►
From YouTube: Leeds City Council - Scrutiny Board (Environment, Housing & Communities) Call In - 2 December 2020
Description
No description was provided for this meeting.
If this is YOUR meeting, an easy way to fix this is to add a description to your video, wherever mtngs.io found it (probably YouTube).
A
Okay
right
welcome
to
the
call-in
meeting
for
the
screen
board,
environment,
housing
and
communities
more
on
the
detail
behind
that.
But
I
I
would
like
to
start
today's
meeting
by
saying
a
thank
you
to
somebody
who
is
leaving
the
council
at
the
end
of
december.
A
Karen
schofield,
who
is
known
to
all
of
us,
is
leaving
the
council
after
30
years
of
work
and
with
this
council.
I
first
got
to
know
curtin
in
1998
when
I
joined
the
council
when
she
was
in
a
small
room,
and
I
had
to
go
and
ask
for
rations
from
her
for
paper
and
various
other
things,
and
that
was
when
I
first
got
to
know
karen
and
she
guided
me
through
my
first
tensive
steps
in
council
over
the
years.
A
I've
got
to
know
her
and
for
those
present
may
be
aware
that
one
of
her
passions
is
she's,
a
petrol
head
and
mr
schumacher
is
her.
Hero
she's,
never
quite
had
any
british
person
as
her
hero,
but
mr
schumacher
is
her
hero,
but
seriously
khan.
On
behalf
of
everyone.
A
Can
I
thank
you
for
your
effort
that
you've
given
to
the
council
over
the
years
and
the
patience
that
you
have
shown
when
some
of
us
members
get
a
little
bit
irate
and
a
bit
wanting
things
done
yesterday
and
you
responded
to
it
in
the
manner
that
we
know
you
do
so
on
behalf
of
the
council
and
everybody
else.
Thank
you
very
much
for
your
time
with
us.
B
A
Problem
no
problem
at
all
right:
we
now
move
to
the
more
formal
parts
of
the
meeting.
So
what
I'd
like
to
do?
First
of
all
is
ask
each
member
of
the
board
to
introduce
themselves.
So
I'm
councillor,
barry
anderson.
I
chair
this
particular
scrutiny
board
and
I
represent
ireland
worth
the
award
councillor.
Akhtar
doesn't
seem
to
be
in
so
counselor
bentley.
A
And
we
have
a
sub
council
growing,
can't
make
it
today.
So
his
substitute
for
today
is
councillor
denise
reagan.
So
councillor
reagan.
B
A
Now
I'm
now
going
to
go
on
to
the
other
people
who
will
be
playing
the
major
part
in
terms
of
the
debate
that
will
go
on
so
first
of
all,
councilor
robert
finnegan,
who
is
the
leader
of
the
mbis
and
the
person
who's
brought
forward.
This
call-in
today.
A
Mr
james
rogers,
thank
you.
Georgian
protest
director
of
community
environment,
mr
shaheed,
mahmood.
B
Good
afternoon
michael
everett,
head
of
finance,
supporting
communities
and
environment
directorate.
C
A
Well,
rob's,
not
here
so
angela
brogdon
hi,
angela
brogdon
principal
scrutiny,
advisor
right.
So
can
I
hand
over
now
to
look
at
items
one
two,
six
to
becky
atherton!
Please.
B
Thank
you,
chair
number
one.
There
are
no
appeals.
Number
two.
There
are
no
items
requiring
the
exemption
of
the
public
number
three.
There
are
no
late
items
number
four
declarations
of
disclosable
pecuniary
interest.
Can
I
now
invite
elected
members
to
declare
any
disclosable
pecuniary
interests
I'll
take
silence
as
their
there
being
none
number
five?
Apologies.
B
Apologies
have
been
received
from
councillor
gruen
and
councillor
sharp,
and
we
have
councillor
reagan
and
councillor
renshaw
substituting
and
then
number
six
calling
of
a
decision
briefing
paper.
This
paper
outlines
the
calling
process
and
highlights
the
following
key
points.
In
particular,
this
call-in
meeting
is
specific
to
the
report
considered
by
the
executive
board
on
the
18th
of
november
2020.
B
Issues
outside
of
this
decision,
including
other
related
decisions,
may
not
be
considered
as
part
of
the
board's
decision
regarding
the
outcome
of
the
calling.
In
conclusion,
the
board
may
pursue
one
of
two
courses
of
action:
option:
one
release
the
decision
for
implementation
option
two
recommend
that
the
decision
be
reconsidered.
B
A
Thank
you,
okay,
so
I
would
now
like
to
invite
council
robert
finnegan
to
outline
the
reasons
why
this
call-in
has
been
requested.
D
D
D
My
representations
this
afternoon
looks
to
do
that
to
identify
a
way
forward
that
saves
this
valuable
community
asset,
but
also
delivers
to
lee
city
council
some
of
the
savings
it
needs
to
find
in
these
difficult
and
challenging
times.
We
all
know
that
next
year's
budget
is
the
most
challenging
we
are
ever
likely
to
face.
D
D
A
bit
of
background
to
the
community
that
relies
on
the
lucian
community
centre,
the
community
the
center
serves
is
the
most
deprived
community,
not
only
in
mali,
but
across
all
four
wards.
In
the
outer
south
area
committee,
as
in
robinhood
rothwell,
molly,
north
and
molly
cell,
there
are
neighborhoods
adjacent
to
the
center
that
have
levels
of
deprivation
similar
to
the
most
deprived
communities
in
leeds
council.
Cooper
who
represented
the
area
knows
a
community
in
the
center.
Well
can
confirm
this.
D
Its
closure
would
batter
these
sections
of
our
community
most.
I
think
everyone
will
agree.
They've
already
taken
a
hell
of
a
battering
up
today,
perhaps
too
much
of
a
battering,
and
what
would
closure
achieve?
The
economic
case
is
not
so
strong.
The
service
review
report,
which
proposes
closure
of
the
lewisham
community
centre
states.
Its
running
costs
are
forty
thousand
and
twenty
pounds
a
year.
D
This
includes
22
122
716
for
staffing
costs.
We
believe
this
is
inaccurate.
Despite
two
attempts
to
qualify
where
the
staffing
costs
come
from,
officers
have
been
unable
to
do
so.
We
believe
this
is
a
historical
figure
to
cover
the
resident
caretaker,
who
hasn't
been
at
lewishim
for
over
five
years
and
as
such,
can
be
disregarded.
D
D
The
rates
bill
is
over
four
thousand
pounds
a
year
which,
if
it
were
taken
over
by
a
charitable
community
group,
will
be
subject
to
relief.
Possibly
up
to
ninety
percent
income
is
around
four
thousand
pounds
a
year,
so
the
savings
from
closure,
with
the
most
optimistic
assessment,
is
likely
to
be
less
than
thirteen
thousand
pounds
a
year,
such
a
small
saving,
which
would
have
a
significant
community
impact
on
the
young,
the
old,
the
disabled.
It's
not
a
decision.
I
would
be
prepared
to
support-
and
I
suspect
other
colleagues
would
agree
with
me
about
this.
D
A
community
group
lewisham
action
group
is
being
set
up
to
explore
the
options
to
run
the
centre
on
behalf
of
the
community,
the
group
which
includes
center
users,
local
residents,
local
town,
council
councillors
and
other
stakeholders.
Mr
hold
a
meeting
via
zoom
in
december,
to
set
up
a
properly
constituted
group
to
discuss
with
lee
city
council
an
asset
transfer
or
similar
approach.
D
I
have
faith
in
such
a
process.
It
worked
well
at
both
cherwell
astanopal
and
in
drinkington,
where
community
groups
took
over
the
running
of
a
building
successfully
cutting
costs
and
increasing
use.
I
have
faith
in
the
community
lives
around
lewisham
community
centre
that
they
can
do
the
same.
What
is
the
offer?
D
We're
asking
the
scrutiny
board
to
recommend
that
lewisham
community
centre
is
removed
from
the
closure
list
for
12
months,
while
we
develop
a
sustainable,
a
long-term
solution
to
running
the
centre.
Molly
town
council
has
indicated
that
it
will
support
half
of
the
running
costs
during
this
year
around
seven
thousand
pounds.
D
So
the
cost
elite
city
council
to
remove
lewisham
community
centre
for
that
year
would
be
around
seven
thousand
pounds
a
small
price
to
pay
to
explore
the
options
of
a
sustainable
future,
as
well
as
retaining
an
important
community
asset
for
the
most
deprived
community
in
the
molly
area.
It
gives
a
break
to
the
young,
the
old
and
the
disabled
at
a
time
when
they
all
feel
under
significant
degrees
of
pressure.
D
A
Hi
we've
had
a
request
to
remove
this
from
the
list.
Do
we
as
a
scrutiny
board,
actually
have
that
power?
If
we
were
minded
to
do
so,
or
are
we
limited
into
what
we
can
actually
look
at
legally
today,.
B
You
can't
attach
any
caveats
to
the
decision
to
release
for
implementation.
The
only
power
the
scrutiny
board
has
today
is
to
take
one
of
the
two
options
on
the
table
so
either
to
release
for
implementation
or
to
refer
back
to
decision
makers
for
for
for
reconsideration.
B
The
scrutiny
board
can
informally
make
whatever
recommendations
as
part
of
this
discussion
it
may
wish
to,
but
in
terms
of
the
power
to
actually
formally
recommend
the
exec
board
does
something
that
doesn't
exist
within
the
remit
of
this
meeting.
A
That's
right,
it's
just
so
that
members
have
got
that
as
the
background
so
that
they
can
comment
accordingly.
So
with
that
said
members,
anybody
would
like
to
ask
any
questions
of
counselor
finnegan
to
clarify
any
points
that
he's
made
councillor
harland.
B
A
Now
I'll
call
in
shaheed
just
to
confirm
that,
but
yes
shahi,
can
you
just
confirm
that
that
is
the
case?
Please.
E
That
is
correct.
The
service
review
report
recommendation
said
to
approve
the
proposal
going
out
to
consultation
as
part
of
the
council's
medium-term
financial
strategy
and
preparation
for
setting
the
21-22
budget.
B
D
D
I
think,
if
it's
locally
run,
we
can
deal
with
a
local
booking
process
which
will
work
much
more
efficiently
and
you'll
have
that
direct
sort
of
access?
