yes,
there
you
are,
and
we
also
my
fire
chief.
A
A
Oh
so
will
the
motion
passes
Senator,
Higdon,
I'm,
sorry,
I
just
saw
your
hand
raise
on
the
screen.
Go
ahead,
sir
floor's
yours.
H
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
I
do
I'm
not
there
as
as
evident.
J
And
I
want
to
just
thank
them
for
being
in
attendance.
A
Sir,
all
right,
the
agenda
was
pretty
open.
You
know
we've
spent
all
summer
talking
about
the
issue
trying
to
get
our
hands
around
the
magnitude
of
it.
I've
asked
everybody
to
help
us
be
creative,
you
know
is:
is
there
a
solution
that
holds
our
locals
harmless
and
yet
doesn't
cause
a
barrier
and
entry
to
new
growth
in
what
has
got
to
be
one
of
our
largest
signature,
Industries
driving
tourism
in
all
of
our
counties?
So
a
lot
of
folks
have
signed
up
to
talk,
staff
and
I
have
looked
at
it.
A
It
looks
like
we
can
break
you
down
into
some
categories,
so
I'm
going
to
ask
the
school
folks
to
come
up.
First
I
think
we've
got
Henry
County
Public,
Schools,
Where'd
I
had
another
one
Franklin
County
Schools
and
any
other
school
person
that
wants
to
come
to
the
table
and
look
we've
had
testimony.
A
So
if
we
could
today
what
I
would
love
is
if
you've
got
something
new
to
bring
to
the
conversation
fantastic
but,
more
importantly,
give
me
some
ideas
and-
and
you
know,
you've
all
probably
sat
through
these
seminars
and
things
where
you
brainstorm
and
you
write
it
on
the
board
and
we
do
word
clouds
or
whatever.
That's
that's
kind
of
what
I'm
hoping
we
do
is
come
up
with
some
ideas
and
even
if
they're
bad,
let's
throw
them
on
the
table
and
say
this
is
an
idea
and
it's
bad
and
here's.
A
L
If
you
don't
mind,
I'll
start
I
want
to
say
thank
you
for
hearing
our
voices
as
Educators.
We
really
do
appreciate
it,
and
I'll
speak
specifically
about
Franklin
County
Schools.
We
are
obviously
huge
fans
of
the
bourbon
industry.
The
bourbon
industry
has
been
very
good
for
our
for
our
community
for
our
County
for
our
school
system
to
the
tune
of
about
2.9
Million
Dollars
in
tax
revenue
just
for
this
past
year,
and
that's
obviously
a
significant
source
of
Revenue
that
comes
into
our
district.
L
That
provides
opportunities
for
our
students
and
our
staff,
and-
and
we
do
not
want
to
see
that
go
away
and
we're
more
than
willing
to
listen
to
any
suggestions
like
like
you
mentioned,
representative
McCoy.
We
want
to
come
to
the
table
as
as
partners.
We
want
to
collaborate
with
the
bourbon
industry.
We
have
been
good
partners
to
our
community
and
good
partners
to
the
education
system
in
that
for
5.
Over
the
last
six
years,
our
school
district
has
taken
the
four
percent.
L
So
here
in
20,
in
2021,
56
percent
of
the
of
the
revenue
came
from
the
local
and
44
percent
came
from
the
state,
so,
whereas
our
state
revenues
have
been
continually
decreasing
seek
has
not
kept
up
with
the
rate
of
inflation,
our
local
taxation.
We
have
more
than
done
our
part
to
provide
those
opportunities,
and
so
what
I
would
please
ask
you
all
to
consider
is
2.9
Million
Dollars
to
a
school
district
of
our
size
is
significant.
We
have
been
able,
over
the
last
six
years,
to
provide
five
two
percent
raises.
L
We
have
taken
our
teacher
pay
from
90th
in
the
state
to
28th
in
the
state
and
Franklin
County
Schools,
and
that's
been
as
a
result
of
of
working
with
the
revenues
that
we
have.
If
those
revenues
go
away,
we're
gonna
we're
gonna,
lose
a
lot
of
significant
amount
of
ground
and
we're
not
going
to
be
able
to
continue
pushing
forward
with
education.
So
I.
Please
ask
you
to
to
consider
those
things
and
and
we're
more
more
than
willing
to
work
with
work
with
you
all
on
a
solution.
A
L
Right
here,
yes,
we
do,
and
and
Buffalo
Trace
is
currently
undergoing
a
1.2
billion
dollar
expansion.
They're
doing
very
well-
and
that's
that's-
been
fantastic
for
us
four
years
ago
that
2.9
Million
Dollars
was
1.2
million.
So
over
the
last
four
years
we
have
increased
from
1.2
to
2.9
Million.
It's
been
a
significant
increase
and
it's
been
extremely
helpful
for
a
district.
That's
been
so
underfunded
for
several
years.
K
And
I
would
like
to
just
Echo
the
sentiments
that
Mr
Kopp
has
shared
with
you
today,
I'm
going
into
my
first
school
year,
superintendent
of
Henry,
County,
Public
Schools
and
my
community
has
been
so
gracious
to
invite
Angel's
Envy
to
come
on
board
and
be
a
part
of
our
community.
That
represents
a
tremendous
impact
potential
for
my
school
district
and
please
understand
when
I
say
this
I
mean
it
with
all
humility.
It
could
be
a
game
changer
for
me
as
a
superintendent,
in
terms
of
providing
supports
state-of-the-art
facilities.
K
For
my
students,
for
example
Within
by
the
year
2030,
will
we
receive
1.2
million
dollars?
Folks
I
have
buildings
and
they're
wonderful
they're
filled
with
the
most
amazing
kids,
the
most
amazing
staff
in
the
world,
but
I've
got
a
building
was
built
in
1955
1962
and
one
in
1902
and
I
lacked
the
bonding
capacity
to
replace
those
buildings,
and
it
time
is
coming
where
it
needs
to
be
replaced.
We
all
agree.
Education
is
the
future
not
just
to
the
state
of
Kentucky,
but
for
our
country
as
well.
K
We
need
the
bourbon
industry
to
provide
the
supports
and
financial
backing
that
we
that
we
need
to
create
not
just
facilities
but
also
create
a
learning
environment
that
is
full
of
materials
and
resource
sources
for
our
staff
and
our
students.
In
order
to
be
successful
and
I
would
like
to
leave
one
point:
I
do
not
envy
you
in
trying
to
make
the
decisions
that
you're
wanting
to
make,
because
you
represent
not
just
the
citizens
of
this
great
state,
but
you
also
wish
for
all
our
businesses
to
thrive
and
flourish.
K
But
I
would
like
to
point
out
something.
Let's
move
forward
into
the
future
and,
for
example,
my
colleague
in
Franklin
County,
let's
say,
for
example,
you
have
two
million
dollars
coming
from
the
bourbon
industry
that
goes
into
that
pool
of
tax
money
that
you're
collecting
and
now
it's
removed,
because
a
Bourbon
Barrel
tax
is
taken
away.
That
means
our
taxpayers
have
to
pick
up
the
tab
on
that,
because
we're
going
to
receive
the
compensating
rate
the
following
year.
So
please
be
considerate
of
that
as
well.
K
Last
but
not
least,
I'll
say
this
I
think
that
the
bourbon
industry
and
we've
been
talking
with
angels
Envy
in
Henry
County
they're,
wanting
to
partner
with
the
schools.
It's
not
just
about
the
money.
It's
also
looking
at
what
are
future
careers
high
demand,
high-wage
jobs
that
our
students
could
be
looking
forward
to
going
into?
Can
they
partner
with
us
in
those
areas?
Yes,
they
can
so
it's
more
than
just
about
Revenue,
it's
about
building
a
relationship
to
give
a
very
bright
future
for
our
students.
Thank
you
for
your
time.
M
K
We
do
at
the
time
we
do
have
bourbon
warehouses
at
our
housing
barrels
last
year.
I
think
we
started
out
with
fifty
four
thousand
dollars
in
Revenue
that
will
be
jumping
up
significantly
going
into
this
coming
school
year
and
the
following
school
years,
and
my
colleague
County
judge,
executive,
John,
Logan
Brent
would
be
able
to
provide
you
with
more
specific
numbers.
The.
M
The
question
I
have
then
understanding
what
your
Dynamic
is
to
both
the
superintendents
of
Franklin,
County
and
Henry.
County
is
I'm
understanding
and
and
various
things
and
I'll
I'll
tell
you
this
from
my
perspective,
I
know
what
it's
like
to
lose:
an
industry
and
I
Senator
McDaniel's
here
and
others.
M
When
you,
when
we
lost
the
coal
industry,
we
lost
jobs,
we
lost
students,
we
lost
property
tax
base,
I
think
there
was
18
school
systems
that
right
Chris
that
we
had
to
supplement
because
they
did
not
have
the
revenues
coming
in
so
I
know
exactly
what
you're
talking
about,
but
I
also
understand.
This
I've
had
conversations
with
all
different
parties
from
all
over
the
state
and
it's
kind
of
interesting,
because
I
read
the
Franklin
County
newspapers
and
the
Henry
County
newspapers.
M
There
is
quite
a
bit
of
consternation
about
peak's,
Mill
and
other
places
in
Henry,
County
I.
Think
one
of
our
more
noted
agrarians
has
talked
about
how
to
stop
expansion
in
Henry
County,
so
I
had
numerous
counties
reach
out
to
me,
saying
and
I
know:
I
had
some
people
from
the
industry
reach
out
to
me
saying:
do
you
know
property
in
Eastern
Kentucky?
M
M
That's
not
the
income
tax,
the
corporate
tax
or
anything
else,
the
sales
tax
or
which
comes
back
to
the
contacts
I've
had
from
various
counties,
not
just
in
my
area
in
Eastern
Kentucky,
but
across
the
state.
This
is
look
if
they
want
to
store
bourbon,
we'll
create
an
industrial
park
of
Rick
houses
and
we'll
gladly
welcome
them
here
or
I
approach,
one
company-
and
they
did
not-
they
would
not
respond
because
all
it
has
to
do
is
distill
hit
the
barrel
stay
here
for
one
year,
one
day
and
Indiana
is
a
short
distance
away.
M
L
If
you
don't
mind,
I'll
address
that
Dr
Masters.
Thank
you
for
those
comments.
Senator
Stivers,
you're
100
right
in
terms
of
that's
something
that
could
happen
and
one
of
the
things
I
want.
You
all
to
know
is
that
the
school
system-
we
you
know,
we
don't
have-
we
don't
have
a
lot
of
ability
to
Lobby
our
public
in
terms
of
what
a
certain
group
of
homeowners
believe,
but
we
are
in
favor
of
growth.
I've
been
preaching
growth
since
I
came
to
the
school
district
six
years
ago.
L
There's
no
reason
why
Franklin
County
should
not
grow
at
the
rate
of
our
other
counties.
So
we're
going
to
do
everything
in
our
power
to
promote
that
growth
as
much
as
we
can,
but
we
are
talking
about
possibilities,
things
that
could
happen.
If
you
all,
you
know,
get
rid
of
this
this
tax,
it's
not
a
possibility.
It's
a
it's!
A
2.9,
Million
dollars
is
gone
very
quickly.
L
So
for
us-
and
the
other
thing
you
have
to
understand
from
our
perspective,
we
already
lose
out
a
significant
amount
of
Revenue
in
Franklin
County
due
to
state-owned
property,
and
we
have
been
working
for
years
trying
to
get
some
offset
from
the
legislature
to
help
us,
because
we
can't
tax
where
AOC
happens,
to
have
their
building,
where
that
used
to
be
a
Home
Depot
that
brought
in
six
figures
in
tax
revenue.
So
again
any
time
that
that
we're
we
Face
a
threat
of
Revenue,
going
away
we're
going
to
do
everything
that
we
can
to
advocate.
