►
From YouTube: Collaborative Enterprise Seminar - Session 1
Description
Notes at https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/120_Design_Lessons_-_Day_7
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A
Recording
so
we're
recording
this
for
everybody
to
listen
to
anyone
who
else
is
following
open
source
development,
open
source
business
development,
it's
kind
of
a
new
topic.
Now
people
talk
about
how
you
actually
cultivate
enterprise
in
a
completely
open
way,
where
your
intent
is
to
distribute
that
enterprise
to
many
people
around
the
world,
because
you're
not
afraid
that
that's
going
to
hurt
you
in
fact,
you
think
that's
actually
going
to
completely
help.
A
A
B
A
Can
the
idea
here
was
to
to
start
documenting
as
much
enterprise
options
that
we
have
here
to
develop
with
open
source
ecology
in
terms
of
the
open
source
machines,
but
also
other
other
aspects
like
like
grants
or
collaborating
with
other
organizations
like
like
brian's
foundation
for
regeneration?
A
We
have
bnim
architects
who
are
collaborating
with
us
on
a
cdc
home.
We've
got
the
umkc
center
that
we
visited
last
night.
There's
lots
of
opportunity.
When
we
work
openly,
we
open
up
the
boundaries
and
and
involve
everybody.
So
I
did
started
or
it
was.
A
He
started
working
back
where
we
capturing
some
of
the
thoughts,
but
maybe
maybe
we
can
go
introducing
ourselves
in
terms
of
what
we
think
are
some
real
good
opportunities
that
we
see
in
front
of
us
and
actually
start
all
of
us
get
into
the
document
that
we
just
shared
there.
If
you
can.
A
A
Yeah,
so
the
document
is
there
and
we'll
go
as
far
on
it
as
we
can
in
terms
of
collaboratively,
editing
and
recording
katrina.
A
On
the
computer,
no
okay,
great
okay,
so
what
I'd
like
to
do
is
pretty
much
capture
as
we
go
forward
in
the
enterprise
sessions.
A
The
objective
is
to
to
develop
what
we're
working
on
here,
the
so
the
business
side
of
the
scenica
home
and
the
allied
things
that
can
come
out
as
we
think
about
six
months
from
now.
What
do
we
do?
Can
we
actually
make
make
a
living
more
of.
B
A
Doing
the
making
a
living
out
of
the
work
that
we
do
in
the
workshop,
it's
actually
starting
to
come
together
and
look
pretty
good
because
we're
building
a
lot
of
the
modules
and
we're
seeing
some
of
the
the
workflows
and
ergonomics
in
terms
of
we're
building
a
real
thing,
and
we
see
it
in
front
of
our
eyes
and
you
can
see
okay
well.
If
we
get
so
many
hours
per
house,
we
can
make
so
much
revenue
happen
from
that.
A
If
we've
got
a
good
design,
then
then
we
can
create
a
product
that
actually
works
and
the
concept
is
the
efficiency-
that's
involved
there,
but
let's
maybe
go
through
and
and
brian
welcome
to
the
show
here,
as
well
as
as
your
remote
there
at
your
house.
But
I'd
like
to
hear
and
document
so
I'll.
Take
notes
and
I
encourage
everybody
to
take
notes
in
the
working
document,
the
the
the
google
doc,
simply
the
open
source
enterprises
and
record
as
much
and
and
continue
evolving
the
thinking
capturing
some
of
the
critical
issues.
A
Is
documenting
the
insights
that
otherwise
would
be
very
hard
for
you
to
learn
on
your
own
and
that's
the
whole
part
of
the
collaborative
effort
to
make
it
easy
for
everybody.
So
we're
sharing
this
information
openly
without
fear
that
someone
might
take
us
out
of
business.
We
don't
think
like
that,
and
therefore
we
are
willing
to
reveal
as
much
as
possible
as
our
value
proposition.
So
maybe.
A
That
what
I
see,
maybe
maybe
framing
around
what
we
see
because
I
mean
there
are
so
many
opportunities
here
and
I
think
a
lot
of
this
is
first.
Maybe
we
can
share
the
thoughts
that
we
have
on
what's
a
particular
development
and
maybe
some
insights
around
that
what
gets
us
excited
and
what
we
could
see
as
a
as
a
possibility.
So
I'll
start,
maybe
I'll
start
and
I'll
mention
two
things,
because
I
see
there's
there's
two
two
main
things
that
I
see
coming
on
my
side
that
I
could
see
a
clear
revenue
model.
A
It's
literally
like
can
you
imagine
this?
Can
you
execute
it?
It
starts
with
real
clarity
on
what
what's
involved.
What
I
see
is
still
the
same
same
old,
same
old
we've
been
talking
about
for
a
long
time,
and
that
is
the
model
where
we're
getting
the
efficiency
of
the
house
build
I'm
looking
at
a
general
figure
of
about
500
hours
per
per
house
that
we
build
and
that's
kind
of
the
milestone
in
my
mind
that
we're
shooting,
for
if
we
achieve
that,
I
think
all
of
us
could
be
happy
in
terms
of
yes.
A
We
probably
can
simply
get
clients
well,
client,
we're
not
talking
yet
about
marketing,
but
just
the
product
side.
First
of
course,
then
you
have
to
have
marketing
but
we're
at
the
product
stage
at
this
time,
where
we're
developing
very
clearly,
but
I'm
seeing
that
if
we
can
get
this
down
to
500
hours
of
build
time
per
house,
that.
A
B
A
E
A
That
you're
providing
a
turnkey
house
to
a
person
that
that
they
buy
that
from
you.
Ideally,
you
would
have
well
first,
you
got
to
start
with
a
single
model,
but
I
see
that
evolving
into
a
designer
where
you
can
design
any
kind
of
a
modification
of
this
larger,
smart,
smaller
size
and
the
economics
work
if
it's
500
hours,
if
the
current
model
is
like
if
osce
is
running,
if
there's
overhead
and
things
like
that,
we
could
pay
people
50
bucks
an
hour,
so
it's
500
hours
times,
50
comes
out
to
25.
A
So
if
we're
paying
actual
workers,
fifty
bucks
an
hour,
this,
I
think,
could
work
and
then
there's
25k.
That
would
go
to
osc
for
overhead
and
organization
and
all
that
that's
one
model
that
I
could
see
very
clearly
and
specifically
right
now.
We're
finished
at
the
six
months
500
hours
and
that
would
make
it
work.
I
think
we
can
possibly
do
a
little
better
too.
That
would
definitely
be
sufficient
if
it
goes
it's
all
about.
A
How
far
can
we
get
in
terms
of
development,
and
I
think
if
we
don't
get
there,
if
we
don't
get
to
to
that
metric
of
500
less
than
that,
like,
I
would
say
we
can
squeeze
by
if
we're,
if
we're,
if
our
time
is
still
about
a
thousand
hours
per
build,
I
mean
it's
twice:
that's
huge
difference
in
efficiency,
and
but
it's
really
that
can
we
get
to
to
a
very
highly
efficient
state
in
our
work.
That's
one
model
so.
A
That's
a
nutshell
of
it
and
I
could
see
very
clearly
like
if
we
have
that
milestone
this
house.
That's
a
thousand
square
feet.
500
hours,
25k
we
pay
out
to
workers.
25K
goes
to
the
organization.
That's
the
nutshell:
that's
like
the
one
paragraph
executive
summary
of
what
I
could
see
as
working
assuming
that
we've
got
everything
in
place.
The
product
is
developed
and
then
we're
able
to
secure
clients.
A
Now
as
soon
as
we
can
get
that,
I
believe-
and
we
can
offer
something
like
yesterday-
we're
talking
with
the
architects
from
bniam
bien
and
they
they
are
saying.
Well,
whatever
you
do
with
that,
it's
better
wherever
you
put
it
in
any
neighborhood
it
better
fit.
I
mean
that
was
one
of
the
comments
we
had.
You
can
just
plop
some
spaceship
from
elsewhere,
but
I
think
we're
quite
flexible
on
that.
We
can
skin
it
as
well
as
landscape
it
to
fit.
You
can
have
different
different
coverings
on
the
house
or
whatever.
A
So
I
think
I
think
that
could
work
so
the
second
one
that
I
see
very
clearly
is
so
the
grand
grand
stuff
with
with
sbir
sttr,
like
we
got
connected
to
last
night
where
effectively,
because
we
have
worked
on
this
for
the
last
decade.
We've
got
many
many
prototypes.
The
message.
A
Hardly
hear
you,
though,
can
you
can
you.
E
Oh,
can
you
hear
me
now.
A
Pretty
good,
can
you
guys
hear.
B
A
B
A
So
I
mentioned
some
of
the
those
in
the
in
the
google
doc,
everything
from
the
open
source
micro
factory,
the
cb
press,
nickel,
iron
batteries,
aquaponics
based
closed
loop,
water
systems,
which
we're
developing
large
scale,
3d
printers
cnc
torch
table,
tractor
micro
tractor
360
degree
backhoe,
there's,
possibly
some
of
the
cnc
machines.
I
mean
that's
all
things
that
we
have
prototype
to
some
extent
and
we
can
take
to
the
finish
line
with
with
grants
such
as
sbir
and
sttr.
So
I.
A
A
F
B
B
A
To
do,
I
think,
with
the
sttr
the
other
way
to
that's
the
other
brand
of
grants.
I
think
we
were
talking
about.
You
have
to
be
an
a
research,
some
kind
of
a
research
non-profit
research
center
that
could
we
could
qualify
for
that.
So
we
can
look
into
more.
A
C
G
G
A
G
B
A
So
that's
something
we
can
consider.
