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From YouTube: Built Heritage Sub-Committee – September 30, 2013
Description
Built Heritage Sub-Committee – September 30, 2013 – Audio Stream
Agenda and background materials can be found at http://www.ottawa.ca/agendas
A
B
C
B
Thank
you
for
all
that
are
attending
this
special
meeting
today
of
the
built
heritage
subcommittee.
We
do
have
some
speakers,
but
we're
going
to
have
a
little
presentation.
First,
the
are
there
any
conflicts
of
interests
and
we
have
no
minutes
to
approve.
So
therefore,
we're
going
to
go
right
to
the
meat
of
the
matter,
which
is
the
application
to
demolish
207
to
209,
Murray,
Street
and
portions
of
the
former
Our
Lady's
school
287,
Cumberland
Street,
and
to
stabilize
it
south
and
west
walls,
and
so
mr.
Koontz
is
going
to
give
us
a
presentation
and
mr.
B
B
D
This
special
meeting
of
the
built
heritage
subcommittee
and
as
she
harder
said
this
is
the
only
item
on
the
agenda.
The
I
wanted
to
add
that
I
know
that
there
you
didn't
have
a
lot
of
time
to
look
at
this
and
I
wanted
to
add
that
everybody,
the
members
of
the
committee
and
the
public
and
community
associations
all
received
this
report
within
it
within
an
hour
of
each
other.
D
The
subject
properties
are
located
at
the
corner
of
Cumberland
and
Murray
Street
within
the
boundaries
of
the
Lower
Town
West,
the
Lower
Town
West
Heritage
Conservation
District,
that
was
designated
in
1993.
There
are
two
properties
and
here's
the
Heritage
Conservation
District,
as
you
are
aware
that
Lower
Town
West
Heritage,
Conservation
District
and
directly
abuts
the
Byward
market,
Heritage
Conservation
District.
D
The
two
properties
have
been
vacant
and
boarded
up
for
a
for
a
number
of
years,
our
lady
school
on
the
left
here
and
it's
our
lady's
a
school.
Some
people
call
it
our
lady,
but
it
was
her
school
mates.
It
was
constructed
in
1904
part
of
a
complex
of
english-language
Roman
Catholic
institutions
that
surround
us
in
bridges.
There
was
also
a
very
school
and
this
this
school
all
located
I
here
in
the
heart
of
the
Lower
Town
Town
neighborhood.
D
There's
a
another
picture
and
also
see
the
this
brick
double
was
constructed
in
the
818
1890s.
It
is
a
brick
veneer
structure,
1870s,
a
brick
veneer
structure
with
red
and
buff
colored
brick.
It
was
damaged
by
a
fire
prior
to
its
purchased
by
the
current
owner,
and
it
has
been
at
the
time
of
the
Heritage
Conservation
District
study.
It
was
occupied,
but
it
has
been
unoccupied
for
many
years.
D
Both
properties
are
designated
to
part
five,
the
Ontario
Heritage
Act,
as
because
they
are
within
the
boundaries
of
the
Lowertown
west,
Heritage,
Conservation,
District
and
all
applications
for
changes
under
the
Ontario
Heritage
Act
require
City
Council
approval,
which
is
why
this
is
in
front
of
you
today.
The
application
is
for
the
demolition
of
207
209
Murray
Street,
the
partial
demolition
of
287
Cumberland
Street
to
the
north
and
east
walls
and
the
retention
of
its
south
and
west
walls.
D
And
here
is
the
here
is
the
bracing
plan
and
shows
which
walls
would
be
being
retained.
So
this
is
the
west
wall
from
from
the
very
north
part
of
the
west
wall
through
the
jog
and
around
the
corner,
this
very
critical
corner
of
Cumberland
and
Murray
and
along
here,
so
those
will
be
the
ones
that
were
being
retained
and
then
incorporated
into
a
redevelopment
project
on
this
site,
and
here
is
207
209,
Murray
Street,
which
will
which
will
it
will
be
demolished.
D
So,
as
you
can
see,
it
is
the
the
the
the
the
facades
that
suffered
the
least
amount
of
damage
from
from
the
from
the
weather,
etc.
Are
the
other
prominent
street
facades
and
those
will
be
the
ones
that
will
continue
to
be
part
of
the
Lowertown
community
into
the
future
again
heritage
Ottawa
was
notified
of
the
dates
in
Lower
Town
Community
Association
were
notified
of
the
meeting
again
because
of
the
legal
agreement
it
was.
It
was
our
release
last
Thursday,
so
conclusions.
D
The
department
supports
the
application,
because
two
separate
the
engineering
experts
confirm
the
207,
209,
Murray,
Street
and
sorry
bad
grammar
and
in
north
and
east
walls
of
287
Cumberland
Street
are
not
salvageable,
and,
and
so
we
accept
that
that
and
made
the
recommendation
for
the
demolition
of
those
portions
and
the.
But
the
retention
of
the
south
and
west
walls
will
ensure
that
the
scale
and
character
of
the
street
will
remain
and
that
an
application
for
the
development
of
the
site
will
be
received
within
two
years.
