►
Description
Host: Michael Kelly
1. Ivan Fartunov - Aragon
2. Gustav Friis - NEAR Foundation
3. Juan Guillen - MakerDAO
4. Jordan Gray - NEAR Foundation, Astro DAO: https://astrodao.com/
Follow the latest from NEAR Protocol on:
Website: https://near.org/
Discord: https://near.chat/
Blog: https://near.org/blog/
Twitter: https://twitter.com/NEARProtocol
GitHub: https://github.com/near https://github.com/nearprotocol
#Blockchain #FutureIsNEAR #NEAR #nearprotocol
A
A
I
think
that
sums
it
up,
and
so
I
think
to
kick
this
off
we'll
start
by
giving
each
of
the
panelists
a
chance
to
give
a
two
to
three
sentence:
introduction
who
they
are,
what
kind
of
angle
they
have
with
dowels.
You
know
where
they're
coming
from,
because
it's
a
complex
topic
and
then
we'll
take
it
from
there.
So
yvonne.
You
want
to
start
us.
B
C
C
I
tried
to
get
into
mega
dial
back
then,
but
it
was
very
hard
back
in
those
those
times,
but
following
that
right
now,
I'm
in
the
comments
deck,
which
is
a
dao
in
in
zuk,
registered
as
an
association
and
I'm
also
part
in
the
meteor
cartel
ventures,
which
is
an
investment
dow
based
in
delaware
and
I'm
really
interested
in
daos
and
tinkering
on
that
on
on
nia.
For
the
most
part
at
the
moment,.
D
You
set
the
bar
high
yeah.
My
name
is
juan
from
from
maker.
I
joined
the
community
of
maker
when
the
foundation
was
dissolving,
so
I
joined
what
we
call
one
of
the
core
units
which
is
called
ses
and
it
stands
for
sustainable
ecosystem
scaling
and
what
we
do
is
grow
the
the
dow
pretty
much
so
it's
a
surface,
the
work
that
needs
to
be
done,
the
the
capital
and
and
the
workforce,
and
try
to
join
them
together
by
coordinating.
E
D
E
I
am
jordan,
and
also
with
nier
labs
and
specifically
working
on
astro.
Quite
a
bit
and
astro
is
an
easy
to
use.
Normie
interface
for
the
sputnik
out
contracts,
which
are
very
powerful
configurable
and
basically
the
engine.
That's
running
under
the
hood
of
dials
on
near
sputnik.
Astro
gives
you
a
clean
interface
and
we're
really
focusing
on
everyday
users.
E
D
A
Right
on
so
there's
a
pretty
good
selection
of,
I
think,
experience
in
the
dao
space
between
the
four
of
you
I'd
like
to
start
with
yvonne,
and
we
can
actually
kind
of
go
from
there
of
where,
where
you
guys
are
feeling
most
passionate
about
this
the
question,
but
I
think
the
general
topic
of
on-chain
governance
is
one
that
sometimes
divides
people
right,
they'll,
look
at
it
and
they'll
be
like
oh.
Is
it
a
governance
token?
I
don't
want
to
touch
it
or
you
know
someone
will
come
to
you
like.
A
We
only
invest
in
governance,
token
chains,
why
don't
we
start
by
in
each
of
your
opinions?
What
do
you
think
the
value
proposition
is
of
on-chain
governance
in
the
context
of
crypto
in
the
larger
context,
I'll?
Let
you
guys
take
it?
How
you'd
like,
but
that's,
I
think,
a
good
way
to
introduce
the
conversation
of
daos.
B
Yeah,
that's
that's
the
hardest
question
on
the
list.
Well
fro
from
my
my
perspective,
just
the
govern.
On-Chain
governance
is
a
new
coordination,
primitive
and
I,
having
spent
some
time
in
defy,
I
was
like
basically
replacing
the
the
financial
system
is
inevitable.
Like
it's
gonna
go
on
chain.
Let's
do
something
cool,
that's
actually
on
the
on.
B
You
know
on
the
line
like
we
don't
know
if
it's
going
to
happen,
but
if
it
does,
we
we
have
the
potential
to
revolutionize
the
way
people
coordinate
and
the
way
people
pursue
common
goals
and
govern
shared
resources
and
then,
like
I,
don't
want
to
get
into
the
whole
on
versus
off-chain
debate.
I
think
I
think
that's
that's
a
question
that
no
one
actually
knows
the
answer
to
at
this
point
yet,
and
one
of
the
great
things
about
the
space
is
it's
a
space
that
rewards
experimentation.
