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A
B
D
Microphone
to
activate
your
camera,
but
to
also
mute
your
microphone
chair,
I
believe
all.
B
A
Thank
you
very
much,
john
good
morning.
Everyone
thank
you
for
joining
us
on
today's
corporate
governance
and
audit
committee.
Hopefully
everyone's
had
their
pack
and
had
a
chance
to
read
it
and
digest
information.
A
We
I
don't
actually
think
we've
got
as
a
massive
agenda,
but
let's,
let's
get
going
through
it
anyway.
So
start
at
the
beginning.
Item
number
one,
john.
C
There
were
no
appeals
against
the
inspection
of
documents.
A
A
Please
make
them
now,
if
you
have
any
no
great
apologies
for
adsense,
I'm
aware
accounts
that
bentley
has
given
his
apologies.
A
Else
is
present
yeah.
Thank
you
very
much.
Okay.
Let's
move
on
to
item
six,
the
minutes
of
the
previous
meeting.
Let's
start
with
matters
of
accuracy,
any
matters
of
accuracy.
E
Thanks
chair
a
couple
of
masterising
on
items
24
and
25
in
the
minutes,
the
period
of
consultation
on
the
annual
governance
statement
and
accounts
has
concluded
and
no
questions
or
comments
were
received
from
the
public
and
on
item
24.
E
There
was
a
briefing
note
on
the
finance
arrangements
for
lease
in
and
out
arrangements
circulated
to
all
members
on
the
24th
of
august
item
23,
going
back
in
the
minutes
at
page
10
victoria's
here,
and
can
give
a
brief
update
on
where
we're
at
with
the
finance
arrangements
around
section
114
an
emergency
budget.
A
We'll
come
back
to
you,
I'm
sure
you
have
something
to
say
later
good
good
morning,
andy
good
morning
pauline,
I
hope,
you're
welcome.
Thank
you.
Any
other
amounts
of
rising
that
anyone
wants
to.
A
Raise
no
great
okay.
Let's
move
on
to
item
eight!
So
item
eight,
so
we
discussed
this
item
in
a
working
group
and
there's
a
there's,
a
document
which
records
our
conversation
on
page
30.
I
think
it
finishes
at
37
starts
at
page
35.
A
and
the
recommendations
on
page
37
are
set
out.
I'm
not
going
to
read
them
out
right
now,
because
we've
all
read
the
papers.
Is
our
members
content
with
this
or
do
they
does
anyone
have
any
comments.
C
Chair
I've,
I
wasn't
happy
with
this.
I
thought
it
was
unduly
complacent
and
reluctant
to
investigate
complaints.
I
really
I
would
have
a
struggle
to
vote
for
this
recommendation.
A
C
Well,
I
think
we
should
take
a
closer
look
at
the
two
cases
which
I
mentioned,
which
happened
to
be
in
kirkster,
which
obviously
have
been
closely
involved
in.
I
don't
think
they're
untypical
and
I
think,
there's
a
common
theme
that
runs
through
it
and
I
suspect
members
will
very
soon
pick
up
the
same
theme
in
their
own
wards
and
come
to
similar
conclusions.
I've
come
to,
but
I
just
can't
be
happy
with
this.
C
A
Okay,
jonathan,
do
you
have
any
comments
on
the
two
cases
that
counseling
worth
raised
last
week.
B
B
We
looked
into
that
and
officers
had
made
a
conscious
decision
that
the
changes
that
were
proposed
were
minor
in
nature
and
non-material
to
the
application.
In
terms
of
it
didn't
change
the
fundamentals
of
the
scheme,
I
mean
in
most
cases.
I
think
it
was
also
asked
whether
this
was
typical.
In
most
cases,
the
applications
normally
determined
shortly
after
the
panel
meeting
and
therefore
revisions
aren't
received.
B
We
think
that
the
working
group's
recommendation
in
relation
to
requiring
that
schemes
on
council
land,
whether
the
breach
of
control
does
include
a
protocol
for
consideration
of
them,
would
be
sufficient
to
ensure
that
other
directorates
are
aware
of
the
obligation
to
ensure
that
they
are
complying
with
the
planning
legislation
and,
as
we
mentioned
before,
the
council
was
a
planning
authority
wouldn't
prosecute
itself
in
terms
of
those
breaches
of
control.
B
So
the
sort
of
best
mechanism
that
that
can
be
achieved
really
is
to
refer
them
and
escalate.
Those
matters
having
reached
agreement
that
very
senior
officer,
one
of
the
chief
executive,
that
breaches
will
be
resolved
within
the
council.
So
from
that
perspective,
we
think
that
both
of
those
recommendations
are
achievable
and
proportionate.
Thank
you,
chair.
A
C
Yes,
well,
one
of
the
problems
I've
got
is
that
you
have
to
choose
a
specific
example
which
is
documented
in
order
to
raise
it
at
the
panel.
But
what
I'm
actually
looking
at
is
a
pattern
of
behavior
here,
where
certainly
on
the
the
art
design
application,
the
developer
repeatedly
changed
his
position
throughout
the
whole
consideration
and
to
the
point
where
people
didn't
couldn't
rely
on
what
they
were
told.
C
You
know
that
we
we
had
a
public
consultation
to
a
two
public
consultation
meetings
which
were
well
attended
and
the
public
received
assurances
then
which
were
not
actually
delivered
by
the
developer,
but
based
their
initial
opinions
on
what
they've
been
told
and
at
each
stage
of
the
process.
As
soon
as
we
passed,
that
particular
hurdle,
the
all
bets
were
off
and
the
the
the
issue
was
then
changed.
C
Have
they
known
what
the
final
deal
was
going
to
be?
They
made
a
lot
more
fuss
at
the
beginning,
but
that
was
impossible
because
you
always
have
to
react
to
the
actual
plans
are
on
the
table,
not
what
you
think
is
going
to
happen
in
the
future.
So
I
think,
there's
widespread
dissatisfaction
with
the
the
outcome
on
the
artisan
application.
The
public
feel
they've
been
cheated
to
blunt.
C
But
on
mcfadden,
the
the
other
one,
which
was
the
failure
to
enforce
the
members,
need
to
have
a
closer
look
at
what
happened
here.
It
really
isn't
accurate.
What's
in
our
minutes
and
in
the
the
draft
conclusions,
this
was
bad
stuff,
you'll,
you'll,
look
it
through
it
and
you'll
see
the
rest
of
the
panel
that
this
wasn't
a
good
exercise.
It
didn't
leave
the
council
with
a
you,
know:
shining
halo.
It
looked
like
a
shabby
little
deal
and
that,
I
think,
is
what
I
say
happened.
B
Yes,
thanks
chad
in
terms
of
kirksville
hill
planning
application
that
went
to
panel
at
least
twice,
and
the
matches
that
have
been
raised
by
council
rulingworth
were
discussed
at
length
by
the
panel
itself
and
all
those
concerns
were
aired
by
council,
railingworth
and
members
of
the
public
during
that
process.
B
So
I
think
the
issues
are
documented
and
were
well
made
at
the
time,
and
those
concerns
were
taken
into
account
by
members
in
reaching
a
conclusion
to
decide
the
application
as
well.
So
I
would
say
that,
as
I
say,
although
those
concerns
were
well
expressed,
members
did
nevertheless
conclude
that
the
scheme
in
its
final
form
there
were
considered
to
be
acceptable
in
terms
of
the
other
matter.
I'm
not
sure
what
what
else
we
can
suggest
beyond
the
the
recommendation
I'll
set
out
in
the
the
briefing
note.
C
Paper,
I'm
not
sure
if
I
managed
to
get
my
message
across
last
time,
but
the
plans
panel
went
to
the
site.
