Open Telemetry Uncategorized, 1 Jun 2022

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From YouTube: 2022-06-01 meeting

Description

OpenTelemetry PHP SIG Meeting

A

B

Hello, some kid: how are you hey, I'm good? How are you good thank you?

B

Hopefully, some more people show up tonight today.

B

Here he is now.

C

Good morning, good afternoon, good evening,.

C

Are y'all doing this fine fine wednesday.

B

uh I'm really good, though it's uh terrible weather down here in my part of australia,.

C

Aren't you supposed to say down under.

B

Down under yes,.

C

How's, your new how's, your new house,.

B

uh It's really good hello, gmo.

B

A

B

It's so new. We still keep finding doors, we didn't know about like switches and because yeah still don't know where everything is. That is.

D

You buy a palace.

B

Almost yes, a very big house.

C

Like nice thing, real.

D

C

You need to get a label maker and label all of your lights. I never did that, but I always feel like that's one of those things I always feel like. I should do and then I just don't do.

B

I think I need to do that with all of the drawers in our kitchen. I can't find anything I don't know where I put it away.

E

Yeah, that's I know, that's true cooking in a in a somebody's else. Kitchen is the same. Yes,.

E

Yes, so used to things being in a certain place or or even my, um my mom is still living in um in our old place, where I grew up, but she put in like a new kitchen. You know stuff like this, and everything is somewhere else now and I I'm so used to the you know, stuff being in a certain place from my childhood and it's kind of crazy.

E

Yes, I always look in there. Even I know it's not there. I always look in the old places, for you know, cops.

B

I think it would be polite of your mother to just put everything back where it should be.

E

Well, this is like new cupboards, you know, I don't know, what's called an english, we call it the kitchen, you know the furniture for the kitchen.

F

The kitchen as well, yes,.

E

So it's a new one and you know but yeah, and so she reorganized everything to be nicer for her since she's old.

E

She didn't thought of her son coming once in a while, and you know looking for stuff.

E

Wow, but uh did you figure figure out if those are poplars.

B

uh I think that they're, not no, oh, no, okay,.

E

Different features.

B

E

Well, I don't know if they you.

D

Even have populars in australia. Well I mean you can plant them. I feel like I've seen them before.

B

And they are very tall and I don't I don't.

E

Yeah they can get really tall and they have really stiff leaves so they're kind of kind of a butterfly killer because they can cut the wings yeah. That's the downside of them, but they're often planted where you know, people just fast growing trees and they can break easily because they are. The wood is very, it's not very hard.

B

Well, I need to find an expert to help me identify many things around here.

E

Well, if you go give me a closer picture, I don't know about australian trees, but.

D

B

D

B

E

Like a lot of things in australia, yes,.

C

I think there are artificial intelligence apps that will, if you take a picture of a tree, it will identify it.

B

I should try that yeah.

E

Well, I've been scout, you know, so I I've learned that.

C

E

Are you ai? I am well I'm n.I natural intelligence.

E

Well, I don't know about intelligence.

C

We can safely say you're intelligent. Well, I can't be. I have the ability to be all right well without further ado, and let's talk about trees, more talk about open, telemetry php uh we can get going today. So we have a couple open pull requests we have kashan has a b3 propagator for b3 single header. I think uh who's.

C

Commenting on that. I think that nobody's commented on it yet. um Well, I want it. I think.

E

I'm understood, but oh it's still a it's still a draft so.

C

Yeah, that's that's true. I I guess we can wait for him to make it not draft state, but it looked like. It looks pretty reasonable to me from my initial look. I could have sworn this wasn't a draft. Maybe he maybe he moved it to draft state or something.

E

Yeah um he asked me some um questions about this, um how to deal with certain things, because the eb3 protocol has some special cases where there's only where there's a deferred sampling decision and things like that, and um so basically the um the receiving side would um decide whether to sample or not, and so, and he asked me what, when we actually would send these headers and for these special cases, I just told him.

E

We would just need to take care of incoming headers like that, and we don't send them because they are really special cases and for the deferring um people should just make sure that their assemblers can handle this. So because yeah I mean you should have control well, usually over the whole tracing chain. So it's.

C

E

Yeah and wait yeah there were, I think, uh two special k well one. They defer, where there's a header where actually no header sent and something else I can have a look um but yeah. Maybe you didn't actually have time to work again.

C

Yeah, I'm sure I'm sure he'll find this upcoming week.

