►
From YouTube: Development Team Meeting - May 28, 2019
Description
See https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/Development_Team_Log for meeting notes and log.
-----------------
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A
Start
recording,
okay,
so
recording
has
started
and
I'm
actually
using
OBS
studio.
So
this
is
first
time
checking
outlet,
I
tested
it
and
it
looks
really
good.
It
looks
like
the
voice.
Quality
was
really
good,
no
problems
on
any
issues.
So
that's
what
it's
suggest
and
actually
definitely
recommended.
It's
easy,
pretty
easy
to
set
up
and
everything
so
definitely
pleased
with
it.
So
far,
okay!
So
let's,
let's
go
to
the
current
meeting.
A
For
Tuesday
the
28th
2019,
now,
let's
see
we're
kind
of
locked
out
of
editing
it.
Okay.
So
let
me
just
keep
speaker
speak
what
I
wanted
to
say
today
as
far
as
the
update,
so
we're
moving
forward
on
organizing
for
the
steam
camp,
the
open
source,
microfactory
steam
camp
for
everybody,
and
that
announcement
there
is
up
on
the
open
source,
ecology
at
our
website,
and
we
just
added
actually
a
a
video.
A
So
William
was
here
for
a
week
preparing
so
we've
got
about
31
days
left
in
terms
of
the
countdown
early
bird
registration
ends
this
Friday,
but
we
put
up
a
video
describing
in
brief
what
what
the
event
is
about,
and
it's
the
first
time
that
we're
doing
a
design
focused
event
where
it's
about
now
shifting
from
okay.
This
is
what
open
source
ecology
is
producing.
Okay,
here
are
the
tools
for
you
to
design
and
build
things,
so
so
really
a
nice
crash
course,
and
along
with
that,
so
you
can
take
a
look
at
that.
A
You
can
look
at
the
curriculum.
The
crash
course
includes
18
lessons
on
very
basic
design.
Topics
like
like
what
all
goes
into
a
machine
at
a
fundamental
level,
fundamental
level,
what
are
the
primitives
that
that
everything
is
made
of,
and
that's
essentially
frames
power
units
motors
engines,
there's
gear
downs,
power
transmissions,
it's
a
bunch
of
fundamental
units
that,
if
you
understand
them,
you
can
build
structures
and
then
power
them
through
motion
or
then
electronics
and
and
precision
motion
as
well.
So
that's
that's
included
in
what
we'll
be
teaching
on
in
about
a
month.
A
People
are
arriving
in
the
28th,
but
starting
that
June
29th
through
July
the
7th.
So
it's
a
nine-day
immersion,
so
I
want
to
point
out
to
some
of
the
most
recent
work
on
the
OSC
machine
design
guides.
So
this
is
kind
of
a
big
section
that
OSC
machine
design.
Guys.
Let
me
go
back
to
my
blog:
what's
what
did
I
type
wrong?
Ok,
oh
I,
see
machine
design
guide,
doesn't
have
an
S
there.
Also
18
topics.
A
Oh
so
now
breaking
down
all
the
curriculum
from
the
workshop
that
will
be
in
the
form
of
easy-to-access
18
lessons
about
an
hour
each
each
formatted
nicely
an
hour
cover.
So
this
is
I'm
gonna
start
off
with
collaborative
literacy,
because
that's
actually
a
very
important
thing,
and
over
the
years
we
found
that
how
important
the
ability
to
collaborate
between
different
people
is,
and
it's
one
of
the
big
cultural
barriers
as
we
live
in
a
competitive
economy
based
on
violence
and
warfare.
I
mean
it's.
A
It
is
a
big
challenge
when
you,
when
you
actually
think
about
it.
So
some
of
the
things
I'll
be
talking
about
and
I
mean.
The
first
thing
to
learn
about
is
the
psychology
of
collaboration
and
how
people
behave
based
on
personal
issues,
and
that's
things
like
a
steam
eagle,
vulnerability,
the
threat
of
survival
that
the
tiger
is
gonna
eat
us.
You
know
people
are
still
quite
afraid
of
many
different
things.
Their
psychology
is
pretty
much
like
human
psychology
on
the
gut
level
is
in
a
flight
and
flight
fight
and
flight
response.
A
That's,
like
thousands,
hundreds
of
thousands
of
evolution
that
our
brain
is
still
wired
up
like
that
and
that's
why
we
can't
collaborate.
