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From YouTube: Committee on Finance 11-30-2020
Description
The Committee on Finance of the Council of the City of Philadelphia held a Public Hearing on Monday, November 30, 2020, at 1:00 PM, in a remote manner using Microsoft® Teams to hear testimony on the following items:
200573 An Ordinance amending Chapter 19 1300 of The Philadelphia Code, entitled “Real Estate Taxes,” by clarifying definitions and process regarding qualification for certain tax abatements based on tax delinquency, all under certain terms and conditions.
200624 An Ordinance approving a Second Substantial Amendment to the Annual Action Plan 2019 2020 to add $11,311,404 in Federal Coronavirus Aid, Relief and Economic Security Act funding, all under certain terms and conditions.
A
A
This
is
on
monday
november
30th,
the
council's
committee
on
finance.
I
understand
that
state
law
currently
requires
that
the
filing
announcement
be
made
at
the
beginning
of
every
remote
public
hearing
as
follows.
Due
to
the
current
public
health
emergency
city,
council
committees
are
currently
meeting
remotely.
A
We
are
using
microsoft
teams
to
make
these
remote
hearings
possible
instructions
for
how
the
public
may
view
and
offer
public
testimony
at
public
hearings
of
the
council
committees
are
included
in
the
public
hearing,
notices
that
are
published
in
the
daily
news,
inquirer
and
legal
intelligentsia
prior
to
the
hearings
and
can
also
be
found
on
council
on
phl
council
dot
com.
I
know
that
the
hour
has
now
come.
Mr
inusey,
we
please
call
the
role
to
take
attendance
members
that
are
presence
that
members
that
are
in
attendance.
A
Present,
thank
you,
mr
inuzi.
I
want
to
thank
you
quarm.
Our
defiance
committee
is
present
and
this
hearing
is
now
called
to
order.
I
want
to
thank
my
colleagues
and
counsel
and
members
of
this
committee
for
being
here
this
afternoon
and
for
the
public
for
participating,
as
well
as
the
witnesses
that
are
scheduled
to
testify
this
afternoon.
A
Thank
you,
mr
inuzi,
before
we
begin
to
hear
testimony
from
the
witnesses
we
have
here
for
today,
everyone
who
has
been
invited
to
this
meeting
to
testify
should
be
aware
that
this
public
hearing
is
being
recorded,
because
the
hearing
is
public.
Public
participants
and
viewers
have
no
reasonable
expectation
of
privacy.
By
continuing
to
be
in
this
meeting,
you
are
consenting
to
being
recorded
additionally
before
recognizing
members
for
questioning
the
comments
they
had
for
witnesses.
A
I
will
note
for
the
record
at
this
time
that
we
will
use
the
chat
feature
available
microsoft
teams
to
allow
members
to
signify
that
they
wish
to
be
recognized
in
order
to
comply
with
the
sunshine
act.
The
chat
feature
must
only
be
used
for
this
purpose.
Are
there
any
opening
comments
from
members
of
this
committee.
A
We're
starting
with
bill
number
two:
zero:
zero,
five,
seven
three!
So
let's
begin
with
that
matter
and
then
after
we
hear
the
witnesses
from
that
matter,
we'll
go
to
bill
number
two:
zero,
zero!
Six,
two!
Four!
I'm
sorry!
I
I
stand
corrected.
I
stand
corrected.
Let
me
just
get
my
witness
list
up
here.
Make
sure
I
have
this
corrected.
A
Yeah,
I
I'm
I
was
incorrect.
We're
gonna
begin
with
bill
number
two:
zero,
zero,
six,
two
four
and
then
after
we
hear
the
witnesses
on
that
bill,
we'll
move
to
bill
number
two:
zero,
zero,
five,
seven
three
and
my
understanding
you
would
like
to
test.
You
would
like
to
provide
opening
comments
on
bill
number:
two:
zero,
zero,
five,
seven,
three
correct!
A
A
G
2019-2020
this
bill
allocates
approximately
11.3
million
in
community
development
block
grant
funding
through
the
federal
cares
act
to
address
emergency,
covit,
19,
housing
and
community
development
needs.
We
propose
to
use
these
funds
for
emergency
rental
assistance,
eviction
and
foreclosure
prevention
assistance
to
small
neighborhood
businesses.
Well,
it's
not
nearly
enough
to
meet
the
need.
These
additional
funds
are
very
critical
to
helping
our
residents
and
our
communities
respond
to
the
needs
and
the
financial
crisis
caused
by
coven
19..
G
A
G
I'd
be
happy
to
do
that
so
there's
a
million
allocated
for
housing,
counseling
and
legal
services
about
7.7
million
for
rental
assistance,
265
000
for
ta
to
small
businesses,
300
000
for
neighborhood
development,
and
then
that
compares
with
that
first
allocation
of
26
million.
In
that
allocation.
We
we
did
have
funding
in
those
categories.
A
G
A
G
A
G
G
A
Considering
some
of
the
new
measures
that
are
occurring
with
restrictions
that
we've
had
to
take
because
of
covet,
are
there
additional
ideas
or
suggestions
that
could
be
used
from
community
development
block
grant
dollars
either
past
cdbg
dollars
or
other
types
of
opportunities
to
help
small
businesses?
During
these
new
restrictions,
and
during
this
pandemic.
H
A
That
well
I'm
trying
to
say
I
mean
from
my
experience
and
you
know,
being
someone
had
worked
in
the
law
department
representing
the
office
of
housing
community
development.
You
know:
we've
had
different
con
plan
years.
In
a
time
we've
not
expended
all
of
those
dollars.
So
my
question:
are
there
past
con
plain
year
dollars
that
we've
not
expended
or
dollars
that
we've
been
expended
or
I'm
sorry
dollars
that
we've
been
allocated
for
specific
uses
that,
for
whatever
reason
those
uses
were
not
used?
A
Put
in
proportionately
much
more
than
we
did,
and
some
would
say
if
you
talk
to
some
of
the
community
balance
financial
institutions,
which
I
know
you
worked
with
our
neighbor
commercial
carters,
others
would
say
we
should
be
putting
in
you
know,
60
to
80
million
dollars
in
federal
cash
out
to
help
small
businesses,
and
that
was
before
we
put
in
these
additional
mitigation
steps
that
we
need
to
take
because
of
the
surge
of
the
virus.
And
you
know
businesses
are
really
struggling,
especially
our
restaurants,.
H
I
I
mean
absolutely
I
can
I
can
I
could
talk
on
and
on
about
the
needs
of
small
businesses,
of
course,
as
the
administration
we're
weighing
that
with
significant
other
needs
and
other
costs.
I
do
want
us
to
answer
your
first
question
there.
There
was
not
sort
of
an
every
year.
We
balance
our
cdbg
budget.
So
sometimes
there's
you
know,
there's
some
loose
change
so
to
speak
from
prior
years,
but
it's
nothing
significant
or
you
know,
or
additional
this
year
in
comparison
to
past
years.
H
So
this
this
amount
of
coveted
money,
the
2.6,
is
sort
of
our
additional
money
that
went
into
businesses
for
this
year.
The
other
thing
just
for
a
matter
of
correction
councilman
that
the
the
city
initially
put
in
20
million
to
match
the
cdfi
program.
There
was
an
additional
10
million,
so
it
was
30
million
in
total
that
the
the
critique
might
still
stand.
But
I
just
wanted
to
make
sure.
A
And
it's,
I
guess
it's
bet.
So
let
me
just
say
a
couple
things.
I
know
some
members
have
questions.
So
are
you
stating
that
both
commerce
and
department
of
housing
and
community
development
have
gone
through
all
past
con
plan
years
and
have
identified
that
any
dollars
of
time
plan
resources
that
have
been
allocated
for
any
entity
and
have
not
been
used
for
whatever
reason
those
are
have
been
identified
that
are,
are
actually
being
used
or
have
been
out
been
reallocated.
G
I
can
answer
that
yep
every
year
we
go
through
a
process
and
each
comp
plan
budget
has
a
line
item
prior
years
reprogrammed.
So
we
have.
That
then
is
applied
and
I'd
have
to.
I
don't
have
this
year's
annual
action
plan
in
front
of
me,
but
I
can
get
you
that
figure
as
to
how
prior
years
that
are
reprogrammed
into
this
into
this.
This
year's
comp
plan.
A
Yeah,
if
you
could
provide
that,
that
would
be
helpful
and
then
have
you
also
looked
at
doing
things
differently
in
reference
to
how
cbt
dialogues
have
been
used.
I
know
one
of
the
things
that
I've
often
been
critical
of
how
we
as
a
city-
and
this
goes
over
multiple
administrations-
how
we've
allocated
communityville
black
grand
dollars.
A
We
have
done
it
in
a
much
more
restrictive
way
than
other
cities
have
done
and
how
they
use
those
dollars.
We
have
focused,
you
know
just
on
you
know
we
we
are
focused
in.
If
you
look
in
the
comp
plan
on
the
code
of
federal
regulations,
it
gives
a
much
broader
interpretation
and
represents
the
three
main
categories
of
how
cdbg
dollars
can
be
used.
A
One
in
particular
the
prevention
or
elimination
of
slums,
of
blight
slums
or
blight
is
a
broader
interpretation
that
was
used
during
the
rendell
administration
in
reference
to
the
how
hud,
108
dollars
were
used
to
help
grow.
Businesses
around
the
city
of
philadelphia
helped
our
hotel
to
grow
other
businesses
to
grow,
and
we
had
a
much
more
expansive
use
of
hud,
section
108
dollars
at
that
time
period.
Considering
that
we're
now
in
this
economic
crisis
and
we've
used,
you
know
less
than
10
percent
of
the
cdbg
cares
dollars
on
small
businesses.
G
I
think
in
this
year
we
were
facing,
as
you
had
mentioned,
we
also
had
to
use
look
very
creatively
for
some
program
income
that
enabled
us
to
to
fill
some
gaps.
I
think
back
in
the
rendell
administration.
You
know
we
were
receiving
at
that
time.
Substantial
our
allocation
was
much
larger
and
we
also
had
the
great
benefit
of
matching
some
of
those
funds
with
funds
through
the
pennsylvania
housing
finance
agency.
G
So
I
think
in
this
year
it
was
to
try
to
make
sure
that
we
were
fully
trying
to
get
back
to
fully
funding
the
basic
system,
repairs
making
sure
on
the
commerce
department
because
of
the
cuts
that
they
sustained.