C

The other two are poor requests from uk. She was talking about updating the framework integration docs. I know we all have negative feelings about those documentation that documentation. I mentioned that she should rename them to getting started rather than integration guide, to be a little bit more clear and succinct about what they actually are brett. Thank you for your help. With that the w3c test service, it seems like she's, circling the drain on finishing that one. I think she never gave her some good insight. She pretty much spoon fed the answer to her.

C

So hopefully she'll be able to finish that up.

C

uh Thank you, you have uh pull request open. Is there? Are you blocked on anything there or are you still working on it.

G

Yeah, I'm I'm just working on it, but I thought in last segmenting uh we discussed that timo is going to suggest some ideas regarding the you know: moving the uh retry from the exporter, so I'm just waiting. I mean if you can suggest some more ideas and currently I'm looking into the fiber uh concept so till I'm new to the php. So I'm learning it. But apart from.

A

G

I mean: do you want to have any other ideas.

G

C

Yeah he did, he did mention t-mobile. Were you talking with him about retries for this? Maybe maybe not.

B

It wasn't me was it I was. I know I commented on on one of the pull requests that um uh that retries.

B

Maybe should be deferred somehow, rather than sleeping is that is that what you're talking about some kid yeah yeah yeah.

B

Okay, um I mean I had I had a suggestion, but it was just an idea which was in the comments which was um on failure. Instead of sleeping and retrying straight away and therefore holding up sort of application execution, um then maybe we keep a uh like internal storage of um you know things to retry, something like a batch exporter does.

B

uh Does anyone just have any feelings about that? I just I know that when I saw a sleep statement in in an exporter um it it concerned me yeah the performance of the application being instrumented.

E

Yeah, I think we cannot have blocking anywhere and it depends a little bit of course, um which one time we are or the code is running on so um yeah. If it's some event loop um runtime, then it's way over, I mean you wouldn't need sleep. You shouldn't sleep there anyway, but there are different ways to defer things than an apache or caddy or nginx server, or something like that yeah. This is also a little bit problematic, like I think, added a long text of war on about the problems of retries and uh single threats.

E

So um yeah, I don't know and that's the reason why I said it's problematic, because there's actually no good way to handle retries and singer execution right other than sleeping and that's yeah. That's blocking, and it's deferring the the well um finishing the response.

B

I mean if, if retries were only a function of say the batch um processor, then we could maybe use you know the existing um infrastructure of the batch processor to you know, add an extra field or um you know, I suppose not has been said, because it would not be there. But um you know number of times left to retry before I give up on this or something and then as part of the regular cycle of batch processing, um just iterate over everything and try them again.

E

um I'm not quite sure, but the grpc can is this actually um synchronous or asynchronous, or can they be asynchronous the grp sequels, because that would if they are only if they would be asynchronous, they wouldn't there's a better. um There would probably a way to better handle that than if it's just blocking, and we have to wait on a response.

E

Do you get my idea so.

G

I can come again.

E

um I don't I'm not sure um if they call the grpc calls if they're synchronous, so if they are blocking or if they're asynchronous. So if you could do work with kind of a promise or something like that, so while um the responses had some other sense, some other posts could be executed.

G

uh In uh grpc, basically uh they are a seeker on us, but uh there is a weight call. If we, if we use that call, then we make it. You know we wait for the response, so yeah.

E

Let's making it synchronous.

G

E

It's blocking okay. Well then, you know it's it's tricky.

A

C

Anyway, blocking is a bad word for performance.

E

Yeah, but so anyway, the most important thing in this part is that it's configurable and there are no basically no retries plenty fault because and then, if one people or users really want to have a re retry on that part and can configure it. But they should be aware that maybe the process is longer running and that it can be a problem. So if the max, if it exceeds mexican time, then we will create a fatal error.

B

Might be worth documenting as well that um the open telemetry collector is really the ideal solution here and then you, you know you locate it next to your um next to your code as a sidecar or something and it itself acts as a as a buffer to you know, hold on to and then eventually send and retry uh traces.

C

Yep, they spent a lot of time and effort making that logic a lot better from the open census collector, and it's really good. We use it in production all the time. Yeah.

E

And for the other stuff I mean that's not part of the specification, I think, but once I get to reworking all the exporter stuff, then we will use um asynchronous chords for the http ones as well, and then it would be easier to implement something I mean for jager or whatever we have there. So that's actually on my list.

C

Cool, so that's good sake. Do you have what you need to continue moving forward.

G

C

All right, I think that covers all the base. Repo things there are. uh There are two things that are ready to rumble or kind of ready to rumble in the uh make target for the package split. You know I made one small comment on that pr, but besides that it looks fine for me, I'm happy to I'm happy to, or you can merge it at, will, there's a validation for the package. Composer files actually didn't even realize that pr had been opened. Is that ready for review team?