We
still
think
someone's
gonna
eat
us.
That's
deeper
issues
there,
but
anyway
this
so
the
design
guides
will
a
feature
all
the
details
that
we
need
to
know,
starting
like
little
things
like
frames,
universal
axes,
motors
stepper,
motor
controllers,
Marlin
bass,
Drive,
toolpath
generation.
That's
where
CNC
machines,
gear
downs
for
power,
3d
printed
extruder
designs.
A
So
if
we
focus
on
a
3d
printer,
we
want
to
know
how
to
design
an
effective
extruder,
because
that's
the
core
tool
head
of
a
3d
printer,
the
shafts
and
bearings
couplers
pulleys
belt,
sprockets
and
screws.
You
got
to
know
how
some
calculations
like
force
and
torque
structural
calculations,
thermal
calculations,
then
there's
basic
circuits
for
making
all
kinds
of
electronics
assist
to
whatever
we're
building.
Then
there's
hydraulics
the
high
torque
high
power
motion,
kind
of
elements
like
for
tractors
or
heavy-duty
CNC
machines.
A
Heater
elements
are
relevant
for
many
things,
from
the
heaters
and
extruders
and
filament
makers
and
extruder
proper
or
like
even
melting,
metal
or
other
things
without
electric
heating
and
then
CNC
machine
design
will
basically
cover
what
are
the
main.
So
if
you've
got
frames
and
precision
motion
systems,
what
are
the
main
features
of
a
given
device
like?
What's
a
3d
printer
need
to
do?
What
does
a
CNC
torch
have
to
do?
A
What
are
the
critical
elements
that
differentiated
from
differentiate
that
particular
tool
had
an
infrastructure
support
that
it
requires
from
any
other
machine,
because
there's
certain
like
after
you
have
the
frame
and
and
motion
and
the
tool
had?
There
is
also
some
specific
support
like,
for
example,
for
a
CNC
torch
table
possible
support
would
be
a
waterbed
where
the
metal
actually
lays
on
top
of
it,
so
that
the
water
cools
off
the
metal
as
you're
cutting.
So
it
doesn't
warp
things
like
that,
so
each
device
will
have
particular
features
like,
for
example,
heavy
duty.
A
Cnc
mill
might
have
have
lubricant
or
cooling
as
something
that
sprays,
the
parts
so
that
the
cutting
can
take
place
with
less
friction
and
less
heat,
so
there's
unique
properties
and
we'll
go
over
through
all
of
them.
What
what
those
are
for
many
different
devices,
but
besides
that
we're
getting
ready
for
the
event
and
put
out
some
marketing
on
that,
just
public
keeping
on
publishing
that
so
sign
up
for
that
and
open
source
microfactory
steam
camp.
Okay.
So,
but
that's
really
about
it!
A
For
me,
I'm
continuing
to
work
on
a
printer,
we're
gonna
prototype
some
of
the
axes.
Elements
get
all
the
materials
a
lot
of
preparation
on
that,
including
is
doing
the
internet
here.
So
we've
got
the
fast
gigabit
internet
and
we
need
to
trench
to
all
the
buildings
and
spread
the
internet
throughout,
because
we've
got
a
one
gig
line
and
we're
gonna
have
for
the
first
time
a
really
effective
internet,
so
others
could
collaborate.
So
actually
some
people
have
also
signed
up
for
the
remote
version
of
the
workshop.
A
We
do
have
actually
a
remote
option
under
the
registration
or,
if
you
want
to
just
view
the
18
lessons
and
some
of
the
presentations
within
the
workshop.
You
can
do
that
and
it's
me
myself,
William,
Neil
and
Katerina
presenting
throughout
this,
so
should
be
a
good
event.
Okay,
but
that's
it
for
me
and
I'm
gonna
go
back
to
doing
prep
work,
so
maybe
that's
hear
from
some
updates.
Abe
do
you
have
you
have
any
updates
there.
A
A
C
A
C
B
C
Simple
that
yeah
I
can
see
that
being
easy
to
just
ill,
actually
for
the
most
part,
and
actually
I've
got
some
things
that
it
might
be
more
simplified.
Well,
it
looks
like
there's
different
options
in
that
design,
but
that's
an
interesting
design,
so
yeah
and
I
guess
some
of
the
cab
there,
students
still
working
on
that.
