►
From YouTube: Keynote Panel: Getting Hired - Scott Hanselman; Jerome Hardaway; Zainab Ebrahim; Saron Yitbarek
Description
As a Newbie in a Pandemic, How your Unique Story can get you Hired.
A
Hey
friends,
I'm
scott
hanselman
and
welcome
to
openjs
world.
I
was
told
to
give
a
keynote,
but
rather
than
me
talking
for
a
long
time
with
evocative
stock,
photography
and
inspirational
stories.
I
thought
a
better
idea
would
be
to
bring
people
who
are
much
more
interesting
and
much
more
competent
than
I
to
the
stage.
So
I'm
going
to
be
thrilled
to
introduce
our
panelists
for
this
wonderful
panel
getting
hired.
So
again,
I
am
scott
hanselman
to
my
left.
We
have
jerome
hardaway
from
vets
who
code.
Thank
you
for
joining
us.
A
A
Cool,
so
this
panel
wants
to
kind
of
talk
about
getting
hired
decode
a
little
bit
about
it.
We're
in
the
middle
of
you
know
in
the
middle
of
a
panera
bread
in
the
middle
of
a
panini.
Some
people
find
that
an
offensive
joke.
I
find
it
funny
every
single
time.
I
don't
care
whether
you
think
it's
a
bad
thing
or
not.
A
We
are
in
a
really
difficult
time
right
now,
both
in
tech
we're
having
growing
pains
as
a
war
as
a
world,
we're
separated
and
not
all
in
person
at
openjs
world
right
now
and
getting
hired
is
really
hard.
Every
time
I
hear
about
someone
losing
their
job
in
the
middle
of
this
pandemic,
I
think
to
myself
wow.
This
is
a
really
rough,
a
rough
time
to
be
doing
that
zainab
have
have
people
been
coming
to
flourish
for
for
coaching
and
being
better
at
getting
getting
higher
during
this
time.
C
A
Yeah
saron
you've
dedicated
a
lot
of
your
career
to
help.
People
who
are
you
know
early
in
career,
be
successful.
It
seems
like
there's
a
bit
of
a
haves
and
have-nots
between
there's
like
people
who
have
20
years
experience
and
they
may
have
finding
trouble
finding
jobs
because
of
ageism
and
people
who
are
just
getting
started.
Who
can't
get
anyone
to
take
a
chance
on
them?.
D
Yeah
absolutely-
and
I
think
one
thing
that's
been
really
encouraging
in
recent
years-
is
moving
away
from
calling
them
junior
developers
to
early
career
developers.
I
think
that
slowly
we're
becoming
a
little
bit
more
open-minded
as
to
you
know
the
different
skill
levels,
we're
willing
to
accept
in
developer
positions-
and
I
think
just
starting
with
naming-
is
a
good
sign
that
we're
moving
in
the
right
direction.
I've
also
seen
titles
like
associate
developer,
which
is
also
encouraging
because
it
kind
of
establishes
the
career
ladder.
D
You
know
a
little
bit
sooner
a
little
bit
earlier
in
someone's
career,
and
I
find
that
really
encouraging.
So
I
think
that
we
are,
I
think,
we're
very,
very
far
away
from
getting
to
where
we
want
to
be,
but
I
can
see
kind
of
baby
steps
in
incorporating
and
introducing
people
with
just
one
or
zero
years
of
experience
into
the
official
ladder
at
a
tech
company
and
at
an
engineering
team.
A
One
of
my
bosses
has
said
that
when
you're
putting
together
a
basketball
team,
you
can't
teach
height,
but
everything
else
can
be
taught
ball,
handling,
rules
of
the
game
and
all
those
kind
of
things,
and
he
is
consistently
surprised
that
we
don't
hire
for
height.
Because,
honestly,
you
know,
oh
you,
don't
know
ruby,
that's
fine!
We'll
teach
you
ruby,
you
don't
know
c
sharp
will
teach
us
c
sharp
jerome.
You
work
with
veterans
in
upscaling
those
veterans.
Why
don't
people
teach
why
don't
people
hire
like
that.
