Tennessee House of Representatives 112th House Local Government Committee, 1 Mar 2022

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From YouTube: House - Property & Planning Subcommittee - March 1, 2022

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House Property & Planning Subcommittee House Hearing Room 3

A

If everybody will please take their seats.

A

Today is march, the 1st welcome to property and planning subcommittee. Our normal chair is not able to be with us today, representative carr. So that's why I'm chairing this committee?

A

Madam clerk, will you please take the roll.

B

Representative hodges representative leatherwood representative reedy representative right here, chairman moody here, chairman crawford president chairman crawford. You have a quorum.

A

Thank you. Let the record reflect that representative carr is excused. Do any of the members have any personal orders or announcements before we get started, seeing none. We have eight bills on the calendar today, we'll jump right in our first bill is 1675 by chairman sapicki, proper motion in second on the bill. I do see it has an amendment chairman sapicki. Can you please give me your drafting code? That is correct.

C

Mr chairman, zero one, four four, oh three, that.

A

Is correct, proper motion on the amendment? Do I have a second second on the amendment uh chairman, you are recognized on your amendment.

C

Mr chairman, it does rewrite the bill. Does the committee want to add it on or just do the explanation now.

A

uh We can do the committee wants to go ahead and add it on and discuss the bill. That'll be fine. Any objections to the question on the amendment. Seeing none we're ready to vote on amendment 14403, say aye, those opposed. No. The amendment is now on bill. 1675, chairman you're recognized. Thank you.

C

Members house bill uh 1675. This amendment we just put on today comes directly from the senate, our counterparts over there. They have passed this permissive bill already from murray county and have moved it forward. I come today with the same. Ask of this committee. Murray county is in dire straits right now. Economically, we are tasked with tremendous growth. We have growth that has become the fastest growing county in tennessee fourth fastest in the country. We have had 25 percent growth in murray county over the last decade.

C

We are now over a hundred thousand people uh representative, but who is behind me here when she took office during the last census in 2010, we are roughly at about 80 something 78 000 and now we're over 103..

C

We cannot cannot keep up with the building. The builders in murray county have already pulled, I believe 15 000 permits for murray county 15 000 permits. If each one of those households just has one child, just one child that could be 15, 000 more children to our school system. We currently have 12 000 right now.

C

We have 23 schools. I believe, on the last count we're facing an economic crisis in tennessee's, fastest growing, fastest growing county in the state and we're coming to you asking for your help. Actually we're begging for your help. We've got to have your help or our taxpayers in murray county are going to face a massive tax increase and if you want to slow growth down and if builders don't want to build any more homes, have a tax increase in murray kind like this, realtors won't be able to sell homes.

C

We're already talking about at the county level, with our planning commission to start restricting building permits. Builders won't be building any homes in murray county because we can't afford to have this keep going without this impact fee. We're asking you to do the rational premise behind it is. We are extremely- and I say extremely you know unique in the state of tennessee right now. Nobody and nobody in other 95 counties is experiencing. What we are will tell you this.

C

We just approved that 1 billion for west tennessee wait till those people start showing up out there and their infrastructure is getting crushed by the growth builders serve a purpose. They provide new homes for realtors, to sell and for new families to move into a community, but we can't build the schools fast enough.

C

Our county commission already borrowed 70 over 70 million dollars last year to build a school, and we have to figure out this year how we're going to pay for it. It's going to be a tax increase, or it's going to be this impact fee that helps us with a lower tax increase. We know, as as as citizens of murray county we're going to get hit with higher taxes in a reappraisal year.

C

I don't have to tell you the growth williamson county, our neighbor to the north, just went over the average home price of one million dollars. One million dollars.

C

There's no affordable housing right now in middle tennessee anymore, so that argument goes out the door real, quick and in murray county, it's becoming a place where you're going to have to be upper income to live, and we've got to figure out a way to pay for this growth. That's coming! That's not stopping and we're asking you.

C

I'm begging you to just pay pay murray county, the same respect that the senate paid senator hensley, who represents murray county to allow us to take care of our business in murray county, our business that I have members here from the republican party. I have members here from from our county commission. I have members here who represent everybody in murray county. I have got everybody begging, you from murray county, to pass this bill for us, and I know I've got a long road to hoe full committee.