A
C
Of
it
probably
needs
a
bit
more
work,
but
and
there's
some
pictures
that
I
know
send
some
of
the
documentation
and
the
Google
Drive
I
see
photos
of
things,
but
I,
don't
think
that
I
see
photos
of
CAD,
but
then
the
CAD
files
aren't
actually
there
yet
so
I
guess
it's
a
work
in
progress.
Obviously,
so
we'll
just
have
to
get
think
it
with
well
iam
more
on
I,
don't
know
I'm
going
and
what
they,
if
it
is
on
one
on
that
or
I,
don't
recall,
call
I
can't
or
which
students
are
working
on
that.
A
C
Let's
see
I
had
some
thinking
about
the
frame.
I
hadn't
been
finding
a
lot
of
research
on
putting
like
concrete
in
PVC
tubes,
at
least
for
small
PVC
tubes
and
and
some
of
the
you
know,
I
think
there'd
be
information
about
that.
That's
frequently
done
for
larger
pipes
for
various
purposes,
but
I
do
finally
search
up
more
stuff.
I
found
a
whole
thread
on
the
RepRap
aside
on.
C
You
know
that
being
concerned
about
just
plastic
printable
frames
and
that
kind
of
thing
and
more
advanced
designs
that
and
there
was
could
have
information
in
there.
That
was
interesting
about
yeah
plastic,
tube
style
frames
are
just
filling
with
stuff
and
they
have
tensioned
and
compressed
and
strained
frames.
Some
people
did
build
that
were
fairly
simple.
A
C
I
did
find
more
information
about
concrete,
infill
and,
and
some
people
were
in
filling
it
with
sand
and
then
sand
and
epoxy
mixes,
and
things
like
that,
and
it
was
suggested
that
even
just
spray
foam
into
the
PVC
was
adding
quite
a
bit
of
stiffness.
I
saw
some
comments
on
that.
So,
but
I
was
thinking
that
infill
congregate
might
not
even
visit
the
thing
I.
Some
other
information
Americans
was
stressing
pipes.
If
you
can
compress
or
tendon,
you
know
a
pipe
you,
you
can
increase
the
stiffness
o'clock
at
night.
C
I,
don't
find
out
the
details
about
physics,
but
that
I
don't
know
what
information
there
should
be
quite
a
bit
of
architectural
engineering
information,
but
that
kind
of
thing
too,
but
it's
probably
a
little
different
scale,
but
I
was
thinking
that
might
almost
be
easier
to
design
it
so
that
you
could
run
filament
or
wire
through
the
frame
in
some
way
and
maybe
tension
the
frame
and
adjust
it
that
way.
And
then
you
could
still
take
the
whole
thing.
Apart
again,
yeah.
A
C
Nothing
would
we
cool
it
together,
all
right,
some
kind
of
moister
than
that
I
I
could
think
of
me.
A
smaller
frame
would
be
better,
but
in
some
ways,
looking
at
John's
frame,
d30
Ohio
a
little
bit
trying
to
get
more
access
to
information
on
that.
The
the
frame
that
bigger
that
way
with
the
bolt
in
some
ways
is
simpler.
The
clamp
is
nice
and
I
think
the
clamp
will
work,
even
if
it
needs
adjustment
as
long
as
it
holds
tight,
no,
no
on
the
main
four
top
four
corners
as
long
as
it
doesn't
slip.
C
Much
it'll
be
okay,
but
in
some
ways
making
a
larger
frame
instead
of
a
smaller
frame.
As
long
as
you've
got
sheet,
plastic
seems
okay
to
and
then
you
wouldn't
have
to
print
it's
much
plastic
and,
of
course,
a
to
feet
were
huge
printers
to
print
the
entire
frame,
and
you
muzzle
just
print
all
holes
into
plastic
tubes
and
assemble
it
that
way
with
just
bolts
and
the
clamp
would
no
longer
be
necessary.
C
A
A
B
A
B
C
B
C
B
C
Yeah,
the
the
steel
for
just
a
standard
d30
that
Marx
is
building
all
amount
of
is
really
nice
because
it's
well,
it's
it's
square.
You
know
pieces
that
are
cut
and
they're
solid.
I
was
looking
at
the
the
other
day
too,
and
thinking
it's
unfortunate.
We
can't
make
a
simpler
well
stocks.
Neil
is
just
really
hard
to
build
a
frame
out
of
because
you'd
have
to
bolt
it
together.
In
too
many
points.
C
C
B
C
B
C
B
Not
that
it's
it's
called
polymer
concrete,
it's
a
different
type,
it's
a
concrete!