Did
a
site
visit,
identified,
specific
development
which
had
been
carried
out
without
time
permission
and
said
that
it
should
be
reversed
and
the
building
demolished
and
the
council
faced
with
a
panel
decision
that
specifically
asked
for
a
feature
to
be
removed,
did
nothing
and
it's
still
there.
That's
what
I
find
upsetting
it's
still
there
so.
A
So
so
counseling
with
on
on
that
point,
I
I
definitely
heard
you
last
time,
and
that
is
why
the
the
point
about
having
a
process
to
work
this
through,
because
the
council
seems
understanding
me,
doesn't
want
to
prosecute
itself.
There
has
to
be
an
enforcement
measure
and-
and
I
I
feel
like
the
second
recommendation-
does-
does
address
that.
I
think
because,
because
it's
saying
look,
we
need
to
be
able
to
enforce
against
ourselves
effectively.
I
think
that
I
think
your
point
about
the
the
first.
A
The
first
issue
you
raise
about
whether
there's
been
substantial
changes
is,
is
something
that
we
haven't
made
a
recommendation
specifically
about
and
we
hadn't
had
yet
heard
john's
come
back.
I
guess
in
terms
of
the
committee,
in
terms
of
the
governance
process,
the
question
is,
how
do
we
take
it
forwards?
So
I'm
not
sure
necessarily
it's
our
role
to
to
go
back
and
say
that
decision,
but
it
might
be
an
interesting
case
study
if
we,
if
we
have
our
opinions
versus
so
the
offices
have
said
there,
wasn't
any
material
changes.
A
A
Just
at
this
point,
I
think
it's
probably
worth
bringing
some
other
people
in,
because
I
think
other
people
have
got
some
comments.
Human
comments
on
this
on
this
issue,
so
I'll
bring
in
councillor
trustworld
next.
F
Which
I've
got,
I
haven't,
got
any
comments
to
make
on
the
specific
issue
that
john's
raised.
Although
I
do
understand
the
principles
that
he's
is
expounding
and
I
think
we
do
need
to
to
follow
it
up
in
some
way,
if
only
to
reassure
ourselves
that
the
points
that
he's
raised
are
being
tackled
somewhere
substantively,
if
not
by
us.
But
I
just
wanted
to
move
on
and
forgive
me
for
reiterating
something
I
said
in
the
in
the
working
party,
but
I
I
I
remember
the
last
time
we
discussed
planning
substantively
in
this
committee.
F
We
had
a
really
I
I
thought
useful
and
officers
might
have
felt
slightly
overly
robust
discussion
compared
to
that
format
of
the
report,
which
gave
us
rather
more
detail
to
substantiate
some
of
the
assertions
I
just
find
this
and
I'm
I'm
trying
not
to
be
too
pejorative,
but
I
just
found
this
report
somewhat.
Soulless
and
and
anodyne
in
the
the
previous
report
did
give
us
at
least
some
statistics
and
some
figures
to
back
up
the
assertions.
F
Often,
where
the
you
know,
the
comparisons
in
terms
of
appeals
and
members,
overturning
officer
recommendations
were
favorable
rather
than
them
being
negative,
but
I
found
that
sort
of
comparative
information
quite
useful
and
it
gave
us
the
basis
for
quite
a
good
dis
and
robust
discussion,
and
I
know
I
think
I
seem
to
remember
councillor
graham
making
some
some
very
valid
points.
From
the
point
of
view
of
her
a
particular
experience.
F
F
That's
become
a
really
crucial
cornerstone
of
discussions
about
fairly
substantial
developments,
be
the
housing
or
or
business,
and
we
need
to
be
assured
as
part
of
our
role
in
terms
of
governance
and
audit,
that
the
advice
we
take
and
the
way
we
look
at
viability
is
is
robust
because
there
is
still
a
view
out
there
and
to
some
extent
I
agree
with
with
john
a
lot
of
it
is
public
perception,
maybe
not
not
fair
or
accurate,
but
nevertheless
public
perception
that
we
let
developers
get
away
with
things
they
simply
claim.
F
Oh,
we
can't
do
that.
We
can't
provide
this
amount
of
affordable
housing.
We
can't
discharge
these
responsibilities
because
it
would
not
make
the
development
viable,
and
I
think
we
need
to
be
assured
on
that.
One
of
the
points
that's
been
made
in
my
own
scrutiny
board
when
we've
looked
at
elements
of
planning
not
across
the
board,
but
elements
of
parliament
is
the
way
section,
106
monies
are
spent
and
to
try
and
ensure
that
local
members
in
the
areas
that
should
benefit
from
those
past
106
payments
and
some
of
these
date
back
15
years.
F
F
That's
clearly
not
happening
and
that's
the
experience
of
members
on
the
scrutiny
board
that
I
chair
and
jonathan
is
a
fellow
member
of
that
board,
and
he
knows
what
I'm
what
I'm
talking
about,
and
we
actually
question
this
and
it's
one
of
the
few
occasions
where
scrutiny
board
recommendation
actually
says
no
we're
not
accepting
this
you're
not
doing
what
we
asked
you're,
not
progressing
it
properly.
So
you
know
we
are
going
to
give
you
a
a
negative
on
that,
and
that
not
happen
very
often,
and
I
suppose
my
final
comment,
I'm
sorry.
F
If
this
sounds
long-winded,
it's
just
to
get
dig
below
the
surface
of
the
way
we
look
at
criticisms
or
adverse
judgments.
So
I'm
thinking
about
ombudsman
adjudications
there's
no
reference
as
to
whether
there
have
been
any
if
there
haven't
then
I'd
like
to
know,
I
think
that's
a
good
sign
and
there
is
reference
to
the
judicial
review
on
the
core
strategy.
I
appreciate
there's
very
little
that
can
be
rehearsed
in
public,
because
that
is
is
is
an
ongoing
legal
process.
F
It
would
be
useful
to
have
more
information
about
appeals.
We
simply
reassured
that
we
have
a
good
record
on
appeals.
Well,
you
know
it
would
be
nice
to
have
the
statistics
and
the
comparisons
with
with
past
years
and
with
other
core
authorities.
It's
obviously
on
record.
It
can
be
done
as
a
cut
and
paste
and
the
other
is
to
get
some
feel
for
the
sort
of
complaints
we
get
about
the
planning
system
from
the
public
and
from
elected
members.
F
Like
john
going
back
to
his
point
so
the
you
know,
we
know
how
many
complaints
they
are,
whether
there
are
any
themes
whether
what
action
is
taken
to
address
those
themes
or
those
individual
complex.
I
just
don't
get
any
feel
for
that
from
the
way
the
report
has
now
been
reconstituted
and
yeah
I'll
finish.
My
diatribe
there.
Thank
you
chair.
A
Thank
you,
councillor
truswell,
I'm
not
I'm
not
sure,
there's
much
that
jonathan
can
come
back
immediately
on
that,
so
I'll
bring
in
councillor
taylor.
G
Thank
you,
chair
yeah.
I
think
I
associate
myself
to
what
council
trust.
I
think
the
downgrading
the
one
or
six
team
from
a
I
think
it's
a
four
to
a
five
which
is
requiring
improvement,
has
really
been
a
rocket
up
of
that
particular
department
and
I
think,
across
the
board.
We
should
consider
using
that
type
of
power
on
scrutiny
a
bit
more
liberally
than
than
we
do
at
the
moment.
I'm
also
very
sympathetic
to
what
council
illinois
says
and
why?
G
What
the
points
that
he's
made
from
this
meeting
and
and
also
at
the
last
group
yeah
this
report-
I
don't
know
I
I
I
think,
I'm
I
think
I'm
with
john.
I
don't
think
I
could
vote
for
this
in
this
these
recommendations
in
the
way
they
are
at
the
moment.
