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Historic Landmarks Commission Meeting - September 02, 2021
https://www.slc.gov/historic-preservation/
https://www.slc.gov/boards/historic-landmark-commission-agendas-minutes/
A
A
B
All
right,
thank
you
very
much,
mr
chair.
As
you
said,
this
is
a
request
for
new
construction
at
860
and
868
east
third
avenue,
where
there
is
the
existing
gas
station,
which
has
you
know
been
abandoned.
B
The
applicant
also
owns
the
property
to
the
east
of
the
gas
station
site,
which
is
868
east.
It
currently
has
an
existing
detached
single
family
home
on
it,
which
is
going
to
remain
as
part
of
this
project,
but
the
applicant
is
requesting
to
construct
six
single-family
attached
units
on
a
town,
home
style
development.
B
B
And
this
is
a
vicinity
map
of
the
project
location.
I've
outlined
the
gas
station
property
in
yellow
cam.
As
you
can
see,
it
is
out
from
the
southeast
corner
of
the
intersection
of
amnest
streets
and
third
avenue,
so
staff
has
recommended
that
the
applicant
come
to
the
landmark
commission
to
gather
some
feedback
on
this
proposal,
especially
with
regard
to
the
pedestrian
engagement
along
third
avenue
and
at
the
corner
of
any
state,
so
just
to
go
over
the
project.
B
As
you
can
see,
they
are
rear-loaded
with
double-click
garages
and
they
are
comprised
of
three
levels
and
each
of
the
units
has
a
privately
owned,
open
area
or
a
yard
space,
so
to
speak
on
the
roof
which
can
be
accessed
by
a
patch
here
on
the
roof
and,
let's
see
so.
B
B
Farther
towards
the
east,
it's
a
simple
couple
steps
up
and
then,
as
you
move
to
the
west,
it's
a
longer
staircase,
but
each
one
of
those
units
does
have
a
street
level
patio
and
those
were
added
by
the
applicants.
In
response
to
staff's
comments
that
we
would
like
to
see
some
larger
sitting
animals
out
front,
which
are
more
typical
of
the
avenues
making
historic
districts.
B
So
in
addition
to
the
front,
porch
and
front
suit
area
for
the
westernmost
unit,
we
have
also
added
a
small
walkout
area
with
a
sunken
outdoor
patio,
as
well
as
this
small
seating
area
as
well,
in
an
attempt
to
further
engage
the
the
corner
at
wayne,
state
and
third
avenue,
and
to
create
the
sense
that
there
is
still
some
pedestrian
engagement
along
any
street.
Although
there
is
no
door
or
other
type
of
entry
on
this
face
of
the
building.
B
Again,
these
are
just
elevation
valleys.
These
are
the
rear
of
the
homes
which
will
be
accessed
by
the
drywall
in
the
back
of
the
property.
This
is
the
westernmost
unit.
Again,
you
can
see
the
small
sitting
area
along
the
end
streets
and
then
there's
the
sunk
in
the
outdoor
patio
here
and
then
this
is
the
easternmost
unit
units
you
can
see
at
the
very
small
street
up
there
and
then
the
ground
floor
patio
on
front
avenue.
B
So
this
is
the
end
of
staff's
short
introduction.
I
know
that
the
applicant
is
here
and
they
can
walk
through
the
history
of
the
projects
and
the
overall
changes
that
they've
made
to
be
designed
since
the
original
submittal,
and
then
staff
just
encouraged
the
applicant
to
come
before
the
runway
mission
to
gather
some
feedback,
with
particular
attention
to
pedestrian
engagement
on
street
and.
B
B
I
don't
want
to
say
more
more
basic
design,
but
when
it
was
not
quite
as
refined
as
it
currently
is
so
following
the
feedback
that
they
received
from
the
landmark
commission,
they
again
added
that
trunks
front
patio
area,
they've
also
added
for
seating
along
end
street
and
they
used
to
have
bulkheads
that
they
would
access
the
rooftop
garden
areas
with,
but
with
the
zoning
change,
the
maximum
height
also
changed
and
those
bulk
pads
were
outside
of
the
maximum
building
height
allowance,
and
there
was
no
provision
in
the
ordinance
that
would
have
allowed
those
to
stay
so
the
bullet
plugs
have
also
been
removed.