We
could
keep
the
the
level
that
we
had
last
year,
so
I
think
you
know
ann
and
team
and
karen
and
folks
we
work
very
diligently
to
try
to
keep
it
at
the
prior
year
years.
A
I'll
thank
this
last
comment
before
I
open
up
to
council
members,
gim
dom
kiana
st
jensen
jones
net
order
and
I've
got
to
push
back
a
little
bit.
Yes,
the
allocation
was
much
larger
than
I
remember
when
our
con
plan
dollars
specifically
community
belt
black
rain
dials,
was
significantly
higher.
Even
during
the
obama
administration,
it
went
down
because
of
sequestration,
I
believe
it
or
not.
A
Other
cities
historically
have
been
much
more
expansive
and
created
with
be
jolly
cdbg
dollars.
For
example,
cleveland
for
a
number
of
years
has
provided
more
dollars
from
a
low
interest
loan
perspective,
as
opposed
to
grant
perspective
so
as
their
cdbg
dollar
allocation
went
down
because
of
reductions
at
the
federal
level
and
sequestration.
A
Now
it's
gone
down
but
didn't
have
the
same,
drastic
cuts
that
we've
seen,
because
the
way
we
budget
as
a
city
is
just
based
on
whatever
risk
we
receive
from
a
federal
or
state
agency,
regardless
of
cdbg
dollars
or
grand
dollars
from
the
health
department
at
the
state
level
or
other
things
we
just
do
it
from
perspective.
Whatever
we
receive
is
what
we
get
and
we're
not
as
creative
as
we
could-
or,
I
would
say,
should
be.
G
H
We
had
been
spending
down
over
previous
years
and
to
your
first
question
about,
do
we
have
any
old
money?
This
is
the
first
year
we
don't
have
that
old
money,
and
so
it's
really
terrible
timing
and
with
with
the
fact
that
we
have
more
need
than
ever,
and
so
we
are
going
to
be
getting.
You
know
as
creative
as
possible
and
we're
always
balancing
in
our
conversations
with
pidc
and
even
other
cdfis.
H
How
can
we
give
them
cdbg
money
to
lend
in
a
way
that
will
earn
not
only
get
paid
back
but
maybe
earn
some
some
additional
revenue
with
interest
rates?
And
yet
still
we
want
to
use
cdbg
to
do
the
deals
that
are
less
likely
to
get
done
elsewhere
right,
so
we're
balancing
being
really
flexible
with
sort
of
our
underwriting
and
our
and
our
lending
terms
and
still
trying
to
earn
some
income
back
on
it.
H
So
that's
sort
of
a
constant
conversation
we've
been
having
with
pidc
and
I
think,
we've
gotten
to
a
pretty
good
place,
but
it's
still
putting
it
into
effect
and
making
those
deals
go
through
and
again,
as
you
know,
cdbg
comes
with
lots
of
strings
attached.
So
when
pidc
lends
cdbg
dollars,
it
puts
a
lot
of
extra
burdens
on
the
borrower
and
we
don't
want
you
know
so
we're
just
it's
something
we're
balancing
out.
H
A
Okay,
if
you
could
just
provide
that
information
or
reach
out
to
ms
nevins,
to
provide
the
information
to
the
committee,
that
would
be
appreciative,
hopefully
with
a
new
administration
that
will
be
coming
in
as
of
january
20th.
Despite
what
the
current
occupant
of
the
public
housing
at
black
lives
matter
in
washington
dc
believes,
we
could
have
some
more
flexibility
for
how
we
use
hud
dials,
especially
section
108
dollars
with
that
information.
B
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
two
things
that
I
think
need
to
be
on
the
record,
one
that,
over
the
past
10
years,
in
spite
of
republican
and
or
democratic
administration
cdbg
dollars,
has
consist
consistently
decreased
to
the
city
of
philadelphia
at
the
hiatus
of
the
city.
I
believe
our
appropriation
was
closing
in
on
83
million
dollars
annually.
B
B
A
Thank
you,
councilmember
jones.
I
agree
with
essence
your
comments,
but
we
somehow
find
a
way
to
be
creative
when
there's
a
will
to
do
so.
As
I
was
saying
earlier
during
the
rendell
administration,
a
number
of
hotels
that
are
in
our
center
city,
core
hud
108
dials,
were
used
because
that
was
to
prevent
blight.
There
have
been
some
restaurant
chains,
some
that
deal
with
long
distance
or
marathons
also
were
beneficiary
of
hud
sex
108
loans.
So
when
there
is
a
will,
there
is
a
way.
B
G
And
I
will
also
point
out-
and
I
think
you
know
in
prior
testimony-
we
have
been
strongly
advocating
to
at
our
local
hud
office
and
in
washington,
because
you
know
these
regulations
haven't
been
looked
at.
What
are
we
in
year,
46
like
almost
some
46
years
right
and
we
looking
at
the
public
services
cap
right
or
the
the
caps
on
using
money
for
economic
development?
So
we
we
have
also
been
advocating
for
changes
that
we
believe
can
be
done
at
a
regulatory.
They
don't
require
congressional
action.
G
G
G
D
D
My
question
is:
if
you
could
walk
me
through
a
little
bit
of
the
money,
that's
being
allocated
around
the
rent
assistance,
the
housing,
counseling
legal
services
and
how
exactly
that
that
will
roll
out,
because
I
know
we've
heard
a
lot
of
different
numbers,
and
so
you
know
we
had
a
hearing
last
week
about
it
and
I
think
they
were
you
know
trying
to
clarify
information.
That's
spent.
So
if
you
could
just
walk
us
through
how
the
rent
is,
this
money
will
be
allocated
into
him.
That
would
be
helpful.
G
We
have
served
4
000
residents
with
that
first
allocation,
and
I
believe
that
with
phase
two,
the
money
from
phfa
and
then
the
the
match
that
city
finance
provided
will
end
up
serving
6
000
and
then,
as
we
talked
last
week,
the
administration
provided
another
allocation
of
this.
The
corona
virus
crf
money,
I
believe,
20
million,
which
we
are
calling
in
phase
three
and
I've
lost
for
a
minute.
G
G
D
G
So
I
think
what
we're
working
on
now,
I
know
it's,
it's
just
phase,
one
two
and
three.
So
what
we're
working
on
now
is
the
money
that
has
to
be
expended
by
the
end
of
this
year.
So
we
don't
have
to
send
it
back
to
washington
in
phase
two
for
some
of
those
folks
where
the
landlord
wasn't
participating.
G
D
G
D
Okay,
that's
very
helpful,
and
I
think
you
know
I
guess
the
only
other
question
is
is
is
any
of
this
money
is
some
of
the
money
that
you
were
talking
about
earlier
when
you
talked
about
it
going
towards
phase
two?
Is
that
covering
the
shift
from
the
750
to
the
1500
and
rent
assistance,
or
it's
just
it?
Okay
and
then,
and
then
separately,
though
the
tenants
are
going
to
get
a
direct
check.
Is
that
right
and
that's
what
we
can
use
towards
their
landlords?
That.
G
D
I
think
we
had
something
I
think
the
last
data,
although
this
may
not
be
entirely
up
to
date,
but
when
we
had
the
last
questioning
around
it,
there
was
something
like
40
of
tenants
who
applied
had
a
landlord
who
didn't
so
we
were
in.
We
were
in
the
hundreds.
Is
that
right
or
yeah
dozens
do
wait.
So
hundreds
do
you
know
how
many
I
mean.
You
know
you
have
a
certain
allotment.
Obviously,
but
is
there
maybe
a
set
goal
to
serve
for
the
tenants?
Oh
for
the.
G
G
G
D
I
just
wanted
to
express
my
gratitude
again
to
you
for
hearing
that
concern
that
that
had
happened
and
then
moving
pretty
quickly
to
make
sure
that
those
tenants
were
covered.
I
think
when
we
saw
that
tenants
do
do
their
due
diligence
to
apply.
We
want
to
make
sure
that
they
have
a
chance.
Yeah
yeah.
G
D
You
know
you
could
obviously
say
these
people
had
an
incomplete
application.
You
chose
not
to
do
that
and
instead
analyzed,
it
took
a
look
at
the
need
and
made
sure
that
nobody
would
necessarily
lose
out
because
you
had
an
uncooperative
landlord
on
on
the
other
hand,
but
I
want
to
just
say
express
my
gratitude
to
you
and
your
team
and
we'll
continue
to
be
in
touch.
So.
Thank
you
very
much.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
B
G
You
know
that
are
working
on
the
details
of
these
programs,
certainly
in
rental
assistance.
You
know
on
in
commerce:
it's
it's
all
the
the
admin.
That's
required
to
get
these
programs
up
and
running
and
to
make
sure
that
they're
operating
over
that
have
been
over
the
past
six
seven
eight
months
and
I'm
hopeful
not
I'm
hopeful
that
there's
a
post
covered
right.
So
it's
really
to
to
cover
those
those
those
staff
working
on
all
these
projects
and
programs.
G
B
Yep-
and
I
just
I
want
to
back
up
my
my
colleague
council
chair
person,
green's
comments
about
some
of
these
small
businesses.
You
know
we
basically
shut
down
fitness,
centers,
gyms,
indoor,
dining
and
restaurants,
and
I'm
starting
to
see
the
effects
even
this
week,
beginning
today
of
places
shuttered
closed,
not
reopening
it's
a
nightmare,
and
you
know
you
talk
about
rental
assistance.
We
need
a
lot
more
rental
assistance
if
all
these
people
in
hospitality
are
out
of
work,
we're
just
creating
a
bigger
bigger
problem.
B
I
understand
the
health
issues,
but
we
have
to
figure
out
a
safe
way
to
get
more
people
back
to
work
somehow,
because
this
is
going
to
be
an
avalanche
of
problems.
If
we
don't
solve
this,
and
it's
just
going
to
get
I'm
going
to
tell
you
right
now,
this
is
going
to
get
a
lot
worse
before
it
gets
better.
If
we
don't
come
figure
out
how
to
get
these
people
back
to
work
anyway,.
A
F
Thank
you,
chairman
green,
and
thank
you
melissa
again,
just
want
to
reiterate
what
councilmember
kim
was
saying
around
all
this
work,
and
I
think
councilman
dom
is
right.
Things
are
going
to
get
worse
before
they
get
better
for
commerce
department
and,
and
I
look
forward
to
working
with
councilman
green
who's
part
of
national
league
of
cities
around.