G
On
friday
lunchtime,
myself
and
my
two
ward
colleagues
were
given
notice
that
a
site
in
our
ward
for
153
units
on
greenbelt
land,
which
had
been
removed
from
the
sap
after
the
airborough
court
ruling,
is
actually
going
to
panel
on
the
first
of
october
and
the
council
are
recommending
that
it
be
approved
it
just
I
I
agree
with
counseling
with
it.
G
Just
seems
that
any
development
that
the
council
wants
to
go
forward,
whether
it
be
for
reasons
within
his
ward
or
the
reasons
which
I
think
it
is
in
this
world,
which
is
on
the
old
college
site
and
they
need
to
pay
off
the
debts.
So,
let's
get
it
sold
and
get
it
built
on
they
just
they
just
find
a
way
to
rail
railroad
it
through.
In
my
view-
and
it's
just
not
acceptable-
there's
no
update
on
the
biodiversity
report.
There's
no
update
on
the
highways
report.
G
There's
no
update
on
if
any
106
is
coming
our
way,
there's
nothing
in
there
about
the
masses
of
school
places.
This
development
is
going
to
generate
and
it
just
feels
constantly
like
it's
to
be
railroaded
through.
If
it's,
what
the
council
wants
and
based
on
that,
I
don't
think
that
the
recommendations
go
far
enough
to
protect
our
wards
to
protect
our
residents
from
this
type
of
this
type
of
view
within
the
council.
A
Thank
you
very
much
councillor
taylor.
Can
I
bring
in
louise
because
she's
indicated
she
wants
to
speak
as
well.
H
Hi
yeah,
I
can
understand
the
issues
you've
you've
got
and
obviously
counselor
linguist.
I
know
we've
had
some
correspondence
around
this
in
the
past,
so
would
it
help
if
we
actually,
as
internal
audit,
did
a
formal
review
around
this
they'd
be
using
these
as
case
studies,
for
example,
and
then
come
back
to
you?
Would
that
would
that
help
and
we
can
actually
test
out
if
there
are
any
issues,
especially
with
these
cases
that
you've
raised
I'd
just
like
to
put
that
offer
out
without
you.
C
A
A
A
As
a
second
recommendation,
I
do
think
we
should
push
forward
the
ideas
of
having
a
protocol
for
if
there's
enforcement
issues
on
council
land,
because
I
think
we
need
to
move
that
forward,
because
we
definitely
discussed
this
last
year
and
we
we
haven't,
really
got
anywhere
with
it.
A
So
I
think
we
do
need
to
move
that
second
recommendation
forward
in
any
case,
and
then
what
I'm
hearing
from
members
is
that
we
don't
want
to
accept
the
recommendation
that
we're
happy
with
the
the
assurances
in
place
until
we've
heard
back
from
the
internal
audit
team
is
that
is
that
fair?
Is
everyone
comfortable
with
that
as
a
as
a
way
forwards?
A
I'm
saying
nods
from
from
most
council,
amen
worth
seeing
a
nod
from
him.
Yes,
councillor
truswell!
Does
that
sound?
Okay,
yeah?
Okay?
So
I
think,
on
that
basis,
we'll
move
forwards
with
that.
I
very
much
appreciate
members
comments
on
this.
I
think
it
is
very
helpful
and
I
do
think
we
you're
right.
We
need
to
move
move
this
forwards
and
we
don't
want
to
be
having
the
same
conversation
each
each
year,
and
I-
and
I
also
just
just
to
to
stress-
I
do
hear
the
point.
A
Counselor
trustworthiness
made
again
today
around
data
to
back
up
assertions-
and
I
think
that
is
a
key
aspect
of
of
governance
is
understanding
the
data
behind
the
the
statements.
So
I
think
that's
that's
something
we
can.
We
can
learn
from
as
a
committee
so-
and
I
also
heard
your
point
about
the
viability
I
had
a
housing
development
in
my
ward
and
I
had
one
developer.
A
The
architect
came
to
me
and
said:
there's
no
money
for
social
housing,
it's
not
a
viable
project
and
they
got
refused,
and
then
they
came
back
with
a
different
partner,
the
same
architect
and
said
it's
going
to
be
100
social
housing
and
that's
because
it
was
a
different,
different
backer
and
I
just
found
that
very
difficult
to
accept,
but
in
that
case
it
was
refused
with
no
social
housing
so
that
that
was
a
positive
story
on
that.
I
think
I
think
we
should
move
on.
A
If
that's,
okay
with
the
committee,
I
think
we've
got
a
way
way
forward
for
now.
So
thank
you
very
much.
Okay.
Thank
you
very
much.
Jonathan
for
your
time.
I
think
we'll
be
in
touch
even
myself
or
kate
will
be
in
touch
about
how
we
move
forwards
on
this
and
probably
louise
as
well,
but
feel
free
to
dial
out.
If
you,
if
you
don't
want
to
listen
to
the
rest
of
the
committee.
A
Thanks
john
okay,
on
to
item
nine,
so
we
have
again,
we
discussed
this
this
item
in
our
working
group
and
the
notes
are
on
page
47
and
48
I'll.
Wait
I'll,
open
up
two
comments
from
members.
F
Yes,
thank
you
chair
just
going
through
very
quickly
paragraph
3.
F
2.
gives
us,
I
think,
a
very
useful
breakdown
of
the
nature
of
of
disciplinaries.
I
just
wonder
whether
there
is
any
way
of
benchmarking
that
against
other
authorities
and
their
disciplinary
records.
My
next
question
relates
to
paragraph
3.26
on
page
43,
and
it
re
relates
to
the
the
feedback
from
the
the
well-being
pulse
survey.
I've
not
heard
that
term
before
it
indicates
that
over
80
percent
of
respondents
reported
feeling
happy
with
the
level
of
support
they're
receiving.
F
But
obviously
then
you
have
to
ask
the
question
about
what's
happening
with
the
remaining
almost
20,
and
there
is
reference
to
the
fact
that
they're
offered
a
phone
call,
but
my
question
is
in
terms
of
that.
Rather
substantial
number,
I
mean
my
rapid
mental
arithmetic
suggests
it's
about
a
thousand
of
the
respondents.
F
I
Yep,
I
am
hi
everybody
hi.
Yes,
certainly
we
have
conducted
benchmarking
exercises
in
the
past
with
our
partners,
either
the
core
cities,
or
sometimes
with
our
palms
in
in
west
yorkshire.
That
isn't
something
we've
done
with
the
data
from
last
year's
disciplinaries,
but
it
is
something
that
we've
done
in
the
past.
So
if
the
committee
wishes
that
to
be
done,
then
that
can
be
that
can
be.
I
We
can
contact
our
other
local
authorities
and
we
can
do
that
and
previously
the
the
benchmarkings
come
back
has
shown
very
much
sort
of
similar
patterns
so
when
we
have
benchmark
before
it's,
it's
not
necessarily
just
being
on
disciplinaries,
but
we
might
look
at
attendance,
performance
and
other
areas,
so
we
can
certainly
do
that
again
and
on
the
feedback
from
the
well-being
pulse
server.
Yes,
the
the
term
pulse
survey
is
really
just
to
indicate
the
speed.
I
So
it's
the
difference
between
our
big,
which
are
now
every
two
years,
engagement
surveys
that
are
open
for
several
months
and
because
of
the
nature
of
covid
and
because
we
wanted
feedback
back
very
very
quickly.
The
pulse
indicates
that
this
these
surveys
were
open
for
a
week.
So
it
was
quick,
sharp
we've
done
two
of
them
since
we've
been
in
lockdown.
It
was
to
get
that
very
quick
short
feedback
so
that
we
could
react
quickly
and
there
was
then
summary
done
of
the
comments
that
were
left
to
people.
I
So
I
can
contact
one
of
my
colleagues
who's
the
lead
for
that
area
and
get
those
reports
that
went
back
to
senior
officers
about
the
themes,
and
I
can
share
those
with
the
committee.
