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From YouTube: Buddhist Geeks Podcast
Description
Vince Horn, originator of the Buddhist Geeks Pocast - interviews Marcin to expose more of the inner dimensions of the Open Source Ecology project founder. Podcast to be published at https://www.buddhistgeeks.org/
Some links mentioned:
0. https://www.facebook.com/vincenthorn
1. https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/Cost_of_Living
2. John Vervaeke - https://www.google.com/search?q=john+vervaeke&oq=john+ver&aqs=chrome.3.69i57j0l5.5760j0j7&client=ubuntu&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
3. Aquaponic greenhouse - https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/Aquaponic_Greenhouse
4. Seed Eco-Home - https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/Seed_Eco-Home
5. Open Source Microfactory STEAM Camps - https://www.opensourceecology.org/steam-camp-january-2020/
6. Summer of Extreme Design-Build - https://www.opensourceecology.org/summer-x-2020/
7. Cordless drill incentive challenge - https://wiki.opensourceecology.org/wiki/OSE_Incentive_Challenge
And then some numbers from Vince's Transparent Generosity revenue model:
1. https://meta.buddhistgeeks.org/trainings/training-metrics/pragmatic-dharma-training?fbclid=IwAR3eQ9wSPhflW8ItIaHsP64ujy7g4J5ZdHdr9QfTD9GokMatXdT_4wEe-0U
2. https://meta.buddhistgeeks.org/retreats/retreat-metrics?fbclid=IwAR0g7Wf06lFuzFQwg8Eci7YiNee2KUFX32hrB18KDyjv1HJ3aSMemAXH5N0
-----------------
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http://opensourceecology.org/wiki/OSE_Developers
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Take a minute to subscribe to our email newsletter (updates, workshops, etc): http://bit.ly/1LtcM44
B
B
A
A
A
A
A
Okay,
well,
I
had
a
few
things
in
mind.
Obviously
we
want
to
talk
about
your
work
and
what
you're
up
to
and
open
source
ecology
and
just
the
kind
of
general
stuff
that
you're
doing,
and
then
there
were
a
couple
things
in
particular
that
that
I'd
love
to
talk
to
you
about
one
is
the
whole
notion
of
an
open
source
economy
of
abundance
and.
C
A
B
A
Yeah
yeah
so
Buddhist
geeks.
It
started
as
a
podcast
in
2006
and
because
of
the
timing,
and
because
we
were
exploring
kind
of
next
generation
kind
of
topics
we
kind
of
hit
I
guess
we
hit
some
sort
of
wave
and
became
popular
really
quickly,
despite
the
fact
that
we
had
no
idea
what
the
hell
we
were
doing
yeah
and
so
we
sort
of
became
sort
of
a
new
voice
in
a
sort
of
millennial,
Buddhist
kind
of
wave
and
we've
really
started
off
just
kind
of
exploring.
C
A
C
A
A
A
So
each
one
of
our
episodes
like
each
month
we
get
somewhere
between
fifty
and
a
hundred
thousand
downloads
of
the
total
of
our
whole
archive.
Oh
wow
and
I'd
say
each
episode,
probably
something
more
like
thirty
to
forty
thousand
over
the
lifetime
of
the
episode
they're.
Still
surprisingly,
even
though
we
died
they're
still
following
these
people,
just
didn't
unsubscribe
during
the
time
a
lot
yeah.
A
A
A
B
B
Absolutely
absolutely
and
and
I'd
say
in
general,
I
think
that
the
tangible,
hands-on
skills
are
kind
of
getting
deprecated
we
at
present,
we
let
like
people
in
poor
countries
or
machines
do
that
so
people
in
a
Western
world
are
losing
touch
with
that
and
losing
touch
with
this
basic
empowerment
and
productivity.
That's
true
to
each
of
us
I
think
a
lot
of
alienation
in
society
comes
from
that
disconnect
because
we're
fundamentally
productive
and
we
we
like
to
connect.
A
B
No
I
was
saying
that
I
think
a
lot
of
people
are
hungry
for
the
tangible,
like
the
tangible,
productive
skill
set,
that
comes
people
surviving
in
nature
and
also
connecting
to
nature
as
the
fundamental
source
of
all
our
wealth.
That
kind
of
connection
that
that
disconnect
I
think
is
causing
a
lot
of
alienation
and
disempowerment
and
people,
hopelessness
and
people,
and
that's
that's
part
of
the
work
that
we
try
to
address
here.
I
mean
interesting
to
gain
a
Democratic
Society.
You
have
to
be
connected
in
that
way.
B
Otherwise
you
you
feel
too
powerless
and
I
and
I
see
a
lot
of
people
feel
powerless
about
what
they
can
do
with
the
world
and
I
see
that
there's
a
huge
transformation
potential
there
that
and
that's
that's
what
part
of
the
product
that
we
offer,
and
that
is
the
ability
to
reconnect
to
your
power
and
I've.
Seen
that
I
mean
from
my
life,
I
mean
some
preaching.
What
I've
gone
through
is
the
transformation.
From
being
you
know,
the
theoretical
chalkboard,
like
I,
talked
to
my
TED
talk
to
getting
some
real
hands-on
skills.
A
A
C
A
C
C
A
A
Hello,
everybody
Vince
horn
here
for
another
episode
of
Buddhist
geeks
and
today,
I
am
very
very
delighted
to
be
having
a
conversation
with
Markin
Marcin
Jew
Bukowski
good
to
have
you
on
the
show
Marcin
and
thank
you
so
much
for
taking
the
time
to
chat
with
the
Buddhist
geeks.
I'm
really
excited
about
this
conversation.
A
C
A
A
B
A
That's
awesome,
so
you
kind
of
you're
living
the
dream
for
me,
which
is
you've,
got
high
speed,
gig.
You
know
multi
gigabit,
internet
and
you're
out
on
a
farm
yeah,
building
yeah.
This
is
really
cool.
I'm
excited
to
talk
about
your
work,
so
so
I,
so
I
saw
your
TED
talk
a
number
of
years
ago,
yeah,
that's
probably
about
ten
years
or
so
good.
You
know
something
like
that,
and
and
just
immediately
was
like
okay,
this
person
and
your
partner,
Katarina
y'all,
are
doing
really
interesting
work
with
the
open
source,
ecology,
movement,
mm-hmm.
A
B
It
is
global
village,
Construction,
Set,
50
industrial
machines
to
create
small-scale
civilization,
with
modern
comforts,
essentially,
the
critical
machines
from
tractors
to
bread,
ovens,
the
production
equipment,
energy
equipment
and
in
cars
and
everything
you
need
to
create
infrastructure,
that's
the
basis
of
thriving,
then.
So
you
know
we
can
talk
about
then
getting
meditated,
but
you
have
to
provide
some
basic
needs.
First,
yeah.
B
Exactly
the
idea
is,
let's
distribute
the
economy
so
right
now
we're
in
a
state
of
centralization,
but
the
fund
by
fundamental
design.
We
have
a
distributed
world
and
I.
Think
that
comes
from
the
first
principle
of
energy
energy
is
distributed.
Solar
energy
is
distributed,
that's
pretty
much
where
all
the
power
for
today's
economy
comes
from
it's
from
the
Sun
right,
so
by
nature
we
have
a
distributed
system,
but
the
way
we
created
we
kind
of
reformulate
it
as
humans
isn't
into
a
hugely
centralized
one.