A
D
D
So
I
think
that's
going
to
play
a
big
big
part
in
the
future,
not
sure
when
or
or
how,
but
I
think
that's
going
to
be
crucial
too
so
the
possibility
of
any
community
being
able
to
invest
or
or
yeah
vote
on
on
another
community
and
have
these
groups
of
groups.
I
think
it's
going
to
be
very,
very
interesting.
E
I
I
like
that
on
near
since
everything
is
fast
and
cheap,
it's
very
easy
to
do
the
governance
on
chain,
but
it's
it's
one
of
those
nature
versus
nurture
questions.
It's
a
gradient,
there's,
always
some
coordination
that
happens
off-chain
and
then
there's
always
well.
Ideally,
there's
something!
That's
on
the
chain,
that's
transparent!
It's
the
ledger!
E
Let
people
know
what
happened,
and
I
think
that
the
most
valuable
thing
about
that
transparency
and
the
on-chain
nature
of
it
is
just
that
it's
written
down,
aligns
people
and
that's
a
super,
valuable
thing,
and
that's
what
I
like
to
see
like
a
lot
of
the
a
lot
of
the
people
who
are
just
getting
into
dao's
for
the
first
time
on
near
they've,
run
collectives
in
the
past,
and
things
like
that.
So
this
is
just
like
a
new
tool
for
them
to
use
to
write
down
like
with
my
art
and
technon
collective.
E
Every
year
we
will
decide
what
we're
going
to
do
after
looking
at
what
went
well
and
what's
going
to
happen
in
the
future,
and
if
we
write
it
down
on
chain,
then
everybody's
aligned
and
we've
got
that
litmus
test
where
we
can
be
like
okay.
Does
this
initiative
match
up
with
this
or
not
when
we
pre
pre
being
a
dao?
We
would
like
make
that
decision,
but
then
we'd
be
kind
of
lazy
about
like
oh
this,
this.
Let's
just
do
this.
C
I
think
the
the
definitions
are
very
difficult
to
understand
in
terms
of
like
what
is
on
qin
dao,
for
example.
Really
like
does
that
mean?
No,
you
know
human
coordination
interference,
everything
that's
not
on
the
blockchain.
Is
then
it's
not
unchained.
Now
or
or
is
it
just
that
you
you
know
in
the
end,
you
have
some
event
triggered
by
you
know
a
number
of
votes
in
in
say
a
dao,
or
if
it's
a,
if
the
blockchain
protocol,
where
you
you
know,
then
you
know
have
some.
C
You
know
vote
of
a
sense,
because
I
I
see
that
there's
a
lot
of
powerful
things
in
in
having
those
votes
and
seeing
you
know
who
voted
that?
What
reputation
for
that
that
you
can,
when
I
speak,
it's
a
normal
cooperative,
as
you
mentioned
that
you
know
you
can
everyone
can
have
a
you
know,
shared
insight
in
what
is
actually
in
the
treasury.
C
That
brings
up
a
lot
of
sort
of
new
involvement
from
a
lot
of
actors.
That
is,
you
know,
would
not
maybe
take
care
of
that.
Usually
they
would
just
be
like
the
accounting
guy
on
the
you
know,
in
the
normal
cooperative,
for
example,
that
would
be
sort
of
involved
in
in
like
bringing
their
own
perspectives
to
that,
but
sort
of
in
the
dows
I'm
involved
in
we
spent
most
of
the
time
actually
using
sort
of
other
non,
at
least
let's
say
not
on
chain
coordination
tools.
C
Maybe
we
use
you
know,
source
crit,
where
we
see
our
you
know
contribution
yeah,
maybe
on
chain,
but
also
like
on
for
some
discord
or
different
forums
and
stuff
like
that,
maybe
you
know
we
use
something
like
codinape
where
we
are
like
voting
on
on.
You
know,
contribution
of
different
people-
that's
also
not
unchained,
but
we
can
maybe
sort
of
vote
off
chain
with
the
voting
that
we
have
on
chain.
If
we
use
something
like
snapshot,
so
I
think
it's
it's.
C
A
Well,
let's,
let's
maybe
make
it
a
little
bit
more
easier,
so
we
we
know,
we
know
that
there
are.
You
know:
gaming,
dows,
there's
collector
dows,
there's
governance
dows
for
different,
adapts
and
protocols.
Why
don't?
Each
of
you
kind
of
talk
about
for
the
specific
companies
that
you
guys
are
coming
from?
What's
the
kind
of
entry
point
into
how
people
would
use
your
products
and
yeah.