Plus
we
look
at
the
charging
policy
at
this
particular
point.
Groups
are
put
off
because
it
costs
too
much
to
use
the
facility
at
this
particular
point.
That's
the
feedback
that
we're
getting
from
them
at
this
stage.
It's
a
part
and
parcel
of
a
sort
of
community
takeover
is
to
address
that
to
address
its
under
usage,
I
mean
we're
not
we're
not.
D
We
we're
not
in
any
shape
waveform
denying
the
fact
that
it
needs
to
be
used
better,
but
some
of
that
resistance,
we
think,
is
central
bookings
which
are
challenging
often
and
the
fact
that
the
costings
and
the
costings
policy
don't
really
help
those
who
perhaps
need
a
bit
of
a
help
or
a
bit
of
support.
D
And
if
I
can
just
comment,
if
I
may,
on
on
the
actual
the
actual
recommendation
recommendation,
the
service
review
report,
which
is
in
front
of
me,
says
members
are
requested
to
consider
the
proposal
to
implement
the
efficiency
savings
identified
in
the
report,
including
the
closure
of
lewisham
community
centre,
myself,
allison,
bywater,
etc.
It
doesn't
actually
say
to
go
out
to
consultation
happen.
If
it
did
do
I'd,
be
less
worried.
D
The
report
says
to
consider
the
proposal
it
doesn't
say
to
go
out
to
consultation,
would
have
been
slightly
more
satisfied,
but,
as
colleagues
will
be
aware,
at
the
point
where
you
know
there
is
a
proposal
foreclosure,
it's
often
very
difficult
to
get
the
community
to
accept
that.
That's
not
a
done
deal
and
the
best
way
of
removing
that
cynicism
that
exists
with
them
is
just
to
remove
it.
Give
it
12
months,
let's
see
what
we
can
do
with
it.
A
Because
that
issue
has
been
raised
about
the
consultation
I'll
now
call
on
mr
rogers
to.
A
B
I'm
struggling
with
my
connection,
which
is
the
reason
why
I'm
not
putting
the
video
on
so
if
it's
still
working
just.
A
We'll
call
we'll
be
able
to
clarify
and
quiz
the
officers
more
clearly
about
that
when
we
go
over
to
their
their
side
of
things,
so
counselor
bentley.
C
Thanks
chair
and
thanks
robert
for
your
presentation,
just
a
bit
more
clarification.
C
Can
you
just
tell
us
how
many
groups
are
currently
using
the
I
don't
mean
currently
using
because
no
one's
using
it
at
the
moment,
but
but
in
either
pre
or
post
covid?
How
many
groups
will
be
using
this
community
center
and
sort
of
a
bit
of
a
follow-up
to
that
as
part
of
the
plan?
If
as
much
as
you
know
about
it,
and
perhaps
it's
more
question
processes,
what
plans
are
being
made
to
accommodate
those
groups
if
the
community
center
were
closed.
D
Thanks
thanks
councillor
bentley
at
this
particular
point,
we
have
two
separate
dance
groups
using
it
regularly.
We
have
the
youth
service
who
do
two
sessions
out
of
lewisham
at
this
particular
point,
and
we
have
a
visually
impaired
group
that
use
it
at
this
stage.
So
we
have
four
separate
groups
if
you
like
disabled
group,
two
children
and
young
persons
based
groups
and
the
youth
service
in
terms
of
the
alternatives.
D
Certainly
offices
are
proposing
molly
town
hall.
If
anybody
knows
the
location
of
the
louisiana
center
and
the
location
of
mollytown,
although
that's
the
right
hike
up
and
it's
not
in
the
heart
of
the
community,
and
it's
not
necessarily
the
best
of
buildings,
if
you
would
choose
to
dance
or
if
you
are
visually
impaired
as
well,
those
are
the
alternatives
that
we
know
actually
exist.
There
isn't
another
community
center,
formal
community
center
elite
city
council
community
center
in
the
molly
south
area.
This
is
the
last
one
standing
if
you
like,.
A
Now
so
that
we
okay,
mr
mahmoud,
wanted
to
come
in,
I
would
like
to
try
and
get
all
the
questions
from
the
members
first
of
all,
so
that
we
can
then
revisit
things
so
counselor
can
and
then
counselor
collins.
B
Thank
you,
chair
council
finnegan,
before
bringing
this
for
a
call
in.
Has
there
any
conversation
being
taken
with
the
officers
on
the
executive
member
just
for
for
qualification.
D
Please
well
at
this
particular
point,
we've
had
a
long
discussion
at
community
committee.
Now,
as
we
understood
the
process,
community
committee
are
the
ones
who
should
be
taking
decisions
on
community
centres
because
the
decision-making
process
is
delegated
down
to
community
committee.
So
it's
certainly
been
discussed
at
community
committee.
At
this
a
particular
point,
I
think
there
was
a
full
and
robust
exchange
at
community
committee.
D
At
that
stage,
the
community
committee
subgroup
was
somewhat
uncomfortable
with
the
fact
that
they
weren't
consulted
by
anybody
about
the
proposals
at
that
particular
stage,
so
we're
trying
to
work
our
way
through
the
appropriate
structures,
community
committee
and
presumably
to
this
particular
body,
for
a
discussion
then,
presumably
on
from
that
to
the
executive
member
at
that
stage.
D
So
at
this
particular
point,
I
think
this
has
been
in
the
public
domain
over
the
last
two
or
three
weeks
we're
trying
to
work
through
the
processes,
as
we
understand
them
in
terms
of
the
sort
of
structures
that
we're
supposed
to
go
through
rather
than
side
step.
Community
committee
try
and
run
it
through
community
committee,
which
is
doing
at
this
stage.
This
is
another
opportunity
for
us
to
have
this
decision
reconsidered.
A
B
Thank
you
good
job
council
finnegan.
If
this
proposal
is
that
it
should
go
to
consultation
and
that's
what's
been
approved,
what
are
you
actually
trying
to
achieve
by
calling
it
in?
Is
it
just
to
highlight
this
so
that
the
consultation
has
more
response,
or
do
you
really
feel
that
it's
more
appropriate
not
to
have
a
consultation
with
the
local
community
and
to
do
it
behind
closed
doors.
D
Right
now,
my
word
is
that
once
things
get
on
lists,
it's
very
difficult
to
get
them
off
those
lists
and
to
go
out
to
your
community
and
say
yeah.
This
is
on
a
proposed
closure
list
at
this
stage.
D
The
council
is
purely
going
through
the
formalities
and,
what's
the
point,
so
I
think
what
I'm
trying
to
say
at
this
particular
stage
is
if
we
were
to
accept
that
this
should
be
referred
back
for
reconsideration,
give
us
a
year.
If
it
fails,
it's
finnegan's
failure.
Nobody
can
take
responsibility
other
than
myself
at
that
particular
point.
D
It
costs
you
seven
grand
to
actually
do
that
because
the
town
councils
put
it
in
the
other
half
and
it
gives
that
community,
which
is
pretty
much
a
community
that
has
little
faith
in
the
central
government,
local
government,
all
the
rest
of
it.
That
they've
got
a
genuine
sporting
chance
of
pulling
this
off.
If
he's
on
a
list,
it's
on
a
proposed
closure
list
at
this
particular
point,
then
to
galvanize
that
community
get
them
involved
in
any
sort
of
process
is
a
lot
more
difficult
when
you're
already
on
the
list
for
closure.
D
D
We'd
look
at
localizing,
it
we'd
look
at
the
charging
policy,
we'd
look
at
what
we
can
do
to
encourage
more
use
of
the
center
amongst
all
sections
of
the
community
in
that
area,
but
I
think
it
is
a
devil
of
a
task
to
get
them
motivated
and
enthused
about
the
proposal.
If
it's
and
it's
on
a
closure
list,
I
think
it's
a
foregone
conclusion.
That's
a
very
difficult
thing
to
pull
off.
B
B
I
can
appreciate
what
you're
saying
about
it
should
never
have
gone
on
the
list
in
the
first
place,
but
I'm
just
concerned
that
psychologically
it
might
actually
be
worse
now
to
take
it
off
the
list,
because
people
will
think
that
there's
no
threat
to
that
that
community
venue
can
you
not
see
that
that
could
be
an
issue.
D
Well,
it
would
be,
but
what
we're
asking
is
it's
taking
off
for
12
months,
so
the
community
at
that
particular
point
can
see
that
the
city
council
is
giving
them
an
opportunity.
It
was
an
opportunity
to
come
up
with
a
sustainable
solution.
It's
not
big,
it's
not
a
an
open
check
for
it
to
go
on
forever
and
ever
and
ever
they
know
that
the
clock
is
ticking,
but
that
clock
is
ticking
in
a
fair
way
in
a
way
that
is
less
pressured
than
good
lord.
D
If
we
don't
pull
this
off,
we're
going
to
end
up
with
a
sheeted
up
building
or
it
drops
or
whatever
it
might
actually
be.
So
I
think
there
is
some
mileage
in
saying
to
the
community.
Okay,
we
all
of
us
counselors
you,
the
town,
council,
weather
all
partners.
I've
got
12
months
to
come
up
with
a
better
proposal
than
this,
and
I
think
that
galvanizes
people
it
gives
them
an
opportunity
to
reflect
on
potential
alternatives.
So
it's
not
an
open
check,
we're
not
saying
leave
it
open
forever
and
ever
and
ever
that's
just
doing.
D
Nothing
is
not
an
option.
We
accept
that
entirely
utterly,
but
just
give
us
a
bit
of
time
where
we
can
get
that
community
galvanized.
We
can
give
them
hope
and
we
can
come
back
with
a
proposal
and
we
fail
it's
it's
our
failure.
It's
the
community's
failure.
It's
not
the
city
council's
failure,
they've
bent
over
backwards
to
be
reasonable
and
accommodating.
A
B
Thank
you
chair,
so
councillor
finnegan
I've
got
a
couple
of
points
that
I've
been
listening
to.
So
obviously
we
think
that
it's
going
to
go
out
to
consultation
to
the
community.
So
have
you
got
plans
in
place
to
actually
galvanize
your
community
to
make
sure
that
their
voices
are
heard?
You
know
if
you've
got
avenues
in
place
to
and
you're
ready
to
go
knowing
that
that
will
happen.