A
And
and-
and
so
tell
me
a
bit
more
about
like
the
journey
that
you've
been
on
with
the
global
village
Construction
Set,
because
I
saw
you
you've
made
a
tremendous
amount
of
progress
on
that
front.
You
know
it's
one
thing
to
hear
someone
give
a
TED
talk
about
about
something.
That's
like
an
inspiring
idea.
Half
prototypes
is
another
to
see.
You're
10
years
later,
yeah
like
have
made
real
progress
on
the
stuff
and
they.
B
Definitely
maybe
you
know
you
can
say
at
the
time
of
the
TED
talk
were
a
few
percent
down
right
now,
I
would
quantify
it
as
like.
1/3
done
so.
We've
got
hundreds
of
prototypes
like
20
or
30,
unique
prototypes
everything
from
the
tractors
to
CNC
machines,
3d
printers
houses,
aquaponic
greenhouses.
In
fact,
we
actually
added
the
house
as
a
critical
machine
since
we
kind
of
thought.
Well,
that's
it's
a
living
machine.
It
actually
belongs
in
the
global
village.
Construction
Set,
but
the
the
power
is
yeah,
getting
a
comprehensive
set
along
a
Construction
Set
approach.
B
So
we're
looking
at
it
more
as
building
blocks
and
to
derive
from
how
Linux
open-source
software
has
derived
that
one
of
the
keys
to
success
was
large
modular
breakdown
into
very
small
parts.
So
you
can
have
thousands
of
people
working
on
at
the
same
time
and
that's
exactly
what
we
do
with
Hardware
break
it
down
into
modules
and
development
steps
for
each
module,
so
we're
inching
along
at
the
time
of
the
TED
talk.
B
I
kind
of
felt,
like
I,
missed
my
great
opportunity
because
I
had
so
many
people
contact
me
and
all
of
that
and
we
didn't
have
an
organization
and
we
hardly
have
an
organization
right
now.
We
really
don't
yet
we're
not
at
that
level
of
having
a
business
so
to
say
like
a
real,
solid
organism,
but
we
do
have
a
lot
of
foundational
work.
B
A
That's
cool
I
mean
it's
interesting,
I'm
thinking
back
to
when
I
got
even
more
kind
of
interested
in
y'all's
work
and
I.
Think
at
a
certain
point,
I
started
to
really
feel
this
kind
of
pull
to
be
sort
of
subtract
myself
out
ourselves
out
of
the
sort
of
capitalist
system
a
bit
more
to
be
able
to
offer.
You
know
meditation
teaching
more
freely.
You.
C
A
C
A
A
That's
unheard
of
you
know
to
be
able
to
hit
those
kind
of
those
numbers
and,
and
that's
what
I
think
is
really
interesting
about
what
what
you're
trying
to
do
is
you're,
really
setting
a
goal
of
kind
of
price
reduction
that
really
competes
with
the
capitalist
markets
on
their
own
terms.
In
a
way,
that's
hard
for
them
to
be
hard.
If
you're
actually
able
to
pull
this
off
for
companies
to
to
have
any
response
to
a
tenth
of
the
price
house
or
tractor,
or
you
know,
brick
press
or
all
the
things
that
you're
building
yeah.
B
That's
exactly
right,
so,
let's
dive
into
there's
actually
a
very
interesting
page
like
when
I
look
at
the
wiki
statistics,
there's
a
page
on
our
wiki
open
source,
ecology
at
org,
slash
wiki,
which
is
cost
of
living,
and
you
said
it:
the
number-one
cost
of
living
is
housing,
so
on
average
I
have
some
stats
here
and
it's
sixty
eight
hundred
dollars
a
year.
Then
the
second
one
is
your
car,
thirty
four
hundred
dollars
a
year
and
then
food
twenty
six
hundred
dollars
a
year
and
yeah.
B
It
adds
up
to
about
twenty
thousand
or
so
just
let's
see
that
the
number
actually
is
twenty
thousand
per
year
per
person
according
to
the
Bureau
of
Labor
Statistics
for
a
household.
Well,
it
doesn't
sound
too
too
bad,
but
the
idea
is
let's
so:
let's
go,
for
example,
to
the
CD
go
home
just
to
show
you
like
a
very
tangible
example.
B
So
in
a
CD
go
home,
you
mentioned
twenty
five
thousand
dollars:
okay,
but
where
is
the
labor
that's
materials,
so
in
our
model,
what
we
aim
to
do
is
provide
a
turnkey
service
of
the
the
model
that
we
built.
That
you
see
me
in
right
now,
I
can
show
show
the
link
below
the
video
later
yeah,
but
the
model
there
is
a
client
pays,
probably
like
a
ten
thousand
dollar
service
fee.
B
We
host
a
workshop
where
we
swarm
on
the
build
and
with
about
50
or
so
people
and
build
that
in
five
days
and
I
think
that
the
more
like
a
turnkey
cost
to
the
client
will
be
more
like
seventy
thousand
that's
kind
of
what.
If
we,
if
you
actually
start,
you
know
full
cost
accounting
like
the
twenty
five
thousand
dollars
is
material.
Yes,.
A
B
You'd
have
to
figure
out
how
to
do
it,
but
we
did
with
a
swarm
based
build
the
idea
there
is.
You
are
providing
an
immersion
education,
so
basically
you're
selling
an
experience
that
people
participate
and
get
a
lot
of
skills.
Have
a
lot
of
fun
shatter
some
of
the
limits
in
their
mind
about
what's
possible
in
terms
of
effective
building
using
a
very
collaborative
learning,
rich
learning,
environment,
that's
very
supportive!
So
that's
the
product
we're
trying
to
develop,
and
probably
if
we
look
at
the
economics,
probably
like
seventy
thousand
dollars
for
a
house
builder.
B
Basically
the
house,
the
person
who
wants
to
have
the
house,
but
for
a
1,400
square
foot
house
so
still
about
once,
there's
the
cost
of
industry
standards
right
if
we
actually
roll
this
out
so
there's
a
whole
organization
after
me,
behind
it
and
so
forth.
But
it's
kind
of
how
it
looks
right
now
now,
of
course,
if
you're,
a
skilled
guy
and
you've
got
a
family
that
can
build
that,
while
you're
not
gonna,
be
able
to
do
it
in
five
days.
B
But
over
a
month
you
can
take
our
modular
construction
methods,
because
everything
in
the
system
is
designed
to
be
handled
by
people
not
not,
for
example,
cranes
or
large
machines
them.
The
way
we
designed
a
modular
construction
method
lends
itself
to
a
swarm,
build
with
normal
people
and
really
reducing
the
skill
set,
but
essentially
trying
to
turn
this
into
Legos
as
much
as
possible.
B
Is
shared
absolutely
everything
in
there's
two
levels,
so
one
is
the
design.
Second,
is
the
enterprise
design,
and
that's
that
this
is
where
we
talk
about
the
concept
of
distributive
enterprise
yeah.
So
the
idea,
if
we
do
it
and
it's
good
for
the
world,
everyone
can
use
it
and
and
people
in
a
modern
society.
People
think
that
you
have
to
be
proprietary
or
you
have
to
have
a
competitive
advantage
based
on
IP.
