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From YouTube: 20200922 Kubernetes SIG Usability
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A
Cool
welcome
everybody
to
sig
usability's,
regularly
scheduled
meeting.
As
everyone
knows,
we
always
record
all
of
our
meetings
and
post
them
to
youtube
afterwards.
So
our
agenda
today
is
josie,
has
some
updates
on
what
she's
been
working
on
for
github
label
updates
and
roadmap
so
we'll
hand
the
meeting
over
to
josie
and
then,
after
that,
gabby
carl
and
josie
have
a
job
survey
update
which
will
be
really
cool,
so
yeah
josie.
You
want
to
kick
it
off.
B
Is
this
better
yeah,
yeah,
okay,
perfect,
so
I
had
a
chance
to
meet
with
the
contributor
sig,
and
then
I
followed
up
talking
to
bob
and
george,
and
they
mentioned
that
labels
in
github
are
there's
a
lot
of
them
already
and
so
adding
more
probably
wouldn't
be
very
helpful
if
the
end
objective
is
to
start
bringing
visibility
to
usability
issues,
but
that
being
said,
there's
they
brought
up
a
lot
like
a
couple
of
other
spaces
where
there's
a
lot
of
design
opportunity
like,
for
example,
if
we
did
want
to
think
about
labeling
in
github
as
a
whole
like.
B
They
said
that
there's
sort
of
this
process
from
a
feature
going
into
alpha
and
then
beta
and
then
eventually
it
becomes
stable
and
it
gets
put
into
the
actual
product
right
now.
That's
sort
of
a
gut
feeling
basis
that
thing
like
that
features
get
promoted
and
he
was
saying
you
know
it
would
be
really
great
to
get
feedback
on
these
alpha
features
and
like
improve
them
and
then
have
like
confidence
when
it's
promoted
to
beta
and
stable.
B
A
Okay,
cool,
that's
really
good
feedback
to
have
so
it
looks
like
you
had
an
issue
that
you
were
highlighting
in
the
agenda.
Do
you
want
to
share
that
and
go
through
it?
I
can
make
you
co-host.
B
Oh
oz
is
here
cool.
B
Here
I'll
put
the
issue
it's
in
the
slack,
but
I'm
happy
to
put
it
in
the
chat
as
well,
and
so
oz
is
looking
for
feedback
on
the
potential
solution
that
he's
proposing
and
that
sort
of
got
me
thinking
that
maybe
there's
sort
of
a
question
about
how
we
can
get
feedback
on
proposed
solutions
and
issues
from
the
community
and
that's
like
another
opportunity.
The
design
sig
could
look
into.
A
Cool
yeah
oz:
do
you
want
to
talk
about
this
at
all.
C
C
Oh,
this
is
confusing
and
because
the
command
line
allows
you
to
add
more
context
to
the
config,
so
you
can
add
a
context
and
by
default,
if
you
just
have
one
context,
it's
being
used
but,
as
you
add
more
context,
the
command
line
doesn't
know
what
to
do
so.
You
have
like
I
tell
students
now,
let's
add
another
context,
so
they
added
context
and
some
of
them
will
just
try
to
use
it
before
they
set
it
as
an
active,
and
then
they
get
this
error.
C
What
you
see
here,
the
connection
to
the
server
localhost
was
refused.
Did
you
specify
the
right
host
or
the
port,
and
this
has
nothing
to
do
with?
What's
really
going
on
here,
just
like
falling
back
the
defaults,
but
if
you're
new,
you
have
no
clue
so
that
was
just
like
wanted
to
see.
If
this
is
interesting
for
people
to
change,
I
personally
find
the
command
line
of
gwen
is
pretty
easy
to
use.
So
there's
not
much
to
improve
on
the
ufx
here.
Just
like
some
of
the
messages
are
kind
of
like
confusing
yeah.
A
Cool
yeah.
This
is
definitely
something
that
I
have
spent
some
time
thinking
about
as
well,
especially
if
you
have
nested
clusters.