I
mean
the
realistic
question
is
for
us:
it's
like
okay.
Well,
I
don't
have
to
write
this.
I
can
work
with
somebody
or
we
should
talk
about.
There's
possibilities
to
collaborate
with
people
to
do
to
write
and
do
this
grant
writing
I
mean
absolutely
so
when
we
say
we
can
do
it,
I
don't
mean
I
guess
I
have
to
do
it
all
myself
and
I
never
say
that
I,
I
will
always
say:
okay,
we
can
collaborate
with
people
or
bring
some
other
people
in.
A
If
we
decide
to
pursue
it,
then
we
could
allocate
some
resources
to
making
that
happen.
So
those
are
two
things
I
I
could
see
definitely
contributing
it's
it's
something
that
I
mean.
Of
course,
then
we
can
apply.
You
know
we
can
do
it.
Maybe
as
a
thing,
that's,
if
we
don't
want
to
catch
this
cycle,
we
can
of
course
catch
the
next
cycle.
The
concept.
A
Six
months,
maybe
you
guys
want
to
do
something
like
that,
and
and
since
we
have
all
this
prior
art
here,
you
can
build
on.
I
mean
that's
a
perfect.
A
A
Exactly
so,
I'm
quite
encouraged
about
the
future
for
all
the
people
coming
here,
including
myself,
and
anyone
who
collaborates
remotely
as
well.
So
that's
great,
that's
just
a
great
opportunity
so
I'll
quit
at
that,
and
so
maybe
we
can
go
around.
Who
wants
to
go
next
as
far
as
what?
What
we
think
are
some
of
the
most
potent
things
we
can
develop
as
enterprise,
just
just
getting
a
throwdown
of
all
the
possibilities
here.
A
G
B
A
Wants
to
go
next,
though,
okay,
so
paul,
please
let
me
just
join
right
back
in
okay.
A
A
Okay,
so
we'll
have
the
next
person
in
line
here,
we'll
share
our
stories
and
we'll
record
that
so
please
actively
try
to
edit
the
working
docs.
So
we
can
catch
all
this
and,
of
course
we
can.
Since
we're
recording
the
video,
we
can
go
back
in
the
notes
and
capture
anything
that
we
have
missed.
C
A
A
B
H
Great
so
I'll
start
with
just
editing
the
main
documentary
martian
poster
hi
everyone,
I'm
paul
you've,
been
building
walls
of
paper
this
past
week.
H
This
yeah,
my
name,
is
paul
an
apprentice
here
at
osce
and
in
detroit
I've
started
a
company
called
detroit
arcology
and
we
have
presented
a
design
to
the
city
of
detroit
for
multi-family
ced
housing,
using
the
seat
of
home
design,
and
so
in
detroit,
I've
spent
the
last
several
months
since
october,
becoming
familiar
with
the
pipeline
to
buy
inexpensive
land.
There
are
a
lot
of
empty
lots
and
also
abandoned
buildings
in
detroit.
Many
of
them
are
owned
by
the
detroit
land
bank,
who
has
a
mandate
to
see
them
such
productive
use?
H
You
know
one
of
the
formerly
great
manufacturing
centers
of
the
us
are
just
making
a
comeback
and
to
be
part
of
that,
there's
definitely
a
big
need
for
affordable
housing,
so
many
neighbors
and
residents
are
excited
and
open
to
do
experimental
ideas
because
they
feel
like
the
existing
ones
and
the
government
haven't
been
able
to
help
them
there's
a
high
foreclosure
rate.
H
You
know
many
of
you
are
familiar
with
this
problem
where
people
leave
the
city
and
then
the
people
who
are
left
behind
are
less
able
to
maintain
the
infrastructure
and
pay
the
taxes,
and
so
oh
yeah.
They
tend
to
leave
even
more
and
then
at
least
more
foreclosure
rate
for
people
who
stay
behind
then
and
it's
kind
of
a
doom
cycle.
But
there
is
a
way
to
reverse
it,
and
I
think
city
go
home,
can
play
a
part
in
them.
So
we
smoke
a
lot.
H
So
one
lot
is
6
400
square
feet
and
the
price
from
the
land
bank
is
a
dollar
40
per
square
foot,
which
is
very
below
market
rate.
Probably
it's
comparable
in
kansas
city
as
well
or
st
louis.
You
know
many
civilians.
B
H
You
know
towns
in
indiana
and
so
forth,
and
so
that
works
out
to
be
nine
thousand
dollars
for
a
lot,
and
this
is
a
lot
you
can
build
to
see
become
one.
You
can
build
a
greenhouse
lawn
for
an
urban
garden.
So
it's
good
to
experiment.
It's
you
know.
I
lived
in
new
york
city
before
that
and
it
was
prohibited
to
acquire
a
lot
for
any
kind
of
experimentation,
but
you
could
adversarially
just
sort
of
take
over
a
lot
and
the
city
usually
wouldn't
stop
you.
H
If,
if
the
neighborhood
like
you,
if
you're
doing
your.
B
H
E
H
A
Right
somebody
say:
yes,
somebody
affirm
from
remote.
H
H
That's
a
good
question:
we
want
to
start
with
one
as
our
prototype
just
to
be
the
first
to
be
home
in
a
major
american
city.
You
know,
kansas
city
also
would
be
a
major
american
city,
but
you
know
I
live
in
detroit,
so
I've
been
putting
the
most
effort
in
there
and
then
it
could
be
toured
by
city
officials.
It
could
be
potential
franchise,
builders
and
people
who
want
to
be
builders
of
this
methodology,
because
you
know
it's
clearly
cheaper
and
has
a
lot
of
great
benefits
over
traditional
buildings.
H
Just
unusual
just
people
don't
know
it
yet.
So
this
is
one
way
to
get
them
familiar,
so
it
seems
less
strange
potential
customers,
people
who
want
this
home.
You
know
if
we
build
a
city
to
go
home
and
they
like
it,
they
just
walk
by
in
the
street
and
they
say
hey
who
built
that
right.
I
want
one
of
those
potential
osu
contributors,
people
who
you
know.
B
B
H
H
Can
come
by
and
see
a
person
neighbors
know
just
people
who
would
live
next
to
an
osce,
home
and
the
wider
world.
So
those
are
the
benefits
of
building
in
detroit
I'll
get
off
my
soapbox
and
then
the
ceb
and
geothermal
approach
would
be
well
suited
to
detroit,
because
there
are
extremes
in
place
during
summer
because
you
haven't
got
to
detroit
yeah.
We
can
get
to
two
degrees,
fahrenheit
and
you
know
sometimes
less
so,
and
that's
for
most
of
january
and
february,
so
pretty
extreme
and
then
also
august
and
july
timeframe.
H
Right
now
be
very
hot
and
also
have
flash
floods
which
they're
going
they're
going
through
right
now
and
so
geothermal
and
cev
would
be
flood
proof.
Fireproof
would
provide
energy,
sorry,
temperature
stabilization,
which
currently,
I
think
all
the
earthships
brag
about
having
like
people
can
survive
in
the
high
desert
or
the
blazing
summer
heat
comfortably
in
earth
ship
that
stays
at
70
degrees
and.
J
H
They've
just
been
overlooked
like
if
you
name
a
city
in
the
midwest
like
bloomington,
indiana,
cincinnati,
ohio,
most
cities
in
ohio.
You
know
people
say
alabama
mississippi.
You
know
it's
probably
very
similar,
probably
towns
in
kentucky.
You
know
I've
lived
in
those
areas,
you
know
even
I
agree
with
them,
and
you
know
I
grew
up
in
oklahoma
and
people
consider
that
flyover
country.
So
you
know
literally.
A
H
H
The
city
of
detroit
specifically
has
taken
these
lands
back,
usually
their
addictions
are
foreclosures,
usually
foreclosures
people
have
left
and
or
they
couldn't
pay
their
back
taxes
and
the
city
has
taken
them
back
and
wants
to
give
them
to
a
responsible
owner.
A
H
That
in
detroit,
specifically
that
experienced
the
biggest
flight
of
people
to
the
suburbs,
and
so
they
have
the
biggest
stock.
You
know
it's
a
city
of
like
800
000
people
now
and
it's
designed
to
be
a
city
of
millions.
A
A
H
Right
from
detroit-
and
I
know
the
process-
and
I
know
what
they're
looking
for
like
they
do-
want
to
fit
in
the
neighborhood
they're.
Okay,
with
a
weird
looking
house
like
ced,
I
have
eight
drinks,
which
are
another
sort
of
distinctive
design
that
you
can
use
for
cabin
rentals
and
operate
vacation,
airbnb
situations
and
they're,
okay,
with
like
one
or
two
lots
of
neighborhood
being
that
way,
but
not
the
whole
lot,
because
it
lowers
property
value
and
it's
a
little
bit
unusual.
So
you
have
to
pitch
it
carefully.
H
We
try
to
buy
like
a
15
000
square
foot
lot
and
that
was
too
big
for
these.
Like
small
designs,
like
it's
mismatched,
you
know
we
suggest
these
other
locks
instead,
and
you
know
several
months,
I'm
happy
to
all
the
months
that
I
spent
to
give
that
advice
or
experience
to
someone
else
or
to
have
them
work
with
us.
H
Ideally
to
have
us
collaborate,
because
the
goal
is,
you
know:
detroit's
not
set
up
like
new
york,
where
you,
like
click,
a
website,
click
button
on
zillow
and
then
close
on
the
property
in
like
30
days.
That's
that's
not
the
case.
It's
like
months
with
back
and
forth
and
is
your
use
out
of
the
city.