In
order
to
win
here
our
competitive
advantage
or
a
collaborative
advantage
is
the
opposite.
B
It's
the
fact
that
we're
collaborating
and
if
you
think
about
it,
if
you're
in
kindergarten
you'd
understand
it,
because
at
that
point
we
kind
of
were
taught
to
share,
but
from
high
school
and
to
college
Ani,
we're
completely
taught
the
opposite,
and
right
now
there's
a
huge
cultural
barrier
that
prevents
people
from
comprehending
that
hey.
We
can
actually
do
more
together
and
annihilate
the
material
scarcity
issues
that
are
still
central
to
life
in
the
West
and
in
the
developing
world.
So
yeah.
A
It's
a
mind
shift,
that's
interesting,
and
it's
it's
so
easy
to
see
that
happening
in
the
in
the
software
world
over
the
last.
Well,
it's
easy
to
see
it
happening.
That's
easy
to
see
the
forces
of
centralization
happening
as
well,
yeah,
because
that's
that's
very
real
with
Facebook
and
Google
and
Amazon
yeah.
B
Let
me
let
me
expand
on
it
because
there's
a
very
important
number,
it's
it's
a
Gini
coefficient
I,
don't
know
if
you've
heard
of
that
Gini
coefficient
is
a
measure
of
the
actual
distribution
of
wealth
and
0
is
when
everybody
the
next
has
as
much
wealth
as
the
next
person.
One
is
where
one
super
ruler
has
all
the
wealth
in
the
world.
Well,
we're
pretty
close
to
that
because
ADA,
though,
naturally
the
figure
is
like
six
of
the
world's
richest
billionaires
have
as
much
wealth
as
the
bottom
50%
at
the
bottom
of
the
pyramid.
B
B
When
you
look
at
it,
it's
not
you'd
think
that
around
2000,
the
digital
age,
that
that
thing
would
collapse
back
down
and
we're
again
in
the
long
tail
getting
into
wealth
being
distributed
more
equitably.
But
that
is
clearly
not
the
case.
I
mean
it
may
be.
There
may
be
some
hints
of
it
possibly
dropping
in,
but
it's
not
clear
so
know
that
the
promise
has
not
happened.
B
A
And
measures
yeah
that
makes
sense-
and
it's
I
mean
that
seems
to
be
one
of
the
biggest
crisis-
points
that
we're
facing
inequality,
crisis
and
the
Demont.
You
know
it's
connected
to
democracies,
the
crisis
of
democracy
for
sure-
and
you
know
you
and
I-
were
talking
a
little
bit
about
there's
a
one
theorist
who
I
really
like
John
for
Vicki
talks
about
the
meaning
crisis
and
awakening
from
the
meaning
crisis.
A
Someone
can
grow
their
own
food,
but
it's
not
something
that
most
of
us
know
how
to
do.
I've
just
started
gardening
myself
and
it's
it's.
You
know
it's.
It's
not-it's,
no
small
task
to
to
produce
enough
food
to
take
care
of
yourself
or
to
you
know,
to
build
your
own
house
all
right.
Could
you
talk
about
your
journey
in
terms
of
going
from
I
think
it
was
a
great
PhD
student
yeah
in
yeah.
B
All
right,
oh
it's
a
it's,
a
great
story:
I
love
it
because
in
the
second
year
of
my
PhD
actually,
so
you
heard
me
talk
about
that
theoretical
chalkboard,
where
you
know
in
the
first
year,
you
know
you
enter
your
program.
I
was
still
at
that
point.
Thinking.
Oh
yeah,
science,
great
physics,
we're
gonna,
do
something
good
for
the
world.
I
actually
went
into
fusion,
which
is
the
energy
that
happens
on
the
Sun,
we're
trying
to
tame
and
bring
it
down
to
earth
since
then
have
of
course,
migrated
to
okay.
B
Let's
talk
about
more,
like
solar
energy,
that
the
fusion
that
comes
to
the
earth
that
we're
not
creating
on
earth
lots
of
complexities
there,
but,
as
I
got
thrust
into
this
theoretical
program,
lots
of
you
know
coursework,
which,
on
things
that
don't
exist,
it's
like
wow,
you
know,
I
went
to
a
professor
once
and
I
asked
him
what
this
long
equation
meant.
He
said,
oh
that
actually
doesn't
exist.
I
just
made
it
up.
It's
like
okay
people,
weren't
talking
about
things
that
do
not
exist.
B
Yet
there
are
very
tangible
issues
we
need
to
solve
for
the
betterment
of
all
humanity.
So
what's
the
disconnect
here
so
actually
in
a
second
year-
and
this
is
this-
relates
to
your
audience,
and
that
is
in
the
second
year
I
I
took
a
what's
known,
was
called
a
lifestyle
engineering
course
with
a
local
yoga
teacher
in
Madison
Wisconsin,
so
I
learned
how
to
breathe,
meditate
cook
Indian
food
and
pretty
much
completely
disconnected
from
my
program
and
kind
of
said.
B
Okay
I
started
coming
in
at
like
noon,
and
it's
like
why
can't
I,
it's
like
I
could
set
my
own
schedule
or
whatever,
but
I
pretty
much
disconnecting
I
ended
up
doing
more
independent
study
on
all
the
sustainability
stuff.
That
I
was
now
getting
really
interested
in
and
almost
actually
getting
kicked
out.
A
couple
of
times
actually
failed.
B
My
prelim,
in
which
I
case
I,
had
to
I
had
another
three
months
to
okay
study
up
or
get
out
so
I,
just
totally
cranked
down
and
I
have
the
ability
to
focus
pretty
well,
so
I
could
actually
past
it
but
yeah.
It
was
an
interesting
thing.
The
last
year
of
the
PhD
I
noticed
some
of
the
other
artifacts
of
the
school
were
that
I
could
not
talk
openly
about
my
research
to
others,
and
that
was
like
man.
B
What's
going
on
we're
a
public
institution,
yet
the
mechanisms
in
there
don't
even
allow
me
to
learn
freely
from
others,
so
I
I
started
thinking
about
open
source.
One
guy
in
my
group
actually
introduced
me
to
Linux
around
the
2000
mark.
I
was
like
oh
wow.
This
is
cool.
This
is
a
system,
that's
free!
You
can
download
it.
You
can
modify
it.
You
can
use
it
at
that
point
we're
using
Mac's.
So
when
I
saw
that's
like
wow,
look
at
this
there's
other
ways
to
do
things.
B
No,
so
that
was
an
eye-opener
for
me
and
I
felt
that
this
idea
that
it's
free
and
you
can
actually
modify
it
and
and
create
software,
for
it
was
great
and
people
are
actually
collaborating
together
to
make
that
happen
just
voluntarily
like
wow.
That's
a
great
idea
and
I
started
thinking
about
what
what
it
would
really
look
like
if
we
truly
collaborated
throughout
society,
so
start
formulating.
B
Society
happen,
but
then
that
becomes
all
scarce
so
coming
from
Poland.
Also,
that's
the
other
critical
ingredient.
I
came
from
Poland
tanks
were
rolling
down
my
streets
in
1984
when
I
came
so
I
saw
a
transition
from
communism
to
this
amazing
supermarket
with
everything
there,
whereas
in
Poland
I
would
have
to
wait
in
line
for
food
and
stuff,
like
that.
With
my
parents
at.