B
B
B
If
you're
already
saying
that
you
know
the
groups
are
limited
in
their,
the
income
in
the
area
is
limited
in
there
you
know
you're
going
to
set
up
a
a
group
to
take
it
on
as
an
asset
transfer
and
move
it
forward.
So
I
think,
there's
a
lot
of
you
know
if
but
wise
and
wares
there
and
ultimately,
if
in
you
know
it
does
go
down
the
route
that
you
buy
yourself
12
months,
the
12
months
comes
to
the
end,
we're
no
further
forward.
B
D
Anyways-
let's
even
work
through
that,
if
this
committee
we're
so
minded
to
refer
it
back
to
exec
board
to
buy
as
another
year
and
I'll
be
taking
off
the
list.
At
this
particular
point,
I
will
pledge
now
that
the
town
council
will
cover
the
13
grand
at
this
particular
stage.
So
there's
an
offer
not
that
I'm
here
to
barter,
but
there
we
are
there's
an
offer
on
the
table
for
this
particular
scrutiny
to
reflect
upon
we'll
cover
that
as
an
offer.
D
D
The
issue
at
this
particular
point
is
that
people
are
put
off.
Why
are
they
put
off
because
central
bookings
doesn't
work
anywhere
near
as
well
as
it
should
do,
and
it
is
almost
impenetrable
for
you
to
be
able
to
find
out
how
to
actually
get
the
room
booked?
How
what
is
going
to
cost
you
all
those
other
issues?
So
there's
an
issue
there
at
a
point
where
you've
got
some
local
control,
your
side
steps
central
bookings,
and
that
makes
that
process
much
easier.
D
On
top
of
that,
we've
got
groups
who
are
keen
on
looking
to
explore
the
options
of
actually
using
the
center,
but
they
find
the
present
charging
policy
is
unaffordable.
Now,
if
it's
unaffordable
at
this
particular
point,
they
generally
don't
go
anywhere
because
there
isn't
an
alternative.
You
can't
trail
up
to
the
town
hall,
because
the
town
hall
is
even
more
expensive,
expensive
and
unaffordable
at
this
particular
stage.
D
So
the
option
would
be
for
us
to
look
at
what
we
can
do
to
increase
usage.
We
think
that
that
is
a
nail
done.
There
are
no
other
groups
that
we
know
want
to
use
it.
If
we
get
a
reasonable
local
based
charging
policy,
then
I
think
the
income
will
increase
at
that
particular
stage.
I'm
absolutely
sure
my
colleagues
at
the
town
council
would
look
to
be
able
to
provide
whatever
help
and
support
is
necessary
if
there
was
a
shortfall,
as
with
my
colleagues
on
community
committee.
D
D
If
that's
the
case,
then
there's
going
to
be
a
cost.
Whatever
way
we
actually
look
at
it.
Now
we
have
to
figure
out
new
ways
of
doing
things,
we're
in
the
toughest
financial
bind
we've
ever
found
ourselves
in
at
this
particular
point.
The
community
has
to
accept
that
if
it
feels
that
these
assets
are
valuable,
it
needs
to
be
part
and
parcel
of
the
role
of
resolving
those
particular
challenges.
D
The
alternative
to
look
and
hope,
somebody's
going
to
pick
up
the
slack,
whether
that's
the
council
or
the
town
council,
or
anybody
like
that-
is
unrealistic
and
unachievable.
So
12
months,
the
offer
is
there
on
the
table,
let's
see
what
we
can
do
with
it
and
if
it
fails
at
that
particular
point,
it's
a
failure
of
everyone,
but
it's
it
would
only
be
a
failure
if
we
believe
that
that
community
isn't
likely
to
meet
those
challenges,
and
I
I
personally
think
that
if
we
give
them
hope
they
will
meet
those
challenges.
B
Thank
you,
chair
yeah,
so
councillor
finnegan,
if
you'd
been
consulted
at
an
earlier
stage,
do
you
feel
that
you'd
have
come
up
with
these
proposals
with
the
potential
to
save
all
this
angst
and
everything
else.
D
B
Thank
you
chair,
I'd
just
like
to
add.
I
think
council
finnegan
probably
needs
reminding
that
it
was
discussed
at
the
outer
south
community
committee,
and
it
was
made
clear
in
there
that
it
was
a
consultation
and
the
reason
why
there
was
some
confusion
was
because
it
had
been
the
community
center
sub-group
meeting
the
same
morning
as
it
was
the
outer
south
community
committee.
B
So
maybe
council
finnegan
just
needed
reminding
that
yes,
he
was.
It
was
made
aware
that
it
was
a
consultation
exercise
on
on
top
of
that.
I'd
just
like
to
ask:
is
there
a
local
community
group
that
already
supports
that
that
does
fundraising
events
to
contribute
towards
the
outgoing
costs
of
that
center.
D
A
A
Thank
you.
Okay,
christopher
blackburn,
then
comes
to
bentley.
B
Yes,
thank
you
chair,
I'd
like
to
know
when
you
say
that
a
group
are
you
hoping
that
a
group
will
take
it
on
as
a
as
a
community
as
a
transfer?
B
Would
this
have
been
done
if
it
hadn't
been
if
it
hadn't
been
proposed
for
closure?
This
is
just
being
done
because
you
might
lose
it.
In
other
words,.
D
I
suspect
the
community
more
galvanized
five
years
ago
there
was
a
similar
consultation
where
there
was
suggestion
of
closure
at
that
particular
point,
it
didn't
happen
at
that
stage.
It
was
found
that
it
wasn't
appropriate
for
whatever
reason-
and
I
think
that
was
a
that-
was
a
failed
opportunity
and
I
think
the
community
perhaps
assumed
incorrectly
and
unless
you
understand
local
government,
finance
and
other
such
things.
I
perhaps
that
that
it
will
always
be
there,
because
it's
always
been
there.
It's
been
there
for
donkeys
years.
It
will
always
be
there.
D
I
think
people
perhaps
are
more
aware-
and
I
think
the
pandemic
has
perhaps
helped
them-
focus
their
minds
on
the
fact
that
only
through
that
collective
effort,
only
through
community
engagement,
the
community
taking
on
some
of
that
responsibility
are
things
going
to
survive,
and
I
think
they've
they've
grasped
that
point
and
it's
a
very
difficult
point
to
actually
get
asked,
because
the
community
has
always
had
it's
always
been
there.
Somebody
else
has
always
run
it.
They've
never
had
to
do
anything
more
about
it.
B
Yes,
please
can
you
tell
me,
then,
council
finnegan,
if
you
believe
that
there
is
groups
or
people
in
your
community
center
now
that
would
take
it
on
that.
You
know
they
think
there's
a
chance.
Is
there
some
people
out
there?
Is
it
a
decent
proposition.
D
We've
got
two
dance
groups:
both
of
them
are,
are
well
organized
and
well
focused,
and
I
think
they
they'd
be
devastated
if,
if
this
community
asset
is
withdrawn,
so
there
are
people
in
there
that
we
know
are
doers
who
are
able
to
help
and
support
and
raise
funds
on
all
those
other
issues,
the
us
service.
It
goes
without
saying
if
the
youth
service
goes
at
this
particular
point,
they
have
no
no
place
locally
to
deal
with
the
challenges
that
they
face
and
they're
doing
an
excellent
job.
D
The
youth
service
do
an
excellent
job
in
morley,
so
they
bring
something
to
the
port
and
they
tend
to
to
have
ideas
and
proposals
and
young
people
who
can
represent
their
views
as
well
as
part
and
parcel
that
that
issue
the
disabled
group
that
actually
uses
it
yeah.
I
think
we've
got
people
there
who
are
well
motivated,
who
want
to
get
involved
talking
to
the
silver
surfers
group
guy,
who
has
suggested
that
already
is
very
active
in
other
community
groups.
D
He's
part
and
parcel
of
the
molly
literature
festival
he's
the
treasurer,
as
it
happens,
he's
the
right
man
for
the
job.
At
that
particular
point,
he's
well
focused
and
well
motivated
the
mums
and
tots
group
basically
said
they
tried
to
engage
at
that
central
bookings
level
and
that
failed
miserably.
Now,
I'm
not
quite
sure
why,
whether
it
was
it
was
because
it's
impenetrable
or
the
costings
or
whatever
so
yeah.
There
are
other
groups
in
there.
We've
got
a
town
council,
that's
pretty
active.
D
We
have
local
town
councillors,
we're
actually
out
there
working
lewishime
at
this
particular
point:
planting
up
improving
a
memorial
down
there,
already
engaging
with
the
community
down
there
in
terms
of
bins
and
dog,
fouling
and
other
such
issues
so
yeah.
I
think
there
is
the
embryonics
of
a
group
that,
when
only
look
to
to
look
at
the
center,
but
also
look
at
improving
the
part,
it's
quite
a
lot
of
work
that
needs
to
be
done
down
at
the
park.
D
People
remember
the
sarah
harper
memorial,
that's
in
lewiston
park
at
this
particular
point,
there's
already
a
group,
that's
working
on
improving
that
and
bringing
a
mosaic
and
other
such
things
to
it.
So
yeah.
I
think
there
is
the
opportunity
there
is
a
galvanized
group
that
are
prepared
to
take
that
extra
step
and
take
the
responsibility
that
they
need
to
take
to
make
sure
that
we
have
a
sustainable
plan
for
the
center.
B
E
D
We've
got
stanno,
I
mean
I
agree
with
the
entirely
cancer
black,
but
we
have
stanhope
and
drigg
we're
good
examples
of
the
community
running
it
and
they
run
it
better
than
we
can
run
it
to
be
truthful.
The
community
tends
to,
for
all
sorts
of
reasons,
do
a
better
job
than
we
can
do
remotely.
If
you
like,
stanhope's,
been
an
absolute
success
story
that
went
through
an
asset
transfer
on
the
local
community.
Triggs
just
got
there
at
this
particular
point.
D
B
B
B
Yeah,
I
think
we
may
have
lost
the
chair.
I
think
we
have
yeah
there's
a
couple
of
people
just
dropped
out.
Would
members
like
to
nominate
another
colleague
to
continue
with
chairing,
or
would
you
like
me
to
see
if
I
can
get
counselor
back
cancer
anderson
back
in
first
councilman
graham
usually
takes.