C
A
D
So
maker's
product
is
die,
as
probably
everyone
knows
here,
and
that
is
a
stable
coin,
packed
nowadays
to
the
us
dollar.
It's
an
algorithmic,
decentralized
stablecoin.
So
that
comes
with
its
own
advantages
and
yeah.
Why
do
we
need
a
stablecoin
is
because
the
market
is
way
too
volatile
like
no
one
knows
how
much
is
the
kind
of
coke
in
heath
or
or
any
other
volatile
asset?
D
So
we
do
need
the
stablecoin
to
to
not
go
crazy,
pretty
much
and
and
the
argument
once
that
this,
whatever
coin
is,
is
or
gets
widespread
adoption
it
will
be
stable.
I
don't
think
that
cuts
it
or
at
least
not
for
the
next
decade
or
so,
and
that's
yeah.
That's
that's
the
the
main
use
of
of
the
eye
going
back.
D
D
So
we
need
to
make
sure
that
the
peg
is
held
since
it's
not
a
fixed
bag.
It's
it's
floating,
then
there's
a
matter
of
growing.
How
do
we
make
sure
that
we
scale
that
even
more
a
lot
of
people,
including
myself,
think
that
we
can
still
100x
die
and
need
to
apply?
So
how
do
we
make
that
that
jump?
It's
it's!
What's
keeping
us
up
at
night.
B
Thing
so
aragon
is
probably
the
first.
It
is
the
first
like
dao
framework
after
the
dao,
and
because
of
that,
I
think
a
lot
of
a
lot
of
the
projects
that
build
on
top
of
us
have
been
mostly
like
protocol
and
product
dials.
So
far-
and
you
know
once
dows
became
a
relevant
topic
across
the
industry
again,
which
was,
I
would
say,
like
mid
last
year,
already
ethereum
fees
were
were
going
through
the
roof
and
and
that
made
a
lot
of
the
on-chain
components
of
of
running
a
dao
somehow
challenging
on
ethereum.
B
But
you
know
that's
the
past.
I
I
like
your
question,
because
you
know
we
had
a.
We
had
a
really
cool
conversation
with
with
lucas
from
from
gnosis
who's
who's
in
the
who
who's
who's
there
in
the
audience
and
about
like
how
guilts
are
a
massive
new
opportunity,
for
example,
because
it's
it's
it's
inherent
to
them
like
you
know,
it's
a
bunch
of
people
that
need
to
coordinate
on
what
jobs
to
pursue
like
what
what
bosses
to
fight
they
have
shared
resources.
So
it's
it.
It
feels
very
natural.
B
So
that's
one
one!
One
vertical!
I'm
really
excited
about
work.
Collectives
on
on
all
fronts,
from
developers
to
creatives
are
also
like
something
that
I'm
I'm
really
excited
about
in
terms
of
like
what
you
ask
like
the
house
that
we'll
be
building
on
that
infrastructure-
and
you
know
in
that
context
we're
we're
targeting
whatever
we
have
as
a
value
proposition
towards
those
use
cases.
E
So
there's
there's
a
lot
of
that
going
on
where
there's
like
a
lot
of
existing
groups
that
already
have
this
model
that
are
adopting
just
some
new
technology
and
then
there's
just
a
plethora
of
use
cases
when
you
make
it
so
easy
to
launch
a
dow
that
anybody
can
do
it.
There's
like
throwaway
dials.
You
could
do
a
dial
for
an
event.
You
can
do
adele
for
a
vacation.
E
A
C
Yeah,
so
that
that's
really
in
terms
of
like
the
you
know,
the
purpose
which
I
I
hope
all
of
us
ask
ourselves.
What's
the
the
purpose
of
of
participating
in
different
things
and
the
different
doubts
I
participate
in
have
different
purposes
so
so
one
the
first
I
mention
is:
is
the
common
stack
which
is
building
you
know
using
these
sort
of
token
economic
primitives
to
you,
know,
sort
of
challenge
the
tragedy
of
the
commons
perception,
public
food
fund,
gunding,
etc.
C
So
it's
a
curated
newsletter
coming
out
every
week
and
what
happens
in
the
creation
of
this
is
that
it's
it's
two
to
three
hundred
proposals
now
per
week
from
people
around
the
world
that
are
submitting
it.
If
their
proposal
gets
approved,
they
earn
a
near
reward
in
return
and
this
gets
into
the
newsletter.