B
B
That
came
up
a
couple
of
years
later,
when
I
went
on,
got
a
piece
of
land
I'm
settled
on
a
farm
and
recognized
that
I
have
no
practical
skills
whatsoever.
Like
I
read
all
the
books
and
I
thought:
I
was
hot
yeah.
Just
let
me
add
it
and
then
you
get
killed
by
things
like
weeds
or
equipment
breaking
down
and
the
fact
that
stuff
is
expensive.
The
story
with
the
tractor
that
broke
and
I
had
to
pay
to
get
it
repaired
and
it
broke
again.
B
C
A
It's
very
hard
because
there's
just
not
a
lot
of
resources,
there
I
mean
that's.
Why
I
get
excited
about
your
work,
because
it
seems
like
you're
trying
to
kind
of
provide
the
basic
building
blocks
for
other
people
to
be
able
to
kind
of
continue
to
build
on
that
vision
of
an
open
source
economy
of
abundance
and
I.
A
Don't
wanna
get
too
idealistic
here,
because
it's
really
like
this
is
really
hard
stuff
that
you're
doing
I
see
you
posting
pictures
every
day
of
prototyping
of
you
know
iterating
on
things,
and
it's
like
you're
doing
like
you're
you're,
like
messing
with
like
wood
and
metal
and
atoms
and
atoms,
and
trying
to
like
figure
out
how
to
build
this
stuff.
Yeah.
B
The
to
continue
on
what
you
just
said
is
this
is
not
about
ideals,
and
this
is
about
hard
skills
of
radically
efficient
production,
and
that's
kind
of
me
talking
out
of
communism
like
communism,
was
very
inefficient
in
what
it
did
was
still
a
very
centralized
system.
So
yes,
but
the
the
kind
of
stories
here
that
begin
our
lead
A's
of
our
farm,
it's
like
well.
B
How
do
we
get
to
this
industrial
productivity
on
a
small
scale,
so
I
started
to
find
hints
that
that's
possible
build
the
brick
press,
build
the
first
tractor
and
so
like
wow.
These
things
produce,
like
four
and
the
surprise,
was
quite
positive.
Like
an
initial
brick,
press
I
was
hoping
to
get
like
three
bricks
per
minute.
I
knew
nothing
about
hydraulics
or
or
metal
work.
B
I
learned
all
of
that
on
a
spot,
because
I
had
a
fire
under
my
butt
to
do
it,
and
then
the
initial
brook
press
produced
ten
bricks
a
minute
it
was
crazy.
So
so
the
technology
works,
but
we
have
to
have
the
access
to
it
yeah.
So
it's
not
it's
not
easy
in
the
sense
that
yeah,
you
basically
have
to
reinvent
a
kernel
for
for
a
collaborative
civilization,
starting
at
the
hardware
level,
not
easy.
There's
a
lot
of
logistics
and
details
to
it
over
software.
But
the
metaphor
is
clearly
there.
B
A
Now,
here's
a
question
on
a
sort
of
personal
level
so
like
I'm,
working
on
growing
microgreens
right
now,
yeah
and
and
have
just
the
first.
Several
batches
have
just
been
like
a
lot
of
mold
and
I'm
sort
of
back
to
the
drawing
board
and
and
I
just
noticed.
Like
it's
been
a
month
since
I've
tried
again
because
I'm
sort
of
deflated
sorry,
it
wasn't.
A
A
B
B
So
it's
inspiring
to
first
of
all
create
that
for
myself
and
created
at
the
same
time,
for
many
others
who
go
through
the
same
breakthroughs
that
I
do
and
that's
what
drives
me
because
that
new
reality
it's
all
in
my
head
already
I'm,
acting
as
if
it
were
to
exist
and
that
that's
where
I
would
say,
my
confidence
or
continuous
drive
comes
from
it's
one.
I'm
a
stakeholder
and
I
want
to
helped
others
too.
A
B
Yeah
yeah
I
mean
the
vision
is
clear
that
we
liberate.
We
free
our
lives
from
material
constraints,
so
we
can
move
on
to
personal
human
evolution
like
what
is
that
you
know
ask
yourself:
what
is
that
that
you
truly
want
to
be
doing
now
and
would
be
doing
if
you
had
no
constraints
like
you
need
to
get
a
house
or
a
car
or
pay
your
bills?
What
would
it
be?
B
And
it's
sad
that
the
majority
of
people
do
not
get
the
chance
to
do
that
and
that's
perhaps
even
worse,
in
a
developed
world
than
the
developing
world
I
mean
right,
we're
not
doing
what
we
want
to
do.
We
were
trapped,
so
the
the
promise
of
freedom
is
as
great
as
ever,
and
it's
this
same
promise
that
all
religion
or
anyone
has
ever
promised
it's
a
great
ideal
that
we
want
to
strive
for,
and
the
reality
of
that
is.
We
can
do
that
through
personal
responsibility
to
make
that
happen
to
commit
to
that
and
we're.
A
B
A
A
C
A
C
B
I
think
right
now,
I'm
seeing
some
good
examples.
We're
running
this
immersion
program
for
three
months
this
summer
and
some
of
the
students
that
have
already
signed
up
the
kind
of
message
I
get
from
them
just
being
able
to
build
something,
that's
tangible
is
super
empowering,
even
if
it's
like
a
silly.
B
So
the
idea
that
you
can't
change
your
material
world
in
a
tangible
way.
That's
it
that's
a
powerful
one.
So
so
a
little
aha
moment
that
says
wow
I
can
like
say
it's
say
it's
3d,
printing,
an
object
like
that.
You
designed
it's
like
wow.
That
can
happen
a
breakthrough
moment
for
people
to
aha
moment
like,
even
though
like
it
could
be
some
silly
thing
like
a
paper
holder,
not
something
that's
got
a
billion
dollar
value
right
there,
but
something
small
but
shows
you
that
you've
done
it.
You
were
responsible.
B
You
see
your
agency,
you
build
your
agency
in
the
world.
That
is
the
breakthrough,
so
it
starts
with
the
ability
to
see
that
you
can
do
something
that
you
didn't
think
you
could
do
before.
And
then,
when
you
deepen
that
experience,
you
see
how
that
relates
to
making
to
transforming
the
world.
Because
no
longer
do
we
start
thinking.
Oh
the
reality
is
as
it
is
around
us.
We
are
actually
actually
the
authors
of
that
reality
and
right
now
we
we
relegate
that
role
to
the
corporation
or
to
a
business.
That
does
that
so
most.
A
B
Are
not
in
a
mindset
that
says
hey
this
is
up
to
us.
This
is
kind
of
like,
like
in
a
movie
It's
a
Wonderful
Life.
It's
the
same
thing
like
each
one
of
us
is
so
responsible.
You
know
I'm
talking
about.
Yes,
each
one
of
us
is
responsible
for
making
that
kind
of
transformation
by
the
choices
that
we
make,
and
if
people
have
that,
if
people
get
to
that
level,
that's
that's
beautiful
and
that's
that's.
B
What
we're
trying
to
show
so
and
I
I
want
to
keep
going
to
what
we're
doing
a
summer,
because
this
summer,
it's
the
first
time
we're
producing
a
three-month
immersion
program
where
you
take
yourself
from
zero
to
quite
a
capable
producer
maker
and
the
idea
there
is
essentially
I
can,
in
these
three
months,
you'll,
probably
learn
more
than
you
ever
would
in
terms
of
practical
skills
across
more
disciplines
that
you
probably
would
in
a
lifetime
anywhere
else.