B
If
I'm
being
100
honest,
I'm
thinking
it's
a
little
bit
of
trying
to
hitch
the
bets
in
their
favor
and
you
know
just
laziness
right.
We
I've
been
on
this
remote
journey
of
being
able
to
educate
enough
skilled
people
remotely
for
six
seven
years
right.
So
I
I
have
that
experience
a
lot
of
people,
especially
we're
not
truly
doing
it
remote
first
or
doing
it
on
you
know
in
a
pandemic.
So
it's
not
like
real
remote
work.
B
Where
you,
you
know
you
can
work
from
home
and
then
you,
like,
you
know,
go
to
the
beach
and
then
everybody's
happy
and
stuff.
It's
like!
Oh,
you
know,
I'm
gonna
put
on
a
mask
and
wash
my
hands
like
for
45
seconds,
because
you
know
I
don't
want
to
get
sick.
So
it's
a
different
mindset
and
people
are
just
not
thinking
from
it
like
in
that,
like
in
that
aspect
when
it
comes
to
hiring
and
like
working
with
remote
workers.
B
I
I
spoke
last
week
to
our
company
that
had
200
entry-level
jobs
just
on
backfield,
because
you
know
we're
just
going
to
wait
till
the
world
opens
up
when
my
senior
software
engineers,
so
my
my
alumni,
who
are
getting
there
going
for
their
second
job.
So
when
they
come
to
me-
and
they
ask
me
to
like
help
them
with
it-
they're
getting
hired
within
weeks
and
they're
getting
upwards
to
like
the
salary
plus
like
20
30
50
more
than
what
they
asked
for.
B
B
You
know,
they're
getting
snatched
away,
hotcakes
and
they're
getting
a
lot
more
money
than
they're
asking
for,
while
juniors
they're
having
to
almost
be
like
small
versions
of
devrel
and
they're
having
to
really
showcase
those
skills
to
us
to
instill
that
social
equity.
To
you
know,
get
companies
to
you
know,
take
a
chance
on
that.
A
A
So
I
guess
we
won't
hire
a
junior,
achieving
pardon
me
an
early
in
career
or
an
emerging
developer,
because
we
don't
have
the
time
the
patience,
perhaps
we're
too
lazy
to
really
invest
in
them.
I
can't
sit
with
that
person
and
give
them
that
love
that
they
need
that
and
honestly
the
ability
to
fail.
I
think
that
we
don't
give
early
and
career
developers
a
safe
place
to
fail
fast
and
often
without
judgment.
B
We
call
it
grace
in,
like
my
community,
like
you,
have
to
be
able
to
give
people
grace
like
we
demand,
we
demand
a
level
of
perfection
that
we
can't
obtain
from
a
junior
so
that
we
didn't
have,
and
one
is
particularly
when
you
go
to
like
middle
and
city
engineers.
They
are
I've,
seen
it
in
my
community
a
lot
where
people
are
demanding
a
level
of
capabilities.
I'm
like
do
you
not
remember
how
like,
when
we
first
got
in
this
community?
How
easy
it
was
to
get
in,
like
all
you
had
to
do,
was
know.
B
Bootstrap
and
jquery
like
now
is
a
front
end.
You
can't
even
like
you
need
to
know
a
front-end
framework.
You
need
to
understand
apis.
You
need
to
like
be
able
to
tell
the
difference
between
several
for
running
css
frameworks
from
bootstrap
to
foundation.
Tailwind,
it's
not
the
same,
so
we
have
to
give
people
grace
if.
A
C
Yeah,
it's
pretty
overwhelming.
I
think
what
we've
been
seeing
a
lot
with
the
people
that
we've
been
talking
about
is
like
a
lot
of
anxiety
and
feeling
like
they're,
not
good
enough
right,
and
I
find
that
that
mentality
sometimes
even
hinders
their
ability
to
really
get
through
the
interview
process.
Right,
because,
when
you're
going,
the
interview
process
in
itself
is
already
extremely
hard
right.
C
You're,
like
put
on
the
spot,
you
have
to
talk
to
people,
it's
really
anxiety
inducing
in
itself,
but
then,
if
on
top
of
that,
you
feel
like
you
know,
there's
so
much
to
learn.