C

Next week, finance sub finance calendar rules, I'm five weeks, five weeks away from getting this to the floor, but the senate, the senate never questioned it. They made the amendment to limit it and I'll discuss it. Very briefly, mr chairman, it talks about allowing our county legislative body to impose up to a maximum of three dollars per square foot on new construction, residential, new construction.

C

It talks about how the revenues for this impact fee is put on by the senate can be used for the for the construction or renovation of schools, public facilities and other related infrastructure, fire halls police sheriffs roads. How are our builders going to build more homes unless we can build the roads to them?

C

If we can't get this passed, murray county will no longer be the fastest growing county in tennessee, because we're going to have to slow it down and possibly stop issuing building permits.

C

So, mr chairman, I I've been a little long-winded. I apologize. We do have some people from murray county. I'm asking allow them to testify. Mr chairman,.

A

Without objection, we'll go out a session and hear from our speakers today we're out of session. uh I do have five people on the list. um Are you all coming at once? Are we gonna do this individually.

A

It doesn't matter I'm going to limit you to three minutes a piece so, mr.

C

Chairman make sure they introduce themselves because there's two people not here to testify. Yes,.

A

Sir, so we have three on the list. Please do identify yourself for the record and uh we will start. I guess, uh ladies first so.

D

Thank you is my mic on.

A

uh It should be a little red light on it, it is okay, then it should be on um and go ahead and identify yourself, and you have three minutes.

D

I'm humbled to be here in front of you all today. Thank you, representatives for seeing us and hearing us. My name is debbie matthews and I am from the great county of murray county and I'm a little bit of a different hybrid today, because I am a realtor.

D

I am the agent of the year for nashville realty group, which is a 70 person, brokerage that sits in franklin. I sold 24 million dollars worth of property last year and I represented builders that build in murray, county williamson, county cheatham, county davidson county. We build all over and we build and deal with different ordinances and impact fees depending on the county.

D

I was also a city council person for the city of columbia and sat on the planning commission for six years, so I am the one that actually built the growth plan, the strategic growth plan for columbia and it's out the door already. It is beyond what we ever dreamed of. So, if we're looking at tennessee just to give you an idea of what's going on the city of nashville doubled in size in the last 10 years, it is projected that nashville double again in the next five.

D

If we go straight down the 65 corridor from nashville to huntsville, alabama huntsville is expecting a million more people in the next 10 years, so the 65 corridor, in no short order, is on fire and murray county. The north end at spring hill is sort of the ignition point right now.

D

The city of spring hill straddles over the williamson county and the murray county line. It's about 35 000 people on the williamson county side. They have been afforded an impact and adequate facilities, fees for new growth, the builders in williamson county make about twenty thousand dollars. A house or williamson county, makes twenty thousand dollars a house being built in williamson county in murray county right. Now, as it stands, we get approximately two in williamson county, there's a new school every year to handle the growth in murray county right now.

D

Looking at our projections, we're about we're going to be three behind. So if you're born on williamson county side, things look good step, one foot over the murray county side, we're struggling for books, we're the lowest starter pay in the in 14 districts that were just uh surveyed for teachers.

D

It is a dire drastic difference between these two counting lines. So we're coming to you today for just two things. We want self-determination for us to govern ourselves on whether we impose taxes or not on who does business in murray county.

D

The other thing is, we would like equal representation under the law to have the same revenue sources that williamson county is given, because our kids have to compete with williamson county kids.

D

It's not a difference to get those scholarships or those test scores, and we would like to at least impose the same thing that was afforded to williamson county when they were experiencing this growth. Thank you very much.

A

You're welcome um next, on our does any of the members have questions for this speaker, our next, our next on the list, scott sumners, mr sumners, please tell us your name while you're here and you have three minutes, sir.

E

Good afternoon representatives, my name is scott sumners, I'm a the fifth district county commissioner for the murray county commission. Also, the budget chairman, thank you for having us here tonight today to let us speak on our on our needs. As you've heard, we're experiencing rapid growth in murray county uh from 2019 to 2020, 20.

E

murray county has had the number one population growth rate in the state. According to the 2010 census, we grew 16 and a half percent and 2020 census saw us grow at a rate of 25 percent.

E

During my eight years on the county, commission, we've had to build four new schools, three of those new schools, they're brand new, and they are in the northern part of our county.