So
this
is
what
our
current
step
at
doing
that.
B
Yes,
immerse
people
give
people
a
tangible
opportunity
to
build,
I
mean
starting
on
the
first
day.
We
actually
build
a
3d
printer
on
the
very
first
day,
and
we
continue
that
along
the
modular
approach,
just
real
deep
dive
in
a
supportive
environment
and
you're
building
all
kinds
of
things
up
to
the
the
machines
and
houses
at
the
end
that
you
start
to
now
understand.
Yes,
this
I
now
I
understand
how
it
works.
B
There
are
building
modules
like
the
Legos,
where
we
start
to
understand
how
the
modules
work
in
the
week
work
on
putting
them
together
and
that's
a
transformative
experience.
So
taking
anybody
at
any
skill
level
is
very
important,
because
the
engineer
could
perhaps
re-engineer
the
module
and
make
a
different
one.
The
user,
the
less
skilled
person,
can
take
our
free
CAD
lesson
the
ability
to
take
those
existing
modules
already
and
build
with
them
without
having
to
actually
re-engineer
them.
B
A
Ok
interesting:
well,
let's
go
into
that
because
you're
you're
talking
a
lot
about
sort
of
empowering
at
the
level
of
agency.
You
know
at
the
individual
agency
and
yet
that
that
vision
that
you're
describing
is
also
a
collective
one,
a
collaborative
one.
It
requires
a
bunch
of
empowered
agents
to
work
together
toward
a
toward
a
shared
vision,
yeah
and
that's
where
I
found
some
some
challenge.
C
A
B
Mean
you
really
have
to
do
that,
which
you
know
like
people
like
peter
diamandis,
talked
about
in
the
book?
Bold,
but
it's
the
big
hairy,
audacious
goal,
the
massive
transformative
purpose.
So
if
you
can
identify
one
that
embodies
a
lot
of
people,
then
you're
pretty
golden
and
for
us
we're
just
saying.
Oh
we're
gonna
create
a
new
kernel
for
civilization
or
its
technological
base.
Well,
that's
a
large
vision,
if
you
add
a
number
to
it.
B
It's
like
30
trillion
of
value
in
the
primary
and
secondary
sectors
of
the
economy,
so
we're
starting
with
a
big
vision.
So
it
has
to
be
something:
that's
that
you
can
get
a
lot
of
people
behind
and
from
then
you
have
to
work
on
the
basic
tools,
tool
sets
and
tool
set
to
enable
it
to
happen.
But
the
mindset
is
one
that
simply
says
we
are
transitioning
beyond
beyond
the
scarcity
mindset
into
abundance,
simply
saying:
okay,
an
economy,
you
can
have
Unilever
producing
your
paper
towels
or
john
deere
producing
tractors.
Well,
our
ideas.
B
Let's
distribute
that
to
every
community
every
community
you
can
create
an
open-source
micro
factory
where
you
have
a
huge
repository
of
collaboratively,
generated
design
produced
locally
same
old
same
old.
I
mean
that's,
not
saying
anything
new,
that's
been
around
10
or
20
years.
With
that
explicit
vision
spoken
by
people
like
Neil
Gershenfeld,
with
fab,
the
fab
labs
and
other
people.
There's
an
initiative
called
fab
city.
Every
city
produces
its
what
it
needs,
no
new
ideas
here,
it's
just
about
executing
it,
but
but
ideas
for
people
is
to
get
into
this.
B
What
I
found
very
recently
is
the
concept
that
oh,
we
can
actually
do
this.
We
can
make
these
products
which
have
more
economic
power
than
then
we
can
find
people
to
hire.
That's
not
an
issue,
but
people
can't
get
around
the
idea
that
okay.
Well,
then,
let's
start
collaborating
on
this
product
and
that
product
and,
let's
start
producing
things
locally,
that's
hard
I
would
say
primarily
because
the
cultural
mindset
that
says
well
how
am
I
gonna
make
money.
People
immediately
go
back
to
their
reptilian
brain
of
10,000
go
and
get
scared.
A
Yes,
yeah,
okay,
so
the
witch
which
connects
back
with
this
whole
kind
of
notion
of
scarcity
and
and
sort
of
fear-
and
it's
interesting
because
part
of
my
experience
on
this
sort
of
coming
up
as
a
contemplative
I
was
a
computer
engineering
student
and
then
I
dropped
out
to
meditate,
full-time
and
so
I
sort
of
took
a
different,
different
track
and
came
back
around
to
technology.
But
from
the
point
of
view
of
you,
know
kind
of
a
Buddhist
kind
of
paradigm
of
awakening
where
it
is
very
much
about
recognizing
that
sort
of
ego.
A
Contraction
in
the
sense
of
self
contraction
is
not
fundamentally
Who
I
am
and
what
we
are
that
there's
some
way
in
which
the
technologies
and
tools,
the
psycho
technologies
of
meditation
help
one
deconstruct
that
self
contraction
and
to
discover
an
abundance
which
is
beyond
sort
of
what
we
think.
You
know
what
we
think
this
is
and
but
that's
a
beautiful
thing
to
wake
up
to.
But
then
it's
really
hard
to
realize
that
and
then
be
living
in
this
reality.
A
C
A
The
inner
experience
of
that
freedom
of
abundance
and
the
actual
oh
yeah
systems
that
we
live
in
and
I
see
that
a
lot
of
contemplatives
we
struggle
with
that,
and-
and
it's
like,
we
need
what
you
know.
The
kind
of
vision
that
you're
talking
about
to
kind
of
sync
up:
the
interior
and
the
exterior
x'.
I'm
so
that
they're
they're
sort
of
co-arising
are.
B
A
B
That
the
thing
I
say
about
that
it's
our
choice.
We
choose
that
we
have
enough
agency
if
we
strip
ours
free
ourselves
from
certain
constraints
that
might
dictate
otherwise
to
us,
but
no,
we
have
the
people
need
to
recognize
that
we
have,
as
individuals
have
that
agency
to
decide
which
path
we
take.
So
it's
not
it's
a
choice.
Somebody
has
to
make.
A
B
C
A
Says
in
its
it's
a
it's
a
leap:
it's
a
leap
of
faith
to
make
that
choice,
because
there's
there's
no
there's.
You
know
it's
like
going
off
into
the
to
the
underbrush
and
I
gather
ideas
and
they're
pioneers,
and
they,
if
it
carved
a
little
bit
of
a
way
but
there's
not
there's
not
always
a
clear
path
through
yeah.
B
Only
right
now
are
we
connecting
that
to
material
reality
and
that,
materially
reality
is
entrepreneurship,
its
enterprise,
its
producing
real
things,
livelihood
for
people
right
and
I
feel
really
good
about
where
we're
going
with
that
right
now,
through
some
of
the
entrepreneurial
activity
that
we're
starting,
starting
and
I,
think
we're
on
the
beginning
of
a
curve
that
we're
really
gonna
take
off
pretty
soon.
That's.