B
D
A
A
C
Thank
you
chair.
My
my
phone
always
goes
off
when
I'm
about
to
speak.
So
that's
another
five
pounds
for
the
lord
mayor's
fund.
C
I
don't
know
who
that
was
sorry
to
come
back
for
a
second
bite,
but
you
didn't
actually
ask
me
to
after
I
asked
my
first.
C
Some
of
which
have
been
answered.
I
was
gonna,
ask
about
the
money,
because
if
we're
only
talking
about
seven
thousand
pounds,
I
was
going
to
ask
councilman
finnegan,
whether
ward
members-
or
you
know,
ward
based
initiative
or
something
could
could
bridge
that
gap,
so
that
the
his
he
could
move
forward
with
his
proposals
or
his
plan.
That
would
have
no
cost
to
talk
to
the
council
and
trish
asked
that
question,
and
we
got
that
answered
by
by
councillor
finnegan.
C
The
the
the
other
point
was,
I
think
we
we
may
be
getting
a
bit
hung
up
about
consultation.
So
if
I
could
just
get
clarification
from
councillor
finnegan
on
this,
if
the
executive
committee
reminded
to
change
its
decision
on
this
and
remove
lewisham
from
the
the
plan,
could
council
finnegan
confirmed
then
that
you
would
go
forward
with
trying
to
get
an
alternative
and
then
that
alternative,
as
well
as
the
council's
proposal
to
close,
if
it
still
wanted
to,
would
then
be
put
forward
for
consultation.
So
we're
not
stopping
the
consultation.
C
We're
we're
just
delaying
it
for
a
year,
so
that
the
community
can
see
what
the
alternatives
are
before
they
make.
A
decision
and
secondly
that
that's
first
part
of
the
question
second
part
of
the
question
is
again:
I'm
I'm
surprised.
We've
got
to
this
stage
because
I
had
an
identical
situation
almost
in
my
ward
in
in
meanwood,
which
is
probably
the
most
deprived
part
of
my
ward,
where
we
had
a
community
center,
which
was
not
performing
very
well,
didn't
attract
many
groups.
It
was
it
you
know
it.
C
It
was
on
its
way
out
in
a
way,
but
the
community
team
helped
us
find
somebody
to
to
run
that
and
it
where
it
then
got
taken
on.
I
think,
by
its
leads
spaces,
it
leads
spaces
from
from
memory,
the
the
the
the
third
sector
organization,
and
now
it's
a
thriving
community
center.
We
in
fact
they've
just
expanded
it
to
take
on
a
nursery
school
and
it
it
it's
turned
it
round.
But
that
was
the
council
itself
coming
forward
to
us
through
shaheed
and
his
team
saying.
How
can
we?
C
D
The
first,
with
the
first
question,
I
think
I
agree
with
you
entirely,
but
it
got
a
bit
way
later
with
it
at
this
particular.
The
second
question
is:
at
this
stage:
no,
we
nobody's
come
forward
and
say
well,
let's
explore
this
at
this
particular
point
and
in
officers
defense.
They
will,
I
suspect,
argue
at
this
particular
point:
we're
going
out
to
consultation,
we're
trying
to
get
it
through
exec
board,
all
those
other
issues.
D
At
this
stage
it
would
have
been
helpful
if
this
discussion
could
have
been
had
before
it
appeared
in
an
executive
board
report,
because
all
that
does
is
is
set
concerns
running
at
this
particular
stage.
If
we
had
that
discussion,
if
it
had
gone
through
community
committee,
come
through
the
community
center
sub
group,
then
we
could
at
least
have
that
discussion.
We
could
have
been
put
on
notice
even
right.
Okay,
at
this
particular
point,
we're
thinking
they're
closing
it.
What
are
you
going
to
do
about
it?
Giving
us
an
opportunity
at
this
stage?
D
First
thing
that
we
see
is
the
service
review
report,
and
it's
here
in
front
of
me
and
it's
unclear
if
I'm,
if,
if
I'm
being
fair,
it
is
at
least
unclear
because
it
it
talks
about
the
closure
of
the
community
center
along
with
alison
barrow
water
and
all
the
rest
of
it.
It's
not
entirely
clear.
It's
not
implicitly
clear
what
we're
thinking
we're
thinking
about
doing
this
and
again
the
other
side
of
the
coin
is
once
it's
on
a
list.
D
It's
a
challenge
to
get
the
community
to
accept
that
you
can
remove
it
from
that
particular
list
that
it's
not
a
foregone
conclusion.
We've
all
been
here,
we've
all
been
through.
You
know
these
propellers
are
in
there
and
at
the
point
where
you
try
and
get
the
community
involved
or
go
out
to
consult
him.
Their
view
is
well.
What's
the
point,
it's
already
a
foregone
conclusion,
the
camera's
going
to
close
it
anyway.
D
So
what's
a
bloody
point
and
that's
what
I'm
keen
on
avoiding
I'm
keen
on
looking
at
alternatives,
I
think
it's
got
a
sustainable
future.
It's
a
decent
center
people
know
it
it's
a
decent
center
at
this
particular
point.
Community
needs
to
get
galvanized.
The
community
needs
to
also
be
put
on
notice
that
they
need
to
be
part
of
the
solution
and
they
can't
expect
someone
else
to
do
it
all
for
them,
and
I
think
that's
that's
the
point
that
we're
at
at
this
particular
point.
D
B
I
thank
you,
chad,
just
a
couple
of
comments
really
not
not
questions.
Firstly,
I'd
like
to
say
that
the
service
do
a
marvelous
job
across
the
city,
not
just
in
mali,
and
I
know
they're
doing
an
excellent
job.
D
B
The
the
one
thing,
alan,
that's,
not
my
phone,
it's
my
husband's
by
the
way
this
is
mine,
just
I'll
just
go,
switch
that
off
hang
on.
B
About
that,
just
a
cautionary
tale.
Really
I've
been
a
recent
adoptee
to
the
directors
of
such
a
venue
in
bywater
as
well,
a
beautiful
old
school
that
has
a
nursery
attached
to
it.
A
wonderful
space
we've
used
it
for
community
committees
a
few
times.
This
unprecedented
pandemic
has
nearly
wiped
us
out
and
the
the
people
of
are
really
enthusiastic
to
get
involved
in
the
first
instance.
B
Thank
you.
It's
been
an
interesting
debate.
Robert.
Am
I
clear
understanding
that
it
was
on
a
list
five
years
ago
and
that
you've
had
five
years
notice
that
this
community
center
hasn't
been
performing
as
well
as
it
could
have,
and
it
did.
It
must
have
been
taken
off
the
list
because
it's
still
running
so.
B
Why
now,
do
you
think,
after
five
years
of
inactivity
that
the
community
is
going
to
get
up
and
grasp
it
by
the
nettle
and
that
you're
asking
for
yet
another
year,
so
that
you'll
have
been
on
six
years
notice
that
this
is
closing
and
from
what
I
can
gather
from
what
you're
telling
us?
You
have
five
groups
that
use
it
now
and
maybe
another
two
that
are
interested
in
it
in
the
future.
B
D
D
The
economy
is
dr
thriving,
we'll
be
in
a
situation
where
we
wouldn't
need
to
revisit
as
much
as
anything
else
I
put
my
hands
up
should
have
done
better
should
have
worked
harder
at
this
particular
point,
but
as
ever
with
these
things,
when
that
imminent
challenge
is
removed,
you've
always
got
a
million
other
challenges
that
you
you
stand
up
and
try
and
deal
with
at
that
particular
point
whatever
that
might
actually
be,
but
it's
important
perhaps
to
focus
on
we're
talking,
13
000
pounds
here
at
this
particular
stage
and
we've
got
four
thousand
pounds
is
coming
from
four
groups,
so
if
I
could
double
that,
I'm
up
to
eight
thousand,
what's
that
the
shortfall
at
that
particular
point
is
five
grand
now,
if
I
can't
get
community
committee
or
my
war
colleagues
or
the
town
council
interested
in
covering
that
and
providing
that
help
and
support.
D
So
I
need
to
do
twice
as
well.
At
this
point,
I'm
told
13.5
hours
gives
me
four
grams
if
I
can
double
that
up
to
26
hours
over
a
particular
week.
So
what
we're
looking
at,
possibly
just
over
five
hours
a
day
in
some
shapewear
form,
then
I
can
double
that
income.
That's
eight
grand!
I
have
to
find
five
thousand
from
other
sources
and
I'm
sure
that's
a
fairly
low
target,
that's
fairly
low
target
for
me
to
try
and
hit
now.
D
If
that's
the
case,
I'm
reasonably
confident
that
I
can
find
whatever
subsidy
I
need
to
find
over
the
two
or
three
years,
possibly
for
it
to
build
to
be
a
thriving
community
center.
Now
I
would
take
the
fine
example
of
stano
standouts
run
by
a
local
community
center
at
this
particular
point
was
due
to
close
way
back
when
taken
over
by
community
center.
It's
thriving
at
this
particular
point.
D
It
does
great
stuff
from
kitty's
football
through
to
derby
and
joan
to
a
church
user.
Every
man
and
his
dog
uses
it
at
this
particular
point
now
I
don't
believe
the
people
in
turwell
are
any
less
or
better
motivated
than
the
people
in
lewisham
and
to
suggest
in
any
shape
waveform
that
they
can't
pull
off
the
same
result
that
folks
insure
will
do,
would,
I
think,
be
insensitive.
I
think
they
can
do
at
this
particular
point.
They
are
put
on
notice.
We
are
putting
them
on
notice
at
this
particular
stage.
D
Use
it
to
lose
it
that's
pretty
much
it.
It's
been
the
same
with
post
offices
over
the
years.
It's
been
the
same
with
lots
of
other
facilities
over
the
years.
If
they
don't
use
it,
then
they
ultimately
lose
it,
but
I
think
there
are
real
opportunities
and
the
numbers
we're
talking
about
are
really
small.
D
Ultimately,
are
we
really
saying
that
this
council
is
likely
to
go
bankrupt
and
we
can't
support
the
elderly,
the
young,
the
disabled,
the
most
deprived
community,
morally,
to
a
tune
of
13
000
pounds
wherever
that
comes
from
whether
it
comes
from
community
committee
or
ward
members
or
the
town,
council
or
combination
those
factors?