I
If
that's
something
that
would
be
of
interest-
and
I
just
just
off
the
top
of
my
head,
there
was,
as
you
might
expect,
quite
a
lot
of
feedback
early
on
around
the
large
numbers
of
people
who
worked
from
home
and
the
equipment,
and
that's
why
we
did
a
separate
survey
of
the
work
from
home
cohort
to
get
more
detailed
information
about
their
needs
and
things.
You
know
that
because
people
went
home
so
quickly,
they
didn't
necessarily
immediately
have
all
of
the
kit
that
they
needed
so
yep.
F
I
There
was
one
item
that
I
was
coming
back
to,
let
you
know
an
update
on
from
the
working
group,
because
we
would
normally
have
completed
this
in
in
may,
but
the
annual
exercise,
which
is
around
our
high
risk
postholders,
there's
1362
posts
that
are
identified
as
high
risk.
I
This
is
for
the
annual
register
of
interest
and
the
new
positive
assurance
around
the
gifts
and
hospitality
and
as
of
close
of
play
friday,
we
only
now
have
45
left
to
come
in
37
of
those
are
from
online
people
that
we're
we're
emailing.
There
are
eight
which
we're
communicating
with
post.
So
that's
going
to
be
people
who
aren't
actually
in
work
at
the
moment,
whether
that
be
maternity
level
or
on
long
term
sick.
I
So
I
I
believe
that
the
arrangement
was
that
I
would
obviously
provide
an
update
for
the
next
committee
meeting
in
october,
with
the
expectation
that
it'll
be
zero
and
I'm
I'm
confident
that
having
got
to
45
at
this
point,
they're
coming
in
every
day,
so
we've
had
a
lot
of
people
on
annual
leave
in
the
september
post
august
as
well.
So
I'm
confident
that
those
will
be
zero
for
your
october
meeting.
A
I
think
that's
that's
yes,
good!
Thank
you
very
much
everyone.
Let's,
let's
move
on
to
item
10,
which
is
is
louise.
J
Good
morning,
good
morning,
chair
good
morning,
this
is
the
report
on
the
update
on
the
the
actress
project.
J
I
just
want
to
to
bring
members
attention
to
a
few
points,
so
excellent
progress
has
been
made
in
the
last
reporting
period
and
as
of
this
morning
at
9
30.
I
can
confirm
that
no
access,
2003
databases
remain
to
be
uplifted
to
access
2010.
J
So
that's
very
good
news.
I
will
come
on
to
the
the
full
figures
at
the
end
of
of
of
the
report.
The
only
work
remaining
is
ensuring
that
services
are
fully
able
to
continue
all
actions
that
they
require
to
do
with
those
new
access,
2010
databases
and
staff
from
dis
applications.
Teams
have
been
pulled
in
to
assist
with
that,
knowing
that
full
well
in
the
future
that
they
will
have
to
support
services,
and
they
will
own
those
databases
going
forward.
J
I
can
report
that
no
new
databases
have
been
created
in
the
last
period
and,
as
you
will
recall
at
the
back
end
of
last
year,
this
was
a
significant
problem,
but
following
your
this,
the
the
help
from
this
committee
and
from
the
11s
and
some
very
firm
communication
went
out
to
all
services
to
tell
them
to
stop
creating
new
databases,
and
that
has
worked.
So.
Thank
you
very
much
for
that
assistance.
In
that
matter,.
J
There
has
been
teams,
as,
as
we've
been
working
with
services,
they
have
come
forward
and
informed
us
of
a
couple
of
old
databases,
so,
whilst
they're
no
longer
in
use
the
data
within
them
is
required
to
be
kept
for
statutory
reasons,
statutory
retention
periods,
and
so
there
has
been
some
work,
just
migrating
that
data
into
the
new
databases,
so
that
we
haven't
lost
the
data
okay.
J
So
over
this
the
the
summer,
I
have
had
two
conversations
with
the
cabinet
office
to
discuss
the
next
phase
of
the
access
project
and
the
implications
that
that
has
on
our
psn
certification
due
to
covid
you'll
know
from
the
number
of
times
I've
been
to
this
committee
that
our
normal
cycle
for
applying
for
our
psn
certification
is
generally
july,
but
because
of
covid
that
has
now
moved
to
december
of
this
year.
J
Obviously,
as
part
of
those
conversations
with
the
cabinet
office,
I
needed
to
ensure
that
the
work
that
we
were
doing
and
the
plans
that
we've
been
putting
in
place
around
the
next
phase
of
access,
which
is
the
eradication
of
access
completely
and
the
access
2010
databases
that
they
were
in
agreement
and
with
our
plans
proposed
plans
and
that
it
wouldn't
impact
on
our
psn's
application
in
december.
J
So
in
principle,
the
cabinet
office
have
agreed
on
our
plans
for
our
removal
of
our
reliance
on
access,
and
I
do
have
a
written
confirmation
of
this
from
the
cabinet
office,
which
should
committee
require
or
be
interested.
I
can
share
that
written
communication
with
you
following
this
meeting.
J
However,
this
this
project
and
and
the
work
of
this
committee
has
raised
a
number
of
issues
around
project
management
and
such
like
within
dis
and
the
is
have
now
recognized
those
issues
by
this
project
and
a
number
of
other
things.
So
a
considerable
amount
of
work
has
been
going
on
and
governments
arrangements
in
ais
have
now
been
strengthened
considerably.
J
As
stated
in
the
report,
a
new
portfolio
management
office
has
been
established
and
the
new
government's
governance
structure
has
also
been
put
in
place
and
obviously
the
phase
two
of
the
access
2010
project,
as
well
as
other
governance,
related
projects
will
fall
under
this
new
governance
structure.
J
I
was
asked
to
outline
all
the
projects
that
are
ongoing,
which
do
have
an
impact
on
our
compliance
regime,
and
that
was
brought
up
in
that
meeting.
But
I
think
it
was
about
a
week
before
we
went
into
lockdown,
so
it
since
that
time.
J
We
there's
there's
been
no
additional
sort
of
focus
on
that,
but
we
now
have
this
compliance
board
in
place
and
it
means
that
there
will
be
regular
reporting
on
all
projects
that
have
a
compliance
implication
and
it
gives
a
a
root
for
the
raising
of
risks
and
issues
and
other
escalations.
So
there's
there's.
No.
Everyone
knows
that.
That
is
the
route
that
we
have
to
go
through,
rather
than
the
problems
that
we
saw
before
where
things
were
seem
to
be
a
bit
all
over
the
place.
J
Just
to
then
move
on
to
the
the
actual
figures
at
the
end
of
the
report.
So
again,
as
of
this
morning,
I
can
confirm
that
there
are
no
new
databases
have
been
created.
There
are
no
databases
in
progress.
C
J
Yes,
you're
quite
right,
but
there
are
a
number
of
other
products
available
and
the
the
work
going
forwards.
They
they
are
almost
splitting
to
three
chunks
as
it
were,
and
the
first
chunk
is
on
average.
Around
50
of
those
databases
are
for
business
analysis,
so
that
data
is
moved
into
business,
intelligence
tools
specifically,
and
you
may
or
may
not
have
heard
of
microsoft.
Products
called
power
bi.
J
So
we
would
be
moving
those
sort
of
reporting
requirements
and
business
intelligence
requirements
into
to
that
product.
There's
another
chunk
of
databases
which
the
data
really
should
never
have
been
in
an
access
database.
They
should
have
been
in
a
line
of
business
applications.
So,
for
example,
you
know
a
children's
social
care
database
or
a
housing
database
so
that
all
the
data
should
have
been
kept
together.
J
So
in
those
cases
that
data
will
be
migrated
into
the
line
of
business
application.
So
it's
all
together
and
we
haven't
got
these
separate
databases
here
there
and
everywhere.