D
The
proposed
stabilization
is
still
bracing
are
to
be
undertaken
by
an
expert
in
heritage
masonry,
and,
and
so
we
have
every
confidence
that
that
they,
that
the
bracing
and
the
stabilization
will
be
effective,
and
these
two
walls
will
be
retained
for
the
future
and
the
recommendations
that
you
have
in
front
of
you
today
also
reflect
a
signed
legal
agreement
between
the
city
and
the
property
owner.
Thank
you
very
much.
E
C
F
F
D
F
F
D
Is
a
signed
legal
agreement
and
that
that
has
sign
been
signed
in
order
to
resolve
the
outstanding
issues
around
this
site
so
and
the
the
owners
and
the
city
have
participated
in
the
negotiations
that
led
to
that.
So
we
have
every
confidence
that
the
conditions
in
that
settlement
are
going
to
be
adhered
to.
F
G
Parties
have
reached
a
legal
resolution
in
this
and
there
is
a
signed
resolution
with
respect
to
the
obligations
on
a
part
of
both
parties
and
mr.
lo
zone
has
committed
to
respecting
his
obligations
under
that
agreement.
By
signing
this
agreement,
and
that
does
include
that
he
will
provide
that
submission
for
the
application
to
alter
within
24
months.
G
B
C
It's
just
to
perceive
this
a
little
further,
so
that
the
built
heritage
treaty
and
the
public
can
understand
in
cases
of
what
the
demolition
by
and
neglect
where
we've
reached
this
point,
where
there's
a
legal
agreement
I
think
we
would
all
like
to
know
how
the
city
would
enforce
this.
What
kind
of
penalties
would
be
in
place
so
that
other
property
owners
were
tracking?
This
might
be
able
to
see
that
a
legal
agreement
is
not
too
something
that
can
be
abandoned
after
that,
maybe
you
could
help
us
just
to
understand
a
bit
more.
E
I'm
sure
I'll
preface
my
remarks
by
saying
that
this
is
a
confidential
legal
agreement.
I
appreciate
the
unusual
nature.
We've
we've
rarely
done
this,
where
we
come
forward
with
an
application.
That's
side
by
side
with
a
settlement
and
I
can
certainly
say
that
both
sides
worked
very
hard
over
the
last
couple
of
weeks
to
a
chain
attain
this
settlement
in
a
cooperative
fashion.
B
B
H
Morning,
everybody,
my
name,
is
Liz
Mackenzie
and
speaking
as
co-chair
of
the
Heritage
Committee
of
the
Lowertown
Community
Association,
on
the
request
for
demolition
of
207,
209
Street
and
a
partial
demolition
demolition
of
our
ladies
schooled.
Only
two
buildings
are
later
located
in
the
Lower
Town
West
Heritage,
Conservation
District.
They
happen
to
be
just
around
the
corner
from
my
house,
and
I
watched
them
deteriorate
for
many
years,
while
properties,
the
Heritage
Conservation
District,
are,
by
definition,
designated
under
part
five
of
the
Heritage
Conservation
Act.
H
This
is
intended
to
provide
protection
because,
according
to
the
Heritage
Conservation
Act,
they
are
considered
to
be
historically
or
culturally
significant
and
they
require
special
care
and
attention
in
a
planning
process
to
ensure
that
they
are
conserved.
The
planning
process
has
not
given
special
care
or
attention
to
these
properties
owned
by
Claudia's,
open
a
company
that
has
collected
and
degraded
Lowertown
here,
digital
produce
for
more
than
30
years.
H
Many
residents
ignore
a
tone
of
close
to
or
daily
past
the
property
owned
by
this
company,
we're
forced
to
witness
the
water
neglect
and
inevitable
that
inevitably
culminates
in
the
destruction
of
a
building
in
our
Heritage
Conservation
District.
For
those
who
care
about
heritage,
it
is
slow
and
painful
tortured
to
watch
our
designated
buildings
steadily
fallen
into
disrepair
now,
snowbirds
in
through
a
broken
window.
Now
bricks
fall
off
during
successive
freeze.
Thaw
cycles
now
a
hole
in
the
roof.
Now
the
roof
framing
begins
to
rot.
H
We
are
degraded
by
graffiti
now,
posters
are
planted
to
the
build
plaster
to
the
building
to
make
an
extra
buck
by
selling
advertising
dereliction
disrespect.
This
is
demolition
by
neglect
and
it
is
despicable.
The
entire
Heritage
Act
outlines
the
tools
the
lowest
poly
can
use
to
ensure
the
maintenance
of
heritage
property
with
it
an
htc
as
follows.
H
When
we
was
both
leaders
passed
a
bylaw
under
Section
15.1
of
the
building
code
act,
setting
of
standards
for
maintenance
of
property
in
municipality,
it
can
pass
a
law
that
sets
out
additional
minimum
standards
for
the
maintenance
of
heritage
property
with
an
HDC.
The
municipality
can
then
require
property
owners
to
mainly
came
their
properties
to
these
standards.