Can
we
not
give
them
at
least
a
bit
of
hope
that
if
they
roll
up
their
sleeves,
they
can
achieve
achieve
great
things
they
can
achieve
the
same
as
a
community
in
stanhope
they
can
achieve
the
same
as
a
community
in
drinkington.
B
I'm
afraid
they
were
kicked
out
for
half
of
that
conversation,
but
I
think
from
what
I
can
gather
from
the
bit
I
was
at
the
end
of
the
beginning.
Is
what
council
finnegan's
been
saying
all
the
way
through
just
give
us
another
chance,
and
I
can
get
the
groups
together.
Is
that
my
understanding
there,
robert.
D
Well,
I
don't
think
we're
asking
for
another
chance
we're
asking
for
a
first
chance
a
primary
chance
at
this
particular
point.
So
yes
give
us
the
opportunity
at
this
particular
point,
and
at
that
point
your
colleagues
and
everybody
else
can
blame
me.
If
it
fails
there,
you
go
what
what
a
great
deal
you're
being
offered
at
that
point.
D
B
You
keep
going
on
about
this
community
centre,
that's
there
and
what
could
be
done
with
it?
What
couldn't
be
done?
It's
not
an
area
that
I'm
100
up
to
speed
with
everything.
That's
going
on
there
but
interesting.
What
council
gabriel
says
about
the
past
five
years
and
yourself
you
keep
saying
what
could
be
there,
who
could
be
using
it?
B
Why
they're
not
already
using
it,
but
my
main
question
is
because,
if
it's
not
on
the
list,
definitely
to
be
closed,
why
are
you
getting
people
wound
up
that
it
is
or
are
you
wanting
to
say
when
it
isn't
closed?
Oh
we
saved
it.
So
it's,
I
think,
really
I'd
like
to
know.
Where
are
you?
Where
can
you
me?
It
says
it's
going
to
be
closed.
Thank
you,
chair,
okay,.
D
Chair
the
best
council
meeting,
our
financial
challenge
service
review
report,
says
members
are
requested
to
consider
the
proposal
to
implement
the
efficiency
savings
identified
in
this
report,
including
the
closure
of
lewisham
community
center
molly
south.
It
goes
on
to
ellison
by
water
and
others.
So
it
says
that
in
the
service
review
report
might
be
badly
put,
it
might
be
suggesting
goes
out
to
consultation.
D
D
Why
take
up
the
golden
opportunity
anybody
who's
trying
to
book
anything
through
central
bookings
will
know
that
it
is
an
absolute
and
utter
challenge
and
that
people
are
put
off
because
it
is
impenetrable
on
top
of
that
they
will.
They
will
also
say
that
the
charging
policy
is
as
such
that
they
can't
actually
afford
and
taking
it.
This
is
the
most
deprived
community
in
the
molly
area.
We
can
understand
and
appreciate
why
they
can't
afford
those
charges
that
are
presently
levied
on
them.
D
They
do
try
and
use
the
lewisham
community
center,
so
I
think
at
this
particular
point
I
think
they're
too
poor
to
use
it
if
I'm
being
honest,
counselor,
graham
and
while
ever
we
continue
with
the
charging
policy.
That's
in
there
they're
going
to
continue
to
be
too
poor
to
be
able
to
use
it,
and
I
think
it's
regrettable
that
lee
city
council
has
a
charging
policy
that
is
not
accessible
to
those
who
are
on
some
of
the
lowest
incomes
in
our
community.
I'm
sure
you'd
agree.
B
Thank
you.
I
I
don't
think
I'd
be
very
say
using
the
word
par
to
describe
people.
It
will
maybe
in
a
lower
circumstance.
So
I
would
support
you
then
trying
to
get
the
community
to
take
over
the
community
centre.
It's
happened
in
lots
of
areas
across
the
city,
but
I
think
that
it
needs
and
what
you've
said
it
is
put
forward.
It
does
not
say
we
are
closing,
and
that
is
what
we're
hoping
we
don't
want
to
close
anywhere.
B
B
Thank
you
chair.
I'm
I'm
a
bit
puzzled
as
to
if
it's,
if
it's
down
for
a
consultation
period,
what
is
that
length
of
consultation
period,
and
is
that
not
the
same
as
what
you're
requesting
council
of
finnegan
in
having
to
take
off
a
list
that
that
isn't
possibly
there
and
and
and
to
consult
with
the
communities
to
find
out
what
they
want?
How
they're
going
to
do
it?
D
I
I'm
I'm
I'm
quite
comfortable
cancer
reagan.
If
officers
are
going
to
confirm
today
that
the
consultation
will
take
place
over
the
next
year,
in
which
case
we
can
drop
a
plan
at
that
particular
point.
If
somebody
can
give
me
that
reassurance,
we'll
all
go
home
and
have
an
early
lunch,
that's
great.
D
If
that's
what
is
being
offered
at
this
particular
point,
the
wedding
that
I
have
is
that
it's
going
to
be
a
consultation
that
needs
to
be
concluded
before
we
get
to
the
february
budget
meeting
at
this
particular
point
and
that
this
savings
is
already
lodged
in
there
now
to
do
a
consultation
when
we're
in
tier
three
is
a
struggle,
and
if
I
have
december
and
january
at
this
particular
point,
so
you've
got
christmas
on
all
the
associations
with
that
and
it's
going
to
be
concluded
for
the
budget
statement
that
we
will
all
be
debating
discussing
in
february
and
that's
slightly
different
I'd
like
it
off
that
particular
list.
D
Now,
if
somebody's
going
to
say,
don't
worry
council
finnegan,
we
are
not
going
to
close
it
before
2022.
We'll
have
that
length
of
consultation
at
that
particular
point.
We'll
have
a
london
look
at
it
in
2022,
fine
I'll
leave
you
all
at
this
particular
point
with
that
confirmation
and
I'll
comfortably
go
away
and
do
whatever
I
can
do
to
conclude
that
consultation
with
a
sustainable
plan.
D
But
that
is
not
what
I
am
being
told
and
maybe
so
obviously
can
assure
me
that
it
will
reign
open
until
2022,
in
which
case
fine,
let's
crack
on
let's
crack
on
with
a
plan.
My
worry
is.
This
is
lined
up
as
a
budget
saving
for
20
21
and
we
make
that
decision
in
february,
and
that
sounds
to
me
like
a
truncated
consultation
which,
to
be
honest,
my
community
would
just
see
as
bogus
that
you're
not
interested
two
months
and
you're
gonna
close
it
anyway.
So
I
get
involved.
D
A
A
B
If
I
can
ask
that
shaheed
leads
from
later
to
council
officer
point
of
view,
and
can
I
comment
after
shaheed's
maid
report,
please
yeah
thanks
yeah
all.
E
Yeah
thanks
councillors.
I
I
to
be
honest.
I
think
some
of
the
debate
that
members
have
had
has
kind
of
answered
some
of
the
questions
that
council
finnegan
and
they
were
raising
so
I'll
only
add
value
to
to
what's
already
going
on,
rather
than
repeat
that.
First
of
all,
I
would
say
that
what
counselor
finnegan
was
describing
as
consultation
processes
are
very
much
part
of
the
consultation
process.
E
That
officers
would
seek
to
engage
so
community
committees,
the
sorry,
the
community
committee,
the
subgroup
that
looks
after
community
centers
local
groups,
any
consultation
mechanism
that
local
members
may
set
up,
including
board
members
themselves
as
well,
because
this
is
in
the
outer
south,
sorry
out
of
south
community
committee
area
in
morley
in
mali
south.
I
would
also
say
that
my
team's
got
a
really
strong
record
in
consultation
and
a
really
good
strong
record
in
asset
transfer.
E
Council
bentley
gave
a
great
example
of
one
where,
where
we
had
quite
a
tight
timeline
at
council
bentley
in
terms
of
the
costs
of
that
particular
building
and
how
to
move
fairly
quickly,
we
also
know
what
good
looks
like.
So
we
can
very
quickly
establish
prior
to
budget
council
in
february
about
whether
this
would
fly
as
a
proposal
to
do
a
local
community
asset
transfer.
E
So,
for
example,
if
council
failing
was
keen
on
the
town
council
playing
a
part
in
that,
maybe
maybe
doing
the
asset
transfer
themselves,
we'd
be
more
than
happy
to
have
a
very
quick
conversation
about
the
viability
of
that.
But
we
do
have
a
very
good
track
record
of
being
able
to
assess
the
viability
of
those
kinds
of
proposals
fairly
quickly
and
certainly
could
be
able
to
do
that.
E
Well
before
the
the
february
timeline
for
budget
for
budget
council,
I
won't
comment
on
usage
and
cost,
because
I
know
son
and
richard
are
on
the
line
and
you
may
wish
to
bring
that
in.
But
I
would
just
clarify
I'll
just
just
crystallize
again
for
members
that
the
the
issue
here
is
that
it's
it's.
There
is
a
budget
challenge
for
the
organization,
and
this
is
part
of
the
response
to
the
overall
response
for
that
budget
challenge
that
the
council
faces.
E
There
is
a
budget
imperative
and
I
am
mindful
I
wasn't
in
the
box
seat
back
in
2014-15
when
the
initial
discussions
were
taking
place
about
this
center
and
its
position
at
that
time
when
it
was
challenged.
But
the
challenge
then
was
what
do
we
then
do
about
that,
and
we
had
plenty
of
time
time
between
2015
and
2020
to
secure
a
more
sustainable
proposition
and
usage
is
actually
plateaued,
if
not
decreased
in
that
time.
E
A
D
Hey
yeah,
yes,
thank
you
chair
councillor,
finnegan
is
quite
right.
I
mean
many
years
ago.
B
There
was
a
full-time
caretaker
attached
to
the
site
when
it
was
used
more
widely,
but
over
the
last
few
years
we've
done
lots
and
lots
of
work
on
reducing
the
level
of
inputs
needed
because
we
needed
to
try
and
do
our
best
to
maintain
that
all
these
community
centers
across
the
city
are
sustainable
and
viable.
So
we
looked
at
different
models
and
how
we
can
do
things
and
how
we
can
work
smarter
and
get
more
people
and
more
groups
onto
keyholders
and
things
like
that.