M
Most
people
in
Franklin
County
now
know
that
I
own
a
house
and
have
owned
a
house
here
since
2004.,
so
I
get
all
types
of
visitors
at
my
house
I'm
on
a
it's
kind
of
hard
to
avoid
sometimes
but
I've
heard
from
both
that
and
people
coming
to
me
about
these
issues
about
loss
of
property
value
which
I'm
very
well
aware
of
that
when
Eastern
Kentucky
is
substantially
owned
by
the
Daniel
Boone
National
Forest,
but
I
I
caution
everyone
about
thinking.
M
N
Thank
you,
Mr,
chairman
gentlemen,
thank
you
for
being
here.
We've
talked
about
this
exceptionally
complex
issue,
but
I
want
to
go
through
a
couple
of
things
here
and
ask
you
guys
to
respond.
Henry
County.
You
will
be
the
sole
outlier
in
what
I
have
to
say
today,
which
is
as
a
district
who
is
new
to
having
distilled
Urban
barrels
stored
in
your
District.
N
N
If
you
look
at
the
10-year
trend
for
I
want
to
go
through
a
couple
counties,
it's
just
odd
that
you
guys
ended
up
here
today
in
Marion
County
in
10
years,
you've
gone
from
63
million
to
277
million
dollars
in
distilled
Spirits
stored
there,
but
yet
your
tax
rates
going
from
53
8
to
58.1
in
Franklin
we've
gone
from,
see
I
lost
my
place
just
a
little
bit.
I
had
it
in
here.
N
Forgive
me.
Okay
from
Franklin
we
went
from
120
million
to
416
million
and
from
62
cents
to
70
cents,
for
the
tangible
property
tax
rate
and
if
I
can
go
down
through
Bardstown
from
150
million
to
250
million,
but
from
72
to
85
on
the
rate,
a
bullet
from
245
to
354,
on
and
on.
Everyone
has
seen
a
substantial
increase
in
the
value
of
of
spirits
taxed
right.
But
yet
everybody
has
continued
to
take
an
increase
on
the
tangible
property
tax
rate
that
is
applied
to
these
barrels.
N
L
Very
very
good
question:
I
can
also
state
that
for
the
last
two
years
our
tax
rate
was
at
71.8
and
we
have
actually
lowered
that
rate
each
of
the
last
two
years
last
year
to
71.3
and
this
year
to
70.8.
It
is
very
much
due
to
the
the
figures
and
the
calculations
that
we
we
received
from
the
Kentucky
Department
of
Education,
when
we're
asked
to
do
everything
that
we
can
at
the
local
level.
L
That
means
taking
the
four
percent
increase
in
revenue,
and
we
have
done
that
in
five
of
the
last
six
years
again
to
try
to
offset
that
lack
of
funding
that
we
have
received
from
the
state.
Again.
When
you
go
from
56
funding
to
44
funding
over
a
10-year
period,
you
have
to
be
able
to
provide
opportunities.
The
cost
of
textbooks
doesn't
go
down.
The
top.
L
The
cost
of
teacher
salaries
does
not
decrease
those
things
go
up,
so
local
school
districts
are
forced
to
take
that
increase
in
revenue
and
thankfully,
the
last
two
years
in
Franklin
County.
Our
revenues
have
increased.
So
when
we've
taken
an
increase
in
Revenue,
we've
been
able
to
decrease
the
tax
that
that
we
that
we
collect.
But
those
are
all
those
are
all
valid
questions
and
concerns,
and
you
know
maybe
we
wouldn't
be
as
loud
here
advocating
for
that
Bourbon
Barrel
tax.
L
N
You
know,
but
I
find
it
interesting.
I
hear
I've
heard
this.
You
know
it's
kind
of
interesting
that
in
the
last
four
years,
all
of
a
sudden,
the
education
Community
has
been
been
concerned
with
the
inflationary
of
facts
while
under
the
previous
administration
before
Governor
Bevin
came
in
no
one
ever
came
in
complaining
about
not
keeping
up
with
inflation.
I
never
heard
that
complaint.
It
seemed
to
be
a
fairly
partisan
complaint.
N
It
seems
to
be
fairly
recent
and
seems
to
be
something
that
people
want
to
continue
to
place
blame
upon,
and
so
you
know
to
expect
this
industry
to
particularly
sustain
when
you
know,
when
small
things
were
happening,
that
there
were
objections
to
I
simply
did
not
hear
those.
Frankly
until
Matt
Bevin
became
governor
of
the
Commonwealth
and
so
I
find
it
problematic.
Now
that
you
guys
find
yourself
in
a
bad
spot
and
listen,
two
million
dollar
loss
is
a
big
deal.
I
get
it
right,
but
to
come
in
here
and
lecture
the
general
assembly.
L
Well,
definitely
not
lecturing
just
providing
information
and
I
can
state
that,
from
the
day
that
I've
been
superintendent,
we've
looked
very
carefully
at
the
at
the
economic
index
and
and
the
the
facts
that
we've
been
forced
to
deal
with
and
I've,
never
once
at
any
point
considered
Politics,
as
as
part
of
this
all.
K
I
would
just
Echo,
you
know
my
previous
superintendent
of
what
he
said
I'm
a
first
year
superintendent,
so
I
can't
speak
to
leaders
before
me,
but
I
do
know.
This
Marion
County
receives
approximately
1.8
million
dollars
in
distilled
Spirits
tax.
I
do
know
that
our
board
has,
in
the
last
several
years,
taken
the
four
percent
option,
for
example
this
year
that
generates
a
local
increase
effort
of
approximately
660
000,
while
the
state
decrease
and
seek
in
the
way
it
works
was
approximately
four
hundred
thousand.
K
So
what
I
say
to
that
is
we
have
very
limited
options
in
increasing
funding
for
the
district
and
Os
costs
continue
to
increase.
You
know,
there's
only
so
many
options
that
we
can
take.
So
you
know
the
way
we
look
at.
This
is
It's
a
partnership
and-
and
you
know,
we're
very
proud
of
our
industry
in
Marion
County.
K
You
know
Makers
Mark,
Diageo
and
others,
and
we
view
them
as
a
partner,
and
you
know
they
need
us
to
provide
the
very
best
product
that
we
can
do
and
as
a
result,
you
know
we
need
their
partnership.
So
that's
and
I
would
add
one
final
thing
in
2008,
Marion
County
was
29
local
effort,
71
percent
State
this
year,
we're
about
50
50,
which
you
know
could,
like
the
others,
be
due
to
the
unprecedented
growth,
partly
due
to
the
bourbon
industry.
G
Yes,
thank
you.
Mr
chairman
I
commend
the
chair.
The
leadership
of
this
task
force
for
all
the
the
data
that
you've
provided
all
the
information.
Every
single
meeting
added,
a
layer
of
information
that
we
needed
and
I
I,
truly
believe.
Eric
Kennedy
gave
some
of
the
best
testimony
about
the
complexity
of
the
tax
structure
and
the
different
layers
and
you've
spoken
about
that
today
and
to
come
up
with
the
Creative
Solutions.
That
co-chairman
McCoy
has
asked
us
to
do.
G
There's
just
a
few
more
pieces
that
I
need
to
know-
and
you
spoke
today
about
the
loss
of
Revenue
when
a
building
in
an
industry
sells
its
building
to
a
state,
a
state
agency.
Yes,
do
you
know
that
for
the
irbs
when,
when
you
when
a
industry
is
removed
from
the
property
tax,
do
you
know
what
the
loss
is
for
this
industry
at
any
level
at
any
year,
in
your
in
your
county,
I.
G
A
In
representative
decorate,
you
may
recall
a
couple
meetings.
It
was
one
of
the
pieces
of
information
we
asked
for
for
the
counties
to
bring
us
the
property
tax
revenue
that
they
for
went
in
the
IRB
process.
To
my
knowledge,
I,
don't
know
if
any
staff
member
anybody's
gotten
it
I
have
not
seen
that
info
would
still
love
to
see
that
information.
A
Okay,
fellas
I,
appreciate
it
before
you
leave.
Do
you
got
an
idea?
That's
what
this
meeting's
about
I
mean
I
I,
hope
you
all
understand.
We
genuinely
from
the
bottom
of
our
hearts
appreciate,
understand
comprehend
we're
with
you.
The
goal
is:
how
can
we
do
this
and
not
hurt
you
I
get
the
hurt.
Part
I
need
help
on
the
other
part.
So
tell
me
your
Solutions
all
right,
I'm
sorry
go
ahead.
K
I
agree
and-
and
I
will
say
this
I
mean
that's
a
beautiful
thing
about
the
Democratic
process
and
it's
what
we
teach
our
students
I
mean
we're
able
to
sit
here
together
and
try
to
work
out
a
solution.
I
understand
that
you
have
to
balance
what
is
best
for
students
what's
best
for
our
citizens,
what's
best
for
our
Industries
and
that's
a
very
difficult
thing
to
do,
and
often
you're
faced
with
decisions
that
you
probably
feel
like.
There's
no
way
to
win
it's
a
catch-22..
K
I
wish
I
did
have
a
very
specific
solution
to
you,
I
think
it's
very
difficult
to
duplicate
the
type
of
Revenue
and
the
type
of
increase
in
Revenue
that
we
could.
We
could
potentially
receive
through
the
bourbon
industry,
but
at
this
time
no
I
don't
have
a
solution.
I'll.
L
Be
glad
to
offer
I
I'm
I'm,
not
a
fan
of
problem,
admiring
I
I,
say
it
all
the
time
in
my
job.
Let's
not
admire
the
problem.
Let's
try
to
find
a
way
to
solve
the
problem
you
know
outside
of
just
eliminating
The
Bourbon
Barrel
tax.
Is
there
any
way
that
we
could
look
at
a
graduated
elimination
of
that
or
a
reduction
in
the
amount
of
that
tax,
where
we
could
still
look
for
ways
to
be
made
whole
by
the
legislature
through
that
advanced
seek
formula?
L
But
while
we
then
we
could
still
reduce
the
burden
on
the
bourbon
industry,
but
it
maybe
wouldn't
be
all
at
once.
It
would
be
something
where
we
could
then
work
together
to
you
know,
find
ways
if,
if
we
were
hit
with
this
immediately,
like,
like
my
colleague,
Dr
Master,
says
the
compensating
rate
for
Henry
County,
for
instance,
if
they
were
receiving
this
much
money
and
then
that
money
goes
away
for
us
as
a
district.
L
2.9
Million
dollars
is
a
huge
portion
of
what
we
receive
and
we
would
have
to
raise
taxes
to
Senate
Senator
McDaniels.
You
know
his
statement
earlier.
We
we
would
have
to
raise
that
tax
rate
from
70.8
significantly
to
offset
that
increase.
So
is
there
a
way
in
which
we
can
lower
the
taxes
there,
a
way
in
which
we
can
graduate
it
over
over
time
again
and.
A
You're
dead
on
those
are
the
kinds
of
things
I
wanted
to
hear
and
I
want
to
hear.
Okay,
what's
a
proposal
to
do
that
and
what's
the
good
and
the
Bad
and
the
Ugly,
if
we
did
that
right
well,
you
know.
So
you
know
I
really
hope
you'll
continue
to
think,
but
I
hope
the
rest
of
the
folks
coming
after
you
have
got
something
to
maybe
throw
out
their
president's
diverse.
Has
a
question:
Mr.
M
K
K
M
M
A
Very
much
I
appreciate
it.
Let's
do
next
up.
If
we
kind
of
look
at
the
groupings,
we've
got
some
County
judges
and
other
County
like
Economic
Development
folks.
So
let's
have
the
Marion
County
Economic
Development
Marion,
County,
judge,
executive
Henry,
County,
judge,
executive
Bullitt,
County,
judge,
executive
and
Shelby
County
judge
executive.