H
Know
recently,
City
Council
has
adopted
on
September
the
25th
property
standards
for
heritage
robberies,
but
our
municipality
uses
these
tools.
Speculators
will
continue
to
hold
and
regret
property
in
the
HDC
with
impunity.
The
loss
of
these
buildings
was
completely
preventable.
Had
they
been
aware
on
the
part
of
the
most
polluted
to
protect
them.
Our
HD
C's
are
under
attack,
constant
attack
and
support
from
the
city
to
protect
our
heritage.
H
H
On
the
recommendations,
the
load
on
community
association
heritage
committee
meets
the
following
requests:
long
to
approve
the
don't
approved
approval
to
demolish
207
to
a
911
street
and
there's
an
appendix
B
to
this
route.
That
gives
a
history
of
the
building.
Okay,
that
the
owners
be
required
to
provide
a
complete
set
of
laser
scans,
as
recommended
in
the
engineering
report.
Rather
than
with
photographs,
as
requested
in
staff
report,
we
agree
that
they
should
go
ahead
before
issuing
a
demolition
permit.
H
We
further
request
that
a
restoration
architect
or
engineer
review
the
plans
and
scans
to
ensure
that
they
provide
a
suitable,
excellent
record
to
allow
for
accurate
reconstruction.
They
have
that
are
possible.
Steps
be
taken
to
dismantle
and
conserve
the
building
materials
from
207
Marie
straight
worth
of
you
to
be
incorporated
in
reconstruction
of
only
future
building
on
the
site.
H
For
demolition
under
the
Act
remember
to
only
approval
of
the
application
Amish
part
of
our
ladies
schoolroom
at
287,
Cumberland
Street,
and
there's
a
brief
history,
research
by
the
community
by
the
Heritage
Committee
of
our
ladies
school,
but
the
owners
they
required
to
provide
a
complete
set
of
laser
scans
rather
than
the
photographs
requested
in
the
staff
report.
We
further
requested
a
restoration
architect
review.
The
plans
have
scans
to
ensure
that
they
provide
a
suitable
record
extant
record
to
ensure
a
complete
historical
record.
H
H
Future
Vera
contingency
fund
be
established
to
ensure
that
if
any
failure
or
mishap
when
dismantling
the
wells
of
our
lady
school
funds
would
be
available
for
remediation
and
say
that
financial
penalties
be
leveled
if
an
application
under
the
interior,
Heritage
Act
for
more
development
on
the
site
is
not
received
within
two
years
of
the
issuance
of
the
heritage
permit
for
demolition
under
the
Act
three,
but
there
was
being
required
to
pay
all
encroachment
fees
now.
I
understand
is
the
legal
agreement
in
perhaps
those
encroachment
fees
were
waived
in
the
legal
agreement.
H
I
don't
understand,
I
haven't
seen
the
legal
agreement.
Of
course.
However,
this
is
not
a
one-off
little
guy
who
happened
to
buy
a
building
that
he
then
didn't
know
what
to
do
with.
This
is
part
of
a
broad
scale,
acquisition
of
heritage
properties
for
speculation
and
allowing
them
to
be
neglected
and
require
demolition
and
I,
don't
think
having
the
city
absorb
the
encroachment
fees
sends
a
lesson
to
other
developers
that
might
be
in
the
process
of
doing
the
same
thing.
It
doesn't
send
the
right
message
that
the
city
will
help
you
out
here.
H
Well,
the
further
requests
that
are
the
priority
and
the
proactive
basis
biocontrol
offers
being
instructed
to
ensure
that
all
buildings
within
or
adjacent
to
the
Lowertown,
Heritage
Conservation
districts
and
the
bioriod
Heritage
Conservation,
District
and
building
subject
to
a
heritage
overlay,
are
brought
up
to
property
standards
pursuant
to
15.1
of
the
building.
That
code
act
with
respect
to
repair
and
maintenance
of
our
other
requirements
of
residential
property
standards
and
with
a
list
of
these
buildings,
be
provided
to
the
Lord
on
Community
Association,
Heritage
Committee.
H
That
the
reference
for
that
is
the
property
maintenance
standards
under
the
Ontario
Heritage
Act
section
38,
1,
section
40
5.1.
We
further
requested
options
for
proceeding
with
interventions
in
Our
Lady
School
be
deferred
to
a
later
meeting
to
allow
for
more
discussion
as
there's
no
work
planned
on
our
lady
school
until
the
spring
of
2014.
That's
my
reading
of
the
engineering
report.
But
since
nothing
is
going
to
happen
till
then
I
don't
see
the
Russian
pushing
something
through
today.
That
is
so
significant.
H
F
B
B
I,
just
it's
good,
okay,
long
as
it
stops
it
loose
here,
so,
okay,
so
just
to
hang
on
because
there
may
be
some
questions
but
I
want
to
on
your
motion.
Do
you
do
you
that
you
have
presented
to
you
all?
Have
this
or
any
of
you
have
it's
okay?
So
let's
I'm
asking
the
staff
on
number
two.
What's
your
comment
on
the
scans,
the
complete
set
of
laser
scans
rather
than
photographs
that
they're
recommending?