So
in
that
sense,
it's
kind
of
showing
that
dows
can
also
be
used
for
for
these
type
of
sort
of
co-creation
or
crowdsourcing
of
yeah,
in
this
case
a
quite
simple
newsletter
and
that's
the
purpose
of
obviously
of
that
now.
C
So
I
think
we're
really,
starting
only
to
see
the
the
very
very
you
know
top
of
of
what's
possible
here,
because
most
of
these
things
are
sort
of
a
little
bit.
What
we
saw,
I
think
in
the
traditional
like
in
the
in
the
first
sort
of
wave
of
the
internet,
where
we
saw
you
know
jeff
bezos,
you
know
great.
We
have
the
internet,
we
can
do
you
know
bookstore
or
something
like
that.
You
know
so
you're
taking
something
that
you
already
know
a
traditional
organization
and
just
replicate
that
with
that
new
technology.
A
I
think
staying
on
that
topic,
you
know
the
whole
dow
concept
is
quite
new
and
at
times
I
think
he
can
actually
become
quite
tedious.
You
know
if
you're,
if
you
get
a
bunch
of
proposals
and
you're
spending
all
that
time,
accepting
each
proposal
at
the
same
time,
people
are
looking
at
vote.
Policy
and
they're
saying
you
know,
is
a
is
a
token
based
vote
policy,
really
something
that's
going
to
be
sustainable
for
the
long
term.
For
in
your
opinions,
we
can
start
with
yvonne
and
kind
of
go
around.
A
B
Other
types
of
data,
valuable
work
towards
the
network
and
all
of
that
has
to
be
rewarded
and
the
reward
mechanisms.
You
know
we
we
mentioned
source
credit
coordinate.
I
think
that's
a
very
interesting
space
that
that
that's,
that
feels
a
bit
underexplored
and
I
mean
also
rewarding
participation
in
governance-
needs
like
that
that
that
just
has
to
happen
right,
because
it
takes
a
lot
of
time
and
effort
to
get
familiar
with.
What's
going
on
with
those
thousands
proposals-
and
you
know,
delegation
is
something
that
that's
happening
across
a
lot
of
projects.
B
I
don't
think
it's
like
a
silver
bullet
solution.
It
makes
sense
in
some
use
cases
it
makes
sense
in
others.
You
know
the
quadratic
voting
thing
also
is
not
a
silver
bullet,
because
it
takes
a
lot
of
the
a
lot
of
the
sort
of
oligopoly.
Just
brings
it
off
chain,
so
it's
it's
there.
There
are
quite
a
few
verticals
and
yeah.
C
So
if
I
then
try
to
like
zoom
out
even
more,
I
would
say
you
know
in
like
the
the
years
I've
been
in
blockchain
space
scalability
was
was
really
real.
A
big
big
deal,
big
problem.
We
have
seen
a
lot
of
involvements
there.
Of
course
we're
here
at
neocons
and
so
like
there's
near
there's,
also
an
inferior
main
chain.
You
know
apotrom
connects
optimism.
You
know
a
lot
of
stuff
is
happening
in
that
field.
I
think
we
met.
C
But
what
I
think
is
one
of
the
biggest
thing
that
needs
to
happen
is
the
third
big
pillar,
which
is
privacy,
and
we
have
a
lot
of
you
know,
attempts
there
primitives.
You
know
whether
it's
going
to
be
shared
knowledge
proofs,
a
stock.
So
you
know
I'm
not
really
an
expert
there
and
there
are
many
attempts
new
projects.
C
What
I
was
talking
about
for
new
type
organizations,
then
you
know
you
just
can't:
have
normal
organizations
have
full?
You
know
all
their
the
data
up
there.
So
these
attempts
on
those
protocols,
I
think,
is
very,
very
interesting
and
and
what
I
hope
will
happen
and
that's
like,
let's
say
20
years
from
now.
That
would
be
in
the
interest
of
humanity.
I
think
if
we
have
privacy
protocols
where
organizations
can
mask
what
they
want,
but
they
subscribe
to
certain
a
certain
privacy
protocol
where
it
can
also
be
sort
of
revealed
sort
of
aggregate
meshes.
C
So
if
you
think
like,
for
example,
the
interbank
market,
you
cannot
see
anything
on
today,
you
could
not
will
not
be
able
to
see
the
solvency
of
the
different
banks.
Only
the
authorities
will
be
able
to
do
that,
but
you
will
have
a
dashboard
where
you
see
the
systemic
risk
of
the
whole
system
there,
because
that's
a
systemic
risk
of
us
as
a
species.