J
The
third
chunk
are
those
where
there
isn't
an
appropriate
line
of
business
application
and
the
council
would
either
have
to
look
at
what
applications
it's
already
got
and
see.
If
any
are
suitable
for
that
data,
or
we
may
have
to
go
out
to
procure
something
completely
new,
but
that's
all
documented
in
the
phase
two
plan
for
access.
A
Thank
you.
Louise
can
I
bring
in
councillor
trussville,
please.
F
Yeah
thank
you
chair.
This
has
obviously
been
an
issue,
a
long-standing
concern
to
this
committee,
and
it
looks
at
long
last
as
though
we
where
we
are
where
we
need
to
be
where
ideally
should
have
been
some
time
ago.
But
could
I
just
repeat
the
usual
committee
catechism
to
to
louise,
to
seek
assurance
that
that
the
teams
or
people
dealing
with
this
issue
within
the
council
are
sufficiently
resourced?
Have
the
right
skills
and
the
the
issue
is
being
now
fully
prioritized
by
all
sections
of
the
council?
A
Thank
you
thanks
paul
I've
got
a
couple
of
questions
as
well.
If
that's
right,
louise
so
can
I
just.
F
J
Yes
and
the
the
new
arrangements
in
in
dis
now
mean
that,
whereas,
as
previously
as
as
previously
reported,
resources
were
often
moved
from
from
one
project
to
the
other,
and
then
I
would
find
out
a
number
of
weeks
later
when
the
project
was
slipping,
the
the
implementation
of
the
the
portfolio
board
and
the
compliance
board
means
that
no
resources
can
be
moved
without
discussion.
Discussions
first
to
understand
what
what's
the
the
impact
on
any
of
the
compliance
projects
in
moving
these
resources
around.
F
A
J
D
Thanks
joe,
I
just
thought
it
was
worth
just
contemplating
the
the
impact
of
that
last
session
on
the
annual
governance
statement.
So,
as
councillor
truswell
said
it's,
this
has
been
a
sort
of
a
long-standing
issue.
Certainly
since
I
joined
the
committee
probably
about
15
18
months
ago,
and
obviously
it
was
flagged
in
the
annual
governance
statement
and
that
we
went
through
in
draft
form
at
the
last
meeting
and
given
that
that
document
is
a
live
document
until
it's
signed
at
some
point
sort
of
end
of
october
november
time.
D
Some
of
those
developments
and
actions
that
have
been
taken,
you
know,
probably
want
to
be
reflected
in
some
way
in
that
annual
governance
statement,
so
that
it's
the
latest
position.
That's
in
that
key
public
document
chair
that
was
that
was
all
thank
you.
A
Thank
you
gareth.
I
support
that
in
terms
of
terms
of
councillor
harren,
do
you
want
to
speak.
J
I
I
would
have
to
check,
obviously
I'd
I'll,
have
to
check
the
wording
simply
because
we
wouldn't
want
any
document
going
into
the
public
that
would
advertise
our
security
structures
and
our
our
current
security
stamps.
So
I
I
will
certainly
check
first
before
committing
to
saying
whether
it
could
be
a
public
document
or
not.
A
Yeah
in,
in
any
case,
please
circulate
it's.
The
whole
committee
and
make
a
note
about
how
confidential
it
is.
Is
that
okay,
counselor
herman
yeah
great
councillor,
graham.
E
E
A
Thank
you
councilor,
graham,
so
so
my
questions
louie
so
in
terms
of
the
time
frame
for
those
on
testing
and
waiting
to
go,
live,
what's
what's
the
time
frame
for
that.
A
Secondly,
in
terms
of
the
access
data
2010
database,
when
are
the
key
milestones,
because
I
think
that's
something
the
committee
certainly,
I
will
be
interested
in
because
I
want
to
know
that
the
new
governance
arrangements-
I
think
we've
said
this
several
times
today-
needs
to
actually
happen,
not
just
say
we're
going
to
have
the
right
compliance
place,
compliance
procedures
in
place
and
seeing
the
access,
2010
project
moving
forward
will
be
one
piece
of
evidence
on
that
and
and
thirdly,
paragraph
5.1
says
that
the
director
of
resources
and
housing
amongst
others,
is
ensuring
this
project
is
prioritized.
A
Can
you
confirm
that
neil
is
being
briefed
and
kept
up
some
speed
on
the
progress
of
this
project?.
J
Yes,
so
on
your
final
point,
yes,
neil
has
been
receiving
the
the
weekly
reports
on
this
project,
the
same
as
as
yourself
counselor
scopes,
so
he
has
been,
and
I
do
separately
meet
with
with
neil
on
a
monthly
basis,
and
we
do
always
cover
this.
J
This
particular
project
is
one
of
our
standing
items
for
discussion,
so
neil
is
is
fully
aware
of
where
we're
at
with
this-
and
I
did
brief
him
last
week
prior
to
coming
to
the
to
to
committee
today,
as
as
for
the
your
other
two
questions,
would
it
be
better
if
I,
if
I
circulated
that
that
information,
I
don't
have
it
to
hand,
and
I
don't
want
to
sort
of
be
looking
through
my
my
email
folder
as
well,
so
I'm
on
this
call,
if,
if
that's
more
suitable,
but
I
can
find
that
information
for
you
today
and
could
circulate
the
the
time
frame
for
for
the
rest
of
the
access,
2003
going
live
and
the
key
milestones
for
2010.
A
Yes,
thank
you,
louise.
The
the
reason
I
ask
is
because
I
think
it
feeds
into
how
we
a
question
about
how
we
want
this
to
be
continued
to
be
reported
to
us
going
forwards,
and
I
think
that's
one
of
the
key
key
questions
here.
I'd
I'm
keen
to
stress
that
slimming
down
reports
is
not
not.
The
aim
is.
The
aim
is
to
like
focus
on
on
the
governance
and
audit
and
risk
stuff.
A
That's
what
I'm
trying
to
do,
and
I
guess
in
my
head,
there's
there's
two
this:
this
project
isn't
necessarily
something
that
we
want
to
focus
on
other
than
the
fact
that
it
got
so
far
behind
that
we
felt
the
need
to
monitor
it
on
a
regular
basis,
and
I
guess
it's
a
much
wider
piece
of
monitoring
and
governance
assurance
we
need
from
both
dis,
but
also
in
your
role
as
gdpr
guardian.
A
I
guess
for
lack
of
a
better
phrase,
and
so
I
guess
we
can't
really
make
a
decision
about
what
report
we
want
next
about
the
access
database
until
we
know
what
the
time
frames
are,
but
I
think
we
will
want
to
keep
monitoring
this,
at
least
at
some
level,
because
it
will
demonstrate
whether
the
new
compliance
arrangements
are
working.
I
think
that'll
be
a
good
case
study,
but
I
think
going
forward.
We
need
to
to
think
about
the
wider
governance
piece,
but
also
the
wider
gdbr
piece,
which
I
guess
in
some
ways
is
this.
A
J
Yes,
counselor,
I
I
I
agree,
and,
and
certainly
with
with
my
obviously
I've,
been
coming
to
to
this
committee
with
almost
wearing
two
hats,
and
I
think
it
would
be
beneficial
for
us
to
be
able
to
separate
out
that,
because,
certainly
from
my
data
protection
officer
perspective,
there
are
other
elements
that
I
feel
that
could
be
discussed
from
a
governance
perspective
at
this
this
committee.
J
But
at
the
same
time
I
quite
agree
that
there
needs
to
still
be
some
level
of
monitoring
of
this
this
project.
But
alongside
some
as
I
mentioned
earlier,
there
are
a
number
of
projects
which
are
being
managed
by
dis
which
have
an
impact
on
our
compliance
posture
and
I
think
committing
needs
to
be
aware
of
the
the
wider
agenda
as
well
to
to
understand
and
see
the
whole,
rather
than
just
the
focus
that
understandably,
we've
had
on
on
this
project
over
the
last
18
months
or
so.