B
A
So
input
from
everybody
about
what's
presented
there.
A
Well,
that's
right!
This
is
a
work
session.
Sorry
david!
Thank
you.
Someone
here
to
present
is
it.
Do
we
have
any
more
questions
for
kaelyn
before
we
do
that
not
we'll
ask
the
applicant
to
to
present
at
this
time.
E
Everybody,
hopefully
you
can
hear
me
good
evening,
good,
to
see
everyone
again.
My
name
is
oren
and
my
partner,
marcus
robinson,
is
also
on
the
line
or
with
three
mark
investments
where
the
applicant,
as
well
as
the
property
owner.
We
also
have
our
lead
architect
on
the
call
today,
brian
with
blaylock
and
partners.
Unfortunately,
kevin
blaylock
was
unable
to
make
it,
but
he
says
hello
to
everybody.
Brian
will
walk
us
through
kind
of
our
proposal.
E
We're
really
excited
to
be
here
tonight,
kent
and
yes,
we
we
have
come
before
you
guys
before,
but
we
thought
we
made
some
really
good
progress
on
the
design
and,
as
caitlyn
mentioned,
we
recently
received
the
approval
from
city
council
for
the
rezone
of
the
property.
So
we've
worked
with
caitlyn,
john
and
others
at
planning
to
really
refine
and
bring
the
design
to
where
it
is.
Today
we
are
proud
of
the
project.
E
We
hope
this
is
a
beautiful
addition
to
the
lower
abs,
and
hopefully
you
guys
all
agree
and
support,
but
yeah
just
wanted
to
come
in
get
some
feedback
before
we
came
back
for
an
approval,
I'll
pass
it
over
to
brian
at
blaylock,
who
can
go
through
some
of
our
slides
happy
to
answer
any
questions
that
you
all
may
have,
but
thank
you,
everybody
and
look
forward
to
the
next
steps.
F
Thanks
oren
appreciate
that,
can
everyone
hear
me
hopefully
thank
you
caitlyn
appreciate
the
summary
of
the
project.
F
F
All
right
so,
just
to
remind
everyone
we
did
have
the
last
time
we
actually
had
an
hlc
work
session
was
back
in
january,
so
we
thought
it
would
be
a
a
good
idea
just
to
rehash
what
we
presented
there.
F
Sorry
in
the
last
hlc
work
session,
we
just
basically
reviewed
the
general
master
plan
of
introducing
six
town
homes
working
within
the
setbacks
of
rmu
35
and
really
just
our
desire
to
modulate
modulate
those
units.
So
we
kind
of
introduce
porches
and
and
break
down
the
scale
of
the
overall
development
and
make
it
more
conducive
to
the
narrow
lots
that
are
predominant
along
this
area.
F
So
I'm
going
to
share
our
3d
model
just
to
walk
through
an
insight
into
our
process.
I'll
show
you
kind
of
how
we've
we've
got
to
the
point
we're
at
so
this
is
just
an
initial
diagram
showing
the
buildable
volume
on
the
site.
So
essentially,
with
the
rmu
35
zone,
we
have
a
35
foot
max
building
height.
F
So
you
know
within
the
zoning
zoning
restrictions
we
would
really
be
able
to.
If
we
stepped
up
with
the
topography,
this
shows
kind
of
the
max
building
envelope
so
early
on
and
in
our
discussions
internally
and
with
planning
commission
and
all
the
powers
that
be
we,
we
decided
to
carve
this
development
into
the
ground
and
we
we
liked
that
because
it
started
to
reduce
the
scale,
particularly
ryan.
F
You
are
definitely
missing
something:
okay,
let
me
yeah
there
we
go.
You
see
that
yep,
okay,
cool,
so
yeah,
so
just
for
orientation.