How
do
we
establish
the
federal
lobbying
that
we
need
to
change
cdbg
and
increase
it
and
allow
more
flexibility?
F
But
I
wanted
to
ask
commerce,
because
I
know
over
the
last
four
or
five
years
in
particular,
we
really
have
been
trying
to
match
and
leverage
some
of
the
cdb
money
with
general
operating
money,
because
it
is
freer
and
allows
you
to
do
more
work.
How
does
philadelphia
fare
with
other
cities
in
their
leveraging
of
cdbg
dollars
with
general
operating
funds
to
support
some
of
this
activity?
Can
you
can
you
speak
to
that.
H
That
is
a
good
question
I
do
not
have.
I
don't
have
any
date
on
that.
I
would
say
I
I'm
sorry.
I
forget
who
said
it
earlier.
I
think
it
was
councilman
jones.
A
lot
of
cities
use
very
little
cdbg
for
economic
development
because
the
strings
attached
don't
lend
itself
really
easily
to
working
with
businesses,
but
I
don't
know
what
the
breakdown
would
be
in
other
cities.
That
would
be
interesting
to
look
at.
F
Well,
we
should
again
tap
the
national
league
of
cities,
resources
we
have
with
our
chairman.
I
think,
mr
chairman,
that
is
an
important
piece
and
maybe
through
your
connections,
we
could
really
have
an
honest
conversation
about
that,
because
I
know
those
of
us
who've
advocated
to
do
more
for
business,
carters
and
I'll.
Get
to
my
my
questions
around
commercial
carters
and
how
we're
going
to
move
forward.
You
know
the
cdbg
money
should
be
leveraged
and
we
should
be
matching
it
accordingly.
F
And
when
I
talk
to
my
colleagues
in
other
cities,
they
do
a
lot
more
of
that
leveraging
than
we've
done,
and
I
agree
with
you.
I
think
that
the
section
108
loans
I
have
been
a
proponent
of
section,
108
loans,
not
being
just
a
loan
pool
of
hotels
for
the
city
of
philadelphia.
I've
been,
I
believe
that
section
108
should
be
utilized
as
we
even
look
at
the
stimulus
package
that
we're
looking
at
now
in
council
and
how
we
look
at
infusing
money
back
into
the
commercial
carters.
F
You
know
their
center
city
and
center
city,
restaurants
and
kudos
to
councilman,
dom
and
and
heinen
and
others
who
really
work
to
open
up
the
industry.
But
the
fact
of
the
matter
is
all
those
businesses
are
not
going
to
survive
because
they
can't
be
small,
quaint
restaurants
in
a
covered
world,
but
what
the
opportunities
does
that
give
us
from
a
commercial
carter
perspective
right?
I
represent
south
kensington.
I
have
an
interest
in
folks
looking
at
you
know
this
as
another
destination
point
for
potential
businesses,
where
we
haven't
seen
this
businesses
grow.
F
So
to
that
extent
karen,
what?
What
are?
What
are
the
conversations
you're
having
as
people
find
themselves
struggling
to
pay
downtown
commercial
rents?
Is
there
any
interest
for
people
looking
at
neighborhoods
as
possible
relocation,
and
how
are
we
prepared
to
support
businesses
in
that
transition?.
H
Yeah
we
are
always
I
mean
you
know,
that's
why
we
have
our
business
services
line
as
well
as
the
relationships
we
have
with
sort
of
all
of
our
intermediaries,
the
cdc's,
the
business
improvement
districts
to
try
to
make
those
connections.
I
wouldn't
say:
we've
seen
anything.
You
know
statistically
significant.
As
far
as
business
is
looking
to
relocate.
H
I
will
say
there:
there
have
has
been
an
uptick
anecdotal
at
this
point,
but
of
of
people
opening
businesses.
So
there
is
interest
from
people
who
are
who
are
starting
businesses
now,
but
that
is
an
interesting
opportunity,
councilwoman
the
idea
of
like
businesses
wanting
to
relocate
to
lower
rent
situations.
H
I
think
I
guess,
as
everyone
at
this
point
is
waiting
for
some
of
this
stuff
to
to
play
out
and
settle
down,
but
that's
something
we
would
want
to
jump
on
and
and
again
we
maintain
that
network.
So
when
we
know
of
a
business
looking
for
that,
we
kind
of
get
the
basics
of
what
they're
looking
for.
We
go
through
our
lists
that
we
know
from
our
corridor
managers,
but
we
also
sort
of
send
it
out
and
make
connections.
H
F
Yeah
we've
asked
the
planning
commission
to
help
us
kind
of
design
what
an
incentive
for
affordable
commercial
space
would
look
like
in
areas
like
american
street,
where
you
know
we
are
being
pushed
by
the
development
interests
that
want
to
come
into
the
area.
So
I
think
there's
some
space
around
in
this
conversation
for
us
to
say
you
know-
and
I
know
we're
we're
debating
the
abatement
and
we're
going
to
debate
the
commercial
abatement.
F
H
Oh
well,
a
couple
of
things
that
I
think
we
already
knew
and
many
of
I've
had
this
conversation
with
many
of
you.
I
know
you
knew
it
too
that
some
of
those
things
our
businesses
struggled
with
was
was
having
their
their
paperwork
in
order
right
having
their
finances
in
order
having
their
taxes
in
order,
and
that
made
it
that
much
harder
for
them
to
be
able
to
take
advantage
of
any
of
the
relief
programs
that
were
out
there.
H
Previous
to
this,
it
was
hard
for
them
to
take
advantage
of
maybe
getting
a
loan
to
be
able
to
grow,
but
now
it
was,
you
know
it
might
have
been
the
difference
between
getting
some
relief
and
not,
and
so
we
were
already
looking
at
that.
We
have
stepped
up
we're
using
our
covent
cdbg
dollars
with
to
to
step
up
our
our
business
technical
assistance
fundings
to
to
provide
more
of
that
kind
of
one-on-one
help
to
businesses.
H
So
that's
one
we
just
need
and
that
that
kind
of
stuff
often
has
to
be
done.
One-On-One.
It's
really
intensive.
You
know
it's
a
lot
human
and
intensive.
The
other
thing
is.
We
think
we
really
again
something
we
already
knew,
but
highlighted
during
a
crisis
is
needing
local
ownership
of
properties,
whether
that's
the
businesses
themselves,
who
are
committed
to
being
here
or
whether
it's
maybe
the
local
nonprofit
that
you
know
will
commit
to
this
space,
will
make
sure
that
they
can
keep
the
tenant
in
the
space.
H
H
Something
again
we've
already
talked
about
is
the
need
to
figure
out
how
to
do
upper
floors
if
the
business,
if,
if
somebody
owns
the
building,
they
can
continue
to
get
rents,
you
know
leverage
their
rents
through
through
different
uses,
so
those
are
some
of
the
things
that
we're
looking
at,
and
this
has
just
stepped
up
as
well
as,
obviously
you
know
racial
equity
and
opportunity.
In
any
of
this,
we
have
to
get
out
of
our
own
way,
sometimes
and
figuring
out
how
to
help
the
people
that
that
need
help.
F
So,
thank
you
for
that.
I
look
forward
to
working
on.
You
know
how
we,
how
do
we
strengthen
the
capacity
of
our
commercial
carter
so
that
they
better
could
support?
I
know
that,
in
my
conversations
with
the
african-american
chamber,
as
well
as
with
the
hispanic
chamber
of
commerce,
I
think
we
need
to
really
ramp
up
tech
that
one-on-one
technical
assistance
with
some
of
these
businesses.
You
know
and
identify
good
accountants
and
good
the
good
guys.
Right
not
I
mean,
I
think,
one
of
the
things
I've
always
known
as
I've
been
doing.
F
Tax
reform
legislation
is
that
we
got
really
bad
accountants
that
give
really
bad
advice
to
small
businesses,
because
they
could
not
demonstrate
losses
because
of
the
way
their
accountants
spread
out
and
manage.
You
know
and
reconcile
their
accounts
right.
So
when
you,
when
you're
soliciting
funding-
and
you
want
to
show
a
loss,
you
know
when
you're
112
at
all
all
year
long,
you
create
a
a
disadvantage
for
yourself
around
being
able
to
prove
that
you've
had
coveted
losses,
because
you
don't
register
them
right.
These
are.
I
F
Reconciliations
and
I
know
we're
getting
in
the
weeds
of
it,
but
that's
where
we
got
to
go.
We
have
to
go
to
the
weeds
of
it.
The
back
office
is
what
hurts
these
small
businesses
and
their
capacity
to
grow
and
to
to
access
capital
and
and
all
of
those
other
issues.
So
I
think
we
have
to
be
very
intentional
around
this
space,
the
one
the
other
area-
and
I
know
you
heard
it
and
you've
heard
it
from
the
commerce
side
from
the
businesses.
F
You
know
the
restaurants
and
and
others
commerce
department
needs
to
lead
the
conversation
with
the
administration
around
all
of
these
january
1st
february,
1st
march,
1st,
permit
fees,
licensing
deadlines
that
we
have
for
businesses
in
the
city,
and
you
guys
have
to
be
at
the
table
this.
The
city
has
to
really
look
at
this
about.
What
can
we
waive?
F
What
should
we
be
waiving
so
that
we
can
give
people
opportunities
right,
and
this
is
one
of
the
opportunities
we
get
to
look
at
the
as
rob
wunderling
reminds
us
157
steps
to
open
up
a
business
right
and
the
50
steps
and
fees
that
you
have
to
pay
to
stay
open.
This
is
the
time
where
you
guys
should
be
at
that
table.
Talking
about
this
and
really
coming
back
and
saying
to
us,
do
we
really
need
to
charge
all
these
things?
F
If
people
aren't
working,
they
ain't
paying
the
rental
assistance
and
I
feel
like
we're
just
you
know,
moving
from
peter
to
paul
as
opposed
to
saying
what
is
the
most
strategic
investment
that
government
can
make
in
this.
So
I
look
forward
to
the
through
those
many
conversations
and
the
national
conversations.
I
think
we
have
to
change
if
we
learn
anything
through
code
with
cdbg,
how
we
do
it,
how
we
leverage
it
how
we
invest
on
it
has
to
be
very,
very,
very
focused,
and
it.
I
F
Be
focused
differently
because
we
saw
the
disparities
and
it
can't
be
a
moment
as
as
the
urban
coalition
says,
this
is
not
about
a
moment.
This
is
about
a
movement,
and-
and
that
means
that
we
have
a
lot
more
work
to
do
on
this.