There's
so
much
to
know,
and
I'm
expected
to
know
all
of
these
things
all
at
once
in
order
to
prove
myself
in
order
to
get
this
job
that
I
really
want,
and
I
like
to
reframe
that
a
little
bit
in
the
sense
that
if
you
can
code,
you
can
learn
and
this
industry
it's
all
about
learning.
Nobody
is
perfect.
C
You
know
I
mean
like
you
can
learn,
and
that
is
the
type
of
stuff
that
gets
you
hired
right
being
able
to
demonstrate
that
you
can
you're
resourceful
that
you
can
learn
that
you're
driven,
and
I
think
that
that's
that's
the
focus
that
we
should
be
having
really
because
the
amount
of
frameworks
and
technologies
and
tools
that
are
going
to
come
up
are
going
to
continue
to
grow
right,
and
that
should
not
be
the
focus.
If
you
can
code,
you
can
pretty
much
pick
up
any
of
those
things
along
the
way.
A
So
ron
in
your
career,
you
have
been
very
much
as
someone
who
empowers
and
wants
people
to
think
about
the
system,
as
opposed
to
thinking
about
the
individual
line
of
code.
Is
that
important?
What
zainab
is
saying
to
like
learn?
How
to
learn
is
the
most
important
skill
that
people
have
to
have
right
now
in
today's
job
market.
D
D
You
know,
job
hunts
and
their
learn
to
code
journeys
and
one
of
the
things
that
shows
up
over
and
over
again
is
just
people
just
bouncing
around
being
all
over
the
place
and
their
inability
to
you
know
to
lower
their
inability,
but
their
struggle
to
learn
isn't
because
they
literally
can't
learn
it's
because
they
feel,
as
as
he
said,
overwhelmed
and
they
feel
all
over
the
place
and
they
feel
like.
Oh,
you
know
I
hear
about
this
new
framework.
Okay,
let
me
jump
to
this
real
quick.
D
Oh
two
weeks
pass:
oh
no,
there's
another
frame!
Okay,
let
me
go
to
this
and
they're
jumping
around
so
much
and
so
frequently
that
they
get
nothing
done
and
then
feeling
like
they
get
nothing
done,
makes
them
feel
stupid
and
that
they
can't
learn.
And
then
this
is
vicious
cycle.
So
I
feel,
like
you
know,
it's
not
just
learning
how
to
learn
but
learning
how,
as
jerome,
just
put
in
the
chat
learning,
how
to
plan
and
learning
how
to
stick
to
a
plan
and
believe
in
the
plan.
D
A
I
really
like
what
I'm
seeing
in
in
social
media
with
with
younger
people,
and
I
mean
literally
younger
in
age,
using
technology
in
a
way
that
is
creative,
so
that
they
can
have
accountability
partners.
There's
a
young
woman
on
tick,
tock,
name,
medical
cat
with
a
k
she
streams,
herself
studying
so
that
others
might
normalize
studying
for
three
or
four
hours
at
a
time.
So
she
puts
her
phone
there
and
she
studies
she
plays
music.
She
does
pomodoros
and
then
every
25
minutes.
A
She
takes
a
break
and
she
addresses
the
live
audience
and
it's
mostly
just
chill
and
vibe
and
learn
with
cat,
and
I
think
to
myself
like
wow.
I
would
never
have
that
ability
to
to
be
that
organized
to
be
that
disciplined
to
be
that
plan,
but
what's
cool
about
it,
that
you're
watching
her
be
dedicated
to
a
thing,
and
it's
like
well.
A
If,
if
this
internet
stranger
is
being
open
and
positive
and
empowering
then
maybe
I'll
plan,
my
study
and
we'll
we'll
do
it
together,
we'll
study
together
and
having
those
those
those
partnerships
as
opposed
traditional
mentorships,
which
is
just
old
person
lectures
young
person,
I
think
is,
is
a
new
way
to
think
about
studying
and
planning,
especially
in
public
jerome.
Now
you
have
put
together
vets
who
code
for
many
years
now,
and
it's
not
necessarily
a
mentorship
program,
there's
a
lot
of
peer.