Technically,
it's
anything
which
is
a
binder,
can
mixed
with
an
aggregate.
So
you
have
the
aggregate
which
is
sand
in
this
case
and
then
there's
the
polymer
material,
which
is
usually
thermoset
polyurethanes.
B
C
A
C
C
It
can
be
an
issue
occasionally
so
there's
there's
certain
parts,
people
print
that
tend
to
to
resonate
significantly
if
it
was
tensioned
with
a
wire
filament
with
a
hollow
hollow
tube
structure
like
that,
then
technically,
you
could
actually
tune
it
I'm
sure,
there's
lots
of
ways
to
do
that.
You
just
tab
the
bolts
on
your
on
your
printer.
It
is
what
one
of
those
videos
sound
like
you,
just
kind
of
tweak
things
a
little
and
it'll
change
the
resident's.
C
You
see
some
designs
for
C
and
C
with
conduit
and
things
like
that.
But
it's
gonna
have
a
certain
amount
of
sag
at
some
point
and
flexibility.
So
I,
don't
know
how,
because
I
didn't
find
enough
math
on
it
yet,
but
forgive
you
can
tension
or
compress
the
pipe
that
way,
it
might
add
some
stiffness
and
and
some
dampening
effects.
C
Math
is
on
that,
like
you
know
what
what
the
scale
of
the
effects
are
for
length
and
all
that
kind
of
stuff
and
how
much
force
you
would
have
to
tension
things
with,
but
I
can
be
done
with
wire
and
I.
They
can
do
that.
There's
monofilament,
of
course
our
super-strong
hundred
hundreds
of
pound,
monofilament
sand,
I
guess,
there's
other
films
which
I
suppose.
If
we
had
a
precise
enough
extruder
as
I
understand,
you
could
extrude
that
but
easy.
C
C
Yeah
I'm,
not
I,
haven't
seen
the
state
some
of
the
results
from
the
prints
and
d3
and
everything,
and
of
course
it
all
depends
on
what
speed
and
what
accuracy
considering
printing
that.
So,
yes,
I
think
that
I
don't
know
what
kind
of
industry
standards
there
are
for
determining
print,
but
it
seems
like
maybe
maybe
there's
a
need
for
some
open
standards
for
concerning.
A
C
To
show
I
mean
there's
Benji's,
obviously,
but
it
seems
like
maybe
some
industrial
type
test
which
I'm
sure
there
are
certain
things
in
industry
they
can
print.
The
test,
like
I
sees
people
printing
more
useful
things
like
not
living
hinges
that
those
break
easy,
but
that
that
is
something
that's
probably
hard
to
print
in
some
cases.
C
But
I've
seen
things
like
operational
pin,
hinges
and
stuff
like
that
to
be
difficult
to
print,
and
that
might
be
a
good
way
to
test
precision
and
in
speed,
because,
obviously
you
know
the
approaching
getting
the
d30
to
more
professional
quality.
Is,
it's
probably
you
know
a
matter
of
speed,
and
I
don't
know
what
the
speed
in
comparative
results
are.
So
that's
one
thing:
it
seems
like
some
standards
or
something
in
its
current
state
or.
B
C
B
C
B
C
C
C
And
only
like
12
feet
for
a
small
frame
and
I
think
it
may
be
even
combinations
of
stuff
in
the
frame
would
be
okay
because
it
might
balance
the
weight
or
something
I.
Think
a
lot
of
the
stiffness
and
some
of
the
strength
of
the
frame.
A
lot
of
its
gonna
come
from
mounting
all
the
the
axes
on
it,
which
is
partly
why
I'm
concerned
about
not
bolting
the
axes
directly
to
it
with
those
clamps
John's
frame.
It
sounds
like
his
works
well,
and
it's
I
think
that
16
inches
or
more.
C
C
Guess
the
men's
on
what
materials
it
can
do
and
how
accurate
that
is,
I
understand
that
the
finite
element
and
also
stuff,
is
it
it's
gonna
be
now
based
on
how
well
you
can
actually
model
the
actual
material
and
forces
which
you
know
that's
complicated.
Is
the
seam
you're
talking
about
a
prison
using
360
I,
don't
know
what
its
capabilities
are.
C
It
looked
pretty
easy
to
do
some
of
that
in
freak
head
and
I
did
a
little
bit
of
modeling,
but
I
assume
there's
a
lot
more
setup
and
you
have
to
know
how
it
works.