C
D
Yeah,
I
wanted
to
add
the
I
think
that
a
huge
bottleneck
that
each
towel
has
is
the
the
human
component.
So
some
people
are
in
three
four
ten
fifteen
dollars
and
I
don't
even
know
how
they
manage.
I
I
have
enough
with
the
with
one
but
yeah.
I
think
that
the
answer
is
creating
frameworks
and
and
see,
what's
what's
the
blocker
in
each
moment.
If
you
have
a
lot
of
proposals,
maybe
you
can
ask
people
to
pledge
something
to
make
sure
that
you
release
the
spam.
D
I
don't
know
that
they're
100
tools
and
I
think
that
another
big
thing
that
we
are
facing
right
now
is
that
we
are
not
using
the
software
components,
so
we're
importing
things
that
we
know
from
from
web
2
and
these
old
companies
and
we're
not
fully
exploring
the
the
software
component
and
an
extreme
example
would
be
liquid
plutocracy.
So
you
could
imagine
now
setting
a
budget
for
all
the
teams
and
then
delegates
or
voters
changing
the
vote
and
in
real
time
the
budget
flowing
from
one
one
guild
or
one
community
to
the
next.
D
E
D
E
D
A
I
want
to
move
the
discussion,
actually
a
question
for
gus
so,
and
this
actually
is
timely,
because
the
the
vc
panel
is
gonna
be
going
on
in
about
an
hour
and
something
that's
been
much
discussed
in
the
venture.
Capital
circles
is
what
you
know.
What
is
what
can
be
changed
with
venture
dows,
and
how
can
we
reimagine
investing?
How
can
we
reimagine
rewarding
certain
managers
for
running
a
venture
dow
and
what
are
people
from
the
traditional
vc
space
missing
that
they
can
learn?
A
You
know
what
opportunities
are
are
in
this
venture
dow
structure
place
so
gus.
I
know
you
actually
you've
been
quite
interested
in
this
topic
and
you
and
you
have
a
bunch
quite
a
few-
really
good
ideas
in
terms
of
working
with
certain
governments
and
things
like
that.
Do
you
want
to
talk
a
little
bit
about
the
the
kind
of
venture
dow
space
and
where
you
see
it,
going.
C
Taking
the
you
know,
traditional
the
general
partner,
limited
partner
approach
and
there
is
sort
of
you
know
investors
and
they're
people
that
carries
that
out,
and
then
there
are
others
where
it's
sort
of
more
member
managed
where
you
at
any
time
can
can
get
out.
Maybe
you,
your
share
is,
is
sort
of
you
can
maybe
contribute
eve
or
maybe
a
near
if
it's
coming
there
and
then
that
is
your
share
of
then
the
whole
dao's
capital.
C
Then
what
the
the
moloch
taos
brought
first
in
the
grand
setting
on
ethereum,
because
it
was
very
hard
to
get
grants
in
the
firm
in
like
2017-18,
specifically
18
after
the
crash
and
and
and
yeah
so
so
there
you
can
have
at
any
time.
You
can
rage
quit
and
you
can
get
out
the
liquid
amount
of
tokens
that
your
shares
are
entitled
to.
C
So
that
that's
one
thing
in
terms
of
like
let's
say
I
have
to
pitch
it
to
a
normal
vc,
which
was
one
of
the
questions
that
you
ask
like
what
what
why
should
I?
Why
should
a
vc
switch?
So
I
think
one
thing
is
like
the
incentive
structure
that
if
you
have
specific
deal
flows
you
know
the
specific
token.
Then
there
is
like
the
transparent
threshold
element
of
thous.
So
there
a
specific
deal
lead
leading
that
putting
that
on
chain.
C
You
can
automate
the
whole
process
on
how
much
you
know
extra
they're
going
to
be
getting
incentivized
for
getting
in
that
deal,
for
example,
and
just
like
for
all
people
working
on
you
know
stuff
in
daos.
This
is
much
better
than
linkedin,
you
know
or
github
or
twitter,
because
these
things
are,
you
know
not
connected,
but
in
dao's.
If
you
have
brought
in
good
leads,
you
could
have
approval
track
record
there,
and
that
goes
for
all
of
us,
so
that's
sort
of
the
best
cv
you
can
have
in
that
sense.
C
Of
course
you
it
depends
on
that.
One
address
that
you're
using
and
you
know
it's
not
like.
You
cannot
have
a
dodgy
address
that
people
don't
know
about
like
they
don't
you
know
you
do
the
same
with
linkedin
right.