If
there's
enough
seats
up
there.
A
A
J
A
J
We
go,
we
got
it.
One
of
the
things
I
would
like
to
look
at
is
sunsetting
this
tax
25
30
years
down
the
road.
What
I
have
spent
my
entire
business
career
as
a
lobbyist
for
big
tobacco
I've
worked
in
alcohol
with
bullet
I
was
their
state
lobbyist
for
16
years?
I
understand
that
side
of
the
business
understand
my
side
as
County
judge,
executive
I
have
had
to
work
through
when
the
pension
came
down
and
I
had
to
find
an
extra
million
dollars
for
our
shortfall
that
we
were
given.
J
We
found
that
million
dollars
when
big
alcohol
came
into
Shelby
County
I
was
a
lobbyist
that
worked
and
I
kid
with
bullet.
Quite
often
that
had
I
known
I
would
be
County
judge.
You
would
not
have
gotten
the
tax
deal
that
you
got
when
he
came
into
this
County,
but
we
work
with
them
bullet
is
a
great
corporate
citizen.
I
have
two
new
distilleries
coming
into
Shelby
County
over
200
million
dollars,
investment
in
our
County,
the
business
of
bourbon
is
not
going
out
of
business,
it's
growing
its
business
and
it
has
done
that.
J
But
many
years
ago,
bill
Samuels,
set
before
the
legislative
body
and
said
when
we
were
working
on
tax
deals.
We,
the
bourbon
industry,
will
never
harm
the
education
system
of
Kentucky
I'm
approaching
over
a
million
dollars
for
our
school
system
in
Shelby
County.
When
these
new
operations
get
up
and
operational,
we'll
push
over
two
million
dollars
for
our
school
system.
We
can't
continue
to
harm
our
school
system.
J
I
can
make
up
the
shortfall
if
it
goes
to
the
library
if
it
goes
to
other
taxing
districts
that
are
a
part
of
it,
but
our
fire
departments
and
our
education
system
cannot
be
harmed
by
this,
but
I
would
like
and
be
more
than
willing
to
sit
down
with
the
industry
and,
let's
look
at
a
sunset,
25
30
years
down
the
road.
Where
can
we
go
with
this?
We
make
the
concessions
when
we
bring
these
new
Industries
in
no
property
tax
we
share
in
the
occupational
Revenue
big
bourbon
doesn't
bring
big
jobs.
J
We
can
run
bullet
Distillery
on
probably
50
70
people,
it's
not
the
occupation.
It's
that
Barrel
tax
that
was
so
important
any
contract
with
any
new
distillery
coming
into
Shelby.
County
says
any
concessions
will
go
away
if
the
barrel
tax
goes
away.
I,
don't
know
that
any
other
county
has
done
that,
but
that's
big
bourbon.
J
You
brought
something
to
the
table
and
it
was
that
Barrel
tax.
That's
why
we
wanted
you
in
Shelby
County.
It
helped
our
education
system.
I'm
a
negotiator
I've
always
negotiated.
It's
not
a
matter
of
yea
or
nay
it's.
What
can
we
find
in
the
middle
representative?
Decker
has
been
outstanding
in
working
with
my
office,
working
with
our
education
system
and
working
to
find
these
Solutions
I
can't
compliment
the
representative
enough
for
the
job
she
does
in
working
with
Shelby
County.
Many
of
you
have
been
given
Barrel
slats
from
the
bourbon
industry.
P
Yes,
sir,
if
you'll
humor
me
about
two
minutes,
I'll
get
to
this
to
one
of
the
solutions.
Okay
and
I
want
to
address
Senator
Stivers.
You
were
asking
about
some
numbers
and
I
want
to
throw
those
out
if
I
could
so
I'm
from
Henry
County
Kentucky,
our
economic
engine
was
Burley
tobacco.
For
decades
we
have
five
small
Industries
there,
all
employing
less
than
100
folks.
The
global
economy
took
out
the
back
industry
and
it
took
out
most
of
my
Little
Mom
and
Pop
100,
100
jobs
or
less
industry.
P
First
16
years,
the
judge
executive
I
had
zero
good
good.
There
was
no
good
economic
news.
First
16
years,
2018
Peerless,
Distillery,
Angels,
Envy,
Distillery
and
rabbit
hole,
Distillery
all
came
in
the
same
year.
It
was
an
election
year.
It
was
a
nice
gift
for
me
that
year
a
lot
happening.
People
were
excited,
Rabbit
Hole
wanted
to
build
warehousing,
a
tasting
room
and
a
Distillery
the
they
picked
a
poor
piece
of
ground.
P
Next
to
a
subdivision,
the
people
rose
up,
fought
that
and
ended
up
suing
them
planting
zoning
past
that
the
county
did
our
part
to
endorse
that
project.
In
order
to
save
that,
we
gave
them
at
cost
four
thousand
dollars
an
acre,
40
acres
in
our
county-owned
Industrial
Park,
just
for
warehousing
warehousing
only
they
said
the
distilleries
off
the
table,
the
tasting
room-
we
may
do
something
out
there,
but
we've
got
to
have
a
place
to
store
this
bourbon,
because
the
Distillery
now
is
in
downtown
Louisville.
P
We
need
warehousing
Fiscal
Court
made
a
decision
to
do
that,
based
upon
the
benefit
of
the
barrel
tax
that
we're
supposed
to
get
so
I
know.
There
was
a
lot
I
think
it's
important
to
make
that
comment,
because
we've
talked
a
lot
about
irbs
and
things
we
didn't
give
an
RB.
We
just
sold
this
land
at
four
thousand
dollars
an
acre
that
we
had
hundreds
of
thousands
of
dollars
in
federal
grants,
state
grants
tobacco
settlement
dollars
to
put
the
infrastructure
in
and
County
tax
dollars.
P
First
thing,
I
want
to
say
second
thing:
also
Angels
Envy
came
that
year
in
2018
and
in
the
planning
zoning
meeting
in
a
public
meeting
they
handed
out.
This
was
part
of
their
slide
presentation
and
I
passed
that
out
I.
Hopefully,
you
all
will
get
that,
but
before
a
room
full
of
people,
we
had
to
have
it
at
our
school
because
it
was
so
largely
attended.
P
They
said
we
estimate
that
you
all
will
receive
855
000
in
Barrel
tax
revenue,
so
part
of
our
decision
for
welcoming
them
in
was
based
on
that
Braille
tax
revenue
and
I
want
to
get
to
the
numbers
point.
For
you
very
fresh.
Three
nights
ago,
Fiscal
Court
just
heard
a
rezoning
request
from
Angel's
Envy
Distillery
and
passed
it
a
thousand
acres
25
new
58,
000
Barrel
warehouses.
Now
I
want
to
do
that.
Math,
25,
warehouses
times
58
000
barrels
is
one
million
four
hundred
fifty
thousand
barrels.
P
All
the
distilleries
in
Henry
County
start
at
fifty
dollars
a
fifth
fifty
dollars
a
fifth
times.
240
fifths
and
a
barrel
equals
twelve
thousand
dollars
per
barrel.
Twelve
thousand
dollars
per
barrel
times.
One
million
four
hundred
fifty
thousand
I've
been
using
the
same,
adding
machine
for
20
years
for
my
budgets
and
I
had
to
get
down
with
my
magnifying
glass
and
look
at
the
zeros
17
billion
400
million
our
tax
on
17
billion.
400
million
is
a
little
bit
over
seven
million
dollars.
P
P
The
sunset
is
problematic.
Whichever
way
you
go,
if
you
put
a
five-year
sunset
in
then
all
these
promises
that
we
were
made,
we
don't
get
anything
for
it,
because
our
barrels
are
just
coming
online
in
five
years
and
then,
if
you
put
in
30
years,
20
years
or
30
years,
I
like
that
better
but
probably
kicking
the
can
down
the
road.
P
What
we've
heard
the
industry
State
say
what
you
all
said
is
we're
worried.
Folks
are
going
to
go
someplace
else,
the
startups!
P
Well,
what
if
you
Exempted
the
first
10
000
barrels
and
that
doesn't
sound
like
a
lot
but
but
watch
these
numbers
with
me
at
25,
a
fifth!
So
not
the
fifty
dollars
a
fifth,
but
at
twenty
five
dollars
a
fifth
that's
six
thousand
dollars
a
barrel.
A
thousand
barrels
will
be
six
million.
Ten
thousand
barrels
will
be
sixty
million
dollars.
That's
quite
a
bit
of
capital.
I
would
think
once
somebody
got
to
60
million
in
retail
capital
that
it
probably
wouldn't
hurt
them
to
pay
a
few
hundred
thousand
in
Barrel
tax.
P
At
that
point,
so
I
would
think
that
would
really
help
all
those
mom
and
pop
startups
all
those
type
of
folks
get
started,
and
that
would
be
something
that
I'd
like
to
throw
at
us
a
solution,
but
it
we
have
no
other
options.
We're
one
of
15
counties
in
the
state
of
Kentucky
does
not
have
a
occupational
tax
does
not
have
an
insurance
premium
tax
and
we're
becoming
a
bedroom
community
more
and
more,
and
we
don't
have
a
way
to
pay
for
the
services.
So
thank
you
for
your
time
appreciate
it.
A
Thank
you
and
I
appreciate
you
throwing
an
idea.
That's
that's!
That's
interesting!
We'll
just
keep
going
across
the
table
go
ahead.
E
Again,
thank
you
for
the
opportunity
to
come
before
you
all.
I
think
this
is
my
first
time
having
a
seat
at
the
table
during
this
I've
been
attending
the
meetings
again
I'm
the
economic
development
director
in
Marion
County,
just
a
little
bit
about
my
background.
I
was
formerly
a
senior
project
manager
at
the
cabinet
for
economic
development
under
the
governor
Bevin
Administration
worked
a
year
for
the
Bashir
Administration
before
taking
this
role
in
in
Marion,
County
and
I.
E
Just
want
to
point
out
that
I
probably
have
more
in
common
with
you
all
than
not
typically
I
would
be
all
about.
You
know
creating
a
business
friendly
environment,
doing
whatever
it
takes
to
cut
red
tape
and
make
it
easier
to
do
business
here
in
Kentucky
until
I
saw
what
this
could
potentially
do
to
us
at
the
local
level
and
how
detrimental
it
would
be
to
my
County
by
taking
this
tax
away
so
I
hope
to
provide
just
a
little
bit
of
a
different
perspective
from
the
economic
development
side
of
things
today.
E
I
don't
necessarily
feel
like
Marion
County
has
had
a
true
seat
at
the
table
until
today.
So
I
greatly
appreciate
that
and
I
hope
you'll
kind
of
allow
us
the
opportunity
for
that
today.
E
If
we
would
have
had
enough,
have
had
a
seat
at
the
table
and
had
an
opportunity
to
have
a
rebuttal,
maybe
a
little
bit
towards
some
presentations
that
have
been
given,
particularly
by
the
Kentucky
distillers
Association,
when
we're
talking
about
bourbon
in
Kentucky,
which,
by
the
way
I'm
a
huge
fan
of
very
much
so
I
wish
I
had
one
with
me
right
now.
That
could
be
helpful.
E
We
we
jumped
from
slide
to
slide
talking
or
they
jumped
from
slide
to
slide
talking
about
Bourbon
and
then
all
of
a
sudden
would
say
something
that
I
found
to
be
a
little
misleading,
saying
that
other
states
had
so
many
other
distilleries
in
them
outside
of
Kentucky
that
we
were
kind
of
falling
behind
on
that,
and
you
know
I
would
have
a
rebuttal
to
that
to
say.
Are
we
still
talking
about
bourbon?
Are
we
still
talking
about
the
Bourbon
Trail?
Are
we
talking
about
other
spirits
that
are
distilled
in
other
states?