So
thank
you
both,
ladies
for
all,
the
work
that
you
did.
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
A
Thank
you,
councilman
maria
kiana
sanchez,
for
your
questions
definitely
agree
with
you
in
reference
to
needing
to
be
more
creative,
especially
at
the
national
level,
with
the
new
administration
coming
in,
and
we
don't
know
who
the
hud
secretary
will
be,
but
I
think
that'll
be
an
opportunity,
especially
as
ms
long
stated,
that
we're
in
con
play
number
46,
which
just
saying
the
number
46
makes
me
think
that
I'm
much
older
than
I
think
I
am
in
my
own
mind
because
I
remember
complaining.
30
and
28
29.
A
Right,
I
know
yes,
it's
it's
hard
to
believe
we're
at
46..
Also,
I'd
like
to
make
a
note
that
we've
also
been
joined
by
council
member,
I'm
david
o.
Thank
you
for
being
here.
I
do
just
to
you
know
in
the
chat
feature
I'd
like
to
recognize
councilmember
jones.
Let's
see
if
he
has
questions
and
then
after
councilmember
jones,
we
have
councilman
bass.
C
Thank
you.
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
and
good
afternoon
to
everyone.
How
are
you
good?
Thank
you
good
thanks,
good
good.
So
the
first
thing
I
wanted
to
say
is
I
wanted
to
thank
you
all
for
all
of
the
work
that
you
all
are
putting
in,
and
these
are
very
trying
times
a
very
difficult
time.
I
hear
from
our
businesses
all
of
the
time
about
how
they're
struggling
to
survive.
I
hear
from
you
know
regular
everyday
average
folks
who
are
also
struggling
to
survive.
We
do
a
food
distribution
at
one
point.
C
We
hear
from
them
all
the
time
about
what
they
need,
how
we
can
be
helpful
and
when
there's
money
just
sitting
there,
you
know
it's
it's
hard
to
help
them
understand
or
or
understand
on
their
behalf,
what's
actually
happening
with
the
city
and
why
we
can't
get
these
dollars
out.
So
I
I
really
just
had
to
say
that
the
other
thing
I
wanted
to
say
on
a
more
positive
note.
C
If
you
will
is
that
I
heard
I
think
karen,
I
think
you
mentioned
that
there
were
new
businesses,
starting
that
you
know.
An
unexpected
offshoot
of
what's
happening
is
that
there
are
a
lot
of
new
businesses
that
were
starting
that
you
know
were
unexpected.
So
can
you
talk
about?
Who?
Who
is
that?
What
kind
of
businesses
are
they?
What
does
it
look
like?
Are
they
more
professional
services?
Are
they
more?
You
know
basic
services.
Are
they
you
know
goods
and
retail?
C
H
Yeah,
I
don't
have
I
I
can't
talk
in
any
kind
of
confirmed
way,
the
ones
I'm
thinking
of
and
that
I've
heard
from
from
my
colleagues
who
you
know,
staff
our
business
services
line
are
mostly
like
retail
opportunities
and
and
I
we
we
are
chalking
it
up
to
two
things-
one.
Whenever
there's,
I
guess
a
recession
and
people
losing
their
jobs.
Some
people
may
take
this
opportunity
to
to
start
something
that
I
feel
like
might
normally
take
a
little
more
time,
so
we
might
not
be
seeing
them.
H
I
think
what
we
might
be
seeing
is
people
that
were
going
to
start
their
business
in
april
or
may,
and
now
it's
you
know,
got
pushed
back,
so
it
feels
like
it's
a
little
bit
more
right
now,
but
yeah
I
don't
have
any
good.
I
don't
have
any
data
on
top
of
my
head
as
far
as
like
yeah
the
types
and
the
different
industries.
H
Like
I
said
I
know,
there's
been
a
couple
retail.
There
was
an
opening
this
weekend
up
in
mount
airy
of
a
black-owned
sort
of
high-end.
I
guess
baby
baby
gear
retailer,
which
is
really
nice
yeah,
so
and
I
was
glad
to
see
she
got
some
news
but
yeah
we'll
start
we'll
try
to
put
our
finger
on
that
as
we
move
forward
and
see
what
we
can
figure
out
about
in
industries.
Councilwoman
you're
right,
that's
a
that's
a
great
that
would
give
us
some
good
perspective.
C
I
I
think
so
I
think
that
you
know
the
more
data
we
can
have
on
who
it
is
what
what
kind
of
businesses
they
are
where
they
are.
I
think
that
that
would
be
helpful
to
us
as
we
really
try
to
get
a
a
good
picture
of
what's
happening
economically
in
the
city
and
also
lessons
learned:
what
can
we
learn
from
those
businesses
that
are
starting
up?
Maybe
it's,
as
you
said,
some
people
are,
you
know
taking
this
as
an
opportunity?
Maybe
they
have.
C
You
know,
lost
employment
from
their
nine
to
five,
but
always
had
a
dream
and
now
are
following
up
on
that,
and
so
you
know
how
do
we
encourage
more
of
that?
If
that's
actually
the
case,
that's
what's
happening,
how
do
we
invest
more
money
into
that,
so
the
more
information
we
have,
I
think
the
more
helpful
we
can
be
to
you.
A
So
having
that
information,
I
think
is
very
helpful
because
then
you
can
also
start
to
drill
down
and
find
out.
You
know
what
are
the
challenges
those
businesses
are
having
and
know
what
led
them
to
start
their
business
and
then
also
following
back
up
with
those
businesses
say
end
of
the
second
quarter
or
end
of
the
third
quarter.
I
guess
sense
of
how
they're
doing
now
and
then
we
can
try
to
tailor
additional
resources
and
assistance
to
those
businesses.
A
B
Thank
you,
mr
chairman,
just
a
quick
comment:
I'm
slowly
and
supportive
of
new
businesses
opening
up,
but
I
just
wanted
to
remind
everyone
that
the
cost
to
open
a
new
business
is
far
greater
than
the
cost
to
support
an
existing
one,
and
usually
the
supporting
of
the
existing
one
is
a
lot
more
jobs
for
our
residents
of
this
city.
So
we
need
to
do
both,
but
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
we
have
the
focus,
as
chairman
green
originally
said,
on
those
existing
businesses
that
are
really
suffering.
B
A
Dom
you
are
absolutely
correct.
We
have
to
chew
gum
and
walk.
At
the
same
time,
I
want
to
follow
up
one
thing
that
council
remember
bass
stated
in
reference
to
you
know
the
fact
that
of
the
cdbg
cash
dollars,
you
know
less
than
10
percent
of
being
spent
on
small
businesses
from
the
total
amount
of
cares
dollars.
A
Well,
let
me
just
step
back
we're
looking
about
32
million
dollars,
I
think
between
the
cbpg
cares
and
the
total
federal
cares
dollars
have
been
spent
on
small
businesses.
If
you
could
provide
the
total
number
federal
care
styles
that
came
to
the
city,
I'm
sure
that's
with
both
rob,
deboe
and
or
larissa
waxman
and
sarah
dewolf,
who
have
that
information,
but
just
curious
what
the
total
amount
of
federal
cares
dollars
have
come
into
the
city,
because
it
looks
at
looks
like
based
on
the
information
provided
about.
A
32
million
dollars
have
been
allocated
for
small
businesses
of
the
2.1
of
cdbg
cares
and
then
at
30
million.
That
can
be
provided
a
small
business
dollars
to
help
augment
the
state
program,
so
miss
curious
what
a
total
amount.
I'm
sure
that
could
be
a
a
quick
text
that
can
be
sent
to
get
the
total
number
of
dollars
that
have
come
into
the
city
from
the
federal
government
of
cairo's
dollars.
A
Okay,
seeing
no
additional
questions
by
members
of
this
committee
for
this
panel.
Thank
you
all
for
being
here.
I
would
like
to
now
move
into
the
next
panel
regarding
bill
number
two:
zero:
zero.
Five,
seven
three!
I
believe
we
have
our
revenue.
Commissioner,
frank
breslin,
to
testify,
as
the
only
panelists
only
witness
on
this
panel
also
note
that
councillor
mckinnon
has
an
opening
comments
they
would
like
to
make
in
reference
to
this
bill.
E
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
I
just
want
to
make
a
brief
comment
on
bill
number.
Two:
zero,
zero.
Five,
seven
three
misclassification
workers
is
an
unlawful
practice,
it's
already
against
the
law
on
the
local
state
and
federal
level,
but
it
is
happening
not
quite
here
in
philadelphia
or
it's
happening
all
over,
but
it's
happening
all
the
time.
In
some
places,
the
misclassification
of
workers
become
a
major
political
and
policy
issue.
E
We've
seen
it
most
recently
during
major
fights
between
drivers
of
ride
sharing
services
and
the
service
owners,
but
it
also
happens
in
the
health
care
industry,
child
care
and
beyond
simply
put
the
misclassification
of
workers
is
an
unlawful
practice
of
labeling
a
worker
as
an
independent
contractor.
Instead
of
an
employee.
These
are
not
arbitrary
terms.
E
These
are
defined
through
the
fair
labor
standards
act,
which
is
a
federal
law,
the
economic
realities,
test
and
years
of
case
law.
In
order
to
be
classified
as
an
independent
contractor,
the
person
performing
the
work
must
have
the
right
to
control
and
direct
the
work
that
they
do
and
how
it
is
done.
If
a
worker
is
under
the
direction,
supervision
or
control
of
another
person
or
entity,
they
are
an
employee,
not
a
1099.
E
That
is
also
in
accordance
and
in
line
with
the
federal
irs
law.
Why
does
this
matter?
It
matters
for
lots
of
reasons,
but
here
are
two
issues
that
I
want
to
address
today,
specifically
one
when
working
people
are
misclassified,
the
city
loses
tax
revenues
that
are
due
to
when
working
people
are
misclassified.
E
E
Accounts
this
council
body
has
made
it
abundantly
clear
that
they
support
expanded
protection
for
working
working
people
through
countlesses
of
pieces
of
legislation
in
this
year
alone,
let
alone
the
last
past
five
to
ten
years.
But
we
cannot
overlook
what
is
staring
us
right
in
the
face:
thousands
of
workers,
thousands
of
people
who
are
being
taken
advantage
of
and
left
behind,
because
they
are
misqualified
by
corporations
who
are
trying
to
cut
costs.
E
I
see
worker
misclassification,
most
often
in
the
construction
industry,
which
is
why
this
bill
is
important.