You
have
a
very
very
you
know
beautiful
linkedin,
and
then
you
have
a
dirty
snapchat
or
whatever
I
don't
know,
but
but
that's
sort
of
yeah
a
fairly
simple
question
to
it:
yeah.
A
Yeah,
I
know
that
in
other
circles
you
know
they're
even
talking
about
being
able
to
fractionalize
access
to
certain
investments
from
a
venture
dow
right,
so
you
can
even
imagine
tokenizing
only
the
d5
projects
of
a
dao
and
then
being
able
to
sell
access
to
the
d5
investments
to
other
people.
I
think
there's
a
lot
of
innovation,
specifically
there
in
the
larger
crypto
stack,
so
kind
of
expanding
this
out
to
nfts
games,
more
mainstream
forms
of
governance
for
the
other
three
panelists
here.
A
E
E
There
was
three
causes
on
here
that
were
able
to
raise
in
total,
like
a
little
over
half
a
million
dollars
for
the
flooding
in
china
and
covered
relief
in
india
and
also
in
vietnam.
So
I
think
that,
like
fundraising
and
humanitarian
efforts,
they
find
it
very
natural
home
in
daos,
and
then
I
was
talking
previously
about
like
cooperatives
and
unions
like
actually
being
a
very
natural
fit,
and
then
a
lot
of
artists
and
creatives
are
really
liking.
E
This
dow
model,
they
artists,
are
collaborative
and
they
like
working
together
and
one
of
the
nice
things
about
having
a
band
of
artists
is
that
as
one
person
promotes
it,
it
promotes
everybody
involved.
So
as
an
nft
artist,
it's
very
hard
to
stand
out.
If
you're
in
a
collective,
then
you
can
all
push
together.
So
that's
like
a
really
nice
fit
for
a
dow
as
well.
D
Yeah,
I'm
going
to
bring
it
back
to
the
financial
part
and
the
d5.
I
guess
too
many
years
on
the
on
the
fintech
space,
but
so
yeah.
We
we've
had
distributed
ledgers
for
decades
now,
and
the
the
great
invention
of
bitcoin
was
actually
pairing
value
within
or
incorporating
the
value
within
the
blockchain
and
the
decentralized
ledger.
So
so
I
think
that
anything
that
has
to
do
with
coordinating
people
and
and
money
has
been
the
invention
for
the
last
couple.
D
It's
greatly
appreciated
and
going
back
to
the
to
the
vcs
right
now,
the
if
the
vcs
are
not
investing
in
in
this
industry,
they
might
be
missing
huge
returns
and,
as
you
have
more
projects
that
they
might
need
to
adapt
to
vcs,
but
then
that
that
might
flip
in
the
future
and
it
would
be
like
hey
just
send
me
die
to
this
address.
I
don't
know
how
you
deal
with
the
legal
part.
It's
up
to
you,
so
I
think
we'll
find
a
lot
of
legal,
wrappers
and
interesting
solutions
to
to
bridge
this.
B
I'm
gonna
double
click
on
that
vc
angle.
So
I'm
going
to
answer
the
previous
in
this
question.
At
the
same
time,
look
at
that
so,
as
ron
said,
it's
it's
about
coordination
and
efficiency
around
deploying
capital,
but
that
expands
beyond
financial
capital
and
I
think
that's
where
daos
could
be
more
powerful
than
traditional
vcs,
because
you
know
over
the
past
week
and
a
half
we
all
of
us
have
spoken
with
a
lot
of
new
projects,
starting
up
and
and
and
everyone's
like.
I
don't
need.
I
don't
need
cash
I
have
like
cash
is
cheap.
B
Today
I
need
a
community.
I
need
people
that
can
help
me
build
stuff,
and
you
know
so
to
dials
are
starting
to
look
like
a
much
better
vehicle
for
deploying
social,
human
and
and
cultural
capital.
Even
you
know
that
the
cartel
has
done
amazingly
on
on
that
front
with
with
creating
this
collaborative
culture
and
that
that
has
trickled
in
a
lot
of
the
projects
they've
invested
in
so
yeah.
It's
it's
about
efficient
deployment
of
all
types
of
capital,
also
like
a
lot
less
paperwork.
B
A
So
this
might
be
a
little
bit
more
of
a
controversial
question,
so
I'm
hoping
that
that
we
have
a
a
slight
difference
of
opinion
among
the
panelists,
but
the
the
short
version
of
the
question
is:
will
daos
go
mainstream
like
other
crypto
product
acronyms,
right
nft?
So
short
brief,
you
know
background
history.