E
You
know
vodkas
tonics,
all
dozens
of
other
spirits
and
so
I
think
there
were
some
things
that
were
very
misleading
from
from
a
Local
Economic
Development
perspective.
We've
had
three
distilleries
interested
in
Marion
County
within
the
last
two
months,
two
of
those
being
International
companies
that
don't
already
have
a
presence
here
in
the
United
States
or
in
Kentucky
that
are
looking
to
grow
their
American
whiskey
footprint,
and
they
do
not
want
to
do
that
anywhere
outside
out
of
Kentucky.
They
want
it
to
be
here.
E
So,
just
as
a
reminder,
I
think
these
numbers
may
have
been
discussed
already,
but
I
want
to
bring
up
Kentucky
bourbon
project
since
2015
and
I'm
just
going
to
name
off
a
few
that
have
happened
in
counties:
Nelson
County,
755
million
dollars
of
investment
over
27
projects.
This
does
not
include
numbers
from
2022,
so
this
is
from
2015
to
2021
Franklin
County,
here
in
Frankfurt,
361
million
dollars
of
investment,
Jefferson
County
171
million
dollars
of
investment.
E
I.
Don't
believe
that
the
bourbon
industry
is
slowing
down
and
I
just
want
to
talk
about
the
law
that
we've
been
talking
about.
That
was
passed
in
2014
by
you
all
the
law
was
passed
without
involving
our
local
officials.
In
fact,
I
have
our
County
judge
executive
here
with
us
today,
who
didn't
even
know
that
the
law
of
the
tax
credit
was
being
passed
in
2014..
E
E
Is
it
truly
a
problem?
I
know
for
a
fact
that
if
we
would
have
been
involved
in
2014
with
the
law
that
was
passed,
we
certainly
would
have
handled
our
IRB
situations
a
lot
differently
of
how
we've
incentivized
at
the
local
level
for
distilleries
to
move
into
Marion,
County
and
I'm,
going
to
turn
it
over
to
our
judge
executive
to
talk
about
some
numbers
that
he
has.
So
thank
you
again
for
the
opportunity
always
willing
to
to
sit
down
and
talk
through
Solutions
with
you
all.
Thank
you,
but.
O
All
right,
thank
you.
David
Doherty,
the
County
judge
of
Marion
County.
G
O
Started
in
2014
I'm
on
my
second
term
last
year
in
my
second
term
and
we'll
be
the
judge
for
the
next
four
years
again,
as
Brooklyn
mentioned
in
2016
Marion
County
done
about
495
million
dollar
industrial
revenue
Bond.
That
was
a
difficult
process
for
the
folks
of
Marion
County.
The
Fiscal
Court,
as
the
other
judges
can
relate
to
you
they're,
not
always
the
easiest
things
to
to
to
make
happen.
O
A
lot
of
people
are
affected
by
those
irbs
and
the
reason
you
do
those
irbs
is
for
the
the
growth
of
your
your
taxes
in
your
community
in
your
county,
all
the
taxing
districts
get
a
piece
of
that
of
that
distilled
Spirits
tax,
industrial
revenue,
bonds,
Abate
the
tax
for
the
county.
So
it
is
a
definitely
a
welcoming
thing
we
do
for
the
distilleries
and
something
that
I
think
in
the
future.
O
If,
if
this
tax
is
eliminated,
could
cause
some
hurdles
for
the
bourbon
business
I
think
it
would
create
difficulty
in
going
to
other
communities
due
to
what
are
you
going
to
get
out
of
it?
Like
you
say,
they're,
not
a
lot.
A
large
employer
in
these
counties
usually
50
to
60
jobs,
so
you
know
other
than
the
bonus
of
the
distilled
Spirits
tax
they're
difficult
to
justify
for
your
community
for
your
counties
and
I
think
this
is
looked
at
totally
wrong.
O
In
my
opinion
on
on,
you
know
the
way
it's
being
handled,
it's
just
to
eliminate
something
that
we
have
recruited
and
tried
to
help
bring
these
folks
to
our
communities.
I
think
it's
it's
a
there's
something
else
that
hasn't
been
mentioned,
something
that
that
we
do
not
get
from
distilled
Spirit
from
distilleries
is
net
profit.
O
243
does
not
allow
us
to
get
that
tax,
which
is
a
lot
of
money
for
the
counties
that
we
do
not
get.
So
that's
something
else
that
I
haven't
heard
and
brought
up,
but
I
don't
really
have
a
solution
other
than
we
never
really
agreed
in
2014.
If
we
would
have
known
that
this
was
going
to
be
an
such
a
hit,
we
would
never
probably
have
done
the
irbs
other
than
saying
that,
but
we
do
appreciate
our
bourbon
people
in
our
County.
We
get
along
with
them
great
Makers.
O
Mark
is
a
a
great
Community
member
for
us
and
diagio
as
well,
but
the
future
of
Diageo
was.
We
haven't,
received
a
dime
from
Diageo
yet
because
of
the
this
delayed,
that
would
be
the
only
solution
that
I
might
would
have
would,
instead
of
the
put
it
out
another
year
before
the
tax
begins.
That
would
be
the
only
thing
I
could
think
of
that
might
would
help
with
this.
Okay.
A
Thank
you,
a
couple
questions.
Do
you
have
any
idea
how
much
tax
property
tax
was
abated.
O
A
I'm
just
curious
second,
the
in
any
of
your
contracts-
and
this
is
kind
of
for
any
of
you
counties.
Is
there
a
requirement
that
the
bourbon
industry
keep
the
barrels
in
those
warehouses
that
were
funded
through
the
IRB
for
any
period
of
time?
Jerry,
okay,
get
near
a
mic.
There.
H
The
contracts
that
I'm
familiar
with
they're
they're
what
they
call
a
six
turn,
which
is
a
30-year
contract,
basically
built
for
Maker's
Mark,
because
it's
a
six-year-old
product
they
stay
in
those
houses
for
the
contractor
for
30
years
at
the
25-year
level,
is
when
they're
worth
the
most.
Then
they
start
back
on
the
back
side,
because
you
have
houses
going
out
of
it.
That's
not
they
they've
haven't
expired
their
term
limit
and
to
help
you
representing
McCoy
and
and
Robert
the
the
first
thing
of
it
is.
H
We
did
Supply
the
numbers
I'm,
sorry,
you
didn't
get
them
from
the
abatement
and
in
our
community
it's
about
3.6
million
a
year
in
property,
tax
abatement
and
half
of
the
tangible
tax
for
the
barrels
we
receive
out
of
that
on
the
existing
26
warehouses.
It's
there
already
under
this
agreement,
existing
not
the
15,
that's
been
in
a
1.7
million.
H
H
H
Our
community
gave
a
lot
to
keep
the
world's
number
one
producer
bourbon
in
the
largest
bourbon
producer
in
the
world,
to
stay
in
our
community,
and
we
also
have
four
roses
as
well
between
those
two
distilleries
others
32
new
yeah,
32,
new
warehouses
being
built
17
of
them.
It's
24,
000
barrels,
the
other
15
under
the
rrb,
is
58
000
barrels,
so
you're
looking
at
math
here
that
under
the
you
talk
about
Solutions.
H
So
if
there
is
a
sunset
or
whatever
the
sunset's
exponentially,
going
to
go
up,
I've
had
the
ability
and
the
opportunity
gave
to
me:
I
have
produced
over
200
million
200
million
gallons
of
bourbon.
The
numbers
are
phenomenal.
I've
done
this.
The
the
reach
that
we
have
had
has
been
when
you
look
at
the
recent
article
about
some
Texas
bourbon.
H
They
come
up
and
they
buy
Kentucky
bourbon
to
to
mingle
with
their
Texas
bourbon,
to
call
it
a
good
bourbon
so
and
Robert
to
help
you
a
little
bit
here
with
this
I'm,
not
singling
you
out,
but
all
these
folks
I
brought
with
me
they've
been
on
my
porch
in
the
last
year
and
a
half
because
it
affects
every
one
of
them
matter
of
fact.
We
had
to
narrow
this
down.
H
H
No,
when
I'm
gonna
say
insurance
premium
surcharge,
neither
one
of
these
companies
because
they're
self-insured,
so
when,
when
you
look
at
the
gift
and
what
we
have
gave
to
them
to
make
sure
that
they
stay
whole
in
our
community,
closing
roads
fixing
roads,
making
sure
that
they
have
the
the
the
level
of
support
to
make
them
success.
We're
sort
of
a
bit
of
myth
with
all
this.
H
All
the
way
around
how
they
could
come
to
the
table
and
ask
for
this
to
be
gone
or
some
type
of
way
to
Sunset
it
sunset
would
be
okay.
If
you
can
keep
us
whole
on,
if
y'all
could
pass
along
Kentucky
Department
of
Revenue
can
let
me
have
how
many
barrels
they
do
have,
so
we
could
figure
out
the
exact
amount
that
they
have
in
storage
like
they
were
in
the
past.
This
would
be
absolutely
fantastic.
H
So
our
solution
is
this.
I
have
two
fire
departments
here,
one
of
them
they're
doors
will
close
if
this
goes
away,
they'll
be
gone,
so
that's
going
to
fall
back
on
us
as
a
county
to
provide
fire
protection
for
both
beam
and
four
roses.
Each
one
and
I
have
my
EMS
team
here,
my
EMA.
It's
it's
all
about
the
resources.
That's
required
to
take
care
of
millions
of
Barrels
in
in
your
community
and
the
manufacturing
base.
That's
Limited,
like
I,
said:
I
have
a
lot
of
experience
in
that
industry.
H
I'm
I'm,
sorry
that
you
all
wasn't
here
at
the
last
one
I've
left
packets,
explaining
this
up
here
to
you
all.
Our
solution
is
I,
hear
what
Dan
saying
I've
worked
with
Dan
in
the
past.
I
have
literally
some
of
the
same
background,
not
as
lengthy,
because
I
was
manufacturing
most
of
my
career,
but
we're
here
we're
here
to
help
work
with
them.
If
there
is
a
reasonable
solution,
but
right
now
we
I
have
our
CFO
and
we
have
quite
the
competent
staff
and
we
haven't
been
able
to
find
the
solution.
H
They
talk
about
corporate
credits.
Well,
when
you,
when
you
take
a
corporate
credit
on
1.1
million
barrels
a
year,
that's
a
pretty
good
chunk
of
change.
That
I
don't
know
if
the
state
could
afford
to
subsidize
this
with
so
and
I'll
be
happy
to
answer
any
other
questions
with
this
or
from
the
Kentucky
distillers.
Association.
H
H
M
But
let
me
let
me
ask
a
question
about
just
County
Logistics.
When
you
talk
about
Solutions,
if
I'm
not
badly
mistaken,
each
County
kind
of
has
an
insurance
rating
based
on
one.
Do
you
have
a
fire,
hydrant
yep
and
two
somebody
that
can
use
the
fire
hydrant?
Yes,
sir?
So
if
you
don't
have
either,
you
generally
have
like
a
14
or
15
rating,
which
means
that
you're
for
most
people,
your
homeowners
or
your
business
insurance
premium,
is
going
to
go
through
the
roof.
M
H
M
Asked
from
this
I
think
you
know
when
we're
talking
about
Solutions.
Yes,
sir
I
think
it's
somewhat
of
a
red
herring
to
say
we're
wanting
to
put
fire
departments
out
of
solutions.
I
doubt
the
distillers
want
to,
because
you
know
in
most
of
the
contracts
you
do
the
what's
it
called
you
make
sure
that
they're
Exempted
from
your
contracts,
yes.
M
H
And
most
of
the
distillers
in
the
past
had
always
been
in
the
counties
so
not
to
affect
the
fire
rating
of
the
of
the
cities
and
and
Robert
if
I
may,
and
this
isn't
for
entertainment,
if
I
can
have
the
chief
stand
up
and
turn
around
for
just
a
minute.