You
know
or
get
it
to
do
the
analysis
relatively
accurately
and
of
course,
I
assume
it's
it's
only
good
to
you
know
a
certain
percentage
or
so
many
decimals,
and
you
know
it's
approximate
to
real-world
depending
on
what
sort
of
testing.
Obviously
it's
just
a
static
and
not
like
dynamic
load
testing.
All
right
finite
element
analysis.
C
Might
actually
be
just
take
less
time
than
trying
to
do
some
of
the
cat
stuff
sometimes,
but
it's
useful
to
do
both
I,
don't
have
a
exact
schedule,
but
I'm
hoping
that
I
keep
thinking
well,
I'd
like
to
finish
it
pretty
quick
this
this
summer,
but
and
you
know,
get
something
working
but
I'm
thinking,
I'll
piece
it
together
in
tests.
You
know
maybe
the
whole
thing:
I
don't
even
have
hardly
any
parts,
although
I
have
a
lot
of
tools
and
equipment
in
some
some
parts
around,
but
I'll,
probably
reorder.
C
My
parts
Electronics
is
honour
for
just
general
use
but
hoping
to
build
it
pretty
soon
this
this
summer,
but
there's
those
delays
and
stuff
I
keep
having
to
figure
out
different
attachment
points,
and
it's
gonna
require
a
lot
of
testing.
That's
mostly
what
it
is.
It's
a
development
order,
type
really
so
I
expected
to
I'm
skeptical
of
a
bunch
of
different
aspects
of
it
and
they
keep
questioning
some
of
the
designs
on
that.
The
frame
but
I
kind
of
like
the
the
way
I've
set
up
the
axes
are
fall.
C
C
Don't
know
how
many
hours
I'm
hoping
that
I
can
get
the
CAD.
You
know
pretty
thorough,
assuming
there
aren't
too
many
changes
after
the
fact
two
hours,
just
developing
simple
things
like
the
clamp
and
we'll
see
how
all
that
works.
So
it's
still
an
interesting
part,
but
a
lot
of
little
things
take
take
a
lot
of
time.
So
how
could
a
few
hours
and
they're
already
over
the
last
months,
but.
C
Hoping
I
can
accelerate
the
build
and
I'm
hoping
I
can
do
within
assuming
the
assembly
will
take
so
many
days,
but
I
I'll
probably
ask
will
it
more
than
once
to
test
different
things
so
that
that's
the
the
question
it
may
take
a
few
months
so
that
could
be
it
could
be
I,
don't
know
if
it'll
be
a
hundred
hours,
but
you
know
hopefully
I
can
do
it
in
less
than
that.
Only
fifty
or
something
but
not
counting
the
previous
time,
but
yeah
yeah,
so
I
figure
if
I
actually
get
in
ten
hours.
A
C
C
C
Yeah
I
I
suppose
that
the
hard
part
that
Elsie
already
has
the
initial
infrastructure
because
they
undo
to
begin
with,
and
that's
a
lot
of
it.
That's
initial.
You
I
mean
how
do
you
start
kind
of
without
that,
of
course,
as
much
as
the
bootstrap
things
better
and
that's
that's
hard
I
mean
we
don't
have
enough.
C
C
C
They
have
a
begin
with
sometimes
I
think.
Well,
they
could
have
got
stuff,
but
it
people
is
gonna
cost
it's
usually
labor
cuts
are
usually
higher
right,
so
it
one
way
or
another.
Even
if
you
get
people
to
work
cheap
or
pay
to
come
to
workshops
that
it's
still
kind
of
costly
I
guess
that's
sort
of
the
issues
they're
having
but.
C
C
You
have
to
produce
enough
stuff.
That's
why
I'm
hopeful
I
mean
how
much
he
keeps
talking
about
producing
different
things.
I
know
that's
hard
when
I
don't
have
the
people
for
him
to
keep
up
with
in
for
them
to
do
just
a
few
people,
they're
tough
for
them
to
run
any
kind
of
actual
business,
so
they
have
to
bootstrap
something
and
I
know
that
it's
probably
more
probably
more
interested
in
doing
the
administrative
stuff,
and
it's
always
been
that
they
want
to
get
other
people
to
replicate
the
business
stuff.
So.