B
G
Chair
I
will
defer
to
miss
Coutts
earlier
comment
that
mr.
cook
is
here
and
can
comment
on
exactly
what
a
laser
scan
is.
However,
the
report
recommendation
also
asks
not
just
for
a
complete
set
of
photographs,
but
also
for
a
complete
set
of
plans,
and
so
they
will
go
hand-in-hand
with
the
plans
to
give
an
accurate
depiction
of
what's
currently
on
site.
So.
B
Mr.
cook
I'll
be
when
you're
up
here.
I
would
be
asking
you
to
confirm
that,
thank
you
and
then
a
question.
I
guess,
for
you
miss
Mackenzie
that
the
storm
from
the
demolish
this
is
in
be
the
storm
from
the
demolished
walls
of
our
lady's
school,
be
conserved
and
stalked
out
for
use
in
any
building
to
be
constructed
on
the
site
in
the
future.
Maybe
it's
not
for
you,
but
maybe
it's
for
staff
that
would
be
in
B
to
B
the
stone
from
the
demolished
walls
of
our
lady
school
Excel.
The
stockpile.
H
Me
brick
and
the
foundation
stones,
I,
I,
guess
I
should
say
the
building
material
from
ladies
school
should
be
conserved.
D
Think
that
the
I
mean
we
are
saving
to
all
to
complete
walls
and
and
I
think
that
that
that
that
that
is,
that
is
adequate
for
it.
For
the
city,
we
think
that
you
know
a
creative
project
can
can
using
those
two
walls
and
I
modern
materials.
We
don't
want
to
hamper
the
design,
so
we're
very
happy
with
the
retention
of
with
the
recommendation
as
a
stance.
Okay,.
B
E
B
B
B
B
F
Comes
back
to
the
question
of
urgency,
madam
chair.
According
to
their
to
the
report,
as
Liz
said,
mr.
cook
indicated
that,
because
of
the
lateness
of
the
day,
work
is
not
going
to
proceed
until
spring
2014,
so
I
guess
it
does
beg
the
question.
Why
we're?
Why
we're
here
on
it
with
in
an
urgent
meeting.
E
A
A
We
reluctantly
agree
that,
with
the
two
engineers
assessments
and
I
appreciate
that
we
had
two
companies
look
at
this,
that
the
structures
are
in
danger
of
imminent
collapse
and
cannot
be
saved
intact.
Given
that
demolition
must
proceed
to
preserve
public
safety,
we
have
the
following
comments:
one.
We
support
the
retention
Institue
of
the
two
facades
of
our
lady's
school
building.
A
We
do
not
support
the
complete
demolition
of
207
and
on
Murray
Street.
Well,
the
engineers
are
no
doubt
correct
that
the
facade
has
been
allowed
to
deteriorate,
so
that
cannot
be
retained
in
situ.
We
propose
that
it
be
instead
dismantled
and
stored
and
that
it
be
required
that
the
owner
rebuild
the
facade
on
a
future
new
structure
at
this
location,
using
the
original
elements
as
much
as
possible.
A
Riya
urge
that
the
heritage
overlay
be
retained
with
the
intention
that
no
structure
be
permitted
at
287
Cumberland.
That
would
be
larger
than
the
current
school
building.
We
understand
that
there
will
be
an
application
under
the
intera
heritage
for
new
construction
at
this
time,
as
these
properties
will
be
redeveloped.
A
B
B
B
So
that
would
be
direction
that
we're
giving
to
staff
on
that
and,
as
far
as
your
concern
about
protecting
the
facade
I
mean
it
was
built
in
the
1870s
we're
talking
Murray
Street
now
it
may
not
look
totally
unique,
but
it
does
look
significantly
unique
from
my
perspective.
Not
that
I
have
the
background
that
vice-chair
Petoskey
does
or
yourself
for
sure,
but
I
just
wanted
to
comment.
If
it
comes
back
that
the
stone
is
is
not
salvageable.
D
B
I
think
that's
good
news.
I
also
want
to
make
sure
that
you
know
this
is
for
the
Lower
Town
Community
Association.
This
is
a
very
important
site
and
it's
one
that
we've
heard
about
a
lot.
So
when
those
applications
are
when
that
thought
process
starts,
I've
I
want
to
make
sure
that
we're
going
to
have
a
conversation
with
the
people
in
this
room
to
talk
about
where
you
think
that
you're
going
I,
don't
I.
D
F
D
It
does
not
does
not
go
away
and
that
variances
can
be
applied
for
and
I
think
that
and-
and
there
would
be
a
process
that
if
a
building
came
in
that,
for
example,
was
even
a
few
inches
taller,
it
would
have
to
have
a
variance
to
the
Heritage
overlay
and-
and
we
look
at
those
on
a
case-by-case
basis,
and
if
it
is
an
interesting
and
creative
building,
that
is,
has
a
half
a
story
at
the
back.
In
order
to
accommodate
new
uses.
D
We
would
you
know
we
could
you
know
entertain
I
mean
they
can
always
apply
for
a
Heritage
overlay,
and
we
would
certainly
I
don't
think
in.