This
is
their
logo
and
their
Mantra
they're
literally
right
across
the
street,
from
Jim
Beam
Chief.
If
you
would
see
what
it
says
on
there,
can
you
read
it?
No
I'm
too
old
is
bourbon
and
and
this
and
they
that's
been
their
logo
and
their
Mantra.
H
P
J
J
Chairman,
just
just
in
closing
I
I
would
like
to
say
you've
heard
from
the
county
judges
today
we
are
open
to
negotiations,
but
negotiations
is
not
my
way
or
the
highway
and
we
we
will
work
with
the
industry.
We
will
work
with
you
to
find
a
solution
to
this
problem,
but
it
can't
be
take
it
or
leave
it
and.
A
It
is
for
your
help.
No
no
and
I
appreciate
that
very
much.
Thank
you
for
those
comments.
All
right.
Next
up.
Look
like
the
another
group
that
would
be
here.
We
got
some
folks
from
the
some
Sheriff's
departments.
A
If
you
wanted
to
talk,
you
don't
have
to
as
I
looked
over,
it
said,
didn't
want
to
speak,
and
so,
if
anybody
from
the
sheriff's
once
got
something
to
add
or
has
a
an
idea,
we'd
be
glad
to
hear
it
all
right.
If
not
last
group
on
the
list
is
industry
folks,
anybody
kind
of
on
that
side
that
wants
to
get
up
and
talk
and
and
real
quick
since
I'm,
the
chairman
I,
get
to
do
anything.
A
I
want
I
forgot
to
recognize
because
she's
hiding
behind
a
pole,
but
our
incoming
State
Rep
is
going
to
be
taking
my
spot
representative
maceroni's
here
and
I
just
wanted
to
introduce
her
as
well.
So
welcome
sorry,
I
missed
you
on
the
front
end.
A
If
you
guys
would
introduce
yourself
and
same
question
to
you,
I
asked
everybody
I've
heard
all
your
all
your
comments.
I
want
to
hear
some
solutions.
C
Yes,
sir,
thank
you
Mr
chairman
excuse
me.
Eric
Gregory,
president
of
Kentucky
disorders,
Association
and
I
am
going
to
turn
it
over
to
Chris
Nolan,
real,
quick
and
a
minute
who's
going
to
talk
about
some
potential
Solutions,
some
ideas
that
we've
had,
but
first
again,
as
everybody
else
has.
Let
me
thank
y'all
presidents,
divers,
chairman
McCoy
members
of
the
committee
for
having
this
task
force
to
create
an
open
dialogue.
So
we
can
get
to
some
solutions.
C
That's
why
we
have
been
and
continue
to
be
transparent
in
all
these
discussions
and
have
been
for
15
years
in
my
tenure,
we've
been
discussing
a
way
to
address
the
barrel
tax
since
2008,
because
it's
an
issue
that
is
discriminatory
and
almost
singular
to
Kentucky,
because
we
are
the
only
place
in
the
world
that
taxes
aging
barrels
of
spirits,
and
it
is
a
tax
specifically
to
Bourbon,
because
we
age
bourbon,
you
don't
age
FICA,
you
don't
age
gin,
you
don't
age
run,
but
you
do
age.
C
Bourbon,
we've
openly
shared
our
calculations
and
concerns,
and
we
understand
and
respect
that
this
is
a
tough
and
complicated
issue
for
everyone
involved.
There
are
millions
of
dollars
at
stake.
Barrel
tax
revenue
has
skyrocketed
from
less
than
14
million
dollars
in
2014
to
40
million
dollars
this
year.
C
But
one
thing
that
we
cannot
afford
to
do
in
our
opinion
is
not
address
this
mounting
problem
and
I'm
glad
other
stakeholders
came
today
and
are
coming
forward
with
Solutions.
C
C
This
year
alone,
we've
fallen
from
11th
to
12th,
nationally
in
the
number
distilleries,
and
we're
only
10
distilleries
away
from
slipping
to
14th
behind
Virginia
and
our
friends
in
Tennessee.
When
you
look
at
the
rate
of
growth
Kentucky's
in
the
bottom
tier
ranking
29th
in
the
rate
of
adding
new
distilleries.
C
At
one
point,
we
had
24
percent
of
all
distilleries
in
the
United
States.
We
now
have
four
percent.
We
used
to
have
nearly
half
of
all
the
distilling
jobs
in
the
country.
Now
that's
less
than
a
third
other
states
that
we've
shown
are
even
running
advertising
campaigns
targeting
Kentucky
bourbon
and
this
year.
For
the
first
time
ever,
Americans
are
spending
more
money
on
tequila
than
they
are
U.S
produce
whiskey
and
make
no
mistake
about
this
issue.
The
world
is
watching
us
just
this
week.
C
As
Senator
Stivers
pointed
out,
we've
had
some
people
suggest
we
move
our
barrels
to
other
states
like
the
distilleries.
Did
the
1970s
just
across
the
border,
in
Southern,
Indiana
or
even
Tennessee,
which
has
twice
in
the
last
decade,
rejected
attempts
to
enact
a
barrel
tax
and
both
those
States
now
have
more
than
100
distilleries
like
Kentucky,
so
before
I
turn
over
to
Chris.
Let
me
just
say
the
warning
flags
are
all
here.
C
So
we've
never
said,
take
it
or
leave
it.
But
we
have
said
we
are
committed
to
working
with
all
stakeholders
to
identify
and
resolve
this
Barrel
tax
issue
and
growing
our
industry.
Further.
By
removing
this
tremendous
barrier
to
Industry
additional
distilling,
industry
growth
will
generate
state
and
local
taxes
and
tax
revenue
through
job
creation,
tourism,
investment
and
supply
chain
recruitment,
and
so
now,
I'd
like
to
turn
it
over
to
Chris
Nolan
who's,
going
to
talk
about
some
ideas
and.
N
Thank
you
Mr
chairman,
and
if
you
want
to
let
Mr
Nolan
go
ahead,
if
you
want
to
let
them
get
through
what
they're
doing
and
I'll
just
go
at
the
end,.
A
Okay,
president,
would
you
want
to
wait
representative
Decker?
Do
you
want
to
wait
and
hear
it
all
or
do
you
have
a
question
well.
A
G
C
Property
tax
property,
but
barrels
are
not
considered
and
distillate
is
not
considered
a
taxable
good
anywhere.
C
Makes
it
there
that's
a
very
good
question:
most
people
make
a
a
clear
Spirit.
Most
people
make
a
whiskey
whether
it's
bourbon
or
a
single
malt
or
some
other
ones,
but
bourbon
right
now
is
a
very
hot
product.
It
is
what
is
driving
a
lot
of
the
the
spirits
category
right
now.
Well,
it
was
until
vodka
came.
Knocking
vodka
tequila
came
knocking
our
door
this
year.
C
B
Yeah,
thank
you
Mr
chairman,
thank
you
Eric,
in
what
we
want
to
talk
about.
Obviously,
today
is
tax
policy.
I
mean
we've
heard
a
lot
about
the
taxes
and
the
tax
revenue
that's
generated,
and
our
discussion
here
as
Eric
said
for
the
at
least
the
last
15
years
has
been
about
the
tax
policy
and
getting
the
tax
policy
right
for
this
Commonwealth,
so
that
the
industry
can
continue
to
compete.
Obviously
one
option
on
the
table
would
be
to
Levy
this
type
of
property
tax
on
all
the
industries
in
Kentucky.
B
That
would
be
one
tax
policy,
but
I
don't
think
anybody
wants
to
do
wants
to
do
that.
That
would
not
be
very
popular
with
the
folks
on
both
sides
of
me
here
representing
industry.
We
want
a
good
tax
policy,
and
so
one
option
obviously
would
be
to
make
the
tax
fully
refundable.
We've
talked
about
that
for
years
back
in
2018,
when
you
all
did
tax
reform,
we
were
trying
to
have
that
conversation
and
the
the
positives.
The
pros
of
that
is
that
it's
mostly
removes
the
barrier
to
entry
that
we've
been
talking
about.
B
It's
relatively
simple
to
to
to
construct
and
easily
put
together
from
a
policy
perspective
and
the
new
revenues
that
our
industry
is
expected
to
bring
into
the
state
coffers
over
the
next
three
years
and
3.3
billion
dollars
worth
of
new
investment
would
backfill
a
lot
of
that
that
tax
credit,
because
we
expect
that
to
generate
another
60
million
in
Revenue
every
year.
B
So
if
you
talk
about
eliminating
30
or
40
million
dollars
in
Barrel
taxes
or
talk
about
making
those
refundable
30
to
40
million
we're
going
to
be
dumping,
another
60
million
into
the
state
coffers
after
that
three
years
of
investment.
So
that's
a
return
on
investment.
However,
there
are
negatives
to
the
refundability
and
we
certainly
get.
That
argument
is
that
the
right
policy
for
the
state
and
in
our
discussions
with
leadership,
there's
been
a
hesitant
hesitancy
to
go
down
that
road,
and
we
completely
understand
that.
B
We
see
that
as
a
negative
towards
that
idea,
and
then
you
add
to
it
that
the
state
is
refunding.
The
taxes
that
are
paid
to
a
local
government
makes
that
even
more
complex.
So
is
that
the
best
solution?
I
leave
that
for
discussion,
but
that's
a
solution.
Mr
chairman,
as
you
had
mentioned,
putting
all
the
solutions
on
the
table
potential
Solutions,
the
second
one
would
be
expanding
the
use
of
our
tax
credits.
We
are
amassing
tax
credits
that
we
obvious
obviously
cannot
monetize,
and
that
does
help
our
distillers.
B
If
we
expand
the
use
of
that
credits,
it
keeps
our
local
communities
whole
if
those
credits
are
expanded
to
other
things,
but
the
negatives
to
that
is
how
do
you
do
it,
and
what
do
you
expand
them
to?
How
do
you
create
some
sort
of
tax
credit
for
other
taxes?
The
bourbon
industry
is
paying
whether
that's
sales
tax
is
occupational
taxes,
insurance
premium
taxes,
the
kind
to
that
whole.
B
The
negative
to
that
whole
idea
is,
it
would
be
an
unprecedented
use
of
tax
credits
and
a
very
complicated
use
of
tax
credits,
and
again,
is
that
the
good
public
policy
to
get
into
very
difficult.
We
understand
a
third
option
would
be
in
eliminating
the
tax
and
allowing
local
entities
to
use
some
level
of
compensating
rate
for
property
taxes
in
conjunction
with
other
state
or
local
tools,
as
we've
heard
today.
The
compensating
rate
could
be
very
high
in
some
communities.
B
B
A
look
at
the
positives
to
that
is
that
it
would
immediately
remove
the
barriers
to
entry
and
the
distillers
would
not
be
paying
the
tax
going
forward,
but
the
negatives
obviously
would
be
the
impact
on
the
local
communities
and
that
would
need
to
be
taken
into
some
sort
of
account.
B
The
fourth
and
last
option
is
one-
that's
been
discussed
here
already,
which
is
a
phased
out
in
Sunset
of
the
tax,
and
we
would
suggest
a
phase
out
and
sunset
of
the
tax
in
non-irb
warehouses.
We
understand
the
IRB.
Warehouses
are
a
unique
situation,
that's
a
two-party
contract
business
contract
and
we
think
there's
ways
to
address
that
through
those
contracts,
but
that
phase
out
begins
to
remove
the
barrier
to
entry
as
a
positive
and
allows
local
entities
to
continue
receiving
Revenue.
B
But
it
is
at
a
reduced
rate
over
time
and
that
allows
local
entities
to
plan
for
the
new
Revenue
sources
for
what
new
Revenue
sources
they
may
need.