A
A
B
Because
the
idea
here
is
like
we're
we're
stuck
in
this
point:
okay,
how
do
we
connect
this
vision
to
to
what
we
do
for
a
living
right,
and
the
point
is
that
the
entire
economy
lends
itself
to
thousands
of
opportunities
for
that,
so
we're
trying
to
show
that
okay,
here's
an
example
where
open
source,
absolute
collaborative
distributive
Development
is
yielding
livelihoods
that
are
simply
displacing
the
status
quo.
What
is
the
status
quo
so
they'll?
Be
that
say
the
ten
billion
dollar
cordless
drill
industry?
Well,
well,
why
not?
B
Instead
of
four
large
companies
having
80%
share
of
the
market
when
we
distribute
that
to
hundreds
or
thousands
of
producers
worldwide
by
simply
showing
okay,
let's
get
a
bunch
of
people
together,
there's
a
concept
called
open
source,
there's
digital
fabrication
like
3d
printers
and
there's
wiki's
and
Doc's,
that
you
can
share
information
infinitely
and
free
CAD,
where
you
can
design
anything
in
an
open
source
infrastructure,
and
then
you
got
Linux
open
source
computers,
so
you've
got
this
whole
infrastructure.
We
can
do
this
collaboratively,
so
why
doesn't
it
happen?
B
Why
don't
we
simply
say
we're
gonna
make
something
better,
faster
stronger,
because
the
the
big
guys
they're
inefficient
at
the
end
of
the
day,
they're
inefficient
everyone
all
of
them
are
competing
with
their
own
Rd
departments
to
make
a
better
product.
You
would
naturally
think
that,
oh
well,
if
we
get
a
bunch
of
people
working
together
in
a
refine
process,
that
process
needs
to
be
evolved,
it
has
to
be
an
effective
process.
B
B
So
we
think
that
this
will
succeed
if
we
can
execute
on
the
notion
of
a
massive
redistribution
of
wealth
from
the
few
to
the
many
concrete
example
being
okay,
that
you
have,
the
cordless
drill,
investors
for
Black
and
Decker,
or
whatever
listener
they're
getting
all
the
value
that
others
produce
designer
doesn't
really
benefit
too
much.
The
workers
do
not
benefit
that
much.
B
So
we're
saying,
let's
shift
that
let's
have
80%
of
the
actual
workers,
the
collaborators,
the
designers,
the
producers
in
many
many
communities
do
that
all
over
the
world,
and
now
we
have
this
massive
inversion
of
power
relations
throughout
the
world.
With
a
very
concrete
example,
now
a
drill,
it's
manageable,
it's
a
manageable
project.
It
lends
itself
to
open
source.
3D
printing
lends
itself
to
a
large
collaborative
effort.
There's
battery
packs,
there's
motors,
there's
a
truck
there's
the
body.
There's
various
electronics,
almonds:
there's
you
can
break
it
down.
B
You
can
open-source
it
again
3d
printed
and
also
on
top
of
that,
we're
saying
we're
going
to
take
waste
plastic
and
we're
gonna
make
it
from
that
using
a
filament
making
open-source
machines
that
are
part
of
that
challenge.
So
the
challenge
involves
the
fact
that
you're
going
to
design
the
drill,
design,
a
fabrication
infrastructure
for
that
drill
from
waste
plastic
and
your
open
source
franchising
the
business
model,
so
people
can
replicate
it
either
independently
or
part
of
our
group
under
the
OSE
brand.
B
So
our
explicit
goal
is
a
hundred
to
200
people
at
the
conclusion
of
this
incentive
challenge.
Who
will
be
producing
this
cordless
drills
drill
in
many
places
around
the
world?
The
challenge
will
be
$250,000
prize,
it
will
run
for
six
months
and
a
kickoff
is
September
2nd
this
year.
So
this
is
going
to
be
I'm.
Looking
at
this
as
an
as
an
economic
experiment
and
social
experiment
to
change
the
world.
A
B
Exactly
exactly
so,
if
this
works,
the
model
can
be
applied
to
potentially
a
waterfall
shed
watershed
moment
in
human
history.
That's
being
you
know,
that's
being
very
ambitious
about
it.
That's
the
potential!
Let's
see
how
far
that
we
can
achieve,
but
it's
not
going
to
be
about
me.
I'm
gonna
set
some
rules
that
you
know
the
core
ose
team.
We're
gonna
set
up
the
infrastructure
for
that
to
happen,
but
it's
not
about
us
and
we're
very
clear
about
that.
B
A
B
An
offshoot
of
the
XPrize
every
single
project
that
blew
me
away
is
not
collaborative
it's
you
have
teams,
say
500
teams,
they
all
compete
against
each
other.
The
rules
explicitly
say
you
cannot
copy
from
other
people
well,
invert,
that
let's
make
the
rules
that
you
are
required
to
copy
and
build
upon
others
and
continuously
upload
to
the
repository
and
you
you
are
all
doing
it
together.
We'll
have
multiple
prizes,
we'll
have
to
get
a
clear,
judging
structure
and
all
that.
But
it's
it
just
kind
of
blows
me
away
that.
B
Okay,
even
in
these
challenges,
which
some
of
them
are
supposed
to
be
for
common
good
projects,
including
in
Mozilla,
to
give
an
example
as
their
heroics
challenge,
they
they
actually
weren't
collaborative
because
it
was
still
teams
again
and
against
other
teams,
and
second
only
the
winner.
They
actually
had
to
have
the
winner
be
open-source,
but
that
all
the
other
entrants
weren't
required
to
be
open-source.
That's
how
they
ran.
So
it.
B
A
Okay,
cool
I,
like
that,
so
so
here's
kind
of
an
intersection
of
going
on
the
collaboration
thing
I
wanted
to
talk
to
you
about.
We,
we
I
think
we
had
a
short
email
exchange
about
this,
but
you
know
one
of
the
things
that
I've
been
involved
in
is
a
kind
of
movement
of
teaching
and
translating
meditation
practices
that
are
traditionally
done
in
silence
by
yourself.
Okay,.
C
A
Style,
meditation
and
translating
those
two
social
methods
yeah
we
meditate
out
loud
with
other
people
and
there's
something
really
interesting.
That's
coming
a
lot
several
years
of
doing
that
and
it's
oh
and
we've
open
sourced,
so
we've
open
sourced
those
methods
by
the
way.
So
so
so
we're
following
your
footsteps
here,
art.
B
A
In
the
same
way
and
to
me
these
social
meditation
methods,
they
provide
a
type
of
experience
wherein
one
really
starts
to
get
that
I'm,
not
just
this
sort
of
separate
self
over
here.
Having
this
completely
separate
experience
and
and
have
no
connection
with
you
and
you
know,
art
cities
aren't
intertwined,
our
consciousness
is
intertwined.
A
B
I
mean
when
you
describe
that,
that's
how
I
feel
like
during
our
extreme
build
process.
It's
you're
doing
something
that
you
could
not
do
yourself
and
so
you're
you.
You
have
exactly
what
we
do
like
in
a
spiritual
field,
but
it's
deeply
related
to
what
we
do,
because
you
need
that
kind
of
a
mindset,
this
kind
of
recognition
that
okay
yeah,
we
can
actually
do
better
together
or
we
are
related.
What
I
do
affect
you
and
if
I
make
something
better
for
the
world,
you
can
benefit
from
it
and
I
can
benefit
from
you.