Third
ave
is
here
and
street
north
is
kind
of
left.
So
again
this
this
is
the
max
building
envelope
volume
for
the
zoning.
F
F
So
the
next
step
we
actually
took
that
scale
down
further
and
our
design
process
is
really
one
of
subtraction
and
kind
of
carving
a
way
to
create
individual
unit
and
make
these
read
as
individual
town
homes,
but
also
reduce
scale
and
volume.
That
was
a
one
of
the
comments
from
that
first
hlc
session.
So
the
next
kind
of
conceptual
step
was
introducing
this
idea
of
front
porch.
F
So
this
started
initially
just
as
kind
of
a
staircase
and
a
stoop
at
the
entry
and
then
introducing
openings
and
really
these
are
trying
to
be
sensitive
in
scale
but
bringing
in
daylight
and
again
just
exercising
some
restraint
we
didn't
want
to.
We
wanted
to
kind
of
have
this
be
a
background
building
of
sort.
F
So
this
is
kind
of
a
bigger
step
and
a
lot
to
unpack,
but
basically
this
is
showing
the
material
palette
that
we're
exploring.
So
this
is
brick
as
the
primary
material,
with
some
wood
accent
to
provide
some
warmth
architecturally,
and
then
there
is
some
smooth-based
stucco
plaster
that
we're
also
looking
at
as
well.
F
So
we
presented
this
particular
design
to
the
planning
commission
and,
as
caitlyn
indicated,
there
was
a
few
concerns,
the
main
one
being
these
stair
bulkheads.
We
fought
pretty
hard
to
keep
these
in
the
project
just
further.
You
know
the
comfort
and
ease
of
accessing
the
rooftop,
the
ability
to
bring
daylight
in,
but
there
isn't
an
exception
that
allows
for
them.
F
The
other
couple
of
concerns
were
to
activate
third
avenue
with
with
more
of
a
front
porch,
and
the
third
main
concern
was
along
n3,
trying
to
make
this
feel
more
like
a
front
face
similar
to
what
we
have
on
third
ave
so
to
address
the
bulkheads
we
kind
of
push
those
down,
but
we
still
are
adamant
about
having
access
to
the
roof.
F
F
So,
like
I
said
initially,
these
front
porches
were
conceived
as
kind
of
a
you
know,
a
stairway
with
a
stoop
or
a
porch
at
the
front
entry.
But
you
know
in
our
talks
with
planning
commission,
they
wondered
if
we
can
make
those
a
bit
grander
and
really
start
to
activate
the
sidewalk.
F
F
So
that
I
think
the
second
biggest
move,
or
probably
the
largest
move,
we
we
made
and
biggest
revision,
was
starting
to
try
to
wrap
the
aesthetic
along
third
ave
onto
n
street
and
to
make
this
feel
more
like
a
front
facade,
so
we
have
kind
of
two
front
faces
so
we've
also,
as
katelyn
indicated,
we've
carved
in
a
a
terraced
area
as
well.
It's
kind
of
in
that
great
area
and
one
thing
to
correct
is
we
actually
are
anticipating
a
doorway
access
onto
this
area?
F
It's
just
not
at
grade
it's
down
at
that
kind
of
sunken
basement
level.
When
we
thought
through
you
know
whether
to
put
it
put
a
doorway
into
the
garage
area,
this
space
actually
in
this
corner
is
kind
of
a
flex
space
office,
flash
potential
bedroom.
We
just
thought
this
would
be
used
more.
F
That's
that's
kind
of
just
a
look
into
our
process,
we're
happy
to
hear
whatever
input
the
commission
has
and
look
forward
to
keep
keeping
this
process
rolling.
A
Commissioners,
this
is
a
work
session.
Let's
give
the
applicant
any
feedback
that
people
want
to
give
them.
That's
what
we're
here
for.
C
C
This
is
really
really
helpful
to
see
your
rationale
and
I
I
don't
have
anything
to
say
to
change
this.
I
think
it's
going
to
be
a
great
project
there.