But
the
big
deal
is
that
they're
able
to
plan
for
it,
and
we
continue
to
say
that
all
this
investment
that's
been
talked
about
today
and
the
investment
that's
Yet
to
Come
does
generate
new
revenues
for
all
of
our
communities,
including
the
state.
C
You
there
just
real,
quick
and
that's
something
we
do
have
Dr
Coombs
here
with
us
today,
who
has
looked
at
how
a
phase
out
would
would
happen
to
ease
that
transition
and
actually,
in
the
first
few
years
of
that
phase
out
the
local
communities
and
the
state
are
actually
going
to
get
higher
revenues
back,
because
the
inventory
as
it
ages
is
going
to
produce
higher
revenues
before
it
starts
a
gradual
drawdown
and
then
for
the
irbs
I.
Don't
know
if
you're
getting
ready
to
address
that
Chris
or.
D
C
As
I
mentioned,
the
senator
McDaniel
in
our
last
meeting
I
think
all
our
distilleries
with
irbs
and
there's
not
many
there's
a
handful
and
it's
mostly
in
Marion,
Nelson
and
bullet
counties.
I,
don't
know
about
Franklin
County,
but
I
think
you
will
find
the
distilleries
again
our
willing
Partners.
They
are
willing
to
sit
down
and
discuss
ways
that
the
IRB
contracts
can
be
kept
whole,
while
those
contracts
are
in
place
because
they
understand
that
they
did
make
commitments
to
those
communities
and
even
commitments
as
far
as
pilots
and
other
things
are
concerned,
earned.
C
B
Sorry,
Chris
I'm,
just
about
to
the
end
I
mean
that
the
negatives
to
that
type
of
solution
is
that
it
doesn't
solve
our
issue
immediately,
and
we
understand
that,
but
that's
an
option
that
we've
put
on
the
table,
something
we're
willing
to
talk
about.
As
that
sounds
like
some
local
governments
are
willing
to
talk
about
as
well.
B
So
with
that
I
just
I'll
wrap
up
those
were
kind
of
the
four
buckets
I
would
say
that
we
feel
like
could
could
be
had
discussions
to
see
what
type
of
solutions
are
on
the
table
and
I'm
happy
to
turn
it
over
to.
A
Q
I
can
go
ahead
and
go
if
that's
okay.
Thank
you
all
for
having
me
today.
This
is
my
first
time
appearing
before
this
task
force
and
I
appreciate
the
opportunity.
I
am
Ashley
Watson
president
and
CEO
of
the
Kentucky
Chamber
of
Commerce
Kentucky's
largest
Business
Association,
and
we
all
know
over
the
last
couple
of
years.
Q
If
you
think
about
how
they
stepped
up
when
covid-19
happened,
to
make
the
hand
sanitizer
when
they
raised
money
for
Western
Kentucky
when
the
tornado
hit
when
they
raise
money,
when
the
flooding
happened
in
Eastern,
Kentucky
and
so
much
more,
and
thanks
to
you
all
at
the
legislature,
the
distilling
industry
has
seen
much
success
over
the
last
couple
of
years.
Q
But
this
tax
statute
has
truly
become
a
deterrent
for
growth
in
one
of
our
signature
Industries,
and
not
only
does
this
tax
punish
production
by
our
existing
companies,
it
deters
new
investment
in
job
creation
from
startup
companies.
This
tax
creates
a
high
barrier
for
entry
for
new
distilleries,
which
must
pay
taxes
for
years
on
their
aging
bourbon
years,
before
sales
selling,
even
the
first
bottle
and
as
a
general
assembly.
You
all
have
worked
hard
over
the
last
several
years
to
help
create
an
environment
that
attracts
Investments
to
this
state,
especially
for
our
signature.
Q
Industries
bourbon
is
a
signature
industry
because
it
drives
so
many
other
business
sectors.
It
fuels
our
Farmers,
our
agriculture,
our
Mills,
our
retailers,
restaurants
and,
of
course,
tourism.
So
fixing
this
tax
is
more
than
just
helping
one
specific
industry.
It
helps
the
entire
Commonwealth.
Yet,
unfortunately,
here
our
state
continues
to
tax
its
homegrown
industry
like
no
other
place,
and
we
must
find
a
solution
that
works
for
everyone.
Currently
only
40
out
of
Kentucky's
120
Counties
have
distilleries.
Q
The
leaders
in
these
count
is
obviously
many
of
here
sitting
behind
us
right
now
recognize
the
vibrancy
and
the
jobs,
the
supplier,
development,
the
downtown
revitalization
and
the
tourism
that
these
companies
bring
it's
imperative
that
these
existing
Industries
and
the
counties
with
distilleries
that
we
remove
this
barrier.
Kentucky
has
plummeted
from
Once
having
24
percent
of
all
distilleries
in
the
U.S.
To
now
only
having
four
percent
to
remain
the
bourbon
capital
of
the
world
and
I
know
we
all
still
want
that.
This
slide
must
stop.
Q
We
also
strongly
support
our
local
counties-
our
cities,
our
school
boards,
who
work
hard
every
day
to
make
communities
a
place
where
people
want
to
work
live,
raise
a
family.
We
support
their
continued
growth
and
we
also
support
giving
them
added
flexibility,
so
they
can
continue
that
growth
as
kentuckians
and
as
a
general
assembly.
You
all
have
tackled
very
tough
issues
that
are
complicated
over
the
last
couple
of
years.
Issues
like
tax
reform
fixing,
our
unemployment
insurance
system,
modernizing
our
workers,
comp
system
and
so
much
more.
Q
Q
On
behalf
of
all
Kentucky
businesses,
we
as
a
chamber
commit
to
furthering
the
discussion
around
finding
a
solution
and
exploring
the
ideas
that
Chris
just
mentioned,
including
potentially
phasing
out
the
tax
over
time
to
allow
for
adjustments
in
tax
revenue
and
planning
by
our
local
government.
Much
like
what
you
all
did
when
you
put
forth
triggers
in
House
Bill
8
of
last
year
to
make
sure
that
the
revenue
would
be
there.
Q
Watts
often
says
the
best
thing
the
bourbon
industry
brings
to
Kentucky
are
the
jobs
and
those
jobs
that
create
generational
change,
changed
our
communities
and
I?
Usually
don't
speak
personally
up
here.
I
try
to
stick
to
business,
but
this
one
was
so
obvious.
I
had
to
at
least
bring
it
to
your
all's
attention.
I
can
speak
personally,
as
my
husband
who
was
raised
in
Bardstown
was
the
first
in
his
family
to
graduate
college.
He
was
afforded
this
opportunity
because
of
his
father's
job
at
Heaven
hell
where
he
recently
retired,
with
40
years
of
service.
Q
Not
only
did
my
husband
graduate
from
college
so
did
his
brother
and
sister,
who
are
now
both
living
in
Kentucky
and
raising
families.
This
is
what
the
bourbon
industry
brings
to
Kentucky
generational
change
and
opportunity.
This
is
the
reason
we
all
have
to
work
together
to
provide
a
solution
to
the
signature.
Industry
can
continue
to
thrive.
I
trust,
all
of
us.
This
in
this
room
can
figure
out
a
Tax
Solution.
What
we
can't
figure
out
is
not
having
our
bourbon
industry
and
that
generational
change
it
provides
in
the
Commonwealth.
Thank
you.
D
Mr
chairman
members
of
the
committee
I'm
Frank,
gemley
of
the
Kentucky
Association
of
Manufacturers.
Thank
you
for
the
opportunity
to
be
here
thanks
for
all
your
work
on
this
issue,
I'll
be
brief
and
endorse
the
remarks.
All
the
remarks
of
my
colleagues
up
here,
including
the
importance
of
vital
local
government
services
and
vital
improvement
in
our
schools.
Nothing
is
more
important
to
manufacturers
in
Kentucky
than
the
educational
system
and
the
workforce
that
it
produces.
So
for
reasons
of
tax
fairness
and
for
economic
development
improvement
in
our
state.
We
encourage
you
to
eliminate
the
barrel
tax.
D
It
is
remarkable
that
Kentucky
is
the
only
state
in
the
country
that
taxes
Bourbon
and
the
barrel
and,
as
you
all
know,
it's
difficult
to
overstate.
The
impact
of
the
bourbon
industry
to
our
state
as
Ashley
was
just
commenting
on
I'm
the
grandson
of
a
distiller.
So
this
is
a
subject
that
is
near
and
dear
to
my
heart,
so
we
encourage
you
to
phase
it
out
and
we
stand
ready
to
work
with
you
and
the
rest
of
industry
and
our
communities
to
get
to
a
solution
that
works
for
all
of
the
above.
N
D
You
know
that's
a
very
important
distinction.
Thank
you,
Mr,
chairman,
for
taking
that
one
off
that
list
all.
N
N
You
know
here
kind
of
the
Doom
and
Gloom,
but
I
want
to
share
something
with
you,
so
the
distilling
establishments
fell
from
24
to
6
in
the
last
20
years.
Share
of
employment
fell
from
43
to
30
percent,
but
the
share
of
distilling
payroll
Rose
from
40
to
45
percent
do
largely
to
the
presence
of
high
paying
professional
jobs
at
the
headquarters
here,
Kentucky
Remains,
the
main
player
in
terms
of
overall
production,
employment
and
payroll
Where'd.
N
That
you
guys
mentioned
we
do
every
two
years.
So
let
me
go
on
for
further
and
ask
you
something
else.
In
2012,
the
bourbon
industry
was
a
2.6
billion
dollar
industry,
correct
in
2022.
It's
a
4.8
billion
dollar
industry,
an
85
growth
rate
in
that
same
year.
According
to
your
guys
analysis,
you
were
storing
4.9
million
barrels
in
2021
you're,
storing
10.3
million
barrels,
an
increase
of
110
percent
of
barrel
storage,
while
the
industry
as
a
whole
only
grew
at
85
percent.
N
B
I
can
start
Senator.
Thank
you
for
that
question
and
we're
seeing
from
the
industry
we're
talking
to
distillers
and
every
distiller
that
has
located
here.
I
won't,
say
every
many
distillers
who
have
located
here
in
recent
years
or
have
announced
plans
to
said
we
looked
at
multiple
States
and
Kentucky
has
a
regulatory
environment
and
taxing
environment.
That
is
not
good
for
the
industry
good
for
their
decision
making.
B
They
fortunately
made
the
decision
to
come
here,
but
we
also
know
of
many
that
did
not
come
here,
because
of
that
you
know
we
have
a
Distillery
that
went
into
Nelson,
County
I
believe
that
specifically
said
I
was
this
close
to
going
to
another
state
but
made
the
decision
that
I
had
to
be
in
Kentucky
and
that's
that
was
fantastic.
But
we
also
know
of
three
four
five
six
examples
of
distillery's
massive
distilleries
that
are
in
Texas
right
now,
because
they
don't
have
the
tax
burden
that
Kentucky
has
and
those
are
ones
we
lost.
B
C
Oh
sorry
and
Mr
chairman,
one
of
the
things
I
would
say
is
yes,
the
distillers
are
expanding
right
now
to
keep
up
with
consumer
demand
and
that's
why
the
production
has
increased
and
that's
why
the
barrel
storage
is
increased.
How
much
would
it
have
increased
or
how
much
could
it
have
increase
if
we
didn't
have
the
Braille
tax.
N
So
you
know
Chris,
you
got
to
something
that
I
wanted
to
mention
here
that
made
a
decision
they
had
to
be
in
Kentucky.
So
my
mom
tells
this
story
right.
So
my
dad
was
the
last
draftee
for
Vietnam
from
Kentucky,
so
they
get
the
Vietnam
war
ends,
while
he's
in
basic
training.
They
get
sent
to
Germany
right
and
they
show
up
and
they
get
there
that
my
mom's
first
time
out
in
public
and
some
guy
says
well.