So
as
an
example
in
vsphere
with
tanzu,
we
have
a
supervisor
kubernetes
cluster
and
then
we
have
and
then
that's
managing
the
life
cycle
of
a
kubernetes
service,
and
so
you
have
context
of
different
layers
in
the
stack.
Basically,
like
am
I
interfacing
with
my
infrastructure.
A
Am
I
interfacing
with
my
kubernetes
cluster
and
so
the
context
in
that
setting
gets
really
confusing
for
people,
and
I
imagine
in
the
multi-tenancy
working
group
we
have
the
virtual
cluster
project,
which
is
sort
of
a
similar
setup,
where
you
have
a
central
control
plane
that
users
don't
get
access
to,
and
then
they
get
sort
of
what's
called
a
virtual
control
plane,
which
is
their
own,
that
they
can
customize.
However,
they
want
but
doesn't
actually
have
direct
access
to
the
infrastructure
either.
A
So
I
think
that
making
it
easier
for
people
to
deal
with
a
lot
of
context
and
making
it
more
clear
what
context
they're
in
without
having
to
type
a
command
would
be
really
valuable.
Like
that's
something
that
I
always
kind
of
wanted
was
like,
instead
of
just
like,
instead
of
needing
to
say
get
context,
could
I
almost
get
like
a
prompt
that
tells
me
what
cluster
and
what
name
space
I'm
in
you
know
so
yeah.
I
definitely
think
there's
some
good
work
that
could
go
on
here.
C
So
I
already
made
like
a
small
like
silly
implementation.
I
it's
linked
in
the
maybe
fixed
by
kubernetes
pull
requester
at
the
top.
I
don't
know
it's
definitely
not
like
the
best
go
code.
I've
written
it's
just
like
I
add
one
switch
in
the
handling
and
there's
no
tests,
and
I
probably
need
some
kind
of
like
help
here,
sponsoring
this
pr
or
like,
because
I'm
not
a
communist
contributor.
So
somebody
from
tanzania
is
willing
to
help
me
with
that
and
I'll
put
some
more
effort
on
it.
A
Okay,
yeah.
I
think
that
there
is
a
mentoring
program
where
more
established
contributors
will
sort
of
help.
You
get
past
the
initial
contribution
and
add
whatever
test
you
need
to
add,
so
I
will,
I
think,
probably
a
good
place
to
ping,
for
that
is
in
the
user.
The
the
contributor
experience
channel
just
say:
hey
like
I
have
this,
you
know
I
I'm
working
on
this.
C
A
A
Cool
and
then
I
think,
josie,
you
also
wanted
to
kind
of
have
a
conversation
about
how
to
make
it
easier
for
people
to
get
involved
in
the
sig.
B
B
B
B
A
Yeah
and
then
I
was
talking
yeah,
I
think
that
that's
very
true,
I
suspect,
there's
something
we
could
do
if
we
wanted
to,
for
example,
look
at
so
there's
a
couple
problems
like
problem
number.
A
One
is:
where
do
we
send
people
when
they
want
to
get
started
and
right
now,
there's
like
six
different
pages
and
different
repos
that
we're
supposed
to
maintain
as
part
of
the
kubernetes
project
and
then
there's
like
our
meeting
notes,
you
know
which
you
don't
which
so
yes,
I
think
that
we
could
probably
like
at
least
improve
the
meeting
notes
and
also
just
maybe
write
something
up.
That's
like
a
link
that
we
put
everywhere
where
we're
like.
A
You
have
to
join
the
google
group
and
then,
once
you
join,
the
google
group
you'll
get
the
invitation
to
the
meeting
and
google
group
has
latency,
so
it
may
take
up
to
a
week
for
that
to
show
up
right,
because
I
think
that's
really.
What
confuses
everyone
is.
It's
like.
You
join
the
google
group
and
then
you're
like
okay.
What
now
and
then,
like
five
days
later,
this
invitation
shows
up
in
your
inbox
and
you're
like
what
is
happening
so
yeah.