E

Our municipalities are continuing to annex land and approve high-density residential developments for every 100 residential homes that are built. You can count on at least 39 schoolchildren new school children to attend our schools.

E

uh The city of columbia has uh approved around approved, but there are 14 000 new residential lots in their pipeline.

E

So if you, if you use that math that I just gave you that's about 5400 new school children in our schools, which equals to about six to seven new facilities that we will need uh since 2014 our debt has increased from, I think 240 million. Is that correct? 240 million dollars and 95 percent of that is school. Debt murray counties believe that the growth should pay for itself, but the state laws are preventing that from happening.

E

Growth counties are limited by an arbitrary law that permits counties to charge a dollar a square foot per residential dwelling, with the rising cost of construction for new schools. The county powers relief act does not help murray county achieve our goals of helping those offset property taxes.

E

Our property taxes should not be the main source of revenue to pay for new schools and murray countians agree with that. They made it clear to us that an impact fee is needed on new development. The county commission agreed, and we passed a resolution unanimously in favor of that house. Bill 1675 is a permissive bill that will allow our county legislative body the ability to enact impact fees on new residential development.

E

This bill helps our county counties know what is best for their communities.

E

We ask that you and your colleagues support this bill in this committee and throughout this legislative process, a vote of no from the state legislature will in fact be a vote to increase our property taxes in murray county. Thank you.

A

Thank you, mr sumners. um Brian mckelvey he's not here: okay, don morrow and okay, andy ogles this time mr ogles you're recognized to speak. He's.

E

Not mr ruggles either he's our finest director.

A

Okay, he's he's not on the list, so I can't allow him to speak. Okay, um chairman. Is there anybody else you have? I thought you said you had three that you needed to speak. Okay, all right. Does anybody have any questions for speakers today without objection, we'll go back into session.

A

Chairman supiki you're recognized for your final remarks on 1675.. Thank.

C

You, mr chairman and committee, you know yesterday we were on the house floor and we allowed montgomery county to do something that was going to benefit their their area. I'm asking for the same same consideration for my county that I represent I'm asking for help for my county. I know I know that you have been worn out by lobbyists over the last few or greater weeks.

C

They don't live in murray county.

C

The people that I represent, live in murray county and the people that I represent sent me here to get this bill passed so that they can bring relief to the 103 000 people who now live in murray county.

C

I'm humbly asking for your vote today, I'm humbly asking for your vote next week and as it gets to the house floor, I'm humbly asking for your support of this legislation. Thank you, mr chairman.

A

Thank you, mr chairman, um representative leatherwood, you have a question for our sponsor. I.

F

Do just looking at the fiscal note on the original bill: do you have that there I show it increases local revenue, um 74 million, almost 75 million dollars, the original.

C

Is that that was you recognized? That was when it was a statewide bill.

F

Statewide bill. Okay and you just answered my question but I'll go ahead and follow through so it makes sense yeah with the amendment it's 2 million, so I was just wondering about the differences. Yes, sir, thank you.

A

Any other questions for the sponsor.

A

Seeing none without objection we'll go ahead and vote on house bill 1675., all those in favor, please say aye. Those opposed! No no bill fails.

C

Thank you chairman and committed.

A

Mr chairman, this was the third time this bill was calendared, so just to make you aware, this will go on the final calendar, the special calendar to be there in case it needs to be reconsidered.

A

Without objection, this bill will go on special calendar with the final calendar.

A

Item number two house bill 2725 by chairman reagan, got a proper motion in second on the bill. Chairman reagan, good to see you in the committee and you're recognized on your bill, sir.

B

Thank you, mr chairman. It's a pleasure to be here appreciate the consideration and after the last bill, I'm I bring you an easy one.

B

This one is essentially aimed at counties and municipalities with historic zoning.

B

Not able to fulfill their duties, so what this bill does is provide that vacancies shall be filled by members who are removed or replaced in the same manner. Members are appointed to the commission, that is to say, actions are initiated by the mayor of the county and confirmed by the or the I should say, not just county but municipality, as well confirmed by the vote of the local governing body. With that explanation, I stand ready to answer questions.

A

From house bill 2725 moving on all those in favor, please say: aye oppose no bill moves on to local full. Sir. Thank you very much, mr.