A
Okay,
so
so
what
I'm
hearing
is
almost
we
need
two
two
semi
regular
reports,
one
from
you
about
gdpr
and
one
from
either
you
or
someone
else
in
dis
about
dis
risks
and
then
there's
a
there's.
Another
piece
on
top
of
that
is:
how
does
the
access
monitoring
fit,
but
we
can't
decide
on
that
until
we
know
the
timeline
is
that's
what
I'm
hearing
I
I
feel
like.
Maybe
that's
probably
it
sounds
like
a
sensible
way
forwards.
A
A
I
think
I
think
I'm
getting
general
nods.
So,
let's,
let's
do
that,
just
the
other
of
just
the
other
piece.
You
also
mentioned
your
compliance
board.
Would
that
be
fitting
into
your
gdpr
hat
or
into
the
dis.
A
Okay,
so
we'll
be
expecting
to
see
at
least
some
some
thoughts
around
that
good,
okay.
So
moving
back
to
the
agenda,
so
the
recommendation-
I
item
is
paragraph
6.1
on
page
53,
the
corporate
governance
and
audit
committee
is
asked
to
consider
the
contents
of
this
report
and
support
actions.
Therein
are
we.
Are
we
satisfied
to
accept
that
recommendation
good?
A
Thank
you
very
much.
Everyone!
That's
very
positive!
Thank
you
for
that
louise
and
also
thank
you
for
suggestions
on
the
way
forwards.
I
feel
like
yeah,
I
mean
I've.
I
know
gary
said
he's
known
about
it
for
18
months,
I've
known
about
it
since
I
got
first
appointed
on
this
committee
in
may
2018..
So
it's
it's
nice
that
it's,
hopefully
we're
going
to
see
the
back
of
of
phase
one
anyway.
Okay,
moving
on
to
agenda
item
11
on
page
55
over
to
louise,
are
you
speaking
on
this.
H
I
am
thank
you
chair
good
morning
everybody,
so
today's
update
report
covers
the
period
june
august
2020.,
rather
than
take
you
to
the
report.
I'd
just
like
to
highlight
a
few
worries
for
you
today.
So
in
my
view,
internal
audit
are
continuing
to
write
the
challenge
of
working
and
auditing
remotely.
It
really
is
a
credit
to
the
team.
They've
managed
to
issue
12
audit
reports
in
the
period
plus
a
whole
array
of
grant
assurances
that
are
listed
in
the
report.
H
1012
audit
reports
about
positive
opinions
and
two
of
that
limited
the
two
limited
opinions
being
the
r35
legislation
and
the
dolls,
which
is
the
deprivation
of
liberty
safeguards
goals,
was
a
follow-up
where
the
key
fabians
were
around
the
time
scales.
The
team
were
working
to
plus
the
performance
information
that
was
available
was
still
a
bit
limited.
H
However,
legislation's
lagged
a
bit
behind
and
it's
still
yet
to
be
passed.
So
management
have
actually
now
decided
to
put
some
interim
measures
in
place,
which
should
hopefully
the
next
time
we
do.
A
follow-up
will
actually
give
us
the
the
okay
to
have
a
positive
assurance,
so
the
second
limited
assurance
was
for
ir35
and
this
involved
full
review
of
the
central
controls
and
of
the
controls
within
the
directions,
because
obviously
the
central,
the
creditors
and
taxation
team
have
have
some
responsibility,
but
also
the
directorates
have
a
large
responsibility
as
well.
H
So
hopefully
we'll
we'll
use
in
adults
as
a
bit
of
a
test
case
and
then
helping
roll
that
that
out.
I
think
it's
just
around
actually
understanding
where
some
of
this
information
was.
We
could
actually
cleanse
all
the
data
that
they
needed
so
going
on.
H
Now
we're
very
much
at
the
start
of
this
journey,
but
it's
a
massive
and
pivotal
program
for
the
council
and
in
this
project
internal
logic,
we're
working
alongside
the
program
to
help
ensure
that
governance
arrangements
are
in
place
and
operating
and
that
compliance
is
actually
built
in
as
a
fundamental
part
of
the
design
and
then
the
remainder
of
the
report.
It
just
goes
onto
our
performance
as
internal
or
audit.
So
that's
our
pis
in
terms
of
feedback,
but
also
progress
against
the
plan.
H
So
that's
the
report
in
a
nutshell.
Thank
you
for
your
time
and
I'm
happy
to
take
any
questions.
A
B
Thanks
chairman,
thank
you.
Louise
just
there's
two
bits
from
me:
there's
a
question
I
have
on
the
dolls
and
says
section:
3.8
and
management
has
responded
positively
and
you're
working
with
the
directorate
leadership
team.
It's
how.
How
often
are
our
updates
so
between
the
leadership
team
and
yourselves
and
the
exit
member
on
that,
because
that's
really
important,
especially
for
me
personally,
with
a
family
member
under
adults,.
H
I
think
this
regular
liaison
with
the
leadership
team
and,
like
I
mentioned
we,
we
have
regular
liaisons
anyway,
with
steve,
but
formally
probably
quarterly,
and
as
far
as
engagement
with
the
exec
member.
I
don't
actually
have
that
information
to
hand,
but
I
can't
get
back
to
your
counsellor
with
that
information.
B
Well,
thank
you
yeah.
We,
I
really
feel
with
that
one.
You
know
not
just
personally
but
really
important
to
us
as
an
organization
and
that's
one
of
them,
one
of
the
most
important
things
that
we
do
possibly
as
a
counselor
actually.
B
And
just
on
the
open
referrals
for
the
reactive
answer
for
artwork:
are
these
other
certain
directorates
that
have
more
open
referrals
than
others,
and
is
that
a
worry?
If
so,
are
you
able
to
give
us
a
breakdown.
H
And
I
can
get
more
information
on
that
and
what
tends
to
happen
is
open
referrals
that
get
passed
over
to
directors
the
chance
to
be
a
lot
around
housing
benefits.
So
investigations
on
whistle
through
whistleblown,
for
example,
neighbours
reporting
on
neighbours.
That
kind
of
thing,
and
rather
than
that
I
haven't,
got
the
exact
breakdown.
But
I
can
send
that
through
to
all
members,
if
phil
members
would
like.
A
B
B
A
A
H
A
Good
good
anything
else
counts
and
harand
great.
Thank
you.
Can
I
bring
in
councillor
truswell
next,
please.
F
Yeah,
thank
you.
Chair
ben's,
already
addressed
one
of
the
points
I
wanted
to
make
on
reactive,
anti-fraud
work.
I
just
wondered
whether
the
kobe
pandemic
period
and
the
fact
that
we've
obviously
had
to
box
clever
forms
of
a
better
expression
in
terms
of
the
way
we
operate
has
thrown
up
any
issues
other
than
that
that
you've
referred
to
louise
in
your
report
in
terms
of
the
administration
and
disbursement
of
government
grants.
F
Has
there
been
anything
else,
that's
kind
of
emerged
and
again
I
it's
going
back
to
my
hobby
course
on
paragraph
3.6
and
paragraph
3.9,
the
references
to
dolls
and
to
ir35.
F
I
think
it
just
would
be
useful
to
have
a
few
examples
of
what
we're
actually
talking
about
in
terms
of
those
measures
which
aren't
being
addressed
by
management
or
remain
outstanding,
and
obviously
the
reporting
to
ir
35
was
a
couple
of
years
ago,
and
I
think
it
came
to
this
committee
shortly
after
that,
and
I
must
stand.