I
definitely
hear
you.
B
I
was
talking
to
gabby
and
carl
about
this
and
we
were
thinking.
Maybe
we
could
leverage
github
projects
and
start
creating
a
backlog
of
stuff
to
do
and
then,
like
with
all
of
the
contacts
that
you
have
it
like.
We
can
put
those
in
the
little
categories
and
then
yeah.
Then
it
becomes
like
a
little
thing
that
someone
can
pick
up
and
and
start
as
well.
A
Yeah,
that's
a
great
idea.
I
I
did
the
same
thing
with
the
multi-tenancy
working
group,
so
yeah.
I
can
create
a
project
right
now,
so
the
place
that
here
I'll
just
show
you
all
what
I'm
looking
at
so
basically
the
place
that
we
can
really
do
stuff
like
that
is
within
our
sig
project.
So
we
can't
do
it
in
the
main
kubernetes
one
like.
A
I
don't
have
the
right
permissions
over
there,
but
this
is
the
this,
so
like
kubernetes,
sig,
sig
usability
is
where
we
is
really
like
our
playground
that
we
can
kind
of
do
whatever
we
wanted,
so
for
just
like
sig,
u's
ability
right
now.
I
think
this
is
like
just
a
very
simple
sort
of
placeholder
that
somebody
put
here
as
k.
So
I
think
it's
interesting
that
we
have
this
at
all,
because
normally
we
don't
have
this.
A
Unless
we
have
like
a
code
project
but
because
we
have
it,
we
can
go
into
projects
and
create
a
project
and
create
a
backlog
and
like
link
issues
to
it
and
everything.
A
What
I
have
found
works
well
in
the
past
and
I'm
definitely
open
to
doing
it.
Other
ways
is
really
opening
issues
here
and
then
attaching
them
to
the
project
and
also
using
milestones
as
a
way
to
group
the
issues,
if
you
just
so,
if,
like
we
created
a
project
right
now
right-
and
we
can
just
call
this
usability,
you
know
backlog
and
then
probably
do
like
a
see
basic
kanban.
A
So
what
I
would
suggest
instead
is
creating
issues
over
here
and
then,
when
you
create
an
issue,
you
can
add
it
to
the
project
and
then
you
can
put
it
in
the
appropriate
column
and
assign
it
to
people,
but
it
also
means
that
we'll
have
to
add
people
who
are
engaged
in
the
project
as
team
members.
So
just
you
know,
let
me
know
who
we
want
to
add
and
we
can
do
that.
D
A
Like
it
doesn't
that
does
nothing
for
my
life
right.
So
then,
if
I
convert
it
to
an
issue,
you
know.
A
Like
then,
I
can
actually
open
it
up
and
assign
people
and
put
labels
on
it
and
add
a
milestone
and
like
do
a
lot
more
stuff
with
it.
Basically.
D
A
Yeah
so
a
lot
of
times,
people
will
actually
kind
of
like
the
one
oz
was
just
showing
us,
like
people
write
up
really
nice
issues.
So
it's
better
to
just
add
that
issue
to
the
project,
rather
than
add
some
sort
of
tracking
note
that
then
kind
of
gets
wonky
and
then
you're
linking
stuff
back
to
each.
D
Other
cool
I
mean
yeah
to
what
josie
said.
You
know
if
people
come
and
kind
of
like
introduce
themselves
in
the
slack-
and
I
guess
being
able
just
being
more
like
intentional,
about
carving
out
issues
and
maybe
even
possibly
like
sharing
them
with
them
in
case
they're.
Looking
for
kind
of
like
small
opportunities
to
contribute
would
would
be
something
to
try.
A
A
I
think
that's
awesome
yeah.
We
should
totally
do
that
and
you
know
if
you
all
want
to
just
kind
of
play
with
this
project
board
and
tell
me
if
there's
any
permissions,
you're
missing
to
actually
successfully
use
it.
We
can
try
and
figure
that
out.