B

Chairman committee.

A

Item number three house bill 2467 by chairman halsey, to have a motion proper motion in second. I do see that it has an amendment chairman hulsey. Will you please give us your drafting code.

G

Yes, sir, I'm thank you, chairman of committee. It's a zero one, three three, nine five. That is correct.

A

I did hear a motion on the amendment. Second, on the amendment uh chairman, jose you're, recognized on the amendment. Okay, the amendment makes.

G

The bill um mike.

A

Mccarthy, chairman, let us go ahead and put the item on the bill, so we can discuss it. Then uh all those without objection, we'll vote on amendment number one three, three, nine five, all in favor, please say aye those opposed. No. The bill is now amended. Chairman halsey you're recognized.

G

Thank you, mr chairman, um as you know, representative mike carter of this body, passed away in may, may the 15th and prior to that, I've had actually contact with him just about every day for six seven months, and uh we talked about some of the things looming against the united states and against the state of tennessee that were worrisome and that were troubling and things that you could classify in an evil category and what we could look forward into in the future.

G

That could really hurt tennessee people and one of those things was looking at a federal government. That's 30 trillion dollars in debt. What happens in the currency collapse? What happens when finances are wiped out? What happens when a dollar completely loses its value and a currency collapse? What happens when people?

G

The federal reserve, goes to a central bank digital currency and there is no more cash which, by the way, all of them are talking about it and mike was concerned that when those times come, there's no mechanism to help tennessee people keep their property if they can't pay their property taxes.

G

So he told me it was a passion of his to have a bill that allowed people to pay their property taxes forward like an escrow account- and I promised him that I would run that bill and and it's in the bill it's named after. It's called the representative, mike carter preservation act. What the bill does and I have met with the state trustees, association, the tennessee county officials, association and they're, who actually wrote this amendment and it's to start the process, because there are several county trustees. Who can do it now with no problem?

G

There are some who cannot, because they don't have the software and their computer system to do it, but we're expecting this to improve and come online, but what it does. It allows somebody to pay their property taxes forward in an escrow account as far as they want to that way. If they have a collapse down the road four years, five years, eight years from now- and they don't have the money that this money will come out of their escrow account and pay their tax, their taxes.

G

So at least no matter how bad it is for them, the state can't take their property away. So that's the focus of the bill and that's what it does.

A

Any questions on the bill is amended to the sponsor, seeing none without objection, we're ready to vote on house bill, 2467 moving on, please say: aye. Those opposed no bill moves on.

G

To local government, thank you, chairman and committee.

A

Item number four is house bill, 2503 by representative lynn. We've got a proper motion and second, uh do you see that it has an amendment? I need your drafting code miss liam.

H

It does have an amendment just a second. Let me get my amendment. My drafting code is zero. One, four zero, seven, eight that.

A

Is correct? Do I have a motion on the amendment proper motion and second on the amendment uh representative, lynn, you're recognized on the amendment.

H

Oh, thank you. This bill would add cannon county back into the exception in this law. So cannon county would continue to be accepted from this law.

A

Okay say that one more time this.

H

Bill adds, cannon county back into the law. The the original bill would take cannon county, um no cannon county would be put into the law. This is taking it out of the bill.

A

This is taking.

H

Cannon county out of the bill.

A

Okay, that's. That was my understanding. Yes, uh is that not correct legal okay? Without objection, I'm going to recognize legal and let them tell us exactly what we're looking at here. Legal.

H

B

You matt money from legal, so in the original statute. um For many of these, these plans, trousdale clay, cannon, dekalb smith, macon, wilson and bledsoe county were accepted from the statute.

F

B

So the original bill took all those population breaks out. The amendment brings counting county back in as a population break that is accepted from the statute right, so they would not be subject to the bill as written.

A

Okay, thank you. Legal.

A

So I guess we're ready to vote on amendment 014078 or do we have any questions on the amendment seeing none we're ready to vote on amendment 14078 going on to the bill all in favor, please say: aye opposed. No. The bill is now amended. Representative lynn, you're recognized on the bill as amended. Thank.

H

You, sir, many years ago, a law was passed by the general assembly that made a process for adopting and making amendments to regional and municipal plans, so that bill was passed by the general assembly and there were a few counties exempted out of that law.