N
N
We
really
do
bourbon
likes
the
historic
nature
of
being
in
Kentucky,
be
it
the
you
know,
the
imagery
of
the
water
or
the
grain,
or
these
Rick
houses
or
whatever
the
case
is
and
I
think
the
data
Bears
out
that
the
executives,
the
corporate
headquarters,
like
our
low
tax
rate
and
they're,
going
to
like
the
lower
tax
rate
that
they're
fixing
to
get
soon
and
Mr
chairman
I'll,
be
as
brief
as
I
can
with
this
statement,
but
guys
any
taxation
regime
is
about
an
all-inclusive
package,
not
any
individual
item.
N
You
reference
the
barrel,
but
notably
absentee's
extended
conversation
about
occupational
tax
property,
tax
insurance,
premium
tax
and
all
those
other
things
that
go
into
not
making
us
a
taxation
blip,
as
was
described
to
me
by
a
previous
Commissioner
of
Revenue.
When
we
were
discussing
the
oh
goodness,
it
Escapes
Me,
Now,
the
the
International
taxation
stuff
that
we
dealt
with
the
other
year
that
we
worked
with
beam
directly
to
try
to
make
sure
that
Kentucky's
bourbon
industry
wasn't
negatively
affected,
but
Kentucky.
N
The
general
assembly
did
our
part
in
2014
with
his
tax
credit
bourbon's
unhappy,
because
you
guys
are
accruing
so
many
credits,
but
the
locals
with
a
lower
rate.
They
wouldn't
be
accruing.
So
many
credits
I
would
argue
that
on
the
mandatory
unitary
combined
returns
there.
N
But
I
would
argue
that
this
General
Assembly
has
done
more
in
the
past
decade
with
regulatory
changes
to
enhance
the
bourbon
industry
than
almost
anything
else.
Be
it
you
know
small
batch
distilleries,
or
you
know
local
tastings
or
all
those
things
that
are
important
to
that
industry
to
the
locals.
I
would
argue
you
think
you
have
a
great
relationship.
You
did
in
the
past
and
I
hope
you
do
in
the
future.
But
right
now
the
reason
you
liked
Bourbon
and
the
reason
you
wanted
them
is
because
you
viewed
this
bourbon
tax.
N
The
barrel
tax
is
beneficial
to
your
community.
The
industry
doesn't
want
that
or
they
want
some
change
to
it
to
the
industry.
You
think
you
get
along
with
locals,
but
the
one
tie
that
binds
more
than
anything
you
don't
want
to
deal
with
anymore,
but
I
also
think
to
the
industry.
Folks,
you
represented
to
the
locals
when
you
moved
to
their
communities
the
benefits
of
this
Barrel
tax,
and
you
have
not
just
an
economic
but
a
moral
obligation
to
the
commitment
that
you
made
to
those
folks
to
the
locals.
N
I
would
say
if
you
want
to
keep
the
bourbon
industry,
you
got
to
work
with
them
on
what
this
taxation
structure
looks
like
I
would
argue
to
both
sides,
as
I
have
before
the
general
fund
is
not
your
salvation,
hoping
that
the
seek
formula
will
increase
because
remember,
seek
is
a
piece,
is
a
pie
and
there's
an
overall
dollar
figure
we
budget
to,
and
if
we
budget
to
that
dollar
figure
bourbon
school
districts.
Yes,
you
go
up,
but
necessarily
the
other
schools.
N
Local
districts,
local
effort
will
then
look
disproportionately
higher
in
their
potential
share
of
that
pie
will
go
down
so
the
general
fund
seek
formula.
These
are
not
the
salvation
for
this,
so
to
locals.
I
would
argue
to
you
work
with
them
on
this
tax
policy
or
your
neighboring
counties
might
to
the
industry.
I
would
argue
to
you
if
you
don't
honor
those
moral
and
implicit
obligations.
Don't
necessarily
expect
such
a
Cooperative
General
Assembly
over
the
next
decade,
as
we
advance
Mr
chairman
to
your
admonition
that
is
so
wisely
made.
N
We
should
come
with
Solutions
and
the
solutions
is,
but
the
solution
is
one
that
we
implemented
at
the
state
level
a
decade
ago.
This
is
a
local
conversation
and
you
guys
need
to
be
having
it
and
don't
count
on
the
general
assembly
or
the
other
taxpayers
of
the
Commonwealth
to
get
involved
in
this
local
versus
industry
dispute.
Thank
you
for
your
time.
Mr
chairman
thank.
M
If
this
is,
this
is
somewhat
on
the
same
lines
as
Center
McDaniel
I'm
going
to
ask
with
first
of
all,
somebody
tell
me
how
many
new
Rick
houses
are
projected
to
be
built
in
the
next
five
years.
C
M
But
it
I
just
came
from
Heaven,
Hill
and
I
think
they're,
projecting
they
just
built
two
and
they're
right
building
two
more
right
about
five
million
per
rickhouse
and
I.
Think
those
are
some
of
the
smaller
Rick
houses.
C
I
I
think
it's
probably
in
the
40
to
50
000
Barrel
range,
but
I'd
have
to
double
check
with
them.
Okay,.
M
Along
the
lines
of
Senator
McDaniel,
when,
when
you're
sitting
here
and
and
I'm,
not
sure
what
was
meant
in
Marion
County,
that
they
did
an
IRB
and
16
when
the
ad
valorem
tax
credit
was
passed
in
14.
How
that
impacted
that,
because
it
was
out
on
the
table
but
starting
in
around
14,
you
all
and
15,
because
a
couple
of
things
we
did
here,
you
all
seen
a
mass
upward
trajectory
in
investment,
job
growth,
taxes
paid
due
to
sales.
M
C
I
think
you
look
at
it
from
a
competitive
standpoint.
Again,
we
have
distilleries
right
now
that
are
in
Mass,
going
to
other
states,
they're
not
coming
to
Kentucky
and
the
rate
that
they
are
other
states
right
now,
and
if
we
want
to
continue
that
growth,
we
want
to
continue
the
investment.
If
we
want
to
continue
even
we've
got.
10
percent
of
the
2200
distilleries
that
located
outside
Kentucky
would
be
in
the
top
five.
C
So
yes,
sir
you're
exactly
correct,
we're
doing
well
right
now
and
we
are
doing
well
because
we
are
home,
thankfully,
to
some
of
the
biggest
distilling
companies
and
not
only
the
country
and
the
world.
But
if
some
of
these
other
distilleries
in
the
other
states
start
to
take
hold
and
they
become
the
next
Maker's
marker,
they
become
the
next
Heaven
Hill.
B
More
and
more
of
those
distilleries
will
will
say
you
know:
I,
don't
have
to
be
in
Kentucky
to
make
bourbon
and
now
only
80
percent
of
the
world's
bourbon
is
made
in
Kentucky.
So
I
can
pop
my
brand
up
in
Indiana
or
Tennessee
or
Texas,
and
not
have
that
stigma
because
most
consumers
think
oh,
it's
bourbon.
It's
good
bourbon,
it's
probably
from
Kentucky!
B
So
we're
looking
ahead
to
try
to
eliminate
those
barriers
so
that
folks
more
freely
come
to
Kentucky
and
want
to
say
oh
yeah,
if
I'm
making
a
bourbon
I
better
be
in
Kentucky,
which
is
what
happened
to
several
of
our
distilleries
that
are
now
large
distilleries.
They
made
the
decision
10
years
ago.
Yeah
I
got
a
better
deal
in
Pennsylvania,
which
was
one
of
them,
but
if
I'm,
making
bourbon
I
really
need
to
be
in
Kentucky.
C
C
Point
yeah
I
mean
if
you
look
at
12
years
ago,
from
where
we
are
right
now
we
would
never
dreamed
that
we'd
be
in
the
success
mode
that
we're
in
right
now,
but
at
the
same
time
this
is
an
industry
that
is
driven
or
has
external
pressures
that
we
can't
control
tariffs
covid.
Anything
like
that.
We
have
Market
pressures
like
tequila
and
other
Spirits,
we're
changing
consumer
tastes
like
we
had
in
the
70s.
C
C
You
know
if
those
start
to
change,
then
yes,
suddenly,
12
years
from
now
that
Revenue
may
not
be
there
and
I.
Guess
that's
one
of
the
things
we're
trying
to
say
is
we
don't
want
to
be
in
a
situation
where
another
downturn
in
the
bourbon
industry,
through
competition
or
changing
consumer
taste
or
any
of
these
things
has
an
effect
on
schools,
fire
districts,
Community
budgets?
That's
why
we're
bringing
this
up
right
now,
the
bourbon
the
barrel
tax
is
growing.
M
Well
and
I'm
going
to
say
this:
I
would
say
that
if
anybody
understands
what
the
loss
of
an
industry
means
like
I,
do
is
probably
the
Henry
County
Judge
because
they
lost
the
tobacco
industry
and
there
will
be
good
days
and
bad
days
in
the
industry
may
leave
and
I,
and
that's
why
I'm
interested
in
knowing
this
and
I've
asked
you
some
pretty
tough
questions.
I
want
to
know
how
do
you
sell
it
man,
it's
tough,
to
sell
when
you're,
showing
those
types
of
returns
to
say.
M
Nobody
thought
the
small
tobacco
farm
was
ever
going
to
go
out
of
business,
but
it
did-
and
I
will
say
this
somewhat,
like
Senator
McDaniel
to
those
individuals
in
Marion,
County
I
actually
know
of
a
few
counties
that
are
not
too
far
away
from
you
that
are
making
overtures
to
take
some
of
your
house,
business
and
I
know
in
my
area
we
would
love
to
have
a
rick
house.
You
know-
and
somebody
said
well,
it
might
be
a
crumb
well
when
you've
not
had
any
cake
in
a
long
time.
M
My
crumb
looks
like
the
whole
slice
and
so
I
know
the
competition
is
out
there
and
there
has
to
be
some
response,
but
it's
hard
to
sell
that.
There's
a
need
for
a
response.
When
you
have
this
type
of
trajectory
in
your
growth
and
sales.
B
Senator,
if
I
can
respond
to
that
question
earlier,
just
a
second,
when
you
have
somebody
like
Angels
Envy
in
Henry
County,
they
are
Kentucky
based,
they
came
here
before
bourbon
boom
got
started,
they
had
their
location
in
Louisville
and
they
had
the
need
to
expand
they're.
Looking
at
their
projections
trying
to
meet
consumer
demand,
they're
like
we
have
to
expand,
we
need
more
bourbon
warehouses.
We
can't
put
them
in
downtown
Louisville.
B
So
when
they
started
looking
for
a
place
to
go,
they
found
Henry
County.
They
didn't
go
to
Henry,
County
and
say
we'll
give
you
money,
they
said
we've
got
to
expand.
Would
you
have
us
in
Henry
County,
but
part
of
that
deal
is
that
these
State
statutes
require
that
we
pay
the
taxes.
So,
no
matter
where
we
went,
the
state
statutes
require.
We
pay
the
community
these
taxes,
it
wasn't
necessarily
the
deal
we
cut
was
we'll
pay
you
taxes.
If
we
come
to
your
community,
it
was
the
taxes
are
required.
B
Now,
how
can
we
structure
something?
That's
beneficial
to
them,
no
matter
where
they
went,
they
would
have
structured
a
deal,
and
in
this
case
it
was
not
irbs.
It
if
based
on
the
previous
discussion,
but
it
was
just
land,
and
so
that
was
the
agreement,
but
they
would
have
made
they
had
to
make
that
agreement.
Because
this
the
state
statutes
require
the
taxation
and
we
would
honor
all
those
agreements
and
we
think
the
irbs
can
be
adjusted
for
those
agreements
that
were
made.
F
I've
heard
a
lot
about
Texas
bourbon
in
these
meetings
and
I've
never
tried
it.