A
B
Well,
I
would
say:
that's
that's
the
core
of
that
I
would
say
8020,
because
what
I'm
doing
right
now
would
not
be
happening
if
I
did
not
do
what
you
described
so
I
meditate
every
day
myself.
Oh,
you
do
oh
yeah
yoga
meditation
every
day
since
that
I
was
was
at
25
and
the
lifestyle
engineer,
teacher
and
Madison
Wisconsin.
So.
B
B
Much
connect
so
I
kind
of
established,
so
the
connection
to
the
infinite
computer
I
plug
in
and
and
then
sit
on
a
chair
and
meditate
for
like
half
an
hour.
So
just
I,
don't
know
what
you
call
it
exactly
I
think
it's
I
mean
it's
it's
where
you
basically
reduce
your
senses,
so
I
so
I
have
earplugs
I
close
my
eyes
and
have
a
hat
and
like
eliminate
all
the
external
noise
and
just
kind
of
listen
what's
inside
and
what
what
comes
up
and
through
that
just
a
lot
of
creativity
comes
about.
B
So
that's
the
kind
of
process
I
go
through
and
then
I'm
pumped
I'm
on
fire
to
to
do
that,
transition
of,
because
it's
so
very
spiritual
or
high
thoughts
like
a
infinite
possibility,
collaboration
all
that
come
into
my
mind
and
then
I
get
up
and
just
start
doing
it.
So
I
look
at
Fleet
transition
from
okay,
there's
that
vision
and
then
I
just
start
doing
it
every
day.
So
it's
great
I
love
this.
This
is
I
mean
you
know.
Just
to
you
know
you
got
the
audience
that
listens
to
this
too.
B
Doesn't
you
know
pursue
pursue
some
kind
of
a
meditative
practice,
but
man
that's
just
one
of
the
tools
we
have
not
learned
to
develop
as
humans,
I
mean
that
should
be
taught
in
school.
It's
just
basic
capacity
of
humans,
to
steel
yourself
and
to
and
and
to
control
your
mind
or
body
and
breathing
in
different
ways
than
just
standard
noise,
yeah
yeah.
A
B
A
A
C
C
A
Beyond
it's
transpersonal
its
boundless,
it's
it
it's
like
an
honor.
It's
like
it's
like
a
renewable
source
of
energy.
Yeah
it'd,
never
be
you
know
you
can
never
draw
out
enough
compassion
down
to
like
empty
the
well
yeah,
exactly
I
feel
that
in
your
you
know,
in
your
description
and
what
you're
doing
and.
B
A
Yeah,
but
would
you
say
it
which
I
mean
because
it,
but
there
is
a
process,
though
of
like
of
that
sense
of
fear,
or
you
know
doubt
coming
up
arising.
You
know
again
and
again,
like
oh,
maybe
I'm
not
gonna
be
able
to
do
this.
Maybe
it's
too
much.
Maybe
it's
gonna
take
too
long.
Maybe
we,
you
know,
like
those
kind
of
things
with
it,
I
mean
I'm,
assuming
that
that
still
arises
for
you
that
you
still
have
to
kind
of
work
with
and
process
absolutely
you're
in,
but.
B
Here,
I'll
call
go
on
to
two
other
bodies
of
human
knowledge
that
we
need
to
be
aware
of.
One
is
general
semantics:
how
do
we
think?
How
do
we
process
language?
There's
a
book
by
that
name
by
a
Polish
guy?
It's
a
seminal
book
in
a
in
on
human
thought.
So,
if
you're,
a
Buddhist
that
could
I
would
just
suggest,
that's
actually
some
fundamental
reading
not
to
be
haughty
here
in
any
way,
but
from
general
semantics
also
comes
the
study
of
mental
models
like
how
do
we
think
and
mental
models
like
okay?
B
B
The
leaders
of
the
world
understand
leaders
I
mean
that
modern,
the
people
who
are
idolized
today,
the
people
with
money.
They
understand
the
concepts
of
mental
models
and
and
cognitive
bias.
So
this
is
like
the
Buddhism
is
all
about
breaking
through
your
cognitive
biases.
It's
all
there
so
studying
that
helps
like
just
really
looking
at
mental
models
and
cognitive
biases
as
framed
through
the
framework
of
general
semantics,
which
in
this
essence
says
that's
the
map
is
not
the
territory.
That's
where
we
say
what
you
perceive
is
not
reality
right.
A
Yeah
yeah
I
think
that's,
that's
one
half
of
it
yeah
that
that
there's
a
kind
of
emptiness
to
our
ideas
and
concepts
that
they're
not
fixed
and
yet
the
other
half
of
it
is
like
and
are
our
ideas
and
our
models
on
one
level
are
also
all
we
have
without
them.
We
we
have,
you
know
we're
just
like
yeah.
How
do
ya.
A
B
C
B
Really
I
mean
this
is
all
about.
Yeah
I
mean
you
have
to
deal
with
that,
as
you
know,
myself
as
a
person
striving
to
learn
in
all
ways
and
be
a
non-movement
entrepreneur.
I
study
this
stuff,
as
in
like
the
mental
models,
cognitive
bias,
coaching
I
mean
I
get
started
getting
into
this,
like
I
had
pretty
much
I
would
say
like
a
few
years
ago,
I
kind
of
went
through
a
low
when
maybe
like
three
years
ago,
I
went
through
a
low
where
I
saw
I
noticed
that
this
ain't
going
anywhere.
B
You
know,
I,
said
all
this
stuff
you
know
put
out
some
plants
nobody's
replicating,
not
nobody,
but
it's
not
gaining
traction
as
in
major
replication,
all
kinds
of
enterprises
starting
all
over
the
place-
and
there
are
some
there's
a
few
dozen,
but
it's
economically
insignificant
and
when
I
saw
that
it's
like
okay,
so
thing
this
is
a
cool
idea.
What's
up
and
and.
B
I
thought
that
that's
when
that
distinction
between
vision
and
execution,
that
part
really
started
to
hit
me
and
that's
when
I
said,
okay
got
to
just
step
up
my
game
and
that's
called
entrepreneurship,
part
pick
up
some
skills
of
execution
management,
and
how
do
you
actually
turn
this
into
reality?
So
definitely
just
a
whole
new
wave
of
learning
getting
healthy
again,
ie
like
exercising
everyday
cuz
farm
life
is
actually
pretty
hard
on
your
body
yeah.
So
one
thing
I
do
right
now,
every
day,
I
do
my
exercises
like
half
an
hour.
B
B
B
It
you
got
it
for
yourself
and
I
feel
really
good
where
I'm
at
right
now.
But
the
thing
is
that
you
that's
don't
wish
you
could
have
that.
No,
you
don't
want
to
wish
to
be
like
me
or
like
your
hero.
You
want
to
understand
that
that's
called
discipline
and
work
right.
You
got
to
work
it,
so
you
can
do
it,
but
you
got
to
put
the
work
into
it.
That's
the
bottom
line
there
yeah.
A
Back
to
practice
practice
yeah
yeah,
but
not,
but
it's
interesting
because
there's
practice
like
people
practice
like
you
know,
CEOs
are
practicing,
you
know,
snipers
are
practicing
people
practice,
but
sometimes
there's
there's
a
lack
that
a
vision
part
is
so
important
like
what
are
you
practicing
for
you
know
what
is
this?
What
is
your
kind
of
discipline
for
there's?