A
B
How
do
I
make
sure?
Well
just
how
do
I
best
pay
the
best
way
to
say
this,
I
feel
like
I
have
a
unfair
disadvantage
in
the
education
place
right.
I
am
my
people
right,
the
people
that
come
through
vetsuko
they're,
usually
people
who
you
know
they
were
on
the
front
lines
and
battlefields
and
stuff,
and
that's
who
I
was
so
in
the
military.
They
would
call
us,
like
first
term
troops
like
the
e4
mafia,
so
the
lower
ranking
people
and
I'm
one
of
them.
B
B
Exactly
right,
I
can
come
in
talking
to
them
the
way
they've
already
been
trained
and
it
just
just
resonates
right
and
they
understand,
because
from
my
background
I
have
you
know
in,
I
have
enough
experience
to
where
most
of
the
most
guys
and
girls
who
are
in
infantry
or
like
aaron,
who
she
was
an
eod
and
always
just
explosive
ordnance
disposal,
because
she
didn't
want
to
jump
out
of
planes.
So
she
chose
bombs
over
planes
to
swap
me.
A
B
I
think
that's
the
biggest
like
yeah,
I
think
that's
the
biggest
secret,
like
you
know,
I'm
I
think
I'm
the
only
code
school
guy-
that's
not
like
you
know.
I
don't
have
fancy
bastards
or
anything
like
that.
I'm
just
hey
yo!
I
was
out
there.
I
switched
to
m4
for
a
macbook
pro
and
I
never
looked
back
just
like
y'all.
B
So
I,
like
you
know
we
have
people
who
are
love,
css
and
love
ux.
We
have
people
who
love
just
you
know
doing
api
serverless
and
I
try
to
you
know
see
I
try
to
quickly
identify
it's
almost
like
of
you
know
the
360
of
a
battlefield,
I'm
always
trying
to
perpendicularly
through,
like
cyclically
in
a
cycler
manner,
identify
what
they
love
and
what
they're
having
problems
with
and
try
to
like
fill
the
gaps
of
those.
So
that's
like
I
said
I
have
I.
A
So
let
me
ask
this
then
zainab:
how
important
is
it
that
people
who
are
into
tech
and
beginning
see
people
who
are
their
people,
because
jerome
has
just
described
a
really
welcoming
environment
that
you
know
and
I'll
be
honest
with.
You
doesn't
speak
to
me
right
because
I
never
served
and
thank
you
for
your
service,
but
I'm
hearing
that
that's
what
they
need.
How
important
is
it
saying
that
for
people
to
see
people
that
look
like
them
in
I
tech,
you
may
be
muted.
C
My
bad
yep,
it's
absolutely
important.
I
think
the
idea
of
belonging
goes
such
a
long
way
right,
because
this
industry
and
just
coding
in
general,
is
seen
as
something
that's
very
hard.
That
takes
a
lot
of
focus.
It
takes
a
lot
of
energy
and
sometimes
we
struggle
with
a
lot
of
imposter
syndrome
right
like
knowing
that
someone
like
me
can
do
it
is
such
a
huge
boost
right
specifically
because
of
that
anxiety
that
comes
with
you
know
doing
something
that's
really
hard.
C
A
A
That
statement
that
you
made
that
that
someone
says
well,
you
know
she
did
it.
I
can
do
it
and
if
I
see
that
person
I
can
do
it,
I
don't
want
me
doing
it
to
make
someone
feel
like
they
explicitly
can't
like,
for
example,
when
I
go
to
family
get
togethers,
I'm
the
computer
person
and
there's
something
about
me
or
my
style
or
whatever,
because
I
want
more
of
a
classic
nerd
thing
with
the
star
wars
and
the
whatnot
and
the
leds
and
the
video
games
they
go.
A
Oh
he's
a
computer
person,
you
know
he's
a
computer
person
like
very
early.
We
get
split
into
computer
people
and
not
computer
people,
and
I
don't
like
that.