C

If so, I couldn't take a look at it after this meeting.

E

um Can you come again.

C

E

Was taking a look at.

C

E

um Oh, the script: thingy, oh yeah, that's a left over from some.

C

C

Yeah just remove it and then merge it up here. That's fine! uh The validation for the package. Composer files is that ready for review um number 865 in the contribu repo. I I didn't even see this one get open. So I'm sorry that I missed that and I will review it after this meeting.

E

I think it is it's the same as for um for the main repository.

C

We do then I'll I'll. I prefer to that after this meeting. As long as I don't see any creepy crawlies.

C

E

So, but regarding the validation, well, that's basically um uh like a sanity check or a lint linting, the composer files. um What I've been working until now, I'm nearly finished is on actually installing all the um packages. So if we go into open telemetry php, we have, I think, six packages right now there and then I'm working on this dev tools, thing which we post on the open, telemetry php organization to basically resolve all of the composer factory packages.

E

And try insulate installation of these packages and a test repository in a test directory for all these packages and then making sure they work, but we also they also need to really edit like the default dependencies.

E

We have for um the http on clients and stuff like this, so it took a little bit longer, but it's working now, I'm just just in the process of finishing some stuff up and then we actually yeah. We can test that every package is installable, so that's basically it's taking you know resolving all the packages and then creating local repositories by linking and so on. It's a little bit a bit more tricky than just validating the files, but it works now um and then yeah.

E

We can use it and we will be sure that every package today is actually installable.

E

Awesome and we think yeah and we might- this- might be reusable for other stuff. So I didn't want to just you know, hard code, all the things.

E

Yeah we can see- maybe I put it in another repository. It could be useful for other projects as well, but for now we have it and um we can make sure that all the time every package acts well actually installable and with all the dependencies we have.

E

And that's why how our phones this one? uh You know error, which I um did a pull request. I think two days ago.

E

Yeah, you emerged. It was basically just a left over some packages that I oh yeah in the package and left the old, the old name in there, but it of course doesn't exist and why it did never exist, so it wasn't installable. It was, I think, the contrib um package, so but everything else now works and installable and yeah. Once that is finished, I will create a pull request to integrate this call into the ci, and then I can actually close this ticket for the packages.

C

C

Thanks for the update, that was that's going to be immensely helpful and people are starting to use the library a little bit more conveniently.

E

Yeah and I will- or we can add some more um stuff- you know some utility things to this uh dev tools. uh um So if you, if somebody has any idea which we can add some whatever um you can, could edit there um it's just a composer, some composer commands. So I compose a console application and if you want to know how it works, then you can just have it.

E

um Maybe I can just link it.

C

Yeah, you can click in the the meeting notes if you'd like sorry that you can make it in the meeting notes or in slack, if you'd like.

E

F

E

C

B

E

Adding that to the meeting notes- oh yeah yeah, one uh things to add this because um brad and uh bob and me had some or I asked some conversations, um so this is actually using some.

E

If you go into the workflows in this patch, it's basically you um using a reference of a workflows uh which I put in this repository as well, which we can add which actually could reuse for the main packages as well.

E

So we might do that and also I created, I don't know well if we want to use it. I created like a um a meta package for all the development dependencies we have um so meta package is basically just a composer file which just references other packages and doesn't have any anything else, but maybe we want to use it as well for the um for the main repository. So we don't.

E

We have less redundancy because it's basically just pulling in all the defaults and development dependencies. We have php united and php standards, whatever we have so.

E

If that's okay with you guys, then I can make a cool request for that. Restaurant.

E

That's perfect! Yeah, because very often I found or we changed something in this regard or in the main repository, and then we forget about the contract repository. So when we have some um some single point of truth so to speak, then we could just change everything there and then we will be changed.

E

Yeah and uh that's just some- I want to make some effort that we don't have. We have left redundancy and less you know um stuff. We have to change if we don't have to change everything.

D

Lots of different repositories, and things like that.

C

Using the dry principle is always good.

C

The next thing that I had on the agenda was the hotel community demo I'll share this link in chat just want to make sure that everybody was aware of it and our involvement in it.

C

The open, telemetry community demo is a demo that the open, telemetry team is putting together to showcase all the languages working together in one cohesive unit, and we are.

F

C

To do an author, an authentication service, I believe timo is volunteering to do that and it'll be really neat to be able to use that project in order to be able to see all the different languages working together in one little shop. That is docker compose installable. So if you want to check that out I'll post, a link in the chat for github.com, open, telemetry, open telemetry community.