So
last
night
I
decided
I'm
going
to
go.
Buy
me
a
bottle
of
Texas
Bourbon
and
I
am
a
big
fan
of
Kentucky
bourbon.
By
the
way
I've
got
a
pretty
good
collection,
never
enter
my
mind
to
buy
anything
from
anywhere
else.
Anyway.
I
went
to
the
liquor,
store
and
I
said:
do
you
have
Texas
bourbon?
He
said
I
sure
do
I
said
how
much
is
a
bottle
of
this
and
he
said
117
dollars
and
I
thought.
Well.
F
He
said
here
I'll,
let
you
try
it
first.
He
got
two
different.
He
got
two
different
ones
out
both
of
them.
Tasted
like
kerosene,
there's,
no
comparison,
there's
no
comparison!
You
could
pour
a
bottle,
half
a
bottle
of
Jim
Beam
in
there.
It
wouldn't
help
it.
It
was
awful.
So
I
just
wanted
to
point
out
that
you
can
write
bourbon
on
anything.
You
want
to
write
it
on,
but
you
can't.
Apparently,
you
can't
make
good
bourbon
in
Texas.
I
learned
that
well
and
I'm.
Glad
I
didn't
spend
100
17
on.
C
Mentioned
our
marketing
campaign-
and
it's
called
the
proof-
is
here
again,
and
so
we
would
love
for
you
to
create
a
testimonial
for
us
that
Texas
bourbon
doesn't
stand
up
to
Kentucky
bourbon.
Yes,.
C
Q
G
Thank
you,
Mr
chairman
I
I'm,
trying
to
draw
some
conclusions
from
all
that
I'm
hearing
want
to
make
sure
I
understand.
Clearly
what
I've
heard
from
what
you
said
in
answer
to
a
question
I
had
earlier
about
other
states
and
what
are
their
tax
structures?
They
are
having
property
tax,
absent
barrels.
So
I
conclude
that
that
is
you
say
it's
more
advantageous,
so
some
people
are
going
there
so
that
overall
tax
structure
creates
less
tax
revenue
for
those
States
than
our
Barrel
tax.
Does
here.
G
And
we've
asked
the
counties
and
to
tell
us
what
they
have
lost
in
property
tax
so
that
we
can
look
at
what
about
the
industry
you.
You
should
know
that
right
or
do
you
know
that?
Can
you
present
that
what
the
industry
has.
C
We
can
certainly
ask
well,
we
can
certainly
ask,
but
I
would
also
say
that
when
you
that
I
think
and
Dr
Kim
have
some
of
these
numbers
that
when
you
have
property-
and
you
add
a
rick
house
or
a
warehouse
to
it-
the
property
value
goes
up
correct,
Dr
Coombs.
C
M
D
Yes,
so
we
do
track
the
amount
of
real
estate,
property
taxes
and
tangible
property
taxes
that
the
industry
pays
by
jurisdiction
by
year.
We've
been
doing
this
for
13
14
years
and
so
independent
of
the
barrel
tax.
Okay,
yes,
so
I
put
this
table
together
last
night,
so
in
2013.
D
Real
estate
taxes
paid
by
the
industry
two
point:
two
million
in
2020,
6.6
million,
so
triples
in
the
last
seven
years.
The
amount
of
real
estate
taxes
made
by
distilleries
tangible
in
2013
1.4
million
in
2020
3.8
million.
So
that's
about
two
and
a
half
times
increase.
So
as
the
Investments
are
made.
Yes,
you
get
the
barrels
to
tax,
but
you
also
get
the
buildings
and
the
equipment,
the
visitor
centers,
the
hospitality
centers
Etc.
So
it's
a
growth
of
in
terms
of
Real
Estate.
D
In
the
last
seven
years,
4.4
million
tangible
2.4
million
aging
Barrel,
16.1
million,
so
the
barrel
taxes
are
growing
at
a
faster
rate
than
the
real
estate
taxes.
If
I
may
add
one
other
thing,
because
people
keep
talking
about
how
it's
done
in
other
states
and
you've
asked
that
twice.
That's
a
great
question:
what
you'll
find?
D
If,
if
you
look
at
Public
Finance
Arrangements
around
the
United,
States
Kentucky
is
very
low
in
its
Reliance
on
property
taxes,
real
estate
property
taxes,
we're
in
the
bottom
10
of
states
for
local
governments,
dependence
upon
real
estate,
property
taxes,
Kentucky
has
very
low
tax
rates,
and
this
leads
me
to
a
logical
conclusion.
Given
the
school
boards
talk
about
hitting
the
four
percent
cap
and
having
to
lower
the
rates
every
year,
we've
created
that
with
house
bill
44.
D
the
four
percent
cap
on
the
growth
in
property
tax
rates
and
that
keeps
Kentucky's
property
tax
rates
extremely
low.
So
this
is
one
thing
that
you
could
look
at
about
another.
This
is
not
their
policy.
This
is
just
Coombs
Professor.
Listening
to
everybody
and
playing
back
what
I
hear
and
having
looked
at
this
for
30
or
40
years,
the
school
system
could
rely
more
on
local,
real
estate
property
taxes.
If
you
remove
that
four
percent
cap
every
year,
and
then
they
wouldn't
be
as
addicted
to
the
Aging
Barrel
taxes,
okay,.
G
G
H
Does
that
help
you
over
a
period
of
time
when
you,
when
you
take
the
three
point,
something
million
a
year
in
property
tax
abatement
which
includes
tangible?
Yes,
you
can
do
the
math
literally,
it
figures
have
to
be
27
and
a
half
years
on
the
whole
based
off
of
because
on
the
tangible
side,
first,
two
years
two-year
tax
on
the
liquid
in
the
barrel.
G
A
I
Name
is
Dave
Jergens
I'm,
chairman
of
the
southeast
Bullitt
taxing
district
I,
was
on
the
fire
department
in
1979
when
it
was
formed.
I'm,
a
retired
elevator
constructor
I've
worked
in
many
of
the
facilities
over
the
years.
I
remember
the
lean
years
to
where
there
was
really
nothing
produced
in
the
early,
70s
and
80s.
My
point
is
in
2016
beams
was
granted
I'm,
not
sure
all
these
they're
not
paying
taxes
on
11
warehouses
in
Bullitt
County,
and
we
just
discovered
that
about
three
months
ago
our
tax
revenue
on
property
was
staying
flat.
I
Shepherdsville
has
taken
our
land.
To
put
all
the
warehouses
in
southeast
bullet
does
not
get
that
revenue
on
those
warehouses
to
Mr
Stivers
comment
about
the
ISO
ratings.
Our
ISO
rating
is
a
four
in
early
1980,
Mr
Summer's
father
approached
as
a
beam
employee
approach,
Southeast
Bullitt.
We
need
you
to
build
a
firehouse
close
to
The
Distillery.
They
gave
us
nine
thousand
dollars.
I
We
built
the
firehouse.
I
mean
that
day
we
bought
a
used
fire
truck
from
the
city
of
Louisville
for
3
300.
We
just
ordered
two
trucks:
that'll
take
a
year
and
a
quarter
to
get
here
at
a
million
and
a
half
dollars
again
back
in
the
day.
We
would
go
to
Louisville
and
get
their
hand-me-down
turnout
gear
in
today's
world.
Turnout,
Gear
boots
pants
coat,
gloves,
Nomex,
Hood,
helmet
and
air
pack
somewhere
is
around
twelve
thousand
dollars
per
person.
I
There's
four
guys
that
run
out
of
the
four:
how
a
firehouse
in
a
three-quarter
million
dollar
truck
up
to
respond
to
beams.
Our
far
house
is
a
mile
from
it.
So
in
2016,
I,
don't
go
to
all
Fiscal
Court
meetings.
I
miss
the
part
that
beams
was
granted
a
deal
on
the
taxes.
So
again
our
tax
base
on
the
I
on
you
all
use
different
phrases.
I
My
tax
bills,
distilled
Spirits
tax
I've,
been
told
that
there's
land
there's
the
building
and
there's
the
barrel
and
the
distilled
Spirits
when
on
December
31st,
when
there's
a
magical
and
I,
you
all
press
a
button
and
it
tells
the
state
where
every
ounce
of
bourbon
that
you
own
is
located
and
that
prints
out
something
to
us.
You
all
send
us
a
check
in
April,
but
the
point
is
we
call
we
are
given
350
000
in
distilled
Spirit
Stacks.
We
get
that
sometime
in
February
or
April.
I
That
is
over
a
third
of
our
budget
to
operate
the
fire
department.
Now,
in
the
past,
there's
been
things,
that's
been
done
when
the
best
thing
in
the
world
I'm
I
volunteer
for
a
lot
of
things.
You
haven't
lived
till
you
volunteer
to
be
on
a
zoning
board,
I
mean
don't
ever
do
that
I've
been
on
the
fire
department,
I
I
collect
the
taxes,
I'm
past
potentator
Kosair,
so
do
you're
a
rich
first
question
was:
what
can
we
do
different
when
I
travel
around
the
country
for
Shriners?
I
The
cities
will
give
you
all
kinds
of
Tourism
dollars.
I
hosted
a
party
at
Myrtle
Beach
last
year
for
1500
Shriners,
I,
won't
say
publicly
what
Myrtle
Beach
gave
us
to
come
back
the
next
year,
but
let's
look
at
tourism
dollars
to
figure
out
a
way
to
attract
people.
I,
don't
know
how
many
thousands
of
cars
run
up
down
I-65,
but
I
lay
in
bed
at
night
and
I
can
hear
them
from
my
farm.
I
But
my
point
is:
in
tourism:
you
have
to
come
to
Bullock
County
at
the
first
exit
to
buy
diesel
fuel
for
a
semi.
Why
doesn't
the
state
have
something
I'm
just
using
this?
As
a
point,
I
mean
you're
in
South
Bulloch
County
before
you
come
to
a
rest
area.
So
if
you
bring
when
I
was
on
the
tourism
board,
if
you
bring
x
amount
of
people,
they'll
give
you
a
percentage
because
they
figure
you're
going
to
stay
in
a
night
or
two
eat
this.
Do
that
so
again
as
a
state?
I
What
can
we
do
to
make
it
easier
for
people
to
come
here
and
and
go
see
these
bourbon
warehouses
I've
worked
in
them
into
a
little
past
history
of
the
elevator
business
I
used
to
maintain
the
elevators
in
this
building
and
a
lot
of
them
in
Frankfurt
over
the
years.
But
when
I
was
driving
up
here,
I
used
to
see
dozens
of
tour
buses
going
to
Bardstown
I
had
lunch
in
Bardstown
yesterday
and
I
didn't
see
a
tour
bus
anywheres.
I
So
my
point
is
things:
will
change
in
tourism
in
1972
I
worked
in
a
Distillery
on
18th
Street
that
had
hundreds
of
people's
bottling
in
1980
I
was
paid
by
that
elevator
or
that
still
to
maintain
the
elevators
that
the
last
person
to
ride
the
elevator
was
me
a
quarter
three
months
previous
because
they
were
closed
up
so
again
it
all
changes,
there's
a
lot
of
history,
but
it
we
didn't
just
get
here.
We
can't
fix
it
today
and
how
can
we
go
about
this
for
everybody
to
come
out
on
the
a
Winning
Side?
I
A
To
speak,
thank
you
for
your
comments
and
you
you
stumbled
unwittingly
or
maybe
not
unwittling,
to
a
constitutional
Quagmire
that
does
needs
to
be
solved
as
well.
Yeah
all
right,
well,
I!
Think!
That's
it
for
today.
Thank
you
all
very,
very
much.
The
next
meeting,
if
there
is
one,
is
President
Stivers
meeting
so
stay
tuned.
Thank
you
all.
We're
adjourned.