A
Awesome
so
josie
was
there
anything
else
you
wanted
to
dive
more
into
before
we
jump
into
the
data
piece.
B
No,
I
think
so
I
guess
next
steps
for
me
is
to
like
play
around
with
the
project
board
and
then
maybe
start
writing
an
issue
for
onboarding
and
possibly
another
one
for
getting
feedback
on
like
sick,
related
stuff,
yeah.
A
Yeah,
I
think
that's
a
great
idea
and
when
you
create
that
I
can
try
and
dig
up
all
of
the
places
that
sick
usability
exists
in
the
kubernetes
project
and
just
link
it
there
so
that
we're
looking
at
everything
and
because
like
for
as
an
example
in
other
groups,
I
have
had
to
like
change
the
zoom
link
and
so
I'll
update
the
meeting
notice.
But
then
it
turns
out
everyone's
using
a
link
in
the
agenda,
doc
that
I
forgot
to
update.
A
So
then
I
have
six
people
on
this
zoom
and
seven
people
on
the
zoom
so
like
just
because
there's
like
this
proliferation
of
different
documents,
if
we
can
just
have
a
list
of
them
and
then
think
about
how
people
coming
to
us,
how
we
want
to
make
them
very.
A
You
know
quick
to
be
able
to
engage
with
us
in
all
of
those
places
because
they
could
be
showing
up
anywhere
yeah.
E
E
A
Hey
cool
great
great
topics,
thank
you
for
bringing
those
up
gabby
did
you
want
to
kick
off
the
data
collection,
piece,
yeah.
D
Sounds
good,
let
me
share
my
screen
real.
D
Quick
cool
dlc,
our
study,
google
duck
yep
awesome.
D
D
D
Oh
just
from
like
maybe
more
of
a
question
for
tasha
like
if
like
if
we
want
to.
D
If
we
feel
like
the
quantitative
breakdown
of
the
survey
that
we
sent
out,
might
be
useful
to
other
people
like
whether
we
could
publish
that
now
or
whether
we
should
wait
and
kind
of
publish
like
a
bigger
kind
of
like
here's.
The
survey
that
we
did
and
the
people
that
responded
to
it
type
of
type
of
publish.
A
Let's
see
so,
could
you
could
you
repeat
the
question,
so
is
it
that
you
want
to
republish
the
data
or
the
or
get
more
responses
or
kind
of?
What
are
we?
What
are
we
looking
to
do.
D
The
quantitative
breakdown
of
the
survey
that
was
sent
out,
like
you
know,
we
got
a
lot
of
interesting
data
from
it.
That
says,
like
you,
know,
here's
how
many
machines
are
in
people's
fleets,
here's
the
breakdown
of
job
roles
and
like
how
they're
using
containers
and
kubernetes
in
development
through
production.
D
A
Yeah,
so
what
I
would
say
is
as
long
as
we
are
removing
any
personally
identifiable
information.
I'm
very
you
know
it's
open
source,
so
I'm
very
down
with
us
sharing
early
sharing,
often
and
just
kind
of
explaining
exactly
where
it
is
especially
with
like
a
you
know.
So
so
when
we
publish
the
data,
what
I
would
suggest,
I'm
sure
you
all
are
already
100
on
top
of
this,
is
that
there's,
like
a
blog
post,
that
kind
of
explains
exactly
what's
going.
E
A
The
process
where
we're
going,
but
you
know
like
I'm
very
much
of
the
mind,
that
the
more
open
we
can
be
the
better
and
that
people
will
be
very
interested
in
this
data
cool
and
also
maybe
we
should
have
you
all
present
on
this
data
at
the
upcoming
kubecon.
I
think
I
grabbed
sig
usability
a
spot
so
and
we're
allowed
up
to
four
speakers,
so
that
could
be
a
good
topic.
D
Yeah
then
any
whether
it's
kubecon
or
a
blog
post,
yeah
yeah,
the
data's
there
so
yeah.
You
can
share
that
out.
If
people
will
find.