The
law
is
clear:
the
only
people
on
the
construction
site
who
can
lawfully
be
classified
as
independent
contractors
or
those
who
own
operate
and
are
licensed
as
trade
specific
contractors
on
job
sites
throughout
the
city.
There
are
hundreds
of
workers
today,
as
we
speak,
or
receiving
either
cash
payments
or
who
are
being
unlawfully
classified
as
independent
contractors.
E
A
Thank
you,
councilman
heenan,
in
that
regard,
if
we
could
have
mr
newsome
call
the
first
panel,
actually
the
only
witness
for
this
panel,
I'm
testifying
for
this
hearing
this
afternoon.
I
believe-
that's
mr
frank,
breslin,
our
revenue,
commissioner,
please
state
your
name
and
then
proceed
with
your.
I
Testimony
good
afternoon,
councilmember,
greene
and
members
of
the
committee
on
finance,
I'm
frank
breslin
revenue.
Commissioner,
thank
you
for
the
opportunity
to
testify
in
support
of
bill
number
two:
zero:
zero.
Five
seven
three,
this
bill
clarifies
the
definition
of
delinquent
tax
to
include
the
failure
of
any
employer
to
pay
over
to
the
city,
any
wage
taxes
that
were
collected
or
that
should
have
been
collected,
but
for
the
misclassification
of
workers
for
applicants
to
the
tax
abatement
programs.
I
The
administration,
like
council,
believes
that
worker
misclassification
is
an
unacceptable
business
practice
that
hurts
workers
and
costs
the
city
much
needed
revenue.
The
problem
is
not
just
in
philadelphia.
Worker
misclassification
is
an
issue
faced
by
jurisdictions
across
the
country
and
like
other
jurisdictions,
and
even
the
irs
philadelphia
is
challenged
to
enforce
applicable
protections
against
worker
misclassification.
I
A
Thank
you,
commissioner
breslin.
I
noticed
that
councilman
maria
cano
sanchez
has
a
question
and
I
think
counselor
mckinnon
also
the
question
in
for
you
as
a
witness.
I
just
have
some
basic
questions
before
we
get
started
with
other
members
from
council,
and
I
understand
the
legislation
focuses
on
people
that
should
have
been
taxed
that
should
have
been
collected.
A
I
know
this
is
an
issue,
especially
with
this
new
gig
economy
and
people,
and
even
I
think
some
business
is
taking
a
business
strategy
of
identifying
all
employees
as
an
independent
contractor,
as
opposed
to
an
actual
employee,
and
this
has
created
significant
changes
and
nuances,
interpretation
and
labor
and
employment
law.
My
question
is:
how
will
the
city
enforce
this,
especially
for
those
who
should
have
collected
taxes,
wage
taxes.
I
So
I
mean,
as
I
reference
we
have
normal
enforcement
practices
which,
if
we
get
any
leads
or
during
our
normal
audit,
we
go
through
the
1099s
and
ascertain
whether
the
subcontract
employees
are
actually
subcontractors
ballot,
subcontractors
or
whether
they're
misclassified
in
our
employees.
In
the
case
where
we
determine
that
they
are
employees,
we
then
assess
the
employer
for
the
wage
taxes,
including
interest
and
penalties.
I
I
Sometimes
it's
through
our
tax
discovery
program
where
we
find
a
business
was
not
reporting
to
the
city
and
when
they
come
in,
we
make
the
determination
that
they're
not
actually
a
business.
They
should
have
been
an
employee
and
we
have
the
employer
information.
So
we'll
look
at
the
employer,
so
there's
a
lot
of
different
ways.
This
comes
in.
I
think
this
bill
helps
us
in
one.
It
just
explicitly
puts
worker
misclassification
into
the
definition.
I
So
it
really
highlights
the
issue
and
it
gives
the
department
the
authority
to
request
additional
information
as
deemed
necessary.
So
in
the
case
where
we
feel
that
there
might
be
worker
misclassification
and
an
in
an
abatement
applicant,
we
could
ask
to
review
the
1099s
and
make
that
determination.
I
don't
think
it's
something
we
would
do
on
every
case.
We
wouldn't
have
the
resources
to
do
that.
A
I
The
l,
I
has
a
process
where
their
investigators
go
out
on
site
so
and
they
do
an
investigation
process
to
determine
who
what
contractors
are
on
site
and
whether
properly
registered
in
the
when
they
make
the
determination
that
a
a
contractor
is
not
properly
registered.
Then
they
send
us
those
leads
at
one
point:
it
was
monthly,
I'm
not
sure
what
the
frequency
of
those
coming
in
right
now
are,
but
they
send
them
to
our
tax
discovery
unit.
I
Then
our
tax
discovery
unit
will
contact
those
businesses
and
set
them
up
for
for
business.
Tax
we've
been
kind
of
splitting.
Some
of
these
are
are
fairly,
can
get
fairly
complex.
So
we
make
a
determination
and
we've
been
feeding
more
of
these
cases
to
our
auditors
now
than
actually
to
our
tax
discovery,
but
it
goes
to
one
or
the
other.
Our
auditors
are
used
because
not
only
do
we
want
to
get
the
business
registered
so
usually
we
do
that
by
contacting
the
business
and
asking
them
to
file
the
applica
applicable
returns
with
us.
A
I
Well,
actually,
what
happens
is
the
the
the
the
kind
of
the
the
check
is
built
into
our
system,
so
once
the
account
is
set
up,
then
the
now
there's
lag,
of
course,
for
a
lot
of
the
business
taxes
right,
because
the
bur,
the
business
income
and
receipts
tax
and
the
net
profits
tax
won't
be
due
until
april
of
the
following
year.
So
we
won't
see
any
business
taxes
immediately.
I
The
following
year
is
where
things
for
those
taxes
would
kick
in,
and
then
we
have
a
non-filer
notice
process
built
into
the
system.
So
once
we
get
past
the
due
date
and
the
return
has
not
been
filed,
a
non-filer
notice
will
go
out
eventually.
If
the
taxpayer
doesn't
respond
to
the
non-filer
notices,
it
escalates
to
something
called
a
code
enforcement
complaint.
When
there's
act,
where
there's
actually
a
judgment
placed
against
the
business
for
every
return
that
has
not
been
filed.
I
I
The
exact
time
frame
because
it
gets
complicated
with
you-
have
the
apple.
The
tax
return
due
in
april,
businesses
are
able
to
get
an
extension
till
october,
so
there
could
be
significant
lag
there
right,
but
it's
a
it's
an
electronic.
It's
an
automated
process
that
those
notices
will
go
out
and
we
do
that
for
our
monthly
filing
too.
So
similar
notices
can
go
out
for
use
in
occupancy
tax
for
liquor
tax.
All
of
our.
I
So
we
really
have
an
automated
process
that
then
automatically
escalates
into
into
these
code
enforcement
complaints,
where
a
judgment
is
actually
filed
against
the
taxpayer
for
each
of
the
non-filed
returns.
So
those
fines
can
get
significant
and
that
could
also
affect
the
taxpayer
in
terms
of
getting
financing
able
to
be
getting
finances
because
those
judgments
will
show
up.
A
And
when
you
send
that
automatic
notification
is
there
any
way
of
checking
to
see
that
if
that
entity
had
opened
up
multiple
accounts
and
different
names
or
different
perspectives,
that
you're
saying
those
to
all
possible
like
if
I'm
a
multinational
company
and
I
open
up,
say
derek
green
pennsylvania.
Llc
for
my
international
is
derek
green
and
in
different
states.
I
do
different
things
in
different.
Cities
is
a
way
to
make
sure
that
I'm
getting
the
benefit
of
opening,
but
it's
not
paying
the
full
amount
taxes,
even
after
that
lag
period
of
time.
I
I
We
would
require
each
of
those
companies
to
file
some
states
and
some
jurisdictions
do
what
they
call
combined
reporting,
where
only
the
one
company
reports
for
everyone.
We
don't
do
that,
so
we
require
each
of
those
entities
to
report
and
then
the
process
I
just
described
would
apply
to
each
of
those
separate
entities.
So
there's
really
no
ability
that
at
least
limits
any
ability
to
be
able
to
hide
behind
an
umbrella
or
a
you
know,
a
a
a
forgetting
the
word,
but
a
kind
of
a
one
single
overarching
entity.
I
A
F
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
I
just
want
folks
to
know
that
I
did
talk
to
the
bill
sponsor
about
this
legislation,
and
I
agree
with
him
that
there
are
thousands
of
businesses
who
take
advantage
of
workers,
particularly
low
wage
workers
and
may
misclassify
them,
so
that
employees
are
not
eligible
for
all
the
benefits
that
comes
with
with
an
employee
that
there
are
standing
laws
around
this
issue
and
around
what
is
legal
and
what
is
is
not
legal.
F
I'm
I'm
particularly
aware
of
the
situation
as
chair
of
the
the
committee
on
licenses
and
inspection
for
12
years.
I
work
with
many
of
the
tradesmen
as
we
try
to
counteract
some
of
the
bad
construction
processes,
particularly
around
public
safety
and
access
to
folks
for
osha
and
some
of
the
safety
standards.
But
what
are
the
unintended
consequences
of
legislations
like
this?
That
don't
have
regulatory
definitions
outline
about
how
we
can
systematically
make
sure
that
the
application
of
this
enforcement,
because
it
is
done
by
complaint,
does
not
trigger
or
highlight
a
particular
constituency?
F
So
I
agree
with
the
bill's
sponsor
that
there
are
people
with
creative
accountants
who
create
whatever
loophole
and,
as
our
revenue
commissioner
alluded
to,
if
you
are
a
bad
actor
you're
going
to
act
badly
and
you're,
going
to
figure
it
out
and
you're
going
to
pay
an
accountant
who's
going
to
help.
You
figure
it
out.
However,
when
you
put
this
law
that
again
is
triggered
by
complaints
and
can
target
particular
industries
and
particular
workers
with
no
protections
for
them
and
no
pathway
for
them.
F
I
have
to
call
it
what
it
is,
the
the
while
the
intent
may
be
won
the
con.
The
unintended
consequences
is
that
undocumented
workers
who
play
a
significant
role
in
small
businesses
and
in
the
construction
industry
could
become
targets
in
the
application
of
this
law.
Now.
Do
I
believe
that
this
administration
wants
to
do
that?