I
want
to
normalize
normal
people
coding
and
whenever
someone,
you
know,
I
say,
I'm
a
computer
person
and
then
that
immediately
frames
our
relationship
such
that
they
go
and
flip
the
I'm
not
a
techie.
A
But
but
you
are
you
use
excel
and
you
do
great
things
with
word
and
you,
you
know,
do
macros
in
photoshop,
like
maybe
you're,
more
technical
than
you
give
yourself
credit
for
you
know
what
can
we
do
in
the
community
to
be
more
welcoming
to
those
people
jerome?
You
look
like
you
have
something
you
want
to
add.
B
Yeah
I've
been
thinking
about
that
a
lot.
My
solution
to
this
is
normalizing
people
bringing
their
entire
self
to
work,
and
not
just
when
it
like
benefits
the
company.
All
right,
we've
had
a
lot
special
past.
Two
years
being
a
minority
we've
had
a
lot
of
conversations
around
black
lives
matter
and
being
able
to
bring
your
whole
self
to
work,
but,
as
you've
been
seeing,
of
course,
the
past
year
companies
have
started
to
take
their
back
because
it's
a
lot
harder
than
you
know,
throwing
a
black
square
on
instagram
or
a
black
band
banner.
B
So
the
first
thing
that
we
have
to
do
is
just
allow
people
to
be
their
whole
self.
Like
you
know,
if
you
see
me
on
twitter
twice
a
day,
I'm
talking
about
cooking
recipes
right,
because
that's
what
I
like
to
think
about
when
that
that
helps
me
get
my
brain
working
better
than
thinking
about
code
right,
but
you
know,
oh,
I
wonder
how
caviar
fried
rice
would
go.
A
B
Well,
I
think
that's
like
I
said,
I'm
it's
very
hard
because
of
my
background.
No
one
really
tries
to
gatekeep
me
because
they're,
like
yo,
this
dude
has
a
purple
heart.
Who
am
I
gonna
like
tell
this
dude
what
he
can
and
can't
do
so
it's
very
it's
very
weird
right
so,
but
I
think,
as
a
community
we
just
gotta
let
people
bring
their
whole
sales
to
work
like
I
love
going
on
twitter
and
finding
all
the
other
random
things
out
about
people
like
I,
you
know
air
fryer
nation
right
with
angie
right.
A
Of
course,
angie
is
a
very
famous
developer
and
tester
and
international
speaker,
who
also
has
a
cult
of
people
who
love
air,
frying
and
they've
even
made
t-shirts
right,
and
that's
a
really
great
example,
though,
that
we
as
a
community
need
to
be
welcoming
to
people
and
all
of
their
diverse,
diverse
interests.
I
know
saron
that
when
you
founded
code
newbies,
that
was
really
really
important
to
make
it,
so
everyone
could
be
interested
in
all
the
things
that
they're
interested
in
you
are
normalizing
normal
people
coding.
D
Yeah
exactly
and
jerome,
I
totally
love
your
point
about
seeing
different
people
and
bringing
them
their
whole
selves.
One
of
my
favorite
people
to
follow
on
instagram
is
april
camera,
her
last
name
right
now,
but
she's
vogue
and
code
on
the
internet.
She
works
for
microsoft
and
she
I
just
love
her
instagram
because
she's,
I
think,
she's
a
developer
relations
person.
I
think
she.
D
Yeah
yeah
exactly
and
she's
talking
about
her.
You
know
her
plants
and
her
fashion
that
she
she
sews
her
own
clothes,
these
beautiful
designs
and
how
she,
you
know,
organizes
her
office
and
I
think
she
just
moved
to
a
new
house
and
it's
just
so
much
fun.
Seeing
someone
who's
highly
technical,
written
books
about
python,
you
know
does
so
many
great.
You
know
hardcore
quote-unquote
code,
things
being
just
a
normal
person
and
for
us
at
code
newbie
for
us,
where
that
really
we've
tried
to
kind
of
emphasize
that
is
in
the
podcast.
D
We
have
a
show
called
the
code
movie.