H

This bill is adding those counties into that law, except for cannon county canada county would still be the only county exempted out, and so the the language of the bill simply restates the entire law. I wish it didn't. I wish it was only putting the counties making it clear that those counties are being put back into the law, but it restates the entire law, and I can tell you what the entire law does.

H

If you'd like to know years ago, when this law was passed, planning commissions, they had all authority to make changes to the and make amendments to the regional and municipal plans, but they're, not an elected body.

H

So what we did was we passed the law to say well, they can make proposals to the city, commission and county commission, but the city, commission and county commission have to vote on the changes that the planning commission proposes, or the city commission and county commission can also make proposes to proposals to the planning commission.

H

They talk about it. They can either approve it or not, approve it, but it still goes back to the elected body for a vote. Good law really good law, but when the law was passed, several counties were amended out of the law. So what this bill is doing is um it's all? These years later, this bill is going to put those counties into the law, so those county commissions and municipal governments will have the ability to vote on the changes that their planning commission is proposing.

H

Instead of the planning commission having all power, and it was only cannon county that didn't want to be added back into the law they like the way it currently is any questions.

A

For the sponsor.

A

Seeing none without objection, we're ready to vote on house bill 2503 as amended, please say: aye. Those opposed no bill moves on to local government.

H

Thank you, sir. Thank you committee.

A

Item number five house bill: 2134.

A

We're gonna roll that bill without objection for two weeks.

A

Item number six 2534 by representative hicks, proper motion in second on the bill. Representative hicks. I do see that has an amendment. Can you please give us your drafting code? Sure mr.

I

I

uh Zero one three, nine seven, four, that.

A

Is correct? Do I have a motion on the amendment proper motion and second on the amendment representative, hicks you're, recognized on the amendment.

I

Thank you, mr chairman, and thank you committee uh house, bill 2534 was brought by our planning association. Their legislative committee and ecd worked hard on this. This bill makes government work better for our citizens.

I

There are two main objectives to this bill. First, currently, any subdivision plat with more than two lots that has roads and infrastructure goes before the regional or municipal planning commissions for a preliminary approval.

I

Then it goes before the regional and municipal planning commission for a final approval. The final approval is where this bill changes things house bill. 2534 changes this to any subdivision with 25 lots or less can receive final approval from the regional or municipal planning staff.

I

Second, currently, any division of lots up to two lots can receive preliminary approval. Preliminary approval by the regional or planning staff house bill, 2534 changes this to any division of five lots or less can receive preliminary approval by the regional or municipal planning staff.

I

This change is only when it's just a division of property, in other words, there's no infrastructure or roads being done to the property. Okay.

I

This gives regional and municipal planning commissions, more flexibility on approval of a routine plat and plans, that's routine approval of plants and plants, those that meet all regional and municipal planning planning regulations.

I

This can lead to both shorter meetings and reduce plat approval times for land owners and developers.

I

It levels the playing field for both municipal and regional planning commissions by making regulations consistent, there's been some inconsistency in some things. That's that uh wasn't quite clear.

I

This changes, these changes are permissive, not mandatory planning commissions, both regional and municipal, are free to either adopt or not adopt these standards. So with that, and that explains the bill I'll be happy to answer any questions I can.

A

Okay, we're dealing with the amendment here and it's my understanding that the amendment rewrites the bill so at this time, if there be no objection, we'll go ahead and place the amendment on the bill, all those in favor of a bill, I mean amendment number one, three, nine, seven, four going on the bill, please say aye opposed. No.

A

The bill is now amended. We're working off the bill. Is there any questions for the sponsor.

A

Okay, uh I I had a couple questions there. If you wouldn't mind. uh Thank you, sir. um I just want to make sure that we get this on record and and make sure that it's clear for everybody to understand so, basically the bill we just voted on before yours that made that that has to go back to the county commissions for final approval.

A

What your bill would do is they could sign the planning staffs, could sign off on those plats and cut the time out of it having to go to the planning commission for their approval to make a recommendation to the full county commission correct.

I

Yes, mr chairman, anything 25, lots or under could be approved through the planning staff instead of having to go through the planning. Commission you on final approval. This is final approval. You are correct.