F
What
we
don't
honor
is
the
fact
that
they're
willing
to
go
through
the
process
of
getting
an
ein
number
to
document
their
work,
so
if
they
ever
have
an
opportunity
for
a
pathway
to
citizenship,
they
have
proof
that
they
have
been
contributing
members
of
society
and
so
that
they
can
pay
taxes
and
a
conversation
that
has
been
ongoing.
You
know
with
the
sponsor
of
this.
We
had
this
conversation
before
and
I
don't.
F
I
think
we
could
never
get
to
a
space,
because
until
we
have
immigration
reform,
we're
going
to
have
unintended
consequences
for
undocumented
workers,
and
so
for
that
reason
you
know
these
pieces
of
legislation
while
not
intended
in
that
way,
there's
no
other
way
for
the
communities
that
I
represent
to
see
it
any
other
way
than
they're,
potentially
being
targeted,
and
do
I
agree
that
they're
bad
actors,
absolutely.
Unfortunately,
I've
learned
in
my
13
years
in
council
that
there
is
no
law
for
ignorance
and
bad
actors.
F
People
who
want
to
be
bad
are
going
to
be
bad
and
they're,
going
to
figure
it
out.
So
in
that
regard
I
want
to
ask
the
commissioner,
because
I
think
you
stated
this
to
the
questions
to
the
to
the
chair
is
this
is
going
to
be
triggered
by
complaints?
How
do
we
ensure
that
the
application
of
this
isn't
discriminatory
against
undocumented
workers
who
have
no
recourse.
I
In
light
of,
I
don't
know
that
that
is
how
it
would
work
for
the
abatement
process,
since
those
abatement
applications
are
coming
from
opa
to
the
department
of
revenue,
at
which
point
we
have
to
do
a
compliance
check
on
those.
So
our
normal
compliance
check
is
to
look
at
the
entity
and
see
if
they
have
any
non-filed
returns
and
if
they
have
nt,
if
they
have
any
delinquencies
on
their
account,
if
they
filed
all
their
returns
they're
properly
registered,
they
have
no
delinquencies.
I
Then
we
approve
it.
We
let
opa
know
and
they
move
along
with
the
approval
process,
so
this
legislation
doesn't
dictate
specific
procedures
to
us.
So
I
think
what
we
would
look
at
is.
We
would
need
to
utilize
some
type
of
a
screening
process
to
determine
companies
that
may
have
some
indication
of
misclassified
workers.
I
We
haven't
determined
that
just
from
my
years
of
compliance,
I
could
you
know,
think
out
loud
and
it
might
be
something
like
look
at
companies
where,
based
on
the
amount
of
revenue
that
the
company
is
generating
from
their
business
income
and
receipts
tax
returns
and
a
look
at
their
payroll,
that
those
numbers
are
not
in
sync,
at
which
case
we
would
say
to
that
company.
We
want
to
see
your
payroll
records
or
your
1099
records
to
make
a
determination
whether
they're
misclassified.
I
I
If
somebody
wants
to
do
that
process,
they
can
do
that
now,
through
the
tax
discovery
unit,
I
mean
we
have
a
tax
fraud
hotline
where
they
can
actually
do
that
anonymously
and
send
that
to
us,
and
we
would
review
that
so
they're
really
two
separate
processes
that
are
taking
place
and
would
be
kind
of
done
separately.
This
would
require
some
piloting
of
some
type
of
a
screening
process
and
and
we're
not
there,
yet
we
haven't
determined
what
that
process
would
look
like.
I
I
So
we
would
start
drafting
regulations.
That
would
be
my
policy
group
and
I
don't
know
the
time
frame
off
the
top
of
my
head,
but
I
would
say
we
would
have
you
know,
regulations
in
three
to
six
months
and
then
we
would
and
and
then
we
would
have
to
work
up
a
process
for
this,
that
you
know
we're
challenged
like
all
departments.
Right
now
with
you
know,
covid
requirements
and
staffing.
So
so
that
is
something
that
I'd
have
to
discuss,
but
we
would
probably
start
piloting
something
at
least
small
scale.
I
As
soon
as
the
regulations
come
out,
we
would
try
to
put
a
procedure
together
and
I
think
that
again
I
would
have
to
talk
to
my
compliance
team
and
get
their
thoughts,
but
I
would
think
that
we
would
look
at
our
normal
compliance.
Practice
is
to
small
scale
pilot,
different
types
of
programs,
screening
processes
and
then
identify
which
ones
are
effective.
We
don't
want
to
be
spending
resources,
looking
at
lots
of
1099s
or
w2s.
I
I
F
So
again-
and
I
I
know
the
bill
sponsor-
has
some
questions
for
you.
My
request
is
going
to
be
and
to
the
members
of
this
committee
look
councilman
councilmember
heenan
has
been
consistent
around
this
underground
economy.
I
you
know,
I
don't
want
anybody
skirting
taxes,
if,
if
we
don't
have
to,
I
prefer
to
see
this
done
in
some
sort
of
pilot.
A
Thank
you,
councilmember
sanchez.
Before
I
recognize
councillor
mahine,
I
just
want
to
follow
up
on
that
point.
Regarding
regulations
with
commission
president,
did
you
give
a
range
of
time
I?
I
know
you
gave
her
some
perspective,
but
I
didn't
hear
a
specific
range
of
time
from
what
it
would
take
to
do
have
regulations
implemented.
I
know
this
can't
give
a
specific
day,
but
if
I
mean
monthly
time.
I
A
E
You,
mr
chair,
and
you
know
my
my
and
to
the
commissioner,
has
been-
has
been
answered.
You
know,
and-
and
I
do
want
to
you
know,
make
a
statement
and
to
you
know
my
colleague,
councilmember
sanchez
said
as
we've
had
these
conversations
in
the
past
and
what
we've
had
today,
as
as
we
work
forward
to
making
sure
that
every
worker
in
the
city
of
philadelphia
is
protected
in
every
way.
E
We
possibly
can
you
know
in
in
this
case
the
law
question
is
defined
by
the
federal
government,
and
that
is
why
we
on
a
local
level.
You
know
try
to
work
on
worker
protections
such
as
you
know,
fair
work
week
and
and
and,
and
you
know,
with
predictable
scheduling
and
and
time
for
for
for
loved
ones.
As
as
we
move
forward,
you
know
we're
looking
for
for
the
rate
of
return
and
rate
the
higher
coming
off
of
this
devastating
economic
covert
crisis
that
that
we're
in.
E
E
E
You
know
every
member,
I
know
the
council
member
sanchez,
you
know,
will
continue
to
voice
her
concerns
and
I'm
sure
you
know
we
have
the
ability
to
see
what
the
unintended
consequences
are.
As
regulations
are,
are
drafted
up
and
vetted
through,
because
we
we
don't
want,
you
know
devastating
under
under
unattended
consequences.
You
know
for
for
all
workers,
but
I
also
want
to
remind
members
of
this
committee
and
our
commissioner
that
this
bill
is
not
for
every
work
site
in
the
city
of
philadelphia.
E
E
This
bill
in
front
of
us
here
today,
strictly
and
narrowly,
is
to
those
who
are
seeking
the
benefit
of
a
10-year
tax
payment,
which
is
much
more
manageable
when
it
comes
to
the
process
of
tax
clearance,
which
may
not
be
on
a
complaint-driven
basis.
As
the
commissioner
had
stated,
this
is
a
compliance
when
somebody
receives
a
permit
for
the
job
and
they
make
application
for
the
very
rewarding
and
rich
benefit
of
a
10-year
tax
abatement.
So
I
think
it
starts
with
that.
E
It's
a
lot
easier
to
manage
that
way,
as
opposed
to
point
driven,
because
there
are
other
avenues
for
complaints
that
the
commissioner
has
stated.
So
I
can't
remember
sanchez
always
look
forward
to
working
out
issues
with
you
and
or
you
know,
being
in
part
of
the
conversations
as
we
move
forward.
So
thank.
C
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
just
had
a
couple
of
quick
questions.
Actually
just
really
one
quick
question
and
a
statement,
and
my
statement
is
that
you
know
I
I
see
both
sides
of
this
issue
both
would
what
councilwoman
maria
quinones
sanchez
discussed
earlier
in
terms
of
making
sure
that
there,
the
unintended
consequence
is
not
someone
who
you
know
was
working
hard
and
trying
to
support
their
family
and
trying
to
make
it,
especially
during
covert
if
they're
not
bounced
off
of
the
site
and
also,
at
the
same
time,.
C
That
we
don't
have
some
folks
who
are
unscrupulous,
who
are
taking
advantage
not
only
of
workers
but
of
taxpayers
by
skirting
the
spirit
of
the
10-year
tax
abatement.
So
you
know
I
just
wanted
to
mention
that
my
question
for
the
commissioner
is
because
this
is
something
new
and
when
we
do
new
things
in
philadelphia,
sometimes
we
get
it
right
and
sometimes
we
get
it
kind
of
right,
and
sometimes
we
don't
get
it
right
at
all.
C
I
C
A
A
A
A
Still
hearing
that
still
seeing
and
hearing
none,
I
want
to
thank
all
the
panels
and
witnesses
for
their
participation.
We've
got
all
of
your
opinions
and
perspectives.
I
now
invite
all
the
panels
and
witnesses
to
please
disconnect
from
the
meeting
before
we
go
into
our
public
meeting.
We'll
now
pause
the
proceeding
briefly,
as
the
participants
leave
the.
A
A
Okay,
we
will
now
convene
the
public
meeting.
Mr
arnazi,
will
you
please
call
the
role
to
take
attendance
amendments
that
are
in
attendance?
Please
indicate
that
you
are
present
when
your
name
is
called
also.
Please
say
a
few
brief
words
when
responding
so
that
we
can
see
your
image
displayed
on
screen
in
our
beautiful
microsoft
teams
platform
when
you
speak.
A
C
H
H
A
A
A
A
And
as
we're
waiting
for
councilmember
jones
to
re
join
us,
I
want
to
reiterate
the
comments
made
by
council
member
gim.
I
hope
all
those
who
are
attending
this
public
hearing
advice
committee
had
a
wonderful
thanksgiving
one
that
was
quite
different
than
what
we've
had
in
the
past
and
then
we're
continuing
to
participate
in
physical,
distancing
and
celebration
as
we're
dealing
with
the
pandemic,
which,
with
a
good
portion
of
today's
hearing,
was
debating
and
discussing
how
we're
going
to
provide
additional
resources
based
on
this
unfortunate
health
issue.