C
Yeah,
you
know
so
textbook
products
in
the
open-source
everything
store,
I,
guess,
there's
a
lot
of
things
that
could
be
produced,
just
support,
I,
guess
a
campus,
but
in
marketing
I
think
that
the
printer
replication
stuff
it's
kind
of
hard,
because
it's
limited
market,
but
there's
people
always
go
with
easier,
easier
stuff.
People
will
go
by
the
process,
not
the
holes,
but
cuz.
Those
are
expensive,
except
for
maybe
businesses
might
buy
those
more
expensive,
3d
printers
more
readily,
because
it's
it's
a
it's
an
easy
ecosystem
to
just
adapt,
adapt
something
in
the
lulzbot.
C
C
C
C
Yeah
so
I
fit
in
the
theory.
130
is
I,
don't
know
improve
on
the
drawbacks.
I
think
a
lot
of
it
is
usually
cheaper
and
cheaper,
isn't
always
a
better
or
more
sustainable,
but
that
that's
like
the
starting
point.
You
know
there
has
been
a
shift
I
think
much
in
case.
Our
more
is
a
shift
to
more
off-the-shelf
parts
so
that
it's
easier
and
there's
so
much
supply
for
these
cheap
printer
parts.
C
C
C
C
The
different
a
slightly
different
design
with
this
PVC
or
something
might
be
useful
in
designing
other
parts,
thinking
that
the
universal
access
is
pretty
nice,
but
I'm
sure
that
there's
pros
and
cons
I
haven't
worked
with
it
enough
for
any
3d
printers
enough
to
know
exactly
so.
I
figured
I'd
start
with
something
real
simple
and
that
that
will
make
it
easier
to
just
kind
of
learn
home
but
stuff
fairly
yeah.
The
people
I
guess
they're
trying
to
sell
them
in.
C
C
I
guess,
if
I
I,
if
it
was
like
a
better
one
and
I,
didn't
want
to
spend
the
time
to
put
it
together,
I
probably
would
I
mean
I'm
kind
of
interested
in
the
one
to
start
with
just
to
learn
about
cuz
building
them
is
a
great
way
to
learn
about
it.
If
you
don't
know,
I
mean
that's
kind
of
the
workshop
model.
C
That
there's
so
much
cheap,
stuff,
china,
and
if
people
are
interested,
they
people
tend
to
just
buy
something.
But
yes,
it
depends
on
how
easy
the
kits
are
I.
Think
that's
a
lot
of
its
the
logistics
which
the
manual
for
the
d30
is
looking
pretty
good
a
lot
better.
They
did
a
lot
of
work
on
that
I.
Think
there's
a
bunch
of
things
that
have
been
simplified
in
the
build.
The
magnets
surprisingly
didn't
work
out,
so
I
think
things
keep
changing
on
that.
C
C
Yeah
yeah
the
men
for
building
the
kit
in
a
workshop
there's
a
small
fraction
of
people
who
want
a
printer,
yeah
and
I,
don't
see
that
the
printers
artist
Lee
ever
gonna
be
a
huge
demand
for
everybody.
I
mean
you
see
lots
of
expensive
different
machines
targeting
like
small
business
to
build,
like
you
know,
they're
doing
the
lasers
they're
all
proprietary
all
the
time,
but.
C
People
that
have
the
money
for
small
businesses
they'll
eventually
go
with
those
easy
proprietary
solutions,
so,
but
a
lot
of
time,
their
solutions
have
to
be
good
enough
to
best
those
in
some
ways.
It's
hard
to
get
a
lot
of
those
her
stuff
does
work
well,
and
sometimes
it's
actually
the
software,
but.
C
C
Obviously
the
hardware,
the
the
whole
ecosystem
real
hardware
and
like
the
global
village,
Construction
Set
machines,
or
even
just
the
micro
factory,
isn't
there
yet.
So
it
is
a
not
a
products,
it's
kind
of
it
there's
some
chicken-and-egg
issues,
but
you
kind
of
have
to
have
things
good
enough
before
you
get
to
a
certain
point
before
people
will
take
it
seriously.
I
guess
or
enough
percentage
of
people
want
to
buy
into
the
concept.
C
C
C
C
C
Cnc
mill,
whether
they
have
certain
things,
but
they
don't
have
a
you
know
like
a
full
shop
mill
that
you
can
then
use
to
bootstrap
and
build
everything
else,
because
if
you
have
like
a
lathe
is
what
I
mean
not
just
a
mill
but
a
layer
that,
because
you
tar
screws
and
make
bolts
right,
you
can
build
anything
if
you
can
do
that.