Here
you
have
tokens,
they
had
their
heyday,
you
know
bef
before
and
after
ethereum
launch,
but
you
had
a
lot
of
really.
You
know
pointless
tokens
before
then
ethereum
launched
you
had
a
lot
of
utility
tokens.
A
Then
there
was
the
security
token
phase.
No
one
talks
about
that
anymore
because
it
flopped.
Then
we
got
nfts
that
really
started
to
go
mainstream.
Now
we're
talking
about
dows,
so
I'd
like
to
hear
from
from
each
panelist,
you
know:
is
there
something
about
daos
that
will
keep
it
from
going
mainstream?
You
know
it
might
not
have
the
monetization
component
that
nfts
will
have
that
have
or
you
know
something
like
that,
or
is
the
use
case
expansive
enough
that
you
think
actually
that's
the
reason
why
it
will
go
mainstream.
D
E
So
I
I
think
that
the
thing
that
will
keep
daos
from
going
mainstream
is
the
name
of
it.
It's
just
confusing
as
crap
to
everyday
people,
but
it's
also
a
term
that
I
think
does
very
accurately
describe
what
the
thing
is.
So
I
think
that
in
that
sense,
it's
still
a
useful
label
and
something
that
is
also
an
educational
instrument.
When
I'm
explaining
it
to
people,
I
would
say
that
yes,
dows
will
go
mainstream.
E
A
D
D
Maybe
some
people
won't
even
know
that
they
are
working
for,
though
it
might
be,
like
you're,
a
contractor
you're,
an
employee
for
some
kind
of
vehicle
that
belongs
to
the
dao,
and
I
see
a
lot
of
compostability,
so
potentially
a
core
unit
or
a
guild
could
end
up
working
for
two
different
protocols
in
maker.
We
already
had
this
experience
of
two
dowels,
collaborating
and
and
yeah
involving
other
projects
as
well
that
their
companies
in
the
the
real
world.
So
I
think
that
it's
inevitable.
A
A
C
So
when
we
think
about
the
like
dot
com
area
bubble,
so
many
of
these
companies,
which
were
worth
a
lot
and
are
just
not
here
anymore,
at
all,
they
disappeared
shortly
after
many
of
them
had
come
in
their
name.
You
know,
they'll
come
call
some
bookcom
or
something
like
that.
You
know
they
all
had
these
weird
names
in
there
and
I
I
think
the
same
is
going
to
happen
here.
C
A
lot
of
towers
are
not
going
to
be
very
valuable,
but
there's
going
to
be
a
lot
of
lot
of
dows,
but
I
think
we
really
just
are
making
it
when
we're
not
talking
about
dance
anymore,
because
you
know
now
it's
just
the
internet.
You
know
it's
not.
You
don't
have
to
like
position
yourself
by
saying
I
am
a
dao.
I
mean
it
works
right
now
and
it
works
in
in
these
communities
rain
right
now,
but
I
think
that's
that's
how
you're
gonna
go
for
sure.
C
C
For
the
other
question,
we're
definitely
going
to
have
a
hype
cycle
where,
just
in
the
in
the
echo
chamber,
where
of
course
taos
are
going
to
be
the
next
big
thing.
But
that's
it's!
That's
just
mainstream!
It's
just
like
a
another
like
hype
in
a
like
echo
chamber,
just
a
little
bit
bigger
one
than
just
the
people
doing
it
now
on
twitter.
B
It's
a
bit
different,
it's
more
of
a
freedom
potential
in
the
sense
of
a
lot
of
people
that
go
towards
working
for
them
now,
in
the
early
early
days
of
it
in
a
way,
have
freedom
of
expression,
of
creativity
and
of
of
pursuing
goals
that
they
identify
with
and
and
investing
their
time
and
effort
in
in
in
things
that
they
believe
in
which,
which
is
very
liberating-
and
I
believe,
especially
especially
creatives,
would
be
the
the
at
the
forefront
of
this
without
revolution.
And
it's
gonna
go
mainstream.
It's
I'm.
I
agree.
A
All
right
guys!
Well,
that's
that's
four
green
check
marks
and
we're
gonna
check
back
in
at
near
con
2
to
see
how
their
predictions
have
fared
to
date.
So
we
got
five
minutes
left.
Is
there
any
questions
from
the
audience
on
the
topic
of
dowse
feel
free
to
raise
your
hand
if
you
guys
have
any
right
now
any
questions
for
anybody.