A
B
E
Unfortunately,
the
law
is
preempted
by
federal
law,
state
law
and
local
law
here
in
the
city
of
philadelphia
laws
that
currently
exist
it
you
know
one
needs
to
be
tax
compliant
to
reap
the
benefit
of
a
10-year
tax
abatement.
So
I
am
always
open
for
sitting
and
having
a
conversation
and
trying
to
work
out
some
on
some
of
the
possible
unintended
consequences
with
our
with
our
rather
department.
A
F
F
We
don't
have
a
law
that
allows
these
people
to
legitimately
be
on
the
sites
right.
So
I
don't
know
that
we're
going
to
get
anywhere
there,
but
he
doesn't
need
this
law
to
go
after
folks
because
the
laws
exist.
This
is
a
regulatory
issue,
not
again,
I
think
the
spirit
of
the
law
around
setting
a
tone
that
people
should
pay
their
taxes.
Look
I'm
chair
of
appropriations.
I
want
everybody
to
pay
their
fur
taxes.
There's
a
there's,
30
laws.
I
can
write
for
you
tomorrow
of
people
who
don't
pay
taxes
that
we
all
know.
F
F
They
have
no
other
pathway
because,
as
heenan
says,
there's
enough
laws
on
the
books
that
if
people
are
not
complying,
we
could
pursue
them
again.
I'm
gonna
ask
the
bill
sponsor
you
know
you
don't
need
this
bill,
you
can
do
a
regulatory
pilot
with
the
revenue
commissioner
show
that
you're
not
gonna
be
discriminatory,
and
then
we
can
pass
a
law
to
amplify
that
memorialize
that,
but
I
can't
be
inconsistent.
We
can't
sit
here
and
say
we're
a
sanctuary
city.
F
We
have
so
many
people
that
are
undocumented
based
on
federal
laws,
but
that
we
choose
not
to
enforce
or
enforce
already.
What
I'm
saying
is
the
greedy
developer
in
their
minds
of
you
know
as
part
of
this
underground
economy
is
not
that
worker,
who
is
risking
himself
already
by
getting
an
ein
and
filing
a
1099,
so
he
can
file
taxes
so
when
he
has
a
pathways
to
citizenship,
he
has
a
documented
history
of
being
a
contributing
member.
What
I'm
saying
is
they
shouldn't
be
sacrificed
as
we
try
to
collect
from
unscrupulous
folks?
F
I
think
he
can
do
a
pilot
through
regulations
without
this
law
that
allows
him
to
demonstrate
that
these,
the
folks
that
I'm
concerned
about
are
not
going
to
be
targeted
and
that's
the
only
solution.
Any
law
is
inconsistent
with
the
spirit
again,
not
the
law,
the
spirit
by
which
this
council
and
this
administration
have
operated.
E
Thank
you,
mr
chair,
and
I
just
want
to
make
a
comment
to
councilman
dom's.
You
know
question
so
councilman
dom
and
other
members
of
council
majority
members
of
council
over
the
past
five
years.
Six
years
have
have
been
a
champion
for
tax
delinquencies,
who
have
been
a
champion
for
tax
lien
sales.
Who've
been
a
champion
for
opening
up
small
businesses.
E
Who's
been
a
champion
along
with
other
members,
to
make
sure
that
there
are
programs
for
people
where
there's
unattended
consequences.
So
I
want
to
thank
alan
dom
for
his
history
of
ensuring
that
the
city
is
finding
its
33
million
dollars
all
right.
That
was
misplaced
for
his
champion
of
making
sure
that
we
fund
a
call
center
right
to
recoup
a
lot
of
our
misclassified
or
misrepresented
taxes
that
haven't
been
collected
and
or
also
authorizing
the
revenue
department
and
the
law
department
to
seek
damages
for
outside
the
county.
E
For
those
who
are
tax
delinquency.
So
I
I
do
appreciate
his
statement
with
this
bill
simply
does.
Is
it
further
clarifies
and
expands
the
definition
of
delinquencies
for
somebody
who
is
applying
for
a
tax
benefit
right?
It's
just
a
further
clarification
for
a
developer
or
an
owner
who
is
supposed
to
be
tax
compliant
anyway.
A
B
Thank
you.
Thank
you.
Councilmember
keenan,
I
guess
look,
I'm
in
favor
of
people
paying
their
taxes.
There's
no
question
about
that.
Okay,
what
I'm
not
in
favor
of,
though,
is
hurting
people
during
this
pandemic.
You
know
in
a
way
that
would
really
set
them
back
and
that's
my
concern.
I'm
trying
to
figure
this
out
if
we
can
find
this
way
to
accommodate
both
of
you
so
that
we
don't
have
this
issue
and
that's
really
what
I'm
trying
to
get
to.
B
I
don't
want
to
hurt
the
people
that
have
no
other
way
of
making
money
right
now
and
are
suffering
dramatically
during
this
pandemic.
The
pandemic
was
over.
Maybe
it's
a
different
story,
but
we're
in
the
middle
of
a
crisis
right
now,
so
that
concerns
me,
but
by
the
same
token
I
don't
want
people
not
to
pay
their
taxes.
So
how
do
we
resolve
that?
That's
the
question.
E
We'll
sit
down
with
the
revenue
commissioners
council,
mr
chairman
councilman.
We
can
have
further
conversations
with
the
revenue
commissioner.
These
are
laws
that
are
on
the
book
and
we're
applying
it
to
a
tax
abatement
only
and
we
can
try
to
figure
out,
just
as
we
have
with
real
estate
taxes
programs
for
poor
people,
just
as
as
lupe
and
other
types
of
considerations.
E
But
you
know
we
don't
make
up
the
irs
code,
we
don't
make
up
the
state
code
and
we
already
have
a
local
code
right
for
the
linked
tax
delinquencies
that
are
in
place.
So,
yes,
we
can
sit
down.
We
can
either
talk
about
a
belay
of
some
sort
of
you
know
through
regulations
or
money
could
be
implemented,
but
I
don't
think
we
should
waiver
on
what
is
law
and
what
is
not
wrong.
A
Considering
there
are
regulations
to
be
drafted,
is
there
ability
of
both
the
sponsor
counselor
mckinnon,
as
well
as
councilman
sanchez,
to
work
together
on
the
regulations
with
the
revenue.
Commissioner,
one
of
the
things
I
have
learned
through
my
work
in
the
special
committee
regulatory
reform
and
review,
there's
quite
a
process
in
drafting
regulations,
and
it
provides
various
opportunities
for
consultation
and
adjustment
and
also
amendments
and
I'm
thinking
by
both
parties
coming
together
to
work
collaboratively
with
the
revenue,
commissioner,
that
maybe
we
can
find
a
way
to
identify
those
businesses.
A
E
Chairman,
mr
chairman,
this
is
bobby.
I
am
going
to
be
calling
this
up
for
a
vote
unamended
and
willing
to
as
offered
to
sit
down
with
the
revenue
commissioner
on
regulations,
I
don't
think
they're
in
any
kind
of
hurry,
but
I
want
to
remind
everybody
all
right.
This
is
simply
applying
laws
that
exist.
E
Currently
they
exist
right
now
and
applying
it
to
somebody
who
is
reaping
the
benefit
of
a
10-year
tax
abatement.
It's
not
penalizing
workers
in
any
way.
This
is
protecting
workers.
This
is
ensuring
that
the
folks
who
are
exploiting
more
workers
in
the
city
of
philadelphia
do
the
right
thing
before
they
receive
a
benefit
from
the
city
of
philadelphia
like
we
have
in
a
lot
of
other
cases.
E
So
right
the
laws
exist,
and
it
only
applies
to
the
10-year
tax
abatement,
and
there
are
only
two
types
of
workers
that
are
on
a
construction
site.
This
law
already
exists,
we're
not
changing
it.
You
are
a
licensed
contractor
where
you
want
to.
You
are
an
employee
of
a
licensed
contractor,
so
those
two
things
have
proper
training.
They
paid
taxes,
they
had
workman's
compensation
right
and
they
paid
taxes.
E
F
Again,
I
am
chair
of
appropriations
and
I've
been
working
on
collection
strategies
with
oopa
and
tap
and
everything
else.
I
there's
no
one
more.
That
wants
people
in
compliance
than
than
I
do,
but
there
is
no
way-
and
this
is
why
this
conversation
has
never
progressed.
There
is
no
way
hello.
Okay,
I'm
sorry!
I
got
frozen
there.
There
is
no
way
that
you
can
enforce
this
without
the
recognition
that
people
don't
have
a
way
to
meet
that
legal
threshold.
F
F
All
we're
going
to
do
is
further
put
them
underground,
because
then
they,
instead
of
their
ability
to
be
a
1099
worker,
then
now
they
become
a
cash
worker
and
they're
going
to
be
further
exploited.
So
I
understand
the
spirit
of
collection,
I'm
saying:
there's
enough
laws
in
the
books.
If
there
are
unscrupulous
actors,
I
am
willing
to
work
with
the
bill
sponsors
on
regulations
to
do
that.
F
Passing
a
law
and
asking
my
colleagues
to
vote
against
the
spirit
by
which
we
have
operated
as
a
sanctuary
city
with
a
recognition
of
people
who
have
no
other
way.
There's
no
other
way.
There's
no
regulations
we
can
write,
because
the
federal
government
guidelines
are
what
the
councilman
heenan
says.
The
law
is,
the
law
is
the
law,
because
we
can't
change
that
doubling
down
and
creating
regulations
when
we
know
what
the
unintended
consequences
are
not
going
to
take
us
any
further.
F
The
only
conversation
I'll
have
is:
how
do
we
through
regulation
target
and
pilot
these
folks
without
doubling
down
and
targeting
1099
workers
that
we
know
this
is
like
saying
we're
going
to
shoot
the
victim
to
get
to
the
perpetrator
when
the
victim
has
no
other
choice.
I
agree
with
councilman
heenan,
as
I
have
done
in
the
13
years.
F
I've
been
here,
people
need
to
pay
and
they
should
pay,
but
we
shouldn't
use
the
workers
as
an
excuse
for
us,
our
inability
to
enforce
our
already
strong
collection
laws,
and
that's
why
I'm
asking
I
want
us
this
council
to
stay
consistent
in
the
spirit
by
which
we've
operated,
that
we're
not
going
to
hurt
workers
at
the
expense
of
owners
who
have
the
ability,
through
accounting
practices
and
legal
and
legal
maneuvers,
to
exploit
people.