There
is
probably
a
product
of
my
deteriorating
brain
in
old
age,
but
I
don't
remember
all
the
substantive
issues
was
it
whether
we
were
treating
people
who
should
be
treated
as
employees
as
contractors
and
vice
versa
or.
H
F
My
reference
to
ir35
was
that
it's
a
couple
of
years
since
the
issues
been
in
detail
to
the
board,
I
think-
and
it
was
just
to
get
a
refresh
as
to
what
the
substantive
issues
were.
Is
it
about
the
way
we
treat
people's
employment,
we're
treating
people
who
should
be
employees
as
contractors
or
vice
versa?
Is
that
the
main
issue.
H
Yes,
it's
around
certified,
it's
it's
where
people
are
working
for
us
on
a
temporary
basis
wish
to
be
paid
via
an
invoice
so
as
a
contract
rather
than
on
payroll,
and
it's
that
assessment
that
we
have
to
do
as
to
whether
they
should
be
on
payroll
or
not.
So,
therefore,
we
responsible
paying
the
tax.
F
H
This
is
why
it's
an
issue
for
us:
we
need
to
make
sure
that
we
have
the
proper
processes
in
place
to
to
account
for
that
appropriately.
A
Thank
you
very
much
bringing
councillor
inningworth.
C
Thank
you,
sir.
I
was
looking
at
4.3.3
on
page
64,
which
mentions
the
climate
emergency
and
I
thought
it
at
two
levels.
This
at
one
point
of
the
actual
sort
of
climate
cost
of
the
ordered
operation
must
be
fairly
modest.
On
the
other
hand,
look
for
a
different
point
of
view.
This
is
going
to
turn
our
whole
world
upside
down.
C
Our
cash
flows,
our
business
plan,
everything
we
do
is
going
to
be
transformed
by
this
and
it's
the
job's
enormous,
and
I'm
just
wondering
how
you're
going
to
tread
a
path
between
the
trivial
and
the
world
shattering.
H
Obviously,
every
year
we
do
do
a
risk-based
plan.
Yes,
it
would
have
been
good
to
include
something
on
climate
emergency
this
year,
but
obviously
the
coverage
pandemic
put
paid
to
that,
but
obviously
each
year
we
do
consider
it
and
to
be
honest
for
us,
as
internal
audit
would
actually
the
first
instance.
H
It
would
probably
be
looking
at
like
the
the
corporate
arrangements
for
how
we
were
assessing
and
the
the
the
role
that
the
council
could
play
within
the
community
and
also
what
we
can
reflect
and
do
as
ourselves
to
to
address
that
internally,
such
as
maybe
reduced
printing.
A
Thanks
for
that
question,
that's
really
good
question
and
I
think
we
said
we
as
a
council
declared
the
climate
emergency
last
year,
and
I
guess
at
some
point
before
2030.
A
It
would
be
helpful
to
have
some
kind
of
internal
audit
in
terms
of
whether
we
are
progressing
in
the
right
direction
to
meet
that
target.
I
know
it
was
a
it's
an
ambitious
target
and
it
is
a
like
a
we've
got
to
recognize
that
it's
an
ambitious
target,
not
necessarily
an
easy
target
to
achieve,
but
that
doesn't
take
away
from
the
desire
from
many
people
from
all
parties
to
achieve
that
target.
A
I
think
that's
really
a
really
helpful
report
piece
of
work
to
do
and
whether
that's
next
year
or
the
year
after,
I'm
not
sure,
but
I
think
it
should
be
on
the
agenda
that
the
other
thing
I
wanted
to
ask
in
terms
of
just
just
check
that
you've
got
it
on
your
notes,
we'll
you'll
be
able
to
fit
in
the
extra
report
that
you
said.
You'd
look
at
round
round
planning.
A
I
think
that's
probably
quite
an
urgent
piece
of
work
before
we
can
accept
any
assurances
around
the
planning.
A
H
Yes,
we
will
treat
it
as
a
priority
as
as
previously
mentioned
when
I
brought
the
revised
plan
back
the
reprioritized
plan,
I
did
mention
that
we'd
held
back
some
spare
capacity
to
see
if
there's
any
emerging
risks.
So
obviously
this
can
count
as
one
of
those.
A
Thank
you.
I
can't
see
anyone
else
indicating
at
this
point.
So
with
that,
are
we
content
with
the
recommendations
on
page
66.
A
I'm
seeing
nods
and
acceptance,
so
thank
you
very
much.
Louise,
that's
very
helpful.
So
moving
on
to
item
12
in
the
work
program,
I
think
the
first
person
that
would
be
helpful
to
hear
from
on
this
is
victoria.
If
that's
all
right
in
terms
of
the
work
program
and
in
particular
the
accounts.
K
Okay,
thanks
counselor
sorry,
I
I
had
trouble
at
the
beginning
trying
to
take
it
off
mute.
So
I
do
apologize
for
not
coming
in
just
on
the
the
work
programming
and
on
the
accounts.
We're
currently
undertaking
the
audit,
which
I'm
sure
gareth
will
go
through
in
more
detail
and
we've
we're
on
track
with
the
audit.
But
we
are
proposing
to
take
that
back
one
month.
K
There
are
a
number
of
reasons
why
we're
going
to
delay
the
accounts
and
the
while
we're
proposing
to
delay
the
audit
of
the
accounts
and
the
first
one
is
around
the
decision
that
we're
acquiring
on
the
current
financial
year,
which
is
for
2021.
K
we're
waiting
for
government
to
give
us
their
decision
on
whether
there's
going
to
be
any
further
support
from
mhclg
for
this
current
financial
year.
K
Obviously,
we
couldn't
ask
external
audit
to
sign
off
the
accounts
until
we've
had
that
decision
from
central
government
and
we're
expecting
that
mid-october
and
therefore
that's
why
we're
proposing
to
delay
the
audit,
big
corporate
governance
and
audit
committee,
where
they
consider
the
account
until
mid-november,
and
the
second
reason
is
around
the
pension
fund.
So
we're
waiting
for
some.
A
report
around
the
assurance
on
the
pension
fund
audit
and
that
should
be
again
at
the
end
of
october,
so
we're
just
waiting
for
that
decisions.
K
That
and
again,
therefore
grant
thornton
wouldn't
be
able
to
give
their
opinion
on
the
accounts
without
that
assurance,
and
then
the
third
thing
is
around
the
progression
of
the
order.
I
think
it's
it's
very
challenging,
with
with
working
remotely,
etc
and
with
kobit
19.
Although
the
information
sharing
is
happening
and
it's
have
put
in
some
different
and
challenges
that
we
wouldn't
normally
have
expected
and
therefore,
with
those
three
things,
three
things
taken
into
consideration,
my
recommendation
is
that
we
do
delay
the
audit
and
governance
committee
until
mid-november.
A
Can
can
I
just
clarify
for
everyone's
point
of
view
in
terms
of
meeting
requirements
of
the
law?
I'm
assuming
this
delay
is
acceptable
and
then
also
second
question
just
for
clarities
just
around.
How
do
we
compare
to
other
councils,
so
the
pension
scheme
issue,
I
suspect,
isn't
isn't
just
us,
for
example.
So
can
you
just
clarify
those
two
points?
Victoria.
K
Yeah,
the
first
one
is
that
the
deadline
for
the
external
audit
completion
was
the
end
of
november.
So
we're
still
in
those
requirements
and
the
second
point
around
the
with
other
authorities-
and
there
is
still
some
authorities
that
haven't
had
their
accounts
signed
up
for
last
year
and
therefore-
and
I
think
everybody's
aiming
to
get
done
for
the
end
of
november.
But
I'm
sure
there'll
be
some
delays.
But
we
will
be
in
line
with
the
statutory
requirements.
D
Thank
you
chair.
I
mean
not
not
really
much
more
to
add
to
what
victoria
said
there
chair
excuse
me.