Now
we
can
reduce
the
resources
and
the
costs.
B
So
the
figures
in
the
report
are
based
on
1920
and
we
did
have
some
level
of
resource
in
their
caretaking.
I
agree
that
it
could
be
hidden
and
some
people
might
not
see
it,
but
there
are
some
statutory
things
that
we
need
to
do
and
that
we
need
to
discharge
our
statutory
duties
around
health
and
safety
checks
around
fire
safety
checks
around
the
grounds,
keeping
it
keeping
the
center
clean
and
tidy
and
doing
any
minor
repairs
yeah.
So
there
has
been
some
resource
around
that
for
1920
and
that's
what's
in
that
report.
B
Now,
we've
done
lots
and
lots
of
work
with
sand
and
his
team.
Over
the
last
couple
years,
I
say
around
sort
of
ways
to
ways
to
reduce
those
costs
and
and
council
finnegan
is
quite
right
that
the
levels
of
staffing
that
we've
been
put
into
the
center
have
been
declining
as
part
of
a
plan
to
reduce
those
costs.
So
the
caretaking
cost
for
2021,
we
would
predict,
would
be
11
11
195
pounds.
B
If,
if
we
were
to
continue
to
run
that
that
center,
there
is
already
a
water
meter
fitted
at
the
center
and
the
council,
cleaning
is
quite
right
that
the
four
thousand
pounds
down
for
water
is
very
high
as
part
of
the
action
plan
to
reduce
the
cost
of
these
centres
across
the
city.
We've
been
doing
a
huge
piece
of
work
around
what
the
utility
costs
are
for
these
centres
and
making
sure
that
he's.
B
It's
not
just
actuals,
but
not
just
estimates
that
we're
using
actuals,
and
there
is
an
issue
with
that
that
level
of
spend
on
the
water
at
lewis
park,
which
my
team
are
looking
at,
and
there
is
an
over
inflated
figure
that
4
000
pounds
should
potentially
be
some
running
costs
there.
B
But
obviously
there
is
some
issues
around
the
business
rates
that
would
still
need
to
be
paid
as
well.
So
there
would
be
some
still
some
significant
running
costs,
but
they
would
be
lower
than
what
was
in
in
in
the
report
and
spent
in
1920,
because
we
are
conscious
that
we
all
want
to
train
and
give
these
senators
the
best
chance
they
can
and
make
them
as
viable
as
viable
as
they
possibly
can.
C
C
It
was
20.5
hours
per
week
and
it
was
still
at
that
point
seen
in
scope
as
one
of
ten
buildings
that
were
being
looked
at.
What
the
future
would
be
at
that
point,
so
that
so
the
usage
has
actually
gone
down
in
the
in
that
period
and
that's
why
it
sort
of
become
in
scope
again
for
the
current
review
and
that's
it
really.
A
Okay,
thank
you
all
right,
michael
from
the
report
side
of
things,
is
there
anything
that
you
want
to
clarify
as
a
result
of
comments
made
by
counselor,
finnegan
or
anything
else.
You
would
like
to
add.
B
Finnegan,
it's
quite
right.
They
looked
at
the
the
service
review.
D
B
That
the
service
review
proposals
are
for
consultation
and
the
decision
itself
will
be
made
following
following
the
consultation
period.
Other
other
things
to
to
note
are.
B
Has
just
made
in
terms
of
the
costings,
so
if,
if
molly
town
council
was
to
take
it
over,
there
would
be
other
costs
other
than
the
ones
that
that
were
previously
stated.
So
it
is
a
bit
more
than
the
the
figures
that
were
quoted
earlier,
so
there's
the
13k
for
the
running
costs,
there's
a
16k
and
that
richard
has
just
talked
about
on
on
this.
On
the
staffing
side
of
things.
B
Business
rates
is
about
4k,
but
then
you
can
knock
off
the
the
income
together
with
additional
income
that
that
might
be
generated.
B
Yeah,
thank
you
chen.
I
know
I
apologize
if,
if
I
suddenly
freeze
on
the
screen,
because
the
connection's
not
great
today
for
any
of
us,
I'm
afraid
is
it
so
yeah.
Just
just
a
few
points
really
chair
and
I
have
to
say
that
councillor
finnegan,
you
know,
makes
some
really
relevant
points
about
the
community
in
in
mali
that
that
could
potentially
use
that
center.
B
I'm
really
pleased
to
hear
that
he's
he's
rallying
a
charge
in
that
area
to
try
and
ensure
that
the
keep
the
that
community
center,
and
indeed
him,
offering
financial
support
from
the
various
bodies
that
he's
associated
with
as
well
is.
I'm
I'm
pleased
to
hear
that
it's
not
just
words.
Actually,
it
sounds
like
councillor.
Finnegan
really
does
intend
to
to
utilize
all
his
resources
to
ensure
that
this
community
center
is
saved,
and
I
I
just
want
to
make
a
couple
of
points
really.
B
The
community
center
issue
of
trying
to
deal
with
the
the
extra
resourcing
that
it
cost
throughout
the
city
has
been
an
ongoing
issue
for
us
for
for
a
number
of
years,
and
indeed
the
consultation
on
all
community
centers
was
started
by
my
predecessor.
B
Councillor
gruen
who's,
not
with
us
today,
but
I'm
sure
he
would
have
would
have
spoken
of
doing
that
consultation
going
back
nearly
ten
years,
so
we
have
been
trying
to
bring
down
the
cost
of
community
centres
so
that
we
were
able
to
keep
them
for
the
best
use
of
the
community
and
a
number
of
examples
of
being
talked
about
today.
B
Whether
that's
been
really
successful
and
I'm
pleased
that
we've
been
able
to
do
that
along
with
ward
members
with
community
committees
and
with
third
sector
organizations
and
other
partners
in
the
city
to
make
sure
that
that
happens.
B
You
know,
and-
and
I
appreciate
that-
that's
being
done
in
mali
as
well,
robert
so
and
I
have
talked
to
councillor
gettings
a
number
of
times
about
the
community
centers
in
mali
that
that
that
he
was
dealing
with
at
the
time
and
we've
been
able
to
overcome
those
barriers
and
get
them
used
by
the
community
and
ran
by
the
community
as
well
for
for
the
benefit
of
the
community.
B
You
know,
and
the
other
point
also
that
councillor
finnegan
makes
about
consultation
being
a
done
deal.
Well,
I
can
assure
you
it's
not
a
done
deal.
Consultation
is
not
a
done
deal,
and
I
know
that
many
elected
members
on
the
call
use
consultation
very
politically.
I
have
to
say
to
say
that
it's
a
done
deal
and
that
that
they've
been
out
and
they've
saved
it.
B
I
I
could
quote
you
know
in
my
own
word,
temple
news
golf
course
that
was
said
that
we
were
going
to
close
it
and
we
insisted
it
was
a
genuine
consultation
and
the
genuine
consultation
won
out,
as
it
did
councillor
finnegan
for
you
in
the
past
five
years
ago,
with
this
self-same
center.
So
I
really
hope
that
you
do
galvanize
that
support.
B
I
think
the
consultation
period-
and
it's
very
clear
if
you
read
the
minute
of
the
executive
board,
is
extremely
clear-
that
the
decision
is
to
go
to
consultation
and
not
to
close.
So
it's
on
consultation
about
the
closure
of
these
centers.
So
I
hope
that
you
do,
you
know,
manage
that
rally
and
that
you
do
manage
to
bring
funds
to
enable
this
centre
to
remain
open,
because
leeds
city
council
are
facing
its
worst
ever
year.
B
In
budgetary
terms,
we
have
a
118
million
pound
gap
to
find
so
I'm
more
than
happy
for
any
member
of
scrutiny,
any
member
of
council
to
come
to
me
with
any
suggestions
of
what
the
alternative
might
well
be.
But
in
the
meantime
we
have
to
take
tough
decisions
and
we
also
have
to
go
to
consultation
with
people
and
residents
in
our
communities
about
how
we
best
save
those
that
amount
of
money
that
we
need
to
save,
which
is
what
this
proposal
is
for.
Sure.
A
C
Thank
you
chair
and
thanks
councillor,
cooper
and
and
the
team
for
responding
and
probably
answering
some
of
the
questions
I
had.
One
thing
I'm
still
not
clear
on,
and
it
would
be
helpful
is,
although
I
accept
that
it
is
a
genuine
consultation.
C
What
sort
of
period
are
you
looking
for,
and
is
it
something
that
is
that
something
you
could
discuss
with
council
finnegan
to
ensure
that
you
both
have
a
reasonable
time
to
to
make
an
assessment
and
the
other
side
of
that
question.
Part
of
the
same
question
really
is
in
terms
of
budget
of
assumptions,
because
the
exercise
that
and
the
numbers
that
were
brought
to
executive
board
on
the
proposals
for
the
21
22
budget
in
terms
of
budget
assumptions.
C
What
were
the
assumptions
about
lewisham
community
center
in
terms
of
if
any,
it's
closure
date
and
its
ongoing
costs
thanks
jeff.
E
Council,
I
just
missed
the
first
part
of
the
question.
I
heard
the
thing
about
the
budget
assumption
it
was
just
the
first
part
of
the
question
was.
C
Yeah
I'll
I'll
say
it
again,
thanks
shade!
Yes,
you
know
what
I
was.
What
I
was
asking
was
we're
talking
about
being
a
genuine
consultation
and
taking
everything
on
board,
so
how
much
time
has
been
allocated
for
the
consultation
and
would
officers
be
prepared
to
talk
with
councillor
finnegan
to
come
up
with
a
reasonable
time?
That
would
enable
you
both
to
make
sure
it
was
a
genuine.
E
E
Yeah,
let
me
just
if
I
can
just
come
back
on
the
consultation
period,
so
the
consultation
period
actually
started
on
the
18th
of
november
and
clearly
what
we've
been.
What
we've
had
to
do
is
just
to
wait
until
we've
had
this
discussion
here
here
today,
so
we
started
back
on
the
18th
of
november
and
then
we'll
run
to
early
february.
I
feel
that's
ample
time
to
get
an
indication
for
where
we
stand
in
terms
of
the
closure
of
this
particular
center.
We
obviously
need
to
get
moving
on
it.