A
It
interesting
oh
yeah.
I
think
people
will
be
super
interested
in
it
like.
I
could
totally
see
a
bunch
of
the
senior
contributors
to
kubernetes,
just
totally
being
super
excited
to
see
it
so.
D
A
D
So
hopping
off
of
that
we
got
together.
We've
set
up
working
meetings
to
to
push
kind
of
like
this.
This
part
forward
of
of
the
job
survey,
but
basically
between
carl
jose
and
myself,
we've
put
together
this
list
of
assets
for
conducting
jobs,
interviews
and
just
to
go
over
it
real
quick.
D
We
have
a
data
usage
consent
form
that
carl
has
put
together,
which
basically
kind
of
talks
about
what
we're
going
to
do
with
their
data,
so
that
they're
well
informed
and
also
kind
of
making
them
aware
that
they
can
request
their
data
if,
if
they
should
so
choose,
but
basically
just
making
sure
that
they
know
one
that
it
will
be
recorded
for
for
kind
of
like
research
purposes
and
yeah
and
just
kind
of
giving
them
a
lot
of
good
upfront
information
about
how
we'll
run
this.
D
This
interview,
the
other.
The
other
asset
in
here,
is
an
email
draft
we
are
planning
on
reaching
out
to.
I
want
to
say,
like
40
people
that
we're
okay
with
being
contacted,
and
so
this
is
just
an
email
that
we
drafted.
That's
a
follow-up,
it's
kind
of
reminding
them
that
they
filled
out.
This
survey
a
while
ago
that
josie
actually
followed
up
with,
I
think
it
was
jorge
and
he
said
that
we
can
include
free
shirts
as
part
as
an
incentive
for
for
this
interview.
So
so
that's
pretty
awesome.
D
Apart
from
you
know
the
the
joy
of
being
of
contributing
to
this
open
source
survey,
there's
also
a
calendar
a
bit
a
calendly
link
that
they
can
follow,
and
you
know
we're
still
trying
to
figure
out
just
like
the
availability
that
we
want
to
put
in
here,
because
we're
we're
juggling
this
at
the
same
time
with
with
other
work,
but
maybe
running
it
during
october,
or
something
like
that
and
just
picking
a
few
days
or
specific
hours.
D
D
What
else
so
we're
also
figuring
out
what
kind
of
analysis
tools
we
have
available
to
us
a
transcription
tool
for
during
the
interviews,
so
we're
looking
at
free
versions
of
a
few
of
these
otter
zoom
does
automatic
transcriptions
and
then
we've
been
been
meaning
to
look
into
this
tetra
insights
tool
as
well,
and
then
also
as
far
as
analyzing
data.
Afterwards,
we're
also
looking
into
pretty
much
similar
tools.
A
Yeah,
I
know
that
somebody
has
the
otter
tool
join
all
of
the
multi-tenancy
meetings
and
I've
never
seen
a
transcript
out
of
it.
I
actually
kind
of
wondered
if
it
was
like
part
of
their
machine
learning
plan
or
something
like
they
just
had
to
join
all
of
the
cigs
and
like
see
how
the
transcription
came
out,
because
I've
never
seen
the
end
result,
but
it
does
join
all
of
our
meetings,
so
yeah
nice.
D
Yeah,
I
think
we
talked
about
that
otter.
I
think
carl.
I
I
don't
know
if
you
have
anything
you
want
to
add
to
this,
but
it
looks
like
the
free
plan
will
work
for
us
here,
but
but
I
think,
like
we're,
gonna
get
pretty
close
to
the
limit.
D
As
far
as
minutes,
I
think
you
get
a
certain
amount
of
like
free
minutes
per
per
month,
so
I
think
our
goal
is
to
interview
10
to
15
people
and
just
if
we
come
up
close
and
between
and
are
using
kind
of,
like
the
three
free
accounts
between
between
all
of
us,
like
we
were
wondering
just
if
there's
any
possibility
of
there
being
like
budget
for
like
a
month's
use
or
two
months
use
of
some
of
these
tools,
although,
although
we
are
focusing
for
the
most
part
on
the
free
plans,
but
that
was
kind
of
like
an
open
question
that
we.