Is
there
if
the
city
department
handles
it?
Are
they
funded
enough
for
your
workers
to
show
up
every
day
to
answer
your
phone
calls
like
you
have
to
definitely
like
it?
You
have
to
drive
the
process
a
lot.
A
H
We
have
a
trello
board,
which
is
like
our
day-to-day
activities
and
finding
so
probably
my
emails
detroit.org.
So
I
put
that
link
in
the
document
that
contains
sort
of
the
most
relevant
things
like
the.
H
The
second
house
that
we
that
we're
renovating
right
now
links
to
our
chat
forums.
People
want
to
get
involved.
B
H
B
H
E
H
B
B
B
B
H
Like
if
someone
tells
me
the
sidewalk
is
going
to
be
demolished
in
two
months,
like
I
expected
to
continue
on
for
two
months
and
when
I
emailed
them
back
they'll
be
like
oh,
it
hasn't
happened
yet,
oh
well,
like
maybe
try
knowing
these
other
people
and
or
you
know
just
chill
it's
you
know
it's
mature,
we're
all
we're
all
doing
our
best,
and
so
I
yeah,
I
definitely
get
stressed
out.
I
wanted
to
drive
faster
and
they're
very
supportive
there's.
That's
not
the.
B
D
H
Do
support
experimental
structures
like
there
was
another
big
developer
from
brooklyn
who
built
these
large
quantity
of
aluminum
structures
and
that's
like
multi-million
dollar.
That's
refrigerant,
hipsters,
really
leaving
new
york
city
prices,
so
other
people
are
capitalizing
on
the
market,
which
means
the
reason
that
open.
E
Source
approaches
for.
H
Up
the
whole
whole
time,
but
everybody's
screen
share.
This
is
the
lot
we
pitched
it's
at
2091
seward
streets.
At
the
only
google
maps,
it
will
map
it.
It's
r3,
so
it's
zoned
for
three
families.
What's
this
address
2091
seward
yeah
in
detroit,
the
neighbors
called
the
style
gardens.
It's
actually
only
a
few
blocks
from
the
our
first
two
houses
and
yeah.
We,
you
know
we
welcome.
Everyone
come
to
us
in
detroit.
B
H
Stay
at
our
under
two
houses-
we're
getting
you
know,
we're
probably
working
plumbing
in
a
few
months
in
the
second
house.
H
And
you
know
we
want
to
have
a
community
garden
grow
food
and
the
driveways
like
car
share.
People
can
buy
their
own
cars,
and
this
design
is
for
the
original
micro
home,
which
you
know.
I
think
it's
like
300
square
feet.
So
it's
quite
small
and
we
wanted
to
make
it
a
line
on
the
south
axis
so
that
it
could
get
solar
power
and
heating
and
the
city.
B
H
To
combine
the
free
buildings
they
asked
like,
why
are
you
building
three
summer
buildings?
Why
not
make
the
one
building
it's
like?
Oh!
Well,
that's
a
great
idea.
The
design
came
to
me
from
the
open
source
design
original
design
from
caterina
single.
Oh,
you
know
I
was
just
gonna
switch
these
together
into
one
like,
even
just
like
double
walls
in
between
for
better
or
sound
insulation,
because
great
sound
insulation
and
whatever
people
want
around
home
is
to
not
be
other
neighbors
all
the
time.
H
So
if
anyone
here
is
interested
in
helping
me,
we
could
probably
do
something
way
more
clever
than
just
squishing
three
microphones
together,
but
that
will
work,
and
so
that's
the
approach
right
now.
That
was
the
main
feedback.
H
A
B
B
H
Here
it's
a
you
know:
three
bedroom
two-story
home
was
built
in
the
1920s.
It
has
like
a
close-up
garden
and
a
garage
in
the
back,
so
yeah
an
attic.
Basically
you
want
to
finish
and
how
much.
H
In
real
estate
negotiations,
where,
if
I
can
tell
what
a
house
is
worth,
I
like
low
ball
them
and
with
no
concessions
I
say
like
well,
I
know
the
house
is
trashed
or
it's
not
limited
for
two
years,
so
I'm
not
going
to
nickel
and
dine.
You
want
to
repair.
I'm
sorry.
This
is
my
offer
it's
much
lower
than
what
you
asked,
but
I'll
accept
it.
No
questions
and
it.
H
Yeah
that
part,
I
would
probably
say,
is
my
strength-
is
like
finding
underpriced
assets
and
kind
of
like
pulling
the
trigger.
H
That
was
a
private
owner
yeah,
the
land
bank
is
slower,
it
is
cheaper
for
sure,
but
you
have
to
you
know,
submit
a
review
of
what
you'll
do
with
the
design
that
they
have
to
approve
and
if
it's
been
demolished
recently,
they
have
to
check
because
the
sidewalk
has
been
demolished.
There's
a
lot
more
bureaucracy
to
get
the
cheap
price.
It's
like
a
trade-off.
E
H
There
are
auctions
in
september,
so
people
want
to
bid
on
detroit
houses
september
is
the
time
frame,
so
you
can
get
on
these
1
000
houses,
but
you
have
to
get
them
off
the
coat
at
six
months.
H
E
A
H
Things
like
there's
a
side
lot
program.
So
if
you
buy
a
house
with
empty
lots
because
they've
been
demolished,
you
can
get
them
for
a
hundred
dollars
extra.
So,
like
I
don't
know,
if
you
think
of
the
city
of
detroit,
like
the
game
of
mine
sweeper,
you
know
you
buy
it
a
lot
with
your
house
on
it,
then
any
of
the
empty
ones.
Next,
to
it
also
kind
of
you
have
the
option
to
buy
them
very
cheap,
and
so
that's
what
my
friend
adrian
did
with
the
community
garden.
A
H
H
So
I
can
see
the
changes
to
deltas
over
time
where
I
believe
I
knew
where
it
was
going,
whereas,
like
most
people
actually
just
see
a
snapshot,
I
think
I
was
going
to
stay
that
way,
forever
yeah,
and
so,
if
you,
if
you
don't
see
the
change
over
time,
then
it's
just,
then
I
think
you
don't
have
the
faith
that
will
get
better,
but
and
also
you
know,
these
practices
aren't
cheap
to
us.
H
I
mean
there
are
many
people
for
they.
You
know
they
don't
have
a
thousand
dollars
to
buy
their
home
and
the
knowledge
to
renovate
it.
That's
where
an
osce
like
franchise
business
could
step
in.
If
you
have
a
mission
to
improve
the
affordable
housing
situation
and
the
knowledge
and
the
money,
and
you
don't
demand
sort
of
like
10x,
you
know
wall
street
or
silicon
valley.
You
see
back
startup
returns
if
you're,
okay,
you
know
making
back.
You
know
10
on
your
investment
or
something
then.
A
H
They
are,
they
have
not
recommended
the
impression
dormant,
but
I
mean
on
paper.
They
are
everything
I
want
to
do.
They
have
like
a
checklist,
they
have
a
curriculum,
homeownership
classes
and
you
have
to
train
and
they
have
to
make
sure
you're
able
to
be
a
homeowner
and
then
they'll
get
they'll,
build
a
house
and
give
it
to
you
basically
for
a
much
lower
posture.
H
H
J
C
H
J
C
What
about
so,
is
there
a
lot
of
light
or
like
any
crime
in.
H
That
area
in
the
area
that
I
bought
the
house
is
the
one
that
is
like
off
the
cusp
of
up
and
coming
so
the
first
house
adrian's
house.
It
was
rough
when
I
first
visited
2019
and
now
it's
much
safer
and
people
are
building
like
a
million
dollar
mansions
like
one
block
away
from
there.
So
the
new
house
that
I
got
is
like
five
or
six
blocks
away,
and
it's
probably
at
that
stage
where
it's
still
a
little
rough.
But
it's
you.
B
H
A
A
Okay,
yeah
absolutely
I
mean
it
doesn't
have
to
all
be
here.
It
can
be
quite
distributed,
but
then
maybe
we
can
coordinate
that
and
we
can
do
do
such
crazy
things
with
numbers,
because
it's
like
it
only
takes
a
few
good
people
to
shift
that
around
and
you
know,
build
in
a
micro
factory.
You
only
need
so
much
critical
mass
to
just
completely
revive
it.
A
A
The
movie
is
that
the
movie
is
about
one
guy
who,
when
he
died
because
he
killed
himself
yeah,
the
whole
town
went
to
crap
instead
of
prosperity,
because
he
had
so
much
effect
on
making
good
change.
He
was
a
banker
guy,
giving
out
people
his
loans
and
and,
like
the
whole
town.
Just
you
guys
know
the
movie
right.
It's
a
wonderful
life.
A
A
B
K
A
H
Retirement
plan
yeah.
Well,
that's
the
main
thanks
for
listening
to
my
spiel,
that's
the
main
entrepreneurial
idea.
I
think
there
is
sort
of
my
purpose
in
learning
cev
and
the
seed.
A
H
I
think
this
former
approach
is
like
not
sustainable
and
you
can't
keep
doing
it
so
well-intentioned
people
like
I
talked
to
a
guy
at
midwest
brookville,
which
is
another
cev
company,
and
he
you
know,
he's
seen
you
at
conferences
and
things,
and
he
said
you
know
his
concern
about
paul
approached.
He
didn't
think
that
he
could
afford
to
pay
for
labor,
but
since
he
was
a
building
company,
you
know
it's
like
in
his
interest.
You
know
that's
his
livelihood,
so
he
he's
not
going
to
be
trying
to
scale
down
the
cost
of
labor.
A
I
think
the
machines
could
take
care
of
that.