E
We
need
to
start
consulting
the
users
think
about
viable
options
for
the
users,
if
that
particular
center
closes,
whether
there's
other
facilities
in
the
area
that
may
be
viable
for
them,
and
really
hear
them
out
around
that,
as
well
as
explore.
Some
of
the
things
that
council
finnegan
shared
with
us
today,
but
as.
E
On
we,
we
can
get
a
fairly
quick
assessment
as
a
team
about
how
viable
any
particular
plan
might
be
to
to
take
this
center
through,
for
example,
a
community
asset
transfer
fairly
quickly.
A
Okay,
councillor
bentley,
do
you
wish
to
come
back
again.
C
Yeah
thanks
chad
that
prompts
another
question.
Actually
what
well
a
follow-up,
but
also
you
didn't
shade.
You
didn't
cover
the
the
budget
assumptions
part
of
my
first
question,
but
if
I
just
follow
up
to
the
bit
you
said,
can
I
take
it
from
that,
then
that
you
will,
as
a
team,
as
a
community
team,
be
working
to
look
at
alternatives
with
with
counsellor
finnegan
or
to
assess
the
alternatives,
as
you
did
with
the
as
you
did
in
my
reward,
so
hopefully,
with
the
meanwood
community
centre.
E
E
C
Yeah
in
the
budget
assumptions
for
2122
that
were
brought
to
executive
board
over
the
last
couple
of
months,
is
there
an
assumption
for
the
future
of
lewisham
center
in
as
much
as
there's
an
assumption
there
that
it
will
close
or
it
will
have
some
costs,
whether
they
be
ongoing
costs
or
just
costs
of
security?
E
B
Yeah,
thank
you
shade.
Yeah,
the
budget
does
assume
the
savings
from
the
first
of
april,
and
it
does
assume
that
that
there
will
be
no
costs.
It's.
B
Proposals
for
a
community
centre,
but
it
does
assume
the
1st
of
april.
C
Yeah
thanks
for
that,
so
we
have
a
consult
just
so
I'm
clear.
We
have
a
consultation
about
its
future,
but
we've
assumed
that
it
won't
be
there
after
the
first
of
april,
we've
also
assumed
after
the
first
of
april.
It
will
not
have
any
costs,
although
we
know
that
there'll
be
costs,
whether
it's
being
used
or
not
in
terms
of
security
rates,
presumably
of
some
sort
and
all
those
other
things.
A
B
First,
I
think
cost
would
have
to
be
managed
out,
so
we
have
to
look
at
alternative
work
or
alternative
work
for
those
staff,
but
the
I
think
it
would
I'm
not
an
expert.
So
I'd
have
to
take
advice
from
collecting
asset
management,
but
if
the
building
was
no
longer
used,
it'd
be
transferred
into
void.
I
believe
I'm
not
exactly
sure
how
that
processing
those
costs
are
then
managed.
So
I
wouldn't
like
to
comment
and
tell
you
anything:
that's
not
factually
correct.
B
Thank
you,
chad,
I
think
just
to
be
clear
in
terms
of
council
bentley's
comment
that
all
proposals
that
have
been
to
executive
board
thus
far
are
just
exactly
that
proposals
and
therefore
they
don't
mean
anything
as
yet,
because
it
will
be
the
final
budget
papers
in
february
that
determine
what
the
budget
is
for
next
year.
If
the
consultation
process
concludes
that
we
should
do
something
different
and
there
will
be
different
figures
in
the
final
budget
papers
that
we
present
to
for
council
for
approval.
B
Thanks
chair,
but
this
is
what
you
get
when
you're,
not
in
the
same
room
together,
don't
yeah.
I
was
just
putting
raising
my
hand
to
make
the
point
that
james
rogers
just
made
that
actually
that
we
are
being
trying
to
be
really
open
and
transparent
about
what
we
are
looking
at
as
an
administration
that
we
might
have
to
consider
for
our
final
budget
report
proposal,
which
will
come
in
february.
So
I
just
wanted
to
make
that
clear
that
you
know
that.
B
So
far,
we've
talked
about
what
the
proposals
are,
that
we
are
actually
considering,
and
that
isn't
to
say
that
that
will
be
the
final
budget
when
it
comes
in
february
and
obviously
I'm
expecting
from
what
councillor
finnegan
said
that
he's
going
to
be
able
to
get
this
group
together,
get
the
finances
together
and
be-
and
you
know
enable
for
this
to
come
out
of
those
proposals.
That's
my
hope.
A
Okay,
thank
you
any
other
member
wanting
to
ask
any
questions
of
officers
before
I
bring
councillor
finnegan
in
okay,
I'll
bring
councillor
finnegan
in
now.
Thank
you
josephine
again,.
D
D
Are
you
bringing
any
cash
at
this
particular
stage,
because
the
impression
that
I
get
is
that
officers
are
just
desperate
to
get
rid
of
this
building
one
way
or
the
other
and
the
february's
deadline
so
you're
assuming
it's
reasonable
for
me
to
go
out
talk
to
my
community
and
come
up
with
well
thought
out
financial
programme
between
now
and
february?
D
So
if
we
take
out
that
we're
already
in
december
at
this
particular
stage,
it's
not
a
fair
assumption
to
actually
make
and
in
terms
of
of
the
offices,
there's
22
000
pounds
a
year
spent
on
this.
That's
over
400
quid
a
week.
Could
the
office
give
me
a
breakdown
of
how
that
400
pounds
is
spent
each
and
every
week
of
the
year
office
of
time?
D
Doing
what
at
this
particular
point,
I'm
slightly
bemused
at
this
particular
point-
and
I
haven't
heard
anything
from
any
officer
about
partnership
now
I
assume
lee
city
council
officers
accept
that
they
have
some
obligations
to
this
community,
which
is
the
most
deprived
in
the
marley
area,
and
certainly
the
impression
that
I'm
getting
I'm
sure
somebody
can
correct.
D
My
misconception
here
at
this
particular
point
is
that
instead
of
just
palming
this
off
they're
looking
for
genuine
partnership
where
the
city
council
is
putting
something
into
the
pot
in
terms
of
revenue
support
and
someone
else
is
putting
some
money
into
that
particular
pot.
Is
that
a
misconception?
D
E
Yeah,
first
of
all,
just
you
know,
officers
counselor
aren't
desperate
to
to
to
to
close
anything.
We
we
don't
make
decisions.
It's
councillors
that
make
decisions.
E
We've
been
asked
to
advise
around
all
of
this
work,
particularly
in
relation
to
to
community
centers,
and
we
would
work
as
we
have
always
done
as
a
council
in
partnership
with
local
communities
like
many
organizations,
users
and
ward
members
and
I'll
just
you
know
again
go
back
to
this
is
a
proposal
to
consult
and
if
we
can
get
started
on
that
consultation
process,
I
think
we'll
have
a
good
feel
by
the
end
of
january,
beginning
of
february
about
whether
we've
an
alt,
a
viable
alternative
proposition
on
the
table
to
closure.
A
Okay,
anybody
want
to
cover
any
of
the
other
points.
Counselor
cooper.
B
Yeah,
if
I
can
just
cover
the
point
about
the
genuine
consultation
and
council
of
finnegan,
saying
that
he's
expected
to
go
out
and
and
get
this
done
now.
B
Well,
I'm
afraid
that
wasn't
what
you
said
when
you
first
came
in
the
meeting
councillor
finnegan
and
asked
scrutiny
to
to
give
this
decision
back
to
executive
board
and
take
your
lewisham
community
center
out
of
it,
because
actually,
you
made
a
really
coherent
argument
to
say
why
the
center
should
stay
open
and
you
also
really
made
it
clear
that
you
have
the
support
of
the
community
of
the
community
groups
of
funding
and
that
you
were
getting
together
a
partnership
that
would
be
in
place
very
quickly,
so
that
you'd
be
able
to
overcome
some
of
some
of
the
the
issues
that
this
center
is
facing
at
the
moment.
B
So
I
would
imagine
you're
already
at
two-thirds
of
the
way
there
from
what
you
said
earlier
at
scrutiny,
council
of
finnegan.
So
yes,
I
do
expect
good
things
from
you,
because
you've
stated
that
here
at
scrutiny.
D
If
I
could
respond
chair
for
me,
I
did
ask
for
a
year.
I
was
given
two
months
at
this
particular
point
and
as
much
as
I
am
flattered
by
people's
views
that
I
work
significantly
quicker
than
everybody
else.
At
that
particular
point,
I
can
reassure
people
that
that
is
not
the
case
and
I'm
trying
to
do
it
during
a
pandemic.
At
this
particular
point,
I
have
a
timetable.
I
will,
as
ever
attempt
to
meet
that
particular
challenge.
D
I
will
attempt
to
convince
my
communities
that
this
is
an
option
that
they
need
to
explore
as
rapidly
as
it's
possible
to
actually
explore.
At
this
particular
point,
I
asked
for
12
months,
I've
been
given
two
I'll
do
my
best.
A
Right,
I
just
want
to
just
clarify
some
points
from
my
understanding
right
in
terms
of
the
costs
that
have
been
quoted
today
by
richard
to
clarify
what
the
costs
are.
A
Have
the
clarify
re-clarified
costs
being
passed
up
to
the
relevant
people
now,
so
that
they
can
make
an
informed
decision
and
have
they
been
put
in
any
consultation
paperwork
website,
social
media
posting
or,
however,
the
council
are
doing
it.
So
that's
my
first
right
after
them,
so
we
can
do
them
one
by
one.
So,
in
terms
of
the
costings,
has
that
now
been
made
available
the
revised
costings
to
the
decision
maker
and
has
that
now
been
put
on
any
database
so
that
anybody's
consulting
can
see
these
revised
costings.
A
B
Thank
you
cher
there
there
is
a
level
of
caretaking
resource,
but
to
make
it
to
make
the
caretaking
model
more
efficient
and
to
try
and
enable
to
reduce
costs
across
all
the
community
centers
across
the
city.
Then
we
have
a
team
of
mobile
caretakers
that
carry
out
a
level
of
work
at
louisian
park
community
center.
That's
right.
A
A
And
in
respect
of
the
this
is
a
question
to
you,
richard
inspect
of
the
water
meter
that's
been
put
in.