So
as
customers
that
didn't
start
with
that,
but
making
certain
machines
first
sometimes
does
seem
like
a
good
idea.
C
C
C
Yeah
I
mean
I
could
keep
talking
a
little
too,
but
I
do
kind
of
need
to
get
out
during
the
day
and
do
certain
things
so
yeah
I
mean
we
could
go
on.
A
lot
of
the
certificates
gets
discussed
a
lot
of
the
time
and
and
I
don't
know
if
without
numbers
in
specifics
and
graphics,
no
open.
This
points
not
easy,
and
that's
eventually
what
needs
to
be
done.
So
it's
like
you
know,
but
open
source
justice,
even
if
you're
open
sourcing
the
business
plan.
C
The
problem
is,
it's
never
gonna
be
the
same
for
any
demographic
or
region.
It's
it's
a
very
different
thing.
For
probably
everybody
that's
going
to
try
to
do
a
business
in
a
different
area
or
something
like
that.
So
it's
hard
to
discuss
some
of
those
things
and
we
can't
have
enough
detail.
I
mean
we
can
generalize
about
it.
C
C
Yeah
keeping
people
engaged
is
as
hard
as
people
just
you
have
a
campus
with
educational
step
that
there's
lots
of
volunteer
educational
stuff,
I
think
where
they
constantly
get
students
and
people
to
come
through
engineers.
Maybe
even
some
experts
occasionally
like
with
opens
ecology
or
other
organizations
that
volunteer
around
the
world.
Just
you
know
doing.
C
C
There
are
well
I've,
seen
other
projects
and
sites,
and
these
are
related
I
think
sometimes
OSE
has
worked
with
some
of
those
just
just
like
websites
where
people
post
certain
stuff-
that's
open,
like
farm
hacks
and
things
like
that.
But
nobody
does
like
a
thorough
hundred.
You
know
around
open
hardware,
you
know
development
content,
so
I.
C
Almost
think
that
it
probably
getting
closer
to
some
some
of
the
opening,
the
machines
and
things
like
that.
Just
because
of
individual
work
on
projects
I
mean
just
RepRap
already
did
so
much
on
its
own.
It's
like
the
individual
organizations,
people
get
into
those
groups
and
do
stuff
online
and,
and
so
I've
been.
You
know
that
there's
these
open-source
projects
just
to
do
a
specific
thing,
and
eventually
they
keep
getting
some
of
those
machines
and.
C
C
You
know,
if
that's
something,
that's
productive,
but
machines
Burton.
So
that
far,
so
if
it's
kind
of
interesting
on
some
scale,
but
at
some
point
you
know
people
can
just
learn
to
to
do
certain
things.
Without
the
C
it's
C,
sometimes
yeah
physical
yeah,
the
physical
place
that
gets
gets
people
to
come.
C
But
a
lot
of
the
open
source
stuff
has
been
done
mostly
just
remotely
online,
but
there
are
serious
limitations.
That
means
it's
like
this
audio
issue
and
a
lot
of
times
in
the
meetings
of
stuff
I
have
to
go
back
through
things,
and
that
takes
more
time
because
a
remote
collaboration
is
pretty
imperfect.
C
C
C
Although
it's
a
person
how
many
people
a
few
people
will
do
that
they'll
just
find
plans
is
build
stuff
on
their
own
and
there's
many
people
that
build
stuff
on
their
own.
All
the
time
from
you
know
scratch
almost
don't
open-source
it
to
or
or
they
share
the
plans,
but
it's
not
really
open
source
yeah
yeah
they
they're.
Just
you
know
individuals
and
maybe
one
person
builds
it
and
then
nobody
else
ever
rep
kate's
it
so
and
usually
that's
because
the
documentation
isn't
perfect
or
people
don't
ever
build
it.
The
same.
C
C
C
C
Yeah
you've
got
to
have
a
full
business
model,
and
some
of
these
she
too,
is
it.
If
you
combine
that
the
farm
concept
with
the
other
business
stuff,
that
makes
things
somewhat
more
sustainable
too,
because
yeah
I
mean
your
basic
resource
is
food
at
least
and
other
things
so
that
having
a
farm
that's
functional
covers
some
of
that
and
people
can
spend
time
on
all
those
things,
but
need
to
get
people
to
do
that
concept
at
the
physical
location.