The
number
one
cost
is
the
earth
preparation
yeah
and
if
you
have
the
mixer,
which
is
what
we're
releasing
different
story
and
in
belize,
we
showed
that
if
you
have
a
bunch
of
people
yeah,
you
can
do
that.
I
think
the
machine
can,
if
you
have
that
process
well
worked.
This
is
the
complete
engineering
question
it's
like
when
we
built
the
first
very
old
workshop
here
took
us
a
long
time
and
we
actually
ended
up
loading,
the
machine
with
buckets.
A
A
A
So
I'd
like
to
see
that
as
soon
as
next
year,
if,
if
the
cb
product
takes
off,
I
think
they'll
speak
for
itself,
but
then
the
supporting
machine
yeah.
That's
that's
like
it's
a
big
deal,
because
otherwise
it's
very
expensive,
I
mean
those
machines
are
quite
expensive.
Nobody.
A
H
I
guess
the
biggest
craftsmanship
we
use
is
from
ect
advanced
or
construction
technologies
and
their
machine
which
produces
you
know,
eight
frames
per
minute.
The
the
six
inch
by
12
inch,
brick
that
will
cost
eighty
thousand
dollars.
Basically,
so
that's
you
know,
that's
one.
You
mentioned
four
times
as
expensive
as
what
the
osc
press
cost
and
then
for
the
next
larger
brick
size
up,
it
was
150
000
or
something.
So
I
think
that's
what
most
people
use.
I
think
that's
why,
because
builders,
they
use
that
commercial
machine
as
well.
A
Building
popping
houses
left
and
right
up
right
now
we
don't
have
a
mixer.
That
is
the
soul.
Handling
is
the
problem.
It's
not
like.
Can
you
like?
The
first
thing
was:
can
the
machine
make
block?
That
was
the
first
solution?
Well,
I
found
yeah.
We
got
like
10
out
of
the
first
well
six
on
the
first
manual
machine
yeah
and
I
was
hoping
for
three,
so
we
doubled
that
and
then
got
to
10
with
the
automatic
machine.
That
is
not
the
issue.
Production
is
not
the
issue.
A
10
per
minute,
yes,
on
50
horsepower
using
the
life
track,
one
that
had
a
50
horsepower
engine
yeah
so
yeah.
That
is
not
the
issue,
so
I
think
that's
the
kind
of
thing
we
gotta
bring
to
the
world
because,
like
the
other
guys,
their
focus
is
not.
You
know
like
act
like
I
don't
yeah.
They
do
talk
about.
You
know
affordable
housing,
but
it
certainly
is
not.
I
mean
it's
legacy,
housing
right
now,
so
that's
something
we
can
definitely
change.
J
A
J
No,
he
just
started
out,
but
he
studied
motions.
So
that
was
what
it's
all
about,
that
it's
the
industrial
engineering
and
he
he
was
obsessed
with
what
time
and
motion
studies.
So
he
had.
He
had
his
kids
tonsils
pulled
to
study
the
title
motion
and
then
kind
of
find
out.
The
cameraman
had
the
lens
cap.
A
I'm
super
concerned
about
that
motion.
That's
why
I
gave
every
one
of
you
a
time-lapse
camera.
We
can
study
that
quite
a
bit
yeah.
It
really
is
that
man.
My
experience
has
been
so
so
crazy
on
that
it's
it's
insane
how
you
can
optimize
yeah,
it's
insane.
It
doesn't
stop
and
it
stops
at
full
automation.
A
It's
crazy
how
much
you
can
do
with
with
efficiencies.
That's
been
our
experience
and
that's
why,
right
now
we
can
even
talk
to
you
with
confidence,
saying
oh
yeah,
we
can
crank
this.
We
can
do
it.
It
can
be
excellent
because
we
know
that
that
can
be
done
and
the
limit
of
it
is
full
automation.
Let's
say
we
say
we
get
to
the
3d
printing
part
or
or
other
things,
where
other
other
aspects
of
how
we
can
do
it.
Maybe
like
we
mentioned
about
those
3d
printed
forms
that
are
filled
with
earth.
A
Maybe
that's
another
way,
there's
wiki
house.
That
does
their
thing,
but
then
wood
panels
are
very
expensive.
So
unless
you
make
your
own
wood
panels
like
out
of
strawboard,
then
you
still
got
very
expensive
industrial
feed
stocks
that
are
not
particularly
sound,
always
so
yeah
anyway.
Let's
lots
could
be
done
there.
It's
it's
really
like,
like
boxable
or
others,
they're,
just
kind
of
making
these
processes
industrial
and
not
to
not
to
make
them
dumb
and
like
cold.
A
A
A
That's
all
so
it's
an
oversized
machine
like
the
3d
printer,
just
a
little
larger,
with
our
little
rebar
trusses.
So
that's
yeah,
we'll
do
a
first
prototype
of
that
first
run
of
that
at
the
worst
you
can
just
put
like
a
you
know
like
even
a
skill
saw
and
you
can
make
that
go
cnc
and
that
in
itself
like,
if
you
can,
you
can
cut
like
you
can,
for
example,
take
a
board
and
slice
it
up
into
our
strips
that
we're
doing
which
would
actually
save
us
a
bunch
of
time.
A
A
I
A
Are
you
muted
or
not
make
sure
if
you.
I
I
Anyway,
it
says
I'm
unneeded.
Okay,
that's
that's
what
I
am
I'm
looking
forward
to.
I
don't
have
any
prototypes
or
whatever,
but
I
am
curious
to
hear
feedback
on
what
people
think
some
of
the
obstacles
to
something
like
that,
because
it
seems
oh.
A
It
seems
like
sound
won
out
again.
Man,
let's
brian
says
sound,
went
out.
Brian
says
sound
went
out.
Let
me
refresh
yes,
we
want
to
look
into
something
else.
Then
jitsie
jitsi's
kind
of
acting
up.
It
says
that
let
me
go
to.
I
Speak
loud
too,
so
anyway,
yeah
I'm
I'm
looking
for
feedback
on
what
people
think
are
some
of
the
obstacles
to
using
3d
molds
for
rammed
earth,
because
I
haven't
really
done
too
much.
Skunk
works
while
I've
been
here
to
kind
of
get
the
ball
rolling
there,
but
yeah.
That's
that's
the
main
thing
that
I'm
focused
on
at
the
moment.
H
Well,
I
love
grambur.
You
know
I
prefer
to
compress
earthquake
just
because
I
don't
know
I've
seen
people
aesthetically,
I
feel
like
you've
been
people
built,
two-story
structures
or
sort
of
larger
structures
and
arches.
B
H
Anything
you
can
do
with
concrete.
You
can
do
with
gram
dirt
right.
F
B
K
A
My
challenge
analysis
on
that
is
once
again
huge
amount
of
soul
moving
yeah,
so
I've
done
earth
bags.
I've
done
cb.
I've
done
cord
wood,
huge
amounts
of
salt
moving,
so
just
get
yourself
a
tractor
and
you're
fine,
that's
fine,
but
you
need
some
heavy
machines
to
do
this
like
this
is
unless
you're.
This
is
like
one
one
off.
A
If
you
want,
if
you're
gonna
go
into
production
tractor
or
some
kind
of
a
thing
like
a
like
a
hammer
mill
like
device
which
has
a
chute
and
that
whacks
it
and
just
spits
it
out
into
the
wall,
it's
just
a
lot
of
work.
Otherwise,
so
but
that's
easy!
That's
not
a
problem
but
you're
going
to
have
to
so
there's
capital
involved
in
that
so
big
machines
that
you
feel
logged
to
your
site.
You
have
to
have
enough
earth
where
you're
going
to
get
that
earth
on
the
site.
A
K
I
Basement
yeah
yeah.
I'm
also
that's
one
of
the
reasons
why
I
was
interested
in
what
you're
saying
about
geopolymers,
because
obviously
one
of
the
ingredients
that
they're
going
to
mix
the
earth
with
is
possibly
concrete,
and
if
we
can
make
concrete,
also
yeah,
then
it
becomes
a
more
sustainable
product.
A
So
I
I
look
at
it
immediately
and
say
the
appliance
that
makes
concrete
it's
not
a
big
deal.
It's
just
heat
plus
an
appliance.
It
could
be
as
large
as
a
like.
An
oven
like
a
pizza,
oven,
kind
of
a
thing.
You
need
a
bunch
of
energy
from
solar,
which
is
near
free,
it'll,
be
a
great
sbir
grant.
So
here
you
make
distributed
concrete
and
it's
from
lime,
lime,
lime
concrete
does
exist.
You
do
want
to
mix
something
else
with
it
to
make
it
bind
more,
but
there's
a
little
bit
of
distributed.
A
Development
like
distributed
enterprise
development
involved
in
that
because
nobody
studies
that,
like
how
do
you
do
distributed
concrete
production?
No,
they
just
take
trucks
of
rocks
in
those
places,
centralized
highly
centralized
and
all
that.
But
in
history,
in
england,
like
every
town
had
its
own
cement
mill
cement
plant,
they
were
burning
limestone
everywhere
right.
So
now
we
have
the
technology
to
do
it
efficiently
and
and
without
wiping
out
the
entire
tree
line
tree.
You
know
all
your
forests
go
solar
now,
so
that's
I
think.
A
That's
it's
one
of
those
things
it's
like,
especially
like
in
disaster
zones
or
war
zones.
Reconstruction.
You
don't
want
to
wait
for
the
the
man
to
bring
your
concrete
over.
You
got
it
right
there.
Under
your
feet.
It's
called
limestone
or
gypsum
rock
limestone
is
around
probably
like,
I
think,
like
three
quarters
of
the
world.