A

Okay, I just wanted to make sure that we got that on record since the bill right before that we voted to make sure everybody was going to the to the county commission for final approval and again just so. Everyone knows and- and you did a great job presenting the bill and making sure that we understood that this wasn't the planning commission making that decision, it's the staff that is in the opposite. Any other questions can.

I

I yes, thank you, mr chairman. uh The the problem here is is by the time the development is done. Okay, it's all been signed off on. You know, you've got t deck signed off on it. You got your road superintendent, you got sewer and water.

I

Everybody signed off on it that it's done so developers are actually having to wait, sometimes 30, 45 and sometimes up to 60 days during covet, to wait on the next planning commission meeting when everything is done and they could be 45 days ahead on starting houses, we we encourage growth in east tennessee, okay and and all the way across the state, instead of trying to slow it down. So this will really help things.

A

uh Represe I mean chairman wright, you're recognized. uh Thank you, mr chairman.

F

So this is final approval. Some of these steps that involve the planning and county commission approving of rezoning and those kinds of plans have already occurred by the time we get to your step is that right.

A

Chairman, I mean representative you're recognized.

I

Thank you, mr chairman. Yes, it is already received rezoning and approval of the subdivision. The preliminary approval already has taken place. This is strictly on the final approval. The only place that it comes in, that is the five lots currently currently in tennessee. Anything that is two lots or under can be. The preliminary approval can be approved by the planning staff.

I

Two lots are under. We are wanting to change that, to five lots or under. In other words, if you have a five acre piece of land you're not going to do any roads, you're not going to do any infrastructure whatsoever, and you want to divide that up into five one acre tracks.

I

You can do that through the planning staff instead of having to go before the commission. Currently you can do two lots. It should be five.

F

Chairman you're recognized no thank you, mr chairman. I'm.

A

um The chairman will take a privilege here and um that statement kind of throws me because my understanding is you do the preliminary plots. Then you still have to go. Get all the signatures road. Commissioner builders, all that, then it normally goes back to the planning commission for their approval to make a recommendation to the county commission. Is that not correct.

I

On anything, currently any two lots yeah any lots.

A

Has to have the it.

I

Goes before, but it get what you what they do is is they they lump them all into one?

I

In other words, they approve anything, two lots that if you want to divide, if you want, if you've got one acre- and you want to divide that into two lots- you do not have to go to the planning commission right now to do that. That is done. That can be done through the planning staff.

I

It can be done through the planning staff. Now, currently, it's being done in washington county all the time- okay, okay and then what they do is they do a lot of those? Actually they put them all together, and it goes before the planning commission, the night of the commission, but it's already been approved, you're, just okay, you're, just okay and all of it at the end. Well, it's not.

A

Approved until they vote on it and and and then it would be approved right, okay, all right any other questions, seeing none we're ready to vote on house bill 2534, all those in favor, please say: aye opposed no bill moves on to local government. Thank.

I

You chairman, thank you committee,.

A

Item number seven presenting from his desk is uh representative hodges. Do I have a motion by promotion in second? I do see it has a amendment. uh Can you please give us your drafting code.

F

Yes, mr chairman: zero one through zero one, three, nine five, one that.

A

Is correct, I have a motion on him in proper motion and second on the amendment representative, hodges you're, recognized on the amendment.

F

Thank you, mr chairman. The amendment does make the bill so I'll just go over the the bill, real, quick and what this is just a privacy right, throw um it allows you to do the same thing you're doing with with a phone book now where you can basically be unlisted on the online searchable assessors database, so it'll allow assessors it's permissive. If assessors want to do this, it will allow them to allow people that make the request remove their names from the online searchable database.

F

um It'll allow them to remove their names and change it to unlisted. uh This doesn't change an open records request or anything like that.

A

All right any questions. We've got a question on the amendment, all those in favor of amendment, one three, nine five, one going on the bill say: aye opposed no. The bill is now amended. You heard the explanation of the bill as amended.

A

Is there any questions for the sponsor question has been called on the bill house bill 2597, all those in favor, please say: aye opposed no bill moves on to local government. Thank you, mr.

F

Chairman in committee.

A

Item number eight on our list house bill 2536 without objection will be rolled one week.

A

That's all of our items on the agenda today is there. Anyone has any announcement or personal orders. Seeing none I'll entertain a motion to adjourn so move.