There
are
cases
when
it
would
be
completely
appropriate
and
result
in
the
building
that
was
better
for
the
site
and
better
for
the
neighborhood.
So
we
will
deal
with
that
again
through
through
a
consultation
process
in
when
the
new
designs
for
this
project
come
in.
But.
F
D
I
There
was
some
concern,
or
there
was
some
comment
made
about-
why
it's
urgent
to
to
get
this
procedure.
True,
I.
Think
if
you
read
my
schedule,
you
will
see
why
it's
very
important
to
get
this
laser
stand
in
order
that
we
can
proceed
with
the
stabilization
and
the
erection
of
the
bracing,
because
there
are
no
plans,
there
are
no
elevations
or
anything
of
the
existing
structure.
So
it
was
our
recommendation
that
we
do
a
3d
laser
scan
of
the
building,
but
we
need
to
do
that
before
the
snow
flies
or
we
can't
do
it.
I
So
if
we
can't
do
it
now,
we
can't
do
it
until
April.
We
can't
do
it
till
April
than
the
July
30th
this
out
the
window,
because
we
need
time
to
do
the
planning.
We
still
have
to
go
back
and
work
with
the
engineers
with
the
contractor
to
provide
the
bracing
so
that
we
can
elect
the
bracing.
We
can't
elect
the
brace
in
until
we
have
the
masonry
done.
We
can't
establish
the
scope
of
work
for
the
masonry
until
I
have
the
laser
stand.
I
So
all
that
has
to
be
built
in
and
so
I
would
say
you
know
if
you
don't
allow
us
to
proceed
now
and
we're
talking
about
four
weeks
before
snow.
If
you
don't
allow
us
to
proceed
now,
then
June
30th
is
going
to
be
more
like
October
30th
of
next
year,
and
so
that's
the
reason
I
want
to
emphasize
that's
the
reason
for
the
urgency
in
putting
it
through.
Second
I
would
like
to
state.
There
seems
to
be
some
worried
that
the
developer
is
not
committed
to
this.
I
This
plan
that
he's
put
before
you
today
will
cost
him
in
the
order
of
$700,000
he's
going
to
put
in
over
$200,000
worth
of
masonry
repair
on
those
two
South
elevations
before
we
erect
bracing,
because
if
we
don't
do
it
before
we
erect
the
base
and
they
can't
do
it,
there
is
some
substantial
damage
on
that
on
the
two
elevations
that
we
are
saving,
particularly
on
the
east
end
of
the
South
elevation
and
on
the
north
end
of
the
of
the
West
elevation.
There
is
substantial
damage
to
the
to
the
upper
break.
I
I
would
say
that
you
know
that
is
a
commitment
and
you're
going
forward
to
put
that
amount
of
money
into
the
masonry
in
the
first
place.
If
he's
going
to
put
that
amount
of
money
into
the
masonry,
then
we're
going
to
make
sure
that
we
cover
it
and
protect
it
and
make
sure
that
it's
not
damaged
in
the
interim.
While
we're
waiting
to
get
a
development
agreement
to
go
forward
and
to
explain
what
the
laser
scanning
is.
If
I
was
here
a
year
ago,
I
couldn't
put
this
proposal
before
you
my
office.
I
We
do
a
lot
of
heritage
masonry,
so
we
deal
a
lot
with
with
certain
leading-edge
technology
and
how
to
survey
existing
historic
buildings
which
don't
have
an
existing
record
and
we've
been
watching
this
technology
developed
over
the
last
five
years,
and
it's
now
come
to
the
fore
where
this
technology
allows
us
to
provide
a
better
product,
our
deliverable
to
the
client
than
we
were
ever
able
to
do
before,
and
we
could
never
do
manually
with
photographs
and
measuring
3d
laser
scanning.
Now
they
take
photographs
from
multiple
locations
on
the
elevation.
I
If
you
go
back
in
two
years
from
now
and
do
the
same
3d
laser
scan,
if
there's
a
two
millimeter
movement
in
your
breaker,
your
stall
it'll
pick
it
up.
That's
how
ocular
this
it
will
provide
you
with
dimensioned
elevations
of
all
your
heritage
before
it's
taken
down,
and
we
have
the
owners
agree
that
we
remove
all
of
the
plywood
whatever
they
do
in
the
photography,
so
that
we
can
get
the
full
elevations
of
what
is
there
and
that's
something
way
more
than
the
city
has
now
of
their
buildings.
I
I
would
like
to
correct
one
thing.
We
will
not
do
plans
because
we're
not
going
into
those,
but
that
especially
two
or
seven,
two
or
nine
is
too
dangerous.
But
you
will
have
the
with
the
laser
scanning
on
three
sides.
They
will
be
able
to
give
you
dimensions
of
the
exterior
of
the
building
and
and
all
of
that,
so
our
schedule
looks
to
getting
approvals
and
on
October
9th
when
it
goes
before
council.