Has
it
under
their
feet.
Here
we
have
plenty
of
limestone,
that's
what
the
gravel
roads
are.
We
can
be
doing
that
right
now,
so
cool,
that's
that's
I
mean
it
sounds
all
hairy,
but
there's
nothing
to
it.
A
J
Got
a
bunch
of
pictures
to
share
with
you,
because
it's
less.
I
A
So
solar,
concrete,
yeah
yeah
everyone
will
go
freak.
A
A
Yeah
from
like
a
you
know
here,
20
kilowatt
panel
on
a
workshop,
we're
producing
enough
block
like
that
over
a
month
we're
making
enough
concrete
for
an
entire
house
from
like
a
from
our
workshop
roof.
We
run
that
when
we're
not
running
the
other
machines,
because
it's
like
you
always
have
the
sun-
maybe
some
days
you're
off.
So
it's
a
great
sideline.
A
So
that
just
has
a
high
carbon
footprint
because
of
the
heating,
like
brains,
because
you're
burning
fossil
fuels
to
heat
it.
That's
that's
what
they
do
here.
It's
a
solar
carbon
neutral.
This
is
revolutionary
yeah.
This
is
this
class.
This
would
be
a
trillion
dollar
industry.
Just
like
the
recycled
plastic
homes.
That's
another
trillion
dollar
industry
yeah.
So.
A
A
I
Water
water
type
protects
against
hail
and
yeah.
A
B
A
Google
ruthless
roof
on
the
wiki
and
you'll
find
it
the
final
design.
It's
under
the
architecture,
part
library.
I
was
specking
that
out
so
actually
the
joshua
appears
from
michigan
tech
he's
also
done
some
design
on
that.
I
don't
think
he's
got
something
like
us.
I
don't
know
what
he
has
he's.
I
think
he
had
a
concept.
I
don't
think
he
had
an
actual
design
but
yeah
cool
stuff.
F
I
A
A
A
Does
that
make
sense
both?
Are?
I
think
I
I
really
like
that.
I
I
do
like
that
idea.
I
didn't
really
think
much
about
that,
but
yeah
yeah,
that's
a
perfect
thing
for
trash
trash
plastic
man
and
then
you
put
a
nice
skin
on
it.
Make
plants
grow
on
it
or
something
your
aquaponic
towers
right
on
your
walls,
that'll
be
great
matt.
What's
your.
A
Yeah
3d
print
that
so
multiple,
like
multi-cell
glazing,
like
polycarbonate,
make
it
up
to
like
four
walls
thick
make
a
large
cell
number
like
10
or
20
layer,
3d
print,
that's
built
into
that
form,
and
you
could
get
some
good
insulation,
so
we
haven't
done
that,
but
it's
about
if
you've
got
the
layers.
It's
all
about
air
motion,
so
conduction
is
how
most
I
think
most
heat
loss
comes
through
conduction.
A
So
if
you
3d
print
multiple
layers,
how
do
you
minimize
conduction?
You
make
the
connections
between
each
layer
just
a
little
point
here
and
there
enough
to
make
it
structural,
but
you
can
that's
what
3d
printing
lends
itself
to?
You
can
do
complex
geometry,
so
why
not
print
a
multi-cell
structure
with
the
3d
printers?
That
has
insulating
property?
So
if
you
probably
google
it
like,
I
googled
a
3d
printed
insulation.
A
I
didn't
find
much,
but
this
is
like
polycarbonate
multi-wall
glazing.
As
a
start,
those
things
have
like
it's
like,
I
think,
like
r1
per
cell,
like
the
the
four
cell
is
already
r4
just
make
more
and
you're
fine
and
r10
are
20..
Our
20
is
what
we
have
to
compete
with
here.
We'd
have
to
do
20
cells,
but
each
cell
could
be
probably
like
a
millimeter,
so
you
can
have.
I
think
the
limits
are
to
be
explored
here
as
far
as
what
can
be
done.
A
Because
everyone
loves
hemp,
creed,
all
right
next
person,
please
feedback
on
what
you
think
are
business
opportunities.
I
love
this
rammed
earth
stuff.
Man
can
talk
about
your
business
opportunity.
Kent
from
indonesia,.
F
B
F
So
I
was
actually
thinking
about
a
company
with
a
different
business
units,
so
you'd
have
one
like
for
for
building
or
making
buildings
using.
You
know
the
cb
press
and
then
you
could
have
a
business
unit.
3D
printers.
I
A
So
yeah
there's
that's
pretty
encouraging
because
that's
the
farthest
anyone
abroad
has
ever
gotten.
I
mean
I
don't
know
anybody
else.
Who's
actually
got
that
clear
intent
to
to
actually
go
forward
with
it
and
he's
a
proud
recipient
of
the
shuttleworth
five
thousand
dollar
grant
that
I
nominated
him
for.
A
Succeed,
we're
gonna
have
help
him
succeed.
So
that's
good.
A
Yeah,
we'll
we'll
keep
going
so
who
wants
to
go
next.
A
C
Hey
so
I
mean,
I
think
you
know,
I
want
to
see
housing
be
a
solved
problem,
because
my
passion
is
now
really
housing.
C
Some
of
the
I
guess
aspects
that
we've
worked
on
so
far,
I'm
interested
in
maybe
like
recycling,
plastics
or
or
or
bioplastics
that
that
kind
of
seems
like
a
lot
of
potential
to
me,
and
I
also
think
one
thing
is
that
I
don't
think
the
world
will
ever
get
to
widespread
open
hardware
adoption
without
without
a
lot
of
money
behind
it.
C
Like
there
are,
there
are
a
lot
of
companies
with
strong
incentives
to
to
to
fight
against
open
source.
One
example
is
like
apple,
not
depreciating
opengl
and
not
supporting
vulcan.
C
That's
an
example
where
you
know
companies
like
intentionally
sabotaging
an
open
source
project
to
try
and
like
to
get
developers
to
work
on
a
proprietary
platform,
a
proprietary
hardware
platform.
B
C
I've
been
studying
the
models
for
open
source
software
enterprise
and
there's
mainly
like
three
there's
a
open
core
where
you
have
a
main
set
of
software,
and
then
you
can
provide
additional
services
or
a
newer,
a
newer
branch
that
people
will
pay
for.
You
can
provide
services
like
red
hat,
you
can
move
on
or
you
can
like
host
your
software
on
the
cloud
for
other
people
to
use,
and
those
are
from
from
all
of
my
research
on
open
source
software.
C
Those
are
the
only
ones
I
found,
but
there
are
in
practice
a
couple.
Others
like
go
dog
just
raises
money
on
patreon
and
like
so
like
crowd.
Funding
is,
is
one,
but
I
don't
think
crowdfunding
is
ever
gonna,
be
like
it's
not
going
to
get
scale.
It's
not
like.
It's
never
going
to
get
scale
it
because
the
best
projects,
even
like
blender,
they
have
nowhere
near
the
budget
of
enterprise
software.
C
C
I
think
it
would
be
bad
if
it
took
decades
to
get
a
lot
of
funding
towards
open
source.
So
I
think
whatever
we
do
has
to
be
fast.
C
Well
so
so
my
goal,
like
long
term,
is
like
the
idealized
feature
I
see
is
providing
a
path
for
every
every
game
developer
in
the
world
to
to
become
an
indie
game
developer
and
to
travel
around
the
earth
freely
without
without
worrying
about
housing
or
any
other
bill.
Just
just
being
able
to
wander.
I
want.
I
want
people
to
be
able
to
wander.
So
that's
that's
a
lot
of
money.
It's
not
so
much
money!
It's
it's
giving
people
physical
autonomy.
C
F
C
C
Stuff,
my
ideas
are
maybe
a
few
like
one
but
dundas
talked
about.
This
is
enabling
small
businesses
to
use
open
source
hardware.
I
think
that
has
a
lot
of
potential
and
it's
focusing
on
actually
helping
companies
save
money
in
instead
of
trying
to
be
an
enterprise.
We
just
focus
on
reducing
the
operating
margins
of
existing
commercial
and
companies.
I
think
that's
a
potential
avenue
for
generating
progress
through
open
source
and.
C
I
think
we
need
a
better
platform
for
open
source
hardware,
because
I
don't
think
github
is
very
good
or
we
don't
have
any
collaboration
tools
for
open
partners
that
are
competent.
That
is
my
that's
my
opinion
and
I
think
it's
the
same
same
problem
with
game
development.
We
don't
have
any
really
good
game
engines
and
I
think
there
are
many
like
overlapping
issues
that
I
can
contribute
to
it.
It's
just
a
matter
of
like
choosing.
What's
the
most
important
to
work
on.
A
All
right,
when
you
talk
about
reducing
operating
margins
for
companies,
what
do
you
think
that
could
be
in
in
terms
of
a
product
like
with
any
specific
or
just
that's
a
general
comment.
A
I
I
guess
when
I,
when
we
were
talking
about
that,
what
we
were
thinking
about
was
the
any
product
that
has
planned.
Obsolescence
is
what
we
want
to
go
after
and
specific.
We
also
want
to
go
after
industries
where
the
technology
hasn't
changed
a
lot.
Oh.
I
And
and
cv
presses,
even
appliances
that
I
keep.
B
B
I
If
I
don't
know,
if
anybody's
looked
into
how
expensive
it
is
to
put
together
a
food
truck,
but
it's
it's
pretty
expensive
and
you've
got
postings
on
craigslist
for
food
trucks
going
for
over
a
hundred
thousand
dollars.