A
Had
yeah,
so
I
think
I
think
the
way
to
think
about
it
is
free
is
really
easy
and
then,
if
there's
something
that
we
need
to
ask
for
data
for
funding
for
then
we
make
a
request
to
the
cncf.
So
what
I
would
say
is
if
you
see
the
need
for
a
tool
that
like
would
really
help
us
you
know,
then
we
can
absolutely
ask
and
see
if
we
can
get
funding.
You
know
and
it's
easier
not
to
have
to
do
that,
but
yeah.
It's
just
kind
of
up
to
y'all.
D
Sounds
good
carl
or
josie
do
you
do
I
want
to
add
anything
anything
else
here
that
we
may
have
missed.
C
I
think
josie
had
to
drop,
but
no,
I
think
I
think
you
covered
it
all.
D
Yeah,
so
I
think
that's
that's
it
as
far
as
update.
We
are
meeting
every
other
week
just
as
far
as
working
sessions,
so
anybody
anybody
that
wants
to
help
out
with
this
is
more
than
welcome
to
to
join
and
yeah.
I
think
our
next
steps
are
just
kind
of
hashing
out
that
availability
and
then
also
yeah,
just
kind
of
like
solidifying
our
tools,
and
I
think
those
are
kind
of
like
the
big
next
steps
that
we
have.
A
Cool
yeah.
I
think
this
sounds
awesome.
I
guess
so.
I
put
in
the
notes
that
you
all
are
having
the
bi-weekly
meeting
and
that
people
should
let
you
know
if
they
want
to
join.
You
could
also
mention
it
in
the
mailing
list,
but
I
have
a
feeling
that
most
of
the
people
who
are
super
engaged
are
making
it
to
these
meetings.
At
this
point,
so
I
think
you're
getting
the
word
out,
but
yeah.
This
all
sounds
awesome
and
it's
very
exciting.
A
My
one
piece
of
feedback
on
the
email
draft
is
people
just
make
sure
what
I
would
say
at
the
very
like.
The
first
sentence
is
that
we're
reaching
out,
on
behalf
of
the
upstream
open
source,
kubernetes
project,
because
otherwise
kind
of
no
matter
how
you
word
it?
A
If
people
don't
know
what
an
egg,
what
a
sig
is,
or
whatever,
like
they're
gonna,
think
that
it's
a
commercial
thing
so
like
trying
to
make
it
as
clear
as
possible
that,
like
you're
part
of
that
you're
reaching
out
on
behalf
of
upstream
open
source,
kubernetes
project
like
just
because
you
never
know
which
words
people
are
really
gonna
ping
on
too
yeah
right.
A
D
I
think
so
josie
when
she
talked
over
hey,
I
I
think
that's
what
they
confirmed.
It's
like
they
get
a
link
they
put
in
their
information
and
they
get
a
free
kubernetes
shirt.
So
you
probably
know
better
than
we
do.
What
what
that
process
looks
like
at
this
point.
A
Yeah
yeah
so
yeah,
if
you,
if
you
want
to
just
ping
me
the
the
link
to
this
duck,
I
might
just
massage
the
wording
a
tiny
bit,
but
I
think
it's.
I
think
it's
really
good.
A
Okay,
cool
sounds
good.
Was
there
anything
else
you
wanted
to
talk
about
today
or
that
we
should
use
the
meeting
time
to.
A
A
Okay
cool!
Well,
let
me
know
if
I
can
help
with
anything,
I'm
super
happy
to
help
review
the
blog
post
or
like
move
anything
forward
that
we
need
to
move
forward.
I
think
the
calendly
is
a
really
good
idea
and
yeah.
If
y'all
want
to
try
out
the
github
project
and
let
me
know
any
changes,
we
need
to
make
to
make
it
easier
for
people.
Let
me
know.