I
I
I
The
the
owner,
the
fence
that
the
owner
has
around
the
building,
is
on
the
right
of
way
onto
the
adjacent
property,
and
it
would
like
to
be
able
to
move
that
in,
and
it
would
also
allow
us
to
remove
the
barriers
on
the
road
in
front
of
in
front
of
that
area.
And
it
serves
no
useful
purpose
to
be
able
to
maintain
that
building
until
next
spring.
It
also
allows
us
to
better
access
the
school
in
order
to
do
our
bracing
in
the
springtime,
and
it
allows
for
the
nursery
contractor.
I
I
One
thing
that
I'm
going
to
get
questions
on
is
the
salvage
ability
of
the
materials,
the
material
and
2
or
7
2
or
9,
2
or
79
Murray
is
a
balloon
frame
building
and
if
he
talked
to
your
fire
chief
they're,
the
most
dangerous
buildings
that
are
in
the
city,
because
a
fire
started
in
the
basement
goes
right
to
the
roof.
Even
though
the
occupant
of
the
building
is
still
watching
television
in
the
living
room,
because
there's
no
fire
separations
to
stop
the
fire
from
going
from
top
to
bottom.
I
In
the
building
and
I
talked
to
a
fire
chief
in
Elmore
ten
years
ago,
and
he
said
all
those
buildings
should
be
torn
down.
As
far
as
the
brick
facade,
the
brick
was
produced
in
1870
in
1870.
The
technology
was
such
that
it
is.
It
is
a
very
low
strength
break
and
has
a
very
high
porosity
and
the
fact
that
the
building
has
been
lying
empty
and
has
had
a
fire
in
which
to
a
saturated
with
water.
I
Most
of
that
breakfast
friable,
we
don't
produce
that
kind
of
brick
anymore,
and
so,
if
we
were
to
try
and
salvage
at
best,
we
might
salvage
I
would
say
30%
of
the
brick
depending
on
whether
they
use
the
cementation
smarter
for
repointing
in
the
past.
If
they
did,
then
the
percentage
will
be
even
lower,
and
you
can't
mix
that
brick
with
with
a
neat
modern
brick,
because
if
you
try
and
do
that,
you
just
further
deteriorate
the
existing
brick.
I
I
E
B
Just
building
on
that
to
our
legal
team
in
2a
of
the
report
recommendation
where
it
says
a
complete
set
of
photos
of
the
existing
building
since
missed
with
plans
for
historical
reference,
would
you,
and
since
the
mr.
Cook
is
in
his
submission,
saying
he's
going
to
perform
3d
laser
scan?
How
would
you
suggest
we
change
the
wording
to
reflect
that?
Madam.
E
B
B
We
will
have
that
come
back
with
the
proper
wording.
I,
don't
think
that,
and
you
know,
I
stand
firm
on
this.
I
don't
like
to
be
making
decisions
that
are
not
going
to
be
in
the
best
interest
of
whether
the
committee
really
wants
to
go
so
I'd
like
to
have
an
understanding
of
the
wording.
We've
got
a
commitment.
This
is
this.
Is
this?
Is
the
work
that's
going
to
be
done,
the
we
just
adding
3d
laser
scan?
What
does
that
do?
What
is
wrong
with
with
adding
that
I
know?
B
E
Sure
you're
correct
to
observe
that
it
is
in
fact
in
one
of
the
operational
documents
at
the
back
but
and
I
know:
I
sound,
overly
lawyerly
and
I
know
this,
but
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
we
understand
that
I
work
with
planning
a
growth
management
and
heritage
to
make
sure
we're
not
missing
something
I
will
promise.
We
will
bring
that
motion
back,
which
will
have
the
words
3d
laser
scans,
but
I
just
want
to
make
sure
it's
correct,
we're
not
correcting
it
again
at
Planning,
Committee
or
council.
So.
E
C
Have
a
question
for
mr.
Cook
I
read
the
his
reports
and
the
other
reports,
as
well
as
the
staff
report,
and
the
submissions
and
I
think
that
I
can
share
with
my
members
of
this
committee
that
I
have
a
good
idea
of
what
is
actually
being
described
in
the
terminology
and
I
think
we
have
good
confidence
that
what
we
are
seeking
to
do
will
be
professionally
done.
So
I
just
wanted
to
pass
that
on
before
we
get
into
our
discussion.
B
A
G
Welcome.
Thank
you
I'll,
be
brief,
because
several
of
these
points
have
been
covered
already.
My
name
is
Donna
Kearns
I
live
in
Lower,
Town
and
I.
Also
own
19th
century
property.
I
was
opposed
to
the
demolition
of
the
properties
on
Murray
Street
in
our
lady
school,
but
as
they've
been
allowed
to
deteriorate
to
such
an
extent,
it
doesn't
look
like
there
are
many
other
options
left
to
us
at
this
point.
I'll
just
repeat
the
concern
about
having
3d
laser
a
full
set
of
3d
laser
scans.
I.
G
Think
moving
forward
with
new
technology
is
really
important
with
properties.