I
mean
just
to
confirm
to
the
committee
that
victoria
and
I
and
our
respective
teams
remain
in
in
regular
discussions.
So
you
know
victoria,
and
I
had
two
meetings
last
week,
for
example,
and
those
three
areas
that
victoria
highlighted
you
know
are.
You
know
why
we
were
proposed
to
put
the
committee's
date
back
a
month
from
mid-october
to
mid-november
and
again
just
to
emphasize
chair
the
the
statutory
date
for
for
audited
accounts.
D
This
year
is
the
30th
of
november.
We
don't
envisage
any
issues
with
that
and
in
terms
of
how
you
compare
elsewhere,
certainly
in
terms
of
most
pension
fund
audits
are
running
to
sort
of
an
end
of
october,
early
november
sign
off
date.
Therefore,
you
know
the
administrator.
You
know
the
audited
bodies
that
need
that
assurance.
Their
audits
are
obviously
not
going
to
be
signed
off
before
then.
D
So
certainly
I
haven't
signed
any
opinions
as
yet
and
I
think
nationally
grant
thornton
likely
to
only
sign
a
handful
and
that's
where
you've
got
a
local
authority
that
also
administers
the
pension
fund.
So
in
essence
the
same
team
are
doing
the
boss
jobs
and
they
typically
tend
to
be
london,
borough's,
chair
and
so
most
of
my
sign-offs
are
planned
for
sort
of
the
middle
of
november
onwards.
D
Chair,
and
I
think
you
know
you
know
victoria
set
out
very
clearly
the
the
the
reasons
for
the
proposals
to
to
shun
that
back.
The
only
other
thing
I'd
mentioned
here,
just
whilst
I've
I've
got
the
floor,
if
you
like
is
the
the
long-awaited
redmond
review
was,
was
published
last
week,
chair
so
at
the
the
next
normal
meeting.
D
If
you
like,
the
one
in
the
middle
of
december,
I'd
propose
that
pamindra
and
I
do
a
bit
about
the
the
redmond
review
and
its
recommendations
and
also
talk
through
the
new
external
audit
code
for
2021
and
some
of
the
changes
that
you
can
expect
for
from
our
audit
approach
for
next
year
and
we
plan
to
do
something
on
that
at
the
december
meeting.
If
that's
okay,
chair.
A
D
We'll
get
something
to
you
and
other
members
this
week
yeah.
We
can
obviously
share
the
report
now
and
we've
got
like
a
summary,
yeah
yeah
e-messages,
so
we'll
get
that
to
your
chair.
Thank
you.
A
That'd
be
appreciated
and
obviously
we
can
do
some
kind
of
training.
I
think
that
probably
is
probably
sensible.
So
with
that
I
guess.
Firstly,
I
need
to
ask
committee
to
agree
to
push
back
the
october
meeting.
I
think
there's
some
genuine
reasons
for
this
and
it's
still
within
our
statutory
requirements.
A
So
unless
someone
specifically
objects,
I
think
we
should
do
that
and
the
other
thing
I'm
going
to
bring
kate
in
in
a
minute.
The
other
thing
we
need
to
note
is
that
at
full
counts.
We
talked
about
the
evolution,
and
one
of
the
things
that
was
recommended
by
full
council
on
an
exec
board
is
that
we
looked
as
the
corporate
governance
audit
committee
at
the
governance
arrangements
of
the
mayoral
authority,
and
so
that
has
been
added
to
the
agenda
as
well.
A
I
don't
think
there's
any
way
around
that
given
before
council
has
told
us
to
do
it
and
so
is
exec
board,
but
I
I
wanted
to
flag
that
and
that's
actually
a
really
urgent
and
important
piece
of
work,
because
getting
making
sure
we
are
comfortable
with
those
arrangements
is
important
and
we'll
have.
We've
been
asked
two
specific
questions.
A
As
well,
one
of
them
is
whether
we
invite
the
mayor
to
full
council
once
or
twice
or
however
many
times
a
year,
and
so
we
will
need
a
report
on
that
from
louise
and
we
will
consider
that
in
due
course
and
with
that
I'll.
I'm
assuming
there's
no
objections
to
that.
No
good!
Do
you
want
to
speak
counselor,
ghana,
yeah.
B
Please,
thank
you
just
on
that
devolution
point.
I
know
we've
got
the
informal
working
group
before
that
meeting,
because
I
suggest
that,
because
it's
is
a
big
issue
and
and
under
public
scrutiny,
as
that's
discussed
in
in
the
live
committee
as
we
are
now
rather
than
in
the
working
group
and
or
any
other
views,
it
would
be
good,
but
my
personal
opinion
is
that
that
should
be
in
the
full
thing
like
this.
A
Yep,
I'm
happy
with
that
councillor,
graham.
E
A
Thank
you,
council,
graham,
I
will
I'm
sure
we
will
be
taken
cersei.
I
think
it'd
be
difficult
for
executive
board
to
ask
us
to
look
at
something
and
then
not
take
our
recommendation
seriously,
and
I
think
it's
clear
that
we
will
need
to
as
a
committee
right
to
executive
board
and
or
full
council
to
say
we
have
done
what
you
asked
us,
and
this
is
our
recommendations.
A
And
we
can
discuss
exactly
what
that
says.
Once
we've
considered
it
kate
did
you
have
anything
else
on
the
the
work
program
that
we
need
to
discuss.
E
E
A
I
mean
we
all
stand
like
a
stuck
record
at
this
point,
but
we
need
we
need
to.
We
need
to
make
sure
it's
progressing
properly,
given
the
level
of
scrutiny
we've
put
it
under.
I
think
the
point
is:
if
it,
if
it
doesn't
progress
forwards
it
it
does.
A
It
would
be
very
disappointing
for
us,
as
a
committee,
in
terms
of
our
influence,
which
it's
got
to
be
so
we've
got
to
keep
a
track
on
that,
so
so,
with
that,
I
think
we'll
we'll
probably
need
to
talk
to
louise
and
bring
a
formal
sort
of
proposal
at
the
next
meeting,
which
is
isn't
actually
that
far
away.
A
E
Yeah,
the
only
other
thing
then
chair
is
in
terms
of
moving
the
date
back
for
what
was
proposed
to
be
the
october
meeting
of
committee
into
november,
and
looking
at
the
council
calendar
then
probably
monday.
The
23rd,
I
think
it
is
of
november,
would
be
the
most
appropriate
date
to
move
back
to,
because
the
week
before
is
very
busy
with
scrutiny
boards
and
the
like,
and
many
of
the
committee's
members
are
tied
up
with
commitments.
There.
A
I
suspect
there'll
be
a
challenge
around
posting
two
live
broadcasts.
I
don't
know
if
we
we've
done
that
before
no
okay-
I
I
don't
know
if
people
have
their
diaries
to
hand,
but
I
think
if
you,
if
you
make
a
note
of
that
and
send
me,
I
think
hopefully
that
will
be
achievable.
A
Good,
so
with
that,
I
can't
see
anyone
else
indicating
it.
Oh
paul
trussville.
F
It's
just
a
very
minor
point
about
the
conductor
meetings,
but
I
just
wonder
whether
victoria
and
louise
would
care
to
consider
using
a
headset
and
a
microphone
and
because
the
sound
quality
from
both
of
them
was
not
good
and
councillor
peter
harond.
The
reason
we
couldn't
hear
you
is
that
you've
got
your
microphone
pointing
backwards
behind
your
head.
A
A
I
recognize
we've
had
some
robust
conversations
today
and
I
do
think
that
is
helpful
and
I
do
think
there
is
a
place
for
strong
disagreement
and
expression
of
views
and
that
I
wouldn't
want
any
other
way.
So
I
really
appreciate
appreciate
that,
and
that
is
how
we'll
make
the
council's
governance
arrangements
better.
So
thank
you
very
much.