When
would
you
hope
to
be
able
to
report
back
on
any
findings
as
to
what
may
or
may
not
be
happening
with
water
usage?
In
other
words,
this
is
what
I'm
getting
at.
Is
this
going
to
be
done
prior
to
a
decision
made
in
february
march
time,
or
will
it
take
you
till
after
that
time
to
reach
conclusions.
B
We
before
that,
before,
we
should
have
reasonably
swiftly,
have.
A
Now
we
heard
from
councillor
bentley
the
good
work
that
was
done
down
in
mainwood
by
the
help
of
the
community
committee.
Can
someone
confirm
that
this
same
level
of
support
could
be
given
to
councillor
finnegan
between
now
and
let's
say
before
the
consultation
closes?
Is
that
some
a
commitment
that
can
be
made
because
we
heard
how
good
the
work
that
councilor
bentley
was
able
to
benefit
from?
Can
someone
make
that
commitment
or
not.
E
Yes,
counselor
anderson.
I
can
make
that
commitment.
We
support
members
very
helpfully
on
asset
transfers
previously
and
would
just
swing
that
into
action
and
son
would
be
instrumental
in.
In
that
conversation,.
A
Right
now,
the
other
point
that
council
finnegan
made
that
I
wanted
to
get
clarification
is
he
was
talking
about
that.
He
was
on
a
sub
group
that
was
discussing
this
now.
I
am
a
member
of
a
a
community
committee
where
we
don't
have,
and
we've
got
two
community
centers
in
the
whole
of
archery,
so
we
don't
get
involved,
but
is
this
a
decision?
Is
this
decision,
one
that
is
delegated
to
community
committees,
or
is
it
just
the
charging
that
is
delegated
to
community
committee,
so
where's
the
the
boundary
between
the
two?
A
E
A
That's
right,
that's
fine!
That's
fine!
That's
fine!
Two
questions
left
one
is
comment
was
made
about
the
capacity
and
ability
of
the
central
booking
system.
Whilst
that
is
not
necessarily
an
issue
that
we
need
to
concern
ourselves
about
today,
but
are
you
planning
to
revisit
the
central
booking
system
so
that
any
other
community
centers
that
may
or
may
not
be
affected
in
the
future?
A
Can
at
least
be
confident
that
the
central
booking
system
is
fit
for
purpose.
E
I
think
that's
part
of
a
constant
dialogue
council
anderson
in
terms
of
improvement.
We
recognize
the
limitations
of
any
booking
system
really,
but
we
have
been
diligently
working
on
that
for
the
last
three
or
four
years
in
particular,
including
reducing
thinking
about
its
impact
in
terms
of
overall
cost
reduction.
But
I'd
welcome
hearing
hearing
a
contribution
into
the
discussion
from
from
saan
and
richard.
C
Yeah,
I
can
come
in
on
that
one
we're
constantly
discussing
with
the
lens
teams
on
how
we
can
improve,
approve
the
delivery
to
the
customer.
C
One
of
the
things
we've
been
working
on
is
trying
to
reduce
the
amount
of
time
it
takes
to
make
a
booking,
but
that
has
to
be
done
in
line
with
certain
documents
and
certification
that
might
be
needed.
So
if
people
are
preparing
food
or
if
they're
running
physical
activities,
there
needs
to
be
checks
that
are
done,
which
does
slow
the
system
down
a
little
bit.
C
A
new
database
is
being
implemented
at
the
moment,
which
is
going
to
make
things
a
lot
smoother
from
their
end,
and
that's
that
should
be
up
and
running
in
the
new
year,
so
that
there
are
things
that
are
being
looked
at
in
terms
of
the
central
letting
system,
and
I
know
there
have
been
issues
in
the
past
and
but
they
are,
they
are
being
looked
at
and
we
are
aware
of
what
some
of
the
issues
are.
A
A
B
A
Did
I'll
start
again
well,
all
I
was
saying
was
that:
can
we
on
the
presumption
that
we
are
about
to
release
this
decision?
A
A
A
B
B
Okay,
if
I
can
just
respond
to
one
of
your
last
point
that
you
made
chair
about
the
executive
board
report
as
well,
that
that
would
reflect
the
the
consultation
period
and
council
of
finnegan's
contributions.
To
that,
I
would
say
that
it
would
not
necessarily
be
there,
because
maybe
that
is
not
going
to
be
as
part
of
the
executive
board
report
in
february.
B
If
councillor
finnegan
naturally
does
achieve
his
goal
of
of
saving
the
community
centre
in
the
way
that
he's
he's
proposing
that
he
wants
to
do
that.
So,
yes,
very,
very
difficult
and
tough
choices
that
the
administration
are
facing
when
we're
looking
at
the
gap
of
118
million
pounds,
I'm
afraid,
and
what,
and
sometimes
those
decisions
are
going
to
impact
on
our
communities
and
our
residents
ability
to
access
centers
such
as
as
the
one
that
you've
been
hearing
about
today.
B
The
report
also
talked
about
to
other
centers
in
the
that
are
under
consultation
as
well,
so
I'm
hoping
that
those
other
community
communities
will
also
be
galvanized,
maybe
in
the
same
way
and
come
forward
with
alternatives
around
usage
and
and
proposals
around
funding
to
try
and
and
save
those
centers
from
from
closure.
I
know
how
important
community
centres
are,
and
I
can
tell
you
that,
because
I
don't
have
one
in
my
world
where
it
really
needs
one.
B
I've
got
to
say
in
the
heart
of
a
really
deprived
community,
and-
and
so
you
know,
I'd
long
to
have
one
to
rally
to
save
I've
got
to
say,
but
I
but
I
haven't,
but
I
appreciate
how
much
they
are
used
by
the
by
communities
and
especially
as
councillor
finnegan
mentioned
it.
I
do
remember
this
particular
center
as
well,
and
I
have
been
in
it.
You
know
many
times
when
I
represented
the
area
some
years
ago.
B
So
I
understand
you
know
how
important
they
are
to
communities
and
ward
members,
and
I
really
hope
that,
through
the
consultation
process
that
other
funding
can
be
brought
to
bear,
that
will
be
able
to
save
this
particular
community
centre,
and
I
hope,
if
the
others
are
sustainable,
they
can
do
that
too,
and
I
would
say
that
you
know
some
of
the
statements
that
have
been
made
about
officers
actually
have
been
a
little
bit
sweeping,
and
I
would
you
know,
stand
by
what
community's
team
and
my
offices
are
doing
on
the
ground,
trying
to
ensure
that
the
best
services
delivered
to
our
ward
members
to
our
community
committees
to
our
community
chairs.
B
And
you
see
that
regularly
through
scrutiny.
You
know,
members
of
the
scrutiny
board
will
will
know
that.
So
I
just
like
to
thank
them
for
all
the
work
they've
been
doing
for
nearly
10
years
to
try
and
get
community
centres
on
a
sustainable
footing.
But,
yes,
it
is
a
decision
to
go
to
consultation,
and
I
hope,
through
that
consultation
solutions
will
come
through
that
consultation
that
will
save
the
centers.
D
D
I
am
not
reassured
that
officers
aren't
looking
for
an
abdication
of
this
particular
process.
It
seems
that
they're
very
keen
on
paling
off
this
community
center,
not
looking
at
a
partnership
which
would
mean
they
bring
something
positive
in
the
same
way
that
we
will
bring
something
positive
to
this
particular
arrangement.
D
We're
given
until
february
you
already
heard
from
the
council
offices
that
there
is
an
assumption
this
center
will
close
in
april,
because
that's
going
to
be
built
into
the
budget
assumptions
the
reality
of
it
is
that,
even
if
it
does
close
at
this
particular
point,
somebody's
going
to
have
to
cover
the
cost
of
security
and
other
associated
costs
anyway,
so
you're
only
passing
the
parcel
to
somebody
else
to
actually
do
with
it.
We
will
bring
forward
by
february
a
partnership
arrangement.
D
We
will
be
looking
for
shahid
and
his
team
to
release
the
information
that
I've
requested
twice
that
I
haven't
got
at
this
particular
point
to
look
at
bringing
something
positive
other
than
an
application
or
responsibility,
a
genuine
partnership
where
they're
bringing
some
cash
to
the
pot
in
the
same
way
that
we
will
bring
some
cash
to
the
pot
and
that
collectively
we
can
do
something
positive
to
save
this
community
that
is
serving
the
most
deprived
community.
This
community
centre
that's
serving
the
most
deprived
community
and
across
the
maori
area.
D
A
Thank
you
very
much
right.
So,
on
the
basis
that
we've,
what
we've
heard
today,
it's
now
up
to
the
board
to
decide
whether
they're
going
to
go
for
option
one
or
option
two.
So
what
I'm
going
to
do
is
to
go
through
in
the
list
in
the
order
that
I've
got
here
and
if
you
can,
let
me
know
whether
or
not
you're
in
favor
of
option
one
or
option
two.
So
starting
with
councillor
bentley.
A
A
One
councillor
blackburn.
B
I'd
go
with
option
one
as
well.
Please.
A
Chair
council
collins
option
one
chair,
council
dobson
option
two
chair
councillor
gabriel
option
one
chair,
counselor,
graham.
A
Counselor
harland
option:
one
chair:
counselor,
can
option.
A
Okay
right,
okay,
so
there
we
are.
We
are
clearly
in
favor
of
option
one
in
terms
of
releasing
the
decision
for
implementation
we
have
made.
You
know
some.
Some
of
us
have
made
a
number
of
comments
throughout
the
meeting
as
well,
which
will
be
reflected
back
in
the
minutes
and
unrecorded,
and
we've
also
had
confirmation
of
either
clarified
information
or
help
that
is
going
to
be
given
to
council
finnegan
in
order
to
meet
the
deadline
as
well
so
on.
A
She
can.
I
just
now
just
sum
up
by
saying
thank
you
all
very
much
for
your
time
and
effort
today.
Thank
you
for
councillor
finnegan
to
airing
this
debate
and
enable
the
whole
issue
of
community
centres
to
probably
be
debated
in
terms
of
a
constructive
way
forward.
So
thank
you
all
very
much
for
your
time
and
effort,
and
those
of
you
who
are
going
to
the
seminar
at
three
o'clock
you've
got
time
to
go
and
have
a
cup
of
tea
and
do
anything
and
catch.