I
There's
a
lot
of
room
there,
trucks
for
you
to
swallow
up
some
of
that
margin.
So
yeah
things
like
that.
Those
were
basically
what
we.
A
Okay,
all
right
who
wants
to
go
next.
I
H
My
main
motivation
for
coming
here
was,
I
mean.
Obviously,
money
is
important
and
it's
it's
crucial
to
any
project
to
have
money,
but
mainly
to
see
if
I
can
use
the
hardware
and
use
what
I've
learned
here
to
build
first
initially
to
build
an
eco
village
or
an
intentional
community
around
just
people
getting
off
grid
on
jobbing.
I
like
that
idea
here
and
then
everyone
works
together
to
support
each
other
and
to
work
toward
solving
the
problems
like
the
pressing
world
issues
that
are
listed
on
the
wiki.
B
H
Really
to
look
for
a
place
to
just
begin
that
at
and
then
begin
to
build
infrastructure
and
work
within
the
network
of
people
that
I
I've
met
here
to
accomplish
that
also
reaching
out
to
other
international
communities
that
are
already
started
and
have
already
become
more
or
less
self-sufficient
as
well.
So.
A
B
D
I
think
it
should
be
good.
The
biggest
two
were
mostly
like
construction
and
agriculture.
I
don't
think
it
can
be
one
hall
center,
but
definitely
something
along
the
lines
of
that
since,
where
I'm
from
vegas
houses
are
pretty
high
right
now,
probably
the
highest
they've
ever
been.
D
So
that's
one
small
farm
like
on
a
quarter
of
an
acre
that
you
know,
can
we
supply
all
the
people
who
want
healthier
options
and
then
thinking
about,
like
the
closed
loop
greenhouse
system,
where
water
is
already
like
not
abundant
there,
so
the
water
you
do
have
you
can
reuse
and
keep
and
can
you
know,
continue
to
produce
food
for
that
community.
B
A
All
right,
yeah!
That's
that's.
Definitely
good,
like
I'd
like
to
see
something
like
that
here,
where
we're
we're
doing
that
too.
I'd
like
to
see
it
and
then
also
think
about
autonomous
vehicles
that
could
deliver
that.
So
maybe
we
can
contribute
to
that
yeah,
because
because
then
you
you're
taking
out
all
your
travel
time
and
that's.
D
D
To
deliver
those
the
food,
you
know
it's
so
hot
up
there
that
they
put
everything.
You
know
like
little
like
great
deal
regulated
bags
with
like
little
ice
packs.
Then,
if
you're
on
the
wrong
side
of
town
by
the
time
they
drop
off
your
food,
everything's,
melted,
everything's,
warm,
you
know
it's
not
as
fresh
as
it
was
at
six
o'clock
in
the
morning
when
the
delivery
game,
when
it's
cool
outside
you're,
getting
it
at
4
pm
110
and
it's
like.
Oh
that's,
not
really,.
A
D
A
All
right,
yeah,
I
think,
there's
clear
models.
There's
requires
some
efficiency
and
then
some
staff
and
support
and
tech.
I
think
know-how
because
to
learn
that
effectively
and
share
that
openly
the
people
who
are
really
good
at
it.
They
don't
tell
you
how
to
do
it
so
jeff.
How
about
you?
What
do
you
think.
B
J
J
The
a
person
working
in
a
fast
food
joint
how
in
the
world
do
they
make
it.
You
know
it's
just
it's
just
almost
impossible
and
they
get
stuck
in
this
rut
and
I've
been
stuck
in
that
rut
before.
Even
though
I
have
skills
and
abilities,
and
all
of
that
and
all
of
that.
J
B
J
J
Cost
about
thirty
thousand
dollars
a
piece-
and
this
was
probably
fifteen
years
ago-.
J
F
J
B
J
So
so
they.
J
For
for.
K
J
The
the
purchases.
J
J
J
So
so
then
you've
got
then
you've
got
the
sandbag
option.
A
I
B
B
B
J
B
H
H
A
B
K
K
K
K
B
A
The
remote
people
matt-
maybe
you
want
to
open
up
since
you
piped
in
already
sure.
G
Yeah,
actually,
I
have
some
notes
down
at
the
bottom
of
the
models.
G
So
so
what
what
I'm
doing
here
and
where
I'm
trying
to
integrate
osc.
G
B
B
G
G
Learning
which
is
also
known
as
unschooling,
if
you're
doing
it
kind
of
with
kids,
it's
kind
of
a
type
of
homeschooling,
but
it's
child
directed.
Basically,
the
idea
is,
if
we
give
kids
a
space
in
which
they
can
pursue
their
interests
and
passions,
and
we
have
facilitators
who
can
kind
of
support
them
in
that
journey.
G
Then
they
can
learn
what
they
need
to
learn
in
a
more
meaningful
and
effective
and
efficient
manner,
and
so
one
aspect:
that's
common
in
these
spaces
is
a
maker
space,
and
so
I
that's
kind
of
where
I
see
fitting
in
as
kind
of
providing
this
it's
kind
of
kind
of
much
more
than
a
maker
space.
But
you
know
if
we
combined
like
a
micro
factory
where
we're
building
stuff
for
revenue
generation,
and
then
some
of
those
machines
can
also
be
used
by
perhaps
older
kids,
who
are
trying
to
experiment
with
different.
G
Aspects,
I
feel
like
there's
a
lot
of
function,
stacking
kind
of
overlapping
that
could
happen
here.
So,
for
example,
staff
could
serve
as
facilitators
for
to
kind
of
support.
Kids
as
they
learn,
while
also
learning
to
build
themselves
and
if
that's
kind
of
a
direction
they
want
to
go
for
their
own
kind
of
livelihood.
G
G
One
of
the
other
benefits
that
I
see
from
this
is:
if
we,
you
know,
if
you're
a
startup-
and
you
know
where
do
you,
where
are
you
getting
your
your
revenue
from
and
so
I
think
one
source
could
be
through.
You
know.
G
From
community
members,
and
so
if
you're
kind
of
new
to
kind
of
the
osce
building
side,
you
could
start
by
generating
some
income
through
that
tuition
piece
and
then
and
then,
as
you
kind
of
get
the
business
side
off
the
ground.
That
could
then
support
kind
of
the
overall
organization,
maybe
even
allowing
to
decrease
tuition
and
membership,
which
is
our
goal
and
then
and
then,
as.
G
You
have
the
freedom
to
engage
in
r
d
and
develop
new
ideas
and
new
businesses
and
test
it
out
and
find
support
in
that
journey
and
and
kind
of
you
know,
identify
livelihoods
that
feel
good
to
them
and
that
aren't
just
as
typical
just
toiling
behind
a
desk
and
something
you
don't
enjoy
and
then.
G
The
other
key
piece
is
in
terms
of
from
the
launch
perspective.
You
know
how
do
we
build
kind
of
the
next
generation
of
osce
builders,
and
so
I
think,
by
providing
this
self-directed
learning
space
where
kids
are
kind
of
on.
G
Being
exposed
to
this
and
kind
of
swimming
in
this
environment,
so
to
speak,
you
know
not
all
of
them
will
end
up
wanting
to
do
this,
but
but
many
might
and
they
have
a
greater
appreciation
for
the
potential
for
them
to
kind
of
take
control
over.
You
know
technology
over
housing
and
things
like
that,
so
so.
G
Hope
is
to
start
with
the
cd
go
home
as
kind
of
a
kind
of
a
regenerative.
G
That
would
help
generate
revenue
for
the
overall
nonprofit
and
then
go
from
there
in
terms
of
expanding
to
other
technology.
So
yeah.
G
G
Being
kind
of
early
adopters
for
some
of
this
work
we're
doing
here,
and
so
if
we,
if
I
can,
you
know
through
ours,
kind
of
proof
and
kind
of
give
evidence
that
this
model
works,
I
can
see
other
self-directed
learning
centers
wanting
to
try
to
replicate
that.
A
Rather
finishing
you
would
you'd
look
at
so
getting
some
clients
well
as
soon
as
we
finish
the
product
and
have
have
it
market
ready.
Would
you
would
you
see
your
goal?
Is
okay,
find
a
client
and
then
do
a
home
for
somebody,
or
would
it
be
for
you
for
yourself
first
or
how
do
you
look
at
it.
G
Yeah
we
have,
we
we,
a
year
ago,
moved
to
an
intentional
community
and
we
have
a
lot
to
build
on
and
so
building
our
own
would
be
the
first
kind
of
prototype,
and
hopefully
we
could
kind
of
make
a
workshop
out
of
it
and
make.
D
B
D
G
Community
but
then,
ultimately
yeah
our
goal
is
to
to
then
offer
this
as
a
service,
with
a
particular
focus
on
accessible,
affordable
housing.
But
then
you
know
if
people
want
to
build
big
stuff
elsewhere,.
C
G
Know
we'll
do
that
too.
You
know
if
we
have
time
and
space
but
but
yeah
we're
really
kind
of
making
affordable
housing,
affordable
and
accessible
yeah
yeah.
I've
spoken
to
some
some
other
groups
around
here
who
are
doing
this
sort
of
thing.
Trying
to
you
know,
work
on
affordable
housing,
and
when
I
mentioned
you
know
how
much
these
are
costs,
like
you
know,
they're
just
they
couldn't
believe
it.
You
know.
G
B
E
E
E
Some
sort
of
educational
entity
to
make
you
like
a
senator
of
some
kind
so
that
you
can
get
you
know
you
can
both
grant.
You
know,
certifications
and
get.
You
know
the
financial
aid
and
tuition
benefits
of
an
existing
academic
institution
that
will
bring
a
lot
more
people
through
the
doors
and
then
I
would
want
to
do
a
zipper
and
just.