B

C

Well, let me find it real, quick demo.

C

Open telemetry demo web store is what it's called this.

C

That's those are all the topics that we had on the agenda for today. Does anybody else have anything I'd like to discuss today.

F

So bob this is adele. Can you hear me yep? We can hear you yeah yeah, so I don't have any specific topic, probably next time onwards, if I'm active. Definitely I will raise some of the point just want to introduce myself, uh I'm from cisco and the sanket produced kishan and amber who who normally contribute in the php community. They are from my team and they report to me. So as a part of this collaboration. Definitely I would like to be more active on the php community. Apart from php.

F

My team is also contributing on the python hotel community and on the paper, server c, plus plus sdk community, as well just wanted to give you the context and also this uh hotel demo, which you are talking. uh Definitely some contribution is going on c, plus plus sdk site from my team, but if there is anything specific on the php you can and other people can definitely be available to contribute.

C

Awesome aj, thank you for uh introducing yourself and we're very happy to have your team members working out with us. Thank you.

E

For the demo that uh should be rather straightforward, so it already made a plan with it so from the requirements it's easily um to be set up with um api platform. So a lot of stuff wouldn't even need um a code or coding and small and generating the api and stuff like this shouldn't be much, but if there's any other need, then of course I will reach out.

F

E

Not a problem, thank you, um yeah. One thing because I was talking about this was the.

E

Thing this is the kind of meta package I was talking about. If you took a look into the composer files, it's basically just you see how it works and there's no code on there. It's basically just a wrapper around all the dependencies.

C

E

So I'm maybe the only thing I should. Let me have a one look at the issues we have.

C

E

Propagator: okay, at a aws, sdk instrumentation: why don't they do this on smoke? um Well, okay,.

E

E

E

Yeah, okay, maybe um this week brett we find a a date to. We can have a date regarding the configuration, but um at the moment I'm still a little bit busy. So I will just I will reach out to you but um yeah. This is something we should have for beyonce.

E

That's how it goes: okay,.

C

All right, well with that, if we have nothing else, then we'll adjourn this meeting and we'll talk about this.

F

Next week,.

G

uh uh Guys can you provide your suggestion on the ticket itself for the retry, you know about brad.

G

Your ideas on the ticket, so in case I know, can you just provide you all the solution that we discussed on the retry ticket itself, so that in case I can you know, follow it up.

A

G

I think he said.

E

I mean on the tick, I think which one is the ticket. I think I already brought the wall of text down.

G

E

E

E

Yeah, basically, there's a command for me, that's from december the 8th. So that's basically um a lot of what I was talking about.

E

It puts in better words what I was trying to explain a few minutes ago. So there's actually you know some links to how the execution and php works and why it can or cannot be a problem and stuff like this, so with a shutdown and process shutdown. Now that works yeah. That basically explains it better than I did here. I think okay.

G

E

Yeah then also the the um event-based runtimes and a link there like swoon swap there and some more now, so you can have an idea how it can be different and different.

H

Okay, anything else, anybody any complaints.

H

uh I'm currently working on uh one of the ticket, and that is issue 632, so I'll be uh creating the pr today only in next star, but I've raised and I've put a comment uh on the ticket and I basically have a problem with recreating the issue so that you can have a look and reply as soon as possible so that I will be able to close it because mostly I've done the uh development part testing. I'm doing so. For that I needed some help. I put the comment you can check.

H

E

uh Scenario performance: well, it's basically when there's an exception, that's just um I'm formatting the the normal x um stack trace, for my exception, to be a little bit more um well, I didn't even write it a little bit more telling or um I'm not quite sure what the initial purpose of it was, but it basically just using you- can just create a create an exception and use the stack trace, which is there and um as to test how it works. So it's basically um you know reformating. These stack trace to be more.

H

Java, like.

E

H

I have reformatted it just that the function is not getting called from anywhere in the code. It's not.

E

It's well okay. I can have a look at it. I just yeah yeah yeah,.

A

E

This I basically just created the ticket. Sometimes I see things which should not be somewhere or could be refactored somewhere else. You know, then, because um yeah, that's not really the um the span or the um I'm looking forward. Give me a second, um I know okay. Well, um the concern of this ban is not to format a step trace, basically like this, which should be just separated.

E

Yeah but I can have a look sure, thank you, you're welcome, so anything else. My friends.

C

Nothing for me.

C

Okay, all right we'll catch y'all on the internet.

A

Yeah have a nice week, everybody bye bye. Thank you.

H

Bye. Thank you.

A