Podcast
we've
done
hundreds
of
episodes
over
the
last
six
seven
years
now
and
when
we
pick
the
yes,
when
we
pick
who
we
want
to
showcase
on
the
show
we
go
for
people
who
are
normal
people
who
represent
all
different
walks
of
life,
all
different
backgrounds,
people
who
started
as
babysitters
and
teachers-
and
you
know
one
of
our
most
popular
episodes-
was
the
truck
driver
who
learned
how
to
how
to
code.
D
You
know
in
between
you
know,
driving
trucks
and
on
little
breaks
and
late
at
night,
and
just
saying
that
you
know
normal
people,
people
with
regular
jobs
with
you
know,
maybe
a
little
bit
more
humble
beginnings
can
get
started
and
by
showcasing
such
a
wide
range
of
people,
you
know
a
nice
array
of
people,
you're
able
to
send
home
the
message
that
hey
there
is
an
archetype.
There
is
no
one
right
way
to
do
it.
There
is
no
single
path,
everyone
is
different
and
this
place
is
welcoming
to
all
so.
A
That's
great,
doesn't
it
seem
like
that
that
open
source
and
linux
and
javascript
and
open
code
is
really
like,
should
be
the
place
where
people
go
to
get
involved
in
tech
like
it
is
on
the
open
source
community
to
be
like
hey,
like
the
whole
point
of
all
of
this
was
free
code
and
free,
you
know
free
knowledge
and
all
these
kinds
of
things.
This
should
be
the
community
that
people
go
to
to
to
get
involved
in
technology.
C
100,
I
actually
think
that
that
is
a
great
opportunity
to
showcase
your
your
skills,
but
also
your
drive
right.
It
shows
that
that
you
care
about
someone
else's
project
or
that
you
care
about
a
community
and
to
build
it,
and
it
is
a
huge
booster
in
someone's
resume,
especially
if
you're
just
getting
started
with
your
career,
so
that
is
definitely
somewhere
that
I
try
to
like
point
people
towards,
but
I
will
say
that
a
lot
of
people
kind
of
feel
intimidated
by
that
as
well.
C
You
know-
and
I
think
it
has
to
do
with
the
fact
that
we
are
probably
scared
of
like
making
mistakes
right
like
if
I
open
a
pull
request
on
some.
You
know
open
source
project.
What,
if
I
get,
you
know
rejected
what,
if
someone
you
know
is
criticizing
the
way
that
I'm
approaching
this,
and
so
I
think,
there's
definitely
a
need
for
creating
a
little
bit
more
of
an
incentive
for
people
to
feel.
Okay
with,
like
you,
don't
have
to
get
everything
right.
C
A
That's
a
call
back
a
little
bit
to
that
car.
That
statement
that
I
made
a
little
bit
ago,
where
I
said
people
need
a
welcoming
place
to
fail.
That's
the
number
one
thing
at
microsoft,
where
I
work
that
we
feel
that
the
early
and
career
people
say
that
they
don't
feel
comfortable
failing
because
they
think
they
have
to
be
perfect.
A
They
were
perfect,
their
whole
lives
to
get
to
this
place
and
now
they're
at
this
big
scary
company,
and
they
need
to
do
just
the
right
thing,
and
I
would
really
like
them
to
be
able
to
fail
quickly.
You
know,
hopefully
without
costing
billions
of
dollars
as
fast
as
possible,
and
they
always
like
how
do
you
know
this
god?
B
That's
my
favorite
thing
like
they
just
put
me
in
a
project
at
microsoft,
and
I
was
like:
oh
I'm
gonna
mess
this
up
I'll.
Let
y'all
know
that
right
now
and
everybody
was
like
well.
At
least
you
run
it.
So
I
was
like
yeah,
I'm
a
you
know
you
have
to
like.
I
said
with
the
whole
idea
of
grace
like,
but
it
starts
with
yourself
right
people
they
get
in
their
own
heads
right
and
they
are
trying
to
live
up
to
an
unrealistic
viewpoint
of
themselves.
I'm
like
you
know
I
try
to.
B
I
tell
my
veterans
that
all
the
time
I'm
like
did
you
forget
how
crazy
it
was
going
through
basic.
You
were
not
you
before
you
were
in
a
basic.