A
E
I
think
it's
more
of
a
question
about
how
it
will
happen,
whether
it's
going
to
be
taos
taking
matters
into
their
own
hands
and
working
on
lobbying
and
pushing
their
own
agendas
into
legislation
or
if
taos
are
going
to
be
more
like
well
we're
doing
our
thing
and
you
can
you
can
all
figure
out
how
to
label
it
like,
like.
I
think
that
that's
like
kind
of
a
meteor
question
is
like
how
it'll
happen.
E
It's
it's
happening
and
it's
it's
hard,
because
doubts
themselves
are
changing
so
to
put
law
around
them
is,
is
very
difficult
law
on
its
side,
like
the
whole
point
of
law,
is
that
you
come
up
with
with
some
language
that
is
ambiguous
enough,
that
it
can
apply
to
as
many
cases
as
possible
and
then
on
the
dow
side,
you're,
taking
something
making
it
as
literal
as
possible
to
make
it
apply
to
everything.
So
in
some
ways,
taos
and
in
the
legislation
are
doing
the
same
thing.
D
Yeah,
I
want
to
add-
and
I'm
happy
to
keep
talking
later.
I
don't
want
to
go
forever,
but
so
it's
not
news
that
80
year
old
people
in
some
senate
will
have
a
hard
time
regulating
web
three.
They
already
had
a
really
hard
time
with
two,
so
this
is
going
to
get
even
weirder,
but
what
I'm,
what
I'm
more,
what
I'm
more
interested
in
is
actually
what's
happening
from
the
other
side.
D
So
right
now
you
have
countries
and
you
have
tax
codes
and
and
what
not
and
then
what
you
will
have
is
groups
of
people
that
don't
belong
or
they
are
based
in
some
country,
but
they
will
have
the
opportunity
to
move.
They
will
have
the
opportunity
to
change
that
and
the
whole
new
world
will
come
out
of
that
again.
I
don't
want
to
go
on
a
limb
here,
because
I
could
talk
about
this
forever,
but
I
think
it's
going
to
be
super
interesting,
what's
happening
on
the
other
side
of
the
legislation.
C
C
It's
not
that
hard
to
set
up
a
association
on
or
a
limited
company
and
then
treat
it
as
a
dow,
and
so
it
depends
a
lot
on
the
like
perspective
of
the
regulation.
You
know,
and
generally
they
just
view
it
from
my
understanding
that
either
there
is
an
entity,
that's
great.
If
there's
no
entity,
then
it's
just
a
general
partnership
and
then
potentially
everyone
is
liable
for
it
and
they
could
even
choose
who
of
the
liable
people
they
would
go
for.
C
So
so
so
that's
kind
of
the
option,
legalized-
and
I
think
that's
quite
clear
in
most
jurisdictions-
then
some
are
just
really
trying
to
endorse
it
and
some
are
trying
to
you
know
fight
it,
and
then
we
have
also,
I
think,
on
like
global
scale
in
this
type
of
cold
war
scene,
we're
in
and
that's
interesting
with
the
andreas
and
horowitz
report.
You
mentioned
that
there's
sort
of
this
fomo
also
a
bit
going
on.
You
know
when
there's
a
cold
war.
C
So
it's
it's
interesting
fact
that
you
know
the
it
was
when
the
leap
blockchain
by
facebook
was
announced
that
china
really
got
serious
with
blockchain
and
and
sort
of
really
said.
Okay
guys
now
it's
time
to
get
all
the
banks,
you
know
wechat
tencent
baidu
together
and
we
do
the
open
service
network,
so
that
was
really
the
then
kind
of
libra
kind
of
crashed
it
seemed
like,
but
but
like
that
is
starting
to.
So
I
feel
in
the
context
of
america.
C
A
You
know,
there's
so
much
innovation
happening
it's
happening
at
lightning
speed,
it's
probably
going
to
disrupt
a
lot
of
things
and
it's
going
to
be
a
little
while
before
the
rest
of
the
crowd
catches
up.
So
let's
take
a
moment
to
thank
all
four
of
our
panelists
for
taking
the
time
to
be
on
this
panel
and
to
keep
doing
the
great
work
they're
doing
in
the
dow
space.
So
thank
you
guys.
E
I
got
one
more
thing
to
announce:
octopus
winners:
we
did
a
octopus
giveaway
on
twitter,
where
you
could
subscribe
or
yeah
get
your
name
in
there.
So
we
got
three.
We
got
three
winners.
There's
henry
z.near
is
henry
z.
Here
is
there
joshua
b
here
is
joshua
b.
Here
is
fathom
here,
fathom.near
here
nope.