I
lived
across
the
street
for
a
couple
years
when
I
was
right
out
of
college
and
would
have
been
a
delight
to
look
out
on
something
like
this,
so
I
think
that
it's
well
done.
I
I
join
you
in
ruling
the
loss
of
your
bulkheads
because
accessing
a
roof
deck
through
a
through
a
hatch
is
not
going
to
be
all
that
appealing,
but
you
know
that's.
C
D
Well,
I've
got
my
microphone
off
kent
and
I'll
I'll
move
into,
and
I
agree
it's
a
it's
a
very
nice
design.
I
think
if
I
were
a
neighbor
to
this
project,
I
would
certainly
be
concerned
with
the
height
and
the
volume.
D
D
I
would
like
to
talk
about
the
roof
decks,
which
I
think
are
a
great
idea.
I
mean
corbus
got
it
right
100
years
ago,
and
it's
still
a
great
idea
and
the
landmarks
commission
may
have
the
ability
to
allow
increased
height
for
those
bulkheads.
I
that
may
be
something
to
chat
with
staff
about,
but
it
would
add
a
concern
that
in
particular
that
east
bulkhead
would
make
what
I
call
the
bambi
meets:
godzilla
28-foot
facade
to
that
historic
home.
D
I
would
like
to
end
with
one
primary
concern,
and
that
is
is
that
I
think
that
these
front
steps
and
decks
are
completely
apologetic
and
there's
just
tremendous
room
for
improvement
there
to
me.
There's
a
place
for
amazon
to
leave
a
package,
but
no
human
being
is
actually
going
to
sit
there
and
engage
with
their
their
neighbors
as
they
walk
by.
D
We
all
understand
the
separation
between
public
space
and
private
space
and
how
those
layers
of
space
work,
architecturally
and,
and
to
me
this
is
just
an
apologetic
solution
and
then
you
guys
are
great
architects.
You
can
come
up
with
something
better,
so.
G
And
I've
seen,
I
might
add,
that
I've
represented
some
developers
on
projects
just
like
this,
and
although
I
didn't
represent
the
one
on
ninth
east
and
17th
south,
where
they
have
little
patios
out
front,
you
see
stuff
out
there,
but
you
never
see
anyone
sitting
there,
because
the
traffic
noise
is
kind
of
crazy.
C
Dave
david
and
bab's
good
observations
on
those
seating
areas.
I'm
glad
you
picked
that
up
because,
as
I
look
at
him
now,
I
think
you're
right
that
that
one
to
the
the
west
facade
actually
would
be
a
more
appealing
spot,
because
you
have
a
little
bit
of
definition
of
your
personal
space.
D
And
if
we
think
about
a
traditional
porch
in
in
a
walkable
neighborhood
like
the
avenues,
the
way
the
the
porch
relates
to
the
street
and
the
neighborhood
and
as
a
as
a
semi-private
space
is
very,
very,
very
important.
D
Right
and
where
there's
such
a
harsh
facade
here,
where
we're
looking
at
28
to
35
feet
of
height,
just
a
few
feet
from
the
sidewalk
to
mitigate
that
with
a
with
a
truly
functioning
porch
feature-
and
I
don't
mean
a
deck
at
the
sidewalk
level,
I
mean
a
truly
functioning
porch,
where
people
sit
there
and
and
can
communicate
with
people
walking
by.
C
B
A
really
great
question:
kenton,
thank
you.
I
don't
know
the
exact
number
off
the
top
of
my
head,
but
stairways
are
permitted
to
encroach
into
the
setback
to
a
certain
degree.
And
again
I
don't
know
what
that
maximum
limitation
is,
but
I
can
look
that
up.
C
That
will
allow
public
interaction
with
with
your
your
personal
limits,
I
think,
is
a
very
good
point
that
david
and
babs
remarked
on
and
again,
as
david
said,
you
guys
are
good
architects.
I
think
you
can
probably
take
that
concept
and
develop
it
within
the
context
of
the
approach
you've
taken
so
far.