E
So
I
just
I
think
that
we
should
pick
one
and
do
it
and
then,
if
we're
as
we
learn,
we'll
understand
the
dynamics
and
be
able
to
to
do
it
for
more
products.
What
I'm
out
of
I
really
like
what
katarina
was
saying
about
the
kids
that
to
me
sounds
doable
but
again,
like
you,
you
would
have
to
find
a
group
of
people
that
want
to
do
the
same
business.
You
know
that's
ultimately,.
B
E
Know
just
because
everyone,
what
we
have
is
a
group
of
people
that
want
to
learn
a
certain
amount
of
content,
but
I
don't
know
if
we
have
a
group
of
people
that
want
to
build
the
same
business
and
in
order
to
really
do
that,
we
need
to
get
out
of
our
heads
and
into
conversations
with
customers
in
order
to
you
know,
put
forth
the
sales
materials
and
prototype
such
that
we
have
somebody
who
will
want.
You
know
we're
learning
from
the
market.
E
You
know
just
like
you're
learning
from
things
that
don't
work
when
you're
making
a
prototype
like
in
terms
of
the
actual
hardware
working
it's
the
same
thing
related
to
a
customer,
so
we
have
to
just
because
we
successfully
get
the
hardware
working
doesn't
mean
that
people
will
buy
it
so,
but
we
all
wanna
we're
all
buying
it
from
an
educational
perspective.
E
E
I
think
the
what
I
would
do
is
create
a
co-op
or
some
sort
of
entity
that
we
all
can,
that
entity
would
be
in
charge
of
developing
the
products
in
terms
of
like
the
marketing
materials,
the
sales
you
know,
inbounds,
you
know
getting
leads
and
doing
all
that,
such
that,
if
you
do
want
to
be
building
houses,
I
mean
that's
the
question
I
have
do.
People
want
to
be
building
brick
presses
and
houses
for
their
job.
You
know
for
the
next
five
to
ten
years.
E
That's
what
that's,
what
you're
offering
and
that's
totally
fine,
if
people
don't
but
a
business
around
selling
eco
homes
is
just
that
it's
selling
and
building
eco
homes.
You
know
it's
just
not
a
one-off,
so
I
would
I
would
build
if
I
would,
if
we
were
really
doing
that,
I
would
build
a
back
office
that
you
know
you
have
your
builders,
but
everything
around
those
builders
that
you
would
need
would
be
the
marketing
the
you
know.
That
would
have
a
really
cool
design
that
would
get
people
excited.
It
would
be
priced.
E
You
know
I
don't
know
online
advertising
all
the
things,
accounting
yeah,
all
the
things
they
probably
don't
want
to
do,
but
it
would
be
a
support
system
for
the
the
builder
as
their
own
entrepreneur
that
you
know
so
that's
sort
of,
but
I
think
for
now
just
doing
the
and
integrating
into
some
of
these
you
know
veteran
and
institution
academic
institutional
programs
will
will
be
the
next
stage,
for
the
stage
will
be
the
next
stage
of
development
for
where
we're
at.
E
E
Well,
there's
lots
of
ways
to
prototype
it,
but
I
think
that
what
we
I
would
start
with
a
javelin
board,
which
is
like
a
a
tool
that
allows
you
to
basically
come
up
with
a
hypothesis
like
this
customer
has
this.
You
know
you
identify
the
customer,
you
identify
the
problem
and
you
have
a
hypothesis
that
that
is
true,
that
you
know
they.
This
type
of
person
says
they
have
this
type
of
problem
and
you
would
test
that
you
would
actually
talk
to
seven
and
say
my
hypothesis.
E
E
In
the
solution
and
with
the
solution
there's
all
kinds
of
prototypes,
what
we
could
do
is
do
a
one-pager
that
has
all
the
you
know,
benefits
of
the
home
or
let's
say
it's
a
3d
press
or
whatever
it
is
like
a
standard.
You
know
what
is
our
3d
printer
kit,
you
know,
would
have
the
cost
it
had
the
benefits.
It'd
be
the
other
things
you
can
do
with.
E
It
would
be,
you
know
all
the
and
then
you
would
basically
show
that
to
someone
who
is
role
playing
as
a
customer
that
you're
trying
to
sell
to,
or
maybe
you've
gone
to,
a
watering
pond,
a
group
of
people
where
you
know
their
customers
are,
or
you
know,
someone
who's
in
the
market
to
buy
and
you're
saying
hey.
Would
you
just
kind
of
give
me
your
your
unfiltered
reactions
and
then.
E
On
we
would
get
honest
and
honest
responses
from
people
who
could
buy
it
and
then
we'll
know
pretty
quickly
how
far
off
we
are
and
then
then
you,
you
basically
pause
and
you
you
make
the
upgrades
and
then
you
try
it
again
and
again
and
again
and
again
until
you're
you're,
making.
A
E
I
I
learned
it
through
javelin
board
is
kind
of
like
design
thinking
and
a
guy
named
tom
chi,
who
is
a
good
friend
of
mine
in
caesars.
He
created
the
google
glasses
at
google
and
he's
of
an
inventor,
and
he
has
a
concept
called
rapid
prototyping.
E
I
Two,
it
also.
G
Sounds
a
lot
like
a
lean
startup
approach
and
and
the
and.
B
G
They
have
a
program
that
that
we
could
participate
in.
I
I
participate
in
it.
It's
like
a
free
program
for
entrepreneurs
and
they'll
help.
You
essentially
walk
you
through
that
process,
so
you
bring
your
business
idea
and
they'll
walk
you
through
this
lean
startup
process
and
the
you
know
identifying
the
customers
and
your
hypotheses
and
testing
those
through
extensive
interviews
with
the
idea
of
being
that
yeah
you're
minimizing
the
amount
of
financial
resources
you
need
to
put
in
at
the
front
so
yeah.
A
A
Is
that
the
idea
yeah
yeah
right,
because
that's
that's
a
common
fault.
It's
a
common
thinking
and
you'd
think
that
when
you're
completing
an
experience
in
the
field
such
as
me,
then
you
think
oh
yeah,
you
got
a
product.
You
got
sales.
No,
it's
completely
different
things
completely
different
things.
You
can
have
something
that
you
love
and
then
you're
using
it
or
whatever,
but
a
business
is
just
another
development.
Just
like
a
product
is
so
so
this
is
completely
consistent
with
all
of
that,
I
would
say
that's
good.
Oh.
E
Yeah
next
week,
I
think
that
no
or
a
week
on
the
22nd
tom
tom's
team
is
coming
into
my
class
and
they're
gonna
we're
they're
gonna
host.
B
E
A
You
can
do
that
on
jitsi,
just
like
we're
doing
now
or
whatever,
whatever
zoom
or
whatever
that'll
be.
B
E
E
Yeah
it's
tom
cheese
thing
I
mean
he
he's
sort
of
developed
it,
but
it
relates
to
evolving
your
product.
Basically,
the
difference
between
conjectures
and
actuals
conductors
are
your
opinions?
What
you
think
people
are
going
to
want
actuals
are
what
actually
happens
and
then
so
you're,
basically
evolving
the
pocket,
the
product
in
relationship
to
actual
conversations
and
there's,
there's
ways
that
you
can
do
that
well,
you're
well,
you're
doing
marching
is
physical,
prototyping.
E
Making
devices
until
they
actually
work,
you
can
do
that
if
that's
that's,
really
important
as
well.
So
this.
E
So
I
would
pick
a
product
we
can,
we
can
go
through
it.
I
think
that
would
be
enormously
valuable.
E
H
A
B
E
A
You
talk
about
that
last
year.
We
sold
about
24
or
so
printers
and
got
like
about
20
000
last
year,
just
on
the
side
over
the
last
year
since
starting
it.
So
it's
cool.
It's
like
back
background
revenue
and
the
product.
If
you
just
one
prototype
with
the
customer,
needs
people
won't
like
this
stuff.
That's
fine,
there's,
not
a
question
about
it.
A
To
me,
I
look
at
it
as
as
simple
development
of
the
back-end
infrastructure,
not
even
like
who
the
customers
are,
because
I
think
there's
plenty
of
them
and
making
the
this
product
simply
accessible
would
be
enough
to
take
it
to
the
next
level,
but
maybe
what
you're
talking
about
for
a
real
business?
We
might
have
to
really
study
that
question
in
in
depth
more,
but
so
the
3d
printer
could
be
something
that
all
of
us,
because
we're
going
to
be
learning
to
build
a
bunch
of
them.
A
A
A
I
don't
know
website
I
have
the
product
listing
on
the
website.
We
spam
the
interwebs
on
facebook
and
things
like
that
or
just
publish
just
just
regular
edu
marketing
kind
of
deal,
we're
just
posting.
What
we're
doing
and
people
find
that
and
a
lot
of
people
come
into
it
saying
hey.
I
want
to
support
osc
and
that's
why
they
buy
it.
They
want
to
get
into
the
community
like,
as
in.
A
Join
a
development
effort
because
we're
not
just
selling
a
printer,
we're
selling
the
capacity
for
you
to
actually
get
involved
in
prototyping
and
learning
how
to
design
things.
So
that's
the
value
that
some
people
really
like.
That's
the
typical
customer.
So
it's
not
like
I
just
want
to
like
print
yoda
heads
or
whatever
it's
it's.
I
want
to
learn
to
collaborate.
I
think
a
lot
of
people
come
with
that
kind
of
atmosphere
around
them,
but.