You
were
to
the
military,
a
horrible
version
of
civilian
that
had
to
get
molded
into
who
you
currently
are
now.
So
don't
think
about
it
in
that
in
the
scope
that
you
have
to
be
perfect,
I
was
like
no,
they
literally
trained
you
and
taught
you
how
to
do
things.
That's
how
it's
going
to
be
now.
B
We
apply
that
to
a
community
like
one
thing
that
I
love
the
best
that
I
learned
from
the
military
is
you
know
I
call
it.
You
know
two
things:
crawl,
walk
run
and
buddy
system.
So
when
I,
when
I'm
in
open
source
and
I'm
helping
my
veterans,
it's
always
first
thing
I
do.
Is
I
connect
them
to
someone
who
has
more
experience
in
this
than
them
and
I
try
to
make
projects
that
can
help
them
grow
in
open
source
as
well,
as
you
know,
not
intimidate
them.
B
I've
I've
learned
a
lot
about
onboarding
open
source
over
the
past
six
years.
Because
of
you
know
I
you
know
I've
seen
it
all
the
bad
things.
I've
seen
all
the
good
things.
So
I'm
like
you
know
what
you
know.
These
are
things
that
you
need
to.
You
need
to
find
when
you're
going
to
open
source
like
community,
just
find
a
first
find
something
that
you
actually
enjoy
and
then
turn
around
and
see.
You
know.
B
Where
can
I
help
and
just
start
talking
to
people
you'll,
be
amazed
how
much
you
know
you'll
learn
just
doing
that.
A
lot
of
people
don't
think
about
that.
You
know
what
coding
is
a
social
game
and
you
have
to
get
in
there
and
start
thinking
and
aspects
of
these
are
people
behind
code
right
companies.
B
They
don't
think
like
that
for
the
most
part,
but
you
know
when
it
comes
to
open
source.
You
can
do
that,
particularly
in
javascript,
where
you
know,
because
of
you
know,
react
and
the
va
engine
we
kind
of
democratized
coding,
because
we
went
from
the
toy
language
and
like
flipped
into
like.
Oh,
this
is
one
of
the
fastest
growing
production
level
languages
on
the
planet
like
how
did
that
happen
right?
This
was
something
made
in
two
weeks.
A
C
The
technical
interview
process
does
not
allow
for
any
margin
of
error
right,
and
so
here
we
are
talking
about
what
it
takes
to
be
a
good
developer,
and
it's
all
about
you
know
embracing
those
failures
and
learning.
Yet
for
some.
For
some
reason,
we've
standardized
an
interview
process
and
a
technical
assessment
that
does
not
allow
for
that.
D
Sure
I
think
that
you
know
my
parting
thoughts
are
that,
even
though
we
have
a
long
way
to
go
in
terms
of
where
we
are
in
the
tech
industry
and
being
more
inclusive
and
being
kinder
and
just
a
better
place
to
work,
I
think
we're
definitely
headed
in
the
right
direction.
I've
been
really
optimistic,
especially
in
the
last
couple
years
of
seeing,
as
I
mentioned,
the
early
career
developer,
you
know
name
change.
D
This
idea
of
you
know
pushing
back
against
burnout
and
really
embracing
self-care
and
mental
health,
and
I
feel
like
we
are
getting
to
a
place
where
we
are
including
more
people
and
we
are
bringing
people
in,
and
that
is
because
of
individuals.
It's
because
of
individual
people,
who
decided
to
be
kind
decided
to
be
open,
decided
to
be
welcoming.
So
I
hope
I
hope
each
of
you
feel
empowered
to
to
take
on
a
little
bit
of
that
responsibility
and
making
coding
a
better
place
to
be.
A
Fantastic
well,
I
appreciate
you
all
saranya
barak,
founder
of
code,
newbies,
jerome
hardaway
from
vets
who
code
zainab
ibrahimi
from
flourish,
and
I
have
been
your
host
scott
hanselman,
also
the
host
of
the
hanson.
It's
podcast
and
we've
appreciated
you
hanging
out
with
us
here.
We
hope
you
have
a
great
conference
at
openjs
world
2021
goodbye.