I
recognize
that
I'm
acknowledging
that
there
are
people
exploiting
workers,
I'm
acknowledging
that
there
are
bad
practices
on
work
sites.
F
I'm
acknowledging
all
of
this
thing.
This
bill
doesn't
further
make
us
any
safer
or
doesn't
get
work
again,
use
the
workers
to
get
the
bad
unscrupulous
actors
to
to
to
compliance.
We
have
the
laws
on
the
books,
so
the
conversation
that
I'll
have
is
how,
through
regulations,
we've
come
up
with
a
pilot
that
demonstrates
that
we're
not
going
to
be
discriminatory,
passing
a
law
to
further
double
down
that
we're
going
to
be
discriminatory
with
a
law
that
we
know
is
unfair
is
that's.
That's
not
an
open
conversation.
F
E
E
The
spirit
of
of
this
legislation
is
tax
compliant
if
there
are
1099s
on
any
site
in
philadelphia,
not
just
taxable
sites.
If
there
are
1099s,
then
they
are
working
behind
the
law
and
for
being
on
the
construction
site.
Now
all
right.
This
is
adding
that
law
that
exists
to
the
10-year
tax
payment,
which
I
think
gonna
be.
I
don't
think
anybody
should
have
a
problem
with
right.
E
We're
gonna
offer
somebody
a
ten
year
tax
abatement,
which
is
very
lucrative
for
developers
and
making
sure
that
they
have
people
who
are
in
tax
compliance,
meaning
all
right.
The
contractors
are
in
tax
compliant,
so
there's
a
process
that
that's
in
place.
The
revenue
department
makes
ensures
all
right
that
if
anybody
is
getting
a
permit
or
apply
for
the
tax
abatement
that
they
are
in
compliance
now,
it's
not
just
about
revenue,
although
there's
tens
of
millions
of
dollars
out
there
that
we
desperately
need.
E
As
you
know,
we've
taken
this
economic
hit
this
year
in
2020,
but
there
are
people
protections,
they're,
all
property
protections.
We
have
buildings
that
are
falling
down.
We
have
building
collapses
that
are
happen
regularly
because
we
don't
have
workers
at
all
in
compliant
right
with
the
laws
that
exist
right.
E
It
was
a
very
challenging
process,
but
also
disturbing
process.
It
was
a
sad
process,
people's
lives
are
lost
and
we
don't
want
that
to
happen
again,
but
and-
and
we
want
to
make
sure
all
right
and
in
the
spirit
that
people
who
are
on
construction
sites
are
there
paying
taxes
who
also
are
osha
trained
and
who
are
protecting
themselves,
as
well
as
the
property
and
equipment
on
the
on
the
building
and
the
end
users
that
are
going
to
be
using
it.
So
thank
you,
mr
chair.
A
A
E
F
Again,
I
started
my
comments
with
I'm
going
to
take
the
councilman
and
the
the
sponsor
of
this
bill
at
his
word
when
his
intent
was
around
collections.
But
now
he
wants
to
blame
workers
for
what
is
happening
up
on
job
sites,
and
I
just
want
to
call
him
on
that.
That
is
not
cool
people
who
work
on
these
work
sites
should
be
protected,
and
if
the
conversation
was
as
it
was,
when
we
were
doing
the
demolition,
which
is
how
do
we
offer
osha
to
everybody?
How
do
we
make
sure
we
create
safe
environments?
F
It
would
be
a
different
conversation
and
I
would
be
leading
that
discussion
around
public
safety.
That's
not
what
he's
doing
here
and
now
he's
going
to
blame
every
crumbling
building
on
employees
who
are
again
or
workers
who
are
coming
on
the
site,
who
are
not
the
developer,
who
are
not
the
the
folks
managing
the
site
that
is
unfair
to
make
that
connection
between
the
problems
we're
having
on
construction
site
and
again,
these
undocumented
workers,
who
are
risking
themselves
by
being
1099
and
trying
to
pay
taxes.
F
So
I'm
just
saying
that's
an
unfair
correlation
and
I
don't
want
it
to
stand
by
itself.
I'm
sure
that's
not
what
he
meant
to
say.
I
know
he
meant
to
say
that
these
developers,
who
are
unscrupulous,
but
here
again
when
you
make
the
correlation
with
people
and
everybody
has
problems
with
how
these
buildings
are
going
up
in
neighborhoods,
I'm
in
a
neighborhood
where
this
is
happening.
I
do
not
want
anybody
believing
and
the
trump
style
that
these
workers
are
the
are
to
blame.
F
E
Council,
member
sanchez,
you
are
thank
you,
chairman
council
member
sanchez.
You
are
unfortunately
factually
incorrect.
That
is
not
what
I
said
and
your
spin
is
is
disheartening
to
me
in
the
spirit
of
this
legislation,
all
right.
What
I
said
merely
and
simply
is
that
there
are
two
types
of
workers
on
a
job
site
for
a
reason:
one
you
need
to
be
by
law,
a
licensed
contractor
or
two
an
employee
of
a
licensed
contractor,
and
there
are
reasons
for
so
collecting
revenue.
E
As
this
as
we
started
out
is
one:
if
not
the
first
attempt
here
right
to
hold
these
developers
accountable
right,
it
is
not
blaming
workers.
You
you
made
that
incorrectly.
That
is
not
the
intent
here.
I
never
blame
workers.
I've
always
supported
work
legislation
to
go,
introduce
workers
legislation
since
I've
been
on
council.
You
know
that,
and
you've
been
also
a
champion
of
that.
So
that
is
not
the
intent.
I
just
want
to
correct
that
statement
as
being
for
the
record
as
factually
incorrect.
F
I
want
to
believe
that's
not
his
intent.
I
know
he's
trying
to
tie
this
in,
for
you
know,
construction
folks
who
who
benefit
from
the
abatement.
I
agree
with
him
around
compliance.
The
laws
are
there
for
compliance
targeting
again.
1099
workers
who
have
no
other
pathway
is,
is
not
the
cure
for
this
particular
problem.
So
again,
I
ask-
and
I
plead
with
my
colleagues
if
he
wants
to
work
on
regulations-
work
on
them,
bring
him
back
to
this
committee.
F
Let's
debate
it
with
a
committee,
that's
informed
part
of
our
job
as
committee
members
is
to
vet
things
before
they
go
on
the
council
floor,
leading
this
on
the
council
floor
so
that
it
can
get
re-debated
when
it's
been
debated
here
and
people
are
informed
around
the
issues.
It's
not
in
the
spirit
of
trying
to
work
with
someone
so
again,
not
that
I
think
we
can
get
anywhere,
because
we
all
acknowledge
that
there
are
unlawful,
1099
workers
on
construction
sites.
Thank
you,
mr
chair.
B
Thank
you,
mr
chairman.
I
just
want
to
make
sure
I'm
hearing
correctly
from
councilman
heenan
that
he's
willing
to
work
out
if
this
gets
passed
out
of
this
committee.
There'll
have
to
be
a
plan
to
implement
this
without
the
exploitation
of
our
undocumented
people
and
making
it
clear
that
no
one's
going
to
get
hurt
here.
I
just
want
to
make
sure
that
would
be
part
of
the
situation.
The
regulation
before
we
vote
on
this
in
a
full
council,
because
I
would
right
now
will
tell
you
I
will
vote
no
one.
E
E
C
Yes,
I
would
like
to
be
recognized.
I
just
wanted
to
add
into
the
conversation
that
you
know
we
will
be
taking
a
look
at
the
regulations
as
they
are
being
developed,
and
it
is
certainly
my
intention
that
if
the
regulations
are
onerous
to
the
people
that
we're
trying
to
protect
that,
we
will
revisit
this
matter
and
have
further
conversation
about
it.
C
So
I
just
wanted
to
you
know
put
that
on
the
record
that
this
that
I
don't
think
that
we
have
to
draw
a
line
in
the
sand
right
here
right
now,
just
because
I
think
we
can
come
back
and
do
what
we
need
to
do
if
we
see
that
things
aren't
going
the
appropriate
way
for
people
that
we're
trying
to
protect.
So
I
just
wanted
to
put
that
on
the
record.
I
know.
Councilman
sanchez
is
a
huge
proponent
and
fighter.
C
E
C
A
It
is
removed
in
property.
Second,
that
bill
number
two:
zero
zero.
Five
seven
three
be
reported
from
this
committee
with
a
favorable
recommendation
and
further
move
that
the
rules
of
council
be
suspended
to
permit
first
reading
of
this
bill
at
the
next
session
of
council.
All
those
in
favor
of
the
motion
will
signify
by
saying.
A
A
B
A
It
was
correct.
The
motion
was
for
bill
number:
two:
zero,
zero,
five,
seven
three
to
be
reported
from
this
committee
with
a
favorable
recommendation
and
move
that
the
rules
accounts
will
be
suspended
to
permit
first
reading
of
this
bill
at
the
next
session
of
council.
That
was
the
question
for
the
vote.
Okay,.
B
B
A
Before
I
recognize
council
member
curtis
jones
for
a
question
based
on
both
robertsville's
order
and
mason's
legislative
emanuel,
we
are
in
a
question
before
this
committee.
However,
based
on
the
voice,
a's
and
nays,
it
was
not
immediately
apparent
on
whether
the
motion
passes.
So
in
that
spirit,
as
chair
allowing
additional
questions
for
clarification
before
we
go
into
a
roll
call
or
additional
voice
votes,
I
will
recognize
council
member
jones.
A
A
F
A
E
E
A
It
was
seconded
by
councilmember
maria
cano
sanchez,
there's
the
moon
that
probably
seconded
that
the
bill
number
two
zero
zero.
Six
two
four
be
reported,
be
reported
from
this
committee
with
a
favorable
recommendation
and
further
move
that
the
rules
of
council
be
suspended
to
permit
first
reading
of
this
bill
at
the
next
session
of
council.
All
those
in
favor
of
motion
will
signify
by
saying
I
I
I
those
opposed
eyes
have
it
and
the
motion
carries.
A
Thank
the
members
of
this
committee
for
today's
conversation.
Definitely
there's
more
work
to
be
done
on
one
of
these
bills
prior
to
it
being
called
up
for
a
final
vote.
I
hope
in
the
spirit
of
the
nature
of
today's
conversation,
we
can
have
a
love
of
collegiality
to
work
on
regulations
regarding
this
issue.
There
clearly
are
strong
arguments
and
perspectives
on
both
sides
of
that
bill.
I'm
seeing
no
other
further
business
before
this
committee
on
finance.