D
H
H
I
I
get
a
little
bit
worried
about
large
expanses
of
stucco
because
they
never
seem
to
be
executed
quite
as
well
as
we
would
hope
they
would
like
in
a
you
know,
a
sketchup
model
where
they're
actually
flat,
and
especially
when
a
lot
of
times.
H
In
my
experience
on
on
multi-family
housing
projects,
like
you
know,
stuff,
like
venting
the
the
dryers
comes
into
play,
and
then
they
just
kind
of
get
scatter
shot
placed
on
that
that
rear
facade,
and
you
know
that,
combined
with
with
some
plaster
execution
issues,
it
can
like
get
ugly
fast
like
a
turning
point
in
a
football
game
or
something
it
can
just
kind
of
spiral
from
there
in
my
mind,
so
I
do
like
that.
H
There's
these
these
porches
here
I
think
those
are
great,
and
you
know
I
like
the
style
of
garage
door
with
the
with
the
lights
in
it.
I
do
just
worry
about
the
flat
the
intended
flat
plaster.
I
don't
know
if
other
commissioners
have
experience
in
that
in
the
context
of
the
historic
landmark
commission,
but
we
just.
D
H
I
think
it
normal-
I
wouldn't
be
as
worried
about
it
in
like
a
normal
side
yard
condition,
but
since
this
is
so
close
to
the
corner,
I'm
just
in
street
view
right
now
like
and
the
the
house
to
the
south
that
four
plex
or
whatever
it
is,
is
set
back.
Pretty
far,
it
looks
like
it's
got
about
a
30-foot
front
yard,
so
you're
gonna,
as
you
drive
up
end
street
you're
gonna,
really
see
that
that's
gonna
be
like
your
primary
experience
of
this
building.
If
you're
going
north
through
the
avenues.
C
C
C
Again
without
without
coming
up
with
a
solution,
I'd
say
I'd,
encourage
you
to
consider
this.
This
facade
as
well.
In
light
of
what
john
has
pointed
out,.
H
Well,
yeah,
I
think
that
wood
kind
of
slivers
a
good
move.
It
really
helps
break
it
up,
and
I
know
we
don't,
or
I've
heard
it
said
we
don't
really
consider
stuff
like
stucco
score
joints,
because
that's
more
of
a
kind
of
constructability
detail,
but
maybe
just
kind
of
laying
those
out
a
little
bit
in
the
drawings
would
help.
D
F
D
C
F
Yeah
we're
we're
basically
right
at
setback
with
this
upper
floor,
so
we
would
need
some
sort
of
variance
or
eat
away
at
the
other
unit.
I.
C
H
F
C
F
Yeah,
I
think
the
general
thought
was
just
a
furnace
closet
for
each
and
then
a
condensing
unit
up
on
the
roof.
F
Okay,
yeah
we'll
look:
we've
we've
really
gone
back
and
forth
on
the
porches,
and
you
know
ultimately,
these
row
house
typologies.
You
know
these
are
a
little
over
20
feet,
wall-to-wall
from
kind
of
the
brick
to
the
wood
for
each
unit.
So
you
know
it
just
it
makes
for
it's
already
kind
of
a
tough
layout,
but
you
know:
we'd
have
to
eat
into
kind
of
this
kitchen
dining
area
to
introduce
a
larger
porch
up
up
at
that
door
level.
D
G
And
you
really
give
up
on
the
roof
by
putting
the
condensers
up
there
and
what
I'm
seeing
in
more
and
more
projects
that
they're
using
the
european
heating
and
cooling
units
that
go
on
the
sea
almost
to
the
ceiling
on
your
upper
walls.
G
There
you
see
them
in
mexico,
you
see
them
in
europe,
they're,
just
like
a
long
white
box,
almost
and
they're
highly
efficient
and
they're
about
5,
000
bucks,
a
piece
and
you
put
them.
I
don't
know
three
and
three
or
four
of
them
in
there
and
then
you
don't
have
to
do
the
venting
and
you
don't
have
the
condenser,
but.