What
we're
losing
at
such
an
incredible
rate
in
our
specific
area,
and
my
concern
is
that
it
wasn't
spelled
out
in
the
city
recommendation,
so
you've
obviously
dealt
with
that
I,
don't
know
what
the
cost
of
protecting
the
community
from
harm
at
this
site
has
been,
but
I
assume
that
it's
been
substantial
over
this
last
period
of
time.
G
Now
we
discovered
that
the
annual
encroachment
fee
of
$47,000
has
been
waived
to
facilitate
this
legal
agreement,
which
is
apparently
not
available
to
us
and
I'm,
quoting
from
the
city's
documents
in
the
interest
of
public
safety.
The
preservation
of
parts
of
the
heritage,
building
and
settling
of
legal
actions.
Waiver
of
the
fee
is
in
the
interest
of
the
city
and
residents
and
is
expressly
sought.
G
I
can
assure
you
that
the
only
message
that
you
are
sending
is
that
this
sort
of
negligence
as
a
property
owner
produces
one
set
of
rules
for
developers
and
large
property
owners
and
another
for
individuals
who
live
in
this
community
as
a
property
owner
I've
made
every
effort
to
preserve
and
protect
nineteenth-century
property,
and
it's
an
expensive
undertaking.
I
can
assure
you.
The
city
also
is
responsible.
It's
not
just
the
mr.
Lois's
that
the
city
hasn't
in
hasn't
had
the
rules
and
the
weight
behind
them
to
ensure
that
these
property
aren't
allowed
to
disintegrate.
G
G
B
D
B
D
There
will
be
a
list
and
we
have
been
and
will
continue
to
work
very
closely
with
the
appropriate
people
in
building
code
in
mr.
Gregoire
etc,
and
the
long-term
effect
is
because
we
can't
force
people
to
apply
to
to
with
building
permits
through
an
application
under
the
Heritage
Act.
But
the
new
property
standards
has
that
can
then
force
very
high
standards
to
protect
the
building
fabric
of
these
buildings,
so
that
they're
properly
boarded
up
and
they
are
inspected
regularly.
So
this
kind
of
deterioration
won't
happen
anymore.
That
is
the
effect
of
the
new
property
standards.
D
D
Up
absolutely
and
in
strand
and
stepped
up
enforcement
is
also
part
of
that
and
which
has
been
over
the
last
few
months.
We
had
that
appropriate
people
have
stepped
up,
enforcement
and
buildings
are
being
better
secured,
etc.
So
we
have
every
confidence
that,
with
with
the
combination
of
enforcement
and
a
new
property
standards
by
law,
that
these
buildings
will
be
well
protected,
so.
B
Thank
you
so
just
two:
does
anyone
have
any
questions
of
Miss
Karen's?
Well,
thank
you
very
much
for
coming
today.
So
just
just
on
that,
I
think
that
the
proof
will
be
in
the
pudding
for
sure,
and
you
know,
there's
going
to
be
a
great
onus
on
us,
our
committee,
to
make
sure
that
we
are
those
stewards
for
heritage
and
working
with
our
leaders
in
the
community
and
all
the
communities
that
our
heritage
conservation
districts
and
as
we
move
forward
we're
starting
with
a
fresh
slate.
B
So
we
can
talk
about
in
2005
or
2008
when
you're
watching
these
places
deteriorate.
What
you
just
heard
from
Miss
coot
says
you're
not
going
to
see
that
again
we
do
have
the
teeth
to
go
in
and
say
the
crack
in
the
wall.
The
the
you
know,
the
the
animals
in
the
home,
the
fire
and
what
it's
done
and
that
sort
of
thing
with
our
property
so
I
think
we
should
have
confidence
in
that.
It's
certainly
why
we
did
it
in
the
first
place.
Thank
you.
B
C
C
B
And
well,
and
it's
great
that
you
have
proof,
read
it,
but
just
for
a
future
you
know
add
other
committees,
one
thing
that
we'd
like
to
do,
whether
it's
the
library
board,
Police,
Services,
Board
or
any
of
our
committees.
You
notice
something
like
that
that
you
know
in
when
you're
reading
it
please
do
pass
it
along,
so
we
can
correct
it.
A
C
Thank
you,
madam
chair
I
have
read
the
reports,
as
everyone
else
has
since
Thursday,
and
also
I'm
familiar
with
our
ladies
school,
not
our
lady
school,
familiar
with
it
since
the
early
70s,
when
it
was
closed
by
the
by
the
school
board
and
I
happened
to
have
a
curious
connection
with
it.
In
that,
when
it
was
closed,
it
was
sold
to
a
developer.
C
Who
is
not
the
current
owner,
and
this
developer
was
a
young
imaginative
entrepreneur
that
saw
the
opportunity
of
converting
the
Our
Lady
school
into
condo
apartments,
and
we
prepared
plans
for
this
adaptive
reuse.
That
would
have
been
the
first
of
adaptive
reuse
of
a
former
school
in
Ottawa.
At
the
time
the
developer
took
the
proposal
to
the
banks,
and
the
banks
said:
are
you
crazy
people
would
never
buy
apartments
in
a
former
school
and
they
weren't,
given
the
lending
for
the
project,
and
so
they
kind
of
had
cold
feet
and
they
let
it
go.