B
A
A
It's
like
100
bucks,
an
hour
that
I
get
out
of
it,
for
I
have
a
little
bit
of
production
like
I
get
some
people
to
help
out
on
production
and
then
it's
pretty
easy
to
put
together,
especially
like
used
to
do
like
a
finished
tested
kit,
but
I'm
just
gonna
switch
that
I'm
thinking
it's
almost
good
enough
to
do
just
just
the
parts
because
for
the
finished
kit
it
takes
you
like
twice
as
long
to
finish
kit
as
in
you
test.
A
Say
to
somebody
as
a
value
proposition
learn
how
to
solder.
So
actually
that's
what
I've
been
doing
lately
saying
hey.
Do
you
want
to
do
this
as
a
kid
where
you
actually
started,
because
we
like
to
prepare
all
that
and
test
everything?
But
it's
not
a
big
deal
if
something's
broken
you
just
ship
a
new
one,
and
it
saves
you
a
bunch
of
time
because
that
can
be
a
bunch.
A
A
So
that's
that's
been
my
experience.
I've
seen
I've
seen
a
bunch
of
built
ones,
there's
a
couple
that
saw
ken
and
jeff.
They
got
one
jeff
never
did
his
because
he
was
busy
working
ken.
Did
it
because
he's
excited
about
he's
actually
sees
the
real
potential
of
it
as
an
enterprise.
A
So
he's
had
some
fire
under
his
pants
for
that,
but
the
average
average
joe
they've
got
a
full-time
job.
Then
it's
you
know
it's
like
a
second
priority
thing:
it's
they
don't
necessarily
get
it
finished.
E
A
So
the
guy's
buying
a
brick
press
for
the
that
we're
going
to
build
in
november
there's
a
client
there
he
hasn't
paid
yet,
but
that's
that's
what
it
looks
like
and
we've
sold
like
one
a
year
or
so
like
just
make
one
or
so
here
and
there,
but
any
of
these
things
can
you
put
up
a
website
and
actually
start
marketing
it?
A
E
A
E
C
A
E
E
About
the
building
it
and
the
design,
then
it
is
about
you
know
like
shop.
You
know,
like
you
know
like
where
I
could
just
like.
Oh,
like
it's
a
completely
different
way
of
presenting
a
product
when
you're
selling
it
right.
It's
like
what
does
the
kid
have,
you
know
show
me
pictures
from
of
it
from
where.
A
I
just
linked
to
the
wiki
page
because
we
don't
have
any
kind
of
a
sales
page
for
it.
The
d3d
printer
we
at
least
did
a
little
photo
shoot
and
just
some
description,
but
it's
all
just
missing
assets
missing
business
assets
there.
So
any
of
these
things,
I
think
a
collaborative
effort
on
just
to
get
one
of
these
that
that
then
everybody
every
one
of
us
is
selling
that
I
think
that's
a
great
idea.
A
That's
that's
something
you
can
walk
out
of
here
and
you've
got
some
a
little
sideline
that
can
generate
as
much
as
you
put
it
put
into
it,
because
the
markets,
I
think,
are
going
to
be
there
well.
If
we
collaboratively
develop
and
we
have
some
marketing
infrastructure
and
all
those
assets
in
place,
then
it's
an
easy
thing.
It's
like
you,
don't
put
it's
like.
A
It
if
you
divide
that
effort
in
between
many
people,
but
for
me
it's
like
no
we've
got
other
burners
other
stakes
in
the
fire
whatever,
so
that
hasn't
been
a
great
party,
but
it's
there
it's
like
ready
every
little.
One
of
these
things
is
ready
for
the
pick,
and
it's
like
it's
all
there
like.
If
someone
wants
to
make
good
money
on
it,
it's
there
for
anybody,
but
I
mean
the
surprising
thing
for
me
is
that
nobody
is
taking
that
up.
A
You
know,
that's
that's
a
surprise
for
me,
but
I
see
that
there's
a
difference
between
the
you
know
the
business
and
yeah
yeah
and
just
having
some
something
that
works
reasonably.
It's
the
whole
productization
thing.
So
that's
that's
the
question.
That's
what's
on
hand
here,
but
imagine
that
you
have
to
you
know,
get
a
bunch
of
people
collaborating
on
that,
because
the
market
is
billions
near
trillions
right,
so
there's
not
a
shortage
of
market.
So
if
we
get
deliberate
about
marketing
it,
this
idea
this
this
product
yeah
it
could
be
really
good.
G
G
G
A
Yeah,
so
it's
I
mean
it's
really
following
the
distributive
enterprise
aspect.
We
mean
that
we
produce
them
the
machines.
We
produce
the
business
models
that
you
can
take
and
work
freely
from.
We
publish
all
that
all
the
economics
of
that
printer,
like
you,
can
see
the
bills
and
materials
it's
all
there
and
we
encourage
that.
A
A
We
have
a
insulated
heated
bed,
so
we
actually
weld
up
the
insulated
bed
because
it's
actually
30
percent
more
energy
efficient
than
anything
out
there.
I
mean
it's,
it's
a
killer.
What
we
have
actually
is
a
killer
product.
If
we
actually
communicate
that
to
the
world,
it's
it's
better
than
anything
else
out
there.
A
Actually,
in
terms
of
extrusion
rate
for
soft
materials,
it's
got
the
our
design
extruder,
which
is
as
far
as
I
can
see,
it's
the
fastest
rubber
printing
extruder
that
exists
and
we've
got
the
heated
bed
which
is
30
more
efficient,
took
some
data
on
that.
So
you,
actually,
you
got
an
eco
printer
and
we're
going
to
develop
the
hot
temperature
chamber
which
now
takes
you
to
the
10
000
and
up
machines.
So
it's
a
killer
right
there.
Anything
I'm
saying
here
is
a
billion
dollar
or
more
industry.
A
It's
it's
good,
but
to
do
it
you
just
have
to
do
some
due
diligence.
You
gotta
learn
how
to
build
it.
The
fabrication
part
is
minimal.
Like
you,
gotta
do
a
little
soldering
a
little
snip
and
snap
there
on
wires,
cut
some
materials
to
size,
and
we
are
the
only
the
most
complicated
thing
there
like
for
the
advanced
printer,
the
the
pro
is.
You
got
to
weld
the
heated
bed
for
the
other
one,
it's
actually
screwed
together.
A
All
you
got
to
do
is
like
drill
out
one
piece,
but
these
these
kind
of
things
you
can
outsource
too,
so
you
can
get
right.
Now
I
get
the
six
by
six
inch
beds
bed
pieces
for
the
d3d
universal.
I
just
get
that
from
metal
by
the
foot
quite
reasonable.
They
all
cut
it
to
size,
and
then
you
just
cut
some
other
materials
to
size
on
an
abrasive.
Cutoff
saw
kind
of
like
the
wood
saw,
but
with
a
an
abrasive
blade,
so
infrastructure
for
manufacturing.
A
This
is
like
a
hundred
bucks
well
plus
a
welder
if
you're
welding,
the
thing
yeah,
it's
it's
it's
a
great
sideline
garage
business
and
this
could
be
livelihood
for
many
people
if
they
chose
to
so
yeah
yeah.
A
So
it's
like
you
know
when
I
see
that
it's
like
wow.
I
wish
I
had
that
when
I
was
growing
up
well,
I
mean
represent
principal
exists,
but
you
don't
get
it
from
wrap
up.
There
is
no
single
product
there
that
you
can
actually
replicate
as
the
real
thing
that's
been
tested,
it's
works
and
all
that
and
actually
supports
you
in
enterprise.
No,
that
does
not
exist
all
that
prusa,
whatever
all
the
other
printers.
They
went.
Propriet
they
kind
of
went
proprietary,
somewhat
open
source,
but
most
of
them
went
proprietary.
A
You
don't
get
the
support
like
that
in
terms
of
the
enterprise
aspect,
so
here
it's
a
golden
opportunity.
It's
it's
a
thing
and
we
can
be
selling
things
like
here's
training
for
people
who
want
to
get
into
production
of
this.
That
could
be
that's
another
business
whole
business,
katarina.
K
A
So
we
should
start
wrapping
up,
but
I
would
say,
let's
maybe
finish
by
saying:
let's
do
something:
what
do
we
do?
I
would
say
I
would
suggest
a
3d
printer
get
work
summer.
Assets
around
it
photo
shoots
finish:
the
manuals
back
and
back
office,
some
marketing
infrastructure
and
collaborate
on
that.
So
all
of
us
benefit
because
we're
not
in
competition
with
one
another,
the
market's
too
large,
and
we
can
build
better
products
where
all
of
us
benefit.
A
A
Yeah
start
talking
to
customers,
we
know
they're
there.
I
mean
people
without
any
advertising.
We
get
one
or
two
by
word
of
mouth
well,
so
to
develop
a
business
yeah,
probably
like
you're,
saying
matt
yeah.
That
would
be
probably
the
proper
thing
to
do,
and
then
we
can
actually
all
use
that
say:
okay,
this
is
exactly
the
product
market
fit
and
we
can
pursue
that
so
yeah.
K
A
Right
decisions
are
made
much
better
with
cake
katrina
says,
but
do
not
despair
because
we
have
two
sessions
like
this
every
week
and
the
next
one
happens
to
be
tomorrow.
So
let's
continue
the
discussion
today.
We
want
to
have
these
two
a
day,
so
we
didn't
have
one
yesterday
we're
gonna
have
one
tomorrow,
let's
maybe
decide
on
something
that
we
all
want
to
commit
to.
As
a
group.
That's
what
this
was
supposed
to
be
we're,
saying
collaborative
developing
some
enterprise
that
we
all
say
this
is
cool.