A
lot
of
people
are
disciplining
themselves,
so
they
can
be
better
at
doing
this
house
quo.
That's
part
of
what
I've
seen
yeah.
B
People
can
discipline
themselves
to
be
better
killers,
but
no
it's
about
integrated
skill
sets.
So
this
is
where
it
goes
back
to
the
education
system,
where
you
you're
in
a
small
discipline
and
one
of
the
questions
I
asked
well
if
you're
this
PhD
in
this
one
small
discipline,
you
know
very
very
much
about
very
little.
You
don't
know
how
this
connects
to
anything
else
in
the
world.
That's
a
very
bad
design
of
how
we
do
advanced
science
today
and
an
advanced
society.
B
A
C
B
A
B
A
B
B
It
yes,
so
that
is
so
I
have
a
mentor
who
helped
define
the
vision
and
what
I
just
I
just
love
it
and
it's
called
OSC's
vision.
It's
about
collaborative
design
for
a
transparent
and
inclusive
economy
of
abundance.
So
now
anything
that
I
do
I
filter
through
that,
like
okay,
was
that
collaborative?
Is
it
inclusive
so
that
statement
I
mean
I
can
go
on
more
length?
What
what
all
of
it
means
but
call
collaborative
design.
B
That
collaborative
part
is
critical,
because
it's
about
all
of
us
working
together,
inclusive
and
collaborative
yeah,
that's
all
about
open
source
and
distributed
like
we
need
to
include
humans
and
nature.
So
that's
the
eco-friendly
is
in
there.
Abundance
is
abundance
of
thinking
and
economies
where
abundance
is
fundamental
to
the
Sun,
providing
10,000
times
more
power
than
we
use.
Even
in
our
modern,
wasteful
society,
we
have
absolute
abundance
on
first
principles.
B
B
So
you
go
through
this
iterative
learning
process
where
you
go
from
ideas
to
reality
as
an
empowering
experience,
but
the
biggest
thing
about
that
being
that
you
learn
that
there's
a
process
by
which
so
many
people
can
collaborate-
and
this
can
be
so
much
greater
than
yourself.
So
that's
that's
what
we're
doing
we're
trying
to
scale
that
up
last
event,
we
ran
three
locations.
At
the
same
time,
our
goal
is
to
run
dozens
of
these,
so
you're
actually
also
collaborating
with
the
other
groups
that
are
running
it
in
real
time
on
the
soap.
B
So
these
events
are
nine
days
in
the
last
five
days.
We
do
projects
so
imagine
you
get
like
24
locations.
24
people
is
just
like
500
people
that
can
be
working
together
in
five
days.
You
can
do
a
lot
if
you
collaborate
like
that.
That's
that's
the
answer
to
your
question.
Well,
how
do
you
actually
get
traction
of
aligning
people
to
go
far
pushing
a
certain
project
forward?
Well,
we're
recreating.
B
We
are
creating
an
explicit
structure
where
that
can
happen
based
on
the
collaborative
skills
and
then
so
that's
a
nine-day
experience
that
we're
offering
now,
either
four
or
nine
day
experience
and
we'll
post
our
next
one.
Soon
we
were
we're
starting
to
run
this
every
essential
e
every
month,
so
really
getting
into
the
regular
programming
and
then,
in
the
summer,
starting
this
summer,
we're
doing
our
three
months
of
if
you
want
a
that
deep
immersion
where
you
learn
more
in
three
months
than
in
your
lifetime.
B
That's
that
and
right
after
that,
so
all
of
this
is
to
get
collaboratively
literate
people.
So
we
can
all
collaborate
on
an
incentive
challenge
that
I
mentioned
so
that
as
a
real
economic
experiment
that
anyone
can
then
take
the
plans
and
Enterprise
plans
and
if
they
really
want
to,
they
can
make
a
livelihood
if
they
like.
So
that's
that's
kind
of
the
nutshell
of
how
we're
approaching
that
to
get
many
people
involved
in
this
build
a
community
where
collaboration
is
now
the
norm.
A
C
A
Okay,
so
merchants
I'll
just
mention
one
thing:
the
system
I
use,
it's
gonna
upload
your
Wow,
so
you
really
do
have
chord
jigs
on
pasta,
yeah,
awesome,
it's
gonna,
upload,
the
wave,
pile
and
we'll
be
done
in
just
a
second
from
the
browser.
I
would
want
anything.
I'll
be
just
like
ten
seconds.
Nice
yeah.
B
A
The
and
talk
to
you
about
some
of
the
sort
of
yeah
like
the
interior
dimensions
above
what
you're
doing,
because
so
much
of
it
is
so.
You
know
focused
on
yeah
the
actual
stuff
and
yeah
I
know
that
there
I
had
a
strong
feeling
here
that
there's
a
there's
a
deep
interior
kind
of
private
rise
to
you
and
try
Venus
projects.
Absolutely
that
was
supposed
people
to
hear
about
an
X,
I
hope
people
will
kind
of
check
out
and
cartoon
didn't
what
you
do.
Yeah.
B
A
Not
yet
so,
after
after
I've
trained
these
forty
facilitators
and
working
with
now
and
some
of
the
main
up
doing
local
groups
or
local
things,
but
at
the
moment
well
we're
getting
ready
to
launch
an
half
a
social,
noting
app,
which
is
really
just
an
interface
for
the
community
of
people
who
are
doing
these
practices.
Yes,.
C
A
B
A
A
A
It's
working
great
because,
instead
of
just
doing
a
sort
of
give
whatever
you
want
yeah,
we
we
sort
of
take
it
sort
of
a
bridge
model,
I
call
it
transparent,
generosity,
we're
sort
of
like
there's
a
suggested
amounts
there's,
and
then
we
share
all
the
data
we
have
about
about
the
project
or
similar
ones
like
you
can
on
a
retreat
with
us
we'll
share
this.
Is
the
average
amount
that
people
who've
done
retrieve
this
length
with
us
have
given?
This
is
the
range
this
is
the
low
end.
A
C
C
C
A
B
B
B
B
A
Yes,
it's
true,
no
you're,
absolutely
right
so
yeah.
So
let
me
I'll
send
you
a
link.
This
is
this
is
the
training
that
I
did
for
about
14
months?
This
is
the
main
way
I
was
making
a
living
last
year
and
so
you'll
see
there.
You
know
I
was
working
with
between
20
and
50
people
and
they
were
donating.
A
You
know
roughly
around
3,500
to
4,000
a
month
and
I
also
was
working
one-on-one
with
people
in
doing
you
know
like
retreat
a
week-long
retreat
every
quarter
and
people
would
donate
something
like
three
to
five
thousand
per
week.
Is
so
you
know,
I'll,
add
it
up.
You
know
we're
working,
full-time
and
working
a
lot,
but
so
making
you
know
like
60
grand
you're
doing.
A
Sir,
with
retreats,
when
we
do
in-person
retreats,
we
actually
have.
We
have
some
base
expenses
that
we
have
to
pay
like
for
the
retreat
center,
and
you
know
the
food
and
everything
but
but
our
compensation
isn't
built
into
the
to
the
core
registration
piece.
So
we
can
keep
the
registration
fees
low.
Our
confrontation
comes
from
generosity,
so
at
the
end
of
the
retreat,
people
can
give
to
us
directly
through
the
nonprofit
nation
and.