C
And
consequently,
the
current
owner
bought
the
thing,
and
since
the
70s
I've
been
watching
this
school
slowly
deteriorate
and,
as
you
know,
a
member
of
the
Ottawa
community
with
an
interest
in
heritage.
I
also
note
in
this
conversation
here
that
demolition
of
heritage
resources
that
has
been
taking
place
since
the
late
60s
early
70s
when
this
school
was
was
closed,
took
place
at
the
same
time
that
the
real
convent
was
actively
demolished.
Our
lady
school
was
closed
and
the
Rideau
convent
was
closed.
At
the
same
time,
the
real
O'connor
was
actively
demolished.
C
Notwithstanding
the
efforts
to
to
save
it
and
our
a
school
then
just
went
into
hibernation
and
slowly
demolished
itself
over
the
last
35
40
years.
So
it's
an
instructive,
instructive
story
for
us
and
I'm
encouraged,
as
is
our
committee,
that
the
enforcement
of
property
standards
by
law
will
be
actively
and
aggressively
prosecuted
to
make
sure
that
the
slow
deterioration
of
heritage
resources
does
not
happen
again.
I
think
we
obviously
have
to
be
vigilant.
C
Ottawa
lists
from
the
Lower
Town
and
also
listening
to
the
technical
description
by
by
John
I
think
that
this
is
a
package
that
should
be
I,
guess
the
threshold
of
a
new
direction
in
conserving
the
buildings
that
are
slowly
I
have
been
slowing
being
demolished
not
only
in
the
private
sector
but
owned
by
the
federal
government
or
school
boards,
or
the
City
of
Ottawa
itself.
So
I
think
we
have
to
be
really
vigilant
about
this
and
I
think
that
this
particular
agreement.
C
Legal
agreement
should
be
a
vote
of
confidence
that
the
city
is
going
to
be
acting.
You
know
on
all
fronts
in
heritage
conservation,
not
just
through
designations
but
through
making
sure
that
the
ones
that
exists
in
heritage,
districts
and
others
for
they
act
don't
fall
through
the
cracks
at
the
bottom.
So,
having
said
all
that,
madam
chair
I
just
want
to
reiterate
that
I
move
the
staff
report.
Thank
you
very
much.
Thank.
B
You
and
thank
you
for
every
time
we
have
a
committee
meeting
so
far,
I
think
we've
had
a
special
story.
That's
come
up
whether
it
was
a
sports
tree
we
have,
and
it's
it
just
adds
to
why
it's
important.
What
the
work
that
we're
doing
and
and
to
hear
that
kind
of
history
that
you
have
on
this
particular
site
is
really
exciting
and
have
you
on
the
committee
to
watch
it
in
the
next
stages
is
even
more
important.
Does
anyone
else
have
anything
to
say?
Member
Quinn?
Yes,.
F
I
guess
I'd
like
to
thank
everybody
who
came,
took
the
trouble
to
come
and
speak
to
us
today
on
this
important
issue
and
I
think
some
important
questions
arose
and
I
appreciate
your
motion.
However,
I
do
have
concerns
about
about
the
encroachment
fee.
I
think
that
really
certainly
in
Lower,
Town
and
and
if
not,
even
more
broadly
speaking
in
the
City
of
Ottawa,
this
property
has
really
been
almost
a
poster
child
of
just
how
badly
things
can
go
wrong.
F
How
neglectful
an
owner
of
our
heritage
can
be
I
appreciate
that
now
there
appears
to
be
a
commitment
of
$700,000,
but,
as
one
of
our
presenters
indicated,
the
reason
that
this
site
requires
that
level
of
commitment
and
investment
now
is
due
to
the
current
owners
lack
of
concern
and
investment
over
a
period
of
many
many
years.
So
I
really
feel
that
the
waving
of
the
encroachment
fee,
this
gift
is
not
warranted
and
I
strongly
object
to
that
portion
of
the
recommendation.
A
That's
been
done
on
that,
so
we
won't
have
to
go
through
this
again
and
I
and
I
also
just
want
to
say
thank
you
to
the
owners
of
this
property
that
we're
willing
to
wait
for
our
additional
engineering
work
to
be
done
and
for
their
commitment
to
keep
these
walls.
One
of
my
concerns
was
that
Western
Wall,
so
I'm
really
pleased
about
that
and
anyway,
that's
all
I
wanted
to
say
I'll
be
supporting
this
today
Thanks.
C
B
Will
we're
going
to
number
three
the
way
the
encroachment
fees
so
on
wave
encroachment
fees
for
the
bracing
structures,
yeas
and
nays
are
just
one
dissent.
This
was
where
you
would
dissent
your
dissent,
I
dissent,
okay,
so
on
the
balance
and
everyone
else
is
it
scary,
thank
you
and
so
on.
The
main
motion,
with
the
exception
of
the
with
the
registered
dissent
on
number
three,
is
that
carried
carry
thank
you.
Everybody,
like
I,
say
notices
of
motion
for
subsequent
committees,
no
or
any
inquiries
or
other
business.
How
about
adjournment
now?